CMS diff: Introduction to QA
Clone URL (Committers only): https://cms.apache.org/redirect?new=anonymous;action=diff;uri=http://openofficeorg.apache.org/openofficeorg%2Forientation%2Fintro-qa.mdtext Yan Ji Index: trunk/content/openofficeorg/orientation/intro-qa.mdtext === --- trunk/content/openofficeorg/orientation/intro-qa.mdtext (revision 1404425) +++ trunk/content/openofficeorg/orientation/intro-qa.mdtext (working copy) @@ -1,26 +1,89 @@ -Title: Introduction to QA -Notice:Licensed to the Apache Software Foundation (ASF) under one - or more contributor license agreements. See the NOTICE file - distributed with this work for additional information - regarding copyright ownership. The ASF licenses this file - to you under the Apache License, Version 2.0 (the - License); you may not use this file except in compliance - with the License. You may obtain a copy of the License at - . - http://www.apache.org/licenses/LICENSE-2.0 - . - Unless required by applicable law or agreed to in writing, - software distributed under the License is distributed on an - AS IS BASIS, WITHOUT WARRANTIES OR CONDITIONS OF ANY - KIND, either express or implied. See the License for the - specific language governing permissions and limitations - under the License. - -1. Please send an email to [ooo...@incubator.apache.org](mailto:ooo...@incubator.apache.org?subject=Starting Introduction to QA) to let us know you are working on this module. - -1. Understanding the defect workflow - - -1. Congratulations! You have completed this Level. Please send a note to [ooo...@incubator.apache.org](mailto:ooo...@incubator.apache.org?subject=Completed Introduction to QA) so -we all know you have completed this level. This is also a good opportunity to send along any feedback or questions you might have on this Orientation Module. - +Title: Introduction to QA +Notice:Licensed to the Apache Software Foundation (ASF) under one + or more contributor license agreements. See the NOTICE file + distributed with this work for additional information + regarding copyright ownership. The ASF licenses this file + to you under the Apache License, Version 2.0 (the + License); you may not use this file except in compliance + with the License. You may obtain a copy of the License at + . + http://www.apache.org/licenses/LICENSE-2.0 + . + Unless required by applicable law or agreed to in writing, + software distributed under the License is distributed on an + AS IS BASIS, WITHOUT WARRANTIES OR CONDITIONS OF ANY + KIND, either express or implied. See the License for the + specific language governing permissions and limitations + under the License. + +LEVEL 1: INTRODUCTION TO QAbr +In this orientation module you will know how a QA works in community.br +To get involved into QA work, firstly you need subscribe mail list: + +***QA Mailing List*** + +The list is for bug reports, quality assurance for release, beta tests, manual test, automated tests, etc. + +Subscribe: [ooo-qa-subscr...@incubator.apache.org](mailto:ooo-qa-subscr...@incubator.apache.org)br +Post (after subscription): [ooo...@incubator.apache.org](mailto:ooo...@incubator.apache.org)br +Unsubscribe: [ooo-qa-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org](ooo-qa-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org) + +Archives: + + - [Markmail](http://markmail.org/search/+list:org.apache.incubator.ooo-qa) + - [Apache](http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-ooo-qa/) + +Post mail using special tag to identify QA activities: + + * [QA REPORT] - topic related with status report + * [QA AUTOMATION] - topic related with automation tools, scripts and scope + * [QA BUG] - topic related with bug discussion + * [QA CRITICAL] - important information related with QE + * [QA CALLFORREVIEW] - topic with some review + * [QA CALLFORVOLUNTEER] - if you want to call for volunteer for testing some features + * [QA] default if others don't fit. + +After you subscribe QA mail list then you can post your topic in the mail group. + +***Bug Handling***: + +Apache Bugzilla: + + * [http://issues.apache.org/ooo](http://issues.apache.org/ooo) + +Bugzilla related documents: + + * Bug lifecycle introduction [Issue Lifecycle](http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/Issue_lifecycle)br + * A guide for opening bug: [How to file bug](http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/QA/HowToFileIssue) + +To open a new bug, you need register your bugzilla account firstly. [Account Request](https://issues.apache.org/ooo/createaccount.cgi) + +Now you can work as a QA role, starting from verifying fixed bugs to get familiar with AOO product. + +To verify fixed defect, you need to get latest build. AOO
Re: [QA Report]Weekly Defect Analysis Report as of 2012/10/29
Thanks, I'll talk to Simon for the detail data. 2012/11/1 Rob Weir robw...@apache.org On Mon, Oct 29, 2012 at 9:23 PM, Ji Yan yanji...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Rob, Sure I can update this chart in my weekly report, please let me know how to do. 1. Where should I upload the data to 2. What the numbers mean, e.g. 2012-08-01,2316,1208, does this mean in 2012 Aug, 2316 defects opened and 1208 fixed? Shenfeng Liu created the original data file. I don't know how he got the data. Maybe you can ask him. If you post an update to the list (or the ooo-qa) list I can add to website for you. We can also add some text to that page to explain what the numbers mean. -Rob 2012/10/29 Rob Weir robw...@apache.org On Mon, Oct 29, 2012 at 8:20 AM, Ji Yan yanji...@gmail.com wrote: Please find weekly defect analysis report http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/QA/Report/DefectStatus/20121029 Thanks for the report. Would it be possible to also get an update for this chart: http://www.openoffice.org/stats/defects.html ??? The data file is here: http://www.openoffice.org/stats/defects.txt Can I get the right numbers from that report? -Rob -- Thanks Best Regards, Yan Ji -- Thanks Best Regards, Yan Ji -- Thanks Best Regards, Yan Ji
Re: extensions and translations.
