Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
upstatemike;382900 Wrote: I see they list Wal-mart, Target Really? At those release prices?!? Wow. (Not that I don't believe you, I just find it strange that you can get a $1000 network music setup at Wal-Mart.) -- Mark Lanctot Current: SB2, Transporter, Boom (PQP3 - late beta) Stored: Boom (PQP1 - early beta), SBC (beta - no battery) Sold: SB3, Duet Mark Lanctot's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2071 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
I see they list Wal-mart, Target, and Office Max as retail outlets for this product. Maybe I'll stop at Wal-Mart on my way home from work tomorrow and see if they have a demo set up for me to try this out... -- upstatemike upstatemike's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=6409 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
Found a partial review on the Media Hub here: http://www.smallnetbuilder.com/content/view/30688/75/ It also includes some performance data comparing it against other NAS devices. Data transfer performance looks pretty good for a device in the price range its in. Looks like they - sadly - limited it a lot. A flash user interface may look nice and spiffy, but customizing it is gonna be a lot harder than for example SqueezeCenter. Most of the features (backup, media importer) it supports are aimed at Windows based clients. Judging from the file system it uses internally its OS is based on some kind of customized Linux implementation, though I admit it is a wild guess at this time. -- furonfour furonfour's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=17114 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
furonfour;382919 Wrote: Looks like they - sadly - limited it a lot. A flash user interface may look nice and spiffy, but customizing it is gonna be a lot harder than for example SqueezeCenter. Most of the features (backup, media importer) it supports are aimed at Windows based clients. I thought the Flash interface was just the NAS management. -- JJZolx Jim JJZolx's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
JJZolx;382932 Wrote: I thought the Flash interface was just the NAS management. Correct, it'll be interesting to see what those players use, but with the touch display and interface I doubt it will be much different. -- furonfour furonfour's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=17114 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
Did anybody see hard specs anyplace? Maximum number of zones? Maximum number of controllers? Is there an option for using wired ethernet in locations where it is available? -- upstatemike upstatemike's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=6409 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
upstatemike;382374 Wrote: Did anybody see hard specs anyplace? Maximum number of zones? Maximum number of controllers? Is there an option for using wired ethernet in locations where it is available? http://www.linksysbycisco.com/US/en/products/DMC250 Looks like there's an ethernet port. I imagine number of zones and controllers may be limited primarily by your network and possibly the processing power of your server, since none of the boxes run the server itself (unlike Sonos). -- JJZolx Jim JJZolx's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
upstatemike;382374 Wrote: Did anybody see hard specs anyplace? Maximum number of zones? Maximum number of controllers? Is there an option for using wired ethernet in locations where it is available? You can pull the other ones down under each component. Clearly it has Ethernet as well. I just glanced through this one without looking closely yet. http://downloads.linksysbycisco.com/downloads/DMP100_V10_UG_90102NC.pdf -- jt25741 SB3-AR Masters Coax - PS Audio DLIII (Cullen L3) - Cardas Golden Reference XLR - Sim Audio P-5 - Cardas Golden Reference XLR - Sim Audio W-5 - Cardas Golden Reference Hi-Mid,PS Audio Xstream Plus Low- Magnepan 3.6R jt25741's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=8645 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
jt25741;381856 Wrote: No native FLAC in the player? Transcoding necesssary.802.11n will be needed even more pushing around uncompressed filesgood for the business of anyone who sells such devices :) I just noticed in the specs that it states that the three streaming formats are PCM, MP3 and FLAC, so it must do native FLAC decoding in the players. http://www.linksysbycisco.com/US/en/products/DMC250 -- JJZolx Jim JJZolx's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
JJZolx;382384 Wrote: http://www.linksysbycisco.com/US/en/products/DMC250 Looks like there's an ethernet port. I imagine number of zones and controllers may be limited primarily by your network and possibly the processing power of your server, since none of the boxes run the server itself (unlike Sonos). Lots of networking info but audio? What DAC does it use? How does it handle replay gain tags? Do the class G amplifiers stay powered all the time like Sonos? -- upstatemike upstatemike's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=6409 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
