Re: Go Figure
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 1/20/01 6:11:18 PM Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: , she would rather have had me marrying one Karem Abdul Jabar, Im sure. G He's okay, but you'd have ended up with arabians instead of fjords! He had my favorite line of arabs, Moniet El Nefous type. They were something! Pamela Who worked in an accounting firm that handled Kareem and his gorgeous horses!
Re: Natural Selection of Stallions -
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 1/20/01 5:42:14 PM Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: . Does this mean that the Fjord horse would then ONLY be available to VERY RICH people? Not to burst anyone's bubble, but I think there's a lot more average families out there than there are rich families. Therefore, if we're going to keep the Fjord the perfect family horse, I think a lot more planning needs to go into this idea. I see your point, and I also see Carol's. It would be nice if we could ensure that the best of the best are bred. And also nice to see that the horses remain versatile and hardy. So far, I think that Evaluations are doing as good a job as any at that. And we've got a fairly decent sized gene pool to pick from in the U.S. Once we get our hands on the Evaluation Book (hint, hint, WHEN does it get mailed out I can't wait to see it!) we can get a pretty informed idea of what horse is more versatile, etc. The only problem I have with what I read Carol's way of thinking is this, I think that the hardiness of the breed would be affected if the gene pool were to be drastically reduced. Would a 100 day test type of thing as they have in Europe leave us with only a handful of stallions? Thereby giving us no option but to do a lot of inbreeding/linebreeding? I'm not an authority on testing/evaluating, etc., but I think that responsible breeders, using tools available to them (evaluations for one) can breed a strong, versatile Fjordhorse and keep the gene pool healthy strong and viable. Now that we know Mr. Von Bon's (well respected) opinion on stallions, I'd be very interested to know what other equally knowledgable fjord experts have to say on the subject. I am always cautious about getting information from more than one source. Do other authorities see the same trend? I've kept my eyes and ears open and see some stallions out there that I think are everything even the most discriminating expert would approve of, as far as strength, type, ability, hardiness, and I have a filly by one of them (Misha) and am breeding a mare to another one (Hostar) this coming season. I also am very interested in Flotren, and oh my, Konnggard, and, well, I could go on and on! I think there are some fantastic stallions in this country. And I'm very glad to know that they are there to pick the very best match I can for each individual mare that I may breed. Pamela
Re: Inagural Parade
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 1/20/01 5:29:52 PM Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: . It was the poorest coverage of any parade that I've ever seen, and sad to say, I didn't see Hannah or Amy. Did anyone get luckier than I did? J. Sigh. I watched the parade myself. I don't like the way Bush got into office, and I'm not convinced he DESERVES to be there. but what can I do? It's a done deal. The amount of booing and protesting was phenomenal and rather sad. Even I, who am not happy with the election results, think the man deserves ONE DAY of just enjoying his new presidency. Oh well. So let's just say it was painful for me to watch the parade, especially since today was a wonderful day to ride! I gave up and put a tape in the VCR. Came back and within the first five minutes of tape saw the Sidesaddle Riders. In the back were the fjords. The cameraman must not have noticed them at first, but once the camera found them, it stayed with them till the riders passed the new president. Pamela
Re: Alternative Ranching
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 1/21/01 1:18:17 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: What is the name of the hormone medicine made from the mares urine? If I ever need it, I don't want that one!! You would be speaking of Premarin, and there is a perfectly good synthetic alternative, but it doesn't make the big clicks for the Druggies, so it's downplayed. Merek
Re: Inagural Parade
This message is from: truman matz [EMAIL PROTECTED] Lynn, that about makes me mad enough to spit, (that I missed it!!). Glad you got to see them, though! J. -Original Message- From: Lynn Mohr [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: fjordhorse@angus.mystery.com fjordhorse@angus.mystery.com Date: Saturday, January 20, 2001 9:19 PM Subject: Re: Inagural Parade This message is from: Lynn Mohr [EMAIL PROTECTED] C-span showed the side saddle group, and focused on the fjords quite a while considering the length they covered any one group Lynn Mohr
Re: Alternative Ranching
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Our Meat Guys are always in the Front Reserved Seats !! Although I did find out, not all of them go to the canner, alot of these guys see a good deal and are actually horse traders, What is the name of the hormone medicine made from the mares urine? If I ever need it, I don't want that one!! Michele Noonan (who is 35, didnt see my name on the list, saw hubby's though) Mom to Fjords Opal (11) Tone' (7) NFH Gracie (7) and two soon to be born foals Our kids are Jake 18 (on Monday), and hates horses Mandy 15 and lives for the LIST and rides daily, Patrick (6)and Riley(5), (the wild little red head boys, trying to keep them off the horses)
Re:copycat
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 1/20/01 7:06:31 PM Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Anyway, it will be interesting to see if she picks up a fjord! eg Pamela Pamela, are you married? Is he nervous (vbg). I had a friend like that for years, too. Kept my partner in line. Gail Las Cruces, NM
Re: Synthetic Harness
This message is from: Laurie Pittman [EMAIL PROTECTED] I highly recommend Camptown Harness ( Dave McWethy's ) for a well made, great looking synthetic harness. I poo poo'd anything but leather, UNTIL I tried a synthetic harness, now we have singles, pairs and a new 4-up of it. Ok Lisa, I remember you poo pooing synthetic harness whenever I mentioned how much I love my Zilco, so I can't help snickering a bit when I hear you extolling the virtues of them now. G I also have one of Dave McWethy's Betta Biothane harness's and I love it too. I'm another one that will never have a leather harness again. Laurie in NW Washington
Re: Inagural Parade
This message is from: Lynn Mohr [EMAIL PROTECTED] C-span showed the side saddle group, and focused on the fjords quite a while considering the length they covered any one group Lynn Mohr
Re:drooling and mineral blocks
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] About the drooling. I heard once that drooling can be a sign of an ulcer. Don't know much else about it, sorry. Haven't heard that one. I think the most common causes of drooling that I see in order from most common to least common are: 1) foxtail or thistle sores 2) baby teeth that don't want to shed 3) choke 4) clover 5) foreign bodies, i.e. wire, sticks, etc. In regards to the salt blocks. My horses used to use both the brown mineral/salt block and the plain salt blocks. I wouldn't really bother with the mineral blocks. There just isn't enough mineral in those things to add much to the diet, especially if you are already feeding a commercial diet. Just stick with the salt blocks as a treat and to ensure adequate water intake. Steve Steve and Amy White Prairieholm Farm Waterloo, Nebraska
Re: Natural Selection of Stallions -
