Re: [Emc-users] Strange MDI.

[Slavko Kocjancic]

Jeff Epler pravi:
> Which version of emc are you testing with?  This behavior is buggy in
> 2.3, but in v2.4_branch and master there's a change that is intended to
> improve or fix this problem:
>
> commit 314f3aa2d90e5ec1f7840166f3e0ad11a9fbc0a6
> Author: Jeff Epler 
> Date:   Wed Jan 27 08:16:47 2010 -0600
>
> improve behavior of MDI O-calls
> 
> Bad things happen when the motion id is zero.  This could frequently
> happen when doing O-calls from MDI, because the motion ids for an MDI
> start at pseudoMdiLineNumber and increase for each executed motion
> (? line?) in the subroutine.  For instance, if pseudoMdiLineNumber was
> -7, then executing an O-call with 8 or more lines of motion would issue
> a motion with ID 0.
>
> diff --git a/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc b/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc
> index 39ce8ad..f26c1cf 100644
> --- a/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc
> +++ b/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc
> @@ -125,7 +125,7 @@ NMLmsg *emcTaskCommand = 0;
>  // signal handling code to stop main loop
>  static int done;
>  static int emctask_shutdown(void);
> -static int pseudoMdiLineNumber = -1;
> +static int pseudoMdiLineNumber = INT_MIN;
>  
>  static int all_homed(void) {
>  for(int i=0; i<9; i++) {
> @@ -1957,7 +1957,7 @@ static int emcTaskIssueCommand(NMLmsg * cmd)
>  }
> if (execute_msg->command[0] != 0) {
> if (emcStatus->task.mode == EMC_TASK_MODE_MDI) {
> -   interp_list.set_line_number(--pseudoMdiLineNumber);
> +   interp_list.set_line_number(++pseudoMdiLineNumber);
> }
> execRetval = emcTaskPlanExecute(execute_msg->command, 
> pseudoMdiLineNumber);
> if (execRetval == 2 /* INTERP_ENDFILE */ ) {
>
>
>   
Version is v2.5~branch
I can't apply patch. Seems that we have different version.
I'm sure there is no whitespace and line termination is linux style.
Can you send entire emctaskmain.cc?

Slavko.

Here is console output...

sla...@emc2-laptop:~/emc2-dev$ git am --signoff mail.eml
Applying Strange MDI.
error: patch failed: src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc:125
error: src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc: patch does not apply
Patch failed at 0001.
When you have resolved this problem run "git-am --resolved".
If you would prefer to skip this patch, instead run "git-am --skip".
sla...@emc2-laptop:~/emc2-dev$




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Re: [Emc-users] mux

[Kirk Wallace]

On Thu, 2010-03-04 at 21:44 -0500, Dave Keeton wrote:
> Thanks for your reply
> 
> What exactly does the
> 
> >addf mux2.1 servo-thread
> 
> do for us, is it required for my situation? What if I add more mux's? Does 
> that line change again or do I add another? Is there a limit to the number 
> of mux's we can use?
> 
> Dave Keeton

Just in case, I'll reinforce one point.

loadrt mux2 count=2<- creates two mux's, mux2.0 and mux2.1
addf mux2.0 servo-thread   <- assigns mux2.0 to run in the servo-thread 

mux2.1 hasn't been assigned yet, so it won't run. I've loaded components
connect their pins and forgot to assign them to threads more than I care
to admit.

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http://www.wallacecompany.com/machine_shop/
http://www.wallacecompany.com/E45/index.html
California, USA


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Re: [Emc-users] Emc-gcode throughput

[Kirk Wallace]

On Thu, 2010-03-04 at 20:52 -0600, Jon Elson wrote:
... snip
> more resources than a 3-axis program, but the super-hard stuff they 
> usually make these parts out of are not machined at high feed rates.  A 
... snip

This one's pretty quick:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0LCaRqQ8Qf8 

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http://www.wallacecompany.com/machine_shop/
http://www.wallacecompany.com/E45/index.html
California, USA


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Re: [Emc-users] mux

[Dave Keeton]

Thanks again Stuart.

Dave Keeton
Technical Services Manager
The Eagle Tool & Machine Co.
Springfield, Ohio




--
From: "Stuart Stevenson" 
Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2010 9:53 PM
To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" 
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] mux

> On Thu, Mar 4, 2010 at 8:44 PM, Dave Keeton  wrote:
>
>> Thanks for your reply
>>
>> What exactly does the
>>
>> >addf mux2.1 servo-thread
>>
>> this line adds the mux2.1 to the the servo-thread
> this causes it to be executed at the servo-thread rate
>
>
>> do for us, is it required for my situation? What if I add more mux's? 
>> Does
>> that line change again or do I add another? Is there a limit to the 
>> number
>> of mux's we can use?
>>
>> yes - if you add more muxes (sic?) you must add more addf lines to 
>> connect
> them to a thread
> ie
>   addf mux2.2 servo-thread ..
>
> you are not restricted to the servo-thread
> you can add them to any thread - it just depends on how fast you want to
> execute them
>
> I don't know of a limit. I would guess the limit is the processor's
> capability.
>
> Dave Keeton
>> Technical Services Manager
>> The Eagle Tool & Machine Co.
>> Springfield, Ohio
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> From: "Stuart Stevenson" 
>> Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2010 9:37 PM
>> To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" 
>> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] mux
>>
>> > You want to add another line
>> >
>> > On Thu, Mar 4, 2010 at 8:05 PM, Dave Keeton  
>> > wrote:
>> >
>> >> All,
>> >> Quick question - If I am using more than one mux (2 for 
>> >> example)
>> >> ,
>> >> would I do it like this?
>> >>
>> >> #Basic example of use
>> >> loadrt mux2 count=2
>> >> addf mux2.0 servo-thread
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >add the next line
>> > addf mux2.1 servo-thread
>> >
>> >
>> >>
>> >> #The first mux
>> >> setp mux2.0.in0 25
>> >> setp mux2.0.in1 100
>> >>
>> >> #The second mux
>> >> setp mux2.1.in0 25
>> >> setp mux2.1.in1 100
>> >>
>> >> I am assuming the "count=2" is how many mux's I am using?
>> >>
>> >> Thank you,
>> >> Dave Keeton
>> >> Technical Services Manager
>> >> The Eagle Tool & Machine Co.
>> >> Springfield, Ohio
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> --
>> >> Download Intel® Parallel Studio Eval
>> >> Try the new software tools for yourself. Speed compiling, find bugs
>> >> proactively, and fine-tune applications for parallel performance.
>> >> See why Intel Parallel Studio got high marks during beta.
>> >> http://p.sf.net/sfu/intel-sw-dev
>> >> ___
>> >> Emc-users mailing list
>> >> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > dos centavos
>> >
>> --
>> > Download Intel® Parallel Studio Eval
>> > Try the new software tools for yourself. Speed compiling, find bugs
>> > proactively, and fine-tune applications for parallel performance.
>> > See why Intel Parallel Studio got high marks during beta.
>> > http://p.sf.net/sfu/intel-sw-dev
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>> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
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>> proactively, and fine-tune applications for parallel performance.
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>>
>>
>
>
> -- 
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> --
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Re: [Emc-users] mux

[Stuart Stevenson]

On Thu, Mar 4, 2010 at 8:44 PM, Dave Keeton  wrote:

> Thanks for your reply
>
> What exactly does the
>
> >addf mux2.1 servo-thread
>
> this line adds the mux2.1 to the the servo-thread
this causes it to be executed at the servo-thread rate


> do for us, is it required for my situation? What if I add more mux's? Does
> that line change again or do I add another? Is there a limit to the number
> of mux's we can use?
>
> yes - if you add more muxes (sic?) you must add more addf lines to connect
them to a thread
ie
   addf mux2.2 servo-thread ..

you are not restricted to the servo-thread
you can add them to any thread - it just depends on how fast you want to
execute them

I don't know of a limit. I would guess the limit is the processor's
capability.

