Re: RACF question.

[Daz]

> Can I  IPL  an  OS/390 2.5  with  out  RACF Dataset ?.
You can, but it is not pretty. Without RACF your system will try to
use ICHRIN01 table if it exists. That should (if you set it up), allow
your started tasks to execute. However, every single access request is
going to come back as a WTO for response.

Do you have BACKUP RACF dataset? I thought that installation gives
SYS1.RACF.PRIMARY and SYS1.RACF.BACKUP, or am confusing things with my
shop? If you have this setup, switch to backup RACF dataset.

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Re: Create a new user System Command

[Peter Hunkeler]

>From within NetView you just issue the command like
>"DISPUSR") however from a MVS console you need to enter the NetView
>command prefix (like %) in front of the command (like "%DISPUSR").

The "command prefix" helps the command listeners on the SSI to
recognize "their" commands. Also, the same command can be used by more
than one instance of a subsystem, each having a different command prefix.

Peter Hunkeler
Senior IT Specialist, IBM zSeries Technical Sales Support, Switzerland

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Re: RECFM=V/VB on SYSOUT: honored by JES?

[Peter Hunkeler]

>and he of course meant to write
>
>. . . unless you have BLNKTRNC=NO . . .

My statement was more towards the comment "...you need to have a look
at what really is on the spool". 

Peter Hunkeler
Senior IT Specialist, IBM zSeries Technical Sales Support, Switzerland

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Re: CA-11 3.0 + CA-DATACOM + Sysplex

[Eric Bielefeld]

I started installing CA11 V3.  It really seemed complicated to have to 
install Datacom to be able to run CA11.  We already had Datacom 
installed, but at an old release level.  By the time I got everything 
ready, they announced our datacenter was closing, so I couldn't install 
anything new anyway.  That's one way to get rid of CA products.

Eric Bielefeld
P&H Mining Equipment
Robert Justice wrote:
unfortunately, we are getting ready to move it into production in a 
25,000+ mips environment. .
Certainly I have seen issues where you have to issue a RESET command 
because the file doesn't get closed properly during an unscheduled 
outage. When I was first playing with it, I had to re-create all of the 
datasets for the product because it was getting DB* errors and reset, 
etc. wasn't working.

Why C/A decided to make people be a DBA just to run a scheduling restart 
manager is beyond me.

I keep hoping the CA11 replacement proposal at our shop gets off the 
ground shortly.

I have yet to talk to anyone that thinks CA-11 under DATACOM is a good 
idea (well, except for C/A people of course).

I certainly understand your hesitation, we're only considering moving to 
CA11 V3 because V2 is unsupported. I keep hoping C/A will realize what a 
mistake this is and come out with a release of CA11 (or a ptf for such) 
that doesn't require datacom
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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Ed Gould]

on 5/16/05 9:34 PM, Ed Finnell at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> 
> In a message dated 5/16/2005 8:43:20 P.M. Central Standard Time,
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> 
> Up until  10 years ago, I still had Star Trek in PL/I on 1,800 80 column
> cards.  It ran from the console in  DOS/VS.
> 
> 
> 
>>> 
> Think Darren still has Trek on his Web site(or a close  proximity).


Beware the wrath of Darren.
Ed

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Ed Finnell]

 
In a message dated 5/16/2005 8:43:20 P.M. Central Standard Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

Up until  10 years ago, I still had Star Trek in PL/I on 1,800 80 column  
cards.  It ran from the console in  DOS/VS.



>>
Think Darren still has Trek on his Web site(or a close  proximity).

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Clark F. Morris, Jr.]

R.S. wrote:
I had similar situation: My son had to prepare some presentation and he 
chose mainframes as the topic.
I delivered some pictures (BTW:I spent almost 1 hour to find in Internet 
good picture of punched card, and next half when searching for BIG photo 
of z/990 !!!), some "funny" facts - like "mainframe is bigger than 
fridge ...and there is refrigerator inside!", or "in the past mainframe 
had 64kB of RAM. Yes, it's 1000 times less than the oldest PC in your 
class." Another : "mainframes are vry expensive, entry level 
solutions is over 1M$, and believe me: no game will run on it".
Since there is a version of Star Trek on either the CBT tape or the MVT 
mods tape and a game actually became a production program in one shop as 
a means of getting sales people comfortable with the computer, I don't 
believe you.  Granted these were for a standard 3277 or 3278 so the 
graphics weren't wonderful but there were games.
Last but not least: I gave him some requsites: the card, the tape, and 
Bus&Tag cable (half meter with the plug). The last thing wasn't good 
idea: boys used them as a club (weapon) and were fighting.
Software is safer. 


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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[SArnett]

Up until 10 years ago, I still had Star Trek in PL/I on 1,800 80 column 
cards.  It ran from the console in DOS/VS.

Ed Finnell wrote:
In a message dated 5/16/2005 7:46:55 P.M. Central Standard Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

Picture  of a punch card ?..I still got somemy wife uses them for 
shopping  lists !
 

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Re: RACF question.

[Craddock, Chris]

>  
> If yes,  so  what  is  the  IBMUSER  password  to be used ?.
>  

back when ah were a lad, t'were always "SYS1"

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Re: sms & dfdss restore

[Karl Tucker]

Have you tried pre-allocating the output file. I know DF/DSS permits   
pre-allocation of output, however, the control cards will change as far as  
REPLACE 
AND RENAME are concerned.
 
Hi remember me,
Karl Tucker

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Robert McCormack]

Here in Oz (Australia) most of our betting shops & tracks  used the 96 
column card.

So, most of our punters (old and young) are familar with marking their 
selections on cards with a pen!

All we need is to change their focus from losing to earning a living - 
sounds simple!

Robert McCormack
Fundi Software
Email:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Work: +61 (Australia) 08-6212-0321
Fax:+61 (Australia) 08-6212-0160

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Ed Finnell]

 
In a message dated 5/16/2005 7:46:55 P.M. Central Standard Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

Picture  of a punch card ?..I still got somemy wife uses them for 
shopping  lists !



>>
If you hold your mouth right can feed them thru an all in one
device to get printed copies! Can use the card rasp if it  jams

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Re: RACF question

[Ed Finnell]

 
In a message dated 5/16/2005 6:55:03 P.M. Central Standard Time,  giova
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

You not  need to restore your production RACF/DB in this system, you can 
start with  a new empty RACF/DB only with the
IBM hard defined  userid  IBMUSER   groupid SYS1  and others  groups.




>>
Didn't say which RACF, think if it's 1.9 or higher can
GENER the current or D/R database(s) over from a SHARED pack.
 
Also don't remember when the names changed from ICH to IRR. Can
STEPLIB to the 2.5 system to run all the RACF utilities and
SYSLIB with VOL=SER for the RACF Utility assemblies. Will also
need to authorize LINKLIB on the 2.5 system.
 
I don't remember running ibmuser without RACF, but thought the
default was the groupid unless otherwise  specified.

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Hank Oerlemans]

Picture of a punch card ?..I still got somemy wife uses them for 
shopping lists !

Hi-tech  or what ?

Hank



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Re: RACF question

[Giovanni L Bozzetti]

Rugel

If no RACF database you need to have a userid and password in SYS1.UADS.

But if the problem is not portable backup because you not have tape, but if 
the disk of this system is acessible by other system you can define a new 
SYS1.RACF.PRIM 
and new SYS1.RACF.BACK.

Use the utility   IRRMIN00 to create a new RACF
When you create a new RACF  userid IBMUSER is defined with the password 
SYS1, because the default group of  IBMUSER is SYS1.

BUT, be CARREFULL with your DRIVE system if you point wrong the new RACF and 
the system use your drive RACF/DB, probable you lost your RACF/DB.

A correct JCL to create a new RACF/DB in a system that have a RACF/DB is 
this:

//jobname
//ST1 EXEC PGM=IRRMIN00,PARM=NEW
//STEPLIBDD DSN=SYS1.LINKLIB,DISP=SHR,UNIT=SYSDA,VOL=SER=NEWSYS
//SYSTEMP DD DISP=SHR,UNIT=SYSDA,VOL=SER=NEWSYS,
//  DSN=SYS1.MODGEN(IRRTEMP1)
//SYSRACF DDDSN=SYS1.RACF.PRIM.NEW,UNIT=SYSDA,VOL=SER=NEWSYS,
//  DISP=(NEW,CATLG,DELETE),
//  DCB=(BLKSIZE=4096,RECFM=F,LRECL=4096,DSORG=PS),
//  SPACE=(CYL,(40,0),,CONTIG)
//

Repeate the JOB to Secondary RACF/DB. The volume NEWSYS is what you want.

And didn't forget to linkedit  ICHDSNT  in SYS1.linklib that have the 
RACF/DB name primary and secondary.

You not need to restore your production RACF/DB in this system, you can 
start with a new empty RACF/DB only with the
IBM hard defined  userid IBMUSER   groupid SYS1  and others groups.

