Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money
-Caveat Lector- how do you deal with households that are not exactly civilian in this situation? A hypothetical extremist who plants a car bomb, or has a bomb factory to send kids out to blow up civilians - who is not in any officially recognized army, and lives with his family in the same building he makes his bombs, or whatever? He is a civilian - officially. That is the age old problem of colonialists and occupiers. Seems like I heard similiar questions when I was in Viet Nam. That is why the South African Apartheid government locked up Nelson Mandella for 20 years. This is a common misconception. One I have talked about here before. The word Jewish has 2 meanings - the 1st designates a religion the way Hindu or catholic does. The second in a tribal / ethnic label, like Italian French and Mexican. What is the point? That American Jews, Italian Jews need 2 countries? I thought the 'homeland' for American Jews is America? The '67 war was not started by the Israelis. One should never gamble more than they can stand to lose. The regional Arab states bet they could destroy Israel. They lost. Who started the war is questionable. Pre emptive strikes by Israel seems to indicate they started the war. I believe the first strike was against the Syrian and Egyptian Air Force by Israel. The stupid Israelis, instead of kicking the Muslims out of the territories they captured, in the manner Jews were kicked out of so many Islamic countries, they said stay, lets try to build a state together. The same Muslims who didn't allow Jews to enter the old city of Jerusalem, were told they could share in Jerusalem. Those same Muslims are now blowing up school buses. Ah yes, good old fashioned 'ethnic cleansing' - too bad the 'stupid Israelis' did not 'cleanse' the area of a few million Palestinians. Of course the reality is that many in Israel (including Sharon) certainly wanted to do this but the Cold War was in full bloom and the US (and the Soviet Union) forbade it. Do you think if the Israeli's had lost that war, there would have been a Jew left alive there? Do you think they would have been invited to stay? The hatred egendered by the establishment of an essentially European colony in the heart of the Middle East and the resultant forcible removable of huge numbers of natives certainly did not engender good will among the Arabs. Regardless, what is done is done. Unfortunately the Israeli right wing lunatics are in now charge of the Aslym. The bottom line is that the Lukidniks and fanatical 'greater Israel' Zionists are in charge and will never give up their ultimate goal of a greater ( i.e. 'Arab free') Israel. Sharon does not want peace. The tragedy is that the US is a willing partner in this ongoing genocide. flw A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money
-Caveat Lector- on 9/23/02 2:34 PM, flw at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -Caveat Lector- how do you deal with households that are not exactly civilian in this situation? A hypothetical extremist who plants a car bomb, or has a bomb factory to send kids out to blow up civilians - who is not in any officially recognized army, and lives with his family in the same building he makes his bombs, or whatever? He is a civilian - officially. That is the age old problem of colonialists and occupiers. Seems like I heard similiar questions when I was in Viet Nam. That is why the South African Apartheid government locked up Nelson Mandella for 20 years. It is a problem. I just don't know what the answer is. This is a common misconception. One I have talked about here before. The word Jewish has 2 meanings - the 1st designates a religion the way Hindu or catholic does. The second in a tribal / ethnic label, like Italian French and Mexican. What is the point? That American Jews, Italian Jews need 2 countries? I thought the 'homeland' for American Jews is America? Look - personally - I consider myself American ( actually a new Yorker, which isn't the same - post 9/11 propaganda notwithstanding) and that is enough for me. Not Italian Jews in one place American Jews in another, but a place where people of Jewish ethnicity have self rule. It is exactly what the Palestinians want now. The parallels are quite close - Its not like Palestinians were ever separate from the rest of the Arab world, except by European colonial mapmaking. So I could ask why does there need to be a Palestinian Islamic Arab homeland, why don't they just accept living in some other place as Syrian Palestinians? It makes as much sense. The '67 war was not started by the Israelis. One should never gamble more than they can stand to lose. The regional Arab states bet they could destroy Israel. They lost. Who started the war is questionable. Pre emptive strikes by Israel seems to indicate they started the war. I believe the first strike was against the Syrian and Egyptian Air Force by Israel. It was a fine line indeed - Egyptian and Syrian troops were massed at the borders and poised to strike. Whether Israel fired that shot or not the war would have begun at the same moment in time. The stupid Israelis, instead of kicking the Muslims out of the territories they captured, in the manner Jews were kicked out of so many Islamic countries, they said stay, lets try to build a state together. The same Muslims who didn't allow Jews to enter the old city of Jerusalem, were told they could share in Jerusalem. Those same Muslims are now blowing up school buses. Ah yes, good old fashioned 'ethnic cleansing' - too bad the 'stupid Israelis' did not 'cleanse' the area of a few million Palestinians. Of course the reality is that many in Israel (including Sharon) certainly wanted to do this but the Cold War was in full bloom and the US (and the Soviet Union) forbade it. I was being facetious when I said they were stupid. The point is that at that moment the Israeli's chose to be softer rather than hard line. Right choice, but it lead to this state of perpetual war. The less moral choice might have been a better political choice. As I ask in the paragraph, if things had gone the other way, I am sure the regional Arabs would have chosen differently. Do you think if the Israeli's had lost that war, there would have been a Jew left alive there? Do you think they would have been invited to stay? The hatred egendered by the establishment of an essentially European colony in the heart of the Middle East and the resultant forcible removable of huge numbers of natives certainly did not engender good will among the Arabs. Regardless, what is done is done. Unfortunately the Israeli right wing lunatics are in now charge of the Aslym. The bottom line is that the Lukidniks and fanatical 'greater Israel' Zionists are in charge and will never give up their ultimate goal of a greater ( i.e. 