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] The article was refering to racing horses in particular and the author felt that horses were weaker today due to undue babying. Jane I'll agree to that. That's one reason it's been so long since we've had a triple crown winner. I even heard a top trainer (D.Wayne Lucas) suggesting we shorten the triple crown races so we would have more winners. If all else fails, lower your standards I guess. Steve Steve and Amy White Prairieholm Farm Waterloo, Nebraska
Re: age data base-- revision # 1
This message is from: Denise Delgado [EMAIL PROTECTED] dear carol, oh, no!! i'm not the officiali just have been doing it for fun. thx. denise OK Are you the official data base list gather? Here is the rest of the data on me. My last name is Makosky
biothane
This message is from: Denise Delgado [EMAIL PROTECTED] listers, i have replaced all my leather odds and ends with biothane throughout. the halter/bridle combos i had specially made and fit each of my horses, perfectly. the stuff wears like iron, stays soft and is super easy to clean and keeps looking new. the main straps are black and then i had the lady apply a colored thinner overlay. that way i can quickly grab each horse's halter and bridle. you can use them separately or in the combo mode for trail riding. with my new saddle they sent me two breast peices. these are made out a the newer biothane that looks and feels more like leather. same great qualitites. i would never go back to leather. too much up keep! denise in northern calif.
QRe: Natural Selection of Stallions -
This message is from: truman matz [EMAIL PROTECTED] Here I am messing where I shouldn't be again, but it sounds like this is coming down to a class distinction in owners,... those who have mega bucks, and those who don't. Why don't those who DO have the money, go ahead and DO the 100 Day Testing, promote their stallions, and then get the mega bucks they deserve for their breedings or from their off-spring? Why push for something as a REQUIREMENT that ONLY the rich can afford? Why put the little breeder out of business if he's got satisfied customers? Now, I don't yet own a Fjord, so I'm not really part of this thing. But one doesn't have to be a rocket scientist to figure out that if all stallions are REQUIRED to do the 100 day testing, folks like me and some with a lot more money than me, would either have to mortgage our homes to buy a Fjord or end up buying some other breed. And that would be a shame Judy-Original Message- From: Karen McCarthy [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: fjordhorse@angus.mystery.com fjordhorse@angus.mystery.com Date: Saturday, January 20, 2001 12:35 PM Subject: Re: Natural Selection of Stallions - This message is from: Karen McCarthy [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] I think that's marvelous idea, Carol. Of course most folks will reject it because they don't want to go through the trouble or their stallions wouldn't make it. --. Upon better research on your end, I think you might see that the 100 Day Testing is very impractical, not to mention severly expensive. It would cost far more than the market value of a stallion to put him thru something like this. Would you re-coup it in breedings? Perhaps, if you wanted to spend the rest of your life promoting him, maybe you could make up for the $$$ spent in the testing. (Karen) _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
Go Figure
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 1/20/01 11:30:11 AM Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Likely cows have more brains than W has displayed so far. Merek ! I would have placed you as a true blue Republican..well what do you know about that. There may be hope for a good conversation over a cup of whatever someday ! My Granny Milly came to Minnesota from Sweden on a boat when she was 16. Died at age 94 a couple of years ago. She told the best Norwegian and Republican jokes of anyone I have ever met. Had true undiluted dislike for both. When I married Jeff, I told her that I was getting hitchedand she asked o, to that big blond guy ?Yes, I said, Well how do you SPELL that name again ? PEDERSEN Granny Ohh, well then, thats OK with me. ( Danish ) If it had been spelled with a T and an O , she would rather have had me marrying one Karem Abdul Jabar, Im sure. G Lisa PEDERSEN
Ortho-flex saddle for sale!
This message is from: Jean Ernest [EMAIL PROTECTED] Well, this tack-a-holic did it again: I bought yet another Ortho-flex saddle, so now I have a new Patriot, a western Brazos and TWO Stitchdown English Ortho-Flex saddles (I did sell one of the first OF I had..so thought I had to buy another?) Anyway, I am putting the 18.5 Stitchdown up for sale. It is virtually new, probably only ridden a total of 10 hours or so, kept in the house,etc. Black, shrunken grain leather, with a soft top grain upholstery leather stitchdown thickly padded seat. CUSHY! It comes with a set of fleece booties which were used once and are like new and quick-out safety stirrups, leathers and a neoprene girth. I paid $2200 new for it and am asking $1700 to see the Stitchdown model, go to their website http://www.ortho-flex.com/ scroll down to the bottom and click on the english saddles to see a picture of the Stitchdown. If someone is interested, I will take some pictures of this saddle with my Digital Camera and send them privately to you. Please e-mamil me privately if you have questions. Jean in Fairbanks, Alaska Jean Ernest Fairbanks, Alaska mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Bio Groom Anti Chew
This message is from: pattybronson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi Mary Guess I forgot to say that yes, Billy is a confirmed cribber. He has worn the Miracle Collar non stop and quite often will crib right through that. I thought one of Dr. McDonnell's comments was interesting regarding tightening the collar (everyone is always telling me I need to tighten it and it is tight). According to her they had a number of asphyxiation cases from people thinking that due to the stretching leather or continued cribbing they needed to keep tightening. You also strongly recommended against something called the vice breaker. When her staff researched the product with the manufacturer it had never actually been used on horses but was recommended for cribbing and unruly stallion handling. Thanks, Patty
Cribbing, chewing and sucking
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 1/20/01 11:30:11 AM Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: This message is from: pattybronson [EMAIL PROTECTED] I remember hearing that cribbing and wind-sucking started as boredom things but evolved into an addiction. The only true and failproof cure for cribbers is easy. Its called HOT WIRE. Friends used it for years, and when after 5 full years with no problems, the power went out, and their QH enjoyed a few blissfull hours of sucking. ( He stopped quick when power was restored. ) Lisa
Synthetic Harness
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 1/20/01 11:30:11 AM Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I bought some biothaine riding reins, last year...and really like them. I just saw an add for a driving harness made out of this materialanyone have anything they'd like to share, good or bad, about buying a harness made out of this? Aimee I highly recommend Camptown Harness ( Dave McWethy's ) for a well made, great looking synthetic harness. I poo poo'd anything but leather, UNTIL I tried a synthetic harness, now we have singles, pairs and a new 4-up of it. For practicle use, daily workouts, and hitching by myself, its so much easier. ( Lighter, and you can throw it down into the dirthose it off and it looks brand new.) Its nice enough to show in, and we have paraded using it also. Call Dave and ask about it. Heres a link : A HREF=http://www.horseharness.com/;Camptown Harness/Aask him about the special signed-by-a-guru-model.mine is COOL ! Lisa * who still loves the look and smell of my russett harness, but cant get Jeff to clean all that brass anymore ! ; ( PS : Funny, the ONLY kind of lines I like are leather.go figure.