Regards
Giovanni Bozzetti
z/OS System Programmer

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sms & dfdss restore

[Marg Gozdowski]

I have a large file on one dasd pack that was dumped using dfdss without
sms on one lpar. I would like to restore this file on two dasd packs using
dfdss & sms on another lpar. How can I do this? I keep getting error msg:
igd17288i about how the file could not be allocated normally & is not
eligible for space constraint relief (multi volume) because it is a single
volume data set. sms is not set up with dataclas or mgmtclas - only storclas

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Re: 80 byte jcl record limit

[Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)]

In <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, on 05/16/2005
   at 12:35 PM, Paul Gilmartin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:

>But, then, where's the continuation column for JCL?
>(The grandtopic of this thread was relaxing the format
>restrictions for JCL)

Wherever the C/I folks say that it is, but I would expect them to pick
column 9. There are disadvantages to whatever they choose, but it
would still be an improvement over FB only.
 
-- 
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 ISO position; see  
We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
(S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)]

In
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
on 05/16/2005
   at 11:10 AM, "Porowski, Ken" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:

>Before there was Xbox, 
>Before there was GameBoy,
>Before there was Playstation,
>Before there were PC's,
>Before there were calculators,
>There were Mainframes.

Calculators (both analog and digital) are older than stored program
computers, by millenia.
 
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 ISO position; see  
We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
(S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)

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Re: RMF Usage

[Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)]

In <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, on
05/16/2005
   at 11:25 AM, Robert Pelletier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:

>Good Morning All. My boss has informed me that we will be getting a
>license for RMF. I am OS390 V2R10. Inorder to get it working do I
>need any software or is it already there?

FSVO there; you may need to add the libraries to the link and LPA
lists. You will also need to do some configuration.
 
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We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)]

In
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
on 05/16/2005
   at 11:27 AM, "Porowski, Ken" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:

>Get a mess of beads and string and see who can string up 1K of core
>the fastest?

>Tug of war with 100' Grey Bus&Tag?

>Write Protect ring toss?

Pulling the rings apart.
 
-- 
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 ISO position; see  
We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
(S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)

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Re: 80 byte ISPF record limit (was: 80 byte jcl ... )

[Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)]

In <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, on 05/16/2005
   at 08:01 AM, Paul Gilmartin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:

>If you have a model 5, or an emulator which supports that, or
>supports programmable screen geometry, ISPF will exploit whatever it
>sees. (Shmuel says up to 160 characters; I haven't tested to that
>boundary.)

80, 132 and 160 are standard screen widths, and work. I don't know
what happens if you use an arbitrary width.

>There may be some issue of getting your sysadmins to define a
>LOGMODE to handle unconventional screen geometries; at least I had
>that experience.

There's a standard LOGMODE for dynamic geometry (D4C32XX3?). What can
be fun is the other direction; getting the VTAM, TPX, etc.,
administrators to define a LOGMODE to force[1] the terminal to a
specific geometry, e.g., 43x80 primary and 27x132 secondary.

[1] I wanted that for 3180 and successors.
 
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Re: RACF question.

[Walt Farrell]

On 5/16/2005 6:16 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
 
In a message dated 5/16/2005 5:09:02 P.M. Central Standard Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

If  yes,  so  what  is  the  IBMUSER  password   to be used ?.

The default was IBMUSER, but without RACF you'll need a UADS
entry that doesn't have a RACF segment. TSO1 and TSO2 used to
be shipped with SERVER/PAC, but most folks delete them early on.
 
I thought the default in UADS was SYS1, just as it is for IBMUSER in a 
newly-initialized RACF database.  But that memory is very old...

Without RACF, nothing will have a TSO segment, and so any ID in UADS can 
be used as long as you know its password.

Walt Farrell, CISSP
z/OS Security Design, IBM
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Mainframe Job

[Elizabeth Czaja]

Does anybody know about a mainframe related programer/developer/tester
job (OS/390,z/OS,PL/1,assembler) in the Silicon Valley area?
Thanks for any input,
Elizabeth

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Re: CA-11 3.0 + CA-DATACOM + Sysplex

[Robert Justice]

unfortunately, we are getting ready to move it into production in a 25,000+ 
mips environment. .
Certainly I have seen issues where you have to issue a RESET command because 
the file doesn't get closed properly during an unscheduled outage. When I 
was first playing with it, I had to re-create all of the datasets for the 
product because it was getting DB* errors and reset, etc. wasn't working.

Why C/A decided to make people be a DBA just to run a scheduling restart 
manager is beyond me.

I keep hoping the CA11 replacement proposal at our shop gets off the ground 
shortly.

I have yet to talk to anyone that thinks CA-11 under DATACOM is a good idea 
(well, except for C/A people of course).

I certainly understand your hesitation, we're only considering moving to 
CA11 V3 because V2 is unsupported. I keep hoping C/A will realize what a 
mistake this is and come out with a release of CA11 (or a ptf for such) that 
doesn't require datacom 

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Re: RACF question.

[Ed Finnell]

 
In a message dated 5/16/2005 5:09:02 P.M. Central Standard Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

If  yes,  so  what  is  the  IBMUSER  password   to be used ?.



>>
The default was IBMUSER, but without RACF you'll need a UADS
entry that doesn't have a RACF segment. TSO1 and TSO2 used to
be shipped with SERVER/PAC, but most folks delete them early on.
 
If you can't find RACF, might not be able to find UADS  either?

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RACF question.

[=?iso-8859-1?Q?Rugel_Jos=E9?=]

HI:
 
Can I  IPL  an  OS/390 2.5  with  out  RACF Dataset ?.
 
( System  can  not  locate  SYS1.RACF  dataset and  I don't  have  3490's ( for 
a  while )  to  make  a  tape restore stand alone ).
 
 
If yes,  so  what  is  the  IBMUSER  password  to be used ?.
 
Thanks.
 

José Rugel Cabrera
System Programmer
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
tel: 42566010-5873 



 

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New GRSDEF parm GRSQ

[Giovanni L Bozzetti]

I wish to use the new GRSDEF keyword  GRSQ(CONTENTION),  that solve some 
performance issue in a SYSPLEX with GRS STAR.

I apply the PTFs that APAR OA07975 inform, but I am confuse in use exactly the 
new PARM.

The APAR explain a new GRSDEF keyword is being made available. Its syntax is:

   GRSQ  { (ALL)}   
  { (CONTENTION)  }
  { (LOCAL)}


I have in my PARMLIB member GRSCNF00:

 GRSDEF MATCHSYS(LPAR1)
 GRSDEF MATCHSYS(LPAR2)
 GRSDEF MATCHSYS(LPAR3)
 GRSDEF MATCHSYS(LPAR4)
 GRSDEF MATCHSYS(LPAR5)

I did apply all PTFs and now I will IPL all 5 system in the sysplex, but I 
didn't find in any manual the correct syntax,
I didn't have window and time to IPL all SYSPLEX twice, I need to use  the 
correct PARM in the first time, anyone have
the correct answer?

I use:   (it is my choise)

 GRSDEF MATCHSYS(LPAR1)   GRSQ(CONTENTION)
 GRSDEF MATCHSYS(LPAR2)   GRSQ(CONTENTION)
 GRSDEF MATCHSYS(LPAR3)   GRSQ(CONTENTION)
 GRSDEF MATCHSYS(LPAR4)   GRSQ(CONTENTION)
 GRSDEF MATCHSYS(LPAR5)   GRSQ(CONTENTION)

   or

 GRSDEF GRSQ(CONTENTION) 
  
 GRSDEF MATCHSYS(LPAR1)
 GRSDEF MATCHSYS(LPAR2)
 GRSDEF MATCHSYS(LPAR3)
 GRSDEF MATCHSYS(LPAR4)
 GRSDEF MATCHSYS(LPAR5)
  
Thanks, for any information.

Giovanni Bozzetti
z/OS System Programmer

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Re: PDS85 if a:b then(sublist) ?

[Mike Caughran]

Thanks that works
Imbriale, Donald (Exchange) wrote:
On the second MEMLIST, try MEMLIST * RESET.
Don Imbriale
 

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
   

Behalf
 

Of Mike Caughran
Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 2:51 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
Subject: PDS85 if a:b then(sublist) ?
Question re PDS85.
If I create a sublist, I can get a memlist * ok
If I create a second sublist I no longer get a good memlist *
EG.
pds85 'sys2.proclib'
if a:b then(sublist)
memlist *
 produces good list
if x:z then(sublist)
memlist *
 produces a memblist of a:b and x:z
How do I reset the memlist to no members?  or to all members?
If I do a "change 'sys2.proclib' "  then the memlist is reset to all
members.
   

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[R.S.]

I had similar situation: My son had to prepare some presentation and he 
chose mainframes as the topic.
I delivered some pictures (BTW:I spent almost 1 hour to find in Internet 
good picture of punched card, and next half when searching for BIG photo 
of z/990 !!!), some "funny" facts - like "mainframe is bigger than 
fridge ...and there is refrigerator inside!", or "in the past mainframe 
had 64kB of RAM. Yes, it's 1000 times less than the oldest PC in your 
class." Another : "mainframes are vry expensive, entry level 
solutions is over 1M$, and believe me: no game will run on it".

Last but not least: I gave him some requsites: the card, the tape, and 
Bus&Tag cable (half meter with the plug). The last thing wasn't good 
idea: boys used them as a club (weapon) and were fighting.
Software is safer. 

