Re: [MBZ] Batteries, was: Daimler cheated too?

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

Got it.  Since my 2014 GLK 250 was dealer serviced by the PO since day 1, I
would prefer to get the Benz branded battery, unless it is a POS.

On Mon, Sep 21, 2020 at 9:00 AM ned kleinhenz 
wrote:

> Hi Andrew,
> AGM is not a brand of battery.  It's a type of battery.  AGM stands for
> Absorbed Glass Mat.  I think it uses lead-acid, but the acid is not a free
> liquid but contained in a glass fabric mat.
> Ned
>
> On Sun, Sep 20, 2020 at 12:17 PM Andrew Strasfogel 
> wrote:
>
>> Thanks, Ned. Is the Mercedes branded replacement battery for a Bluetec
>> car made by AGM or do you have to request it?
>>
>> On Sun, Sep 20, 2020, 10:13 AM ned kleinhenz via Mercedes <
>> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I found AGM batteries are a really good thing.  In the winter of 2019 my
>>> 2006 Mercedes E320CDI needed a new battery.  When they checked the serial
>>> number of the old battery, it was found to be the original battery sold
>>> in
>>> that car when new.  That was 13 years and 200,000 miles ago.   I had
>>> the Mercedes dealer replace it with a new $300 AGM battery.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> In 2015, I had to replace the original AGM battery in my 2000 BMW Z3.
>>> All
>>> I could get quickly was a standard wet cell battery at Sears.  That
>>> battery
>>> never performed well in the infrequent use this car gets. This summer
>>> that
>>> battery would no longer take a charge so I replaced it with a new AGM
>>> battery.  A standard battery at O’Reilly’s would have cost $150.  The AGM
>>> battery cost $200.   The difference in life expectancy is ~5 years vs ~10
>>> to 15 years.  I believe the cost of an AGM battery is well worth it if
>>> you
>>> keep cars as long as I do.
>>>
>>> Ned Kleinhenz
>>> ___
>>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>>>
>>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>>>
>>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>>>
>>>
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Re: [MBZ] Batteries, was: Daimler cheated too?

[ned kleinhenz via Mercedes]

Hi Andrew,
AGM is not a brand of battery.  It's a type of battery.  AGM stands for
Absorbed Glass Mat.  I think it uses lead-acid, but the acid is not a free
liquid but contained in a glass fabric mat.
Ned

On Sun, Sep 20, 2020 at 12:17 PM Andrew Strasfogel 
wrote:

> Thanks, Ned. Is the Mercedes branded replacement battery for a Bluetec car
> made by AGM or do you have to request it?
>
> On Sun, Sep 20, 2020, 10:13 AM ned kleinhenz via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
>> I found AGM batteries are a really good thing.  In the winter of 2019 my
>> 2006 Mercedes E320CDI needed a new battery.  When they checked the serial
>> number of the old battery, it was found to be the original battery sold in
>> that car when new.  That was 13 years and 200,000 miles ago.   I had
>> the Mercedes dealer replace it with a new $300 AGM battery.
>>
>>
>>
>> In 2015, I had to replace the original AGM battery in my 2000 BMW Z3.  All
>> I could get quickly was a standard wet cell battery at Sears.  That
>> battery
>> never performed well in the infrequent use this car gets. This summer that
>> battery would no longer take a charge so I replaced it with a new AGM
>> battery.  A standard battery at O’Reilly’s would have cost $150.  The AGM
>> battery cost $200.   The difference in life expectancy is ~5 years vs ~10
>> to 15 years.  I believe the cost of an AGM battery is well worth it if you
>> keep cars as long as I do.
>>
>> Ned Kleinhenz
>> ___
>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>>
>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>>
>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>>
>>
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Re: [MBZ] Batteries, was: Daimler cheated too? (I'm sure VW feels better now)

[Scott Ritchey via Mercedes]

The cables and clamps on my jump packs are comparable to good (not great) 
jumper cables and the wire is only about a foot long.  In most cases I think 
the jump pack tries to put some juice back into the battery (i.e., charge it) 
before a start attempt.  But I've seen demos where the engine starts with just 
the jump pack (no battery); other details (temp, engine type/size, etc.) escape 
me.

-Original Message-
From: Mercedes On Behalf Of Curt Raymond via Mercedes
Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2020 4:29 PM
To: Mercedes Discussion List 
Cc: Curt Raymond 
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Batteries, was: Daimler cheated too? (I'm sure VW feels 
better now)

 The thing about those boost packs, I look at the size of the cables (tiny) 
that go to the clamps and I think about the amperage they claim (huge) the pack 
will produce and I think "There ain't no way."
Didn't Kaleb have a clamp melt off once?

You can't cheat physics.
-Curt

On Saturday, September 19, 2020, 5:10:43 PM EDT, Clay via Mercedes 
 wrote:  
 
 My boss had one of those pack things in his car.  Wonderful for getting a jump 
in the spring or summer with warm temps in a small petrol power car.  Not 
capable of lighting off a diesel or much use in the dead of winter where big 
amps are needed.  #1 boy who lives in ND keeps one in his jeep for when it is 
too cold to get a start.  It seems to warm up the battery just enough to let 
loose electrons out of his 1200 CCA winter AGM.

clay 

“I think it’s time we stopped  our cringing embarrassment about our history, 
about our traditions, and about our culture, and we stop this general bout of 
self-recrimination and wetness.”

B. Johnson
01/09/2020

> On Sep 19, 2020, at 12:52 PM, Scott Ritchey via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> Me too.  Back in the day it seemed batteries died gradually but now 
> it's sudden death in my experience.  Jumper cables are OK but you need 
> an second, healthy car.  What is the consensus about these Lithium-ion jump 
> packs?
> I bought a Noco Genius Boost Plus GB40 1000 Amp jump pack.  Looked 
> nice and I watched a glowing YouTube review.  But it failed totally 
> when my 13-year-old AGM tractor battery quit.  That jump pack tried to 
> crank (twice) with almost no effect and then gave up indicating the 
> Li-ion bat was over the temp limit.  That jump pack started at 100% 
> charge and still showed 50% when it quit.  A big disappointment.
> I recently bought an Audew 2000A Peak 2mAh jump pack which showed 
> good results (much better than Nico) on a Project Farm YouTube review.  
> In that review the guy actually tested several brands.  I haven't 
> needed it yet (and hopefully won't) so I've no actual experience.
> My Outback has a USB outlet in the cargo area which is powered when 
> the car is running so I leave the jump pack there, plugged in to charge.
> Andrew's point about towing insurance makes more sense in urban areas, IMO.
> Living in a very rural area, I prefer self-rescue vs waiting for a tow 
> truck or a good Samaritan (who could turn out to be a crook).
> Scott
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Mercedes On Behalf Of Allan Streib via Mercedes
> 
> In my experience, batteries are fine, until suddenly they are not.
> 
> They can overnight go from starting fine to not having enough juice to 
> even turn the engine.
> 
> If your battery is seven years old I'd advise replacing it, or at 
> least carrying a set of jumper cables in your car (few people do these 
> days, so it's often hard to find someone who can give you a jump if 
> you don't have cables handy).
> 
> Allan
> 
> Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes  writes:
> 
> 
> 
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> 
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> 
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
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> 


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Re: [MBZ] Batteries, was: Daimler cheated too? (I'm sure VW feels better now)

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

 Owned by Johnson 
Controlshttps://www.google.com/search?sxsrf=ALeKk00lGhqbQo7gyGO5Zrkr6hFrlmteRA%3A1600634104292=hp=-LxnX8SgDqSlytMP1Pu4iAY=who+makes+varta+batteries=who+makes+varta+b_lcp=CgZwc3ktYWIQAxgAMgIIADoICAAQsQMQgwE6CwguELEDEMcBEKMCOgUIABCxAzoICC4QxwEQowI6BQguELEDOgQIIxAnOgQIABBDOgoIABCxAxCDARBDOggILhCxAxCDAToCCC5QLli9F2C1HmgAcAB4AIABdYgB8AqSAQQxNC4zmAEAoAEBqgEHZ3dzLXdpeg=psy-ab

On Sunday, September 20, 2020, 12:52:47 AM EDT, Andrew Strasfogel via 
Mercedes  wrote:  
 
 I was told by the Mercedes Tech. Varta is German.

On Sat, Sep 19, 2020, 10:21 PM Allan Streib via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes  writes:
>
> > So where can I find a Varta replacement battery for my 2014 GLK 250
> > identical to the OE battery in my car that was installed in November
> 2013?
>
> Batteries are batteries. They're all made by Exide or Johnson
> controls. If it's the right size and right rating I wouldn't worry. If
> you insist, I'm sure the dealer will be happy to sell you a battery.
>
> Allan
>
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>
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>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>
>
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Re: [MBZ] Batteries, was: Daimler cheated too? (I'm sure VW feels better now)

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

 The thing about those boost packs, I look at the size of the cables (tiny) 
that go to the clamps and I think about the amperage they claim (huge) the pack 
will produce and I think "There ain't no way."
Didn't Kaleb have a clamp melt off once?

You can't cheat physics.
-Curt

On Saturday, September 19, 2020, 5:10:43 PM EDT, Clay via Mercedes 
 wrote:  
 
 My boss had one of those pack things in his car.  Wonderful for getting a jump 
in the spring or summer with warm temps in a small petrol power car.  Not 
capable of lighting off a diesel or much use in the dead of winter where big 
amps are needed.  #1 boy who lives in ND keeps one in his jeep for when it is 
too cold to get a start.  It seems to warm up the battery just enough to let 
loose electrons out of his 1200 CCA winter AGM.

clay 

“I think it’s time we stopped  our cringing embarrassment about our history, 
about our traditions, and about our culture, and we stop this general bout of 
self-recrimination and wetness.”

B. Johnson
01/09/2020

> On Sep 19, 2020, at 12:52 PM, Scott Ritchey via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> Me too.  Back in the day it seemed batteries died gradually but now it's
> sudden death in my experience.  Jumper cables are OK but you need an second,
> healthy car.  What is the consensus about these Lithium-ion jump packs?
> I bought a Noco Genius Boost Plus GB40 1000 Amp jump pack.  Looked nice and
> I watched a glowing YouTube review.  But it failed totally when my
> 13-year-old AGM tractor battery quit.  That jump pack tried to crank (twice)
> with almost no effect and then gave up indicating the Li-ion bat was over
> the temp limit.  That jump pack started at 100% charge and still showed 50%
> when it quit.  A big disappointment.
> I recently bought an Audew 2000A Peak 2mAh jump pack which showed good
> results (much better than Nico) on a Project Farm YouTube review.  In that
> review the guy actually tested several brands.  I haven't needed it yet (and
> hopefully won't) so I've no actual experience.
> My Outback has a USB outlet in the cargo area which is powered when the car
> is running so I leave the jump pack there, plugged in to charge.
> Andrew's point about towing insurance makes more sense in urban areas, IMO.
> Living in a very rural area, I prefer self-rescue vs waiting for a tow truck
> or a good Samaritan (who could turn out to be a crook).
> Scott
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Mercedes On Behalf Of Allan Streib via Mercedes
> 
> In my experience, batteries are fine, until suddenly they are not.
> 
> They can overnight go from starting fine to not having enough juice to even
> turn the engine.
> 
> If your battery is seven years old I'd advise replacing it, or at least
> carrying a set of jumper cables in your car (few people do these days, so
> it's often hard to find someone who can give you a jump if you don't have
> cables handy).
> 
> Allan
> 
> Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes  writes:
> 
> 
> 
> ___
> http://www.okiebenz.com
> 
> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> 
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
> 


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Re: [MBZ] Batteries, was: Daimler cheated too?

