Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C
If they let out too much water it impedes freighter traffic and would flood Montreal . Sent from Joe Bognar > On Nov 25, 2019, at 5:52 AM, Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List > wrote: > > > This is maybe a really dumb question – is there a way to drain them? > Does anything control the amount of water that heads out to sea down the St. > Lawrence Seaway, Erie Canal, and so on? > > Joe > Coquina > ___ > > Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and > every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use > PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray > ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C
Yah, my friend with the cottage north of Holland MI says it isn't that the lake is higher than it ever has been, this is just another incidence of it being high. He used to have a few hundred feet of sand between his cottage and water, not any more... but bought the land from some folks who lost their cottage on the last big peak. Graham Collins Secret Plans C 35-III #11 On 2019-11-25 9:59 a.m., schiller via CnC-List wrote: Joe, As I understand it, not really. The water levels were really low in 2013 and there was a lot of discussion about how to restrict the flows. There was discussion of placing restrictive boulders in the St. Clair river to try to control the outflow from Lakes Superior/Michigan/Huron. Great Lakes Freighters were limiting loads to navigate and the Army Corp of Engineers was running out of money and resources to dredge. The lakes go through cycles of high and low. Lake Michigan/Lake Huron record high levels occurred in 1986 but are expected to break those records next year. Whole sections of Lake Shore Drive between South Haven and Holland Michigan were lost to bluff erosion. Now some of the houses left are in danger. All of the other Great Lakes broke record high levels last year. Here is a good link to the USACE data: https://www.lre.usace.army.mil/Missions/Great-Lakes-Information/Great-Lakes-Information-2/Water-Level-Data/ With Lake Superior as high as it is, I expect Lake Michigan/Lake Huron to remain high for a while. Neil Schiller 1983 C 35-3, #028, "Grace" Whitehall, Michigan WLYC On 11/25/2019 6:51 AM, Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List wrote: This is maybe a really dumb question – is there a way to drain them? Does anything control the amount of water that heads out to sea down the St. Lawrence Seaway, Erie Canal, and so on? Joe Coquina ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C
There is a "Regulating Dam" on the Iroquois Section of the St. Lawrence Seaway which is there just for that purpose. This river control dam is built across the river from Rockway Point, located on the north shore of New York State, directly across from the town, to Point Iroquois. There is a lift lock at Point Iroquois to bypass the control dam. The dam is there to reduce the range of Lake Ontario water levels, to provide dependable flow for hydropower, adequate navigation depths and protection for shoreline and other interests downstream in the Province of Quebec. Info here: https://ijc.org/en/loslrb/who/regulation Ken H. On Mon, 25 Nov 2019 at 07:52, Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List < cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: > This is maybe a really dumb question – is there a way to drain them? > > Does anything control the amount of water that heads out to sea down the > St. Lawrence Seaway, Erie Canal, and so on? > > > > Joe > > Coquina > ___ > > Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each > and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - > use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray > > ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C
We have really high tides sometimes, but it goes back out 6 hours later, not NEXT YEAR. I did not realize the Lakes were variable to that extent. Joe Coquina On 11/25/2019 8:59 AM, schiller via CnC-List wrote: Joe, As I understand it, not really. The water levels were really low in 2013 and there was a lot of discussion about how to restrict the flows. There was discussion of placing restrictive boulders in the St. Clair river to try to control the outflow from Lakes Superior/Michigan/Huron. Great Lakes Freighters were limiting loads to navigate and the Army Corp of Engineers was running out of money and resources to dredge. The lakes go through cycles of high and low. Lake Michigan/Lake Huron record high levels occurred in 1986 but are expected to break those records next year. Whole sections of Lake Shore Drive between South Haven and Holland Michigan were lost to bluff erosion. Now some of the houses left are in danger. All of the other Great Lakes broke record high levels last year. Here is a good link to the USACE data: https://www.lre.usace.army.mil/Missions/Great-Lakes-Information/Great-Lakes-Information-2/Water-Level-Data/ With Lake Superior as high as it is, I expect Lake Michigan/Lake Huron to remain high for a while. Neil Schiller 1983 C 35-3, #028, "Grace" Whitehall, Michigan WLYC On 11/25/2019 6:51 AM, Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List wrote: This is maybe a really dumb question – is there a way to drain them? Does anything control the amount of water that heads out to sea down the St. Lawrence Seaway, Erie Canal, and so on? Joe Coquina ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution --https://www.paypal.me/stumurray ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C
Joe, As I understand it, not really. The water levels were really low in 2013 and there was a lot of discussion about how to restrict the flows. There was discussion of placing restrictive boulders in the St. Clair river to try to control the outflow from Lakes Superior/Michigan/Huron. Great Lakes Freighters were limiting loads to navigate and the Army Corp of Engineers was running out of money and resources to dredge. The lakes go through cycles of high and low. Lake Michigan/Lake Huron record high levels occurred in 1986 but are expected to break those records next year. Whole sections of Lake Shore Drive between South Haven and Holland Michigan were lost to bluff erosion. Now some of the houses left are in danger. All of the other Great Lakes broke record high levels last year. Here is a good link to the USACE data: https://www.lre.usace.army.mil/Missions/Great-Lakes-Information/Great-Lakes-Information-2/Water-Level-Data/ With Lake Superior as high as it is, I expect Lake Michigan/Lake Huron to remain high for a while. Neil Schiller 1983 C 35-3, #028, "Grace" Whitehall, Michigan WLYC On 11/25/2019 6:51 AM, Della Barba, Joe via CnC-List wrote: This is maybe a really dumb question – is there a way to drain them? Does anything control the amount of water that heads out to sea down the St. Lawrence Seaway, Erie Canal, and so on? Joe Coquina ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C
This is maybe a really dumb question – is there a way to drain them? Does anything control the amount of water that heads out to sea down the St. Lawrence Seaway, Erie Canal, and so on? Joe Coquina ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C
Probably makes it a lot more difficult to keep those invasive Asian carp out of the lakes On Sun, Nov 24, 2019 at 1:27 PM Jeffrey A. Laman via CnC-List < cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: > Ludington Yacht Club, along the east shore of L. Michigan has had a very > difficult time with water levels this year and last. If the water > continues to rise, it will close the club. The docks are floating, but the > LYC grounds around the building are flooded. The parking lot has been > raised maybe 18 inches, but on some days floods. The club was closed for > several weeks at the beginning of the summer due to water threatening > electrical panels and backing up sewage. Both have been remedied. Access > to the docks and building from the parking lot has been via newly > constructed (temporary?) 30ft to 50ft walkways built about 2.5 feet above > grade (flooded by at least a foot of water). If the water rises much more, > the club will have to close. > > Another poster indicated this is all due to lack of evaporation and cold > temps resulting in ice cover. That's half the equation. The L. Mich > drainage basin received excessive rainfall this past summer which drove up > water levels. So, two factors -- rain and evaporation. > > This has been great for the shallow channels that the Army Corp won't > dredge due to recreational use only, but not good for a lot of docks. > There has also been increased danger for swimmers and folks walking out on > piers -- the waves wash over the concrete piers with very little wind. > > Jeff Laman > C "Harmony" > Ludington, MI > > -- > *From:* CHARLES SCHEAFFER > *Sent:* Saturday, November 23, 2019 3:30 PM > *To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com > > *Subject:* Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C > > FWIW, Toronto had flooded docks when I was there in July because of > unusually high water levels. > > Chuck, Resolute, C 34R, Pasadena, Md > > On November 23, 2019 at 9:42 AM "Matthew L. Wolford via CnC-List" < > cnc-list@cnc-list.com> wrote: > > > We are having problems on Lake Erie. Portions of the Erie Yacht Club > grounds were under water this spring and summer. Even when the level > dropped toward the end of the season, a strong breeze will change local > levels and create a problem. During the storm on October 31, the > difference in lake level between Toledo and Buffalo was 14 feet. > > *From:* pete.shelquist--- via CnC-List > *Sent:* Saturday, November 23, 2019 6:34 AM > *To:* cnc-list@cnc-list.com > *Cc:* pete.shelqu...@comcast.net > *Subject:* Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C > > > We have record high water levels on Western Lake Superior and I understand > others in the great lakes are experiencing the same if not worse. With > the forecast unclear if this water level is a new normal or cyclical, and > the fixed docks at our club nearing max height, I’m wondering what other > clubs are experiencing, expecting going forward and what measures you are > implementing to accommodate? > > > > > -- > ___ > > Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each > and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - > use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray > > ___ > > Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and > every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use > PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray > > > > ___ > > Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each > and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - > use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray > > -- Sent from Gmail Mobile ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C