--
Radoslaw Skorupka
Lodz, Poland

Richard Heritage wrote:
This is more of a Friday question, but I got busy Friday and didn't have
time to post.  At my son's school, they are having parents come in and
talk to the class about their jobs.  It's heartwarming that my son is
proud of me and wants me to come in and speak, but I'm at somewhat
nervous about trying to make what I do interesting or even intelligible
to second graders.  Somehow I don't think that HiperSockets will be as
exciting to them as they were to me when I first heard about them.
I have some ideas, but I'm hoping that some of you have been through
this before and have some tips on things that worked (or didn't work!)
for you.  How do you explain such a technical occupation to young
children?  What props or visual aids would you use to illustrate work
that mostly goes on inside either our brains or our computers?  Any
ideas you have will be appreciated.
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CA-11 3.0 + CA-DATACOM + Sysplex

[Mark Zelden]

Hello list,

Is anyone running CA-11 3.0 in a (large?) sysplex environment?  If so,
can you share what you are doing when the master CA-DATACOM (MUF) system
needs to be IPLed?  What issues (if any) have you run into with moving
the MUF?  What about any unplanned outages for the MUF LPAR.

I am not looking for a RTFM answer.  We know the documented procedure
is to suspend CA-11 tasks on all LPARs, move the DATACOM task, then resume
the CA-11 tasks.

We are currently running CA-11 in a 2 LPAR development sysplex but
are hesitant to roll it out to our production sysplexes the way the
product works right now.  Real world experiences are more what we
are looking for.

Private replies welcome from shy ibm-main lurkers. :-)

TIA,

Mark
--
Mark Zelden
Sr. Software and Systems Architect
mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Systems Programming expert at http://Search390.com/ateExperts/
Mark's MVS Utilities: http://home.flash.net/~mzelden/mvsutil.html



p.s.  if you want to get on an interested parties list for
this issue you should contact CA - problem #3235.

 Title: * RUN CA-11 REGIONS WITH CA-DATACOM/AD MUFPLEX

Symptom:Sites running CA-11 on multiple LPARS would like to be able to
process using multiple MUFs in a MUFPLEX configuration.

Reason: To be able to provide a fault tollerent operation utilizing
shared updateable databases between two z/OS CA-Datacom/AD MUFs
running on separate LPARs and or processors.

Action: Investigate & test in house multiple CA-11 regions and
two CA-Datacom/AD MUFs configured as a MUFPLEX.  Also
determine whether the application can automatically detect and
handle the switching from one MUF to the other in the event that
one MUF LPAR is lost.


WARNING:CA-DATACOM/AD HAS NOT BEEN CERTIFIED TO RUN AS A MUFPLEX.

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Howard Brazee]

On 16-May-2005, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Richard Heritage) wrote:

> I've used that explanation with adults and still gotten blank looks.
> Nowadays I just say I'm a software engineer--simpler for all concerned.

Those are the guys who drive the software locomotives, right?

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Re: PDS85 if a:b then(sublist) ?

[Imbriale, Donald (Exchange)]

On the second MEMLIST, try MEMLIST * RESET.

Don Imbriale


>-Original Message-
>From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf
>Of Mike Caughran
>Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 2:51 PM
>To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
>Subject: PDS85 if a:b then(sublist) ?
>
>Question re PDS85.
>
>If I create a sublist, I can get a memlist * ok
>If I create a second sublist I no longer get a good memlist *
>
>EG.
>
>pds85 'sys2.proclib'
>if a:b then(sublist)
>memlist *
>   produces good list
>
>if x:z then(sublist)
>memlist *
>   produces a memblist of a:b and x:z
>
>How do I reset the memlist to no members?  or to all members?
>
>If I do a "change 'sys2.proclib' "  then the memlist is reset to all
>members.
>


***
Bear Stearns is not responsible for any recommendation, solicitation, 
offer or agreement or any information about any transaction, customer 
account or account activity contained in this communication.
***

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Re: FTPing a ADRDSSU file -THANKS!

[Gabe Torres]

Thanks to all for the contributions.
 I'll be testing this out these week.  Contractors were on-site,..so I
had been slightly redirected.

gabe   
---

> Ed,
> There was no blksize info supplied in the DCB, so it must be 
> defaulting to whatever ADRDSSU likes.
> gabe   
> 
>
Gabe,

IIRC the blksize ends up being greater than 32K (with DFDSS) and FTP
drops anything after 32K. The "trick" is to tell DFDSS (via
blkszie=32760)" not to create large blksizes.

Ed

...

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Chase, John]

> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Richard Heritage
> 
> I like that--it would help convey that "my" computer does a 
> lot of things for a lot of people at the same time.  Using 
> this analogy, a PC is more like a drive-through window at 
> McDonalds.  Thanks.
> 
> Richard.
> 
> >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/16/05 11:25 AM >>>
> 
> How about something like a visual depicting a team of octopi "serving"
> burgers, fries, sundaes, sodas, etc.?

And if you also have audio, you might merge in something from "The
Sorcerer's Apprentice" (from Disney's "Fantasia"), with you (the sysprog) as
the "conductor".

-jc-

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Richard Heritage]

Jim--

Thanks for the good ideas.  I had to replace a NIC over the weekend, so
I'm going to pass around the old one.  I also have a broken 486 in the
basement that I'll take the cover off so they can see the insides.

Richard.

>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/16/05 11:58 AM >>>
Richard,

I think Lock brought up some very good points.  Here's what I would
add:

1. Don't underestimate your audience!  I've spoken in front of second
grade classes and ... wow! ... these kids are savvy!

2. Kids respond well to visuals and handouts.  I think passing around
a
motherboard would go over pretty slick.   Or even a dump ... it will
look
like Matrix!

3. Try to stick with examples they know.  ATM machines is a good
example.
Try to get them to think what happens behind the covers - a Wizard of
Oz
type thing.

4. Always reward someone who asks a question ("Excellent question") -
pretty soon the whole class will get into it.  It's pretty exciting
actually ... especially if you're used to presenting in front a sleepy
application programmers!

5. Have fun!!   Break a leg!!

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Richard Heritage]

I've used that explanation with adults and still gotten blank looks. 
Nowadays I just say I'm a software engineer--simpler for all concerned.

>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/16/05 11:33 AM >>>
Not that this will work for 8 year olds, but, when explaining what a 
systems programmer does, I have always said that we maintain the 
software that allow programmers to do their jobs.

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Richard Heritage]

I like that--it would help convey that "my" computer does a lot of
things for a lot of people at the same time.  Using this analogy, a PC
is more like a drive-through window at McDonalds.  Thanks.

Richard.

>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/16/05 11:25 AM >>>

How about something like a visual depicting a team of octopi "serving"
burgers, fries, sundaes, sodas, etc.?

-jc-

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Richard Heritage]

Fortunately I wasn't eating or drinking when I read this.  lol, as the
kids say.

>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/16/05 11:22 AM >>>
Isn't just the same as explaining it to the executive team? 

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Richard Heritage]

I'll have to check with the teacher on that one. ;-)

>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/16/05 1:17 PM >>>
Or shooting rubber bands and paper clips into the acoustic ceiling. 

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PDS85 if a:b then(sublist) ?

[Mike Caughran]

Question re PDS85.
If I create a sublist, I can get a memlist * ok
If I create a second sublist I no longer get a good memlist *
EG.
pds85 'sys2.proclib'
if a:b then(sublist)
memlist *
  produces good list
if x:z then(sublist)
memlist *
  produces a memblist of a:b and x:z
How do I reset the memlist to no members?  or to all members?
If I do a "change 'sys2.proclib' "  then the memlist is reset to all 
members.

Thanks,
Mike
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Re: 80 byte jcl record limit

[Ed Gould]

on 5/16/05 1:35 PM, Paul Gilmartin at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> In a recent note, "Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)" said:
> 
>> Date: Mon, 16 May 2005 12:18:08 -0300
>> 
>> In <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, on 05/15/2005
>> at 09:55 PM, Paul Gilmartin <[log in to unmask]> said:
>> 
>>> What's a "sequence number"?
>> 
>> Standard TSO rules.
>> 
>>> What if the "sequence numbers" are on the left?
>> 
>> That's standard for RECFM=VB.
>> 
> But, then, where's the continuation column for JCL?
> (The grandtopic of this thread was relaxing the format
> restrictions for JCL)
> 

Gil,

It depends :-)

(IF PARM there is one set  if non parm its another:)

Ed

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Re: 80 byte jcl record limit

[Paul Gilmartin]

In a recent note, "Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)" said:

> Date: Mon, 16 May 2005 12:18:08 -0300
> 
> In <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, on 05/15/2005
>at 09:55 PM, Paul Gilmartin <[log in to unmask]> said:
> 
> >What's a "sequence number"?
> 
> Standard TSO rules.
> 
> >What if the "sequence numbers" are on the left?
> 
> That's standard for RECFM=VB.
> 
But, then, where's the continuation column for JCL?
(The grandtopic of this thread was relaxing the format
restrictions for JCL)

-- gil
-- 
StorageTek
INFORMATION made POWERFUL

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Re: 80 byte ISPF record limit

[Edward E. Jaffe]

Ed Finnell wrote:
Is it ISPF or those 20 yr old fixed width screens in front of
the shipped libraries?
The limitations are with ISPF itself.
--
.-.
| Edward E. Jaffe||
| Mgr, Research & Development| [EMAIL PROTECTED]|
| Phoenix Software International | Tel: (310) 338-0400 x318   |
| 5200 W Century Blvd, Suite 800 | Fax: (310) 338-0801|
| Los Angeles, CA 90045  | http://www.phoenixsoftware.com |
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Re: 80 byte ISPF record limit

[Ed Finnell]

 
In a message dated 5/16/2005 12:58:32 P.M. Central Standard Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

I *wish*  that was true! ISPF is *way* behind the curve on  this...