[Scott Ritchey via Mercedes]

AGM=Absorbed Glass Matt.  Instead of plates immersed in liquid sulfuric acid, 
AGM plates are separated by fiberglass mats that are saturated (like a sponge) 
with a thickened electrolyte that stays in place (doesn't run off).  These 
batteries can usually be mounted in any orientation.  They are semi-sealed so 
they don't leak acid and they are valve regulated to limit internal pressure. 
They try to contain most of generated H2 and O2 and recombine back into water 
inside the battery.  Optima gel batteries are similar but are spiral wound 
which limits battery dimensions (must be six cylinders).

Functionally, AGM batteries can deliver higher current, charge faster, tolerate 
deep discharge better, and self-discharge slower (compared to comparable 
flooded batteries). The Car Quest AGM battery in my tractor survived 13-14 
years after it went dead several times.  

The problem is that new batteries can be very different from batteries made 
5-15 years.  Most "brands" periodically contract out to one of about five 
companies that actually make batteries, and even then they build to several 
specification levels.

Flooded batteries can gave good service if properly maintained, which is rare, 
so they usually have shorter life.  So AGM is should be  superior in actual use 
but it is possible to make poor AGM batteries just like poor regular batteries. 

Scott 

-Original Message-
From: Mercedes On Behalf Of Floyd Thursby via Mercedes
Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2020 12:34 PM
To: mercedes@okiebenz.com
Cc: Floyd Thursby 
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Batteries, was: Daimler cheated too?

AGM is a type of battery Advanced? Gel Mat I think it means.  Not your standard 
water/lead/acid type

--FT

On 9/20/20 12:17 PM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes wrote:
> Thanks, Ned. Is the Mercedes branded replacement battery for a Bluetec 
> car made by AGM or do you have to request it?
>
> On Sun, Sep 20, 2020, 10:13 AM ned kleinhenz via Mercedes < 
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
>> I found AGM batteries are a really good thing.  In the winter of 2019 
>> my
>> 2006 Mercedes E320CDI needed a new battery.  When they checked the 
>> serial number of the old battery, it was found to be the original battery 
>> sold in
>> that car when new.  That was 13 years and 200,000 miles ago.   I had
>> the Mercedes dealer replace it with a new $300 AGM battery.
>>
>>
>>
>> In 2015, I had to replace the original AGM battery in my 2000 BMW Z3.  
>> All I could get quickly was a standard wet cell battery at Sears.  
>> That battery never performed well in the infrequent use this car 
>> gets. This summer that battery would no longer take a charge so I 
>> replaced it with a new AGM battery.  A standard battery at O’Reilly’s would 
>> have cost $150.  The AGM
>> battery cost $200.   The difference in life expectancy is ~5 years vs ~10
>> to 15 years.  I believe the cost of an AGM battery is well worth it 
>> if you keep cars as long as I do.
>>
>> Ned Kleinhenz
>> ___
>> http://www.okiebenz.com
>>
>> To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
>>
>> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
>> http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
>>
>>
> ___
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>
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>
--
--FT


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Re: [MBZ] Batteries, was: Daimler cheated too?

[Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes]

That’s it

--FT
Sent from iPhone

> On Sep 20, 2020, at 12:43 PM, Mitch Haley via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> Absorbed Glass Mat

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Re: [MBZ] Batteries, was: Daimler cheated too?

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

On 2020-09-20 11:17, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes wrote:
Thanks, Ned. Is the Mercedes branded replacement battery for a Bluetec 
car

made by AGM or do you have to request it?


Starmarked batteries used to be made by Varta.
Then I think they might have been Bosch.

Any car with the battery in an enclosed space should be Absorbed Glass 
Mat, or at least with a vent hose running out of the enclosed space.


I assume Starmarked batteries for cars without underhood batteries, like 
my W140 trunk battery or my S210 underseat battery, should have had 
their part numbers updated to AGM long ago.


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Re: [MBZ] Batteries, was: Daimler cheated too?

[Floyd Thursby via Mercedes]

AGM is a type of battery Advanced? Gel Mat I think it means.  Not your 
standard water/lead/acid type


--FT

On 9/20/20 12:17 PM, Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes wrote:

Thanks, Ned. Is the Mercedes branded replacement battery for a Bluetec car
made by AGM or do you have to request it?

On Sun, Sep 20, 2020, 10:13 AM ned kleinhenz via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:


I found AGM batteries are a really good thing.  In the winter of 2019 my
2006 Mercedes E320CDI needed a new battery.  When they checked the serial
number of the old battery, it was found to be the original battery sold in
that car when new.  That was 13 years and 200,000 miles ago.   I had
the Mercedes dealer replace it with a new $300 AGM battery.



In 2015, I had to replace the original AGM battery in my 2000 BMW Z3.  All
I could get quickly was a standard wet cell battery at Sears.  That battery
never performed well in the infrequent use this car gets. This summer that
battery would no longer take a charge so I replaced it with a new AGM
battery.  A standard battery at O’Reilly’s would have cost $150.  The AGM
battery cost $200.   The difference in life expectancy is ~5 years vs ~10
to 15 years.  I believe the cost of an AGM battery is well worth it if you
keep cars as long as I do.

Ned Kleinhenz
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--
--FT


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Re: [MBZ] Batteries, was: Daimler cheated too?

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

Thanks, Ned. Is the Mercedes branded replacement battery for a Bluetec car
made by AGM or do you have to request it?

On Sun, Sep 20, 2020, 10:13 AM ned kleinhenz via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> I found AGM batteries are a really good thing.  In the winter of 2019 my
> 2006 Mercedes E320CDI needed a new battery.  When they checked the serial
> number of the old battery, it was found to be the original battery sold in
> that car when new.  That was 13 years and 200,000 miles ago.   I had
> the Mercedes dealer replace it with a new $300 AGM battery.
>
>
>
> In 2015, I had to replace the original AGM battery in my 2000 BMW Z3.  All
> I could get quickly was a standard wet cell battery at Sears.  That battery
> never performed well in the infrequent use this car gets. This summer that
> battery would no longer take a charge so I replaced it with a new AGM
> battery.  A standard battery at O’Reilly’s would have cost $150.  The AGM
> battery cost $200.   The difference in life expectancy is ~5 years vs ~10
> to 15 years.  I believe the cost of an AGM battery is well worth it if you
> keep cars as long as I do.
>
> Ned Kleinhenz
> ___
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>
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>
> To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
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Re: [MBZ] Batteries, was: Daimler cheated too?

[ned kleinhenz via Mercedes]

I found AGM batteries are a really good thing.  In the winter of 2019 my
2006 Mercedes E320CDI needed a new battery.  When they checked the serial
number of the old battery, it was found to be the original battery sold in
that car when new.  That was 13 years and 200,000 miles ago.   I had
the Mercedes dealer replace it with a new $300 AGM battery.



In 2015, I had to replace the original AGM battery in my 2000 BMW Z3.  All
I could get quickly was a standard wet cell battery at Sears.  That battery
never performed well in the infrequent use this car gets. This summer that
battery would no longer take a charge so I replaced it with a new AGM
battery.  A standard battery at O’Reilly’s would have cost $150.  The AGM
battery cost $200.   The difference in life expectancy is ~5 years vs ~10
to 15 years.  I believe the cost of an AGM battery is well worth it if you
keep cars as long as I do.

Ned Kleinhenz
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Re: [MBZ] Batteries, was: Daimler cheated too? (I'm sure VW feels better now)

[Russ Williams via Mercedes]

I have a Boltpower NO2 jump pack. I've used it 6x's in the last few 
months. Works
great. 800CCA 1200Peak Amps. The first time I used it was to boost off a 
Froad Power
choke 2500. His battery was down to 3 Volts on my multi meter. Hook up 
the bolt to it
waited 30 seconds and it fired up the Power Choke on 3 rev. The guy was 
impressed with
it. Said he had a hard time jumping the truck off with a regular car 
battery. Truck has had
a problem since new with a parasitic draw problem that the dealer hasn't 
been able to find.
He's has it in the shop 3x's each time they say they fixed it but it 
keeps rearing up it's ugly

head and coming back. The last time they "fixed" it was the week before.
I bought the Bolt because of a article I read that the reporter had 
tested 10 different jump
packs that were rated to start ditzels and this was the only that did 
what it was advertised
to do. Tester was starting a 124 300D with the test units and a battery 
that was at 2 volts.


Russ W.


On 9/19/2020 15:52, Scott Ritchey via Mercedes wrote:

Me too.  Back in the day it seemed batteries died gradually but now it's
sudden death in my experience.  Jumper cables are OK but you need an second,
healthy car.  What is the consensus about these Lithium-ion jump packs? ...



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Re: [MBZ] Batteries, was: Daimler cheated too? (I'm sure VW feels better now)

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

I was told by the Mercedes Tech. Varta is German.

On Sat, Sep 19, 2020, 10:21 PM Allan Streib via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes  writes:
>
> > So where can I find a Varta replacement battery for my 2014 GLK 250
> > identical to the OE battery in my car that was installed in November
> 2013?
>
> Batteries are batteries. They're all made by Exide or Johnson
> controls. If it's the right size and right rating I wouldn't worry. If
> you insist, I'm sure the dealer will be happy to sell you a battery.
>
> Allan
>
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Re: [MBZ] Batteries, was: Daimler cheated too? (I'm sure VW feels better now)

[Allan Streib via Mercedes]

Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes  writes:

> So where can I find a Varta replacement battery for my 2014 GLK 250
> identical to the OE battery in my car that was installed in November 2013?

Batteries are batteries. They're all made by Exide or Johnson
controls. If it's the right size and right rating I wouldn't worry. If
you insist, I'm sure the dealer will be happy to sell you a battery.

Allan

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Re: [MBZ] Batteries, was: Daimler cheated too? (I'm sure VW feels better now)

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

On 2020-09-19 15:52, Scott Ritchey via Mercedes wrote:

What is the consensus about these Lithium-ion jump packs?


The Delco in my Saturn was from Fall 2014. 2016 I left the trunk open 
for over an hour and the car refused to try to start, thinking the 
battery was too low. Hooking up a charger reset the low voltage trigger 
and the car started, but that was an indication of very low battery 
capacity, I should have traded it in under warranty. Winter 2019, the 
car cranked slow, so I bought a couple of tiny Stanley lithium pack. 
When temps hit -13F, the car barely started. When it was -18 a couple 
days later, no start. The Stanley pack, twice the size of a cigarette 
pack, made the difference between starting and not starting. I believe I 
used the warm pack out of the house and not the cold pack out of the 
car, I figure it's abusive to use lithium batteries below 14F. I've also 
used it to start lawn mowers as an alternative to buying another $90 
motorcycle battery that the mower would just kill in a year or two.


This is about the smallest and weakest thing I found, seems like they 
were about $35 at Walmart a couple years ago, I got them on clearance 
for under $15. They will start a car with help from the car's battery, 
but they won't do it alone.

https://www.amazon.com/STANLEY-SS4LS-PowerToGo-Lithium-Portable/dp/B07MGC1SLX/

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Re: [MBZ] Batteries, was: Daimler cheated too? (I'm sure VW feels better now)

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

Point taken,

So where can I find a Varta replacement battery for my 2014 GLK 250
identical to the OE battery in my car that was installed in November 2013?