Dave Keeton
> Technical Services Manager
> The Eagle Tool & Machine Co.
> Springfield, Ohio
>
>
>
>
> --
> From: "Stuart Stevenson" 
> Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2010 9:37 PM
> To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" 
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] mux
>
> > You want to add another line
> >
> > On Thu, Mar 4, 2010 at 8:05 PM, Dave Keeton  wrote:
> >
> >> All,
> >> Quick question - If I am using more than one mux (2 for example)
> >> ,
> >> would I do it like this?
> >>
> >> #Basic example of use
> >> loadrt mux2 count=2
> >> addf mux2.0 servo-thread
> >>
> >
> >
> >add the next line
> > addf mux2.1 servo-thread
> >
> >
> >>
> >> #The first mux
> >> setp mux2.0.in0 25
> >> setp mux2.0.in1 100
> >>
> >> #The second mux
> >> setp mux2.1.in0 25
> >> setp mux2.1.in1 100
> >>
> >> I am assuming the "count=2" is how many mux's I am using?
> >>
> >> Thank you,
> >> Dave Keeton
> >> Technical Services Manager
> >> The Eagle Tool & Machine Co.
> >> Springfield, Ohio
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> --
> >> Download Intel® Parallel Studio Eval
> >> Try the new software tools for yourself. Speed compiling, find bugs
> >> proactively, and fine-tune applications for parallel performance.
> >> See why Intel Parallel Studio got high marks during beta.
> >> http://p.sf.net/sfu/intel-sw-dev
> >> ___
> >> Emc-users mailing list
> >> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> > --
> > dos centavos
> >
> --
> > Download Intel® Parallel Studio Eval
> > Try the new software tools for yourself. Speed compiling, find bugs
> > proactively, and fine-tune applications for parallel performance.
> > See why Intel Parallel Studio got high marks during beta.
> > http://p.sf.net/sfu/intel-sw-dev
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Download Intel® Parallel Studio Eval
> Try the new software tools for yourself. Speed compiling, find bugs
> proactively, and fine-tune applications for parallel performance.
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>
>


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Re: [Emc-users] Emc-gcode throughput

[Jon Elson]

Kirk Wallace wrote:
>
>
> I looked at Jan's example of what he might be converting:
> http://www.starragheckert.com/sh/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=89&Itemid=197
>  
> (Short URL) http://alturl.com/87gd 
> http://www.manturbo.com/en/ 
>
> I wondered if block rate would be a problem with a five-axis
> multi-spindle machine doing complex shapes in a production setting.
It shouldn't make that much difference.  Of course, a full 5-axis part 
program that is moving 5 axes in sontinuous motion will take a little 
more resources than a 3-axis program, but the super-hard stuff they 
usually make these parts out of are not machined at high feed rates.  A 
LOT of people don't know about the G64 P option until they ask, then 
they are amazed!

Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] mux

[Dave Keeton]

Thanks for your reply

What exactly does the

>addf mux2.1 servo-thread

do for us, is it required for my situation? What if I add more mux's? Does 
that line change again or do I add another? Is there a limit to the number 
of mux's we can use?

Dave Keeton
Technical Services Manager
The Eagle Tool & Machine Co.
Springfield, Ohio




--
From: "Stuart Stevenson" 
Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2010 9:37 PM
To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" 
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] mux

> You want to add another line
>
> On Thu, Mar 4, 2010 at 8:05 PM, Dave Keeton  wrote:
>
>> All,
>> Quick question - If I am using more than one mux (2 for example) 
>> ,
>> would I do it like this?
>>
>> #Basic example of use
>> loadrt mux2 count=2
>> addf mux2.0 servo-thread
>>
>
>
>add the next line
> addf mux2.1 servo-thread
>
>
>>
>> #The first mux
>> setp mux2.0.in0 25
>> setp mux2.0.in1 100
>>
>> #The second mux
>> setp mux2.1.in0 25
>> setp mux2.1.in1 100
>>
>> I am assuming the "count=2" is how many mux's I am using?
>>
>> Thank you,
>> Dave Keeton
>> Technical Services Manager
>> The Eagle Tool & Machine Co.
>> Springfield, Ohio
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Download Intel® Parallel Studio Eval
>> Try the new software tools for yourself. Speed compiling, find bugs
>> proactively, and fine-tune applications for parallel performance.
>> See why Intel Parallel Studio got high marks during beta.
>> http://p.sf.net/sfu/intel-sw-dev
>> ___
>> Emc-users mailing list
>> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>>
>>
>
>
> -- 
> dos centavos
> --
> Download Intel® Parallel Studio Eval
> Try the new software tools for yourself. Speed compiling, find bugs
> proactively, and fine-tune applications for parallel performance.
> See why Intel Parallel Studio got high marks during beta.
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> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> 


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Re: [Emc-users] mux

[Stuart Stevenson]

 You want to add another line

On Thu, Mar 4, 2010 at 8:05 PM, Dave Keeton  wrote:

> All,
> Quick question - If I am using more than one mux (2 for example) ,
> would I do it like this?
>
> #Basic example of use
> loadrt mux2 count=2
> addf mux2.0 servo-thread
>


add the next line
addf mux2.1 servo-thread


>
> #The first mux
> setp mux2.0.in0 25
> setp mux2.0.in1 100
>
> #The second mux
> setp mux2.1.in0 25
> setp mux2.1.in1 100
>
> I am assuming the "count=2" is how many mux's I am using?
>
> Thank you,
> Dave Keeton
> Technical Services Manager
> The Eagle Tool & Machine Co.
> Springfield, Ohio
>
>
>
>
> --
> Download Intel® Parallel Studio Eval
> Try the new software tools for yourself. Speed compiling, find bugs
> proactively, and fine-tune applications for parallel performance.
> See why Intel Parallel Studio got high marks during beta.
> http://p.sf.net/sfu/intel-sw-dev
> ___
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> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
>


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[Emc-users] mux

[Dave Keeton]

All,
 Quick question - If I am using more than one mux (2 for example) , 
would I do it like this?

#Basic example of use
loadrt mux2 count=2
addf mux2.0 servo-thread

#The first mux
setp mux2.0.in0 25
setp mux2.0.in1 100

#The second mux
setp mux2.1.in0 25
setp mux2.1.in1 100

I am assuming the "count=2" is how many mux's I am using?

Thank you,
Dave Keeton
Technical Services Manager
The Eagle Tool & Machine Co.
Springfield, Ohio


 
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[Emc-users] How EMC face with the chanllege of hard platform development? (muti-core, 64 bit processor etc)

[夏一宁]

hi all,

   Ijust have a question,since emc is on base of orgin 32 system.But now
with improvement of technology,can emc fully take advantage of them? RCS is
a good idea for hierarchy control,and I just see some implementation of
communication between processes (one computer),or different computers with
UDP protocol. BUT how about muti-core or 64bit processor? Is it a problem?

best regards

shining

3.5
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Re: [Emc-users] Absolute Encoder Connector

[Kirk Wallace]

On Thu, 2010-03-04 at 15:13 -0700, John Harris wrote:
> Hi Kirk,
> Try Samtec at 
> http://www.samtec.com/documents/webfiles/pdf/FTSH_TH.PDF They only do dual 
> row headers, and they also do ribbon cable connectors to match. You can get 
> free samples if you find your way to their Sudden Service page.
> 
> I f you can tell me exactly the row and pin count, with SMT or through hole, 
> I may be able to give you the exact part number. Their catalog and web site 
> are tough unless you know your way.
> 
> John

Thanks John. The encoder has a single row of five pins, or as Lawrence
noted blades. This connector seems to be the mate for the encoder:
http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&name=WM1723-ND 

I'll give your link a look.

-- 
Kirk Wallace
http://www.wallacecompany.com/machine_shop/
http://www.wallacecompany.com/E45/index.html
California, USA


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Re: [Emc-users] Absolute Encoder Connector

[Kirk Wallace]

On Thu, 2010-03-04 at 14:03 -0800, Flying Electron Inc wrote:
... snip
> Suprising that Avago didn't explicitly specify a mating connector part
> number in their datasheet, but for some reason they didn't.  The datasheet
> says 1.25mm pitch, very close to 0.05" but different enough to cause trouble
> with a real 0.05" pitch connector.
... snip
> Looks like about 37 cents for the connector and about a quarter for the 5
> crimps, but I'd order some extra crimps just in case of accidents during
> crimping.
> 
> Lawrence

Thanks Lawrence.