>>
Is it ISPF or those 20 yr old fixed width screens in front of
the shipped libraries? Somewhere between 2.4 and 2.10 all the
shipped ISPF screens were changed to use Dynamic screen widths.
They also packaged them in DTL just to make them almost  unmaintainable.

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Re: 80 byte ISPF record limit

[Edward E. Jaffe]

Paul Gilmartin wrote:
If you have a model 5, or an emulator which supports that, or supports
programmable screen geometry, ISPF will exploit whatever it sees.
 

I *wish* that was true! ISPF is *way* behind the curve on this...
http://bama.ua.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind0501&L=ibm-main&P=R45606
--
.-.
| Edward E. Jaffe||
| Mgr, Research & Development| [EMAIL PROTECTED]|
| Phoenix Software International | Tel: (310) 338-0400 x318   |
| 5200 W Century Blvd, Suite 800 | Fax: (310) 338-0801|
| Los Angeles, CA 90045  | http://www.phoenixsoftware.com |
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Re: DEL GDG problem

[Larry Crilley]

Radoslaw,

Do you still have T-REX?  You should be able to DELETE SCRATCH the entry
from the volume.

Larry Crilley
Dino-Software, LLC
http://www.dino-software.com/
412-734-2853.




-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Wong, Dorothy
Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 1:23 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: DEL GDG problem

Have you tried 
DEL HLQ1.DATASET.G0805V00 NVR FILE(DDNAME) CAT(mastercatalog)  ??

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of R.S.
Sent: May 16, 2005 8:00 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
Subject: DEL GDG problem

The following scenario:

HLQ1.DATASET.G0805V00

Member of GDG, SMS-managed, extended format PS.
Single volume, but defined with VOL=(,,,4)
Volser SMSXX1
Now the volume is available from another LPAR. The new system has no 
'HLQ1' datasets, the original BCS wasn't imported.
The original system is shut down.


I want to delete the dataset, just to clean up the volume.

How can I do it ?

I tried
DEL HLQ1.DATASET.G0805V00 NVR FILE(DDNAME)
and several other, no success.

Of course I can use ICKDSF...

-- 
Radoslaw Skorupka
Lodz, Poland

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Thanks Again All RE: RMF Usage

[Robert Pelletier]

Again you all have been a tremendous help.

-Original Message-
From: Knutson, Sam [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 12:40 PM
To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: RMF Usage


Robert,

The Redbook Effective zSeries Performance Monitoring using RMF

http://www.redbooks.ibm.com/abstracts/sg246645.html?Open 

is a great introduction to RMF and it's many facilities.  RMF is like Eve
without Prozac.  There are several distinct on-line and batch facilities all
collectively called RMF.  The Redbook is an excellent alternative to the
traditional RMF manuals which you should have handy.  It covers setup and
use of RMF.

Consider that some RMF options like CACHE can cause the RMF started task to
be a much larger CPU consumer and especially if you are a small shop this
may be an issue.  

An IPL should not be required for enabling any of the pieces of RMF.

Best Regards,

Sam Knutson, GEICO
Performance and Availability Management
(office)  301.986.3574

"Think big, act bold, start simple, grow fast..."


-Original Message-
Good Morning All. My boss has informed me that we will be getting a license
for RMF. I am OS390 V2R10. Inorder to get it working do I need any software
or is it already there? I know I have to change IFAPRD00 to enabled and
start RMF. Do I need to IPL? Once again thanks all. Bob Pelletier
Connecticut Student Loan Foundation

<>
 
This email/fax message is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and
may contain confidential and privileged information.  Any unauthorized
review, use, disclosure or distribution of this email/fax is prohibited.  If
you are not the intended recipient, please destroy all paper and electronic
copies of the original message. 

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Re: DEL GDG problem

[Wong, Dorothy]

Have you tried 
DEL HLQ1.DATASET.G0805V00 NVR FILE(DDNAME) CAT(mastercatalog)  ??

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of R.S.
Sent: May 16, 2005 8:00 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
Subject: DEL GDG problem

The following scenario:

HLQ1.DATASET.G0805V00

Member of GDG, SMS-managed, extended format PS.
Single volume, but defined with VOL=(,,,4)
Volser SMSXX1
Now the volume is available from another LPAR. The new system has no 
'HLQ1' datasets, the original BCS wasn't imported.
The original system is shut down.


I want to delete the dataset, just to clean up the volume.

How can I do it ?

I tried
DEL HLQ1.DATASET.G0805V00 NVR FILE(DDNAME)
and several other, no success.

Of course I can use ICKDSF...

-- 
Radoslaw Skorupka
Lodz, Poland

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Ray Mullins]

Or shooting rubber bands and paper clips into the acoustic ceiling. 

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
Of Steve Arnett
Sent: Monday May 16 2005 08:36
To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

Hey, you left out 80 column card paper planes and shooting rubber bands into
the overhead florescent light frames.

Porowski, Ken wrote:

>Get a mess of beads and string and see who can string up 1K of core the
fastest?
>
>Tug of war with 100' Grey Bus&Tag?
>
>Write Protect ring toss?
>
>Put the fun back in computing!
>

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Re: RMF Usage

[Knutson, Sam]

Robert,

The Redbook Effective zSeries Performance Monitoring using RMF

http://www.redbooks.ibm.com/abstracts/sg246645.html?Open 

is a great introduction to RMF and it's many facilities.  RMF is like Eve
without Prozac.  There are several distinct on-line and batch facilities all
collectively called RMF.  The Redbook is an excellent alternative to the
traditional RMF manuals which you should have handy.  It covers setup and
use of RMF.

Consider that some RMF options like CACHE can cause the RMF started task to
be a much larger CPU consumer and especially if you are a small shop this
may be an issue.  

An IPL should not be required for enabling any of the pieces of RMF.

Best Regards,

Sam Knutson, GEICO
Performance and Availability Management
(office)  301.986.3574

"Think big, act bold, start simple, grow fast..."


-Original Message-
Good Morning All. My boss has informed me that we will be getting a license
for RMF. I am OS390 V2R10. Inorder to get it working do I need any software
or is it already there? I know I have to change IFAPRD00 to enabled and
start RMF. Do I need to IPL? Once again thanks all. Bob Pelletier
Connecticut Student Loan Foundation

<>
 
This email/fax message is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s) and
may contain confidential and privileged information.  Any unauthorized
review, use, disclosure or distribution of this email/fax is prohibited.  If
you are not the intended recipient, please destroy all paper and electronic
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Re: RMF Usage

[Mark Zelden]

On Mon, 16 May 2005 12:08:22 EDT, Ed Finnell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
>No IPL.

Perhaps not, but if he may want/need a dynamic LPA update for the
modules in hlq.SERBLPA and LNKLST/APF updates for hlq.SERBLINK.

Mark
--
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mailto: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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Mark's MVS Utilities: http://home.flash.net/~mzelden/mvsutil.html

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Re: 80 byte jcl record limit

[Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)]

In <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
on 05/16/2005
   at 08:12 AM, "Craddock, Chris" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:

>This is one of those areas where ISPF's archaic limitations show
>through. It's wonderful for editing row/column oriented data with
>less than (say) 80 bytes per line. It sucks for  long(er) lines and
>more fluid data content.

All software sucks. The editors popular on the PC can't handle some
things that ISPF and XEDIT do well. Further, 80 columns has been
obsolete in the ISPF world for decades.
 
-- 
 Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT
 ISO position; see  
We don't care. We don't have to care, we're Congress.
(S877: The Shut up and Eat Your spam act of 2003)

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Re: FTPing a ADRDSSU file

[Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)]

In <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, on 05/15/2005
   at 10:05 PM, Bruce Black <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:

>Another aspect of reading RECFM=U data is that you can't chain the
>reads  together. 

Not for tape, but you can for DASD.
 
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Re: 80 byte jcl record limit

[Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)]

In <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, on 05/15/2005
   at 10:13 PM, Paul Gilmartin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:

>The JCL RM does not say a nonblank in a continuation column is
>required.

Correct answer to the wrong question, because it doesn't say that
continuation is required. It does, however, tell you how to do
continuation, and one of the ways that it tells you involves a
nonblank in the continuation column.
 
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Re: 80 byte jcl record limit

[Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)]

In <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, on 05/15/2005
   at 09:55 PM, Paul Gilmartin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:

>What's a "sequence number"? 

