Re: [hlds_linux] Forum vs. email list

[Emil Larsson]

Better archiving is good, I don't think the archives are public either
(other than the unofficial scraping forums), which they should be. Happened
more than once that i show fellow admins something from this mailing list,
and a open archive would let them follow the discussion.

I'm happy with keeping the mailing list around. Though I admit it's a little
hidden away, easy to overlook as a new admin.

On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 7:21 AM, Fletcher Dunn
wrote:

> There's no pressure from anywhere to close this mailing list.
>
> Since most people seem to be happy with the list in its current form, it
> looks like it's highly unlikely that we would be able to find another
> alternative that offers compelling enough advantages to make it worth our
> while to migrate.
>
> Making it easier to search the archives seems like something simple we
> could look into.
>
> I'll see you guys in another two years when the next Valve noob brings up
> this topic again. :)
>
> Cheers,
> Fletch
>
> -Original Message-
> From: hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com [mailto:
> hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] On Behalf Of ics
> Sent: Monday, October 24, 2011 10:03 PM
> To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list
> Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Forum vs. email list
>
> I prefer mailing list. Just because it's easy to use while reading
> regular e-mail and you can just pick a message to read easily, delete
> immediately the rest that you don't need. On forum, you have to browse
> around on many threads and it's very time consuming. I also hate the
> SPUF style where you just get post to your mail that happened after your
> reply and the messages after that are ignored untill i visit the forum
> again. Forums might be clean first but full of dirt later. Too many
> immature people there, way less here on this list.
>
> People go crazy on forums whenever someone from Valve replies, they want
> to contribute. I'ts a mess there. Benefit on forums is the the easier
> search and messages browsing if you prefer reading all once a week and
> have time to go through all the messages. The count of messages that
> should not be posted would rise high too. It would be harder to find the
> thing you are looking for. It's good for historians. How many people
> browse old messages anyway and why? To check something or find answer?
> Isn't wiki for the answers better or some sort of section "how to run a
> server for dummies".
>
> The recent change where there's as much as ~10 people been around from
> Valve within a month is something i've never seen before. I thought the
> list would live long and the latter closing notice would have been
> proved wrong but i guess there is pressure to close the list down. This
> is way more convinient than forums. Please do not close this down.
>
> -ics
>
>
> 25.10.2011 7:28, Andrew kirjoitti:
> > What about adding some kind of easy searching to the mailing list
> > archives? That seems to be only commonly brought up minus to keeping
> > this format.
> >
> > I am able to access them (the archives) with my login, but the
> > standard listings by month and downloadable gzip'ed archives makes
> > searching nontrivial. Improving that would be a big +
> >
> > On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 11:24 PM, m33crob  wrote:
> >> I too would prefer to keep the mailing list. If a forum materializes out
> of
> >> this conversation, I would be interested in becoming a moderator. I'm
> >> already super active in the Steam Forums and you guys may or may not
> have
> >> noticed that I update the Steam Forums server sections almost everyday.
> >>
> >> On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 9:15 PM, Jesse Molina
>  wrote:
> >>
> >>> I prefer mailing lists, which is why I am here.  Discussion and replies
> are
> >>> below:
> >>>
> >>> I prefer mailing lists because there is a small technical barrier to
> entry.
> >>>   Chances are that you had to use a search engine to find it, which
> means you
> >>> probably already tried to find what you were looking for via that
> search
> >>> engine and failed.  Many noobs don't even know what a mailman list is,
> and
> >>> that's good.  I want to talk to other people who can actually help me.
>  This
> >>> mailing list is not primarily for a social experience.  For most
> forums, a
> >>> significant amount of code is dedicated to smileys, avatars,
> signatures,
> >>> friends/foes, etc, because they need the social experience, because
> they are
> >>> ad-revenue driven.  The amount of whitespace on web forums, compared to
> >>> email, is terrible.
> >>>
> >>> Here's a thought:  The quality of the discussion is primarily impacted
> by
> >>> how those with authoritative knowledge (Valve employees and pros)
> engage in
> >>> the discussion.  If Valve employees were more inclined to participate
> in
> >>> discussion on a web forum, I'd go web forum.  I would not cry too hard
> if
> >>> this one mailing list went away.  It's just games.
> >>>
> >>> About the archives:  Why are they password protected, and 

Re: [hlds_linux] Forum vs. email list

[Jeff Sugar]

Agreed. This plan seems like it'd do some good.

Perhaps a link could be in each email at the start or end with a link to it
on the archive? That'd make it easier for people to read any posts in that
thread they missed, especially newcomers
On Oct 25, 2011 12:07 AM, "Emil Larsson"  wrote:

> Better archiving is good, I don't think the archives are public either
> (other than the unofficial scraping forums), which they should be. Happened
> more than once that i show fellow admins something from this mailing list,
> and a open archive would let them follow the discussion.
>
> I'm happy with keeping the mailing list around. Though I admit it's a
> little
> hidden away, easy to overlook as a new admin.
>
> On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 7:21 AM, Fletcher Dunn
> wrote:
>
> > There's no pressure from anywhere to close this mailing list.
> >
> > Since most people seem to be happy with the list in its current form, it
> > looks like it's highly unlikely that we would be able to find another
> > alternative that offers compelling enough advantages to make it worth our
> > while to migrate.
> >
> > Making it easier to search the archives seems like something simple we
> > could look into.
> >
> > I'll see you guys in another two years when the next Valve noob brings up
> > this topic again. :)
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Fletch
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com [mailto:
> > hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] On Behalf Of ics
> > Sent: Monday, October 24, 2011 10:03 PM
> > To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list
> > Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Forum vs. email list
> >
> > I prefer mailing list. Just because it's easy to use while reading
> > regular e-mail and you can just pick a message to read easily, delete
> > immediately the rest that you don't need. On forum, you have to browse
> > around on many threads and it's very time consuming. I also hate the
> > SPUF style where you just get post to your mail that happened after your
> > reply and the messages after that are ignored untill i visit the forum
> > again. Forums might be clean first but full of dirt later. Too many
> > immature people there, way less here on this list.
> >
> > People go crazy on forums whenever someone from Valve replies, they want
> > to contribute. I'ts a mess there. Benefit on forums is the the easier
> > search and messages browsing if you prefer reading all once a week and
> > have time to go through all the messages. The count of messages that
> > should not be posted would rise high too. It would be harder to find the
> > thing you are looking for. It's good for historians. How many people
> > browse old messages anyway and why? To check something or find answer?
> > Isn't wiki for the answers better or some sort of section "how to run a
> > server for dummies".
> >
> > The recent change where there's as much as ~10 people been around from
> > Valve within a month is something i've never seen before. I thought the
> > list would live long and the latter closing notice would have been
> > proved wrong but i guess there is pressure to close the list down. This
> > is way more convinient than forums. Please do not close this down.
> >
> > -ics
> >
> >
> > 25.10.2011 7:28, Andrew kirjoitti:
> > > What about adding some kind of easy searching to the mailing list
> > > archives? That seems to be only commonly brought up minus to keeping
> > > this format.
> > >
> > > I am able to access them (the archives) with my login, but the
> > > standard listings by month and downloadable gzip'ed archives makes
> > > searching nontrivial. Improving that would be a big +
> > >
> > > On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 11:24 PM, m33crob  wrote:
> > >> I too would prefer to keep the mailing list. If a forum materializes
> out
> > of
> > >> this conversation, I would be interested in becoming a moderator. I'm
> > >> already super active in the Steam Forums and you guys may or may not
> > have
> > >> noticed that I update the Steam Forums server sections almost
> everyday.
> > >>
> > >> On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 9:15 PM, Jesse Molina
> >  wrote:
> > >>
> > >>> I prefer mailing lists, which is why I am here.  Discussion and
> replies
> > are
> > >>> below:
> > >>>
> > >>> I prefer mailing lists because there is a small technical barrier to
> > entry.
> > >>>   Chances are that you had to use a search engine to find it, which
> > means you
> > >>> probably already tried to find what you were looking for via that
> > search
> > >>> engine and failed.  Many noobs don't even know what a mailman list
> is,
> > and
> > >>> that's good.  I want to talk to other people who can actually help
> me.
> >  This
> > >>> mailing list is not primarily for a social experience.  For most
> > forums, a
> > >>> significant amount of code is dedicated to smileys, avatars,
> > signatures,
> > >>> friends/foes, etc, because they need the social experience, because
> > they are
> > >>> ad-revenue driven.  The amount of whitespace on web fo

Re: [hlds_linux] TF2/CSS no steam connection (insecure) on the first startup

[Ulrich Block]

Am 25.10.2011 02:56, schrieb Marco Padovan:

Hi,
since the recents updates I'm experiencing a trange problem:

everytime I create a new server on the first start it is not connecting
to steam...
I need to stop and restart it in order for it to connect properly.

This is happening on both CSS and TF2.

Is this happening to anybody else?
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Same here. I wasn´t sure if it is because of my system or if it is 
caused by the server. Because I was not sure I haven´t reported yet.


I am using a symlink system for my servers so I thought there could be a 
chance that it is related to that.


I already tested removing the "Steam" folder before every 
restart/reinstall to see if it changes anthing. But it was always the 
same. No connection on first connect.


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Re: [hlds_linux] TF2/CSS no steam connection (insecure) on the first startup

[Christoffer Pedersen]

I can confirm that issue, my servers are having it aswell.

-Oprindelig meddelelse-
Fra: hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com
[mailto:hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] På vegne af Ulrich Block
Sendt: 25. oktober 2011 09:28
Til: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list
Emne: Re: [hlds_linux] TF2/CSS no steam connection (insecure) on the first
startup

Am 25.10.2011 02:56, schrieb Marco Padovan:
> Hi,
> since the recents updates I'm experiencing a trange problem:
>
> everytime I create a new server on the first start it is not connecting
> to steam...
> I need to stop and restart it in order for it to connect properly.
>
> This is happening on both CSS and TF2.
>
> Is this happening to anybody else?
> ___
> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives,
please visit:
> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
>

Same here. I wasn´t sure if it is because of my system or if it is 
caused by the server. Because I was not sure I haven´t reported yet.

I am using a symlink system for my servers so I thought there could be a 
chance that it is related to that.

I already tested removing the "Steam" folder before every 
restart/reinstall to see if it changes anthing. But it was always the 
same. No connection on first connect.

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Re: [hlds_linux] TF2/CSS no steam connection (insecure) on the first startup

[Loïc PERY]

I confirm too !

2011/10/25 Christoffer Pedersen 

> I can confirm that issue, my servers are having it aswell.
>
> -Oprindelig meddelelse-
> Fra: hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com
> [mailto:hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] På vegne af Ulrich
> Block
> Sendt: 25. oktober 2011 09:28
> Til: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list
> Emne: Re: [hlds_linux] TF2/CSS no steam connection (insecure) on the first
> startup
>
> Am 25.10.2011 02:56, schrieb Marco Padovan:
> > Hi,
> > since the recents updates I'm experiencing a trange problem:
> >
> > everytime I create a new server on the first start it is not connecting
> > to steam...
> > I need to stop and restart it in order for it to connect properly.
> >
> > This is happening on both CSS and TF2.
> >
> > Is this happening to anybody else?
> > ___
> > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives,
> please visit:
> > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
> >
>
> Same here. I wasn´t sure if it is because of my system or if it is
> caused by the server. Because I was not sure I haven´t reported yet.
>
> I am using a symlink system for my servers so I thought there could be a
> chance that it is related to that.
>
> I already tested removing the "Steam" folder before every
> restart/reinstall to see if it changes anthing. But it was always the
> same. No connection on first connect.
>
> ___
> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives,
> please visit:
> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
>
>
> ___
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> please visit:
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>
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Re: [hlds_linux] [hlds] Forum vs. email list

[Steven Hartland]

- Original Message - 
From: "Fletcher Dunn" 

To: "Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list" 
; 
Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2011 1:34 AM
Subject: [hlds] Forum vs. email list



>I am honestly astounded by the amount of people who complain when

people ask for help on help forums or mailing lists. Not everyone
signs up and instantly reads everything, goes through all the
archives, or spends hours researching.


