Re: [Finale] email filtering misuse

[dhbailey]

Mark D Lew wrote:
On Jan 11, 2005, at 4:51 PM, Owain Sutton wrote:
Who charges the tax?  Email isn't based on agreements between national 
organisations in the way the postal system is.  Either you create a 
separate national email system, or you find a way of implementing such 
a tax everywhere from the Cayman Islands to mafia-ridden ex-Soviet 
states.

Yes, that's the problem.  I'm just saying that if we can figure out a 
way to implement it effectively, that would be a good thing.

Even if we come up with a working tax applied only on ISPs registered in 
participating nations, isn't that an improvement?  It means that (1) the 
tax-evading spammers are obliged to go to an extra effort to be 
registered offshore, and (2) spam-filtering systems can then get to work 
on offering an option to reject all emails from ISPs in the Cayman 
Islands etc.

mdl
That's a bit of a pipe-dream, isn't it?  If hackers can spoof my e-mail 
address so it appears to come from New Hampshire, why do you think they 
would be able to block e-mail from a specific country?  All they would 
have to do is to spoof everything (it won't be long before that happens, 
even if hasn't already) in the headers.

A charge on e-mails won't stop the spam -- the USPS keeps charging 
people for mailing junk mail, and it hasn't stemmed the tide of garbage 
that gets into my mailbox.  The spam will merely change shape, where 
there will be monolithic spam operations in legitimate countries, paying 
the fee, which they will develop enough political clout to put a cap on 
the e-mail payments, so the spam-centers will pay a large amount, but on 
a per-message basis, it will end up being so cheap as to do nothing 
except to make some millionaires out of a few enterprising spammers who 
work around the charges.

And it will cost all the rest of us and then lead to other internet 
taxes once governments see all the income generated by your innocuous 
e-mail tax.

Face it, folks, junk mail, pesky phone calls, spam, are a part of life, 
live with however you want, with a white-list service, with 57 different 
e-mail addresses, whatever you want, but tread lightly when you start 
willingly offer to pay a tax.

Remember the US income tax, originally at something like 3%, which 
wasn't written into the Constitutional amendment only because everybody 
agreed back then that nobody would ever need to raise it above that.  It 
seemed so unlikely as to be impossible, and now look at it!

I'd rather receive 500 FREE spams each day and keep e-mail free, than to 
pay an initial tax of $7 as someone suggested.  Because I know that in 
another few years it will be $70, then $700 and then the internet will 
become the haven of only the wealthy and the whole benefit of the 
instantaneous, free interchange of information will be gone in a flash 
and we'll be stuck with just another income-producer for bloated 
worthless governments to suck dry.

--
David H. Bailey
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Re: [Finale] email filtering misuse

[Phil Daley]

At 06:26 PM 1/11/2005, David W. Fenton wrote:
 
>On 11 Jan 2005 at 6:42, Phil Daley wrote:
>
>> At 1/10/2005 09:28 PM, David W. Fenton wrote:
>> 
>>  >If you're *not* receiving all your spam and evaluating
for false
>>  >positives on a regular basis, then you're losing some
percentage of
>>  >legitimate messages.
>> 
>> This is obviously your personal opinion since, as a blanket
statement,
>> it is false.
>
>It is not provably true that you *are* receiving all of them unless

>you're reviewing all of your messages.
>
>Is knowing you are losing some for a fact really any worse than not

>knowing for certain whether you are or are not?
I check them all every day on the web.
It takes about 2 minutes to go through the spams looking for valid From
addresses.


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Re: [Finale] OT: email "tax" (was email filtering misuse)

[Mark D Lew]

On Jan 12, 2005, at 2:42 AM, dhbailey wrote:
That's a bit of a pipe-dream, isn't it?  If hackers can spoof my 
e-mail address so it appears to come from New Hampshire, why do you 
think they would be able to block e-mail from a specific country?  All 
they would have to do is to spoof everything (it won't be long before 
that happens, even if hasn't already) in the headers.
No, it's not a pipe dream.  It's a sound policy goal which is still 
searching for a sound means of implementation.  We've already 
acknowledged that there are practical obstacles that need to be figured 
out.  You cite one such obstacle and present it as evidence that the 
goal is bad.  By your logic, we may as well give up on reducing health 
care costs, fighting terrorism, and curing cancer as well.

Like traffic congestion, air pollution, and overfishing the oceans, 
email spam is the product of a market failure.  It's perfectly 
reasonable to look for a mechanism to correct that market failure.

