from:"Phillip Whiteside"

That's pretty awesome timing, I was pretty much all set to make a new
partition and have a 'play' with the mini-iso :-)

I'll put it on to
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/DocumentationHelp/MinimalInstall 'as is', it
can always be edited if the need arises.

Thanks,

Phill.

On Tue, Aug 3, 2010 at 8:46 PM, Yorvyk yorvik.ubu...@googlemail.com wrote:

 On Tue, 3 Aug 2010 14:24:23 +0400
 Mikhail Maksimov mcwil...@gmail.com wrote:

  Update: both Ubuntu and Lubuntu installed from their respective 10.04 CDs
 do
  not have any eth0-related entries in /etc/network/interfaces. Lubuntu
  installed from 10.04 mini iso does have the usual:
  auto eth0
  iface eth0 inet dhcp
 
  which causes NetworkManager to not manage eth0 by default. Looks like we
  need to update the instructions...
 
  Regards!
  Mikhail
 
 This 'solution' just popped up on my RSS feed
 http://www.ubuntugeek.com/how-to-fix-network-manager-disabled-problem-in-ubuntu-10-04-lucid.html

 --
 Steve Cook (Yorvyk)

 http://lubuntu.net

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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] modem 3g

Hi,

try the instructions at http://forum.phillw.net/viewtopic.php?f=18t=92  please
let me know how you get on.

Regards,

Phill.

On Tue, Aug 3, 2010 at 8:52 PM, Jean-Pierre Vidal Piesset
jpx...@gmail.comwrote:

 Hi

 I've looked to several pages (the most complete is
 http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1472896) and there's no way to
 get my 3g modem to work... is there something that i'm missing?

 As i've said in the forum (that shows as Solved) i tried the solution and
 nothing happens.

 My modem is a Huawei e226.



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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] NetworkManager bug in Lubuntu?

Hi Mikhail,

Is the proposed change

*gksudo leafpad /etc/network/interfaces*
and edit it from
*auto eth0*
*iface eth0 inet dhcp*
to
*auto lo*
*iface lo inet loopback*

Save, quit  reboot?
Alternatively, if you have a different working solution, would you email it
me so I can update the wiki page.

Thanks,

Phill.

On Tue, Aug 3, 2010 at 9:58 PM, Mikhail Maksimov mcwil...@gmail.com wrote:

 Yorvik,

 that 'solution' does not fix the default behavior of NM to not manage
 interfaces defined in /etc/network/interfaces. I think it may enable the
 whole NM management system when and if it is somehow turned off (screwed
 up?) but this is not the original case.

 Regards!
 Mikhail


 On Tue, Aug 3, 2010 at 11:46 PM, Yorvyk yorvik.ubu...@googlemail.comwrote:

 On Tue, 3 Aug 2010 14:24:23 +0400
 Mikhail Maksimov mcwil...@gmail.com wrote:

  Update: both Ubuntu and Lubuntu installed from their respective 10.04
 CDs do
  not have any eth0-related entries in /etc/network/interfaces. Lubuntu
  installed from 10.04 mini iso does have the usual:
  auto eth0
  iface eth0 inet dhcp
 
  which causes NetworkManager to not manage eth0 by default. Looks like we
  need to update the instructions...
 
  Regards!
  Mikhail
 
 This 'solution' just popped up on my RSS feed
 http://www.ubuntugeek.com/how-to-fix-network-manager-disabled-problem-in-ubuntu-10-04-lucid.html

 --
 Steve Cook (Yorvyk)

 http://lubuntu.net

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[Lubuntu-desktop] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/GettingInvolved

Hi Julien,

when we were looking at the reporting bugs coding, I had a further dig down
that page. Under Contributing to the lubuntu project

*Reporting bugs* (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/ReportingBugs) the page
you were working on seems fine.

*Translations* (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations/Lubuntu) is a
non-existant page, would be okay to add that page and then split it into two
parts; the lxde parts of lubuntu would point to the translations section at
http://lxde.org/join_lxde_community with a mention of the Ubuntu
translations team at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Translations

*Tests* (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/SubTeams/TestingSubTeam) Is
referring back to 10.04 testing, would this be better to point to the
Developers section (https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Developers)

*Code  Patches* points to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Developers so
seems to be correct.

*Artwork* points to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Artwork so seems to be
correct.

if you are interested in contributing in one or more of these areas, please
go to the SubTeams
sectionhttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/GettingInvolved#subteamsection
 for more information.
the SubTeams section click goes nowhere. Possibly rephrase to
If you are interested in contributing in one or more of these areas, please
click on the areas above that you would like to help with

I'd also like to add *Documentaion *to the list of areas where people can
apply to. With having Zach along for helping with wiki format etc. we do now
have some extra resources in man-hours and knowledge to be able to have a
sub-team (plus I know a couple of others who will help).

Regards,

Phill.
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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] NetworkManager bug in Lubuntu?

2010-08-02 Thread Phillip Whiteside

Hi,

that certainly leaves me a bit puzzled, as the mini-iso requires a wired
connection for it to work !!

I'll set up a new partition and try it again (I'm the author of instructions
you're referring to). You are the first person to say that you are having a
problem when using them.

Regards,

Phill.

On Mon, Aug 2, 2010 at 7:25 AM, Mikhail Maksimov mcwil...@gmail.com wrote:

 Yorvyk,

 for me the problem reproduces on all three Lubuntu installations I
 have at hand: an old P4-based desktop system and two notebooks,
 ThinkPad X61 and Lenovo G450.

 As Julien noticed, this is a known misbehavior of NetworkManager,
 documented on the Debian wiki (http://wiki.debian.org/NetworkManager,
 under Wired Networks are Unmanaged). There's also a bug in Debian
 tracker, http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=530024.

 Were those many installs of yours done via Lubuntu CD, or via minimal
 installation (
 https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/DocumentationHelp/MinimalInstall)?
 If the problem occurs only when doing minimal install, we have to
 update the instructions.

 Regards!
 Mikhail

 On Sun, Aug 1, 2010 at 10:19 PM, Yorvyk yorvik.ubu...@googlemail.com
 wrote:
  On Sun, 1 Aug 2010 19:31:05 +0400
  Mikhail Maksimov mcwil...@gmail.com wrote:
 
  Hi, list.
 
  Lubuntu Lucid installed from mini.iso seems to be affected by a bug in
  NetworkManager (http://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=530024
 ):
  the wired network interface is not managed by NetworkManager by
  default. Does anyone know if this also happens when installing from
  Lubuntu CD?
 
  Never seen a problem with the many installs I’ve done using Lubuntu
 Lucid.
 
  --
  Steve Cook (Yorvyk)
 
  http://lubuntu.net
 
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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] How to Get Informative Boot/Install

2010-08-02 Thread Phillip Whiteside

If I recall, the routine for testing the CD that is on the CD will report
failure.

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Developers

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/DevelopersHas the work-around for it.

Regards,

Phill.

On Mon, Aug 2, 2010 at 7:25 PM, Andrew Woodhead 
andrew.woodhead...@googlemail.com wrote:

 When you see the First boot screen, press pace and you will get the normal
 text boot screen. You can now test the CD for defects. A slow burn and MD5
 success will pretty much garuntee this but it's worth a test. The same
 screen can test the ram.

 On Mon, Aug 2, 2010 at 7:20 PM, Lane Lester lles...@info-fast.com wrote:

 On Mon, Aug 2, 2010 at 2:09 PM, Andrew Woodhead 
 andrew.woodhead...@googlemail.com wrote:

 Did you MD5 test the ISO?


 No, but I just did, and it's correct.


 Did you burn as SLOWLY as you could?


 Yes, 8.


  Have you checked the CD for defects?


 No, don't know how. How does one do that?


 Have you tested your RAM for errors?


 No, because I often install new distros, and I recently installed the
 Ubuntu Minimal CD Alpha 2 without difficulty.

 OTOH, my fairly new motherboard has an nVidia chipset, which sometimes
 causes problems.

 Lane




 On Mon, Aug 2, 2010 at 7:06 PM, Lane Lester lles...@info-fast.comwrote:

 Thanks, Andrew. When the nomodeset didn't work, I tried that post's
 second option:
 i915.modeset=0 xforcevesa
 but it stopped at the same place, although with a small font.

 Lane


   *Lane Lester*
  The Web Doctor http://www.the-web-doctor.com
 You can have your own website for just $10+10+10!
 Click here to visit one of my 
 sites.http://pageswirl.com/rotate.php?user=lanelester


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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] How to Get Informative Boot/Install

2010-08-02 Thread Phillip Whiteside

Glad to be of help, at least the documents are read occasionally ;-)

you may also want to check https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Developers#Missing
key for lubuntu ppa As that is another known little gremlin in the system.

Regards,

Phill.
P.S. on my email system, I use Reply to all

On Tue, Aug 3, 2010 at 1:11 AM, Lane Lester lles...@info-fast.com wrote:

 On Mon, Aug 2, 2010 at 6:57 PM, Lane Lester lles...@info-fast.com wrote:

 I'll try another and see how it goes.

 Lane


 A fresh CD did the trick! I'm typing this in Lubuntu 10.10. I didn't have
 to add anything to the command line to do the install.

 Now to see about installing the nVidia video driver. That hardly ever goes
 to completion, but all I have to do is copy a good xorg.conf over, and I'm
 all set.

 Thanks again for continuing to feed the suggestions until I got a working
 system!

 Lane

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[Lubuntu-desktop] 10.10 alpha2 iso

2010-07-30 Thread Phillip Whiteside

Hi,

Julien has confirmed that the uploaded iso as passing its md5checksum test,
so it is good for usage.

I will endeavour to keep them updated as Julien releases them and update
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Developers  as I get them uploaded.

Regards,

Phill.
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[Lubuntu-desktop] hosting an iso

Hi Julien,

My permanent host system is not ready yet, so I asked the people who are
looking after my hosting at present..

phill: hi, I just want to know if it is okay to host a 600MB cd image that
would be downloaded by approximately 20 people ?
Hamid H.: yes of course
phill: thanks you ever so much

It's being uploaded as we speak, once it's on there I've to figure out how
to access it :-)

Regards,

Phill.
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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] hosting an iso

Hi Steve,

It's only for the 10.10 alphas :-)

hopefully my main hosting will be sorted out by then and can already host
the 10.10 (final) on there, the sysop will use bandwidth throttling if I am
putting the dedicated server that I've got a piece of under too much strain
:-)

Regards,

Phill.

On Thu, Jul 29, 2010 at 8:20 PM, Yorvyk yorvik.ubu...@googlemail.comwrote:

 On Thu, 29 Jul 2010 16:41:57 +0100
 Phillip Whiteside phi...@phillw.net wrote:

  Hi Julien,
 
  My permanent host system is not ready yet, so I asked the people who are
  looking after my hosting at present..
 
  phill: hi, I just want to know if it is okay to host a 600MB cd image
 that
  would be downloaded by approximately 20 people ?
 Should there be another zero, or two, on the end of that :D

  Hamid H.: yes of course
  phill: thanks you ever so much
 
  It's being uploaded as we speak, once it's on there I've to figure out
 how
  to access it :-)
 
  Regards,
 
  Phill.


 --
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 http://lubuntu.net

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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Intro...

Hi Zach,

it's great to have a new slave to help me with documentation :p

Seriously, yeah, great to have you along for this exciting project.

Regards,

Phill.

On Thu, Jul 29, 2010 at 9:04 PM, Zach Kriesse zkrie...@ubuntu.com wrote:

 Hello all, just wanted to introduce myself to the team. Some of you may
 know me, at least Phill W will. I'm interested in the Lubuntu Desktop
 project and I'd like to help out. Specifically with Documentation and
 Wiki work. My personal Ubuntu Wiki page is
 https://wiki.ubuntu.com/zkriesse and my launchpad page is
 https://launchpad.net/~zkriesse Any questions you can either email me or
 find me on the irc.freenode.net network I'm usually in the following
 channels. #ubuntu-beginners #ubuntu-beginners-team
 #ubuntu-beginners-wiki #ubuntu-youth #ubuntu-doc and many others. Any
 questions go ahead and email me or find me on IRC. I look forward to
 working with all of you.

 --
 Cheers!

 zkriesse


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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Changes to the seed

Hi Julien

Hopefully by then I will have sorted out how this hosting the iso works :p

My internet was having a bad hour and it failed the upload at 98.2 %  (three
hours that took, I'm on a pretty slow link out here in the contryside). At
least once I get the iso ONTO the server I can have look / play with how to
make it accessible :-)

Regards,

Phill.
P.S. you've got far too much time on your hands if you're uploading games
(lol)


On Thu, Jul 29, 2010 at 10:55 PM, Julien Lavergne gi...@ubuntu.com wrote:

 Hi,

 I made some changes to the lubuntu-desktop package (which was a bit
 broken recently) for Maverick :
 - Replacing epdfview by evince : let's try if it's lightweight and good
 enough.
 - Adding ace-of-penguins : it's a collection of little games (cards,
 minesweeper ...). Not fancy but very lightweight :)

 Any feedbacks / tests are welcome.

 I don't plan to add any more modifications until Alpha 3, planned for 5
 or 6th August.

 Regards,
 Julien Lavergne


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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] [lubuntu-desktop]

2010-07-28 Thread Phillip Whiteside

Hi,

I'm not sure how you installed LAMP, I use tasksel and it always works fine
for me. I've just done a classroom on it. The slides haven't been posted up
yet, but the tutorial can also be found at
http://forum.phillw.net/viewtopic.php?f=5t=119

http://forum.phillw.net/viewtopic.php?f=5t=119Regards,

Phill.

On Wed, Jul 28, 2010 at 5:54 PM, xsaiddx said kosai...@gmail.com wrote:

 im wondering why 3 in 5 times when my pc start after few sec everythin
 freez and i have no controle mouse/keyboard .. only the turf off button
 also if i run lampp and im not connected to internet lampp doesnt work its
 so weird

 any idea ??

 tnx

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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Logs and ubot

2010-07-27 Thread Phillip Whiteside

Hi Jerry,

the ubot and (proposed) channel logging is for the #lubuntu IRC
(Details at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/DocumentationHelp#How
to get help)

Chromium Vs Chrome,
http://code.google.com/p/chromium/wiki/ChromiumBrowserVsGoogleChrome Chromium
is, afik, the version that does not track what you do, it is also the
development of Chrome (Feel free to correct me) and the devs are really open
to reporting of bugs.

AbiWord,

I've attached an Abiword document copied and pasted from my forum area, it
seems to have maintained the links. I've not altered the text colour, as I
use a 'dark' theme on my forum area, with the text in a lighter colour.
http://forum.phillw.net/viewtopic.php?f=18t=114

OpenOffice,

I've attached an open office document copied and pasted from my forum area
with an image in it. It does not seem to have posted the image?
http://forum.phillw.net/viewtopic.php?f=5t=119

I have recently prepared a set of slides for an up coming class that I am
giving on installing LAMP. As far as I know for embedding graphics, you have
to add it to the document as an image with the local link to the image.
(Well, certainly in OOo presentation, you have to).

But, they are finer points of applications, and not what I was asking about
:-)

Regards,

Phill.