On Sat, Sep 19, 2020 at 5:57 PM Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> Yes USAA towing is worthless because they dont pay as much as other jobs so
> the drivers promise to come but never show up. You need to ne on a first
> name basis with a local tow guy to drive old stuff.
>
> The lithium batteries are handy for break downs, but just as handy for
> helping other people with their problems when you are out and about, or
> when someone's truck wont crank and is blocking your driveway. So they are
> really twice as useful.
>
>
>
> On Sat, Sep 19, 2020, 2:24 PM Allan Streib via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
>
> > I've gotten assistance with the jump packs twice. Once from a cop
> > and once at a parts store. In both cases they started the car.
> >
> > I'd personally hesitate to buy one as you need them so rarely. My luck
> > would be that when I needed it, it wouldn't be charged.
> >
> > Roadside assistance insurance coverage is OK but when I needed it
> > recently they had "very long hold times due to COVID-19." I waited about
> > 15 minutes with no answer then hung up and called a towing service
> > myself, and it took them over an hour to show up. I did get reimbursed
> > by State Farm though.
> >
> > Allan
> >
> > Scott Ritchey via Mercedes  writes:
> >
> > > Me too.  Back in the day it seemed batteries died gradually but now
> it's
> > > sudden death in my experience.  Jumper cables are OK but you need an
> > second,
> > > healthy car.  What is the consensus about these Lithium-ion jump packs?
> > > I bought a Noco Genius Boost Plus GB40 1000 Amp jump pack.  Looked nice
> > and
> > > I watched a glowing YouTube review.  But it failed totally when my
> > > 13-year-old AGM tractor battery quit.  That jump pack tried to crank
> > (twice)
> > > with almost no effect and then gave up indicating the Li-ion bat was
> over
> > > the temp limit.  That jump pack started at 100% charge and still showed
> > 50%
> > > when it quit.  A big disappointment.
> > > I recently bought an Audew 2000A Peak 2mAh jump pack which showed
> > good
> > > results (much better than Nico) on a Project Farm YouTube review.  In
> > that
> > > review the guy actually tested several brands.  I haven't needed it yet
> > (and
> > > hopefully won't) so I've no actual experience.
> > > My Outback has a USB outlet in the cargo area which is powered when the
> > car
> > > is running so I leave the jump pack there, plugged in to charge.
> > > Andrew's point about towing insurance makes more sense in urban areas,
> > IMO.
> > > Living in a very rural area, I prefer self-rescue vs waiting for a tow
> > truck
> > > or a good Samaritan (who could turn out to be a crook).
> > > Scott
> > >
> > >
> > > -Original Message-
> > > From: Mercedes On Behalf Of Allan Streib via Mercedes
> > >
> > > In my experience, batteries are fine, until suddenly they are not.
> > >
> > > They can overnight go from starting fine to not having enough juice to
> > even
> > > turn the engine.
> > >
> > > If your battery is seven years old I'd advise replacing it, or at least
> > > carrying a set of jumper cables in your car (few people do these days,
> so
> > > it's often hard to find someone who can give you a jump if you don't
> have
> > > cables handy).
> > >
> > > Allan
> > >
> >
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> >
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> >
> >
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Re: [MBZ] Batteries, was: Daimler cheated too? (I'm sure VW feels better now)

[Karl Wittnebel via Mercedes]

Yes USAA towing is worthless because they dont pay as much as other jobs so
the drivers promise to come but never show up. You need to ne on a first
name basis with a local tow guy to drive old stuff.

The lithium batteries are handy for break downs, but just as handy for
helping other people with their problems when you are out and about, or
when someone's truck wont crank and is blocking your driveway. So they are
really twice as useful.



On Sat, Sep 19, 2020, 2:24 PM Allan Streib via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> I've gotten assistance with the jump packs twice. Once from a cop
> and once at a parts store. In both cases they started the car.
>
> I'd personally hesitate to buy one as you need them so rarely. My luck
> would be that when I needed it, it wouldn't be charged.
>
> Roadside assistance insurance coverage is OK but when I needed it
> recently they had "very long hold times due to COVID-19." I waited about
> 15 minutes with no answer then hung up and called a towing service
> myself, and it took them over an hour to show up. I did get reimbursed
> by State Farm though.
>
> Allan
>
> Scott Ritchey via Mercedes  writes:
>
> > Me too.  Back in the day it seemed batteries died gradually but now it's
> > sudden death in my experience.  Jumper cables are OK but you need an
> second,
> > healthy car.  What is the consensus about these Lithium-ion jump packs?
> > I bought a Noco Genius Boost Plus GB40 1000 Amp jump pack.  Looked nice
> and
> > I watched a glowing YouTube review.  But it failed totally when my
> > 13-year-old AGM tractor battery quit.  That jump pack tried to crank
> (twice)
> > with almost no effect and then gave up indicating the Li-ion bat was over
> > the temp limit.  That jump pack started at 100% charge and still showed
> 50%
> > when it quit.  A big disappointment.
> > I recently bought an Audew 2000A Peak 2mAh jump pack which showed
> good
> > results (much better than Nico) on a Project Farm YouTube review.  In
> that
> > review the guy actually tested several brands.  I haven't needed it yet
> (and
> > hopefully won't) so I've no actual experience.
> > My Outback has a USB outlet in the cargo area which is powered when the
> car
> > is running so I leave the jump pack there, plugged in to charge.
> > Andrew's point about towing insurance makes more sense in urban areas,
> IMO.
> > Living in a very rural area, I prefer self-rescue vs waiting for a tow
> truck
> > or a good Samaritan (who could turn out to be a crook).
> > Scott
> >
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Mercedes On Behalf Of Allan Streib via Mercedes
> >
> > In my experience, batteries are fine, until suddenly they are not.
> >
> > They can overnight go from starting fine to not having enough juice to
> even
> > turn the engine.
> >
> > If your battery is seven years old I'd advise replacing it, or at least
> > carrying a set of jumper cables in your car (few people do these days, so
> > it's often hard to find someone who can give you a jump if you don't have
> > cables handy).
> >
> > Allan
> >
>
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Re: [MBZ] Batteries, was: Daimler cheated too? (I'm sure VW feels better now)

[Allan Streib via Mercedes]

I've gotten assistance with the jump packs twice. Once from a cop
and once at a parts store. In both cases they started the car.

I'd personally hesitate to buy one as you need them so rarely. My luck
would be that when I needed it, it wouldn't be charged.

Roadside assistance insurance coverage is OK but when I needed it
recently they had "very long hold times due to COVID-19." I waited about
15 minutes with no answer then hung up and called a towing service
myself, and it took them over an hour to show up. I did get reimbursed
by State Farm though.

Allan

Scott Ritchey via Mercedes  writes:

> Me too.  Back in the day it seemed batteries died gradually but now it's
> sudden death in my experience.  Jumper cables are OK but you need an second,
> healthy car.  What is the consensus about these Lithium-ion jump packs?
> I bought a Noco Genius Boost Plus GB40 1000 Amp jump pack.  Looked nice and
> I watched a glowing YouTube review.  But it failed totally when my
> 13-year-old AGM tractor battery quit.  That jump pack tried to crank (twice)
> with almost no effect and then gave up indicating the Li-ion bat was over
> the temp limit.  That jump pack started at 100% charge and still showed 50%
> when it quit.  A big disappointment.
> I recently bought an Audew 2000A Peak 2mAh jump pack which showed good
> results (much better than Nico) on a Project Farm YouTube review.  In that
> review the guy actually tested several brands.  I haven't needed it yet (and
> hopefully won't) so I've no actual experience.
> My Outback has a USB outlet in the cargo area which is powered when the car
> is running so I leave the jump pack there, plugged in to charge.
> Andrew's point about towing insurance makes more sense in urban areas, IMO.
> Living in a very rural area, I prefer self-rescue vs waiting for a tow truck
> or a good Samaritan (who could turn out to be a crook).
> Scott
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Mercedes On Behalf Of Allan Streib via Mercedes
>
> In my experience, batteries are fine, until suddenly they are not.
>
> They can overnight go from starting fine to not having enough juice to even
> turn the engine.
>
> If your battery is seven years old I'd advise replacing it, or at least
> carrying a set of jumper cables in your car (few people do these days, so
> it's often hard to find someone who can give you a jump if you don't have
> cables handy).
>
> Allan
>

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Re: [MBZ] Batteries, was: Daimler cheated too? (I'm sure VW feels better now)

[Clay via Mercedes]

My boss had one of those pack things in his car.  Wonderful for getting a jump 
in the spring or summer with warm temps in a small petrol power car.  Not 
capable of lighting off a diesel or much use in the dead of winter where big 
amps are needed.  #1 boy who lives in ND keeps one in his jeep for when it is 
too cold to get a start.  It seems to warm up the battery just enough to let 
loose electrons out of his 1200 CCA winter AGM.

clay 

“I think it’s time we stopped  our cringing embarrassment about our history, 
about our traditions, and about our culture, and we stop this general bout of 
self-recrimination and wetness.”

B. Johnson
01/09/2020

> On Sep 19, 2020, at 12:52 PM, Scott Ritchey via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> Me too.  Back in the day it seemed batteries died gradually but now it's
> sudden death in my experience.  Jumper cables are OK but you need an second,
> healthy car.  What is the consensus about these Lithium-ion jump packs?
> I bought a Noco Genius Boost Plus GB40 1000 Amp jump pack.  Looked nice and
> I watched a glowing YouTube review.  But it failed totally when my
> 13-year-old AGM tractor battery quit.  That jump pack tried to crank (twice)
> with almost no effect and then gave up indicating the Li-ion bat was over
> the temp limit.  That jump pack started at 100% charge and still showed 50%
> when it quit.  A big disappointment.
> I recently bought an Audew 2000A Peak 2mAh jump pack which showed good
> results (much better than Nico) on a Project Farm YouTube review.  In that
> review the guy actually tested several brands.  I haven't needed it yet (and
> hopefully won't) so I've no actual experience.
> My Outback has a USB outlet in the cargo area which is powered when the car
> is running so I leave the jump pack there, plugged in to charge.
> Andrew's point about towing insurance makes more sense in urban areas, IMO.
> Living in a very rural area, I prefer self-rescue vs waiting for a tow truck
> or a good Samaritan (who could turn out to be a crook).
> Scott
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: Mercedes On Behalf Of Allan Streib via Mercedes
> 
> In my experience, batteries are fine, until suddenly they are not.
> 
> They can overnight go from starting fine to not having enough juice to even
> turn the engine.
> 
> If your battery is seven years old I'd advise replacing it, or at least
> carrying a set of jumper cables in your car (few people do these days, so
> it's often hard to find someone who can give you a jump if you don't have
> cables handy).
> 
> Allan
> 
> Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes  writes:
> 
> 
> 
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> 
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> 


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Re: [MBZ] Batteries, was: Daimler cheated too? (I'm sure VW feels better now)

[Scott Ritchey via Mercedes]

Here is that PF YouTube review:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JN8A2nIMUWA=youtu.be=6



-Original Message-
From: Scott Ritchey 
Sent: Saturday, September 19, 2020 4:52 PM
To: 'Mercedes Discussion List' 
Subject: RE: [MBZ] Batteries, was: Daimler cheated too? (I'm sure VW feels
better now)

Me too.  Back in the day it seemed batteries died gradually but now it's
sudden death in my experience.  Jumper cables are OK but you need an second,
healthy car.  What is the consensus about these Lithium-ion jump packs?
I bought a Noco Genius Boost Plus GB40 1000 Amp jump pack.  Looked nice and
I watched a glowing YouTube review.  But it failed totally when my
13-year-old AGM tractor battery quit.  That jump pack tried to crank (twice)
with almost no effect and then gave up indicating the Li-ion bat was over
the temp limit.  That jump pack started at 100% charge and still showed 50%
when it quit.  A big disappointment.
I recently bought an Audew 2000A Peak 2mAh jump pack which showed good
results (much better than Nico) on a Project Farm YouTube review.  In that
review the guy actually tested several brands.  I haven't needed it yet (and
hopefully won't) so I've no actual experience.
My Outback has a USB outlet in the cargo area which is powered when the car
is running so I leave the jump pack there, plugged in to charge.
Andrew's point about towing insurance makes more sense in urban areas, IMO.
Living in a very rural area, I prefer self-rescue vs waiting for a tow truck
or a good Samaritan (who could turn out to be a crook).
Scott


-Original Message-
From: Mercedes On Behalf Of Allan Streib via Mercedes

In my experience, batteries are fine, until suddenly they are not.