JJZolx;382392 Wrote: I just noticed in the specs that it states that the three streaming formats are PCM, MP3 and FLAC, so it must do native FLAC decoding in the players. http://www.linksysbycisco.com/US/en/products/DMC250 Page 36 clearly states what is supported on the player, and FLAC is not there (mp3, AAC-LC, WMA9, and WAV).On another manual it states FLAC is transcoded...just poke around. The system supports FLAC, but not over the air -- two different topics. -- jt25741 SB3-AR Masters Coax - PS Audio DLIII (Cullen L3) - Cardas Golden Reference XLR - Sim Audio P-5 - Cardas Golden Reference XLR - Sim Audio W-5 - Cardas Golden Reference Hi-Mid,PS Audio Xstream Plus Low- Magnepan 3.6R jt25741's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=8645 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
jt25741;382482 Wrote: Page 36 clearly states what is supported on the player, and FLAC is not there (mp3, AAC-LC, WMA9, and WAV).On another manual it states FLAC is transcoded...just poke around. The system supports FLAC, but not over the air -- two different topics. May be Streamed in PCM, MP3, or FLAC Sound like a conflict in the documentation. They obviously have a lot of documentation spread around, from data sheets to user manuals, to the web pages for 1/2 dozen new products. What would you take this to mean: Format Supports up to 24-Bits, May Be Streamed in PCM (raw), MP3 (transcoded), or FLAC(transcoded) If you say that the FLAC is transcoded to something else, then I suppose you'd have to say that MP3 is as well. No two documents on the site are the same. There's mention of Ogg and Real in some of them, but no mention in others. Just sounds like a poor job of documentation. -- JJZolx Jim JJZolx's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
JJZolx;382392 Wrote: I just noticed in the specs that it states that the three streaming formats are PCM, MP3 and FLAC, so it must do native FLAC decoding in the players. http://www.linksysbycisco.com/US/en/products/DMC250 I wonder if it supports gapless playback. This is the sort of detail that is easily missed by companies whose core competencies are not audio related. That will irritate the hell out of audio enthusiasts that spend tons of money on this system. And how quickly do you think Cicso will address those types of issues? Probably no where nearly as quickly as Logitech. Yes, competition is good, but I doubt very much that I'll be pining for this Cisco setup to replace my slim devices/logitech setup. -- maggior Rich - Setup: 2 SB3s, 1 duet, 1 receiver. SuSE 11.0 Server running SqueezeCenter 7.2.1 (7.3 had dropouts for me) and SqueezeSlave. MusicIP has been turned off temporarily while I move to a lossless version of my library. http://www.last.fm/user/maggior maggior's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=9080 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
maggior;382514 Wrote: I wonder if it supports gapless playback. This is the sort of detail that is easily missed by companies whose core competencies are not audio related. That will irritate the hell out of audio enthusiasts that spend tons of money on this system. And how quickly do you think Cicso will address those types of issues? Probably no where nearly as quickly as Logitech. Yes, competition is good, but I doubt very much that I'll be pining for this Cisco setup to replace my slim devices/logitech setup. We'll all just have to wait and see what this system really supports. But in the past, Linksys multimedia products have been very simply focussed as far as interoperability. If it is supported by Windows(like Media Extender technology), or maybe a Mac it is supportable. Native FLAC, OGG, or APE in the players would be a refreshing but unlikely departure and proof of a renewed commitment and focus. -- jt25741 SB3-AR Masters Coax - PS Audio DLIII (Cullen L3) - Cardas Golden Reference XLR - Sim Audio P-5 - Cardas Golden Reference XLR - Sim Audio W-5 - Cardas Golden Reference Hi-Mid,PS Audio Xstream Plus Low- Magnepan 3.6R jt25741's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=8645 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
Don't forget that Cisco has also owned Scientific Atlanta, the set-top box maker, for the past couple of years. Cisco is making a serious push into the consumer market, and they want to have a whole house solution, based on Cisco products. Their goal is to increase consumer media consumption, especially video, so that network infrastructure companies will need to buy more Cisco routers and switches to handle the load. That's where they make the real money. -- corbey corbey's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=11286 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
This should be a good development for everyone. The streamer market is still so small that new entrants are likely to expand the market rather than cannibalize other manufacturers. Re; pricing, it would be unlikely that the launch prices would hold. Comparisons at the moment may not be accurate. My first impression on seeing the specs and pictures was that it wasn't really adding too much to the party and certainly not enough take me away from the Duet. The 'N' cabability is interesting and Slimdevices has been a bit slow in adopting this. The handset looked a bit big as well. It'll be interesting to see the Mk2. -- HectorHughMunro HectorHughMunro's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=16514 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
No native FLAC in the player? Transcoding necesssary.802.11n will be needed even more pushing around uncompressed filesgood for the business of anyone who sells such devices :) -- jt25741 SB3-AR Masters Coax - PS Audio DLIII (Cullen L3) - Cardas Golden Reference XLR - Sim Audio P-5 - Cardas Golden Reference XLR - Sim Audio W-5 - Cardas Golden Reference Hi-Mid,PS Audio Xstream Plus Low- Magnepan 3.6R jt25741's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=8645 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