On Wed, Jul 28, 2010 at 1:40 AM, jerryla...@aim.com wrote:

 Phil,

 I don't know what a log-bot or a ubot is.  I've used the ubuntu forums for
 years getting a lot of useful info for example the ubuntu maverick forum,
 forums dealing with intel and ati video graphics, etc.

 I've lubuntu on a couple of my four test pc's, working well!  LXDE is
 fine.  I do have a bit to learn about chrome or is chromium?

 abiword doesn't cut it because I can't select and copy an internet page
 including graphics with abiword the way openoffice write will.  I don't know
 if I could copy the text then select and paste the graphics into abiword?

 Jerry

  -Original Message-




forum posting.abw
Description: application/abiword


test with graphics.odt
Description: application/vnd.oasis.opendocument.text
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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] wiki page

2010-07-23 Thread Phillip Whiteside

Hi,

I've not ignored things, I'm still learning and hope you are all happy with
my layout so far. I do not understand how / what the area you wish to be
split / added to.

I think we should put a link on the https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/ to

Applications and other Features, it's more a description of Lubuntu than

a Getting Involved stuff.


There are also pages on there that are out of date.

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/ContactUs is out of date, there are others
that are also well out dated. Can I have a general clean up of those also?
I'm told that the 'system' keeps backups, but I assure you that I would hold
a local copy and upload to the server any pages that I want to edit a lot
and also for any pages I nominate for deletion.

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/SubTeams/DocumentationSubTeam  Would you
check with https://wiki.ubuntu.com/c-david-rigby that I add my self to that
list.

Sorry to be a pain on checking things out; but you seem to be the only one
who replies when I am asking for the structure of how the Lubuntu team is.

Keep going; lubuntu is very well liked by those who discover it. You and all
the dev and testing team are absolute stars.

Regards,

Phill.

On Sat, Jul 10, 2010 at 3:28 PM, Julien Lavergne gi...@ubuntu.com wrote:

 Le samedi 10 juillet 2010 à 02:13 +0100, Phillip Whiteside a écrit :
  'https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/DocumentationHelp#Applications and
  other Features' is moved to
  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/GettingInvolved

 I think we should put a link on the https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/ to
 Applications and other Features, it's more a description of Lubuntu than
 a Getting Involved stuff.

 For other modifications, I'm ok with them.

 Regards,
 Julien Lavergne


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[Lubuntu-desktop] Chromium and piglet.

2010-07-21 Thread Phillip Whiteside

Hi,

Good news and bad news

As in the time honoured fashion, I'll do the bad news first.

My hard disk on piglet is dying, quite rapidly. I have all my backups etc,
but transferring all my various partitions on to a replacement hard drive is
going to take a little while. I'm planning to kick it all off Thursday 22 at
about 10:00 UTC, so will be a little 'tied up'.

The even worse news ...

I'll be back !!!

And now the good news

for those who are sane, have better things to do etc. and are not on the
Lubuntu desktop bugs mailing list, this one popped by a little earlier ..

While evaluating boot charts (on armel) I just noticed that starting

chromium entails a two second I/O block where it calls lsb_release

twice. lsb_release is an utterly heavy program, since it invokes Python.

If I eliminate this and hardcode DISTRO and RELEASE, I can halve the

startup time from 2.2 s to just over a second.


As that is on a 'decent' computer, it could make quite a difference to the
less powerful ones. I'm very happy to say that it took only about three
hours to be addressed and ..

https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/chromium-browser/+bug/608253

I echo the thanks for the speed at which Fabian at the Chromium team pushed
the resolution out. If you'd like to get a hold of it to see the difference
it makes, give it 24 hours to hit the daily build and add the daily ppa [1]
I'm pretty sure it will be confirmed works. Do feel free to say so on the
bug report, for both 10.04 lubuntu and 10.10 :-)

Regards,

Phill.
[1]sudo apt-key adv --recv-keys --keyserver keyserver.ubuntu.com4E5E17B5
 sudo add-apt-repository ppa:chromium-daily
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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Thoughts on installation

2010-07-17 Thread Phillip Whiteside

Heck Steve,

you'll be suggesting https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu or even
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/DocumentationHelp next ;-)

Regards,

Phill.

On Sat, Jul 17, 2010 at 11:03 PM, Steve yorvik.ubu...@googlemail.comwrote:

 A couple of thoughts I had while installing Lubuntu for somebody today.
  Could the screensaver be disabled during install, this is an incredible
 waste of computing power on an old machine which takes quite some time for
 the install to complete.
 Would it be possible to 'seed' some web addresses into the Chromium
 Bookmark Bar.  Such as lubuntu.net and ubuntuforum.org.


 --
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 http://lubuntu.net

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[Lubuntu-desktop] meta package

2010-07-17 Thread Phillip Whiteside

Hi,

(please do not hate me too much today)

could you have a look at https://help.ubuntu.com/community/MetaPackages and
phrase our lxde variant to it.

Based on:

*xfce*: This package is a meta-package; it depends on the core packages of
the Xfce4 desktop environment and recommends some extra Xfce4 packages. If
you intend to use Xfce4 and want the full experience then installing this
package and the packages it Recommends is a great place to start. If you
just want to pick and choose the core components then feel free to remove
this package.

I would make it for us as:

*lxde*:  This package is the meta-package for lubuntu; it is just a list of
what to install. It is a design decision that all packages included in
lubuntu-desktop depend on it, so as to be able to use *
--no-install-recommends* option when the initial installation occurs, thus
preventing non-essential programs being installed. If you just want to pick
and choose the which components of lubuntu to use, this package can be
safely removed.

Am I somewhere near?

Sorry to bother you, I'm trying to get the Wiki area all sorted out; do
expect some more questions. If there is someone else I should be liasing
with for this task, please let me know.

Regards,

Phill.
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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Server Download Available?

Hi,

head over to  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu#Get Lubuntu

The 1st 'get lubuntu' gives you a choice of server or torrent, the second is
a server download only.

Regards,

Phill.

On Thu, Jul 15, 2010 at 8:00 PM, Lane Lester lles...@info-fast.com wrote:

 I went to https://lists.launchpad.net/lubuntu-desktop/msg01907.html

 If I left-click on the Download link, it downloads a 22K file.

 If I right-click on the Download link, Transmission starts a torrent
 download.

 Torrents take forever with me, so I like to get things from a regular
 server.

 Lane
  *Lane Lester*
  The Web Doctor http://www.the-web-doctor.com
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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] 2.6.35-8 kernel won't start X?

Hiya,

if you have a minimal installation, you can just pop on the lubuntu desktop
onto it. It's covered at
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/DocumentationHelp#Minimal
Install

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/DocumentationHelp#Minimal InstallRegards,

Phill.

On Thu, Jul 15, 2010 at 7:51 PM, Lane Lester lles...@info-fast.com wrote:

 On Thu, Jul 15, 2010 at 12:29 PM, Bob Trevithick bob.trevith...@gmail.com
  wrote:

 Please disregard this post.. it appears to *not* be specific to
 Lubuntu.  Many of the alpha testers are having problems with 35-7
 regardless of their flavor of 'buntu.  Oddly, I had no problems until
 35-8, but now 35-7 is acting up as well.  The joys of pre-beta. :-)


 Kernel 35-8 is working OK for me with nvidia-current, but this is on an
 install of Ubuntu Minimal CD. I'll download Lubuntu and see how that
 installs... if I can find the link for the latest.

 Lane
  *Lane Lester*
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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Server Download Available?

The ones here ? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Developers

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/DevelopersRegards,

Phill.

On Thu, Jul 15, 2010 at 8:28 PM, Lane Lester lles...@info-fast.com wrote:

 On Thu, Jul 15, 2010 at 3:24 PM, Phillip Whiteside phi...@phillw.netwrote:


 head over to  https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu#Get 
 Lubuntuhttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu#Get+Lubuntu


 The 1st 'get lubuntu' gives you a choice of server or torrent, the second
 is a server download only.


 Thanks, Phill. I'm interested in 10.10, and it looks like someone goofed
 and linked the torrent for the Server link as well as the Torrent link.

 Lane
   *Lane Lester*
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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Server Download Available?

Ahh,

I will let Julien know.

I'm _sure_ I got my download that way, but you are correct, it is now
pointing a a torrent.

Regards,

Phill.

On Thu, Jul 15, 2010 at 8:36 PM, Lane Lester lles...@info-fast.com wrote:

 On Thu, Jul 15, 2010 at 3:32 PM, Phillip Whiteside phi...@phillw.netwrote:

 The ones here ? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Developers


 Yep, you get a 22K file from both links.

 Lane
  *Lane Lester*
  The Web Doctor http://www.the-web-doctor.com
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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] 2.6.35-8 kernel won't start X?

Hi,

I think they would give you the 10.04 package on top of the newer kernel
package. I'd need to ask where the 10.10 ppa is at.

Regards,

Phill.


On Thu, Jul 15, 2010 at 8:36 PM, Lane Lester lles...@info-fast.com wrote:

 On Thu, Jul 15, 2010 at 3:28 PM, Phillip Whiteside phi...@phillw.netwrote:

 if you have a minimal installation, you can just pop on the lubuntu
 desktop onto it. It's covered at 
 https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/DocumentationHelp#Minimal
 Installhttps://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/DocumentationHelp#Minimal+Install

 https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/DocumentationHelp#Minimal+Install
 Regards,

 Phill.


 That sounds good! Those commands are for 10.04; if I use my Ubuntu Minimal
 CD 64-bit Maverick CD, will the commands give me a 10.10 Lubuntu?

 Lane
  *Lane Lester*
  The Web Doctor http://www.the-web-doctor.com
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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] first impression about lubuntu from lubuntu.net iso and it's netbook mode

Hi,

glad you like it :-) The styles, wallpaper, button order etc. etc. Can be
found at Preferences -- Openbox Configuration. Gtk2 themes can be found
with any search engine, a couple of good places to head for free ones are
http://art.gnome.org/themes/gtk2  http://www.deviantart.com/ (search for
gtk),

The preferences for the panel can be found by right-clicking on it, and
selecting 'Panel Settings' (I always have mine at the top).

I also run Deadbeef, but it is not in the repositries as yet so has to be
maunally added (We can't include it by default).

As you seem interested in art-work, themes etc. why not join the artwork
area? Where they're up to is at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Artwork this
mailing list will put you in touch with them.

I'll put onto my list to get some documentation written up and posted on the
adding / changing themes etc. (Unless some one already has some).

There was some further discussion at
http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1445641 which has to alter your
desktop picture.

Please note !! All the above is for desktop version, but the programmes
should all be the same, just some settings will be different !

Regards,

Phill.

On Wed, Jul 14, 2010 at 1:43 AM, Sylkis syl...@gmail.com wrote:

 Hi,

 Today I have downloaded the iso from lubuntu.net, that is the one supposed
 to be used by ordinary users, I suppose. Generally it makes great impression
 (however it has to be personalised in my opinion to become fully useable,
 but I guess that can be said about any operating system) and have some
 suggestions about netbook desktop of lubuntu.

 I really love it, it works basically in the same way as UNR, but it's
 lightweight of course :) but it has few drawbacks.

 First of all - I couldn't find anywhere how to personalise it. I mean from
 the menus, what can I find in them, to the way how it looks like. No
 wallpaper, no changes in colour scheme, etc - and it surely WILL scare away
 new users from this mode.
 I know that making it transparent menu (the bottom panel can do that,
 right? so I guess it should not be a big problem to do the same thing
 here?) or wallpaper-able in any other way and customizeable in terms of
 colours, etc would make it a bit heavier, but still I think it's really
 worth it. Now it looks potentially unattractive for random ordinary user,
 especially for newbies,  as the only thing that is great about it is
 usefullness and convienience. But in today's world of eye-candied
 Ubuntu-Unity, macOSX and windows7 it's not enough, as it lacks really basic
 features, that non-netbook lubuntu desktop DOES offer. I'm not saying that
 it should become something like that heavy animated openGL netbook-launcher
 thing, but I believe most people would prefer to look at some favourite
 photo (or sth) rather than on plain light blue screen.
 OR if there is a way how to customize the looks of the netbook menu, you
 should make it easily accesible, cause I couldn't find it, and if I didn't -
 then I bet no newbie would either.

 Another thing that I think would be nice is that the top panel of the
 netbook desktop menu would be somehow always on top, I mean never covered
 with windows, and clicking on it while some window is maximized would
 minimize everything and let user jump to desktop same as one icon in the
 bottom panel does (and that one would be unnessesary then). BUT - as I have
 mentioned, there IS an icon in panel that makes user jump to naked desktop
 menu anyways, so that change is just an idea that is unlikely to do, as it's
 not needed. I guess i't somehow because I'm use tod UNR, there clicking on
 the left side of the panel worked like that.

 Oh, and non-netbook-menu matter; it would be GREAT if the standard black
 LXDE background of the bottom panel would be included. It looked just great,
 i don't understand why was it changed for such ugly gray one, but well -
 that's a matter of taste, and the general artwork looks really fine, so I
 guess it was part of a larger concept. Still, while customising I wanted to
 change the colour of the panel and found no alternative graphic, only the
 deafult gray one, or the possibility of plain and/or transparent colours. I
 belive such graphic weigths just a few KB, so wy not give people choice?

 And last but not least, I didn't see deadbeef in defaultly installed apps,
 there was still aqualung in there. Is it still supposed to be like that? and
 will the bottom panel be moved to top, and [minimise]/[maximise]/[close]
 buttons moved to the left corner of window, like in new ubuntu? I'm just
 curious about consistence of general ubuntu idea and the if that the iso
 from lubuntu.net is and up-to-date one, or shall I download newer one from
 somewhere else?

 Phew... I think that's all for now, I'm getting back to lubuntu as my main
 system of everyday use, after quite a long break.

 If I come up with anything, I'll let you know for sure.

 Cheers, Kuba

 ___

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Some suggestions

Hi,

If you need firefox, Open office etc., then maybe you should have a look at
xubuntu? https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Xubuntu
that is the lower resource version of Ubuntu (gnome) that includes the most
part of it.

Lubuntu is a departure from open office, etc. There is nothing to stop you
installing *any* package into lubuntu, just bear in mind a couple of points:

1) The lubuntu team is very small, because of that:

2) You're on your own it is not working / breaks you system.

Lubuntu does take everything I have thrown at it, that it is not to say you
would have the same happy experience. Please just bear that in mind when you
stray from the default applications. Please do not go complaining to us or
others that you added 'this', 'that' and 'the other' to it and managed to
break it. The team can only support a standard installation of lubuntu, if
you wish to go 'play' and see how far you can get, make sure you have plenty
of backups.

*Altering lubuntu is *not* encouraged for anyone needing a stable system or
anyone who is not comfortable running into occasional, even frequent
breakage. You are, however, welcome to do so at your own risk.*

All the *buntu family allow you to do to it as you wish, just accept we
cannot help you if things should go wrong.

Regards,

Phill.
P.S.
If you are hell bent on pushing lubuntu, then
http://forum.phillw.net/viewtopic.php?f=18t=103 may interest you. I do,
however once again state that the title of that thread and that area are in
no way a part of the official lubuntu area.