I'd like to use this comment as a springboard for a discussion about
the format of this list.

I hear that a few years ago the idea of migrating the email list to a
forum was kicked around.  However, at the time (is this still true today?)
the users of the list didn't like the idea.  it is my understanding that
most server admins prefer:

1.) Receiving push notifications.
2.) Viewing the list in their email client

#1 seems like a really compelling advantage (especially for announcements),
while #2 seems like a personal preference, and many people have the opposite
preference.

A forum has several compelling advantages:

1.) Easier to search and find answers to previously asked questions


Only if the search is good, most forums search fail to find answers as
their search methods are:
1. poor
2. slow


2.) Easier to follow a thread of conversation.  (I personally find any email
distribution list to become unreadable pretty much instantly, with all the
's and broken line breaks that everybody's mail clients and put everywhere.)


It is easier to follow if your new to the conversation, but if your following
the a topic its actually slower, as you need to constantly load lots of old
content and scroll past it.

3.) Easier to modify your post if you notice a mistake or want to clarify
something, rather than making a new post.


This can actually be a down side as it means that its impossible for people to
know that you've changed something.


4.) Easier to delete or move posts if they are spam, rude, inappropriate,
belong in the general TF2 SPUF forum, etc.


Just ban users who abuse, tbh forums attract this behavour much more than
a mailing list.


5.) Easier to ignore an entire thread that you are not interested in.


Not really, when your looking for new posts it will still contantly pop
up, which is not the case in a good mailing list email client.


Could there be some sort of forum + push notification that would satisfy
what everybody wants?  This list exists to serve you guys, so I'm curious
what everything thinks.  I *believe* most of the guys would find a forum
format (perhaps with some push notification) more convenient.


forums don't work for me as they are too much overhead, I don't have time
to constantly check a forum, where as I do get chance to skim through
the emails from a mailing list and pick out those topics where are
important to me. Even with an email feed a forum has some notable
disadvantages:-
1. Its more time consuming to reply, so you would need to add email reply
submission.
2. It attracts more spam and useless comments, email lists are older and
keep the usual forum trolls out. You get a much higher noise to useful
content ratio on forums.
3. Without push I can only read your news in that location, as a GSP with
30+ similar lists across the industry we need it to be accessible in
one place which an email list provides.

If the list where to migrate to a forum, I would be highly unlikely to
use it which would mean missing out on important announcements and
good content, which would be shame; so my vote would be to keep it
how it is which works well for what we use it for.

   Regards
   Steve


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Re: [hlds_linux] Forum vs. email list

[Carl]

It would probably be somewhat difficult, but would a hybrid approach be 
possible?  For example, make a subforum on the steam forums which 
mirrors all emails sent to this list, and pushes all posts made by 
logged-in forum users back to this list?  It would make this list 
searchable, people could still read and reply in their favorite news 
client, and the current people on the list could filter forum->list if 
they wanted to.




On 10/24/2011 8:34 PM, Fletcher Dunn wrote:

I am honestly astounded by the amount of people who complain when
people ask for help on help forums or mailing lists. Not everyone
signs up and instantly reads everything, goes through all the
archives, or spends hours researching.

I'd like to use this comment as a springboard for a discussion about the format 
of this list.

I hear that a few years ago the idea of migrating the email list to a forum was 
kicked around.  However, at the time (is this still true today?) the users of 
the list didn't like the idea.  it is my understanding that most server admins 
prefer:

1.) Receiving push notifications.
2.) Viewing the list in their email client

#1 seems like a really compelling advantage (especially for announcements), 
while #2 seems like a personal preference, and many people have the opposite 
preference.

A forum has several compelling advantages:

1.) Easier to search and find answers to previously asked questions
2.) Easier to follow a thread of conversation.  (I personally find any email distribution 
list to become unreadable pretty much instantly, with all the's and broken 
line breaks that everybody's mail clients and put everywhere.)
3.) Easier to modify your post if you notice a mistake or want to clarify 
something, rather than making a new post.
4.) Easier to delete or move posts if they are spam, rude, inappropriate, 
belong in the general TF2 SPUF forum, etc.
5.) Easier to ignore an entire thread that you are not interested in.

Could there be some sort of forum + push notification that would satisfy what 
everybody wants?  This list exists to serve you guys, so I'm curious what 
everything thinks.  I *believe* most of the guys would find a forum format 
(perhaps with some push notification) more convenient.

It would be good to get some opinions about how people prefer to consume the 
information on this list.

Please chime in.

Your humble servant,
- Fletch

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Re: [hlds_linux] Forum vs. email list

[Eric Riemers]

I prefer the mailinglist, tons of reasons why i would want that more then a
forum (ease of use being one of them)

But if we *have* to move to the forums, at least make it so that we have
our own section only for server maintainers, say for instance only people
with a registered server with good standings is allowed to post there.
Granted it might not be bullit proof but it might keep at least 90% of the
non-relevant forum people out there. And ofcourse, assuming this has push
alerts (with full reply for ease of use?)

On Tue, 25 Oct 2011 08:03:08 +0300, ics  wrote:
> I prefer mailing list. Just because it's easy to use while reading 
> regular e-mail and you can just pick a message to read easily, delete 
> immediately the rest that you don't need. On forum, you have to browse 
> around on many threads and it's very time consuming. I also hate the 
> SPUF style where you just get post to your mail that happened after your 
> reply and the messages after that are ignored untill i visit the forum 
> again. Forums might be clean first but full of dirt later. Too many 
> immature people there, way less here on this list.
> 
> People go crazy on forums whenever someone from Valve replies, they want 
> to contribute. I'ts a mess there. Benefit on forums is the the easier 
> search and messages browsing if you prefer reading all once a week and 
> have time to go through all the messages. The count of messages that 
> should not be posted would rise high too. It would be harder to find the 
> thing you are looking for. It's good for historians. How many people 
> browse old messages anyway and why? To check something or find answer? 
> Isn't wiki for the answers better or some sort of section "how to run a 
> server for dummies".
> 
> The recent change where there's as much as ~10 people been around from 
> Valve within a month is something i've never seen before. I thought the 
> list would live long and the latter closing notice would have been 
> proved wrong but i guess there is pressure to close the list down. This 
> is way more convinient than forums. Please do not close this down.
> 
> -ics
> 
> 
> 25.10.2011 7:28, Andrew kirjoitti:
>> What about adding some kind of easy searching to the mailing list
>> archives? That seems to be only commonly brought up minus to keeping
>> this format.
>>
>> I am able to access them (the archives) with my login, but the
>> standard listings by month and downloadable gzip'ed archives makes
>> searching nontrivial. Improving that would be a big +
>>
>> On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 11:24 PM, m33crob  wrote:
>>> I too would prefer to keep the mailing list. If a forum materializes
out
>>> of
>>> this conversation, I would be interested in becoming a moderator. I'm
>>> already super active in the Steam Forums and you guys may or may not
>>> have
>>> noticed that I update the Steam Forums server sections almost everyday.
>>>
>>> On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 9:15 PM, Jesse Molina 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 I prefer mailing lists, which is why I am here.  Discussion and
replies
 are
 below:

 I prefer mailing lists because there is a small technical barrier to
 entry.
   Chances are that you had to use a search engine to find it, which
   means you
 probably already tried to find what you were looking for via that
 search
 engine and failed.  Many noobs don't even know what a mailman list is,
 and
 that's good.  I want to talk to other people who can actually help me.

 This
 mailing list is not primarily for a social experience.  For most
 forums, a
 significant amount of code is dedicated to smileys, avatars,
 signatures,
 friends/foes, etc, because they need the social experience, because
 they are
 ad-revenue driven.  The amount of whitespace on web forums, compared
to
 email, is terrible.

 Here's a thought:  The quality of the discussion is primarily impacted
 by
 how those with authoritative knowledge (Valve employees and pros)
 engage in
 the discussion.  If Valve employees were more inclined to participate
 in
 discussion on a web forum, I'd go web forum.  I would not cry too hard
 if
 this one mailing list went away.  It's just games.

 About the archives:  Why are they password protected, and why has my
 password never ever worked?  From day one, the password that came in
my
 welcome email didn't work and I never tried again.  I have never ever
 searched the archives because I can't.

 It is nice to have a single point of discussion for issues, as opposed
 to
 many different sites and applications.  As an example, I am an
aquarium
 hobbyist, and I often visit five different web forums because each has
 some
 specialty, or the community is fractured up.  This is annoying.  This
 is
 also why I don't check forums.srcds.com but once in a great while.

 I've never seen a duel-pane message board reader 

[hlds_linux] See server reputation

[Loïc PERY]

I know that there is some plugins wich permit to see server reputation but i
think valve need to implement a command like:

tf_show_server_reputation.

What did you think of that ?

Valve, can you do it for the next update please ?
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Re: [hlds_linux] See server reputation

[w4rezz]

To show a server reputation use cl_gameserver_list client command,
actual reputation value does not matter, instead of that you should
check the "trend" status.

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Re: [hlds_linux] See server reputation

[Andreas Grimm]

it seems that cl_gameserver_list isn't updated in realtime. and it's 
inefficient to use cl_gameserver_list with over 100 gameservers.
when I see gameserver with id x, y and z are not "ok" ... eh which gameservers 
now had these ids in their cfg?!

foreach ( server : getGameservers() )
{
if ( server.rcon("command_to_see_the_tend_status") != 'nice' )
{
print("check %s's cfg file!",server.name);
}
}

that would be so much easier than writing lists manually, where I can realize 
getGameserverNameByIdentityId() in realworld-modus (using brain, wasting 
calories, etc)

-Original Message-
From: hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com 
[mailto:hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] On Behalf Of w4rezz
Sent: Tuesday, October 25, 2011 11:47 AM
To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list
Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] See server reputation

To show a server reputation use cl_gameserver_list client command,
actual reputation value does not matter, instead of that you should
check the "trend" status.

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Re: [hlds_linux] TF2/CSS no steam connection (insecure) on the first startup

[Marco Padovan]

They starts up as they were ok, map is loaded and I can issue console
commands like "status" and "stats"...

they just do not reply to UDP queries and they are reported as
"insecure" to the status command.