'Arab free') Israel. Sharon does not want peace. The tragedy is that the US is a willing partner in this ongoing genocide. The fact that a right wing US supports a right wing Israel is no surprise. If the Arabs had not boycotted the last election, and declared the last intafada, I think we would be much closer to peace today than we are now. That¹s the hope and tragedy of democracy - people get the govt they ask for, the one they deserve. flw A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said,
Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money
-Caveat Lector- Look - personally - I consider myself American ( actually a new Yorker, which isn't the same - post 9/11 propaganda notwithstanding) and that is enough for me. Not Italian Jews in one place American Jews in another, but a place where people of Jewish ethnicity have self rule. It is exactly what the Palestinians want now. The parallels are quite close - Its not like Palestinians were ever separate from the rest of the Arab world, except by European colonial mapmaking. So I could ask why does there need to be a Palestinian Islamic Arab homeland, why don't they just accept living in some other place as Syrian Palestinians? It makes as much sense. You are begging the issue. Palestinians live in Palestine (W Bank, Gaza, etc) Israeli Jews and Arabs live in Israel. Obviously those who presently live in those places consider those places their 'homeland.' Whether you are an American Jew or American Irish, America is YOUR homeland unless you decide to immigrate someplace else - then that place becomes your 'homeland'. American Jews or American Irish do not need another 'homeland' and to put the quest for an emotional 'homeland' above the interest of your real homeland is wrong and an insult to your fellow citizens. I resent my tax dollars being used by pandering politicians who put their own political self interest above my country's interest. I abhore my tax dollars being spent to support state terrorism to further the interest of an apartheid, racist Theocracy just as I resent my tax dollars being used to support the Egyptian police state. flw A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money
-Caveat Lector- You are playing the bait and switch again. The Saudi's are essentially hiring young Palestinians as murderers. They are making the killing of innocents a lucrative career path. High pay for short 'career' isn't it? Not one a person who is not frustrated to a point of insanity would choose it appears. What is is with people who only see the world in black and white. Several on this list keep assuming that because I'm Jewish, or because I think Israel has a right to exist, that I'm some rightwing Sharon loving settler. That because I find convincing boys that murder will bring them heavenly orgasms is as evil as evil can get, that I think any act perpetrated against Muslims is OK. The reality is that Israel is an oppressor, apartheid, occupying state. The Palestinians are not occupying Israel, they are not making Israelis live under state terrorism. They are not building illegal Palestinian squatter camps in Israel. The Palestinians are not starving the Israeli children. They are not stealing Israeli water. They are not smashing down the Israeli homes of IDF bomber pilots. They are not burning down 500 year old olive groves in Israel. They are not committing cultural genocide against the Israelis - the Israelis are doing it to themselves. What you fail to understand is that there is no moral equivilancy here. The Israelis and their Jewish (and non-Jewish) supporters fail to realize that they are on the side of apartheid, colonialism, cultural genocide - they are on the wrong side of History. flw A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money
-Caveat Lector- on 9/22/02 11:58 AM, flw at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -Caveat Lector- You are playing the bait and switch again. The Saudi's are essentially hiring young Palestinians as murderers. They are making the killing of innocents a lucrative career path. High pay for short 'career' isn't it? Not one a person who is not frustrated to a point of insanity would choose it appears. That statement probably isn't true if you believe in heaven for martyrs, for misguided children who think their family would be better of with money and a dead son, than a live son without blood money. What is is with people who only see the world in black and white. Several on this list keep assuming that because I'm Jewish, or because I think Israel has a right to exist, that I'm some rightwing Sharon loving settler. That because I find convincing boys that murder will bring them heavenly orgasms is as evil as evil can get, that I think any act perpetrated against Muslims is OK. The reality is that Israel is an oppressor, apartheid, occupying state. The Palestinians are not occupying Israel, they are not making Israelis live under state terrorism. They are not building illegal Palestinian squatter camps in Israel. The Palestinians are not starving the Israeli children. They are not stealing Israeli water. They are not smashing down the Israeli homes of IDF bomber pilots. They are not burning down 500 year old olive groves in Israel. They are not committing cultural genocide against the Israelis - the Israelis are doing it to themselves. What you fail to understand is that there is no moral equivilancy here. The Israelis and their Jewish (and non-Jewish) supporters fail to realize that they are on the side of