[LUTE] Re: vertical dyslexia?
Mmmm, I've suffered from this very same problem since I was about 17 years of age. It's usually caused by excessive rehydration on a Friday night, and often leads to weakness of the left hand, poor syncopation with the right and a sort of blurred vision, as well as the symptoms you mention, the only known partial cure ( not fully ) is to drink say 5 pints instead of 6. Hope this helps N -Original Message- From: Anthony Hind [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 16 May 2007 16:23 To: Lute Net Subject: [LUTE] vertical dyslexia? Dear All Recently, I have noticed that I seem to be beginning to suffer from a sort of vertical dyslexia when reading tablature, even on pieces I have played before. Suddenly, I become conscious of the fact that the notation is the inverse, position-wise, of the actual strings (high bottom-string at the top, etc.). At that moment, I feel slightly dizzy (slight vertigo) and confused (well perhaps that might be my natural state) and I become sort of literal and unable to use it as an automatic trigger for note playing. I have to consciously ask myself which string is being referred to. This seems to occur just after there are successive notations with the same letter, but one on a high string and the other on a low string. For a time, I can't seem to get back into the automatic reading mode. Has anyone else experienced this sort of thing? Regards Anthony To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: vertical dyslexia?
Surely It's not a geographic issue, I live far from you...but it happens the same to me, but it is worse if I'm playing baroque guitar...at a moment I cannot say what kind of tablature I'm reading...neither do I realize which is the upper or lower string in the tab. But it usually happens late at night after a thousand hours at the computer, and very dry and red eyes... My suggested cure is similar to the one already offered...but I'd prefer a Malbec. Laura - Mensaje original - De: Narada [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fecha: Miércoles, Mayo 16, 2007 1:09 pm Asunto: [LUTE] Re: vertical dyslexia? Mmmm, I've suffered from this very same problem since I was about 17 years of age. It's usually caused by excessive rehydration on a Friday night, and often leads to weakness of the left hand, poor syncopation with the right and a sort of blurred vision, as well as the symptoms you mention,the only known partial cure ( not fully ) is to drink say 5 pints instead of 6. Hope this helps N -Original Message- From: Anthony Hind [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 16 May 2007 16:23 To: Lute Net Subject: [LUTE] vertical dyslexia? Dear All Recently, I have noticed that I seem to be beginning to suffer from a sort of vertical dyslexia when reading tablature, even on pieces I have played before. Suddenly, I become conscious of the fact that the notation is the inverse, position-wise, of the actual strings (high bottom-string at the top, etc.). At that moment, I feel slightly dizzy (slight vertigo) and confused (well perhaps that might be my natural state) and I become sort of literal and unable to use it as an automatic trigger for note playing. I have to consciously ask myself which string is being referred to. This seems to occur just after there are successive notations with the same letter, but one on a high string and the other on a low string. For a time, I can't seem to get back into the automatic reading mode. Has anyone else experienced this sort of thing? Regards Anthony To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: vertical dyslexia?
you'awl may laugh and joke but i've got dyslexia big time and i simply can not - not WILL not - but CAN not .. read music - in both tabs and notation. i can forge through a melody, note by note but it's a long and painful process. i only really know a piece when i hear it. (godbless midi and mp3.) i happened to hear an interview once with joanna lumley (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joanna_Lumley) in which she said she'd tried many times to do it but simply couldn't - even with encouragement from her conductor husband, stephen barlow (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Barlow). i play better now, aged 60, than i ever did when i was kid but i still can't read a note. - bill http://earlymusiccharango.blogspot.com/ ___ The all-new Yahoo! Mail goes wherever you go - free your email address from your Internet provider. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: vertical dyslexia?