jt25741;381856 Wrote: No native FLAC in the player? Transcoding necesssary.802.11n will be needed even more pushing around uncompressed filesgood for the business of anyone who sells such devices :) Nah, they just compress that silly lossless file :) -- Jonnio Jonnio's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=18575 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
jt25741;381856 Wrote: No native FLAC in the player? Transcoding necesssary.802.11n will be needed even more pushing around uncompressed filesgood for the business of anyone who sells such devices :) Yes, that is a major problem. -- HectorHughMunro HectorHughMunro's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=16514 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
HectorHughMunro;381942 Wrote: Yes, that is a major problem. I've played around with streaming Flac as WAV/PCM on my server and can easily stream to four sync'd Squeezeboxes while doing this (never tried more than that). Typically, Flac compression only nets about 30-40% in increased storage space or bandwidth, so if your wireless network can't handle streaming uncompressed PCM, it's probably pretty marginal to begin with. -- JJZolx Jim JJZolx's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
JJZolx;381944 Wrote: I've played around with streaming Flac as WAV/PCM on my server and can easily stream to four sync'd Squeezeboxes while doing this (never tried more than that). Typically, Flac compression only nets about 30-40% in increased storage space or bandwidth, so if your wireless network can't handle streaming uncompressed PCM, it's probably pretty marginal to begin with. Wifi tends to be quite variable -- sometimes strong, with good throughput, sometimes not so strong.The maximum numbers for n/g/a are highly idealized and rarely even closely obtained. For instance... a microwave oven goes on in the house, the APs negotiate a much lower transmission speed during this time. Saving 30%-50% of the bandwidth necessary to move a file around can mean buffers don't deplete during these typical drop-offs etc. Granted it doesn't take much to stream CD WAV files around uncompressed, and if that is all you are doing it is likely either hit or miss. But once you put a couple PCs in the house on the same wireless network, a NMT streaming DTS SD Video those bits of bandwidth become even more scarce.Keep in mind all these wireless technologies are simplex as well. Even a relatively good signal negotiated at 20mbps compared to the state of the art network gear from 12 or more years ago (100mb Switched full duplex) giving full duplex 200mb bandwidth per station, the difference can be huge. -- jt25741 SB3-AR Masters Coax - PS Audio DLIII (Cullen L3) - Cardas Golden Reference XLR - Sim Audio P-5 - Cardas Golden Reference XLR - Sim Audio W-5 - Cardas Golden Reference Hi-Mid,PS Audio Xstream Plus Low- Magnepan 3.6R jt25741's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=8645 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
thomsens;380852 Wrote: .. Whoever thought Cisco doesn't get it, really doesn't understand Cisco. They have been putting audio and video on IP for years and have been preaching network based applications forever. The only real question is their ability to deliver a compelling and user friendly consumer level product. And frankly, they are right - to the average person, their music is locked up in iTunes/iPod and/or striped across multiple computers in the home - just like Cisco suggested. Those with properly tagged NAS based libraries are definitely in the minority - just not on this forum.. I have *NO* experience with Cisco, I do have experience with Linksys products. Cisco may well get the design aspect, but they had better seriously ramp up customer support for such consumer devices. If they rely on the Linksys model for customer support of consumer products then this entire line is DOOMED! :) -- toby10 toby10's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=12553 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
Maybe instead of viewing Cisco as a competitor Logitech/SD should try and partner with them to incorporate SqueezeCenter in their Media Hubs and media networking components to ease the home and internet networking hurdles. I think this would benefit both companies. I have no idea about the processor's specs of the Cisco Media Hubs, but if it's powerful enough and the possibility of putting SC on them exists... then SD folks should approach Cisco. Using Cisco hubs as the hardware server and their home network devices as the backbone can only be a good thing. The more the merrier. Keep your friends close, but your potential enemies closer. Apple allowed its mortal foe's operating system to coexist within their hardware. What I call, so far, the biggest digital Trojan Horse. I'm not an Apple fan, but that strategic move by Steve Jobs was brilliant. -- tamanaco tamanaco's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4620 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