I left a couple of them sitting there for hours (4+hours) nothing
changed... It wasn't even re-trying :/

Il 25/10/2011 04:45, byteframe ha scritto:
> Maybe? I just recently have noticed a 2 minute or so pause during server
> start up (after successful update/verify via -autoupdate). The console looks
> like I didn't specify a map (the pause happens early). After a short while
> it loads and everything is fine. Maybe the steam servers are slow are
> something. Hope this was not too anecdotal.
>
> On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 8:56 PM, Marco Padovan  wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>> since the recents updates I'm experiencing a trange problem:
>>
>> everytime I create a new server on the first start it is not connecting
>> to steam...
>> I need to stop and restart it in order for it to connect properly.
>>
>> This is happening on both CSS and TF2.
>>
>> Is this happening to anybody else?
>> ___
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>> please visit:
>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
>>
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Re: [hlds_linux] TF2/CSS no steam connection (insecure) on the first startup

[Marco Padovan]

Glad I'm not alone :)

Hope this will get fixed :)

Issues started to appear since the CSS - Orangebox engines split update
if I remember correctly

Il 25/10/2011 10:26, Loïc PERY ha scritto:
> I confirm too !
>
> 2011/10/25 Christoffer Pedersen 
>
>> I can confirm that issue, my servers are having it aswell.
>>
>> -Oprindelig meddelelse-
>> Fra: hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com
>> [mailto:hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] På vegne af Ulrich
>> Block
>> Sendt: 25. oktober 2011 09:28
>> Til: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list
>> Emne: Re: [hlds_linux] TF2/CSS no steam connection (insecure) on the first
>> startup
>>
>> Am 25.10.2011 02:56, schrieb Marco Padovan:
>>> Hi,
>>> since the recents updates I'm experiencing a trange problem:
>>>
>>> everytime I create a new server on the first start it is not connecting
>>> to steam...
>>> I need to stop and restart it in order for it to connect properly.
>>>
>>> This is happening on both CSS and TF2.
>>>
>>> Is this happening to anybody else?
>>> ___
>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives,
>> please visit:
>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
>>>
>> Same here. I wasn´t sure if it is because of my system or if it is
>> caused by the server. Because I was not sure I haven´t reported yet.
>>
>> I am using a symlink system for my servers so I thought there could be a
>> chance that it is related to that.
>>
>> I already tested removing the "Steam" folder before every
>> restart/reinstall to see if it changes anthing. But it was always the
>> same. No connection on first connect.
>>
>> ___
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>> please visit:
>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
>>
>>
>> ___
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>> please visit:
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>>
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Re: [hlds_linux] See server reputation

[ics]

3 servers of mine havent shown anything than downward fast and 1 other slightly 
upward and one time downward fast for it too.

I can see much more from actual values and how the servers are populated than 
cl_gameserver_list command. For example most of the servers gain 1500-2000 rep 
per week, one averaging 4000, the most popular one.

Valve never put the rep value default command because they are not interested 
much about which servers have most but instead of taking bad servers off from 
the good ones. The bad being fake slots etc. For me the value is just extra fun 
and interesting to look at. Much more better stat is how full your servers are 
and how long does one player stay on it by average.

-ics

- Alkuperäinen viesti -
> To show a server reputation use cl_gameserver_list client command,
> actual reputation value does not matter, instead of that you should
> check the "trend" status.
> 
> ___
> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives,
> please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux

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Re: [hlds_linux] Core Size and other issue

[Shin Ice]

Nice to know ics.

Thanks all again :)

On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 5:05 PM, ics  wrote:
> You might get bunch of errors in server start. Ignore them, if the server
> runs ok. Assertion failed has been there like 2 years.
>
> -ics
>
> 24.10.2011 15:34, Shin Ice kirjoitti:
>>
>> This time I understood it better, thanks again ;)
>>
>> It seams that the core "problem" is fixed, but I'm still receiving
>> "Assertion Failed" on server restart :-/
>>
>> On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 1:32 PM, hlds  wrote:
>>>
>>> Read my message again.
>>>
>>> The default limit for core files is few MB (or something like this) and
>>> is
>>> not enough for a Source dedicated server. You must increase the limit,
>>> otherwise whenever your server crashes the core file created by operating
>>> system is truncated (and invalid =>  so you get that "funny" error
>>> message).
>>>
>>> It is something like this:
>>>
>>> 1. Server crashes.
>>> 2. The operating system creates a core file that has 1MB instead of 60MB.
>>> 3. The srcds_run script runs gdb (GNU Debugger) to get the error details
>>> from core file.
>>> 4. The core file is invalid =>  you get that funny message.
>>>
>>> To fix the funny message use the "ulimit -c" in the script used for
>>> starting the server.
>>>
>>> Then start the server again and when it crashes see the debug.log file.
>>>
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com
>>> [mailto:hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] On Behalf Of Shin Ice
>>> Sent: Monday, October 24, 2011 2:15 PM
>>> To: ics; Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list
>>> Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Core Size and other issue
>>>
>>> @ ics: i think srcds_run is the right bin, but if I'm wrong please
>>> suggest me a better way.
>>>
>>> @ hlds: thanks for the hint, I made a lot of researches but I don't
>>> have valid excause.
>>>
>>> Funny is now that it expects a bigger core:
>>>  BFD: Warning: /home/my/path/css/core is truncated: expected core file
>>> size>= 60669952, found: 1085440
>>>
>>> On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 12:58 PM, ics  wrote:

 Last time i ever saw core error like that was when someone tried to use
>>>
>>> wrong binary to start the server.

 -ics

 - Alkuperäinen viesti -
>
> Hi again,
>
> I made different tests but i still receive this erros _also_ with a
> vanilla server.
> After i wrote yaur mail I installed another server, I only added my
> server.cfg but the result is still the same:
>
> First restart:
> Segmentation fault (core dumped)
> BFD: Warning: /home/my/path/css/core is truncated: expected core file
> size>= 60669952, found: 1085440.Cannot access memory at address
> 0xf77d18f0Cannot access memory at address
> 0xef978c0c/home/my/path/css/debug.cmds:4: Error in sourced command
> file:Cannot access memory at address 0xf77d18f0email debug.log to
> linux@valvesoftware.comMon Oct 24 11:54:17 CEST 2011: Server restart
> in 10 seconds
>
> Second restart:
> configstore.cpp (1342) : Assertion Failed: Saving local config store
> failed during shutdown
>
>>>
>>> /home/buildbot/buildslave_steam/steam_rel_client_linux/build/src/clientdll/c
>>> onfigstore.cpp
>
> 1342 Assertion Failed: Saving local config store failed during
> shutdown
> configstore.cpp (96) : Assertion Failed: ConfigStore
> (InstallConfigStore) is dirty, and being destroyed, we're discarding
> data
>
>>>
>>> /home/buildbot/buildslave_steam/steam_rel_client_linux/build/src/clientdll/c
>>> onfigstore.cpp
>
> 96 Assertion Failed: ConfigStore (InstallConfigStore) is dirty, and
> being destroyed, we're discarding data
>
> The install was finished ~5 minutes ago.
> No mani, no metamod, no sourcemod.
>
> On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 11:42 AM, brendan halley
> wrote:
>>
>> Well have you tried a vanilla server to see if you get the same error?
>> On Oct 24, 2011 8:14 PM, "Shin Ice"  wrote:
>>
>>> All addons are up to date, but i have sometimes the "Assertion
>>> Failed" error also on a clean install without any addon.
>>>
>>> So you think it depends only from mani?
>>>
>>> On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 11:10 AM, brendan halley
>>>   wrote:

 Why would you use Mani just reinstall and chuck source mod on and I
 bet that will fix your problem.
 But if you insist on keeping mani then make sure the gamedata (is
 that what it is in mani?) is up to date aka just update mani

 On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 8:08 PM, Shin Ice
 wrote:
>
> Hi again,
>
> I can't believe that no one has an answer for my question or at
> least a hint for me.
>
> Regardless, thanks for reading! =)
>
> c'ya
> Shin
>
> On Thu, Oct 20, 2011 at 10:35 AM, Shin Ice
> wrote:
>>
>> Hi all,

Re: [hlds_linux] See server reputation

[Loïc PERY]

ics, how did you see those numbers ?

i got that for my server:
Standing: Good. Trend: Slightly Upward
think its good ?

what are levels for standing and trend ?

2011/10/25 ics 

> 3 servers of mine havent shown anything than downward fast and 1 other
> slightly upward and one time downward fast for it too.
>
> I can see much more from actual values and how the servers are populated
> than cl_gameserver_list command. For example most of the servers gain
> 1500-2000 rep per week, one averaging 4000, the most popular one.
>
> Valve never put the rep value default command because they are not
> interested much about which servers have most but instead of taking bad
> servers off from the good ones. The bad being fake slots etc. For me the
> value is just extra fun and interesting to look at. Much more better stat is
> how full your servers are and how long does one player stay on it by
> average.
>
> -ics
>
> - Alkuperäinen viesti -
>  > To show a server reputation use cl_gameserver_list client command,
> > actual reputation value does not matter, instead of that you should
> > check the "trend" status.
> >
> > ___
> > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives,
> > please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
>
> ___
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> please visit:
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>
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Re: [hlds_linux] Forum vs. email list

[Kigen]

I think I can fix our forum vs email problem with both sides being happy. :D

Just got a coding idea.  We'll see where it goes.

On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 4:37 AM, Eric Riemers  wrote:
>
> I prefer the mailinglist, tons of reasons why i would want that more then a
> forum (ease of use being one of them)
>
> But if we *have* to move to the forums, at least make it so that we have
> our own section only for server maintainers, say for instance only people
> with a registered server with good standings is allowed to post there.
> Granted it might not be bullit proof but it might keep at least 90% of the
> non-relevant forum people out there. And ofcourse, assuming this has push
> alerts (with full reply for ease of use?)
>
> On Tue, 25 Oct 2011 08:03:08 +0300, ics  wrote:
>> I prefer mailing list. Just because it's easy to use while reading
>> regular e-mail and you can just pick a message to read easily, delete
>> immediately the rest that you don't need. On forum, you have to browse
>> around on many threads and it's very time consuming. I also hate the
>> SPUF style where you just get post to your mail that happened after your
>> reply and the messages after that are ignored untill i visit the forum
>> again. Forums might be clean first but full of dirt later. Too many
>> immature people there, way less here on this list.
>>
>> People go crazy on forums whenever someone from Valve replies, they want
>> to contribute. I'ts a mess there. Benefit on forums is the the easier
>> search and messages browsing if you prefer reading all once a week and
>> have time to go through all the messages. The count of messages that
>> should not be posted would rise high too. It would be harder to find the
>> thing you are looking for. It's good for historians. How many people
>> browse old messages anyway and why? To check something or find answer?
>> Isn't wiki for the answers better or some sort of section "how to run a
>> server for dummies".
>>
>> The recent change where there's as much as ~10 people been around from
>> Valve within a month is something i've never seen before. I thought the
>> list would live long and the latter closing notice would have been
>> proved wrong but i guess there is pressure to close the list down. This
>> is way more convinient than forums. Please do not close this down.
>>
>> -ics
>>
>>
>> 25.10.2011 7:28, Andrew kirjoitti:
>>> What about adding some kind of easy searching to the mailing list
>>> archives? That seems to be only commonly brought up minus to keeping
>>> this format.
>>>
>>> I am able to access them (the archives) with my login, but the
>>> standard listings by month and downloadable gzip'ed archives makes
>>> searching nontrivial. Improving that would be a big +
>>>
>>> On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 11:24 PM, m33crob  wrote:
 I too would prefer to keep the mailing list. If a forum materializes
> out
 of
 this conversation, I would be interested in becoming a moderator. I'm
 already super active in the Steam Forums and you guys may or may not
 have
 noticed that I update the Steam Forums server sections almost everyday.

 On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 9:15 PM, Jesse Molina
 wrote:

> I prefer mailing lists, which is why I am here.  Discussion and
> replies
> are
> below:
>
> I prefer mailing lists because there is a small technical barrier to
> entry.
>   Chances are that you had to use a search engine to find it, which
>   means you
> probably already tried to find what you were looking for via that
> search
> engine and failed.  Many noobs don't even know what a mailman list is,
> and
> that's good.  I want to talk to other people who can actually help me.
>
> This
> mailing list is not primarily for a social experience.  For most
> forums, a
> significant amount of code is dedicated to smileys, avatars,
> signatures,
> friends/foes, etc, because they need the social experience, because
> they are
> ad-revenue driven.  The amount of whitespace on web forums, compared
> to
> email, is terrible.
>
> Here's a thought:  The quality of the discussion is primarily impacted
> by
> how those with authoritative knowledge (Valve employees and pros)
> engage in
> the discussion.  If Valve employees were more inclined to participate
> in
> discussion on a web forum, I'd go web forum.  I would not cry too hard
> if
> this one mailing list went away.  It's just games.
>
> About the archives:  Why are they password protected, and why has my
> password never ever worked?  From day one, the password that came in
> my
> welcome email didn't work and I never tried again.  I have never ever
> searched the archives because I can't.
>
> It is nice to have a single point of discussion for issues, as opposed
> to
> many different sites and applications.  As an example, I am an
> aquarium
> hobbyist, and I

Re: [hlds_linux] Halloween, quickplay, and registering your server

[1nsane]

How many slots does your server have?