Did you get my posting re Masters FIS racing? Sent from my iPhone On Nov 24, 2019, at 1:00 PM, Marek Dziedzic via CnC-List wrote: There was a demonstration in front of the International Joint Commission office this weekend in Ottawa. People demand lowering the water levels as a pre-emptive move to avoid flooding next year. Marek From: CnC-List On Behalf Of CHARLES SCHEAFFER via CnC-List Sent: 23 November, 2019 15:30 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: CHARLES SCHEAFFER Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C FWIW, Toronto had flooded docks when I was there in July because of unusually high water levels. Chuck, Resolute, C 34R, Pasadena, Md On November 23, 2019 at 9:42 AM "Matthew L. Wolford via CnC-List" mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote: We are having problems on Lake Erie. Portions of the Erie Yacht Club grounds were under water this spring and summer. Even when the level dropped toward the end of the season, a strong breeze will change local levels and create a problem. During the storm on October 31, the difference in lake level between Toledo and Buffalo was 14 feet. From: pete.shelquist--- via CnC-List<mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2019 6:34 AM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com<mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Cc: pete.shelqu...@comcast.net<mailto:pete.shelqu...@comcast.net> Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C We have record high water levels on Western Lake Superior and I understand others in the great lakes are experiencing the same if not worse. With the forecast unclear if this water level is a new normal or cyclical, and the fixed docks at our club nearing max height, I’m wondering what other clubs are experiencing, expecting going forward and what measures you are implementing to accommodate? ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C
There was a demonstration in front of the International Joint Commission office this weekend in Ottawa. People demand lowering the water levels as a pre-emptive move to avoid flooding next year. Marek From: CnC-List On Behalf Of CHARLES SCHEAFFER via CnC-List Sent: 23 November, 2019 15:30 To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: CHARLES SCHEAFFER Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C FWIW, Toronto had flooded docks when I was there in July because of unusually high water levels. Chuck, Resolute, C 34R, Pasadena, Md On November 23, 2019 at 9:42 AM "Matthew L. Wolford via CnC-List" mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com>> wrote: We are having problems on Lake Erie. Portions of the Erie Yacht Club grounds were under water this spring and summer. Even when the level dropped toward the end of the season, a strong breeze will change local levels and create a problem. During the storm on October 31, the difference in lake level between Toledo and Buffalo was 14 feet. From: pete.shelquist--- via CnC-List<mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2019 6:34 AM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com<mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Cc: pete.shelqu...@comcast.net<mailto:pete.shelqu...@comcast.net> Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C We have record high water levels on Western Lake Superior and I understand others in the great lakes are experiencing the same if not worse. With the forecast unclear if this water level is a new normal or cyclical, and the fixed docks at our club nearing max height, I’m wondering what other clubs are experiencing, expecting going forward and what measures you are implementing to accommodate? ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C
Ludington Yacht Club, along the east shore of L. Michigan has had a very difficult time with water levels this year and last. If the water continues to rise, it will close the club. The docks are floating, but the LYC grounds around the building are flooded. The parking lot has been raised maybe 18 inches, but on some days floods. The club was closed for several weeks at the beginning of the summer due to water threatening electrical panels and backing up sewage. Both have been remedied. Access to the docks and building from the parking lot has been via newly constructed (temporary?) 30ft to 50ft walkways built about 2.5 feet above grade (flooded by at least a foot of water). If the water rises much more, the club will have to close. Another poster indicated this is all due to lack of evaporation and cold temps resulting in ice cover. That's half the equation. The L. Mich drainage basin received excessive rainfall this past summer which drove up water levels. So, two factors -- rain and evaporation. This has been great for the shallow channels that the Army Corp won't dredge due to recreational use only, but not good for a lot of docks. There has also been increased danger for swimmers and folks walking out on piers -- the waves wash over the concrete piers with very little wind. Jeff Laman C "Harmony" Ludington, MI From: CHARLES SCHEAFFER Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2019 3:30 PM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C FWIW, Toronto had flooded docks when I was there in July because of unusually high water levels. Chuck, Resolute, C 34R, Pasadena, Md On November 23, 2019 at 9:42 AM "Matthew L. Wolford via CnC-List" wrote: We are having problems on Lake Erie. Portions of the Erie Yacht Club grounds were under water this spring and summer. Even when the level dropped toward the end of the season, a strong breeze will change local levels and create a problem. During the storm on October 31, the difference in lake level between Toledo and Buffalo was 14 feet. From: pete.shelquist--- via CnC-List<mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2019 6:34 AM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com<mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com> Cc: pete.shelqu...@comcast.net<mailto:pete.shelqu...@comcast.net> Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C We have record high water levels on Western Lake Superior and I understand others in the great lakes are experiencing the same if not worse. With the forecast unclear if this water level is a new normal or cyclical, and the fixed docks at our club nearing max height, I’m wondering what other clubs are experiencing, expecting going forward and what measures you are implementing to accommodate? ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C
FWIW, Toronto had flooded docks when I was there in July because of unusually high water levels. Chuck, Resolute, C 34R, Pasadena, Md On November 23, 2019 at 9:42 AM "Matthew L. Wolford via CnC-List" wrote: > We are having problems on Lake Erie. Portions of the Erie Yacht Club > grounds were under water this spring and summer. Even when the level dropped > toward the end of the season, a strong breeze will change local levels and > create a problem. During the storm on October 31, the difference in lake > level between Toledo and Buffalo was 14 feet. > > From: pete.shelquist--- via CnC-List mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com > Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2019 6:34 AM > To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com mailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com > Cc: pete.shelqu...@comcast.net mailto:pete.shelqu...@comcast.net > Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C > > > We have record high water levels on Western Lake Superior and I > understand others in the great lakes are experiencing the same if not worse. > With the forecast unclear if this water level is a new normal or cyclical, > and the fixed docks at our club nearing max height, I’m wondering what other > clubs are experiencing, expecting going forward and what measures you are > implementing to accommodate? > > > > > > > - > ___ > > Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each > and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use > PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray > > ___ > > Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each > and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use > PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray > > ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C