Laura, I think you are right. I had been writing on the computer all morning, and then put in a few hours on some lute pieces that I hadn't played fro a while. After sending my message, I put down the lute for an hour, and when I began again, the problem had more or less gone. It must be a form of computer based brain-overload. Perhaps, the keyboard set-up has some hidden influence. I had also been doing some number-based exercises with no particular correspondence to courses. Now when you mention Malbec, I did wonder whether my blood-alcohol level might not have fallen to a dangerous low. I had no Malbec, so I swigged some yellow Savagnin, my own cèpage of choice. Cheers (I think I can safely say here, with out the fear of passing for an Esturian), Anthony Le 16 mai 07 à 20:37, [EMAIL PROTECTED] a écrit : Surely It's not a geographic issue, I live far from you...but it happens the same to me, but it is worse if I'm playing baroque guitar...at a moment I cannot say what kind of tablature I'm reading...neither do I realize which is the upper or lower string in the tab. But it usually happens late at night after a thousand hours at the computer, and very dry and red eyes... My suggested cure is similar to the one already offered...but I'd prefer a Malbec. Laura - Mensaje original - De: Narada [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fecha: Miércoles, Mayo 16, 2007 1:09 pm Asunto: [LUTE] Re: vertical dyslexia? Mmmm, I've suffered from this very same problem since I was about 17 years of age. It's usually caused by excessive rehydration on a Friday night, and often leads to weakness of the left hand, poor syncopation with the right and a sort of blurred vision, as well as the symptoms you mention,the only known partial cure ( not fully ) is to drink say 5 pints instead of 6. Hope this helps N -Original Message- From: Anthony Hind [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: 16 May 2007 16:23 To: Lute Net Subject: [LUTE] vertical dyslexia? Dear All Recently, I have noticed that I seem to be beginning to suffer from a sort of vertical dyslexia when reading tablature, even on pieces I have played before. Suddenly, I become conscious of the fact that the notation is the inverse, position-wise, of the actual strings (high bottom-string at the top, etc.). At that moment, I feel slightly dizzy (slight vertigo) and confused (well perhaps that might be my natural state) and I become sort of literal and unable to use it as an automatic trigger for note playing. I have to consciously ask myself which string is being referred to. This seems to occur just after there are successive notations with the same letter, but one on a high string and the other on a low string. For a time, I can't seem to get back into the automatic reading mode. Has anyone else experienced this sort of thing? Regards Anthony To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: vertical dyslexia?
Bill I'm sorry about that. My part-time dyslexia does not seem a joke to me. I began to wonder what was happening to me, so I can sympathize. In fact, it may be a mild form, I have, that is only revealed under duress. On the other, hand as someone else suggested, it could be one of the problems of old age, creeping up on me. Nevertheless, I know a music student of 70 years of age who, like yourself, is still progressing on the lute. That gives me some hope, but I have a long way to go to get to his level, but not so long to get to that age. Regards Anthony Le 16 mai 07 à 21:26, bill kilpatrick a écrit : you'awl may laugh and joke but i've got dyslexia big time and i simply can not - not WILL not - but CAN not .. read music - in both tabs and notation. i can forge through a melody, note by note but it's a long and painful process. i only really know a piece when i hear it. (godbless midi and mp3.) i happened to hear an interview once with joanna lumley (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joanna_Lumley) in which she said she'd tried many times to do it but simply couldn't - even with encouragement from her conductor husband, stephen barlow (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Barlow). i play better now, aged 60, than i ever did when i was kid but i still can't read a note. - bill http://earlymusiccharango.blogspot.com/ ___ The all-new Yahoo! Mail goes wherever you go - free your email address from your Internet provider. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/ nowyoucan.html To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: vertical dyslexia?
Bill I envy your memorizing abilities. I have just been thinking what your situation implies. You obviously must have found a way of learning all pieces by heart. I find that extremely difficult, but began trying to do so after reading an article by Matthew Wadsworth on that question, in the English lute journal. He mentions three different facets of his memorizing process, and their various advantages, which includes a better knowledge of the music's structure. I imagine that the abilty to improvize must pass through an abitlity to comprehend (in the original sense of that word) a music's structure in that way. Paolo Pondolfo,gambist, in his notes to his Improvisando, Glossa, implies that relying on muscial notation brings a loss of the interior knowledge of the music and with it the abiltiy to constantly recreate by improvisation. Without going that far, there may be an element of truth in this; at least I can imagine this could make an interesting topic for further discussion. Best regards Anthony Le 16 mai 07 à 21:26, bill kilpatrick a écrit : you'awl may laugh and joke but i've got dyslexia big time and i simply can not - not WILL not - but CAN not .. read music - in both tabs and notation. i can forge through a melody, note by note but it's a long and painful process. i only really know a piece when i hear it. (godbless midi and mp3.) i happened to hear an interview once with joanna lumley (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joanna_Lumley) in which she said she'd tried many times to do it but simply couldn't - even with encouragement from her conductor husband, stephen barlow (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Barlow). i play better now, aged 60, than i ever did when i was kid but i still can't read a note. - bill http://earlymusiccharango.blogspot.com/ ___ The all-new Yahoo! Mail goes wherever you go - free your email address from your Internet provider. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/ nowyoucan.html To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: vertical dyslexia?