On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 11:59 PM, Mart-Jan Reeuwijk wrote:

> How about reserved slots?
>
> Cos I'm not planning to let the ppl that actually PAY for the server to be
> left out cos there is no slots free, or admins not able to join the server
> to check upon players/complaints etc because of this.
>
> If those cant be, then I see no other option then to leave this "event"
> alone. I dont mind the F2P guys etc, but if my community cant join the
> server because I cant enable their res slots for account/server's reputation
> security etc, there is no use for me to run it.
>
> I'm not talking about any advantage, we run minimal admin commands plugins
> (ban, mute, kick etc), thats it, but such server must be some purpose to my
> community, and the admins must be able to ban ppl that aren't welcome, like
> hackers, scammers, griefers, etc. And we all know those come crawling out at
> such events, trying to exploit all new stuff.
>
> Last year I wanted to ban automatically ppl that had all the achievements
> related to it and more then a hour on our server farming, they where just
> farming on the server for the masks. To some extend thats fine, but others
> wanted their achievements and items too, and those farmers knew already
> exactly where those where spawning. Didn't work out in time and plugin
> failed.
>
> And is that bug fixed that the gift spawned in a unreachable place,
> requiring a reload of the map cos it didn't disappear after x time? it was
> the main cause that ppl wanted noclip etc. so gameplay could continue after
> it. Nice to shove it back on us with a problem caused by a bug on it, admins
> gave noclip or tele for the players to collect that "gift" in the
> unreachable place (forgot where, and the wiki doesn't even have it), and now
> we are told thats wrong. And even add repercussions to it.
>
> Some ppl had to look for ways to get the achievements after the event, and
> couldn't get them till recently it was activated again. I find that a bit of
> fail. But meh.
>
> Tip for server admins: make sure the map reloads every 15 minutes. For w/e
> gets stuck, at least they have another chance then without waiting too long.
> Dont forget to FORCE it.
>
> Well, for the rest, I have no doubt it will be a great haloween  this year.
> Wonder if it will be Trick (glitches) or Treat (crash).
>
>
> >
> >From: Fletcher Dunn 
> >To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list <
> hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com>; "h...@list.valvesoftware.com" <
> h...@list.valvesoftware.com>
> >Sent: Tuesday, 25 October 2011, 1:29
> >Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Halloween, quickplay, and registering your
> server
> >
> >>or just that server must log in by setting the appropriate cvars?
> >YES.
> >
> >-Original Message-
> >From: hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com [mailto:
> hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] On Behalf Of StevoTVR
> >Sent: Monday, October 24, 2011 4:27 PM
> >To: Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list
> >Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Halloween, quickplay, and registering your
> server
> >
> >What exactly does the "and log into your account" part mean? Does this
> >mean that owner of the Steam account the server is registered with must
> >be logged in to the Steam client, or just that server must log in by
> >setting the appropriate cvars?
> >
> >On 10/24/2011 3:19 PM, Fletcher Dunn wrote:
> >> You must register your server (and log into your account) to get the
> special drops.
> >>
> >> You must register your server (and log into your account) to receive
> quickplay traffic.
> >>
> >> You may opt out of quickplay and still get the special drops.
> >>
> >> There will be a special client quickplay option for Halloween.  We'll
> let you know just before the update how to configure your server to be
> eligible to be matched with clients who select this option.  Basically you
> just need to be running the right map(s).
> >>
> >> -Original Message-
> >> From: hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com [mailto:
> hlds_linux-boun...@list.valvesoftware.com] On Behalf Of
> gamead...@127001.org
> >> Sent: Monday, October 24, 2011 3:11 PM
> >> To: 'Half-Life dedicated Linux server mailing list'
> >> Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Halloween, quickplay, and registering your
> server
> >>
> >> Just to clarify, since there's been no Valve answer on this and
> (msleeper's
> >> assurances to the contrary) this isn't clear...
> >>
> >> To enable the special drops, do we merely have to be registered, or do
> we
> >> also have to meet the quickplay criteria with regards to sv_tags etc.
> >>
> >> Similarly, if we're registered but have
> tf_server_identity_disable_quickplay
> >> set?
> >>
> >> I am aware that Valve have only ever said "registered", but since
> >> registering and quickplay have been, up to now, synonymous (in that
> >> quickplay was the other reason to register) this is probably worth
> spelling
> >> out.
> >>
>

Re: [hlds_linux] Forum vs. email list

[James Puckett]

Forum = moderation.

On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 6:39 AM, Kigen  wrote:

> I think I can fix our forum vs email problem with both sides being happy.
> :D
>
> Just got a coding idea.  We'll see where it goes.
>
> On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 4:37 AM, Eric Riemers  wrote:
> >
> > I prefer the mailinglist, tons of reasons why i would want that more then
> a
> > forum (ease of use being one of them)
> >
> > But if we *have* to move to the forums, at least make it so that we have
> > our own section only for server maintainers, say for instance only people
> > with a registered server with good standings is allowed to post there.
> > Granted it might not be bullit proof but it might keep at least 90% of
> the
> > non-relevant forum people out there. And ofcourse, assuming this has push
> > alerts (with full reply for ease of use?)
> >
> > On Tue, 25 Oct 2011 08:03:08 +0300, ics  wrote:
> >> I prefer mailing list. Just because it's easy to use while reading
> >> regular e-mail and you can just pick a message to read easily, delete
> >> immediately the rest that you don't need. On forum, you have to browse
> >> around on many threads and it's very time consuming. I also hate the
> >> SPUF style where you just get post to your mail that happened after your
> >> reply and the messages after that are ignored untill i visit the forum
> >> again. Forums might be clean first but full of dirt later. Too many
> >> immature people there, way less here on this list.
> >>
> >> People go crazy on forums whenever someone from Valve replies, they want
> >> to contribute. I'ts a mess there. Benefit on forums is the the easier
> >> search and messages browsing if you prefer reading all once a week and
> >> have time to go through all the messages. The count of messages that
> >> should not be posted would rise high too. It would be harder to find the
> >> thing you are looking for. It's good for historians. How many people
> >> browse old messages anyway and why? To check something or find answer?
> >> Isn't wiki for the answers better or some sort of section "how to run a
> >> server for dummies".
> >>
> >> The recent change where there's as much as ~10 people been around from
> >> Valve within a month is something i've never seen before. I thought the
> >> list would live long and the latter closing notice would have been
> >> proved wrong but i guess there is pressure to close the list down. This
> >> is way more convinient than forums. Please do not close this down.
> >>
> >> -ics
> >>
> >>
> >> 25.10.2011 7:28, Andrew kirjoitti:
> >>> What about adding some kind of easy searching to the mailing list
> >>> archives? That seems to be only commonly brought up minus to keeping
> >>> this format.
> >>>
> >>> I am able to access them (the archives) with my login, but the
> >>> standard listings by month and downloadable gzip'ed archives makes
> >>> searching nontrivial. Improving that would be a big +
> >>>
> >>> On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 11:24 PM, m33crob  wrote:
>  I too would prefer to keep the mailing list. If a forum materializes
> > out
>  of
>  this conversation, I would be interested in becoming a moderator. I'm
>  already super active in the Steam Forums and you guys may or may not
>  have
>  noticed that I update the Steam Forums server sections almost
> everyday.
> 
>  On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 9:15 PM, Jesse Molina
>  wrote:
> 
> > I prefer mailing lists, which is why I am here.  Discussion and
> > replies
> > are
> > below:
> >
> > I prefer mailing lists because there is a small technical barrier to
> > entry.
> >   Chances are that you had to use a search engine to find it, which
> >   means you
> > probably already tried to find what you were looking for via that
> > search
> > engine and failed.  Many noobs don't even know what a mailman list
> is,
> > and
> > that's good.  I want to talk to other people who can actually help
> me.
> >
> > This
> > mailing list is not primarily for a social experience.  For most
> > forums, a
> > significant amount of code is dedicated to smileys, avatars,
> > signatures,
> > friends/foes, etc, because they need the social experience, because
> > they are
> > ad-revenue driven.  The amount of whitespace on web forums, compared
> > to
> > email, is terrible.
> >
> > Here's a thought:  The quality of the discussion is primarily
> impacted
> > by
> > how those with authoritative knowledge (Valve employees and pros)
> > engage in
> > the discussion.  If Valve employees were more inclined to participate
> > in
> > discussion on a web forum, I'd go web forum.  I would not cry too
> hard
> > if
> > this one mailing list went away.  It's just games.
> >
> > About the archives:  Why are they password protected, and why has my
> > password never ever worked?  From day one, the password that came in
> > my
> > welcome email

Re: [hlds_linux] Forum vs. email list

[James Puckett]

So... I'm for having a forum.

On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 6:59 AM, James Puckett <
jamesrichardpuck...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Forum = moderation.
>
>
> On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 6:39 AM, Kigen  wrote:
>
>> I think I can fix our forum vs email problem with both sides being happy.
>> :D
>>
>> Just got a coding idea.  We'll see where it goes.
>>
>> On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 4:37 AM, Eric Riemers  wrote:
>> >
>> > I prefer the mailinglist, tons of reasons why i would want that more
>> then a
>> > forum (ease of use being one of them)
>> >
>> > But if we *have* to move to the forums, at least make it so that we have
>> > our own section only for server maintainers, say for instance only
>> people
>> > with a registered server with good standings is allowed to post there.
>> > Granted it might not be bullit proof but it might keep at least 90% of
>> the
>> > non-relevant forum people out there. And ofcourse, assuming this has
>> push
>> > alerts (with full reply for ease of use?)
>> >
>> > On Tue, 25 Oct 2011 08:03:08 +0300, ics  wrote:
>> >> I prefer mailing list. Just because it's easy to use while reading
>> >> regular e-mail and you can just pick a message to read easily, delete
>> >> immediately the rest that you don't need. On forum, you have to browse
>> >> around on many threads and it's very time consuming. I also hate the
>> >> SPUF style where you just get post to your mail that happened after
>> your
>> >> reply and the messages after that are ignored untill i visit the forum
>> >> again. Forums might be clean first but full of dirt later. Too many
>> >> immature people there, way less here on this list.
>> >>
>> >> People go crazy on forums whenever someone from Valve replies, they
>> want
>> >> to contribute. I'ts a mess there. Benefit on forums is the the easier
>> >> search and messages browsing if you prefer reading all once a week and
>> >> have time to go through all the messages. The count of messages that
>> >> should not be posted would rise high too. It would be harder to find
>> the
>> >> thing you are looking for. It's good for historians. How many people
>> >> browse old messages anyway and why? To check something or find answer?
>> >> Isn't wiki for the answers better or some sort of section "how to run a
>> >> server for dummies".
>> >>
>> >> The recent change where there's as much as ~10 people been around from
>> >> Valve within a month is something i've never seen before. I thought the
>> >> list would live long and the latter closing notice would have been
>> >> proved wrong but i guess there is pressure to close the list down. This
>> >> is way more convinient than forums. Please do not close this down.
>> >>
>> >> -ics
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> 25.10.2011 7:28, Andrew kirjoitti:
>> >>> What about adding some kind of easy searching to the mailing list
>> >>> archives? That seems to be only commonly brought up minus to keeping
>> >>> this format.
>> >>>
>> >>> I am able to access them (the archives) with my login, but the
>> >>> standard listings by month and downloadable gzip'ed archives makes
>> >>> searching nontrivial. Improving that would be a big +
>> >>>
>> >>> On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 11:24 PM, m33crob  wrote:
>>  I too would prefer to keep the mailing list. If a forum materializes
>> > out
>>  of
>>  this conversation, I would be interested in becoming a moderator. I'm
>>  already super active in the Steam Forums and you guys may or may not
>>  have
>>  noticed that I update the Steam Forums server sections almost
>> everyday.
>> 
>>  On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 9:15 PM, Jesse Molina
>>  wrote:
>> 
>> > I prefer mailing lists, which is why I am here.  Discussion and
>> > replies
>> > are
>> > below:
>> >
>> > I prefer mailing lists because there is a small technical barrier to
>> > entry.
>> >   Chances are that you had to use a search engine to find it, which
>> >   means you
>> > probably already tried to find what you were looking for via that
>> > search
>> > engine and failed.  Many noobs don't even know what a mailman list
>> is,
>> > and
>> > that's good.  I want to talk to other people who can actually help
>> me.
>> >
>> > This
>> > mailing list is not primarily for a social experience.  For most
>> > forums, a
>> > significant amount of code is dedicated to smileys, avatars,
>> > signatures,
>> > friends/foes, etc, because they need the social experience, because
>> > they are
>> > ad-revenue driven.  The amount of whitespace on web forums, compared
>> > to
>> > email, is terrible.
>> >
>> > Here's a thought:  The quality of the discussion is primarily
>> impacted
>> > by
>> > how those with authoritative knowledge (Valve employees and pros)
>> > engage in
>> > the discussion.  If Valve employees were more inclined to
>> participate
>> > in
>> > discussion on a web forum, I'd go web forum.  I would not cry too
>> hard
>> >

