At 01:41 PM 7/9/01, hal9001 wrote:
>I wish I could retire but I can't because I've not got a job, bummer eh!
>
>K
Do you get paid for your work? Shouldn't Transcendor creators also get paid?
Priscilla
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "John Neiberger"
>To:
>Sent: Monday, July 09, 2001 6:35 PM
>Subject: Re: RouterSim 3.0 [7:11342]
>
>
> > Yowza! Come on, people, give Kevin a break! I think most are missing
> > the point he tried to make in the first place. He wasn't necessarily
> > calling Jennifer a criminal and coming down on her for it, he simply was
> > saying that it might not be wise to pirate training materials and then
> > mention it on a mailing list the includes a *large* number of people
> > that create or contribute to training materials!
> >
> > That just makes sense! Kevin was attempting to make Jennifer more
> > aware of the list environment, that's all.
> >
> > So, everyone, back to your corners and unruffle your feathers! :-)
> >
> > >>> "hal9001" 7/9/01 11:05:08 AM >>>
> > Oh dear, not YOU, particularly but there are people in this world that
> > Marx
> > described as "useful fools", these people thus unwittingly allow
> > despots etc
> > get into positions of power and privilege.
> >
> > You might consider your position in the great order of things and you
> > might
> > consider say Mr Gates, his position and how he got there!
> >
> > However! It was rather good of you Kevin to to consider giving the
> > matter a
> > rest as I realise what a bunch of crepuscular low life's we must all
> > seem to
> > you and your lofty but quite laudable ideals. You be a great help in
> > an
> > ideal world...but that's just the point.....an deal world.
> >
> > Jennifer I gather wearing plenty of Garlic and carrying a cross is a
> > great
> > help, on the other hand that could be something to do with bats, they
> > come
> > out in the dark don't they.
> >
> > GIVE IT UP! FINISH IT! Pleeeeeeeease!
> >
> > Karl
> >
> > Reichmarshall of my little abode! Or so my wife says.
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Kevin Wigle"
> > To: "hal9001" ;
> > Sent: Monday, July 09, 2001 4:49 PM
> > Subject: Re: RouterSim 3.0 [7:11342]
> >
> >
> > > I was hoping to just let it die but the "Seig Heil" is just a little
> > over
> > > the top.
> > >
> > > What is so difficult to understand about buying a single copy of any
> > piece
> > > of software and then burning copies? (and then telling the world
> > about it)
> > >
> > > The scenario I painted doesn't require much imagination.
> > >
> > > And I'm not trying to run anybody off. But what I said should
> > "distract"
> > > anybody that does this openly.
> > >
> > > Kevin Wigle
> > >
> > >
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "hal9001"
> > > To:
> > > Sent: Monday, July 09, 2001 11:27 AM
> > > Subject: Re: RouterSim 3.0 [7:11342]
> > >
> > >
> > > > Yes Messers - Sue, Grabbit and Runne.
> > > >
> > > > I find it amazing that there are those who slavishly chase around
> > and
> > > brown
> > > > nose themselves with big business and the powerful who are quite
> > capable
> > > of
> > > > protecting themselves. Sad. Now every one say after me:
> > > > "Seig Heil".
> > > >
> > > > K
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: "Jennifer Cribbs"
> > > > To:
> > > > Sent: Monday, July 09, 2001 4:12 PM
> > > > Subject: Re: RouterSim 3.0 [7:11342]
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > I have worked so hard studying and have loved all the wonderful
> > > > > contributions from the people that make this site
> > > > > special. But I am not a thief Phil...I really am not. We bought
> > the
> > > > > disk..We didn't steal it. We all paid money that we
> > > > > had saved so we could study and pass our tests. We had a
> > wonderful
> > > > > instructor that cared about us and helped us.
> > > > > They had special group studies on varied topics that people
> > could
> > > > > participate in if they chose. We had dinners
> > > > > together. We were all involved together on a common mission of
> > getting
> > > > > through our classes and passing our first cert
> > > > > together. I was not trying to implicate anything or anybody.
> > > > Academically,
> > > > > it was a great environment and too bad more
> > > > > aren't the same and are conductive to learning.
> > > > >
> > > > > Since those times are past, this group, without it being a
> > formal
> > > > classroom
> > > > > is the closest thing I have to college. And
> > > > > right now, I am just discouraged...
