Re: Sonny
This message is from: Genie Dethloff <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Finne was trained thru level one in Parelli by his previous owner; I never saw or learned any of that work. He was very good on the ground but we had (and still have) trouble on the lunge line. He did not consider the lunge whip his friend which may be due to the fact that the farmer where he was boarded cracked the lunge whip to herd the horses in and since Finne did not want to come in, I think he chased him with it!! Once again, you cannot intimidate/scare a Fjord into cooperating. I had to have my trainer work with him for a long time at trotting on the lunge because he took off with me several times and I knew that wasn't good. She was both stronger physically and has little fear, but more importantly knew how to give what she calls "lumpy aids" which gave him nothing to pull against. Fjords can have alot of trouble balancing early on and then they pull and get very heavy in the neck and on the forehand. Being unbalanced is very scary for a horse! We stopped lunging as we were much better able to help him balance under saddle. We will start lunging again soon as he is getting much softer and more balanced under saddle. We found that lunging before a ride made things worse rather than better - he got nervous while he did not under saddle. In several ways we have had to train him "backwards" but it seems to be working. I hope you find a good trainer who is willing to be adaptable to Sonny's needs and in the interum, have fun with your ground work and building up trust and respect in a fair and gentle manner. -- Genie Dethloff and Finne Ann Arbor, Michigan
RE: Sonny and clicker training
This message is from: "Gail Russell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I had an interesting experience with Odin the other day. We took the other horses out of his pen and left him ALL ALONEwhich may not ever have happened to him before. He was NOT HAPPY! Ran around, bucking and tearing about. Heartless folks that we are, we loaded up the horses and took them away for a trail ride. I did leave Odin with some hay to occupy him, as I was concerned about colic if he got too upset. Upon our return, I went into the paddock and put a halter on him so Jim could bring the other horses back in. Well...he very much wanted to go see them. This is Odin, who has learned how to set his neck against us and take off. SoI had him doing head down, backing, yielding his hindquartersall of which has been taught to him via the clicker. The interesting/instructive thing is that, while he was executing these behaviors, he was really very compliant, relaxed, etc. The work I had introduced him to with the clicker was solid enough that it overrode his desire to be with the other horses. When I stopped doing clicker-trained exercises.and let him think for a minute, he reverted to pulling away. I was not fast enough to stop him before he had the mechanical advantage on me. Not a good thing, as Martha would say. However, the interesting thing was (glass half full thinking) that he had REALLY learned the exercises I had taught him with the clicker. Now, if I can just use the clicker to train him to yield to pressure,even when he has a mechanical advantage on meI think he might be able to stay with me even when he has the opportunity to pull away. Alexandra Kurlanda showed me how to use piles of hay as a distraction to teach Odin to "recover" from pursuing a distraction by responding to a pull on the halter as a cue. Alex also showed me how to do "mat training"and then let the horse's desire to go to stand on the mat (where he thinks he can get clicked and treated) as a distractionand an opportunity for him to be clicked for leaving the distraction. So...I learn a bit more each day. Now I just have to find the time to execute it. Gail
Re: Sonny
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 3/1/2005 6:20:15 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Brigid, I especially read your posts on that list..I have been lurking for awhile. ** *Blush* I started a little clicker work with Adel a few years back but my then instructor didn't like me to use it with her in lessons. ** I don't use it in lessons, but I do when I practice what I learned. We had, I thought, a good relationship before I started doing the Parelli stuff with her but when I started waving that orange stick at her she ran away from me, wasn't happy, was a totally different horse. ** The pressure can increase pretty quickly with those exercises if you're not careful, and create a horse who is fearful or who fights back. When I went through the Level One exercises, I used the clicker and didn't even use the stick, I just "drove" with the end of the rope. Rafael did not like my instructor and, even though I have not worked with her for months, he is quite nervous when she is in the same arena! So I haven't done much of that lately but wanted to get back to the Clicker training/positive reinforcement with her. *** As you probably know, there are tons of exercises on _www.clickryder.com_ (http://www.clickryder.com) , all fun and useful :-). How's the weather there in Alaska? Is it "breakup time" yet? / )_~ /L/L Brigid Wasson SF Bay Area, CA _www.Brigid.Clickryder.com_ (http://www.brigid.clickryder.com/)
Re: Sonny
This message is from: Jean Ernest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Brigid, I especiallly read your posts on that list..I have been lurking for awhile. I started a little clicker work with Adel a few years back but my then instructor didn't like me to use it with her in lessons. So I didn't pursue it much. But when I started workiing with Adel on the Parelli stuff and took her to the clinic, she acted very confused, and "hurt?". We had, I thought, a good relationship before I started doing the Parelli stuff with her but when I started waving that orange stick at her she ran away from me, wasn't happy, was a totally different horse. So I haven't done much of that lately but wanted to get back to the Clicker training/positive reinforcement with her. She had always seemed eager to please before the Parelli stuff, but I don't think she could understand why I suddenly was doing all that pushing around, pressure, etc. with no Positive reinforcement. These Fjords love praise, and love their treats, and as you said, clicker training seems to work especially well with them. Jean in Fairbanks, Alaska >Jean, I'm on that list. > >Clicker training is phenomenally effective with Fjords because they cannot >be swayed by negative reinforcement, and God knows they like to eat!
