Slavery in all its forms should be ended, that's why I brought it up! We need to develop sustainable technology that doesn't rely on rare minerals because of the human and environmental cost.
Have we really reached the point that if I don't explicitly reject slavery in a public discussion, the assumption is that I'm pro-slavery? ~David On Thu, Oct 18, 2018 at 3:06 PM <denisedalph...@gmail.com> wrote: > It’s weird to me that you’re justifying slavery because it occurs. > > This conversation is taking a fascinating turn. > > On Oct 18, 2018, at 14:27, David A. Powers <cybo...@gmail.com> wrote: > > 1. Stealing by RA is terrible. Remember that along with the fact of black > innovators not getting credit, there is an even more common story of > exploitation in the music industry: musicians and creators who get ripped > off, whether it's theft by a manager, record labels stealing, or this > current example. This kind of exploitation goes on all the time, and I do > believe musicians, writers, and artists, need to work to take whatever > steps they can to stop such theft. Let me tell you, I lived in the D, if > someone steals from you there, they better be prepared to get their ass > beat. I'm just saying... > > 2. It's racist to make assumptions about race and cultural background > based on someone's accent. > > 3. All civilized societies to this day, use slave labor in some forms. In > the global economy, slavery is simply pushed to the margins: slaves still > work in mines to get stuff that goes into our high tech gadgets. As long as > civilization uses slaves, there are going to be ideologies that justify the > exploitation. US racism is rooted in the history of slavery, but also in > the economic competition between north and south, and the fact that the > industrialized north didn't need slave labor because it had found a more > efficient way to exploit human labor. > > 4. The meaning of work, slavery, and exploitation is going to change in a > society run by machines. > > And #4 is why Drexciya and techno are relevant--we live in a society of > machines, and slave labor is embedded in the very machines we use to > communicate with each other and to create techno music. > > Drexciya's music reflects the experience of the people who made it, > including being black, growing up in Detroit, the history of US slavery and > racism, etc. But SLAVERY is not a "black issue" it's a human issue, which > is explored from a particular viewpoint rooted in a particular cultural > experience. > > Music is not ABOUT ideas. Music is a living experience that cannot be put > into words. > If it could be put into words, then the music would actually be redundant! > If you want ideas, read a book. > The experience of listening to a Drexciya record is totally different than > talking about it. > Nothing you could say about a Drexciya record, would exhaust the potential > wealth of meanings and experience that the record contains. > Art is open ended, that's what makes it art and not propaganda... > > ~David > > On Thu, Oct 18, 2018 at 12:52 PM Steven Robertson <stev...@k-os.net> > wrote: > >> I'm all for positive discrimination. In order to achieve any sense of >> equality, it has to be done. It's the way to correct things. >> >> RA is a London-based website so far as I know. London is an international >> city whose residents are less racist than average. It seems that the most >> racist parts of the world are the parts with the least amount of diversity. >> This obviously because when you live and work with people from all over the >> world you see them as human beings. The narrator could be black, but from >> London. >> >> Not giving credit, clearly is unprofessional. The accent of the narrator, >> I don't think is a problem. I'd love to see and hear more talk of Detroit >> music from Detroiters, and for Drexciya specifically, well - an African >> accent could be perfect. >> >> I do wonder if race and racism entirely an artificial idea, that it is >> really down to a tribalism. It's something I think is often used to >> manipulate people in times of war (or conquest), and to sow division. Isn't >> race more a colonial idea, to justify the theft of land from its native >> people? These days we should know that we're all the same race, and that >> there are so many colours. Nobody is simply white or black. There is no >> black or white. Except, where positive discrimination is due. >> >> I'm lucky never to have experienced racial discrimination. I've rarely >> seen any racism, and certainly less as time goes by. However, things could >> change, but I'm thankful to live somewhere there is very little of this, >> with respect to people from many places. Things have been sliding backwards >> though, throughout Europe. Still, Europeans are not responsible for racism >> in the US. There are people that are responsible, and you'll find them in >> positions of power, using it as a tool, a method of control. IMHO. >> >> I'd be really disappointed if the music was _all_ about race and racism. >> I don't think that's a fair representation. >> >> On Thu, 18 Oct 2018, at 5:25 PM, denisedalph...