toby10;381020 Wrote: I have *NO* experience with Cisco, I do have experience with Linksys products. Cisco may well get the design aspect, but they had better seriously ramp up customer support for such consumer devices. If they rely on the Linksys model for customer support of consumer products then this entire line is DOOMED! :) That may well be the case. Cisco is one of the best in terms of enterprise support, but that support model is too expensive for the consumer. Perhaps they've continued to use the original Linksys approach for those products which is inadequate (I've never called them honestly). In my view, forums are the primary technology support approach these days, but I suppose I lot of people still call the support line. I honestly haven't done that for cheap gear ($100) for years. They need to have an active support community for sure. I guess my main thought is that this product set and the launch of the new site appear to be Cisco trying to re-engergize their approach to the consumer. It remains to be seen if it will be effective, but it's impressive so far. -- thomsens thomsens's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=1352 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
I think these are some really cool products, but as has been said this is a direct shot at Sonos, not as much at squeeze. This will likely go one of two ways - it will be a decent hit and grab some amount of the market share or help grow the market. OR It will be a huge flop - introducing all of the products at once like this they better have them COMPLETELY worked out. People won't put up with growing pains when they have thousands invested in the equipment, and there won't be any cool new products to bring people back in to try again. This gives them one shot with the majority of their people. If they don't make it count the products are doomed. -- Jonnio Jonnio's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=18575 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
My instinct tells me that this is a positive development for the Squeeze line. I would bet that Logitech/SB rarely loses potential sales to competitors. Because, there are few competitors and few sales. This is a niche market that isn't very large or well known. Greater success must come from increased mass market awareness and penetration. The geek and audiophile crowds (that is, those audiophiles who accept digital music, many do not) are too small to provide much incremental market opportunity. Most of the market only knows about ripping CDs to put them on iPods. That's why iPod docking stations are everywhere and outsell SBs - people have their music on their iPods. It's a dead-end street, they don't realize there is more that can be done. Cisco will contribute to more noise. If, being pessimistic, Cisco wins most of the market growth and SB only gets 20 percent of the increase, that's still 20 percent of a sales opportunity it wouldn't have had otherwise. But I don't think that will happen, I think this product line is very competitive now and as-is. -- Goodsounds Goodsounds's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=14201 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
I agree above this being a positive development for the market, though it doesn't appeal much to me as an existing SB user. Assuming they deliver as promised it does look like a better Sonos than Sonos (feature by feature-- especially the iPod dock). More interesting (for me), Cisco's approach suggests that the rest of the market sees value in a player design subject to fewer constraints than the existing SB2+ derived products-- maybe something with more CPU, more RAM, more flash, a USB port, and Controller-like open (well, mostly) environment? Exciting changes from a consumer standpoint! -- syburgh syburgh's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=14239 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
Engadget Linksys by Cisco Wireless Home Audio System Unveiled http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/07/linksys-by-cisco-wireless-home-audio-system-unveiled/ Linksys announces Media Hub NAS http://www.engadget.com/2009/01/07/linksys-announces-media-hub-nas/ -- tamanaco tamanaco's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4620 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
Threads merged. The product looks pretty impressive though pricey. Very thorough and complete, and an emphasis on lossless. I don't understand the Player product though. You control it through an IR remote, but no display on the remote or the player? So how do you know what you're playing, and how do you change it? Also we'll see how well this is supported as time goes on. What formats are supported, and will this ever change? Continuously evolving the product is an advantage Logitech will likely have over this - Cisco/Linksys has so many products that many simply get lost and Linksys abandons them after a year or two. How many new routers has Linksys introduced in the past, say, 3 years, and how many are still sold and supported today? -- Mark Lanctot Current: SB2, Transporter, Boom (PQP3 - late beta) Stored: Boom (PQP1 - early beta), SBC (beta - no battery) Sold: SB3, Duet Mark Lanctot's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=2071 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
Thanks for the merge. Yes competition is good. It is going to be interesting how all this flushes out over the coming year(s). I would like to see the ipod integration hit the squeeze. -- goody goody's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=22405 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
$27 billion in cash Be very afraid. -- JJZolx Jim JJZolx's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