Sonny & Parelli
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi Beth, I'm glad to hear that you aren't giving up on Sonny. Parelli IS a good program, but sometimes you have to adapt it to your horse. Good luck finding a good trainer to come to you. There are some out there. Pamela Northern Holiday Horses Welcome Polaris
Re: Sonny
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 3/1/2005 4:25:19 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Very true I gather info and mush it around to work for me and my level of comfort. So I train by the Roberta method : )) *** I like that ;-D / )_~ /L/L Brigid Wasson SF Bay Area, CA _www.Brigid.Clickryder.com_ (http://www.brigid.clickryder.com/)
Re: Sonny
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 3/1/2005 2:35:38 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I have joined the PNH Clickers Yahoo list also. I want to really pursue the clicker training this summer! *** Jean, I'm on that list. Clicker training is phenomenally effective with Fjords because they cannot be swayed by negative reinforcement, and God knows they like to eat! / )_~ /L/L Brigid Wasson SF Bay Area, CA _www.Brigid.Clickryder.com_ (http://www.brigid.clickryder.com/)
Re: Sonny
This message is from: "Warren Stockwell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > *** There are many great shows on RFD-TV put on by the Parellis and other > clinicians like John Lyons and Clinton Andersen. No one system has all the > answers, but each has some valuable tools which will work for you. Fjords don't > generally follow the "program" that many clinicians have, so you'll find > yourself tweaking the exercises to suit ;-). > > > / )_~ > /L/L > Brigid Wasson > SF Bay Area, CA > _www.Brigid.Clickryder.com_ (http://www.brigid.clickryder.com/) Very true I gather info and mush it around to work for me and my level of comfort. So I train by the Roberta method : ))
Re: Sonny
This message is from: Jean Ernest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I have decided that the strict Parelli program wasn't going to work for Adel as well as the combination of several programs such as Clicker training along with the Parelli. I have joined the PNH Clickers Yahoo list also. I want to really pursue the clicker training this summer! Jean in Fairbanks, Alaska, where my Fjords are shedding! Brigid wrote: *** There are many great shows on RFD-TV put on by the Parellis and other clinicians like John Lyons and Clinton Andersen. No one system has all the answers, but each has some valuable tools which will work for you. Fjords don't generally follow the "program" that many clinicians have, so you'll find yourself tweaking the exercises to suit ;-).