That looks like a match. Too bad the crimper is over $200. Another
option is to look through my "stuff" and see if I have a connector on a
junk hard drive or camera.
-- 
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http://www.wallacecompany.com/machine_shop/
http://www.wallacecompany.com/E45/index.html
California, USA


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Re: [Emc-users] Absolute Encoder Connector

[John Harris]

Hi Kirk,
Try Samtec at 
http://www.samtec.com/documents/webfiles/pdf/FTSH_TH.PDF They only do dual 
row headers, and they also do ribbon cable connectors to match. You can get 
free samples if you find your way to their Sudden Service page.

I f you can tell me exactly the row and pin count, with SMT or through hole, 
I may be able to give you the exact part number. Their catalog and web site 
are tough unless you know your way.

John

- Original Message - 
From: "Kirk Wallace" 
To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" 
Sent: Thursday, March 04, 2010 2:40 PM
Subject: [Emc-users] Absolute Encoder Connector


> I've got my encoders from Avnet (AEAT-6010):
> http://wallacecompany.com/machine_shop/EMC2/absolute_encoder/
>
> but now I need to figure out how to connect to them. I figured I could
> get by for now with soldering wires to the back of the PC board, but
> there is no way, it's way to small. So I need to find a proper
> connector, but I don't know what keywords to search on. The pins have
> a .05" pitch. Thanks for any help.
> -- 
> Kirk Wallace
> http://www.wallacecompany.com/machine_shop/
> http://www.wallacecompany.com/E45/index.html
> California, USA
>
>
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> 


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Re: [Emc-users] Absolute Encoder Connector

[Brian Mihulka]

Kirk Wallace wrote:
> I've got my encoders from Avnet (AEAT-6010):
> http://wallacecompany.com/machine_shop/EMC2/absolute_encoder/ 
>
> but now I need to figure out how to connect to them. I figured I could
> get by for now with soldering wires to the back of the PC board, but
> there is no way, it's way to small. So I need to find a proper
> connector, but I don't know what keywords to search on. The pins have
> a .05" pitch. Thanks for any help.
>   
I can't say for sure because the data sheet didn't list the manufacurer 
of the connector.  But it might be a Hirose 1.25mm that you can get from 
Mouser.

Shell:  
http://mouser.com/ProductDetail/Hirose-Electric/DF13-5S-125C/?qs=Ux3WWAnHpjD9cQ40KIKz%252bw%3d%3d
Tin contacts: 
http://mouser.com/ProductDetail/Hirose-Connector/DF13-2630SCF/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMsV8lMX1HNLj03%2fq360t8zB
Gold contacts:  
http://mouser.com/ProductDetail/Hirose-Connector/DF13-2630SCFA/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMsV8lMX1HNLj2YDcLcdXUix

Brian

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Re: [Emc-users] Absolute Encoder Connector

[Flying Electron Inc]

On Thu, Mar 4, 2010 at 1:40 PM, Kirk Wallace wrote:

> I've got my encoders from Avnet (AEAT-6010):
> http://wallacecompany.com/machine_shop/EMC2/absolute_encoder/
>
> but now I need to figure out how to connect to them. I figured I could
> get by for now with soldering wires to the back of the PC board, but
> there is no way, it's way to small. So I need to find a proper
> connector, but I don't know what keywords to search on. The pins have
> a .05" pitch. Thanks for any help.
> --
> Kirk Wallace
> http://www.wallacecompany.com/machine_shop/
> http://www.wallacecompany.com/E45/index.html
> California, USA
>
>
Suprising that Avago didn't explicitly specify a mating connector part
number in their datasheet, but for some reason they didn't.  The datasheet
says 1.25mm pitch, very close to 0.05" but different enough to cause trouble
with a real 0.05" pitch connector.

My guess would be a MOLEX PicoBlade 1.25mm connector, probably part
number 51021-0500

http://www.mouser.com/catalog/632/1277.pdf

The picture of the connector seems like it should plug in nicely with the
outline of the connector in the datasheet.

You'll need some female crimps too either part number 50058-8000
or 50079-8000 depending on the size of wire you will be using.

Looks like about 37 cents for the connector and about a quarter for the 5
crimps, but I'd order some extra crimps just in case of accidents during
crimping.

Lawrence
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[Emc-users] Absolute Encoder Connector

[Kirk Wallace]

I've got my encoders from Avnet (AEAT-6010):
http://wallacecompany.com/machine_shop/EMC2/absolute_encoder/ 

but now I need to figure out how to connect to them. I figured I could
get by for now with soldering wires to the back of the PC board, but
there is no way, it's way to small. So I need to find a proper
connector, but I don't know what keywords to search on. The pins have
a .05" pitch. Thanks for any help.
-- 
Kirk Wallace
http://www.wallacecompany.com/machine_shop/
http://www.wallacecompany.com/E45/index.html
California, USA


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Re: [Emc-users] Emc-gcode throughput

[Kirk Wallace]

On Thu, 2010-03-04 at 12:41 -0600, Jon Elson wrote:
> Rudy du Preez wrote:
> > Has anybody been working on the limited throughput situation?
> >   
> Going to hardware step generation is definitely moving in the right 
> direction.
> I did some tests a while back, on a 600 MHz Pentium III computer.  I 
... snip
> Jon

I looked at Jan's example of what he might be converting:
http://www.starragheckert.com/sh/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=89&Itemid=197
 
(Short URL) http://alturl.com/87gd 
http://www.manturbo.com/en/ 

I wondered if block rate would be a problem with a five-axis
multi-spindle machine doing complex shapes in a production setting. I
suspect the current controller is hardware and software optimized for
turbine blade milling, but that's a guess on my part. Stuart's machine
seems to work well, but it's no Speedy Gonzales.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=37Q5cDj1zL4 
-- 
Kirk Wallace
http://www.wallacecompany.com/machine_shop/
http://www.wallacecompany.com/E45/index.html
California, USA


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Re: [Emc-users] Accuracy & stability of those AMT103 capacitive encoders

[Jon Elson]

Erik Christiansen wrote:
> I'm grateful though, even for that 14th post, because there you say
> "I've mounted a new CUI differential encoder ..."
> The Digi-Key part 102-1788-ND, nominated on another thread, is "TTL
> voltage output". (Perhaps that's what the -ND means.)
>
> I'll go looking for a differential CUI encoder forthwith.
>
>   
On Digi-Key, ND means "No Discount".  This is from the days where they 
had flat volume discounts on all their items, so if you ordered 25 you 
got a 3% discount, order 100 get a 10% discount, etc.  I don't know why 
they don't drop this, as they have not offered this discount scheme in 
something like 20 years!  But, ND is still there on EVERY part number in 
the catalog.

On the CUI encoder, the differential driver is made in a little heat 
shrink blob on a cable accessory.  So, you buy the standard encoder and 
then also buy the $7 differential driver cable.  This is not the best 
way to do things, but it at least gets the diff. driver within a foot of 
the encoder.

Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] Accuracy & stability of those AMT103 capacitive encoders

[Jon Elson]

Erik Christiansen wrote:
>  That's very
> comforting for me, but perhaps your customer is/was trying to push peas
> up too steep a hill.
>   
I believe that customer was off his rocker, but he wanted to try this.  
It was a petty small machine, a Taig, and he was wanting to get 10s of 
G's acceleration, I think.  The machine base was never meant for this, 
with those tiny leadscrews.

Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] Emc-gcode throughput

[Jon Elson]

Rudy du Preez wrote:
> Has anybody been working on the limited throughput situation?
>   
Going to hardware step generation is definitely moving in the right 
direction.
I did some tests a while back, on a 600 MHz Pentium III computer.  I 
made a 2" diameter circle in 10,000 line segments.
With the default smoothing, it took 250 seconds to execute.  With the 
smoothing parameter set with G64 P0.0005
(meaning an error tolerance of 0.0005" is acceptable) this program runs 
in 17 seconds.  At that rate, it is doing 10,000
blocks in 17 seconds or 588 G-code blocks a second.  That is with a 
fairly slow computer by today's standards, too!
I think I later got it down to 13 seconds, or 769 blocks/sec.  These 
tests were done on a true servo system using my PWM controller board and 
servo amps.  So, there was no BASE_THREAD task in the system, and no 
step pulses anywhere.

