Not entirely... that's not a true statement. One of the WISP's they
purchased had a great deal of Trango installed. Granted, they may be
replacing it as they go, but I know for a fact they are not 100% Canopy.
Travis
Microserv
Chuck McCown - 3 wrote:
JAB? They probably have 50,000 subs by now. Canopy shop.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom DeReggi" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org>
Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 6:16 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Client Speeds
Again... Canopy is a very popular platform, I do not deny that.
But I still feel there is no basis to your statement, or statistics that
back up your original statement taht Canopy dominates the large provider
market.
What about Tower Stream? Last I knew they were one of the largest Urban
WISPs. They use Aperto.
What about AirBand, they had some serious numbers at some time, one two
occasions, I was aware of them buying Proxim at one point, then a lot of
Alvarion later on.
What about Prairie-I.net, one of the larger, I know they used alot of
Trango
at one point.
What about Travis, one of the larger, He's bigtime Trango user.
What about Matt Larson (now w/GAB), he had gotten pretty darn big, he was
mostly Tranzeo and StarOS.
What about Covad/Nextweb, to the beest of my knowledge they were NOT
primarilly a Canopy shop.
Sure, Canopy is emergencing as a company that is continueing to evolve in
compatibility with WISP models to enable expansion to 20mbps and beyond.
But to say Canopy owned the large player market is ludicris.
You could argue Canopy was a preferred choice for many Muni plays, most
all
of which went bankrupt or shut down their networks, creating one of the
largest availability stockpiles of second hand used product for WISPs to
now
buy at discount, compared to any other brand. I find it interesting that
Alvarion and Trango still hold their value higher on Ebay.
I'll also argue that what is considered preferred choice gear is a leap
frog
game. Ironically, I personally have been using some Canopy recently,
because of a unique value proposition it offers for specific application
on
this given day. However, there are many new players, which very well may
bring the next best product line to the market. A perfect example are new
products like Redline, Aperto, Alvarion dominating the new 3650 markets.
And the comment "are swapping out their Trango gear anyways.", that's a
croc. If they are swapping them out, they are fools. Eight years later,
my
Trangos are as strong as the day they were installed.
I'd actually argue the opposite of your comment. Alvarion always had the
reputation as the choice for the larger VC funded companies that could
afford the best. Canopy is more destined to be a preferred choice for
"small
operators." To Canopy's luck, Trango, the price and engineering leader,
and
favorite to many medium size providers, decided not to continue down the
path to evolve PtMP solutions into the next generation 20-30mbps
capacities,
therefore leaving the door wide open for Canopy to work its way into
winning
business from smaller market providers. If a WISP wants 20mbps, and
doesn't
want to mess around with OEM style gear, its one of the solution left that
can do it at near the same price point.
Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband
----- Original Message -----
From: "3-dB Networks" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "'WISPA General List'" <wireless@wispa.org>
Sent: Friday, December 05, 2008 8:16 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Client Speeds
I guess we need to define large... :-)
You also need to look at the region I know best... for WISP's over say
1000
customers in the State of Colorado... only one WISP operational in say
2006
on had over 1000 customers and was using anything but Canopy... and now
they
are swapping out their Trango gear anyways.
I think large for a WISP has to be at the 5000 sub or higher mark. I for
one can only think of three or four companies at that mark... and they
all
use Canopy...
Since I don't get out to the East coast... I know I can be very very
wrong
:-) I should have put that disclaimer on that statement (so I
apologize!)
Daniel White
3-dB Networks
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On
Behalf Of Tom DeReggi
Sent: Thursday, December 04, 2008 11:43 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Client Speeds
the really big WISP's all deploy Canopy I think for a reason
Canopy makes a real nice platform now, and some large companies may use
Canopy.. But that comment is in no way true.
I can name just as many large companies that deploy, Trango, Alvarion,
StarOS, etc.
Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband
----- Original Message -----
From: "3-dB Networks" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "'WISPA General List'" <wireless@wispa.org>
Sent: Thursday, December 04, 2008 8:47 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Client Speeds
Steve,
I think Mesa Networks former CEO (if your not familiar with our
company
we
are a spin off of Mesa Networks) Todd Bergstrom attributes part of our
success by leasing equipment early on as a WISP. He wrote an article
here
about leasing that might change your mind. http://tinyurl.com/5uowsx
Basically look at it this way. If you lease your equipment, it allows
you
to build that next tower site, get customers installed, increase your
revenue. You end up paying more in the long run because of the
interest,
but you may also save money by being able to buy in bulk from your
vendor
instead of individual or 5 packs. Todd probably explains it better in
the
article.
Other than this, I've been racking my brains on things that another
WISP
can
replicate to expand... and the only thing I can think of is equipment
related... I know we couldn't have built our network using an
802.11a/b/g
solution (although our networks first couple hundred customers were on
KarlNet) because you hit an oversubscription on the AP really fast.
We
had
many many AP's with 50+ customers... we would not have been successful
without timing and the ability to place so many customers on an AP.
Our
WISP almost failed back in 2002 (before I joined Mesa) because we hit
the
limitations of the KarlNet system. My experiences with a Tranzeo
network
in
2006/2007 lead me to believe things really haven't changed that much
(its
all still 802.11 and its hard to make significant improvements to it).
So
while this is probably along the lines of rip out your network and
start
over... the really big WISP's all deploy Canopy I think for a reason.
My 2 cents, take them for what they are worth (which 2 cents isn't
worth
much anymore)
Daniel White
3-dB Networks
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
On
Behalf Of Steve Barnes
Sent: Thursday, December 04, 2008 3:53 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Client Speeds
I guess maybe I am old school but leasing the CPE just makes it so
that
the monthly fee has to pay the CPE cost instead of the install. You
still have to pay for it. It may make cash flow easier but the ROI
takes longer due to interest rates and labor dealing with lease Co.
Can you help me with that one.
Steve
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
On
Behalf Of Travis Johnson
Sent: Wednesday, December 03, 2008 11:45 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Client Speeds
Honestly, the fastest way to grow is to lease your CPE. Then the
install
fee covers your cost on every install, and you aren't "upside down"
on
every new customer.
Travis
Microserv
Chuck McCown - 3 wrote:
You are doing it. Just keep bootstrapping. Once you get 1000
subscribers
things will be a bit better.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Barnes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org>
<mailto:wireless@wispa.org>
Sent: Wednesday, December 03, 2008 7:32 PM
Subject: [WISPA] Client Speeds
I have read many post on this list about how much bandwidth
different
WISP offer. I want to discuss that as well as the recommended
equipment
that is so often discussed on this list.
I am a startup. Little to no startup capital. I had to pinch
each
penny to get as much as possible out of it. My goal was to
service the
clients no one wanted in a county that had no Fiber or DSL other
that
what Verizon holds hostage. So now after 2 years I have 8
towers with
320 clients.
The service I offer is a $39.99 basic level 640k x 256k and a
$59.99 Pro
Level 1M x 512k. You guys are talking about 10Mb. If I turn
off the
speed control on AP's and let people play I don't get over 3.5M
on any
of them. ( 2.4 MT or StarOS, and Tranzeo CPE's) I use a StarOS
Full
Duplex Link to Backhaul to a Fiber connection that I Share cost
of with
another WISP my size. The investment I would have to make to
achieve
10MB to each client is financially Impossible.
Surely some of you big guys out there have been in my shoes.
What do
you recommend a small WISP in my situation to do in the future.
Please don't start with the statement, "How you should have
started you
service". I was providing a solution. So this is what I have
and I
know of at least 6 other small WISP's on this list who are in
the same
boat.
So BIG GUYS think back. How do I grow into new BROADBAND
definition
without rebuilding my network from the ground up. What is
everyone
charging and what does the client get for that price. Financing
is not
readily available and the Boss hopes to one day get some ROI.
No
Grants available and no big group wanting to invest or challenge
Verizon.
Steve Barnes
RC-WiFi.com
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