Standard TSO rules.

>What if the "sequence numbers" are on the left? 

That's standard for RECFM=VB.
 
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Re: 80 byte jcl record limit

[Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.)]

In <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, on 05/15/2005
   at 09:24 AM, Paul Gilmartin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:

>What, in particular, is the difficulty? 

He's probably alluding to the fact that CLIST provides stack controls
that REXX doesn't.
 
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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Gray, Larry - Larry A]

I always thought of MCP as a restrictive front-end to RACF or a bad WLM
policy.  When it abended, you either got to the correct RACF rules or it
reverted to the good WLM policy or possible pre goal mode days. 

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Jay Maynard
Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 11:42 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds


On Mon, May 16, 2005 at 10:32:02AM -0500, Compton, John wrote:
> I still think the way "MCP" was depicted in "Tron" is the best simile.
> A big stern 'something' whirling round and round letting (or making)
things
> happen as it sees fit.

Uhm, but why didn't the ENCOM mainframe enter a disabled wait state when
Tron ABENDed it?

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Bob Halpern]

Contact Steve Hackenberg (I think he is now with IBM) from Candle. He
made a video for a jury about multi-tasking operating systems using a
chef for a model. He might be able to provide you with a copy. 

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Richard Heritage
Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 7:37 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
Subject: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

This is more of a Friday question, but I got busy Friday and didn't have
time to post.  At my son's school, they are having parents come in and
talk to the class about their jobs.  It's heartwarming that my son is
proud of me and wants me to come in and speak, but I'm at somewhat
nervous about trying to make what I do interesting or even intelligible
to second graders.  Somehow I don't think that HiperSockets will be as
exciting to them as they were to me when I first heard about them.

I have some ideas, but I'm hoping that some of you have been through
this before and have some tips on things that worked (or didn't work!)
for you.  How do you explain such a technical occupation to young
children?  What props or visual aids would you use to illustrate work
that mostly goes on inside either our brains or our computers?  Any
ideas you have will be appreciated.



Richard Heritage
Lead Systems Software Engineer
IT @ Johns Hopkins

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Re: RMF Usage

[Ed Finnell]

 
In a message dated 5/16/2005 10:25:50 A.M. Central Standard Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

am OS390  V2R10. Inorder to get it working do I need any software or is it 
already  there? I know I have to change IFAPRD00 to enabled and start RMF. Do I 
need to  IPL? Once again thanks all.



>>
No IPL. Might need to do some security work especially for RMFGAT.
Most of the samples will suffice for data collection. If they're true  PHB's 
they'll probably want to see output from RMFPP.
Available at
 
 
_http://www-1.ibm.com/servers/eserver/zseries/zos/rmf/rmfhtmls/rmftools.htm#spr_win_
 
(http://www-1.ibm.com/servers/eserver/zseries/zos/rmf/rmfhtmls/rmftools.htm#spr_win)
 
 

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Jim Liebert]

Richard,

I think Lock brought up some very good points.  Here's what I would add:

1. Don't underestimate your audience!  I've spoken in front of second
grade classes and ... wow! ... these kids are savvy!

2. Kids respond well to visuals and handouts.  I think passing around a
motherboard would go over pretty slick.   Or even a dump ... it will look
like Matrix!

3. Try to stick with examples they know.  ATM machines is a good example.
Try to get them to think what happens behind the covers - a Wizard of Oz
type thing.

4. Always reward someone who asks a question ("Excellent question") -
pretty soon the whole class will get into it.  It's pretty exciting
actually ... especially if you're used to presenting in front a sleepy
application programmers!

5. Have fun!!   Break a leg!!

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Lock Lyon]

Richard,

Here are some thoughts, based on my experiences presenting technical 
concepts in G1-G6. YMMV!

How you present depends somewhat on your goals and your audience: Are you 
trying to inform and/or entertain the children?  What kind of presentation 
media will be available (black/white board, overhead projector, 
PowerPoint)? Will faculty and staff or other parents be present?  How will 
you judge 'success' ?

Me, I go for entertainment of the primary audience, the children.  At that 
age they are very visual-oriented, but not very conceptual.  'Programmer' 
they understand (they think).  'System' may be incomprehensible. 
'Mainframe' may be misleading.  I opt for bright colored visuals with 
simple pictorial messages (think "PC" + "Bank" + "$$$" level). 
Keep sentences short, ask them several questions that require a show of 
hands ("How many of you have a computer at home"?). Move your gaze around 
a lot, look at everyone.

Explain things in terms of visual analogies that the children can 
understand. ("Auto -- Mechanic" ;  "PC -- Technician"; "Business Computer 
-- Systems Programmer"). 

I *never* attempt to sell the idea of jobs or careers at this level. By 
the time my audiences enter the workforce the technical landscape will 
have changed too much.  I also never spend any time on technical topics 
(no examples of Cobol / C / java, no pics of PC innards, no diagrams with 
boxes labelled "CPU", "peripherals", "internet".) I lose the audience 
whenever I do.

What seems to grab them most (i.e., fewer fall asleep) is being able to 
understand the link between what I do and what it causes to happen. "I 
type the right stuff on the keyboard and the computer runs faster" is 
incredibly inaccurate -- but they understand the basic message!  And 
that's all I ever cared about.

How do I measure success? By how many questions I get! This was the most 
frightening part for me; being prepared to give a simple answer to almost 
any question.

HTH.  Good luck!

Lock Lyon
Compuware Corp



This is more of a Friday question, but I got busy Friday and didn't have
time to post.  At my son's school, they are having parents come in and
talk to the class about their jobs.  It's heartwarming that my son is
proud of me and wants me to come in and speak, but I'm at somewhat
nervous about trying to make what I do interesting or even intelligible
to second graders.  Somehow I don't think that HiperSockets will be as
exciting to them as they were to me when I first heard about them.

I have some ideas, but I'm hoping that some of you have been through
this before and have some tips on things that worked (or didn't work!)
for you.  How do you explain such a technical occupation to young
children?  What props or visual aids would you use to illustrate work
that mostly goes on inside either our brains or our computers?  Any
ideas you have will be appreciated.



Richard Heritage
Lead Systems Software Engineer
IT @ Johns Hopkins



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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Hall, Ken (IDS DCS PE)]

I always envisioned the MCP more analogous to SRM than to the OS as a whole.

Probably running in "Ultimate Goal" mode.

> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Behalf Of Jay Maynard
> Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 11:42 AM
> To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
> Subject: Re: [IBM-MAIN] Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds
> 
> 
> On Mon, May 16, 2005 at 10:32:02AM -0500, Compton, John wrote:
> > I still think the way "MCP" was depicted in "Tron" is the 
> best simile.
> > A big stern 'something' whirling round and round letting 
> (or making) things
> > happen as it sees fit.
> 
> Uhm, but why didn't the ENCOM mainframe enter a disabled wait 
> state when
> Tron ABENDed it?
> 
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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Jay Maynard]

On Mon, May 16, 2005 at 10:32:02AM -0500, Compton, John wrote:
> I still think the way "MCP" was depicted in "Tron" is the best simile.
> A big stern 'something' whirling round and round letting (or making) things
> happen as it sees fit.

Uhm, but why didn't the ENCOM mainframe enter a disabled wait state when
Tron ABENDed it?

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Re: DEL GDG problem

[Steve Arnett]

Have you tried:  DELETE / NONVSAM?  Seems like that has always worked 
whether the catalogue was available or not for SMS managed...

R.S. wrote:
Mark Zelden wrote:
On Mon, 16 May 2005 14:00:16 +0200, R.S. 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:


The following scenario:
HLQ1.DATASET.G0805V00
Member of GDG, SMS-managed, extended format PS.
Single volume, but defined with VOL=(,,,4)
Volser SMSXX1
Now the volume is available from another LPAR. The new system has no
'HLQ1' datasets, the original BCS wasn't imported.
The original system is shut down.
I want to delete the dataset, just to clean up the volume.
How can I do it ?
I tried
DEL HLQ1.DATASET.G0805V00 NVR FILE(DDNAME)
and several other, no success.
Of course I can use ICKDSF...

Did you try and delete it using ISMF?   I'm not sure that would work
any better than delete NVR though.

IMHO it works exactly the same. It fails with same messages. 

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Steve Arnett]

Hey, you left out 80 column card paper planes and shooting rubber bands 
into the overhead florescent light frames.

Porowski, Ken wrote:
Get a mess of beads and string and see who can string up 1K of core the fastest?
Tug of war with 100' Grey Bus&Tag?
Write Protect ring toss?
Put the fun back in computing!
-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Ed Finnell
Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 10:41 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: [IBM-MAIN] Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

In a message dated 5/16/2005 9:37:23 A.M. Central Standard Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

What  props or visual aids would you use to illustrate work
that mostly goes on  inside either our brains or our computers?  Any
ideas you have will be  appreciated.

 

Tell them you are friends with the Thing  King? 

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Richard Pinion]

I gave up a looong time ago trying to explain what a system programmer 
does.  I just say I'm a programmer.  