I think if you need more than 1000 blocks/second, you need to examine 
how you are generating your G-code and see if it can be optimized.
Assuming 0.001" vector segments, you could move at on inch/second while 
following any arbitrary curve that doesn't exceed your machine's 
acceleration limits.

Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] Advice on Servo Tuning

[Flying Electron Inc]

On Wed, Mar 3, 2010 at 10:17 AM, Jon Elson  wrote:

> Chris Morley wrote:
> >>>
> >> The servo drives are from Advanced Motion Controls. They are Direct PWM
> >> Brushless DC Servo Drives Model# BD30A8. The datasheet can be read at
> >> http://www.a-m-c.com/download/datasheet/bd30a8.pdf . I talked to their
> tech
> >> support and there is no current loop or velocity loop in the drive. They
> >> told me the PWM signal directly controls the amount of time the MOSFETs
> are
> >> turned on. If it was a brushed DC motor, I understand that the PWM duty
> >> cycle would have a linear relationship to the average voltage and hence
> >> average speed of the motor, but since it's a brushless DC motor, I don't
> >> understand if that same relationship holds or not.
> >>
> >
> >
> > AMC has instructions on their web site (little hard to find the right
> one)
> >
> > on how to tune the servo drive itself.
> >
> > Are you sure the drive is set right for velocity mode?
> >
> If you look up the pdf he links to above, it is clear this is NOT
> inherently a servo amplifier, it is
> just a PWM amplifier, with no internal loop other than the current
> limit.  There is no tach input,
> no encoder input, other than PWM from the controller.  Therefore, other
> than setting the current limit,
> there is no tuning that can be done.  I make a very similar servo amp,
> and maybe I shouldn't call it a servo amp, as it has no inherent loop,
> either.
>
> The OP's last question, yes, there is still an approximate linear
> relation between PWM duty cycle and speed.
> The motor's resistance throws it off a little, speed will drop slightly
> under load.  Tuning of such drive systems is a bit different than on
> velocity servo systems, and the inherent stability is less.  You don't
> want to turn up gain until you have "wiggles", you want to tune first
> for stability, then use FF1 and FF2 to reduce following error.  See my
> page on servo tuning for these types of servos at :
> http://wiki.linuxcnc.org/cgi-bin/emcinfo.pl?PWM_Servo_Amplifiers
>
>
> Jon
>
>
Thanks for the link to your servo tuning page, I will play with the PID
settings to see if I can tune for stability first and then add in the FF1
and FF2 as you suggest.

Lawrence
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Re: [Emc-users] Strange MDI.

[Slavko Kocjancic]

Slavko Kocjancic pravi:
>
>
> 2010/3/4 Gene Heskett  >
>
> On Thursday 04 March 2010, Slavko Kocjancic wrote:
> >Hello...
> >
> >Again I can't aply that patch Here is console output
> >
> >sla...@emc2-laptop:~$ cd emc2-dev
> >sla...@emc2-laptop:~/emc2-dev$ git am --signoff smdi.eml
> >Applying Strange MDI.
> >.dotest/patch:10: trailing whitespace.
> >static int pseudoMdiLineNumber = INT_MIN;
> >.dotest/patch:19: trailing whitespace.
> >   interp_list.set_line_number(++pseudoMdiLineNumber);
> >error: patch failed: src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc:125
> >error: src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc: patch does not apply
> >Patch failed at 0001.
> >When you have resolved this problem run "git-am --resolved".
> >If you would prefer to skip this patch, instead run "git-am --skip".
> >sla...@emc2-laptop:~/emc2-dev$
> >
> >Jeff Epler pravi:
> >> On Tue, Mar 02, 2010 at 08:28:17PM +0100, Slavko Kocjancic wrote:
> >>> Hello..
> >>> I write hole center probe subroutine and works nice if it's
> called from
> >>> main program.
> >>>
> >>> in test.ngc I have
> >>> ;---
> >>> o call
> >>> M02
> >>> ;---
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> and that's works without problem.
> >>>
> >>> but if I type
> >>> o call
> >>> in MDI mode the only 1's move is ok and after that the move's are
> >>> unpredictable for my opinion.
> >>
> >> Which version of emc are you testing with?  This behavior is
> buggy in
> >> 2.3, but in v2.4_branch and master there's a change that is
> intended to
> >> improve or fix this problem:
> >>
> >> commit 314f3aa2d90e5ec1f7840166f3e0ad11a9fbc0a6
> >> Author: Jeff Epler  >
> >> Date:   Wed Jan 27 08:16:47 2010 -0600
> >>
> >> improve behavior of MDI O-calls
> >>
> >> Bad things happen when the motion id is zero.  This could
> frequently
> >> happen when doing O-calls from MDI, because the motion ids
> for an MDI
> >> start at pseudoMdiLineNumber and increase for each executed
> motion
> >> (? line?) in the subroutine.  For instance, if
> pseudoMdiLineNumber
> >> was -7, then executing an O-call with 8 or more lines of motion
> would
> >> issue a motion with ID 0.
> >>
> >> diff --git a/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc
> b/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc
> >> index 39ce8ad..f26c1cf 100644
> >> --- a/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc
> >> +++ b/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc
> >> @@ -125,7 +125,7 @@ NMLmsg *emcTaskCommand = 0;
> >>  // signal handling code to stop main loop
> >>  static int done;
> >>  static int emctask_shutdown(void);
> >> -static int pseudoMdiLineNumber = -1;
> >> +static int pseudoMdiLineNumber = INT_MIN;
> >>
> >>  static int all_homed(void) {
> >>  for(int i=0; i<9; i++) {
> >> @@ -1957,7 +1957,7 @@ static int emcTaskIssueCommand(NMLmsg * cmd)
> >>  }
> >> if (execute_msg->command[0] != 0) {
> >> if (emcStatus->task.mode == EMC_TASK_MODE_MDI) {
> >> -   interp_list.set_line_number(--pseudoMdiLineNumber);
> >> +   interp_list.set_line_number(++pseudoMdiLineNumber);
> >> }
> >> execRetval = emcTaskPlanExecute(execute_msg->command,
> >> pseudoMdiLineNumber); if (execRetval == 2 /* INTERP_ENDFILE */ ) {
>
> Your method of obtaining the patch, copy-paste perhaps,
> contaminated the
> patch with trailing whitespace after the text of the patch.  Call
> it back
> into your editor of choice, and if vim have it search for ' ',
> which will
> highlight all the spaces.  Delete any that are at or beyond the
> right end of
> the lines.  Save, try it again.
>
> The keystrokes would be / which will show a line at the bottom of
> the screen,
> then hit ' space 'enter.  That will show all spaces.  I have a
> permanent
> setting in my copy that shows them by default, but only those
> which have a
> line ending after then, so normal spaces don't bother me.
>
> --
> Cheers, Gene
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
>
> That, that is, is.
> That, that is not, is not.
> That, that is, is not that, that is not.
> That, that is not, is not that, that is.
>
>
> Maybe the problem is as I got mail in windows. probably wrong line 
> termination. Now I save mail on ubuntu and try to update. Git was not 
> happy again!
>
> says
> previous dotest directory .dotest still exists but mbox given.
I'm check that mail. Seems that there are no spaces. But line terminates 
with CR/

Re: [Emc-users] Emc-gcode throughput

[Rudy du Preez]

Slavko, Sven and Jeff

Thanks a lot for the prompt response and the hints and information. We will
use the info to investigate our problem and see if we can improve the
performance. I will report back on the results.

Rudy
 

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database 4914 (20100304) __

The message was checked by ESET Smart Security.

http://www.eset.com
 


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[Emc-users] Jog button issue

[Paul Keeton]

All,
I am wanting to hook up my jog buttons for manual jogging in tkemc. I 
have two buttons for each axis (Plus and Minus). I had these working before I 
installed an MPG unit but now they are not working. What are the signals/pins 
required to jog an axis through halui? Do I have to install another set of 
buttons to enable jog mode or mpg mode? Has anyone else done this?