> > > > >
> > > > > It is greatly distracting me from what my goals are. I do not
> > mind a
> > > > debate
> > > > > but over pertinent issues that matter in the
> > > > > long run from a 'cert viewpoint' but this is not one of those
> > issues,
> > > but
> > > > it
> > > > > is, like I said, very distracting for me from a
> > > > > personal standpoint regarding my studying. I have never even
> > read one
> > > of
> > > > > Howards, Priscilla's or Tom's books, but I
> > > > > bet they are good. Of course, I am only assuming that based on
> > the
> > > > answers
> > > > > I have seen posted by them on this site
> > > > > and the 'free' study material compiled by them posted on
> > > > > certificationzone.com that is available on a monthly basis that
> > I
> > > > > have read. Those people are why I stayed, because you can learn
> > from
> > > > them.
> > > > > But I have not stolen anything from
> > > > > them Phil as was implied by Wigle.
> > > > >
> > > > > And you are right..this is ridiculous....I enjoy this site too
> > much
> > for
> > > > one
> > > > > Wigle to run me off.
> > > > > I guess I will just wait for the dark blue sedan to pull up with
> > all
> > the
> > > > > haggling lawyers ....
> > > > >
> > > > > Jenn
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > 7/9/2001 9:30:48 AM, "Circusnuts" wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > >What !!!
> > > > > >
> > > > > >Now this is ridiculous !!!! Jennifer- unless you're getting
> > hate
> > mail
> > > > the
> > > > > >rest us are not seeing, no one else on this list cares.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >I enjoy you posts & am surprised Kevin has carried things this
> > far...
> > > > > >Phil
> > > > > >
> > > > > >----- Original Message -----
> > > > > >From: "Jennifer Cribbs"
> > > > > >To:
> > > > > >Sent: Monday, July 09, 2001 10:18 AM
> > > > > >Subject: Re: RouterSim 3.0 [7:11342]
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >> Rational or otherwise, an already convicted thief or not, I
> > have
> > > > withdrawn
> > > > > >> my subscription from groupstudy..
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> 7/9/2001 8:42:33 AM, "Kevin Wigle" wrote:
> > > > > >>
> > > > > >> >Jennifer,
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >> >I'm not condemning you. I've read your posts and I thought
> > you a
> > > > > >rational
> > > > > >> >person.
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >> >But just read this............
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >> >"We couldn't afford it otherwise. None of us. We all copied
> > it
> > to
> > > > > >> >use from our school burner. It was registered in
> > > > > >> >a co-instructors name. It was all about wanting to pass and
> > > learning
> > > > and
> > > > > >> >him helping us. Not cheating or pirating.
> > > > > >> >Right or wrong, that's what we did. "
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >> >Can't get much closer to a confession than that. "We"
> > normally
> > > > includes
> > > > > >the
> > > > > >> >person talking but I'll let the lawyers haggle that one.
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >> >Anyway, think of all the people on this list that make this
> > list
> > > such
> > > > a
> > > > > >> >great place for learning.
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >> >Howard Berkowitz, Author and Instructor
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >> >Tom Lisa, Author and Instructor
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >> >Priscilla Oppenheimer, Author and Instructor
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >> >Not to mention the many CCIE's on the list.
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >> >They give their time freely to the list which is as good as
> > it
> > gets.
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >> >On the other hand, some people still want to steal from them
> > and
> > > > others.
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >> >I just can't seem to reconcile how anybody can steal their
> > work
> > and
> > > > then
> > > > > >> >post to a mailing list where they contribute freely. The
> > > Transcenders
> > > > > >are
> > > > > >> >not their work but the pricipal is the same.
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >> >Like I said, I have used "evaluation" software so I'm not
> > saying
> > I'm
> > > > > >above
> > > > > >> >the same issues, but I have bought legal copies of anything
> > I
> > found
> > > to
> > > > be
> > > > > >> >useful. Also, I don't post to a publc place that may
> > unwittingly
> > > cast
> > > > > >> >suspicion on other people.
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >> >And just one more thing, if you continue to post to a public
> > email
> > > > list
> > > > > >or
> > > > > >> >participate in any public endeavor - then you should be
> > prepared
> > to
> > > > have
> > > > > >> >people question your actions and for you to defend them.
> > Such
> > > debates
> > > > > >> >normally are not meant to destroy the other person but to
> > gain
> > more
> > > > > >insight
> > > > > >> >or impart advice/knowledge.
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >> >Take this as you will.
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >> >Kevin Wigle
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >> >----- Original Message -----
> > > > > >> >From: "Jennifer Cribbs"
> > > > > >> >To:
> > > > > >> >Sent: Monday, July 09, 2001 12:45 AM
> > > > > >> >Subject: Re: RouterSim 3.0 [7:11342]
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >> >
> > > > > >> >> I am not used to being a defender of my actions Kevin. I
> > am
> > > > stopping
> > > > > >> >this.
