Hi,
I had a talk with Chris and Mason, who helped me better
understand the steps for 2-3. I will aggregate more metrics
data and share them in a google doc here soon.
* What are the websites that uses these values most
* What elements are they using the CSS property on, are there
rendering differences once disabled?
* Why are some of these value's counter higher than the
aggregated WebFeature::kCSSValueAppearanceNonStandard
Thanks,
Di
On Wednesday, July 26, 2023 at 5:04:17 PM UTC-7 Di Zhang wrote:
Hi Alex,
It's great to have support on this deprecation. Since we
feel a deprecation period of 117 to 120 is too short, I
just removed the target milestone. It can be updated once
we have better metric pulses.
For suggestion 1, the wpt test appearance-cssom-001.html
<http://wpt.live/css/css-ui/appearance-cssom-001.html?include=Invalid>actually
list all of them.
For Chrome, we are failing the 11 listed on this feature
as well as 1 slider-vertical (for both appearance and
-webkit-appearance).
For Firefox, everything is passing: it only supports
standard appearance values.
For Safari, it is failing for the newly added 3
push-button, slider-horizontal, square-button [1], 1
internal apple-pay-button, and the same 1 slider-vertical.
WebFeature::kCSSValueAppearanceNonStandard is currently
tracking for all non-standard values, including
slider-vertical. I could make them into 2 different
WebFeatures as I suspect slider-vertical is high usage
value (as it affects how <input type=range> gets
rendered). Splitting it might decrease the usage percentage.
Suggestions 2 and 3 are great, I don't know how to best
start on them.
[1]
https://github.com/w3c/csswg-drafts/issues/8506#issuecomment-1515062326
<https://github.com/w3c/csswg-drafts/issues/8506#issuecomment-1515062326> was
resolved April 2023
Thanks,
Di
On Wednesday, July 26, 2023 at 3:48:55 PM UTC-7 Alex
Russell wrote:
Hey Di,
Thanks for taking compat seriously.
We chatted about this at API OWNERS this morning, and
there'd broad support for the deprecation. There's
also concern about the relatively short deprecation
window, but maybe there are some ways we can build
confidence? Some ideas that were contributed by Mike,
Yoav, and Chris:
* Perhaps we can look to see which keywords in this
proposal are unsupported in other engines? E.g.,
if it's not compatible to use it across Gecko,
WebKit, and Blink today, perhaps it's easier to
remove.
* A spot check of the big users of these values to
understand if there are patterns. Perhaps there's
a single library, or embedded script, that
represents the bulk of use, which might lead us
to some quick wins for driving down use (e.g.,
targeted outreach).
* DevRel might be able to help spread the word
about deprecation.
In general, I think there's support for marking this
as deprecated quickly, but it might be better if we
agree to revisit the removal date based on evidence
in the future. WDYT?
Best,
Alex
On Tuesday, July 25, 2023 at 4:03:15 PM UTC-7 Di
Zhang wrote:
Thanks for the feedback. The counter does feel
high, I will follow the Deprecation steps [1] and
extend the milestones (likely DevTrial 117 and
Shipping 3 milestones later at 120).
[1]
https://source.chromium.org/chromium/chromium/src/+/main:third_party/blink/renderer/core/frame/deprecation/README.md
<https://source.chromium.org/chromium/chromium/src/+/main:third_party/blink/renderer/core/frame/deprecation/README.md>
On Monday, July 24, 2023 at 11:29:06 PM UTC-7
Yoav Weiss wrote:
Thanks!! So IIUC, any usage will result in
rendering changes? If that's indeed the case,
I think it makes sense to try and drive usage
down before changing behavior..
On Tue, Jul 25, 2023 at 12:08 AM TAMURA, Kent
<tk...@chromium.org> wrote:
Valid appearance keywords have some
side-effects even though they have no
special painting.
* Skip border painting
* 'display' property value is changed to
'inline-block' or 'block'. So some
properties such as 'width' 'height' are
not ignored.
<p>
<span style="border:2px solid red;
height:3em; background:yellow;
appearance:media-slider;">Valid</span>
<span style="border:2px solid red;
height:3em; background:yellow;
appearance:foobar;">Invalid</span>
</p>
On Mon, Jul 24, 2023 at 5:00 PM Yoav
Weiss <yoavwe...@chromium.org> wrote:
tkent@ - can you expand on the compat
risk? It's not immediately obvious to
me what these apps were doing that
resulted in a rendering difference.
On Mon, Jul 24, 2023, 03:45 TAMURA,
Kent <tk...@chromium.org> wrote:
Removing appearance keywords
which have no painting code
might have compatibility issues.
We removed the keyword "caret" in
the past, and it caused issues
like crbug.com/944023
<http://crbug.com/944023>.