On Wed, Jul 14, 2010 at 10:47 PM, Yorvyk yorvik.ubu...@googlemail.comwrote:

 On Wed, 14 Jul 2010 14:23:58 -0400
 Jean-Pierre Vidal Piesset jpx...@gmail.com wrote:

  I use OOo a lot, since it's the only that can import correctly ms files
  and here (Chile) everybody use windows and ms office, so for me it's the
  only way to do what i need. This said, gnome office don't have something
 to
  view or edit ppts.
  Besides there are a lot of things that with abiword i just can't do.
 
 I suppose it depends on what you’re doing and what sort of 'mess' people
 make of thier MSWord documents.

  About chromium and firefox, i've installed firefox and works very nice.
 My
  video card is an Ati integrated of 8mb.
 
  Thanks for the tip to be able to contribute. The cromium app is a goo
 idea,
  don't you think?
 
 The problem with any distribution is going to be what apps are chosen as
 default, as you’ll never please everybody. But, you can at least choose
 something different if you don’t like what’s on offer and it is relatively
 easy to install and remove apps.


 --
 Steve Cook (Yorvyk)

 http://lubuntu.net

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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Some suggestions

Hi, it's usually at this point I get shouted at.

WICD is interesting, but we've had far more success with
http://forum.phillw.net/viewtopic.php?f=18t=92  You must however understand
that such postings cannot be supported by the team. A lot of the things over
there are either on the Wiki area, or they are not. The things that are not
on the Wiki area are nothing to do with the lubuntu team.; they are, as
http://forum.phillw.net/viewtopic.php?f=18t=103 says, daft things that we
do.

Chromium is still about the leanest browser, it may take a little more RAM
up on entry, but requires less per new tab than ffox does. As the argument
goes on, it will finish with HTML5 in a couple of years time, flv will not
be an issue. (http://www.youtube.com/html5 ) Oh, it will happen :-)

Yeah, I have seen that in certain reports they do say that xubuntu is more
resource hungry than ubuntu; that is of no concern to us, we concentrate on
the best we can do for lubuntu.
http://forum.phillw.net/viewtopic.php?f=4t=52

People confuse Chome with Chromium, they are different. also the devs for
Chromium are accessible but please understand that the whole google OS /
Chrome / Chomium is very new. We do have a 'slight' advantage ... it's all
developed around ubuntu / debian. Oooh, I do love it when a plan comes
together - Just don't tell a certain William Gates.

Regards,

Phill.

On Thu, Jul 15, 2010 at 4:45 AM, Jean-Pierre Vidal Piesset jpx...@gmail.com
 wrote:

 Hi:

 First of all, i'm not complaining, i'm just saying that a program is better
 than another, but the reasons to use abiword and gnumeric are quite solid so
 i wont say anything else about that.
 Second, i've found WICD, an app that could replace network manager in
 lubuntu 10.10 to be far independent from gnome... has someone tried it? is
 it good enough?
 Third, for Chromium my idea was to make an add-on that eliminates all the
 animations from the program itself.
 Fourth, xubuntu cosumes more ram than ubuntu itself.

 A question... how's going the thing about being a part of canonical family?

 --
 jpxsat

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Re: Persona Questionnaire

Hi Alan,

I've taken the liberty to post the request to
http://www.accessifyforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=16362 it is a site that has
helped me get my 'AAA' / Level 3 accessibility compliance. They're a pretty
demanding crowd, so do not expect them to pull their punches.

Regards,

Phill.

On Wed, Jul 14, 2010 at 7:59 PM, Alan Bell 
alan.b...@theopenlearningcentre.com wrote:

  One of the projects kicked off by the accessibility team at the Ubuntu
 Developer Summit was to create a set of personas or fictional characters
 with accessibility needs. The design team have a set of personas already,
 each with different skills and life experiences and it is these people they
 think about when designing the user interface. One of their personas (Lola,
 a 29 year old PhD student living in Paris) is partially sighted and uses
 assistive technology. This is a great start, but we want to provide the
 design team and all those working on Ubuntu with some more detailed personas
 with an assortment of needs. The aim is to educate and motivate all those
 working on Ubuntu, accessibility isn't just a technical feature, it is about
 people and if some part of the system isn't available for everyone then it
 is broken.
 In order to write a series of fictional, but believable characters we have
 put together a survey asking people to tell us about themselves and the
 issues they find when interacting with computers. We collaborated on the
 questions that should be asked here http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/Access and
 now we have taken the results of that work and built an online form
 http://access.libertus.co.uk and an alternative text version
 https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Accessibility/Personas/Survey which can be emailed
 to  ubuntu.accessibility.sur...@gmail.com

 Please take a few minutes to fill out the survey and pass it on to friends
 and relatives who may be able to provide interesting and useful answers.

 When the results are in (by August 8th or thereabouts) we will start the
 process of writing up the personas using the survey answers as
 inspiration.This will generate our realistic, but fictional, characters who
 will help make Ubuntu better for everyone.

 Thanks to all those who helped get the survey this far.

 Alan

 --
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 https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-accessibility


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Re: Persona Questionnaire

Hi Alan,

http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/Access  has been changed to
http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/OGCR7tZiNX

Regards,

Phill.

On Wed, Jul 14, 2010 at 8:29 PM, Alan Bell 
alan.b...@theopenlearningcentre.com wrote:

 oops the link to the correct etherpad document is
 http://pad.ubuntu-uk.org/OGCR7tZiNX

 Alan.

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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] IRC bots

2010-07-12 Thread Phillip Whiteside

Hi,
with no votes against so far, i propose to put in a request for both IRC
bots to be added in 24 hours; so, as they at weddings speak now, or forever
hold your peace :-)

It has been mentioned to me that we could (should) use #ubuntu-meetings for
meetings, but until things settle down and we get full adoption, I do not
see having the ability to host a meeting on #lubuntu as being a problem, it
only adding an option.

As always when I ask questions, I will take 'deafening silence' as an okay.
I can see no negative side to #lubuntu that having the functionality that
those two bots will bring. Anyone wishing to help with adding lubuntu
specific factoids to the ubot please do say :-)
(Oh, I'd better explain, a factoid is when you type in *!lxterminal* and the
bot tells you where to get information on lxterminal).

Regards,

Phill.

On Mon, Jul 12, 2010 at 3:14 AM, Phillip Whiteside phi...@phillw.netwrote:

Hi,

Moot bot is the one I am suggesting be added for meetings, getting either
added is not a problem. Being given permission by the team to do so is what
I seek just as I always ask about doing things to the wiki area (the next
level of that is going to take some time).

I've gotten this far https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu but have been told
that I need to consider how
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/DocumentationHelp is set up and needs to
be split up into sub-pages to follow the wiki guide lines.

IMHO we do need to allow a few minutes of time to what happens when the
'cheeky little baby meerkat' is released and lubuntu support gets busy when
all these new people start to use it.

Regards,

Phill.

On Sun, Jul 11, 2010 at 9:33 PM, Chow Loong Jin hyper...@ubuntu.comwrote:

On Monday 12,July,2010 02:23 AM, Phillip Whiteside wrote:
Hi gang,

*_ubot2_*

in amongst my travels I've had a chat about the little room bots that
live on rooms like #ubuntu-beginners that people can ask questions of
(try entering !grub and !grub2 on that room). I have been informed that
we can have the ubot2 added to #lubuntu if we wish. This would give
access to a quick way of people getting information. I've also asked
about the adding to the ubot2 (for example lxterminal) and have been
told that this can be requested.

_*meeting bot*_

We can also have a meeting bot added, so any meeting that we hold on
#lubuntu will be automatically formatted and archived. Zach had a play
with it on the #ubuntu-beginners-wiki channel. The result of it can be
found
at
http://mootbot.libertus.co.uk/ubuntu-beginners-wiki/2010/ubuntu-beginners-wiki.2010-07-11-15.57.html
(I
hasten to add, it was just Zach learning from Alan a bit about how the
bot works, with me looking on ;-) )

I propose that we have this functionality added to #lubuntu, please let
me know whether to ask for either or both to be added.

I suggest getting both bots added. For the latter, we could request that
MootBot[1] reside in #lubuntu (see the How do I request the bot?
section).

[1] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ScribesTeam/MootBot

--
Kind regards,
Chow Loong Jin

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[Lubuntu-desktop] IRC bots

2010-07-11 Thread Phillip Whiteside

Hi gang,

*ubot2*

in amongst my travels I've had a chat about the little room bots that live
on rooms like #ubuntu-beginners that people can ask questions of (try
entering !grub and !grub2 on that room). I have been informed that we can
have the ubot2 added to #lubuntu if we wish. This would give access to a
quick way of people getting information. I've also asked about the adding to
the ubot2 (for example lxterminal) and have been told that this can be
requested.

*meeting bot*

We can also have a meeting bot added, so any meeting that we hold on
#lubuntu will be automatically formatted and archived. Zach had a play with
it on the #ubuntu-beginners-wiki channel. The result of it can be found at
http://mootbot.libertus.co.uk/ubuntu-beginners-wiki/2010/ubuntu-beginners-wiki.2010-07-11-15.57.html
 (I
hasten to add, it was just Zach  learning from Alan a bit about how the bot
works, with me looking on ;-)  )

I propose that we have this functionality added to #lubuntu, please let me
know whether to ask for either or both to be added.

Regards,

Phill.
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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] IRC bots

2010-07-11 Thread Phillip Whiteside

Hiyas hyperair

As far as I understand it, Alan is involved with moot-bot at the development
area. (These devs always scare me). Getting any of them installed would not
be a problem, as previously stated lubuntu does have a lot of good will for
the project.

Hiyas yorvyk

Are you hinting we should have a meeting:)

Well, for the 10.10 maybe an idea? last meeting was in Feb when 10.04 was at
alpha stage.

Regards,

Phill.

On Sun, Jul 11, 2010 at 9:33 PM, Chow Loong Jin hyper...@ubuntu.com wrote:

On Monday 12,July,2010 02:23 AM, Phillip Whiteside wrote:
Hi gang,

*_ubot2_*

_*meeting bot*_

I propose that we have this functionality added to #lubuntu, please let
me know whether to ask for either or both to be added.

I suggest getting both bots added. For the latter, we could request that
MootBot[1] reside in #lubuntu (see the How do I request the bot?
section).

[1] https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ScribesTeam/MootBot

--
Kind regards,
Chow Loong Jin

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] IRC bots

2010-07-11 Thread Phillip Whiteside

Hi,

that was the general idea of what I was told :-)

although having a link to a wiki page does increase the chances of the
addition being accepted as it will filter to all the ubots on all pages.

Regards,

Phill.

On Sun, Jul 11, 2010 at 11:25 PM, Andrew Woodhead
andrew.woodhead...@googlemail.com wrote:

to add to ubottu (the bot in #ubuntu) run:

!factoid is description

e.g.

!eggs is Eggs are laid by chickns and can be made into tasty omelettes

etc.
Run this in #ubuntu channel and it will be reviewed for addition.

On Sun, Jul 11, 2010 at 7:23 PM, Phillip Whiteside phi...@phillw.netwrote:

Hi gang,

*ubot2*

in amongst my travels I've had a chat about the little room bots that live
on rooms like #ubuntu-beginners that people can ask questions of (try
entering !grub and !grub2 on that room). I have been informed that we can
have the ubot2 added to #lubuntu if we wish. This would give access to a
quick way of people getting information. I've also asked about the adding to
the ubot2 (for example lxterminal) and have been told that this can be
requested.

*meeting bot*

We can also have a meeting bot added, so any meeting that we hold on
#lubuntu will be automatically formatted and archived. Zach had a play with
it on the #ubuntu-beginners-wiki channel. The result of it can be found at
http://mootbot.libertus.co.uk/ubuntu-beginners-wiki/2010/ubuntu-beginners-wiki.2010-07-11-15.57.html
(I
hasten to add, it was just Zach learning from Alan a bit about how the bot
works, with me looking on ;-) )

I propose that we have this functionality added to #lubuntu, please let me
know whether to ask for either or both to be added.

Regards,

Phill.

[Lubuntu-desktop] wiki page

2010-07-09 Thread Phillip Whiteside

Hi Julien,

I apologise for the multiple messages coming from my editing the wiki area.
I've got a couple of wiki people helping me with links etc. As they are not
trivial edits, I feel uneasy to use that tag.

Hi Gang,

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/DocumentationHelp

I'd like to do a make-over of that area. What is proposed is:

'Documentation and Help' becomes 'Help'
'https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/ReleaseManagementDiscussion' is removed, as
it is out of date.
'https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/DocumentationHelp#Applications and other
Features' is moved to https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/GettingInvolved
i also propose that details of 10.10 is moved to
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/Developers with the details of
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu#Test
Lubuntu being moved over there, leaving just a 'stub'.

With the help of the wiki team, I've done some editing for things like the
inclusion of code to be typed into a terminal session.

Just so as everyone knows, I'm part of
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/BeginnersTeam/FocusGroups/Wiki/SoD2010 so, our own
wiki area is a good one for me to get help on.

As it is the aim of lubuntu to be adopted by Canonical, as per my previous
posting I'd like to ensure we comply with their documentation standards.

I'd appreciate any input as to what you'd like to see on there along with
proof reading to ensure any spelling mistakes etc. are corrected. All those
on the mailing list who have their launchpad accouts can log in and edit the
pages.

As always, your input is needed.

Well, that's my and the wiki teams ideas, please shout up anything that you
think are wrong, I will take deafening silence to mean Just get on with it
:-)

Regards,

Phill.
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Re: [Ubuntu-manual] An interesting blog by Matt Zimmerman touches on docs

2010-07-09 Thread Phillip Whiteside

Hi,

i'm still a bit puzzled (normal for me)

Firefox
Chromium
Thunderbird
FileZilla etc.

All are programmes that require the net. What about AbiWord, Gnumeric, or
even Open Office? As all installations of *buntu have a browser then imho,
putting the most up to date wiki page on for that application in html format
makes sense to me (pfd can 'do' links, but it is a long time since I used
that rather expensive programme). Things can never be fully up to date, but
those who have access to update / upgrade would presumably have access to
get updated instructions?

Regards,

Phill.

On Fri, Jul 9, 2010 at 9:30 PM, Kyle Nitzsche
kyle.nitzs...@canonical.comwrote:

 Hi Jason,
 On 07/09/2010 04:08 PM, Jason Cook wrote:
  The inclusion of on-disk documentation should be up to the user and be
  package-wide. Having a documentation package that has the
  documentation for all installed applications. The way this would work
  (at least in theory) is:
 
  * on instalation of this package
o finds all installed packages
o check for documentation
o download documentation
  * on installation of new package(s)
o find newly installed packages
o download new documentation
  * on removal of package
o remove install documentation
 
  Being done this way allows the user to choose weather documentation is
  installed by default and conserves disk space by only having the
  documentation for installed application.This would also eliminate the
  need to install a separate package (such as openshot-docs) for
  documentation, it would be added automatically.
 