apartheid, colonialism, cultural genocide - they are on the wrong side of History. Even if everything you say is true it does not make it Ok for the Saudi's to pay for the killing of innocent children in school buses, for the killing of innocent teenagers at a youth night in a disco, for innocent shoppers in a mall, commuters on a bus, or diners in a pizzeria. Israeli murder cannot justify Palestinian murder. If it does, then Palestinian murder justifies Israeli murder, and the cycle of violence cannot end. Let me ask you - seriously - where can the Jews have a homeland? Do their nationalist desires not deserve the same consideration as the Palestinians? (for the sake of simplicity we will leave the Palestinian state of Jordan out of it for the moment) -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsel or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands of those who feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you. Samuel Adams NEURONAUTIC INSTITUTE on-line: http://home.earthlink.net/~thew A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money
-Caveat Lector- In a message dated 9/22/02 11:12:35 AM Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Let me ask you - seriously - where can the Jews have a homeland? Do their nationalist desires not deserve the same consideration as the Palestinians? They should've taken Madagascar when they had the chance. Bill. A HREF="http://www.ctrl.org/"www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF="http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html"Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF="http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/"ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money
Title: Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money -Caveat Lector- Then you would be griping about the evil Jews and their domination in Africa. on 9/22/02 12:14 PM, William Shannon at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -Caveat Lector- In a message dated 9/22/02 11:12:35 AM Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Let me ask you - seriously - where can the Jews have a homeland? Do their nationalist desires not deserve the same consideration as the Palestinians? They should've taken Madagascar when they had the chance. Bill. A HREF="http://www.ctrl.org/www.ctrl.org/A" DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF="http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.htmlArchives" of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF="http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ctrl/A" To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om -- All the thoughts of a turtle are turtle Emerson, Journals, 1855 NEURONAUTIC INSTITUTE on-line: http://home.earthlink.net/~thew A HREF="http://www.ctrl.org/"www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF="http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html"Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF="http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/"ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money
-Caveat Lector- In a message dated 9/22/02 11:18:47 AM Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Then you would be griping about the evil Jews and their domination in Africa. Probably...ya' got me there! Does anyone watch football anymore?? I've got to go watch my investments...wish I could stick around and be called all sorts of terrible names by Mr.Anonymous (J2/Zev) but alas - duty calls. Bill. A HREF="http://www.ctrl.org/"www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF="http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html"Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF="http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/"ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money
-Caveat Lector- Even if everything you say is true it does not make it Ok for the Saudi's to pay for the killing of innocent children in school buses, for the killing of innocent teenagers at a youth night in a disco, for innocent shoppers in a mall, commuters on a bus, or diners in a pizzeria. Israeli murder cannot justify Palestinian murder. If it does, then Palestinian murder justifies Israeli murder, and the cycle of violence cannot end. If it is wrong for Saudis to donate to families of human bombs, then it is certainly wrong for Americans to provide Israel with jets and bombs to be used to bomb civilians in Palestine. Let me ask you - seriously - where can the Jews have a homeland? Do their nationalist desires not deserve the same consideration as the Palestinians? (for the sake of simplicity we will leave the Palestinian state of Jordan out of it for the moment) What Jews are you talking about that need this homeland? Judism is a religion. I know that there are Jewish Americans, French Jews, Mexican Jews, etc. etc. In any event, the only Jews that need a homeland are the Jews that presently live in Israel. Whether or not Israel should have been created in 1948 is a moot issue. It exists. Israelis (both Jewish and Moslems) have a right to live in peace within the pre 1967 borders. Palestinians have the right to live in unmolested in the occupied terroritories - without being occupied. flw A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money