A charge on e-mails won't stop the spam -- the USPS keeps charging 
people for mailing junk mail, and it hasn't stemmed the tide of 
garbage that gets into my mailbox.
Oh yes it has.  You don't think that you'd get ten times as much junk 
mail if postage were free?   I've worked in the junk mail industry and 
I can assure you that they are very very aware of what sort of a 
response rate they get for every piece.  The single biggest concern of 
junk mailers is how to improve their response rate, and a big part of 
that equation is eliminating people from their list who they know won't 
respond.  There is no such incentive for email spammers. That's the 
problem.

  The spam will merely change shape, where there will be monolithic 
spam operations in legitimate countries, paying the fee, which they 
will develop enough political clout to put a cap on the e-mail 
payments, so the spam-centers will pay a large amount, but on a 
per-message basis, it will end up being so cheap as to do nothing 
except to make some millionaires out of a few enterprising spammers 
who work around the charges.

And it will cost all the rest of us and then lead to other internet 
taxes once governments see all the income generated by your innocuous 
e-mail tax.

Face it, folks, junk mail, pesky phone calls, spam, are a part of 
life, live with however you want, with a white-list service, with 57 
different e-mail addresses, whatever you want, but tread lightly when 
you start willingly offer to pay a tax.

Remember the US income tax, originally at something like 3%, which 
wasn't written into the Constitutional amendment only because 
everybody agreed back then that nobody would ever need to raise it 
above that.  It seemed so unlikely as to be impossible, and now look 
at it!

I'd rather receive 500 FREE spams each day and keep e-mail free, than 
to pay an initial tax of $7 as someone suggested.  Because I know that 
in another few years it will be $70, then $700 and then the internet 
will become the haven of only the wealthy and the whole benefit of the 
instantaneous, free interchange of information will be gone in a flash 
and we'll be stuck with just another income-producer for bloated 
worthless governments to suck dry.
Jeez, talk about paranoid.  Your comparison to income tax is a terrible 
analogy, for so many reasons.  Aside from getting your facts wrong, you 
imply that income tax is both a typical tax and analogous to the 
discussion at hand, when in fact it is neither.

There are numerous reasons why income tax expanded in the 20th century 
as a means of funding the growing public sector, none of which have 
anything to putting a small fee on emails.  It is not a universal 
pattern that every tax increases enormously once it is put into place.  
Our income tax is atypical, and you'd be hard pressed to name any tax 
that has had a similar history. Anyway, even if an email tax does 
increase at the same rate that U.S. income tax did historically, you're 
still looking at about a 15-fold increase over the course of 90 years, 
not the 100-fold increase in "few years" that you describe in your 
hyperbolic last paragraph.

A better comparison would be the price of a postage stamp.  When the 
first U.S. postage stamp was released in 1847, the price to mail a 
letter was 5 cents. Adjusted for inflation, that's equivalent to about 
one dollar in today's money, which means that in the course of 150 
years the fee went down, not up.

As for that "initial tax of $7" that "someone suggested", you got that 
number from me, and it was put forth as a maximal estimate, assuming a 
fee of 0.02 cents per piece on a person who sends 100 emails a day.  Do 
you send a hundred emails a day?  If you're like the rest of us, your 
output is probably closer to 20 a day, if even that.  And there's no 
reason your ISP can't give you an allowance of $5 or whatever.  The 
cost to the normal user must be trivial. That's not just an auxiliary 
policy goal; it is essential to the worki

Re: [Finale] email filtering misuse

[Christopher Smith]

On Jan 12, 2005, at 5:42 AM, dhbailey wrote:
I'd rather receive 500 FREE spams each day and keep e-mail free, than 
to pay an initial tax of $7 as someone suggested.  Because I know that 
in another few years it will be $70, then $700 and then the internet 
will become the haven of only the wealthy and the whole benefit of the 
instantaneous, free interchange of information will be gone in a flash 
and we'll be stuck with just another income-producer for bloated 
worthless governments to suck dry.


Uh-oh. We're not going to be reading about you holed up in a Montana 
cabin holding off the "Revenooers" with a shotgun, are we? 8-)

Sorry if that seems like I'm mocking you, but for tax excess, try 
living in Canada, particularly Quebec, which has the heaviest tax load 
in North America. You would be taking to the streets in no time.

On the other hand, self-employed artists get a handy tax break, and the 
price of living is low, so it's not all that bad.

Christopher
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Re: [Finale] OT: Mac Mini

[Darcy James Argue]

On 12 Jan 2005, at 02:20 AM, A-NO-NE Music wrote:
OWC is a great place until you need their
after sales help.
Actually, I've had great customer service from OWC, including a number 
of returns.  Never had any trouble with them.