Paul
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Re: [Emc-users] Strange MDI.

[Slavko Kocjancic]

2010/3/4 Gene Heskett 

> On Thursday 04 March 2010, Slavko Kocjancic wrote:
> >Hello...
> >
> >Again I can't aply that patch Here is console output
> >
> >sla...@emc2-laptop:~$ cd emc2-dev
> >sla...@emc2-laptop:~/emc2-dev$ git am --signoff smdi.eml
> >Applying Strange MDI.
> >.dotest/patch:10: trailing whitespace.
> >static int pseudoMdiLineNumber = INT_MIN;
> >.dotest/patch:19: trailing whitespace.
> >   interp_list.set_line_number(++pseudoMdiLineNumber);
> >error: patch failed: src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc:125
> >error: src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc: patch does not apply
> >Patch failed at 0001.
> >When you have resolved this problem run "git-am --resolved".
> >If you would prefer to skip this patch, instead run "git-am --skip".
> >sla...@emc2-laptop:~/emc2-dev$
> >
> >Jeff Epler pravi:
> >> On Tue, Mar 02, 2010 at 08:28:17PM +0100, Slavko Kocjancic wrote:
> >>> Hello..
> >>> I write hole center probe subroutine and works nice if it's called from
> >>> main program.
> >>>
> >>> in test.ngc I have
> >>> ;---
> >>> o call
> >>> M02
> >>> ;---
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> and that's works without problem.
> >>>
> >>> but if I type
> >>> o call
> >>> in MDI mode the only 1's move is ok and after that the move's are
> >>> unpredictable for my opinion.
> >>
> >> Which version of emc are you testing with?  This behavior is buggy in
> >> 2.3, but in v2.4_branch and master there's a change that is intended to
> >> improve or fix this problem:
> >>
> >> commit 314f3aa2d90e5ec1f7840166f3e0ad11a9fbc0a6
> >> Author: Jeff Epler 
> >> Date:   Wed Jan 27 08:16:47 2010 -0600
> >>
> >> improve behavior of MDI O-calls
> >>
> >> Bad things happen when the motion id is zero.  This could frequently
> >> happen when doing O-calls from MDI, because the motion ids for an
> MDI
> >> start at pseudoMdiLineNumber and increase for each executed motion
> >> (? line?) in the subroutine.  For instance, if pseudoMdiLineNumber
> >> was -7, then executing an O-call with 8 or more lines of motion would
> >> issue a motion with ID 0.
> >>
> >> diff --git a/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc b/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc
> >> index 39ce8ad..f26c1cf 100644
> >> --- a/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc
> >> +++ b/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc
> >> @@ -125,7 +125,7 @@ NMLmsg *emcTaskCommand = 0;
> >>  // signal handling code to stop main loop
> >>  static int done;
> >>  static int emctask_shutdown(void);
> >> -static int pseudoMdiLineNumber = -1;
> >> +static int pseudoMdiLineNumber = INT_MIN;
> >>
> >>  static int all_homed(void) {
> >>  for(int i=0; i<9; i++) {
> >> @@ -1957,7 +1957,7 @@ static int emcTaskIssueCommand(NMLmsg * cmd)
> >>  }
> >> if (execute_msg->command[0] != 0) {
> >> if (emcStatus->task.mode == EMC_TASK_MODE_MDI) {
> >> -   interp_list.set_line_number(--pseudoMdiLineNumber);
> >> +   interp_list.set_line_number(++pseudoMdiLineNumber);
> >> }
> >> execRetval = emcTaskPlanExecute(execute_msg->command,
> >> pseudoMdiLineNumber); if (execRetval == 2 /* INTERP_ENDFILE */ ) {
>
> Your method of obtaining the patch, copy-paste perhaps, contaminated the
> patch with trailing whitespace after the text of the patch.  Call it back
> into your editor of choice, and if vim have it search for ' ', which will
> highlight all the spaces.  Delete any that are at or beyond the right end
> of
> the lines.  Save, try it again.
>
> The keystrokes would be / which will show a line at the bottom of the
> screen,
> then hit ' space 'enter.  That will show all spaces.  I have a permanent
> setting in my copy that shows them by default, but only those which have a
> line ending after then, so normal spaces don't bother me.
>
> --
> Cheers, Gene
> "There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
>  soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
> -Ed Howdershelt (Author)
>
> That, that is, is.
> That, that is not, is not.
> That, that is, is not that, that is not.
> That, that is not, is not that, that is.
>
>
Maybe the problem is as I got mail in windows. probably wrong line
termination. Now I save mail on ubuntu and try to update. Git was not happy
again!

says
previous dotest directory .dotest still exists but mbox given.
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Re: [Emc-users] Emc-gcode throughput

[Gene Heskett]

On Thursday 04 March 2010, Rudy du Preez wrote:
>I have a general question about the throughput of EMC2 and what determines
>it. I friend is using nurb modeling to describe the shapes that he has to
>mill in soft material. So far he has had disappointing results using EMC2
> in that the processing of the large gcode files with many short vectors
> and the resulting cutting speed is too low.  For most cutting moves the
> programmed speed of the axes is not reached in these applications. Jogging
> speeds on the machine is fine. Where does the problem lie?
>
>In playing with parameters such as base_thread, we found that these have
>some influence on the troughput and cutting speed. The processing power and
>latency of the PC also comes into play. It seems that careful tuning and
>balancing of some parameters is required. The problem is to know which ones
>will improve the situation best. The steppers are currently driven via the
>parallel ports. A MESA 5i20 card is planned to replace this.
>
>Has anybody been working on the limited throughput situation?
>
>Rudy
>
I don't know if there is a one true way to attack this.  I run steppers too, 
and found quite some time back that if I were willing to give up on 
acceleration and use a gentler accel setting, the top speed achievable was 
considerably higher.  However corner blending considerations will then slow 
it down because of the gentler accelerations being used.  Without some very 
strong, low inertia servo's, my method seems to be the best for my work, 
where I often cut one-sie's, and may spend a day cutting air before actually 
making the part, but once the mill starts throwing chips, the part is 
generally usable.

YMMV of course.  If, OTOH, your cutting speed is limited by available spindle 
power and rpms, as mine is, one might want to up the accel's and give away 
top speed.  You can, for the most part, reverse a nema 23 stepper that isn't 
moving a 20 tpi screw at more than a couple of inches/minute very quickly, 
but you cannot extend that violent an accel to more than that same couple of  
ipm without encountering a stall.  And there goes that part, its usually 
wrecked.  I've had it dancing on the table a few times, but not now, and its 
much more dependable this way.

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Re: [Emc-users] Accuracy & stability of those AMT103 capacitive encoders

[Sven Wesley]

2010/3/4 Erik Christiansen 

> On Wed, Mar 03, 2010 at 02:57:32PM +0100, Sven Wesley wrote:
> > >
> > If you really want to read some experienced info on the AMT's, look up my
> > killer thread in the mail archive. Search for "Engrave.py cuts deeper and
> > deeper". Enjoy.
> > Conclusion: The AMT's do the work when other encoders fail.
>
> Sven,
>
> Would it be the "AMT103 line driver cable assembly" which provides the
> AMT103 with differential output? (If there's an AMT103 with differential
> output at
>
>
> http://www.cui.com/adtemplate.asp?invky=333508&catky=112362&subcatky1=994182&subcatky2=997829&subcatky3=
>
> then I need to clean my glasses with emery paper.)
>
> The so-called "datasheet" for the cable is nothing but an uninformative
> sketch, unfortunately.
>
> If everyone is of necessity getting by with well shielded TTL signals,
> then I could try it too.
>
> Erik
>
>
Yes. I use the encoders with the differential output cable.
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Re: [Emc-users] Strange MDI.

