Well, I'm happy to be wrong here. I'd rather it was you making money because some misanthrope screwed up than you being said misanthrope.
On Tue, Mar 16, 2010 at 12:50 PM, George Church <[email protected]> wrote: > I suppose the pilot lines are 1/2" galv 40 so you can't make it real ez by > drilling in a snap halfway between the existing 12' oc and end up with 6' > spacing very economically? Unscrew a pilot head, install a 1/2" tee, > re-install, and stab 1/2" pipe 6' over to a new intermediate? Either f these > would be less than ripping it out and starting over, I'd think- but YOU'RE > looking at it. > > glc > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Greg McGahan > Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 11:56 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: RE: pilot lines > > We are replacing all of the existing 5.6k nozzles (10'-0 on center) with > 11.2's spaced at 8' on center. We are replacing all of the pipe feeding the > existing nozzles but had hoped to reuse the existing pilot lines to save the > owner money. > > I asked NFPA, but like I said, I don't have an answer. > > Greg McGahan > > Living Water Fire Protection > (850) 937.1850 | Fax (850) 937.1852 | Cell (850) 554.3231 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of > [email protected] > Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 10:52 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: RE: pilot lines > > Exposure protection has different rules than protection under an overhang > due to width. Different purpose, different criteria. Spacing of the > nozzles is dependant on overlap and wetting of the complete surface moreso > than NFPA 13 general spacing requirements. Spacing of the sensing devices > (pilot heads) is based on the outdoor spacing rules as has been discussed. > If your installation meets the 15ft height criteria from ground to soffit as > stated in 6.5.2.4.9 and there no levels above to be protected then I see no > reason why you can't increase the pilot spacing to 10ft. as noted. > > Are you having to do anything with the discharge nozzles or is the problem > just in the pilot head spacing? Knowing what the spacing and discharge > angles of the discharge nozzles is critical. Also at what angle are they in > relation to the adjacent wall? > > Craig L. Prahl, CET > Fire Protection Specialist > Mechanical Department > CH2MHILL > Lockwood Greene > 1500 International Drive > PO Box 491, Spartanburg, SC 29304-0491 > Direct - 864.599.4102 > Fax - 864.599.8439 > [email protected] > http://www.ch2m.com > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Greg McGahan > Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 11:36 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: RE: pilot lines > > Ok, let me clarify. This is exposure protection against the side of a > building per 13 and 15. There is a soffit at the roof level about 3' deep > and a little over 2' wide. So this is not an exposure protection system with > dry pilot heads in the complete open with nothing to collect heat. > > With that being said, I am fine with the 8' if that is indeed the intent of > 15 and there is no argument from me. > > Before I have that answer conclusively though, it seems that the requirement > for 8' spacing in the great wide open then it should be increased by some > measure if there is collection. My line of reasoning follows the thought > that if this were a normal closed head system protecting under the soffit, > then the heads would be spaced at a max of 15'. > > > Greg McGahan > > Living Water Fire Protection > (850) 937.1850 | Fax (850) 937.1852 | Cell (850) 554.3231 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of > [email protected] > Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 10:26 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: RE: pilot lines > > All pilot heads are the intermediate type like used in racks. Para. > 6.5.2.4.9 has very specific wording, can your installation meet that > criteria? If you can meet the vertical spacing and arrangement requirements > then you can apply .9, if you can't then you're back to para. ....8 > > Since there is less structure to trap heat on typical outdoor arrangements, > the spacing is reduced to 8ft. horizontally and also vertical separation > limitations between levels must be recognized. > > > > > > Craig L. Prahl, CET > Fire Protection Specialist > Mechanical Department > CH2MHILL > Lockwood Greene > 1500 International Drive > PO Box 491, Spartanburg, SC 29304-0491 > Direct - 864.599.4102 > Fax - 864.599.8439 > [email protected] > http://www.ch2m.com > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Greg McGahan > Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 10:23 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: RE: pilot lines > > What about Para .9 that allows you to increase the spacing to 10'-0" for a > given level? This para's explanation is indicative of pilot heads with > nothing above them to collect heat. > > I also sent this to NFPA. > > Greg McGahan > > Living Water Fire Protection > (850) 937.1850 | Fax (850) 937.1852 | Cell (850) 554.3231 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of > [email protected] > Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 9:19 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: RE: pilot lines > > If it's outside - 8ft. It's either inside or outside. > > Is this for a deluge system? > > > Craig L. Prahl, CET > Fire Protection Specialist > Mechanical Department > CH2MHILL > Lockwood Greene > 1500 International Drive > PO Box 491, Spartanburg, SC 29304-0491 > Direct - 864.599.4102 > Fax - 864.599.8439 > [email protected] > http://www.ch2m.com > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] > [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Greg McGahan > Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2010 10:12 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: pilot lines > > NFPA #15 6.5.2.4 > > Para .2 - Pilot lines under a ceiling - spacing per 13 Para .8 - Outdoors - > spacing at 8'-0 > > Situation - Soffit on the exterior of a building 2'-4" wide....... > > Which one is the absolute in this situation? > > Greg McGahan > > Living Water Fire Protection > (850) 937.1850 | Fax (850) 937.1852 | Cell (850) 554.3231 > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > > For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > > To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] > (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > > For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > > To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] > (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > > For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > > To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] > (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > > For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > > To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] > (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > > For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > > To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] > (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > > For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > > To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] > (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > > For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > > To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] > (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum > > For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] > > To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] > (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) > -- Ron Greenman Instructor Fire Protection Engineering Bates Technical College Tacoma, WA Member: SFPE, ASCET, NFPA, AFSA, NFSA AFAA, NIBS, WSAFM, WFC _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [email protected] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[email protected] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