Cheers,
- Darcy
-
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Brooklyn, NY
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Re: [Finale] Re: [OT] font order jumbled in OSX

[Andrew Stiller]

andrew, i just upgraded to 10.3.6 and then 10.3.7, and in searching to 
see just what was different in the versions found this (for 10.3.6 
updater):
...
Other
* Resolves a situation in which incorrect characters could show up for 
some fonts.

Thanks for that. When I finally succeed in downloadin OSX 10.3.7 I 
guess I'll find out for myself...

--Andrew
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Re: [Finale] OT: Mac Mini

[Bonnie Harris]

Now, if they'd just add audio line-in as well as out..guess you 
can't put *everything* in such a small box?
Bonnie
On Tuesday, January 11, 2005, at 09:54 PM, Darcy James Argue wrote:

Okay, I bit the bullet and preordered the 1.42 GHz model:
http://www.apple.com/macmini/specs.html
Apple says I should receive it on Jan 22 so I will let you know how it 
performs (especially when running Garritan Personal Orchestra, which I 
also ordered).

I got the internal BT/AirPort upgrade as well -- the combo was 
reasonably priced.  The only really annoying thing is that Apple 
wanted an extra *$425* to raise the memory to 1 GB.  (512 MB RAM was 
only $75 extra, go figure -- normally, I figure I could squeak by with 
512 MB, but I hear GPO really wants 1 GB.)  So I'm just hoping that 
the memory on the Mini will be user-upgradeable -- Apple's site says 
no, but I guess we shall see.

If worst comes to worst, I figure I can buy the memory stick from OWC 
for under $200, take it to the Apple Store or TekServe, and have them 
install it there -- I don't know how much that will set me back, but 
the total cost will surely be less than $425.

At any rate, I probably shouldn't have gotten that 1 GHz G4 upgrade 
for my venerable Beige G3 last year (up from the 533 MHz G4 upgrade I 
already had installed), but I just couldn't stand it anymore.  Finale 
was simply not bearable without the upgrade, and maybe now I'll get a 
few extra bucks on eBay for my venerable beige box.  But with the 
pricing on these Mac Minis, Apple just made processor upgrades 
obsolete.

Apparently the Mac Mini is *completely silent*, as well.  I will let 
y'all know if this is the case, but if it's true, hoo-boy, am I ever 
looking forward to *that*.

Also, the computer comes w/Garage Band 2.0, so I'll post a review of 
it's music notation capabilities as well. [grin]

- Darcy
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[Finale] Finale 2005 printing bug with pdfs- OS X

[David Horne]

I seem to remember a thread here quite a while back reporting a bug when
printing pdfs of finale 95 files created with OS X. Well, I just
received a score from my publishers, and it seems the bug has struck
again! All whole bar and semiquaver rests print as ppp marks. (File was
created with Finale 2005 and OS 10.3.5) I'll put to one side the fact
that
someone must have printed this off without noticing the glaring problem!
(It's on every page as far as I can tell.)

I'm just wondering if the original person who wrote about this would be
able to say if there was any fix to the problem? It's very bad timing,
as there is an open rehearsal of the piece on Friday, and I'm terrified
the problem has affected parts as well as score. (The players and
conductor have had the parts for a couple of weeks- I'd have thought
they'd have complained if no one noticed it!)

Any assistance on this would be much appreciated.

Thanks,

David
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Re: [Finale] OT: Mac Mini

[Darcy James Argue]

On 12 Jan 2005, at 03:22 PM, Bonnie Harris wrote:
Now, if they'd just add audio line-in as well as out..guess you 
can't put *everything* in such a small box?
Bonnie
Well, you'd want at least a 24-bit/96KHz breakout box anyway.  (Rumors 
of Apple's own FireWire breakout box abound... )

Anyway, I'm glad they didn't try to shove in a cheap audio input that 
no one would want to use.

- Darcy
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Re: [Finale] Garage Band 2

[Matthew Hindson Fastmail Account]

Mark D Lew wrote:
>Or maybe Recordare will look into creating a utility to convert them
> to MusicXML?
If they could it would be great, because since GB is based on Logic, we 
would have some hope of directly exporting MusicXML files from Logic as 
well.

BTW GarageBand is a great little app for anyone who hasn't tried it. 
It's an extreme resource hog, but still, students LOVE working with it. 
 And once they learn how to bounce down tracks to save processing 
power, it's possible to do some quite sophisticated things with it, even 
if you can't change time signatures.