Re: [hlds_linux] Halloween, quickplay, and registering your server

[Chefe]

If you have 25 instead of 24, its only a little penality. If you have .. 
maybe 32 slots, its very higher, see here: 
https://support.steampowered.com/kb_article.php?ref=2825-AFGJ-3513 .


Am 25.10.2011 15:55, schrieb 1nsane:

How many slots does your server have?

On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 11:59 PM, Mart-Jan Reeuwijkwrote:


How about reserved slots?




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Re: [hlds_linux] Halloween, quickplay, and registering your server

[Michael Johansen]

What about the replay system? I have 24 slot servers, but they both have replay 
on, which makes them 25.. Does that have a penality?

> Date: Tue, 25 Oct 2011 16:03:02 +0200
> From: ch...@oktoberfest-servers.de
> To: hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com
> Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Halloween, quickplay, and registering your server
> 
> If you have 25 instead of 24, its only a little penality. If you have .. 
> maybe 32 slots, its very higher, see here: 
> https://support.steampowered.com/kb_article.php?ref=2825-AFGJ-3513 .
> 
> Am 25.10.2011 15:55, schrieb 1nsane:
> > How many slots does your server have?
> >
> > On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 11:59 PM, Mart-Jan 
> > Reeuwijkwrote:
> >
> >> How about reserved slots?
> >>
> 
> 
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Re: [hlds_linux] Halloween, quickplay, and registering your server

[Emil Larsson]

Hopefully not, if it's counting slots taken by Replay and SourceTV as player
slots (server reputation wise) then I would consider it a bug. Plenty of our
servers have both and their reputation is fine at least.

On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 4:15 PM, Michael Johansen  wrote:

>
> What about the replay system? I have 24 slot servers, but they both have
> replay on, which makes them 25.. Does that have a penality?
>
> > Date: Tue, 25 Oct 2011 16:03:02 +0200
> > From: ch...@oktoberfest-servers.de
> > To: hlds_linux@list.valvesoftware.com
> > Subject: Re: [hlds_linux] Halloween, quickplay, and registering your
> server
> >
> > If you have 25 instead of 24, its only a little penality. If you have ..
> > maybe 32 slots, its very higher, see here:
> > https://support.steampowered.com/kb_article.php?ref=2825-AFGJ-3513 .
> >
> > Am 25.10.2011 15:55, schrieb 1nsane:
> > > How many slots does your server have?
> > >
> > > On Mon, Oct 24, 2011 at 11:59 PM, Mart-Jan Reeuwijk >wrote:
> > >
> > >> How about reserved slots?
> > >>
> >
> >
> > ___
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Re: [hlds_linux] See server reputation

[ics]

If you really want to know, load up this plugin 
http://didrole.com/server_reputation/ and type show_server_reputation 
but remember that it doesn't matter if you have 30 000 or 1 million rep. 
All you need is active player base to get server up and running as it 
should be and get extra free slots filled with matchmaking players.


-ics

25.10.2011 14:48, Loïc PERY kirjoitti:

ics, how did you see those numbers ?

i got that for my server:
Standing: Good. Trend: Slightly Upward
think its good ?

what are levels for standing and trend ?

2011/10/25 ics


3 servers of mine havent shown anything than downward fast and 1 other
slightly upward and one time downward fast for it too.

I can see much more from actual values and how the servers are populated
than cl_gameserver_list command. For example most of the servers gain
1500-2000 rep per week, one averaging 4000, the most popular one.

Valve never put the rep value default command because they are not
interested much about which servers have most but instead of taking bad
servers off from the good ones. The bad being fake slots etc. For me the
value is just extra fun and interesting to look at. Much more better stat is
how full your servers are and how long does one player stay on it by
average.

-ics

- Alkuperäinen viesti -
  >  To show a server reputation use cl_gameserver_list client command,

actual reputation value does not matter, instead of that you should
check the "trend" status.

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Re: [hlds_linux] See server reputation

[Asher Baker]

The reputation displayed by that plugin (and others like it) isn't the
same as the one used in the server registration system.

On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 3:47 PM, ics  wrote:
> If you really want to know, load up this plugin
> http://didrole.com/server_reputation/ and type show_server_reputation but
> remember that it doesn't matter if you have 30 000 or 1 million rep. All you
> need is active player base to get server up and running as it should be and
> get extra free slots filled with matchmaking players.
>
> -ics
>
> 25.10.2011 14:48, Loïc PERY kirjoitti:
>>
>> ics, how did you see those numbers ?
>>
>> i got that for my server:
>> Standing: Good. Trend: Slightly Upward
>> think its good ?
>>
>> what are levels for standing and trend ?
>>
>> 2011/10/25 ics
>>
>>> 3 servers of mine havent shown anything than downward fast and 1 other
>>> slightly upward and one time downward fast for it too.
>>>
>>> I can see much more from actual values and how the servers are populated
>>> than cl_gameserver_list command. For example most of the servers gain
>>> 1500-2000 rep per week, one averaging 4000, the most popular one.
>>>
>>> Valve never put the rep value default command because they are not
>>> interested much about which servers have most but instead of taking bad
>>> servers off from the good ones. The bad being fake slots etc. For me the
>>> value is just extra fun and interesting to look at. Much more better stat
>>> is
>>> how full your servers are and how long does one player stay on it by
>>> average.
>>>
>>> -ics
>>>
>>> - Alkuperäinen viesti -
>>>  >  To show a server reputation use cl_gameserver_list client command,

 actual reputation value does not matter, instead of that you should
 check the "trend" status.

 ___
 To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives,
 please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
>>>
>>> ___
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>>> please visit:
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>>>
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Re: [hlds_linux] See server reputation

[Loïc PERY]

got no problem for players, 32 slots and always filled 24/7 :D

interresting point, how did you know that Asher?

other question: map like cp_panor will result in a penalty too during the
halloween event ?


2011/10/25 Asher Baker 

> The reputation displayed by that plugin (and others like it) isn't the
> same as the one used in the server registration system.
>
> On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 3:47 PM, ics  wrote:
> > If you really want to know, load up this plugin
> > http://didrole.com/server_reputation/ and type show_server_reputation
> but
> > remember that it doesn't matter if you have 30 000 or 1 million rep. All
> you
> > need is active player base to get server up and running as it should be
> and
> > get extra free slots filled with matchmaking players.
> >
> > -ics
> >
> > 25.10.2011 14:48, Loïc PERY kirjoitti:
> >>
> >> ics, how did you see those numbers ?
> >>
> >> i got that for my server:
> >> Standing: Good. Trend: Slightly Upward
> >> think its good ?
> >>
> >> what are levels for standing and trend ?
> >>
> >> 2011/10/25 ics
> >>
> >>> 3 servers of mine havent shown anything than downward fast and 1 other
> >>> slightly upward and one time downward fast for it too.
> >>>
> >>> I can see much more from actual values and how the servers are
> populated
> >>> than cl_gameserver_list command. For example most of the servers gain
> >>> 1500-2000 rep per week, one averaging 4000, the most popular one.
> >>>
> >>> Valve never put the rep value default command because they are not
> >>> interested much about which servers have most but instead of taking bad
> >>> servers off from the good ones. The bad being fake slots etc. For me
> the
> >>> value is just extra fun and interesting to look at. Much more better
> stat
> >>> is
> >>> how full your servers are and how long does one player stay on it by
> >>> average.
> >>>
> >>> -ics
> >>>
> >>> - Alkuperäinen viesti -
> >>>  >  To show a server reputation use cl_gameserver_list client command,
> 
>  actual reputation value does not matter, instead of that you should
>  check the "trend" status.
> 
>  ___
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>  please visit:
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> >>>
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> >>>
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[hlds_linux] HL2DM - more than 16 slots problem

[buster_cool]

hello guys,

i missed some news or infos about the problem that i have...i dont know why but 
since the big engine update i cant host more than 16 slots, is that a new 
feature? or did i something wrong?

best reguards
peter
-- 
Empfehlen Sie GMX DSL Ihren Freunden und Bekannten und wir
belohnen Sie mit bis zu 50,- Euro! https://freundschaftswerbung.gmx.de

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Re: [hlds_linux] See server reputation

[ics]

Yes i know, i read the mails. Reputation system is only 1 small part of 
the matchmaking system that takes into account the things listed in the 
FAQ on support pages.


Reputation only tells you if you have a server where people play on or 
is it just come and go traffic. If the players are more than 15 minutes 
on your server, you shall have a positive reputation and that's what 
everyone should have if they run a decent server. If 15 mins or less, 
it's just random players joining and leaving without stable player base.


-ics

25.10.2011 17:50, Asher Baker kirjoitti:

The reputation displayed by that plugin (and others like it) isn't the
same as the one used in the server registration system.

On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 3:47 PM, ics  wrote:

If you really want to know, load up this plugin
http://didrole.com/server_reputation/ and type show_server_reputation but
remember that it doesn't matter if you have 30 000 or 1 million rep. All you
need is active player base to get server up and running as it should be and
get extra free slots filled with matchmaking players.

-ics

25.10.2011 14:48, Loïc PERY kirjoitti:

ics, how did you see those numbers ?

i got that for my server:
Standing: Good. Trend: Slightly Upward
think its good ?

what are levels for standing and trend ?

2011/10/25 ics


3 servers of mine havent shown anything than downward fast and 1 other
slightly upward and one time downward fast for it too.

I can see much more from actual values and how the servers are populated
than cl_gameserver_list command. For example most of the servers gain
1500-2000 rep per week, one averaging 4000, the most popular one.

Valve never put the rep value default command because they are not
interested much about which servers have most but instead of taking bad
servers off from the good ones. The bad being fake slots etc. For me the
value is just extra fun and interesting to look at. Much more better stat
is
how full your servers are and how long does one player stay on it by
average.

-ics

- Alkuperäinen viesti -
  >To show a server reputation use cl_gameserver_list client command,

actual reputation value does not matter, instead of that you should
check the "trend" status.

