Don't think I clearly stated my point but writin never been my best subject lol
Jeff JB Fire Protection Sent from my iPhone > On Sep 1, 2016, at 11:49, Steve Leyton <[email protected]> wrote: > > Uhhhhhh … not sure those metrics matter or if I even understand the point > you’re making. > > Once upon a time, floor controls were not required on multi-story buildings > unless subject building was code-classified as high-rise. Even then, the > requirement to control and alarm each floor separately was (and still is) in > the building code(s) and we just played along. Since those days, we now > have indoor plumbing AND clear prescriptions in NFPA 13 and 14 for when and > how to sectionally control floors of a sprinkler system. But it’s still just > one system with a single main riser unless there’s more than one main riser. > There is no limit to the number of standpipes you can install off of a > single “system”, but if you have floors greater than 52,000 sq. ft. in LH > and/or OH occupancies, then you would need two sprinkler risers or “systems”. > Where it gets confusing to me is whether you can select two standpipes in a > single system (as defined by NFPA 14) and make them combination to fulfill > the requirement, or whether you would need a completely separate system with > its own connection to a water supply and dedicated riser. > > Perhaps someone can enlighten me, but it appears that the 2013 requirement > for floor control assemblies in buildings 2-stories in height has been taken > out of the standard. So I guess the status quo in 13 depends on which > edition you’re using, but in a non-high-rise building, NFPA 14 affords you > the option of creating combination standpipes but requires that for every > sprinkler connection there must be a control and check valve. So except for > the requirement to sectionally alarm each floor as in a high-rise, you have a > defacto floor control assembly in practice. However, none of this creates a > separate “system” horizontally, IMHO. > > The foregoing is my opinion only and is not intended to represent the NFPA 14 > Technical Committee, nor serve as an interpretation of the standard. > > Steve Leyton > Protection Design & Consulting > San Diego, CA > > > > > > From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:[email protected]] > On Behalf Of Jeff Bridges > Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2016 11:31 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: RE: 5 year fire sprinkler Obstruction Assessment - What items in a > system define it as a separate wet pipe system? > > I didn’t > I was showing if it all is one system as Ron was eluding to, floor controls > not considered as separation, the cumulative total of floor space being > covered under a single riser would be 120K > BUT if floor controls ARE considered as a riser, each RISER is covering 30K. > I never said that 30K is a max per riser but if, under my example, floor > controls are merely considered making the system easier to drain and not a > separate system, then it exceeds 52K as allowed. > Right? > > Jeff Bridges > JB Fire Protection Inc > (888) 523-4737 Fax (714) 578-0901 > Fire Sprinklers Save Lives & Property > www.jbfireprotection.com > > This email transmission (and any of its attachments) is intended only for the > person or entity to whom it is addressed, and may contain confidential, > proprietary and/or privileged information. No waiver of any applicable > privileges or protections is intended hereby. If you are not the person to > whom this transmission is addressed, you are hereby notified that the > disclosure, copying, distribution, reliance upon or use of any of the > information contained in this transmission is strictly prohibited. If you > have received this transmission in error, delete any copies which may exist > on your system and notify the sender immediately. This email transmission > cannot be guaranteed secure or error-free. Any views expressed in this > message are those of the individual sender, except where the sender specifies > them to be the views of the company and is authorized to do so. > > > From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:[email protected]] > On Behalf Of Parsley Consulting > Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2016 11:07 AM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: 5 year fire sprinkler Obstruction Assessment - What items in a > system define it as a separate wet pipe system? > > Jeff, > I'm kind of curious how you've decided that 30,000 square foot per floor > exceeds the allowable floor space per riser. Aren't the values in 8.2.1 > supposed to be applied to any one floor area? > Ken Wagoner, SET > Parsley Consulting > 350 West 9th Avenue, Suite 206 > Escondido, California 92025 > Phone 760-745-6181 > Visit our website > > On 09/01/2016 10:45 AM, Jeff Bridges wrote: > I would respectfully disagree with the below analogy. > Example: (4) Story building consisting of 30K SF per floor > Single lead-in supply- combo standpipe with floor controls. > How can it be considered a single system when it exceeds the allowable floor > space per riser? > Just sayin’ > > Jeff Bridges > JBFP Inc > > > > > I have to disagree with this analysis that a floor control valve defines a > system. A floor control valve is not even defined individually in 2013 > whereas a sprinkler system is (no mention of floor control valves) as are > control valves. As always, I would consider a system to be what it has always > been and the addition of the required floor control valve and associated > requirements on systems in multi-story buildings just nationally codifies a > common practice hereabouts of building a system that has isolatable floors. > This way an entire large building does not need to be drained to make a > repair or for a T.I., leaves fore protection in service on floors not > effected and also conserves water. I'm open to an argument that changes my > mind but this one doesn't. > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org > > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
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