Carols comments, shows and organization
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Information Architecture) Carol Rivoire brought up some very interesting questions in her letter, and it certainly seems to be drawing some response. I have not had much time of late even to read the list, much less contribute, but I feel compelled to make some comments here. 1. Concerning shows. I am aware that the NFHR does not sponsor any of the shows, but I think it might be a good idea if they did. I would not like to see them restricted to NFHR-registered horses, nor would that be a good idea cost wise, but most breed registries sponsor at least a nationals (or "world") show as some call it and many sponsor regional shows as well. I think that this would contribute to the professionalization of our breed. Let Libby and Woodstock be as they are, but perhaps the registry could start by setting standards for shows and approving shows as NHFR-approved (like AHSA approved or ADS approved. We wouldn't even have to have the registry sponsor entire shows, perhaps classes would do, that somehow counted for points towards regional or national awards. One of the benefits of this, if the registry did it, would be to obtain and provide a blanket insurance policy for a show and the actual show producer could ask that their show be covered under that policy (perhaps for a small fee). I have produced 2 "Fun Days" and insurance for each event cost me $350! Obviously, you can't run too many events that way. But there's more... 2. If we were to have regional shows, we would need regions. Most breeds have the country divided up into regions. The, we would need at least one organization in each region that would be the official NFHR-affiliate. For example, the Promotional Group might want to be that for one region (or it might not)...Fjordings West for another The establishment of regional groups would give us personnel to run a show in a region. The Fjord Herald could have a regional report in each issue for that region. Regions could be used to accumulate points for the nationals or whatever...Plus, it would give new Fjord owners a clear local organization to belong to -- I'm in Oregon and right now I don't know if I should tell people to belong to the Promotional Group or to Fjordings West or to both. It would be much easier if Oregon were officially covered by one region. 3. We need a rulebook (or to adopt the rulebook of other organizations). For the NFHR. I've mentioned this to people and it's mostly fallen on deaf ears, but there was some confusion at the Oregon Evaluation over tack -- what was allowed, what wasn't, was what was being used legal or not? If it were written down, that would be the end of it. For example, at a breed show, what's a two-year old? Aged by date of birth or having an official birthday on Jan. 1 of the next year (like most breed registries do, so that a baby born in October turns 1 the next January). Some people might go by the AHSA standard, but I can guarantee that others do not. If it were written down, it might be clearer. And what of tack -- can we use snaffles on older horses shown Western? or must they be in a curb bit? Is training tack allowed? I'm not talking about silver show saddles -- I would hate to see the breed go that direction -- but are we having breed shows that accept schooling tack? If we are, fine, but let's decide and write it down. A rulebook would also give some sort of consistency to classes. Libby has a classes for "Novices" is defined as "never having won a ribbon in a horse show before." That's a great class and I don't have a problem with it, but I've never heard novice defined like that before -- it's not having won 3 blues in that division (Western, English, driving...) in most other organizations. Wouldn't some standardization be useful? Turlock has novice classes as well, but they're defined in the more conventional way, so winning one means something different. Plus, if you go to Libby, you're either in novice or open, since there's no in between (until this year, when they did add green horse and walk/trot) so if you're not a novice because you won a 6th place somewhere and you're honest, then you're stuck competing in a class that perhaps you have no chance to even place in. As far as rules are concerned, I'm of the opinion that, for the most part, it's better not to recreate the wheel. There is an AHSA rulebook and an ADS rulebook which it might be appropriate to adopt some sections out of. But relatively small breeds (buckskins, POAs, etc.) have written their own books and so it's not impossible. And that might be the way to go, since there are certain characteristics of those owning own breed that might need to be taken into account (for example, a lot of older Fjord horses are still green, so perhaps we would want to allow a snaffle or bosal in Western classes, regardless of the age of the horse). A rulebook ought to be one of the things you get when you joi
Re: Wayne Hipsley's comments
This message is from: GAIL RUSSELL <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I would love to learn all these things - even though I am highly unlikely to become a significant breeder of Fjords. I did not take Gunthar to the evaluation, or go to the preparation because I was staying home trying to figure out how to handle and ride him so I could survive owning him for another year. :) But I would stop all live-preserving efforts with Gunthar if I thought I would get all this out of a clinic. Might even have been willing to haul Gunthar as an example of a poorly balanced horse for an open evaluation if I knew others would bring their horses for open discussion. If the evaluation had been promoted as all this - I think I might have *made* the time to go, instead of staying home. >An important supplement to the above list of items during the evaluation, the >breeders and owners should be offered and participate in educational forums on >the conformation and type for the breed. With discussions on common weaknesses >and frequently occurring structural deviations. Those that have significant >genetic links, those with nutritional links, and those that are management >related like the lack of proper hoof care. Correct movement of the horse then >becomes a very important issue. Movement at the walk, trot and eventually the >canter. How to evaluate the movement, and where to stand to assess the >movement. Learn to normal from abnormal. Learn correct conformation from >incorrect. Breed type is also high on the list of discussions. What does the >word 'type' mean? How does it apply to the horse you own? What are the common >characteristics that help define breed type? And so on. >Then, one needs to learn how to develop an eye for looking at the horse. >Learning to determine balance, head to hindquarter, side to side and back to >hoof. Learning to 'weigh' in one's eye the specific regions of the horse for >muscle development, length of bones and definition of joints. Gail Russell Forestville CA [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Isn't it wondrous ...