>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] 05/16/05 11:33AM >>>
Not that this will work for 8 year olds, but, when explaining what a 
systems programmer does, I have always said that we maintain the 
software that allow programmers to do their jobs.

Richard Heritage wrote:

>This is more of a Friday question, but I got busy Friday and didn't have
>time to post.  At my son's school, they are having parents come in and
>talk to the class about their jobs.  It's heartwarming that my son is
>proud of me and wants me to come in and speak, but I'm at somewhat
>nervous about trying to make what I do interesting or even intelligible
>to second graders.  Somehow I don't think that HiperSockets will be as
>exciting to them as they were to me when I first heard about them.
>
>I have some ideas, but I'm hoping that some of you have been through
>this before and have some tips on things that worked (or didn't work!)
>for you.  How do you explain such a technical occupation to young
>children?  What props or visual aids would you use to illustrate work
>that mostly goes on inside either our brains or our computers?  Any
>ideas you have will be appreciated.
>
>
>
>Richard Heritage
>Lead Systems Software Engineer
>IT @ Johns Hopkins
>
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>
>  
>

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Steve Arnett]

Not that this will work for 8 year olds, but, when explaining what a 
systems programmer does, I have always said that we maintain the 
software that allow programmers to do their jobs.

Richard Heritage wrote:
This is more of a Friday question, but I got busy Friday and didn't have
time to post.  At my son's school, they are having parents come in and
talk to the class about their jobs.  It's heartwarming that my son is
proud of me and wants me to come in and speak, but I'm at somewhat
nervous about trying to make what I do interesting or even intelligible
to second graders.  Somehow I don't think that HiperSockets will be as
exciting to them as they were to me when I first heard about them.
I have some ideas, but I'm hoping that some of you have been through
this before and have some tips on things that worked (or didn't work!)
for you.  How do you explain such a technical occupation to young
children?  What props or visual aids would you use to illustrate work
that mostly goes on inside either our brains or our computers?  Any
ideas you have will be appreciated.

Richard Heritage
Lead Systems Software Engineer
IT @ Johns Hopkins
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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Compton, John]

I still think the way "MCP" was depicted in "Tron" is the best simile.
A big stern 'something' whirling round and round letting (or making) things
happen as it sees fit.



-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
Of Chase, John
Sent: 16 May 2005 16:25
To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Leon Schwering
> 
> Isn't just the same as explaining it to the executive team?  
> You have to know your audience and explain it to them in 
> terms they understand.  The network guys(& gals) have used 
> road networks, and the mail system to explain their ideas.  
> For our scout troop we used a simple logic gate made from 
> wiring and light bulbs from Radio Shack.  Yes we also 
> compared it to the computers they use (wintel stuff).

How about something like a visual depicting a team of octopi "serving"
burgers, fries, sundaes, sodas, etc.?

-jc-

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Porowski, Ken]

Get a mess of beads and string and see who can string up 1K of core the fastest?

Tug of war with 100' Grey Bus&Tag?

Write Protect ring toss?

Put the fun back in computing!

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Ed Finnell
Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 10:41 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: [IBM-MAIN] Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds


 
In a message dated 5/16/2005 9:37:23 A.M. Central Standard Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

What  props or visual aids would you use to illustrate work
that mostly goes on  inside either our brains or our computers?  Any
ideas you have will be  appreciated.



>>
Tell them you are friends with the Thing  King? 

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Chase, John]

> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Leon Schwering
> 
> Isn't just the same as explaining it to the executive team?  
> You have to know your audience and explain it to them in 
> terms they understand.  The network guys(& gals) have used 
> road networks, and the mail system to explain their ideas.  
> For our scout troop we used a simple logic gate made from 
> wiring and light bulbs from Radio Shack.  Yes we also 
> compared it to the computers they use (wintel stuff).

How about something like a visual depicting a team of octopi "serving"
burgers, fries, sundaes, sodas, etc.?

-jc-

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RMF Usage

[Robert Pelletier]

Good Morning All. My boss has informed me that we will be getting a license for 
RMF. I am OS390 V2R10. Inorder to get it working do I need any software or is 
it already there? I know I have to change IFAPRD00 to enabled and start RMF. Do 
I need to IPL? Once again thanks all.
Bob Pelletier
Connecticut Student Loan Foundation

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Porowski, Ken]

How about 'Future Mainframer' ?

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of EA MacNEIL
Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 11:18 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: [IBM-MAIN] Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds


I know I'd be "piss'd" if somebody gave my 8-year old a T-Shirt with that word 
on it!

>>>Get them all the T-Rex 'Mainframes: we're back and we're pissed' t-Shirts



Ted MacNEIL
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


-
Post your free ad now! Yahoo! Canada Personals

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Leon Schwering]

Isn't just the same as explaining it to the executive team?  You have to know 
your audience and explain it to them in terms they understand.  The network 
guys(& gals) have used road networks, and the mail system to explain their 
ideas.  For our scout troop we used a simple logic gate made from wiring and 
light bulbs from Radio Shack.  Yes we also compared it to the computers they 
use (wintel stuff).

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[EA MacNEIL]

I know I'd be "piss'd" if somebody gave my 8-year old a T-Shirt with that word 
on it!

>>>Get them all the T-Rex 'Mainframes: we're back and we're pissed' t-Shirts



Ted MacNEIL
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


-
Post your free ad now! Yahoo! Canada Personals

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Re: DEL GDG problem

[Imbriale, Donald (Exchange)]

If HLQ1 data sets are in a user catalog accessible to the system, IMPORT
CONNECT that user catalog, then define alias HLQ1 related to the user
catalog, then delete the GDS, delete the alias and EXPORT DISCONNECT the
user catalog.

Don Imbriale


>-Original Message-
>From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf
>Of R.S.
>Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 8:00 AM
>To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
>Subject: DEL GDG problem
>
>The following scenario:
>
>HLQ1.DATASET.G0805V00
>
>Member of GDG, SMS-managed, extended format PS.
>Single volume, but defined with VOL=(,,,4)
>Volser SMSXX1
>Now the volume is available from another LPAR. The new system has no
>'HLQ1' datasets, the original BCS wasn't imported.
>The original system is shut down.
>
>
>I want to delete the dataset, just to clean up the volume.
>
>How can I do it ?
>
>I tried
>DEL HLQ1.DATASET.G0805V00 NVR FILE(DDNAME)
>and several other, no success.
>
>Of course I can use ICKDSF...
>
>--


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account or account activity contained in this communication.
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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Porowski, Ken]

Before there was Xbox, 
Before there was GameBoy,
Before there was Playstation,
Before there were PC's,
Before there were calculators,
There were Mainframes.
And the world ran on them.
Some say they are dinosaurs.
But these dinosaurs still exist.
And they are growing bigger every year!

Get them all the T-Rex 'Mainframes: we're back and we're pissed' t-Shirts
  

-Original Message-
From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Ed Finnell
Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 10:41 AM
To: IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
Subject: Re: [IBM-MAIN] Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds


 
In a message dated 5/16/2005 9:37:23 A.M. Central Standard Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

What  props or visual aids would you use to illustrate work
that mostly goes on  inside either our brains or our computers?  Any
ideas you have will be  appreciated.



>>
Tell them you are friends with the Thing  King? 

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Re: Suppressing IPCS BLS18100I in REXX Execs

[Todd Burch]

Thanks Sam.   I did look in the manuals, but did not search the archives.
Thanks for the friendly reminder.   Looks like that will fix me up, and
thanks for the heads up for inhouse stuff too.

Todd

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Ball, Warren [IT]]

Somehow I don't think that HiperSockets will be as
exciting to them as they were to me when I first heard about them.

Kids are excited by big words like "hipersockets".

How do you explain such a technical occupation to young
children?  What props or visual aids would you use to illustrate work
that mostly goes on inside either our brains or our computers?  

What works with my 8-year old son is tying together the computing
ideas that make his Playstation II play his video games.  It also 
helped me my showing him things on the PC, as he loves playing
games on websites such as cartoonetwork.com

I dont think trying to explain mainframe stuff would work.

Richard Heritage

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Re: Suppressing IPCS BLS18100I in REXX Execs

[Knutson, Sam]

http://bama.ua.edu/cgi-bin/wa?A2=ind0307&L=ibm-main&P=R11254&I=1

I remember the answer since I asked the question but in general the IBM-MAIN
archives a treasure trove that should be visited along with the IBM
documentation when researching a question.

http://bama.ua.edu/archives/ibm-main.html

Best Regards,

Sam Knutson, GEICO
Performance and Availability Management
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
(office)  301.986.3574

A pilot who doesn't have any fear probably isn't flying his plane to its
maximum. - Jon McBride, astronaut 

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Re: Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Ed Finnell]

 
In a message dated 5/16/2005 9:37:23 A.M. Central Standard Time,  
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

What  props or visual aids would you use to illustrate work
that mostly goes on  inside either our brains or our computers?  Any
ideas you have will be  appreciated.



>>
Tell them you are friends with the Thing  King? 

