Hi,
I had a talk with Chris and Mason, who helped me better understand the
steps for 2-3. I will aggregate more metrics data and share them in a
google doc here soon.
* What are the websites that uses these values most
* What elements are they using the CSS property on, are there
rendering differences once disabled?
* Why are some of these value's counter higher than the aggregated
WebFeature::kCSSValueAppearanceNonStandard
Thanks,
Di
On Wednesday, July 26, 2023 at 5:04:17 PM UTC-7 Di Zhang wrote:
Hi Alex,
It's great to have support on this deprecation. Since we feel a
deprecation period of 117 to 120 is too short, I just removed the
target milestone. It can be updated once we have better metric pulses.
For suggestion 1, the wpt test appearance-cssom-001.html
<http://wpt.live/css/css-ui/appearance-cssom-001.html?include=Invalid>actually
list all of them.
For Chrome, we are failing the 11 listed on this feature as well
as 1 slider-vertical (for both appearance and -webkit-appearance).
For Firefox, everything is passing: it only supports standard
appearance values.
For Safari, it is failing for the newly added 3 push-button,
slider-horizontal, square-button [1], 1 internal apple-pay-button,
and the same 1 slider-vertical.
WebFeature::kCSSValueAppearanceNonStandard is currently tracking
for all non-standard values, including slider-vertical. I could
make them into 2 different WebFeatures as I suspect
slider-vertical is high usage value (as it affects how <input
type=range> gets rendered). Splitting it might decrease the usage
percentage.
Suggestions 2 and 3 are great, I don't know how to best start on them.
[1]
https://github.com/w3c/csswg-drafts/issues/8506#issuecomment-1515062326
<https://github.com/w3c/csswg-drafts/issues/8506#issuecomment-1515062326>
was
resolved April 2023
Thanks,
Di
On Wednesday, July 26, 2023 at 3:48:55 PM UTC-7 Alex Russell wrote:
Hey Di,
Thanks for taking compat seriously.
We chatted about this at API OWNERS this morning, and there'd
broad support for the deprecation. There's also concern about
the relatively short deprecation window, but maybe there are
some ways we can build confidence? Some ideas that were
contributed by Mike, Yoav, and Chris:
* Perhaps we can look to see which keywords in this proposal
are unsupported in other engines? E.g., if it's not
compatible to use it across Gecko, WebKit, and Blink
today, perhaps it's easier to remove.
* A spot check of the big users of these values to
understand if there are patterns. Perhaps there's a single
library, or embedded script, that represents the bulk of
use, which might lead us to some quick wins for driving
down use (e.g., targeted outreach).
* DevRel might be able to help spread the word about
deprecation.
In general, I think there's support for marking this as
deprecated quickly, but it might be better if we agree to
revisit the removal date based on evidence in the future. WDYT?
Best,
Alex
On Tuesday, July 25, 2023 at 4:03:15 PM UTC-7 Di Zhang wrote:
Thanks for the feedback. The counter does feel high, I
will follow the Deprecation steps [1] and extend the
milestones (likely DevTrial 117 and Shipping 3 milestones
later at 120).
[1]
https://source.chromium.org/chromium/chromium/src/+/main:third_party/blink/renderer/core/frame/deprecation/README.md
<https://source.chromium.org/chromium/chromium/src/+/main:third_party/blink/renderer/core/frame/deprecation/README.md>
On Monday, July 24, 2023 at 11:29:06 PM UTC-7 Yoav Weiss
wrote:
Thanks!! So IIUC, any usage will result in rendering
changes? If that's indeed the case, I think it makes
sense to try and drive usage down before changing
behavior..
On Tue, Jul 25, 2023 at 12:08 AM TAMURA, Kent
<tk...@chromium.org> wrote:
Valid appearance keywords have some side-effects
even though they have no special painting.
* Skip border painting
* 'display' property value is changed to
'inline-block' or 'block'. So some properties
such as 'width' 'height' are not ignored.
<p>
<span style="border:2px solid red; height:3em;
background:yellow;
appearance:media-slider;">Valid</span>
<span style="border:2px solid red; height:3em;
background:yellow; appearance:foobar;">Invalid</span>
</p>
On Mon, Jul 24, 2023 at 5:00 PM Yoav Weiss
<yoavwe...@chromium.org> wrote:
tkent@ - can you expand on the compat risk?
It's not immediately obvious to me what these
apps were doing that resulted in a rendering
difference.
On Mon, Jul 24, 2023, 03:45 TAMURA, Kent
<tk...@chromium.org> wrote:
Removing appearance keywords which have no
painting code might have compatibility
issues. We removed the keyword "caret" in
the past, and it caused issues like
crbug.com/944023 <http://crbug.com/944023>.