Re: Sonny
This message is from: Jean Ernest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> If you go on eBay, you may be able to get the NEW level One program for much less. Just be SURE that it is the NEW UPDATED version with the DVD's. There are several listed there now. Too bad I didn't buy an extra one last year, when I could have gotten it for $99. Oh Well. Jean in Fairbanks, Alaska, cloudy, +12 I also >received my free DVD from Parelli and I would really like to buy step 1, it >is expensive but I think it would be worth it. Thanks again to everyone, it >is wonderful to know so many people that can help! Beth Knuth
Re: Sonny
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 3/1/2005 12:42:33 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: I am looking into finding a trainer that will come here to my home and help me with Sonny on the ground to gain his respect. I just cannot send him away again. It was too traumatic for me and him. *** Good idea, as you'll learn how to handle him yourself if a trainer comes to you (or you trailer to him/her for weekly lessons). Probably mostly me. I also received my free DVD from Parelli and I would really like to buy step 1, it is expensive but I think it would be worth it. *** There are many great shows on RFD-TV put on by the Parellis and other clinicians like John Lyons and Clinton Andersen. No one system has all the answers, but each has some valuable tools which will work for you. Fjords don't generally follow the "program" that many clinicians have, so you'll find yourself tweaking the exercises to suit ;-). / )_~ /L/L Brigid Wasson SF Bay Area, CA _www.Brigid.Clickryder.com_ (http://www.brigid.clickryder.com/)
Sonny
This message is from: "Mark Knuth" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I wanted to thank everyone who answered and helped my with my decision to keep Sonny. We will keep him, I feel we can work through this and maybe someday ride again. First, we will spend time bonding and getting ground manners. I returned the saddle I bought him and we will buy a round pen. I am looking into finding a trainer that will come here to my home and help me with Sonny on the ground to gain his respect. I just cannot send him away again. It was too traumatic for me and him. Probably mostly me. I also received my free DVD from Parelli and I would really like to buy step 1, it is expensive but I think it would be worth it. Thanks again to everyone, it is wonderful to know so many people that can help! Beth Knuth
RE: Sonny
This message is from: "Gail Russell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Do you have a sense of whether Sonny is reactively running off out of fear, or out of an affirmative decision that he is going to leave whenever HE chooses? Gail -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jean Ernest Sent: Sunday, February 27, 2005 9:04 AM To: fjordhorse@angus.mystery.com Subject: Re: Sonny This message is from: Jean Ernest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I just watched the latest Parelli Savvy club video with Stephanie Burns and Linda Parelli who are talking about a Fear makeover..They emphasize that you should never feel that you HAVE to RIDE your horse, that it is perfectly OK to do groundwork, etc. sometimes for years, never let anybody pressure you into riding when you don't feel it is safe, or you simply don't want to. It is OK to NOT ride! Don't ride until and unless you feel confident, and then only in a situation where you aren't pushing beyond the horse's comfort zone..And YOUR comfort zone. Then maybe just get on for 5 minutes, then get off, etc. Yes, your Fjord needs more training, and maybe you'll feel safe riding him a round pen at first, or doing ground work, playing with him in the round pen at liberty, doing clicker training, etc. Have fun with him! Form that all important bond! Jean in Fairbanks, Alaska, light snow and +20F
Re: Sonny
This message is from: "jgayle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I agree with Jean E re just having a horse around to enjoy. I have two who are pasture mates and my good friends. It seemed to my in my very active horse days there were so many different types of horse owners and their expectations for their own horses, that I just did what suited me best. Jean G. Author "The Colonel's Daughter" Occupied Germany 46-49 Send $20 to: PO Box 104 Montesano, WA 98563
Re: Sonny
This message is from: Tamara Rousso <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> On Sunday, February 27, 2005, at 06:54 AM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: *** Tamara, I'm glad you've discovered the "Fjord secret" ;-). I wish more people understood this; if they did, we'd hear less about how stubborn and difficult Fjords (allegedly) are. So true, Brigid. I had an acquaintance call me and wanted to feed lease Harrison in exchange for using him in her riding program. She had seen how good he is with my kids. First of all there is no way in the world I would ever let Harrison go anywhere. We would miss him too much! Secondly I tried to explain to her that she wouldn't have the same horse for her students. She just wouldn't believe me. She kept telling me he just needs to be worked consistently. Jeesh! I finally just had to go with a firm "no". When I told my husband her request his response was "is she crazy?" :^) Tamara Fallbrook
Re: Sonny
This message is from: Jean Ernest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I just watched the latest Parelli Savvy club video with Stephanie Burns and Linda Parelli who are talking about a Fear makeover..They emphasize that you should never feel that you HAVE to RIDE your horse, that it is perfectly OK to do groundwork, etc. sometimes for years, never let anybody pressure you into riding when you don't feel it is safe, or you simply don't want to. It is OK to NOT ride! Don't ride until and unless you feel confident, and then only in a situation where you aren't pushing beyond the horse's comfort zone..And YOUR comfort zone. Then maybe just get on for 5 minutes, then get off, etc. Yes, your Fjord needs more training, and maybe you'll feel safe riding him a round pen at first, or doing ground work, playing with him in the round pen at liberty, doing clicker training, etc. Have fun with him! Form that all important bond! Jean in Fairbanks, Alaska, light snow and +20F