 That's a reasonable amount of infrastructure development in order to
 support downloadable, translated docs with the primary goal of
 supporting the use case of a user who is not connected to the internet.
 Yet, it assumes they do have an internet connection at other times (in
 order to download the docs). While it is possible, I tend to think a
 more strategic direction is increasingly more web based help with
 increasingly less on-disk help.

 Cheers,
 Kyle
  Jason Cook


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[Lubuntu-desktop] Fwd: Using Mallard for Ubuntu docs

2010-07-08 Thread Phillip Whiteside

Hi gang !!

I'm on the documents mailing list and much is going on with the various
formats. As such, does anyone have any preferences re:

I think Xfce may be willing to adopt Mallard, but I'm not sure what the

situation is with KDE. The others I have even less idea about.


in [1]


How much do distributions like kubuntu, xubuntu and lubuntu derive their

docs from the ubuntu team? Will it mean that they have to also convert

to mallard? Or will they be converting the mallard back to docbook?


As for the translations I think that until we know how much we risk

messing up, we should not start doing too much. There are a lot of

translators that have put in hard work, and it would be very annoying

for them to have to do it again.


[1] https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-doc/2010-July/014908.html

Oddly enough in this instance, we're in a better position as there is not
hundreds of pages of lubuntu documentation. I'd like to suggest that lubuntu
will follow the main ubuntu in the document format, which will be Mallard.

Your thoughts on the subject, please.

Regards,

Phill.


-- Forwarded message --
From: Luke-Jennings ubuntujenk...@googlemail.com
Date: Thu, Jul 8, 2010 at 10:20 AM
Subject: Re: Using Mallard for Ubuntu docs
To: Jim Campbell jwcampb...@gmail.com
Cc: Manual mailing list ubuntu-man...@lists.launchpad.net, Ubuntu Doc 
ubuntu-...@lists.ubuntu.com


Hello,

On Mon, 2010-07-05 at 10:48 -0500, Jim Campbell wrote:
 Hi all,

 On Thu, Jul 1, 2010 at 3:31 PM, Kyle Nitzsche
 kyle.nitzs...@canonical.com wrote:
 Hi All,

 Just chiming in with my two cents for your consideration...

 Wondering how this plan coordinates with the (lofty) goal that
 was
 discussed with great enthusiasm at Maverick UDS of creating a
 common
 pool for documentation source, where the Ubuntu Manual project
 and the
 Ubuntu Docs project can house doc source material, thereby
 supporting
 common usage and enabling all the good bits that derive from
 that, such
 as single-source maintenance, reusability, higher quality
 (since errors
 need to be corrected only once), but most importantly,
 improving the
 user experience through support of remixed content into
 exciting new
 contexts.

 From what I understand, the manual team was looking to do this for
 Maverick+1.  There was much discussion initially, but things seem to
 have quieted down, at least on their mailing list.  I'm not sure what
 is going on with that project now, but I'm copying their list in hopes
 that we'll get a reply here.

 Since there is currently no docbook - mallard converter (be
 it through xslt or whatever), then that goal is made more
 problematic
 and distant, it would seem. Since this was a topic of high
 interest at
 UDS, this deserves some explicit consideration here, it would
 seem.


 With regards to docbook - mallard conversions, from my experience,
 creating topic stubs in Mallard makes it very easy to stub-out
 documentation, allowing new contributors to easily see what needs to
 be done, and to dig in.  This helps to alleviate the, Where can I
 start?  What needs to be done? question that confronts new
 contributors.  I think we'd be able to get a lot of new content fairly
 quickly using Mallard, even w/o conversion scripts.


 There were discussions previously on this list about the
 impacts
 (regressions) that conversion from docbook to mallard would
 have on
 existing Ubuntu Docs translations, namely that inline tags are
 often
 different (between docbook and mallard), which means the
 source strings
 are different, which means existing translations break. So
 that is a
 potential regression that probably should be identified up
 front with
 some kind of fact-based analysis (5% of strings, or 50%?) that
 gives
 some idea of the extent of translation regression that may
 occur, at
 least to enable Ubuntu Translators to understand what kind of
 additional
 work to expect. If much of this can be avoided by writing a
 clever
 conversion script, then that should be identified as an
 important piece
 of work, it would seem.

 Others have commented on this over the past several days.


 Also, see below...

 On 06/30/2010 11:10 AM, Phil Bull wrote:

  Hi Jim,
 
  On Wed, 2010-06-30 at 09:51 -0500, Jim Campbell wrote:
 
  So did we want to go ahead with using Mallard for this
 release of
  Ubuntu docs?  Phil, if I recall correctly, didn't you have
 a branch of
  Ubuntu docs containing page stubs from our prior release?
 
  I think we should

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Problema con el Ubuntu 10.04 en una laptop Compaq

Hi Fransico, This being translated by google translation, so it will
probably not read quite correctly. I appreciate you have a bug but I do not
think the bug-squad can look into it, until you have registered it as bug
 using https://help.ubuntu.com/community/ReportingBugs_es
 while that happens I'd like to suggest that you try a minimal installation
and then add the lubuntu desktop onto that. There are instructions for that
at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/DocumentationHelp#Minimal Install If you
would like me to run google translate over them for you, please ask.

Hi BugSquad, I've suggested something that may help, and also copied this to
the lubuntu mailing list. I'm still new at bug squad things, so please
forgive me if I have done something wrong

Regards,

Phill.

Hola Fransico, esta siendo traducido por traducción de Google, por lo que
probablemente no lea toda la razón. Le agradezco que haya un error, pero no
creo que el error de los escuadrones pueden mirar en él, hasta que se ha
registrado como fallo usando
https://help.ubuntu.com/community/ReportingBugs_es
 mientras eso sucede me gustaría sugerir que trate de una instalación mínima
y luego añadir el escritorio lubuntu en eso. Hay instrucciones para que en
la dirección https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/DocumentationHelp#Minimal
Install Si me gusta correr traductor Google sobre ellos para usted, por
favor pregunte.

Hola BugSquad, he sugerido algo que puede ayudar, y copian esto a la lista
de correo lubuntu. Todavía estoy en las cosas nuevas escuadrón de errores,
así que por favor me perdone si he hecho algo mal
Un cordial saludo,

Phill.

2010/7/1 Francisco Davila pan...@mined.rimed.cu

  Saludos a todos:
 Disculpen les escriba en español pero mi ingles no es nada bueno. Deseaba
 consultarles el siguiente problema:
 Tengo una laptop Compaq Presario 1215US (40Gb disco, 320Mb RAM CPU Athlon 4
 1Ghz chiset VIA686A) a la cual necesito por situaciones de estudio
 instalarle el sistema GNU Ubuntu. Como la laptop esta algo limitada en
 recursos no utilice la instalacion grafica y opte por realizar la
 instalacion utilizando la version Alternate de Ubuntu 10.04 instalando en
 modo de linea de comando. Posteriormente instale los paquetes adecuados
 (Gnome Office, el navegador Midori, el gestor de correo Sylpheed y otras
 aplicaciones ligeras. Concluida la instalacion de los paquetes al reiniciar
 comienza la carga del sistema, pero inesperadamente la laptop se cuelga.
 El problema no ocurre siempre en el mismo punto, a veces logro llegar a la
 pantalla de login, otras veces logro incluso entrar al sistema y entonces se
 cuelga al intentar abrir cualquier programa. Repeti la instalacion varias
 veces utilizando el desktop XFCE (Xubuntu 10.04) y sucede lo mismo. Llegue a
 probar con LXDE (Lubuntu 10.04) y lo mismo. Consulte el log y en el inicio
 de la carga del sistema me aparece lo siguiente:

 [8.828369] ACPI: I/O resource vt596_smbus [0x8100-0x8107] conflicts with
 ACPI region SMIO [0x8100-0x8106]
 [8.965801] via686a :00:07.4: base adress not set - upgrade BIOS or use
 force_addr=0xaddr

 En una prueba ulterior con la base ubuntu 10.04 y el entorno lxde instalado
 (solo el paquete lxde, sin instalar el paquete de lubuntu-desktop completo)
 con algunas aplicaciones (Abiword, Gnumeric, Sylpheed y Midori) arranque en
 modo recuperacion, inicie una sesion de consola como root y cargue el
 sistema con el comando startx y todo funciona bien, puedo utilizar la laptop
 por horas sin que ocurra ningun problema. Reinicie en el modo normal y de
 nuevo se cuelga.
 Esperando puedan ayudarme gracias a todos desde ya. Saludos cordiales.
 Frank

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 Francisco Davila pan...@mined.rimed.cu 2010/7/1
Greetings to all:
Sorry I write in Spanish, but my English is not good. He wanted to consult
the following problem:
I have a Compaq Presario 1215US laptop (40GB drive, 320MB RAM 1Ghz CPU
Athlon 4 chiset via686) to which I need to study situations putting on
Ubuntu GNU system. As the laptop is somewhat limited in resources do not use
the graphical installer and choose to install using the Alternate version of
Ubuntu 4.10 installed in command line mode. Then install the appropriate
packages (Gnome Office, Midori browser, Sylpheed mail manager and other
lightweight applications. After the installation of packages when you
restart the system begins loading, but suddenly the laptop hangs. The
problem does not occur always in the same spot, sometimes made it to the
login screen, sometimes achieving even enter the system and then hangs when
trying to open any program. I repeated the installation several times using
the XFCE desktop (Xubuntu 10.04) and same thing happens . Get to try out
LXDE (Lubuntu 10.04) and the same. View the log and the start of loading of
the system I get the following:

[8.828369] ACPI: I/O resource vt596_smbus [0x8100-0x8107]

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] [Alpha2] Is it just me or the keyring for Lubuntu PPA is missing?

Hi Julien,

if the lubuntu key(s) are help on the MIT.edu server ( it (they) should be),
I was told that keyserver is under far less strain than the ubuntu one. (It
has been previously mentioned in the mailing list). Just a thought that may
make life a little easier for you when you generate the iso :-)

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/DocumentationHelp#Key Servers

Regards,

Phill.

On Wed, Jul 7, 2010 at 8:19 PM, Julien Lavergne gi...@ubuntu.com wrote:

 Le mardi 06 juillet 2010 à 23:00 +0100, Yorvyk a écrit :
 
  I’m sure Julian will have a valid explanation :)

 The keys server was down when I generated the iso, this explain the
 error when you try to update.

 Not sure about the 404 error, the address seems good in the
 sources.list.

 Regards,
 Julien Lavergne



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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] [Alpha2] Is it just me or the keyring for Lubuntu PPA is missing?

Hi gang,

I'm sorry I'm a bit out of the loop on this one (I have the a2 iso, just
like a couple of others, have not had chance to install it). Is the current
work-around going to be:

1) wait for it to complain about the missing key when you update lubuntu
2) take a note of the key
3) use https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/DocumentationHelp#Key Servers to get
it
4) remove the ppa from sources using Software Sources. (The gui does it
better)
5) follow https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/DocumentationHelp#Keep Lubuntu
up-to-date as if you had pre-beta3 of 10.04 (the cli does it better)

I know adding a missing key using the MIT, removing and re-adding the ppa
does work (I had a query on it in #ubuntu-beginners earlier for a different
ppa). Is this an acceptable work-round for the alpha2 ? Before anyone starts
screaming at me again about using cli - we *are *only* *on the alpha2. The
reason I'm suggesting for us to use the MIT key-server is that the ubuntu
key server is either poorly, over-worked or underpaid (or, like most of us -
all three) as there has been a few instances when it has timed out recently
reported.

If some one could confirm this is about what they did (I'm not wanting to
risk the ubuntu key-server being down as the fault is repaired, so for this
work-round I suggest we use the MIT one). I'd like to get it onto the wiki
area a.s.a.p. and confirmed for the people on the mailing list

*Checking our cd's*

If I do not hear to the contrary in the next 12 hours, I will put a cut down
version of http://forum.phillw.net/viewtopic.php?f=18t=94 onto the wiki
page so that people can be sent there instead of my baby forum. Please do
not get me wrong, I am very happy to have people go there; I just feel it is
more 'professional' for that to appear on the wiki. I know there are time
pressures, this should, IMHO, relieve some of it for both 10.04 and 10.10.

*IRC Title*
*
*
Once again ,can I ask whoever has OP authority for #lubuntu to alter the
title to include that documented help is available at
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/DocumentationHelp It has the written stuff
and links to all the wonderful screen casts that have been done to support
lubuntu.

Regards,

Phill.


On Wed, Jul 7, 2010 at 10:16 PM, Yorvyk yorvik.ubu...@googlemail.comwrote:

 On Wed, 07 Jul 2010 21:19:40 +0200
 Julien Lavergne gi...@ubuntu.com wrote:

  Le mardi 06 juillet 2010 à 23:00 +0100, Yorvyk a écrit :
  
   I’m sure Julian will have a valid explanation :)
 
  The keys server was down when I generated the iso, this explain the
  error when you try to update.
 
  Not sure about the 404 error, the address seems good in the
  sources.list.
 
  Regards,
  Julien Lavergne
 
 
 Hmm, so what is this pointing to
deb http://ppa;launchpad.net/lubuntu/ppa/ubuntu maverick main

 and there a reason for
deb http://ppa.launchpad.net/lubuntu-desktop/ppa/ubuntu lucid main

 --
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Re: [Ubuntu-manual] An interesting blog by Matt Zimmerman touches on docs

Hi

Naturally, there are disadvantages, such as:

* no internet connection = no help (beyond the minimal on-disk help)
* umm.. any other disadvantages?


You missed out

1) people on narrow-band (as it is now called) for whom the
https://shipit.ubuntu.com/ is their only hope
2) people paying per byte

Don't let osabdfl hear that you are going to 'cut off' those areas of the
world who are in that position.

Regards,

Phill.
P.S., are we allowed to call him that? If not, sorry.

On Wed, Jul 7, 2010 at 10:13 PM, Kyle Nitzsche
kyle.nitzs...@canonical.comwrote:



 http://mdzlog.alcor.net/2010/07/06/weve-packaged-all-of-the-free-software-what-now/

 Which includes this tantalizing paragraph:

 *Treat data as a service*. It’s no longer useful to package up
 documentation in order to provide local copies of it on every Linux
 system. The web is a much, much richer and more effective solution to
 that problem. The same principle is increasingly applicable to
 structured data. From documents and contacts to anti-virus signatures
 and PCI IDs, there’s much better data to be had “out there” on the web
 than “down here” on the local filesystem.

 With which I agree in general.
 * on-disk docs might effectively be limited to only what is necessary to
 get started and get connected to the web (localized, of course).
 * run-time help links might instead display appropriate content in the
 browser.

 What are the advantages?
 * web functional richness offers numerous paths into content and many
 opportunities for sweet eye-candy' design
 * periodically redesign web UI to bring freshness (instead of being
 stuck in same old rendered source format)
 * no help viewer dedicated app required (use browser)
 * content is more dynamic and flexible (no building packages and
 installing them) which means it's easier to fix errors and address key
 omissions
 * content can include (clearly labeled) user submissions in various
 formats: articles (reviewed and unreviewed), forums, wikis, which means
 official content undergoes obvious public review and feedback
 * in general it can provide a much easier-to-understand path for users
 to submit content
 * minimized disk footprint

 Naturally, there are disadvantages, such as:
 * no internet connection = no help (beyond the minimal on-disk help)
 * umm.. any other disadvantages?