This message is from: Sessoms <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Isn't it wondrous when our Fjords let us kneel next to them to say, "Goodnight, sweet pony." As they lay with head upright in their sleeping place looking enchanted in the starlight.. Meredith Sessoms Soddy-Daisy, Tennessee, USA mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] ~ Dorina ~ NFR Aagot .~:~. Fjords ~ Caper ~ Carly ~ Crickett .~:~. Labradors
RE: fjordhorse-digest V98 #184
This message is from: Larson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> As Regards Steve's comments: Have you been to a APHA show lately? You can't see the horse for the chrome and glitter of tack and rider. I'm color coordinated and you're not, so I win! Like you, I could care less what the rider in the arena with me is wearing. I DO care how our horses are performing. Yes, I will agree there is a certain amount of professionalism promoted by a well turned out, neat and orderly rider. But I hope to never see Fjord people go to the bizarre extreme other breeds have. We have been involved with APHA, AQHA and NRHA for many years. The AQHA folks have a great breed information package sent to each new member, as do the APHA. They are loaded with information on Association programs, breed typing, organization numbers, addresses, etc. In short, everything a new owner needs to know. Nothing is ideal, but they continue in their efforts to promote and educate. How can the NFHR MEMBERS assist the Registry in putting together such a package? Now, just as AQHA has an "IDEAL Quarter Horse", does NFHR? If not, how do we request the NFHR help us establish one? Which farms are willing to host clinics promoting breed/conformation education? We have the only Fjords in this part of New Mexico. Ginny and Bill Cowles have all the rest just north of Santa Fe. However, everyone in the county knows they are here. They participate in every parade (we have quite a few since this is the Indian Capital of NM) and participate in the Easter and Christmas cantatas. They also provide pony rides at the local church fireworks sale prior to the 4th of July. People are so fascinated by them, I have actually plagerized info provided to me by Nancy Lehnert to use as handouts. Sorry, Nancy. It was self defense. If I hadn't, I'd be talking all the time! Even non-horse people want to know all about them. My point is this: The owners and breeders are equally responsible, along with the Registry, for education and promotion of the breed. Promote your own within your community. Request specific assistance in education from the Registry. And be willing to assist in the actual work involved in these projects.
Re: fjordhorse-digest V98 #184
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Response to Mary Olford from Wayne Hipsley ".Winging It..." The expectations for the presentation of the horses during the evaluations was established by the Evaluation Committee. It was one of the many issues they worked through in the preparation of the Evaluation concept. So, from there I derive my expectations. In the same paragraph you have mentioned the lack of preparation for the evaluation and how you and others "..winged it..". It is very unfortunate that you were not given the opportunity to have some form of advance preparation, so you and your horse would know what to expect. It is not fair for you or others to operate on the blind side of the issue. You cannot be expected to perform or your horse cannot be expected to perform if you have no educational support or a resource from which to draw information. The importance of the evaluation in my personal opinion should be the one of the highlights of a horse's life. The best possible image of the horse should be presented whether the horse be evaluated for conformation or movement or any combination thereof. For a moment join with me. You be the judge. A horse is brought into the arena for you to evaluate. The owner appears nervous, the horse is leading and not being lead by the handler. The owner attempts to get the horse to stand still regardless of the body and leg positions. The horse keeps moving in circles, never standing for a fair opportunity to fairly evaluate the horse. The situation grows worst when asked to move the horse at the walk and then the trot. The gait is inconsistent and the lines are varied. When asked to trot, the horse does a lazy jog not demonstrating the ability to use its hindquarters, the strides are short and choppy, the upper body is out of balance. When asked to attempt to trot the horse again, the handler quits half way across the arena because they are out of breath. Thus, the horse does not demonstrate a positive movement at the trot. All of this because the handler did not prepare the horse for the presentation. Some people think the only person watching is the evaluation team. They tend to forget prospective buyers are watching, if a stallion, potential mare owners are watching. And on average, they may not be scoring the horse, they are formulating an opinion about the animal. Therefore, I believe the evaluations can be more tthan another trip to the show ring. I feel without proper preparation and education little can be accomplished in life. All of this takes on different forms for each of us. But in this case I believe we need to start with the fundamentals and move forward to the presentation of the animal. Either in advance of the evaluation or on the day[s] of the evaluation the following could be accomplished. 1st - Explain the value of the evaluation and how the information can be used to enhance the breed. 2nd - Explain the process of the evaluation, what is expected of the handler/rider, what is expected of the horse. 3rd - Go through a demonstration on how to present the horse and answer any questions on the process. 4th - Review the score sheets and the meaning of the scores and other information conveyed to the owner after the process. 5th - Open forum to answer any questions A video of the process with a very clear explanation could be made available to all persons participating in their first evaluation. The video could be a refresher for the more experienced. An important supplement to the above list of items during the evaluation, the breeders and owners should be offered and participate in educational forums on the conformation and type for the breed. With discussions on common weaknesses and frequently occurring structural deviations. Those that have significant genetic links, those with nutritional links, and those that are management related like the lack of proper hoof care. Correct movement of the horse then becomes a very important issue. Movement at the walk, trot and eventually the canter. How to evaluate the movement, and where to stand to assess the movement. Learn to normal from abnormal. Learn correct conformation from incorrect. Breed type is also high on the list of discussions. What does the word 'type' mean? How does it apply to the horse you own? What are the common characteristics that help define breed type? And so on. Then, one needs to learn how to develop an eye for looking at the horse. Learning to determine balance, head to hindquarter, side to side and back to hoof. Learning to 'weigh' in one's eye the specific regions of the horse for muscle development, length of bones and definition of joints. All of the above then leads us to presenting the horse to create the correct image of the horse either in hand, riding or driving. One further question might be asked. If you cannot receive the information on presenting the Fjord at an evaluation, then where does one receive this information. "Winging it" is
More on comments