On 11/1/12 12:39 AM, Marcus (OOo) wrote: Am 10/27/2012 01:17 AM, schrieb jan iversen: I see, I have to get used to this license issues (a long time ago I believed open source was just open source, then I joined an apache project). never mind. Would it be to our advantage if we offered third party developers (that is how I see extension developers) the possibility to register a language file and get it translated as part of the language packs ? Of course it would be to our advantage; or let's say for the project and software. A lot of extensions would be available in many languages. However, I don't know where we should draw the line to set a limit. When we select here and there some extensions, then the other developers will ask why not their extensions. It's quite simple I would say, if people want develop extensions under ALv2 and want to contribute the code to the project. We can easy create a special section in our repo where we can host them. But this means they have to be handled in the same way as all other stuff here. Means a new release have to be voted... And IMHO it's not possible to translate all strings for all extensions. But maybe others here have a great idea? we can't probably provide it and I think we have to do enough ;-). But I can think of an alternative service hosted somewhere else. Juergen Or should we just say extension developers does not concern us (and help AOO get more used) so we just look the other way ? Maybe the right way is somewhere in the middle. Yeah, maybe. ;-) Marcus On 27 October 2012 00:58, Marcus (OOo)marcus.m...@wtnet.de wrote: Am 10/27/2012 12:36 AM, schrieb jan iversen: While doing an update to the l10n workflow I think I found a slight problem. Extensions offers the capability to integrate/extend our UI. Assuming somebody writes an extension, and publishes it on http://www.openoffice.org/**extensions/http://www.openoffice.org/extensions/how does that get integrated into the translation process ? Simply, not at all. As far as I can see the sources are not integrated into our build --all --with-lang. Right. If I am right that they are not part of the general translation, then is that per design so or should it be different ? Yes, this is by design. Extensions are offered to extent your AOO install at any point of time. These are developed by people that do not have to belong to our project (when we put aside some exceptions). They can act independently. And therefore they are allowed to (or have to ;-) ) do all on their own; incl. translation. That applies for all extensions and templates available on: - http://extensions.services.**openoffice.orghttp://extensions.services.openoffice.org - http://templates.services.**openoffice.orghttp://templates.services.openoffice.org I might be following a wrong track here, but please forgive me for trying to make the l10n process as complete as I can. Don't panic. That's a great goal and everybody is thankful to you for doing this task. Marcus
Re: AOO volunteers: essential skills and tasks
Rob, I've submitted QA introduction page, pls help commit it. Thanks 2012/11/1 Kay Schenk kay.sch...@gmail.com On 10/31/2012 11:36 AM, jan iversen wrote: +1 to your 3 layer strategy. I have made a proposal for the wiki page, however I am not competent to fill in the tasks. http://wiki.openoffice.org/w/**index.php?title=Communication/** new_contributorsaction=submithttp://wiki.openoffice.org/w/index.php?title=Communication/new_contributorsaction=submit I have NOT linked it in anywhere, but a natural link would in participation on the main page. Jan. OK, I will bail out from this for now, and see what else develops here. You know what they say about too many cooks... :/ Looking forward to interesting results from both Rob and Jan. I will certainly help as I see a need. On 31 October 2012 18:59, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Wed, Oct 31, 2012 at 1:46 PM, jan iversen jancasacon...@gmail.com wrote: Hi. I think your md pages are SUPERwhat I suggested was an additional wiki page (actually someone else called it postoffice) where we put small tasks that need to be translated / written etc. So I see your pages go hand in hand with Wiki pages, just too different levels of interaction with the community. Right. So maybe when we do a wider call for volunteers we can offer three tracks: 1) Sign up for ooo-dev and drink from the firehose (our only current option) 2) A short intro on the wiki, one that doesn't exist yet, but maybe someone can write one. 3) A longer self-paced intro on the website (what I'm working on) They are volunteers, so we can't force them to do anything. But we can offer them a few choices. I'm happy to provide one of those choices. Who wants to provide another? -Rob jan On 31 October 2012 16:59, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Wed, Oct 31, 2012 at 11:51 AM, Kay Schenk kay.sch...@gmail.com wrote: On 10/28/2012 04:30 PM, Rob Weir wrote: On Sun, Oct 28, 2012 at 6:29 PM, Andrea Pescetti pesce...