 So that is where I'd be putting my efforts at re-thinking docs:
 * how to start building the best web-based system possible (one that
 supports the Ubuntu ecosystem, including regular Ubuntu releases and
 Ubuntu variants)
 * identifying the content that *must* be delivered as packages onto the
 disk (basically identifying the Getting started/Getting Connected and
 content)

 Cheers,
 Kyle




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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Lubuntu Maverick Alpha 2

2010-07-05 Thread Phillip Whiteside

Hi Julien,

Your wish is my command :-) it has been added.

As a hark back to the problem with the CD in 10.04 not correctly checking
itself, I do not know if you got that resolved. If not would it be okay to
add the instructions from
http://forum.phillw.net/viewtopic.php?f=18t=94start=0#p119 for manually
checking the iso and CD?
As I've not had time to 'play' with the 10.10 one fully, is this still a
problem? If so, Bob has kindly updated the thread at
http://forum.phillw.net/viewtopic.php?f=18t=94start=0#p221 .

Regards,

Phill.
P.S. Thanks Bob, for updating the thread :-)

On Mon, Jul 5, 2010 at 7:41 PM, Julien Lavergne gi...@ubuntu.com wrote:

 Le dimanche 04 juillet 2010 à 23:46 +0100, Phillip Whiteside a écrit :
  are you happy for the alpha2 to be added to the testing lubuntu
  section at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu#Test Lubuntu

 This one should be fine, you can add it to the wiki :-)

 Thanks.

 Regards,
 Julien Lavergne


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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Dell Mini-9 issues

Hi Bob,

the 95% stall on install is a known 'bug'. I do not know how much RAM you
have on the Dell, but a couple of pointers that may help from this
problem...

Then a perused through the bios setting and found the setting APIC Mode
was set to Disabled. I changed it to Enabled and that seemed to do the trick

and the thread http://newyork.ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1473819

I've seen it noted that it can take several hours on low RAM machines to do
the final part of the cleanup.

Regards,

Phill.

On Sun, Jul 4, 2010 at 8:39 PM, Bob Trevithick bob.trevith...@gmail.comwrote:

 I just did the alpha-2 install on my Mini-9 Netbook, and there were
 various little issues that arose.  I'm not sure what level of detail
 you want at this point, or if you want a distinct thread started for
 each issue, so I'll just quickly list some here and perhaps you could
 indicate which, if any, are of interest to pursue further?

 1 - Install went fine until it reached the 95% point of Installing
 System, running dpkg, at which point it simply stopped for about a
 half hour and then completed the install successfully.  I was almost
 ready to abort, and I suspect many people would have.

 2 - My screen was so dim that it literally wasn't usable until I
 Googled for this issue and added appropriate commands to the grub
 startup command (both during the install and for subsequent boots).

 3 - On first run of Synaptic, it reports Auto Removable items.  It
 also generates errors, when I Reload, about signatures which
 couldn't be verified.

 4 - The browser has some minor problems, but I see that there are
 already bugs filed on chromium-browser which cover those.

 I haven't had a chance to test it much.  Is there a particular test
 regimen you'd like run, or aren't we at that point quite yet?

 Regards,
 Bob

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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Lubuntu Maverick Alpha 2

Hi Julien,

are you happy for the alpha2 to be added to the testing lubuntu
section at https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu#Test
Lubuntu

https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu#Test LubuntuRegards,

Phill.

On Fri, Jul 2, 2010 at 9:44 PM, Julien Lavergne gi...@ubuntu.com wrote:

 Hi,

 I just generated the second alpha of Lubuntu Maverick. Like other Alpha
 2, you should be aware of those warnings :

 Pre-releases of Maverick are *not* encouraged for anyone needing a
 stable
 system or anyone who is not comfortable running into occasional, even
 frequent breakage.  They are, however, recommended for Ubuntu developers
 and
 those who want to help in testing, reporting, and fixing bugs.

 We are still very early in the development, so don't expect many
 improvements and too much stability.

 How to report bugs :
 https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/ReportingBugs

 Torrent:
 http://people.ubuntu.com/~gilir/lubuntu-maverick-alpha2.iso.torrent
 Download:
 http://people.ubuntu.com/~gilir/lubuntu-maverick-alpha2.iso
 Md5sum:
 http://people.ubuntu.com/~gilir/md5sum.txt

 Regards,
 Julien Lavergne


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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Dell Mini-9 issues

Re: md5checksum on CD

There is a bug on testing the CD, again it has been noted and when Julien
and Ian get some time it can be looked into. - If the person who gave me the
quicker instructions rather than the one I have I will pop it onto the
wiki.
*
*

   *Next, you can burn the cd (**
   
https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BurningIsoHowto*https://help.ubuntu.com/community/BurningIsoHowto
   *). Once it is done, check the CD by issuing:
   *
   * * #* * #*Code:**dd if=/dev/cdrom bs=2048 count=266741 | md5sum*
   *
   It should also report back **386a227968cbabc89e1a23b95035160e**. If not,
   the CD did not burn correctly.*


Regards,

Phill.

On Mon, Jul 5, 2010 at 12:18 AM, Bob Trevithick bob.trevith...@gmail.comwrote:

 @Phill: Thanks.. the 95% bug I should have looked up!  If I can ever
 burn a CD (see below) I'll try the install with ethernet unplugged. :)

 @Andy: Okay, this is weird.  I did check the md5sum of the ISO I
 downloaded, but I did *not* check the CD I burned.. and I should have.

 I've now made three coasters, four counting the original one, and no
 matter what system I use to burn the CD, the file boot.cat comes out
 with the wrong md5.  It's the only error on the CD.  Neither Brasero
 nor Xfburn can put this image on a CD without screwing up that one
 file.  And neither one warns me of the error.  I wonder why it's
 always the same file?

 Anyway, my apologies.. I should have checked the CD as well as the
 ISO, obviously!  There's something I won't forget to do ever again. :)
  Now if I can just get it to burn accurately, just once, I can start
 over and hopefully things will work better.

 Regards,
 Bob

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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Dell Mini-9 issues

Those instructions are solely for the 10.04 disk, if you are using a
different installation method then the check sum will be different.

If you pop over to the thread
http://forum.phillw.net/viewtopic.php?f=18t=94 that gives the 10.04
release, I would need to update it for the release levels for the alphas, or
I could give you the instructions as to how to write them :p

Possibly the md5 | cdrom command may be easier for people, as it only
requires the md5 sum to check against.

Regards,

Phill.

On Mon, Jul 5, 2010 at 12:56 AM, Bob Trevithick bob.trevith...@gmail.comwrote:

 Ah, well, hmm.  I don't get the correct md5sum according to this
 method either, Phill.

 b...@ub32:~$ dd if=/dev/cdrom bs=2048 count=266741 | md5sum
 0e9fac900c8288b243e875d9b1b65479  -
 266741+0 records in
 266741+0 records out
 546285568 bytes (546 MB) copied, 112.087 s, 4.9 MB/s

 So, I tried yet another approach and burned one with Nautilus as per
 the instructions.  For the first time, I got an actual error during
 the burn.  It didn't tell me what was wrong, but at least it alerted
 me to the burning error.

 Okay, I've tried to burn this on three different machines, using three
 different burning applications, and two different types of blank CDs.
 Maybe I'm not cut out for this kind of work. ;-)

 I'll download the 32-bit alternate CD, do a command-line install, and
 then apt-get the lubuntu-desktop package.  That should give me the
 same thing I'm trying to do here, right?

 Thanks!

 Regards,
 Bob

 On Sun, Jul 4, 2010 at 7:32 PM, Phillip Whiteside phi...@phillw.net
 wrote:
  dd if=/dev/cdrom bs=2048 count=266741 | md5sum

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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Dell Mini-9 issues

Hi Bob,

If the CD is not burned at 4X speed, it can cause horrors. In 9.10 I could
burn at that rate, in 10.04 I cannot. As a part of these 'funnies' that
happen, one of the tech guys told me that he could not burn at 4X in 9.10
but can do in 10.04 .

I have learned to 'cheat' and use CD-RW's or DVD-RW's which keeps the burn
speed down.

Oh, and I've used brassero etc., it seems to be a kernel issue but one that
is really hard to nail down.

Regards,

Phill.
On Mon, Jul 5, 2010 at 2:13 AM, Bob Trevithick bob.trevith...@gmail.comwrote:

 Sure, I can write up a version for Maverick, as soon as I understand
 what's actually happening with the whole process.  I mean, I took
 Andy's advice and made a bootable USB stick instead (much faster than
 the CD.. glad I learned about that) but I still don't know why the CD
 burn process is causing errors, etc.

 On Sun, Jul 4, 2010 at 8:27 PM, Phillip Whiteside phi...@phillw.net
 wrote:
  Those instructions are solely for the 10.04 disk, if you are using a
  different installation method then the check sum will be different.
  If you pop over to the
  thread http://forum.phillw.net/viewtopic.php?f=18t=94 that gives the
 10.04
  release, I would need to update it for the release levels for the alphas,
 or
  I could give you the instructions as to how to write them :p
  Possibly the md5 | cdrom command may be easier for people, as it only
  requires the md5 sum to check against.
  Regards,
  Phill.
 
  On Mon, Jul 5, 2010 at 12:56 AM, Bob Trevithick 
 bob.trevith...@gmail.com
  wrote:
 
  Ah, well, hmm.  I don't get the correct md5sum according to this
  method either, Phill.
 
  b...@ub32:~$ dd if=/dev/cdrom bs=2048 count=266741 | md5sum
  0e9fac900c8288b243e875d9b1b65479  -
  266741+0 records in
  266741+0 records out
  546285568 bytes (546 MB) copied, 112.087 s, 4.9 MB/s
 
  So, I tried yet another approach and burned one with Nautilus as per
  the instructions.  For the first time, I got an actual error during
  the burn.  It didn't tell me what was wrong, but at least it alerted
  me to the burning error.
 
  Okay, I've tried to burn this on three different machines, using three
  different burning applications, and two different types of blank CDs.
  Maybe I'm not cut out for this kind of work. ;-)
 
  I'll download the 32-bit alternate CD, do a command-line install, and
  then apt-get the lubuntu-desktop package.  That should give me the
  same thing I'm trying to do here, right?
 
  Thanks!
 
  Regards,
  Bob
 
  On Sun, Jul 4, 2010 at 7:32 PM, Phillip Whiteside phi...@phillw.net
  wrote:
   dd if=/dev/cdrom bs=2048 count=266741 | md5sum
 
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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Dell Mini-9 issues

Hi Bob,

does the iso that you are using pass the md5?

If you're using the https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu#Download Lubuntu then I
can ask as to how the iso burns to a usb with checking the md5.

Regards,

Phill.

On Mon, Jul 5, 2010 at 2:49 AM, Bob Trevithick bob.trevith...@gmail.comwrote:

 Okay, I'll try to wrap my head around the whole problem and see if I
 can write it up coherently.. after a bit of sleep. :)

 In the meantime, with the USB install, I have the same issues I noted
 in my opening post.. and looking at the USB stick I notice that the
 boot.cat file still has the wrong md5sum (if that's relevant.)  So, my
 initial post still stands if any of those things are of interest at
 the moment.

 Tomorrow I'll see precisely what it takes to overcome the dim display
 problem.  And I have to sort out wireless and a few other things.  Let
 me know, please, what would be most useful to you folks at this stage.

 Night,
 Bob

 On Sun, Jul 4, 2010 at 9:33 PM, Phillip Whiteside phi...@phillw.net
 wrote:
  Hi Bob,
  If the CD is not burned at 4X speed, it can cause horrors. In 9.10 I
 could
  burn at that rate, in 10.04 I cannot. As a part of these 'funnies' that
  happen, one of the tech guys told me that he could not burn at 4X in 9.10
  but can do in 10.04 .
  I have learned to 'cheat' and use CD-RW's or DVD-RW's which keeps the
 burn
  speed down.
 
  Oh, and I've used brassero etc., it seems to be a kernel issue but one
 that
  is really hard to nail down.
  Regards,
  Phill.
  On Mon, Jul 5, 2010 at 2:13 AM, Bob Trevithick bob.trevith...@gmail.com
 
  wrote:
 
  Sure, I can write up a version for Maverick, as soon as I understand
  what's actually happening with the whole process.  I mean, I took
  Andy's advice and made a bootable USB stick instead (much faster than
  the CD.. glad I learned about that) but I still don't know why the CD
  burn process is causing errors, etc.
 
  On Sun, Jul 4, 2010 at 8:27 PM, Phillip Whiteside phi...@phillw.net
  wrote:
   Those instructions are solely for the 10.04 disk, if you are using a
   different installation method then the check sum will be different.
   If you pop over to the
   thread http://forum.phillw.net/viewtopic.php?f=18t=94 that gives the
   10.04
   release, I would need to update it for the release levels for the
   alphas, or
   I could give you the instructions as to how to write them :p
   Possibly the md5 | cdrom command may be easier for people, as it only
   requires the md5 sum to check against.
   Regards,
   Phill.
  
   On Mon, Jul 5, 2010 at 12:56 AM, Bob Trevithick
   bob.trevith...@gmail.com
   wrote:
  
   Ah, well, hmm.  I don't get the correct md5sum according to this
   method either, Phill.
  
   b...@ub32:~$ dd if=/dev/cdrom bs=2048 count=266741 | md5sum
   0e9fac900c8288b243e875d9b1b65479  -
   266741+0 records in
   266741+0 records out
   546285568 bytes (546 MB) copied, 112.087 s, 4.9 MB/s
  
   So, I tried yet another approach and burned one with Nautilus as per
   the instructions.  For the first time, I got an actual error during
   the burn.  It didn't tell me what was wrong, but at least it alerted
   me to the burning error.
  
   Okay, I've tried to burn this on three different machines, using
 three
   different burning applications, and two different types of blank CDs.
   Maybe I'm not cut out for this kind of work. ;-)
  
   I'll download the 32-bit alternate CD, do a command-line install, and
   then apt-get the lubuntu-desktop package.  That should give me the
   same thing I'm trying to do here, right?
  
   Thanks!
  
   Regards,
   Bob
  
   On Sun, Jul 4, 2010 at 7:32 PM, Phillip Whiteside phi...@phillw.net
 
   wrote:
dd if=/dev/cdrom bs=2048 count=266741 | md5sum
  
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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Using Mallard for Ubuntu docs

2010-07-01 Thread Phillip Whiteside

Hi,
as one who does not use gnome, my little two cents worth is that
instructions should not be tied 100% to gnome. Whilst the vast majority use
'vanilla' ubuntu, there are other flavours. As ubuntu is ubuntu, should we
be as aware of that as we are translations?
Xubuntu, Kubuntu etc. Each of the flavours has translation teams and I'm
sure some translators work on more than one flavour, the 'base' installation
documents need to cover all that is common (grub, kernel etc) after that how
does for example, the chromium browser team from ubuntu work with those from
kde work with xfce, work with lxde etc ? I've seen some excellent wiki pages
that put in the difference between gksudo and kdesu. One easy example for
lubuntu (allbeit not a fully fledged ubuntu yet) is that it would be leafpad
and not gedit that is the shipped programme for people to do that lower
level of editing with.