> > > > > >> >> We don't feel the same and I do not want
> > > > > >> >> to be placed in the positon of having to defend a point in
> > my
> > > > personal
> > > > > >> >> history that you disagree with me about. Maybe I
> > > > > >> >> shouldn't have said anything, but I am not used to keeping
> > secrets
> > > > > >either.
> > > > > >> >I
> > > > > >> >> am an honest person and it is pointless to
> > > > > >> >> continue this. I should not have even replied to your
> > baited
> > > > question.
> > > > > >> >> After accusations, answers are pointless, for
> > > > > >> >> accusations only breed a heated response, and I am not
> > going to
> > > get
> > > > > >caught
> > > > > >> >> up in that.
> > > > > >> >>
> > > > > >> >> 7/8/2001 11:43:43 PM, Jennifer Cribbs wrote:
> > > > > >> >>
> > > > > >> >> >Kevin,
> > > > > >> >> >
> > > > > >> >> >I am not saying I am guilty of anything...You are! When
> > you
> > are
> > > in
> > > > a
> > > > > >> >> semester of school virtually inexperienced in the
> > > > > >> >> >computer realm, things happen. I am merely replying to a
> > mail
> > > that
> > > > > >was
> > > > > >> >> posted here.
> > > > > >> >> >
> > > > > >> >> >You think it is a soft piracy ring??...and it will be my
> > fault
> > > they
> > > > > >get
> > > > > >> >> caught??...I don't think so Kevin. You are the one
> > > > > >> >> >who is wrong. I was the student on a learning quest. And
> > if I
> > > was
> > > > > >wrong
> > > > > >> >> and this is the worst thing I ever do, then I
> > > > > >> >> >won't worry or lose sleep over it.
> > > > > >> >> >
> > > > > >> >> >There are so few indescretions in my life that this one
> > just
> > > kinda
> > > > > >sticks
> > > > > >> >> out and came to mind...Sorry for the stress my
> > > > > >> >> >post caused you.
> > > > > >> >> >
> > > > > >> >> >Jennifer
> > > > > >> >> >
> > > > > >> >> >
> > > > > >> >> >
> > > > > >> >> >
> > > > > >> >> >
> > > > > >> >> >7/8/2001 8:41:46 PM, "Kevin Wigle" wrote:
> > > > > >> >> >
> > > > > >> >> >>In today's litigious world, I'm surprised that anyone
> > would go
> > > > onto a
> > > > > >> >> >>respected mailing list and publicly admit that they're
> > guilty
> > of
> > > > > >> >software
> > > > > >> >> >>piracy and provide enough details to be tracked down.
> > > > > >> >> >>
> > > > > >> >> >>Then further implicate the school by using their
> > equipment and
> > > > > >further
> > > > > >> >> >>implicate a "co-instructor" at the school.
> > > > > >> >> >>
> > > > > >> >> >>I'm sure it wouldn't take much sleuthing to find the
> > school,
> > the
> > > > > >> >> >>co-instructor's name and the entire "ring".
> > > > > >> >> >>
> > > > > >> >> >>I'm not saying I'm lily white but I don't advertise my
> > > > indiscretions
> > > > > >to
> > > > > >> >the
> > > > > >> >> >>world. I'm sure a company like Cisco does not want it to
> > be
> > > known
> > > > > >that
> > > > > >> >a
> > > > > >> >> >>school allowed (either explicitly or through negligence)
> > > software
> > > > > >piracy
> > > > > >> >> had
> > > > > >> >> >>anything to do with the academy.
> > > > > >> >> >>
> > > > > >> >> >>At the end of the day it is theft, we can all debate the
> > > problems
> > > > of
> > > > > >> >> >>obtaining affordable training/schooling, but at the end
> > of the
> > > > > >debate -
> > > > > >> >it
> > > > > >> >> >>is theft. The school could be sued, the academy could
> > be
> > > > withdrawn,
> > > > > >the
> > > > > >> >> >>co-instructor could lose his job and legal expenses could
> > make
> > > > > >whatever
> > > > > >> >> >>profit you thought you made unavailable for a long time.
> > > > > >> >> >>
> > > > > >> >> >>Why would you want to tell us about it?