They can overnight go from starting fine to not having enough juice to even
turn the engine.

If your battery is seven years old I'd advise replacing it, or at least
carrying a set of jumper cables in your car (few people do these days, so
it's often hard to find someone who can give you a jump if you don't have
cables handy).

Allan

Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes  writes:




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Re: [MBZ] Batteries, was: Daimler cheated too? (I'm sure VW feels better now)

[Scott Ritchey via Mercedes]

Me too.  Back in the day it seemed batteries died gradually but now it's
sudden death in my experience.  Jumper cables are OK but you need an second,
healthy car.  What is the consensus about these Lithium-ion jump packs?
I bought a Noco Genius Boost Plus GB40 1000 Amp jump pack.  Looked nice and
I watched a glowing YouTube review.  But it failed totally when my
13-year-old AGM tractor battery quit.  That jump pack tried to crank (twice)
with almost no effect and then gave up indicating the Li-ion bat was over
the temp limit.  That jump pack started at 100% charge and still showed 50%
when it quit.  A big disappointment.
I recently bought an Audew 2000A Peak 2mAh jump pack which showed good
results (much better than Nico) on a Project Farm YouTube review.  In that
review the guy actually tested several brands.  I haven't needed it yet (and
hopefully won't) so I've no actual experience.
My Outback has a USB outlet in the cargo area which is powered when the car
is running so I leave the jump pack there, plugged in to charge.
Andrew's point about towing insurance makes more sense in urban areas, IMO.
Living in a very rural area, I prefer self-rescue vs waiting for a tow truck
or a good Samaritan (who could turn out to be a crook).
Scott


-Original Message-
From: Mercedes On Behalf Of Allan Streib via Mercedes

In my experience, batteries are fine, until suddenly they are not.

They can overnight go from starting fine to not having enough juice to even
turn the engine.

If your battery is seven years old I'd advise replacing it, or at least
carrying a set of jumper cables in your car (few people do these days, so
it's often hard to find someone who can give you a jump if you don't have
cables handy).

Allan

Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes  writes:



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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[dan--- via Mercedes]

Nope. There’s one eBay seller who has some “reconditioned” battery packs, 
whatever that means. I asked for clarification but have yet to get a response.

I went ahead and bought a set of 10 cells that were highly rated off a solid 
(domestic) Amazon seller. Cost me a little under $30 for the set of 10. They 
have solder tabs as do the originals, so I’ll be deconstructing the old pack as 
a template to build the new one, shouldn’t be difficult.

All is well in Florida. Staying away from all the blue hairs, as they don’t 
seem to be taking any of this shelter in place stuff seriously.

-D

> On Mar 29, 2020, at 9:15 PM, Rick Hawkins Java Letterpress Cycles Photon 
>  wrote:
> 
> Hey, dan,
> 
> Can’t you buy the battery pack you need on ebay or amazon?
> 
> I recently fixed a dyson and a roomba and battery packs were dirt cheap on 
> amazon
> 
> Also if you build packs, in less you have cells with solder tabs, the cells 
> are spot welded together ... places like batteries plus can often do that but 
> they aren’t usually cheap unless you are buddies with them
> 
> How are you doing?
> 
> Xx rick


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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

> On October 20, 2017 at 1:01 PM Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes 
>  wrote:
> 
> 
> No idea where to get a Bosch battery around here.

Maybe Pep Boys, where everybody else said they got theirs?
https://stores.pepboys.com/md/laurel/13344-laurel-bowie-rd.html

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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

No idea where to get a Bosch battery around here.

On Fri, Oct 20, 2017 at 8:26 AM, rogerhga--- via Mercedes <
mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:

> I've used the Bosch 49 battery with both of my 617 engines (123, 116).
> They fit perfect, last a long time, and have a great warranty. The price
> has gone up a lot. My last purchase not that many years ago was only
> $99.00. If you have a 116, 123, or 126, I think you'll be very satisfied
> with this battery.
> Just some info to add...
> Best Wishes,
> Roger
> Roger Hale
> Dinnerware Classics, Inc.
> Monroe, Ga.
> 770-267-0850
> www.dinnerwareclassics.com
>
>
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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[rogerhga--- via Mercedes]

I've used the Bosch 49 battery with both of my 617 engines (123, 116). They fit 
perfect, last a long time, and have a great warranty. The price has gone up a 
lot. My last purchase not that many years ago was only $99.00. If you have a 
116, 123, or 126, I think you'll be very satisfied with this battery. 
Just some info to add... 
Best Wishes, 
Roger 
Roger Hale 
Dinnerware Classics, Inc. 
Monroe, Ga. 
770-267-0850 
www.dinnerwareclassics.com 


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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[fmiser via Mercedes]

> Fred wrote:

> My '85 TD needed a new battery and PEP Boys had a Group 49 Bosch
> on promo, so I bought one. ($132.74 - $50 gift card and $5
> coupon).

Nice!

> The H8 (Autozone) that was in there did not quite fit, the 49
> however fits like it was made for it. (Maybe it was).

The BCI chart I have indicates the H8 is the DIN equivalent of an
BCI group 49 - so they are _supposed_ to be the same.  Thus either
one should "fit like it was made for it".  Make me wonder about
the AutoZone battery.

Here is a chart I built showing the DIN and EN numbers as well as
the BCI. I have failed to figure out why there are two DIN
numbers...

NOTE 1: all of these batteries are 175 mm wide, so I did not
list that dimension.

NOTE 2: The batteries with a "b4" holddown may be a problem
for 123 cars.  I don't know the clamping range of the
factory clips.

NOTE 3: This chart is in the same order as the last listing -
descending volume as calculated from the maximum
exterior dimensions.  With all else equal, greater
volume should equal greater capacity - unless the
calculated volume does not compare to the internal
volume.  

| BCI |DIN| EN   | length | height | Holddown |
|-+-+-+--+++--|
|  49 | H8  | L5  | 88L5 |354 |190 | b3   |
|  93 | T8  | LB5 | 88LB |354 |175 | b3   |
| 94R | H7  | L4  | 77L4 |315 |190 | b3   |
|  92 | T7  | LB4 | 77LB |315 |175 | b3   |
| 98R | H6  | 3   | 66L3 |283 |190 | b4   |
|  48 | H6  | L3  | 66L3 |278 |190 | b3   |
|  41 | T65 | | 54LB |293 |175 | b4   |
| 40R | T6  | LB3 | 66LB |278 |175 | b1   |
|  91 | T6  | LB3 | 66LB |278 |175 | b3   |
| 97R | H5  | L6  |  |252 |190 | b4   |
|  47 | H5  | L2  | 55L2 |242 |190 | b3   |
| 96R | | |  |242 |175 | b5   |
|  90 | T5  | LB2 | 45LB |242 |175 | b3   |
|  42 | T5  | LB2 | 45LB |242 |175 | b4   |
| 67R | | |  |132 |176 | b2   |
| 99R | T4  | LB1 | 36LB |210 |175 | b3   |

Holddowns
 b1 - 10.5 mm high, long side only
 b2 - ?? high, short side only
 b3 - 10.5 mm high on long and short sides
 b4 - 19.0 mm high, long side only
 b5 - ?? high, long side only

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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

> On October 19, 2017 at 7:54 PM Fred Moir via Mercedes  
> wrote:
> 
> 
> Andrew.
> 
> By the label:-
> 
> 850 at 0c
> 
> 1000 at 32c

850 CCA, 1000 CA. Pretty standard for a 49.
It's good to know that an H8 isn't exactly a 49. I knew a 93 was slightly 
different, but don't remember why. IIRC all the 116,123,126 etc came with 49s 
in them. 

Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Fred Moir via Mercedes]

Andrew.

By the label:-

850 at 0c

1000 at 32c


Fred Moir.
Lynn MA.
Diesel preferred.



From: Mercedes <mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com> on behalf of Andrew Strasfogel 
via Mercedes <mercedes@okiebenz.com>
Sent: 19 October 2017 17:27
To: Mercedes Discussion List
Cc: Andrew Strasfogel; Meade Dillon
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Batteries

How many CCAs?
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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Craig via Mercedes]

On Thu, 19 Oct 2017 21:10:41 + Fred Moir via Mercedes
 wrote:

> Alles.
> 
> My '85 TD needed a new battery and PEP Boys had a Group 49 Bosch on
> promo, so I bought one. ($132.74 - $50 gift card and $5 coupon).

That is the one that is in the '82 240D/3.0 Kaleb now has. It worked just
fine for us. I also got it on special from Pep Boys ...


> The H8 (Autozone) that was in there did not quite fit, the 49 however
> fits like it was made for it. (Maybe it was).

Maybe it was ...


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

How many CCAs?

On Oct 19, 2017 5:13 PM, "Max Dillon via Mercedes" 
wrote:

> Sounds like a good deal, let us know how it holds up.
> --
> Max Dillon
> Charleston SC
> '87 300TD
> '95 E300
>
> On October 19, 2017 5:10:41 PM EDT, Fred Moir via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >Alles.
> >
> >My '85 TD needed a new battery and PEP Boys had a Group 49 Bosch on
> >promo, so I bought one. ($132.74 - $50 gift card and $5 coupon).
> >
> >The H8 (Autozone) that was in there did not quite fit, the 49 however
> >fits like it was made for it. (Maybe it was).
> >
> >YMMV
> >
> >Fred.
> >
> >
> >Fred Moir.
> >Lynn MA.
> >Diesel preferred.
> >___
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> >
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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

How many CCAs?

On Oct 19, 2017 5:13 PM, "Max Dillon via Mercedes" 
wrote:

> Sounds like a good deal, let us know how it holds up.
> --
> Max Dillon
> Charleston SC
> '87 300TD
> '95 E300
>
> On October 19, 2017 5:10:41 PM EDT, Fred Moir via Mercedes <
> mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote:
> >Alles.
> >
> >My '85 TD needed a new battery and PEP Boys had a Group 49 Bosch on
> >promo, so I bought one. ($132.74 - $50 gift card and $5 coupon).
> >
> >The H8 (Autozone) that was in there did not quite fit, the 49 however
> >fits like it was made for it. (Maybe it was).
> >
> >YMMV
> >
> >Fred.
> >
> >
> >Fred Moir.
> >Lynn MA.
> >Diesel preferred.
> >___
> >http://www.okiebenz.com
> >
> >To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/
> >
> >To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:
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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Max Dillon via Mercedes]

Sounds like a good deal, let us know how it holds up.
-- 
Max Dillon
Charleston SC
'87 300TD
'95 E300

On October 19, 2017 5:10:41 PM EDT, Fred Moir via Mercedes 
 wrote:
>Alles.
>
>My '85 TD needed a new battery and PEP Boys had a Group 49 Bosch on
>promo, so I bought one. ($132.74 - $50 gift card and $5 coupon).
>
>The H8 (Autozone) that was in there did not quite fit, the 49 however
>fits like it was made for it. (Maybe it was).
>
>YMMV
>
>Fred.
>
>
>Fred Moir.
>Lynn MA.
>Diesel preferred.
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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

I never heard about any shut down of US lead mining.  Please send me a link
to this story.