Regards,

Phill.


On Thu, Jul 1, 2010 at 9:31 PM, Kyle Nitzsche
kyle.nitzs...@canonical.comwrote:

 Hi All,

 Just chiming in with my two cents for your consideration...

 Wondering how this plan coordinates with the (lofty) goal that was
 discussed with great enthusiasm at Maverick UDS of creating a common
 pool for documentation source, where the Ubuntu Manual project and the
 Ubuntu Docs project can house doc source material, thereby supporting
 common usage and enabling all the good bits that derive from that, such
 as single-source maintenance, reusability, higher quality (since errors
 need to be corrected only once), but most importantly, improving the
 user experience through support of remixed content into exciting new
 contexts. Since there is currently no docbook - mallard converter (be
 it through xslt or whatever), then that goal is made more problematic
 and distant, it would seem. Since this was a topic of high interest at
 UDS, this deserves some explicit consideration here, it would seem.

 There were discussions previously on this list about the impacts
 (regressions) that conversion from docbook to mallard would have on
 existing Ubuntu Docs translations, namely that inline tags are often
 different (between docbook and mallard), which means the source strings
 are different, which means existing translations break. So that is a
 potential regression that probably should be identified up front with
 some kind of fact-based analysis (5% of strings, or 50%?) that gives
 some idea of the extent of translation regression that may occur, at
 least to enable Ubuntu Translators to understand what kind of additional
 work to expect. If much of this can be avoided by writing a clever
 conversion script, then that should be identified as an important piece
 of work, it would seem.

 Also, see below...

 On 06/30/2010 11:10 AM, Phil Bull wrote:
  Hi Jim,
 
  On Wed, 2010-06-30 at 09:51 -0500, Jim Campbell wrote:
 
  So did we want to go ahead with using Mallard for this release of
  Ubuntu docs?  Phil, if I recall correctly, didn't you have a branch of
  Ubuntu docs containing page stubs from our prior release?
 
  I think we should go ahead with the Mallard conversion. I looked around
  for a branch containing stubs, but I didn't find one. Who knows what I
  did with it?
 
  Ideally, we would coordinate with the GNOME doc team; we should slot our
  docs into their Desktop Help. That's in a very early stage of
  development at the moment, though. For now, we should probably just
  identify clearly Ubuntu-specific areas of our own docs and convert
  those.
 
 
 The Ubuntu desktop experience is sometimes different from a pure Gnome
 one, at least until Ubuntu innovations like notifications, window
 buttons, and panel items like networking, about me, and power management
 are adopted in gnome (I think I got that list right...). So this idea of
 slotting in of ubuntu docs into gnome docs may result in two
 explanations in such areas: if on Gnome, it's like this, if on Ubuntu,
 like this, which seems less than ideal. I continue to wonder whether it
 makes more sense to have an Ubuntu Docs framework that slots in gnome
 docs as appropriate, which, I realize, is how it is currently done.
 There is no technical barrier to including mallard content in docbook
 source that I know of.

  It would be helpful to convert all of the existing DocBook into plain
  text first. I find that much easier to deal with when doing a
  conversion. I'll set-up a branch with Mallard .page stubs and dump the
  text-only topics into the .page files. That should provide a good
  starting point.
 
  To help the process along, would anyone be interested in a Mallard
  training session on IRC?
 
  Thanks,
 
  Phil
 
 
 Cheers,
 Kyle

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 ubuntu-...@lists.ubuntu.com
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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] put back task bar(Window List) lxde

2010-06-30 Thread Phillip Whiteside

Hi andy,

not only does it not work, but it does not work quite badly... As I did have
to test it.

Any one got any ideas as to how to rescue this?

thanks,

Phill.

On Sat, Jun 26, 2010 at 10:59 PM, Phillip Whiteside phi...@phillw.netwrote:

 Thanks Andy,

 I just have to wait for the OP to come back on.

 Thanks,

 Phill.


 On Sat, Jun 26, 2010 at 10:55 PM, Andrew Woodhead 
 andrew.woodhead...@googlemail.com wrote:

 Right click the panel - properties (or edit panel). You will then see a
 dialogue like this:
 http://lxde.sourceforge.net/screenshots/lxpanel_pref.png

 You can then readd the task bar (window list) item

 all done


 On Sat, Jun 26, 2010 at 10:50 PM, Phillip Whiteside phi...@phillw.netwrote:

 Hi,

 well, it had to happen :-)

 Remove Task Bar (Windows List) From Panel

 Once someone has done that, how do they get it back? (I'm too big a
 coward to try that on my system, so it's possibly one for the devs)

 Thanks,
 Phill.
 it reminds me of the Do NOT remove network manager warning I see on the
 support forum

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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fwd: Grub Install Bug @Lubuntu-10.04 (Distribution Release)

2010-06-29 Thread Phillip Whiteside

Ahh, I was not aware of that, in gmail I just use Reply to All, but I do
understand some of you dislike Gmail ;-)

(No Flaming me, I'm just getting the education version set up !!! - lol)

Regards,

Phill.

On Tue, Jun 29, 2010 at 7:45 PM, Steve yorvik.ubu...@googlemail.com wrote:

 On Tue, 29 Jun 2010 16:13:33 +0100, Goh Lip g@gmx.com wrote:



 ps: It has been mentioned before, but may I suggest the administrator of
 this mailing list add a mechanism so that replies of messages will
 automatically send to 'lubuntu-desk...@launchpad.net' rather than to the
 author? Something along the line of 'reply-to'?   Thanks.


  I agree, as not all mail clients have a 'reply-to-list' option, and even
 those that do don’t always spot the list address.


 --
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 http://lubuntu.net


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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fwd: Grub Install Bug @Lubuntu-10.04 (Distribution Release)

hi Goh,

yes, there is, it is *not* a dell issue, as is clearly explained, also the
work around for a bug that one of the devs
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/grub2/+bug/496435/comments/6  says
is not fully tested, the consensus of those who are dealing with problems
over at http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1516153 is still to use
still to use  dpkg-reconfigure and not apt-get etc.

I'm awaiting the guy who writes up a lot of documentation that we mere
mortals use to refer to in order to have a chat with him, I have a strong
sense that he will also shrug his shoulders and say that the grub team have
messed up (again) and to continue to use the dpkg-reconfigure option. I
recall that grub2 came out and totally broke RAID support. They have been
playing catch up ever since. Given the chance, I'd use burg as it is more
pro-active and re-active to problems.

I really do not know why we are arguing over this? Grub 2 can cause major
problems when there is more than one hard disk involved - that is beyond
dispute. In 9.10 it cannot support RAID, with 10.04 we got a newer version
that gave some RAID support, but they would not back port it, when 10.04
came out it had a big fall out with Win7. - that is still a 'work around'.

Such a basic part of *nix should not need 'work-arounds', n00bs will not
that there is one - It must be sorted out.

Should not we be trying to help the OP, it is quite evident there is a
problem and people get annoyed over having their computer in a non booting
mode? Regardless of any sleek looking graphics, let us not fall into the
trap that Microsoft did with Service Pack 2 for XP. When we do tempt people
over to *nix, if their first introduction to it is a broken system they will
not only never come back, they will tell everyone that *nix breaks
computers. That is not acceptable, we are in the hands of the Grub people -
so people should complain there and we should ensure that people asking why
lubuntu does not work in such situations are clearly told that it is not a
fault of lubuntu.

Regards,

Phill.

On Sun, Jun 27, 2010 at 7:27 AM, Goh Lip g@gmx.com wrote:

 On Sun, 27 Jun 2010 06:12:35 +0100
 Phillip Whiteside phi...@phillw.net wrote:

  Goh,
 
  I'm not quite sure how to explain this to you?
 
  Rule #1 You install *buntu it works, if it does not work it does not
  break anything.
 
  At present it can totally break things. There is no point arguing
  over it, just go see the forum area for people for whom it has broken
  there is no point saying that it is does not, as there are a lot of
  people saying that it does.
 
  The problems with grub2 and Win7 were bad enough under the 'older'
  grub2. You do not seem to have read through that thread fully
 
  some links to read,

 Phillip, have read your links above. To add, there are some problems
 not in your links related to Dell's recovery system, raid, lvm and
 others...but not to denigrate your specific issue which is the
 failure to install by install grub-pc and you have found
 success by sudo apt-get install grub-pc;  yes, you're right, I cannot
 see the point arguing that it should just work with install grub-pc
 and not just sudo apt-get install grub-pc. You do not seem to have
 read how to use 'sudo' and 'apt-get' rather than understanding how to
 install grub.

 Are there any more specific issues with grub you like to bring up
 rather than saying I haven't read fully?

 Goh Lip




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[Lubuntu-desktop] Chromium Flash

Hi gang,

I know the chromium team are working on in-built flash support, until that
happens and lubuntu ships it, can I pop on the instructions from
http://www.ubuntugeek.com/howto-enable-flash-support-for-google-chromium-browser.html
over
onto the wiki help area, i'm guessing 'Advanced Users' would be the place
for it.

First you need to make sure you have installed chromium browser

Now you need to install flash using the following command

sudo apt-get install flashplugin-nonfree

Now you need to copy libflashplayer.so file into
/usr/lib/chromium-browser/plugins directory

sudo cp /usr/lib/flashplugin-installer/libflashplayer.so
/usr/lib/chromium-browser/plugins

Now you can run the chromium browser using the following command from
terminal

chromium-browser --enable-plugins

to test it, to keep that setting,

Go to  the menu, select Internet -- and right click on Chromium Browser,
select Properties and change where it says 'command'

from

chromium-browser %U

to

chromium-browser -- enable-plugins %U

Regards,

Phill.
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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] FW: Another interesting music player

Hi,

I'm not quite sure how I got involved in this thread but
http://ubuntuforums.org/showthread.php?t=1503749 does tell me something more
that deadbeef can do, heck I'm really impressed  :-)

I do recall one of the provisos for using a programme is that it be in the
ubuntu repo's - How does one go about getting a programme into the repo? I
know I will need to contact the author, but I would need to let him know
what ubuntu requires and ask if he / she wants to proceed.

Regards,

Phill.

On Fri, Jun 25, 2010 at 2:40 PM, Glenn de Groot
glenn_de_gr...@hotmail.comwrote:

  Xnoise just got a ppa:

 http://www.webupd8.org/2010/06/xnoise-media-player-gets-ppa-new.html


 -Glenn

 --
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 fan.http://www.rulive.nl/aspx/home.aspx

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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Chromium Flash

Hi,

Okay, I can leave that bit out, it is just I know that set of instructions
work so am not to blame if it does not work for the next peron ;-)

Regards,

Phill.


On Sun, Jun 27, 2010 at 9:22 PM, Chow Loong Jin hyper...@ubuntu.com wrote:

 On Sun, 27 Jun 2010 21:04:08 +0100
 Phillip Whiteside phi...@phillw.net wrote:

  Hi gang,
 
  I know the chromium team are working on in-built flash support, until
  that happens and lubuntu ships it, can I pop on the instructions from
 
 http://www.ubuntugeek.com/howto-enable-flash-support-for-google-chromium-browser.html
  over
  onto the wiki help area, i'm guessing 'Advanced Users' would be the
  place for it.
 
  First you need to make sure you have installed chromium browser
 
  Now you need to install flash using the following command
 
  sudo apt-get install flashplugin-nonfree
 
  Now you need to copy libflashplayer.so file into
  /usr/lib/chromium-browser/plugins directory
 
  sudo cp /usr/lib/flashplugin-installer/libflashplayer.so
  /usr/lib/chromium-browser/plugins

 I don't think it's necessary to copy the .so file around. Chromium
 automatically searches in the mozilla plugins' directories as
 well.

  [...]

 --
 Kind regards,
 Chow Loong Jin

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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fwd: Grub Install Bug @Lubuntu-10.04 (Distribution Release)

Hi Mario,

there have been issues with grub and multiple hard drives, this affects all
ubuntu's (and also debian). There is a bug fix out, but that had not been
fully signed off (see Colin Watsons own comments).

https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/grub2/+bug/496435

https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/grub2/+bug/496435The solution
/work around does seem to be the one currently advised.

OK, . it appears that having run dpkg-reconfigure grub-pc and making
the proper selections results in defaulting to the proper behaviour

I will however try some different scenarios as time allows, and hopefully we
can all monitor the behavior as development proceeds.

So, if this behavior stands as-is, I'd guess reinstalling grub 2 needs to
be done with dpkg-reconfigure rather than grub-install to ensure that
the preferred behavior is saved as default.

That certainly seems simple enough.

I suggest you have a read of that bug report and try what it suggests. If
you still have a problem, then have a read on
http://ubuntuforums.org/forumdisplay.php?f=333 You are not alone, feel free
to post on there some of the guys are quite skilled in sorting this problem
out.

Regards,

Phill.

On Sat, Jun 26, 2010 at 6:57 PM, Mario Behling m...@mariobehling.de wrote:

 Dear all,

 forwarded a bug report below.

 Best,

 Mario

 -- Forwarded message --
 From: Abnormal Terminate(R) abnormal...@gmail.com
 Date: Sat, Jun 26, 2010 at 12:35 AM
 Subject: Grub Install Bug @Lubuntu-10.04 (Distribution Release)
 To: Mario Behling m...@mariobehling.de


 Hi!
 I cannot create Bug Report, because it I put it here...
 Environment:
 1. Using a PC, who can be uses an USB external HDD or SSD (and can be
 mounted as sdb device).
 2. Install Lubuntu from CD to this USB HDD (as variant, install to SDHD
 Flash Card, plugged into PCs CardReader), mounted as sdb1.
 3. Using Parted Editing manually, and put / for all device space
 without swap.
 Result of Install Lubuntu:
 1. After normally ended Installation Process, my PC has the MBR on FIRST
 HDD (!!!), but I _use not_ this device for installation Lubintu, not use
 it completely!
 2. On my PC cannot be starts none PS' File Systems without having as
 plugged External Devices because MBD find it and stooped without this
 External HDD or SDD. It has black screen only and display Diagnostic
 Message on this situation.
 Resume:
 It's stupidly situation. And who is this developer, who wrote a code for
 use as default FIRST HDD (mounted as sda) for put MBR, but loading Grub
 from SECOND HDD (mounted as sdb), if the User set up as work (loadable)
 Device SECOND HDD or other device?!
 And Setup absolutely have not any position for user's choosing about a
 Device, who can be uses as place for the Master Boot Record...
 It is absolutely abnormal situation, IMHO.
 For example, Ubuntu (or Xbuntu) Installer has an option for choosing a
 place for create MBR with choosing place for Grub too.
 Thanks for possibility of understanding.

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[Lubuntu-desktop] put back task bar(Window List) lxde

Hi,

well, it had to happen :-)

Remove Task Bar (Windows List) From Panel

Once someone has done that, how do they get it back? (I'm too big a coward
to try that on my system, so it's possibly one for the devs)

Thanks,
Phill.
it reminds me of the Do NOT remove network manager warning I see on the
support forum
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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] put back task bar(Window List) lxde

Thanks Andy,

I just have to wait for the OP to come back on.