This message is from: Cynthia <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Ok, time for me jump in. First of all, I received an e-mail from Sharon Falck (secretary to the MWFHC) that she talked to Wayne at Libby and he has agreed to present a clinic on evaluations at the mid-winter meeting in February in Illinois. Problems are recognized and are being dealt with - not all the problems, but a start is being made. Thanks, Wayne for your additional comments. I think they are very helpful. About the Blue Earth show - three years ago I stood up at the meeting and said that I was not too interested in continuing to come to a show that was on one day and contained only two classes I could possibly enter, I got put on the show committee. This committee worked very hard, and with the cooperation of the fair board, expanded the show significantly. Novice and open classes in driving and riding, both English(actually more like dressage) AND western riding classes, get of sire and dam, obstacle driving classes and more performance riding classes were introduced. The show has been two days for the last two years. These are major changes in upgrading the show. This year, with Jim judging, the cycle of alternating two very draft oriented judges was broken (and hopefully will remain so). I was very pleased with the quality of the horses and people at this year's show. Horses were well groomed and 99% of all people in the classes were well groomed. The well trained horses won, however their exhibitors were groomed. Not that I don't have some suggestions and ideas for improvements and I hope to definitely do the cones courses again - I already have some great ideas for next year. I have volunteered to be on the show committee for last year and this but have not been involved. I would like to see the day before the show be a clinic or education day. I would like to see some dressage tests (also could be done the day before - we even have an idea for a judge who works with Fjords close by in Minneapolis). Etc, etc. I am not sure where the word "advanced" came from. I think more demanding (perhaps, knowledgeable) judges will take care of the issue of asking horses to perform to the same standard they have to in open competitions. There is a list of approved judges for Fjord events and I hope we will take advantage of it. If the costs for a qualified judge slightly increases the cost of the show (up to $7 a class?) I will pay it. I value the opportunity to compete my Fjord with other Fjords and I value the fact that the show is just darn fun! The people are great. I found some of the "old timers" were really interested in watching some of those who show in open competitions. They recognized the quality of the horses and wanted to know how they could be let in on it. Many of them in the Midwest have been oriented towards draft showing traditions and are not adverse to ADS ones - they just don't know about them. One component of most driving shows I have been to - even in little old Nebraska - is that a knowledgeable judge is brought to the show and then that judge does a clinic - this allows the club to get the judge a little cheaper and pay most of the expenses through those who want to go to the clinic. This is how quality improves and expertise comes to you. I haven't finished on these topics yet, but this is long enough for now. Cynthia Madden mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Omaha, Nebraska USA
Re: Round pen
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 98-09-23 20:05:18 EDT, you write: << Using this pen, last year we were able to train a young woman with total paralysis of both legs, who had never been on horseback, to ride our mare, Kaia. They went on to take a Gold Medal in the Special Olympics. >> I love hearing this. Congratulations to you for helping this lady out, and congratulations to her for going the distance and making it to the Special Olympics. Someday, I hope Juniper will be there too. She proves herself to me on an almost daily basis. Yesterday we were sidewalking my son. He wanted to trot. We asked her to, but she refused. She NEVER refuses anything, unless I really don't want to do what I'm asking (such as when a trainer asks me to take a jump when I don't WANT to jump). Anyway, she always trots when we ask her to for Raymond. No matter how much we asked, told her, demanded, she kept up a steady, gentle walk. Oooops. The saddle was tilted ever so slightly to the left, making my son off balance. Fine at the walk, but he would have come off at the trot. Thank God she had horse sense, even if I wasn't as aware as I shouldn't have been. It was a stupid operator error on my part, but this horse is just marvelous for the special kids! Pamela
Hunting season tack
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Pamela wrote: "... Speaking of buying tack, hunting season is here (or near). I detest the color orange and would like to find some nice, bright NEON YELLOW for riding" Fluorescent orange is not my favorite color either, but there's a clear reason why it's preferred over all other colors for safety gear -- it's THE color most easily seen by the human eye. No other bright or fluorescent color comes close, which is why all hunters and most highway workers are required to wear fluorescent orange outerwear. I'll personally stick with fluorescent orange during hunting season, even if it does make a rather garish fashion statement. ;-) DeeAnna
Carol Comments
This message is from: "Myrdal Bros" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Hi, and greetings from North Dakota. Just wanted to throw in a couple of thoughts on Carol's comments. I worked several years for a large international organization, and one of my jobs was in promotions. This was all unrelated to the horse industry, but I believe the same principals can be applied. One of the absolutely best investments we ever did make was to hire a good firm to make a promo video. Yes, it was costly, but boy was it worth it!!! It gave us a great tool for any setting, and people want visual info. these days. The reason I brought this up is simply because I think that in the Fjord we truly have something great to promote and show off. We "just" got into the Fjord a couple of years ago, (though have 20 years of equine experience) and we live in an area quite remote and unfamiliar with the Fjord. I only know of 3 other people with Fjords in the entire state of ND. We are seriously interested in promoting the breed in our state and hopefully in the future have a small breeding program, but we are moving forward slowly in order to "do the right thing". I would LOVE to see a promo video, AND I also would love to see videos on evaluations. Yes, I know this can be costly, but we cannot afford to keep this breed "a secret". And I am CERTAIN that the return in both interest and therefore continues income for the Registry will be evident. Thank you Carol and all others for a great discussion, - it in itself is quite educational. >From flat, but beautiful North Eastern North Dakota. ( I grew up in Norway, how in the world did I end up this far from ocean and mountains :) ) Janne Myrdal
Round pen
This message is from: "Dr. John Crawford" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I am in the market for a round-pen. I would like feedback from anyone who has used a iron, non-permanent type - did you like it? If not, why? Other suggestions are also welcome. Thanks - Linda Lottie in Minnesota Linda, We use a pen from Rocking W, in Enid, OK. It is constructed of trapezoidal panels, approximately 13' x 5', that interlock with metal pins at each end. Because of the trapezoidal shape, when assembled into a circle the panels lean outward at about 17 degrees. Our pen is about 45' in diameter at its base, and 48' in diameter at the top. The bottom 3' of each panel is solid metal, while the top 2' is comprised of two metal rails. The entry gate panel is of similar construction, with additional bracing on the outside to stabilize the panel while allowing free movement of the gate. With experience, two people can assemble (or dis-assemble) the pen in about 90 minutes. Because of the weight of the panels, about 150 lb. each, two people are required for assembly. We chose the 45' diameter for the same reason circus rings are about this size. It's the smallest diameter in which centrifugal force will allow a person to stand upright on the back of a trotting horse. It also allows someone standing in the center to easily reach a horse on the perimeter with a long lash whip. Because of the solid wall construction and the outward sloping walls, it is almost impossible for even the greenest young horse (or hottest macho stallion) to get himself into any serious trouble in this style of round pen. The inexperienced horse may, in the beginning, try to go "up the wall", but always finds himself sliding ineluctably back into the proper track. We use our pen for liberty work, ground driving, and riding. It is without doubt one of our best training aids. Using this pen, last year we were able to train a young woman with total paralysis of both legs, who had never been on horseback, to ride our mare, Kaia. They went on to take a Gold Medal in the Special Olympics. You should be able to obtain the manufacturers phone number from directory assistance. If not, I can post it to the list. Dr. John G. Crawford
