Re: [Elecraft] SWR Readings:Differences

[Brian Alsop]

Add to the list.
The PL-259 has an undersized center pin.  I've seen these.

73 de Brian/K3KO

On 9/3/2014 14:20, Mel Farrer via Elecraft wrote:

Good list, and here at least is one more.


# PL-259 male or female connector made of some non-solderable material.  Looks 
like it soldered but isn't. Cheap import.

Mel, K6KBE





On Wednesday, September 3, 2014 6:57 AM, Guy Olinger K2AV  
wrote:



Here is a small, non-inclusive list of things that can be bad with a coax
run to the house. I have personally seen all of them at some time or place.
Some big names, too.

1) At either or both ends, the shield was not soldered to the PL259 shell,
and the connection has dwindled to a small percentage of the shield due to
gradual destruction of the fine wire touching points.

1a) Ditto for the center conductor to the hollow center conductor pin of
the PL259. Amazing how many PL259's are not soldered in a hurry to 'hear
how it works". I've done it myself and forgotten I didn't. For years.

2) "Balun" is cheep junk, or burned up/melted/shorted
turns/cracked/destroyed core, now junk.

3) Coax on tower is not high quality, and does not have it's weight
supported. The stretch has changed the separation of shield and center
conductor, and the characteristic impedance has shifted, introducing an
unwanted transformation into the equation.

3a) Coax is very old, but still "looks OK" even though it isn't. Much coax
material undergoes very slow (even decades) chemical changes which can
change characteristics. Wide frequency and TDR scans of coax into opens,
shorts, checked 50 ohm and 200 ohm terminations are only way to check for
still-OK-ness.

4) Water has invaded the coax, from a nick, tear or critter bite in the
jacket, or non/poorly sealed coax connector, and capillary action has
wicked along it's entire length. This can be hundreds of feet in the worst
of cases. The loss-added coax does not necessarily stay at 50 ohms Z zero.
I have seen coax shields green (copper oxide) their entire length.
Interestingly the practical outcomes of this extra loss was initially most
often blamed on the transceiver.

5) Coax has been wrapped around a pipe by rotator torque. See 3)

6) Coax has had something heavy dropped on it. See 3)

7) Coax shield was only ground path for induced current for a close
lightning strike. (Usually a direct strike smokes coax beyond any
confusion.)

8) PL259 shell was not pliers-tightened and has worked loose, gradually
producing burned points of connection.

9) Long coax run was laid tight in summer heat, and stretched in the
winter. See 3)

10) Constant flexing of coax finally breaks the center conductor. After
that, "connection" is strange.

11) Unsupported aerial coax over-weighted by ice and stretched, pulled out
of connectors, see 8).

12) Coax is innocent and it's really the antenna.

13) Operator in fact does not know how to operate the instrument or how to
interpret readings.

14) Short lengths of coax and "other boxes" are ignored, and those in fact
contain the problem.

15) Measuring instrument has been damaged or was defective from the
factory.

15a) Measuring instrument is cheep junk.

16) Operator was "told" what the trouble was by a "trusted source" and is
having a lot of trouble thinking outside of the "trusted box" when the
trusted source was in fact in error for this instance.

17) Dummy load used to calibrate/provide 50 J zero comparison or reference
termination is not 50 J zero for any number of reasons, including the likes
of several seconds of QRO on a 2 watts worth of 50 ohms. Didn't turn black
on the outside, but the resistor innards were already toast. Didn't *look*
burned, so must be fine, right?

18) Dummy load while accurate at DC has significant reactive components at
RF.

19) Coax was not 50 ohms from the get-go (try 56). But it looks good so it
must be good. And the seller had a nice looking web page and the best price.

20) I need to wrap this up, but I know I'm not remembering something really
juicy, which will come to mind after I hit the send button.

A group of Olde Pharte hams sitting around a table in a Lunche Jointe, came
up with a napkin version of this that had over 40 items on it. The napkins
were used for the inevitable outcome of ribs, and so was lost to posterity.
One of these included a male F connector that had not had its threads
grooved into the shell. This ignominious occurrence is not mentioned above,
because it could not ever be part of a "working" setup. But it was amazing
how many other things were blamed for "not fitting", including calls to an
equipment maker about female chassis connectors, before the lack of threads
was noticed.

Good luck to all and 73,

Guy K2AV




On Wed, Sep 3, 2014 at 12:18 AM, Vic, K2VCO  wrote:


If your line is lossless (it isn't) you would expect the same SWR
readings anywhere along the line. With practical lines that have some
loss, the SWR should be LOWER farther away from the antenna. You are
getting the opposite result.

Re: [Elecraft] [K3] Noise Blanking, all-mode squelch- any strategies for settings?

[Brian Alsop]

Something missed in this discussion.

When you change a NB/NR setting, don't expect a instantaneous change.
Count to five and then conclude whether a setting change helped or not.

In some past posting, this was pointed out by Elecraft.

73 de Brian/K3KO

On 7/30/2014 15:45, Jim Brown wrote:

On 7/29/2014 2:58 PM, Fred Jensen wrote:

Noise blankers do exactly what their name implies ... when a sharp
noise pulse comes along, they simply punch a hole in the signal [mute
the receiver] for a short period.  The adjustable things are generally
the length of the "hole" and some form of threshold setting that
determines when it decides it's a noise pulse.


Fred has given you a great explanation and excellent advice. I'll add a
bit of clarification. A Noise Blanker does NOT do much (if anything) on
broadband random noise. Rather, it works mostly on various forms of
man-made noise. Much of the noise I hear comes and goes, and/or is
different on different bands.

As Fred has made clear, less is more -- when I use the NB, I often do a
long push on the knob to enter setup mode, and reset both the DSP and
the IF to those best compromise minimum values that reduce the noise
without chopping too much of the audio.

It also helps to RTFM, which has some advice about what the DSP NB does
and what the IF NB does.

73, Jim K9YC
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Re: [Elecraft] OT GENERAC generators

[Brian Alsop]

I have a gasoline powered unit.  Dismissed propane because of the cost 
of the tank/tank rental and the minimum yearly fee for propane --whether 
you need any or not.  These costs ended up being too high for a few days 
a year of generator use.  We're in the sticks and don't have competition 
in the propane market.


I suggest one look into the details of how propane is sold in your area 
before buying a propane fired generator. YMMV


73 de Brian/K3KO

On 7/26/2014 05:41, Lynn W. Taylor, WB6UUT wrote:

Propane, in a sealed tank under pressure, tends to have good shelf-life.

Gasoline, stored in a vented tank, tends to turn to varnish.

A tank of diesel will support bacteria growth, which clogs the filter
(when you need it most).

If we're talking about an emergency generator that is used infrequently,
then propane is a really good choice.

73 -- Lynn

On 7/25/2014 6:40 PM, Acbross via Elecraft wrote:

A friend of ours had a propane powered generator in his cab over.
Didn't like it at all because it ran off the same tank as his heater
and stove. Biggest problem with it was propane has less power per
volume than gas.


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Re: [Elecraft] K3 power out - key down

[Brian Alsop]

I'm not a QRP fan for DX.  However, one can definitely copy a weaker 
signal with JT65.  No matter how much power you have, you can't work 
them if you can't copy them.  It seems like the magic combo is 1500 W 
and JT65 on both ends.  I think guys are resorting to this on 160M to 
try and squeeze out a new one or two.


The five minutes or so per QSO is a bummer though.

73 de Brian/K3KO

On 7/20/2014 21:09, Bill Turner wrote:

ORIGINAL MESSAGE:  (may be snipped)

On 7/20/2014 12:36 PM, Edward R Cole wrote:

The software provides about 10-dB better SNR (making the 10w JT65
signal equivalent to 100w CW).


REPLY:

I find an 8877 provides about 22 dB SNR over ten watts. :-)

73, Bill W6WRT

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Re: [Elecraft] Unhook *ALL* connections before Lightning storm

[Brian Alsop]

This sounds like good advice.  However, every connector socket on my K3 
is populated, ditto the computer, ditto the KPA500, ditto the KAT500.


Pulling all wires when there is a potential storm threat is totally 
impractical.  Even if I did, I'm sure some of the connectors would 
simply not last.


I suspect others have similar situations.

73 de Brian/K3KO

n 7/15/2014 10:58, Bill Blomgren (kk4qdz) via Elecraft wrote:

  And another warning: Nearby (like next door) lightning will be picked up by 
ANY long wires which end up acting as antennas.

I did computer repair in Florida.  I had a time share/multitasking system in a 
law office that had thousands of dollars in damage after the building next door 
got hit.

The terminals were plugged into serial lines back to the central system.  So 
were the printers. (Think: 6 processor unix type system with a network inside 
the box)

The tops of ICs were all over the guts of every printer, terminal and the computer let 
out the magic smoke.  ALL of the terminals and printers had been "unplugged" - 
but not from the RS232 connections.

The ONLY way to isolate the rig is totally unplug the thing: antennas, power 
supplies and so on... same with your computers.

Down in Florida, there are code required surge MOV's in every circuit breaker 
panel.  All they do is eliminate something close by.  They get vaporized by a 
direct hit.


KK4QDZ - Now with Extra Class Priv's, and a tiny KX3 to enjoy them!



  From: Keith Trinity WE6R 
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Sent: Monday, July 14, 2014 8:19 PM
Subject: [Elecraft] Unhook *ALL* connections before Lightning storm


Hi all, I work on K3's all day and would like to advise/remind folks
that lightning comes in through ANY path it pleases, not just the antenna.

Time and time again folks say they unhooked their antenna but the
lightning took out the DSL modem, computer and K3 via the RS232 port!
Anything connected is a potential path...
Be safe! '73
Keith WE6R

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Re: [Elecraft] KAT500 Firmware Revisions for MAC OS X

[Brian Alsop]

Guys,

I apologize if my posting offended anybody.

This is not such a far fetched question.  In fact my son-in-law has such 
a household.  It made video chats with our 4 year old grandson a real 
problem.  He won't even use SKYPE and insists on FACETIME.


So how was this resolved?  He loaned me a 1 kilobuck MAC laptop
Now we can do FACETIME too.

73 de Brian/K3KO


On 6/1/2014 22:59, Scott Manthe wrote:

There should be no reason that Ted should have to borrow a PC in order
to update the firmware in his KAT500. The OSX utility should have the
same functionality as the Windows version. In any case, there's also no
reason he should have to put up with a lack of courtesy when asking a
question on the reflector.

Ted- Did you try searching for the firmware manually?

73,
Scott, N9AA


On 6/1/14 6:35 PM, Brian Alsop wrote:

Are WINDOWS PC's banned from your household?

Certainly you know somebody who owns a WINDOW's laptop.

If the situation were reversed and I needed an APPLE computer for a
few minutes to install new firmware, I'd beg or borrow one.

73 de Brian/K3KO

On 6/1/2014 22:28, Dauer, Edward wrote:

The current firmware version for the KAT500 is apparently MCU 1.67.
To access it requires the KAT500 Utility version 14.2.20.  That,
however, seems to be available only for Windows.  The latest utility
version for Mac OS X on the website is 1.14.2.1.  When I run that,
the latest firmware version it finds is 1.41.  Unfortunately 1.41
seems not to give the KAT500 the capability of tracking the frequency
setting from the K3 as it tunes - with F/W 1.41 retunes only on the
first dit.  Am I doing something wrong?  Is there a way to get 1.67
using a Mac (short of installing Windows on the Mac)?

Thanks for whatever advice might be offered . . .

Ted, KN1CBR


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Re: [Elecraft] KAT500 Firmware Revisions for MAC OS X

[Brian Alsop]

Are WINDOWS PC's banned from your household?

Certainly you know somebody who owns a WINDOW's laptop.

If the situation were reversed and I needed an APPLE computer for a few 
minutes to install new firmware, I'd beg or borrow one.


73 de Brian/K3KO

On 6/1/2014 22:28, Dauer, Edward wrote:

The current firmware version for the KAT500 is apparently MCU 1.67.  To access 
it requires the KAT500 Utility version 14.2.20.  That, however, seems to be 
available only for Windows.  The latest utility version for Mac OS X on the 
website is 1.14.2.1.  When I run that, the latest firmware version it finds is 
1.41.  Unfortunately 1.41 seems not to give the KAT500 the capability of 
tracking the frequency setting from the K3 as it tunes - with F/W 1.41 retunes 
only on the first dit.  Am I doing something wrong?  Is there a way to get 1.67 
using a Mac (short of installing Windows on the Mac)?

Thanks for whatever advice might be offered . . .

Ted, KN1CBR
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Re: [Elecraft] The Old 15 Meter - or 21 Mc - Band

[Brian Alsop]

I wonder if the probability of being an future avid DXer depended upon 
whether one was first licensed near a sunspot peak or sunspot minimum?


For me the working of a WH6 on 40M just before school was the clincher.

Ruined a bunch of FT-243 xtals trying to grind them down for near the 
Novice 15 and 40 M band lower edges.


Worst DX: "Working" the FCC when supposedly on 80M but bandswitch on 
40M.  So being crystal controlled didn't mean you couldn't operate 
outside the Novice bands...


73 de Brian/K3KO

On 5/26/2014 14:31, Dauer, Edward wrote:

Me too!  For me it was 1957 - the peak of the best sunspot cycle ever.
Every morning before going to school I was in my cellar ham "shack"
working my way through the rest of the world on 21.1+ with a DX-20, a
dipole, an HQ-100, and a QTH right at the ocean's edge.  DXing like
shooting fish in a barrel.  Great fun.  The Novice license in those days
was valid for one year and NON-renewable.  It was one year, then up or
out.  (I was KN1CBR then, became K1CBR later, then went back to KN1CBR
when vanity calls became available, purely as a matter of nostalgia.)
These days I am recapturing some of it - but not the technical primitivity
- with my KX3 and indoor dipole (at 21.02 Mhz) in an urban condo in
Denver.  Still great fun!

Ted, KN1CBR






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Re: [Elecraft] K3: PSK31 will not allow Split operation.

[Brian Alsop]

There is also RIT or XIT-- provided the split value isn't huge.
Also with subrx, one can do split just fine in PSK.

73 de Brian/K3KO

On 5/13/2014 13:18, MontyS wrote:

If you want to run PSK31 split, use LSB or USB modes, being sure to turn



off the compression and any equalization.

Monty K2DLJ

Ah, but maybe SPLIT for PSK31 is on on the list of things to come later…
or have I missed something?

—Bob W1XT, Sun City West, Arizona



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[Elecraft] MDS practical measuring?

[Brian Alsop]

It was time to drag out the test gear and give my older K3 a going over.

One thing of interest was Minimum Detectible Signal.

There is a WIKI definition for it but the equation doesn't help me a bit.

I just thought I'd attach a calibrated signal generator and keep 
reducing the level (for a 500 Hz bandwidth) until I couldn't hear it.
That doesn't seems subjective since the signal generator is a constant 
tone and not information to decode.


Then I tried looking at Spectrogram and defining a minimum S/N ratio 
which would define MDS.  The MDS values derived this way were much lower 
for a 6 dB S/N ratio.  In fact, I couldn't hear the signal at this S/N 
ratio!  The integration time constant used for averaging clearly was 
helping with detection.  So what time constant would be appropriate for 
normal CW?


How indeed is MDS measured quantitively?

73 de Brian/K3KO


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Re: [Elecraft] QRQ CW

[Brian Alsop]

I wonder where Dave got this idea from. I'd like to suggest it is 
wishful thinking.