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Re: [hlds_linux] HL2DM - more than 16 slots problem

[Kyle Sanderson]

Hard coded at 16 (you're not the first person to bring this up).

On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 8:19 AM,  wrote:

> hello guys,
>
> i missed some news or infos about the problem that i have...i dont know why
> but since the big engine update i cant host more than 16 slots, is that a
> new feature? or did i something wrong?
>
> best reguards
> peter
> --
> Empfehlen Sie GMX DSL Ihren Freunden und Bekannten und wir
> belohnen Sie mit bis zu 50,- Euro! https://freundschaftswerbung.gmx.de
>
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[hlds_linux] Required TF2 update coming later today

[Tony Paloma]

We're going to have a required TF2 update coming later today. This isn't the 
update for the Halloween event nor is it the update that will require your 
server to be registered in order to receive gift drops on Halloween maps, but, 
as with all required updates, you will need to apply the update to your servers 
to allow players to connect.

Thanks,
Tony

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Re: [hlds_linux] [hlds] Halloween 2011

[Cliff Riley]

Honestly, I don't care if it's being farmed, considering the masks
still sell for 1 scrap even though there are unlimited of them every 5
minutes. Now those in addition to the new stuff will go up if the
farming stops imo, last year people didn't have idle bots and stuff to
farm as fast as they are this year and the price was still the same.
It's crazy that these people are paying a months worth of drops to get
a set of masks, if the new stuff is going to drop the same way we're
going to have chaos for stuff that should be fun to hunt for.

Inb4 masks + new drops going for refined each. :|

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Re: [hlds_linux] [hlds] Halloween 2011

[msleeper]

We don't care that you don't care, or what trading rates for items
are. This is not relevant to server administration.

On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 3:03 PM, Cliff Riley  wrote:
> Honestly, I don't care if it's being farmed, considering the masks
> still sell for 1 scrap even though there are unlimited of them every 5
> minutes. Now those in addition to the new stuff will go up if the
> farming stops imo, last year people didn't have idle bots and stuff to
> farm as fast as they are this year and the price was still the same.
> It's crazy that these people are paying a months worth of drops to get
> a set of masks, if the new stuff is going to drop the same way we're
> going to have chaos for stuff that should be fun to hunt for.
>
> Inb4 masks + new drops going for refined each. :|
>
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Re: [hlds_linux] Required TF2 update coming later today

[Emil Larsson]

Knowing Valve... Halloween update on Thursday. ;) Good that you try to get
out the fixes in advance though, major bugs during a major event is...
always rather stressful.

On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 8:19 PM, Tony Paloma wrote:

> We're going to have a required TF2 update coming later today. This isn't
> the update for the Halloween event nor is it the update that will require
> your server to be registered in order to receive gift drops on Halloween
> maps, but, as with all required updates, you will need to apply the update
> to your servers to allow players to connect.
>
> Thanks,
> Tony
>
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Re: [hlds_linux] hlds_linux Digest, Vol 44, Issue 86

[Tuga aka mabaclu]

I'd prefer to have a forum because it would be much easier to organize the
information and I wouldn't need to get my inbox spamed.
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Re: [hlds_linux] HL2DM - more than 16 slots problem

[msleeper]

There is a source plugin at SourceOP that pushes it over 16 players.
But you better hope your server isn't crap, srcds strains under so
many physics props flying around.

On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 1:31 PM, Kyle Sanderson  wrote:
> Hard coded at 16 (you're not the first person to bring this up).
>
> On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 8:19 AM,  wrote:
>
>> hello guys,
>>
>> i missed some news or infos about the problem that i have...i dont know why
>> but since the big engine update i cant host more than 16 slots, is that a
>> new feature? or did i something wrong?
>>
>> best reguards
>> peter
>> --
>> Empfehlen Sie GMX DSL Ihren Freunden und Bekannten und wir
>> belohnen Sie mit bis zu 50,- Euro! https://freundschaftswerbung.gmx.de
>>
>> ___
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>> please visit:
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>>
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Re: [hlds_linux] Forum vs. email list

[Michael]

A Google Group might be good because it can be used as mailman serv with a
nice visual frontend and archive. People who like this current format could
keep using it or people who are for forums could opt out of email updates
and just browse through the frontend. Everything would be much easier to
find and it could also host as file repositories for admin resources or a
dedicated place to upload crash dumps.

Beyond that I actually wish this list had more actual discussion in it.
There a few people on the list that treat it like a glorified newsletter
from valve and if anyone starts a thread other than a valve dev or replies
with something they personally believe has been clarified already or is not
relevant they become very aggressive and attack the person. Oddly enough
they are also the fist people to complain about getting spammed by the list
and the ones that generally break all threaded email clients with broken
">" spam. If you don't have anything constructive to say then just dont
say anything and if you really think the extra 20 emails a day is a problem
then switch to digest mode so you only get one email each day.

~Michael
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Re: [hlds_linux] Forum vs. email list

[Ryan Alyea]

I'm not reading through all the responses, since it would be better served on a 
forum.

I am a member on this list to receive the announcement of updates (or as of 
lately, the pre-announcements, the update of "you must have your server 
registered").

If this list is to be preserved, I would like an "announcements only" list 
where I can receive the notices without the discussions.

Ryan Alyea
r...@fangamer.com

On Oct 24, 2011, at 5:34 PM, Fletcher Dunn wrote:

>> I am honestly astounded by the amount of people who complain when
>> people ask for help on help forums or mailing lists. Not everyone
>> signs up and instantly reads everything, goes through all the
>> archives, or spends hours researching.
> 
> I'd like to use this comment as a springboard for a discussion about the 
> format of this list.
> 
> I hear that a few years ago the idea of migrating the email list to a forum 
> was kicked around.  However, at the time (is this still true today?) the 
> users of the list didn't like the idea.  it is my understanding that most 
> server admins prefer:
> 
> 1.) Receiving push notifications.
> 2.) Viewing the list in their email client
> 
> #1 seems like a really compelling advantage (especially for announcements), 
> while #2 seems like a personal preference, and many people have the opposite 
> preference.
> 
> A forum has several compelling advantages:
> 
> 1.) Easier to search and find answers to previously asked questions
> 2.) Easier to follow a thread of conversation.  (I personally find any email 
> distribution list to become unreadable pretty much instantly, with all the 
> 's and broken line breaks that everybody's mail clients and put 
> everywhere.)
> 3.) Easier to modify your post if you notice a mistake or want to clarify 
> something, rather than making a new post.
> 4.) Easier to delete or move posts if they are spam, rude, inappropriate, 
> belong in the general TF2 SPUF forum, etc.
> 5.) Easier to ignore an entire thread that you are not interested in.
> 
> Could there be some sort of forum + push notification that would satisfy what 
> everybody wants?  This list exists to serve you guys, so I'm curious what 
> everything thinks.  I *believe* most of the guys would find a forum format 
> (perhaps with some push notification) more convenient.
> 
> It would be good to get some opinions about how people prefer to consume the 
> information on this list.
> 
> Please chime in.
> 
> Your humble servant,
> - Fletch
> 
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Re: [hlds_linux] Forum vs. email list

[Michael]

There actually is a [hlds_announce] list for just that propose but its
fallen out of use I don't believe I've seen anything sent on it in over a
month now.

~Michael
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Re: [hlds_linux] Required TF2 update coming later today

[Ross Bemrose]

Shouldn't this warning be sent to hlds_announce as well?  I know one of my
friends only subscribes to that list and neither of the server mailing lists
and complained because he didn't get it.

On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 3:47 PM, Emil Larsson  wrote:

> Knowing Valve... Halloween update on Thursday. ;) Good that you try to get
> out the fixes in advance though, major bugs during a major event is...
> always rather stressful.
>
> On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 8:19 PM, Tony Paloma  >wrote:
>
> > We're going to have a required TF2 update coming later today. This isn't
> > the update for the Halloween event nor is it the update that will require
> > your server to be registered in order to receive gift drops on Halloween
> > maps, but, as with all required updates, you will need to apply the
> update
> > to your servers to allow players to connect.
> >
> > Thanks,
> > Tony
> >
> > ___
> > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives,
> > please visit:
> > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
> >
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Re: [hlds_linux] Required TF2 update coming later today

[ics]

Update notes most likely say it when update goes live (that servers need 
to register in order to get gifts dropping). That way people who don't 
follow all the discussions here or elsewhere get the notice.


-ics

25.10.2011 23:15, Ross Bemrose kirjoitti:

Shouldn't this warning be sent to hlds_announce as well?  I know one of my
friends only subscribes to that list and neither of the server mailing lists
and complained because he didn't get it.

On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 3:47 PM, Emil Larsson  wrote:


Knowing Valve... Halloween update on Thursday. ;) Good that you try to get
out the fixes in advance though, major bugs during a major event is...
always rather stressful.

On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 8:19 PM, Tony Paloma
wrote:
We're going to have a required TF2 update coming later today. This isn't
the update for the Halloween event nor is it the update that will require
your server to be registered in order to receive gift drops on Halloween
maps, but, as with all required updates, you will need to apply the

update

to your servers to allow players to connect.

Thanks,
Tony

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Re: [hlds_linux] Forum vs. email list

[kama]

On Tue, 25 Oct 2011, Michael wrote:

> There actually is a [hlds_announce] list for just that propose but its
> fallen out of use I don't believe I've seen anything sent on it in over a
> month now.

Last message was only a couple of days ago.

Oct 21 Tony Paloma [hlds_announce] Team Fortress 2 Update Released

Since I am responding I can let my vote be on the mailing list.

Forums are bound to fail with all the noise that resides within them.
Mailinglists with filters are easier to handle. And as some have told
before. All different mailinglists are gathered on one spot instead of
scattered over the internet, which means that there is an easier way to
keep up with the information.

I believe I am currently following aprox 30 mailinglists, all followed
withing one site.

/Bjorn

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[hlds_linux] Team Fortress 2 Update Released

[Tony Paloma]

Required updates for Team Fortress 2 are now available.  The specific changes 
include:



- Fixed a client crash caused by corrupt particle data

- The Professor's Peculiarity can now be used as a crafting ingredient

- Football Manager 2012 promo items are now tradable and available for purchase

- Additional stability/performance work for both clients and servers

- Updated localization files



Thanks,

Tony
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Re: [hlds_linux] Forum vs. email list

[Rob Liu]

I have another suggestion.  Maybe limit the mailing list to server operators
only?

On Wed, Oct 26, 2011 at 9:46 AM, kama  wrote:

>
>
> On Tue, 25 Oct 2011, Michael wrote:
>
> > There actually is a [hlds_announce] list for just that propose but its
> > fallen out of use I don't believe I've seen anything sent on it in over a
> > month now.
>
> Last message was only a couple of days ago.
>
> Oct 21 Tony Paloma [hlds_announce] Team Fortress 2 Update Released
>
> Since I am responding I can let my vote be on the mailing list.
>
> Forums are bound to fail with all the noise that resides within them.
> Mailinglists with filters are easier to handle. And as some have told
> before. All different mailinglists are gathered on one spot instead of
> scattered over the internet, which means that there is an easier way to
> keep up with the information.
>
> I believe I am currently following aprox 30 mailinglists, all followed
> withing one site.
>
> /Bjorn
>
> ___
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> please visit:
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Re: [hlds_linux] Required TF2 update coming later today

[Rob Liu]

Really appreciated the early notice.  Please don't ever stop doing that : )

On Wed, Oct 26, 2011 at 9:33 AM, ics  wrote:

> Update notes most likely say it when update goes live (that servers need to
> register in order to get gifts dropping). That way people who don't follow
> all the discussions here or elsewhere get the notice.
>
> -ics
>
> 25.10.2011 23:15, Ross Bemrose kirjoitti:
>
>  Shouldn't this warning be sent to hlds_announce as well?  I know one of my
>> friends only subscribes to that list and neither of the server mailing
>> lists
>> and complained because he didn't get it.
>>
>> On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 3:47 PM, Emil Larsson  wrote:
>>
>>  Knowing Valve... Halloween update on Thursday. ;) Good that you try to
>>> get
>>> out the fixes in advance though, major bugs during a major event is...
>>> always rather stressful.
>>>
>>> On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 8:19 PM, Tony Paloma>>
 wrote:
 We're going to have a required TF2 update coming later today. This isn't
 the update for the Halloween event nor is it the update that will
 require
 your server to be registered in order to receive gift drops on Halloween
 maps, but, as with all required updates, you will need to apply the

>>> update
>>>
 to your servers to allow players to connect.

