RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[Kim Longenbaugh]

It's the associative property:
All p*rn is bad, therefore all p*rn sites are bad. 

-Original Message-
From: Jacob [mailto:ja...@excaliburfilms.com] 
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 9:09 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

HEY!.. not all p*rn sites are bad! ;-)

-Original Message-
From: Charlie Kaiser [mailto:charl...@golden-eagle.org]
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 8:37 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

I dunno; I think that's a bit harsh considering the (non) tech-savvy
level of the average user base. 

There's a lot of malware out there that's pretty sophisticated and can
trap a user that is not really doing anything wrong. Something as simple
as mis-typing a URL or hitting a google link that looks legit is enough
to snag someone.
Now, if they're surfing p*rn or warez sites or something with an
inherent risk factor, that's one thing. But if there wasn't a risk of
drive-by malware, we wouldn't have all the anti-this-or-that apps and
have to spend so much time preventing or fixing malware infestations.

Now, if it's a sysadmin that's gotten nailed, we have the right to razz
them about it... :-)

***
Charlie Kaiser
charl...@golden-eagle.org
Kingman, AZ
***  

> -Original Message-
> From: Sherry Abercrombie [mailto:saber...@gmail.com]
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 8:25 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed
> 
> I just think that it serves them 
> right to have that inconvenience because of their own actions.   
> 


~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~
<http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~


~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~
<http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[Charlie Kaiser]

I probably wasn't clear enough; Tech B found the root cause (specific update
that hosed a DLL)...
That's always been my troubleshooting focus. Find the root cause...

***
Charlie Kaiser
charl...@golden-eagle.org
Kingman, AZ
***  

> -Original Message-
> From: Jacob [mailto:ja...@excaliburfilms.com] 
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 10:47 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed
> 
> Hmm... Still have to found out the root cause. Why did 12 
> machines have the same DLL problem at the same time?  Bad 
> patch? Copying over the DLL is just a quick fix which is 
> perfectly normal in this situation. Still need to find the 
> actual problem.
> 
> When I troubleshoot, I like to come up with a temp, quick fix 
> (what is takes to get the user/system going).. then a 
> permanent fix which addresses the root cause (which can take 
> time). Most techs I run into just look at the temp, quick fix 
> and never look at the root cause. Could be the just do not 
> know to (training) or no time to look at the root cause (a 
> whole other issue).


~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[Jacob]

Hmm... Still have to found out the root cause. Why did 12 machines have the
same DLL problem at the same time?  Bad patch? Copying over the DLL is just
a quick fix which is perfectly normal in this situation. Still need to find
the actual problem.

When I troubleshoot, I like to come up with a temp, quick fix (what is takes
to get the user/system going).. then a permanent fix which addresses the
root cause (which can take time). Most techs I run into just look at the
temp, quick fix and never look at the root cause. Could be the just do not
know to (training) or no time to look at the root cause (a whole other
issue).


-Original Message-
From: Charlie Kaiser [mailto:charl...@golden-eagle.org] 
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 9:40 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

Sometimes. Let's say you have an application issue with a desktop. Tech A
wipes and rebuilds. Takes an hour. Tech B spends an hour troubleshooting the
issue, isolates it to a DLL that got whacked by some update or something.
Copies the file from a good system to the problem PC and it's fixed.
The help desk starts getting more calls about the same issue on let's say 2
dozen more desktops. Tech A now has 24 more hours of work to do wiping
desktops, and 24 user-hours are out while the machines are being reimaged,
not to mention the wait time before the tech can get to them. Tech B on the
other hand, has the replacement DLL sitting on a file share. He copies the
DLL to the desktops, says reboot when you go to lunch, and is done. Or
better, scripts sending the DLL out to all the machines through
logon/startup/logoff/shutdown/whatever scripts.

Which scenario is, in the long run, more efficient? If you don't KNOW the
root cause for requiring a wipe/rebuild, IMO you've got the potential for
spending a lot more time in the end...

***
Charlie Kaiser
charl...@golden-eagle.org
Kingman, AZ
***  

> -Original Message-
> From: Ray [mailto:rz...@qwest.net] 
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 8:53 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed
> 
> But all too often IT is running leaner, as well as the 
> endusers could be.
> Techs screwing around for 1/2 hour or longer just cause 
> downtime for both parties. 


~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~


~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[Ray]

I understand how it works. Hopefully somebody's paying attention to trends
rather than assuming every problem will end up a system-wide problem. I'm
sure we've all had bad updates for example.

I've seen way too many silly "safequards" be put in place because "one time,
5 years ago..".  

-Original Message-
From: Charlie Kaiser [mailto:charl...@golden-eagle.org] 
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 9:40 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

Sometimes. Let's say you have an application issue with a desktop. Tech A
wipes and rebuilds. Takes an hour. Tech B spends an hour troubleshooting the
issue, isolates it to a DLL that got whacked by some update or something.
Copies the file from a good system to the problem PC and it's fixed.
The help desk starts getting more calls about the same issue on let's say 2
dozen more desktops. Tech A now has 24 more hours of work to do wiping
desktops, and 24 user-hours are out while the machines are being reimaged,
not to mention the wait time before the tech can get to them. Tech B on the
other hand, has the replacement DLL sitting on a file share. He copies the
DLL to the desktops, says reboot when you go to lunch, and is done. Or
better, scripts sending the DLL out to all the machines through
logon/startup/logoff/shutdown/whatever scripts.

Which scenario is, in the long run, more efficient? If you don't KNOW the
root cause for requiring a wipe/rebuild, IMO you've got the potential for
spending a lot more time in the end...

***
Charlie Kaiser
charl...@golden-eagle.org
Kingman, AZ
***  

> -Original Message-
> From: Ray [mailto:rz...@qwest.net]
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 8:53 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed
> 
> But all too often IT is running leaner, as well as the endusers could 
> be.
> Techs screwing around for 1/2 hour or longer just cause downtime for 
> both parties.


~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~


~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[Charlie Kaiser]

You assume that the issue has indeed been isolated to the desktop machine.
:-) Especially with domain/profile issues, the line is not necessarily that
clear... 
I've seen desktop techs wipe more than one machine for an issue that turned
out to be something further up the chain. Personally, I'll hire someone with
strong troubleshooting skills way faster than someone who's fast at imaging
and deployment.

***
Charlie Kaiser
charl...@golden-eagle.org
Kingman, AZ
***  

> -Original Message-
> From: Jim Majorowicz [mailto:jmajorow...@gmail.com] 
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 9:22 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed
> 
> I think the implied comment is that a wipe/rebuild is more 
> cost effective use of man-hours than troubleshooting for most 
> *DESKTOP* related issues.  I agree with what you're saying 
> though.  Troubleshooting is becoming a lost art for entry level techs.
> 


~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[Charlie Kaiser]

Sometimes. Let's say you have an application issue with a desktop. Tech A
wipes and rebuilds. Takes an hour. Tech B spends an hour troubleshooting the
issue, isolates it to a DLL that got whacked by some update or something.
Copies the file from a good system to the problem PC and it's fixed.
The help desk starts getting more calls about the same issue on let's say 2
dozen more desktops. Tech A now has 24 more hours of work to do wiping
desktops, and 24 user-hours are out while the machines are being reimaged,
not to mention the wait time before the tech can get to them. Tech B on the
other hand, has the replacement DLL sitting on a file share. He copies the
DLL to the desktops, says reboot when you go to lunch, and is done. Or
better, scripts sending the DLL out to all the machines through
logon/startup/logoff/shutdown/whatever scripts.