Re: Sonny
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] In a message dated 2/26/2005 10:19:46 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: That is certainly what we have found with Harrison. He is a wonderful horse with my daughter & son because he is bonded with them. Occasionally we have had others want to ride him and he can be a bit of a pistol for them. Once you have that figured out it can be quite flattering! *** Tamara, I'm glad you've discovered the "Fjord secret" ;-). I wish more people understood this; if they did, we'd hear less about how stubborn and difficult Fjords (allegedly) are. / )_~ /L/L Brigid Wasson SF Bay Area, CA _www.Brigid.Clickryder.com_ (http://www.brigid.clickryder.com/)
Re: Sonny
This message is from: Tamara Rousso <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> On Saturday, February 26, 2005, at 07:41 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: If you develop the close relationship they need, they will carry you through Hell, but if you don't, they won't do anything for you. That is certainly what we have found with Harrison. He is a wonderful horse with my daughter & son because he is bonded with them. Occasionally we have had others want to ride him and he can be a bit of a pistol for them. Once you have that figured out it can be quite flattering! Tamara Fallbrook CA
Re: Sonny
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Hi Beth- Good advice already, including working with the person who trained Sonny to show you how to ride him and to increase your confidence. I always like to start my rides with groundwork. My Fjords are so reliable at this point that I don't do it every time, but the first couple YEARS I did ;-). It never failed that what happened in ground work also happened while riding; if the horse was calm and obedient, so he was under saddle, while if he was distracted and running around, it was not a very fun ride! What you describe seems to be extremely common with Fjords. People buy one, send it to a trainer, take it home, mount up, and have a disaster. I have learned that Fjords are very loyal and need serious bonding time. They are not the type of horse one can "cowboy up." If you develop the close relationship they need, they will carry you through Hell, but if you don't, they won't do anything for you. / )_~ /L/L Brigid Wasson SF Bay Area, CA _www.Brigid.Clickryder.com_ (http://www.brigid.clickryder.com/)
Sonny
This message is from: "janet" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Hi Beth, did I understand correctly, that Sonny has only had 45 days of training? that is not enough time to train a horse to the point he is ready to ride by a beginner. He barely has been introduced to the saddle. Most likely Sonny is being strong on the lounge, because he does not fully understand what he is suppose to do, he is trying to escape a confusing situation. I like to put a minimum of 60 days of training on my young horses with a professional before I get them, but in doing that I fully realize I -still- have a lot of work to do just to get the horse to be a safe trail horse. I depend upon the professional to get the horse going well enough so he understands the basics, but it takes lots of repetition over a year or two under an experienced rider/driver to take that horse from 60 days to a dependable family horse. It sounds like you might be best off either sending Sonny back for a considerably longer time with a trainer (and I question the credibility of a trainer who would have accepted him for only 45 days), or realize that maybe you might enjoy a seasoned older horse a lot more than a youngster who requires a lot of regular work. Janet W McNally
Re: Sonny
This message is from: Jean Ernest <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >OK, All of what Pam has said is good advice. As to being fair to keep him >if you do not ride him..Do you enjoy having him around? does he have a >good place to live, some room to move around, good feed, etc? And he has >a buddy? You do not have to ride a horse to enjoy him. You can look into some fun things to do, which will help train him, such as clicker training, etc. I suggest checking out Alexandra Kurland's books and videos on clicker training, http://www.theclickercenter.com/ and join the Click rider list. http://groups.yahoo.com/group/clickryder Another source of good information and encouragement is Dr. Deb Bennett's web site and the forum http://www.equinestudies.org/ and http://www.equinestudies.org/discus/ I have four fjords now..the two old ones haven't been ridden for a couple years..Old Bjarne, 30. won't be ridden again, except maybe I'll set a small child on him, 28 year old Stella will be driven and ridden this summer, I hope, but if not, I certainly won't feel I have to rid of her! Don't listen to those folks who only consider a horse as a "Utililty"..You can enjoy them without riding! But there are ways you can work with him so you CAN safely ride! Jean in Fairbanks, Alaska, waiting for spring to get to riding again. > Here we have the problem, I don't mind >keeping Sonny, never riding again, just letting him be a lawn mower and >buddy to my other horse or should I sell him to someone who would use him to >his full potential. There are people who say I am wrong to keep him and not >use him. They say I am not being fair to him. What do you all think, it is >a fact I am not going to do any more work on him. I will lunge him and walk >him around but that is it.