 Thanks,
 Tony

 __**_
 To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives,
 please visit:
 http://list.valvesoftware.com/**mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux

  __**_
>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives,
>>> please visit:
>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/**mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
>>>
>>>  __**_
>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives,
>> please visit:
>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/**mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
>>
>
>
> __**_
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Re: [hlds_linux] Forum vs. email list

[doc]

I'm casting my vote for the Mailing Group. It's nice to be able to check my
phone for a new message and see if I have to hit my emergency UPDATE SERVER
button. Forums that email me could do about the same thing, but there isn't
anything wrong with the current mailing list as it stands right now.

And for those who say they don't like the amount of spam that gets sent to
your inbox (read spam as: messages not pertaining to your servers/games),
you really should check out setting up filters to have these message avoid
your inbox unless it's a certain keyword or comes from a Valve worker
themselves.

If you do go the forum route could you set it up where we can still respond
via email or will we have to log into the forums? I'm pretty sure not every
admin services their box with a smartphone and ssh client but most times I'm
on the road and so this is my best option - if I have to load up a
web-browser and then log in just to post a crash report, I will be less
inclined to participate in any discussions - which might be a good thing?

Either way is fine, maybe it's just nostalgia but Mailing Groups are pretty
neato and helpful still. Especially for something like this.

On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 1:46 PM, kama  wrote:

>
>
> On Tue, 25 Oct 2011, Michael wrote:
>
> > There actually is a [hlds_announce] list for just that propose but its
> > fallen out of use I don't believe I've seen anything sent on it in over a
> > month now.
>
> Last message was only a couple of days ago.
>
> Oct 21 Tony Paloma [hlds_announce] Team Fortress 2 Update Released
>
> Since I am responding I can let my vote be on the mailing list.
>
> Forums are bound to fail with all the noise that resides within them.
> Mailinglists with filters are easier to handle. And as some have told
> before. All different mailinglists are gathered on one spot instead of
> scattered over the internet, which means that there is an easier way to
> keep up with the information.
>
> I believe I am currently following aprox 30 mailinglists, all followed
> withing one site.
>
> /Bjorn
>
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> please visit:
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>
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Re: [hlds_linux] Team Fortress 2 Update Released

[Eli Witt]

Client crashes still occurring, my server just lost 5/12 players at once.

On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 5:45 PM, Tony Paloma wrote:

> Required updates for Team Fortress 2 are now available.  The specific
> changes include:
>
>
>
> - Fixed a client crash caused by corrupt particle data
>
> - The Professor's Peculiarity can now be used as a crafting ingredient
>
> - Football Manager 2012 promo items are now tradable and available for
> purchase
>
> - Additional stability/performance work for both clients and servers
>
> - Updated localization files
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> Tony
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>
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Re: [hlds_linux] Forum vs. email list

[msleeper]

Unless they do something like requiring a server token ID when signing
up for the list, there's no possible way for them to enforce this. It
would be great if they did/could, but it would never happen.

On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 6:20 PM, Rob Liu  wrote:
> I have another suggestion.  Maybe limit the mailing list to server operators
> only?
>
> On Wed, Oct 26, 2011 at 9:46 AM, kama  wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, 25 Oct 2011, Michael wrote:
>>
>> > There actually is a [hlds_announce] list for just that propose but its
>> > fallen out of use I don't believe I've seen anything sent on it in over a
>> > month now.
>>
>> Last message was only a couple of days ago.
>>
>> Oct 21 Tony Paloma [hlds_announce] Team Fortress 2 Update Released
>>
>> Since I am responding I can let my vote be on the mailing list.
>>
>> Forums are bound to fail with all the noise that resides within them.
>> Mailinglists with filters are easier to handle. And as some have told
>> before. All different mailinglists are gathered on one spot instead of
>> scattered over the internet, which means that there is an easier way to
>> keep up with the information.
>>
>> I believe I am currently following aprox 30 mailinglists, all followed
>> withing one site.
>>
>> /Bjorn
>>
>> ___
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>> please visit:
>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
>>
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Re: [hlds_linux] Forum vs. email list

[Asher Baker]

There are a few (probably very few, but we exist) people that "need"
to monitor the list, and are perfectly capable of posting relevant
replies, that don't run servers.

The current system is fine, people that are being acidic to the
quality of the list just need to be removed.

On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 11:32 PM, msleeper  wrote:
> Unless they do something like requiring a server token ID when signing
> up for the list, there's no possible way for them to enforce this. It
> would be great if they did/could, but it would never happen.
>
> On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 6:20 PM, Rob Liu  wrote:
>> I have another suggestion.  Maybe limit the mailing list to server operators
>> only?
>>
>> On Wed, Oct 26, 2011 at 9:46 AM, kama  wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, 25 Oct 2011, Michael wrote:
>>>
>>> > There actually is a [hlds_announce] list for just that propose but its
>>> > fallen out of use I don't believe I've seen anything sent on it in over a
>>> > month now.
>>>
>>> Last message was only a couple of days ago.
>>>
>>> Oct 21 Tony Paloma [hlds_announce] Team Fortress 2 Update Released
>>>
>>> Since I am responding I can let my vote be on the mailing list.
>>>
>>> Forums are bound to fail with all the noise that resides within them.
>>> Mailinglists with filters are easier to handle. And as some have told
>>> before. All different mailinglists are gathered on one spot instead of
>>> scattered over the internet, which means that there is an easier way to
>>> keep up with the information.
>>>
>>> I believe I am currently following aprox 30 mailinglists, all followed
>>> withing one site.
>>>
>>> /Bjorn
>>>
>>> ___
>>> To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives,
>>> please visit:
>>> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux
>>>
>> ___
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>> please visit:
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>>
>
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Re: [hlds_linux] Required TF2 update coming later today

[DarthNinja]

On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 6:22 PM, Rob Liu  wrote:

> Really appreciated the early notice.  Please don't ever stop doing that : )
>
>
I second that :3
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Re: [hlds_linux] Forum vs. email list

[msleeper]

That's probably true, but I don't think a system should be setup to
cater to the minority.

On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 6:46 PM, Asher Baker  wrote:
> There are a few (probably very few, but we exist) people that "need"
> to monitor the list, and are perfectly capable of posting relevant
> replies, that don't run servers.
>
> The current system is fine, people that are being acidic to the
> quality of the list just need to be removed.
>
> On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 11:32 PM, msleeper  
> wrote:
>> Unless they do something like requiring a server token ID when signing
>> up for the list, there's no possible way for them to enforce this. It
>> would be great if they did/could, but it would never happen.
>>
>> On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 6:20 PM, Rob Liu  wrote:
>>> I have another suggestion.  Maybe limit the mailing list to server operators
>>> only?
>>>
>>> On Wed, Oct 26, 2011 at 9:46 AM, kama  wrote:
>>>


 On Tue, 25 Oct 2011, Michael wrote:

 > There actually is a [hlds_announce] list for just that propose but its
 > fallen out of use I don't believe I've seen anything sent on it in over a
 > month now.

 Last message was only a couple of days ago.

 Oct 21 Tony Paloma [hlds_announce] Team Fortress 2 Update Released

 Since I am responding I can let my vote be on the mailing list.

 Forums are bound to fail with all the noise that resides within them.
 Mailinglists with filters are easier to handle. And as some have told
 before. All different mailinglists are gathered on one spot instead of
 scattered over the internet, which means that there is an easier way to
 keep up with the information.

 I believe I am currently following aprox 30 mailinglists, all followed
 withing one site.

 /Bjorn

 ___
 To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives,
 please visit:
 http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux

>>> ___
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>>> please visit:
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>>>
>>
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>> please visit:
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>>
>
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Re: [hlds_linux] Required TF2 update coming later today

[msleeper]

More update announcements = more opportunities for people to tell
Valve how incompetent they are, am i rite?

On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 6:49 PM, DarthNinja  wrote:
> On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 6:22 PM, Rob Liu  wrote:
>
>> Really appreciated the early notice.  Please don't ever stop doing that : )
>>
>>
> I second that :3
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Re: [hlds_linux] Team Fortress 2 Update Released

[Ravnox]

Regarding the recent "tab" client crash, I'd like to point everyone to  
the following thread by Tony:  
http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2199895


"If you're occasionally crashing when pushing the tab key, please get  
the latest Steam client beta (click the Change button in the Account  
tab on the Settings page) and report back if it helps any. Thanks! "


I didn't see this posted on the list and I think it's appropriate  
since this issue has been killing our players. I've updated myself and  
I'm telling players on our servers to do the same if they still  
experience the "tab" crash.


--
Ravnox


Quoting Tony Paloma :

Required updates for Team Fortress 2 are now available.  The   
specific changes include:




- Fixed a client crash caused by corrupt particle data

- The Professor's Peculiarity can now be used as a crafting ingredient

- Football Manager 2012 promo items are now tradable and available   
for purchase


- Additional stability/performance work for both clients and servers

- Updated localization files



Thanks,

Tony






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Re: [hlds_linux] Team Fortress 2 Update Released

[Aaron Thompson]

Just reporting no said crashes thus far. Only have problems with Zombie
Fortress and 2 maps which are most-likely unrelated. I will report any
issues that are mysterious once I have encountered them.

On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 5:00 PM, Ravnox  wrote:

> Regarding the recent "tab" client crash, I'd like to point everyone to the
> following thread by Tony: http://forums.steampowered.**
> com/forums/showthread.php?t=**2199895
>
> "If you're occasionally crashing when pushing the tab key, please get the
> latest Steam client beta (click the Change button in the Account tab on the
> Settings page) and report back if it helps any. Thanks! "
>
> I didn't see this posted on the list and I think it's appropriate since
> this issue has been killing our players. I've updated myself and I'm telling
> players on our servers to do the same if they still experience the "tab"
> crash.
>
> --
> Ravnox
>
>
>
> Quoting Tony Paloma :
>
>  Required updates for Team Fortress 2 are now available.  The  specific
>> changes include:
>>
>>
>>
>> - Fixed a client crash caused by corrupt particle data
>>
>> - The Professor's Peculiarity can now be used as a crafting ingredient
>>
>> - Football Manager 2012 promo items are now tradable and available  for
>> purchase
>>
>> - Additional stability/performance work for both clients and servers
>>
>> - Updated localization files
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Tony
>>
>
>
>
>
>
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Re: [hlds_linux] Team Fortress 2 Update Released

[Kyle Sanderson]

Cool update! Any idea when we can see it for Counter-Strike Source?

Kyle.