Which scenario is, in the long run, more efficient? If you don't KNOW the
root cause for requiring a wipe/rebuild, IMO you've got the potential for
spending a lot more time in the end...

***
Charlie Kaiser
charl...@golden-eagle.org
Kingman, AZ
***  

> -Original Message-
> From: Ray [mailto:rz...@qwest.net] 
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 8:53 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed
> 
> But all too often IT is running leaner, as well as the 
> endusers could be.
> Techs screwing around for 1/2 hour or longer just cause 
> downtime for both parties. 


~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[Micheal Espinola Jr]

Depending on your environment and data storage, its a faster solution.

--
ME2



On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 10:05 AM, Don Guyer wrote:
> That’s how our field techs resolve a lot of issues.
>
>
>
> Troubleshooting is a lost art form, to most techs today.
>
>
>
> Don Guyer
>
> Systems Engineer - Information Services
>
> Prudential, Fox & Roach/Trident Group
>
> 431 W. Lancaster Avenue
>
> Devon, PA 19333
>
> Direct: (610) 993-3299
>
> Fax: (610) 650-5306
>
> don.gu...@prufoxroach.com
>
>
>
> From: Lee Douglas [mailto:lee.doug...@gmail.com]
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 9:50 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed
>
>
>
> One thing they left out is to format the drive and start over - I've heard
> that a lot on this forum 
>
> On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 9:44 AM, Ziots, Edward  wrote:
>
> Sigh,
>
>
>
> Who Ratted us all out… they should be TARRED and feathered…
>
>
>
> Z
>
>
>
> Edward Ziots
>
> Network Engineer
>
> Lifespan Organization
>
> MCSE,MCSA,MCP+I, ME, CCA, Security +, Network +
>
> ezi...@lifespan.org
>
> Phone:401-639-3505
>
> ____
>
> From: Candee Vaglica [mailto:can...@gmail.com]
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:52 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed
>
>
>
> I *love* it!
>
>
>
> On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 12:22 AM, Kurt Buff  wrote:
>
> Now anyone can be a sysadmin/tech support person:
>
> http://xkcd.com/627/
>
> ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
> ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[Jim Majorowicz]

Aren't you paid to say that?  :)

-Original Message-
From: Jacob [mailto:ja...@excaliburfilms.com] 
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 9:09 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

HEY!.. not all p*rn sites are bad! ;-)

-Original Message-
From: Charlie Kaiser [mailto:charl...@golden-eagle.org] 
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 8:37 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

I dunno; I think that's a bit harsh considering the (non) tech-savvy level
of the average user base. 

There's a lot of malware out there that's pretty sophisticated and can trap
a user that is not really doing anything wrong. Something as simple as
mis-typing a URL or hitting a google link that looks legit is enough to snag
someone.
Now, if they're surfing p*rn or warez sites or something with an inherent
risk factor, that's one thing. But if there wasn't a risk of drive-by
malware, we wouldn't have all the anti-this-or-that apps and have to spend
so much time preventing or fixing malware infestations.

Now, if it's a sysadmin that's gotten nailed, we have the right to razz them
about it... :-)

***
Charlie Kaiser
charl...@golden-eagle.org
Kingman, AZ
***  

> -Original Message-
> From: Sherry Abercrombie [mailto:saber...@gmail.com] 
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 8:25 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed
> 
> I just think that it serves them 
> right to have that inconvenience because of their own actions.   
> 


~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~


~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~


~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[Jim Majorowicz]

I think the implied comment is that a wipe/rebuild is more cost effective use of
man-hours than troubleshooting for most *DESKTOP* related issues.  I agree with
what you're saying though.  Troubleshooting is becoming a lost art for entry
level techs.

-Original Message-
From: Charlie Kaiser [mailto:charl...@golden-eagle.org] 
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:55 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

Troubleshooting is an extremely valuable tool. Curing a symptom doesn't fix
a problem. Even a wipe and rebuild can be ineffective if the root cause is
elsewhere. It's one thing to wipe/rebuild a desktop machine for a problem,
but when it's a strange issue with an exchange box, or SQL server, or DC,
it's not always an option, much less the best one.
And it's kind of embarrassing to wipe a PC, return it to service, and have
the same problem crop up again later that day. Doesn't look very
professional, IMO.

Being able to troubleshoot is a skill that has, to a great degree, been lost
in our business. That's why we end up with things like that sysadmin
flowchart. There's an art and skill to methodical diagnosis that
differentiates the artisans from the parts changers...
There's also an art in knowing when to wipe and when to troubleshoot... :-)

***
Charlie Kaiser
charl...@golden-eagle.org
Kingman, AZ
***  

> -Original Message-
> From: David Lum [mailto:david@nwea.org] 
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:47 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed
> 
> +1  Time is money.
> 
>  
> 
> Having said that sometimes I will troubleshoot out of 
> curiosity even after it's obvious blowing away and starting 
> over is faster - I get a burning desire to know WHAT 
> happened. Sometimes that tidbit pays huge dividends later, or 
> sometimes knowing exactly what happened amazes other tech's.
> 
>  
> 
> Dave
> 
>  
> 
> From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonhhc.com]
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:16 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed
> 
>  
> 
> "lost art"?
> 
> Or (in most cases) it's just not cost effective.
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> ____________
> 
> From: Don Guyer [mailto:don.gu...@prufoxroach.com]
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 10:06 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed
> 
> That's how our field techs resolve a lot of issues.
> 
>  
> 
> Troubleshooting is a lost art form, to most techs today.
> 
>  
> 
> Don Guyer
> 
> Systems Engineer - Information Services
> 
> Prudential, Fox & Roach/Trident Group
> 
> 431 W. Lancaster Avenue
> 
> Devon, PA 19333
> 
> Direct: (610) 993-3299
> 
> Fax: (610) 650-5306
> 
> don.gu...@prufoxroach.com
> 
>  
> 
> From: Lee Douglas [mailto:lee.doug...@gmail.com]
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 9:50 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed
> 
>  
> 
> One thing they left out is to format the drive and start over 
> - I've heard that a lot on this forum 
> 
> On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 9:44 AM, Ziots, Edward 
>  wrote:
> 
> Sigh, 
> 
>  
> 
> Who Ratted us all out. they should be TARRED and feathered.
> 
>  
> 
> Z
> 
>  
> 
> Edward Ziots
> 
> Network Engineer
> 
> Lifespan Organization
> 
> MCSE,MCSA,MCP+I, ME, CCA, Security +, Network +
> 
> ezi...@lifespan.org
> 
> Phone:401-639-3505
> 
> 
> 
> From: Candee Vaglica [mailto:can...@gmail.com]
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:52 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed
> 
>  
> 
> I *love* it!
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 12:22 AM, Kurt Buff 
>  wrote:
> 
> Now anyone can be a sysadmin/tech support person:
> 
> http://xkcd.com/627/
> 
> ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource 
> hog! ~ ~ 
> <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> 


~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~


~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[Jacob]

HEY!.. not all p*rn sites are bad! ;-)

-Original Message-
From: Charlie Kaiser [mailto:charl...@golden-eagle.org] 
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 8:37 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

I dunno; I think that's a bit harsh considering the (non) tech-savvy level
of the average user base. 