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Re: SMP/e Apply failure, SMPTLIB question

[Paul Gilmartin]

In a recent note, Kurt Quackenbush said:

> Date: Mon, 16 May 2005 10:17:14 -0400
> 
> The GIM65903I message explains why the SMPTLIB data set is needed, and
> 
M&C makes this splendidly clear.  The only possible omission is that
the Commands manual mentions SMPPTS, but not SMPTLIB.  Perhaps a
minor RCF is in order.  (Or is the SMPTLIB a logical extension of the
SMPPTS?)

> that is to find module IWMC3AEI required to build load module IWMI2PVT.
>   Apparently that module is not supplied by the PTF (which is perfectly
> reasonable) and you didn't ACCEPT JBB7717 so SMP/E can't find the module
> in the distribution library which is typically where it will be found.
> If SMP/E can't find a usable copy of the module in the dlib, then SMP/E
> will search for the correct copy of the module in the SMPPTS and SMPTLIB
> 
And here, M&C says:

   Programmer Response: Correct the allocation error described in
   previous messages and rerun the job.

Hmmm.  Easier said than done.  If the error allocating the SMPTLIB
is persistent, I suspect ACCEPT won't work either.  I'd proceed by
deleting JBB7717 from the SMPPTS and re-RECEIVEing it.

-- gil
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Systems Programming for 8 Year-olds

[Richard Heritage]

This is more of a Friday question, but I got busy Friday and didn't have
time to post.  At my son's school, they are having parents come in and
talk to the class about their jobs.  It's heartwarming that my son is
proud of me and wants me to come in and speak, but I'm at somewhat
nervous about trying to make what I do interesting or even intelligible
to second graders.  Somehow I don't think that HiperSockets will be as
exciting to them as they were to me when I first heard about them.

I have some ideas, but I'm hoping that some of you have been through
this before and have some tips on things that worked (or didn't work!)
for you.  How do you explain such a technical occupation to young
children?  What props or visual aids would you use to illustrate work
that mostly goes on inside either our brains or our computers?  Any
ideas you have will be appreciated.



Richard Heritage
Lead Systems Software Engineer
IT @ Johns Hopkins

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Re: 80 byte ISPF record limit (was: 80 byte jcl ... )

[Chase, John]

> -Original Message-
> From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List On Behalf Of Paul Gilmartin
> 
> In a recent note, Ball, Warren [IT] said:
> 
> > Date: Mon, 16 May 2005 09:41:07 -0400
> > 
> > How does one get more than 80 columns showing on one's 
> terminal?  Can 
> > it be done through ISPF?
> > 
> Depends on the terminal.  If you have a real model 2 or 4, 
> you're SOL (except on those occasions when "the network is 
> down", and you continue smugly working while your colleagues 
> complain).
> 
> If you have a model 5, or an emulator which supports that, or 
> supports programmable screen geometry, ISPF will exploit 
> whatever it sees.
> (Shmuel says up to 160 characters; I haven't tested to that 
> boundary.) There may be some issue of getting your sysadmins 
> to define a LOGMODE to handle unconventional screen 
> geometries; at least I had that experience.

Use the IBM-supplied logmode D4C32XX3 (or D4A32XX3; only difference is in
the RUSIZEs).  Ensure that your terminal / emulator supports the 3270 QUERY
Structured Field (I can't think of any nowadays that don't).

-jc-

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Re: DEL GDG problem

[Avelino Ferreira]

Try using DELETE command from ISMF panels. It works most time for me!


Avelino Ferreira 
 
RTP MVS Support for AUSSY1, CARMVS1, RALMVSC and RALMVSG
ADI -  Americas Delivery Integration
IBM Global Services - Service Delivery Center Brazil
 [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tieline 6839-8515   Outside 55 19 3887-8515




"R.S." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
Sent by: IBM Mainframe Discussion List 
05/16/2005 08:00 AM
Please respond to
IBM Mainframe Discussion List


To
IBM-MAIN@BAMA.UA.EDU
cc

Subject
DEL GDG problem






The following scenario:

HLQ1.DATASET.G0805V00

Member of GDG, SMS-managed, extended format PS.
Single volume, but defined with VOL=(,,,4)
Volser SMSXX1
Now the volume is available from another LPAR. The new system has no
'HLQ1' datasets, the original BCS wasn't imported.
The original system is shut down.


I want to delete the dataset, just to clean up the volume.

How can I do it ?

I tried
DEL HLQ1.DATASET.G0805V00 NVR FILE(DDNAME)
and several other, no success.

Of course I can use ICKDSF...

--
Radoslaw Skorupka
Lodz, Poland

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Re: DEL GDG problem

[R.S.]

Mark Zelden wrote:
On Mon, 16 May 2005 14:00:16 +0200, R.S. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:

The following scenario:
HLQ1.DATASET.G0805V00
Member of GDG, SMS-managed, extended format PS.
Single volume, but defined with VOL=(,,,4)
Volser SMSXX1
Now the volume is available from another LPAR. The new system has no
'HLQ1' datasets, the original BCS wasn't imported.
The original system is shut down.
I want to delete the dataset, just to clean up the volume.
How can I do it ?
I tried
DEL HLQ1.DATASET.G0805V00 NVR FILE(DDNAME)
and several other, no success.
Of course I can use ICKDSF...

Did you try and delete it using ISMF?   I'm not sure that would work
any better than delete NVR though.
IMHO it works exactly the same. It fails with same messages. 
--
Radoslaw Skorupka
Lodz, Poland
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Re: SMP/e Apply failure, SMPTLIB question

[Kurt Quackenbush]

GIM35307E ** SMPTLIB SMPE.JBB7717.F3 FOR JBB7717 WAS NOT ALLOCATED TO
SMP00038 BECAUSE THE DATA SET WAS NOT FOUND.
 GIM54701E ** ALLOCATION FAILED FOR SMP00038 - IKJ56232I DATA SET
SMPE.JBB7717.F3 NOT ON VOLUME AS INDICATED IN THE
  CATALOG OR VOL PARAMETER.
GIM65903IMODULE IWMC3AEI IS NEEDED TO BUILD THE FOLLOWING LOAD MODULES
FOR SYSMOD UA11933 BUT THE SMPTLIB DATA SET COULD NOT BE ALLOCATED.
GIM65905I- LOAD MODULE IWMI2PVT.
No SMPTLIB datasets were allocated at the time of the receive of the PTFS.
When I looked in the MCS for the PTF UA11933, I saw that there was a
++DELETE for LMOD IWMI2PVT and then JCL to rebuild the module from the DLIBs
which makes sense.
My question is why is SMPE expecting modules to be coming in from the
SMPTLIBs? I looked to see if there were RELFILES associated with this PTF
but there was no indication that there were.
The GIM65903I message explains why the SMPTLIB data set is needed, and 
that is to find module IWMC3AEI required to build load module IWMI2PVT. 
 Apparently that module is not supplied by the PTF (which is perfectly 
reasonable) and you didn't ACCEPT JBB7717 so SMP/E can't find the module 
in the distribution library which is typically where it will be found. 
If SMP/E can't find a usable copy of the module in the dlib, then SMP/E 
will search for the correct copy of the module in the SMPPTS and SMPTLIB 
data sets (exactly as Paul GilMartin supposed).

Kurt Quackenbush -- IBM, SMP/E Development
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Re: 80 byte ISPF record limit (was: 80 byte jcl ... )

[Dave Salt]

From: "Ball, Warren [IT]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
How does one get more than 80 columns showing on one's terminal?  Can it be 
done through ISPF?
>
Mod 5 gives a display that's 27 lines deep by 132 columns wide. 
Alternatively, mainframe files can be edited using any PC text editor. For 
example, put "E" next to a member in a member list and it opens and displays 
using Notepad or Wordpad or any other text editor of your choice.

Dave Salt
SimpList(tm) - The easiest, most powerful way to surf a mainframe!
http://www.mackinney.com/products/SIM/simplist.htm
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Re: DEL GDG problem

[Mark Zelden]

On Mon, 16 May 2005 14:00:16 +0200, R.S. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:

>The following scenario:
>
>HLQ1.DATASET.G0805V00
>
>Member of GDG, SMS-managed, extended format PS.
>Single volume, but defined with VOL=(,,,4)
>Volser SMSXX1
>Now the volume is available from another LPAR. The new system has no
>'HLQ1' datasets, the original BCS wasn't imported.
>The original system is shut down.
>
>
>I want to delete the dataset, just to clean up the volume.
>
>How can I do it ?
>
>I tried
>DEL HLQ1.DATASET.G0805V00 NVR FILE(DDNAME)
>and several other, no success.
>
>Of course I can use ICKDSF...
>

Did you try and delete it using ISMF?   I'm not sure that would work
any better than delete NVR though.

Mark
--
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Sr. Software and Systems Architect
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Mark's MVS Utilities: http://home.flash.net/~mzelden/mvsutil.html

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Re: 80 byte ISPF record limit (was: 80 byte jcl ... )

[Paul Gilmartin]

In a recent note, Ball, Warren [IT] said:

> Date: Mon, 16 May 2005 09:41:07 -0400
> 
> How does one get more than 80 columns showing on one's terminal?  Can it be 
> done
> through ISPF?
> 
Depends on the terminal.  If you have a real model 2 or 4, you're SOL
(except on those occasions when "the network is down", and you
continue smugly working while your colleagues complain).