> > > > > >> >> >>
> > > > > >> >> >>Kevin Wigle
> > > > > >> >> >>
> > > > > >> >> >>
> > > > > >> >> >>----- Original Message -----
> > > > > >> >> >>From: "Jennifer Cribbs"
> > > > > >> >> >>To:
> > > > > >> >> >>Sent: Sunday, 08 July, 2001 17:42
> > > > > >> >> >>Subject: Re: RouterSim 3.0 [7:11342]
> > > > > >> >> >>
> > > > > >> >> >>
> > > > > >> >> >>> Personally, I think it's good to help people and there
> > is a
> > > > > >difference
> > > > > >> >> >>being
> > > > > >> >> >>> profiting from someones else's work and
> > > > > >> >> >>> helping people trying to learn. When I was in school,
> > all
> > the
> > > > > >> >students
> > > > > >> >> >>went
> > > > > >> >> >>> in together and bought transcender for the
> > > > > >> >> >>> ccna. We couldn't afford it otherwise. None of us.
> > We all
> > > > copied
> > > > > >it
> > > > > >> >to
> > > > > >> >> >>> use from our school burner. It was registered in
> > > > > >> >> >>> a co-instructors name. It was all about wanting to
> > pass and
> > > > > >learning
> > > > > >> >and
> > > > > >> >> >>> him helping us. Not cheating or pirating.
> > > > > >> >> >>> Right or wrong, that's what we did. And I will also
> > add
> > that
> > > > > >> >> >>transcender's
> > > > > >> >> >>> high points are the excellent explanations at
> > > > > >> >> >>> the end of each question. The questions themselves
> > were not
> > > > geared
> > > > > >in
> > > > > >> >a
> > > > > >> >> >>way
> > > > > >> >> >>> however to prepare a student for what
> > > > > >> >> >>> was coming and the structure of what the real questions
> > were
> > > > about.
> > > > > >> >If
> > > > > >> >> >>you
> > > > > >> >> >>> didn't study the explanations, you might fall
> > > > > >> >> >>> into that trap of memorizing and not learning.
> > > > > >> >> >>>
> > > > > >> >> >>> People will probably disagree with me also...
> > > > > >> >> >>>
> > > > > >> >> >>> Jennifer Cribbs.
> > > > > >> >> >>> [been there, done that]
> > > > > >> >> >>>
> > > > > >> >> >>> 7/8/2001 2:46:10 PM, "PHIMHONGKONG" wrote:
> > > > > >> >> >>>
> > > > > >> >> >>> >contact me at [EMAIL PROTECTED] i have router sim 2.1
> > and
> > > switch
> > > > > >sim +
> > > > > >> >> >>ccno
> > > > > >> >> >>> >sim
> > > > > >> >> >>> >i can burn you one
> > > > > >> >> >>> >:-d
> > > > > >> >> >>> >i dont sell pirate software . i am helping you to
> > study :-)
> > > > > >> >> >>> >
> > > > > >> >> >>> >poeple please dont say i am pirater
> > > > > >> >> >>> >
> > > > > >> >> >>> > wrote in message
> > > > > >> >> >>> >[EMAIL PROTECTED]">news:[EMAIL PROTECTED]...
> > > > > >> >> >>> >> Hi to all,
> > > > > >> >> >>> >> For anybody who own a RouterSim 3.0. I am planning
> > to
> > > invest
> > > > > >> >$250.00
> > > > > >> >> >>> >buying
> > > > > >> >> >>> >> RouterSim 3.0 router simulator to preopare for my
> > CCNA
> > > > > >> >certification.
> > > > > >> >> >>Can
> > > > > >> >> >>> >I
> > > > > >> >> >>> >> burn a copy of this as my back-up? Can I
> > simultaneously
> > > > install
> > > > > >> >this
> > > > > >> >> to
> > > > > >> >> >>> >two
> > > > > >> >> >>> >> hard drives (i.e, to a desk top and to a lap top)?
> > > > > >> >> >>> >> Please educate me.
> > > > > >> >> >>> >>
> > > > > >> >> >>> >> Thanks,
> > > > > >> >> >>> >> Val
> > > > > >> >> >>> Have a great day!!
> > > > > >> >> >>> Jennifer
> > > > > >> >> >Have a great day!!
> > > > > >> >> >Jennifer
> > > > > >> >> >
> > > > > >> >>
> > > > > >> >> Have a great day!!
> > > > > >> >> Jennifer
> > > > > >> Have a great day!!
> > > > > >> Jennifer
> > > > > Have a great day!!
> > > > > Jennifer
________________________
Priscilla Oppenheimer
http://www.priscilla.com
Message Posted at:
http://www.groupstudy.com/form/read.php?f=7&i=11557&t=11342
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