On Fri, Nov 21, 2014 at 7:13 AM, Mitch Haley via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes wrote:

 What's the difference between a group 49 and the cheaper one?


 I really don't know what the difference is between 49, 93, T8 and H8.
 There's none that I can see.
 Apparently H8 is the new name for 49, and T8 is the same as 93, but
 what's the difference between 49 and 93?
 Mitch.


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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

 

 On November 21, 2014 at 9:28 AM Andrew Strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com
 wrote:
 
  I never heard about any shut down of US lead mining. Please send me a link to
 this story.
 

 

Not mining, smelting.
Where have you been for the past year?
http://www.factcheck.org/2013/12/no-back-door-gun-control/
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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

Missouri has what is/was known as the lead belt, somewhat of a misnomer
as they are also major source of Zn.

Andrew
Recovering geologist

On Fri, Nov 21, 2014 at 10:10 AM, Mitch Haley via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:



  On November 21, 2014 at 9:44 AM Andrew Strasfogel astrasfo...@gmail.com
 
  wrote:
 
   Previous comments suggested US lead production had ceased. Than can be
 no
  production w/o mining, which AFAIK is still permitted.
 

 With no primary smelters (the kind that refine ore dug from the ground), I
 don't
 know how much mining is currently taking place. Anything dug out of the
 ground
 gets exported now that there's no place to smelt it here. I suspect
 there's a
 good bit of demand in China but I don't know if they have their own mining
 sources.


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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

Winter hell, its only mid-autumn and its been below freezing every morning this 
week at my house.

-Curt
  From: arche...@embarqmail.com arche...@embarqmail.com
 To: Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com 
 Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2014 9:53 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Batteries
   

Yeah, it probably wouldn't work up north in the winter and might not work down 
here in the winter. Even a pair of them (450 CCA) might not work in the winter.
Gerry



Curt Raymond wrote:
 Might work reasonably well when its warm out but 225CCA is 1/4 what a group 
 49 battery is capable of. Based on the price it sounds like capacity is sold 
 linearly...
 -Curt
      From: archer75--- via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
  To: Craig diese...@pisquared.net; Mercedes Discussion List 
mercedes@okiebenz.com 
  Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2014 8:12 PM
  Subject: Re: [MBZ] Batteries
    
 When I was bench testing several alternators last summer, I put the shop 
 battery, a $29.xx 225 CCA garden tractor battery, in the '83 300D; drove to 
 town with A/C on, went to several stores, and drove home with no problem.
 Thought about installing 2 in parallel ($58.xx) so car would still start if 
 one went bad, but tray was not quite long enough.
 Gerry...who likes to experiment
 
 
 
 Craig wrote:
  Since the battery in our '82 240D/3.0 died last week, I went looking for
  a replacement battery for it.
  WOW! Have battery prices gone through the roof!
  AutoZone wanted $150 - $175.
  NAPA wanted $184.
  Thanks,
  Craig
 
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 individuals are responsible for the content of the post.  The list owner has 
 no control over the content of the messages of each contributor.
 
 
  
 
 
 -
 No virus found in this message.
 Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
 Version: 2015.0.5577 / Virus Database: 4213/8603 - Release Date: 11/20/14


-- 
arche...@embarqmail.com arche...@embarqmail.com

  
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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[MG via Mercedes]

Just bought a used battery for my TD about two weeks ago. The 
local Upull had 6 big batteries with the audi symbol on them. I 
decided to give one a try at $60. Took out the 4 year old 
autozone gold that wouldn't start the car any more and lifted in 
the used one. First thing I noticed was that the 'new' used 
battery was about half again heavier then the AZ gold. So far 
even at the 24deg that it was here on Monday the battery didn't 
have any problem starting the car. I like it and at $60 I can buy 
two of them if this one fails in a couple of years, if they still 
continue to carry them.


Manfred

Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2014 19:47:28 + (UTC)
From: Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com

Yeah, I paid $125 for a group 48 for the Jetta at Car Quest last 
year. If you've got a Car Quest try them, my local Autozone 
wanted $150.

-Curt
  From: Craig via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
 Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2014 2:12 PM
 Subject: [MBZ] Batteries

Since the battery in our '82 240D/3.0 died last week, I went 
looking for

a replacement battery for it.

WOW! Have battery prices gone through the roof!

AutoZone wanted $150 - $175.
NAPA wanted $184.

Is that the case across the U.S.?

Thanks,


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

 On November 21, 2014 at 1:05 PM Curt Raymond via Mercedes
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:


 Winter hell, its only mid-autumn and its been below freezing every morning
 this week at my house.
 
At my house it's been below freezing every minute this week, and below 15°F
every morning.
Brrr.
 
Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[MG via Mercedes]

My granddaughter was sitting here reading with me, she's 9 and 
she said it was 44. ;-) I think she may be right.


Manfred

Date: Fri, 21 Nov 2014 07:13:55 -0500
From: Mitch Haley mi...@mitchellhaley.com

 but
what's the difference between 49 and 93?
Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Scott Ritchey via Mercedes]

And yet, This is the hottest fall on record according to the global warming 
watchers!

 -Original Message-
 From: Mercedes [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of
 Curt Raymond via Mercedes
 Sent: Friday, November 21, 2014 1:05 PM
 To: arche...@embarqmail.com; Diesel List
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Batteries
 
 Winter hell, its only mid-autumn and its been below freezing every morning
 this week at my house.
 
 -Curt


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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Curly McLain via Mercedes]

When you distort the data  (or just make it up) your statistics can 
prove whatever you want.


Read the book  How to Lie with Statistics  50's cartoons, but still 
right on the money.





And yet, This is the hottest fall on record according to the global 
warming watchers!



 -Original Message-
 From: Mercedes [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of
 Curt Raymond via Mercedes
 Sent: Friday, November 21, 2014 1:05 PM
 To: arche...@embarqmail.com; Diesel List
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Batteries

 Winter hell, its only mid-autumn and its been below freezing every morning
 this week at my house.


  -Curt



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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes]

It's all Bush's fault and the republicans 

Sent from my iPhone

 On Nov 21, 2014, at 6:32 PM, Curly McLain via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
 When you distort the data  (or just make it up) your statistics can prove 
 whatever you want.
 
 Read the book  How to Lie with Statistics  50's cartoons, but still right 
 on the money.
 
 
 
 
 And yet, This is the hottest fall on record according to the global warming 
 watchers!
 
 -Original Message-
 From: Mercedes [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of
 Curt Raymond via Mercedes
 Sent: Friday, November 21, 2014 1:05 PM
 To: arche...@embarqmail.com; Diesel List
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Batteries
 
 Winter hell, its only mid-autumn and its been below freezing every morning
 this week at my house.
  -Curt
 
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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Meade Dillon via Mercedes]

Paid $20 for the used autocraft battery for The White Whale, I get a couple
years from it I'll be happy.

Max Dillon,
Charleston SC
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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Curly McLain via Mercedes]

Advanced auto with the online order and 20 - 30% discounts brings it 
down to $125 or so.


Or, if you buy the other size  (84 maybe?) it will be 80-90 wiht the 
discount.  Same CCA and it fits like a group 49.  a couple mm 
difference in the case, be WAY cheaper than a group 49.


Batteries and tars:  prices are crazy high.


Since the battery in our '82 240D/3.0 died last week, I went looking for
a replacement battery for it.

WOW! Have battery prices gone through the roof!

AutoZone wanted $150 - $175.
NAPA wanted $184.

Is that the case across the U.S.?

Thanks,

Craig


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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Mitch Haley via Mercedes]

Craig via Mercedes wrote:

Since the battery in our '82 240D/3.0 died last week, I went looking for
a replacement battery for it.

WOW! Have battery prices gone through the roof!

AutoZone wanted $150 - $175.
NAPA wanted $184.

Is that the case across the U.S.?


Yep.

You buy them online (store pickup) from Advance Auto with a $50 off on $125 
purchase coupon. Ten years ago I'd just pick one up off the shelf at Autozone or 
Wal-Mart for $60.


http://www.fatwallet.com/forums/hot-deals/1405075/

Mitch.

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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

Yeah, I paid $125 for a group 48 for the Jetta at Car Quest last year. If 
you've got a Car Quest try them, my local Autozone wanted $150.
-Curt
  From: Craig via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2014 2:12 PM
 Subject: [MBZ] Batteries
   
Since the battery in our '82 240D/3.0 died last week, I went looking for
a replacement battery for it.

WOW! Have battery prices gone through the roof!

AutoZone wanted $150 - $175.
NAPA wanted $184.

Is that the case across the U.S.?

Thanks,


Craig

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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Fred Moir via Mercedes]

Craig, et alloya.Just had to have Autozone put a new battery into the Jetta, 
$159 plus $11 for the Guvnah. Started reluctantly this a.m. Though not a 
surprise.I just stood there and watched, didn't have to touch it, less than 5 
minutes and good to go.

Fred Moir.Lynn MA.Diesel preferred.

 Date: Thu, 20 Nov 2014 12:12:22 -0700
 To: mercedes@okiebenz.com
 Subject: [MBZ] Batteries
 From: mercedes@okiebenz.com
 
 Since the battery in our '82 240D/3.0 died last week, I went looking for
 a replacement battery for it.
 
 WOW! Have battery prices gone through the roof!
 
 AutoZone wanted $150 - $175.
 NAPA wanted $184.
 
 Is that the case across the U.S.?
Thanks,
Craig
  
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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Tim Crone via Mercedes]

On Nov 20, 2014 2:12 PM, Craig via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com.

 Is that the case across the U.S.?

Sam's is still  $120 with a three year warranty, at least here in NC.

Best,
Tim

 Thanks,


 Craig

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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Andrew Strasfogel via Mercedes]

I think I paid $135 at Sears for their largest Diehard;  they also
collected the old battery.

On Thu, Nov 20, 2014 at 4:03 PM, Tim Crone via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 On Nov 20, 2014 2:12 PM, Craig via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com.
 
  Is that the case across the U.S.?

 Sam's is still  $120 with a three year warranty, at least here in NC.

 Best,
 Tim

  Thanks,
 
 
  Craig
 
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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Randy Bennell via Mercedes]

On 20/11/2014 1:12 PM, Craig via Mercedes wrote:

Since the battery in our '82 240D/3.0 died last week, I went looking for
a replacement battery for it.

WOW! Have battery prices gone through the roof!

AutoZone wanted $150 - $175.
NAPA wanted $184.

Is that the case across the U.S.?

Thanks,


Craig


The battery makers heard we were all going to get out of dirty oil 
consuming cars and into electric vehicles and decided to get more profit 
at the outset instead of waiting for the volume to make them wealthy.