Re: Natural Selection of Stallions -
This message is from: truman matz [EMAIL PROTECTED] I don't even own a Fjord yet, but desire to do so as soon as possible. Fjords are purported to be the do everything horse, and to be the family horse. From what I've studied about the breed thus far, I find them to be a wonderful animal, and I surely wouldn't want to see them lose any of their fine qualities. I also don't know anything about the 100 Day Test, (or whatever it was), but have been reading in this listing that it would be VERY expensive. Does this mean that the Fjord horse would then ONLY be available to VERY RICH people? Not to burst anyone's bubble, but I think there's a lot more average families out there than there are rich families. Therefore, if we're going to keep the Fjord the perfect family horse, I think a lot more planning needs to go into this idea. God bless those with the money. They can do all the things the little guy can't, which is wonderful for the breed. But we need the average families just as much, because they make up the bulk of the Fjord market. Sorry to be just rattling on here, but feel that there's got to be a solution that's to everyone's advantage, and mostly to the advantage of the Fjord. Judy -Original Message- From: Lori Albrough [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: fjordhorse@angus.mystery.com fjordhorse@angus.mystery.com Date: Saturday, January 20, 2001 12:19 PM Subject: Re: Natural Selection of Stallions - This message is from: Lori Albrough [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What do you think? I think that's marvelous idea, Carol. Of course most folks will reject it because they don't want to go through the trouble or their stallions wouldn't make it. Further to my earlier message on this subject, I wanted to clarify that I think it is a good idea, but like someone mentioned, it would be extraordinarily expensive (and difficult to just find the trainers and riders who would be qualified enough to run the program) but at some point down the road it may be cost effective. But first we have to create a market for people who can get past the cute/fuzzy thing and consider a Fjord for dressage/cutting/etc. Lori
Re: Inagural Parade
This message is from: truman matz [EMAIL PROTECTED] I sat in front of the TV from 9:30 A.M. 'til 5 P.M., watching CNN coverage of the Inaguration/ Parade, etc. It was the poorest coverage of any parade that I've ever seen, and sad to say, I didn't see Hannah or Amy. Did anyone get luckier than I did? J. -Original Message- From: Gregor Fellers [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: fjordhorse@angus.mystery.com fjordhorse@angus.mystery.com Date: Friday, January 12, 2001 5:11 PM Subject: Inagural Parade This message is from: Gregor Fellers [EMAIL PROTECTED] We have two Fjords that will be in the January 20, inaugural parade. SF Amy and SF Hannah will be ridden side saddle with the International Side Saddle Organization. Carol Fellers in cold NH.
Re: NW Stockshow Perf.
This message is from: Karen McCarthy [EMAIL PROTECTED] Wow Beth! Thanks for the great description of your performance. Sounds like too much fun...wish we had something like that around here (N. Nevada), but no. I've done a driving to music thing at the annual Dressage in the Wine Country performance in Sonoma County a couple of times. Got a friend with a Halflinger, and another w/ a Welsh cob we did a CDE sport pony routine/demo. Not near as much fun as a full orchestra 'tho! Count me in for a video! Karen _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
Re: 100 day tests ? Nope.
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 1/20/01 12:30:19 PM Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: ? Never happen. This is America, where people here ( in every horse breed ) thinks that every cute piece of male fluff to hit their back yard is stallion quality. There are too many stallions now being kept intact, and most of them will never leave their Oh Lisa, don't get me started on this! I have a friend who I SWEAR copies every last thing I do!!! When I bought my first horse, a very nice Arab gelding, she went out and bought an Arab. Stallion. Now my gelding was very nice, very correct, but didn't have the extra something that a stallion should have. Her stallion was worse! Extremely crooked legs, overbite, etc. But she wouldn't geld him. I started taking archery, with a simple recurve bow, SHE started taking archery with a compound bow. I should be flattered! Ten years ago I moved to the Pacific Northwest, and yep. Guess where she's living now! Chewelah Washington LOL. Right SMACK dab next to one of my favorite stallions, Hostar (Misha is another one. I have to alternate breeding Juniper between these two. I wish Juniper had a clone so I could breed her to both stallions every year!). Anyway, it will be interesting to see if she picks up a fjord! eg Pamela
Re: eons and eons and eons, etc...............
This message is from: Michele Bigelow [EMAIL PROTECTED] You can add us to your list.Michele 35, and Dave 44.