-Caveat Lector- on 9/22/02 10:51 PM, flw at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If it is wrong for Saudis to donate to families of human bombs, then it is certainly wrong for Americans to provide Israel with jets and bombs to be used to bomb civilians in Palestine. Bombing civilians is wrong. No matter who does it. A serious question - how do you deal with households that are not exactly civilian in this situation? A hypothetical extremist who plants a car bomb, or has a bomb factory to send kids out to blow up civilians - who is not in any officially recognized army, and lives with his family in the same building he makes his bombs, or whatever? He is a civilian - officially. Before you say that it is a police issue, it seems that the PA has been reluctant , to say the least, to arrest these kinds of people - because Arafat does not want to be a target (that is the nicest possible reasons - there are other ore sinister possibilities, but lets assume the best about ol' statesman yassir) What Jews are you talking about that need this homeland? Judism is a religion. I know that there are Jewish Americans, French Jews, Mexican Jews, etc. etc. In any event, the only Jews that need a homeland are the Jews that presently live in Israel. Whether or not Israel should have been created in 1948 is a moot issue. It exists. Israelis (both Jewish and Moslems) have a right to live in peace within the pre 1967 borders. Palestinians have the right to live in unmolested in the occupied terroritories - without being occupied. This is a common misconception. One I have talked about here before. The word Jewish has 2 meanings - the 1st designates a religion the way Hindu or catholic does. The second in a tribal / ethnic label, like Italian French and Mexican. The '67 war was not started by the Israelis. One should never gamble more than they can stand to lose. The regional Arab states bet they could destroy Israel. They lost. The stupid Israelis, instead of kicking the Muslims out of the territories they captured, in the manner Jews were kicked out of so many Islamic countries, they said stay, lets try to build a state together. The same Muslims who didn't allow Jews to enter the old city of Jerusalem, were told they could share in Jerusalem. Those same Muslims are now blowing up school buses. Do you think if the Israeli's had lost that war, there would have been a Jew left alive there? Do you think they would have been invited to stay? -- -- -- -- -- - -- - -- -- - - - - -- --- -- - - - - -- - - - -- -- - -- - I see in the near future a crisis approaching that unnerves me and causes me to tremble for the safety of my country corporations have been enthroned, an era of corruption in high places will follow, and the money power of the country will endeavor to prolong its reign by working on the prejudices of the people until all wealth is aggregated in a few hands and the Republic is destroyed. I feel at this moment more anxiety for the safety of my country than ever before, even in the midst of war. Abraham Lincoln NEURONAUTIC INSTITUTE on-line: http://home.earthlink.net/~thew A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money
-Caveat Lector- Oops. False reference. Deftly done though. The compensation the Saudis give has nothing to do with blowing up homes. They do not give it to homeless families - they give it to families who have a martyr for a son. As if the Koran didn't make the difference between martyrdom and murder pretty clear. You are right. I apologize. The Israels do not blow up the homes of the family members of human bombers - they give them a Mezuzah to hang over their doorway. Does the Torah encourage Israeli pilots to drop 2000 lb bombs on apartment houses filled with women and children? flw A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money
-Caveat Lector- You are playing the bait and switch again. The Saudi's are essentially hiring young Palestinians as murderers. They are making the killing of innocents a lucrative career path. The fact that Israel is involved in evil shit on it's own, and it is, does not change the inherent evil of the suicide murderer, nor the perhaps greater evil of those who pay for it, and make it viable. What is is with people who only see the world in black and white. Several on this list keep assuming that because I'm Jewish, or because I think Israel has a right to exist, that I'm some rightwing Sharon loving settler. That because I find convincing boys that murder will bring them heavenly orgasms is as evil as evil can get, that I think any act perpetrated against Muslims is OK. To sum up - I did not, as you imply, deny that Israel has undertaken an evil horrific policy when they bulldoze homes. It still does not make blowing up school buses OK. Blowing up school buses does not deserve an award. on 9/21/02 10:26 PM, flw at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -Caveat Lector- Oops. False reference. Deftly done though. The compensation the Saudis give has nothing to do with blowing up homes. They do not give it to homeless families - they give it to families who have a martyr for a son. As if the Koran didn't make the difference between martyrdom and murder pretty clear. You are right. I apologize. The Israels do not blow up the homes of the family members of human bombers - they give them a Mezuzah to hang over their doorway. Does the Torah encourage Israeli pilots to drop 2000 lb bombs on apartment houses filled with women and children? flw A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om -- A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money
-Caveat Lector- But the money isn¹t going to victims. It is going specifically to the families of people who kill innocent civilians, for no other reason than they killed themselves while murdering others. Why is it wrong to pay compensation for innocent family members? Especially since it has long been the Israeli illegal policy of 'collective punishment' (banned under international law as a Nazi tactic) to smash and destroy the homes and business' of family members of human bombers. That¹s not what 'victim' means to me. If the Saudi¹s want to help let them build an infrastructure for Palestinian society. For what reason? So the Israelis can smash and destroy it as they have done to most of the Palestinian civil society infrastructure. Let them do something with the Palestinians, other than hiring them as menial labor in their little feudal kingdom. Until the latest Interfada, the Israelis were hiring many more Palestinians to do their menial labor then the Saudis (and still do). However recently the beneficient Israelis have also switched to poor 3rd world laborers from the Phillipines and even Mexico to do their dirty work. Except for their hookers - most of them are imported from Eastern Europe - especially those under 15. Of course we can't leave out the bunch of poor Peruvian peasants recently imported to populate another illegal 'settlement' (i.e. squatter colony). flw A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money
