Is there any distinction made for 'vertical circulation'?
Quoting James Litvak <[email protected]>:
The standpipe is in a stairwell. Some of the stairs it'll be in the corner,
others beside the door. All of them will be outside the required path of
egress clearance. The definition of circulation path in A117.1 is "An
exterior or interior way of passage from one place to another for
pedestrians". It's pretty vague. Unfortunately there's no differentiation
between, say, a hallway or a stairwell. I think I'll contact the building
department and see what they think. Hopefully they'll write something for
me saying that section doesn't apply.
On Tue, Nov 14, 2017 at 3:40 PM Mike B Morey <[email protected]> wrote:
Unfortunately other than the fact that the drawings in the 3## section
make it pretty obvious this isn't what they're talking about, there's no
definitions. I figured if its a stairwell it's an easier shoot down for
someone who wants to write their own interpretations since the conspicuous
absence of stairs in pretty much this entire standard should make it pretty
open and shut. You could argue its not those things and that the previous
section says leading edge, which the leading edge of the handle if you put
it parallel to the floor probably isn't more than 4" out. Basically this
code section is to keep someone tapping a cane against the edge of the
walking path from slamming into some random protruding object, if they hit
the hand wheel it may not be super pleasant but its not the kind of
protrusion, IMHO, this section addresses. Just one of those fun common
sense vs power trip things probably. Standard disclaimer, these are my
opinions only and have not been approved or reviewed by my employer.
------------------------------
*Mike Morey*
*CFPS 3229 • NICET S.E.T. 123677*
*Project Manager* • Fire Protection Group
* Shambaugh & Son, LP **an EMCOR Company*
7614 Opportunity Drive • Fort Wayne, IN • 46825
*direct *260.487.7824* / cell *260.417.0625* / fax *260.487.7991
* email *[email protected]
From: "rongreenman ." <[email protected]>
To: [email protected]
Date: 11/14/2017 03:25 PM
Subject: Re: ANSI A1171.1 Figure 307.3
Sent by: "Sprinklerforum" <
[email protected]>
------------------------------
Does the standard define the standpipe as a post or pylon?
On Tue, Nov 14, 2017 at 12:10 PM Mike B Morey <*[email protected]*
<[email protected]>> wrote:
Where is the standpipe located? Are we talking a typical stairwell
install or elsewhere? Section 307 starts off by stating that it governs
circulation paths, and stairs aren't part of that definition in section
1005 based on a quick look. The standard is available several places
online if you google it, not sure if they're "legal" copies but for the
sake of answering the question I'd take a look at that angle. If its in a
hall or something I'd imagine it could be put in a box in the wall or
something.
------------------------------
* Mike Morey*
* CFPS 3229 • NICET S.E.T. 123677*
* Project Manager* • Fire Protection Group
* Shambaugh & Son, LP **an EMCOR Company*
7614 Opportunity Drive • Fort Wayne, IN • 46825
* direct *260.487.7824* / cell *260.417.0625* / fax *260.487.7991
* email **[email protected]* <[email protected]>
From: James Litvak <*[email protected]* <[email protected]>
>
To: "*[email protected]*
<[email protected]>" <
*[email protected]*
<[email protected]>>
Date: 11/14/2017 02:59 PM
Subject: ANSI A1171.1 Figure 307.3
Sent by: "Sprinklerforum" <
*[email protected]*
<[email protected]>>
------------------------------
I'm working on building permit plans for a job, and the architect passed
on an email from their accessibility consultant that the fire department
hose valves can't protrude beyond the standpipe riser more than 4", per
ANSI A117.1 figure 307.3. The text of that section is:
307.3 Post-Mounted Objects. Objects on posts or pylons shall be permitted
to overhang 4 inches (100 mm) maximum where more than 27 inches (685 mm)
and not more than 80 inches (2030 mm) above the floor. Objects on multiple
posts or pylons where the clear distance between the posts or pylons is
greater than 12 inches (305 mm) shall have the lowest edge of such object
either 27 inches (685 mm) maximum or 80 inches (2030 mm) minimum above the
floor.
What they're saying is that we will need to turn an elbow up from the
outlet of the standpipe and install the valve vertical. I've already told
them this won't work anyway, since the valve itself has a 5" hand wheel,
and due to takeouts, the least amount of projection physically possible is
about 8". According to the consultant, the way to mitigate this is to
install cane protection, which the architect appears to want to avoid. Is
anyone aware of this code section, and does it apply the way I'm being told
it does? In nearly 13 years as a designer, I've never been told such a
requirement exists.
James
Charlotte, NC_______________________________________________
Sprinklerforum mailing list
*[email protected]*
<[email protected]>
*https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__lists.firesprinkler.org_listinfo.cgi_sprinklerforum-2Dfiresprinkler.org&d=DwICAg&c=GKdB6-XpYq_0W-WluyVHtw&r=z4t2hrRBa-JsS06T4X_uuYOSJoclVWgSRO8Nq6TDdsg&m=wiCt1iqr5u69Txm-iBELel0Xzd3F5uGuCJUQXBz1wqg&s=xRsf5UToNzmQSkkENHTI-JrcpESCaLYKnTi-kcXYGmg&e=*
<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__lists.firesprinkler.org_listinfo.cgi_sprinklerforum-2Dfiresprinkler.org&d=DwICAg&c=GKdB6-XpYq_0W-WluyVHtw&r=z4t2hrRBa-JsS06T4X_uuYOSJoclVWgSRO8Nq6TDdsg&m=wiCt1iqr5u69Txm-iBELel0Xzd3F5uGuCJUQXBz1wqg&s=xRsf5UToNzmQSkkENHTI-JrcpESCaLYKnTi-kcXYGmg&e=>
This message is for the named person's use only. It may contain
confidential, proprietary or legally privileged information. No
confidentiality or privilege is waived or lost by any mistransmission. If
you receive this message in error, please immediately delete it and all
copies of it from your system, destroy any hard copies of it and notify the
sender. You must not, directly or indirectly, use, disclose, distribute,
print, or copy any part of this message if you are not the intended
recipient.
_______________________________________________
Sprinklerforum mailing list
*[email protected]*
<[email protected]>
*http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org*
<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__lists.firesprinkler.org_listinfo.cgi_sprinklerforum-2Dfiresprinkler.org&d=DwMFaQ&c=GKdB6-XpYq_0W-WluyVHtw&r=z4t2hrRBa-JsS06T4X_uuYOSJoclVWgSRO8Nq6TDdsg&m=5qwVwJLjSTa1NIX64A78M2wWVYYDHlGdPLp5aekf9Eg&s=hCvxa01YwdjeSk4O21JWnAfEVWaoF93WIMHJkrFr_lM&e=>
--
Sent from Gmail Mobile[attachment "attcgpkb.jpg" deleted by Mike B
Morey/Shambaugh/EMCORGROUP]
_______________________________________________
Sprinklerforum mailing list
[email protected]
https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__lists.firesprinkler.org_listinfo.cgi_sprinklerforum-2Dfiresprinkler.org&d=DwICAg&c=GKdB6-XpYq_0W-WluyVHtw&r=z4t2hrRBa-JsS06T4X_uuYOSJoclVWgSRO8Nq6TDdsg&m=5qwVwJLjSTa1NIX64A78M2wWVYYDHlGdPLp5aekf9Eg&s=hCvxa01YwdjeSk4O21JWnAfEVWaoF93WIMHJkrFr_lM&e=
_______________________________________________
Sprinklerforum mailing list
[email protected]
http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
_______________________________________________
Sprinklerforum mailing list
[email protected]
http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