absolutely - to those who can look at a manuscript and read it effortlessly w/o strum und drum, this inability to read music must seem like someone who is incapable of tieing his own shoe laces ... but i assure you - five lines and wildly wiggly dots have little to do with what me and my charango can produce. - bill http://earlymusiccharango.blogspot.com/ ___ New Yahoo! Mail is the ultimate force in competitive emailing. Find out more at the Yahoo! Mail Championships. Plus: play games and win prizes. http://uk.rd.yahoo.com/evt=44106/*http://mail.yahoo.net/uk To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: vertical dyslexia?
absolutely - to those who can look at a manuscript and read it effortlessly w/o strum und drum, this inability to read music must seem like someone who is incapable of tieing his own shoe laces ... but i assure you - five wavering lines and wildly wiggly dots have little to do with what me and my charango can produce. - bill http://earlymusiccharango.blogspot.com/ ___ Now you can scan emails quickly with a reading pane. Get the new Yahoo! Mail. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[LUTE] Re: vertical dyslexia?
In my case, its called getting old and myopic.If I dont have the music or tablature at 2 arms length away from me, I see everything double. Problem is that the stupid reading glasses they give you are never made for being able to read from a music stand sitting a few feet away from you and low... The solution is to learn all your music by heart so when you play in concert you don't look totally confused. and of course, you can then drink as many pints as you want, as long as it doesn't impair anything else but your vision I by the way also have the same problem if I look at my strings, instead of double strings, I now see 4 stringsso again, not looking is the best solution. I recently bought a Santoor that I play in my medieval group, and it has 4 strings per note.fun when you are trying to hit the damn things with tiny little hammers and there I'm sorry, but I have to look... So I guess I will have to bring the Santoor to my next appointment with my optician, so he can make me glasses that will allow me to see the instrument properly. Bruno On 5/16/07, bill kilpatrick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: you'awl may laugh and joke but i've got dyslexia big time and i simply can not - not WILL not - but CAN not .. read music - in both tabs and notation. i can forge through a melody, note by note but it's a long and painful process. i only really know a piece when i hear it. (godbless midi and mp3.) i happened to hear an interview once with joanna lumley (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joanna_Lumley) in which she said she'd tried many times to do it but simply couldn't - even with encouragement from her conductor husband, stephen barlow (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Barlow). i play better now, aged 60, than i ever did when i was kid but i still can't read a note. - bill http://earlymusiccharango.blogspot.com/ ___ The all-new Yahoo! Mail goes wherever you go - free your email address from your Internet provider. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- Bruno Cognyl-Fournier Luthiste, etc Estavel Ensemble de musique ancienne www.estavel.org
[LUTE] Re: vertical dyslexia?