Re: Built FJORD Tough
This message is from: Karen McCarthy [EMAIL PROTECTED] As far as Bumper Stickers, how about Why own a CHEVY, when you can drive a FJORD ? Lisa I like it!! Karen _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
Re: Natural Selection of Stallions -
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Arthur Rivoire) Hello from Carol Rivoire at Beaver Dam Farm in Nova Scotia - Before people start arguing, let me restate the point of my posting - I said that according to B.J. van Bon, Chief Inspector of Fjords for Holland, today's Fjord breeding stallions don't have the qualities of strength; ie, (physical strength, endurance, longevity, thriftiness) that the older stallions had. He's mentioned this concern to me several times over the last few years, but it was only in a recent conversation I fully understood his meaning and the implications. What he was saying was that the Norwegian Fjord Horse has a heritage of immense strength in the above mentioned areas - Muscle Power, Endurance, Thriftiness (able to live long, productive, hard-working lives with minimal care and food.) Not that we should deprive our horses, but that we should take care not to lose these inherent strengths through our methods of horsekeeping and usage. He was saying that in the old days in Norway, the breeding stallions were used by the farmers in very rough terrain and conditions. If the stallion didn't stand up, he wasn't used for breeding. Van Bon called that Natural Selection of Stallions. I asked him that IF FJORDS WERE SPORT HORSES, wouldn't that (the rigors of training and competiton) be an equally good method of slecting stallions and maintaining these qualities of strength in the breed? He agreed it would. The reason he zeroed in on the stallions is that STALLIONS HAVE THE MOST INFLUENCE ON THE BREED. --- IMPORTANT POINT: Stallions have the most influence ONLY IF good breeding practices are in effect. By that I mean, STRICT SELECTION OF STALLIONS, gelding all those not worthy. And to do that, there has to be a system that weeds out the weak ones. I agree that the American Evaluation system is important, but it's not everything. Could we not have something more, like the 100 Day Testing? The Evaluation defines the conformation and movement of the horse, and his training, but tells little about the endurance of the horse. The 100 Day Testing (or some such system) does that. It's good advice to say that owners should get their horses out and compete them, thereby proving the stallion and generating interest in Fjords as sport horses. I agree. However, shouldn't we think about a system that would weed out undesirable stallions BEFORE they spend years breeding? Some say such a system is prohibitively expensive - WHY WOULD A 100 DAY TESTING need to be that expensive? Let's make it 90 Days. That's three months at a Training Barn. Don't you think it might be possible to set up a system whereby an experienced, reputatable trainer (approved by a system we'd set up) might take on six Fjord stallions at a time at a monthly rate of, say $1000 per month per horse? That's a lot of money, I know, but wouldn't it be worth it for a good stallion? A stallion that can earn $1,000 stud fee? A stallion that, as an Approved Stallion having done the 100 Days might attract ten mares ($10,000) the next season? And $1,000 per horse per month is an attractive fee for the trainer justifying, I'd think, a vigorous work-out twice a day, which would tell a tremdous amount about the horse. Obviously, this investment wouldn't be worthwhile for every stallion breeding today, but that's the point. It WOULD be worthwhile for the good ones. Training Centers that meet certain criteria could be approved around the country giving each stallion a level playing field. I don't see that this is prohibitively expensive for serious breeders. STRICTLY OPTIONAL: In any case, it would be strictly optional, leaving the free marketplace to prove its value. In 100 days (or 90 days) of rigorous training, it would become apparent which stallions had what it takes to stay sound in mind and body, and those are the ones we need to carry on the tradition of the Fjordhorse. Karen questioned why mares don't go through the same process. The reason is that ideally it's the stallions who have the most influence on a breed, seeing that mares have one foal a year, and stallions several. However, that depends on what standards a breed has for its stalions. I once went to a Morgan breeding conference where they said the average Morgan stallion bred 1.2 mares per year. -- Obviously, as regards influence on the breed, there's not much difference between Morgan mares and stallions. --- That's not the tradition of Fjordhorses. The breed is traditionally improved through the stallions. I think we've got to guard against this sort of thing. At last count, there were 81 breeding farms listed in the Fjord Herald. I would hazard a guess that there are at least 200 stallions (reg. unregistered) breeding in the U.S. All of them contributing to the gene pool. How many of them do you think come anywhere near the standards of Norway or Holland? There are some, to be sure, but
Re: drooling and stretching
This message is from: Karen McCarthy [EMAIL PROTECTED] This message is from: Bonnie Liermann [EMAIL PROTECTED] About the drooling. I heard once that drooling can be a sign of an ulcer. Don't know much else about it, sorry. I have had experiences with horses drooling from a mouth abcess; usually an object, grass awn, (foxtail), lodging in the feshy area under the tongue. My vet told me to flush out the mouth with the end of a hose, apply peroxide, and re-flush. After about 2-3 days, drooling (and nasty smell) all gone. Now there is drooling, and there is drooling...I do think we had a thread last year about droolers at feeding time; for them, there is NO cure! I own one, my mare Tise, who needs a drool cup! (Do any of you out there - and I know there s/b a few from the looks of the median age of this list - remember the Sat. Nite Live skit about the drool cup???) Re. stretching: Mr. Sven will do this on a good sunny morning, right before I feed. I call it his sun stretch and his chest actually touches the ground. He also scatches himself on the ear with a hind hoof. Not bad for a 22 year old fart-box sunfisher. Karen McCarthy Great Basin Fjords Carson City, NV _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
Re: Ages?