-Caveat Lector- on 9/20/02 1:49 PM, flw at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -Caveat Lector- But the money isn¹t going to victims. It is going specifically to the families of people who kill innocent civilians, for no other reason than they killed themselves while murdering others. Why is it wrong to pay compensation for innocent family members? Compensation for what? For having a murderer for a son? Paying families is an incentive to blow yourself up while killing innocents. It's not moral, and it goes against the Koran. Especially since it has long been the Israeli illegal policy of 'collective punishment' (banned under international law as a Nazi tactic) to smash and destroy the homes and business' of family members of human bombers. A horrific and animal practice. Does either act justify the other? That¹s not what 'victim' means to me. If the Saudi¹s want to help let them build an infrastructure for Palestinian society. For what reason? So the Israelis can smash and destroy it as they have done to most of the Palestinian civil society infrastructure. What infrastructure was that? Let them do something with the Palestinians, other than hiring them as menial labor in their little feudal kingdom. Until the latest Interfada, the Israelis were hiring many more Palestinians to do their menial labor then the Saudis (and still do). No question they are treated by many as second class citizens. Question is why is that true in all the Arab nations as well? However recently the beneficient Israelis have also switched to poor 3rd world laborers from the Phillipines and even Mexico to do their dirty work. Except for their hookers - most of them are imported from Eastern Europe - especially those under 15. Of course we can't leave out the bunch of poor Peruvian peasants recently imported to populate another illegal 'settlement' (i.e. squatter colony). flw A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- -- If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, go home from us in peace. We ask not your counsel or your arms. Crouch down and lick the hands of those who feed you. May your chains set lightly upon you. Samuel Adams NEURONAUTIC INSTITUTE on-line: http://home.earthlink.net/~thew A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money
-Caveat Lector- Compensation for what? For having a murderer for a son? Paying families is an incentive to blow yourself up while killing innocents. It's not moral, and it goes against the Koran. Especially since it has long been the Israeli illegal policy of 'collective punishment' (banned under international law as a Nazi tactic) to smash and destroy the homes and business' of family members of human bombers. A horrific and animal practice. Does either act justify the other? Yes. If the Israelis are blowing up innocent families homes, it is honorable that the Saudis are providing them compensation for it to enable them to have new shelter. For what reason? So the Israelis can smash and destroy it as they have done to most of the Palestinian civil society infrastructure. What infrastructure was that? Are you not aware of the 2 year campaign by the Israelis to smash and destroy the civil society infrastructure of the Palestinians? Smashing roads, civic buildings, schools, police stations,all birth,death, and school records intentionally destroyed, land records, now they have a new tactic - smashing all manufacturing, repair shops, small business. A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money
-Caveat Lector- Oops. False reference. Deftly done though. The compensation the Saudis give has nothing to do with blowing up homes. They do not give it to homeless families - they give it to families who have a martyr for a son. As if the Koran didn't make the difference between martyrdom and murder pretty clear. on 9/20/02 10:07 PM, flw at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Yes. If the Israelis are blowing up innocent families homes, it is honorable that the Saudis are providing them compensation for it to enable them to have new shelter. -- -- -- -- -- - -- - -- -- - - - - -- --- -- - - - - -- - - - -- -- - -- - Experience should teach us to be most on our guard to protect liberty when the Government's purposes are beneficent. Men born to freedom are naturally alert to repel invasion of their liberty by evil-minded rulers. The greatest dangers to liberty lurk in insidious encroachment by men of zeal, well-meaning but without understanding. Justice Louis D. Brandeis NEURONAUTIC INSTITUTE on-line: http://home.earthlink.net/~thew A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money
Title: Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money -Caveat Lector- on 9/19/02 3:43 PM, Mermaid at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -Caveat Lector- Half of me says oh good someone is helping these people and half of me says it is not a good idea to give money to the families of the suicide bombers because it is almost saying its okay to give your sons to the cause we will reimburse you for your loss with money. The Mermaid x It is not ALMOST saying it ok. It is explicitly saying it is ok to murder innocent, it is PAYING people to murder innocents. But I guess as long as its just Jews its not like its wrong right? Can you explain the half of you that thinks its Ok to pay people for murder? -- Doubt. Doubt thyself. Doubt even if thou doubtest thyself. Doubt all. Doubt even if thou doubtest all. It seems sometimes as if beneath all conscious doubt there lay some deepest certainty. O kill it! Slay the snake! The horn of the Doubt-Goat be exalted Dive deeper, ever deeper, into the Abyss of Mind, until thou unearth the fox THAT. On, hounds! Yoicks! Tally-ho! Bring THAT to bay! Then, wind the Mort! Uncle Al. the kiddies pal NEURONAUTIC INSTITUTE on-line: http://home.earthlink.net/~thew A HREF="http://www.ctrl.org/"www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF="http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html"Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF="http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/"ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money