There's a lot of malware out there that's pretty sophisticated and can trap
a user that is not really doing anything wrong. Something as simple as
mis-typing a URL or hitting a google link that looks legit is enough to snag
someone.
Now, if they're surfing p*rn or warez sites or something with an inherent
risk factor, that's one thing. But if there wasn't a risk of drive-by
malware, we wouldn't have all the anti-this-or-that apps and have to spend
so much time preventing or fixing malware infestations.

Now, if it's a sysadmin that's gotten nailed, we have the right to razz them
about it... :-)

***
Charlie Kaiser
charl...@golden-eagle.org
Kingman, AZ
***  

> -Original Message-
> From: Sherry Abercrombie [mailto:saber...@gmail.com] 
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 8:25 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed
> 
> I just think that it serves them 
> right to have that inconvenience because of their own actions.   
> 


~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~


~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[Devin Meade]

Re-imaging a system that has an unknown problem can part of the
problem isolation process.  Problem isolation as a part of
troubleshooting is a lost art.  So is verification that you followed a
written procedure, but I do digress...

I keep seeing entry level techs that want to fly by the seat of their
pants.  They are dying to prove they know how to defrag or chkdsk or
run malwarebytes  or whatever.  They don't want to define the problem
and then record their actions.


On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 10:52 AM, Ray wrote:
> But all too often IT is running leaner, as well as the endusers could be.
> Techs screwing around for 1/2 hour or longer just cause downtime for both
> parties.
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Charlie Kaiser [mailto:charl...@golden-eagle.org]
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:55 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed
>
> Troubleshooting is an extremely valuable tool. Curing a symptom doesn't fix
> a problem. Even a wipe and rebuild can be ineffective if the root cause is
> elsewhere. It's one thing to wipe/rebuild a desktop machine for a problem,
> but when it's a strange issue with an exchange box, or SQL server, or DC,
> it's not always an option, much less the best one.
> And it's kind of embarrassing to wipe a PC, return it to service, and have
> the same problem crop up again later that day. Doesn't look very
> professional, IMO.
>
> Being able to troubleshoot is a skill that has, to a great degree, been lost
> in our business. That's why we end up with things like that sysadmin
> flowchart. There's an art and skill to methodical diagnosis that
> differentiates the artisans from the parts changers...
> There's also an art in knowing when to wipe and when to troubleshoot... :-)
>
> ***
> Charlie Kaiser
> charl...@golden-eagle.org
> Kingman, AZ
> ***
>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: David Lum [mailto:david@nwea.org]
>> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:47 AM
>> To: NT System Admin Issues
>> Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed
>>
>> +1          Time is money.
>>
>>
>>
>> Having said that sometimes I will troubleshoot out of curiosity even
>> after it's obvious blowing away and starting over is faster - I get a
>> burning desire to know WHAT happened. Sometimes that tidbit pays huge
>> dividends later, or sometimes knowing exactly what happened amazes
>> other tech's.
>>
>>
>>
>> Dave
>>
>>
>>
>> From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonhhc.com]
>> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:16 AM
>> To: NT System Admin Issues
>> Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed
>>
>>
>>
>> "lost art"?
>>
>> Or (in most cases) it's just not cost effective.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 
>>
>> From: Don Guyer [mailto:don.gu...@prufoxroach.com]
>> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 10:06 AM
>> To: NT System Admin Issues
>> Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed
>>
>> That's how our field techs resolve a lot of issues.
>>
>>
>>
>> Troubleshooting is a lost art form, to most techs today.
>>
>>
>>
>> Don Guyer
>>
>> Systems Engineer - Information Services
>>
>> Prudential, Fox & Roach/Trident Group
>>
>> 431 W. Lancaster Avenue
>>
>> Devon, PA 19333
>>
>> Direct: (610) 993-3299
>>
>> Fax: (610) 650-5306
>>
>> don.gu...@prufoxroach.com
>>
>>
>>
>> From: Lee Douglas [mailto:lee.doug...@gmail.com]
>> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 9:50 AM
>> To: NT System Admin Issues
>> Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed
>>
>>
>>
>> One thing they left out is to format the drive and start over
>> - I've heard that a lot on this forum 
>>
>> On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 9:44 AM, Ziots, Edward 
>> wrote:
>>
>> Sigh,
>>
>>
>>
>> Who Ratted us all out. they should be TARRED and feathered.
>>
>>
>>
>> Z
>>
>>
>>
>> Edward Ziots
>>
>> Network Engineer
>>
>> Lifespan Organization
>>
>> MCSE,MCSA,MCP+I, ME, CCA, Security +, Network +
>>
>> ezi...@lifespan.org
>>
>> Phone:401-639-3505
>>
>> 
>>
>> From: Candee Vaglica [mailto:can...@gmail.com]
>> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:52 AM
>> To: 

RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[Ray]

But all too often IT is running leaner, as well as the endusers could be.
Techs screwing around for 1/2 hour or longer just cause downtime for both
parties. 
   

-Original Message-
From: Charlie Kaiser [mailto:charl...@golden-eagle.org] 
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:55 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

Troubleshooting is an extremely valuable tool. Curing a symptom doesn't fix
a problem. Even a wipe and rebuild can be ineffective if the root cause is
elsewhere. It's one thing to wipe/rebuild a desktop machine for a problem,
but when it's a strange issue with an exchange box, or SQL server, or DC,
it's not always an option, much less the best one.
And it's kind of embarrassing to wipe a PC, return it to service, and have
the same problem crop up again later that day. Doesn't look very
professional, IMO.