This message is from: pattybronson [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hmm, I think age is a state of mind unfortunately I haven't figured out what state mine is in. Happily trotting along Patty
Re: Bio Groom Anti Chew
This message is from: Mary Thurman [EMAIL PROTECTED] --- pattybronson [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This message is from: pattybronson [EMAIL PROTECTED] No he is definitely cribbing although they are all 4 legged termites. I should mention that due to an injury my now 10 month old filly has been stall bound since Nov. 28th. She started chewing but the anti chew seems to have curbed her appetite. I think you are probably right in assuming that there really isn't anything bad tasting enough to deter a confirmed cribber. I assume that most of the 'stop chewing' products on the market are aimed at stopping a 'chewer' when he first gets started - before he becomes a 'confimed chewer' or evolves into a cribber. I find that the young ones start tasting everything around about the same time they start shedding/cutting teeth. Since tooth shedding goes on into the fifth year (or is it later than that?) I always watched for signs of chewing and applied a 'chew deterent' as soon as I saw them. It seems to go in 'fits and spurts' as they cut the new teeth for that year and stop worrying things, then start up again when the next set starts to itch. My usual procedure was to start out with Ivory bar soap rubbed on 'tasted' spots - since, as you say, Anti Chew is sometimes hard to find - then I'd quickly go to the bitter stuff if soap was not working. I've found Bio Groom Anti Chew in a few horse supply catalogs - Valley Vet Supply, and Country Horse Supply are a couple of them. Hope it keeps working for your younger horses. Sounds like your gelding is a confirmed cribber already, so will probably always need a collar or some such device. Mary = Mary Thurman Raintree Farms [EMAIL PROTECTED] __ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Auctions - Buy the things you want at great prices. http://auctions.yahoo.com/
Re: Ages?
This message is from: Jon Mary Ofjord [EMAIL PROTECTED] As long as we are 'fessing up, I am still 49 for a few more months. Jon Mary can confess on her own. My lips are sealed.
National Western Stock Show and stuff
This message is from: Starfire Farm, LLC [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hello everyone, Sorry I dropped the ball on a few past subjects (including being volunteered by PAT.) I'll have to get back to them. We were busy preparing for, and performing in, the National Western Stock Show Evening of Dancing Horses. I'm preparing an article for the Herald, but will give you the short version here. Sandy and I have been performing in the Evening of Dancing Horses for the past six years. This was a show started by our local dressage group which consisted of people riding their dressage horses in musical freestyles, performing for the general public. We originally rode to recorded music. The following year, Michael Martin Murphey was introduced to the show, providing live Country music to add to the horse performances. Four years ago I pulled a group of riders and drivers together to perform in a quadrille with Fjord horses. We rode a quadrille to live music by MMM and the band for the next two years. Last year (2000) Taffy Plaisted and I drove a carriage pas de deux to MMM and the band playing and singing Mustang Sally. This year the show (which was two nights, again sold out) was performed entirely with live music, including Michael and his band and the Pueblo Symphony with conductor Dr. Jacob Chi. The band and the symphony were on a huge stage set on the arena floor, and we and our Fjords performed two acts. One was a driving/riding pas de trois in which Taffy Plaisted rode her mare RT Solveig, I drove our relatively new pair BDF John Arthur and BDF Magnum to a marathon carriage and Diane Krause drove her grey mare Melody (a Snowy Mountain mare) to a Meadowbrook cart. Diane and I drove a mirror pattern while Taffy interspersed some dressage movements; half pass, extended trot, simple changes, etc. We were wearing Victorian ball gowns, with Sandy on the back of my carriage in top hat and tails. Michael, the band and the Symphony played one of Michael's songs called Carolina in the Pines. The crowd (5,000 people each night) loved our routine, especially the parts where the pair and the single cart drove opposing circles, with one turnout driving inside the circle of the other. We received whoops, hollers and whistles along with enthusiastic applause during the entire routine. During the first night's performance, Melody got a little carried away with the crowd applause, the band and the symphony and cantered around for the first part of the routine. John and Magnum were steady and stayed on pattern, allowing Diane and Melody to re-enter the pattern about halfway through. The crowd never knew anything was wrong. All were on the second night, and our performance was nearly flawless. Samantha and Savanna Poirier, Ginny Wegener, and Carrie Young joined John Arthur, Magnum and I to act out the lyrics to MMM singing The Pony Man which is a song about children dreaming about riding ponies and sailing in a pirate ship. Michael sings this to children who have come from the audience and sit in front of the stage. It's a touching piece, and I'm sure there were several tears shed by some of the adults in the audience. Other acts included; vaulting, professional trick roper and trainer Jerry Diaz and his wife performing to live opera, Biker babes and a Harley motorcycle, Eitan riding his Morgan stallion doing Cowboy Dressage, a reining/dressage pas de deux, a Quadrille of adults and a Quadrille of children on their darling ponies, musical performances, etc., etc. It has a little something for everyone, even those not interested in horses. After the show is done, the audience is invited to the paddock area to meet the horses and performers. The Fjords were a hit, mugging for friendly pats and making new friends. Our audience is becoming more knowledgeable, as no one asked us if we painted that stripe down their mane and back! Or, perhaps the announcer mentioned it prior to the routine. Quite a few admirers told us that they come every year just to see the Fjords! If anyone is interested in a copy of our video, contact us privately. The video is not professionally produced, it was shot by Sandy or our friends either at the arena gate or in the audience. There are some good close-up shots, however, and you can get a feel for how it really went. We'll include footage of last year's performance as well as this, and ask a small fee to reimburse cost of tape, packaging and postage. If you live in Colorado (or can be in Colorado during January) and want to be part of next year's performance, contact me. Plans are already underway for another quadrille! Come join us in the fun! Beth -- Beth Beymer Sandy North Starfire Farm, Berthoud CO http://www.starfirefarm.com
New Website
This message is from: Sherle Monheim [EMAIL PROTECTED] We have a new website up and running, some pages are still under construction, but would like some fee back as to how it looks. Thanks Sherle in Northern Wisconsin where its Sunny and a +10 today, but the days are getting longer. Website is: BWRanch.homestead.com/BitsWheels.html
New Website
This message is from: Sherle Monheim [EMAIL PROTECTED] We have a new website up and running, some pages are still under construction, but would like some fee back as to how it looks. Thanks Sherle in Northern Wisconsin where its Sunny and a +10 today, but the days are getting longer.