Here on White Lake (Lake Michigan), we have floating docks so their was only problems with the water lines on the shore connections (you can only flex PVC so far before it give up). White Lake Yacht Club has fixed docks and had water nearly over the docks. They curtailed swimming off the docks over electrical leakage issues. South Haven had their fixed docks awash several times this summer and have had wash out problems along their walk to the south marina. Several houses along the Lake Michigan shoreline have either been condemned, fallen in or had to be moved. This happened before in 1986. We stayed out of the water in 2000 due to low water and moved up to Saugatuck/Douglas for a year and then stayed on the lake side of the bridge in South Haven after that due to low water. We finally moved north to White Lake in 2016 and been happy here. On White Lake, last year we had problems with clumps of floating weeds this year it has been algae (Blue and Green). Farm runoff has been the explanation for the algae. Neil Schiller 1983 C 35-3, #028, "Grace" Whitehall, Michigan WLYC On 11/23/2019 6:34 AM, pete.shelquist--- via CnC-List wrote: We have record high water levels on Western Lake Superior and I understand others in the great lakes are experiencing the same if not worse. With the forecast unclear if this water level is a new normal or cyclical, and the fixed docks at our club nearing max height, I’m wondering what other clubs are experiencing, expecting going forward and what measures you are implementing to accommodate? ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C
PCYC is on Lake Ontario, and fortunately have floating docks, so had minimal effect on us. It did get to with in a couple of inches of our main power feed having to be turned off – so this winter we will be relocating it to higher ground. The biggest impact was the limited number of places our members could go due to the flooding, and the abnormal amount of debris in the lake. From: CnC-List On Behalf Of pete.shelquist--- via CnC-List Sent: November 23, 2019 6:35 AM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: pete.shelqu...@comcast.net Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C We have record high water levels on Western Lake Superior and I understand others in the great lakes are experiencing the same if not worse. With the forecast unclear if this water level is a new normal or cyclical, and the fixed docks at our club nearing max height, I’m wondering what other clubs are experiencing, expecting going forward and what measures you are implementing to accommodate? ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C
We are having problems on Lake Erie. Portions of the Erie Yacht Club grounds were under water this spring and summer. Even when the level dropped toward the end of the season, a strong breeze will change local levels and create a problem. During the storm on October 31, the difference in lake level between Toledo and Buffalo was 14 feet. From: pete.shelquist--- via CnC-List Sent: Saturday, November 23, 2019 6:34 AM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Cc: pete.shelqu...@comcast.net Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C We have record high water levels on Western Lake Superior and I understand others in the great lakes are experiencing the same if not worse. With the forecast unclear if this water level is a new normal or cyclical, and the fixed docks at our club nearing max height, I’m wondering what other clubs are experiencing, expecting going forward and what measures you are implementing to accommodate? ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C
The high water levels in the Great Lakes are being caused by intense low temperatures which freeze the surface and stop evaporation. It is the same function as pool covers here in Florida. Interestingly, evaporation on the lakes is highest when the humidity is low. So if you folks get another cold winter, the lakes will rise again.We had out 27 MKIII in Chicago for 15 years, and in about 2012, we were all worried about the historic low levels. Now you have to step up to get on the tenders, Queen's Landing which uses to be a lower level for storing dinghys along the harbor is now a cement beach, and the break wall around the harbor is almost completely underwater, posing a hazard for those the uninitiated.Another cold winter and Lake Shore Drive will become a skating rink when the Nor'Easters come knocking. It has happened before. This is likely to become the year it happens again.Bruce Sent from Samsung tablet. null___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C
Here at our club on Lake Ontario we (thankfully) have floating docks. Access to those floating docks is now the concern. Plus one of our retaining walls has been washed out. As part of a rebuild project we are also raising the height of our fixed walkways by 10” to help keep the land access to the docks out of the water, with temporary elevated wooden walkways as a fallback plan. We have record high water levels on Western Lake Superior and I understand others in the great lakes are experiencing the same if not worse. With the forecast unclear if this water level is a new normal or cyclical, and the fixed docks at our club nearing max height, I’m wondering what other clubs are experiencing, expecting going forward and what measures you are implementing to accommodate? ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels...for C
We have record high water levels on Western Lake Superior and I understand others in the great lakes are experiencing the same if not worse. With the forecast unclear if this water level is a new normal or cyclical, and the fixed docks at our club nearing max height, I’m wondering what other clubs are experiencing, expecting going forward and what measures you are implementing to accommodate? ___ Thanks everyone for supporting this list with your contributions. Each and every one is greatly appreciated. If you want to support the list - use PayPal to send contribution -- https://www.paypal.me/stumurray
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels
True -- but they're entirely surrounded by the lake up there on the Keeweenaw. I was thinking of the downwind plumes like they get in Buffalo. We don't see that on the western end of the lake. And we don't have anything like the upper Great Lakes upwind of us to provide the moisture, like they do in the lower Lakes. Fred Street -- Minneapolis S/V Oceanis (1979 CC Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI :^( On Oct 4, 2012, at 10:25 AM, schil...@bloomingdalecom.net wrote: Fred, Some places do get significant lake effect snow. Houghton comes to mind with a 100 year average of 240 inches per year and a record of 396 inches. ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels
Fred, Some places do get significant lake effect snow. Houghton comes to mind with a 100 year average of 240 inches per year and a record of 396 inches. Neil Schiller 1970 Redwing 35, Hull #7 (C C 35, Mark I) Corsair BSME Michigan Tech, 1977 Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE DROID Frederick G Street f...@postaudio.net wrote: We don't see much lake effect snow on Superior, as we're upwind of everything... -- Fred On Oct 3, 2012, at 2:12 PM, Neil Andersen neil.eric.ander...@gmail.com wrote: I have heard that there is a call for a greater than usual volume of Lake effect snowfall this year due to the higher than usual Lake temperature… From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Frederick G Street Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 11:50 AM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels Speaking just for Lake Superior, we're in a drought situation here right now, so inflow is much reduced; but the biggest culprit seems to be the warmer than usual winters, which lead to significantly reduced ice cover, which in turn leads to greatly increased evaporation. Fred Street -- Minneapolis S/V Oceanis (1979 CC Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI :^( On Oct 3, 2012, at 10:38 AM, Robert Mazza wrote: OK Stu, here's a dumb question: If the water is leaving the Upper Great Lakes faster than normal, why isn't the level of the Lower Great Lakes rising with all that influx of water? We keep our boat in Hamilton, Ontario, and the water level at the fixed docks at the Royal Hamilton Yacht Club is so low now that I have to sit on my butt on the dock with my legs dangling in space before a gingerly lower myself on to the deck of Trillium now several feet below dock level. I can't see how putting baffles in the St. Clair River is going to improve the water level on Lake Ontario. There seems to be something more at work here than water flow through the St. Clair River. It probably has to do more with lack of snow fall and snow build up in the winter with resulting reduced run off in the spring, as well as changes in precipitation generally. Global warming (or Climate Change) perhaps? I don't have an answer, but this does seem to be a problem facing the whole Great Lakes, not just the Upper Lakes. ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels
I still have a memory of visiting a high school buddy who went to Michigan Tech, and going tobogganing down a snow drift out of a second story window in the dorm. Crap that’s a lot of snow. Rick Brass BSME GMI 1974 From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Jake Brodersen Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2012 8:38 PM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels Neil, I’ll vouch for the 396 inches. I was there during the winter of 78-79. Even for a Youper, that was a lot of snow! Jake BSCS Michigan Tech 1979 From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of schil...@bloomingdalecom.net Sent: Thursday, October 04, 2012 11:25 AM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels Fred, Some places do get significant lake effect snow. Houghton comes to mind with a 100 year average of 240 inches per year and a record of 396 inches. Neil Schiller 1970 Redwing 35, Hull #7 (C C 35, Mark I) Corsair BSME Michigan Tech, 1977 ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels
What about water use? Irrigation, municipal, etc? Is that a factor? Steve CC 32 Toronto On Thu, Oct 4, 2012 at 12:40 AM, Ronald B. Frerker rbfrer...@yahoo.comwrote: Mostly makes sense. However, flow through the Chicago canal to the Mississippi by way of the Illinois doesn't ever cause much more than flushing a toilet in MPLS. The Chicago was diverted to the Illinois to keep Chicago sewage out of Lake Michigan. The canal just allows for traffic between the river and the lake given the river course change. Also, I believe someone mentioned the dredging earlier, but IIRC, flow rate would not be as related to river depth as to the drop rate of the river bottom and the height of water column of the upper lakes. If only a section was dredged and not the entire river, I would think the flow rate would not be significantly different due to dredging. I'm not overly familiar with that section of the country, but it does sound more like a weather problem than a man-made one. Ron Wild Cheri CC 30 STL --- On *Wed, 10/3/12, Alex Giannelia a...@airsensing.com* wrote: From: Alex Giannelia a...@airsensing.com Subject: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com cnc-list@cnc-list.com Date: Wednesday, October 3, 2012, 5:31 PM Stu is right to point this out. We need to listen and to do something. Here is my background based on what I do for a living and who I do it for. This issue is always going to be a difficult one. I am in the aerial mapping business and we have seen projects come out either because the lake levels were too high and caused property damaging erosion (1988-1990 comes to mind) that needed to be mapped for? The IJC. So they are looking at this. There are four drain plugs in the system that I know of, 1 Jackfish River to divert to hydro power in the James Bay 1) Chicago Canal to flood the Mississippi for shipping 2) Oswego to flood the Hudson 3) St. Lawrence which also drives shipping and hydroelectric These are supposed to balanced, and if the scientists were running the show, they probably would be, but politicians are, so the squeaky hinge gets the flow, so the St. Clair River deal just put a kibosh on everything because it accelerates the flown to Erie which due to its shallow nature is a great evaporator. No one figured on losing ice the way we have on all the lakes. I photographed Lake Ontario in Feb 1978, the last time it had more than 50% cover. Counting on this evaporation to create more snow is a nice wish, but as one guy on this list pointed out, Superior is upwind of everything, so don't count on it. WE ARE THE REASON. AND WHEN WE EITHER CHANGE OUR WAYS, OR GET POLITICIANS TO CHANGE THEM FOR US, THE SITUATION WILL CHANGE FOR THE BETTER, BUT IF WE DO NOTHING, THE WATER WILL EVAPORATE AND DUMP DOWNWIND INTO THE OCEAN EITHER AS SNOW OR RAIN. My .02 worth. ALEX GIANNELIA CC 35-II (1974) WILL BE RENAMED ON THE HARD SINCE NOV. 2006 and if the lake levels drop more, may be there forever ;} Toronto Ontario ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com http://mc/compose?to=CnC-List@cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels
There is also the effect of the post-glacial rebound (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post-glacial_rebound). The evaporation (esp. during winter) and much lower precipitation (there were some 6 months of near (or real) draught) create a perfect storm for the lower water levels. Possibly, time to move to wing keel (or centre board)? I did (now all the racers will chime in to condemn the move). But we have the low water levels for at least three years now (not on the Great Lakes, but the water level problem is common). Any boat with more then 5ft draft is stuck in the harbour for at least half of the season; and sometimes we have even less than that. With my 3ft6in darft I am sailing (granted, less efficiently) and the racers are not. Marek ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels
Where are you located Marek?Ron --- On Thu, 10/4/12, Marek Dziedzic dziedzi...@hotmail.com wrote: From: Marek Dziedzic dziedzi...@hotmail.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Date: Thursday, October 4, 2012, 10:30 AM There is also the effect of the post-glacial rebound (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Post-glacial_rebound). The evaporation (esp. during winter) and much lower precipitation (there were some 6 months of near (or real) draught) create a perfect storm for the lower water levels. Possibly, time to move to wing keel (or centre board)? I did (now all the racers will chime in to condemn the move). But we have the low water levels for at least three years now (not on the Great Lakes, but the water level problem is common). Any boat with more then 5ft draft is stuck in the harbour for at least half of the season; and sometimes we have even less than that. With my 3ft6in darft I am sailing (granted, less efficiently) and the racers are not. Marek -Inline Attachment Follows- ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels
This is an amazing list. Some people may not think it important, but I appreciate the detailed explanation of what is causing Great Lake water level problems, and the detail of why is just excellent. Now I think I understand. And no joke, water levels are totally sailing related. Thanks, Chuck Resolute 1990 CC 34R Atlantic City, NJ - Original Message - From: Walt Dickie wa...@crresearch.com To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Sent: Thursday, October 4, 2012 3:49:22 PM Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels Absolutely right. Most people around the Chicago area, where I live, look at the size of Lake Michigan and just assume it has a big drainage area, which it doesn’t. There’s a ridge that runs through the western suburbs that demarcates the lake’s drainage from the Mississippi’s. When I go downtown I go past the sign marking the “Continental Divide” in Oak Park, IL; it’s about 2 miles from my house and 10 miles from the shore. The rain that runs off my roof goes into the Gulf of Mexico, not the lake. From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Ronald B. Frerker Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 11:26 PM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels Levels on the Mississippi should have no effect. The river watershed is not connected to the Great Lakes. Most of the Great Lakes have little watershed area; well at least in the US. For eg., the Superior watershed only goes back 50mi from the western shore. So a light winter can have a dramatic effect if the flow out of the lake system is normal. And as I believe Fred pointed out, evaporation is a major factor, especially when the watershed area is small relative to the surface water area. Usually there is little maneuvering room for changing dam releases on the upper Miss. The changes are usually made on the big dams of the Missouri since 40% of the lower Miss' summer flow is from the Missouri. Ron Wild Cheri CC 30 STL --- On Wed, 10/3/12, Chuck S cscheaf...@comcast.net wrote: From: Chuck S cscheaf...@comcast.net Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Date: Wednesday, October 3, 2012, 5:13 PM Great Lakes water level: Just guessing, but isn't the fall in lake levels due to lower rainfall amounts? Also, didn't they raise the level of the Mississippi (by lowering dam levels upstream to feed it) because they need to keep channels filled for commercial shipping? Chuck Resolute 1990 CC 34R Atlantic City, NJ From: dwight veinot dwightvei...@hfx.eastlink.ca To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Sent: Wednesday, October 3, 2012 6:07:20 PM Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels So what could the government do??? Has someone interfered with nature or what??? Dwight Veinot CC 35 MKII, Alianna Head of St. Margaret's Bay, NS From: CnC-List [ mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com ] On Behalf Of Stu Sent: October 3, 2012 1:14 PM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels The main intention of my first email, was to pass along information on what is happening to the water levels in the Great Lakes and to let people know that the governments are doing nothing to improve the situation. Allowing the level in 1 lake to drop another 5 feet is going to destroy fishing, boating and most recreational activities on the lake. Don't shoot the messenger -- point the gun at the politicians. Stu No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.2221 / Virus Database: 2441/5307 - Release Date: 10/03/12 ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com -Inline Attachment Follows- ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels
I also believe the whole area is slowly lifting up (rebounding) after being burdened by the weight of a mile or so of ice during the last ice age. Mike Cio Cio San Padanaram, MA From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Chuck S Sent: Thursday, October 04, 2012 4:27 PM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels This is an amazing list. Some people may not think it important, but I appreciate the detailed explanation of what is causing Great Lake water level problems, and the detail of why is just excellent. Now I think I understand. And no joke, water levels are totally sailing related. Thanks, Chuck Resolute 1990 CC 34R Atlantic City, NJ From: Walt Dickie wa...@crresearch.com To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Sent: Thursday, October 4, 2012 3:49:22 PM Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels Absolutely right. Most people around the Chicago area, where I live, look at the size of Lake Michigan and just assume it has a big drainage area, which it doesn’t. There’s a ridge that runs through the western suburbs that demarcates the lake’s drainage from the Mississippi’s. When I go downtown I go past the sign marking the “Continental Divide” in Oak Park, IL; it’s about 2 miles from my house and 10 miles from the shore. The rain that runs off my roof goes into the Gulf of Mexico, not the lake. From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Ronald B. Frerker Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 11:26 PM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels Levels on the Mississippi should have no effect. The river watershed is not connected to the Great Lakes. Most of the Great Lakes have little watershed area; well at least in the US. For eg., the Superior watershed only goes back 50mi from the western shore. So a light winter can have a dramatic effect if the flow out of the lake system is normal. And as I believe Fred pointed out, evaporation is a major factor, especially when the watershed area is small relative to the surface water area. Usually there is little maneuvering room for changing dam releases on the upper Miss. The changes are usually made on the big dams of the Missouri since 40% of the lower Miss' summer flow is from the Missouri. Ron Wild Cheri CC 30 STL --- On Wed, 10/3/12, Chuck S cscheaf...@comcast.net wrote: From: Chuck S cscheaf...@comcast.net Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Date: Wednesday, October 3, 2012, 5:13 PM Great Lakes water level: Just guessing, but isn't the fall in lake levels due to lower rainfall amounts? Also, didn't they raise the level of the Mississippi (by lowering dam levels upstream to feed it) because they need to keep channels filled for commercial shipping? Chuck Resolute 1990 CC 34R Atlantic City, NJ From: dwight veinot dwightvei...@hfx.eastlink.ca To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Sent: Wednesday, October 3, 2012 6:07:20 PM Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels So what could the government do??? Has someone interfered with nature or what??? Dwight Veinot CC 35 MKII, Alianna Head of St. Margaret's Bay, NS From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Stu Sent: October 3, 2012 1:14 PM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels The main intention of my first email, was to pass along information on what is happening to the water levels in the Great Lakes and to let people know that the governments are doing nothing to improve the situation. Allowing the level in 1 lake to drop another 5 feet is going to destroy fishing, boating and most recreational activities on the lake. Don't shoot the messenger -- point the gun at the politicians. Stu No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.2221 / Virus Database: 2441/5307 - Release Date: 10/03/12 ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com -Inline Attachment Follows- ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com about:blank ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels
You’re right. Here’s a good discussion: http://www.iugls.org/the-glaciers-are-long-gone-but-theyre-still-affecting-water-levels.aspx. It’s not a huge effect, but it’s not nothing. “… the apparent effect of GIA (Glacial Isostatic Adjustment) accounted for 4-5 centimeters (up to 2 inches) of a 23 centimeter (9 inch) decline in the head difference between Lakes Michigan-Huron and Erie between 1963 and 2006.” That’s roughly 4 centimeters in 40 years, or ~.1 centimeter/year. From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Fair, Mike Sent: Thursday, October 04, 2012 3:37 PM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels I also believe the whole area is slowly lifting up (rebounding) after being burdened by the weight of a mile or so of ice during the last ice age. Mike Cio Cio San Padanaram, MA From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Chuck S Sent: Thursday, October 04, 2012 4:27 PM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.commailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels This is an amazing list. Some people may not think it important, but I appreciate the detailed explanation of what is causing Great Lake water level problems, and the detail of why is just excellent. Now I think I understand. And no joke, water levels are totally sailing related. Thanks, Chuck Resolute 1990 CC 34R Atlantic City, NJ From: Walt Dickie wa...@crresearch.commailto:wa...@crresearch.com To: cnc-list@cnc-list.commailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com Sent: Thursday, October 4, 2012 3:49:22 PM Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels Absolutely right. Most people around the Chicago area, where I live, look at the size of Lake Michigan and just assume it has a big drainage area, which it doesn’t. There’s a ridge that runs through the western suburbs that demarcates the lake’s drainage from the Mississippi’s. When I go downtown I go past the sign marking the “Continental Divide” in Oak Park, IL; it’s about 2 miles from my house and 10 miles from the shore. The rain that runs off my roof goes into the Gulf of Mexico, not the lake. From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Ronald B. Frerker Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 11:26 PM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.commailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels Levels on the Mississippi should have no effect. The river watershed is not connected to the Great Lakes. Most of the Great Lakes have little watershed area; well at least in the US. For eg., the Superior watershed only goes back 50mi from the western shore. So a light winter can have a dramatic effect if the flow out of the lake system is normal. And as I believe Fred pointed out, evaporation is a major factor, especially when the watershed area is small relative to the surface water area. Usually there is little maneuvering room for changing dam releases on the upper Miss. The changes are usually made on the big dams of the Missouri since 40% of the lower Miss' summer flow is from the Missouri. Ron Wild Cheri CC 30 STL --- On Wed, 10/3/12, Chuck S cscheaf...@comcast.netmailto:cscheaf...@comcast.net wrote: From: Chuck S cscheaf...@comcast.netmailto:cscheaf...@comcast.net Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels To: cnc-list@cnc-list.commailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com Date: Wednesday, October 3, 2012, 5:13 PM Great Lakes water level: Just guessing, but isn't the fall in lake levels due to lower rainfall amounts? Also, didn't they raise the level of the Mississippi (by lowering dam levels upstream to feed it) because they need to keep channels filled for commercial shipping? Chuck Resolute 1990 CC 34R Atlantic City, NJ From: dwight veinot dwightvei...@hfx.eastlink.camailto:dwightvei...@hfx.eastlink.ca To: cnc-list@cnc-list.commailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com Sent: Wednesday, October 3, 2012 6:07:20 PM Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels So what could the government do??? Has someone interfered with nature or what??? Dwight Veinot CC 35 MKII, Alianna Head of St. Margaret's Bay, NS From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Stu Sent: October 3, 2012 1:14 PM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.commailto:cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels The main intention of my first email, was to pass along information on what is happening to the water levels in the Great Lakes and to let people know that the governments are doing nothing to improve the situation. Allowing the level in 1 lake to drop another 5 feet is going to destroy fishing, boating and most recreational activities on the lake. Don't shoot the messenger -- point the gun at the politicians. Stu No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.comhttp://www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.2221
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes water levels
It's all relative! The lake I sail on is at 4,260 ft. I live just down the road. My sense is that when the ice caps melt I'll have beach front property. You guys will be up to your armpits - or deeper!!! sam :-) CC 26 Liquorice Ghost Lake Alberta On 2012-10-04, at 7:42 PM, Bob Hickson bobhick...@rogers.com wrote: I am no expert but I know that the levels of the lakes go through natural cycles over a span of several years. http://www.waterlevels.gc.ca/CA/netgraphs_e.html If you look at the historic levels in the lakes, it seems that the levels in recent years have been more stable than in the past For a forecast of the next 30 days you can follow this link (forecast is updated frequently) http://www.lre.usace.army.mil/greatlakes/hh/greatlakeswaterlevels/waterlevelforecasts/weeklygreatlakeswaterlevels/index.cfm The longer term forecast for Lake Ontario is for it to continue low through the winter and into the spring L Best regards, Bob Hickson, P. Eng, RHI, CEA CC 29-2 Flying Colours (416) 919-2297 bobhick...@rogers.com __/) ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels
