I suppose the pilot lines are 1/2" galv 40 so you can't make it real ez by drilling in a snap halfway between the existing 12' oc and end up with 6' spacing very economically? Unscrew a pilot head, install a 1/2" tee, re-install, and stab 1/2" pipe 6' over to a new intermediate? Either f these would be less than ripping it out and starting over, I'd think- but YOU'RE looking at it.
glc -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Greg McGahan Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 11:56 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: pilot lines We are replacing all of the existing 5.6k nozzles (10'-0 on center) with 11.2's spaced at 8' on center. We are replacing all of the pipe feeding the existing nozzles but had hoped to reuse the existing pilot lines to save the owner money. I asked NFPA, but like I said, I don't have an answer. Greg McGahan Living Water Fire Protection (850) 937.1850 | Fax (850) 937.1852 | Cell (850) 554.3231 -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of [email protected] Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 10:52 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: pilot lines Exposure protection has different rules than protection under an overhang due to width. Different purpose, different criteria. Spacing of the nozzles is dependant on overlap and wetting of the complete surface moreso than NFPA 13 general spacing requirements. Spacing of the sensing devices (pilot heads) is based on the outdoor spacing rules as has been discussed. If your installation meets the 15ft height criteria from ground to soffit as stated in 6.5.2.4.9 and there no levels above to be protected then I see no reason why you can't increase the pilot spacing to 10ft. as noted. Are you having to do anything with the discharge nozzles or is the problem just in the pilot head spacing? Knowing what the spacing and discharge angles of the discharge nozzles is critical. Also at what angle are they in relation to the adjacent wall? Craig L. Prahl, CET Fire Protection Specialist Mechanical Department CH2MHILL Lockwood Greene 1500 International Drive PO Box 491, Spartanburg, SC 29304-0491 Direct - 864.599.4102 Fax - 864.599.8439 [email protected] http://www.ch2m.com -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Greg McGahan Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 11:36 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: pilot lines Ok, let me clarify. This is exposure protection against the side of a building per 13 and 15. There is a soffit at the roof level about 3' deep and a little over 2' wide. So this is not an exposure protection system with dry pilot heads in the complete open with nothing to collect heat. With that being said, I am fine with the 8' if that is indeed the intent of 15 and there is no argument from me. Before I have that answer conclusively though, it seems that the requirement for 8' spacing in the great wide open then it should be increased by some measure if there is collection. My line of reasoning follows the thought that if this were a normal closed head system protecting under the soffit, then the heads would be spaced at a max of 15'. Greg McGahan Living Water Fire Protection (850) 937.1850 | Fax (850) 937.1852 | Cell (850) 554.3231 -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of [email protected] Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 10:26 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: pilot lines All pilot heads are the intermediate type like used in racks. Para. 6.5.2.4.9 has very specific wording, can your installation meet that criteria? If you can meet the vertical spacing and arrangement requirements then you can apply .9, if you can't then you're back to para. ....8 Since there is less structure to trap heat on typical outdoor arrangements, the spacing is reduced to 8ft. horizontally and also vertical separation limitations between levels must be recognized. Craig L. Prahl, CET Fire Protection Specialist Mechanical Department CH2MHILL Lockwood Greene 1500 International Drive PO Box 491, Spartanburg, SC 29304-0491 Direct - 864.599.4102 Fax - 864.599.8439 [email protected] http://www.ch2m.com -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Greg McGahan Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 10:23 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: pilot lines What about Para .9 that allows you to increase the spacing to 10'-0" for a given level? This para's explanation is indicative of pilot heads with nothing above them to collect heat. I also sent this to NFPA. Greg McGahan Living Water Fire Protection (850) 937.1850 | Fax (850) 937.1852 | Cell (850) 554.3231 -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of [email protected] Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 9:19 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: pilot lines If it's outside - 8ft. It's either inside or outside. Is this for a deluge system? Craig L. Prahl, CET Fire Protection Specialist Mechanical Department CH2MHILL Lockwood Greene 1500 International Drive PO Box 491, Spartanburg, SC 29304-0491 Direct - 864.599.4102 Fax - 864.599.8439 [email protected] http://www.ch2m.com -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Greg McGahan Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 10:12 AM To: [email protected] Subject: pilot lines NFPA #15 6.5.2.4 Para .2 - Pilot lines under a ceiling - spacing per 13 Para .8 - Outdoors - spacing at 8'-0 Situation - Soffit on the exterior of a building 2'-4" wide....... Which one is the absolute in this situation? Greg McGahan Living Water Fire Protection (850) 937.1850 | Fax (850) 937.1852 | Cell (850) 554.3231 _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
