I'm just not sure what kind of control you have over the firewall with these cloud servers...
On Jul 30, 2010, at 8:48 PM, Chuck Hill wrote: > > On Jul 30, 2010, at 5:42 PM, Ken Anderson wrote: > >> Does everyone run apache and WO on the same machine? No DMZ? > > That depends on the size of the installation. Usually Apache and some of the > instances can co-exist. You can run Apache on each machine and put a load > balancer in front. For lower usage apps, you can put the database on the > same machine. Put them all behind a firewall and only allow 80 and 443 > through. > > Chuck > > > >> I'm still not clear on how these cloud servers are supposed to work >> regarding separation... >> >> Ken >> >> On Jul 29, 2010, at 1:35 AM, Lon Varscsak wrote: >> >>> I have a dedicated box on rackspace too...it's pricey, but solid as a rock. >>> WO/apache/Postgres. >>> >>> -Lon >>> >>> On Wed, Jul 28, 2010 at 6:24 PM, James Cicenia <ja...@jimijon.com> wrote: >>> I actually have a dedicated managed box over at Rackspace. Their support is >>> top notch. And the webobjects app just keep chugging. I use mysql. >>> >>> - James >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Jul 28, 2010, at 3:49 PM, Ken Anderson wrote: >>> >>>> I'm considering using rackspace and fathomdb - seems very similar to ec2 >>>> and rds. Anyone have any experience with rackspace? I've been using the >>>> for mail hosting for a while and I like them. >>>> >>>> Ken >>>> >>>> On Jul 28, 2010, at 5:51 AM, Giles Palmer wrote: >>>> >>>>> +1 for a podcast! >>>>> >>>>> We are just starting down the EC2 route and would be very interested in >>>>> your experiences. We are using postgres so can't make use of RDS which >>>>> is a great shame, we are also intending to make use of hBase (Hadoop) for >>>>> some of our file storage. >>>>> >>>>> Giles >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> You know, that could make a great podcast or even better, a nice WOWODC >>>>>> presentation :-) Ubermind did a great introduction to WOlastic last >>>>>> year, your case study can complement it. >>>>>> >>>>>>> doing what you've done means you're managing mysql, looking after it, >>>>>>> making sure it doesn't fall over, doing backups, managing replication >>>>>>> etc. rds does all of that for you. it also makes changing the config of >>>>>>> your database server a breeze: need more disk space ? couple of clicks. >>>>>>> need more ram ? couple of clicks. need more compute power behind it ? >>>>>>> couple of clicks. need automatic fail-over to a different availability >>>>>>> zone ? couple of clicks. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> re web server resources, remember it's just a normal wo deployment >>>>>>> running in the cloud, so you can do whatever you do now. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> we don't separate the web and app tier - all our ec2 instances run >>>>>>> monitor, wotaskd and apache, and are effectively independent of each >>>>>>> other, and we use an elastic load balancer up front. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> simon >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On 27 July 2010 17:40, James Cicenia <ja...@jimijon.com> wrote: >>>>>>> So the base image is the actual OS? So you are managing it as the admin? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I decided to try WOlastic. I configured the instances, setup up mysql >>>>>>> with my users and sync'd the database from existing production to >>>>>>> amazon. >>>>>>> So you are suggesting RDS vs. what I just did? What are the benefits of >>>>>>> RDS? Amazon backs up the mysql I created. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Now I am a bit stumped on WebServerResources. How are you handling that? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Well, if this works well, I can my webobject apps over and then just >>>>>>> sell my server and drop the colo. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> - James >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Jul 27, 2010, at 11:28 AM, Simon wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> rolling your own is surprisingly easy if you start with a base image. >>>>>>>> we started out with a vanilla centos image from rightscale, and have >>>>>>>> built it up into what we needed from there. you can then create an >>>>>>>> ebs-backed ami in a couple of clicks. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> re pricing, it all depends on what you need. our financial models tell >>>>>>>> us for our deployment is excellent value for money, and we can scale >>>>>>>> well beyond our current needs and it remains as such. use the cost aws >>>>>>>> calculator to figure out your own costs, and remember to factor in >>>>>>>> staff costs in your decision making process. those DBA's are darn >>>>>>>> expensive compared to RDS :-) >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> http://calculator.s3.amazonaws.com/calc5.html >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> the only performance issue we found is that it is basically impossible >>>>>>>> to host your DB outside of amazon due to latency. but you don't have >>>>>>>> to use RDS - if you like sticking needles in your eyes you can just >>>>>>>> run and look after your own mysql / postgre / mssql / whatever on an >>>>>>>> ec2 instance. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> the general performance of our apps has also vastly improved. a >>>>>>>> mixture of using more computing power and amazon having much faster >>>>>>>> internet transit than we were paying for in our previous co-lo. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> alongside production we also run our staging servers and our hudson >>>>>>>> build server on ec2. in productivity terms running hudson there was a >>>>>>>> huge leap forward: previously a new build would take around 30 minutes >>>>>>>> to upload to staging / production. now it takes 19 seconds flat :-) >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> we're shortly going to move our subversion repository to ec2 as well. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Simon >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 27 July 2010 15:13, James Cicenia <ja...@jimijon.com> wrote: >>>>>>>> This is very cool. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I need to move one of my servers, or, use the cloud approach for its >>>>>>>> WOApps. I see you rolled your own but wolastic seems like it is for a >>>>>>>> mere mortal. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Anyone use wolastic? What is the pricing your are seeing? Issues? >>>>>>>> Performances? Etc. