>> >>> Judah wrote: >>> You know that the US is a much bigger country than either the UK or >>> Canada, right? >> >> Fine, let's go per capita > >Ok, lets go per capita. What are your numbers?
Per-capita health care costs for US and Canada: US spends 3 times as much as Canada http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news03/health_costs.html some general health care spending stats for most of the world: http://www.who.int/whosis/database/core/core_select_process.cfm?countries=all&indicators=nha http://www.epi.org/economic_snapshots/entry/webfeatures_snapshots_20071205/ is very telling to quote: the cost gap between the United States and Canada has only widened since 1993, and per capita health care expenditures in the United States are now almost double those in Canada ($6,401 vs. $3,359). Canada's per capita health expenditures rose about 65% from 1993 to 2005, while costs in the United States rose by over 90%. ... Yet infant mortality in the United States is higher and life expectancy at birth is less than in Canada. It is also noteworthy that despite Canada's much lower expenditures on health care, Canadians consult with physicians far more often than do Americans. The average number of physician consultations per capita was 6.0 in Canada, versus 3.8 in the United States.1" > > >Odd you should mention that but I do in fact have a number of friends >at Oregon Health Sciences University who do research. And yes, if they >come up with a new drug, the university stands to make a fair bit of >money. Not billions though. I know that Northwestern has an unusually >large endowment. A quick search puts it at 7 billion with $700 million >having recently come from the sale of patent rights to the drug >Lyrica, the largest royalty sale in history. The bulk of most basic >research funding still comes from the government however. And >regardless, even in the case of money made from drug development, the >relationship between national health insurance and that drug >development funding is going to be miniscule at best. There will still >be a market for drug research and new drugs will still be sold all >over the world. There's a problem when you bring in medical research into the equation. Most medical research by pharma is usually patent protection or working on a slight variation of their current best seller. The vast majority of real innovation has come from the NIH and NIH funded research centers. Not from pharma. So you're raising a specious argument here. If the US went for a single payer insurance system like in or Canada or a two tiered system like the UK, this would not affect the real scientific research community. Only the bloated big pharma. > >>> a thousand.Lets try getting a system where the leading cause of >>> bankruptcy isn't medical care. Lets try for a system where sick people >>> can go see a doctor. >> >> If you don't focus on those questions then all you'll have is >> bankruptcy. By everyone. Looked at the entitlement numbers? Robert >> can tell ya. > >You don't think that those questions are going to come into play? >Look, I know the entitlement numbers. I understand the basic market >forces. Hell, I have a degree in applied mathematics and can even >calculate actuarial tables. All of that comes to naught though if we >don't first address the basic question: are we going to do this? >That's it. Are we going to do this? > >Lets get to the point where we say "yes, we're going to do this. It is >time for the wealthiest nation in the world to agree that everyone >deserves healthcare". Then we can talk about the details of managing >risk pools, providing efficient payment systems, preventative versus >catastrophic care and all the other nitty gritty details. Other >countries have done this. They've had successes and failures. None of >them, as far as I'm aware, has been bankrupted by it. That's great. >That means we have data to work with. We're smart and we can work this >out. But first we have to have the will to do so. That is the >question. > >Judah ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~| Adobe® ColdFusion® 8 software 8 is the most important and dramatic release to date Get the Free Trial http://ad.doubleclick.net/clk;207172674;29440083;f Archive: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-community/message.cfm/messageid:288791 Subscription: http://www.houseoffusion.com/groups/cf-community/subscribe.cfm Unsubscribe: http://www.houseoffusion.com/cf_lists/unsubscribe.cfm?user=89.70.5