If you have a model 5, or an emulator which supports that, or supports
programmable screen geometry, ISPF will exploit whatever it sees.
(Shmuel says up to 160 characters; I haven't tested to that boundary.)
There may be some issue of getting your sysadmins to define a LOGMODE
to handle unconventional screen geometries; at least I had that
experience.

Again, XEDIT good; ISPF bad.  If I disconnect from an XEDIT session,
then reconnect with a different screen geometry, XEDIT immediately
refreshes the display in the new geometry.  ISPF in like circumstances
is apt to fall into an endless sequence of TERMINAL I/O ERROR, and
unless I can disconnect and reconnect with the original geometry,
my session must be cancelled by operator command.

The deficiency is in ISPF: from TSO READY prompt, reconnection with
different screen geometry is handled effectively.

-- gil
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Re: 80 byte ISPF record limit (was: 80 byte jcl ... )

[Ball, Warren [IT]]

How does one get more than 80 columns showing on one's terminal?  Can it be 
done through ISPF?  
>
> 
I agree strongly.  Although Shmuel points out terminals nowadays
are not limited to 80 columns, there's always a residual use for
lines wider than any particular terminal.

-- gil

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80 byte ISPF record limit (was: 80 byte jcl ... )

[Paul Gilmartin]

In a recent note, Craddock, Chris said:

> Date: Mon, 16 May 2005 08:12:56 -0500
> 
> That's why most of the "other platforms" editors are more
> context sensitive. Re-flowing lines -can- be completely
> automatic in a moderately intelligent editor designed for
> the language you're using. Same goes for syntax colorization,
> auto-completion etc. etc.
> 
Assembler presents quite a challenge, here.  It's painfully
hard to tell what's an apostrophe-delimited string vs.
what's an attribute introduced by a single apostrophe, etc.

> This is one of those areas where ISPF's archaic limitations
> show through. It's wonderful for editing row/column oriented
> data with less than (say) 80 bytes per line. It sucks for
> long(er) lines and more fluid data content. We've all used it
> for so long, and in essentially the same way, so it has been
> easy to overlook how cumbersome it is for editing >80 byte
> lines.
> 
Consider even XEDIT, which (optionally) allows displaying a long
file line in multiple screen lines, formatted as a single 3270
field for easy insertion and deletion.  IIRC, in ISPF, in contrast,
if I delete a single character from a partially visible line
compensates (in its view) by introducing a blank at the right
edge of the screen, rather than ignoring the null echoed by the
READ MODIFIED.

Has there ever been a Requirement for an ISPF mode in which
long lines would be displayed wrapped on the screen, rather
than by horizontal scrolling?

> Yep! It is a royal PITA. And a no-brainer in a more flexible
> editor :O(
> 
I agree strongly.  Although Shmuel points out terminals nowadays
are not limited to 80 columns, there's always a residual use for
lines wider than any particular terminal.

-- gil
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Re: 80 byte jcl record limit

[Craddock, Chris]

David Low said;
> 
> > Hmm... I would hate to have to scroll 32K to the right... I 
> definitely
> > prefer 72 columns in 400+ lines to 32k columns in 1 line
> > - --
> 
> I agree, it is nice to have all the data accessible such that 
> only vertical scrolling is required.  But what if you coded 
> one of those lines wrong and had to shift data by one byte?  
> Have fun re-wrapping all the subsequent lines.

That's why most of the "other platforms" editors are more
context sensitive. Re-flowing lines -can- be completely 
automatic in a moderately intelligent editor designed for
the language you're using. Same goes for syntax colorization,
auto-completion etc. etc. 

This is one of those areas where ISPF's archaic limitations
show through. It's wonderful for editing row/column oriented
data with less than (say) 80 bytes per line. It sucks for 
long(er) lines and more fluid data content. We've all used it
for so long, and in essentially the same way, so it has been
easy to overlook how cumbersome it is for editing >80 byte 
lines.

> Many HFS paths are much longer than 80 bytes.  I've mistyped 
> HFS paths more than a few times to know that it's a tedious 
> process having to cut/paste/shift lines around to correct 
> them.  A one-liner to fix would be a quick BNDS command and a 
> shift left or right.

Yep! It is a royal PITA. And a no-brainer in a more flexible
editor :O(

CC

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Re: 80 byte jcl record limit

[Joe Zitzelberger]

On May 16, 2005, at 8:54 AM, Low, David wrote:
Hmm... I would hate to have to scroll 32K to the right... I definitely
prefer 72 columns in 400+ lines to 32k columns in 1 line
- --
I agree, it is nice to have all the data accessible such that only 
vertical scrolling is required.  But what if you coded one of those 
lines wrong and had to shift data by one byte?  Have fun re-wrapping 
all the subsequent lines.
This just shows how decrepit and obsolete the ISPF/TSO approach to user 
interaction has become.  While IBM still ships software that is 
'punch-card-focused', every other platform in the computing world and 
their text editors can automagically shift that data easily.

Why are we still computing like we did in the 1970s?
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Q: How many Marxist revolutionaries does it take to change a 
proletarian lightbulb?

A: None.  A proletarian lightbulb contains the seeds of its own 
revolution.

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Re: 80 byte jcl record limit

[Low, David]

> Hmm... I would hate to have to scroll 32K to the right... I definitely
> prefer 72 columns in 400+ lines to 32k columns in 1 line
> - --

I agree, it is nice to have all the data accessible such that only vertical 
scrolling is required.  But what if you coded one of those lines wrong and had 
to shift data by one byte?  Have fun re-wrapping all the subsequent lines.

Many HFS paths are much longer than 80 bytes.  I've mistyped HFS paths more 
than a few times to know that it's a tedious process having to cut/paste/shift 
lines around to correct them.  A one-liner to fix would be a quick BNDS command 
and a shift left or right.

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Re: Rexx execs and telnet sessions

[andrew mcintyre]

> I'm trying to automate heartbeat to one of our SMTP-servers.

NetView for z/OS's AON feature is what you want. Check this statement out (the
first example is what you've asked for):
http://publibz.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr_OS390/BOOKS/ENVG1000/3.27?SHELF
=ENV1BK00&DT=2002024241

Various alert possibilities exist when there's a problem:
1 - NetView DDF 3270 panels - oldie but still works great
2 - SNMP traps to any SNMP manager such as the Tivoli Universal Agent feeding
the alerts to the OMEGAMON GUI console (I personally like this one)
3 - TEC events to your TEC console
4 - probably more I can't think of right now


Andrew McIntyre - Senior I/T Specialist - certified
zSeries Software Technical Sales
SMPO (Software Migration Project Office)
TMT (Tivoli Migration Team)
404-487-2477 or tie 546-2477
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

SMPO
 http://www.ibm.com/software/solutions/softwaremigration
NetView for z/OS
 http://www.ibm.com/tivoli/products/netview-zos/resources/nv390-update.html
System Automation for z/OS
 http://www.s390.ibm.com/sa


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Re: 80-byte JCL record limit

[john gilmore]

Paul Gilmartin writes:
The JCL RM does not say a nonblank in a continuation column is required.
Once upon a time---Before Paul was born?---JCL statements were written as 
HLASM source statements are still written (in the absence of an ICTL 
assembler statement).  In an  80-byte card image column 72 was the 
continuartion column.  If it contained a non-blank, a statement was 
continued on the next card image.  If not, not.

This statement-continuation scheme is no longer the only one supported, but 
it itself is still in fact supported.

Except in COBOL, sequence numbers historically appeared in columns 73-80 
inclusive; and they had legitimate uses while physical punched cards were 
still in use.

Ignorance of this history is understandable; self-righteous 
self-congratulation abourt such ignorance is less so.

John Gilmore
Ashland, MA 01721
U.S.A.
_
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today - it's FREE! 
http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

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Rexx execs and telnet sessions

[Mikael Wargh]

Hello you all almighty mainframers,
I'm trying to automate heartbeat to one of our SMTP-servers. ICMP echo is
not allowed. One good possibility would be a testing telnet session to that
SMTP-server. However it seems to be a kind of tricky or impossible to use
telnet from rexx execs. Is there any simple way to solve this problem or is
the rexx tcp/ip socket programming the only way?

Kind Regards,
Mikael Wargh

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DEL GDG problem

[R.S.]

The following scenario:
HLQ1.DATASET.G0805V00
Member of GDG, SMS-managed, extended format PS.
Single volume, but defined with VOL=(,,,4)
Volser SMSXX1
Now the volume is available from another LPAR. The new system has no 
'HLQ1' datasets, the original BCS wasn't imported.
The original system is shut down.

I want to delete the dataset, just to clean up the volume.
How can I do it ?
I tried
DEL HLQ1.DATASET.G0805V00 NVR FILE(DDNAME)
and several other, no success.
Of course I can use ICKDSF...
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Radoslaw Skorupka
Lodz, Poland
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Re: Info on RETRIEVER

[Karthick I]

Charles
Thanks .. but was looking for somthin. more like ... this..

http://www.macro4.com/solutions/products/columbus-dw/index.html


Cheers
Karthick.I

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