Just looking at what they are selling and the price of it makes me wonder. Looks nice and simple until you ask the question - how do you get your music onto the thing? Once its there how do you back it up? Don't expect there to be a raid option either - Linksys released a NAS without raid in the last year. If your music is ripped and in digital format doesn't that make an iPod dock redundant? Then there's the audio quality. I have been buying audio products from Logitech for many years, Cisco - not so much. The thing that got me interested in the SB was the software. It has evolved continually because of input from these forums. I have no doubt it will continue to evolve. There is also no doubt Logitech has realized the value of community in development of new SB products and features. It has yet to be seen if Cisco will figure that out. -- tedfroop Good judgement is the result of experience ... Experience is the result of bad judgement. -- Fred Brooks tedfroop's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=3011 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
The player is just an expensive SqueezeBox Receiver. I looked over at the Sono's forum and there are many postings about this topic with pretty good detail about the Cisco product. There is a general concern on the Sonos forum about how this might impact thier product of choice. From what I see, choosing a Linksys or Sonos is not much different other than a few features here and there. Even with the Cisco product in the market, if I were to choose what product I was to purchase (Linksys, Sono's, Squeeze), I would still go with my first choice, the Squeeze products. Cost was a major factor as it did not cost much to get started with the Squeeze set of products. The touch screen is a nice touch but is it worth the extra money? The competition is always good in the tech business, it just leads to more inovative ideas. I for one still would like to see Logitech/Slim come out with a receiver + amp device plus perhaps some bundled speakers. Maybe the boom with out the speakers. That way we get an amp (increase the power out) plus a way to use it if there is no remote handy. This would get me pretty excited. -- froth froth's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=11878 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
I like the Squeezebox, but wireless N sure does sound nice given my occasional drops and inability to use a ethernet solution in my particular case. Wish the product or could be upgraded to N ... -- jbart1965 jbart1965's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=18344 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
After looking through the product announcements, the really amazing thing is how coherent the product line is right out of the door. Just goes to show what can be done with sufficient capital resources. The iPod dock and the CD player are just a couple of interesting parts of the system. Having the ability to distribute music directly from CD or an iPod have been requested from Slim/Logitech forever. There's little question that they're aiming higher than the market Logitech is now aiming for with their own streaming products. Sonos is the one that should be worried. -- JJZolx Jim JJZolx's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
Howard Passman;379675 Wrote: You'll have to learn IOS or use the world's worst GUI, then you'll have to beg for a service contract. Of course support will be decent, but if you think Squeezebox Wiki is bad, wait until you see CISCO's help pages. Or you could pay to take classes and get (insert name of their music prduct here) certified. And of course it will only work with their routers :-) All joking aside, CISCO doesn't get it. It being whatever product they're fiddling with. They don't even try to understand consumers. They lead and if you want it, you follow. I don't see any improvements or changes in Linksys since they purchased it and that's probably good. I can wait. Howard Keep in mind that Cisco doesn't try to understand consumers because it hasn't ever sold to consumers until the purchase of Linksys. The devices running IOS are enterprise geared. They've slowly moved into the SMB (small medium business) space, but Cisco's view of SMB is typically much larger than the layperson would think. That old router mentioned in a previous post was intended to be configured, installed and managed by a service provider. Not the end user. Who cares how complicated it may seem if you never have to see how complicated it is? As for something only working with Cisco routers you need to realize that Cisco supports more open standards than anyone else in their respective product lines. Now, onto this new entry. I have no idea what it will be or if it will be any good. But, I do know that Cisco has the resources to bury Logitech and Sonos both. Simply because they have the cash on hand to purchase both companies. Ideally, we will see a lot of great competition leading to better products all around. So as you can all tell I am a very biased Cisco fan. Mostly because I make my living selling it (full disclosure). Rather than rip on them or anyone else, I'll sit back and watch what happens. And listen to my audio streaming through my squeezebox across a rock solid Cisco powered network. -- rainjacks rainjacks's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=21999 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
