To me it seems pretty logical that if God
revealed his secrets to prophets in Bible times, he would continue doing so
afterwards.....even unto this day. I have heard that some Christians
believe the heavens are sealed though.....do you believe such?
jt: No I don't and I'd like to point out that God is not bound by logic....
but you've still not come up with any incomprehensible mystery and what is
revealed is for us and for our children
DAVEH: Hmmmmmm.......I thought my explanation of paradise qualifies as a 'mystery solved'. Or perhaps instead of it being a mystery, it was just a misunderstanding of how a specific passage of Scripture should be interpreted.
... God still hides things from folk who think themselves wise and prudent and reveals them to babes...
DAVEH: I don't view the thief/paradise deal was hidden by God. IMO.....He plainly revealed it in the Bible, but it became a mystery to those who made assumptions based on other passages that were mysteries.
DAVEH: Hmmmmmm.......I thought my explanation of paradise qualifies as a 'mystery solved'. Or perhaps instead of it being a mystery, it was just a misunderstanding of how a specific passage of Scripture should be interpreted.
... God still hides things from folk who think themselves wise and prudent and reveals them to babes...
DAVEH: I don't view the thief/paradise deal was hidden by God. IMO.....He plainly revealed it in the Bible, but it became a mystery to those who made assumptions based on other passages that were mysteries.
jt: What are you talking about? Jesus went to Paradise before he
ascended and when he did ascend he took all the ppl in Paradise with him - those
in Abraham's bosom that is. So your mathmetical exercise didn't change
anything. In Matt 13:13,14,15 Jesus tells his disciples that he speaks in
parables to hide things rather than to reveal them
DAVEH: LDS theology teaches we were all created by God as spirit children in heaven, which includes you, me, Jesus and Lucifer. Lucifer rebelled and became our "personal adversarys". <snip>
DAVEH: LDS theology teaches we were all created by God as spirit children in heaven, which includes you, me, Jesus and Lucifer. Lucifer rebelled and became our "personal adversarys". <snip>
DAVEH: That's part of it......But
not the whole story. The Bible teaches much more, but it has been
suppressed to make a 'simpler' theology work for many more people. While
baptism in itself will not save anybody, I firmly believe without baptism, one
cannot be saved. (Mk 16:16 and Jn 3:5)
jt: Who has been doing the suppressing Dave? Regeneration by baptism
is NOT a scriptural teaching.
DAVEH: The Bible clearly explains
that baptism is an essential part of salvation. You and DavidM have been
discussing such lately, and I don't feel the need to repeat his arguments.
jt: So you are in agreement with DavidM
about regenerational baptism then? I see.....
DAVEH: However, I believe some passages
(that DavidM does not necessarily accept) even clarify the point further.
Jesus says in Jn 3:5...... ".....Verily, verily, I
say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of Spirit, he cannot enter into
the kingdom of God." .........To me, Judy,
that passage is pretty self explanatory, unless one is compelled to think 'born
of water' really means birth. Well in a sense it does symbolize
birth.....a rebirth that is known as baptism.
jt: Wrong - This is a rebirth that is impossible for anyone other than God
Himself to perform and it does not refer to water baptism. John 3:5 speaks of
being born of the Spirit or "Born Again." The water spoken of here is the
water of God's Word which will also wash a person but then I realize I am
wasting my time. I don't believe you are interested in the Truth because
you believe yourself to be so far ahead of most of us.
DAVEH: Once again I think you've
made a false assumption, Judy. Unless you specifically ask for a quotation
from other Latter-day revelation, I will base most all my comments I post to TT
from the Bible. I use a KJV of the Bible, and accept is as the word of God
as far as it is translated correctly.
jt: ... and where it is not translated correctly I suppose is where it
conflicts with your extra biblical revelation... God is not trying to make
anything simpler for anybody. He says "I am the Lord, I change not" but we
as believers are to love ppl and encourage them to repent and to seek Him with
their whole heart. He deals with individuals. The thief who was
forgiven on the cross went to Paradise without baptism.
DAVEH: As I indicated at the
beginning of this post....... that is another false assumption I believe you
have made. I'd love to hear your rebuttal to my explanation (in a couple
parallel posts.)
jt: Your explanation doesn't change a thing. The thief went to
Paradise with Jesus that very day ascended with the rest of the ppl in
Abraham's bosom with Jesus when he ascended but he was in Paradise with him THAT
DAY. What is the big revelation? There were two parts of Paradise
DaveH and the people Jesus preached to were the ones in Abraham's bosom ie: the
righteous dead who had not as yet seen the Promise - the ones spoken of in
Hebrews 11.... The rich man who wanted to warn his brothers not to come there
was in the other part, the part that did NOT ascend with Jesus.
Judy
