I do enough of it to know. I am one of the people doing the filtering and it is rough
sorting them out.
For all of the methods that I have tried to evaluate somebody for a given position,
the least reliable information I can rely on is what the last guy thought the
candidate was worth. If it were right would we be talking in the first place? When it
comes down to money I try to have a picture of what the candidate can bring to the
table versus what we need to meet our objectives for the task at hand. It's not easy
but I personally lean away from specific skill-sets and salary in favor of attitude,
confidence and talent. Good people will do well at anything they commit to and are
always a bargain at market prices.
On the business side of it though, I'm worried about the money/budget/skill-sets etc
that make a project tick. Sometimes it is difficult not to take advantage of the
situation to close the gaps in the budget. In reality that makes it a budget problem
which is something else entirely. As far as salary histories go I feel that the act of
requiring the upper hand in a financial negotiation cuts against the grain of my
belief that good business is mutually beneficial to both parties and is to be
conducted in good faith.
Are all employers against you? I think not. But some are. They are best avoided.
Ken Leja
-----Original Message-----
From: whatshakin [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2000 10:53 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: Companies requiring proof of previous salary
You make it sound like employers are against you...Employers are actually
hoping you are the candidate they are looking for, so they don't have to go
through this:
Run an ad in a newspaper/online or use a recruiting service. In my city, I
get hundreds, sometimes thousands of responses. Wade through the resumes
initially looking for the usual B.S (experienced in X...been working since
Y(not really experienced)), and also pruning the idiots that cannot even
bother to get their resumes to a professional level.
This usually weans the resume pile by 90%.
Read resumes again in more detail looking for those skills that match what
we are looking for.
Begin scheduling technical interviews and spending time with those
candidates that are/were good at B.S*ing and those that are legitimate.
Numerous hours/days later we have a handful (if lucky) of potential
candidates. Schedule the second round of interviews to test inter-personal
skills and hopefully get to within two or three candidates. From the
remaining candidates, if any, schedule third round interviews and get down
to the nitty gritty of money and benefits etc.
A month or so after beginning we may finally get some decent help...
Most employers are more than willing to pay well the candidates that have
what we want. If you only have a couple of years experience though, you
must realize you are not going to get more than $50K. No way.
Wouldn't it be nice if the perfect candidate came walking through the door
every time you needed one? Doesn't happen, instead we have to go through
that crap.
----- Original Message -----
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 'whatshakin' <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2000 7:33 PM
Subject: RE: Companies requiring proof of previous salary
>
> My policy is that it can only be used against you in the negotiation
process.
> If they know what you are making they have at least an idea for a minimum
offer based on that. Key word: "Minimum".
>
> Besides, one of the documents that you most likely be requested to sign
later is some sort of non-disclosure agreement that probably limits your
ability to divulge your salary to other employees or prospective employers.
>
> I make it known that my dealings with my clientele are kept private, and
that salary / salary offers are one of the items covered by that deal. If
you are required to divulge that information, it is then not private and
they can no longer expect you to keep it that way (But will probably try
anyway). I stand firm on my ethic and if they do not respect that then I can
not accept the position. My last two employers "required" salary histories
and when I explained my position, not only did I earn their respect, but I
received offers at slightly higher than market average. I have likely also
have been turned down by potential employers for this reason but I have not
regretted the lost opportunity at all. In fact I like to clear this item off
the table as early as possible in order to not waste any time on the
loosers. In reality every job I have interviewed for (50+) "required" this
information at the onset. I have not needed to divulge it in over five years
and have doubled my !
> income three times since then.
>
> The negotiating skills needed to work around this issue say a great deal
more about you than a blind submission to a mandatory policy and a good
employer, will surely take notice of that.
>
> Ken Leja
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: whatshakin [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2000 8:02 PM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: Companies requiring proof of previous salary
>
> Previous salary says a lot about a persons skill level. After all, if you
> are not worth your former or current employer paying you what you are
asking
> for, why should another employer pay you that much?
>
> Granted, it is a well known fact that many employees often do not recieve
> the benefits they deserve if they remain at one company for more than five
> years or so. However, your salary is probably not too far off what a job
> change will get you. This being the case, it should not be too
embarassing
> telling your prospective employer what you currently make. If it is, you
> are probably not worth what you are shooting for.
>
> There are exceptions to the rule.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Brian <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: Stephane Wantou Siantou <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2000 3:26 PM
> Subject: Re: Companies requiring proof of previous salary
>
>
> > On Sun, 8 Oct 2000, Stephane Wantou Siantou wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > Hey Guys,
> > > I recently had an interview with a company that requires proof of
> > > my previous salary. I don't want to show them anything about my
> > > previous salary. How do you think I can go about it?
> > > Thanks
> >
> > I would tell them to take a leap. Your previous salary is *no* basis
for
> > what you are worth to them. It shouldn't even matter.
> >
> > Brian
> >
> >
> > >
> > > **NOTE: New CCNA/CCDA List has been formed. For more information go to
> > > http://www.groupstudy.com/list/Associates.html
> > > _________________________________
> > > UPDATED Posting Guidelines: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/guide.html
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> > >
> >
> > -----------------------------------------------
> > Brian Feeny, CCNP, CCDP [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Network Administrator
> > ShreveNet Inc. (ASN 11881)
> >
> > **NOTE: New CCNA/CCDA List has been formed. For more information go to
> > http://www.groupstudy.com/list/Associates.html
> > _________________________________
> > UPDATED Posting Guidelines: http://www.groupstudy.com/list/guide.html
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> >
>
> **NOTE: New CCNA/CCDA List has been formed. For more information go to
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