-Caveat Lector- On Thu, 19 Sep 2002, thew wrote: -Caveat Lector- on 9/19/02 3:43 PM, Mermaid at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -Caveat Lector- Half of me says oh good someone is helping these people and half of me says it is not a good idea to give money to the families of the suicide bombers because it is almost saying its okay to give your sons to the cause we will reimburse you for your loss with money. The Mermaid x It is not ALMOST saying it ok. It is explicitly saying it is ok to murder innocent, it is PAYING people to murder innocents. But I guess as long as it¹s just Jews it¹s not like it¹s wrong right? Can you explain the half of you that thinks it¹s Ok to pay people for murder? Don't forget that Israel bulldozes their relative's homes and extradites them out to some third-world countries, penniless. If your brother or cousing killed someone, would you think it just that your house and all your belongings are destroyed and you're banished forever to live abroad? It is also illegal by international law and a crime against humanity. But do the Hitler's mental kindred care? A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money
-Caveat Lector- Communities live and die by the morality they encourage amongst themselves and toward others. Palestinian terrorists have a very large support system in their families, in the community and beyond. If this support system feels the ends justify the means, then they know they will suffer from the breaking the moral laws of their own religious beliefs. Those who do not speak out loudly against the evil in their midst, Jews or Palestinians, cannot count on their opponents behaving morally and stopping retribution. Are there easy answers? No. -Caveat Lector- On Thu, 19 Sep 2002, thew wrote: -Caveat Lector- on 9/19/02 3:43 PM, Mermaid at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -Caveat Lector- Half of me says oh good someone is helping these people and half of me says it is not a good idea to give money to the families of the suicide bombers because it is almost saying its okay to give your sons to the cause we will reimburse you for your loss with money. The Mermaid x It is not ALMOST saying it ok. It is explicitly saying it is ok to murder innocent, it is PAYING people to murder innocents. But I guess as long as it¹s just Jews it¹s not like it¹s wrong right? Can you explain the half of you that thinks it¹s Ok to pay people for murder? Don't forget that Israel bulldozes their relative's homes and extradites them out to some third-world countries, penniless. If your brother or cousing killed someone, would you think it just that your house and all your belongings are destroyed and you're banished forever to live abroad? It is also illegal by international law and a crime against humanity. But do the Hitler's mental kindred care? A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. == == Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A == == To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money
Title: Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money -Caveat Lector- I was talking about the universities ...dummy the help the students are getting for their educationThat of course if the Israelis dont go and reduce them into a pile of rubble like they have everything else...I mean god forbid that palestinians should be educated. And the fact that the poor sods who the Israelis have put out of work are getting some money to support their families. I do not condone anyone for killing either Jew or gentile what we need to do is bang these shmuckos heads together and tell them to STOP killing each other.I want PEACE I assume you want PEACE.This is all about GREED and Stealing land that doesnt belong really to anybody in particular. Forget that they are Israelis or Palestinians they are HUMANBEINGS at the end of the day...who gives a shit about the land.It is all so ruddy petty and infantile.The ones who are not Human are the perpetrators of this pathetic war,And you and I know very well who they are. Not that you would admit it becaue youve got your head so far up your bum youre as blind as they are! The Mermaid xxx - Original Message - From: thew To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, September 19, 2002 10:03 PM Subject: Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money -Caveat Lector- on 9/19/02 3:43 PM, Mermaid at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -Caveat Lector- Half of me says oh good someone is helping these people and half of me says it is not a good idea to give money to the families of the suicide bombers because it is almost saying its okay to give your sons to the cause we will reimburse you for your loss with money.The Mermaid x It is not ALMOST saying it ok. It is explicitly saying it is ok to murder innocent, it is PAYING people to murder innocents. But I guess as long as its just Jews its not like its wrong right?Can you explain the half of you that thinks its Ok to pay people for murder?-- Doubt. Doubt thyself.Doubt even if thou doubtest thyself.Doubt all.Doubt even if thou doubtest all.It seems sometimes as if beneath all conscious doubtthere lay some deepest certainty. O kill it! Slay thesnake!The horn of the Doubt-Goat be exaltedDive deeper, ever deeper, into the Abyss of Mind,until thou unearth the fox THAT. On, hounds!Yoicks! Tally-ho! Bring THAT to bay!Then, wind the Mort!Uncle Al. the kiddies palNEURONAUTIC INSTITUTE on-line: http://home.earthlink.net/~thew A HREF="http://www.ctrl.org/"www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF="http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html"Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF="http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/"ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om A HREF="http://www.ctrl.org/"www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF="http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html"Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF="http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/"ctrl/A To s
Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money
