Hi J Smith MLO is superb BECAUSE it only caters to the "techie" power user.
I have tried every other GTD and task management software out there. I've been trying to find the perfect system for around 4 years. Last year I discovered MLO and it absolutely changed my life. There are a plethora of user-friendly, simplistic, "mainstream" options out there. There is only one MLO. My only regret was not finding it earlier!! On Friday, 20 November 2015 05:38:29 UTC+13, J Smith wrote: > > > > chrisleeuk > > As previously discussed MLO is much more of a platform and less of an > application. All I am saying is that the confusing and cluttered nature of > the inteface this is holding back sales dramatically. And that this is > completely unnecesssary and a shame. > > Personally I have wasted countless hours trying to get MLO to do what I > seek. Through pure bloody-mindedness I have tried using all sorts of > dramatically different configurations. > > Out of interest did you ever try GTDNext. I have my eye on them because > unlike MLO they are incredibly responsive to customers. They are an > extremely small team however they listen to all feedback and reply to it > all - usually pretty swiftly (often within a day or two). They will give > reasons where they don't implement stuff. And they also release things in > the modern way with lots of small incremental changes, which further > encourages users to get involved and to give more feedback. In short they > clearly seem to have read Eric Ries's best selling book "The Lean Startup" > and seem to be putting into practice. MLO have a lot to learn from GTDNext. > > Yes MLO is find for geeks, but it is not fine for mainstream users. And I > simply can not imagine any of my non-geekfriends using it because the > learning curve is too steep and the interface too cluttered/confusing. > > Which is a shame because it is superb in so many ways... > > > > On Wednesday, 18 November 2015 17:54:23 UTC, chrisleeuk wrote: >> >> This is more a reply to the comments from John Smith. >> >> >> >> I regard myself as a techie, which according to your comments suggests I >> don't fit into the definition of a normal human being :) >> >> I'm not sure if that makes me some kind of super human, or a weird tech >> geek, either way, I take it as a compliment. >> >> >> >> I'm sorry that you find the learning curve for MLO so challenging. >> >> I agree that MLO could probably benefit from a little more in the help >> department and it always better to make software accessible. >> >> >> >> MLO is definitely powerful and configurable and no doubt learning all the >> features does take time. >> >> >> >> Personally I found that with MLO I could start small. I could learn to >> use the basic task functionality without much issue. Gradually I learned >> the more advanced functionality, but MLO did a good job of hiding all this >> stuff away until I was ready. >> >> >> >> I've tried probably half of the software and services on your list of >> competition. Many were easy to use and no doubt would appeal more to a >> wider public. However in every case I found them either too limiting or I >> had to bend my work flow and way of thinking to fit the product. >> >> >> >> With MLO I can configure it to fit me. >> >> >> >> Your argument is principally that MLO will fail due to lack of mass >> market appeal, or that it is inferior because it will be too difficult for >> the average person. >> >> >> >> It's a typically modern view that products must conform to the lowest >> common denominator in order appeal to the maximum audience. That’s the kind >> of thinking that, for example, results in big corporations creating some >> truly dreadful, but highly profitable TV shows. >> >> >> >> MLO does require some investment of your time. It does require learning. >> It’s highly specialized, and won’t appeal to everyone. >> >> >> >> MLO as a company is small but it’s sustained itself for 15 years so far. >> >> >> >> Not every product needs to be all things to all people, but if you can't >> get on with MLO, you have a big list of other software that might meet your >> individual needs better. >> >> >> >> MLO appeals to a niche market, and that’s fine by me. >> >> >> >> On Monday, 1 December 2014 01:56:40 UTC-7, J Smith wrote: >>> >>> Obviously because I am new... that means in part I have no idea what I >>> am talking about. But partly it makes me a real expert in the NEW user >>> experience. >>> >>> The thing is I develop/managed websites for a living and I too would >>> regard myself as 'above average' technically and I also have a strong sense >>> of how users work. >>> >>> To be honest, I do feel for the MLO team. Given where they are, it will >>> not be easy to get to where they need to get to in order to get anything >>> close to adoption by the mainstream audience. >>> >>> I am being extremely persistent here because I have a fairly short >>> time-window in which to get my entire life onto MLO... or give the heck up. >>> >>> I