[Gene Heskett]

On Thursday 04 March 2010, Slavko Kocjancic wrote:
>Hello...
>
>Again I can't aply that patch Here is console output
>
>sla...@emc2-laptop:~$ cd emc2-dev
>sla...@emc2-laptop:~/emc2-dev$ git am --signoff smdi.eml
>Applying Strange MDI.
>.dotest/patch:10: trailing whitespace.
>static int pseudoMdiLineNumber = INT_MIN;
>.dotest/patch:19: trailing whitespace.
>   interp_list.set_line_number(++pseudoMdiLineNumber);
>error: patch failed: src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc:125
>error: src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc: patch does not apply
>Patch failed at 0001.
>When you have resolved this problem run "git-am --resolved".
>If you would prefer to skip this patch, instead run "git-am --skip".
>sla...@emc2-laptop:~/emc2-dev$
>
>Jeff Epler pravi:
>> On Tue, Mar 02, 2010 at 08:28:17PM +0100, Slavko Kocjancic wrote:
>>> Hello..
>>> I write hole center probe subroutine and works nice if it's called from
>>> main program.
>>>
>>> in test.ngc I have
>>> ;---
>>> o call
>>> M02
>>> ;---
>>>
>>>
>>> and that's works without problem.
>>>
>>> but if I type
>>> o call
>>> in MDI mode the only 1's move is ok and after that the move's are
>>> unpredictable for my opinion.
>>
>> Which version of emc are you testing with?  This behavior is buggy in
>> 2.3, but in v2.4_branch and master there's a change that is intended to
>> improve or fix this problem:
>>
>> commit 314f3aa2d90e5ec1f7840166f3e0ad11a9fbc0a6
>> Author: Jeff Epler 
>> Date:   Wed Jan 27 08:16:47 2010 -0600
>>
>> improve behavior of MDI O-calls
>>
>> Bad things happen when the motion id is zero.  This could frequently
>> happen when doing O-calls from MDI, because the motion ids for an MDI
>> start at pseudoMdiLineNumber and increase for each executed motion
>> (? line?) in the subroutine.  For instance, if pseudoMdiLineNumber
>> was -7, then executing an O-call with 8 or more lines of motion would
>> issue a motion with ID 0.
>>
>> diff --git a/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc b/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc
>> index 39ce8ad..f26c1cf 100644
>> --- a/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc
>> +++ b/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc
>> @@ -125,7 +125,7 @@ NMLmsg *emcTaskCommand = 0;
>>  // signal handling code to stop main loop
>>  static int done;
>>  static int emctask_shutdown(void);
>> -static int pseudoMdiLineNumber = -1;
>> +static int pseudoMdiLineNumber = INT_MIN;
>>
>>  static int all_homed(void) {
>>  for(int i=0; i<9; i++) {
>> @@ -1957,7 +1957,7 @@ static int emcTaskIssueCommand(NMLmsg * cmd)
>>  }
>> if (execute_msg->command[0] != 0) {
>> if (emcStatus->task.mode == EMC_TASK_MODE_MDI) {
>> -   interp_list.set_line_number(--pseudoMdiLineNumber);
>> +   interp_list.set_line_number(++pseudoMdiLineNumber);
>> }
>> execRetval = emcTaskPlanExecute(execute_msg->command,
>> pseudoMdiLineNumber); if (execRetval == 2 /* INTERP_ENDFILE */ ) {

Your method of obtaining the patch, copy-paste perhaps, contaminated the 
patch with trailing whitespace after the text of the patch.  Call it back 
into your editor of choice, and if vim have it search for ' ', which will 
highlight all the spaces.  Delete any that are at or beyond the right end of 
the lines.  Save, try it again.

The keystrokes would be / which will show a line at the bottom of the screen, 
then hit ' space 'enter.  That will show all spaces.  I have a permanent 
setting in my copy that shows them by default, but only those which have a 
line ending after then, so normal spaces don't bother me.

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 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)

That, that is, is.
That, that is not, is not.
That, that is, is not that, that is not.
That, that is not, is not that, that is.

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Re: [Emc-users] Magnetic Encoder

[Gene Heskett]

On Wednesday 03 March 2010, Dave wrote:
>It is interesting how things change.  Way back in early 70's there was a
>Hamilton Avnet office not far from my parents house.  Being a kid
>interested in electronics I would literally ride my bike to the Hamilton
>Avnet office and order parts and pay cash for them.
>
>They would give me any catalog that I had an interest in.  They really
>tried to help me out even though I probably never spent more than $20 at
>a time with them.  (Big bucks in the early 70's).  I remember having a
>hard time strapping all of the catalogs onto my bike rack and making it
>back home with my components in a little bag.I had "feet" of
>electronics catalogs stacked up in my room.
>
>Dave
>
>On 3/2/2010 12:57 PM, Kent A. Reed wrote:
>> Andy:
>>
>> Before anyone makes too much of my email, I haven't tried to buy
>> anything from Avnet since I retired from a federal R&D lab, so it's
>> entirely possible that it is still arrogant toward hobbyists and small
>> businesses. Hope it works out for you.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Kent

Not Hamilton-Avnet, but Gifford-Brown, in Des Moines IA, were the same way 
with me.  I rode my bicycle the about 30 miles, from north of Redfield IA. to 
their store on Walnut St, near downtown Des Moines, and back to get whatever 
I needed to fix whatever radio or tv I was working on at the time.  Often 
less than a fiver at a time. Catalogs were my parts warehouse in '48, I was 
14 yo then.  The bike?  A Schwinn cycle-truck, a std 26" rear wheel, 14" 
front wheel rig with a frame mounted wire basket over the front wheel for 
whatever.  Fuggly but practical.  It sure wasn't a girl magnet.

-- 
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 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)

"Nine years of ballet, asshole."
-- Shelly Long, to the bad guy after making a jump over a gorge that he
   couldn't quite, in "Outrageous Fortune"

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Re: [Emc-users] Accuracy & stability of those AMT103 capacitive encoders

[Stephen Wille Padnos]

Erik Christiansen wrote:
> [snip]
> I'm grateful though, even for that 14th post, because there you say
> "I've mounted a new CUI differential encoder ..."
> The Digi-Key part 102-1788-ND, nominated on another thread, is "TTL
> voltage output". (Perhaps that's what the -ND means.)
>
At Digi-Key, "-ND" means "No Discount".  They used to have a standard 
discount on larger orders, but they didn't apply it to parts with -ND at 
the end.  I'm not sure there are any non-ND parts in the catalog now ;)

- Steve


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Re: [Emc-users] Accuracy & stability of those AMT103 capacitive encoders

[Erik Christiansen]

On Wed, Mar 03, 2010 at 02:57:32PM +0100, Sven Wesley wrote:
> >
> If you really want to read some experienced info on the AMT's, look up my
> killer thread in the mail archive. Search for "Engrave.py cuts deeper and
> deeper". Enjoy.
> Conclusion: The AMT's do the work when other encoders fail.

Sven,

Would it be the "AMT103 line driver cable assembly" which provides the
AMT103 with differential output? (If there's an AMT103 with differential
output at

http://www.cui.com/adtemplate.asp?invky=333508&catky=112362&subcatky1=994182&subcatky2=997829&subcatky3=

then I need to clean my glasses with emery paper.)

The so-called "datasheet" for the cable is nothing but an uninformative
sketch, unfortunately.

If everyone is of necessity getting by with well shielded TTL signals,
then I could try it too.

Erik

-- 
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supposed to do.
  -- Robert A. Heinlein


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Re: [Emc-users] Emc-gcode throughput

[Jeff Epler]

I wrote a message about this some time ago, but its contents are still
essentially accurate:
http://mid.gmane.org/20081022160842.ga6...@unpythonic.net

When converting complex curves like nurbs into gcode, the relevant
behavior of the motion planner is this:

| Make sure moves are "long enough"
| -
| Principally because of the rule that "the machine will never move at
| such a speed that it cannot come to a complete stop at the end of the
| current movement", there is a minimum movement length that will allow
| the machine to keep up a requested feed rate with a given acceleration
| setting.
| 
| The acceleration and deceleration phase each use half the inifile
| MAX_ACCELERATION.  In a blend that is an exact reversal, this causes the
| total axis acceleration to equal the inifile MAX_ACCELERATION.  In other
| cases, the actual machine acceleration is somewhat less than the inifile
| acceleration
| 
| To keep up feed rate, the move must be longer than the distance it takes
| to accelerate from 0 to the desired feed rate and then stop again.
| Using A as 1/2 the inifile MAX_ACCELERATION and F as the feed rate
| *in units per second*, the acceleration time is
| ta =  F/A
| and the acceleration distance is
| da = (1/2) * F * ta
| the deceleration time and distance are the same, making the critical
| distance
| d = da + dd = 2*da = F^2 / A.
| 
| For example, for a feed rate of 1 inch per second and an acceleration of
| 10 inch/sec^2, the critical distance is 1^2 / 10 = .1 inch.  For a feed
| rate of .5 inch per second, the critical distance is .5^2 / 10 = .025
| inch.