The contest winners clearly are superior ops and will use whatever speed 
benefits them.  Likely higher speeds early in the contest and lower 
speeds later.  Not a fixed speed throughout.


I don't know why there is such an aversion to admitting that many people 
can copy more than 40 WPM.  There is no law of physics or biology 
preventing it.  After all people routinely talk and 300 WPM.  If one can 
decode those utterances at 300 WPM why not simple dot/dash CW at 40 WPM?


73 de Brian/K3KO

On 5/1/2014 16:22, Jim Brown wrote:

On 5/1/2014 9:15 AM, dave wrote:

But I suspect that the winners do not regularly run high speed.


N6TV won CW Sweepstakes this year using K3s at the W7RN super-station.
Bob usually steams along at 30-34 WPM.

73, Jim K9YC
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[Elecraft] QRQ CW

[Brian Alsop]

There was a thread on QRQ CW here.  Also a query about does anybody send 
QRQ CW.


For 2013 CQ WW contest N6TV did an analysis.
The answer was 30+ WPM average.
The top speeds were in excess of 50 WPM!

See: http://cqww.com/blog/?p=302

With all the K3's being used by contesters, it doesn't appear that 
contesters are running into QSD problems at 30+ WPM.


73 de Brian/K3KO


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Re: [Elecraft] adjacent antennas and potential radio damage

[Brian Alsop]

Guys,
There is no substitute for a measurement.  There is no global answer to 
how close is too close or how much power is too much power.


Measurement process is simple:
1) Run one rig at 1 to 5 watts
2) Look at the S-meter on the other.
3) Scale the results upward by adding the number of dB to full power.
If this results in something > 80db over S9 then be concerned.  Consider 
RX protection.


Do the same with the other rig transmitting.
You might consider doing this on all bands.

73 de Brian/K3KO


On 4/16/2014 17:08, Mike Harris wrote:

Quite so.

Forty years ago the FT101 had a front end protection circuit that
included a light bulb.  When I was in the Antarctic, location doesn't
really matter, my antennas were reasonably close and when I keyed the
main TX at 1500W the rear of the '101 would flash with the keying. Never
suffered a front end failure.

I have a circuit diagram dated 2010 for an "RX Protector", which
unfortunately doesn't offer any authorship detail, it looks similar to
the '101 circuit.  If anyone wants a copy let me know.

If the idea of a bulb and a couple of back to back diodes and big
signals worries you then perhaps making this as a piece of test
equipment to be used as a level reality check and then taken out of the
signal path is possibly the answer.

Regards,

Mike VP8NO

On 16/04/2014 12:40, Charlie T, K3ICH wrote:

Connect a "grain-of-wheat" light bulb across the unused coax and
gradually increase transmit power.

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Re: [Elecraft] Side Effects of QRQ On The K3

[Brian Alsop]

Not quite so.  Increase your TX DLY to 25 ms and listen to your CW.
At 8ms (default), it behaves as you say.  Significantly higher values 
cause QSD.  It doesn't matter if you're using the internal keyer or an 
external keyer.


73 DE Brian/K3KO

On 4/12/2014 22:35, Fred Jensen wrote:

On 4/12/2014 1:07 PM, David Cole wrote:


Could you expand a bit on the choppy CW thing?  I am a new K3 person,
and I just bought my K3.  All this talk about choppy CW makes me a bit
apprehensive. If I use a normal Vibroplex iambic paddle, and send well
am I going to have a problem, or is this something about using the KBD
option?


Short answer: No and you can stop being apprehensive about it. :-)

You will plug in your paddle [and/or external keyer and/or computer],
and you will be sending clickless CW with full-QSK.  Had the subject not
come up [again] on this email list, the odds that you'd ever encounter
and notice its effects are vanishingly small unless you are a 60+ WPM
full QSK operator.  I operate in a lot of CW contests with N1MM driving
a WinKeyUSB at between 30 and 35 WPM, KPA500, full QSK, QRQ option off.
  No one has ever given me a QSD.  When I've specifically asked friends
[good CW ops] to evaluate my keying, they tell me it's great.  My "fist"
is another matter of course. :-)

It's another example of how you have to filter a list like this one. The
variety of K3 owners is vast, and some push the limits in various ways
and at those limits, they start seeing things the vast majority of us
never do or ever will.  They tend to discuss them here, which is fine.
Those using the K3 as the IF for transverters up to the microwave ranges
are very concerned about frequency stability, and often discuss it on
this list too.  Your K3 will be rock-solid for you on HF, no need for
apprehension over that either.

73,

Fred K6DGW
- Northern California Contest Club
- CU in the 2014 Cal QSO Party 4-5 Oct 2014
- www.cqp.org

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[Elecraft] K3 TX TEST Mode via Software

[Brian Alsop]

I'm using the K3 for measurements and want it to be in the TX TEST mode.

The software uses SWH18.  However, it is a toggle.  So if "*hit" happens 
and you have to run the data collection software again, it returns the 
K3 to the normal mode.


I've scanned the manual looking for a command which does the same but is 
not a toggle.  NADA.


Any workarounds?

73 de Brian/K3KO



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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft compatible WX station

[Brian Alsop]

This begs the question.  The original poster said he was getting ready 
for the hurricane season.  Given what you say, I doubt the Davis 
anemometer cups would survive a near hurricane blow.


Ditto with my Oregon scientific.

So maybe the original postee has to reassess just what he wants from him 
WX station.  It looks like he needs something more robust than a hobby 
grade wx station.


However, my first concern when a hurricane is approaching is how robust 
is my house, the escape route, environment and the surrounding trees!


73 de Brian/K3KO

On 3/1/2014 22:50, mcduf...@ag0n.net wrote:



I am also interested in this topic. I am in the process of getting a Davis
Vantage Pro and wonder where this should be located relative to proximity
to an antenna?


I'm running mine mounted right at the top of the tower, within a few feet of the
tribander (see picture on QRZ page).  I've never had any RF issues with it, but
this one sure is built cheap!  It doesn't take much hail to break a cup.  They
are VERY fragile.  I've never even given thought to the station causing
interference to my rigs, and I've never run into any.  I worry more about
interfering with the instruments, but haven't seen any.

Gary
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[Elecraft] Left field P3 addition?

[Brian Alsop]

It occurred to me that the P3 might be made into a decent 200KHz wide RF 
spectrum analyzer (note analyzer, not display) with the addition of N 
trace averaging (n, infinite).


I use my K3 as test gear as well as for operating.  With an elementary 
sweep generator, K3/ROCKY almost works as an RF spectrum analyzer if it 
only ROCKY could average sweeps.


SPECTROGRAM/Sweep generator does work fine if you're interested in AF 
stuff.  SPECTROGRAM has a user settable integration time.  Compared to a 
noise generator, one can pick up another 20db of "skirts" with a clean 
swept signal.  I've found sweeping in the range of 1-10 seconds over 
sizable chunks of spectrum quite practical. Integration times of 10-100 
seconds could produce quite very useable display.  Substitute SPECTRUM 
LAB for SPECTROGRAM and things really get interesting.  One can dump of 
the Fourier Transform bin data in sub-Hz intervals if you want for plot 
comparisons or math manipulation.


Since the P3's IF can be set to anything between 455KHz to about 30 MHz, 
one wouldn't need the K3.  Just a test jig, sweep generator and P3. 
Sweep generator signals are way more than adequate to drive the P3.


Goofy idea?

No. I don't have a P3 presently.

73 de Brian/K3KO


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Re: [Elecraft] 270V ERR KPA500

[Brian Alsop]

Or the interlock hardware is installed wrong.

73 de Brian/K3KO

On 2/12/2014 17:28, bill conkling wrote:

Mine did this right from the start.  Trace the 270 volt wire from PS go amp 
module, thru the Z bracket.  Somewhere the 270 is going low.  Mine had a bad 
cap on the circuit board near the 270 V connector.

... bill nr4c

Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE DROID

DGB  wrote:


I'm getting this error from my amp when I turn it on and set it in the
OPER mode. Then it requires shutoff via the rear switch to shut it off.
I've been running it off 120v and has been working fine.

What do I need to look for?

73 Dwight NS9I
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Re: [Elecraft] Crystal Filter Offset in 4.81, What does it mean?

[Brian Alsop]

I should also point out that his shows no measurable effect on the 250 
and 200 Hz filters. 400Hz and wider are impacted.


On 2/5/2014 14:37, Brian Alsop wrote:

Guys,

I ran a sweep of the filter response with a 400 Hz filter at nominal 0.2
and 03.

I have the plot but can't post here.

In short the left side of the filter response is moved to the right. The
right side moves slightly inward as well.

The net effect is a narrowing of the filter -6db bandwidth and also a
small shift in center frequency.

Here are the numbers:

BW (-6dB) =380 Hz, center 485 Hz @ 0.2
BW (-6db) =300 Hz, center 508 Hz @ 0.3

It appears if you do this, you might also have to adjust the filter
offset to bring the center of the passband back to the nominal pitch value.

73 de Brian/K3KO

On 2/5/2014 13:40, Mike K2MK wrote:

I installed the 4.81 beta firmware and I am able to change the crystal
filter
offset as described in the firmware notes. I can hear slight
differences in
a CW signal between 0.1, 0.2, and 0.3 KHz. What I don't understand is
what
does it mean. Previous to this release I would have assumed that the
crystal
filter is centered on my chosen CW pitch suggesting a 0 KHz offset. If I
choose one of the 3 offsets am I now listening (and transmitting)
slightly
off zero beat. Why would I want this? Wouldn't I also want a 4th
choice of 0
KHz?

Explanations in layman's terms would be appreciated.

73,
Mike K2MK



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Re: [Elecraft] Crystal Filter Offset in 4.81, What does it mean?

[Brian Alsop]

Guys,

I ran a sweep of the filter response with a 400 Hz filter at nominal 0.2 
and 03.


I have the plot but can't post here.

In short the left side of the filter response is moved to the right. 
The right side moves slightly inward as well.


The net effect is a narrowing of the filter -6db bandwidth and also a 
small shift in center frequency.


Here are the numbers:

BW (-6dB) =380 Hz, center 485 Hz @ 0.2
BW (-6db) =300 Hz, center 508 Hz @ 0.3

It appears if you do this, you might also have to adjust the filter 
offset to bring the center of the passband back to the nominal pitch value.


73 de Brian/K3KO

On 2/5/2014 13:40, Mike K2MK wrote:

I installed the 4.81 beta firmware and I am able to change the crystal filter
offset as described in the firmware notes. I can hear slight differences in
a CW signal between 0.1, 0.2, and 0.3 KHz. What I don't understand is what
does it mean. Previous to this release I would have assumed that the crystal
filter is centered on my chosen CW pitch suggesting a 0 KHz offset. If I
choose one of the 3 offsets am I now listening (and transmitting) slightly
off zero beat. Why would I want this? Wouldn't I also want a 4th choice of 0
KHz?

Explanations in layman's terms would be appreciated.

73,
Mike K2MK



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Re: [Elecraft] K3 FSK D low tones?

[Brian Alsop]

Thanks to Jim, W0EB.

It's already in there.

Just change the pitch while in the FSK-D mode.

In N1MM, if you're using a DXP38 modem, it is simple to change the mark 
setting to match.


Works!  Now the audio signals are not attenuated by many dB.

73 de Brian/K3KO


On 2/3/2014 18:46, Brian Alsop wrote:

2KHz is getting a bit above my hearing range.

I wonder if there is a way to do low tone FSK-D @1275 Hz mark.
Not interested in AFSK.

I suppose the center frequency of the filter would have to be reset as
well as the dual tone filter.

73 de Brian/K3KO


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[Elecraft] K3 FSK D low tones?

[Brian Alsop]

2KHz is getting a bit above my hearing range.

I wonder if there is a way to do low tone FSK-D @1275 Hz mark.
Not interested in AFSK.

I suppose the center frequency of the filter would have to be reset as 
well as the dual tone filter.


73 de Brian/K3KO


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Re: [Elecraft] Update on KAT500/KPA500 firmware tweaks

[Brian Alsop]

Yippie.  Can't wait!  S&P on bands like 160M is problematic.

73 de Brian/K3KO

On 1/31/2014 17:07, Wayne Burdick wrote:


We're also working on a new feature that will allow the K3 to retune
the KAT500 automatically, in receive mode, each time the VFO is
moved. This feature would be turned on/off in a K3 menu entry
(default would be off). By "retune," I mean that the KAT500 would
select an LC combination that had been previously stored for the
applicable band segment--the same thing that happens when the tuner
measures the transmit frequency.

Wayne N6KR




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[Elecraft] FS XG-2

[Brian Alsop]

Assembled. Make offer.
73 de Brian/K3KO


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[Elecraft] Fwd: Weird K3 SSB problems fixed

[Brian Alsop]

Please ignore this.  I found a 300 mv SDR audio signal on line in.

I don't understand how it got into the mic input-- it's only selected 
that way for DATA A.  I thought the mike/line in inputs were isolated 
from one another.


Guess not.  Removing the line-in signal solved the problem.

73 de Brian/K3KO


 Original Message 
Subject: Weird K3 SSB problems fixed
Date: Wed, 25 Dec 2013 19:27:10 +0000
From: Brian Alsop 
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net

Thanks to tips from several people of the list this problem was solved.

It turns out that a scope showed there was a 300 mv audio signal on line
in.

Line in was not selected and I don't understand how it got to the mic
input. Bleed through?  I normally use line in for PSK in the data A mode.

Never the less, I had shot myself if the foot.  The SDR RX/Rocky
connected to the K3 normally has its audio sent to a sound card with no
speaker/earphones connected.  Today I listened to it a bit on a
different sound card.  Resetting the sound card choice, I'd sent it to
the SC used for PSK transmit tones.

73 de Brian/K3KO

On 12/25/2013 17:28, Brian Alsop wrote:

I was using the K3 today.  The VOX kept cycling to transmit and back
with no voice input.

Sounded like an easy problem to fix.  Just touch up the antivox.

Nope.

Listening in the monitor, there is a rushing sound with clicking (like
fans in the background or something with a superimposed woodpecker).
Clearly that spurious noise is what was tripping the vox off/on.

Next removing the mike plug, the rushing sound was still there.

With no mike input where is it coming from?  Unlikely to be RFI since it
is there at 1 watt.

Setting the mike gain to zero and compression doesn't fix it.
Compression level does substantial increase or decrease it.

Any suggestions?

73 de Brian/K3KO



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[Elecraft] Weird K3 SSB problems fixed

[Brian Alsop]

Thanks to tips from several people of the list this problem was solved.

It turns out that a scope showed there was a 300 mv audio signal on line 
in.


Line in was not selected and I don't understand how it got to the mic 
input. Bleed through?  I normally use line in for PSK in the data A mode.


Never the less, I had shot myself if the foot.  The SDR RX/Rocky 
connected to the K3 normally has its audio sent to a sound card with no 
speaker/earphones connected.  Today I listened to it a bit on a 
different sound card.  Resetting the sound card choice, I'd sent it to 
the SC used for PSK transmit tones.


73 de Brian/K3KO

On 12/25/2013 17:28, Brian Alsop wrote:

I was using the K3 today.  The VOX kept cycling to transmit and back
with no voice input.

Sounded like an easy problem to fix.  Just touch up the antivox.

Nope.

Listening in the monitor, there is a rushing sound with clicking (like
fans in the background or something with a superimposed woodpecker).
Clearly that spurious noise is what was tripping the vox off/on.