RB

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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[rogerhga--- via Mercedes]

WOW.  Batteries have gone up more than my Obamacare insurance.  I purchased 
Bosch group 49 from PepBoys for both of my old 617s.  They prorated one this 
summer that my alternator ruined, so it must have been within their 3 yr 
warranty and it was $109 or $119 when I purchased it.  They are now $179.  What 
is going on in the battery market?  Are batteries trying to keep up with motor 
oil prices? 
Good luck Craig on whatever you get.  I really like the Bosch, but I may not be 
able to afford them the next time around. 
Best Wishes, 
Roger 
Roger Hale 
Dinnerware Classics, Inc. 
Monroe, Ga. 
770-267-0850 
www.dinnerwareclassics.com  (new) 
www.southernnightsantiques.com  (antique) 

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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

I suspect a good part of the increase in price WAS due to increased shipping 
costs, batteries are heavy after all. It all makes me wonder if electric cars 
have something to do with it but AFAIK they don't use lead acid batteries...
-Curt
  From: rogerhga--- via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2014 5:45 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Batteries
   
WOW.  Batteries have gone up more than my Obamacare insurance.  I purchased 
Bosch group 49 from PepBoys for both of my old 617s.  They prorated one this 
summer that my alternator ruined, so it must have been within their 3 yr 
warranty and it was $109 or $119 when I purchased it.  They are now $179.  What 
is going on in the battery market?  Are batteries trying to keep up with motor 
oil prices? 
Good luck Craig on whatever you get.  I really like the Bosch, but I may not be 
able to afford them the next time around. 
Best Wishes, 
Roger 
Roger Hale 
Dinnerware Classics, Inc. 
Monroe, Ga. 
770-267-0850 
www.dinnerwareclassics.com  (new) 
www.southernnightsantiques.com  (antique) 

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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Scott Ritchey via Mercedes]

Lead cost?  I understand that all US smelting was shut down in 2013 for 
environmental reasons: 
http://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews/constitution/item/16881-epa-closure-of-last-lead-smelting-plant-to-impact-ammunition-production

I guess lead has other applications (other than ammo).  There is a lot of new 
non-lead ammo available these days.  Probably not so many non-lead batteries.


 -Original Message-
 From: Mercedes [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of
 rogerhga--- via Mercedes
 Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2014 5:45 PM
 To: mercedes@okiebenz.com
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Batteries
 
 WOW.  Batteries have gone up more than my Obamacare insurance.  I
 purchased Bosch group 49 from PepBoys for both of my old 617s.  They
 prorated one this summer that my alternator ruined, so it must have been
 within their 3 yr warranty and it was $109 or $119 when I purchased it.  They
 are now $179.  What is going on in the battery market?  Are batteries trying
 to keep up with motor oil prices?
 Good luck Craig on whatever you get.  I really like the Bosch, but I may not 
 be
 able to afford them the next time around.
 Best Wishes,
 Roger
 Roger Hale
 Dinnerware Classics, Inc.
 Monroe, Ga.
 770-267-0850
 www.dinnerwareclassics.com  (new)
 www.southernnightsantiques.com  (antique)
 
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 no
 control over the content of the messages of each contributor.


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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[archer75--- via Mercedes]

When I was bench testing several alternators last summer, I put the shop 
battery, a $29.xx 225 CCA garden tractor battery, in the '83 300D; drove to 
town with A/C on, went to several stores, and drove home with no problem.
Thought about installing 2 in parallel ($58.xx) so car would still start if one 
went bad, but tray was not quite long enough.
Gerry...who likes to experiment

Craig wrote:
 Since the battery in our '82 240D/3.0 died last week, I went looking for
 a replacement battery for it.
 WOW! Have battery prices gone through the roof!
 AutoZone wanted $150 - $175.
 NAPA wanted $184.
 Thanks,
 Craig

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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[G Mann via Mercedes]

I recently had the WHOW what the heck is happening to battery cost
discussion with my supplier when I purchased a pair of 8D 1000 cca
batteries for my new [to me] Mercedes bus and discussed the purchase of 10
group 31 batteries to use as the solar battery bank.

The answers I got seems to make sense. 1. Lead is now an EPA controlled
substance which requires draconian handling rules and systems be in place
for the manufacturers. 2. Many battery manufacturers have gone out of
business in the past 5 to 8 years so even if a battery carries a brand
name it is likely made by one of only two companies that now totally
dominate the market.

Old capitalism rule.. competition breeds product pricing competition. What
we had no longer exists, thus, price goes up..

Add to that, the production of new lead from mines has been shut down [EPA
draconian rules again] so scarcity of raw material is perceived to drive up
cost to build.

Ah... for the good old days... when an ounce of gold would buy a new
suit, a steak meal, a bottle of whiskey, and a night at the best sporting
house in town.

Grant...


On Thu, Nov 20, 2014 at 6:12 PM, archer75--- via Mercedes 
mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:

 When I was bench testing several alternators last summer, I put the shop
 battery, a $29.xx 225 CCA garden tractor battery, in the '83 300D; drove to
 town with A/C on, went to several stores, and drove home with no problem.
 Thought about installing 2 in parallel ($58.xx) so car would still start
 if one went bad, but tray was not quite long enough.
 Gerry...who likes to experiment

 Craig wrote:
  Since the battery in our '82 240D/3.0 died last week, I went looking for
  a replacement battery for it.
  WOW! Have battery prices gone through the roof!
  AutoZone wanted $150 - $175.
  NAPA wanted $184.
  Thanks,
  Craig

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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Curt Raymond via Mercedes]

Might work reasonably well when its warm out but 225CCA is 1/4 what a group 49 
battery is capable of. Based on the price it sounds like capacity is sold 
linearly...
-Curt
  From: archer75--- via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com
 To: Craig diese...@pisquared.net; Mercedes Discussion List 
mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 Sent: Thursday, November 20, 2014 8:12 PM
 Subject: Re: [MBZ] Batteries
   
When I was bench testing several alternators last summer, I put the shop 
battery, a $29.xx 225 CCA garden tractor battery, in the '83 300D; drove to 
town with A/C on, went to several stores, and drove home with no problem.
Thought about installing 2 in parallel ($58.xx) so car would still start if one 
went bad, but tray was not quite long enough.
Gerry...who likes to experiment



Craig wrote:
 Since the battery in our '82 240D/3.0 died last week, I went looking for
 a replacement battery for it.
 WOW! Have battery prices gone through the roof!
 AutoZone wanted $150 - $175.
 NAPA wanted $184.
 Thanks,
 Craig

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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Curly McLain via Mercedes]

I recently had the WHOW what the heck is happening to battery cost
discussion with my supplier when I purchased a pair of 8D 1000 cca
batteries for my new [to me] Mercedes bus and discussed the purchase of 10
group 31 batteries to use as the solar battery bank.

The answers I got seems to make sense. 1. Lead is now an EPA controlled
substance which requires draconian handling rules and systems be in place
for the manufacturers. 2. Many battery manufacturers have gone out of
business in the past 5 to 8 years so even if a battery carries a brand
name it is likely made by one of only two companies that now totally
dominate the market.

Old capitalism rule.. competition breeds product pricing competition. What
we had no longer exists, thus, price goes up..

Add to that, the production of new lead from mines has been shut down [EPA
draconian rules again] so scarcity of raw material is perceived to drive up
cost to build.

Ah... for the good old days... when an ounce of gold would buy a new
suit, a steak meal, a bottle of whiskey, and a night at the best sporting
house in town.

Grant...




 The 2 left must have jiggered the regs (we don't need laws anymore) 
so that batteries can't be imported from other countries too.  No 
Mexican of Chinee batteries on the shelf.   Howcome?  It ain't 
freight cost.


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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes]

I have had to buy 2 batteries in the last couple of weeks, had a couple sitting 
around and now won't hold a charge. I bought mine at Walmart for about $125. I 
need a couple more and will check SAMs also. Yes they seem to have gone up 
quite a bit.

Sent from my iPhone

 On Nov 20, 2014, at 1:12 PM, Craig via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
 Since the battery in our '82 240D/3.0 died last week, I went looking for
 a replacement battery for it.
 
 WOW! Have battery prices gone through the roof!
 
 AutoZone wanted $150 - $175.
 NAPA wanted $184.
 
 Is that the case across the U.S.?
 
 Thanks,
 
 
 Craig
 
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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes]

What's the difference between a group 49 and the cheaper one?

Sent from my iPhone

 On Nov 20, 2014, at 1:30 PM, Curly McLain via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
 Advanced auto with the online order and 20 - 30% discounts brings it down to 
 $125 or so.
 
 Or, if you buy the other size  (84 maybe?) it will be 80-90 wiht the 
 discount.  Same CCA and it fits like a group 49.  a couple mm difference in 
 the case, be WAY cheaper than a group 49.
 
 Batteries and tars:  prices are crazy high.
 
 Since the battery in our '82 240D/3.0 died last week, I went looking for
 a replacement battery for it.
 
 WOW! Have battery prices gone through the roof!
 
 AutoZone wanted $150 - $175.
 NAPA wanted $184.
 
 Is that the case across the U.S.?
 
 Thanks,
 
 Craig
 
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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Kaleb C. Striplin via Mercedes]

Well it says something when I can take dead batteries from parts cars down to 
the crusher and they pay $15 each.

Sent from my iPhone

 On Nov 20, 2014, at 7:45 PM, G Mann via Mercedes mercedes@okiebenz.com 
 wrote:
 
 I recently had the WHOW what the heck is happening to battery cost
 discussion with my supplier when I purchased a pair of 8D 1000 cca
 batteries for my new [to me] Mercedes bus and discussed the purchase of 10
 group 31 batteries to use as the solar battery bank.
 
 The answers I got seems to make sense. 1. Lead is now an EPA controlled
 substance which requires draconian handling rules and systems be in place
 for the manufacturers. 2. Many battery manufacturers have gone out of
 business in the past 5 to 8 years so even if a battery carries a brand
 name it is likely made by one of only two companies that now totally
 dominate the market.
 
 Old capitalism rule.. competition breeds product pricing competition. What
 we had no longer exists, thus, price goes up..
 
 Add to that, the production of new lead from mines has been shut down [EPA
 draconian rules again] so scarcity of raw material is perceived to drive up
 cost to build.
 
 Ah... for the good old days... when an ounce of gold would buy a new
 suit, a steak meal, a bottle of whiskey, and a night at the best sporting
 house in town.
 
 Grant...
 
 
 On Thu, Nov 20, 2014 at 6:12 PM, archer75--- via Mercedes 
 mercedes@okiebenz.com wrote:
 
 When I was bench testing several alternators last summer, I put the shop
 battery, a $29.xx 225 CCA garden tractor battery, in the '83 300D; drove to
 town with A/C on, went to several stores, and drove home with no problem.
 Thought about installing 2 in parallel ($58.xx) so car would still start
 if one went bad, but tray was not quite long enough.
 Gerry...who likes to experiment
 
 Craig wrote:
 Since the battery in our '82 240D/3.0 died last week, I went looking for
 a replacement battery for it.
 WOW! Have battery prices gone through the roof!
 AutoZone wanted $150 - $175.
 NAPA wanted $184.
 Thanks,
 Craig
 
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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Curly McLain via Mercedes]

What's the difference between a group 49 and the cheaper one?



Group 93 fits and can be the same CCA  it is a couple mm different, 
but a bunch cheaper the last time I bought one.   No idea why there 
are 2 sizes that are essentially the same, but one is 10-20% cheaper.


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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Dan Penoff]

I got my nose out of joint after Sears started referring to their DieHards for 
foreign cars as international versions, and charged significantly more than a 
good old group 24/30 battery, even if the required battery was essentially the 
same size or CCA rating.  The stealership can still be a good value, but they 
are across town, so it's not convenient for me.  For that matter, my local Ford 
stealership wanted to replace the battery in one of my Focii, which did need 
replacement, and I think they quoted me $100 to do it, which isn't bad at all.

I go to Interstate and FLAPS, both of which I have had good experiences with.  
Seems that down here you can typically get 5-6 years out of a good quality 
battery, despite the heat being rough on them.