JJZolx;380732 Wrote: After looking through the product announcements, the really amazing thing is how coherent the product line is right out of the door. Just goes to show what can be done with sufficient capital resources. The iPod dock and the CD player are just a couple of interesting parts of the system. Having the ability to distribute music directly from CD or an iPod have been requested from Slim/Logitech forever. The completeness of this system does point out one problem with the Logitech/SlimDevices solution, namely the inability to one-stop shop. With the Cisco thing out there, you can buy everything but the router/WAP in one box, and the router/WAP comes under the Linksys brand as well. With Logitech/SlimDevices, you have to provide the computer and run the server (unless you want to be SqueezeNetwork only, but that's not the way I roll). I'd really like to see Logitech/SlimDevices put a plug and play server in a box. Maybe as simple as rebadging a RipServer, but it would enable them to hit whole new markets that they don't already have. They could easily go from that to various plug-and-play bundles. Just plug these into your network, do a little configuration, and insert your CD's. There's little question that they're aiming higher than the market Logitech is now aiming for with their own streaming products. Sonos is the one that should be worried. Always a funny thing to see written, given that the top end product in the Logitech line is $2000, and the $300 ones are no slouches Eric -- kolding SqueezeBox 2 - Rotel RSX-1056 - Totem Acoustic Dreamcatchers SqueezeBox 3 - Rotel RX-1052 - Vandersteen 1B's SqueezeBox Boom SliMP3 and Squeezebox 1 - Retired kolding's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=31 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
I wonder if the amp with the CD player built in can actually rip music
to the server. Now that would be a darn good idea.
--
JadeMonkee
2x squeezebox classics {1x wired, 1x wifi} | squeezecentre v7.3.1 |
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raidiator 4.14 | 1gb hynix hymd512m646cfp8-j | 2x 1tb samsung hd103uj }
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Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
With Cisco's money, they can hire any interior architect they want. I'm extremely impressed by the launch and agree with JJZolx on how complete the solution is. SD and Sonos have been at it for some time and this is basically 1.0 for Cisco. I've always thought they have a good chance at making waves due to their presence in the home with Linksys, complete understanding of the power of the network, and the fact that they generally do not try to lock in the customer with proprietary technology like Sony, MS and Apple try to do. Whoever thought Cisco doesn't get it, really doesn't understand Cisco. They have been putting audio and video on IP for years and have been preaching network based applications forever. The only real question is their ability to deliver a compelling and user friendly consumer level product. And frankly, they are right - to the average person, their music is locked up in iTunes/iPod and/or striped across multiple computers in the home - just like Cisco suggested. Those with properly tagged NAS based libraries are definitely in the minority - just not on this forum. That's where it really gets interesting though...Linksys products were basically contract designs and this product line appears to be one of the first types of products coming out with real Cisco involvement in the engineering of the actual product. If you look through the web site, they go to great lengths to establish a cool factor and the fact that Cisco actively participated in creating these products. I like my SD products for now and they are probably safe as long as TP dominates the quality/price category, but for lower-end audio, I'm thinking the space is getting exciting. SqueezeCenter is the real gem in SD's possession for me, but it's still somewhat complex for the average person. If Cisco reduces the complexity, gives you better CD and iPod access and is a one-stop-shop, then it's very compelling. -- thomsens thomsens's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=1352 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
Apologies if this had been posted before, but could not find the link in this thread after a quick glance: http://www.linksysbycisco.com/US/en/promo/Promotion-WHA -- furonfour furonfour's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=17114 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
I keep hearing more and more about this product. I guess we will know more very soon. But here are some of the points I have heard about. - Wireless N network - Receiver + amp available w/ color display - Receiver w/ no amp w/ color display - Device with built in receiver / amp / speakers / ipod dock / color display (boom type device) - Wireless Controller with display - Receiver w/ no amp about same cost as Squeezebox classic - Potential of integration other media media offerings from the cisco branded companies (streaming video, HD PVR etc.) No idea as to what kind of server drives this thing or anything more technical at this time. Of course, you can offer all the features in the world but if they do not work well, then what is the point. If Cisco throws bags of money at this they might end up with a decent product. Might also end up with a poor product. Time will tell. I will be watching as I am most interested in products with built in amps and good integration with other multi media sources. I like the Squeeze devices I have and have no real complaints. The price was right and the quality great. -- froth froth's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=11878 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