As a member in good standing of the presbyopic set, I highly recommend getting a set of glasses specifically designed for music reading (i.e., tuned for 18 or so). I got some about three years ago, and they make reading music much easier, especially when the damned publisher uses a microscopic typeface. They cost around $100 and were well worth the cost. Guy -Original Message- From: Bruno Fournier [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2007 3:59 PM To: bill kilpatrick Cc: Lute Net Subject: [LUTE] Re: vertical dyslexia? In my case, its called getting old and myopic.If I dont have the music or tablature at 2 arms length away from me, I see everything double. Problem is that the stupid reading glasses they give you are never made for being able to read from a music stand sitting a few feet away from you and low... The solution is to learn all your music by heart so when you play in concert you don't look totally confused. and of course, you can then drink as many pints as you want, as long as it doesn't impair anything else but your vision I by the way also have the same problem if I look at my strings, instead of double strings, I now see 4 stringsso again, not looking is the best solution. I recently bought a Santoor that I play in my medieval group, and it has 4 strings per note.fun when you are trying to hit the damn things with tiny little hammers and there I'm sorry, but I have to look... So I guess I will have to bring the Santoor to my next appointment with my optician, so he can make me glasses that will allow me to see the instrument properly. Bruno On 5/16/07, bill kilpatrick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: you'awl may laugh and joke but i've got dyslexia big time and i simply can not - not WILL not - but CAN not .. read music - in both tabs and notation. i can forge through a melody, note by note but it's a long and painful process. i only really know a piece when i hear it. (godbless midi and mp3.) i happened to hear an interview once with joanna lumley (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joanna_Lumley) in which she said she'd tried many times to do it but simply couldn't - even with encouragement from her conductor husband, stephen barlow (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Barlow). i play better now, aged 60, than i ever did when i was kid but i still can't read a note. - bill http://earlymusiccharango.blogspot.com/ ___ The all-new Yahoo! Mail goes wherever you go - free your email address from your Internet provider. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- Bruno Cognyl-Fournier Luthiste, etc Estavel Ensemble de musique ancienne www.estavel.org
[LUTE] Re: vertical dyslexia?
thx for the tip.Not having ever had a pair of glasses for vision in my life, I went to see an optician and I had a pair of glasses made for my presbyopic condition , 2 years, ago, not realizing after paying a few 100$ that they were made for reading under normal arm extension. Even though I had told the optician that I found reading music difficult on a music stand So 200$ ( canadian ) down the tube and of course those pharmacy glasses aren't any better, cheaper but not better. So now my only hope is to go back in there with my music stand and lute and tell him this where my music sits and this where I sit. and some of those Scholar editions of Dufay and Landini ( I do a lot of medieval music) are really hard to read.. cheers Bruno On 5/16/07, Guy Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: As a member in good standing of the presbyopic set, I highly recommend getting a set of glasses specifically designed for music reading (i.e., tuned for 18 or so). I got some about three years ago, and they make reading music much easier, especially when the damned publisher uses a microscopic typeface. They cost around $100 and were well worth the cost. Guy -Original Message- From: Bruno Fournier [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2007 3:59 PM To: bill kilpatrick Cc: Lute Net Subject: [LUTE] Re: vertical dyslexia? In my case, its called getting old and myopic.If I dont have the music or tablature at 2 arms length away from me, I see everything double. Problem is that the stupid reading glasses they give you are never made for being able to read from a music stand sitting a few feet away from you and low... The solution is to learn all your music by heart so when you play in concert you don't look totally confused. and of course, you can then drink as many pints as you want, as long as it doesn't impair anything else but your vision I by the way also have the same problem if I look at my strings, instead of double strings, I now see 4 stringsso again, not looking is the best solution. I recently bought a Santoor that I play in my medieval group, and it has 4 strings per note.fun when you are trying to hit the damn things with tiny little hammers and there I'm sorry, but I have to look... So I guess I will have to bring the Santoor to my next appointment with my optician, so he can make me glasses that will allow me to see the instrument properly. Bruno On 5/16/07, bill kilpatrick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: you'awl may laugh and joke but i've got dyslexia big time and i simply can not - not WILL not - but CAN not .. read music - in both tabs and notation. i can forge through a melody, note by note but it's a long and painful process. i only really know a piece when i hear it. (godbless midi and mp3.) i happened to hear an interview once with joanna lumley (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joanna_Lumley) in which she said she'd tried many times to do it but simply couldn't - even with encouragement from her conductor husband, stephen barlow (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Barlow). i play better now, aged 60, than i ever did when i was kid but i still can't read a note. - bill http://earlymusiccharango.blogspot.com/ ___ The all-new Yahoo! Mail goes wherever you go - free your email address from your Internet provider. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- Bruno Cognyl-Fournier Luthiste, etc Estavel Ensemble de musique ancienne www.estavel.org -- Bruno Cognyl-Fournier Luthiste, etc Estavel Ensemble de musique ancienne www.estavel.org
[LUTE] Re: vertical dyslexia?
