Unfortunately you have to be realistic though. I agree with you in a sense, but going into a store and buying JAWS or Window Eyes off of the shelf? That would be nice? that's one reason I like the Mac and accessories. The people in the Mac and Apple stores will likely not be trained for extensive use with Vo, but they should be able to make sure it works. Try going into a Best Buy and asking them if JFW works. We probably make up less than 10% of the population so it isn't going to happen. It would still be expensive, and that's why I needed the agency to buy it for me. Again don't get me wrong, in a perfect world that might happen, but we all know the world is far from perfect. I'm not trying to defend anybody necessarily, and I don't consider myself dependent because I need assistance from them. I got my own jobs, take care of myself, go where I need to go etc. A good organization helps people become independent. I agree that whenever possible, we should do for ourselves and not be too dependent on anybody, agencies included.
On Nov 30, 2009, at 12:23 PM, Richie Gardenhire wrote: > And for this reason, I feel that many state agencies, (Alaska's, being > one of them)will be cutting back services, in favor of other things > and as Mark so eloquently pointed out, the elderly, the poor, and the > disabled, will be hurt first. I know thisis a different subject line > from what was originally intended, and I apologize for that, but I > will say one more thing on this, and that is that I'm in favor of > universal design so that blind people can walk into any store and > purchase off-the-shelf software and get it working and we not be > forced to be co-dependent on state agencies to purchase our stuff. I > guess, in a way, I'm against state agencies for the reasons I stated > above. Richie Gardenhire, Anchorage, Alaska. > > > On Nov 30, 2009, at 10:32 AM, carlene knight wrote: > > Hi Mark: > > I certainly don't hold a grudge as everybody is entitled to their > opinion. However, if it weren't for the Commission for the blind here > in Oregon, there is no way that I could perform the job I was hired > for. I had to have a programmer write JAWS scripts so that I could > get to the buttons, read the drop down boxes that just had graphics > for names, etc. I couldn't have afforded the thousands of dollars that > has costed. He is working as we speak since the company I work for > has changed software and everything we had done in the past regarding > the original software is now null and void. I could have not afforded > a Braille display at about 12,000 dollars. I can say with certainty > that there are few if any companies that would provide any of these > services. Unfortunately many government funded agencies, including > the Oregon Commission for the blind do know little about Mac > accessibility as they have contracts with certain vendors, and, face > it,whether we like it or not, a majority of companies still use > Windows based software. My husband and I both decided on our own to > try the Mac, and though I've had some problems, I'm glad I did. I've > learned it without an instructor. We nearly lost our Commission last > summer so when I hear people talking about how we shouldn't have > government agencies such as this, I have to disagree though they do > have their problems. Yes, some people do rely on others to much, but > not all of us do. Like you, I grew up in the public school system in > a rural area. I was born blind also. I'll get off my soap box now. > > On Nov 30, 2009, at 10:51 AM, Mark BurningHawk Baxter wrote: > >> You, and I to a lesser extent, and others are the exception. I was >> born blind, didn't go to any institutions for the blind, was raised as >> an only child, mostly in rural Vermont with minimal help from state >> agencies. Graduated from Dartmouth when I was 20, again with minimal >> if any help from agencies--didn't have my first experience with any >> agencies or institutions for the blind until I was 24, when the >> Carroll Center was offering a medical transcription course and I >> needed another, safer place to be. They kicked me out of their dorm, >> making me homeless, after six weeks there. Rehab flatly refused to >> support me and my music career in any way, and pressured me to go to >> the Carroll Center in the first place, then pressured me to get >> therapy and reform my ways when they made me homeless. I only started >> cautiously learning how to deal with the agencies in 2007, when it >> became clear that my failing hearing was going to force me out of the >> transcription career I'd had for 13+ years. I learned Jaws and >> Windows essentially by myself, as I've always been good with tech. >> Even now, while I may have learned a little about how to get along >> with the agencies and get what I need, it's a very uneasy truce at >> best./ I hope to be starting a job at another institution for the >> blind soon, but this time as a trainer, not a student, which hopefully >> will turn out better. You can see why I advocate for the abolition of >> such systems. They do not foster independence of thinking, and tend >> to punish outside-the-box people, in my experience. I do realize that >> people blinded later in life may not adapt as fully as those born >> blind; I'm learning that as I lose my hearing, so I have the privilege >> of seeing both sides of the coin, but think about what that implies-- >> that the pressure on those whose world has already been blasted by >> losing their sight will essentially become putty in the hands of high- >> pressure agencies who are set in their ways. The system seems to >> punish at both ends--if you're too independent, you're pressured to >> conform; if you're new to blindness, you're taught not to think for >> yourself. Hell, I didn't even do mobility orienting stuff until last >> year, when Rehab here in CA suggested I ry it, and I decided, in the >> interests of keeping the peace, what the heck; my mobility teacher >> quickly realized that there was very little, beyond the immediate >> rehearsing of directions, that she could improve upon what I and my >> dog were already going. Since I got Trekker, that's even more so; now >> that Trekker is temporarily broken, I truly feel the loss. :) I don't >> see how the agencies really have done me any good, other than in the >> purely material realm, and if I weren't as articulate as I am about >> stating my needs, and as forceful as I am about what I need, which >> most people are not, even that gain might be minimal, and even now the >> damage is significant. So, that's where my beef with the system(s) >> comes in; sorry if that makes it a personal grudge, but there you are >> then. >> >> >> Mark BurningHawk Baxter >> >> Skype and Twitter: BurningHawk1969 >> MSN: burninghawk1...@hotmail.com >> My home page: >> http://MarkBurningHawk.net/ >> >> -- >> >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >> Groups "MacVisionaries" group. >> To post to this group, send email to macvisionar...@googlegroups.com. >> To unsubscribe from this group, send email to >> macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com >> . >> For more options, visit this group at >> http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en >> . >> >> > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "MacVisionaries" group. > To post to this group, send email to macvisionar...@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com > . > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en > . > > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "MacVisionaries" group. > To post to this group, send email to macvisionar...@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/macvisionaries?hl=en. > > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MacVisionaries" group. 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