Thanks,

Phill.

On Sat, Jun 26, 2010 at 10:55 PM, Andrew Woodhead 
andrew.woodhead...@googlemail.com wrote:

 Right click the panel - properties (or edit panel). You will then see a
 dialogue like this:
 http://lxde.sourceforge.net/screenshots/lxpanel_pref.png

 You can then readd the task bar (window list) item

 all done


 On Sat, Jun 26, 2010 at 10:50 PM, Phillip Whiteside phi...@phillw.netwrote:

 Hi,

 well, it had to happen :-)

 Remove Task Bar (Windows List) From Panel

 Once someone has done that, how do they get it back? (I'm too big a coward
 to try that on my system, so it's possibly one for the devs)

 Thanks,
 Phill.
 it reminds me of the Do NOT remove network manager warning I see on the
 support forum

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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] Fwd: Grub Install Bug @Lubuntu-10.04 (Distribution Release)

Goh,

I'm not quite sure how to explain this to you?

Rule #1 You install *buntu it works, if it does not work it does not break
anything.

At present it can totally break things. There is no point arguing over it,
just go see the forum area for people for whom it has broken there is no
point saying that it is does not, as there are a lot of people saying that
it does.

The problems with grub2 and Win7 were bad enough under the 'older' grub2.
You do not seem to have read through that thread fully

some links to read,
https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/grub2/+bug/576724

http://www.chiark.greenend.org.uk/ucgi/~cjwatson/blosxom/2010/06/21#2010-06-21-grub2-boot-problems

and, of course http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=9502020postcount=16

http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=9502020postcount=16At which point
did you detached from end user reality

Goh, I really suggest you keep on track with the thread on the maverick
discussion thread, because unless lubuntu ditches grub for burg, (which we
cannot do) we are stuck with what the devs for grub enforce upon us.

Regards,
Phill.

On Sun, Jun 27, 2010 at 5:28 AM, Goh Lip g@gmx.com wrote:

On Sun, 27 Jun 2010 09:57:05 +0700
Quynh Vu Do vdqu...@gmail.com wrote:

Hi,

2010/6/27 Goh Lip g@gmx.com

On 06/27/2010 01:57 AM, Mario Behling wrote:

Dear all,

forwarded a bug report below.

Best,

Mario

1. After normally ended Installation Process, my PC has the MBR on
FIRST HDD (!!!), but I _use not_ this device for installation
Lubintu, not use it completely!
2. On my PC cannot be starts none PS' File Systems without having
as plugged External Devices because MBD find it and stooped
without this External HDD or SDD. It has black screen only and
display Diagnostic Message on this situation.

Mario, did not see the OP (abnormal) post on this list. But from
what I gather, he has installed the grub to the external disk.
Naturally, there is no way the system be able to boot this up.

It's the contray I think.

This is a common mistake when you install Ubuntu to a USB device
because by default Grub is installed to the first hard disk
(/dev/sda). Ont he last screen of the installation process you need
to click on the Advanced button and select the place where Grub
should be installed and -in case of installation to an USB drive, you
should choose that USB drive (eg /dev/sdb). In this case you can use
that USB device to boot any computer. Failing to do that (i.e. using
the default of /dev/sda), you'll need the USB device plugged in the
computer for Grub to start (otherwise it will display an error). You
can of course re-install Grub on the first hard disk if you want to
get rid of the necessity to have the USB device plugged in in order
to boot the computer from the (internal) first hard disk.

I learned this from several mistakes in the past.

I also read somewhere that it's safer to disconnect the internal hard
drive before installing to a USB device so that you don't get mixed
between hard disks.

Regards

--
Vu Do Quynh (M.)
Hanoi, Vietnam

Quynh, first, please read my post on the Lubuntu mailing list.

http://www.mail-archive.com/lubuntu-desktop@lists.launchpad.net/msg01347.html

I understand what you say and I know it is a very common issue with
people installing OS on the thumb. I add this is more a problem with
grub legacy as the (hd0,x) and /dev/sdax will change with every boot -
the change effected by the bios, not the OS.It is less a problem with
grub2 as the boot searches for uuid.

However, if the grub is installed at the external drive, and in my
opinion, is a fatal thing to do, there is every possibility of the
system not booting up.

Also, the existence of a bug report does not imply there is anything
intrinsically wrong with it, but could be the result of the
implementation of the installation, in this case, the setting up of the
grub of the external disk to the mbr (sda, in our lingo) of the hard
disk. Again, this must not be done and the fault, if we can call it
that, of the developers, is to enable it by default. But then, how can
the system recognize that the grub is from the external and not the
hard disk and that should be the default if setting grub of a hard disk
partition? So to call the developers stupid is in my mind, unjustified,
crass and stupid in itself. Not understanding the way it works is no
justification for rudeness, and even then, if the developers have
indeed make a mistake, and they will, it is bad behaviour of any
culture to be rude.

Quynh, if there is any specific thing you want to bring up after
reading my post, please feel free to address it. As of this message, I
do not see any thing specific to address.

Regards - Goh Lip

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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] FW: Another interesting music player

2010-06-23 Thread Phillip Whiteside

Hi,
My only enquiry for that would be what resources gnome-mplayer needs to play
background music / streamed radio stations versus what DeadBeef uses? (I
love music while I work :-) )

Regards,

Phill.

On Wed, Jun 23, 2010 at 10:44 PM, Julien Lavergne gi...@ubuntu.com wrote:

 Le jeudi 24 juin 2010 à 00:13 +0300, Andrew a écrit :
  I just love DeadBeef... I only miss one thing: being able to import
  playlists form other music players. Xnoise is interesting because it
  can play videos too and from what I've read, Ubuntu is targeting a
  media player such as Banshee (it's being considered to be made default
  for UNE sometime) because it can play both music and video files. And
  that does make sense: a media player instead of both a video and a
  music player.

 Someone suggested this to me : keep only a video player which plays
 music and drop the music player. And I must admit that the option is a
 valid one. gnome-mplayer can do all the job.
 Another (bad) example, Windows have only a media player, not a video +
 music player.

 Regards,
 Julien Lavergne


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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] FW: Another interesting music player

2010-06-23 Thread Phillip Whiteside

As ever, pcman, a good point. Yeah, we *need *to keep a music player. I like
DeadBeef, it's low resource usage means that my laptop hardly knows it is
running :-)

Regards,

Phill.



On Wed, Jun 23, 2010 at 11:19 PM, PCMan pcman...@gmail.com wrote:

 1. Given you have proper codecs and audio libs installed for mplayer,
 adding a music player won't bring many addiional dependencies since
 they are already there.
 2. Usability matters. If you consider user interface, gnome-mplayer is
 a nice video player but it's really a bad music player. It's even
 difficult for the users to find that gnome-mplayer actually plays
 music.
 3. Playing music and video are quite different things.  The focus of
 video player is smooth image processing, and the focus of music player
 should be playlists management. It's quite often that you have more
 than 100 songs in playlist, but normally you won't put 100 video files
 in play queue and play them one by one. Music player and video player
 are totally for different purpose.
 4. If someone still remember, winamp 5, the famous music player on
 Windows in the past tried to support video playback, but do people use
 it? It's still mostly used as music player.

 Unless your goal is something that can fit 100 mb cd, I think that
 removing music player is not a valid approach to a desktop focusing on
 usability.

 On Thu, Jun 24, 2010 at 5:44 AM, Julien Lavergne gi...@ubuntu.com wrote:
  Le jeudi 24 juin 2010 à 00:13 +0300, Andrew a écrit :
  I just love DeadBeef... I only miss one thing: being able to import
  playlists form other music players. Xnoise is interesting because it
  can play videos too and from what I've read, Ubuntu is targeting a
  media player such as Banshee (it's being considered to be made default
  for UNE sometime) because it can play both music and video files. And
  that does make sense: a media player instead of both a video and a
  music player.
 
  Someone suggested this to me : keep only a video player which plays
  music and drop the music player. And I must admit that the option is a
  valid one. gnome-mplayer can do all the job.
  Another (bad) example, Windows have only a media player, not a video +
  music player.
 
  Regards,
  Julien Lavergne
 
 
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[Lubuntu-desktop] key error

2010-06-23 Thread Phillip Whiteside

Hi gang,

I have an OP on with a problem, the pastebin is due to expire, so I include
it at the bottom. Any ideas?

(23:26:47) xsaiddx: hello guys
(23:26:55) *gilir left the room (quit: Quit: Ex-Chat).*
(23:27:31) xsaiddx: how can i keep lubuntu updated cus i keep gettin those
updates of ubuntu
(23:29:43) phillw: hi xsaiddx, one moment, i'll go get the link
(23:30:06) xsaiddx: phillw: okies : D
(23:30:28) phillw: xsaiddx:
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/DocumentationHelp#Keep%20Lubuntu%20up-to-date
(23:31:45) xsaiddx: yeh i did that and when i push update via synaptic it
gives me some errors
(23:31:53) *vitium1 [~starc...@81-86-175-58.dsl.pipex.com] entered the room.
*
(23:31:54) phillw: what errors?
(23:32:00) xsaiddx: and can i take of those lines in the source list of
ubuntu
(23:32:06) xsaiddx: hang on
(23:32:43) *vitium left the room (quit: Ping timeout: 245 seconds).*
(23:34:52) xsaiddx: its error GPG http://ppa.launchpad.net lucid Release:
cant verify those signatues cus the public key its unavailable
(23:36:17) xsaiddx: signatures beacause the public key its unavailable
(23:36:44) phillw: xsaiddx: can you try this from a terminal and let me know
what it says
(23:36:46) phillw: sudo add-apt-repository ppa:lubuntu-desktop/ppa
(23:37:33) xsaiddx: did it just now and can i take off those lines fo ubuntu
??
(23:37:45) xsaiddx: in the source-list file ?
(23:38:35) xsaiddx: is gives me this and sumthin else gpgkeys: HTTP fetch
error 7: couldn't connect to host
(23:39:15) phillw: I'm not sure what you have in your listing to be checked,
that command will give you the lubuntu one, I've seen that error before when
one of the servers for updates has been down.
(23:40:30) xsaiddx: ahh and can i give you my source list file ??
(23:40:52) phillw: how familiar are you with the terminal?
(23:41:52) xsaiddx: and i kno the basic commandes tho
(23:42:16) xsaiddx: why?
(23:43:55) phillw: there is a thread on such things happening, take a look
at it and see if it is what you are seeing
http://ubuntuforums.org/archive/index.php/t-1221323.html
(23:44:12) phillw: If that is not it, I will look for another thread
(23:44:19) xsaiddx: ok thanks
(23:49:14) xsaiddx: i ead that i have to put the key into this commande but
idont kno how sudo apt-key adv --keyserver keyserver.ubuntu.com --recv-keys
XXkeyIDX
(23:49:22) xsaiddx: i read
(23:51:32) xsaiddx: phillw: hello you there ?
(23:51:43) ***phillw back
(23:51:56) xsaiddx: wb
(23:52:19) phillw: do you see which key is failing?
(23:52:33) xsaiddx: yess
(23:53:26) xsaiddx: here NO_PUBKEY ACC3E225CF57B0F4
(23:53:39) xsaiddx: but how ican type it in hexadecimal
(23:53:41) phillw: okies,
(23:53:51) phillw: it is already in hex :-)
(23:54:14) xsaiddx: :ZzZz
(23:54:16) phillw: give me a moment to get the exact command for you
(23:54:21) xsaiddx: ok
(23:54:54) *n00bomatic2 left the room.*
(23:55:06) phillw: sudo apt-key adv --keyserver
keyserver.ubuntu.com--recv-keys ACC3E225CF57B0F4
(23:55:24) ***phillw crosses fingers
(23:55:43) *n00bomatic [~cyp...@g227070039.adsl.alicedsl.de] entered the
room.*
(23:56:05) xsaiddx: shud i replace ubuntu with lubuntu ??
(23:56:46) xsaiddx: phillw: shud i replace ubuntu with lubuntu ??
(23:57:00) phillw: xsaiddx: can you post up your full version of
(23:57:02) phillw: W: GPG error: http://ppa.launchpad.net jaunty Release:
The following signatures couldn't be verified because the public key is not
available: NO_PUBKEY 60D11217247D1CFF
(23:57:48) phillw: the whole line is what i need from you.
(23:58:19) xsaiddx: ok ill past to you the hole mesage but its french and we
ll tanslate
(23:58:53) xsaiddx: phillw: W: Erreur GPG?: http://ppa.launchpad.net lucid
Release: Les signatures suivantes n'ont pas pu ?tre v?rifi?es car la cl?
publique n'est pas disponible?: NO_PUBKEY ACC3E225CF57B0F4
(23:59:37) xsaiddx: these signaturs coudnl be veified cus the public key its
not available
(23:59:38) phillw: the command should work
(23:59:47) phillw: sudo apt-key adv --keyserver
keyserver.ubuntu.com--recv-keys ACC3E225CF57B0F4
(23:59:53) xsaiddx: k
(24/06/10 00:00:01) *sixpack75 left the room (quit: Ping timeout: 264
seconds).*
(00:00:13) phillw: you are requesting a key from the key server.
(00:01:14) xsaiddx: well now i have to add a epotsity of lubuntu right then
update ?
(00:01:45) phillw: how did you install lubuntu?
(00:02:22) *Al2 [...@164.108.231.222.megaegg.ne.jp] entered the room.*
(00:02:22) xsaiddx: i was on ubuntu then installed the meta package
lubuntu-desktop
(00:04:00) phillw: ahh,. you need to follow
https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Lubuntu/DocumentationHelp#Install%20Lubuntu%20from%20Ubuntu%20or%20any%20Ubuntu%20flavors
(00:04:16) phillw: you would have gotten out dated stuff
(00:04:23) *Al1 left the room (quit: Ping timeout: 260 seconds).*
(00:05:04) xsaiddx: okay il try it
(00:05:24) phillw: those instructions do work
(00:06:29) xsaiddx: yeh well i tried in lil whole but it takes much time
then failed
(00:07:07) xsaiddx: in lil while ago but ..

Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] lubuntu cpu scaling....

Hi Bob,

I don't have a dual core, can you have a look through the instructions, feel
free to post it up as Dual Core work in progress on the baby area and
leave a note on it to say you're still working on it. As I do not have dual
core, I can not give any input at all. I'm sure Adam will be happy to chat
with you over it.


Cheers,

Phill.

On Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 9:49 PM, Bob Trevithick bob.trevith...@gmail.comwrote:

 Well, with my old AMD 3800+ X2, I have three steps: 1G, 1.8G and 2G.
 I got a very similar output to the OP's when I installed cpufreqd:

  current CPU frequency is 1000 MHz.
   cpufreq stats: 2.00 GHz:6.49%, 1.80 GHz:0.40%, 1000 MHz:93.11%  (394)

 I tried setting it to performance and got the expected 2G all the
 time.  It appears to default to ondemand which is, I think, the best
 default in general.