You'll have to learn IOS or use the world's worst GUI, then you'll have to beg for a service contract. Of course support will be decent, but if you think Squeezebox Wiki is bad, wait until you see CISCO's help pages. Or you could pay to take classes and get (insert name of their music prduct here) certified. And of course it will only work with their routers :-) All joking aside, CISCO doesn't get it. It being whatever product they're fiddling with. They don't even try to understand consumers. They lead and if you want it, you follow. I don't see any improvements or changes in Linksys since they purchased it and that's probably good. I can wait. Howard -- Howard Passman .and still waiting for extra cradles.. ...and waiting... ...and waiting... Howard Passman's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=16674 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
Don´t Cisco own Kiss? And they hardly made the impact they should have there. But the more competition the merrier, I agree. -- James_B James_B's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=11309 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
tamanaco;377352 Wrote: Let's not forget that on the foundation (legacy) laid down by these old suits is where all these new digital SlimYahGoo (pun intended) is built on. As said above, having Cisco join the party is a good thing. Smart Cisco boxes for home entertainment derived from enterprise strength Cisco boxes (routers... etc) that properly prioritize and distribute the entertainment pockets is a very, very good thing. Ciscos track record in entering consumer markets is more than bad. Does anyone remember their DSL-Routers (owned one, 8 years back or so)? Also, they have been pretty successful in running down any takeovers in this area they have made. Heard anything from Linksys recently? No, I think Cisco entering that market is good news for Logitech since it may mean they do away with one of their competitors. I agree they lay the foundations on which we build a lot of things, but groundworks people don't necessarily make for good interior architects. -- pippin --- see iPeng at penguinlovesmusic.com pippin's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=13777 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
Funny how Cisco seems to have forgotten previous product such as LInksys WMA11B music picture streamer or the KIss networked video. -- bpa bpa's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=1806 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
pippin;377632 Wrote: I agree they lay the foundations on which we build a lot of things, but groundworks people don't necessarily make for good interior architects. True... but I rather live in an ugly house than in one with a cracked foundation and bad plumbing. I also agree that Cisco has not been successful in the consumer market or at properly assimilating the small companies they acquire... Linksys is a good example... but who knows... maybe this time they'll bring something innovative to the home market. -- tamanaco tamanaco's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4620 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
tamanaco;377720 Wrote: True... but I rather live in an ugly house than in one with a cracked foundation and bad plumbing. I also agree that Cisco has not been successful in the consumer market or at properly assimilating the small companies they acquire... Linksys is a good example... but who knows... maybe this time they'll bring something innovative to the home market. Well, my point was: it's different businesses, a bit like IBM making gaming consoles. Agreed, I woudln't want my backbone made by Logitech, but that Cisco DSL-Router I owned sucked, too -- pippin --- see iPeng at penguinlovesmusic.com pippin's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=13777 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
#8220;Today your content is very tightly tied to a device,#8221; Mr. Hooper said. #8220;Your music is tied to your iPod LOL. So not much sign the Cisco 'suits' get it...I reckon they'll need to acquire someone with a track record. Sonos? -- amcluesent amcluesent's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10286 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
As a consumer who spends a good portion of his time working with my home audio/video streaming, I say the more the merrier. The greater the variety the better the chance we'll overcome DRM restrictions and iTunes style lock-in. That's why I was heartened by iLuv offering an Internet streaming radio for ~140$ recently. Streaming digital entertainment is still in enough of an infancy that everyone joining really helps. Regardless of how lame Cisco's entry will likely be. :P -- sander sander's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=10737 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
Re: [slim] NYTimes - Cisco to enter the Home Digital Entertainment Market
Let's not forget that on the foundation (legacy) laid down by these old suits is where all these new digital SlimYahGoo (pun intended) is built on. As said above, having Cisco join the party is a good thing. Smart Cisco boxes for home entertainment derived from enterprise strength Cisco boxes (routers... etc) that properly prioritize and distribute the entertainment pockets is a very, very good thing. -- tamanaco tamanaco's Profile: http://forums.slimdevices.com/member.php?userid=4620 View this thread: http://forums.slimdevices.com/showthread.php?t=57371 ___ discuss mailing list discuss@lists.slimdevices.com http://lists.slimdevices.com/lists/listinfo/discuss