Re: Sonny
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] He is home now and I work with him as often as I can with the weather being bad now. Today my husband and I worked with him. Sonny ran away from us because he was so strong we couldn't hold onto the rope while lunging him. We got him under control there, lunged some more until we felt he knew we were boss. I rode him next and he did okay but I could feel he wanted to run away. My husband said let me get on him, so he got on and Sonny took off and my husband slid off the side when Sonny rounded the corner. Here we have the problem, I don't mind keeping Sonny, never riding again, just letting him be a lawn mower and buddy to my other horse or should I sell him to someone who would use him to his full potential. There are people who say I am wrong to keep him and not use him. They say I am not being fair to him. What do you all think, it is a fact I am not going to do any more work on him. I will lunge him and walk him around but that is it. I am too old and I can not do it. I know I should have thought of that before I bought him but we are here now. Should I sell him or keep him? What is best for Sonny? Beth Knuth Don't despair. I see a few possible issues based on what you said. First, don't ever put yourself into a situation that you feel is unsafe, and if what I'm saying to you doesn't make sense for your situation, ignore it. Fjords have strong necks and if they want to set them against you, especially on a longe line, they can. I had some problems longeing a young fjord who knew her strength. First, do NOT use just a halter and a line. They can just tear away from you. I use cavessons, but the cavessons I had were way too gentle, very padded and it was nothing to pull away from me. I discussed the situation with my dressage trainer and he recommended I think it is called a Portuguese cavesson (if you are interested I will find the site and send it to you). It has no padding and if a horse decides to misbehave he/she punishes themself. To be fair, I don't want to punish a fresh horse just out of its stall that has pent up energy, so I allow some turnout time before longeing. Then when the cavesson is on, it is time for business. They learn pretty quickly that they cannot pull shenanigans on the longe line and you can then go forward with your lessons. Next, I wouldn't even attempt to ride the horse at all until it understood the basics on the longe. It just isn't safe. Even my very talented instructor won't get on a horse that is not safe. I don't know what style riding you are doing, but check out this website if you are interested (it's my instructor's site) www.Classicaldressage.com Even if you don't want to ride dressage, it is a good way to get any horse started for any discipline. He has a lot of great training articles there. When you had the horse at the trainer, did you ride under his/her supervision, so you knew what had been done with the horse, and what buttons he had installed in his training? Good luck, and I hope this was of at least a little help to you. Pamela
Sonny
This message is from: "Mark Knuth" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I am writing because I have a problem and I need Fjord Horse people knowledge. Sonny is the Fjord I bought from my neighbor in June 2004. He colicked in November due to my ignorance, I knew I had to be careful with food but I still must have overdone it. I sent Sonny away to a trainer to learn how to be ridden for Jan. and half of Feb. He is home now and I work with him as often as I can with the weather being bad now. Today my husband and I worked with him. Sonny ran away from us because he was so strong we couldn't hold onto the rope while lunging him. We got him under control there, lunged some more until we felt he knew we were boss. I rode him next and he did okay but I could feel he wanted to run away. My husband said let me get on him, so he got on and Sonny took off and my husband slid off the side when Sonny rounded the corner. Here we have the problem, I don't mind keeping Sonny, never riding again, just letting him be a lawn mower and buddy to my other horse or should I sell him to someone who would use him to his full potential. There are people who say I am wrong to keep him and not use him. They say I am not being fair to him. What do you all think, it is a fact I am not going to do any more work on him. I will lunge him and walk him around but that is it. I am too old and I can not do it. I know I should have thought of that before I bought him but we are here now. Should I sell him or keep him? What is best for Sonny? Beth Knuth
RE: Sonny Colic