Next removing the mike plug, the rushing sound was still there.

With no mike input where is it coming from?  Unlikely to be RFI since it
is there at 1 watt.

Setting the mike gain to zero and compression doesn't fix it.
Compression level does substantial increase or decrease it.

Any suggestions?

73 de Brian/K3KO



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[Elecraft] Weird K3 SSB problems

[Brian Alsop]

I was using the K3 today.  The VOX kept cycling to transmit and back 
with no voice input.


Sounded like an easy problem to fix.  Just touch up the antivox.

Nope.

Listening in the monitor, there is a rushing sound with clicking (like 
fans in the background or something with a superimposed woodpecker).

Clearly that spurious noise is what was tripping the vox off/on.

Next removing the mike plug, the rushing sound was still there.

With no mike input where is it coming from?  Unlikely to be RFI since it 
is there at 1 watt.


Setting the mike gain to zero and compression doesn't fix it. 
Compression level does substantial increase or decrease it.


Any suggestions?

73 de Brian/K3KO



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[Elecraft] N-GEN,XG2 available

[Brian Alsop]

These have been displaced by newer gear.
Assembled and fully functional.
Make reasonable offer.

73 de Brian/K3KO


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Re: [Elecraft] P3 Loss of signal

[Brian Alsop]

Charlie,

Your information about BNC pin size diameter used to be true but not so 
anymore.


These days the BNC center pin size is the same for 50 and 75 ohms.
The quote below is from 2004 so this change took place a long time ago.
See:
http://forum.allaboutcircuits.com/newsgroups/viewtopic.php?p=157284

73 de Brian/K3KO

PostPosted: Wed Aug 11, 2004 11:25 pmPost subject: Re: BNC centre 
pin size for 75 and 50 ohm sockets 	

"Fred"  schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:4119d8e2$0$206$db0fe...@news.zen.co.uk...
Quote:
I have access to some 50 ohm BNC sockets. However it must mate to a 75
ohm
plug. Since we are talking about video frequencies here I'm not worried
about mismatches etc.

What are the dimensional differences between the 50 and 75 ohm sockets?

Can anyone point to dimensioned drawings of both types including pin size
etc?


Hello Fred,
I tried with Google: bnc 75 50 difference

The first hit.
http://www.levitonvoicedata.com/support/technotes/tech_note_detail.asp?tnID=175

Original text from this page follows.

--- begin ---

Difference between 50 Ohm and 75 Ohm BNC Connectors

What are the physical differences between 50 Ohm BNC connectors and 75 
Ohm BNC connectors?
There are a few physical differences. The 75 Ohm plug’s center pin has 
the same diameter in the rear as in the front mating interface area. 
Whereas, the 50 Ohm plug’s center pin has a thicker diameter in the rear 
area where it is crimped.


Both plugs have the same pin size in the mating area. Regarding the
dielectric on each, the 75 Ohm connector’s dielectric is made of Teflon
which has higher impedance properties than Delrin. The 50 Ohm connector’s
dielectric is made of Delrin.

Finally, the main physical difference is that the 75 Ohm plug does not 
have extended dielectric around its outer spring fingers.



On 11/20/2013 14:59, Charlie T, K3ICH wrote:

When comparing similar size cables or connectors, the one with the
smaller inner diameter will be the highest impedance.

73, Charlie k3ICH







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Re: [Elecraft] K3: Receive Ant Question

[Brian Alsop]

FB Don,

I see the *'s .  At first viewing, they look like flyspecks on my 
printout.


Thanks.

73 de Brian/K3KO
On 11/13/2013 23:42, Don Wilhelm wrote:

Brian,

There is a "*" next to that "spark gap" and a note on the diagram which
defines the "*" as a COR.
Yes, there also is a spark gap.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 11/13/2013 6:29 PM, Brian Alsop wrote:

Hi Don,

Correct me if I am wrong.

The back panel diagram of the K3 shows two BNC's labed RX antenna.  I
thought the thread originator was referring to this input path for a
RX antenna. It's what I use for RX antenna input.

I see "spark gaps" on the inputs on those pages you quote.  I don't
see a carrier operated relay for the above BNC's.  If it is there. I
don't see it on the schematics.  The relay that is there is to
complete the rx/tx circuit when the BNC's are not in use. At least
that's what I can glean from the circuit.

The aux antenna BNC didn't come till later when the subrx and
diversity reception became a reality.  It does have a real relay that
goes click, click with too much RF.  It also has a spark gap protector.

73 de Brian/K3KO





On 11/13/2013 22:56, Don Wilhelm wrote:

All the antenna configuration diagrams in the K3 manual show a COR on
the RX ant input.
See pages 41 through 44.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 11/13/2013 5:43 PM, Brian Alsop wrote:

Guys,

I thought he said RX antenna input.  The COR is on the aux ant input.
There is no COR on the RX antenna input (it's not needed, I think.)


73 de Brian/K3KO



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Re: [Elecraft] K3: Receive Ant Question

[Brian Alsop]

Hi Don,

Correct me if I am wrong.

The back panel diagram of the K3 shows two BNC's labed RX antenna.  I 
thought the thread originator was referring to this input path for a RX 
antenna. It's what I use for RX antenna input.


I see "spark gaps" on the inputs on those pages you quote.  I don't see 
a carrier operated relay for the above BNC's.  If it is there. I don't 
see it on the schematics.  The relay that is there is to complete the 
rx/tx circuit when the BNC's are not in use.  At least that's what I can 
glean from the circuit.


The aux antenna BNC didn't come till later when the subrx and diversity 
reception became a reality.  It does have a real relay that goes click, 
click with too much RF.  It also has a spark gap protector.


73 de Brian/K3KO





On 11/13/2013 22:56, Don Wilhelm wrote:

All the antenna configuration diagrams in the K3 manual show a COR on
the RX ant input.
See pages 41 through 44.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 11/13/2013 5:43 PM, Brian Alsop wrote:

Guys,

I thought he said RX antenna input.  The COR is on the aux ant input.
There is no COR on the RX antenna input (it's not needed, I think.)


73 de Brian/K3KO



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Re: [Elecraft] K3: Receive Ant Question

[Brian Alsop]

Guys,

I thought he said RX antenna input.  The COR is on the aux ant input.
There is no COR on the RX antenna input (it's not needed, I think.)


73 de Brian/K3KO

On 11/13/2013 22:28, Mike K2MK wrote:

Hi Steve,

It is separated by a relay but that doesn't mean that you can't damage
internal circuitry. If you hear relay clicking sounds while you are
transmitting then you have tripped the protective COR (carrier-operated
relay). If this occurs then you need to reducer power or separate your
antennas more, and/or provide external protection.

The diagram on page 42 of the K3 manual illustrates the presence of the
COR(s).

73,
Mike K2MK



K4FJ wrote

Am I correct in assuming that the Rec Ant input is disconnected from the
main receiver input upon transmit by way of a relay?  If so, can I further
assume that connecting a beverage, or other receive antenna, to the
Receive Ant input will cause no harm to the main receiver upon transmit?
In other words, is a relay enough protection?

I ask because I would like to rule out needing an external protection
device when using a beverage antenna.  I run full legal power.

Thanks in advance.

73, Steve, K4FJ

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[Elecraft] KAT500 ability to...

[Brian Alsop]

Can be bypass mode be programmed into the KAT-500 on a segment basis?

I would only need the KAT-500 for the upper parts of the phone bands.

Rather than having to remember to turn off/on the KAT-500 when moving 
up/down, I'd rather have it automatically "remember".  Ditto bypassing 
itself automatically in CW segments.


73 de Brian/K3KO


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Re: [Elecraft] CW Pitch Resolution

[Brian Alsop]

Hi John,

I read that article too.  Personally I think it is a lot of bunk. It 
assumes perfect hearing.


Where ones sweet spot is depends upon his hearing and hearing 
degradation.  The closest pitch to 432 Hz is 429.97 Hz on my K3.
Some people's sweet spot may be 700 Hz-- since 432 Hz may be 20 db down 
from there!


There was a link somebody posted a year or so ago.  It could be used 
determined how much pitch difference one can detect.  For most people is 
>3 Hz.  For piano tuners and musicians with perfect pitch it is likely 
to be less.  You can also try using the K3's fine tuning and tune in a 
carrier.  The increase or decrease the K3's frequency by 3Hz and see if 
you can detect any change.


Thus most won't perceive any difference between 429.97 and 432 Hz.
If you can, than congratulations on your perfect pitch.

73 de Brian/K3KO

On 10/13/2013 14:03, John Seney wrote:

Hi Folks:

The CW pitch resolution in my K3 seems to be 10 Hz per step. A recent article 
in QST
spoke of 432 Hz as being a sweet spot frequency based on musical notes. A quick 
search
on frequencies of real musical notes shows hardly any are at integer values.

Note -- Freq -- Wavelength

D4  293.66  117.
D#4/Eb4 311.13  111.
E4  329.63  105.
F4  349.23  98.8
F#4/Gb4 369.99  93.2
G4  392.00  88.0
G#4/Ab4 415.30  83.1
A4  440.00  78.4
A#4/Bb4 466.16  74.0
B4  493.88  69.9
C5  523.25  65.9
C#5/Db5 554.37  62.2
D5  587.33  58.7
D#5/Eb5 622.25  55.4
E5  659.26  52.3
F5  698.46  49.4
F#5/Gb5 739.99  46.6
G5  783.99  44.0
G#5/Ab5 830.61  41.5
A5  880.00  39.2

Could the firmware be changed for experimentation with this or is there an 
easier
way to accomplish it with RIT or filter offsets?

73

John - WD1V



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[Elecraft] K3 pitch change with filter selection

[Brian Alsop]

Guys,

There has been quite a bit of discussion about use of very wide filters 
for HF narrow signal mode operation here recently.  If QRM gets to be a 
problem the fallback position is to narrow the filter.


Keep in mind the following.  The AF pitch you will get for a fixed 
frequency signal is a function of the filter.  The amount of pitch shift 
between filters can be 3 Hz at times.  How the decoder handles such a 
step function change in pitch, I don't know.


Here is some data (CW mode, pitch =500):

filter widthOFFSET  IF FREQ pitch change
400 Hz  08.215 MHz  defined to be zero
200 -.83 8.214170  -3.6 Hz
250 -.02 8.214980  -2.5
1800  0  8.214450  -0.9
2.7 -.85 8.213200  -1.2

The IF frequencies are nominal. They reflect the filter offset and other 
considerations. In reality, actual frequency produced by the synthesizer 
board and its AD9834 synthesizer IC and may differ.  One reason may be 
the programming 32 bit word is inaccurate.  I ran into this with another 
synthesizer where it was impossible to calculate an precise 32 bit 
programming word with 32 bit IEEE floating point math.  One gets about 
25-26 bits of accuracy in the floating point operations results. There 
are certain lucky numbers which produce exact results. Like here, the 
observed differences were in the 0-5 Hz range.  In that case, I was able 
to augment the accuracy through error look up tables and reduce the 
error to under 0.5 Hz.  The math coprocessor used did not permit 64 bit 
math.  Numerical studies showed that 64 bit math would have completely 
solved the problem.


To see if the errors were similar to the numerical experiments, I used 
the 250 Hz filter and varied the filter offset between -0.050 and +0.050 
in 0.01 steps.  The result was a sawtooth pitch error curve ranging from 
-2.5 Hz to zero. (Numerical studies showed a sawtooth error form). There 
are also certain "magic" numbers which produce zero error. Based on 
this, I'm guessing the K3 math used for the programming word calculation 
is 32 bit floating point.  The resultant synthesizer 32 bit programming 
word error is most likely producing the observed effect.


The problem is the amount of the error is a function of your filter 
offset. One has no idea how much difference there may be as filters are 
switched.  If this is a problem for JT9 users, there is a solution for 
the wider filters-- simply tweak the offset in 0.01 steps till the pitch 
difference between filters disappears.


I then looked at the linearity of the 1Hz tuning steps suspecting the 
same sawtooth effect to show up.  It does.  2-3 Hz departures from 
linearity exist.


I suspect the small band to band differences in accuracy (calibrated at 
one frequency and off at another) are also due in part to synthesizer 
output frequencies.


All of this is irrelevant to most users.  I'm not sure if JT9 users are 
impacted or not.


How many other amateur rigs can say they do this well?  I am always 
amazed that the almost lab-grade performance of the K3.


Keep in mind of don't have super lab grade equipment here.  However the 
HP8675B generator is locked to Rb and has a very clean stable signal. 
SpectrumLab, as employed, is able to resolved pitch differences of 
<<.1Hz.  The K3 is using the high stability oscillator.  YMMV


I don't claim to be an expert in all of this stuff.  If the conclusions 
are off base, please correct me.


73 de Brian/K3KO





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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] Filters for mixed JT65 and JT9 HF

[Brian Alsop]

I wonder if someone who has significant WSJT-X experience would like to 
pontificate of the real benefit of squeezing out another KHz of 
bandwidth out?


It seems to me on HF one is simply inviting in more signals which can 
potentially de-sense the RX.  That wipes out the benefit of the weak 
signal mode.  I really doubt these band segment is devoid of users of 
different high power modes.


Maybe WSJT-X is magic


73 de Brian/K3KO

On 10/8/2013 15:34, Joe Subich, W4TV wrote:


Bob,

On 10/8/2013 10:28 AM, Bob wrote:
 > Hi Joe,
 >

I disagree with your adamant public statement as the -10 dB points
even with the filter center shifted up to 2000 Hz are at 300 Hz and
3800 Hz -- That's 3500 Hz edge to edge, not 4000.


I believe your measurements are incorrect.  Using an XG3 at -73 dBm
for a signal source and an audio spectrum analyzer connected to the
Line Out of K3 S/N 622 with an *unmodified* DPS board and original
transformers on the KIO3, the audio is -4 dB at 300 Hz/-15 dB at 200
Hz and -5dB at 4000 Hz/-14 dB a 4200 Hz.

Put another way, the measured -6dB points are 263 - 4016 Hz (BW[6 dB]
= 3753 Hz) and measured -10dB points are 222 - 4142 Hz (BW [10dB] =
3920 Hz).  Those numbers are close enough to 4 KHz for me to be adamant
that the K3 works very well in "broadband mode" with either the FM or
AM filters in WSJT-X.

Moving the LF limit down to 50 Hz as in the case of SSB isn't going to
make a significant difference because the transformers have a good deal
of effect there.  Duplicating the LF measurement in SSB with LO=0.00
moves the -10dB point down by only 50 Hz (170 Hz).

That the K3 is down less than 6dB at 4KHz is the key - could it be a
bit better, yes but at what cost?  Audio frequencies below 300 Hz have
little value for WSJT-X receive (they're more than -1KHz from the old
1270 Hz "0 dF") and even with the roll off WSJT-X performs very well
at -200 Hz.  Split handles any transmit bandwidth issues in any case.

73,

... Joe, W4TV


On 10/8/2013 10:28 AM, Bob wrote:

Hi Joe,

I disagree with your adamant public statement as the -10 dB points even
with the filter center shifted up to 2000 Hz are at 300 Hz and 3800 Hz --
That's 3500 Hz edge to edge, not 4000.  This has also been confirmed by
Lyle himself, who agrees that widening the bandwidth 400-600 HZ would
be a
good thing to do.

I've also confirmed this with two other K3 owners.  If your DSP
response is
wider then consider yourself lucky because others don't experience the
same
thing.