Alternative Ranching
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 1/20/01 11:30:11 AM Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I cannot handle going to those sales, as half the horses go to slaughter, and that only because people have NOT taken care of them, or because they breed w/o purpose and so the result is like a bunch of yearlings etc with nowhere to go. Probably a few of the Belgians that came thru are out of peelines(sp?) Sorry, just had to steam off here. G Janne in ND Otherwise known as Premerin Lines. ( They make a hormone replacment for menopase age women out of mare urine, and the drafts are bigger, thus more pee, and tend to comply with standing in tie stalls, catherized for months. ) Yes, one of the major player in pee ranching is in the Dakotas. The other biggies are mostly in Canada. My rancher friend, Jack, in Sask. Canada, see's 100's of Draft and Draft crosses run through the spring auctions each week. All foals, and they sell for 50.00 to the meat guy. A result of keeping the Premerin mares, bred, thus making the hormone thats needed. The older ones get more, by the pound. All sent to the canners for the Europeian markets and Japan, for consumption. I also do not stomach auctions that sell horses to the (always there in the back row,) meat guys.Lisa
Re: age data base-- revision # 1
This message is from: carol j makosky [EMAIL PROTECTED] Denise Delgado wrote: This message is from: Denise Delgado [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Denise Delgado [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: fjordhorse@angus.mystery.com Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2001 8:54 PM Subject: eons and eons and eons, etc... This message is from: Denise Delgado [EMAIL PROTECTED] well, listers. this is what i have come up with so far..some of the names do not have last names. i just took the names listed and have reproduced them here. any of you out there who have neglected to add on, feel free to do so. here goes katy andersen-14 caitlin-15 anneli-34 susan ginise-34 reena-36 terri hooper (id)-36 aimee day-36 lori albrough-36 russ ginise-37 janne mydral (nd)-38 gunnar rogstad-38 candy sloma-38 jane in maine-38 amy evers-39 patty jo walter-39 catherine lassesen-40 mark mcginley-41 ed sloma-42 lisa-42 karen mccarthy-43 suzan-43 andrea salkow-44 lisa pedersen-44 carole sweet-44 linda hickman-46 pamela (northorse)-46 joni griffin-46 kim rogstad-46 sue giargiari-46 pat mccurty-47 denise delgado-47 micheal melbye-48 pam garofalo-49 teresa (kodiak fishco)-50 kathy spiegel-51 cheryl beillard-51 linda in minn-51 merek geiger-52 gail russel-53 sue clark sorger-53 mike may-53 betsy bister-54 marion bijster-54 marty in md-54 cynthia madden-54 betsy in michigan-55 mike noonan-55 gail vinson in n.m.-55 dick giargiari-56 carol and patrick (jhalst)-56 julie will-56 steve mcilree-57 carol m, golden pond-57 pat porter-58 rondi tyler-60 jean ernst-60 carol tacey-60 carol rivoire-60 sue (ny)-63 bernie karns-63 tony dimuccio-63 fred pack-64 mel goble-67 tillie evers-67 bud evers-71 jean gayle-75 OK Are you the official data base list gather? Here is the rest of the data on me. My last name is Makosky (Carol M. On Golden Pond) I am 57 and retired with my husband, Dan, (58) three years ago. We lived in Waukesha in southern WI for 23 yrs. We left that area just in time as the subdivisions started to spring up like mushrooms there. We have two children, a boy 25 and girl 23. We have one horse, Heidi, my Fjord, 2 labs and 2 Jack Russells, and one cat. -- Built FJORD tough Carol M. On Golden Pond Northern Wisconsin
Secret Santa Karen Kuthka (sp?)
This message is from: Starfire Farm, LLC [EMAIL PROTECTED] Karen, Your Secret Santa gift arrived. Thank you so very much! A beautiful hand painted Fjord on a stone welcome sign (painted by you!) and a wooden clock, also with a hand painted Fjord, surrounded by Norwegian flowers. The horse cookies look and smell so good that we have to resist eating them ourselves! Everything arrived intact, the clock is up and running. Well worth the wait. We guessed that you were somewhere east of us, but didn't get much further than Kansas! Thanks, again. Happy New Year. Beth -- Beth Beymer Sandy North Starfire Farm, Berthoud CO http://www.starfirefarm.com
100 day tests ? Nope.
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 1/20/01 11:30:11 AM Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Maybe it's time for the Evaluation Committee and the NFHR to seriously discuss 100 Day Testing for Fjord stallions, and requiring them to perform in sporting events such as dressage, cutting, combined driving. ... What do you think? I think I dont get it. I hauled my Stallion, 3 days to Mn. this summer, after working for 4 months getting him ready to perform well, both in conformation and riding tests. He did a great job, for never being exposed to much outside of his comfort zone, got a great evaluation with lots of very helpful comments from all evaluators. I can now work on training points, not approached before, and breed mares to him that work with both his wonderful traites and faults. I can advertise him as an evaluated Stallion, and provide his paperwork to any interested mare owners, to see what the experts thought. What would a 100 day test do for ME, that I cannot already provide ? Beautiful offspring, out winning and showing, one evaluation done and working on a driving test for the next time. Sorry to report this bit of info. but in my experiences since getting Fjords in Utah, are that people want CHEAP, and are not too interested in his paperwork. Sad, but true. Of course, they also want broke ( bombproof ) to ride/ drive and big. You will have to convince me that the 100 day test means more to my potential customers, then the previously stated information.Lisa Pedersen PS : Also, what does REQUIRED mean ? You mean cull or at least geld the ones who dont do the 100 day test with passing marks ? Never happen. This is America, where people here ( in every horse breed ) thinks that every cute piece of male fluff to hit their back yard is stallion quality. There are too many stallions now being kept intact, and most of them will never leave their back yards to do anything.just like 90 % of the registered Fjord Stallions out there. Face it, the people who bring their breeding stallions out of their barns and do ANYTHING with them, are few, comparitivly. We do not live in the horse and buggy days anymore ( even in Utah G ) and working equines are nice in Amish country and movies. People here want pleasure horses for their own favorite disapline, and doing a draft test would not interest them. LP PSS : not saying I agree with that, just my observations from 25 years or horse owning.