Matthew
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[Finale] DVI splitter

[Darcy James Argue]

Hey everyone,
Is there such a thing as a DVI splitter cable -- in other words, a DVI 
cable that will effectively do video mirroring off of a single DVI 
port?  (Or, is there perhaps a cable that will split into both DVI and 
VGA?)

Failing that, is there some sort of switcher box that would allow me to 
easily switch back and forth between two different monitors?

[In case y'all hadn't guessed, I'm trying to figure out my display 
options for the Mac mini.]

Cheers,
- Darcy
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Re: [Finale] DVI splitter

[JohnBlane]

In a message dated 1/12/05 4:13:02 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:



Failing that, is there some sort of switcher box that would allow me to
easily switch back and forth between two different monitors?


Darcy -

Check out Dr. Bott. They have a switcher box.
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Re: [Finale] DVI splitter

[Darcy James Argue]

Hi John,
Did you have a product in mind?  The only switches I saw were ones 
designed to share a single monitor between multiple computers, not the 
other way around (which is what I want).

However, I did find this cable, which looks promising:
http://www.pacificcable.com/Picture_Page.asp?DataName=DVIIY-1
Apparently, it splits the DVI-I signal (analog+digital) into separate 
analog and digital streams.  Some people have managed to get it to work 
on the Radeon 9700 (PC version).

If I was confident that this would work on the Mac mini's Radeon 9200, 
I'd get it in a flash.

Cheers,
- Darcy
-
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Brooklyn, NY
On 12 Jan 2005, at 05:17 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 In a message dated 1/12/05 4:13:02 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

 Failing that, is there some sort of switcher box that would allow me 
to
 easily switch back and forth between two different monitors?


 Darcy -
 Check out Dr. Bott. They have a switcher box.
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Re: [Finale] DVI splitter

[A-NO-NE Music]

Darcy James Argue / 05.1.12 / 05:12 PM wrote:

>Is there such a thing as a DVI splitter cable -- in other words, a DVI 
>cable that will effectively do video mirroring off of a single DVI 
>port?  (Or, is there perhaps a cable that will split into both DVI and 
>VGA?)

I believe Gefen (not Geffen) does.  Gefen is probably the only pro DVI
accessory manufactures trusted by many studios around here.  I just went
to their site to check it out, but their site, gefen.com seems to be down
right now.

By the way, Egghead is doing this for you:
 tho, MacFix reports you won't be able to install RAM in Mac
mini by yourself :-(

One more thing.  After all, I realized Mac mini is not fan-less.  Hope it
doesn't emit high fan noise as Powerbook 2nd fan does.  Awaiting for your
report!
:-)

-- 

- Hiro

Hiroaki Honshuku, A-NO-NE Music, Boston, MA
 


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[Finale] Mac mini noise

[Chuck Israels]

I have no info on this specific question, but G5 tower fans are so quiet, under most conditions, that I am able to work undisturbed within about 18 inches of mine, and I was irritated by my G4.  If the fans in the Mac mini are as well designed and engineered, it should be OK.

Awaiting a more complete report and wishing good luck to you, Darcy.

Chuck




Chuck Israels
230 North Garden Terrace
Bellingham, WA 98225-5836
phone (360) 671-3402
fax (360) 676-6055
www.chuckisraels.com
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Re: [Finale] DVI splitter

[JohnBlane]

In a message dated 1/12/05 5:22:43 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:



Did you have a product in mind?  The only switches I saw were ones
designed to share a single monitor between multiple computers, not the
other way around (which is what I want).

However, I did find this cable, which looks promising:

http://www.pacificcable.com/Picture_Page.asp?DataName=DVIIY-1



That doesn't seem like it will accomplish what you want - you want to share a monitor between 2 computers not send video to 2 monitors, right?   Check out the Moniswitch line at Dr. Bott. I use one to toggle one of my 2 cinema displays between my G5 and a G4.
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Re: [Finale] DVI splitter

[Darcy James Argue]

On 12 Jan 2005, at 07:18 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
That doesn't seem like it will accomplish what you want - you want to 
share a monitor between 2 computers not send video to 2 monitors, 
right? 
No.  The opposite.  One computer/DVI port, two monitors.  Just like I 
said below:

The only switches I saw were ones
 designed to share a single monitor between multiple computers, not the
 other way around (which is what I want).
Cheers,
- Darcy
-
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Re: [Finale] DVI splitter

[JohnBlane]

In a message dated 1/12/05 6:23:30 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:


On 12 Jan 2005, at 07:18 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> That doesn't seem like it will accomplish what you want - you want to
> share a monitor between 2 computers not send video to 2 monitors,
> right? 