73, Bob, WB4SON


On Mon, Oct 7, 2013 at 4:51 PM, Joe Subich, W4TV 
wrote:



On 10/7/2013 4:39 PM, Bob wrote:


Just be aware that current DSP firmware in the K3 limits the receive
bandwidth to something around 3400 Hz. So even if you have a wider
filter, like the 6 KHz AM filter, you will not be able to utilize the
full 4 KHz bandwidth of WSJT-X for JT65/MT9 modes.



Absolutely *not* true ... I regularly receive 200 to 2400 Hz in DATA A
with the FM (or AM) filter.  It is simply a matter of adjusting the
High and Low cut frequencies to 200/4200 or shift/Width to 2200/4000.

I have been doing that ever since K1JT offered me a pre-release look
at the "wideband" decoding support in WSJT-X with no issues other than
some CAT problems with the interface to CI-V Commander from DXLab
Suite which K1JT and AA6YQ resolved quite quickly.

73,

... Joe, W4TV



On 10/7/2013 4:39 PM, Bob wrote:


Just be aware that current DSP firmware in the K3 limits the receive
bandwidth to something around 3400 Hz.  So even if you have a wider
filter,
like the 6 KHz AM filter, you will not be able to utilize the full 4
KHz
bandwidth of WSJT-X for JT65/MT9 modes.

Lyle is aware of this issue and it is on his list to work on in the
future.

And even if you are in Split mode, rest assured that you know exactly
where
you are transmitting -- on the exact audio offset indicated on the
display.
   Operating Split is the way to go.  The only drawback I've seen is
that
WSJT-X does nothing to make sure the K3 is in the Split mode, it just
assumes it is.

73, Bob, WB4SON
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Re: [Elecraft] P3 Feature Request - Transmit sampling

[Brian Alsop]

What if one defined the IF of the P3 to be at some PSK frequency and 
connect a loop of wire to it's RF input?  Put the loop on the desk.


There might not be enough resolution to clearly see anything but gross 
PSK signal infidelities.


73 de Brian/K3KO





On 9/24/2013 16:40, Edward R Cole wrote:


I don't have a P3, so my curiosity is only academic.

The "sampling function" being referred to, would bring a low power
sample of transmit power to the P3?  This does not seem very difficult
to "roll your own" sampler.  I gather the P3 has the needed RF ckts to
receive RF and demod it, or is that also needed?

I use LP-Pan with my K3. The LP-Pan only works in Rx so not really
usable for analyzing the K3's own transmissions.  It will work to look
at the KX3, of course.  AFAIK the K3 will not work in duplex mode.

I also have a SDR-IQ, which makes a superb spectrum analyzer for freq.
up to 30-MHz. The SDR-IQ only needs a small antenna to "sniff" enough RF
to display the spectrum as wide as 190-KHz or down to http://www.kl7uw.com
dubus...@gmail.com
"Kits made by KL7UW"
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Re: [Elecraft] KAT500 tune on qsy configuration

[Brian Alsop]

A lot of the need for a tuner here would vanish if the KPA500 could 
handle a 2.5:1 SWR.  Phone->CW band excursions could be tolerated 
without exceeding that limit.   I've looked at the voltages and currents 
involved.  At 500 watts, they don't intractable.


I wonder if the incremental cost would be around the price a KAT500?
Call it a KPA500+.

73 DE Brian/K3KO

On 9/21/2013 17:00, Dick Dievendorff wrote:

Initially the tuner did not retune on in-band QSY. Then we added in band memory recall 
tune on in-band QSY. We thought most of our owners would want that, but I guessed that 
there might be a good reason for a few users to prefer the old behavior. So I provided a 
mechanism to turn off the "improvement".
In cases where you are not using a KPA500 and a retune requires a couple of 
transmissions, why abandon an acceptable ATU setting if you move a bit down the 
band unless poor SWR is actually encountered?

Dick, K6KR


"Why would you NOT want Memory Recall Tune on QSY checked?"

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Re: [Elecraft] KAT500 tune on qsy configuration

[Brian Alsop]

Dale,

I agree.

Autotuners for many of us who do frequent fast search and pounce can 
indeed slow things up.  The last thing you want when trying to pounce on 
a rare one (before the mob arrives) is to have the amp off line-- even 
for half a second.


The best tuner is none.

A bunch of fixed component tuning networks, one per antenna might be a
practical alternative if one can live with the bandwidth.  L networks
are easy and pretty cheap to make.  I have an manually tuned L network
box here that I use to find out what values of L/C are needed.  I think
those who are fortunate enough to have a KAT500 might be able to use it
to determine needed values.  Can the KAT500 values of L/C and whether an
antenna side or rig side cap is required be read out?

If one has engineered a complex system of antennas like yours, then why 
not also engineer a flexible, programmable solution that automatically 
handles the needed fixed networks as a function of user input (if any), 
mode, antenna and frequency.  Tune the antennas for the most frequently 
used mode and switch in networks when required for other 
modes/frequencies.  This is quite practical (for HF) with even a el 
cheapo PIC and some relays.


73 de Brian/K3KO

On 9/21/2013 16:00, Dale Putnam wrote:

The memory remembers what the setting/tuning is per freq... but
doesn't take care of the second, third or fourth wire antenna being
fed on the same freq.The ant1 - ant2 works well for just two antennas
on the same freq, but say you have a directional set of LB, and a
directional set of HB (split at 20m,for this example) with a 6 pole
coax switch outboard towards the antennae from the tuner... then the
memory doesn't do anything but slow you down in antenna changes.

Have a great day,


--...   ...-- Dale - WC7S in Wy



, "Why would you NOT want Memory Recall Tune on QSY checked?" Seems
like having it checked is the fastest way to get to the new tuner
settings if it has tuned up on that frequency before. And if it
hasn't tuned up on that frequency before, it will if you are in Auto
mode.




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Re: [Elecraft] RIGblaster Advantage for Serious Digital Modes, with KX3?

[Brian Alsop]

Joe,

There easy work around to this-- like adding a series resistor between 
AF output and earphones.  Some earphones have built in volume controls.


I use the non-fixed output of the K3 all the time for RTTY receive. 
Having some control over the audio into the decoder is sometimes an 
advantage.


Would you refuse to work a DXpedition that used such a digital setup?

73 de Brian/K3KO

On 9/17/2013 19:24, Joe Subich, W4TV wrote:


Both of those features are a must for serious digital operation.
The independent, fixed level receive output means there are significant
"level conflicts" between operator needs and the needs of the digital
software.  It also represents a real potential for hearing damage if
the digital software requires a high audio level and headphones are
plugged in with the level too high.

> 73,

... Joe, W4TV




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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft SSB Net Announcement

[Brian Alsop]

Just for curiosity, what is the purpose of this Elecraft net?

Is any technical information exchanged?

73 de Brian/K3KO

On 9/15/2013 13:07, Charlie T, K3ICH wrote:

I know it would take a few more net control volunteers, but the Collins
Collectors Association net on 14.263, Sundays at 2000Z usually has at




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Re: [Elecraft] K3 NR needs improvement

[Brian Alsop]

Actually you ought to start with the DSP first.  IF NB is a last resort 
because it can generate trash when a strong signal shows up outside the 
passband.


73 de Brian/K3KO

On 9/5/2013 23:39, Cady, Fred wrote:

_I have a pretty high line noise problem here on six meters and the NR doesn't 
make much of a dent in it. However when I tried the noise blanker it worked 
great -- 10_12 DB of noise reduction as shown by wsjt. Try it. Start with the 
IF blanker first and then add in some dsp.

Also, make sure your agc isn't activating on the noise. If your audio noise 
level increases if you turn agc off, set the THR a bit higher.


73,
Fred ke7x

___
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net [elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On 
Behalf Of Roger de Valle [ro...@genette.biz]
Sent: Thursday, September 05, 2013 4:03 PM
To: 'Elecraft List'
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 NR needs improvement

I live in a high noise environment for 40 and 80m and find I can never get a
useful result with the noise reduction on the K3, subsequently I never use
it. I find that my other rigs finish up far more comfortable to listen to on
these frequencies where noise is prevalent. In an otherwise excellent radio
this is a major disappointment, I might be wrong but most of the software
effort seems devoted to the KX3 so I am not expecting any change soon.

73 Roger VK3ADE.

Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 NR needs improvement

Eric -

What NR settings are you using on CW?  I can't get rid of the background
white noise with the K3 NR like I can with my Orion NR. I wish I could!

My K3 is never 'silent' with NR turned on.

73 de K1ESE
John


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Re: [Elecraft] K3 and whats next from Elecraft

[Brian Alsop]

Interesting.  My measurements up to S9+40 show it pretty linear with a 
slope of 1.001 db/SMH unit.  I didn't go above this.  I'll send you the 
curve.


The generator used is an HP8657B.  This was done with a 400 Hz filter in 
the CW mode.


73 de Brian/K3KO

On 8/21/2013 23:19, wb4...@knology.net wrote:

In order to limit off-topic posts, I responded directly to Fred.

One salient point is that my K3's S-meter does NOT show linear/accurate
readings above about S9 +25.  It hits S9+60 at about -30dBm, which
should read only about S9+40.  This could throw off the assumed dynamic
range of 102dB.  However, Dr. Mitola's suggestion that HF needs about
130dB of dynamic range is still a good target, albeit tough for ANY
radio without RF filtering (analog OR SDR).

I provided several other comments, but I don’t think a manufacturer's
reflector is the proper forum to continue the discussion.  I'm not
hiding anything, as I think Elecraft makes at least two of the best
radios on the market (K3/P3 & KX3), and I'm not planning to part with
either of mine.
73, Terry, WB4JFI

-Original Message- From: Fred Jensen
Sent: Tuesday, August 20, 2013 7:50 PM
To: Elecraft Reflector
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 and whats next from Elecraft

On 8/19/2013 10:28 PM, wb4...@knology.net wrote:

Warning:  rather long reply follows.
If you don't care, or have your mind made up, please skip this email.
Fred asked for some education, so here goes...  I'm not an expert, but
these are my personal ramblings from what I think that I have learned.
If you don't agree, and the moderator doesn’t like this discussion here,
maybe we can find another place to discuss?  Or directly?


Hi Terry, thanks for the reply.  I'm thinking I'm not the only one
seeking the education so I'll reply to the list.  If that's
inappropriate, I'll take it off-list.  I'm also not going to quote your
reply, those interested already have it.

So far, I've learned that 32-bit ADC's have apparently not become as
ubiquitous as I had surmised.  I have looked at the I'net SDR at Twente
University in the Netherlands, and I understand the concept and the
desirability of digitizing directly from the entire HF spectrum for it.
  That cool receiver wouldn't work for everyone if it didn't.  I
understand DSP also, or at least most of the math behind it.

I want to focus my questions on a communications receiver and its
performance however, because that's what I'm certain I don't fully
understand.  In this focus, I'm attempting to receive a single fairly
narrow-band HF signal in the presence of noise and other signals close
by.  Let's say a 2KHz BW signal just for discussion.

Let's say I'm digitizing at the antenna connector everything up to
30MHz.  We know that I have to sample at a rate at least twice the
highest frequency being sampled so I'll stipulate that we're sampling at



120MHz, [4x 30MHz] and that there exists some sort of low-pass filter
with a cutoff frequency of 30MHz, zero attenuation below, and 1,000dB
above in front of the ADC [trying to get rid of "discussion noise" here]

My K3 reads S9 with 50uV into the 50ohm connector which is 5e-11 watts,
or -73dBm.  I have a KBPF3 [or whatever it's called] and I can find
non-ham signals in the .5-30MHz range that will put the S-meter at or
close to full-scale [60 over S9].  For the sake of discussion, let's



assume the S-meter is accurate and the strongest signal I can find is 60



over S9 or -13dBm.  Were the LORAN-C station at Middletown CA still
operating, it would easily exceed anything I can find at HF, on my
service monitor it generally ran around -10dBm at night with my flagpole



as the antenna.

I'll assume that the 2KHz BW signal I want to hear is S2, or 42dB below
S9 or -115dBm which I don't think is unreasonable.  I would calculate
then that the digitizing mechanism directly at the antenna connector
needs to have a minimum dynamic range of 102dBm or a voltage ratio of
125,893 [rounding up].  2^18 gives me +/-131,072 steps so an 18-bit ADC
should work. Right so far?

In my K3, the .5-30MHz spectrum is filtered by the L-C BP filters prior
to the first mixer, significantly reducing the effect of far but very
strong signals on the mixer.  The 8MHz 1st IF is then filtered again by,



in my case, a 2.7KHz xtal filter, so when this all gets to the ADC, it's



3KHz wide or so.

And thus my first question [slightly rephrased]:

"Ignoring the display possibilities of digitizing at the antenna
connector, and concentrating on a communications receiver attempting to
receive a 2KHz BW signal, what are the performance advantages of moving
the A->D conversion to the antenna connector?"

It seems like it should make sense to sample right at the antenna, if
you can digitize at an adequate rate and precision, but I just can't
make it work in my mind that subjecting the ADC to the full spectrum is
good if I'm a single-op and all I'm interested in is the new mult.

Follow-up question [watched too much 'West Wing' I guess]:

Re: [Elecraft] Just a thought

[Brian Alsop]

Look at the LOTW Home page.  Yaesu is emblazoned on the top half.

73 de Brian/K3KO

On 8/20/2013 19:39, Jim Lowman wrote:

I asked someone at ARRL HQ, and was told that much of the equipment has
been donated by the respective manufacturers.

73 de Jim - AD6CW

On 8/16/2013 4:30 AM, Mike wrote:

Septembers QST arrived the other day and on page 13 is a run down of
W1AW. Noticed its loaded with all non U.S. made rigs! No Elecraft or
Ten Tec rigs both made in America.
Just a thought that makes me go h?
Mike
VE3WDM



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[Elecraft] K3 possible new option

[Brian Alsop]

I was hoping that we would truly have a two RX K3-- each with its own 
set of bandpass filters when configured as independent.


Perhaps the space where the general coverage filters are now could be 
utilized for a second set of filters for the sub receiver.


If I want general coverage, I'll get a general coverage RX.

73 de Brian/K3KO



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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft Digest, Vol 112, Issue 30

[Brian Alsop]

I'd say the knobs will get in the way when trying to hang it on your 
belt.  It would need some kind of box to protect knobs/buttons and the 
display.


Oh is it waterproof or does it float?

73 de Brian/K3KO

On 8/19/2013 22:19, Mel Farrer wrote:

I think, darn I hate that, that the correct answer is a dual band module for 
the KX3.  It is already the size of a HT, come on.   I would give up the higher 
power for a good 1-2 watt 2/440 transverter and IT would be GREAT.

Mel, K6KBE





  From: "w0...@aol.com" 
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Sent: Monday, August 19, 2013 11:41 AM
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft Digest, Vol 112, Issue 30


Eric/Wayne ...

Totally asinine idea, why enter a cheap market with a jillion  competitors?


In a message dated 8/19/2013 1:30:31 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
elecraft-requ...@mailman.qth.net writes:

Message:  12
Date: Mon, 19 Aug 2013 08:50:10 -0700
From: Stephen Selberg  
To: "elecraft@mailman.qth.net"  
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] K3 and whats next  from Elecraft
Message-ID:

Content-Type:  text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

Giving the high quality of Elecraft  products, and the phenomenal customer
service, not to mention the made in  the USA stamp, I think an Elecraft
2m/440 HT would be a huge success. I  know I would be one of those people
camping out in front of the store for a  week just be first in line to buy
one. Hopefully the Elecraft gods are  listening.

