Hideki, Thank you. Your results look quite compelling. Do you allow memory (the number of nodes in the tree) to grow along with thinking time or is there a fixed limit?
IIRC Don et. al.'s excellent scaling studies included gnugo but its effect was probably small. Self play dominated. Perhaps, what David Doshay calls, the "evil twin effect" causes self play to give the appearance of scaling better. - Dave Hillis -----Original Message----- From: Hideki Kato <hideki_ka...@ybb.ne.jp> To: computer-go <computer-go@computer-go.org> Sent: Sat, Oct 31, 2009 10:39 pm Subject: Re: [computer-go] First ever win of a computer against a pro 9P as black (game of Go, 9x9). hillism...@netscape.net: <8cc26e08cfc0f77-5fd0-a...@webmail-m052.sysops.aol.com>: > -----Original Message----- > From: Hideki Kato <hideki_ka...@ybb.ne.jp> > To: computer-go <computer-go@computer-go.org> > Sent: Wed, Oct 28, 2009 1:41 am > Subject: Re: [computer-go] First ever win of a computer against a pro 9P as lack (game of Go, 9x9). > ... > BTW, recently I've measured the strength (win rate) vs time for a move > curves with Zen vs GNU Go and Zen vs Zen (self-play) on 19 x 19 board. > Without opening book, it saturates between +400 and +500 Elo against > GNU but doesn't upto +800 Elo in self-play. That's somewhat > interesting (detail will be open soon at GPW-2009). > Hideki I'd say that is more than "somewhat" interesting. While we're waiting for the aper, can you give us a picture of how many games against Gnugo went into this nalysis? Do you see this in 9x9? I've attatched two charts of current results for convinience. hart1 is against GNU Go and Chart2 is self-play. The numbers for the 1st curve "HA8000 (AMD Opteron 2.3GHz) 16 thread" n Chart1 are: ime(s) Win Draw All Dup WR std-dev Elo .02 325 27 2,933 0 11.54% 0.59% -353.8 .1 509 23 728 0 71.50% 1.67% +159.8 .2 946 47 1,147 0 84.52% 1.07% +294.9 .5 1,803 60 2,000 0 91.65% 0.62% +416.2 .0 1,849 33 2,000 0 93.28% 0.56% +456.8 .0 4,455 121 4,812 0 93.84% 0.35% +473.1 The numbers for Chart2 are: ime(s) Win Draw All Dup WR std-dev Elo .1 147 4 2,000 0 7.45% 0.59% -437.7 .3 992 36 2,000 0 50.50% 1.12% +3.5 .0 3,742 38 4,000 0 94.03% 0.37% +478.8 .0 13,157 43 13,328 1 98.89% 0.09% +779.3 Since above results are measured with no opening book, I'm now enchmarking opening book enabled but right now the samples are ot enough (642 games; see the 4th curve in Chart1, "HA8000 (AMD pteron 2.3GHz) 16 thread w/ Book"). Not a curve but a point now :-) For 9x9 it's not clear. The curve starts saturating near +500 Elo ut still seems increasing. Hideki - g...@nue.ci.i.u-tokyo.ac.jp (Kato) _______________________________________________ omputer-go mailing list omputer...@computer-go.org ttp://www.computer-go.org/mailman/listinfo/computer-go/
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