Built FJORD Tough
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 1/20/01 11:30:11 AM Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Time to make up a new bumper sticker: KEEP THE FJORDHORSE WORKING! (I am sure someone out there can be inspired to a better way of saying this!) Karen McCarthy Oooops Karen ! I should have read further before posting.you said it all. As far as Bumper Stickers, how about Why own a CHEVY, when you can drive a FJORD ? Lisa
(no subject)
This message is from: Bonnie Liermann [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi List: Ok, to add to the list, I am 42. I own 4 horses, 1 is a fjord gelding that is almost 2. About the drooling. I heard once that drooling can be a sign of an ulcer. Don't know much else about it, sorry. In regards to the salt blocks. My horses used to use both the brown mineral/salt block and the plain salt blocks. Not excessively, but they would use it. At the time I used a powdered mineral in their feeds. I switched to a pelleted mineral called Equi-shine, which I like alot. Ever since then none of the horses use either block. I can only assume that this new mineral meets all of their requirements. The blocks are out in their paddock 24 hours and they just sit there. Can't wait until winter is gone. I hate ice! Have fun with your horses. bonnie in Wi
Mid Atlantic Fjord Horse Club
This message is from: Curtis Pierce [EMAIL PROTECTED] This is it! The grand announcement for the Mid Atlantic Fjord Horse Club organizational meeting to be held on Sunday, Feb. 11. We are gathering at Jan Bonner's Lynnhaven Farm in Scottsville, Virginia at 1:00 PM. Her farm is about 15 miles south of Charlottesville. E-mail me for directions at [EMAIL PROTECTED] or call me at 703-330-2498. YOu can also get information from Jan at [EMAIL PROTECTED] Anyone interested is invited, no matter what state they live in. We are trying to organize the Fjord owners in this area. As a club we can help each other, promote the Fjord Horse, and enjoy the company of other Fjord owners and interested persons. Please come to our meeting and bring a snack to share. If you can't make it, please contact me to pass on your ideas and interests. Pass this information to a friend! Curt Pierce Bristow VA It's cold and wet, but the Fjords love it outside!
Re: SnowWhite
This message is from: Karen McCarthy [EMAIL PROTECTED] Just deleted (w/o opening) a message in my inbox with the Snow White/HaHaHa in the subject line... _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
Re: Natural Selection of Stallions -
This message is from: Don Jane Brackett [EMAIL PROTECTED] As regards the toughness missing in today's horse that Carol mentioned, I do worry about this. And this is not just a problem with fjordhorses, but almost every horse on the face of the earth, 100 Day Tested or not. Interesting article on this subject in either Equus or The Horse (Jan issues, I was at the library reading so can't remember which). The article was refering to racing horses in particular and the author felt that horses were weaker today due to undue babying. Perfect footing on tracks etc, protecting the horses too much and not allowing flaws to show up until too late, and breeding for $ only. Certainly you have only to look at any horse catalog to see the most amazing assortment of supplements, blankets, pads, special shoes etc. to realize that there are a lot of unsound, and weak horses out there. Wonder how many of these are bred? Jane waiting for the parade to start to maybe get a glimpse of the girls riding the Fjords sidesaddle (do I remember this correctly?)
age data base-- revision # 1
This message is from: Denise Delgado [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Original Message - From: Denise Delgado [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: fjordhorse@angus.mystery.com Sent: Tuesday, January 16, 2001 8:54 PM Subject: eons and eons and eons, etc... This message is from: Denise Delgado [EMAIL PROTECTED] well, listers. this is what i have come up with so far..some of the names do not have last names. i just took the names listed and have reproduced them here. any of you out there who have neglected to add on, feel free to do so. here goes katy andersen-14 caitlin-15 anneli-34 susan ginise-34 reena-36 terri hooper (id)-36 aimee day-36 lori albrough-36 russ ginise-37 janne mydral (nd)-38 gunnar rogstad-38 candy sloma-38 jane in maine-38 amy evers-39 patty jo walter-39 catherine lassesen-40 mark mcginley-41 ed sloma-42 lisa-42 karen mccarthy-43 suzan-43 andrea salkow-44 lisa pedersen-44 carole sweet-44 linda hickman-46 pamela (northorse)-46 joni griffin-46 kim rogstad-46 sue giargiari-46 pat mccurty-47 denise delgado-47 micheal melbye-48 pam garofalo-49 teresa (kodiak fishco)-50 kathy spiegel-51 cheryl beillard-51 linda in minn-51 merek geiger-52 gail russel-53 sue clark sorger-53 mike may-53 betsy bister-54 marion bijster-54 marty in md-54 cynthia madden-54 betsy in michigan-55 mike noonan-55 gail vinson in n.m.-55 dick giargiari-56 carol and patrick (jhalst)-56 julie will-56 steve mcilree-57 carol m, golden pond-57 pat porter-58 rondi tyler-60 jean ernst-60 carol tacey-60 carol rivoire-60 sue (ny)-63 bernie karns-63 tony dimuccio-63 fred pack-64 mel goble-67 tillie evers-67 bud evers-71 jean gayle-75
Re: Natural Selection of Stallions -
This message is from: Karen McCarthy [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] I think that's marvelous idea, Carol. Of course most folks will reject it because they don't want to go through the trouble or their stallions wouldn't make it. Brigid, Please do a little more research on the NFHR Evaluation program vs. a 100 Day Testing program before making a statement like the one above, in that the reason we don't participate in a 100 Day Testing is the because of the fear of rejection, or we really just don't give a s---. Upon better research on your end, I think you might see that the 100 Day Testing is very impractical, not to mention severly expensive. It would cost far more than the market value of a stallion to put him thru something like this. Would you re-coup it in breedings? Perhaps, if you wanted to spend the rest of your life promoting him, maybe you could make up for the $$$ spent in the testing. And for why? To tell everyone thet your horse has been ridden by a competent set of (strange) riders, thousands of miles away from your farm and tested over a 100 day time period? What about a good mare? There are currently (to my knowledge)no mares that have gone thru a program like this. Why not? In the end, it really comes down to you and the horse, and how YOU are going to use him/her. Why not put some serious time and money into him/her YOURself, or with a trainer, compete him/her at open shows and then thru an Evaluation, or Keuring. This is much more realistic and attainable. Besides, I don't think that some of those riders they use in the 100 Day Testings would be overjoyed to be assigned a [EMAIL PROTECTED] Lets think about the many fjord horses out there who have proven themselves many times over... ...Would Gayle Ware's Dusty have gained anything by going thru a 100 day Test? ...Anne Appelbey's Misha? ...Brian Ursula Jensen's Sambar? ...Chip Lamb's Rusten? ...I can go on and on No, these and many other fjords have proven themselves by virtue of performance over and over again, and most are still continuing to do so. Karen McCarthy Great Basin Fjords Carson City, NV _ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