Re: Horsebones in graves, was: Fjords in costume
This message is from: Marsha Jo Hannah <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Anneli Sundkvist <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > nowadays, it is possible to use DNA-technique on ancient bones too, > and soon we will therefore be able to tell what modern horses are the > 'children' of the ancient ones in Scandinavia, and how they are > related. The work was first focused on building up a database with the > DNA-profile of all modern horse breeds, to use as a refrence for > ancient studies. Fascinating! I'd be very interested to hear about that work (both the ancient and modern linkages), when it's done! Thanks very much for the information! Marsha Jo HannahMurphy must have been a horseman-- [EMAIL PROTECTED] anything that can go wrong, will! 30 mi SSE of San Francisco, Calif. ---
Showing fjords
This message is from: Mark and Ann Restad <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> For what it is worth, here is the perspective of a brand new horse person who has never attended any of the aforementioned shows. Remember that many people are choosing a fjord for their first horse. We chose them for the obvious reasons, and a side benefit is that the fjord people I have communicated with in any manner have been wonderful, helpful interesting people. I havn't found any of the stuck up behavior among you that I encountered my whole life with "horse people". Thank you! I hope you can maintain your challenging classes and improvements in those areas while keeping open opportunities for people like myself who could benefit a lot from starting showing in a fun, encouraging environment, and also have the opportunity to learn by watching the feats of the advanced competitors at that show. As we promote the breed, you are going to be seeing more novices like myself in the picture. Good luck working this all out. Also, I agree with the statements that products would be welcome. It would be wonderful if someone specialized in fjord tack, in particular! Ann R
Re: Re[2]: fjordhorse-digest V98 #183
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Well, I just tried to send this via personal email, since it is just a request for the Archived Email list, and I'm sure nobody is interested in reading it, but it was sent back to me. So, I have to request via the list I would love to get a copy of the archived Fjord email list. Having been involved with Fjords for just a bit over a year now, and on this list only for several months, I'd like to catch up on all the information that's been flowing through from the beginning. Thanks, Pamela
Re: fjordhorse-digest V98 #183
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] RE: Carol's Comments Horse Shows. I have just completed an article for the Fjord Hearld on the Libby Show. It will be appearing in the next issue of the magazine. As I prepared the article I could not help but compare the 1998 show to the Libby show I judged in 1994. I was very impressed with the very significant improvement in the manner the owners presented their horses in the breeding and performance classes. It is a tremendous change for the best. And yet, underneath this improvement are the same smiling and cheerful people who enjoy their horses above all else. The show was a wonderful, positive experience. The show organizers need to be congratulated on their desire to keep Libby a friendly environment. I did not judge nor view any of the classes at the Blue Earth show as reference in Carol's commentary. So, I cannot comment on the activities at this event. However, I would like to offer an observation on the transition of other breeds and how the Fjord tends to fit the pattern. In it's infancy, a breed show starts as a fun show with friendly competition and togetherness. Eventually, as human nature takes hold, the sense of competition starts to interfer with the concept of having fun and doing it for the sake of doing it. The sense of competition influences one to think, well if we are going to do this then we should be getting something in return, more ribbons, a trophy, a bigger trophy, prize money, more prize money, more championship classes, more individual recognition classes, different classes, etc. The keen sense of competition creates an entirely different atmosphere at the shows. And soonthe fun days are lost and the feelings forgotten about why everyone got to together in the first place. Remember, the defining word for the original concept of the show was FUN. Yet, the evolution of competition is the typical path followed by many other breeds. And as this evolution takes place the word FUN is forgotten, ignored or laughed at as a reason for the gathering of horses. At least from my point of view, the folks at Libby have kept fun in their show. But, there are things they can do to satisfy more exhibitors while maintaining the image the Pacific Northwest Promotional Group has created. For example: 1. Due to the level of competition offer ribbons to 6th place instead of 4 places. An insignificant economic impact. 2. Continue to establish classes for the novice, maiden, beginner, youth, amateur owner to ride/drive, walk-trot, etc. [Libby has some of these classes now] 3. Encourage the judges of the show to assist exhibitors with POSITIVE comments on their performance. These turn into words of encouragement. Make it a learning experience. 4. Provide particpation ribbons for the classes open to children under 7[or whatever age group] and beginners. Give them a POSITIVE memory. 5. Give a ribbon to the person[s] who travel the longest distance to the show, the person with the most horses, the most entries, etc. Find ways to recognize everyone. Make it POSITIVE. 6. Add some more game classes, where percision of riding and driving do not matter. Keep the FUN obvious. Libby has proven the fun classes are entertaining. If anyone thinks I am thinking or writing in the negative about Libby, STOP. I think they have a great event. My thoughts may add to their finesse of making an even better event, while hopefully offering the initial ideas to other Fjord shows. Libby should be a role model for Fjord shows. Advancement of Competition - The evolutionary pattern of shows creates a 'rub' between the person who wants to advance to a higher level of competition and those who are beginners or those who are happy with their current station in life and the show ring. Thus, when this distinction of competition becomes apparent, the simple way to solve the matter is create a different level of competition for the less experienced and thereby exclude the advanced exhibitor still giving the less experienced the same opportunity for competition. In the Arabians, Morgans, Quarter Horse, Paint Horse and many more, the title of the show classes reflect this distinction of abilities and status. Most of these breeds could be heard hollering about the professional trainer always beating them in the shows. Well, the response was to create an amateur owned trained and ridden/driven class. Today, there are shows exclusively for the amateur shown horses. And, then the breeds have gone further to create other classes for youth, ladies, non-pro, novices, beginners, etc. Something for everyone. On the performance side the same has occurred. English pleasure became something it was not intended. Only the fancy horses would win. The response was to create Country English Pleasure or Country Pleasure Driving for the less formal horse. There are solutions at hand you must just look around. I would like to repeat one comment made by Carol. I, Wayne Hipsley, do like the F
Re[2]: fjordhorse-digest V98 #183