Being able to troubleshoot is a skill that has, to a great degree, been lost
in our business. That's why we end up with things like that sysadmin
flowchart. There's an art and skill to methodical diagnosis that
differentiates the artisans from the parts changers...
There's also an art in knowing when to wipe and when to troubleshoot... :-)

***
Charlie Kaiser
charl...@golden-eagle.org
Kingman, AZ
***  

> -Original Message-
> From: David Lum [mailto:david@nwea.org]
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:47 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed
> 
> +1  Time is money.
> 
>  
> 
> Having said that sometimes I will troubleshoot out of curiosity even 
> after it's obvious blowing away and starting over is faster - I get a 
> burning desire to know WHAT happened. Sometimes that tidbit pays huge 
> dividends later, or sometimes knowing exactly what happened amazes 
> other tech's.
> 
>  
> 
> Dave
> 
>  
> 
> From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonhhc.com]
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:16 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed
> 
>  
> 
> "lost art"?
> 
> Or (in most cases) it's just not cost effective.
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> ____________
> 
> From: Don Guyer [mailto:don.gu...@prufoxroach.com]
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 10:06 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed
> 
> That's how our field techs resolve a lot of issues.
> 
>  
> 
> Troubleshooting is a lost art form, to most techs today.
> 
>  
> 
> Don Guyer
> 
> Systems Engineer - Information Services
> 
> Prudential, Fox & Roach/Trident Group
> 
> 431 W. Lancaster Avenue
> 
> Devon, PA 19333
> 
> Direct: (610) 993-3299
> 
> Fax: (610) 650-5306
> 
> don.gu...@prufoxroach.com
> 
>  
> 
> From: Lee Douglas [mailto:lee.doug...@gmail.com]
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 9:50 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed
> 
>  
> 
> One thing they left out is to format the drive and start over
> - I've heard that a lot on this forum 
> 
> On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 9:44 AM, Ziots, Edward  
> wrote:
> 
> Sigh,
> 
>  
> 
> Who Ratted us all out. they should be TARRED and feathered.
> 
>  
> 
> Z
> 
>  
> 
> Edward Ziots
> 
> Network Engineer
> 
> Lifespan Organization
> 
> MCSE,MCSA,MCP+I, ME, CCA, Security +, Network +
> 
> ezi...@lifespan.org
> 
> Phone:401-639-3505
> 
> 
> 
> From: Candee Vaglica [mailto:can...@gmail.com]
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:52 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed
> 
>  
> 
> I *love* it!
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 12:22 AM, Kurt Buff  
> wrote:
> 
> Now anyone can be a sysadmin/tech support person:
> 
> http://xkcd.com/627/
> 
> ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~ 
> <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> 


~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~ ~
<http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~


~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[Charlie Kaiser]

I dunno; I think that's a bit harsh considering the (non) tech-savvy level
of the average user base. 

There's a lot of malware out there that's pretty sophisticated and can trap
a user that is not really doing anything wrong. Something as simple as
mis-typing a URL or hitting a google link that looks legit is enough to snag
someone.
Now, if they're surfing p*rn or warez sites or something with an inherent
risk factor, that's one thing. But if there wasn't a risk of drive-by
malware, we wouldn't have all the anti-this-or-that apps and have to spend
so much time preventing or fixing malware infestations.

Now, if it's a sysadmin that's gotten nailed, we have the right to razz them
about it... :-)

***
Charlie Kaiser
charl...@golden-eagle.org
Kingman, AZ
***  

> -Original Message-
> From: Sherry Abercrombie [mailto:saber...@gmail.com] 
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 8:25 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed
> 
> I just think that it serves them 
> right to have that inconvenience because of their own actions.   
> 


~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[Raper, Jonathan]

Agreed - there are exceptions to every rule!


Jonathan L. Raper, A+, MCSA, MCSE
Technology Coordinator
Eagle Physicians & Associates, PA
jra...@eaglemds.commailto:%20jra...@eaglemds.com>
www.eaglemds.comhttp://www.eaglemds.com/>


From: Sherry Abercrombie [mailto:saber...@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 11:25 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed

I'm an advocate for re-imaging when the user has gotten spyware/malware etc on 
their workstation and are having issues because of that.I just think that 
it serves them right to have that inconvenience because of their own actions.
On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 10:15 AM, Raper, Jonathan 
mailto:jra...@eaglemds.com>> wrote:

+100



Yes, lost art. Too many "techs" say to re-image, and while I certainly agree 
that it is the most cost-effective immediate "fix", you generally don't know 
the root cause of the problem. Understanding how something works and why it 
broke are invaluable when it comes to building your knowledge base and solving 
real problems later on down the road.



Jonathan L. Raper, A+, MCSA, MCSE
Technology Coordinator
Eagle Physicians & Associates, PA
jra...@eaglemds.com
www.eaglemds.com



From: Len Hammond [mailto:lenhammo...@gmail.com<mailto:lenhammo...@gmail.com>]
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 11:09 AM

To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed



+1   When I'm quoting a machine fix for someone, I often tell them that 
it is quicker/cheaper to wipe & reload than it is to fix it. When I get it to 
my home office, I will usually, off the clock, try to figure it out before I 
reload. The "why" question from my childhood keeps coming back into play. It 
does amaze folks when you can explain the problem in detail and how to prevent 
a recurrence. The user education is great, as I like not having to solve the 
same thing multiple time for the same person - I'm "too lazy" for that, not to 
mention that it is not cost effective for them.

Len Hammond
CSI:Hartland
lenhamm...@gmail.com<mailto:lenhamm...@gmail.com>

On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 10:46 AM, David Lum 
mailto:david@nwea.org>> wrote:

+1  Time is money.



Having said that sometimes I will troubleshoot out of curiosity even after it's 
obvious blowing away and starting over is faster - I get a burning desire to 
know WHAT happened. Sometimes that tidbit pays huge dividends later, or 
sometimes knowing exactly what happened amazes other tech's.



Dave



From: David Mazzaccaro 
[mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonhhc.com<mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonhhc.com>]
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:16 AM

To: NT System Admin Issues

Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed



"lost art"?

Or (in most cases) it's just not cost effective.







From: Don Guyer 
[mailto:don.gu...@prufoxroach.com<mailto:don.gu...@prufoxroach.com>]
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 10:06 AM

To: NT System Admin Issues

Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

That's how our field techs resolve a lot of issues.



Troubleshooting is a lost art form, to most techs today.



Don Guyer

Systems Engineer - Information Services

Prudential, Fox & Roach/Trident Group

431 W. Lancaster Avenue

Devon, PA 19333

Direct: (610) 993-3299

Fax: (610) 650-5306

don.gu...@prufoxroach.com<mailto:don.gu...@prufoxroach.com>



From: Lee Douglas [mailto:lee.doug...@gmail.com<mailto:lee.doug...@gmail.com>]
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 9:50 AM

To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed



One thing they left out is to format the drive and start over - I've heard that 
a lot on this forum 

On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 9:44 AM, Ziots, Edward 
mailto:ezi...@lifespan.org>> wrote:

Sigh,



Who Ratted us all out... they should be TARRED and feathered...



Z



Edward Ziots

Network Engineer

Lifespan Organization

MCSE,MCSA,MCP+I, ME, CCA, Security +, Network +

ezi...@lifespan.org<mailto:ezi...@lifespan.org>

Phone:401-639-3505

____________________

From: Candee Vaglica [mailto:can...@gmail.com<mailto:can...@gmail.com>]
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:52 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed



I *love* it!




On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 12:22 AM, Kurt Buff 
mailto:kurt.b...@gmail.com>> wrote:

Now anyone can be a sysadmin/tech support person:

http://xkcd.com/627/

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>














Any medical information contained in this electronic message is CONFIDENTIAL 
and privileged. It is unlawful for unaut

RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[Jacob]

Our process is simple.

 

XZY does not work -> Did you reset? -> No. -> Reset and try again.

 
|

 
|

 
Yes. -> Reset again and try again.


 

From: Ziots, Edward [mailto:ezi...@lifespan.org] 
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 6:45 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

 

Sigh, 

 

Who Ratted us all out. they should be TARRED and feathered.