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 and whats next from Elecraft

[Brian Alsop]

Steve,

What would you be willing to pay?

What would it have that current import units do not?

(perhaps a manual you can understand or a set of controls that easily 
access the gazillion features?)


Let's face it the current crop of 2m/440 are almost priced to be 
disposables.  What market share is left to go after?



73
Brian/K3KO

On 8/19/2013 15:50, Stephen Selberg wrote:

Giving the high quality of Elecraft products, and the phenomenal customer
service, not to mention the made in the USA stamp, I think an Elecraft
2m/440 HT would be a huge success. I know I would be one of those people
camping out in front of the store for a week just be first in line to buy
one. Hopefully the Elecraft gods are listening.

73,

Steve KS6PD




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Re: [Elecraft] new computer advice suggestions for using with a K3

[Brian Alsop]

One has to be careful with these headers.  There apparently are two 
pinouts for them.  One is used more often in EU and the other in the US.
So make sure you read the documentation supplied with the motherboard to 
assure you connect the right type of cable.


I got caught with this problem while trying to use COM2 (on the 
motherboard).


73 de Brian/K3KO

On 8/10/2013 14:05, Edward Dickinson III wrote:

Most of the motherboards I have looked at online recently do have a  com
port header on them, but no connector on the backplane.  You can likely find
a connector and cable at a computer parts and pieces store.   A rotary tool
with a diamond cutting blade can create an opening for mounting a connector.
Mine is mounted just below the power supply.



Another alternative is to add a com port plugin card in an available slot.





73,

Dick - KA5KKT

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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Erratic SSB Power Output

[Brian Alsop]

I second the grounding strap problem.
Through heat cycling or whatever, the ground nut of the back of my K3 
became loose.  Had a series of weird problems with power.  Tightened it 
up and the problems went away.


There is also the possibility that the cable between your K3 and the amp 
is flaky.


73 de Brian/K3KO

On 7/21/2013 20:13, Tim Hague wrote:

Jack, my K3 is stable, sounds to me that you might have a grounding problem or 
traces of feedback. Not an inherent problem with the K3

Best regards, Tim Hague, M0AFJ
Skype m0afj.Tim
Sent on my iPad


On 21 Jul 2013, at 20:12, JACK WHITE  wrote:


Hello K3 Reflector.


I have an issue with my new K3/100 #7482. On SSB the peak power output isn't 
stable. The SSB power output fluctuates about +/- 15% of where it is set, but 
occasionally spikes to much more. The issue is on all bands but seems worse on 
12/10m. I have tested the rig connected straight to a 1kW Bird 50ohm load and 
have tried 2 different linear power supplies. The problem is present using the 
two tone test feature, microphone or direct PC audio fed into the rig.


The real problem is: I set up my Acom 1000 at the legal limit here (400w) and 
the power output is all over the place, sometimes 150w, then maybe 500w, then 
300w, then all of a sudden the power can spike to 1kW+. I operate mostly CW. 
Things seem more stable on CW, but compared to my previous Jap rigs (FT1000MP, 
FT990, TS850) etc, the power output is very difficult to properly regulate. On 
my previous rigs, I'd set them up to drive the Acom to a certain power level 
and they'd run for hours rock solid without a peep.


I've had an e-mail exchange with a friendly Elecraft Guy which resulted in me 
redoing the TX Gain calibration, he said the numbers looked good, but the 
problem persists. I am curious to see if anybody else has this issue and knows 
of a fix? As it is, the rig isn't much use to me.



Cheers



Jack G8DX
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Re: [Elecraft] K3EXREF query

[Brian Alsop]

Thanks guys for the suggestions.

To appreciate the problem one needs to look at Fig's 7 and 9 in the 
K3EXREF manual.  There is no room for tools.  Nor do I think any kind of 
gop is a good idea.  (Though if this screw were necessary for grounding 
I don't think they would have used a split washer but rather inner tooth 
washers)


Upon further reading, the corrections of this module appear to be in 
~1Hz steps.  I was more interested in something that disciplines the 
oscillator in a finer more continuous way.


73 de Brian/K3KO



On 7/21/2013 16:01, Michael Goins wrote:

I've used a little bit of coax seal too many times to count. Stick a bit in
the screwdriver tip and it will hold the screw very well.Used t recently
re-building a T-8 Tennadyne Log Periodic with lots of difficult to access
areas. Didn't drop a one (and they would have gone into the boom and been
totally inaccessible).

Mike, k5smg
Bella-Green Bed & Breakfast
www.bella-green.com


On Sun, Jul 21, 2013 at 10:52 AM, Geoffrey Mackenzie-Kennedy wrote:


The most useful tool, which I have found for this type of application, is
the simple screw "Grabber".  Not only can this tool be used to hold a screw
and washer(s) while starting the thread, but also while removing a screw
and washers.  It can also be used to retrieve bits of wire, screws, washers
and other small items which may have fallen into "difficult to reach"
places.

The tool requires only one hand to hold it during use, and is operated by
the thumb of that hand.  It is also very inexpensive, about $2, and is
available from most of the major stockists.

73,
Geoff
LX2AO



On July 20, 2013 at 6:39 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote:

  You are right that one must be careful to not lose the split lock washer

between the KREF3 and the front panel, but testers didn't find the process
very difficult to do.

What a couple of people who suffered hand tremors reported doing to avoid
that lock washer falling off was to put a small drop of petroleum jelly or
soft candle wax on the screw after placing the lock washer on it. That
kept
the washer from easily falling off while they repositioned the KREF3 board
and started the screw threads into the fitting on the front panel shield.



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[Elecraft] K3EXREF query

[Brian Alsop]

Anybody install with with the subrx in place?

My recollection is that the installing the screw with the lockwasher on 
the panel side of the master oscillator PCB was a bit tricky.


Also the extra hole for the SMA connector is already in use here for 
something else.


I'm wondering if there is such a thing as a TMP male/female cable that I 
could hook up to from the K3EXREF board to the aux BNC antenna male TMP. 
 I don't use that.


I don't use xverter BNC's either.

Any other suggestions for locating the K3EXREF SMA end.

73 de Brian/K3KO


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Re: [Elecraft] Any way to block the spammers who discovered Nabble recently?

[Brian Alsop]

Except you can't change fonts in XP.  It just ignores changes you try to 
make.  This has gone on for years and apparently there is no motivation 
to fix it.


73 de Brian/K3KO

On 7/10/2013 16:45, Jim Brown wrote:

On 7/10/2013 9:04 AM, Richard Fjeld wrote:

I have been looking for a decent email client


I've been using Thunderbird for at least five years, and like it a lot.
I read a lot of email reflectors, and Thunderbird makes it very easy to
automatically sort each mail from each list into its own mailbox.

73, Jim K9YC
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Re: [Elecraft] OT - anyone have experience with effects of metal roofs on antenna performace?

[Brian Alsop]

SWR is a pretty coarse indication of interaction.  Interactions can 
change directional antenna F/B and F/S ratio by 6-10 db easily (assuming 
you have it in the first place) and hardly affect SWR.


At least, this is my experience from antenna modeling.

However, we have to live with the hands we're dealt.  Without any field 
strength measurements or calculations, one probably won't detect much.

Ignorance is bliss.

73 de Brian/K3KO

On 7/5/2013 20:13, Ignacy wrote:

I had verticals on concrete, roof shingle and metal roofs. Always radials
lying on top. The metal roof was the best by far.

One way to find out how much the roof is affecting the performance of a beam
is to look at SWR changes as the antenna is rotating.

Ignacy, NO9E



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Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
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Re: [Elecraft] OT - Thunderbolt GPSDO GONE

[Brian Alsop]

On 6/18/2013 13:10, Brian Alsop wrote:

Single 24 volt version with Trimble bullet antenna and 35'RG6.

Contact off list.

73 de Brian/K3KO





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[Elecraft] OT - Thunderbolt GPSDO available

[Brian Alsop]

Single 24 volt version with Trimble bullet antenna and 35'RG6.

Contact off list.

73 de Brian/K3KO


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[Elecraft] K3 (get FP temp?)

[Brian Alsop]

I was hoping to automatically get the FP temperature versus time from 
the K3.


Tried the MN072;MN043; combo.  All it did was switch the K3 to the tech 
menu and display the FP temperature on the K3 display.


It did not return a value.

Guess it isn't possible.

73 de Brian/K3KO


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Re: [Elecraft] Combo pre-amp

[Brian Alsop]

Excellent!  It also relieves the clutter at the back of the K3 and makes 
installing a preamp for 160/80 receive antennas cleaner.


It would need to be programmable variable gain to accommodate differing 
noise floors on the different bands.


73 de Brian/K3KO

On 5/28/2013 07:46, Wayne Burdick wrote:

I think an internal preamp for the highest bands (say 15/12/10/6 m) is a cool 
idea. I'll take a look at that (no promises, yet).

Like other K3 options it would have to be compatible with all existing K3s, 
which suggests putting it on the KXV3 module as a user-installable daughter 
board (etc.). Meanwhile there's the PR6, which provides truly excellent 
sensitivity.

Wayne
N6KR


On May 28, 2013, at 12:33 AM, Edward R Cole  wrote:


You are assuming the internal K3 preamp is adequate on 6m in the K3.  The 
reason for the PR6 is that the internal preamp is not adequate for very weak 
signals (I intend to do 6m eme and ms).  Of course if you mean the PR6 is 
installed internal to the K3 then I suppose it would work.

The current configuration is "bolt on" ready and no need for an internal 
installation of the PR6 (or my preamp).




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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 question about cooling

[Brian Alsop]

Keep in mind the fan may come on more and end up at higher speeds more 
ofter if you put the KAT500 on top.   That is not to say it will 
overheat.  Fan noise for some is a KPA500 issue.


73 de Brian/K3KO

On 5/27/2013 13:39, Fred Smith wrote:

I guess it boils down to whatever trips your trigger and the people who
designed it said to put it on top if you wanted, no problems.


73,
Fred/N0AZZ
K3 Ser #'s 6730/5299--KX3 # 2573--K2/100--KAT100
P3/SVGA--KPA500--KAT500--W2



-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net
[mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Richard Gillingham
Sent: Monday, May 27, 2013 8:31 AM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 question about cooling

Yes.
The very first statement under Installation in the KPA500 owner's manual is
the following:

"IMPORTANT:  Provide at least 2 inches (5 cm) clearance behind the fan and
above the amplifier for proper air flow."

Nuf said.

73,
Gil, W1RG



From: w...@bellsouth.net
Date: Sun, 26 May 2013 23:39:00 -0400
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 question about cooling

I do a lot of meteor scatter on 6 meters, and I've tried the tuner both

above and below the amp.


I've found the KPA500 runs cooler with the KAT500 tuner below the amp.

73 de Sebastian, W4AS



On May 26, 2013, at 6:23 PM, mcduf...@ag0n.net wrote:


On Sun, 26 May 2013 15:06:25 -0700, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote:


The KAT500 may be placed on TOP or under the KPA500.


I wouldn't put it on top.  I can hear fan and air changes if I get

within a half

inch of the intake slots with my hand at higher speeds.  You can feel

the air

flow considerably at high speed with your hand an inch over the opening.

That

means it does affect the airflow to put something that close.  I don't

care if

the factory or a manual says you can do it.  I sure wouldn't run mine

that way.


Gary


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Re: [Elecraft] Pigknob

[Brian Alsop]

I'll ask the group since the designer of PigKnob didn't reply when asked 
several months ago.


Will it work with LBRIDGE and other apps sharing the K3?

73 DE Brian/K3KO

On 5/22/2013 11:51, AB1DD wrote:

Got a PigKnob yesterday. Works great! You can tune at one speed, push the knob 
and tune faster. This is all easily reprogrammed. The 8 buttons also can be 
easily reprogrammed with whatever you want. I set one to do a split 5 up, and 
another to normalize. The knob is smooth to tune, the whole thing is well made. 
The interfaces are on a separate board that can be mounted behind the K3,if you 
want, and there is just one small ribbon cable to the knob itself. The only 
issue I had was the piggy wanted to explore the table top, but 4 stick on 
rubber feet took care of that.
I'm happy!

73,
Carl
AB1DD

Resistance is futile.
(don't know about reactance, though)
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Re: [Elecraft] Ideal RTTY filter.

[Brian Alsop]

Ed et al,

As I said in my posting the receive filter info came from a quote 
attributed to Chen in the QST article.  I pointed out that the link 
supplied by QST was not for receive.


So we either have to accept the quote of Chen on the receive side 
(additional data exists that Chen has?) or the QST author got it wrong.


Nothing at all was said about dual peak filtering which is used by many 
of us in conjunction with a 400 or "250" filter.


It would be nice to someday finally nail this whole RTTY filter issue 
down.  Also it would be nice to find a set of optimum AGC settings for 
RTTY.  I suspect there are parameters or a formulation that would 
produce less spurious clicks.  AGC off is definitely not a practical 
solution.


73 de Brian/K3KO

On 5/18/2013 04:17, Ed Muns wrote:



Brian K3KO wrote:

This comes from June 2013 QST page 59.
First of all, Chen's article is about transmit filtering which is not
directly translatable to optimal receive filtering.  Second, the cascade
effect of the K3 crystal filter and DSP filter must be considered in
determining the net receive bandwidth.  So very different net receiver
bandwidths result depending on what DSP bandwidth is used with the engaged
crystal filter bandwidth, e.g., KFLA250 which is really a 370 Hz filter.
Third, the ideal receive bandwidth for optimal decoding is not the same as
the transmit bandwidth for minimum QRM.  Depending on the decoder, a
receiver bandwidth of around 400 Hz is optimum ... unless there is such a
heavy QRM situation that a better overall system trade-off is obtained with
narrower, e.g., 250 Hz, net IF bandwidth.  A transmit filter of 280 Hz is an
optimum trade-off between minimizing QRM to neighboring QSOs and maintaining
signal integrity for the intended receiver.  Finally, this transmit filter
can be implemented in either the radio or the encoder.  MMTTY, for example,
provides a number of transmit filter bandwidths and the default 48-tap TX
bandwidth for AFSK meets Chen's proposal.


Ed W0YK


According to W7AY:

The ideal RTTY filter is 280 Hz wide.  Narrowing it further by 60 Hz
doubles the error rate.

The article references:
http://www.w7ay.net/site/Technical/RTTY%20Transmit%20Filters/index.html

Which doesn't come out and say the above!  It's talking about transmit
filters.  W7AY doesn't like uneven power in transmit tones either.

Anyhow this may confirm what has been said on this reflector. The 350 Hz
(AKA 250 Hz) filter is probably the narrowest practical choice for RTTY.

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[Elecraft] Ideal RTTY filter.

[Brian Alsop]

This comes from June 2013 QST page 59.

According to W7AY:

The ideal RTTY filter is 280 Hz wide.  Narrowing it further by 60 Hz 
doubles the error rate.


The article references:
http://www.w7ay.net/site/Technical/RTTY%20Transmit%20Filters/index.html

Which doesn't come out and say the above!  It's talking about transmit 
filters.  W7AY doesn't like uneven power in transmit tones either.


Anyhow this may confirm what has been said on this reflector. The 350 Hz 
(AKA 250 Hz) filter is probably the narrowest practical choice for RTTY.