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Thanks. >>>>>>>> James Cicenia >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Jul 26, 2010, at 3:55 PM, Simon wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> we don't use the wolastic images (we have our own) but we do deploy >>>>>>>>> entirely on the amazon ec2 cloud now. ec2 instances running standard >>>>>>>>> javamonitor / wotaskd, amazon RDS for database server, s3 for file >>>>>>>>> storage etc. scalability on demand, load balancing, redundancy across >>>>>>>>> multiple availability zones. it's the best thing since sliced bread... >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> our staging servers (also on ec2) run wonders javamonitor / wotasd >>>>>>>>> and hence we'll probably upgrade our production servers to those soon. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> simon >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On 26 July 2010 21:36, Ramsey Gurley <ram...@xeotech.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>> I haven't tried it yet, but WOlastic looks like a *really* cool >>>>>>>>> deployment solution for WO. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> http://wolastic.com/ >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Ramsey >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Jul 26, 2010, at 4:27 PM, Ken Anderson wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Thanks for the thoughts guys! >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Ken >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Jul 26, 2010, at 1:42 PM, Pascal Robert wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Le 2010-07-26 à 12:55, Chuck Hill a écrit : >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Jul 26, 2010, at 9:44 AM, Ken Anderson wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I've been asked to comment on the best way to deploy WebObjects today >>>>>>>>> without any "imposed" restrictions. I haven't done any new >>>>>>>>> deployments in a long while, so I'm likely not up to date on the >>>>>>>>> last. What are people using today, and why do they think it's the >>>>>>>>> best? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Thanks much! >>>>>>>>> Ken >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Lacking imposed restrictions (e.g. must run in J2EE container), >>>>>>>>> traditional WO deployment through Apache with mod_webobjects is >>>>>>>>> probably the way to go. Anjo was working on mod_proxy deployment, >>>>>>>>> but I don't recall how far he got or if he has this in production. >>>>>>>>> It looked promising. There is also a Fast CGI adaptor and Ravi is >>>>>>>>> working on something for WOWODC. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I'm adding some mods in JavaMonitor too (for WOWODC) and Andrew >>>>>>>>> Lindesay also have stuff in LEWOStuff to use mod_proxy_ajp. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> ---- >>>>>>>>> Pascal Robert >>>>>>>>> prob...@macti.ca >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> AIM: MacTICanada >>>>>>>>> Twitter : MacTICanada >>>>>>>>> LinkedIn : http://www.linkedin.com/in/macti >>>>>>>>> WO Community profile : http://wocommunity.org/page/member?name=probert >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >>>>>>>>> Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) >>>>>>>>> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >>>>>>>>> http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/ramsey%40xeotech.com >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> This email sent to ram...@xeotech.com >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >>>>>>>>> Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) >>>>>>>>> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >>>>>>>>> http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/simon%40potwells.co.uk >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> This email sent to si...@potwells.co.uk >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >>>>>>>>> Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) >>>>>>>>> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >>>>>>>>> http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/james%40jimijon.com >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> This email sent to ja...@jimijon.com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >>>>>>> Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) >>>>>>> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >>>>>>> http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/probert%40macti.ca >>>>>>> >>>>>>> This email sent to prob...@macti.ca >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >>>>>> Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) >>>>>> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >>>>>> http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/lists%40cedarstone.co.uk >>>>>> >>>>>> This email sent to li...@cedarstone.co.uk >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >>>>> Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) >>>>> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >>>>> http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/kenlists%40anderhome.com >>>>> >>>>> This email sent to kenli...@anderhome.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >>>> Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) >>>> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >>>> http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/james%40jimijon.com >>>> >>>> This email sent to ja...@jimijon.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >>> Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) >>> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >>> http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/varscsak%40smarthealth.com >>> >>> This email sent to varsc...@smarthealth.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >>> Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) >>> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >>> http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/kenlists%40anderhome.com >>> >>> This email sent to kenli...@anderhome.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >> Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) >> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >> http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/chill%40global-village.net >> >> This email sent to ch...@global-village.net > > -- > Chuck Hill Senior Consultant / VP Development > > Practical WebObjects - for developers who want to increase their overall > knowledge of WebObjects or who are trying to solve specific problems. > http://www.global-village.net/products/practical_webobjects > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. 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