 

Z

 

Edward Ziots

Network Engineer

Lifespan Organization

MCSE,MCSA,MCP+I, ME, CCA, Security +, Network +

ezi...@lifespan.org

Phone:401-639-3505

  _  

From: Candee Vaglica [mailto:can...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:52 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed

 

I *love* it!



 

On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 12:22 AM, Kurt Buff  wrote:

Now anyone can be a sysadmin/tech support person:

http://xkcd.com/627/

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

 

 

 

 

 

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[Sherry Abercrombie]

I'm an advocate for re-imaging when the user has gotten spyware/malware etc
on their workstation and are having issues because of that.I just think
that it serves them right to have that inconvenience because of their own
actions.

On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 10:15 AM, Raper, Jonathan wrote:

>  +100
>
>
>
> Yes, lost art. Too many “techs” say to re-image, and while I certainly
> agree that it is the most cost-effective *immediate* “fix”, you generally
> don’t know the root cause of the problem. Understanding how something works
> and why it broke are invaluable when it comes to building your knowledge
> base and solving real problems later on down the road.
>
>
>
> Jonathan L. Raper, A+, MCSA, MCSE
> Technology Coordinator
> Eagle Physicians & Associates, PA*
> *jra...@eaglemds.com*
> *www.eaglemds.com
>   --
>
> *From:* Len Hammond [mailto:lenhammo...@gmail.com]
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 27, 2009 11:09 AM
>
> *To:* NT System Admin Issues
> *Subject:* Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed
>
>
>
> +1   When I'm quoting a machine fix for someone, I often tell them
> that it is quicker/cheaper to wipe & reload than it is to fix it. When I get
> it to my home office, I will usually, off the clock, try to figure it out
> before I reload. The "why" question from my childhood keeps coming back into
> play. It does amaze folks when you can explain the problem in detail and how
> to prevent a recurrence. The user education is great, as I like not having
> to solve the same thing multiple time for the same person - I'm "too lazy"
> for that, not to mention that it is not cost effective for them.
>
>
> Len Hammond
> CSI:Hartland
> lenhamm...@gmail.com
>
>  On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 10:46 AM, David Lum  wrote:
>
> +1  Time is money.
>
>
>
> Having said that sometimes I will troubleshoot out of curiosity even after
> it’s obvious blowing away and starting over is faster – I get a burning
> desire to know WHAT happened. Sometimes that tidbit pays huge dividends
> later, or sometimes knowing exactly what happened amazes other tech’s.
>
>
>
> Dave
>
>
>
> *From:* David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonhhc.com]
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:16 AM
>
>
> *To:* NT System Admin Issues
>
> *Subject:* RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed
>
>
>
> "lost art"?
>
> Or (in most cases) it's just not cost effective.
>
>
>
>
>  --
>
> *From:* Don Guyer [mailto:don.gu...@prufoxroach.com]
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 27, 2009 10:06 AM
>
>
> *To:* NT System Admin Issues
>
> *Subject:* RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed
>
> That’s how our field techs resolve a lot of issues.
>
>
>
> Troubleshooting is a lost art form, to most techs today.
>
>
>
> Don Guyer
>
> Systems Engineer - Information Services
>
> Prudential, Fox & Roach/Trident Group
>
> 431 W. Lancaster Avenue
>
> Devon, PA 19333
>
> Direct: (610) 993-3299
>
> Fax: (610) 650-5306
>
> don.gu...@prufoxroach.com
>
>
>
> *From:* Lee Douglas [mailto:lee.doug...@gmail.com]
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 27, 2009 9:50 AM
>
>
> *To:* NT System Admin Issues
> *Subject:* Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed
>
>
>
> One thing they left out is to format the drive and start over - I've heard
> that a lot on this forum 
>
> On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 9:44 AM, Ziots, Edward 
> wrote:
>
> Sigh,
>
>
>
> Who Ratted us all out… they should be TARRED and feathered…
>
>
>
> Z
>
>
>
> Edward Ziots
>
> Network Engineer
>
> Lifespan Organization
>
> MCSE,MCSA,MCP+I, ME, CCA, Security +, Network +
>
> ezi...@lifespan.org
>
> Phone:401-639-3505
>   --
>
> *From:* Candee Vaglica [mailto:can...@gmail.com]
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:52 AM
> *To:* NT System Admin Issues
> *Subject:* Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed
>
>
>
> I *love* it!
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 12:22 AM, Kurt Buff  wrote:
>
> Now anyone can be a sysadmin/tech support person:
>
> http://xkcd.com/627/
>
> ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
> ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Any medical information contained in this electronic message is
> CONFIDENTIAL and privileged. It is unlawful for unauthorized persons to
> view, copy, disclose, or dissemi

RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[Raper, Jonathan]

+100

Yes, lost art. Too many "techs" say to re-image, and while I certainly agree 
that it is the most cost-effective immediate "fix", you generally don't know 
the root cause of the problem. Understanding how something works and why it 
broke are invaluable when it comes to building your knowledge base and solving 
real problems later on down the road.


Jonathan L. Raper, A+, MCSA, MCSE
Technology Coordinator
Eagle Physicians & Associates, PA
jra...@eaglemds.commailto:%20jra...@eaglemds.com>
www.eaglemds.comhttp://www.eaglemds.com/>


From: Len Hammond [mailto:lenhammo...@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 11:09 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed

+1   When I'm quoting a machine fix for someone, I often tell them that 
it is quicker/cheaper to wipe & reload than it is to fix it. When I get it to 
my home office, I will usually, off the clock, try to figure it out before I 
reload. The "why" question from my childhood keeps coming back into play. It 
does amaze folks when you can explain the problem in detail and how to prevent 
a recurrence. The user education is great, as I like not having to solve the 
same thing multiple time for the same person - I'm "too lazy" for that, not to 
mention that it is not cost effective for them.

Len Hammond
CSI:Hartland
lenhamm...@gmail.com<mailto:lenhamm...@gmail.com>

On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 10:46 AM, David Lum 
mailto:david@nwea.org>> wrote:

+1  Time is money.



Having said that sometimes I will troubleshoot out of curiosity even after it's 
obvious blowing away and starting over is faster - I get a burning desire to 
know WHAT happened. Sometimes that tidbit pays huge dividends later, or 
sometimes knowing exactly what happened amazes other tech's.



Dave



From: David Mazzaccaro 
[mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonhhc.com<mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonhhc.com>]
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:16 AM

To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed



"lost art"?

Or (in most cases) it's just not cost effective.







From: Don Guyer 
[mailto:don.gu...@prufoxroach.com<mailto:don.gu...@prufoxroach.com>]
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 10:06 AM

To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

That's how our field techs resolve a lot of issues.



Troubleshooting is a lost art form, to most techs today.