Dan


On Jan 20, 2013, at 8:08 PM, Dieselhead wrote:

 Best battery I ever had was a Motorcraft from the Frod stealer when I bought 
 my Escort Dissel.  The car was used for a few months.  It was a yr old and 
 had set on the lot for at least 6 months, and they let the battery run down.  
 They put in a new battery and I never even saw the battery for several years 
 until I stored the car when we moved to HI.  I wanted to take the battery out 
 for storage so I had to find it.  That motorcraft battery lasted 9 years.  2 
 of them were just sitting on a 2x6.  I was sure it would be nothing but a 
 core after two years, but i put it in the car and it fired right up.  I used 
 for a couple more years after that.
 
 That is as close to a new car battery I have been.  OE batteries used to be 
 good, but i suppose the bean counters found out they could buy half a battery 
 for 3/4 the price, so they bought em.
 
 Contrary to woger's experience, I never got more than a year out of a 
 die-easy.  Maybe they last longer in hanger queens.  I am not sure why woger 
 thinks a battery is related to accumulators.  In MB land, accumulators are 
 part of the SLS suspension.  Maybe for the non-moving porch, accumulator 
 means battery.  But then why would you need a battery for a porch?  
 Unfortunately the die-easy battery is as bad as the other junk snears sells.
 
 I've had fair service out of FLAPS group 49 batteries from oreally? 5-6 years 
 is not uncommon.
 

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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[OK Don]

I consistantly got more than the warranty life out of Diehards. I quit
buying them when a source of Interstates became more convenient. They also
last onger than the warranty period. Yes, it gets hot here, and cold. I do
use either a solar cell or a trickle charger when a battery is going to sit
for more than a couple of weeks.

On Sun, Jan 20, 2013 at 7:33 PM, Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote:

 I got my nose out of joint after Sears started referring to their DieHards
 for foreign cars as international versions, and charged significantly
 more than a good old group 24/30 battery, even if the required battery was
 essentially the same size or CCA rating.  The stealership can still be a
 good value, but they are across town, so it's not convenient for me.  For
 that matter, my local Ford stealership wanted to replace the battery in one
 of my Focii, which did need replacement, and I think they quoted me $100 to
 do it, which isn't bad at all.

 I go to Interstate and FLAPS, both of which I have had good experiences
 with.  Seems that down here you can typically get 5-6 years out of a good
 quality battery, despite the heat being rough on them.

 Dan




-- 
OK Don
2001 ML320
2012 Passat TDI DSG
1997 Plymouth Grand Voyager
1957 C182A
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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Rich Thomas]

Foci

--R (sent from my miniPad)

On Jan 20, 2013, at 10:33 PM, Dan Penoff d...@penoff.com wrote:

I got my nose out of joint after Sears started referring to their DieHards for 
foreign cars as international versions, and charged significantly more than a 
good old group 24/30 battery, even if the required battery was essentially the 
same size or CCA rating.  The stealership can still be a good value, but they 
are across town, so it's not convenient for me.  For that matter, my local Ford 
stealership wanted to replace the battery in one of my Focii, which did need 
replacement, and I think they quoted me $100 to do it, which isn't bad at all.

I go to Interstate and FLAPS, both of which I have had good experiences with.  
Seems that down here you can typically get 5-6 years out of a good quality 
battery, despite the heat being rough on them.

Dan


On Jan 20, 2013, at 8:08 PM, Dieselhead wrote:

 Best battery I ever had was a Motorcraft from the Frod stealer when I bought 
 my Escort Dissel.  The car was used for a few months.  It was a yr old and 
 had set on the lot for at least 6 months, and they let the battery run down.  
 They put in a new battery and I never even saw the battery for several years 
 until I stored the car when we moved to HI.  I wanted to take the battery out 
 for storage so I had to find it.  That motorcraft battery lasted 9 years.  2 
 of them were just sitting on a 2x6.  I was sure it would be nothing but a 
 core after two years, but i put it in the car and it fired right up.  I used 
 for a couple more years after that.
 
 That is as close to a new car battery I have been.  OE batteries used to be 
 good, but i suppose the bean counters found out they could buy half a battery 
 for 3/4 the price, so they bought em.
 
 Contrary to woger's experience, I never got more than a year out of a 
 die-easy.  Maybe they last longer in hanger queens.  I am not sure why woger 
 thinks a battery is related to accumulators.  In MB land, accumulators are 
 part of the SLS suspension.  Maybe for the non-moving porch, accumulator 
 means battery.  But then why would you need a battery for a porch?  
 Unfortunately the die-easy battery is as bad as the other junk snears sells.
 
 I've had fair service out of FLAPS group 49 batteries from oreally? 5-6 years 
 is not uncommon.

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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[clay monroe]

I was astounded the dang thing died in such short order.  I have sourced one 
battery per vehicle in the past decade.  Each replacement was for original 
batteries.  Toyota was a 92 model and got a fresh battery in 2000, I sold that 
last year with the same battery.  The 1995 E300D got a fresh one in 2004 when I 
got it ready for a summer cross country tour.  Gump got one in March 2004, 
which has been on a shelf in the garage since she went to the crusher.  type 
49, as a spare for the w124. Had to install a new battery in Frosch when I 
killed the charging system.

SWMBA had a honda civic that she allowed to eat batteries.  Something about not 
turning off headlamps, repeatedly.  It killed the original battery and that 
also had one battery replaced before I sold it off in 2002 to get the w124.

clay

On Jan 20, 2013, at 5:08 PM, Dieselhead wrote:

 Best battery I ever had was a Motorcraft from the Frod stealer when I bought 
 my Escort Dissel.  The car was used for a few months.  It was a yr old and 
 had set on the lot for at least 6 months, and they let the battery run down.  
 They put in a new battery and I never even saw the battery for several years 
 until I stored the car when we moved to HI.  I wanted to take the battery out 
 for storage so I had to find it.  That motorcraft battery lasted 9 years.  2 
 of them were just sitting on a 2x6.  I was sure it would be nothing but a 
 core after two years, but i put it in the car and it fired right up.  I used 
 for a couple more years after that.
 
 That is as close to a new car battery I have been.  OE batteries used to be 
 good, but i suppose the bean counters found out they could buy half a battery 
 for 3/4 the price, so they bought em.
 
 Contrary to woger's experience, I never got more than a year out of a 
 die-easy.  Maybe they last longer in hanger queens.  I am not sure why woger 
 thinks a battery is related to accumulators.  In MB land, accumulators are 
 part of the SLS suspension.  Maybe for the non-moving porch, accumulator 
 means battery.  But then why would you need a battery for a porch?  
 Unfortunately the die-easy battery is as bad as the other junk snears sells.
 
 I've had fair service out of FLAPS group 49 batteries from oreally? 5-6 years 
 is not uncommon.
 
  ..I did not take into account that new cars are sold with garbage
 battery.  No need to have another garbage battery go in...
 
 I don't think they are. Kia or Hyundai very likely buy their batteries by
 the millions and on average likely last a long time. Some don't.
 
 My 2008 C300's production date was Sept 2007 and it's AGM battery is still
 operating normally. One of these days it won't be and likely with no
 warning. That's what happened with my 2001 C320. One morning it wouldn't 
 crank fast
 enough to start so I gave it a one hour charge, got it going and headed to
 the dealer for a replacement. $110 or so installed, as I recall. With a
 warranty.
 
 Long ago I did get ten years out of a Sears Diehard in my 914-6 and when it
 became slow to crank after a month of inactivity, I replaced it. The
 original German battery in my '78 300D failed at just under four years so it 
 got a
 Sears battery which lasted another five years when I sold it.
 
 RLE
 
 
 
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Re: [MBZ] batteries (was: Re: 300CD on Jalopnik)

[WILTON]

'Just wish I could walk through one like I used to.  'A little tougher to 
get past mud holes on my scooter or pushing my walker.  Also, people see me 
on the scooter or pushing the walker and think I'm blind, deaf, dumb, 
stupid, ignorant and helpless.  Often, when I'm approaching a door on the 
scooter, people step out in front of to try to help me with door; I have 
to stop abruptly to keep from hitting them or running over their toes; then 
I've lost my momentum and it's hard to start again, especially it there's a 
slight incline at the door or to cross the threshold, etc.  Actually I can 
handle the doors very well myself, thank you.  I try to thank them for 
helping and try to be tactful; SWMBO, though, says I'm not very tactful.


Wilton

- Original Message - 
From: ernest breakfield erne...@backyardengineering.org

To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Sent: Thursday, August 20, 2009 12:53 PM
Subject: [MBZ] batteries (was: Re: 300CD on Jalopnik)



hi Curt!


Curt Raymond wrote:

Who doesn't want to live around the corner from a scrap yard? ;)



hand in air
   uh, me?   ;-)


Don't your battery retailers have a core charge when you get a new 
battery? Core charge is a ploy to get you to bring the old one back for 
proper disposal...




   i haven't bought many in the last few years, but not for the last 
couple of batteries i've bought; one for my BMW moto (bought at dealer at 
discount), and the other an Optima for my J**p at a Costco. (we've already 
discussed the MBZ batt.)



cheers!
e

[snippage]
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Re: [MBZ] batteries (was: Re: 300CD on Jalopnik)

[Allan Streib]

FWIW when I buy batteries at the Interstate dealer (which they install
for free) they do not charge for disposal.  Heck, they make money by
selling them to recyclers like Exide.  The recyclers grind them up,
separate the lead and make new batteries.

You can also bring any old batteries in and they will take them for you
at no charge.  The county also has a couple of places where you can do
this, also dump your old motor oil along with other household
recyclables (cans, plastic bottles, etc).

Allan

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Re: [MBZ] batteries (was: Re: 300CD on Jalopnik)

[Curt Raymond]

Ahh c'mon, I put an emoticon on that...

I'd forgotten about motorcycle batteries... All the car batteries I've ever 
bought had a core charge, even at Wal-Mart...

-Curt

Date: Thu, 20 Aug 2009 09:53:54 -0700
From: ernest breakfield erne...@backyardengineering.org
Subject: [MBZ] batteries (was: Re:  300CD on Jalopnik)
To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Message-ID: 4a8d7fa2.7020...@backyardengineering.org
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; Format=flowed

hi Curt!


Curt Raymond wrote:
 Who doesn't want to live around the corner from a scrap yard? ;)
   

hand in air
    uh, me?   ;-)



Don't your battery retailers have a core charge when you get a new
battery? Core charge is a ploy to get you to bring the old one back for
proper disposal...
   

    i haven't bought many in the last few years, but not for the last 
couple of batteries i've bought; one for my BMW moto (bought at dealer 
at discount), and the other an Optima for my J**p at a Costco. (we've 
already discussed the MBZ batt.)


cheers!
e



  
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Re: [MBZ] batteries

[RELNGSON]

 Call 1800mercedes and they will come and sell/install a battery for a 
 reasonable price, so I have learned from the list...
 
1-800-formercedes is closer to it. And the price will be dealer retail 
minus any discounts you are eligible for. Which is what you have to pay for 
that 
kind of service.

RLE





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Re: [MBZ] batteries

[ernest breakfield]

i just checked, and actually, the sticker on inside of the glove box 
door in our 300D says: 1-800-222-0100.
   that's the number i used, and amazingly enough after all these years 
it still gets you to Mercedes Customer Service.



cheers!
e


someone wrote:
Call 1800mercedes and they will come and sell/install a battery for a 
reasonable price, so I have learned from the list...





--
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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[RELNGSON]

 ..I used to work on the Telco equipment at Browns Ferry Nuclear Power 
 Plant.
 Our main switch, a Dimension 2000 (we called it the Demented 2000) supported
 1700 extensions. The system ran on a stack of Edison batteries that were
 housed  maintained in the next bay.
 