No.  The opposite.  One computer/DVI port, two monitors.  Just like I
said below:

> The only switches I saw were ones
>  designed to share a single monitor between multiple computers, not the
>  other way around (which is what I want).


Ah, sorry I misunderstood you. Maybe that cable you found will work for you then. You might still check out Gefen. They often provide solutions that no one else does but they are also a bit pricey.

good luck.
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Re: [Finale] email filtering misuse - musicminister@landmarkcog.com

[Darcy James Argue]

Dear Henry,
Would you please remove <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> from the Finale 
list, and permanently ban that email address?  This is getting 
completely out of hand.

(In case you are not aware -- every time *anyone* sends an email to the 
Finale list, they get spammed with automated email from 
"musicminister's" whitelist software.  I even sent (or, that is, tried 
to send) him private email explaining the situation and politely 
requesting that he either configure his whitelist correctly or disable 
the software -- or if he was unwilling to do so, unsubscribe from the 
list.

It has now been several days and the whitelist abuse continues.  IMO it 
is long past time for "musicminister" to get the boot.  And I know I'm 
not the only one who feels this way.

- Darcy
-
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Brooklyn, NY
On 12 Jan 2005, at 08:10 AM, Christopher Smith wrote:
On Jan 12, 2005, at 5:42 AM, dhbailey wrote:
I'd rather receive 500 FREE spams each day and keep e-mail free, than 
to pay an initial tax of $7 as someone suggested.  Because I know 
that in another few years it will be $70, then $700 and then the 
internet will become the haven of only the wealthy and the whole 
benefit of the instantaneous, free interchange of information will be 
gone in a flash and we'll be stuck with just another income-producer 
for bloated worthless governments to suck dry.


Uh-oh. We're not going to be reading about you holed up in a Montana 
cabin holding off the "Revenooers" with a shotgun, are we? 8-)

Sorry if that seems like I'm mocking you, but for tax excess, try 
living in Canada, particularly Quebec, which has the heaviest tax load 
in North America. You would be taking to the streets in no time.

On the other hand, self-employed artists get a handy tax break, and 
the price of living is low, so it's not all that bad.

Christopher
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Re: [Finale] email filtering misuse - musicminister@landmarkcog.com

[Dean M. Estabrook]

I dunno ... best look out for lightning bolts, more earthquakes, and 
diverse other Revelation type activities ...

:)
Dean
On Jan 12, 2005, at 4:35 PM, Darcy James Argue wrote:
Dear Henry,
Would you please remove <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> from the 
Finale list, and permanently ban that email address?  This is getting 
completely out of hand.

(In case you are not aware -- every time *anyone* sends an email to 
the Finale list, they get spammed with automated email from 
"musicminister's" whitelist software.  I even sent (or, that is, tried 
to send) him private email explaining the situation and politely 
requesting that he either configure his whitelist correctly or disable 
the software -- or if he was unwilling to do so, unsubscribe from the 
list.

It has now been several days and the whitelist abuse continues.  IMO 
it is long past time for "musicminister" to get the boot.  And I know 
I'm not the only one who feels this way.

- Darcy
-
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Brooklyn, NY
On 12 Jan 2005, at 08:10 AM, Christopher Smith wrote:
On Jan 12, 2005, at 5:42 AM, dhbailey wrote:
I'd rather receive 500 FREE spams each day and keep e-mail free, 
than to pay an initial tax of $7 as someone suggested.  Because I 
know that in another few years it will be $70, then $700 and then 
the internet will become the haven of only the wealthy and the whole 
benefit of the instantaneous, free interchange of information will 
be gone in a flash and we'll be stuck with just another 
income-producer for bloated worthless governments to suck dry.


Uh-oh. We're not going to be reading about you holed up in a Montana 
cabin holding off the "Revenooers" with a shotgun, are we? 8-)

Sorry if that seems like I'm mocking you, but for tax excess, try 
living in Canada, particularly Quebec, which has the heaviest tax 
load in North America. You would be taking to the streets in no time.

On the other hand, self-employed artists get a handy tax break, and 
the price of living is low, so it's not all that bad.