The counter for this is
https://chromestatus.com/metrics/feature/timeline/popularity/4416
<https://chromestatus.com/metrics/feature/timeline/popularity/4416>.
The value is 0.005 - 0.02.
I recommend having a deprecation
period before removal.
On Thu, Jul 20, 2023 at 3:54 AM
Di Zhang <dizha...@chromium.org>
wrote:
Contact emails
dizha...@chromium.org
Explainer
None
Specification
https://drafts.csswg.org/css-ui-4/#appearance-switching
<https://drafts.csswg.org/css-ui-4/#appearance-switching>
Summary
Since only standard
appearance keywords should be
supported, we are removing
the appearance (and
-webkit-appearance) keywords
that shouldn't be supported
anymore: * inner-spin-button
* media-slider *
media-sliderthumb *
media-volume-slider *
media-volume-sliderthumb *
push-button *
searchfield-cancel-button *
slider-horizontal *
sliderthumb-horizontal *
sliderthumb-vertical *
square-button Note that value
"slider-vertical" will not be
removed as part of this patch
it is used for allowing
<input type=range> vertical.
It will be removed once
feature
FormControlsVerticalWritingModeSupport
is enabled in stable.
Previously, if using any of
the above keywords, a console
warning will be shown, but
the keyword will be
recognized as a valid value.
With the feature enabled,
there will be no console
warning. The appearance
property will be ignored and
set to the empty string. The
use count (under
WebFeature::kCSSValueAppearanceNonStandard)
is at 0.005985% as of July
2023 [3]. [1]
https://drafts.csswg.org/css-ui-4/#appearance-switching
<https://drafts.csswg.org/css-ui-4/#appearance-switching>
[2]
https://github.com/w3c/csswg-drafts/issues/8506#issuecomment-1515062326
<https://github.com/w3c/csswg-drafts/issues/8506#issuecomment-1515062326>
[3]
https://docs.google.com/document/d/e/2PACX-1vTP-wXiSV9_dSbbs4OEH-XqP0hakmoTwmEBkEJ-EAI3vDmlXxWMdHvCYl01QqUHm7q6iw8ubK0d3xk1/pub
<https://docs.google.com/document/d/e/2PACX-1vTP-wXiSV9_dSbbs4OEH-XqP0hakmoTwmEBkEJ-EAI3vDmlXxWMdHvCYl01QqUHm7q6iw8ubK0d3xk1/pub>
Blink component
Blink>CSS
<https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/list?q=component:Blink%3ECSS>
TAG review
None
TAG review status
Not applicable
Risks
Interoperability and
Compatibility
This feature only affects the
reflection in computed style.
Currently, while it is
possible to set an appearance
value with one of these
non-standard values, it will
not affect the appearance of
that element. Now, if
appearance is set to one of
these non-standard values,
the returned computed
appearance value will be
auto. It is unlikely websites
depend on this information:
this deprecation should be
web compatible.
/Gecko/: Shipped/Shipping
/WebKit/: No signal
/Web developers/: No signals
/Other signals/:
Ergonomics
There are no other platform
APIS this will be used in
tandem with and this will not
make it hard for chrome to
maintain good performance.
Activation
There should be no challenge
for developers to take
advantage of this feature
immediately.
Security
N/A
WebView application risks
Does this intent deprecate or
change behavior of existing
APIs, such that it has
potentially high risk for
Android WebView-based
applications?
None
Debuggability
The non-standard appearance
values we are removing are
already not listed in the
autocomplete in DevTools.
Will this feature be
supported on all six
Blink platforms
(Windows, Mac, Linux,
Chrome OS, Android,
and Android WebView)?
Yes
Is this feature fully
tested by
web-platform-tests
<https://chromium.googlesource.com/chromium/src/+/main/docs/testing/web_platform_tests.md>?
Yes
Flag name on
chrome://flags
RemoveNonStandardAppearanceValue
Finch feature name
Non-finch justification
None
Requires code in
//chrome?
False
Tracking bug
https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=924486
<https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=924486>
Estimated milestones
Shipping on desktop 117
DevTrial on desktop 115
Shipping on Android 117
DevTrial on Android 115
Shipping on WebView 117
Anticipated spec changes
Open questions about a
feature may be a source of
future web compat or interop
issues. Please list open
issues (e.g. links to known
github issues in the project
for the feature
specification) whose
resolution may introduce web
compat/interop risk (e.g.,
changing to naming or
structure of the API in a
non-backward-compatible way).
None
Link to entry on the
Chrome Platform Status
https://chromestatus.com/feature/5066630972833792
<https://chromestatus.com/feature/5066630972833792>
Links to previous
Intent discussions
This intent message was
generated by Chrome Platform
Status
<https://chromestatus.com/>.
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