Stu, if you really want to make some waves, get BoatUS in the fray. Bill Coleman CC 39 animated_favicon1 From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Stu Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2012 4:44 PM To: CC Email List Subject: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels This is NOT CC related, but if you can't sail your boat, it will be: Dear friends of Georgian Bay and Lake Huron, A recent report by the International Joint Commission (IJC) recently announced a recommendation that the water level of Lake Huron/Georgian Bay be allowed to decline by another 1½ metres without government intervention (for our American friends, that's 5 feet!). Why do we care? Because the Great Lakes were formed by glacial melt in the last Ice Age, and man has intervened. We have created global warming and we dredged the St. Clair River to permit super tanker ships to reach the upper Great Lakes. In fact, the channel was over-dredged and exposed a soft layer of terrain which washed away further increasing the flow of water leaving the upper Great Lakes. The flow of water leaving the lakes has been dramatically accelerated! If allowed to continue, the lake levels will continue to drop. There is a solution: stone baffles could be installed at the bottom of the St. Clair to return the depth of the St Clair River to that which was intended for freighter traffic. The dollars required to do his are quite manageable and are much less than the cost of allowing the situation to continue. Please take a short moment to sign a new petition which implores the IJC to do something about the problem. (See link below). If you care about the ecological and economic devastation that will result from further drops in the water level, send an e-mail to the IJC, ( link below), and please pass on the links to everyone you know. Thanks for caring about the Bay Read more about it and sign it here: http://www.avaaz.org/en/petition/Save_the_upper_Great_Lakes_water_levels_esp ecially_Lake_Huron_and_Georgian_Bay/?launch To contact the IJC: e-mail - commiss...@ottawa.ijc.org Letter - 234 Laurier Ave W 22nd Floor, Ottawa ON, K1P 6K6 Campaigns like this always start small, but they grow when people like us get involved -- please take a second right now to help out by signing and passing it on. To edit your petition at any time, click here: http://www.avaaz.org/en/petition/Save_the_upper_Great_Lakes_water_levels_esp ecially_Lake_Huron_and_Georgian_Bay/edit/ Let's make change, image001.gif___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels
OK Stu, here's a dumb question: If the water is leaving the Upper Great Lakes faster than normal, why isn't the level of the Lower Great Lakes rising with all that influx of water? We keep our boat in Hamilton, Ontario, and the water level at the fixed docks at the Royal Hamilton Yacht Club is so low now that I have to sit on my butt on the dock with my legs dangling in space before a gingerly lower myself on to the deck of Trillium now several feet below dock level. I can't see how putting baffles in the St. Clair River is going to improve the water level on Lake Ontario. There seems to be something more at work here than water flow through the St. Clair River. It probably has to do more with lack of snow fall and snow build up in the winter with resulting reduced run off in the spring, as well as changes in precipitation generally. Global warming (or Climate Change) perhaps? I don't have an answer, but this does seem to be a problem facing the whole Great Lakes, not just the Upper Lakes. Rob On Tue, Oct 2, 2012 at 4:44 PM, Stu s...@cncphotoalbum.com wrote: ** This is NOT CC related, but if you can't sail your boat, it will be: Dear friends of Georgian Bay and Lake Huron, A recent report by the International Joint Commission (IJC) recently announced a recommendation that the water level of Lake Huron/Georgian Bay be allowed to decline by another 1½ metres without government intervention (for our American friends, that's 5 feet!). Why do we care? Because the Great Lakes were formed by glacial melt in the last Ice Age, and man has intervened. We have created global warming and we dredged the St. Clair River to permit super tanker ships to reach the upper Great Lakes. In fact, the channel was over-dredged and exposed a soft layer of terrain which washed away further increasing the flow of water leaving the upper Great Lakes. The flow of water leaving the lakes has been dramatically accelerated! If allowed to continue, the lake levels will continue to drop. *There is a solution*: stone baffles could be installed at the bottom of the St. Clair to return the depth of the St Clair River to that which was intended for freighter traffic. The dollars required to do his are quite manageable and are much less than the cost of allowing the situation to continue. Please take a short moment to sign a new petition which implores the IJC to do something about the problem. (See link below). If you care about the ecological and economic devastation that will result from further drops in the water level, send an e-mail to the IJC, ( link below), and please pass on the links *to everyone you know.* Thanks for caring about the Bay *Read more about it and sign it here*: http://www.avaaz.org/en/petition/Save_the_upper_Great_Lakes_water_levels_especially_Lake_Huron_and_Georgian_Bay/?launch To contact the IJC: e-mail - commiss...@ottawa.ijc.org Letter - 234 Laurier Ave W 22nd Floor, Ottawa ON, K1P 6K6 Campaigns like this always start small, but they grow when people like us get involved -- please take a second right now to help out by signing and passing it on. To edit your petition at any time, click here: http://www.avaaz.org/en/petition/Save_the_upper_Great_Lakes_water_levels_especially_Lake_Huron_and_Georgian_Bay/edit/ Let's make change, ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels
The main intention of my first email, was to pass along information on what is happening to the water levels in the Great Lakes and to let people know that the governments are doing nothing to improve the situation. Allowing the level in 1 lake to drop another 5 feet is going to destroy fishing, boating and most recreational activities on the lake. Don't shoot the messenger -- point the gun at the politicians. Stu ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels
I have heard that there is a call for a greater than usual volume of Lake effect snowfall this year due to the higher than usual Lake temperature. From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Frederick G Street Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 11:50 AM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels Speaking just for Lake Superior, we're in a drought situation here right now, so inflow is much reduced; but the biggest culprit seems to be the warmer than usual winters, which lead to significantly reduced ice cover, which in turn leads to greatly increased evaporation. Fred Street -- Minneapolis S/V Oceanis (1979 CC Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI :^( On Oct 3, 2012, at 10:38 AM, Robert Mazza wrote: OK Stu, here's a dumb question: If the water is leaving the Upper Great Lakes faster than normal, why isn't the level of the Lower Great Lakes rising with all that influx of water? We keep our boat in Hamilton, Ontario, and the water level at the fixed docks at the Royal Hamilton Yacht Club is so low now that I have to sit on my butt on the dock with my legs dangling in space before a gingerly lower myself on to the deck of Trillium now several feet below dock level. I can't see how putting baffles in the St. Clair River is going to improve the water level on Lake Ontario. There seems to be something more at work here than water flow through the St. Clair River. It probably has to do more with lack of snow fall and snow build up in the winter with resulting reduced run off in the spring, as well as changes in precipitation generally. Global warming (or Climate Change) perhaps? I don't have an answer, but this does seem to be a problem facing the whole Great Lakes, not just the Upper Lakes. ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels
I don't understand all the flap over water levels. Ours goes up and down over 6' every few hours. Up to 40' on the Bay of Fundy. No sweat. Rich Knowles Indigo - CC LF38 Halifax - Nova Scotia On 2012-10-03, at 16:14, Frederick G Street f...@postaudio.net wrote: We don't see much lake effect snow on Superior, as we're upwind of everything... -- Fred On Oct 3, 2012, at 2:12 PM, Neil Andersen neil.eric.ander...@gmail.com wrote: I have heard that there is a call for a greater than usual volume of Lake effect snowfall this year due to the higher than usual Lake temperature… From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Frederick G Street Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 11:50 AM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels Speaking just for Lake Superior, we're in a drought situation here right now, so inflow is much reduced; but the biggest culprit seems to be the warmer than usual winters, which lead to significantly reduced ice cover, which in turn leads to greatly increased evaporation. Fred Street -- Minneapolis S/V Oceanis (1979 CC Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI :^( On Oct 3, 2012, at 10:38 AM, Robert Mazza wrote: OK Stu, here's a dumb question: If the water is leaving the Upper Great Lakes faster than normal, why isn't the level of the Lower Great Lakes rising with all that influx of water? We keep our boat in Hamilton, Ontario, and the water level at the fixed docks at the Royal Hamilton Yacht Club is so low now that I have to sit on my butt on the dock with my legs dangling in space before a gingerly lower myself on to the deck of Trillium now several feet below dock level. I can't see how putting baffles in the St. Clair River is going to improve the water level on Lake Ontario. There seems to be something more at work here than water flow through the St. Clair River. It probably has to do more with lack of snow fall and snow build up in the winter with resulting reduced run off in the spring, as well as changes in precipitation generally. Global warming (or Climate Change) perhaps? I don't have an answer, but this does seem to be a problem facing the whole Great Lakes, not just the Upper Lakes. ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels
Sadly true .. And we'll need wheels on our keels! This is one time I am very happy to have centerboard on Lake Ontario! Paul. :) On 2012-10-03, at 5:53 PM, Frederick G Street f...@postaudio.net wrote: If they wait long enough, they'll be able to drive to their cottages... Fred Street -- Minneapolis S/V Oceanis (1979 CC Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI :^( On Oct 3, 2012, at 3:28 PM, Paul Fountain wrote: On the upper lakes I have friends with cottages on islands that are having to extend docks and take other actions to get to the islands - no fun! ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels
Paul, How would you go under the dock? Doesn't your dock float anymore? My dock (C-3) does. Cheers Colin On 10/3/12, Paul Fountain paul.fount...@sympatico.ca wrote: Rich, It's a serious issue on the Great Lakes right now - many clubs and marinas on Lake Ontario are not accessible to boats drawing over 5 1/2 feet some are pulling deeper drafts already. I've had to extend my dock skirt down 2+ feet so I don't go under the dock. On the upper lakes I have friends with cottages on islands that are having to extend docks and take other actions to get to the islands - no fun! Wish we had tides even wind tides right now! Paul. :) On 2012-10-03, at 3:54 PM, Rich Knowles r...@sailpower.ca wrote: I don't understand all the flap over water levels. Ours goes up and down over 6' every few hours. Up to 40' on the Bay of Fundy. No sweat. Rich Knowles Indigo - CC LF38 Halifax - Nova Scotia On 2012-10-03, at 16:14, Frederick G Street f...@postaudio.net wrote: We don't see much lake effect snow on Superior, as we're upwind of everything... -- Fred On Oct 3, 2012, at 2:12 PM, Neil Andersen neil.eric.ander...@gmail.com wrote: I have heard that there is a call for a greater than usual volume of Lake effect snowfall this year due to the higher than usual Lake temperature… From: CnC-List [mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On Behalf Of Frederick G Street Sent: Wednesday, October 03, 2012 11:50 AM To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels Speaking just for Lake Superior, we're in a drought situation here right now, so inflow is much reduced; but the biggest culprit seems to be the warmer than usual winters, which lead to significantly reduced ice cover, which in turn leads to greatly increased evaporation. Fred Street -- Minneapolis S/V Oceanis (1979 CC Landfall 38) -- on the hard in Bayfield, WI :^( On Oct 3, 2012, at 10:38 AM, Robert Mazza wrote: OK Stu, here's a dumb question: If the water is leaving the Upper Great Lakes faster than normal, why isn't the level of the Lower Great Lakes rising with all that influx of water? We keep our boat in Hamilton, Ontario, and the water level at the fixed docks at the Royal Hamilton Yacht Club is so low now that I have to sit on my butt on the dock with my legs dangling in space before a gingerly lower myself on to the deck of Trillium now several feet below dock level. I can't see how putting baffles in the St. Clair River is going to improve the water level on Lake Ontario. There seems to be something more at work here than water flow through the St. Clair River. It probably has to do more with lack of snow fall and snow build up in the winter with resulting reduced run off in the spring, as well as changes in precipitation generally. Global warming (or Climate Change) perhaps? I don't have an answer, but this does seem to be a problem facing the whole Great Lakes, not just the Upper Lakes. ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com -- Sent from my mobile device ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels
Some folks at our club are having to haul elsewhere this year because they are not able to approach the dock to get into the slings. I'm one of those people but I was planning on hauling elsewhere anyway. Water level is a serious issue at a lot of clubs on Lake Ontario. Steve CC 32 Toronto (TSCC) On Wed, Oct 3, 2012 at 11:38 AM, Robert Mazza robertlma...@gmail.comwrote: OK Stu, here's a dumb question: If the water is leaving the Upper Great Lakes faster than normal, why isn't the level of the Lower Great Lakes rising with all that influx of water? We keep our boat in Hamilton, Ontario, and the water level at the fixed docks at the Royal Hamilton Yacht Club is so low now that I have to sit on my butt on the dock with my legs dangling in space before a gingerly lower myself on to the deck of Trillium now several feet below dock level. I can't see how putting baffles in the St. Clair River is going to improve the water level on Lake Ontario. There seems to be something more at work here than water flow through the St. Clair River. It probably has to do more with lack of snow fall and snow build up in the winter with resulting reduced run off in the spring, as well as changes in precipitation generally. Global warming (or Climate Change) perhaps? I don't have an answer, but this does seem to be a problem facing the whole Great Lakes, not just the Upper Lakes. Rob On Tue, Oct 2, 2012 at 4:44 PM, Stu s...@cncphotoalbum.com wrote: ** This is NOT CC related, but if you can't sail your boat, it will be: Dear friends of Georgian Bay and Lake Huron, A recent report by the International Joint Commission (IJC) recently announced a recommendation that the water level of Lake Huron/Georgian Bay be allowed to decline by another 1½ metres without government intervention (for our American friends, that's 5 feet!). Why do we care? Because the Great Lakes were formed by glacial melt in the last Ice Age, and man has intervened. We have created global warming and we dredged the St. Clair River to permit super tanker ships to reach the upper Great Lakes. In fact, the channel was over-dredged and exposed a soft layer of terrain which washed away further increasing the flow of water leaving the upper Great Lakes. The flow of water leaving the lakes has been dramatically accelerated! If allowed to continue, the lake levels will continue to drop. *There is a solution*: stone baffles could be installed at the bottom of the St. Clair to return the depth of the St Clair River to that which was intended for freighter traffic. The dollars required to do his are quite manageable and are much less than the cost of allowing the situation to continue. Please take a short moment to sign a new petition which implores the IJC to do something about the problem. (See link below). If you care about the ecological and economic devastation that will result from further drops in the water level, send an e-mail to the IJC, ( link below), and please pass on the links *to everyone you know.* Thanks for caring about the Bay *Read more about it and sign it here*: http://www.avaaz.org/en/petition/Save_the_upper_Great_Lakes_water_levels_especially_Lake_Huron_and_Georgian_Bay/?launch To contact the IJC: e-mail - commiss...@ottawa.ijc.org Letter - 234 Laurier Ave W 22nd Floor, Ottawa ON, K1P 6K6 Campaigns like this always start small, but they grow when people like us get involved -- please take a second right now to help out by signing and passing it on. To edit your petition at any time, click here: http://www.avaaz.org/en/petition/Save_the_upper_Great_Lakes_water_levels_especially_Lake_Huron_and_Georgian_Bay/edit/ Let's make change, ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels
Levels on the Mississippi should have no effect. The river watershed is not
connected to the Great Lakes. Most of the Great Lakes have little watershed
area; well at least in the US. For eg., the Superior watershed only goes back
50mi from the western shore. So a light winter can have a dramatic effect if
the flow out of the lake system is normal.And as I believe Fred pointed out,
evaporation is a major factor, especially when the watershed area is small
relative to the surface water area.Usually there is little maneuvering room for
changing dam releases on the upper Miss. The changes are usually made on the
big dams of the Missouri since 40% of the lower Miss' summer flow is from the
Missouri.RonWild CheriCC 30STL
--- On Wed, 10/3/12, Chuck S cscheaf...@comcast.net wrote:
From: Chuck S cscheaf...@comcast.net
Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Date: Wednesday, October 3, 2012, 5:13 PM
#yiv2129176082 p {margin:0;}Great Lakes water level:
Just guessing, but isn't the fall in lake levels due to lower rainfall
amounts?
Also, didn't they raise the level of the Mississippi (by lowering dam levels
upstream to feed it) because they need to keep channels filled for commercial
shipping?
Chuck
Resolute
1990 CC 34R
Atlantic City, NJ
From: dwight veinot dwightvei...@hfx.eastlink.ca
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Sent: Wednesday, October 3, 2012 6:07:20 PM
Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels
So what could the government do??? Has
someone interfered with nature or what???