This message is from: "Carole Cox" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Wow...a scary one! I wasn't familiar with Moorglo so I checked their online add. Looks pretty safe with high fats but...when you think about it...you did increase it by a relatively large amount from what you had been feeding. If you are subbing for pasture I might use more hay or hay cubes -hence increased roughage rather than a grain or grain substitute. Many feeing experts encourage the feeding of hay before grain or grain substitutes in order to aide digestion. Did he have an associated work/exercise change? We have been battling hay issues here in Northern WV for the last two years due to LOTS OF RAIN. We do the best we can to pull the bad out but my experience is that most houses won't touch bad hay. We stay on the safe side and remove what we can catch with those horsey digestive systems being as fussy as they are. I'd keep the Moorglo intake where it was known to be safe and increase the hay or hay cubes prior to the "courtesy sniff" of Moorglo and oats. I am only waiting anxiously to be a happy Fjord owner/breeder but was a barn manager at a local equestrian facility. I have a little Haflinger experience. They need fed about as much as Fjords do! Good Luck! I hope Sonny stays Sunny from here on! Carole Cox BA, BS, EMT-B A+, Network+, CIW -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mark Knuth Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 1:08 PM To: fjordhorse@angus.mystery.com Subject: Sonny Colic This message is from: "Mark Knuth" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I have owned Sonny, 5 year old gelding, since June. He is typical of the Fjords as I've learned and lives to eat. I try to behave and not overfeed him. I let him out 24/7 to eat 2 acres of pasture (he has a quarter horse friend) and I give him 2 to 4 leaves of grassy hay also. There is some alfalfa in the hay. At night he gets a grain pan with a handful of Moorglo and a handful of oats. Mostly just to let him think he's special and that is what he got at his old home (which was next door!). The last few days I have given about 2cups of Moorglo because the pasture is so little. Anyway, yesterday morning when pulling out his hay I always smell it good to be sure fresh and I did smell a musty smell. I pulled and messed with it, I saw no mold, so I threw away in trash part of it and gave the rest to the horses. At 3:00 pm I noticed Sonny laying down which is not his normal behavior and by 4:00 he was laying down, getting up, laying down, rolling etc. I had the vet out and then out again later due to him still being in pain. Sonny got the pain shots and the mineral oil down him and is fine now, but I am scared to death! I do not want him to suffer again. He had never had colic before so I must have done something. Too much Moorglo or the hay was moldy. Give me any advice you might have or any experience with this. I know I just have to not feed him too much for one thing. That sure is hard!!! Thanks for any advice. Beth Knuth, in Indiana, near Wabash
Sonny Colic
This message is from: "Mark Knuth" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I have owned Sonny, 5 year old gelding, since June. He is typical of the Fjords as I've learned and lives to eat. I try to behave and not overfeed him. I let him out 24/7 to eat 2 acres of pasture (he has a quarter horse friend) and I give him 2 to 4 leaves of grassy hay also. There is some alfalfa in the hay. At night he gets a grain pan with a handful of Moorglo and a handful of oats. Mostly just to let him think he's special and that is what he got at his old home (which was next door!). The last few days I have given about 2cups of Moorglo because the pasture is so little. Anyway, yesterday morning when pulling out his hay I always smell it good to be sure fresh and I did smell a musty smell. I pulled and messed with it, I saw no mold, so I threw away in trash part of it and gave the rest to the horses. At 3:00 pm I noticed Sonny laying down which is not his normal behavior and by 4:00 he was laying down, getting up, laying down, rolling etc. I had the vet out and then out again later due to him still being in pain. Sonny got the pain shots and the mineral oil down him and is fine now, but I am scared to death! I do not want him to suffer again. He had never had colic before so I must have done something. Too much Moorglo or the hay was moldy. Give me any advice you might have or any experience with this. I know I just have to not feed him too much for one thing. That sure is hard!!! Thanks for any advice. Beth Knuth, in Indiana, near Wabash
Re: Snipping on Sonny
This message is from: "Jean Gayle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Re snipping. I had a beautiful collie and as he grew and took more interest in the neighborhood girls he kept finding ways to by pass our fence. I would have to yell and scream to no avail trying to find him and usually when I got home he would be sitting there like, "where you been Mom?" Finally he sneaked back in one day and I was ready for him, hoisted him into the back of the truck (seemed to take years before this one hundred pound collie could jump in by himself) and off we went went to the scissors. Forever after it seemed to me he looked at me with that expression of " the punishment did not fit the crime" Jean Jean Gayle Aberdeen, WA [Authoress of "The Colonel's Daughter" Occupied Germany 1946 TO 1949 ] http://www.techline.com/~jgayle Barnes & Noble Book Stores
Re: Snipping on Sonny
This message is from: "Carl & Sarah Nagel" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> -Original Message- >This message is from: "Knutsen Fjord Farm" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >The vet came over today with his scissors and visited Sonny. All Sonny >knows is that he had a nice nap with some odd dreams. Next appointment Dear Peg, We have a Sonny (Jen's Sonny Boy) also. When our vet brought her scissors (scalpel) out last spring and sent Sonny off to dreamland for a quick nap it seemed much harder on my husband than it ever did on Sonny! LOL I don't remember Sonny turning pale at all ... not even a little. Sarah Nagel in Northern Idaho ... where it's all melting ... water, mud everywhere.