This message is from: Steve McIlree <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Ursula-- Wednesday, 23 September 1998, you wrote: > Steve...is there an archive for this List? Someone needs to keep this info. Yes there is a complete archive. However, right now it is not available to anyone but me. Anyone who wants anything from past messages need only ask and I will forward it. Someday when I have the time I'll figure out how to put the information online. -- Steve McIlree & Cynthia Madden -- Pferd, Keyah, Skipper, Tank -- Omaha, Nebraska, USA There is no secret so close as that between a rider and his horse. --Robert Smith Surtees(1803-1864)
Re: fjordhorse-digest V98 #183
This message is from: Ursula Jensen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Re:Carol's comments.AMEN!!! Yes, Steve, too bad that not more members of the Board are on this list. They would certainly benefit from the info generated here. I did have several conversations with Storrs at Libby and I do believe that he went home realizing the important role of the Registry in educating it's members. Carol,rest assured that the Evaluation committee has been VERY busy this past week putting together a working paper to present to the Board.The phone lines are humming. Nothing can be done without the support of the Board. That's the bottom line. If any of you out there feel as strongly about this subject as some of us,please please please, contact your Director and let him/her know how you feel.Get them to loosen the purse string for Education. Brian has suggested the Registry take on a Millenium Project and have Evaluation become the vehicle for Education, about and for, the Fjord horse. Don't dispair folks, Wayne is still on board so far, but I think we are down to our last chance. We'll lose him for sure, if some kind of effort is not being made towards Education. Carol you did the folks on this list a real service by your very articulate explanation of what's going on . Whether people realize it or not the future of the breed in North America, is at stake here. The only way we can maintain the integrity of the Breed is to ensure that Breed standards are being met. Our resource base is so small that we cannot afford to lose people like Wayne or Jim, as these guys have the knowledge and understanding to be our foundation. Unfortunately when you have a volunteer-based Board, things don't get done in any way fast. There is no point in promoting a Breed that some only perceive to know. The Registry needs to committ to Education via Evaluation FIRST then deal with Promotional issues second. Everyone needs to know and understand the Breed first so they can promote it correctly and based on facts. As Wayne put it to me "How can you base your opinion about what a Fjord should looks like, if you've never seen an ideal or good Fjord?" There is way too much mis-information out there right nowsome of you have touched on it during discussions here on the list. How do you think that stuff got started? By people promoting 'dumb' info about this breed. I wish I had more time to address some of the other points (regarding our Breed shows) but suffice it to sayhang in there with your apron Stevedo it right and a few people will always pick up on why you win your classes and learn from you. Some of the things we have done over the years is subtly educate by example. Good judges will recognize your efforts and reward you accordingly. Brian and I plan to write a few articles for our newsletter (PNFPG) on showmanship, driving styles , equipment and dress etc.+ As accredited Pleasure Driving Judges we also have information on how judges judge and place their winners. Techniques using gaits, entrance,dress etc. to screen placements. There are also varied percentages alotted for specific types of classes.Things like that.if people choose to learn and grow in their sport they will care about how they drive and present themselves. They will also win.if you don't want to drive like that...fine...but don't expect to win either. Do it for fun and socialization. It's really hard work to do things right but it's fun also and it looks so darn good. Enough for nowI hope we can really get people off their proverbial butts about this Education via Evaluation issuecall your local Director and voice your opinion. They are (the Board)conference call meeting tonight (wed) and will get an introduction about all this but the actual proposal will be drawn up in the next while so there is plenty of room/time for input..this is very important.Get involved. Steve...is there an archive for this List? Someone needs to keep this info. Sincerely Ursula |---| | Ursula & Brian Jensen from Trinity Fjords | | E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re[3]: Carol's comments
This message is from: Steve McIlree <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Mike-- Wednesday, 23 September 1998, you wrote: >> I think that there is some major misunderstanding regarding the call >> for so-called "advanced" classes at the regional shows. I heard what >> was said in the Blue Earth meeting, and all that was mentioned was >> that perhaps it was time we asked for three trots from our horses in >> driving classes. I don't care what other people wear in a class as >> long as they don't ridicule my turnout. In fact I really don't care >> if someone competes against me wearing "overalls and barnboots". >> However, the horse that the guy in overalls is driving should be >> able to show a slow trot, a working trot and a fast trot. This is >> not "advanced" it is simply "well trained". Leave the classes as >> they are, just make sure that the judges ask for all they should >> from a good pleasure driving horse. > The topic I was refering to was the one that got the response from Tom that > he wasn't going to wear a skirt to show in. I do remember a lot of the > members wanting to see a class that went by ADS rules. I don't know If you > happened to notice but there were an awful lot of turnouts that were > already attired properly. I guess I don't see the big deal in trying it. > What is one class for one show? If no one enters it then don't do it > again. If 10 people enter it then I think you might want to rethink it. > Maybe you don't want to call it advanced. Call it whatever you want. I don't want to beat this to death, but you are following the divergence from the point that Tom started. Nobody really cares about turnout, those of us who usually show ADS are already wearing our skirts. The woman who started the whole discussion simply stated that she thought that we should START ASKING FOR THREE TROTS. I am steeped in ADS rules, and that (three distinct trots) is the only change I would like to see made to what exists. Read what I wrote above. We don't need to change the classes we have, just make sure we're showing well trained pleasure driving horses. I may be wrong, but I believe that that's all any of the pro-ADS people are asking. This is important, because if someone wants to take his or her Fjord to an open show that is conducted under ADS rules, they can easily throw a blanket across their knees to satisfy the apron/lap robe requirement. They surely can come up with a pair of gloves and a hat somewhere. They probably are already use a whip when they drive. But if their horse can't deliver three good trots, they might as well stay at home. -- Steve McIlree & Cynthia Madden -- Pferd, Keyah, Skipper, Tank -- Omaha, Nebraska, USA There is no secret so close as that between a rider and his horse. --Robert Smith Surtees(1803-1864)
Re: fjordhorse-digest V98 #183