73 de Brian/K3KO



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[Elecraft] KTCX03 Questions and experience

[Brian Alsop]

Guys,

Put this in the K3.  Some questions. Would appreciate some enlightenment 
from the experts out there.


It has only three pins which I suppose are +V, ground and signal out.

What does changing REF CAL do since there is no "adjustment" pin?

Also I expected to only have to tweak a well calibrated K3's REF CAL a 
small bit after installing the TCXO.  Not!  REF CAL had to change by 536 
to zero beat WWV on 10 MHz.  Not found any goofy settings that would 
explain that.


Have no way of knowing the internal unit XTAL temp.  So I looked at the 
front panel temp vs frequency change for the first hour of warm up. 
There seems to be little temperature compensation between 19 and 30C 
while there is measurable drift.  Alternatively the compensation 
routines do as good as they can (and much better than the uncompensated 
stock oscillator) over this range.  Compensation appears good after 30C 
up to the 35-36C temps reached after 8 hours. This may be a meaningless 
observation.  Perhaps the internal KTCX03 electronics temps have 
stabilized by then.


Another perhaps meaningless observation.  Again using the front panel 
temp as an indicator.  The unit exhibits a positive temperature 
coefficient for the first hour and then becomes negative.  The stock 
oscillator has a negative coefficient.


It appears to work as advertised.  For normal use temperature 
transients, it easily makes the +/- 0.5 ppm spec -- overkill for most 
everybody.  I have some 8 hour long plots of this and the standard 
oscillator warmup drift if anybody is interested in the nits.


A literature search on TXCO compensation methods uncovers something 
interesting.  A neural network approach gets the drift down to 0.005 
ppm.  It learns how to compensate as it goes.


I wish REF CAL had one more significant digit.  The last REF CAL digit 
amounts to 0.5 Hz per REF CAL unit at 10 MHz.


The K3 is more than a rig, in many areas it approaches a lab instrument.
I use it as such often.

What are your experiences?

73 de Brian/K3KO


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Re: [Elecraft] K3 - remote control head

[Brian Alsop]

How about a detachable P3 display?  The box takes up way too much space.

73 de Brian/K3KO

On 4/29/2013 14:51, Bill wrote:

Will the "mini" be able to perform the same job the control head on a
Kenwood 480 does? Put the radio on a back shelf and only have a 2" deep
control panel to drag around the desk? Maybe a blank panel cover for the
K3 and a remote kit that will provide for this?

There are days when I am not feeling too sparky and I use my 480 because
I can drag the control panel over to my recliner and put it on a TV
tray. Life would be great if I could do the same with the K3.

Thanks,

Bill W2BLC


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Re: [Elecraft] why mix rf connector types within the product line?

[Brian Alsop]

Nope! My Wavetek sig gen uses type N.  Bird watt meters use type N.
Some dummy loads use type C.  The list goes on.

Some Collins transmitters used RCA connectors.
73 de Brian/K3KO

On 4/27/2013 01:39, Jeff Herr wrote:

Come on.

All test equipment uses it!   ALL!




-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net
[mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Joe Subich, W4TV
Sent: Friday, April 26, 2013 17:05
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] why mix rf connector types within the product line?


  > I wish it was standard practice to put BNC connectors on all QRP gear.

Not only is it too easy to damage the center pin/socket, BNC is a "clamp"
type connector and is prone to improper assembly.  Having "grown up" with
Heathkit, I would rather have RCA connectors - the old kind where the shield
can be soldered all the way around - than BNC connectors on RF devices below
50 MHz and less than 50 Watts.

73,

 ... Joe, W4TV


On 4/26/2013 7:46 PM, Tim wrote:

Hi,

I wish it was standard practice to put BNC connectors on all QRP gear.

Tim
KE4KE


On 4/26/13 6:36 PM, Jeff Herr wrote:

I will end up taking the units (kx3 and that nice amp) with me as I
travel.

In effect now we are forced to need adapters.

Do you think BNC connection is not suitable from an engineering
perspective?

WW6L



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Re: [Elecraft] Bluetooth and Elecraft Rig Serial Comms

[Brian Alsop]

I have some empirical data that the K3 works at TTL levels (0 to 5 V).

73 DE Brian/K3KO

on 4/12/2013 22:30, Don Wilhelm wrote:

Phil,

Why do you not try it and report the results?  If the bluetooth
connection is good and the bluetooth to RS-232 adapter is of good
quality, it should work just fine.
I have not tried it, but in theory it should work.  The only caution
that I can state is that the quality of some consumer devices is wanting
for something more robust.  Find one that is sufficiently robust and it
should work.

Unfortunately, many PC type devices do not conform to true RS-232 levels
and speeds, and will work with some devices over short distances, but
fail on other devices that expect the minimum RS-232 switching
voltages.  Others do not work at slow speeds - note the reports of USB
to RS-232 adapter failures on this reflector - some work, and others do
not, particularly with the slower data rate used by the K2.  Adapters
designed for industrial applications will likely work, but some of those
offered for the consumer market may present problems.  My Edgeport-4
will handle anything I have connected to it so far, but a garden variety
Prolific adapter is very picky and fails at slow data rates.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 4/12/2013 6:09 PM, Phil Hystad wrote:

Has anyone used a Bluetooth to RS232 Serial adapter, such as the
dongle style that could plug into a 9-pin connector (but, it does not
have to be dongle style).

This would be instead of using a Serial to USB adapter.  I think,
though I am not positive, that such devices come with driver to define
additional serial COM ports.  I was wondering if such a configuration
would work with the Elecraft utility programs.




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Re: [Elecraft] IS command...only for main receiver? What about sub?

[Brian Alsop]

Won't setting it in the main and doing A>B twice to copy all to subrx work?

73 de Brian/K3KO

On 4/11/2013 00:56, tomb18 wrote:

Nope. only in diversity.  Otherwise IS only sets the main receiver.  If you
go into bset it doesn't change it and if you then give a IS; it only reports
a question mark.  IS never changes the sub receiver shift except in
diversity.







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Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
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Re: [Elecraft] DATA A Reverse? AFSK A Reverse etc?

[Brian Alsop]

Keep in mind what's "normal" depends upon where you are.  My 
recollection is that MTTY used to transmit on USB as non-inverted.   I 
think USB RTTY is standard elsewhere too.


I don't think the argument has ever been settled which sideband is the 
"normal" one for CW either.


I wonder if there is a correlation between which side of the road one 
drives on that the proper sideband to use


73 de Brian/K3KO



On 4/8/2013 21:28, Richard Ferch wrote:

"Reverse" is exactly the same in data modes as in CW - the "reverse"
setting uses the opposite sideband to the "normal" setting. Some digital
modes, e.g. BPSK, will work regardless of which sideband you use (like
CW). Others, notably RTTY, are sensitive to which sideband you use (like
SSB).

DATA A and PSK D are USB, so DATA A-REV and PSK D-REV are LSB. AFSK A
and FSK D are LSB, so AFSK A-REV and FSK D-REV are USB.

73,
Rich VE3KI


VA2FSQ wrote:


Can someone explain exactly what the " Reverse" functions is?
I understand how it is used for CW but for all the data modes?
DATA A, PSK D, AFSK A, and FSK D can all be set as reverse.


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Re: [Elecraft] Filter problems

[Brian Alsop]

8 db.
This number was obtained by observing a signal generator carrier signal 
in Spectrogram (AGC off) with the 2.7 KHz filter.  Then each 
progressively narrow filter was kicked in and the gain adjusted for the 
same peak value.


The 200 Hz filter also needs 8db and perhaps a bit more.

The method leads to no loss in signal audio as the width control is 
progressively decreased.


73 de Brian/K3KO

On 4/4/2013 03:30, Vic K2VCO wrote:

I don't have a 250 Hz filter, but both of my 400 Hz ones do require a
few dB. I am more surprised that your main filter requires NO boost,
than that your sub requires 6 dB. How much do others who have 250 Hz
filters use?




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Re: [Elecraft] [Elecraft_K3] A Different View--K3 Reduced-bandwidth RTTY Analysis

[Brian Alsop]

Monty,

Perhaps I didn't explain my thinking it too well.

Apparently the normal K3 FSK implementation has both frequency shift and 
amplitude shifts.  The time domain plots show an amplitude change from 
mark to space.  The frequency domain plots show the frequency shift 
which is FSK keying.  Both modulate the "carrier" and generate sidebands 
which widen the signal.


The time domain pix show a power level change between mark and space. 
In the case of the standard K3 those transitions are sharp.  In the case 
of the reduced bandwidth FSK, there transition is almost a straight 
line. The slower transition has to generate lower level sidebands.


For an analogy:
Take the case of a pure CW wave, it is a very narrow bandwidth signal. 
Key off and on at 40 wpm and the sidebands arise.  Use Elecraft's raised 
cosine to smooth the zero to full power transition and the bandwidth is 
narrower and sidebands close by are much reduced.


Given the above, I stand by my conclusion that if the mark and space 
powers are equalized, the sidebands close in could be reduced.  How much 
is the question.  One qualification is not knowing what the improvement 
provided is.  (One could in theory imagine the a brick wall filter 
around the primary signal.  Then it wouldn't matter what caused the 
sidebands. )


73 de Brian/K3KO

On 3/25/2013 22:39, MontyS wrote:

No transition sounds like a square corner to me, generating all kinds of
square wave interference.
Monty K2DLJ


-Original Message- From: Brian Alsop
Sent: Monday, March 25, 2013 5:56 PM
Cc: ElecraftReflector
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [Elecraft_K3] A Different View--K3
Reduced-bandwidth RTTY Analysis

Interesting. At at least the transition between the mark and space
amplitudes are smoothed some.  I wonder how many db in spectrum purity
that buys. If it buys something, imagine what no transition would buy.

73 de Brian/K3KO



On 3/25/2013 21:11, Hank Garretson wrote:



On Mon, Mar 25, 2013 at 8:27 PM, Brian Alsop mailto:als...@nc.rr.com>> wrote:

I notice that in the narrower signal spectrun the two tone peaks
have the same amplitude.

Many of us have wondered why our watt meters diddled like the RTTY
tones.

Hopefully that is fixed too.


Not fixed. See the before and after photos.
https://picasaweb.google.com/StarrGarretson/2013_03_25_K3_FSK

Which brings up one of my crotchets.

One of the most useful and important station accessories is an
oscilloscope. Much more useful than one of those multi-hundred dollar
watt meters--who cares if it is 150 or 153 watts?

An oscilloscope centered before your eyes can instantly tell you a whole
bunch about your signal.

Is your keying too hard? Are you overmodulating? Are you
overcompressing? Are your RTTY mark and space different in amplitude? Is
your amplifier adjusted correctly? Do you have the right antenna for the
right band selected? Has something gone wrong with your antenna? Do you
have hum on your signal? Etcetera.

If more hams had a monitor scope, we wouldn't have so many rotten
signals on the air.

73,

Hank, W6SX

Mammoth Lakes, California

Elevation 8083 feet in John Muir's Range of Light

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Re: [Elecraft] [Elecraft_K3] A Different View--K3 Reduced-bandwidth RTTY Analysis

[Brian Alsop]

Interesting. At at least the transition between the mark and space 
amplitudes are smoothed some.  I wonder how many db in spectrum purity 
that buys. If it buys something, imagine what no transition would buy.


73 de Brian/K3KO



On 3/25/2013 21:11, Hank Garretson wrote:



On Mon, Mar 25, 2013 at 8:27 PM, Brian Alsop mailto:als...@nc.rr.com>> wrote:

I notice that in the narrower signal spectrun the two tone peaks
have the same amplitude.

Many of us have wondered why our watt meters diddled like the RTTY
tones.

Hopefully that is fixed too.


Not fixed. See the before and after photos.
https://picasaweb.google.com/StarrGarretson/2013_03_25_K3_FSK

Which brings up one of my crotchets.

One of the most useful and important station accessories is an
oscilloscope. Much more useful than one of those multi-hundred dollar
watt meters--who cares if it is 150 or 153 watts?

An oscilloscope centered before your eyes can instantly tell you a whole
bunch about your signal.

Is your keying too hard? Are you overmodulating? Are you
overcompressing? Are your RTTY mark and space different in amplitude? Is
your amplifier adjusted correctly? Do you have the right antenna for the
right band selected? Has something gone wrong with your antenna? Do you
have hum on your signal? Etcetera.

If more hams had a monitor scope, we wouldn't have so many rotten
signals on the air.

73,

Hank, W6SX

Mammoth Lakes, California

Elevation 8083 feet in John Muir's Range of Light

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Re: [Elecraft] [Elecraft_K3] A Different View--K3 Reduced-bandwidth RTTY Analysis

[Brian Alsop]

I notice that in the narrower signal spectrun the two tone peaks have 
the same amplitude.


Many of us have wondered why our watt meters diddled like the RTTY tones.

Hopefully that is fixed too.

73 de Brian/K3KO

On 3/25/2013 19:59, Hank Garretson wrote:





Andy, K0SM has a very nice look at the K3 reduced-bandwidth FSK keying.
(Now available to all as Beta DSP rev. 2.8.)

http://www.frontiernet.net/~aflowers/k3beta/

It is also interesting to look at before and after FSK signals in the
time domain.

https://picasaweb.google.com/StarrGarretson/2013_03_25_K3_FSK

K3 FSK has always had a small amplitude difference between mark and
space. The transition has always been abrupt, Photo 1. With the new beta
software, the transition is much more gentle, Photo 2. Bravo!

Diddle Exuberantly,

Hank, W6SX

Mammoth Lakes, California

Elevation 8083 feet in John Muir's Range of Light


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Re: [Elecraft] hi cut/low cut not work in CW?

[Brian Alsop]

Shift =.05 does do something but the result still is not as expected.us.

Here's the results with a 2.7 KHz filter
First high cut maxs out a 2.0 KHz, low cut can go to zero.

High cut  low cut   
2.0 no effect
1.8 0-0.2
1.6 0-0.4
1.4 0-0.6
1.2 0-0.8
1.1 0-0.9
1.0 0-0.9

First, why is does high cut not go to 2.7 KHz?  BW for this set of data 
is 2.7 in the BW/SHIFT mode.
Second it does not appear that the high cut and low cut controls are 
independent.


I'm curious about the reason for these observations.

73 de Brian/K3KO


On 3/20/2013 13:23, Joe Subich, W4TV wrote:


 > Turn CONFIG:CW QRQ to OFF.

and/or reset CONFIG:SHIFT=0.01 to SHIFT=0.05

73,

... Joe, W4TV


On 3/20/2013 8:46 AM, Mike K2MK wrote:

Hi Brian,

Turn CONFIG:CW QRQ to OFF.

73,
Mike K2MK


alsopb wrote

I was doing something odd.  Stock 2.7KHz filter, CW mode, V4.61.
Removed all equalization.

Wanted to adjust high cut or low cut.  Tapped shift control.  Did not
revert to high cut/low cut mode.  Ditto for tapping width control.

Can't simulate this with shift because of it's limited range.

High cut/low cut works fine in SSB mode.

73 de Brian/K3KO







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[Elecraft] hi cut/low cut not work in CW?

[Brian Alsop]

I was doing something odd.  Stock 2.7KHz filter, CW mode, V4.61.
Removed all equalization.

Wanted to adjust high cut or low cut.  Tapped shift control.  Did not 
revert to high cut/low cut mode.  Ditto for tapping width control.


Can't simulate this with shift because of it's limited range.