Sonny -
This message is from: "Knutsen Fjord Farm" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Hi List persons - I just read on the Digest that, because I have bought an aluminun trailer, I have "gotten there", wherever that is What a relief, I've spent so much of my life "on the way there", and now, like the others on today's Digest, I'm riding instead of putting it off! Thank you all again for your kind thoughts and comments about Sonny. He seems to be doing better [last shot this AM]. Our main indicator is a drop in temp, [101.3 - 98.7] because he's not that much more lively. We've been keeping him warm and giving lots of extra vitamins. Thanks much for your informative post, Gayle. However, Erlend and Pepper have had dust coughs, and now I'm concerned about them, even tho 2 vets have listened to their lungs and pronounced them clear as of a couple of days ago. Will keep you posted. We finally have located a source for "hog fuel" which will keep the blowing dust down and discourage digging in the dust for that last 1/8 inch of grass. Fortunately, except for a real dust storm the day back from Libby, the weather has been splendid. Nice warm days and cool nights. The barn is being roofed today, so we'll have time to go over the area with a giant magnet before putting the footing down. Am looking for old barn boards to line the tack/feed/office room with, but probably will have to use knotty pine. At least I'll have about the best view in the valley from there [Fjords + mountains]. More later - Peg
Re: Sonny
This message is from: Carolyn Dumong <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Knutsen Fjord Farm wrote: > > This message is from: "Knutsen Fjord Farm" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Hi List - > > I'm writing to ask for your supportive thought and good wishes. Our > sweet weanling colt, Rustenson, has pneumonia. I guess the combined > stresses of compromised immune system from weaning, trailering to Libby, > the over-stimulation of the show, and the heavy dust there and here at > our farm were too much for his little healthy bod. We're giving him > 10ccs of Penn. twice daily, and the vet says prognosis is very good. > I'm still really concerned, though, even forgot my riding lesson this > AM. Writing to the list feels like sharing my worries with good > friends, so thanks for being there. - Peg Hi Peg! Just received your message about your little guy. I haven't been on the list for a few days and am now just getting caught up. Many prayers from us here in S. Florida for his quick recovery. Yes, I know how you feel about sharing with the list. I did the same thing when we were faced with Floyd and I was so scared. So many of you responded and I truly believe that is why we were spared. It was a great comfort to know so many people were sending their best wishes and prayers for us. I will be looking for an update from you on your little one Carolyn
Re: Sonny
This message is from: "Bushnell's" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> At 01:30 PM 9/29/99 -0700, you wrote: >This message is from: "Knutsen Fjord Farm" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Rustenson >[Sonny] and us. He seems to be doing OK, #Peg, I was so glad to read about "Sonny" in your posting this morning! I guess a good many folk give Fjords nicknames; we call Dutchman.."Duffer" but he will probably outgrow it. > >incubator! It's refinished, exactly the right dimensions, has a >built-in bar behind, and just fits our stovetop. "Why on earth is she >telling us this," you ask? Because it has the original brass label on >the front which reads, "Good Luck, built by Charters, TurlockCalif. >- Pat. Pending." Is that cool, or what? > #I can identify with that story! For a long time Gene's wanted to update our tractor (a rare endangered species) and he's always thought he'd get a green John Deere, but when I saw a blue NEW HOLLAND I said we had to have it.. for the Fjords! Arranging our entire lives around the Fjords portray what an extra special breed they are! Speaking of "endangered".. (this is a stretch) there wouldn't happen to be any big environmental guns amongst us would there? A land exchange threatens a mtn. beside us. E-mail me privately if so.. we don't want to detour into "politics" on the List I'm sure. Ruthie, NW MT
Sonny