am also being persistent because there is MUCH wrong with all the >>> competition that I have seen so far. But that won't last (see below). >>> >>> What do I like about MLO? >>> >>> Well, on the up-side, there is a plethora of hotkeys on MLO, many of >>> which you can configure yourself is great and it is dead-easy to whiz items >>> things up and down multi-level Project Trees and also it's also trivial to >>> switch items between being an action and being a Projects. [These aspects >>> are astonishingly rare in the obvious competing product that I have tried >>> but I LOVE them in MLO!] Moreover you can have something called a "Folder" >>> which is neither a Project nor an Action. It's a subject area. (Brilliant! >>> But again, v rare in other apps...). >>> >>> On the down-side this has to be up there as being one of the hardest >>> apps to 'learn how to drive' that I have ever, EVER come across. [And >>> that's even after I have spent quite a lot of time reading up on GTD theory >>> - and after I have even listened to an entire 2-day seminar by David Allen!] >>> >>> BUT I can't think of a single social or business friend who would put up >>> with this level of difficulty of learning that I have experienced with MLO. >>> Yes, some techies might well go for it... but any normal human being - >>> Absolutely no chance! >>> >>> And it's no use saying "but it's very powerful and configurable". Life >>> is short. We are aren't here for the fun of using your >>> software... Ultimately we are only using these tools in order to *save* >>> us time! >>> >>> [Aside: MLO reminds me of the PC database software dBase clone called >>> Clipper - anyone here old enough to remember that? It was indeed incredibly >>> powerful and configurable but the learning curve to get anything useful out >>> of it was about 3 months. Management were NOT happy. And commercially it >>> simply *died* as hugely powerful and highly configurable as it was.] >>> >>> Now, after all the work the you good people at MLO have put into this >>> your extremely powerful tool, this is bad news indeed. >>> >>> If you want a 'quick win' you could regain a lot of usability points at >>> a stroke simply by doing a couple of explainer videos. A quick short high >>> level one for total newbies *selling* the whole concept (max 1-2 mins) >>> and a more detailed one for the converts telling us *how to use* the >>> system (8-12 mins). And then if you get a chance do another 5 or 10 and >>> slap them onto YouTube. And do them in English. >>> >>> Having built this video the next thing you need to do is 'Primary >>> Customer Research' - newbie *user trials *! What you need is need about >>> 8-10 users who are not particularly technical sit them down in front of the >>> software and WATCH. Get them to talk their thoughts out loud. Video them. >>> >>> Then show them the video and watch again. You will be appalled, I >>> promise you. >>> >>> Honestly, you chaps have built a fantastic engine. But if you want to >>> appeal to *Mainstream* users (rather than *Early Adopters*) then >>> frankly you people need to stop all developments until you have done both >>> of the above. >>> >>> To get clear Early Adopters have a very different psychology from >>> Mainstream users. Early Adopters like to be the first. They are generally >>> pretty clever. They like learning news stuff. They tolerate complexity, >>> mistakes, errors and even bugs to a significant extent. >>> >>> BUT there aren't all that many of them. And if your product appears to >>> be going nowhere and is not longer "cutting edge", then they will feel like >>> idiots for wasting their time with you and they are off! >>> >>> MAINSTREAM users are different. They value their time very highly. They >>> just want to get the job done. And fast. They do NOT want to waste any more >>> time than necessary learning stuff. So they want everything to be easy to >>> learn and obvious. They like simplicity. They HATE complexity. They want to >>> get the job done and they want everything to work. >>> >>> Frankly as things stand, MLO is a total nightmare for Mainstream users. >>> But don't just take my/Joel's word for it. Do some serious trials with >>> newbie users! Try some less intelligent / 'ditsy' and/or 'arty' new users. >>> Even try some slightly drunk or extremely tired users. You need a random >>> spectrum of users to trail. They will run screaming I guarantee you. >>> >>> [Aside: Another top top - if you are short of time &/or money and want >>> to do a 'quick and dirty'/'better than nothing' user trial, then consider >>> using Feedback Army and asking the reviewers to so something specific. The >>> clever thing is that you can keep rejecting their responses until you are >>> happy with the level of work that they have done. Brilliant! But actually >>> you at MLO also need to do proper face-to-face user trials I suspect as >>> well] >>> >>> If you want further proof of what I am saying take the number of really >>> important keyboard shortcuts that are completely missing from your official >>> Keyboard Shortcuts page. e.g. >>> >>> Control/PgUp ==> to change tab >>> Control/PgDn ==> to change tab >>> Control/Enter ==> to parse the title of an item >>> Control/Shift/Insert ==> to add a new folder >>> Control/Shift/S ==> to add a star >>> Control/M ==> to move a task >>> >>> ...