This message is from: Arthur and Carol Rivoire <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> This message is from Carol Rivoire at Beaver Dam Farm in Nova Scotia - Regarding comments to my message of today in which I suggested that our Registry, the NFHR, could be doing more for its memebers in the areas of EDUCATION & PROMOTION. Mike May commented that I was confused in thinking that the NFHR ran the shows. -- Yes, that's possible. However, I feel that whether or not the registry is actually running the BREED SHOWS across the country, it should, as the governing body of the Norwegian Fjord breed, have a positive influence. . . A GUIDING INFLUENCE . . . on the standards of the show. For example - All horses should be pure-bred Fjords and registered with an approved registry. - All horses must be properly presented (manes cut, clean, groomed) - No abusive handling of horses - No unsafe equipment allowed - Horses and handlers tacked and dressed appropriately. Those are just my preliminary thoughts that could be used as guidlines from the NFHR to the BREED SHOW organizers. -- This comes under the heading of EDUCATION. -- Also, I understood at the Libby Annual Meeting that all the shows, except Libby, were NFHR sanctioned. HORSES AND HANDLERS TACKED & DRESSED APPROPRIATELY. - Steve mentioned that some Fjord owners were protesting having to wear gloves and "skirts" (driving aprons) to drive their horses. Now this shouldn't be a problem. It all hinges on the word "Appropriate." --- People driving Fjords put to a farm wagon, and in draft harness would look ridiculous with a driving apron, gloves, hat, tie, etc. --- Just as ridiculous as they would look driving a presentation vehicle in jeans and farm boots. --- We need to require Fjord owners who choose to show their horses at one of our BREED SHOWS to present themselves and their horses appropriately. If we don't, we will look ridiculous to spectators who know horses and showing. --- When I've been in Holland to the big Fjord shows, I've enjoyed a class called - "Concours d'Elegance." It's always a well attended class, and terribly interesting because you see everything from elegant four-in-hands put to elegant vehicles such as a vis a vis to wonderful farm turnouts; such as a brightly painted manure spreader pulled by a lovely Fjord in draft harness. The driver will be in appropriate overalls, and his whip might be a branch with a frond of leaves at the tip. --- Each of those drivers is APPROPRIATELY DRESSED, and their horses APPROPRIATELY HARNESSED . . . and that's the name of the game. So, how could the NFHR help its members show appropriately? Well, it could publish EDUCATIONAL pamphlets informing newcomers to the breed, and to showing, just what is expected at open shows and at breed shows. That would be just one of the EDUCATIONAL pamphlets the breed could publish. Another could be on proper GROOMING. Another on proper FEEDING. On basic HEALTH CARE - FOOT CARE - WORMING - VACCINATIONS - Lists could be made available of books and videos and magazines helpful to Fjordowners.These suggestions would be so simple to implement, and not very costly. And before the directors start decrying cost - LET'S NOT FORGET OUR REGISTRY HAS A VERY HEALTHY BALANCE IN THE BANK! And for the life of me, I can't see why it's just sitting there and not being used to PROMOTE the breed, and EDUCATE the members. The gist of my message was to suggest that the NFHR hire Wayne Hipsley (or someone equally qualified . . . if such a person could be found) to act as a CONSULTANT. Wayne's qualifications include 30 or more years involvement with various breed registries. HE HAS SEEN WHAT HAS WORKED FOR OTHER REGISTRIES . . . AND WHAT HASN'T WORKED! His UNIQUE qualifications also include FIVE TRIPS TO NORWAY to study just WHAT IS A FJORDHORSE. --- Why not hire someone like Wayne to direct our efforts at education and promotion of the Fjord? The man is an EXPERT, and whatever it cost the NFHR would be worth it in increased memberships, an expanded Fjord market, higher quality horses, and more educated owners. I have one more thing to say today - Steve mentioned that it was too bad all the DIRECTORS OF THE NFHR are not on the List. Well, I guess! BUT, WHY AREN'T THEY? This is the information age, afterall, and what better way is there for the Directors to know what owners and breeders are thinking than for them to tune into the exchange of information and ideas this List generates? It should be REQUIRED READING for NFHR directors! I very much look forward to reading your comments. Regards from Carol Rivoire in Nova Scotia where the grass is emerald green and long from a month of "Irish Mist" type rain.
Re[2]: Carol's comments
This message is from: Mike May <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> At 12:54 PM 9/23/98 -0500, you wrote: >This message is from: Steve McIlree <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >Mike-- > >Wednesday, 23 September 1998, you wrote: > >> This message is from: Mike May <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >> I think what is really needed is not to change all of the classes to >> requiring ADS rules but rather to add a class or two. Maybe put in an >> "Advanced Driving Class" see how it goes. Require all of the proper >> clothes, tack, whip etc. Have one class that goes by ADS rules. See if >> people like it or not. This way the people that "Don't want to wear a >> sjirt" won't have to enter this class. > > I think that there is some major misunderstanding regarding the call > for so-called "advanced" classes at the regional shows. I heard what > was said in the Blue Earth meeting, and all that was mentioned was > that perhaps it was time we asked for three trots from our horses in > driving classes. I don't care what other people wear in a class as > long as they don't ridicule my turnout. In fact I really don't care > if someone competes against me wearing "overalls and barnboots". > However, the horse that the guy in overalls is driving should be > able to show a slow trot, a working trot and a fast trot. This is > not "advanced" it is simply "well trained". Leave the classes as > they are, just make sure that the judges ask for all they should > from a good pleasure driving horse. The topic I was refering to was the one that got the response from Tom that he wasn't going to wear a skirt to show in. I do remember a lot of the members wanting to see a class that went by ADS rules. I don't know If you happened to notice but there were an awful lot of turnouts that were already attired properly. I guess I don't see the big deal in trying it. What is one class for one show? If no one enters it then don't do it again. If 10 people enter it then I think you might want to rethink it. Maybe you don't want to call it advanced. Call it whatever you want. Mike == Norwegian Fjord Horse Registry Mike May, Registrar Webster, NY, USA (Suburb of Rochester) Voice 716-872-4114 FAX 716-787-0497 http://www.nfhr.com mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re[2]: Carol's comments
This message is from: Steve McIlree <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Mike-- Wednesday, 23 September 1998, you wrote: > This message is from: Mike May <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > At 11:41 AM 9/23/98 -0500, you wrote: >>This message is from: "Jon A. Ofjord" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> >>In re Carol's comments: >> >>When mention was made regarding having advanced driving classes at the Blue >>Earth show, I believe most people who were present at the meeting were of >>the mind to keep these regional shows geared toward the novice performer. >>Those who wanted the advanced driving classes were for the most part, >>people who mostly showed their horses in the driving events. I would like >>to see these people compete in the other classes offered at the show, such >>as the under saddle events or draft classes. They talk about developing >>the horse to its fullest potential, but only show in one discipline. > I think what is really needed is not to change all of the classes to > requiring ADS rules but rather to add a class or two. Maybe put in an > "Advanced Driving Class" see how it goes. Require all of the proper > clothes, tack, whip etc. Have one class that goes by ADS rules. See if > people like it or not. This way the people that "Don't want to wear a > sjirt" won't have to enter this class. I think that there is some major misunderstanding regarding the call for so-called "advanced" classes at the regional shows. I heard what was said in the Blue Earth meeting, and all that was mentioned was that perhaps it was time we asked for three trots from our horses in driving classes. I don't care what other people wear in a class as long as they don't ridicule my turnout. In fact I really don't care if someone competes against me wearing "overalls and barnboots". However, the horse that the guy in overalls is driving should be able to show a slow trot, a working trot and a fast trot. This is not "advanced" it is simply "well trained". Leave the classes as they are, just make sure that the judges ask for all they should from a good pleasure driving horse. -- Steve McIlree & Cynthia Madden -- Pferd, Keyah, Skipper, Tank -- Omaha, Nebraska, USA Far back, far back in our dark soul the horse prances. --D.H. Lawrence(1885-1930)