Christopher
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Para mí, la música es la respiración de la vida y de Dios.
Per me, la musica è l'alito della vita e di Dio
Pour moi, la musique est le souffle de la vie et de Dieu.
Für mich ist Musik der Atem des Lebens und des Gottes.
Dean M. Estabrook
Retired Church Musician
Composer, Arranger
Adjudicator
Amateur Golfer
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Re: [Finale] Mac mini noise

[Darcy James Argue]

Hi Chuck,
For what it's worth, here are the reports from the field:
http://www.macintouch.com/mwsf2005notebook.html
	a.  	It does have a fan. An Apple staffer at the booth told me it 
produces 22 dB, but she wasn't sure if that's when idle, in normal 
use, or what. Since the only units I've seen are out on the floor, I 
couldn't tell how it sounds. It draws air in from vents on the bottom, 
along three sides of the device, and blows out through vents on the 
back, above the ports.
I expect -- at least, I hope -- that the 22 dB is fan noise at peak use.
Also, RE: memory:
	1.  	Apple "does not recommend" that users upgrade the memory 
themselves - you're supposed to have a service provider do it if you 
want to add more after purchase - but doing it yourself does not void 
the warranty unless you damage something. A booth person told me the 
memory slot is easily accessible once you get the case open.
That's good news, although since the case is not openable without 
special tools (which I'm guessing would probably cost at least $20), 
I'm leaning towards taking it down to the Apple Store and having them 
install my third-party memory.  I've spent worse $50.

	3.  	You can add AirPort Extreme for $79 and/or Bluetooth for $50 if 
you're ordering the Mini from the Apple Store, but if you want to add 
wireless later, your only choice will be a kit that includes both 
AirPort Extreme and Bluetooth for about $129 ($112 to dealers). This 
stuff also is not user-installable, supposedly because it involves 
adding antennas as well as cards.
Good thing I got those built-to-order already.
Cheers,
- Darcy
-
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Brooklyn, NY
On 12 Jan 2005, at 07:11 PM, Chuck Israels wrote:
I have no info on this specific question, but G5 tower fans are so 
quiet, under most conditions, that I am able to work undisturbed 
within about 18 inches of mine, and I was irritated by my G4.  If the 
fans in the Mac mini are as well designed and engineered, it should be 
OK.

Awaiting a more complete report and wishing good luck to you, Darcy.
Chuck

Chuck Israels
230 North Garden Terrace
Bellingham, WA 98225-5836
phone (360) 671-3402
fax (360) 676-6055
www.chuckisraels.com
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Re: [Finale] Mac mini noise

[Chuck Israels]

Hi Darcy,

I suppose there are a number of Mac geeks and gurus (and "partial geeks" like me, does that make me a "gee" or an "eek?") who will follow this thread with interest.  22 db (from what distance?) seems as if it would be quiet enough to be more than tolerable.

Good advice I've gotten in the past was: Get the best monitor and printer you can afford, and a CPU that works.  In other words, don't get too seduced by CPU speed and other features.  It's the monitor you're seeing all day, and the printer gets a lot of use.  That was good advice in my experience.  I'm still using (with excellent service, fine print quality, and no inclination to look for another) the HP 5000N printer I bought from that salesman, and my recently purchased Samsung 24" LCD monitor (like the one pictured on Robert Patterson's web site)  is terrific and will serve me well, until someone who needs it makes a not unreasonable offer, and I can afford to pop for that gorgeous 30" Apple one.

I await further news after you've had some hands on experience.  It can be fun getting new tools.  I hope it works out well.

Chuck


On Jan 12, 2005, at 5:02 PM, Darcy James Argue wrote:

Hi Chuck,

For what it's worth, here are the reports from the field:

http://www.macintouch.com/mwsf2005notebook.html

a.  	It does have a fan. An Apple staffer at the booth told me it produces 22 dB, but she wasn't sure if that's when idle, in normal use, or what. Since the only units I've seen are out on the floor, I couldn't tell how it sounds. It draws air in from vents on the bottom, along three sides of the device, and blows out through vents on the back, above the ports.

I expect -- at least, I hope -- that the 22 dB is fan noise at peak use.

Also, RE: memory:

1.  	Apple "does not recommend" that users upgrade the memory themselves - you're supposed to have a service provider do it if you want to add more after purchase - but doing it yourself does not void the warranty unless you damage something. A booth person told me the memory slot is easily accessible once you get the case open.

That's good news, although since the case is not openable without special tools (which I'm guessing would probably cost at least $20), I'm leaning towards taking it down to the Apple Store and having them install my third-party memory.  I've spent worse $50.