If your curves lie in a plane, consider approximating them with arcs
instead of with straight segments.  This can give a better approximation
with a smaller number of segments, making the typical segment longer.
http://emergent.unpy.net/01171767993
- a blog entry of mine on biarcs
http://emergent.unpy.net/files/papers/V1Nos1to4_22.pdf
- the paper I got the math from (fig1 and associated formulae)
  I chose "r=1" to give more-equal arcs, rather than following
  their method for choosing optimal r

Jeff

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Re: [Emc-users] Emc-gcode throughput

[Sven Wesley]

2010/3/4 Rudy du Preez 

> I have a general question about the throughput of EMC2 and what determines
> it. I friend is using nurb modeling to describe the shapes that he has to
> mill in soft material. So far he has had disappointing results using EMC2
> in
> that the processing of the large gcode files with many short vectors and
> the
> resulting cutting speed is too low.  For most cutting moves the programmed
> speed of the axes is not reached in these applications. Jogging speeds on
> the machine is fine. Where does the problem lie?
>
> In playing with parameters such as base_thread, we found that these have
> some influence on the troughput and cutting speed. The processing power and
> latency of the PC also comes into play. It seems that careful tuning and
> balancing of some parameters is required. The problem is to know which ones
> will improve the situation best. The steppers are currently driven via the
> parallel ports. A MESA 5i20 card is planned to replace this.
>
> Has anybody been working on the limited throughput situation?
>
> Rudy
>
>
>
What program is used to generate the G-code?
Is G61 set?

I do nurbs models all the time, 99% of my work is surfacing. No speed
problem.

Regards,
Sven
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Re: [Emc-users] Emc-gcode throughput

[Slavko Kocjancic]

Rudy du Preez pravi:
> I have a general question about the throughput of EMC2 and what determines
> it. I friend is using nurb modeling to describe the shapes that he has to
> mill in soft material. So far he has had disappointing results using EMC2 in
> that the processing of the large gcode files with many short vectors and the
> resulting cutting speed is too low.  For most cutting moves the programmed
> speed of the axes is not reached in these applications. Jogging speeds on
> the machine is fine. Where does the problem lie?
>
> In playing with parameters such as base_thread, we found that these have
> some influence on the troughput and cutting speed. The processing power and
> latency of the PC also comes into play. It seems that careful tuning and
> balancing of some parameters is required. The problem is to know which ones
> will improve the situation best. The steppers are currently driven via the
> parallel ports. A MESA 5i20 card is planned to replace this.
>
> Has anybody been working on the limited throughput situation?
>
> Rudy
>  
>
>   
Did you use G64? If not then machine wil accelerate/decelerate in each 
segment!
If you have fast jog that doesn't be equal to fast cut speed. If you 
have bad acceleration for example to accelerate to max speed when move 
5mm then all segments shorter than 10mm can't use max speed of machine. 
If you use G64 then machine will try to keep speed up but in that case 
it's not possible to trace exact path. If I corectly understand the EMC 
have one line lok ahead buffer. - Somewhere in doc's is statment that if 
emc is paused will decelerate at least in next line of gcode. So for me 
that's mean that if consequent lines is shorter tnan 5mm (in this 
example) then machine won't got max speed.

Slavko


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Re: [Emc-users] Accuracy & stability of those AMT103 capacitive encoders

[Erik Christiansen]

On Wed, Mar 03, 2010 at 02:57:32PM +0100, Sven Wesley wrote:
> >
> If you really want to read some experienced info on the AMT's, look up my
> killer thread in the mail archive. Search for "Engrave.py cuts deeper and
> deeper". Enjoy.
> Conclusion: The AMT's do the work when other encoders fail.

That was one long thread! Boiling down what I've found, the take away
message seems to be that the original TTL output Z axis encoder was
prone to noise, and in your 14th post, you tried a differential encoder,
which happened to be a CUI. Unfortunately, the gmane search results (33
of your posts) ended without a statement of outcome. The last I can see
is a six point list of outstanding issues. (Now if gmane provided a
usable thread view [1], I'd know if the thread continued, under a new
subject, to provide enlightenment.

I'm grateful though, even for that 14th post, because there you say
"I've mounted a new CUI differential encoder ..."
The Digi-Key part 102-1788-ND, nominated on another thread, is "TTL
voltage output". (Perhaps that's what the -ND means.)

I'll go looking for a differential CUI encoder forthwith.

And if some way to view an old gmane thread exists, then I'll see if I
can work it out.

Erik

[1] Searching within the emc-user thread view throws me out to a dumb
list of 33 hits, devoid of thread context.

-- 
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and much more difficult to find."  - Terry Pratchett 


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Re: [Emc-users] Emc-gcode throughput

[Rudy du Preez]

I have a general question about the throughput of EMC2 and what determines
it. I friend is using nurb modeling to describe the shapes that he has to
mill in soft material. So far he has had disappointing results using EMC2 in
that the processing of the large gcode files with many short vectors and the
resulting cutting speed is too low.  For most cutting moves the programmed
speed of the axes is not reached in these applications. Jogging speeds on
the machine is fine. Where does the problem lie?

In playing with parameters such as base_thread, we found that these have
some influence on the troughput and cutting speed. The processing power and
latency of the PC also comes into play. It seems that careful tuning and
balancing of some parameters is required. The problem is to know which ones
will improve the situation best. The steppers are currently driven via the
parallel ports. A MESA 5i20 card is planned to replace this.

Has anybody been working on the limited throughput situation?

Rudy
 

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Re: [Emc-users] Accuracy & stability of those AMT103 capacitive encoders

[Erik Christiansen]

On Wed, Mar 03, 2010 at 12:36:44PM -0600, Jon Elson wrote:
> >   
> What does this time constant actually mean?  Is is a response to changes 
> in velocity?
> That seems to be the only thing I can figure out it means.  If EMC is 
> sampling position at 1 ms intervals, then 400 us is 2.5 time constants, 
> so the velocity error should be pretty small.

Yes, that's what I inferred; a delayed response to acceleration. Your
direct and second hand experience (quoted below) seems to confirm my
sneaking suspicions. (Drat that thinking! ;-)

Erik wrote:
> > It would be nice to be able to fit encoders to 3 axes on a
> > woodworking machine for the price of one axis with US Digital
> > encoders, but what's the stability like?

> I have put these encoders on the Keling motor, and gotten the servo loop 
> to work, using my own servo amps.  I DID notice the stability margin is 
> less than with some other motor/encoder combinations.  The Keling motors 
> have VERY light rotors, and so I added just a little mass to the motor 
> by mounting a small shaft extension, and it helped quite a bit.  I would 
> assume this is a lot less angular momentum than even a small leadscrew.
> 
> I also had a customer who was experimenting with a very high 
> acceleration machine, and I believe he will eventually abandon the CUI 
> encoders.  He was accelerating at something like 1 rad/sec^2, which 
> is really high acceleration, though.  Currently, he has cut the 
> acceleration rates to prevent missing counts.

Looks like you've already done the research which my snoopy mind just
thought prudent. Grateful thanks for the practical insight into the
stability limits. _Where_ it would become a problem is what I couldn't
guess from that datasheet. I take your point that too much motor and
too little load inertia is needed to create trouble. That's very
comforting for me, but perhaps your customer is/was trying to push peas
up too steep a hill.

Thanks again.

Erik

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Re: [Emc-users] Strange MDI.