 Without cpufreqd installed, everything indicates that I'm running at
 1G almost all the time, which is what I would expect.  It will only
 kick in the warp engines when there's a real need to do so.

 Having said that, I'm not sure I see any problem.  It seems to be
 handling my AMD in just the way I prefer, and allows me to modify it.

 If there's something specific I should try to help test this, let me know.

 Regards,
 Bob

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Re: [Lubuntu-desktop] lubuntu cpu scaling....

hi Steve,

you can edit here http://pastebin.com/fqZyA04Z or if you have signed up for
the C-o-C I will gladly give you mod privaleges on the baby forum. I do
recall you saying we need to increase the number of screens for the cube to
work? Oh, and I got ragged over doing 'sudo reboot' Linux does not need such
things for alterations of the system, Gee, they are strict ;-)

Thanks,

Phill.



On Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 10:18 PM, Yorvyk yorvik.ubu...@googlemail.comwrote:

 On Tue, 22 Jun 2010 21:12:41 +0100
 Phillip Whiteside phi...@phillw.net wrote:

  Hi good people, those with such machines,
 

 
  I'd also appreciate the solution to
  http://forum.phillw.net/viewtopic.php?f=18t=101 which was mentioned on
 the
  mailing list, but told that it needs more (That solution was from a dev,
 so
  it needs making into what we mere humans would understand).
 
 sudo apt-get install compiz
 sudo reboot

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Fwd: http://mgjuddltd.co.uk compliance,

-- Forwarded message --
From: Phillip Whiteside phi...@uk.vpolink.com
Date: Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 11:23 PM
Subject: http://mgjuddltd.co.uk compliance,
To: Kenny Hitt ke...@hittsjunk.net, Alex H. linuxx64.bas...@gmail.com,
Bob Trevithick bob.trevith...@gmail.com
Cc: ubuntu ubuntu-accessibility@lists.ubuntu.com

Hi Kenny, Alex  Bob,

firstly, thank you for helping me on this one. I have re-written the site in
terms of headers etc. along with changes to table descriptions / column
descriptions. I have made so many changes that I ask if you would have a
good check on the site and check that it is usable, in the find parts
think of 'oil', 'spanner', 'filter' etc.

I'm up to http://www.accessifyforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=16289 ::sigh:: at
negative comments :-(

Hi Mailing list,

I'm dipping my toe back into the mailing list, after the last time went bad.

If any of you have chance, please have a look.

I'd also appreciate any views on whether I should code to WCAG version 1 or
version 2 ?
Has any one has worked out the answer to 'until' from the
http://www.w3.org/TR/WAI-WEBCONTENT/#tech-divide-links where the word
'until' has its own entry as I use a programming routine that seems to work
fine with readers, yet am told until the readers can handle them, i am not
allowed to?

I know that there is still a lot of for me to learn on the difference
between a robot site saying it is okay and someone with using a screen
reader, or any other accessibility access (Do shout now, while I am
learning), I ask this time that only those who will give
*constructive* criticism
reply. I do need people who will do the manual testing against what the
robots reply.

Regards,

Phill.
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http://mgjuddltd.co.uk compliance,

Hi Kenny, Alex  Bob,

firstly, thank you for helping me on this one. I have re-written the site in
terms of headers etc. along with changes to table descriptions / column
descriptions. I have made so many changes that I ask if you would have a
good check on the site and check that it is usable, in the find parts
think of 'oil', 'spanner', 'filter' etc.

I'm up to http://www.accessifyforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=16289 ::sigh:: at
negative comments :-(

Hi Mailing list,

I'm dipping my toe back into the mailing list, after the last time went bad.

If any of you have chance, please have a look.

I'd also appreciate any views on whether I should code to WCAG version 1 or
version 2 ?
Has any one has worked out the answer to 'until' from the
http://www.w3.org/TR/WAI-WEBCONTENT/#tech-divide-links where the word
'until' has its own entry as I use a programming routine that seems to work
fine with readers, yet am told until the readers can handle them, i am not
allowed to?

I know that there is still a lot of for me to learn on the difference
between a robot site saying it is okay and someone with using a screen
reader, or any other accessibility access (Do shout now, while I am
learning), I ask this time that only those who will give
*constructive* criticism
reply. I do need people who will do the manual testing against what the
robots reply.

Regards,

Phill.
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Re: http://mgjuddltd.co.uk compliance,

Hi,

They're taking the urine now.

  a class = 'N' title='M.G. Judd Part Number' href='display_part.php?PID=218'
  68 OL/OP007/1
  68   /a
  68 /td
  69 td
  69 [image: next problem] #p2[image: previous problem] #p0E836
#E836 [WCAG v1 13.1 (AA)] Use different values for 'title'
attributes with links that use the same link text:
   a class = 'N' title='Original Equipment
Manufacturers Part Number' href='display_part.php?PID=218'
  69 -
  69   /a

Ermm. , and they have two different 'title' tags? the link text is different
per item WTF?


Confused @ phill

Regards,

Phill.

On Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 11:33 PM, Bob Trevithick
bob.trevith...@gmail.comwrote:

 Hi,

 All I see so far is the issue with using the same text to link to
 different places.  Try running tv on:


 http://mgjuddltd.co.uk/search.php?LookFor=chainMyImpSize=NULLMyMetSize=NULL

 Is there a page in particular that we should look at?  I just did that
 search at random.

 Best,
 Bob

 On Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 6:23 PM, Phillip Whiteside
 phi...@uk.vpolink.com wrote:
  Hi Kenny, Alex  Bob,
  firstly, thank you for helping me on this one. I have re-written the site
 in
  terms of headers etc. along with changes to table descriptions / column
  descriptions. I have made so many changes that I ask if you would have a
  good check on the site and check that it is usable, in the find parts
  think of 'oil', 'spanner', 'filter' etc.
  I'm up to http://www.accessifyforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=16289 ::sigh::
 at
  negative comments :-(
  Hi Mailing list,
  I'm dipping my toe back into the mailing list, after the last time went
 bad.
  If any of you have chance, please have a look.
  I'd also appreciate any views on whether I should code to WCAG version 1
 or
  version 2 ?
  Has any one has worked out the answer to 'until' from
  the http://www.w3.org/TR/WAI-WEBCONTENT/#tech-divide-links where the
 word
  'until' has its own entry as I use a programming routine that seems to
 work
  fine with readers, yet am told until the readers can handle them, i am
 not
  allowed to?
  I know that there is still a lot of for me to learn on the difference
  between a robot site saying it is okay and someone with using a screen
  reader, or any other accessibility access (Do shout now, while I am
  learning), I ask this time that only those who will give
  constructive criticism reply. I do need people who will do the manual
  testing against what the robots reply.
  Regards,
  Phill.
 
 
 
 
 

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Re: http://mgjuddltd.co.uk compliance,

Hi,

according to the rules if I use the same link
(href='display_part.php?PID=218') then I must must make a difference to it.

So, if I choose, I can visually put in as many links per item, heck, I can
even link it to the same image on section 2 ?

Whatever the visual table displays, and it can be two different numbers
between the MGJudd part number and the OEM part number they are the same
item.

The URL changes per item each has a unique PID, this is required by MySQL
and means one part has one PID.

Try entering 'stihl filter' into search and you will get the MGJ part number
and the OEM one. They are the same item, so have only one entry on the
database, with their unique ID number.

Puzzled @ phillw



On Wed, Jun 23, 2010 at 12:58 AM, Bob Trevithick
bob.trevith...@gmail.comwrote:

 There is one URL you are going to: href='display_part.php?PID=218'

 But there are multiple descriptions (titles) of that URL.  In one
 case, you call it title='M.G. Judd Part Number' but in another case
 you call it title='Original Equipment Manufacturers Part Number'.

 It's the same URL, but you're potentially confusing the reader by
 giving it two different names.  I think that's what they're getting
 at.  Make scents? :)

 Bob

 On Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 7:52 PM, Phillip Whiteside
 phi...@uk.vpolink.com wrote:
 
  Hi,
  They're taking the urine now.
 
a class = 'N' title='M.G. Judd Part Number'
 href='display_part.php?PID=218'
68 OL/OP007/1
68   /a
68 /td
69 td
69 E836 [WCAG v1 13.1 (AA)] Use different values for 'title' attributes
 with links that use the same link text:
 a class = 'N' title='Original Equipment Manufacturers
 Part Number' href='display_part.php?PID=218'
69 -
69   /a
 
  Ermm. , and they have two different 'title' tags? the link text is
 different per item WTF?
 
  Confused @ phill
  Regards,
  Phill.
  On Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 11:33 PM, Bob Trevithick 
 bob.trevith...@gmail.com wrote:
 
  Hi,
 
  All I see so far is the issue with using the same text to link to
  different places.  Try running tv on:
 
 
 http://mgjuddltd.co.uk/search.php?LookFor=chainMyImpSize=NULLMyMetSize=NULL
 
  Is there a page in particular that we should look at?  I just did that
  search at random.
 
  Best,
  Bob
 
  On Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 6:23 PM, Phillip Whiteside
  phi...@uk.vpolink.com wrote:
   Hi Kenny, Alex  Bob,
   firstly, thank you for helping me on this one. I have re-written the
 site in
   terms of headers etc. along with changes to table descriptions /
 column
   descriptions. I have made so many changes that I ask if you would have
 a
   good check on the site and check that it is usable, in the find
 parts
   think of 'oil', 'spanner', 'filter' etc.
   I'm up to http://www.accessifyforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=16289 ::sigh::
 at
   negative comments :-(
   Hi Mailing list,
   I'm dipping my toe back into the mailing list, after the last time
 went bad.
   If any of you have chance, please have a look.
   I'd also appreciate any views on whether I should code to WCAG version
 1 or
   version 2 ?
   Has any one has worked out the answer to 'until' from
   the http://www.w3.org/TR/WAI-WEBCONTENT/#tech-divide-links where the
 word
   'until' has its own entry as I use a programming routine that seems to
 work
   fine with readers, yet am told until the readers can handle them, i
 am not
   allowed to?
   I know that there is still a lot of for me to learn on the difference
   between a robot site saying it is okay and someone with using a screen
   reader, or any other accessibility access (Do shout now, while I am
   learning), I ask this time that only those who will give
   constructive criticism reply. I do need people who will do the manual
   testing against what the robots reply.
   Regards,
   Phill.
  
  
  
  
  
 

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Re: http://mgjuddltd.co.uk compliance,

The bounces are most likely caused by me using my default email account
(vpolink) and not my phillw.net one

The link on each part is the same?

MGJudd Part No. = F0332
OEM Part No. = 4223 140 1800

The database number for them is 1451 on the database. So, the link is the
same.

Think of it this way, you require a part and you do not know the original
part number, and you get dropped onto the mgjudd site,
seems unlikely? Try putting in ts400 parts illustrated into google you
will find the site there (no, I do not pay for it, I just want to make it
okay for people and the google bot seems to like what I am doing).

In my case, they will hear the MGJudd part number and the OEM part number,
they are the same part and therefore have only one entry on the database.

Does that make sense?

Regards,

Phill.

On Wed, Jun 23, 2010 at 1:39 AM, Bob Trevithick bob.trevith...@gmail.comwrote:

 On Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 8:20 PM, Phillip Whiteside
 phi...@uk.vpolink.com wrote:
  stihl filter

 When I search for that, I get a page that shows no errors at all.
 because all of the links and link titles match up.

 But when I search for 'chain' I go to this page:


 http://mgjuddltd.co.uk/search.php?LookFor=chainMyImpSize=NULLMyMetSize=NULL

 That one has the errors.

 You keep giving the title of the link as title='Original Equipment
 Manufacturers Part Number', but you give different links.

 Think of it this way.  Imagine that I have 5 links on my page, each
 one entitled Best place to vacation.  One points to Hawaii, one
 points to the Gulf of Mexico, one points to Puerto Rico, and so on.
 This is what the rule is intended to prevent, I believe.  The user
 *hears* the same title, but depending on where it is, it takes him to
 completely different places.  Conversely, if the user saw a bunch of
 different titles, but they all pointed to the same place, I think
 you'd get the same warning.

 BTW, I got a bounce when I tried to reply-to-all, because I'm not a
 member of that mailing list.  So I removed it from the cc's on this
 note. :)

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Re: http://mgjuddltd.co.uk compliance,

Hi,

Yeah, I can code it so they have 12 digit random characters attached, the
generation of the table headings and summaries is done via php interrogating
the MySQL database, they will always be the same, however php can do random
stuff.

?php
$this_is_silly= rand()

echo  a class = 'N' title='M.G. Judd Part
Number.$this_is_silly.href='display_part.php?PID=$PID'$MGJPartNo/a;
$this_is_silly= rand()
echo  a class = 'N' title='Original Engineers Manufacturing Number
.$this_is_silly.href='display_part.php?PID=$PID'$MGJPartNo/a;

?

Seems a real stupid way of doing things to me, but if it keeps the robots
happy I'll do it provided the screen readers are okay with it.

Phill.



On Wed, Jun 23, 2010 at 2:28 AM, Bob Trevithick bob.trevith...@gmail.comwrote:

 On Tue, Jun 22, 2010 at 9:02 PM, Phillip Whiteside phi...@phillw.net
 wrote:
  The bounces are most likely caused by me using my default email account
  (vpolink) and not my phillw.net one

 I think the bounce said it was because I sent a note to a mailing list
 that I am not a member of.  Whoops. :)

  The link on each part is the same?
  MGJudd Part No. = F0332
  OEM Part No. = 4223 140 1800
  The database number for them is 1451 on the database. So, the link is the
  same.

 Oh, I completely understand why you're doing it.  It makes perfect
 sense.  It is, however, a violation of one of the accessibility rules.
  That's all I'm saying. :)

  Think of it this way, you require a part and you do not know the original
  part number, and you get dropped onto the mgjudd site,
  seems unlikely? Try putting in ts400 parts illustrated into google you
  will find the site there (no, I do not pay for it, I just want to make it
  okay for people and the google bot seems to like what I am doing).

 I did that, and TV then analyzed the page and found 35 E898 Level 'A'
 errors.  Well, really it's just 35 instances of the same error.

  In my case, they will hear the MGJudd part number and the OEM part
 number,
  they are the same part and therefore have only one entry on the database.
  Does that make sense?

 I completely understand, and your method makes perfect sense.  It just
 doesn't validate.  If there were a way to make those titles unique,
 you'd be all set.  Like, perhaps number them, or do anything so you
 don't fall into the trap of having different titles, which the screen
 reader will pronounce, all leading to the same location.

 I'm just saying what TV says about it.  I ran into the same problem
 with pages of my own way back when, and it took me a while to
 understand what the issue was.  It's probably a mere technicality in
 this case, which having a screen reader user look at the pages would
 tell us.  Or it might actually present a problem sometimes but not
 others.  It would be interesting to see if it's really an issue in
 this particular case.

 Not a biggy, in any event, Phill.. so don't let it bum you out.  It's
 just a minor niggle.  A technical violation, which we should be able
 to figure out some way around with a little thought.

 Bob

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Re: http://mgjuddltd.co.uk compliance,