Re: Carol's comments
This message is from: Mike May <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> At 11:41 AM 9/23/98 -0500, you wrote: >This message is from: "Jon A. Ofjord" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >In re Carol's comments: > >When mention was made regarding having advanced driving classes at the Blue >Earth show, I believe most people who were present at the meeting were of >the mind to keep these regional shows geared toward the novice performer. >Those who wanted the advanced driving classes were for the most part, >people who mostly showed their horses in the driving events. I would like >to see these people compete in the other classes offered at the show, such >as the under saddle events or draft classes. They talk about developing >the horse to its fullest potential, but only show in one discipline. I think what is really needed is not to change all of the classes to requiring ADS rules but rather to add a class or two. Maybe put in an "Advanced Driving Class" see how it goes. Require all of the proper clothes, tack, whip etc. Have one class that goes by ADS rules. See if people like it or not. This way the people that "Don't want to wear a sjirt" won't have to enter this class. >The term "professionalism" also came up in Carol's letter. And I agree >that we all need education in that respect, but I find it hard to compete >against the professionals. I cannot afford a full time trainer, or even a >part time one. Nor can I afford to have a handler show my horses for me. >Our entire years vacation time is our annual trip to the Blue Earth show. >I purchased the best horse I could afford. And I just spent a lot of money >to buy a saddle that fits my horse. But I can't afford to have a show >saddle sitting in my basement only to be used one or two times during the >year. I don't want the Fjords to go the way of the Quarter Horses. By >that I mean I don't want to have to commit a fashion faux pas by showing my >horse in the wrong color saddle, or wearing the wrong color shirt and vest >in the ring. Yes, I think we should be nicely attired, but please don't >take it to the extreme, especially in the regional shows. I, for one, >don't want to see the regional shows overtaken by ONLY the large >professionally staffed farms, or people that can afford to have their >horses professionally trained. There has to be a place for the novices as >well. And working towards excellence should be a fun and non- intimidating >experience. Having a showmanship class or explaining what is looked for in >driving or riding classes would be a great help to people like myself. I >wasn't born with this knowledge and would be more than willing to learn. Again I don't think it is meant to keep any one out of the classes. I agree we need to keep the novices in that ring. But they shouldn't have to stay novices forever. I don't think we all need to be professionals either. >Mainly I would like to see the Fjord people work towards uniting under only >one registry in the United States. As I understand it now, there are two: >the National Fjord Horse Registry and the Fjord Horse Breeders of America. >But I guess that stems from a former split in ideas of whether we have >horses or ponies. Someone could possibly enlighten me on this. Well actually we are called the Norwegian Fjord Horse Registry not the National Fjord Horse Registry. There is also the Norwegian Fjord Horse Association of North America and the Fjord Breeders of America. The NFHA of NA is next in size to the NFHR. We are currently in the talking stages regarding combining our 2 registries. Hopefully it will work out. Mike == Norwegian Fjord Horse Registry Mike May, Registrar Webster, NY, USA (Suburb of Rochester) Voice 716-872-4114 FAX 716-787-0497 http://www.nfhr.com mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Carol's comments
This message is from: "Jon A. Ofjord" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> In re Carol's comments: You mentioned that Wayne Hipsley no longer wanted to do NFHR evaluations because he was concerned with the lack of education provided members of the NFHR. Exactly in what areas do we need this education and how can we acquire it? I also feel like Suzan Johnson did at the Blue Earth evaluations that we also had to "wing it". When I asked what we needed to do for the evaluation process, I was told by more than one member "Just get out there and show, just bring your horse." But watching video tapes and getting little if any advice from other people in regards to showmanship and how to present your horse just doesn't cut it with me. Experience is the best teacher in that respect, but we would have liked to be better informed. We are new to horse showing and need to gain experience from the people who have shown before. I'm sorry we didn't measure up to Mr. Hipsley's expectations as a whole. In regard to the promotion of the breed, what better opportunity to do so than to show the Fjords in open competition against other breeds. Most of us at the breed shows already know the attributes of the Fjords. Those people who find the regional breed shows to be less than their level of competition expertise need to compete in the higher rated shows. We all know how we like to hear that a Fjord beat out the Warmbloods at a dressage show, or how they placed high against other breeds in ADS shows. When mention was made regarding having advanced driving classes at the Blue Earth show, I believe most people who were present at the meeting were of the mind to keep these regional shows geared toward the novice performer. Those who wanted the advanced driving classes were for the most part, people who mostly showed their horses in the driving events. I would like to see these people compete in the other classes offered at the show, such as the under saddle events or draft classes. They talk about developing the horse to its fullest potential, but only show in one discipline. The term "professionalism" also came up in Carol's letter. And I agree that we all need education in that respect, but I find it hard to compete against the professionals. I cannot afford a full time trainer, or even a part time one. Nor can I afford to have a handler show my horses for me. Our entire years vacation time is our annual trip to the Blue Earth show. I purchased the best horse I could afford. And I just spent a lot of money to buy a saddle that fits my horse. But I can't afford to have a show saddle sitting in my basement only to be used one or two times during the year. I don't want the Fjords to go the way of the Quarter Horses. By that I mean I don't want to have to commit a fashion faux pas by showing my horse in the wrong color saddle, or wearing the wrong color shirt and vest in the ring. Yes, I think we should be nicely attired, but please don't take it to the extreme, especially in the regional shows. I, for one, don't want to see the regional shows overtaken by ONLY the large professionally staffed farms, or people that can afford to have their horses professionally trained. There has to be a place for the novices as well. And working towards excellence should be a fun and non- intimidating experience. Having a showmanship class or explaining what is looked for in driving or riding classes would be a great help to people like myself. I wasn't born with this knowledge and would be more than willing to learn. In regards to the promotional aspect of the Fjords, I do not see in ANY of my horse publications an advertisement or promotion for the Fjords. But every month I DO see the Icelandics, Miniatures, Pasos, Friesians, etc. promoted. I would like to see something on the Fjords, even once in a while. A decision would probably have to be made in regards to which publication we need to advertise. Many of you would like to see something in Driving Digest I'm sure, but we need to be seen in other publications as well. The only magazine I see Fjords regularly advertised is The Small Farmers Journal. Mainly I would like to see the Fjord people work towards uniting under only one registry in the United States. As I understand it now, there are two: the National Fjord Horse Registry and the Fjord Horse Breeders of America. But I guess that stems from a former split in ideas of whether we have horses or ponies. Someone could possibly enlighten me on this. Thanks, Carol, for opening up this discussion. I hope we can all benefit from the input and ideas that I'm sure will ensue. Mary Ofjord North Coast Fjords