[Slavko Kocjancic]

Jan de Kruyf pravi:
> Slavko I like to do that, but I do not think it is advisable.
> It will be too easy to make the mess bigger. Rather wait for Jeff to see if
> he cant sort his patch generation
> life will be much easier that way.
>
> What is you computer experience??
>
> j.
>
> On Thu, Mar 4, 2010 at 10:44 AM, Slavko Kocjancic  wrote:
>
>   
Probably is best way to wait. As I have already some changes in 
stepgen.c (latest by Jeff) and machine is working now.
As experiences I'm new to linux. But I'm moderatly familiar with windows 
and proff for assembly in 8051 type microcontrolers (I developing such 
application over 20 years). Languages like Pascal,C,PHP .. are barely 
understandable for me.

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Re: [Emc-users] Strange MDI.

[Jan de Kruyf]

Slavko I like to do that, but I do not think it is advisable.
It will be too easy to make the mess bigger. Rather wait for Jeff to see if
he cant sort his patch generation
life will be much easier that way.

What is you computer experience??

j.

On Thu, Mar 4, 2010 at 10:44 AM, Slavko Kocjancic  wrote:

> Jan de Kruyf pravi:
> > This is a feature of git.
> > Git wants strict white space, but somehow the patch generation does not
> > always give
> > strict whitespace
> > The solution for me is to extract the patch from the mail and apply it
> > manually with
> > patch  -l  or  --ignore-whitespace. (see the patch manpage)
> >
> > j.
> >
>
> Huh
> I'm simply to dumb to do that. :(
> Maybe It helps if I told that I use linux and emc near 14 days!
>
> patch --help says nothing about --ignore-whitespace ?!?!?
> Can you provide me exact commandline?!
>
> I have downloaded package into users/slavko/emc2-dev
> in same place is "smdi.eml" email with patch.
> As I understand I must strip out garbage from that patch. Where garbage
> ends?!
> In commit or diff line?!? (or somewhere else)
>
> thanks
>
> commit 314f3aa2d90e5ec1f7840166f3e0ad11a9fbc0a6
> Author: Jeff Epler 
> Date:   Wed Jan 27 08:16:47 2010 -0600
>
>improve behavior of MDI O-calls
>
>Bad things happen when the motion id is zero.  This could frequently
>happen when doing O-calls from MDI, because the motion ids for an MDI
>start at pseudoMdiLineNumber and increase for each executed motion
>(? line?) in the subroutine.  For instance, if pseudoMdiLineNumber was
>-7, then executing an O-call with 8 or more lines of motion would issue
>a motion with ID 0.
>
> diff --git a/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc b/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc
> index 39ce8ad..f26c1cf 100644
> --- a/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc
> +++ b/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc
>
>
>
>
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Strange MDI.

[Slavko Kocjancic]

Jan de Kruyf pravi:
> This is a feature of git.
> Git wants strict white space, but somehow the patch generation does not
> always give
> strict whitespace
> The solution for me is to extract the patch from the mail and apply it
> manually with
> patch  -l  or  --ignore-whitespace. (see the patch manpage)
>
> j.
>   

Huh
I'm simply to dumb to do that. :(
Maybe It helps if I told that I use linux and emc near 14 days!

patch --help says nothing about --ignore-whitespace ?!?!?
Can you provide me exact commandline?!

I have downloaded package into users/slavko/emc2-dev
in same place is "smdi.eml" email with patch.
As I understand I must strip out garbage from that patch. Where garbage 
ends?!
In commit or diff line?!? (or somewhere else)

thanks

commit 314f3aa2d90e5ec1f7840166f3e0ad11a9fbc0a6
Author: Jeff Epler 
Date:   Wed Jan 27 08:16:47 2010 -0600

improve behavior of MDI O-calls
   
Bad things happen when the motion id is zero.  This could frequently
happen when doing O-calls from MDI, because the motion ids for an MDI
start at pseudoMdiLineNumber and increase for each executed motion
(? line?) in the subroutine.  For instance, if pseudoMdiLineNumber was
-7, then executing an O-call with 8 or more lines of motion would issue
a motion with ID 0.

diff --git a/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc b/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc
index 39ce8ad..f26c1cf 100644
--- a/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc
+++ b/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc




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Re: [Emc-users] Strange MDI.

[Jan de Kruyf]

This is a feature of git.
Git wants strict white space, but somehow the patch generation does not
always give
strict whitespace
The solution for me is to extract the patch from the mail and apply it
manually with
patch  -l  or  --ignore-whitespace. (see the patch manpage)

j.

On Thu, Mar 4, 2010 at 9:56 AM, Slavko Kocjancic  wrote:

> Hello...
>
> Again I can't aply that patch Here is console output
>
> sla...@emc2-laptop:~$ cd emc2-dev
> sla...@emc2-laptop:~/emc2-dev$ git am --signoff smdi.eml
> Applying Strange MDI.
> .dotest/patch:10: trailing whitespace.
> static int pseudoMdiLineNumber = INT_MIN;
> .dotest/patch:19: trailing whitespace.
>   interp_list.set_line_number(++pseudoMdiLineNumber);
> error: patch failed: src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc:125
> error: src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc: patch does not apply
> Patch failed at 0001.
> When you have resolved this problem run "git-am --resolved".
> If you would prefer to skip this patch, instead run "git-am --skip".
> sla...@emc2-laptop:~/emc2-dev$
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Jeff Epler pravi:
> > On Tue, Mar 02, 2010 at 08:28:17PM +0100, Slavko Kocjancic wrote:
> >
> >> Hello..
> >> I write hole center probe subroutine and works nice if it's called from
> >> main program.
> >>
> >> in test.ngc I have
> >> ;---
> >> o call
> >> M02
> >> ;---
> >>
> >>
> >> and that's works without problem.
> >>
> >> but if I type
> >> o call
> >> in MDI mode the only 1's move is ok and after that the move's are
> >> unpredictable for my opinion.
> >>
> >
> > Which version of emc are you testing with?  This behavior is buggy in
> > 2.3, but in v2.4_branch and master there's a change that is intended to
> > improve or fix this problem:
> >
> > commit 314f3aa2d90e5ec1f7840166f3e0ad11a9fbc0a6
> > Author: Jeff Epler 
> > Date:   Wed Jan 27 08:16:47 2010 -0600
> >
> > improve behavior of MDI O-calls
> >
> > Bad things happen when the motion id is zero.  This could frequently
> > happen when doing O-calls from MDI, because the motion ids for an MDI
> > start at pseudoMdiLineNumber and increase for each executed motion
> > (? line?) in the subroutine.  For instance, if pseudoMdiLineNumber
> was
> > -7, then executing an O-call with 8 or more lines of motion would
> issue
> > a motion with ID 0.
> >
> > diff --git a/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc b/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc
> > index 39ce8ad..f26c1cf 100644
> > --- a/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc
> > +++ b/src/emc/task/emctaskmain.cc
> > @@ -125,7 +125,7 @@ NMLmsg *emcTaskCommand = 0;
> >  // signal handling code to stop main loop
> >  static int done;
> >  static int emctask_shutdown(void);
> > -static int pseudoMdiLineNumber = -1;
> > +static int pseudoMdiLineNumber = INT_MIN;
> >
> >  static int all_homed(void) {
> >  for(int i=0; i<9; i++) {
> > @@ -1957,7 +1957,7 @@ static int emcTaskIssueCommand(NMLmsg * cmd)
> >  }
> > if (execute_msg->command[0] != 0) {
> > if (emcStatus->task.mode == EMC_TASK_MODE_MDI) {
> > -   interp_list.set_line_number(--pseudoMdiLineNumber);
> > +   interp_list.set_line_number(++pseudoMdiLineNumber);
> > }
> > execRetval = emcTaskPlanExecute(execute_msg->command,
> pseudoMdiLineNumber);
> > if (execRetval == 2 /* INTERP_ENDFILE */ ) {
> >
> >
> >
> --
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> > Try the new software tools for yourself. Speed compiling, find bugs
> > proactively, and fine-tune applications for parallel performance.
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> >
> >
>
>
>
> --
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> Try the new software tools for yourself. Speed compiling, find bugs
> proactively, and fine-tune applications for parallel performance.
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> http://p.sf.net/sfu/intel-sw-dev
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Try the new software tools for yourself. Speed compiling, find bugs
proactively, and fine-tune applications for parallel performance.
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