High cut/low cut works fine in SSB mode.

73 de Brian/K3KO


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Re: [Elecraft] OT--RFI Issue

[Brian Alsop]

These kind of installation problems are not rare.

TWC did the original installation here.

A few years later while troubleshooting a low signal problem they found:
1)Several corroded connectors from the street to the house
2)An extra unterminated splitter in their house mounted box.
3)Replaced an F connector in the wall plate fixture for the cable modem.
4)Replaced the cable modem.

A few weeks later they had to come out to replace the modem in (4) that 
was a huge source of RFI.  (Switching supply I believe).  New modem was 
quiet.  I'm sure the replaced modem will end up in somebody else's house.


73 de Brian/K3KO


On 3/19/2013 13:18, John Fritze wrote:

Make sure ALL of his cable drops are terminated at a piece of equipment or
are capped with a 70 ohm resister.  Any open ends of cable act as an
antenna.  This is the most common offender!   Make sure all splits go
through a cable splitter of correct impedance.  Make sure all cable
splitters are turned the correct direction. Time Warner installed one
backwards in my house causing poor TV reception.  Lastly, your cable
company has the option to "up" the signal strength at individual houses.
  Perhaps your neighbor's level is so low as to be a problem.

When I had my house remodeled several years ago the electrician thought is
was OK to simply twist the cable center conductors and shields together and
put wire nuts on them.  He did this in several spots.  Needless to say he
got an earful from me.





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[Elecraft] K3 RS232 work with 0-5 volt TTL level data?

[Brian Alsop]

Anybody know if this is so?

I'm talking about sending data to the K3, not receiving data from it.

Much to my surprise, my computer accepts TTL level input as long as the 
polarity is right.


Being lazy. I just haven't gotten around to trying it yet.

73 de Brian/K3KO


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Re: [Elecraft] OT: great deal on netbook

[Brian Alsop]

I have an earlier ACER netbook with a smaller screen which runs winxp.
The thing is amazing.  It is a dual core machine  It runs everything I 
tried..  The HD screen does present some problems.  One may definitely 
need glasses if over 40.


The only problem I had was with the built in webcam.  I could not get 
another USB camera to ever work.  I even tried disabling it by 
disconnecting the wires to it.  No luck.   Hopefully this is solved in 
WIN7.  The other gotcha is that replacing a hard disk is a really chore 
as explained to me by someone who had to do it.


It is really convenient to take on trips.

73 de Brian/K3KO

On 3/19/2013 02:47, Harlan wrote:


Don't know if this is appropriate...
  Best Buy in my area have limited numbers of ACER Aspire One netbooks:
Win7
2 GB memory
320 GB hard drive
Li-ion battery

$119.95

The two stores I went to didn't even know they had them until I gave them the 
UPC number. They looked on their computer and found them for me... hi hi
UPC is 8 86541 59373 3

Great price if you need a small computer
Sent from my Verizon Wireless 4G LTE DROID
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Re: [Elecraft] Wait For The K4 Direct RF Sampled SDR?

[Brian Alsop]

Did you notice the reported 6M sensitivity number?
1.25 microvolt compared to 0.16 microvolt on 1.8-30MHz.
This may be a misprint as the MDS values are close to the same.

73 de Brian/K3KO

On 3/16/2013 03:09, David Gilbert wrote:


The transmit IMD specs are pretty poor as well ... and the interesting
thing is that neither deficiency was even discussed in the narrative
portion of the review.

73,
Dave  AB7E



On 3/15/2013 5:30 PM, Rick Stealey wrote:

Speaking of competitive rigs, I see QST just reviewed the FT3000.  The
number that caught
my eye (well actually the chart) was composit noise.  A whopping -120
dbc at 10 KHz
and beyond !  Yikes.  The K3 was -140 dbc at 10 KHz abd -155 at 100 KHz.
You sure don't want one of those noise generators at your next Field Day.
If someone shows up with one, put him on 10 meters at the far end of
the field.



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[Elecraft] OT- RS232 CARD input clamped to 2.5V

[Brian Alsop]

Guys,

Looking for some insight.

I was doing some checkout of a device.  The device output a +10/-10V 
RS232 signal swing from a MAX232 device.


When it was attached to a PCI serial port card, the output dropped to 
+2.5/-10 V.  In other words, the PCI card was clamping the input 
positive value.  It does work OK even clamped like this.


I'm guessing the internal chips are low voltage devices.

I though one of the redeeming values (for hams at least) of the +15/-15 
volt RS232 spec was noise immunity.  Clamping it to 2.5 Volts means 
considerably less noise (RFI) immunity?


True we do get along with lots of 5V TTL stuff.

73 de Brian/K3KO



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Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft K3 Build Continuing ­ Reflection Point (Page 6)

[Brian Alsop]

Nick,

This reflects the sad state of the US psyche.

To generations past "buy" or "buy assembled" would not even be considered.

Their first reaction to a need was to make something from what materials 
they had on hand.  Clearly this is anti-consumerism and not politically 
correct these days.


Today the answer to everything is to buy.  Making anything has become 
lost.  Too bad, there is a lot of knowledge and satisfaction to be 
gained by making stuff.


Also the present generation blogs everything.  I have mixed feelings on 
this.  It depends upon the quality of the blog and whether or not it has 
been done 100's of times before.  My general impression of blogs is that 
they are Internet Pollution.  Same for 95% of Youtube.


Like all generalizations this one is false sometimes.

I do know almost all advertising $$ is spent targeting 15-40 year olds.
This is because those outside this range don't buy much.  Perhaps it is 
the 40+ category that "wear it out, use it up, do without or make it"


73 de Brian/K3KO



On 3/13/2013 14:02, Nick Palomba wrote:

Elecraft K3 Build Continuing ­ Reflection Point

Ironically ­ Building the Elecraft K3 has let me to reflect. This K3 project
is special to me and has drawn some interesting questions. I have been asked
by several people including friends and coworkers and some outside my family
what I did on my vacation days and when I tried to explain that I was
working on building a Ham Radio ­ Elecraft K3 which I knew they would have
no idea about the brand but I always take shot at it.

The reaction has been staggering ­ so you are building something that is

taking days if not weeks to do that you could have purchased all put
together and ready to use by someone else. On top of that you are setting up
camera and blogging about it. What a waste of time seems to be the
consensus.

http://nicktoday.com/elecraft-k3-build-continuing-reflection-point-page-6/





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Re: [Elecraft] The P3 Effect

[Brian Alsop]

It's called "progress".  It doesn't have to be a P3.  Look at the ire 
the use of SKIMMER has generated.


Now guys have to figure out how to intelligently use the new gadgetry. 
Working DX will still be an developing skill. Those without the 
technology will moan and complain about it being unfair of course.


Which brings up another technology.  Remote operating.  The advantage 
there could be huge.  But in the future, many will have no choice.  So 
how do we judge remotes?


73 de Brian/K3KO


On 3/9/2013 12:52, a...@twcny.rr.com wrote:

Perhaps this is why DXpeditions seem to play "spin the dial" more;
having many stations converge on the last rx frequency probably tends
to slow their rate.  I experienced this effect at PZ5RO.  It would be
interesting to get feedback from DXpedition ops.

73, Redd - AI2N

 eric norris  wrote:

Has anyone else noticed just how many people are now able to pounce
on the last frequency TX5K used?  Back in the day you swapped VFOs
and listened for the calling station.  After I got my P3 it seemed
to be a real advantage because you could instantly find the calling
station (if you could hear him).  Now so many people do this it
seems to almost be a requirement to have a P3 or panadapter of some
sort.  Of course, I could be wrong.

73 Eric WD6DBM



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Re: [Elecraft] setting upper cut/lower cut via commands

[Brian Alsop]

True, but making an asymmetric filter isn't possible I think.

73 de Brian/K3KO

On 3/8/2013 13:26, Joe Subich, W4TV wrote:


BW/BW$ and IS are more reliable since they are not impacted by the
K3 meta status.

73,

... Joe, W4TV


On 3/8/2013 8:15 AM, Don Wilhelm wrote:

Brian,

All I see is the FI and FW commands, so one must "do the math" to
simulate HiCut or LoCut.  Move the IF center frequency by half the
reduction in width.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 3/7/2013 9:27 PM, Brian Alsop wrote:

I don't seem to find any way to set upper cut and lower cut values via
a macro. The programmer's manual doesn't seem to have mnemonics to do
so Is it even possible?  I know one can set the bandwidth and shift.
Is that what we're supposed to do?  I'd rather set the individual
"cut" values independently.



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[Elecraft] setting upper cut/lower cut via commands

[Brian Alsop]

I don't seem to find any way to set upper cut and lower cut values via a 
macro. The programmer's manual doesn't seem to have mnemonics to do so 
Is it even possible?  I know one can set the bandwidth and shift. Is 
that what we're supposed to do?  I'd rather set the individual "cut" 
values independently.


73 de Brian/K3KO
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[Elecraft] HB "button box" for K3

[Brian Alsop]

I really miss extra programmable buttons on the K3.  To remedy this, I 
created a "button box" that has 20 programmable buttons.


It's pretty elementary with a 4x4 keypad and four push buttons.  One 
PIC, one voltage regulator and a MAX232 for RS232.  All buttons are 
in-circuit programmable.  Things I really wanted on one button were 
SPLIT+1, SPLIT+5, UNSPLIT, PSK, FSK, modes and bands.  Sure there are 
other ways to get there.


Now for the rub.  It can be directly plugged into the K3 but one would 
loose all other functions that use that port.  Instead I use LPBRIDGE 
which allows up to five virtual ports (applications) to use the single 
K3 RS232 port.  VSPE is used to bridge the real RS232 port to a virtual 
one for LPBRIDGE.  I use LPBRIDGE all the time anyhow so no big deal for me.


Nothing original.  We will see how "needed" it really is in time.

73 de Brian/K3KO


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Re: [Elecraft] LINK uses?

[Brian Alsop]

Fred,

Here are two uses for VFO linking w/o diversity.  I'm sure there are others.

Single SDR/panadapter/skimmer on VFO B IF.  During everyday operation 
linking the VF0's allows display of what's on VFO A centered on VFOA 
frequency. The only other alternative would be an a/b switch or a second 
SDR + additional sound card for VFOA.  I've been toying with that idea 
but $$ and no more slots on MB says no.


Another use is when you want a permanent S+1 or S+5 split while tuning 
for DX.  Link and set VFOB +x up.


73 de Brian/K3KO


On 3/5/2013 13:00, Cady, Fred wrote:

Good morning all,
I'm trying to get my head around the usefulness of linking main and sub
VFOs outside of diversity mode.
I think I understand Arie, PA3A's application (pretty neat idea):
You have Main and Sub on different antennas and there are times when
working a pileup you would like to listen in a direction other than
where the majority of callers are from. Say from C6 I might be running
Eu but have the possibility of mults calling in from Asia. Arie's slick
scheme allows both ears to switch to the Asia antenna on the Sub
receiver while still transmitting on the Eu antenna. Neat.

What other slick applications are out there for linking both VFOs
without going into diversity mode?

Cheers and 73,
KE7X

Fred
fcady at ieee dot org
"The Elecraft K3: Design, Configuration, and Operation Second Edition"
"The Elecraft KX3" (coming soon)
www.ke7x.com
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Re: [Elecraft] LINK-UNLINK

[Brian Alsop]

The sub button is already too multifunction.  Anything that could be 
done to have it default to two selections would be appreciated.


Unlike others, I use link without diversity quite often.  So having a 
button to control this is a need for me.

73 de Brian/K3KO

On 3/5/2013 04:30, Gary wrote:

I don't see Wayne's offer as a change to the present configuration instead
he's offering to enhance it by adding a menu item that would allow disabling
this feature, for those who don't want it. Those who do want it would simply
need to enable it once (after the firmware update) then operate as before.
Gary N6LRV

-Original Message-
From: elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net
[mailto:elecraft-boun...@mailman.qth.net] On Behalf Of Toby Pennington
Sent: Monday, March 04, 2013 11:13 AM
To: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: [Elecraft] LINK-UNLINK

Wayne,   I see no reason to change the present configuration on link-unlink.
It seems to work well the way it is.

Toby  W4CAK
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 - Eric &Co.... Please relocate the Link/UnLink button.

[Brian Alsop]

This illustrates why the K3 needs more programmable buttons.

I programmed this function on M2 button since I never need memories.
The unlink is done the programmed M4 button--in conjunction with unsplit.

I use this a lot.

73 de Brian/K3KO

On 3/4/2013 14:58, LA8AW wrote:

Today it happened again for TX5K, last year for PT0S and HK0NA,
probably for other DX stations as well:
The DX station TX frequency is jumping up/down.

And the reason is:

The Link function is activated when holding down the SUB rx button for
a short period of time, and there is no indications in the display to
tell that the VFO's are linked.

The operators is probably going to use the Lock function, on the RATE
button, instead push the SUB button (yes, lock is clearly labelled
above the SUB button.)

I suggest to make Link/UnLink as a Menu option instead of a "hidden"
function on the SUB button


_

73 de LA8AW - Odd-Egil
_
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 TXCO for JT65?

[Brian Alsop]

Frank,

Yes the standard TXCO is good enough for JT65.  It is also good enough 
for WSPR which is even more picky.


Last test I did of drift was at 24.9 MHz.  The K3 (standard TXCO) 
drifted 3Hz/hr (after a 6 hours of warmup) relative to my Rb standard.

Expect more if you just turn K3 on and use.

73 de Brian/K3KO

On 3/1/2013 18:15, Frank Precissi wrote:

Hi Gang,

After hoarding away my lunch money from the XYL, I'm about ready to buy a
K3 so my KX3 has some Elecraft company.

I like to do JT65, so my question is that should I go for the high
precision TXCO or is the default adequate?

Oh, and if I take the hour drive to Aptos with a fist-full of cash, will
they sell me a K3 from there (my XYL looks at the credit card reciepts) heh
:)

Frank
KG6EYC
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Re: [Elecraft] K3/0 power

[Brian Alsop]

On 2/26/2013 20:13, Rick Bates wrote:
It isn't.
One needs a 3 amp 18vac AC wall wart, diodes, a few caps an LT1803 
adjustable regulator and a few resistors.


The use of an AC wall wart eliminates any switching supply concerns.

73 de Brian/K3KO



It shouldn't be difficult to build a small, linear, regulated supply for an amp 
or so with parts from the local supply house.  Packaging it is the greater 
challenge.

Rick wa6nhc

Tiny iPhone 5 keypad, typos are inevitable
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Re: [Elecraft] K2 tuner and G5RV

[Brian Alsop]

Ariel,

Please explain to me how your SWR measurements translate to ERP.

There are a whole bunch of things potentially between your rig and the 
antenna.  Then of course there is antenna pattern.


I once had a summer job at Airborne Instruments Labs.  Part of the 
"summer trainee" job was to listen to lectures from some of the engineers.


One particular engineer knew hams worshiped SWR.  He showed us their 
latest satellite antenna.  It had a 5:1 SWR few relative to 50 ohms. 
Their measurments showed no measurable loss due to mismatch.   Why? The 
length of the feedline was 6".


73 de Brian/K3KO



On 2/14/2013 00:23, Ariel Jacala wrote:

I second Gerald.  The Zs6 is a much more efficient antenna and provides a 
better balance of performance.  I got DXCC on the G5RV but I got DXCC  - QRP on 
the ZS6BKW.  I took comparative measurements of SWR using an AA-200 analyzer 
between the two and you can read it on my blog at http://www.ny4g.blogspot.com.