On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 4:17 PM, Aaron Thompson  wrote:

> Just reporting no said crashes thus far. Only have problems with Zombie
> Fortress and 2 maps which are most-likely unrelated. I will report any
> issues that are mysterious once I have encountered them.
>
> On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 5:00 PM, Ravnox  wrote:
>
> > Regarding the recent "tab" client crash, I'd like to point everyone to
> the
> > following thread by Tony: http://forums.steampowered.**
> > com/forums/showthread.php?t=**2199895<
> http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2199895>
> >
> > "If you're occasionally crashing when pushing the tab key, please get the
> > latest Steam client beta (click the Change button in the Account tab on
> the
> > Settings page) and report back if it helps any. Thanks! "
> >
> > I didn't see this posted on the list and I think it's appropriate since
> > this issue has been killing our players. I've updated myself and I'm
> telling
> > players on our servers to do the same if they still experience the "tab"
> > crash.
> >
> > --
> > Ravnox
> >
> >
> >
> > Quoting Tony Paloma :
> >
> >  Required updates for Team Fortress 2 are now available.  The  specific
> >> changes include:
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> - Fixed a client crash caused by corrupt particle data
> >>
> >> - The Professor's Peculiarity can now be used as a crafting ingredient
> >>
> >> - Football Manager 2012 promo items are now tradable and available  for
> >> purchase
> >>
> >> - Additional stability/performance work for both clients and servers
> >>
> >> - Updated localization files
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Thanks,
> >>
> >> Tony
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > __**_
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> > please visit:
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> http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds_linux>
> >
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[hlds_linux] TF2 Replay Issues

[Russell Smith]

Since the patch today my servers have dropped all players on the server 
in a fashion that I haven't seen before.  I'm not sure if it's related 
to the new patch, or if it's the remote host that I'm using for the 
replay files.  I figured I would see if anyone else is having issues or 
has seen this before.


In my kern.log file I see a bunch of messages like the following:

Oct 25 16:34:32 watershed kernel: [756310.675343] nf_ct_ftp: dropping 
packetIN=eth0 OUT= MAC=00:16:3e:aa:d6:e8:fe:ff:ff:ff:ff:ff:08:00 
SRC=208.146.35.5 DST=66.150.188.127 LEN=101 TOS=0x00 PREC=0x00 TTL=1 
ID=5619 DF PROTO=TCP SPT=21 DPT=47766 SEQ=1534697435 ACK=1490424200 
WINDOW=114 RES=0x00 ACK PSH URGP=0 OPT (0101080A225AA0C80B43BCFA)


In the srcds console I see the following:
L 10/25/2011 - 16:34:36: *   ERROR: Publish timed out after 60 seconds.

Followed by everyone being dropped from the server with "STEAMAUTH: 
Client xxx received failure code 6" shortly afterwards, and then:


*
L 10/25/2011 - 16:35:29: *   Replay recording shutting down due to 
publishing error!  Recording will begin
L 10/25/2011 - 16:35:29: *   at the beginning of the next round, but may 
fail again.

L 10/25/2011 - 16:35:29: *


So my interpretation is something wonky is happening with the ftp 
transfer and srcds responds by dropping everyone and restarting the 
recording process.  If this is the case, would it be possible to fail a 
little more gracefully than this?  I would rather have no replays being 
recorded than everyone on the server being dropped.


Russell

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[hlds_linux] Is your TF2 standing trending downward fast?

[Fletcher Dunn]

There has been a bug in the TF2 server reputation trend calculation.  
Previously, it would only report that the reputation was either "slightly 
upward" or "downward fast."

It will be fixed in the next update, to properly show five different levels: up 
fast, up slow, steady, down slow, and down fast.

I'm sure that this news comes as a *complete shock* to everybody.  none of us 
had the SLIGHTEST INKLING that something was amiss, since it seemed to make 
such perfect sense.

No seriously, thanks to those who reported this issue.  And I apologize if 
anybody lost sleep over their server's reputation as a result of this bug.

And just to be clear: the bug was not in the calculation of the reputation data 
and had no effect on quickplay, etc.  It only affects the reporting of the 
trend message.

Your humble servant,
Fletch
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Re: [hlds_linux] Forum vs. email list

[Jesse Molina]

I am going to drag this thread on a little more.



There have been quite a few replies regarding two subjects:

1.) The opinion that the list/forum should be locked down somehow, based 
on a valid steam ID, or a server ID, etc.


2.) That the communications on the list should be limited to "server 
operations" or limited to server operators.




The common factor to both is that it seems like we are objecting to some 
of the content on the mailing list as being irrelevant or off-topic.


I really don't have a non-obvious suggestion for how to improve this 
here on the mailing list.


But, I can point out to all of us the alternative:

http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=45

For those of you who like forums, there it is.  =)



Of the twenty threads on the front page, minus the stickies, my opinion 
tells me they all fell into the following categories and percentiles:


20%  Unix 101
20%  Computer basics 101
20%  I can't read the FAQs, can't google it, can't spell, PLEASE HELP ME!
20%  I'm doing something bat-shit crazy, PLEASE HELP ME!
10%  Off-topic
10%  Legit questions

Note that I'm only looking at the Linux forums.  I don't read the 
Windows forums because they are even worse.




Some of the more humorous/stupid ones:

The six year old thread bump;
http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=292724

The guy who named his map file '$2000$';
http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2195589

Some guy has mp3 files and replays confused;
http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2177640

This guy wants wants more pointy clicky in his life;
http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2165489



Rob Liu wrote:

I have another suggestion.  Maybe limit the mailing list to server operators
only?


--
# Jesse Molina
# Mail = je...@opendreams.net
# Page = page-je...@opendreams.net
# Cell = 1.602.323.7608
# Web  = http://www.opendreams.net/jesse/



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Re: [hlds_linux] Is your TF2 standing trending downward fast?

[James Puckett]

Thanks for clearing this up.

On Tue, Oct 25, 2011 at 6:51 PM, Fletcher Dunn
wrote:

> There has been a bug in the TF2 server reputation trend calculation.
>  Previously, it would only report that the reputation was either "slightly
> upward" or "downward fast."
>
> It will be fixed in the next update, to properly show five different
> levels: up fast, up slow, steady, down slow, and down fast.
>
> I'm sure that this news comes as a *complete shock* to everybody.  none of
> us had the SLIGHTEST INKLING that something was amiss, since it seemed to
> make such perfect sense.
>
> No seriously, thanks to those who reported this issue.  And I apologize if
> anybody lost sleep over their server's reputation as a result of this bug.
>
> And just to be clear: the bug was not in the calculation of the reputation
> data and had no effect on quickplay, etc.  It only affects the reporting of
> the trend message.
>
> Your humble servant,
> Fletch
> ___
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Re: [hlds_linux] Forum vs. email list

[E3pO]

I personally think they need to make a bug zilla type thing that people can
commit bugs to and then have a dev blog that people can rss to check for
upcoming updates or questions. Then people can comment to the blog post.
Keep the existing mailing list but also run a forum powered by the mailing
list.. if someone posts a new thread it will also mail to the list. If
someone replies by email or on the forum it will br sent to both the list
and the forum..
On Oct 25, 2011 11:40 PM, "Jesse Molina"  wrote:

>
> I am going to drag this thread on a little more.
>
>
>
> There have been quite a few replies regarding two subjects:
>
> 1.) The opinion that the list/forum should be locked down somehow, based on
> a valid steam ID, or a server ID, etc.
>
> 2.) That the communications on the list should be limited to "server
> operations" or limited to server operators.
>
>
>
> The common factor to both is that it seems like we are objecting to some of
> the content on the mailing list as being irrelevant or off-topic.
>
> I really don't have a non-obvious suggestion for how to improve this here
> on the mailing list.
>
> But, I can point out to all of us the alternative:
>
> http://forums.steampowered.**com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=**45
>
> For those of you who like forums, there it is.  =)
>
>
>
> Of the twenty threads on the front page, minus the stickies, my opinion
> tells me they all fell into the following categories and percentiles:
>
> 20%  Unix 101
> 20%  Computer basics 101
> 20%  I can't read the FAQs, can't google it, can't spell, PLEASE HELP ME!
> 20%  I'm doing something bat-shit crazy, PLEASE HELP ME!
> 10%  Off-topic
> 10%  Legit questions
>
> Note that I'm only looking at the Linux forums.  I don't read the Windows
> forums because they are even worse.
>
>
>
> Some of the more humorous/stupid ones:
>
> The six year old thread bump;
> http://forums.steampowered.**com/forums/showthread.php?t=**292724
>
> The guy who named his map file '$2000$';
> http://forums.steampowered.**com/forums/showthread.php?t=**2195589
>
> Some guy has mp3 files and replays confused;
> http://forums.steampowered.**com/forums/showthread.php?t=**2177640
>
> This guy wants wants more pointy clicky in his life;
> http://forums.steampowered.**com/forums/showthread.php?t=**2165489
>
>
>
> Rob Liu wrote:
>
>> I have another suggestion.  Maybe limit the mailing list to server
>> operators
>> only?
>>
>
> --
> # Jesse Molina
> # Mail = je...@opendreams.net
> # Page = page-je...@opendreams.net
> # Cell = 1.602.323.7608
> # Web  = http://www.opendreams.net/**jesse/
>
>
>
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Re: [hlds_linux] Is your TF2 standing trending downward fast?

[Emil Larsson]

Huh, well this explains why I only saw those trends. I actually thought the
system was binary with trends, but apparently that as not intended behavior.
Looking forward to more accurate trends now. :)

On Wed, Oct 26, 2011 at 3:51 AM, Fletcher Dunn
wrote:

> There has been a bug in the TF2 server reputation trend calculation.
>  Previously, it would only report that the reputation was either "slightly
> upward" or "downward fast."
>
> It will be fixed in the next update, to properly show five different
> levels: up fast, up slow, steady, down slow, and down fast.
>
> I'm sure that this news comes as a *complete shock* to everybody.  none of
> us had the SLIGHTEST INKLING that something was amiss, since it seemed to
> make such perfect sense.
>
> No seriously, thanks to those who reported this issue.  And I apologize if
> anybody lost sleep over their server's reputation as a result of this bug.
>
> And just to be clear: the bug was not in the calculation of the reputation
> data and had no effect on quickplay, etc.  It only affects the reporting of
> the trend message.
>
> Your humble servant,
> Fletch
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Re: [hlds_linux] Is your TF2 standing trending downward fast?

[ics]

I actually think that they might have added additional 3 levels to it to 
make it more clear :)


-ics

26.10.2011 8:09, Emil Larsson kirjoitti:

Huh, well this explains why I only saw those trends. I actually thought the
system was binary with trends, but apparently that as not intended behavior.
Looking forward to more accurate trends now. :)

On Wed, Oct 26, 2011 at 3:51 AM, Fletcher Dunn
wrote:


There has been a bug in the TF2 server reputation trend calculation.
  Previously, it would only report that the reputation was either "slightly
upward" or "downward fast."

It will be fixed in the next update, to properly show five different
levels: up fast, up slow, steady, down slow, and down fast.

I'm sure that this news comes as a *complete shock* to everybody.  none of
us had the SLIGHTEST INKLING that something was amiss, since it seemed to
make such perfect sense.

No seriously, thanks to those who reported this issue.  And I apologize if
anybody lost sleep over their server's reputation as a result of this bug.

And just to be clear: the bug was not in the calculation of the reputation
data and had no effect on quickplay, etc.  It only affects the reporting of
the trend message.

Your humble servant,
Fletch
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Re: [hlds_linux] Is your TF2 standing trending downward fast?

[w4rezz]

Thanks god.

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[hlds_linux] CS:S Demos still broken

[Josh Stratton]

As of the last update to CS:S (October
13th),
Demos recorded since then are broken. I brought this up when the update hit
but nothing was done.

When playing a demo that has been recorded since that update, the following
error is given.

CNetworkStringTable::ParseUpdate: NULL pEntry, table server_query_info,
> index 0


Like most comunities, mine relies on demos for handling bans so I'm
requesting that this at least be looked into.
Replay hasn't been added to the game yet so there isn't a reasonable way for
people to record in-game on the fly.
-Josh
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