Re: fjordhorse-digest V98 #182
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hey all, been lurking a long time, but Carol's (and others') comments on promoting the breed caught my interest and I felt I needed to offer my humble opinion. I raise, train, and show Miniature Horses. I have been involved with the local Club here for 7 years, five of which I have been their Newsletter Editor and Publicity Chairperson. When I first took on the job, the club had little funding to help "spread the word" about the Miniature Horse and our club. So I had to become very inventive and conservative with spendings. What we have found over the years to be a very good way to show off the Miniatures at little or almost no cost... is to enter "all-breed" stallion parades, or exhibits at County and State Fairs... and Horse Expositions usually offer a demonstration time to get out in front of an audience and show what you can do with that particular breed of horse, and the announcer reads a written script you hand in. It can include history of the breed or just an explanation of what you are doing with the horses. Most of our horse expos give about 15 minutes per breed, and if it lasts more than one day, you get to do it each day. These usually charge a minimal fee for stall and booth space but is well worth it. I know that Idaho (I live in Utah) has one coming up in Boise in February... And the Eastern Idaho State Fair ( Blackfoot) offers this type of exposure plus many driving classes and exhibitions each Labor Day (full week) Local parades and horse shows are certainly something almost every Fjord owner can attend and "show off" their Fjord inexpensively. It takes a lot of individual work as well as group participation. It is absolutely a "rush" to go to an open show and win a Halter, Showmanship or performance class with your Fjord and always they draw attention and questions. Most local horse-related publications welcome stories and photos from ALL breeds. and some just love the more exotic, unique equines. Start making some phone calls and asking around. I send in articles to two or three papers every couple of months , giving them our upcoming schedule of events, results of shows etc, and cute photos to go with if just in case they have room. Just some ideas Luwana Day [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Horsebones in graves, was: Fjords in costume
This message is from: Anneli Sundkvist <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Marsha Jo Hannah wrote: >>I've heard the contention that old Nordic grave sites, from 2000 to 4000 years ago, contained skeletons of what looked a lot like Fjords.Would you care to comment on the known archeological (bones, artwork,etc) history of Fjords?>> Ok, basically: 2000 BC - 0 is the Scandinavian Bronze Age (starts at 1700 BC, ends c. 500 BC) and Celtic Iron Age. I am not specialized in these period, but I think that finds of horse bones in graves are very rare from these periods. We know of horse tack from the Bronze Age, but artefacts have been found in deposites/hoards. During the Roman Iron Age (0-400 AD) horses were sacrificed as part of the cult. Skeletons and tack has later been found in what now are bogs, but what then were lakes. Analysis that have been carried out, but since most of the excavation were carried out in the 60's there were no certain way to judge breed/type/parentage of the horses. The size were however measurable, and most prehistoric horses from Scandinavia seem to be 12-14,3 hands. This fits the size of the Fjord well, but also many other breeds, e.g. the Icelandic horse. The 'great' era for horses in graves in prehistoric Sweden were the Vendel Period (c. 500-800 AD) and the Viking Age (c. 800-1060 AD). Horses were put in chieftain's graves during the Vendel period. The boat graves from the Mälar Valley in Sweden are world famous. Here, a man was put in a boat togheter with several horses with tack, kitchen stuff, other animals, precious clothes and weapons. The boat were then buried (not burnt). Only one man/generation was buried this way. By the end of the Vendel Period, the boat burial custom are getting more common and the gifts put in the graves less expensive. Horses stay to be an important part of the grave goods. Horses are seldom found in female grave, but they do exist. The most famous exemple are the famous Oseberg ship burial from Norway. This grave is dated to 830's AD, and many (I don´t remeber if it is 10 or 15) horses were put in the grave, all decapitivated. A saddle, 3 sleighs and a wagon were also found in the grave. The wood was very well preserved, due to the soil conditions. So, what kind of horses were these? Until less 10 years ago, it was not possible to say. But nowadays, it is possible to use DNA-technique on ancient bones too, and soon we will therefore be able to tell what modern horses are the 'children' of the ancient ones in Scandinavia, and how they are related. The work was first focused on building up a database with the DNA-profile of all modern horse breeds, to use as a refrence for ancient studies. There are a Swedish archaeologist that works to DNA-profile horses from some Swedish Iron Age sites, but his work is not ready yet. So far we have to do with the knowledge that our breed is very old, which the 100% dun colur proves. The Fjord is also closely related to the Icelandic horse. So my guess is that these two modern breeds had the same ancestors. During the last 1000 years, man's diffrent need has developed the Scandinavian horses to different breeds. Regards Anneli >Marsha Jo HannahMurphy must have been a horseman-- >[EMAIL PROTECTED] anything that can go wrong, will! >30 mi SSE of San Francisco, Calif. >--- > >
Carol's comments
This message is from: walker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> This message is from: walker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I'm sure Carol's comments are accurate but may strike some as being too direct, but I think we all need to hear the truth and deal with it head on. Although I did not attend Blue Earth or Libby, I attended both days in Woodstock at the NEFjord show in August. I saw fewer attendees in Vermont this year than in the past - some key breeders/competitors were at Myopia rather than the breed show due to the level of competition offered there. In addition, the lack of fjord information, products, and opportunities to purchase anything Fjord related was astounding! There was an ad in the program about the NEFjord group, but no phone #, mailing address or registration form so one could join! The judges at the show did not comment on the classes or the winners over the speaker - we had a good judge 2 years ago from Michigan, I believe, who gave very interesting feedback to entries in various classes. I have only been a spectator for the past 3 years but I can tell you that the show was not exciting as it has been in the past. I came back with my family on Sunday to see the fjord western reining demonstration (because it was so interesting and professionally presented, very educational!) which was promised at noon and it was cancelled! Didn't those wonderful ladies travel an incredible distance to promote the Fjord in western mode? Why is the Registry NOT involved??
Carol's Comments
This message is from: Mike May <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I have forwarded Carol's comments and the several responses to them to the BOD members that DO have email. Surprisingly 6 of the current BOD members have email. I think the one new member also has email.