This message is from: "Knutsen Fjord Farm" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Hi List - I want to thank all of you who have responded to support Rustenson [Sonny] and us. He seems to be doing OK, but looks so droopy and listless it breaks my heart. Whenever we're near, he trudges over and puts his head against us for loving. So I'm passing along some of the hugs and kisses that have been sent our way. It's so great to have this community to turn to! It's also wonderful to hear of everyone's driving and riding exploits. Many congrats to all of you who have put [or are putting] in the time and effort to get there. I'm eagerly awaiting completion of our facilities so that training will be so much easier. On another note, we're remodeling our house [stil] and were about to get a bid for the kitchen island/cabinets to hold our new gas stovetop. Then we were going to add an eating/conversation bar behind. Well, we had just bought an old stained glass window for a bathroom, when we encountered in the store the antique piece of our dreams - a chicken incubator! It's refinished, exactly the right dimensions, has a built-in bar behind, and just fits our stovetop. "Why on earth is she telling us this," you ask? Because it has the original brass label on the front which reads, "Good Luck, built by Charters, TurlockCalif. - Pat. Pending." Is that cool, or what? Thanks again for all the support. I have to go now - I'll be delighted when my greatest skill levels are no longer at mane cutting and manure picking! Peg
Re: Sonny
This message is from: "Bushnell's" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> At 10:08 AM 9/28/99 -0700, you wrote: >This message is from: "Knutsen Fjord Farm" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > I'm writing to ask for your supportive thought and good wishes. Our >sweet weanling colt, Rustenson, has pneumonia. > Peg, you sure have our supportive prayer and good wishes for Rustenson.. he looked to be a "strapping" boy and will undoubtedly lick this! It's frightening to think about any health threat to these fuzzy darlings; his "cousin," Dutchman (sort of, same Daddy anyhow) has so enamored himself to me I feel like bringing him in the house for safekeeping at night. One of these days he'll probably run me down or step on my foot and we can then get down to a normal relationship =) Fjords sure develop fast don't they Ruthie, NW MT
Re: Sonny
This message is from: "Denise Delgado" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> dear peg, my thoughts are with you and rusty. i feel like i know all these horses not, after hearing so much about them from the list. he will do fine, just keep him hydrated and warm. denise
Re: Sonny
This message is from: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Oh Peg I hope he gets well soon with no lasting effects for you, he is such a sweet little guy Sincerely, Michele Noonan In the Bitteroot Valley Stevensville, Montana
Re: Sonny
This message is from: "Laurie Pittman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Peg, your vet is probably right. Just follow his instructions and keep a close eye on that baby, he'll be fine. I went through the same thing with my QH, Copper, when he was that age (picked it up at a show, even though he'd had his shots), and he pulled through just fine. I don't think he's ever forgiven me for all those shots though. ; ) I'm sure we'll all be thinking good thoughts for him. Laurie - Original Message - From: Knutsen Fjord Farm <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Tuesday, September 28, 1999 10:08 AM Subject: Sonny > This message is from: "Knutsen Fjord Farm" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Hi List - > > I'm writing to ask for your supportive thought and good wishes. Our > sweet weanling colt, Rustenson, has pneumonia. I guess the combined > stresses of compromised immune system from weaning, trailering to Libby, > the over-stimulation of the show, and the heavy dust there and here at > our farm were too much for his little healthy bod. We're giving him > 10ccs of Penn. twice daily, and the vet says prognosis is very good. > I'm still really concerned, though, even forgot my riding lesson this > AM. Writing to the list feels like sharing my worries with good > friends, so thanks for being there. - Peg >
Sonny
This message is from: "Knutsen Fjord Farm" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Hi List - I'm writing to ask for your supportive thought and good wishes. Our sweet weanling colt, Rustenson, has pneumonia. I guess the combined stresses of compromised immune system from weaning, trailering to Libby, the over-stimulation of the show, and the heavy dust there and here at our farm were too much for his little healthy bod. We're giving him 10ccs of Penn. twice daily, and the vet says prognosis is very good. I'm still really concerned, though, even forgot my riding lesson this AM. Writing to the list feels like sharing my worries with good friends, so thanks for being there. - Peg