 The phone system was actually powered by the batteries 24/7. The batteries
 were kept charged by a huge charger that was backed up by a generator set.
 This configuration guaranteed 100% uptime since a loss of line power would
 just stop the batteries from charging.
 
 The batteries were huge clear glass cells that were wired in series to make
 48 volts. There were two banks of batteries so that one could be taken off
 line while the other was serviced.
 
 Our second modern system was a System 75 that supported an additional 750
 phone lines. This system had a more conventional UPS that measured 4' square
 by 4' tall...
 
This brings back memories since I also took care of an ATT Dimension 2000 
back in the day. You haven't lived until you have to clean up the mess 
resulting 
from some knucklehead upping the charge rate on the batteries causing them to 
boil over. Took the paint off the racks, the floors and ventilated my pants. 

The telco batteries and diesels I referred to were probably put in service in 
the twenties since they were in the sub-basement of the then Pacific Tel  
Tel Main CO which was built about that time. I saw it only a few times since 
the 
room was off limits but the engine was about twenty feet long and about eight 
feet high with a walkway along the side for service. Much like the ship 
engines of today. The masonry and concrete building was half a block on each 
side 
and ten stories high and when the diesel was started for it's weekly test, you 
could hear it (and feel it, I thought) throughout the structure.

RLE





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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Jim Cathey]

-My Subaru's been neglected while I've been driving the Benz and the 
Optima
I had in there went dead over the last stint.  Went to charge it 
yesterday
and it was taking a good 30+ amps for a while, then seemed to slow 
down.
Left it on there overnight and was sure it would be done this morning, 
but

low and behold it was pumping in more than 20 amps and the battery was
REALLY hissing, blowing smoke (or steam or whatever) and smelled 
something

like eggs...
I'm assuming that's no a good sign and the battery is probably toast, 
but
what causes that?  I guess I thought the gel cells didn't really do 
that...


It's dead, Jim.  30+ amps is too hot a charge for unattended use,
for safety reasons.  (Nor does it do them any good either, most 
batteries
prefer being charged at well under 10% of their AH rating.)  A good 
6-10A
charger is all you need for regular use.  The hot chargers are mostly 
for

the I can't wait crowd, like mechanics on flat rate.

No lead-acid battery likes being run flat, it's just that the Optimas
tolerate it a little better than the others.  They're also sealed
better (unless you cook them), and will run in any position.  But
they cost a lot more, and have less capacity than regulars.  Treated
well they will probably last longer.  (And by well, run flat and
then cooked doesn't qualify! :-)

I have either a charge maintainer or a knife switch on our vehicles
that don't see regular service.

I hate batteries.  My electric shaver plugs in.  Norelco 2-header
from the late 50's, was my grandfather's.  Now _that's_ service!

-- Jim

Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Levi Smith]

Hmm, what is the AH rating on these batteries?  This is/was an 850CCA
battery  I was figuring that at that rating 40amps wouldn't be that
high, but then I guess I was confusing AH with CA...  It is a smart charger
and should only put in what is needed.  It doesn't normally put that much
amperage into anything unless it's WAY low on power...  (And I selected that
high a charge)

They do seem to last pretty well.  I was just thinking that the other day
when my wife reminded me that we changed the one in her Sube before in 99'
or 00' at the latest and it's still going strong.  Hers isn't an Optima, but
is a gel cell Champion or something...

Levi

On 12/12/06, Jim Cathey [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


 -My Subaru's been neglected while I've been driving the Benz and the
 Optima
 I had in there went dead over the last stint.  Went to charge it
 yesterday
 and it was taking a good 30+ amps for a while, then seemed to slow
 down.
 Left it on there overnight and was sure it would be done this morning,
 but
 low and behold it was pumping in more than 20 amps and the battery was
 REALLY hissing, blowing smoke (or steam or whatever) and smelled
 something
 like eggs...
 I'm assuming that's no a good sign and the battery is probably toast,
 but
 what causes that?  I guess I thought the gel cells didn't really do
 that...

It's dead, Jim.  30+ amps is too hot a charge for unattended use,
for safety reasons.  (Nor does it do them any good either, most
batteries
prefer being charged at well under 10% of their AH rating.)  A good
6-10A
charger is all you need for regular use.  The hot chargers are mostly
for
the I can't wait crowd, like mechanics on flat rate.

No lead-acid battery likes being run flat, it's just that the Optimas
tolerate it a little better than the others.  They're also sealed
better (unless you cook them), and will run in any position.  But
they cost a lot more, and have less capacity than regulars.  Treated
well they will probably last longer.  (And by well, run flat and
then cooked doesn't qualify! :-)

I have either a charge maintainer or a knife switch on our vehicles
that don't see regular service.

I hate batteries.  My electric shaver plugs in.  Norelco 2-header
from the late 50's, was my grandfather's.  Now _that's_ service!

-- Jim


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Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Werner Fehlauer]

Levi -
cooking batteries is definitely NOT healthy!  The heat generated 
internally can warp plates and do other internal bad things.  A battery 
professional would recommend charging at a 2-3 Ampere rate for several 
days - that not only builds a good charge without excessive heating, but 
also chemically helps restore the plates by driving the sulfur back into 
solution.
Several years ago, I had a shop in Anchorage rebuild a 24V DC-3 battery (my 
old Army surplus generator needed a 24V battery) by replacing a few bad 
cells with good ones from a donor battery, and then charging at 2 Amps for 
MORE than a WEEK.  Battery worked well for several years after that!

Werner
'83SD 222K
'90D 227K

- Original Message - 
From: Levi Smith [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: Mercedes Discussion List Mercedes@okiebenz.com
Sent: Tuesday, December 12, 2006 9:07 AM
Subject: [MBZ] Batteries



Couple interesting battery items:

-Got a new battery for my 83' 300D as the old one wasn't up to below
freezing temps.  Ended up getting it from Advance for $70 as there's had a 
3

year free replacment instead of the 2 year at Autozone and bother were 7
year prorated.
What's the Reserve rating?  I know I've seen it say minutes before, but
minutes at what level of power usage?

-Did the Desulfate option on the old battery.  Seemed to be pushing some
water out of the positive terminal of the battery, but not a lot.  Also
possible that was during the charging stage, but I didn't notice it until 
I

did the desulfate option.  What would cause that?

-My Subaru's been neglected while I've been driving the Benz and the 
Optima

I had in there went dead over the last stint.  Went to charge it yesterday
and it was taking a good 30+ amps for a while, then seemed to slow down.
Left it on there overnight and was sure it would be done this morning, but
low and behold it was pumping in more than 20 amps and the battery was
REALLY hissing, blowing smoke (or steam or whatever) and smelled something
like eggs...
I'm assuming that's no a good sign and the battery is probably toast, but
what causes that?  I guess I thought the gel cells didn't really do 
that...


Levi (: 

Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[Jim Cathey]

Hmm, what is the AH rating on these batteries?  This is/was an 850CCA
battery  I was figuring that at that rating 40amps wouldn't be that
high, but then I guess I was confusing AH with CA...


Yes, you were.  The regular group 49 battery is something like
an 85-100 AH battery, and the Optimas are rated at less than that.

-- Jim

Re: [MBZ] Batteries

[David Brodbeck]

On Tue, 12 Dec 2006 10:04:53 -0500, Werner Fehlauer wrote
 Levi -
 cooking batteries is definitely NOT healthy!  The heat generated 
 internally can warp plates and do other internal bad things.

This is especially true of sealed batteries like Optimas.  If they get too 
hot, the safety vents pop and it's no longer sealed anymore.  Once water 
boils off this way, there's no way to replace it.

Generally speaking, sealed lead acid batteries will not tolerate as much 
charge current as non-sealed ones.  Gel cells, in particular, usually have 
some pretty specific restrictions on charging conditions.

Re: [MBZ] Batteries (was Fun in the cold this morning)

[OK Don]

I just had to replace the Interstate in the 240D. It was over 7 years
old. The earliest one has died on me was 4 years. Most go 5.



Some interstate special 1000 amph battery we got when we bought the
83, only lasted 3 years before failure.



--
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Norman, OK
The Americans will always do the right thing... after they've
exhausted all the alternatives.
Sir Winston Churchill
'90 300D, '87 300SDL, '81 240D, '78 450SLC, '97 Ply Grand Voyager

Re: [MBZ] Batteries (was Fun in the cold this morning)

[Werner Fehlauer]

Mike - I personally use only M-B batteries, as they tend to have a 
consistent 5 year (+/-) life, and don't cost significantly more than brand 
X, when I drop across the border to Delaware (no sales tax) and get the 
typical 10% MBCA discount.  And I like to display the car at club car shows, 
and the M-B battery just looks right!


I have only heard good things about the Optima, including almost double the 
life, but that is hearsay.  And the local M-B indy shops push Interstate 
batteries, but then that is a common indy shop battery for many.


As far as who actually makes M-B batteries, I suspect it varies just as 
Sears, where they have periodic low-bidder contracts.  I've seen M-B 
batteries with made in Germany, made in Spain, Varta, and Exide 
markings over the last 15 years.  My recommendation is buy what makes you 
comfortable, but think seriously about replacing any battery approaching 5 
years in age, no matter how well is seems to work or who you think may have 
actually manufactured it!


Werner

- Original Message - 
From: Mike Canfield [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2006 9:13 AM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Fun in the cold this morning



I will disagree about the Optima Red Top.  I have used these batteries for
heavy winching applications offroad and they do not hold up well at all in
comparison to the NAPA(read Exide) Orbital.  If you are going to go with a
gel type the NAPA brand is way better than the Optima of any color. 
That's

not from reading specs, that's from being left stranded from failed
batteries.
 Now, as far as quality batteries go do a bit of research on who makes the
best batteries for solar banks and other life dependant systems..You
will find Johnson Control at or very near the top of the 
list...Believe

it or not..Wally World batteries are built by Johnson Control and have
an EXCELLENT service record as long as you buy the top of the line MAXX
model for heavy winching or diesel cranking.

Who makes the battery for MB?

Mike
- Original Message - 
From: Werner Fehlauer [EMAIL PROTECTED]

To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com
Sent: Wednesday, December 06, 2006 8:36 AM
Subject: Re: [MBZ] Fun in the cold this morning



Levi - if you won't go $100 (with the club discount) for a M-B battery at
the dealer, then the oft recommended batteries for our Diesels is the
Interstate brand, and particularly the Optima (more expensive, but
reportedly last a lot longer) Red Top.  Looking for reliable service in a
Diesel, from a $40 battery is wishful thinking, IMO.

If the current battery is more than 4 years old, it is questionable that
it
will perform adequately.  Remember that a Diesel not only requires lots 
of

Amps to do the glow cycle, but that the engine itself draws a lot of
current
because of a compression ratio that is twice that of gassers.  You are
using
Mobil 1/Delvac 1, of course??

Werner

Re: [MBZ] Batteries (was Fun in the cold this morning)

[John M McIntosh]

On 6-Dec-06, at 7:09 AM, Werner Fehlauer wrote:


Varta,


(a) the varta folks in germany actually answered questions via their  
web site.
(b) both varta battries I had ran 7 years before I replaced them  
based on age, not failure.


Some interstate special 1000 amph battery we got when we bought the  
83, only lasted 3 years before failure.




John
1983 300TDt  374k Kilometers (mobil 1 Delvac)
1990's 300TDt  184k Kilometers (mobil 1 Delvac)
1993 500SEL 184k Kilometers (mobil 1 Delvac)