David Smith wrote: > Despite your request to the contrary, this very long winded message is > begging for responses. If all you wanted was for people with Gentoo > packaged tomcat to contact Gentoo user's list, you should have simply > requested that. > > On to the comments --- > > 1. Compiling tomcat. Why??? Java by it's design is one binary > byte-code for all platforms. Is there really any reason to build it > from source? Well... aside from the Commons-daemon code (jsvc) used > to launch tomcat as a service and the tc-native library for the > connectors. Those bits of native code still requires a build. The idea of Gentoo is to have USE flags that compile in optional libraries based on a system wide decision by the user. A package is pulled from the net, and compiled from source, so everything follows the same set of rules. > > 2. The tomcat-dbcp.jar is intended to avoid a classloader collision > between tomcat's built-in database pooling functions and Commons-DBCP > release builds. I don't see a problem here. > > 3. Personally I would create one package with tomcat-core as close as > possible to what's provided by the tomcat download site and then > create packages for all these dependencies. People can opt-in or > opt-out of the extra features at their discretion. It would make more > of the already built documentation applicable to their setup. > > Lastly, since the main point of this message is to ask us to steer > Gentoo users towards you for questions, we would welcome a > representative on the tomcat-users list who could respond to those > questions. There shouldn't be a need to make people choose one or the > other and most will seek out what they perceive to be the most > authoritative source. I see if I google for 'Gentoo tomcat' I get > your Tomcat guide as the first result. Too bad google isn't used more > often for some of these questions. It's not to get users away from your lists. It is so you don't get flooded with people that have an issue due to the Gentoo build process. It is more of a filter process. > > --David > > William L. Thomson Jr. wrote: >> Ok, not even sure where to start so I will kinda just jump in with this. >> I am not looking to start a flame war, or long thread. I would prefer >> this thread not to grow beyond this post. As there are better places, >> like Gentoo java mailing list, gentoo forums, irc, etc. In the Gentoo >> Tomcat Guide[1] I request users do this before say contacting upstream >> mailing lists or etc. Like what happened in this case. >> >> I am the present maintainer of Tomcat on Gentoo. I started doing so a >> year ago when I noticed 5.0.27 was the lastest stable, and 5.5.x was >> pretty far from hitting the tree, despite being almost a year old at the >> time. The Tomcat maintainer was mia. So I slowly took over and >> eventually became an official dev. >> >> To being with, on Gentoo we compile Open Source Software from source. >> This is quite common in the FOSS world everywhere except for Java.[2] >> For some reason you can't get Apache http server binaries, but you can >> get Tomcat binaries. >> >> With that said, compiling Tomcat from source is COMPLETELY different >> than downloading a pre-built binary version of Tomcat. That has bundled >> dependencies. As in third party jars not part of Tomcat, but shipped >> with it. Because Tomcat needs them to run. >> >> Now keep in mind not only are we compiling Tomcat from source, we are >> compiling all of Tomcat's dependencies from source as well. Which leads >> to considerable dependencies. So package A depends only on B, but to >> build package B might need/depend on the entire alphabet :) >> >> Tomcat 5.5.20, has a ton of build time dependencies with even more >> optional dependencies. It's not clear if the optional dependencies >> activate functionality or not within Tomcat. Some of these in question >> are like Sun's jaf and javamail. Which till recent were not open source >> or easily available, and could only be obtained as binaries from Sun. So >> instead of having a potentially limited functionality Tomcat, we provide >> all possible dependencies, as would be present when Tomcat devs build >> and package Tomcat. >> >> Others can't be bi-passed at all. Try compiling Tomcat with say IBM JDK. >> You will notice classes are missing. Because only Sun JDK's and >> blackdown implement JSSE. There is talk of removing that SSL code, and >> pretty sure has been done with Tomcat 6.0.x. We don't even package JSSE >> on Gentoo, since it's a pre 1.4 tech. Tomcat is one of the only apps >> that is using or needs that stuff. >> >> Now Tomcat 6.0.x has WAY less deps. A MUCH cleaner and clearer >> build/compile process. Despite a bit of nastiness still going on. Like >> naming-factory-dbcp.jar called tomcat-dbcp.jar. Is basically a slightly >> modified re-packaged and compiled from source commons-dbcp, >> commons-pool, and commons-collections. Most all Tomcat packagers for >> Linux distros have voiced their opinion on how that jar is built. So far >> seem to have fallen on deaf ears. >> >> Finally let me apologize for that unfortunately user who decided to post >> here first. Rather than contacting the proper channels first. Seems >> there is lots they don't get about the distro they have chosen to run. >> Much less where to go with questions, problems, or for help with distro >> provided packages. >> >> 1. http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/java/tomcat-guide.xml >> 2. http://www.gentoo.org/proj/en/java/why-build-from-source.xml >> >> P.S. >> For anyone that has a real problem with the dependencies. Our build >> system on Gentoo, specifically ebuilds, are just bash scripts. So one is >> totally free to modify and attempt to reduce the Tomcat's dependencies >> on Gentoo. Good luck there, don't think I haven't tried and haven't been >> there. As is seems to be an issue with our java5 USE flag. Either a >> dropped dep, or compiling Tomcat as 1.5 source/target is causing >> catalina.jar to be off a bit. Lacking some functionality or code as it >> seems. Dropping other deps would likely do the same to other jars. >> >> Also pretty sure the only way to get a 1.5 bytecode Tomcat is to compile >> from source :) Which if one enables the java5 USE flag on Gentoo. Not >> only can they run under 1.5 jre, but they are running 1.5 bytecode. >> Upstream binaries are 1.4 bytecode ;) >> >> > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To start a new topic, e-mail: users@tomcat.apache.org > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >
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