@gmail.com wrote: >> >> >> We should hear the voice of a Black Detroiter narrating about Detroit >> music. How often does that happen. That doesn’t communicate that the music >> is only for people of color. White people are never excluded from anything. >> And in 2018, unintentional? Please. >> >> Luis Manuel Garcia writes amazing pieces about intersectionality in club >> culture for RA. They have the information, they’re just choosing to be old >> grampas about it. >> >> On Oct 18, 2018, at 11:56, Steven Robertson <stev...@k-os.net> wrote: >> >> As a white person who grew up in Scotland, listening to Public Enemy, and >> Paris, and reading the biography of Malcolm X, I don't exactly feel >> comfortable making comment here. I think here there's clearly a lack of >> sensitivity. It is likely to be unintentional, and in the case of the >> unattributed source, they have at least corrected this soon after the issue >> was raised publicly in the past few days. >> >> I appreciate that race and racism have a lot to do with the Drexciya >> story and UR. However, I do feel that the assertion here that it is _all_ >> about race and racism, should be challenged. There is a cultural context >> which is certainly important to remember. It's worth remembering too those >> that were lost in such terrible conditions on their way to America. I would >> argue that the music is not all about race and racism. The music has a soul >> and that soul is humanist, not racist. It's not racist towards white people >> from Europe. Drexciya stands against slavery. We are all human beings. We >> are each responsible to our own behaviour, and our shared futures. The >> music transcends race and racism. We fight the power, and the slavers >> wherever they may be. Drawing a line in the sand and saying that you don't >> belong here is not quite what I think is intended by the music either. We >> are all belong to the sea in some way. It's the strongest idea about it I >> feel. >> >> On Thu, 18 Oct 2018, at 4:14 PM, Andrew Duke wrote: >> >> Sigh. I am absolutely disgusted by RA's handling of this at time of >> publishing and since. Denise makes great points. Liz Copeland's interview >> with James Stinson is also used. I am tired and cranky and thus this post >> ain't eloquent. Someone just sent me this link (below) re RA that was >> published Oct 11, just a few days before the original--uncredited--Drexciya >> feature. The linked feature on RA is especially relevant re the mess they >> made this week and how the concerns of Denise and others were ignored and >> 313-moderator Kent's concerns "downvoted": >> https://telegra.ph/Precedent-Advisor-10-11 >> >> >> On Thu, Oct 18, 2018, 11:12 AM Denise Dalphond, <denisedalph...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >> I told RA what I thought. They ignored me. That's what usually happens. >> >> >> *Denise Dalphond, Ph.D.* >> *ethnomusicologist* >> *schoolcraftwax.work <http://schoolcraftwax.work>* >> >> >> On Thu, Oct 18, 2018 at 10:11 AM Callum MacGregor < >> callum.macgre...@gmail.com> wrote: >> >> What about redubbing the audio with you narrating? Make a corrected >> version.... >> >> On Thu, 18 Oct 2018, 16:06 Denise Dalphond, <denisedalph...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >> I love Drexciya. And it's really cool to be able to hear from James >> Stinson still in 2018, thanks to Andrew Duke. And it's pretty amazing that >> Andrew Duke did that interview. It's a priceless artifact. I could go on! >> >> Resident Advisor didn't credit Andrew Duke when they first posted the >> video, and why is there a white woman's british voice narrating? It's off >> putting. They're using the voice of the colonizer to tell the story of >> brilliant, musical escape from enslavement and forced labor. Escape from >> the colonizer. >> >> Oh here goes Denise, making everything about race. But this actually all >> the way super duper is all about race and racism. >> >> And how much electronic music culture coverage is based in europe, the >> birthplace of imperialism and colonialism? A lot. >> >> Music fans and writers should be more concerned about preserving and >> protecting and respecting the culture that made this music. >> >> Why didn't they ask Cornelius Harris to narrate? Why didn't they ask John >> Collins to narrate? That would be meaningful to artists and fans alike. >> >> >> >> Denise >> >> >> >> *Denise Dalphond, Ph.D.* >> *ethnomusicologist* >> *schoolcraftwax.work <http://schoolcraftwax.work>* >> >> >> On Thu, Oct 18, 2018 at 9:47 AM Jeff Davis <j...@jeffreyjdavis.com> >> wrote: >> >> Pretty sure most of you saw this already but I thought this short >> video did a good job encapsulating and contextualizing the concepts >> behind Drexciya. >> >> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fgG-QiChiA8 >> >> includes a snippet from an Andrew Duke interview as well!! >> >> >> thanks, >> >> Jeffrey J Davis >> >> j...@jeffreyjdavis.com >> >> www.jeffreyjdavis.com >> >> 218.833.2847 <(218)%20833-2847> >> >> >> >>
