I honestly have no idea. That is an interesting question. Chuck
On Jul 30, 2010, at 6:55 PM, Ken Anderson wrote: > I'm just not sure what kind of control you have over the firewall with these > cloud servers... > > > On Jul 30, 2010, at 8:48 PM, Chuck Hill wrote: > >> >> On Jul 30, 2010, at 5:42 PM, Ken Anderson wrote: >> >>> Does everyone run apache and WO on the same machine? No DMZ? >> >> That depends on the size of the installation. Usually Apache and some of >> the instances can co-exist. You can run Apache on each machine and put a >> load balancer in front. For lower usage apps, you can put the database on >> the same machine. Put them all behind a firewall and only allow 80 and 443 >> through. >> >> Chuck >> >> >> >>> I'm still not clear on how these cloud servers are supposed to work >>> regarding separation... >>> >>> Ken >>> >>> On Jul 29, 2010, at 1:35 AM, Lon Varscsak wrote: >>> >>>> I have a dedicated box on rackspace too...it's pricey, but solid as a >>>> rock. WO/apache/Postgres. >>>> >>>> -Lon >>>> >>>> On Wed, Jul 28, 2010 at 6:24 PM, James Cicenia <ja...@jimijon.com> wrote: >>>> I actually have a dedicated managed box over at Rackspace. Their support >>>> is top notch. And the webobjects app just keep chugging. I use mysql. >>>> >>>> - James >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Jul 28, 2010, at 3:49 PM, Ken Anderson wrote: >>>> >>>>> I'm considering using rackspace and fathomdb - seems very similar to ec2 >>>>> and rds. Anyone have any experience with rackspace? I've been using the >>>>> for mail hosting for a while and I like them. >>>>> >>>>> Ken >>>>> >>>>> On Jul 28, 2010, at 5:51 AM, Giles Palmer wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> +1 for a podcast! >>>>>> >>>>>> We are just starting down the EC2 route and would be very interested in >>>>>> your experiences. We are using postgres so can't make use of RDS which >>>>>> is a great shame, we are also intending to make use of hBase (Hadoop) >>>>>> for some of our file storage. >>>>>> >>>>>> Giles >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> You know, that could make a great podcast or even better, a nice WOWODC >>>>>>> presentation :-) Ubermind did a great introduction to WOlastic last >>>>>>> year, your case study can complement it. >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> doing what you've done means you're managing mysql, looking after it, >>>>>>>> making sure it doesn't fall over, doing backups, managing replication >>>>>>>> etc. rds does all of that for you. it also makes changing the config >>>>>>>> of your database server a breeze: need more disk space ? couple of >>>>>>>> clicks. need more ram ? couple of clicks. need more compute power >>>>>>>> behind it ? couple of clicks. need automatic fail-over to a different >>>>>>>> availability zone ? couple of clicks. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> re web server resources, remember it's just a normal wo deployment >>>>>>>> running in the cloud, so you can do whatever you do now. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> we don't separate the web and app tier - all our ec2 instances run >>>>>>>> monitor, wotaskd and apache, and are effectively independent of each >>>>>>>> other, and we use an elastic load balancer up front. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> simon >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 27 July 2010 17:40, James Cicenia <ja...@jimijon.com> wrote: >>>>>>>> So the base image is the actual OS? So you are managing it as the >>>>>>>> admin? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I decided to try WOlastic. I configured the instances, setup up mysql >>>>>>>> with my users and sync'd the database from existing production to >>>>>>>> amazon. >>>>>>>> So you are suggesting RDS vs. what I just did? What are the benefits >>>>>>>> of RDS? Amazon backs up the mysql I created. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Now I am a bit stumped on WebServerResources. How are you handling >>>>>>>> that? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Well, if this works well, I can my webobject apps over and then just >>>>>>>> sell my server and drop the colo. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> - James >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Jul 27, 2010, at 11:28 AM, Simon wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> rolling your own is surprisingly easy if you start with a base image. >>>>>>>>> we started out with a vanilla centos image from rightscale, and have >>>>>>>>> built it up into what we needed from there. you can then create an >>>>>>>>> ebs-backed ami in a couple of clicks. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> re pricing, it all depends on what you need. our financial models >>>>>>>>> tell us for our deployment is excellent value for money, and we can >>>>>>>>> scale well beyond our current needs and it remains as such. use the >>>>>>>>> cost aws calculator to figure out your own costs, and remember to >>>>>>>>> factor in staff costs in your decision making process. those DBA's >>>>>>>>> are darn expensive compared to RDS :-) >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> http://calculator.s3.amazonaws.com/calc5.html >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> the only performance issue we found is that it is basically >>>>>>>>> impossible to host your DB outside of amazon due to latency. but you >>>>>>>>> don't have to use RDS - if you like sticking needles in your eyes you >>>>>>>>> can just run and look after your own mysql / postgre / mssql / >>>>>>>>> whatever on an ec2 instance. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> the general performance of our apps has also vastly improved. a >>>>>>>>> mixture of using more computing power and amazon having much faster >>>>>>>>> internet transit than we were paying for in our previous co-lo. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> alongside production we also run our staging servers and our hudson >>>>>>>>> build server on ec2. in productivity terms running hudson there was a >>>>>>>>> huge leap forward: previously a new build would take around 30 >>>>>>>>> minutes to upload to staging / production. now it takes 19 seconds >>>>>>>>> flat :-) >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> we're shortly going to move our subversion repository to ec2 as well. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Simon >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On 27 July 2010 15:13, James Cicenia <ja...@jimijon.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>> This is very cool. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I need to move one of my servers, or, use the cloud approach for its >>>>>>>>> WOApps. I see you rolled your own but wolastic seems like it is for a >>>>>>>>> mere mortal. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Anyone use wolastic? What is the pricing your are seeing? Issues? >>>>>>>>> Performances? Etc. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Thanks. >>>>>>>>> James Cicenia >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Jul 26, 2010, at 3:55 PM, Simon wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> we don't use the wolastic images (we have our own) but we do deploy >>>>>>>>>> entirely on the amazon ec2 cloud now. ec2 instances running standard >>>>>>>>>> javamonitor / wotaskd, amazon RDS for database server, s3 for file >>>>>>>>>> storage etc. scalability on demand, load balancing, redundancy >>>>>>>>>> across multiple availability zones. it's the best thing since sliced >>>>>>>>>> bread... >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> our staging servers (also on ec2) run wonders javamonitor / wotasd >>>>>>>>>> and hence we'll probably upgrade our production servers to those >>>>>>>>>> soon. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> simon >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On 26 July 2010 21:36, Ramsey Gurley <ram...@xeotech.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> I haven't tried it yet, but WOlastic looks like a *really* cool >>>>>>>>>> deployment solution for WO. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> http://wolastic.com/ >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Ramsey >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Jul 26, 2010, at 4:27 PM, Ken Anderson wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Thanks for the thoughts guys! >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Ken >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Jul 26, 2010, at 1:42 PM, Pascal Robert wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Le 2010-07-26 à 12:55, Chuck Hill a écrit : >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Jul 26, 2010, at 9:44 AM, Ken Anderson wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I've been asked to comment on the best way to deploy WebObjects >>>>>>>>>> today without any "imposed" restrictions. I haven't done any new >>>>>>>>>> deployments in a long while, so I'm likely not up to date on the >>>>>>>>>> last. What are people using today, and why do they think it's the >>>>>>>>>> best? >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Thanks much! >>>>>>>>>> Ken >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Lacking imposed restrictions (e.g. must run in J2EE container), >>>>>>>>>> traditional WO deployment through Apache with mod_webobjects is >>>>>>>>>> probably the way to go. Anjo was working on mod_proxy deployment, >>>>>>>>>> but I don't recall how far he got or if he has this in production. >>>>>>>>>> It looked promising. There is also a Fast CGI adaptor and Ravi is >>>>>>>>>> working on something for WOWODC. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I'm adding some mods in JavaMonitor too (for WOWODC) and Andrew >>>>>>>>>> Lindesay also have stuff in LEWOStuff to use mod_proxy_ajp. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> ---- >>>>>>>>>> Pascal Robert >>>>>>>>>> prob...@macti.ca >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> AIM: MacTICanada >>>>>>>>>> Twitter : MacTICanada >>>>>>>>>> LinkedIn : http://www.linkedin.com/in/macti >>>>>>>>>> WO Community profile : >>>>>>>>>> http://wocommunity.org/page/member?name=probert >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >>>>>>>>>> Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) >>>>>>>>>> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >>>>>>>>>> http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/ramsey%40xeotech.com >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> This email sent to ram...@xeotech.com >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >>>>>>>>>> Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) >>>>>>>>>> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >>>>>>>>>> http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/simon%40potwells.co.uk >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> This email sent to si...@potwells.co.uk >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>>>> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >>>>>>>>>> Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) >>>>>>>>>> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >>>>>>>>>> http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/james%40jimijon.com >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> This email sent to ja...@jimijon.com >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>>> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >>>>>>>> Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) >>>>>>>> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >>>>>>>> http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/probert%40macti.ca >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> This email sent to prob...@macti.ca >>>>>>> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>>> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >>>>>>> Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) >>>>>>> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >>>>>>> http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/lists%40cedarstone.co.uk >>>>>>> >>>>>>> This email sent to li...@cedarstone.co.uk >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >>>>>> Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) >>>>>> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >>>>>> http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/kenlists%40anderhome.com >>>>>> >>>>>> This email sent to kenli...@anderhome.com >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >>>>> Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) >>>>> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >>>>> http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/james%40jimijon.com >>>>> >>>>> This email sent to ja...@jimijon.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >>>> Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) >>>> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >>>> http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/varscsak%40smarthealth.com >>>> >>>> This email sent to varsc...@smarthealth.com >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >>>> Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) >>>> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >>>> http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/kenlists%40anderhome.com >>>> >>>> This email sent to kenli...@anderhome.com >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >>> Webobjects-dev mailing list (Webobjects-dev@lists.apple.com) >>> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >>> http://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/chill%40global-village.net >>> >>> This email sent to ch...@global-village.net >> >> -- >> Chuck Hill Senior Consultant / VP Development >> >> Practical WebObjects - for developers who want to increase their overall >> knowledge of WebObjects or who are trying to solve specific problems. >> http://www.global-village.net/products/practical_webobjects >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > -- Chuck Hill Senior Consultant / VP Development Practical WebObjects - for developers who want to increase their overall knowledge of WebObjects or who are trying to solve specific problems. http://www.global-village.net/products/practical_webobjects
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