The counter for this is
https://chromestatus.com/metrics/feature/timeline/popularity/4416
<https://chromestatus.com/metrics/feature/timeline/popularity/4416>.
The value is 0.005 - 0.02.
I recommend having a deprecation period
before removal.
On Thu, Jul 20, 2023 at 3:54 AM Di Zhang
<dizha...@chromium.org> wrote:
Contact emails
dizha...@chromium.org
Explainer
None
Specification
https://drafts.csswg.org/css-ui-4/#appearance-switching
<https://drafts.csswg.org/css-ui-4/#appearance-switching>
Summary
Since only standard appearance
keywords should be supported, we are
removing the appearance (and
-webkit-appearance) keywords that
shouldn't be supported anymore: *
inner-spin-button * media-slider *
media-sliderthumb *
media-volume-slider *
media-volume-sliderthumb * push-button
* searchfield-cancel-button *
slider-horizontal *
sliderthumb-horizontal *
sliderthumb-vertical * square-button
Note that value "slider-vertical" will
not be removed as part of this patch
it is used for allowing <input
type=range> vertical. It will be
removed once feature
FormControlsVerticalWritingModeSupport
is enabled in stable. Previously, if
using any of the above keywords, a
console warning will be shown, but the
keyword will be recognized as a valid
value. With the feature enabled, there
will be no console warning. The
appearance property will be ignored
and set to the empty string. The use
count (under
WebFeature::kCSSValueAppearanceNonStandard)
is at 0.005985% as of July 2023 [3].
[1]
https://drafts.csswg.org/css-ui-4/#appearance-switching
<https://drafts.csswg.org/css-ui-4/#appearance-switching>
[2]
https://github.com/w3c/csswg-drafts/issues/8506#issuecomment-1515062326
<https://github.com/w3c/csswg-drafts/issues/8506#issuecomment-1515062326>
[3]
https://docs.google.com/document/d/e/2PACX-1vTP-wXiSV9_dSbbs4OEH-XqP0hakmoTwmEBkEJ-EAI3vDmlXxWMdHvCYl01QqUHm7q6iw8ubK0d3xk1/pub
<https://docs.google.com/document/d/e/2PACX-1vTP-wXiSV9_dSbbs4OEH-XqP0hakmoTwmEBkEJ-EAI3vDmlXxWMdHvCYl01QqUHm7q6iw8ubK0d3xk1/pub>
Blink component
Blink>CSS
<https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/list?q=component:Blink%3ECSS>
TAG review
None
TAG review status
Not applicable
Risks
Interoperability and Compatibility
This feature only affects the
reflection in computed style.
Currently, while it is possible to set
an appearance value with one of these
non-standard values, it will not
affect the appearance of that element.
Now, if appearance is set to one of
these non-standard values, the
returned computed appearance value
will be auto. It is unlikely websites
depend on this information: this
deprecation should be web compatible.
/Gecko/: Shipped/Shipping
/WebKit/: No signal
/Web developers/: No signals
/Other signals/:
Ergonomics
There are no other platform APIS this
will be used in tandem with and this
will not make it hard for chrome to
maintain good performance.
Activation
There should be no challenge for
developers to take advantage of this
feature immediately.
Security
N/A
WebView application risks
Does this intent deprecate or change
behavior of existing APIs, such that
it has potentially high risk for
Android WebView-based applications?
None
Debuggability
The non-standard appearance values we
are removing are already not listed in
the autocomplete in DevTools.
Will this feature be supported
on all six Blink platforms
(Windows, Mac, Linux, Chrome
OS, Android, and Android WebView)?
Yes
Is this feature fully tested
by web-platform-tests
<https://chromium.googlesource.com/chromium/src/+/main/docs/testing/web_platform_tests.md>?
Yes
Flag name on chrome://flags
RemoveNonStandardAppearanceValue
Finch feature name
Non-finch justification
None
Requires code in //chrome?
False
Tracking bug
https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=924486
<https://bugs.chromium.org/p/chromium/issues/detail?id=924486>
Estimated milestones
Shipping on desktop 117
DevTrial on desktop 115
Shipping on Android 117
DevTrial on Android 115
Shipping on WebView 117
Anticipated spec changes
Open questions about a feature may be
a source of future web compat or
interop issues. Please list open
issues (e.g. links to known github
issues in the project for the feature
specification) whose resolution may
introduce web compat/interop risk
(e.g., changing to naming or structure
of the API in a
non-backward-compatible way).
None
Link to entry on the Chrome
Platform Status
https://chromestatus.com/feature/5066630972833792
<https://chromestatus.com/feature/5066630972833792>
Links to previous Intent
discussions
This intent message was generated by
Chrome Platform Status
<https://chromestatus.com/>.
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