Uhhhhhh ... not sure those metrics matter or if I even understand the point you're making.
Once upon a time, floor controls were not required on multi-story buildings unless subject building was code-classified as high-rise. Even then, the requirement to control and alarm each floor separately was (and still is) in the building code(s) and we just played along. Since those days, we now have indoor plumbing AND clear prescriptions in NFPA 13 and 14 for when and how to sectionally control floors of a sprinkler system. But it's still just one system with a single main riser unless there's more than one main riser. There is no limit to the number of standpipes you can install off of a single "system", but if you have floors greater than 52,000 sq. ft. in LH and/or OH occupancies, then you would need two sprinkler risers or "systems". Where it gets confusing to me is whether you can select two standpipes in a single system (as defined by NFPA 14) and make them combination to fulfill the requirement, or whether you would need a completely separate system with its own connection to a water supply and dedicated riser. Perhaps someone can enlighten me, but it appears that the 2013 requirement for floor control assemblies in buildings 2-stories in height has been taken out of the standard. So I guess the status quo in 13 depends on which edition you're using, but in a non-high-rise building, NFPA 14 affords you the option of creating combination standpipes but requires that for every sprinkler connection there must be a control and check valve. So except for the requirement to sectionally alarm each floor as in a high-rise, you have a defacto floor control assembly in practice. However, none of this creates a separate "system" horizontally, IMHO. The foregoing is my opinion only and is not intended to represent the NFPA 14 Technical Committee, nor serve as an interpretation of the standard. Steve Leyton Protection Design & Consulting San Diego, CA From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Jeff Bridges Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2016 11:31 AM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: 5 year fire sprinkler Obstruction Assessment - What items in a system define it as a separate wet pipe system? I didn't I was showing if it all is one system as Ron was eluding to, floor controls not considered as separation, the cumulative total of floor space being covered under a single riser would be 120K BUT if floor controls ARE considered as a riser, each RISER is covering 30K. I never said that 30K is a max per riser but if, under my example, floor controls are merely considered making the system easier to drain and not a separate system, then it exceeds 52K as allowed. Right? Jeff Bridges JB Fire Protection Inc (888) 523-4737 Fax (714) 578-0901 Fire Sprinklers Save Lives & Property www.jbfireprotection.com<http://www.jbfireprotection.com/> This email transmission (and any of its attachments) is intended only for the person or entity to whom it is addressed, and may contain confidential, proprietary and/or privileged information. No waiver of any applicable privileges or protections is intended hereby. If you are not the person to whom this transmission is addressed, you are hereby notified that the disclosure, copying, distribution, reliance upon or use of any of the information contained in this transmission is strictly prohibited. If you have received this transmission in error, delete any copies which may exist on your system and notify the sender immediately. This email transmission cannot be guaranteed secure or error-free. Any views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifies them to be the views of the company and is authorized to do so. From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Parsley Consulting Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2016 11:07 AM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: Re: 5 year fire sprinkler Obstruction Assessment - What items in a system define it as a separate wet pipe system? Jeff, I'm kind of curious how you've decided that 30,000 square foot per floor exceeds the allowable floor space per riser. Aren't the values in 8.2.1 supposed to be applied to any one floor area? Ken Wagoner, SET Parsley Consulting 350 West 9th Avenue, Suite 206 Escondido, California 92025 Phone 760-745-6181 Visit our website<http://www.parsleyconsulting.com/> On 09/01/2016 10:45 AM, Jeff Bridges wrote: I would respectfully disagree with the below analogy. Example: (4) Story building consisting of 30K SF per floor Single lead-in supply- combo standpipe with floor controls. How can it be considered a single system when it exceeds the allowable floor space per riser? Just sayin' Jeff Bridges JBFP Inc I have to disagree with this analysis that a floor control valve defines a system. A floor control valve is not even defined individually in 2013 whereas a sprinkler system is (no mention of floor control valves) as are control valves. As always, I would consider a system to be what it has always been and the addition of the required floor control valve and associated requirements on systems in multi-story buildings just nationally codifies a common practice hereabouts of building a system that has isolatable floors. This way an entire large building does not need to be drained to make a repair or for a T.I., leaves fore protection in service on floors not effected and also conserves water. I'm open to an argument that changes my mind but this one doesn't. _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
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