Dwight Veinot
CC 35 MKII, Alianna
Head of St. Margaret's Bay, NS
From: CnC-List
[mailto:cnc-list-boun...@cnc-list.com] On
Behalf Of Stu
Sent: October 3, 2012 1:14 PM
To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com
Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water
Levels
The main intention of my first email, was to pass along information on
what is happening to the water levels in the Great Lakes
and to let people know that the governments are doing nothing to improve the
situation. Allowing the level in 1 lake to drop another 5 feet is going
to destroy fishing, boating and most recreational activities on the lake.
Don't shoot the messenger -- point the gun at the politicians.
Stu
No virus found in this message.
Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2012.0.2221 / Virus Database: 2441/5307 - Release Date: 10/03/12
___
This List is provided by the CC Photo Album
http://www.cncphotoalbum.com
CnC-List@cnc-list.com
-Inline Attachment Follows-
___
This List is provided by the CC Photo Album
http://www.cncphotoalbum.com
CnC-List@cnc-list.com
___
This List is provided by the CC Photo Album
http://www.cncphotoalbum.com
CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels
Mostly makes sense. However, flow through the Chicago canal to the Mississippi by way of the Illinois doesn't ever cause much more than flushing a toilet in MPLS. The Chicago was diverted to the Illinois to keep Chicago sewage out of Lake Michigan. The canal just allows for traffic between the river and the lake given the river course change.Also, I believe someone mentioned the dredging earlier, but IIRC, flow rate would not be as related to river depth as to the drop rate of the river bottom and the height of water column of the upper lakes. If only a section was dredged and not the entire river, I would think the flow rate would not be significantly different due to dredging.I'm not overly familiar with that section of the country, but it does sound more like a weather problem than a man-made one.RonWild CheriCC 30STL --- On Wed, 10/3/12, Alex Giannelia a...@airsensing.com wrote: From: Alex Giannelia a...@airsensing.com Subject: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com cnc-list@cnc-list.com Date: Wednesday, October 3, 2012, 5:31 PM Stu is right to point this out. We need to listen and to do something. Here is my background based on what I do for a living and who I do it for. This issue is always going to be a difficult one. I am in the aerial mapping business and we have seen projects come out either because the lake levels were too high and caused property damaging erosion (1988-1990 comes to mind) that needed to be mapped for? The IJC. So they are looking at this. There are four drain plugs in the system that I know of, 1 Jackfish River to divert to hydro power in the James Bay 1) Chicago Canal to flood the Mississippi for shipping 2) Oswego to flood the Hudson 3) St. Lawrence which also drives shipping and hydroelectric These are supposed to balanced, and if the scientists were running the show, they probably would be, but politicians are, so the squeaky hinge gets the flow, so the St. Clair River deal just put a kibosh on everything because it accelerates the flown to Erie which due to its shallow nature is a great evaporator. No one figured on losing ice the way we have on all the lakes. I photographed Lake Ontario in Feb 1978, the last time it had more than 50% cover. Counting on this evaporation to create more snow is a nice wish, but as one guy on this list pointed out, Superior is upwind of everything, so don't count on it. WE ARE THE REASON. AND WHEN WE EITHER CHANGE OUR WAYS, OR GET POLITICIANS TO CHANGE THEM FOR US, THE SITUATION WILL CHANGE FOR THE BETTER, BUT IF WE DO NOTHING, THE WATER WILL EVAPORATE AND DUMP DOWNWIND INTO THE OCEAN EITHER AS SNOW OR RAIN. My .02 worth. ALEX GIANNELIA CC 35-II (1974) WILL BE RENAMED ON THE HARD SINCE NOV. 2006 and if the lake levels drop more, may be there forever ;} Toronto Ontario ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels
Stu, I can attest to the dropping water levels. We pulled out early to make sure that we could get our boat up river for haul out. Hopefully we will be able to go in next year. Lake Michigan/Huron (considered on body of water)is within 2 inches of the all time low level for October and it is expected that we will lose 2 inches in October. Neil Schiller 1970 Redwing 35, Hull #7 (CC 35, Mark I) Corsair Tucked away in South Haven, MI On 10/2/2012 4:44 PM, Stu wrote: This is NOT CC related, but if you can't sail your boat, it will be: Dear friends of Georgian Bay and Lake Huron, A recent report by the International Joint Commission (IJC) recently announced a recommendation that the water level of Lake Huron/Georgian Bay be allowed to decline by another 1½ metres without government intervention (for our American friends, that's 5 feet!). Why do we care? Because the Great Lakes were formed by glacial melt in the last Ice Age, and man has intervened. We have created global warming and we dredged the St. Clair River to permit super tanker ships to reach the upper Great Lakes. In fact, the channel was over-dredged and exposed a soft layer of terrain which washed away further increasing the flow of water leaving the upper Great Lakes.The flow of water leaving the lakes has been dramatically accelerated! If allowed to continue, the lake levels will continue to drop. _There is a solution_: stone baffles could be installed at the bottom of the St. Clair to return the depth of the St Clair River to that which was intended for freighter traffic. The dollars required to do his are quite manageable and are much less than the cost of allowing the situation to continue. Please take a short moment to sign a new petition which implores the IJC to do something about the problem. (See link below). If you care about the ecological and economic devastation that will result from further drops in the water level, send an e-mail to the IJC, ( link below), and please pass on the links *_to everyone you know_.* Thanks for caring about the Bay *Read more about it and sign it here*: http://www.avaaz.org/en/petition/Save_the_upper_Great_Lakes_water_levels_especially_Lake_Huron_and_Georgian_Bay/?launch To contact the IJC: e-mail - commiss...@ottawa.ijc.org mailto:commiss...@ottawa.ijc.org Letter - 234 Laurier Ave W 22nd Floor, Ottawa ON, K1P 6K6 Campaigns like this always start small, but they grow when people like us get involved -- please take a second right now to help out by signing and passing it on. To edit your petition at any time, click here: http://www.avaaz.org/en/petition/Save_the_upper_Great_Lakes_water_levels_especially_Lake_Huron_and_Georgian_Bay/edit/ Let's make change, ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com ___ This List is provided by the CC Photo Album http://www.cncphotoalbum.com CnC-List@cnc-list.com
Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels
Heard a securite on the VHF today about a dredger operating in the St, Clair River. They are still going at it! Nuts. Typical government attitude toward short term consequences for vested interests. The Chicago waste and barge canal is another example of baffling intransigence. Steve Thomas CC27 MKIII Cruising Western Lake Erie Date: Tue, 2 Oct 2012 19:17:31 -0400 From: schil...@bloomingdalecom.net To: cnc-list@cnc-list.com Subject: Re: Stus-List Great Lakes Water Levels Stu, I can attest to the dropping water levels. We pulled out early to make sure that we could get our boat up river for haul out. Hopefully we will be able to go in next year. Lake Michigan/Huron (considered on body of water)is within 2 inches of the all time low level for October and it is expected that we will lose 2 inches in October. Neil Schiller 1970 Redwing 35, Hull #7 (CC 35, Mark I) Corsair Tucked away in South Haven, MI On 10/2/2012 4:44 PM, Stu wrote: This is NOT CC related, but if you can't sail your boat, it will be: Dear friends of Georgian Bay and Lake Huron, A recent report by the International Joint Commission (IJC) recently announced a recommendation that the water level of Lake Huron/Georgian Bay be allowed to decline by another 1½ metres without government intervention (for our American friends, that's 5 feet!). Why do we care? Because the Great Lakes were formed by glacial melt in the last Ice Age, and man has intervened. We have created global warming and we dredged the St. Clair River to permit super tanker ships to reach the upper Great Lakes. In fact