-Caveat Lector- I'm not sure why you think I approve of that sort of behavior. I think it is barbaric. But in no way does it excuse paying families of murderers to encourage more murder. Bringing up expulsions is a smokescreen, enabling you to ignore the question I asked. I don't know what Hitler has to do with it. on 9/19/02 5:55 PM, Jei at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -Caveat Lector- On Thu, 19 Sep 2002, thew wrote: -Caveat Lector- on 9/19/02 3:43 PM, Mermaid at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -Caveat Lector- Half of me says oh good someone is helping these people and half of me says it is not a good idea to give money to the families of the suicide bombers because it is almost saying its okay to give your sons to the cause we will reimburse you for your loss with money. The Mermaid x It is not ALMOST saying it ok. It is explicitly saying it is ok to murder innocent, it is PAYING people to murder innocents. But I guess as long as it¹s just Jews it¹s not like it¹s wrong right? Can you explain the half of you that thinks it¹s Ok to pay people for murder? Don't forget that Israel bulldozes their relative's homes and extradites them out to some third-world countries, penniless. If your brother or cousing killed someone, would you think it just that your house and all your belongings are destroyed and you're banished forever to live abroad? It is also illegal by international law and a crime against humanity. But do the Hitler's mental kindred care? A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om Free your mind and your ass will follow. St George NEURONAUTIC INSTITUTE on-line: http://home.earthlink.net/~thew A HREF=http://www.ctrl.org/;www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF=http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html;Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF=http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/;ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money
Title: Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money -Caveat Lector- Actually Palestinian universities get lots of money from Israel. But why let facts get in the way of a good point, eh? I will try not to stoop the personal level you feel is called for here, to try to stay with the facts. The perpetrators here are on both sides. They are those who profit from violence. Why you feel this is an excuse to dream of things in my ass is beyond me, but - whatever gets you through the night. Easy to say forget about the land but the land is the only issue. on 9/19/02 7:04 PM, Mermaid at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -Caveat Lector- I was talking about the universities ...dummy the help the students are getting for their educationThat of course if the Israelis dont go and reduce them into a pile of rubble like they have everything else...I mean god forbid that palestinians should be educated. And the fact that the poor sods who the Israelis have put out of work are getting some money to support their families. I do not condone anyone for killing either Jew or gentile what we need to do is bang these shmuckos heads together and tell them to STOP killing each other.I want PEACE I assume you want PEACE.This is all about GREED and Stealing land that doesnt belong really to anybody in particular. Forget that they are Israelis or Palestinians they are HUMANBEINGS at the end of the day...who gives a shit about the land.It is all so ruddy petty and infantile.The ones who are not Human are the perpetrators of this pathetic war,And you and I know very well who they are. Not that you would admit it becaue youve got your head so far up your bum youre as blind as they are! The Mermaid xxx - Original Message - From: thew mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, September 19, 2002 10:03 PM Subject: Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money -Caveat Lector- on 9/19/02 3:43 PM, Mermaid at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -Caveat Lector- Half of me says oh good someone is helping these people and half of me says it is not a good idea to give money to the families of the suicide bombers because it is almost saying its okay to give your sons to the cause we will reimburse you for your loss with money. The Mermaid x It is not ALMOST saying it ok. It is explicitly saying it is ok to murder innocent, it is PAYING people to murder innocents. But I guess as long as its just Jews its not like its wrong right? Can you explain the half of you that thinks its Ok to pay people for murder? -- We are not afraid to entrust the American people with unpleasant facts, foreign ideas, alien philosophies and competitive values. For a nation that is afraid to let its people judge the truth and falsehood in an open market is a nation that is afraid of its people. President John F. Kennedy A HREF="http://www.ctrl.org/"www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF="http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html"Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF="http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/"ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money
-Caveat Lector- In a message dated 9/19/02 7:14:57 PM Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The perpetrators here are on both sides. IF you believe that why do you insist on defending Sharon and his ilk and demonizing the Palestinians? You're about as "fair and balanced" as Fox News...funny too, you both allow Zionist Israel to dictate your very thoughts. Bill. A HREF="http://www.ctrl.org/"www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF="http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html"Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF="http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/"ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money