I basically sat at the machine and the ophthalmologist put a chart at typical music reading distance. He then tweaked the settings on the machine to maximize my ability to read the chart and that determined the prescription. I can't read books with them unless I hold them well away from my face, and they are a little weird for distance, but they are just right for music (and computer monitors...). Guy -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Bruno Fournier Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2007 4:47 PM To: Guy Smith Cc: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Subject: Re: [LUTE] Re: vertical dyslexia? thx for the tip.Not having ever had a pair of glasses for vision in my life, I went to see an optician and I had a pair of glasses made for my presbyopic condition , 2 years, ago, not realizing after paying a few 100$ that they were made for reading under normal arm extension. Even though I had told the optician that I found reading music difficult on a music stand So 200$ ( canadian ) down the tube and of course those pharmacy glasses aren't any better, cheaper but not better. So now my only hope is to go back in there with my music stand and lute and tell him this where my music sits and this where I sit. and some of those Scholar editions of Dufay and Landini ( I do a lot of medieval music) are really hard to read.. cheers Bruno On 5/16/07, Guy Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: As a member in good standing of the presbyopic set, I highly recommend getting a set of glasses specifically designed for music reading (i.e., tuned for 18 or so). I got some about three years ago, and they make reading music much easier, especially when the damned publisher uses a microscopic typeface. They cost around $100 and were well worth the cost. Guy -Original Message- From: Bruno Fournier [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2007 3:59 PM To: bill kilpatrick Cc: Lute Net Subject: [LUTE] Re: vertical dyslexia? In my case, its called getting old and myopic.If I dont have the music or tablature at 2 arms length away from me, I see everything double. Problem is that the stupid reading glasses they give you are never made for being able to read from a music stand sitting a few feet away from you and low... The solution is to learn all your music by heart so when you play in concert you don't look totally confused. and of course, you can then drink as many pints as you want, as long as it doesn't impair anything else but your vision I by the way also have the same problem if I look at my strings, instead of double strings, I now see 4 stringsso again, not looking is the best solution. I recently bought a Santoor that I play in my medieval group, and it has 4 strings per note.fun when you are trying to hit the damn things with tiny little hammers and there I'm sorry, but I have to look... So I guess I will have to bring the Santoor to my next appointment with my optician, so he can make me glasses that will allow me to see the instrument properly. Bruno On 5/16/07, bill kilpatrick [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: you'awl may laugh and joke but i've got dyslexia big time and i simply can not - not WILL not - but CAN not .. read music - in both tabs and notation. i can forge through a melody, note by note but it's a long and painful process. i only really know a piece when i hear it. (godbless midi and mp3.) i happened to hear an interview once with joanna lumley (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joanna_Lumley) in which she said she'd tried many times to do it but simply couldn't - even with encouragement from her conductor husband, stephen barlow (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephen_Barlow). i play better now, aged 60, than i ever did when i was kid but i still can't read a note. - bill http://earlymusiccharango.blogspot.com/ ___ The all-new Yahoo! Mail goes wherever you go - free your email address from your Internet provider. http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/nowyoucan.html To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html -- Bruno Cognyl-Fournier Luthiste, etc Estavel Ensemble de musique ancienne www.estavel.org -- Bruno Cognyl-Fournier Luthiste, etc Estavel Ensemble de musique ancienne www.estavel.org
[LUTE] Re: vertical dyslexia?
Actually, I have monovision contact lenses, which are the functional equivalent of bifocals. They are OK for most purposes but neither eye reads music that well with that arrangement (one's good for distance, the other for normal reading and music falls in between). The music glasses are basically a specialized pair of reading glasses that I wear to correct my contacts so both eyes focus well at around 18. Guy -Original Message- From: Howard Posner [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 16, 2007 5:51 PM To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu Subject: [LUTE] Re: vertical dyslexia? On Wednesday, May 16, 2007, at 16:46 America/Los_Angeles, Bruno Fournier wrote: I went to see an optician and I had a pair of glasses made for my presbyopic condition , 2 years, ago, not realizing after paying a few 100$ that they were made for reading under normal arm extension. Even though I had told the optician that I found reading music difficult on a music stand So 200$ ( canadian ) down the tube You need progressive lenses (the next technological step after bifocals) that allow you to focus at any length by looking through different parts of the lens. Mine well for everything except my 17 computer screen, for which I use prescription reading lenses. To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