} all missing ! (er I think...!) >>> >>> If you had done in depth user trials then surely this would have been >>> picked up. >>> >>> One word of caution. Beware of *some* of your most loyal customers. >>> There is no subtext to this - I am not having a go anyone whatsoever. But >>> it's an established fact that in order to appeal to *Mainstream* >>> customers you will almost certainly get terrible advice from some of your >>> customers. But they are dangerous. They are far too close to your product >>> to see it through the eyes of anyone else. And over time they can bankrupt >>> you. >>> >>> Finally you need to know that much though I am trying to help MLO in >>> what probably seems like a whirlwind of input, please know that I am not >>> happy. And I have been keeping a list of competing software in case I find >>> that I genuinely can not get MLO to work for me (This is still not clear >>> either way...!) . And believe me there is a LOT of competition. My >>> spreadsheet for this purpose has well over 100 competitors ! >>> >>> For completeness here they are: >>> 2Do >>> 5PM >>> Achieve Planner >>> ActionComplete >>> Action Method >>> ActiveInBox >>> Ajour >>> Apigio >>> Asana >>> Assembla Tickets >>> Astrid List/Task Manager >>> Blue Smiley Organizer >>> Bonsai >>> Bontq >>> Central Desktop >>> Clear (Realmac Software) >>> ClearContext >>> Conqu >>> d-cubed >>> DoIt.im >>> Do It Tomorrow >>> do-Organizer >>> DropTask >>> Due Today >>> EasyTask Manager >>> eProductivity >>> EssentialPIM Pro >>> EverNote (+The Secret Weapon) >>> FacileThings >>> Facio Tasks >>> Feng Office >>> Flashpoint >>> Flow >>> Frictionless >>> GeeTeeDee >>> germ.io >>> Get Stuff Done >>> Getitdoneapp >>> Ghost Action >>> Gmail Tasks >>> GoalsOnTrack >>> Google Tasks >>> GTD TiddlyWiki Plus >>> GTDAgenda >>> GTDFree >>> GTDNext >>> gtd-php >>> Harmony PIM >>> HiTask >>> iGTD >>> IQTell >>> Jello Dashboard >>> KOI >>> KonoLive >>> Lifeballanced >>> LifeTopix >>> LiquidPlanner >>> Lists Manager? >>> MasterList Professional >>> mGSD >>> MindManager >>> MindOnTrack >>> MyLifeOrganized >>> Nach >>> Nepture >>> Next Action, Personal Ed >>> Nexty >>> Nirvana >>> Nitro >>> Nozbe >>> Omnifocus >>> OneNote >>> OnePlace >>> Online Task List >>> Oprius >>> Organitask >>> Org-Mode >>> Outlook 2010 >>> Papirus >>> Pimki >>> Plancake >>> PocketInformant >>> Priacta >>> Producteev >>> propelr >>> Psoda >>> Redmill >>> Relenta >>> Remember The Milk (RTM) >>> RexDesktop >>> SimpleNote >>> SandGlaz >>> Smart To-Do List >>> SmartSheet >>> Smartytask >>> Smthngs >>> Task Coach >>> Task Toy >>> TaskFreak >>> TaskPad.jp >>> Tasks/Tasks Pro >>> TaskStep >>> TaskTask (iOS only?) >>> TaskUnifier >>> Taskwarrior >>> Tasque >>> The Now Organiser >>> Things (iOS only?) (by Cultured Code) >>> ThinkingRock >>> Thymer >>> TickTick >>> TiDy >>> TimeGT >>> TimeManagementNinja.com >>> Timetpnote >>> Tjeklist >>> ToDo >>> To-Do DeskList >>> ToDo.txt >>> ToDo Exchange >>> ToDo Matrix >>> Todo Pro >>> ToDoIst >>> ToDoList >>> ToDoMoo >>> Toodledo >>> TomBoy >>> TouchDown w Exchange Tasks >>> TaskUnifier >>> Tracks >>> Tracks.tra.in >>> Treedolist >>> Ultimate ToDo >>> Upvise >>> VIP Task Manager >>> VitalList >>> Voo2doo >>> What To Do >>> WhatsNext (not ready?) >>> Week Plan >>> Wieldy >>> Workflowy >>> Wunderlist >>> Zendone >>> Zoho CRM >>> Zoot >>> >>> OK many of they above may not be *direct* competitors, (e.g. many don't >>> run on Windows and many are more list managers than GTD tools as such ) but >>> I promise you that as a normal/average user, this is the number of tools we >>> have to wade through on-line, competing with your listings. >>> >>> Why are there quite so many competitors? Because they all think that the >>> existing market leaders aren't doing a good enough job! They are trying to >>> steal your lunch and there are a LOT of them out there. >>> >>> Conclusion: >>> You have SERIOUS competition and you need to raise your game. You need >>> dramatically improved usability. >>> >>> Finally: >>> Please don't think I'm saying you need to work harder. Nor write better >>> code. What I'm saying is you need to work differently. VERY differently. >>> >>> J >>> >>> >>> P.S. If anyone from MLO is still reading and appreciating my input >>> please let me know. >>> >>> Alternatively, if I am simply wasting my breath please do let me know >>> too! >>> >> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "MyLifeOrganized" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to mylifeorganized+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to mylifeorganized@googlegroups.com. 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