Title: Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money -Caveat Lector- Scroll back. Read my old posts. I have never defended Sharon. I think the phrase I have used for him most often is dangerous hateful pig, but I can check if you really need a count. Because I think Israel has a right to exist, you somehow think that I agree with everything its govt. does. Maybe you tuned out what I have actually written here on this list, because of my stance, and just filled in your own stereotypes as to what every Jew believes - I dont know. It would be like thinking that because I love America I am pro- Bush, or that because I hate bush I hate the USA. Its simplistic moronic thinking. I ask you to find one place where I have defended Sharon, or his murderous policies. What I have done is refuse to accept statements as facts, just because they are bleated in unison by so many of you. I refuse to pretend that Jordan is not as much the Palestinian state as Israel is (with an ethnic minority leader put in charge by the British in both cases). I refuse to say that strapping explosives to oneself and blowing up kids on a school bus or in a disco is the same as soldiers shooting at armed men who are shooting at them. I refuse to accept anti-Semitism disguised as politics. I have argued for balanced and fair opinions on this issue from my first day on this list. I am not a Zionist (otherwise I would live in Israel). I also do not think Zionism and racism are the same thing. It is the same desire for a homeland that the Palestinians profess now. Personally I think nationalism of any sort is idiotic, but that is the world we actually live in, here and now. I think religion is even stupider than that. If you think it is the same to support Sharon, as it is to think its evil for Saudis to pay families of suicide bombers, your have slid to such and extreme position you arent even on the playing field anymore. on 9/19/02 8:20 PM, William Shannon at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: -Caveat Lector- In a message dated 9/19/02 7:14:57 PM Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The perpetrators here are on both sides. IF you believe that why do you insist on defending Sharon and his ilk and demonizing the Palestinians? You're about as fair and balanced as Fox News...funny too, you both allow Zionist Israel to dictate your very thoughts. Bill. A HREF="http://www.ctrl.org/www.ctrl.org/A" DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF="http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.htmlArchives" of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF="http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ctrl/A" To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om -- --- -- -- -- -- They that can give up essential liberty for a little safety deserve neither liberty nor safety, Ben Franklin NEURONAUTIC INSTITUTE on-line: http://home.earthlink.net/~thew A HREF="http://www.ctrl.org/"www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF="http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html"Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF="http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/"ctrl/A ===
Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money
-Caveat Lector- In a message dated 9/19/02 8:49:35 PM Central Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I refuse to say that strapping explosives to oneself and blowing up kids on a school bus or in a disco is the same as soldiers shooting at armed men who are shooting at them What about murdering little boys for throwing STONES at TANKS? I refuse to accept anti-Semitism disguised as politics Meaning what exactly? If you think it is the same to support Sharon, as it is to think itâs evil for Saudis to pay families of suicide bombers, your have slid to such and extreme position you arenât even on the playing field anymore. I think raising funds for the families of victims is acceptable...these people are oppressed and impoverished. I think Sharon is a war-criminal, a very evil and dangerous man and by far the greatest menace and threat to peace in the Middle East. If you want to call names that's your prerogative, I'd prefer a civil discourse. Bill. A HREF="http://www.ctrl.org/"www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF="http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html"Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF="http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/"ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money
Title: Re: [CTRL] Saudis Pay out money -Caveat Lector- But the money isnt going to victims. It is going specifically to the families of people who kill innocent civilians, for no other reason than they killed themselves while murdering others. Thats not what victim means to me. If the Saudis want to help let them build an infrastructure for Palestinian society. Let them do something with the Palestinians, other than hiring them as menial labor in their little feudal kingdom. on 9/19/02 9:59 PM, William Shannon at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think raising funds for the families of victims is acceptable...these people are oppressed and impoverished -- All the thoughts of a turtle are turtle Emerson, Journals, 1855 NEURONAUTIC INSTITUTE on-line: http://home.earthlink.net/~thew A HREF="http://www.ctrl.org/"www.ctrl.org/A DECLARATION DISCLAIMER == CTRL is a discussion informational exchange list. Proselytizing propagandic screeds are unwelcomed. Substancenot soap-boxingplease! These are sordid matters and 'conspiracy theory'with its many half-truths, mis- directions and outright fraudsis used politically by different groups with major and minor effects spread throughout the spectrum of time and thought. That being said, CTRLgives no endorsement to the validity of posts, and always suggests to readers; be wary of what you read. CTRL gives no credence to Holocaust denial and nazi's need not apply. Let us please be civil and as always, Caveat Lector. Archives Available at: http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html A HREF="http://peach.ease.lsoft.com/archives/ctrl.html"Archives of [EMAIL PROTECTED]/A http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/ A HREF="http:[EMAIL PROTECTED]/"ctrl/A To subscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SUBSCRIBE CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] To UNsubscribe to Conspiracy Theory Research List[CTRL] send email: SIGNOFF CTRL [to:] [EMAIL PROTECTED] Om
