Odd I never seen a problem running multiple winboxes on the same pc. There even been time where I been logged in more then two times to the same router with winbox. Had more then 10 winboxes running at the same time. Personally I very much the MT CLI interface much more then the StarOS menu driven system. The CLI give you assist with all command to build firewall rules, queue rules etc while the editor function in StarOS isn't IMO very helpful there.
/Eje Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile -----Original Message----- From: "Tom DeReggi" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: Wed, 10 Dec 2008 04:08:45 To: WISPA General List<wireless@wispa.org> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Where is StarOS? Let me explain.... MT enables everything to be done through an easy graphical interface. In other words no need to remember syntax. In StarOS, to configure advanced features, from the menu you open up a script page, and then manually writing text commands. StarOS has little documetnations, MT has very complete documentation. >From that perspective MT is easy, and StarOS is hard. However, there is another angle. What if you don't really want to use all those custom advanced features? MT's interface is really somewhat overwelming. There is too much there, designed for the super tech. StarOS on the other hand, has a Mouse clickable menu (NOt a windows GUI, more like a DOS version of a window) that is well organized, and easy to spot and access the feature that you want to configure. The core feature that you want to configure (such as wireless settings) are all complete with easy checkboxes. With StarOS I spend lesss time hunting for the menu item I want to use. For example, when StarOS starts, by default on the main screen you see your wireless connections and the RSSI and Noise for each. You don;t have to click anything to get to that place, its just right there. Then if you press F1, (a single key) you now have a view of all your subscribers and their RSSIs and link Qualities. So basically in seconds, you are viewing menaingful information on your active connections. When you go to configure wireless, all the core features you will change are all on one screen, in one place. And because it is SSH accessed, it can be done from anywhere anytime, and it is lightnig fast to navigate the menu.. >From that perspective StarOS is the more easy. MT is very feature rich, if not the most feature rich. With options, comes choice. And where there is choice there is greater complexity, and greater chance of error. When we first started using MT, techs always had to go look at another MT router already configured to remember how to configure it the way that was our standard to do so. It was harder to remember, and required more training. Once we learned it, it was easy, but it had a longer learnign curve. With StarOS, we are not driven to use all the options. It could be argued that I am not being fair, because we don't use StarOS complex features, to report how hard they are or aren;t to use. STAROS also has made much automatic. For example, WDS bridging is 100% automatic, and requires no customization. Its senses whether to treat the CPE as a wifi station or a WDS true bridge. And does it well. Thats why even though WDS took more processing power, we chose to use Bridging anyway. It was jsut easy, and we could operate it just like a dumb bridge, like a Trango or Canopy. But the primary reason we used StarOS, is they generally were the fist to out out a key features that we were looking for. For example they did 5 Mhz channels first. possibly first to support 533Mhz board. Because we always ahve been a company to jump first on new useful features, we quickly jumped on StarOS. Then we somewhat get locked into it at those regions we deployed it. Today, MT is offering so many improvements, its pretty hard to beat. Ironically, the two big reasons that we use StarOS more, has nothing to do with reasons other WISPs would choose. We wanted a standards based testing tool that was able to be run from any device on our network. We chose Iperf. StarOS was the first to add Iperf to its firmware. To this day, I do not understand why MT will not. (its a small app). The second is that the way that the Mikrotik GUI works, and a design conflict with a proprieatry tool that we call device proxy, that we use to quickly locate and login to a radio, it does not allow us to open up two MIkrotiks routers fro mthe same PC at the same time. Meaning we can;t be logged into both the AP and CPE. This is a big pain for us. We don't have that problem with StarOS, that slows our troubleshooting. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sam Tetherow" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org> Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2008 3:12 AM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Where is StarOS? >I am primarily a MT shop although I have started putting up StarOS APs > on Matt's advice and because they are certified. From a configuration > point I don't think they are really all that complex but then again I am > programmer/network admin/unix geek so I'm probably skewed toward the > technical end. > > I don't think they are any more complex than MT in fact they are quite a > bit simpler, however where MT does shine is in the documentation. In > fact there is so much MT documentation it can be overwhelming at times. > > I have been fairly happy with my StarOS APs so far. They have better > latency than MT APs do both in backhauls as well as APs. However I have > run into instances where they do not handle interference as well as MT > does. I don't know if there are some settings I can change to help, I > pulled the StarOS box back out when I couldn't maintain the throughput > in my noisy 2.4 environment. I might take another stab at it, after > Christmas but as it stands now the MT is handing things better. > > As for management. I miss the command line interface that MT has both > from simple management as well as for automating things. I can use > expect to manage any aspect of an MT box. I'm stuck with starutil for > handing things in StarOS and either I haven't found the master > documentation or it doesn't support everything the menu interface does. > > Sam Tetherow > Sandhills Wireless > > > Josh Luthman wrote: >> Looking at this from an outside point of view I'm awfully confused on the >> simplicity or complexity of learning StarOS. >> >> We have both ends of the poles as well as a middle ground - very easy to >> very hard. Would those of you who stated their opinion on the difficulty >> level mind sharing their other network gear experience, please? >> >> This is very very valuable information -- "But to go full speed, the WDS >> Bridging config used 50% more processing power to pass the same amount of >> traffic." Thanks! >> >> >> Josh Luthman >> Office: 937-552-2340 >> Direct: 937-552-2343 >> 1100 Wayne St >> Suite 1337 >> Troy, OH 45373 >> >> Those who don't understand UNIX are condemned to reinvent it, poorly. >> --- Henry Spencer >> >> >> On Wed, Dec 10, 2008 at 2:42 AM, Tom DeReggi >> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>wrote: >> >> >>> I agree. I also say that StarOS's support is actually pretty good for >>> manufacturer provided support. (They do not have as large a channel of >>> qualified third pary consultants like MT does). >>> It means alot when the person writing code is also the person responding >>> to >>> End User List support request. >>> The beauty of StarOS is its simplicity and ease. Its a fine flatform >>> that >>> we >>> have used often. (I'd argue some of the best drivers, allthough I'm sure >>> Nstreme lovers would argue otherwise :-) >>> >>> Recently they have had some issues with bad batches of failing mPCI >>> cards, >>> which has been a pain, but that is not a reflection of the software. >>> We actually have been very successful with Bridging StarOS PtPs. What we >>> learned, (with assitance from another local WISP) was that WDS Bridging >>> was >>> able to perform as well as routing configs, as long as there was enough >>> CPE >>> power. But to go full speed, the WDS Bridging config used 50% more >>> processing power to pass the same amount of traffic. >>> >>> One thing I don't like about StarOS, is its never really clear what >>> power >>> the cards trasmit at when set to a specifc setting. I think MT does a >>> better >>> job at that. >>> >>> Tom DeReggi >>> RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc >>> IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>> To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org> >>> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 11:15 AM >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Where is StarOS? >>> >>> >>> >>>> I have to disagree with the below. >>>> >>>> There's a short, very steep curve at the bottom, but it's not as bad as >>>> one >>>> might think from his description. >>>> >>>> Compared to Mikrotik, it is the model of simplicity. >>>> >>>> I have used it for the vast majority of everything, from backhauls to >>>> >>> ap's >>> >>>> to clients, and I have it deployed on 2.4, 5ghz, and 900 mhz. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >>>> <insert witty tagline here> >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "Steve Barnes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>>> To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org> >>>> Sent: Tuesday, December 09, 2008 6:36 AM >>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Where is StarOS? >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> StarOS is a solid environment, but you have to commit yourself to >>>>> making >>>>> it work. Very hard for a startup company to just pick it up and >>>>> install >>>>> it. You have a huge learning curve. The other thing I saw was that >>>>> version changes are huge. When going from a V2 OS setup to a V3, >>>>> There >>>>> were huge changes in the OS that took lots of testing and many >>>>> adjustments to our system. >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> >>>> >>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> >>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> No virus found in this incoming message. >>>> Checked by AVG. >>>> Version: 7.5.552 / Virus Database: 270.9.15/1839 - Release Date: >>>> >>> 12/9/2008 >>> >>>> 9:59 AM >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >> >> >> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > WISPA Wants You! 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