Don Guyer

Systems Engineer - Information Services

Prudential, Fox & Roach/Trident Group

431 W. Lancaster Avenue

Devon, PA 19333

Direct: (610) 993-3299

Fax: (610) 650-5306

don.gu...@prufoxroach.com<mailto:don.gu...@prufoxroach.com>



From: Lee Douglas [mailto:lee.doug...@gmail.com<mailto:lee.doug...@gmail.com>]
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 9:50 AM

To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed



One thing they left out is to format the drive and start over - I've heard that 
a lot on this forum 

On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 9:44 AM, Ziots, Edward 
mailto:ezi...@lifespan.org>> wrote:

Sigh,



Who Ratted us all out... they should be TARRED and feathered...



Z



Edward Ziots

Network Engineer

Lifespan Organization

MCSE,MCSA,MCP+I, ME, CCA, Security +, Network +

ezi...@lifespan.org<mailto:ezi...@lifespan.org>

Phone:401-639-3505

________

From: Candee Vaglica [mailto:can...@gmail.com<mailto:can...@gmail.com>]
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:52 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed



I *love* it!




On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 12:22 AM, Kurt Buff 
mailto:kurt.b...@gmail.com>> wrote:

Now anyone can be a sysadmin/tech support person:

http://xkcd.com/627/

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>













Any medical information contained in this electronic message is CONFIDENTIAL 
and privileged. It is unlawful for unauthorized persons to view, copy, 
disclose, or disseminate CONFIDENTIAL information. This electronic message may 
contain information that is confidential and/or legally privileged. It is 
intended only for the use of the individual(s) and/or entity named as 
recipients in the message. If you are not an intended recipient of this 
message, please notify the sender immediately and delete this material from 
your computer. Do not deliver, distribute or copy this message, and do not 
disclose its contents or take any action in reliance on the information that it 
contains.

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[Len Hammond]

+1   When I'm quoting a machine fix for someone, I often tell them
that it is quicker/cheaper to wipe & reload than it is to fix it. When I get
it to my home office, I will usually, off the clock, try to figure it out
before I reload. The "why" question from my childhood keeps coming back into
play. It does amaze folks when you can explain the problem in detail and how
to prevent a recurrence. The user education is great, as I like not having
to solve the same thing multiple time for the same person - I'm "too lazy"
for that, not to mention that it is not cost effective for them.
Len Hammond
CSI:Hartland
lenhamm...@gmail.com


On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 10:46 AM, David Lum  wrote:

>  +1  Time is money.
>
>
>
> Having said that sometimes I will troubleshoot out of curiosity even after
> it’s obvious blowing away and starting over is faster – I get a burning
> desire to know WHAT happened. Sometimes that tidbit pays huge dividends
> later, or sometimes knowing exactly what happened amazes other tech’s.
>
>
>
> Dave
>
>
>
> *From:* David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonhhc.com]
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:16 AM
>
> *To:* NT System Admin Issues
> *Subject:* RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed
>
>
>
> "lost art"?
>
> Or (in most cases) it's just not cost effective.
>
>
>
>
>  --
>
> *From:* Don Guyer [mailto:don.gu...@prufoxroach.com]
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 27, 2009 10:06 AM
>
> *To:* NT System Admin Issues
> *Subject:* RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed
>
> That’s how our field techs resolve a lot of issues.
>
>
>
> Troubleshooting is a lost art form, to most techs today.
>
>
>
> Don Guyer
>
> Systems Engineer - Information Services
>
> Prudential, Fox & Roach/Trident Group
>
> 431 W. Lancaster Avenue
>
> Devon, PA 19333
>
> Direct: (610) 993-3299
>
> Fax: (610) 650-5306
>
> don.gu...@prufoxroach.com
>
>
>
> *From:* Lee Douglas [mailto:lee.doug...@gmail.com]
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 27, 2009 9:50 AM
>
> *To:* NT System Admin Issues
> *Subject:* Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed
>
>
>
> One thing they left out is to format the drive and start over - I've heard
> that a lot on this forum 
>
> On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 9:44 AM, Ziots, Edward 
> wrote:
>
> Sigh,
>
>
>
> Who Ratted us all out… they should be TARRED and feathered…
>
>
>
> Z
>
>
>
> Edward Ziots
>
> Network Engineer
>
> Lifespan Organization
>
> MCSE,MCSA,MCP+I, ME, CCA, Security +, Network +
>
> ezi...@lifespan.org
>
> Phone:401-639-3505
>   --
>
> *From:* Candee Vaglica [mailto:can...@gmail.com]
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:52 AM
> *To:* NT System Admin Issues
> *Subject:* Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed
>
>
>
> I *love* it!
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 12:22 AM, Kurt Buff  wrote:
>
> Now anyone can be a sysadmin/tech support person:
>
> http://xkcd.com/627/
>
> ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
> ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[Don Guyer]

Don't get me wrong, being able to image a computer is invaluable, but it
just seems to be used way too often as an "easy-out".

 

 

Don Guyer

Systems Engineer - Information Services

Prudential, Fox & Roach/Trident Group

431 W. Lancaster Avenue

Devon, PA 19333

Direct: (610) 993-3299

Fax: (610) 650-5306

don.gu...@prufoxroach.com <mailto:don.gu...@prufoxroach.com> 

 

From: David Lum [mailto:david@nwea.org] 
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 10:47 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

 

+1  Time is money.

 

Having said that sometimes I will troubleshoot out of curiosity even
after it's obvious blowing away and starting over is faster - I get a
burning desire to know WHAT happened. Sometimes that tidbit pays huge
dividends later, or sometimes knowing exactly what happened amazes other
tech's.

 

Dave

 

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonhhc.com] 
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:16 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

 

"lost art"?

Or (in most cases) it's just not cost effective.

 

 



From: Don Guyer [mailto:don.gu...@prufoxroach.com] 
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 10:06 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

That's how our field techs resolve a lot of issues.

 

Troubleshooting is a lost art form, to most techs today.

 

Don Guyer

Systems Engineer - Information Services

Prudential, Fox & Roach/Trident Group

431 W. Lancaster Avenue

Devon, PA 19333

Direct: (610) 993-3299

Fax: (610) 650-5306

don.gu...@prufoxroach.com

 

From: Lee Douglas [mailto:lee.doug...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 9:50 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed

 

One thing they left out is to format the drive and start over - I've
heard that a lot on this forum 

On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 9:44 AM, Ziots, Edward 
wrote:

Sigh, 

 

Who Ratted us all out... they should be TARRED and feathered...

 

Z

 

Edward Ziots

Network Engineer

Lifespan Organization

MCSE,MCSA,MCP+I, ME, CCA, Security +, Network +

ezi...@lifespan.org

Phone:401-639-3505



From: Candee Vaglica [mailto:can...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:52 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed

 

I *love* it!



 

On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 12:22 AM, Kurt Buff  wrote:

Now anyone can be a sysadmin/tech support person:

http://xkcd.com/627/

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[Sherry Abercrombie]

Yeah it's a lost art IMHO.  Case in point, I've got a ticket in my inbox
from the HelpDesk area, it's a case of the helpdesk person should have
shadowed this person in Citrix who was reporting that they were getting a
message about a virus when they were trying to print out the employee phone
list from our intranet.  It's just a standard warning type message before
proceeding..if the helpdesk tech had seen it, they wouldn't have sent it
to 3rd level support.