3.  	You can add AirPort Extreme for $79 and/or Bluetooth for $50 if you're ordering the Mini from the Apple Store, but if you want to add wireless later, your only choice will be a kit that includes both AirPort Extreme and Bluetooth for about $129 ($112 to dealers). This stuff also is not user-installable, supposedly because it involves adding antennas as well as cards.

Good thing I got those built-to-order already.

Cheers,

- Darcy
-
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Brooklyn, NY

On 12 Jan 2005, at 07:11 PM, Chuck Israels wrote:

I have no info on this specific question, but G5 tower fans are so quiet, under most conditions, that I am able to work undisturbed within about 18 inches of mine, and I was irritated by my G4.  If the fans in the Mac mini are as well designed and engineered, it should be OK.

Awaiting a more complete report and wishing good luck to you, Darcy.

Chuck




Chuck Israels
230 North Garden Terrace
Bellingham, WA 98225-5836
phone (360) 671-3402
fax (360) 676-6055
www.chuckisraels.com
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Chuck Israels
230 North Garden Terrace
Bellingham, WA 98225-5836
phone (360) 671-3402
fax (360) 676-6055
www.chuckisraels.com
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[Finale] OT rotating monitors

[Randolph Peters]

A while back Robert Patterson informed us about the joys of rotating 
monitors especially with Finale. The discussion at the time, I think, 
had some uncertainty about Mac OS X and rotation.

I was in a computer store today and saw an impressive monitor that 
rotates left or right 45 degrees. It works in Windows and Mac OS 9 
and X. (I saw it in operation on Mac OS 10.3.7)

The image is top notch and it comes in 19 and 20 inch LCD  flat screen models:
http://www.lacie.com/products/product.htm?pid=10401
The only drawback is that you need to also purchase the ATI Radeon 
9800 Pro graphics card, which rules out its use in, say, a PowerBook.

-Randolph Peters
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Re: [Finale] OT rotating monitors

[Chuck Israels]

On Jan 12, 2005, at 6:22 PM, Randolph Peters wrote:

A while back Robert Patterson informed us about the joys of rotating monitors especially with Finale. The discussion at the time, I think, had some uncertainty about Mac OS X and rotation.

I was in a computer store today and saw an impressive monitor that rotates left or right 45 degrees. It works in Windows and Mac OS 9 and X. (I saw it in operation on Mac OS 10.3.7)

The image is top notch and it comes in 19 and 20 inch LCD  flat screen models:

http://www.lacie.com/products/product.htm?pid=10401

The only drawback is that you need to also purchase the ATI Radeon 9800 Pro graphics card, which rules out its use in, say, a PowerBook.

Ah, there's the rub - some $300 or so for the card.  My beautiful Samsung 24" jobbie will do the same, but I think all these rotating monitors require the graphic card upgrade that includes the feature that ATI calls Versavision (at least on Macs running OS X).  I'll bite the next time I have an orchestral score to do.  Nothing like that in the works at the moment.

Chuck



Chuck Israels
230 North Garden Terrace
Bellingham, WA 98225-5836
phone (360) 671-3402
fax (360) 676-6055
www.chuckisraels.com
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Re: [Finale] OT rotating monitors

[Robert Patterson]

I suspect that any versavision-capable video card will do. The current 
list that ATI supports (as of Sep 2004) is at

http://robertgpatterson.com/techtipsfaq.html#anchor#MPRT.1
There are several options quite a bit cheaper than the 9800. One caveat 
is that I read a post to a newsgroup about problems getting the 9200 to 
work with versavision, but the poster may have been trying to get vv to 
work in OS9. Vv is OSX-only.

In any case, you must have a Mac that can take an ATI retail card. That 
rules out anything but the Powermac models.

(While I think the new headless Mac is kinda cool and affordable, I 
would have trouble recommending it to a Finale user. Finale users might 
be much better off looking for a used G4 tower at around the same price: 
comparable cpu speed and vv-capable. OTOH, the new Mac uses ATI 9200 
graphics, and the retail version of the ATI 9200 is vv-capable. If by 
some miracle vv works in the new Macs, then the new Mac would be a 
fantastic Finale machine. The only thing it would be missing is 
multi-monitor support.)

In any case, the rock-bottom cost for a graphics card would probably be 
a used 8500 or 9000, provided you have a Mac that will fit it. (Note 
that to run vv on these older cards you have to update their firmware. 
The update is available from the ATI website.) At c. $125, even the 9200 
is attractively priced, and it should work in any Powermac that can run 
OSX. (Darcy knows more about all these cards than I do.)