The ZS6BKW is not a perfect antenna but it is the least imperfect of the simple 
single wire antennas IMHO.  If you want a better multiband, you can try the 
super loop but it is a multiple wire delta loop.

The K2 will tune a G5RV but your ERP will be better on the ZS6

Ariel NY4G

Sent from my iPhone

On Feb 13, 2013, at 5:18 PM, "Gerald Manthey"  wrote:


I would prefer the ZS6BKW , it is a improved G5RV. Google it and I think
you will be impressed compared to the G5RV 102.
Just my option.
Gerald- KC6CNN
On Feb 13, 2013 4:14 PM, "Paul and Sue Huff"  wrote:


Here in the dead of winter I am thinking about spring antenna projects.
One of the antennas that I am considering is a basic 102 ft G5RV.  I would
be interested in hearing about any experience that anyone has had with this
antenna and a K2 (QRP) with the internal antenna tuner.  Is the tuner able
to provide a match on all bands from 80 to 10?  (I don't work 60 meters).

Thanks in advance for any information that you might have to share.

73,
Paul - N8XMS

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[Elecraft] K3 Firmware program and Virtual serial port

[Brian Alsop]

Guys,

Maybe this has come up before.  It is now obvious that the K3 firmware 
program will not work on a virtual serial port (LPBRIDGE).  Tried.


For curiosity, why is that?

73 de Brian/K3KO


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[Elecraft] W1 wanted

[Brian Alsop]

Let me know if you have one available and shipped price.

73 de Brian/K3KO


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Re: [Elecraft] [K3] RE: Custom 700 Hz 8-Pole K3 Filters (by INRAD)

[Brian Alsop]

Hmm, wouldn't the DSP filter be good enough for this purpose?
Except for obnoxious PACTOR, there are generally not the 40db over S9 
signals to reject.


73 de Brian/K3KO


On 1/27/2013 14:17, KD8NNU wrote:

I use mine for digital modes.   There are times where a 500 hz could be
too narrow.   That is the reason I purchased mine.



~73
Don
KD8NNU
-.- -.. ---.. -. -. ..-
-Original Message- From: John_N1JM
Sent: Sunday, January 27, 2013 9:08 AM
To: elecraft@mailman.qth.net
Subject: Re: [Elecraft] [K3] RE: Custom 700 Hz 8-Pole K3 Filters (by INRAD)

Out of curiosity, what would one use or need  a 700hz filter for?

73, John N1JM


Gary W. Hvizdak wrote

P.S.  The filters retail for $145 each + S&H, with S&H being as follows
...
o   Domestic = $6
o   Canada & Mexico = $14
o   All other international destinations (one or two filters) = $18
o   All other international destinations (more than two filters) = $34

73,
Gary  KI4GGX
(webmaster)

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http://elecraft.365791.n2.nabble.com/K3-RE-Custom-700-Hz-8-Pole-K3-Filters-by-INRAD-tp7569179p7569181.html

Sent from the Elecraft mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
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Re: [Elecraft] K3 Receiver

[Brian Alsop]

Larry,

Is this antenna different from other bands or has it band specific 
components?


It sounds like a set of dirty relay contacts or a bad joint. I've had 
this on a few antenna switches.  The xmit voltage is enough to punch 
through but microvolts aren't.


73 de Brian/K3KO

On 1/24/2013 16:44, Larry Boekeloo wrote:

Good morning everyone from snowy, frigid Michigan...


I have K3 SN# 52XX and the receive seems to come and go on 30 mts - that's 
where I notice it the most but it happens on other bands too.


My AGC settings are:

AGC DLY - NORM
  AGC HLD - 0
  AGC PLS - NORM
  AGC SLP - 4
  AGC THR - 12
  AGC F - 120
  AGC S - 20

For example, the S-meter will be reading an S3 noise level and I can see it on 
the P3.  Suddenly, the noise levels drops to zero and the P3 follows.  If I'm 
listening to a CW signal, that signal drops too.  If I hit the keyer and send a 
dit, the receive comes back.  I've noticed this on a few of the other bands too.

I am running the latest firmware and software but I've noticed it on the 
previous versions too.


Ideas???

Thanks.

Larry, KN8N




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Re: [Elecraft] Is the K3 a "fun" radio to operate ?

[Brian Alsop]

Now if we only had some decent labels to stick on those "10 switches"

Conventional computer labels seem to last a couple weeks before peeling 
off.  Tiny writing isn't my strength so they are cryptic and only 
marginally readable. M1-M4 require diagonal printing.


The other criterion is they have to come off at a desired time without 
residue.


73 de Brian/K3KO


On 1/17/2013 15:26, Wayne Burdick wrote:

The K3 has an average number of menu entries for a radio in its class.
But we've reduced the need to use the menu in two ways.

First, virtually every switch on the K3 has both tap and hold functions.
This doubles the number of functions available on the panel.

Second, the K3 has up to 10 switches that can be programmed to directly
execute menu functions or macros. Of these, up to four are taps and six
are holds. Macros are, in effect, fully customizable switches (allowing
the operator to define what "fun" means :)

Macros can be created using KX3 Utility and sent to the radio. A single
macro can do things like "turn on the sub RX, copy VFO A to B, move B up
2 kHz, enter split mode, and set BW to 200 Hz."

73,
Wayne
N6KR


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Re: [Elecraft] K3 CWT Function with firmware MCU 4.60 / DSP 2.80

[Brian Alsop]

CWT is not working as well in 4.61 either.  It doesn't hit zero beat 
within 4 Hz.  It used to be spot on.  This observation was made and 
posted here when 4.61 came out.


73 de Brian/K3KO


On 1/16/2013 18:36, Chad Wasinger wrote:

Has anyone experienced any issues with not decoding a good cw signal via the 
CWT function on firmware version 4.60/2.80? I've been running the older 4.48 
which is the best firmware I've seen for the CWT function to work properly. I 
did note that the 4.60 firmware had some fixes in it for the CWT function, yet 
I'm not having any luck making it work right. I've tried all the recommend 
settings as well. When I revert back to 4.48, all is good. Also, my KX3 is spot 
on with the CW decoding. I thought possibly my AGC menu's might need adjusted 
but looks like this new release has it's own independent AGC algorithms.
Suggestions?
Thanks,ChadN0YK


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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 RFI problem

[Brian Alsop]

Dave,

Most likely a tuner is being used.
If the balun failed one might not notice that since one generally tunes 
to min SWR.  Unless one recognizes something changed, one wouldn't know 
it failed.  This is especially true for auto tuners.


This "not knowing it failed" is wide spread for bead baluns-- although 
this isn't the case here.


73 de Brian/K3KO


On 1/9/2013 17:26, David Gilbert wrote:


If that balun had overheated and become ruined on 12m it almost
certainly would have affected other bands as well.  A ruined balun is a
changed balun.

Dave   AB7E



On 1/9/2013 7:26 AM, Brian Alsop wrote:

Sounds like the 4:1 balun may be overheating on 12M.  Chances are if
you've been doing this for a bit, it's ruined.  Heat anneals the core
and changes it's electrical properties for the worse.  Heat may have
cracked it.

Now whether a 4:1 balun is the thing to use is another issue.
You don't say how long your open wire line is so it is impossible to
estimate the impedance seen by the balun.

Here are the approximate antenna feedpoint impedances for a 120'
double 50' up.

80M 47 -j188  SWR=17:1   4:1 balun at antenna feedpoint makes
situation worse
40M 1724 +j1869  SWR =75:1  4:1 balun at antenna helps
20M 415 + j880  SWR =45:1   4:1 balun at antenna helps
15M 186+281jSWR =13:1   4:1 balun at antenna helps
12M 1293-155jSWR =63:1   4:1 balun at antenna helps
10M 122.4-j100  SWR =4:14:1 balun at antenna helps

It is clear that 12M may be close to the worst of the lot

If one knew the electrical properties and length of the ladder line,
one can do the impedance transformations and determine just what
impedances the balun sees.  One may end up with entirely different
conclusions from above.  The G5RV is an example of a "doublet" antenna
where the ladder line length is pruned to find an acceptable match on
several bands.

73 de Brian/K3KO





On 1/9/2013 13:41, Jim Miller wrote:

I strongly suspect you have a common mode problem. These can be very
frequency dependent.

Read: http://audiosystemsgroup.com/RFI-Ham.pdf especially the section on
common mode chokes. There is a cookbook near the end for band specific
chokes.

For more details on the math read:
http://fermi.la.asu.edu/w9cf/articles/balun.pdf

I'd also recommend you take out the 4:1 transformer.

Good luck

jim ab3cv

On Tue, Jan 8, 2013 at 8:06 PM, Ron W3ZV  wrote:


At least I'm pretty sure its an RFI problem. I have a K3, KAT500 and
the
KPA500 connected as recommended with Elecraft DB15HD cables. The
antenna is
a 120ft. doublet fed with ladder line to a 4:1 balun and 10ft of
coax to
the KAT500. I have a comment point ground to a ground rod six foot
from the
shack. I have operated the amp at 400+ watts from 80m to 6m. The
only band
that gives me a problem is 12m. When I am operating at 400 watts
ssb, the
amp will fault with a high swr indication within 5 to 20 seconds.
Immediately prior to the fault the swr on the amp display was 1.2:1.
Reducing power to below 300 watts seems to avoid the problem.

Assuming the consensus is that this is RFI, what would be the most
likely
suspect? Coax cables in/out? DB15HD cable? Power cable? What's the
easiest
way to diagnose and correct the problem? Thanks

Ron W3ZV




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Re: [Elecraft] KPA500 RFI problem

[Brian Alsop]

Sounds like the 4:1 balun may be overheating on 12M.  Chances are if 
you've been doing this for a bit, it's ruined.  Heat anneals the core 
and changes it's electrical properties for the worse.  Heat may have 
cracked it.


Now whether a 4:1 balun is the thing to use is another issue.
You don't say how long your open wire line is so it is impossible to 
estimate the impedance seen by the balun.


Here are the approximate antenna feedpoint impedances for a 120' double 
50' up.


80M 47 -j188  SWR=17:1   4:1 balun at antenna feedpoint makes situation 
worse

40M 1724 +j1869  SWR =75:1  4:1 balun at antenna helps
20M 415 + j880  SWR =45:1   4:1 balun at antenna helps
15M 186+281jSWR =13:1   4:1 balun at antenna helps
12M 1293-155j   SWR =63:1   4:1 balun at antenna helps
10M 122.4-j100  SWR =4:14:1 balun at antenna helps

It is clear that 12M may be close to the worst of the lot

If one knew the electrical properties and length of the ladder line, one 
can do the impedance transformations and determine just what impedances 
the balun sees.  One may end up with entirely different conclusions from 
above.  The G5RV is an example of a "doublet" antenna where the ladder 
line length is pruned to find an acceptable match on several bands.


73 de Brian/K3KO





On 1/9/2013 13:41, Jim Miller wrote:

I strongly suspect you have a common mode problem. These can be very
frequency dependent.

Read: http://audiosystemsgroup.com/RFI-Ham.pdf especially the section on
common mode chokes. There is a cookbook near the end for band specific
chokes.

For more details on the math read:
http://fermi.la.asu.edu/w9cf/articles/balun.pdf

I'd also recommend you take out the 4:1 transformer.

Good luck

jim ab3cv

On Tue, Jan 8, 2013 at 8:06 PM, Ron W3ZV  wrote:


At least I'm pretty sure its an RFI problem. I have a K3, KAT500 and the
KPA500 connected as recommended with Elecraft DB15HD cables. The antenna is
a 120ft. doublet fed with ladder line to a 4:1 balun and 10ft of coax to
the KAT500. I have a comment point ground to a ground rod six foot from the
shack. I have operated the amp at 400+ watts from 80m to 6m. The only band
that gives me a problem is 12m. When I am operating at 400 watts ssb, the
amp will fault with a high swr indication within 5 to 20 seconds.
Immediately prior to the fault the swr on the amp display was 1.2:1.
Reducing power to below 300 watts seems to avoid the problem.

Assuming the consensus is that this is RFI, what would be the most likely
suspect? Coax cables in/out? DB15HD cable? Power cable? What's the easiest
way to diagnose and correct the problem? Thanks

Ron W3ZV




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[Elecraft] Odd subrx problem

[Brian Alsop]

This has happened enough to raise it as an issue.

I have a SDR on the subrx IF.  I operate mostly CW.  The SDR is set so 
that frequencies agree at zero beat on CW.  A/B VFO's are linked for 
normal everyday operation.  I use ROCKY for everyday use and SKIMMER for 
contests.


If I change mode to say SSB, the SDR/panadapter display remains proper.

However when I change the mode back to CW, the subrx's display is 
displaced from where it should be.  It takes an A->>B ALL to bring it 
back to normal.


Anybody else see this?  It appears to be some sort of bug.  Since it is 
evident in both ROCKY and SKIMMER, I'm suspecting the K3.  ROCKY is not 
linked at all to the K3 and knows nothing about mode.


73 de Brian/K3KO


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Re: [Elecraft] KPA-500 band data input

[Brian Alsop]

Thanks guys.  This is how it is behaving.  I don't have a schematic for 
the KPA-500 so it is impossible to determine if there are pullup 
resistors or not.


Glad that Elecraft firmware recognizes that if the band is undefined, RF 
sensing of the band become active.


73 de Brian/K3KO

On 1/5/2013 16:02, Don Wilhelm wrote:

Brian,

OK, Jack Brindle sent me a correction - open BCD lines are at a high
level, not low, so the band is undefined.  Also, the AUXBUS is not in
use for this situation.

Sorry for the confusion.

73,
Don W3FPR


Brian,

The open BCD lines should signal 60 meters to the KPA500.  See the band
data chart in the K3 manual.

The normal way the KPA500 works (with the K3) when you press a band
button on the KPA500, it communicates that information to the K3 over
the AUXBUS - the KPA500 does not receive information from the K3 over
the AUXBUS, information flows only from the KPA500 to the K3.

Then the KPA500 waits until the K3 switches bands and presents data on
its BCD outputs - at that time, the KPA500 switches to the same band as
the K3.

Are you breaking the K3 to KPA500 BCD outputs with your antenna
switching hardware?  Ideally I would think the antenna switching would
only listen in on the K3 BCD outputs and react accordingly, but you may
have implemented something more complex.

73,
Don W3FPR

On 1/5/2013 8:34 AM, Brian Alsop wrote:

Question: What "band" is selected when the Radio=BCD and the inputs
are open?

It appears to revert to RF sensing.

The situation is this.  Antenna switching stuff automatically echos
the band BCD data to the KPA-500.  The exception is if one manually
selects an antenna.  In that case power to the auto mode PIC is turned
off and one gets whatever the PIC outputs are with no supplied Vss.

73 de Brian/K3KO




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[Elecraft] KPA-500 band data input

[Brian Alsop]

Question:  What "band" is selected when the Radio=BCD and the inputs are 
open?


It appears to revert to RF sensing.

The situation is this.  Antenna switching stuff automatically echos the 
band BCD data to the KPA-500.  The exception is if one manually selects 
an antenna.  In that case power to the auto mode PIC is turned off and 
one gets whatever the PIC outputs are with no supplied Vss.


73 de Brian/K3KO


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Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
Version: 2012.0.2221 / Virus Database: 2637/5511 - Release Date: 01/05/13

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