On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 9:15 AM, David Mazzaccaro <
david.mazzacc...@hudsonhhc.com> wrote:

>  "lost art"?
> Or (in most cases) it's just not cost effective.
>
>
>  --
> *From:* Don Guyer [mailto:don.gu...@prufoxroach.com]
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 27, 2009 10:06 AM
> *To:* NT System Admin Issues
> *Subject:* RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed
>
>  That’s how our field techs resolve a lot of issues.
>
>
>
> Troubleshooting is a lost art form, to most techs today.
>
>
>
> Don Guyer
>
> Systems Engineer - Information Services
>
> Prudential, Fox & Roach/Trident Group
>
> 431 W. Lancaster Avenue
>
> Devon, PA 19333
>
> Direct: (610) 993-3299
>
> Fax: (610) 650-5306
>
> don.gu...@prufoxroach.com
>
>
>
> *From:* Lee Douglas [mailto:lee.doug...@gmail.com]
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 27, 2009 9:50 AM
> *To:* NT System Admin Issues
> *Subject:* Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed
>
>
>
> One thing they left out is to format the drive and start over - I've heard
> that a lot on this forum 
>
> On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 9:44 AM, Ziots, Edward 
> wrote:
>
> Sigh,
>
>
>
> Who Ratted us all out… they should be TARRED and feathered…
>
>
>
> Z
>
>
>
> Edward Ziots
>
> Network Engineer
>
> Lifespan Organization
>
> MCSE,MCSA,MCP+I, ME, CCA, Security +, Network +
>
> ezi...@lifespan.org
>
> Phone:401-639-3505
>  --
>
> *From:* Candee Vaglica [mailto:can...@gmail.com]
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:52 AM
> *To:* NT System Admin Issues
> *Subject:* Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed
>
>
>
> I *love* it!
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 12:22 AM, Kurt Buff  wrote:
>
> Now anyone can be a sysadmin/tech support person:
>
> http://xkcd.com/627/
>
> ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
> ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>


-- 
Sherry Abercrombie

"Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic."
Arthur C. Clarke
Sent from Newark, TX, United States

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[Charlie Kaiser]

Troubleshooting is an extremely valuable tool. Curing a symptom doesn't fix
a problem. Even a wipe and rebuild can be ineffective if the root cause is
elsewhere. It's one thing to wipe/rebuild a desktop machine for a problem,
but when it's a strange issue with an exchange box, or SQL server, or DC,
it's not always an option, much less the best one.
And it's kind of embarrassing to wipe a PC, return it to service, and have
the same problem crop up again later that day. Doesn't look very
professional, IMO.

Being able to troubleshoot is a skill that has, to a great degree, been lost
in our business. That's why we end up with things like that sysadmin
flowchart. There's an art and skill to methodical diagnosis that
differentiates the artisans from the parts changers...
There's also an art in knowing when to wipe and when to troubleshoot... :-)

***
Charlie Kaiser
charl...@golden-eagle.org
Kingman, AZ
***  

> -Original Message-
> From: David Lum [mailto:david@nwea.org] 
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:47 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed
> 
> +1  Time is money.
> 
>  
> 
> Having said that sometimes I will troubleshoot out of 
> curiosity even after it's obvious blowing away and starting 
> over is faster - I get a burning desire to know WHAT 
> happened. Sometimes that tidbit pays huge dividends later, or 
> sometimes knowing exactly what happened amazes other tech's.
> 
>  
> 
> Dave
> 
>  
> 
> From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonhhc.com]
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:16 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed
> 
>  
> 
> "lost art"?
> 
> Or (in most cases) it's just not cost effective.
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> ____________
> 
> From: Don Guyer [mailto:don.gu...@prufoxroach.com]
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 10:06 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed
> 
> That's how our field techs resolve a lot of issues.
> 
>  
> 
> Troubleshooting is a lost art form, to most techs today.
> 
>  
> 
> Don Guyer
> 
> Systems Engineer - Information Services
> 
> Prudential, Fox & Roach/Trident Group
> 
> 431 W. Lancaster Avenue
> 
> Devon, PA 19333
> 
> Direct: (610) 993-3299
> 
> Fax: (610) 650-5306
> 
> don.gu...@prufoxroach.com
> 
>  
> 
> From: Lee Douglas [mailto:lee.doug...@gmail.com]
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 9:50 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed
> 
>  
> 
> One thing they left out is to format the drive and start over 
> - I've heard that a lot on this forum 
> 
> On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 9:44 AM, Ziots, Edward 
>  wrote:
> 
> Sigh, 
> 
>  
> 
> Who Ratted us all out. they should be TARRED and feathered.
> 
>  
> 
> Z
> 
>  
> 
> Edward Ziots
> 
> Network Engineer
> 
> Lifespan Organization
> 
> MCSE,MCSA,MCP+I, ME, CCA, Security +, Network +
> 
> ezi...@lifespan.org
> 
> Phone:401-639-3505
> 
> 
> 
> From: Candee Vaglica [mailto:can...@gmail.com]
> Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:52 AM
> To: NT System Admin Issues
> Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed
> 
>  
> 
> I *love* it!
> 
> 
> 
>  
> 
> On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 12:22 AM, Kurt Buff 
>  wrote:
> 
> Now anyone can be a sysadmin/tech support person:
> 
> http://xkcd.com/627/
> 
> ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource 
> hog! ~ ~ 
> <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
>  
> 
> 


~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[Maglinger, Paul]

That's only for Macs.



From: Lee Douglas [mailto:lee.doug...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 8:50 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed


One thing they left out is to format the drive and start over - I've
heard that a lot on this forum 


On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 9:44 AM, Ziots, Edward 
wrote:


Sigh, 

 

Who Ratted us all out... they should be TARRED and feathered...

 

Z

 

Edward Ziots

Network Engineer

Lifespan Organization

MCSE,MCSA,MCP+I, ME, CCA, Security +, Network +

ezi...@lifespan.org

Phone:401-639-3505





From: Candee Vaglica [mailto:can...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:52 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
    Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed

 

I *love* it!



 

On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 12:22 AM, Kurt Buff
 wrote:

Now anyone can be a sysadmin/tech support person:

http://xkcd.com/627/

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog!
~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

 

 

 

 



 


 

 


~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[David Lum]

+1  Time is money.

Having said that sometimes I will troubleshoot out of curiosity even after it's 
obvious blowing away and starting over is faster - I get a burning desire to 
know WHAT happened. Sometimes that tidbit pays huge dividends later, or 
sometimes knowing exactly what happened amazes other tech's.

Dave

From: David Mazzaccaro [mailto:david.mazzacc...@hudsonhhc.com]
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:16 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

"lost art"?
Or (in most cases) it's just not cost effective.



From: Don Guyer [mailto:don.gu...@prufoxroach.com]
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 10:06 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed
That's how our field techs resolve a lot of issues.

Troubleshooting is a lost art form, to most techs today.