This entire post is based on claims at the ATI website. I personally 
have note tried to do rotation in OSX. YMMV. (I still use OS9 for Finale.)

Randolph Peters wrote:
A while back Robert Patterson informed us about the joys of rotating 
monitors especially with Finale. The discussion at the time, I think, 
had some uncertainty about Mac OS X and rotation.

I was in a computer store today and saw an impressive monitor that 
rotates left or right 45 degrees. It works in Windows and Mac OS 9 and 
X. (I saw it in operation on Mac OS 10.3.7)

The image is top notch and it comes in 19 and 20 inch LCD  flat screen 
models:

http://www.lacie.com/products/product.htm?pid=10401
The only drawback is that you need to also purchase the ATI Radeon 9800 
Pro graphics card, which rules out its use in, say, a PowerBook.

-Randolph Peters
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--
Robert Patterson
http://RobertGPatterson.com
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Re: [Finale] Garage Band 2

[Rocky Road]

Mark D Lew wrote:
Or maybe Recordare will look into creating a utility to convert them
 to MusicXML?
If they could it would be great, because since GB is based on Logic, 
we would have some hope of directly exporting MusicXML files from 
Logic as well.

BTW GarageBand is a great little app for anyone who hasn't tried it. 
It's an extreme resource hog, but still, students LOVE working with 
it.  And once they learn how to bounce down tracks to save 
processing power, it's possible to do some quite sophisticated 
things with it, even if you can't change time signatures.

Matthew
The first time I've ever seen year 10 students willingly miss recess 
break was when I got them onto GBand for the first time in the lab in 
the period before break. This continued for weeks - started taking 
something to eat with me

--
Rocky Road
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Re: [Finale] Garage Band 2

[Lynn Gold]

On Jan 12, 2005, at 1:06 PM, Matthew Hindson Fastmail Account wrote:
Mark D Lew wrote:
>Or maybe Recordare will look into creating a utility to convert them
> to MusicXML?
If they could it would be great, because since GB is based on Logic, 
we would have some hope of directly exporting MusicXML files from 
Logic as well.

BTW GarageBand is a great little app for anyone who hasn't tried it. 
It's an extreme resource hog, but still, students LOVE working with 
it.  And once they learn how to bounce down tracks to save processing 
power, it's possible to do some quite sophisticated things with it, 
even if you can't change time signatures.
My problem with GarbageBand is it still can't write MIDI files.  It now 
at least lets you edit notes (the previous version didn't).

--Lynn
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Re: [Finale] Mac mini noise

[Lynn Gold]

On Jan 12, 2005, at 4:11 PM, Chuck Israels wrote:
I have no info on this specific question, but G5 tower fans are so 
quiet, under most conditions, that I am able to work undisturbed 
within about 18 inches of mine, and I was irritated by my G4.  If the 
fans in the Mac mini are as well designed and engineered, it should be 
OK.
I saw the Mac Mini today.  It doesn't appear to HAVE a fan, which makes 
it VERY quiet.  The outside case is metal, and it appears to be 
designed to dissipate heat through its case the way the PowerBooks do.

This makes the Mac Mini a VERY quiet machine.
--Lynn
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Re: [Finale] Mac mini noise

[BC2]

From Macintouch:
The side wall of the Apple booth dedicated to the new Mac Mini (again, 
Apple uses lower-case for the second "m") remained packed all day. The 
Mini, to me, isn't as eyecatching as most Apple products, but maybe it 
isn't intended to be - mostly it's small and unobtrusive. Some 
observations:
	a.  	 It does have a fan. An Apple staffer at the booth told me it 
produces 22 dB, but she wasn't sure if that's when idle, in normal use, 
or what. Since the only units I've seen are out on the floor, I 
couldn't tell how it sounds. It draws air in from vents on the bottom, 
along three sides of the device, and blows out through vents on the 
back, above the ports.

Full story here:

Best,
BC2
On Jan 13, 2005, at 12:28 AM, Lynn Gold wrote:
On Jan 12, 2005, at 4:11 PM, Chuck Israels wrote:
I have no info on this specific question, but G5 tower fans are so 
quiet, under most conditions, that I am able to work undisturbed 
within about 18 inches of mine, and I was irritated by my G4.  If the 
fans in the Mac mini are as well designed and engineered, it should 
be OK.
I saw the Mac Mini today.  It doesn't appear to HAVE a fan, which 
makes it VERY quiet.  The outside case is metal, and it appears to be 
designed to dissipate heat through its case the way the PowerBooks do.

This makes the Mac Mini a VERY quiet machine.
--Lynn
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