Re: Natural Selection of Stallions -
This message is from: Lori Albrough [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: What do you think? I think that's marvelous idea, Carol. Of course most folks will reject it because they don't want to go through the trouble or their stallions wouldn't make it. Further to my earlier message on this subject, I wanted to clarify that I think it is a good idea, but like someone mentioned, it would be extraordinarily expensive (and difficult to just find the trainers and riders who would be qualified enough to run the program) but at some point down the road it may be cost effective. But first we have to create a market for people who can get past the cute/fuzzy thing and consider a Fjord for dressage/cutting/etc. Lori
Re: fjordhorse-digest V2001 #18
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi List, This is sort of a test. I've been here, silently, for just over a year. I think I've built up enough confidence to intoduce myself :-). I look forward to the list every day. This is MY time! We have a Fjord mare coming 3 in May and a Throughbred gelding in his 20's. We also have 2 labradors, a dove, a hen, 2 cats and 3 fish tanks. Our kids are 7,4, and 1. I'm 34. Russ, my husband is 37. Froia, our Fjord, is just wonderful. We are ground driving and leading kids on her. We put up hot wire when she started jumping every fence she saw. She even jumped out of the stall over the door!! Our daughter passed her D-1 test in Pony Club on Froia. (I'm being very careful with both our young horse and our young rider. I have good horse and pony club background.) I hope I did this right. I didn't even understand that formatting problem earlier in the week. I hope I didn't do that!! Susan Ginise in Rancho Palos Verdes, CA
Re: ages
This message is from: John and Martie Bolinski [EMAIL PROTECTED] All of our horses paw from time to time. The little shetland/welsh, Wee Willy has made it into an art form. He goes all the way down on his elbows sometimes, stretches slow and long, then stands back up and does an upright stretch that seems to involve a lot of buttock and neck muscles - looks like he is in training for giraffe. He even stretches his tail when he does this. Martie in MD GAIL RUSSELL wrote: Gunthar does cat stretches...so should I. :) Gail Russell Forestville CA [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Re: Natural Selection of Stallions -
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 1/19/01 10:29:19 PM Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Time to make up a new bumper sticker: KEEP THE FJORDHORSE WORKING! (I am sure someone out there can be inspired to a better way of saying this!) I'll tell you who inspires me. LISA. When I visited Norco a year and a half ago, before her move, I was impressed and amazed at her work ethic. Her horses were worked and extremely fit. I came home with the plan of working my ponies a bit more, but it sort of fizzled. This year I became a bit more consistent. Our outdoor arena isn't top grade yet, but it's alright. And the horses are getting a lot more work than last winter (which was zero). I'm also trailering to indoor arenas for lessons. Someday soon I hope to have my horses as fit as Lisa's. And trail rides are definitely in the picture this year. We've got a great local asset, the Flying M Ranch. The AQHA has the odd organized ride there, and every summer there are the poker rides that benefit the local handicapped riding programs. Now I'm training at the barn that benefits this program and Juniper has been enlisted! Should be fun. Flying M has some of the most beautiful land on the face of the earth! Pamela
Re: Cows feelings
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 1/20/01 10:45:31 AM Eastern Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: good going,- but in fear of offending cow people, I cannot respond to the feeling question for cows, ha. Now, the calves I have to bottle feed sometimes they are cute!!! Cows are just dumb if you ask me. Sorry! Likely cows have more brains than W has displayed so far. And cows are NOT that dumb. We had one at the stable. It came when I called it, including once when it was making a run for the street and it stopped dead and returned when I yelled it's name. It quickly learned that whenever it saw me head for my car, I came back with a treat. Once when I left the door open, it was starting to crawl into my 300ZX just as I came back, apparenly realizing where the goodies were kept. It learned to block my path to my horse, if both were out together, so I would have to pay attention to it. It would stand in my path when I was riding, so I would get down to move it away. Did a lot of things that didn't seem like a dumb animal. Merek
Penfrydd Farm off topic
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sue, Ceacy Now that you have brought Ceacy into the digital age, tell her I have been working on a web site for her. I have the basic framework up and working, but will need more verbage plus her input on the content. I used pictures that Karen had taken, and will swap them out for pictures of her choosing. Later Gerry
Cows feelings
This message is from: Janne Myrdal [EMAIL PROTECTED] Lisa, good going,- but in fear of offending cow people, I cannot respond to the feeling question for cows, ha. Now, the calves I have to bottle feed sometimes they are cute!!! Cows are just dumb if you ask me. Sorry! Moving on and back to horses. Went to a local horse sale last night with a friend, bottom of the barrel sale so to speak. I cannot handle going to those sales, as half the horses go to slaughter, and that only because people have NOT taken care of them, or because they breed w/o purpose and so the result is like a bunch of yearlings etc with nowhere to go. Probably a few of the Belgians that came thru are out of peelines(sp?) Sorry, just had to steam off here. G Janne in ND, 22 degrees today, but where I am watching the inauguration today, sorry some of you but I'll be glad to see W in there.