Don Guyer
Systems Engineer - Information Services
Prudential, Fox & Roach/Trident Group
431 W. Lancaster Avenue
Devon, PA 19333
Direct: (610) 993-3299
Fax: (610) 650-5306
don.gu...@prufoxroach.com<mailto:don.gu...@prufoxroach.com>

From: Lee Douglas [mailto:lee.doug...@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 9:50 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed

One thing they left out is to format the drive and start over - I've heard that 
a lot on this forum 
On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 9:44 AM, Ziots, Edward 
mailto:ezi...@lifespan.org>> wrote:

Sigh,



Who Ratted us all out... they should be TARRED and feathered...



Z



Edward Ziots

Network Engineer

Lifespan Organization

MCSE,MCSA,MCP+I, ME, CCA, Security +, Network +

ezi...@lifespan.org<mailto:ezi...@lifespan.org>

Phone:401-639-3505



From: Candee Vaglica [mailto:can...@gmail.com<mailto:can...@gmail.com>]
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:52 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed



I *love* it!




On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 12:22 AM, Kurt Buff 
mailto:kurt.b...@gmail.com>> wrote:

Now anyone can be a sysadmin/tech support person:

http://xkcd.com/627/

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~
























~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[Daniel Rodriguez]

I heard this before:

"FDisk is your friend"

On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 9:49 AM, Lee Douglas  wrote:

> One thing they left out is to format the drive and start over - I've heard
> that a lot on this forum 
>
>
> On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 9:44 AM, Ziots, Edward wrote:
>
>>  Sigh,
>>
>>
>>
>> Who Ratted us all out… they should be TARRED and feathered…
>>
>>
>>
>> Z
>>
>>
>>
>> Edward Ziots
>>
>> Network Engineer
>>
>> Lifespan Organization
>>
>> MCSE,MCSA,MCP+I, ME, CCA, Security +, Network +
>>
>> ezi...@lifespan.org
>>
>> Phone:401-639-3505
>>   ----------------------
>>
>> *From:* Candee Vaglica [mailto:can...@gmail.com]
>> *Sent:* Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:52 AM
>> *To:* NT System Admin Issues
>> *Subject:* Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed
>>
>>
>>
>> I *love* it!
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 12:22 AM, Kurt Buff  wrote:
>>
>> Now anyone can be a sysadmin/tech support person:
>>
>> http://xkcd.com/627/
>>
>> ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
>> ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[David Mazzaccaro]

"lost art"?
Or (in most cases) it's just not cost effective.
 



From: Don Guyer [mailto:don.gu...@prufoxroach.com] 
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 10:06 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed



That's how our field techs resolve a lot of issues.

 

Troubleshooting is a lost art form, to most techs today.

 

Don Guyer

Systems Engineer - Information Services

Prudential, Fox & Roach/Trident Group

431 W. Lancaster Avenue

Devon, PA 19333

Direct: (610) 993-3299

Fax: (610) 650-5306

don.gu...@prufoxroach.com <mailto:don.gu...@prufoxroach.com> 

 

From: Lee Douglas [mailto:lee.doug...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 9:50 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed

 

One thing they left out is to format the drive and start over - I've
heard that a lot on this forum 

On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 9:44 AM, Ziots, Edward 
wrote:

Sigh, 

 

Who Ratted us all out... they should be TARRED and feathered...

 

Z

 

Edward Ziots

Network Engineer

Lifespan Organization

MCSE,MCSA,MCP+I, ME, CCA, Security +, Network +

ezi...@lifespan.org

Phone:401-639-3505



From: Candee Vaglica [mailto:can...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:52 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed

 

I *love* it!



 

On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 12:22 AM, Kurt Buff  wrote:

Now anyone can be a sysadmin/tech support person:

http://xkcd.com/627/

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[Don Guyer]

That's how our field techs resolve a lot of issues.

 

Troubleshooting is a lost art form, to most techs today.

 

Don Guyer

Systems Engineer - Information Services

Prudential, Fox & Roach/Trident Group

431 W. Lancaster Avenue

Devon, PA 19333

Direct: (610) 993-3299

Fax: (610) 650-5306

don.gu...@prufoxroach.com <mailto:don.gu...@prufoxroach.com> 

 

From: Lee Douglas [mailto:lee.doug...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 9:50 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed

 

One thing they left out is to format the drive and start over - I've
heard that a lot on this forum 

On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 9:44 AM, Ziots, Edward 
wrote:

Sigh, 

 

Who Ratted us all out... they should be TARRED and feathered...

 

Z

 

Edward Ziots

Network Engineer

Lifespan Organization

MCSE,MCSA,MCP+I, ME, CCA, Security +, Network +

ezi...@lifespan.org

Phone:401-639-3505



From: Candee Vaglica [mailto:can...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:52 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed

 

I *love* it!



 

On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 12:22 AM, Kurt Buff  wrote:

Now anyone can be a sysadmin/tech support person:

http://xkcd.com/627/

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[Lee Douglas]

One thing they left out is to format the drive and start over - I've heard
that a lot on this forum 

On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 9:44 AM, Ziots, Edward  wrote:

>  Sigh,
>
>
>
> Who Ratted us all out… they should be TARRED and feathered…
>
>
>
> Z
>
>
>
> Edward Ziots
>
> Network Engineer
>
> Lifespan Organization
>
> MCSE,MCSA,MCP+I, ME, CCA, Security +, Network +
>
> ezi...@lifespan.org
>
> Phone:401-639-3505
>   --
>
> *From:* Candee Vaglica [mailto:can...@gmail.com]
> *Sent:* Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:52 AM
> *To:* NT System Admin Issues
> *Subject:* Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed
>
>
>
> I *love* it!
>
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 12:22 AM, Kurt Buff  wrote:
>
> Now anyone can be a sysadmin/tech support person:
>
> http://xkcd.com/627/
>
> ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
> ~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[Ziots, Edward]

Sigh, 

 

Who Ratted us all out... they should be TARRED and feathered...

 

Z

 

Edward Ziots

Network Engineer

Lifespan Organization

MCSE,MCSA,MCP+I, ME, CCA, Security +, Network +

ezi...@lifespan.org

Phone:401-639-3505



From: Candee Vaglica [mailto:can...@gmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 7:52 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed

 

I *love* it!



 

On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 12:22 AM, Kurt Buff  wrote:

Now anyone can be a sysadmin/tech support person:

http://xkcd.com/627/

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

 

 

 

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

RE: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[David Lum]

+1

Printed and will be posted in the window of our Service Desk office for all to 
see...

From: Candee Vaglica [mailto:can...@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, August 27, 2009 4:52 AM
To: NT System Admin Issues
Subject: Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed

I *love* it!



On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 12:22 AM, Kurt Buff 
mailto:kurt.b...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Now anyone can be a sysadmin/tech support person:

http://xkcd.com/627/

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~






~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~ <http://www.sunbeltsoftware.com/Business/VIPRE-Enterprise/>  ~

Re: OT: Our profession has been exposed

[Candee Vaglica]

I *love* it!



On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 12:22 AM, Kurt Buff  wrote:

> Now anyone can be a sysadmin/tech support person:
>
> http://xkcd.com/627/
>
> ~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
> ~   ~
>

~ Finally, powerful endpoint security that ISN'T a resource hog! ~
~   ~