@apache.org wrote: On 23/10/2012 Rob Weir wrote: New Volunteer Orientation root page: http://incubator.apache.org/**openofficeorg/orientation/http://incubator.apache.org/openofficeorg/orientation/ This is an excellent resource. But we received a few requests from prospective volunteers this weekend and I'm believing it would be overwhelming to point them there. I still believe these documents are excellent, but probably they are assuming our volunteer is above average, or at least willing to engage deeply with the project. They would be perfect for me, for you, or for a newcomer like Jan who has the skills and the mindset to understand in detail how things work. And how do we know in advance which volunteers are like Jan and which are not? I think we should find some way to point them to the info and say that they are welcome to jump in and ignore this all, or skim it in parallel with direct participation, or read through this stuff first. It is entirely up to them. But generally, the more one needs to interact with other project participants and other systems and even other parts of Apache, the more this information becomes useful. Although not stated, one could almost say that Level 4 would be becoming a Committer. So you are correct that this is a track for a more determined volunteer, But we will also have (and we do have: most volunteers I see on the mailing lists in Italian fall in this category) volunteers who don't care that much about OpenOffice as a project: they use the product and just want to give something back. They want to scratch an itch, or just to do something, but they are very task-oriented: they want something to do rather than something to read. For example, we may have translation volunteers who would be perfectly satisfied if we e-mail them a PO file and tell them to grab POEdit and send the file back; and then they would consider a deeper engagement, but not earlier. Translation volunteers are different in many ways, but even there I think we need some solid orientation material. They won't go far before wondering why they cannot write to Pootle and the website, but others can. That leads us into discussion of roles at Apache, etc. And we really need to expose them to the Apache License at the earliest opportunity. We do no one any favors if we're passing around PO files via private mail, and receiving translations without any public record of contribution. In any case, this is an issue we've had for a while. Becoming a Committer is a higher hurdle than is appropriate for most translation volunteers, due to iCLA, etc. The orientation guides did not create this problem, they merely remind us of it. And indeed they are not totally wrong: knowing how the Apache Board works is not needed to be able to translate a press release, or a few OpenOffice
Re: [DISCUSS] IDE, comment translation, debugging, documentation and other development issues
Hi Andrea, OK, but if a developer bumps into German comments while investigating code, it doesn't harm to check in a translation to English. Most of our more experienced developers know German and English, so it won't be problematic to find someone who can ensure that the translation is correct. On the other hand, I'm not sure that a systematic translation of German comments makes sense, since there are modules that are or will soon be deprecated; it probably makes more sense to translate when needed. you got it: This way (translate when needed) is preferable for all code that is not deprecated. Fortunately there are a lot of developers here who can understand those comments and who could help to translate them into English but translating shouldn't be the main focus eg. just for counting code changes like within our main fork (hint hint...). Kind regards, Joost
Re: [RELEASE] Releasing new languages for 3.4.1
On 30/10/2012 Rob Weir wrote: However, if we want to have a beta release of these lang packs, then this is not hard either: 1) Checked the PO files into the 3.4.x branch 2) Verify that they have correct license headers (assuming PO files allow a license header) 3) Generate a source package as a diff file of the branch against the 3.4.1 revision 4) Generate the binary packages, perhaps just lang packs, perhaps full installs 5) Sign the source package and binary packages 6) 72 hour release vote 7) Announce via blog, etc. This seems good since it would allow to avoid distributing a 3.4.2 for the only sake of adding new languages: users would be disappointed to see a new 3.4.2 identical to 3.4.1 (since all changes and bugfixes are being applied to trunk only). The only problem I see is that we would then have the distributed 3.4.1 binaries in English compiled from the August sources, and the distributed 3.4.1 binaries in Danish compiled from the November sources. But, so long as the AOO34 branch is updated with new language files only, this approach can work. About 1 and 2: PO files do allow for a license header, but are imported (with conversion) in the sources rather than simply copied, so steps 1 and 2 would be replaced by importing the PO files and clarify their provenance/license. Of course, this all has overhead, especially for you, the release manager. So we don't want to repeat this too frequently. This has overhead on the release managers, package providers, website maintainers, mirror operators and (to a lesser extent) on the whole community. But if we can enable new languages to appear within a few weeks, perhaps in batches of 3-5, this is positive news for the community engagement. Localization volunteers are the ones we are most prepared to handle at the moment, and an important resource for the project. Regards, Andrea.
Re: [ApacheCon] BoF session on AOO community
On 10/30/12 12:14 PM, Rob Weir wrote: On Oct 30, 2012, at 4:19 AM, Jörg Schmidt joe...@j-m-schmidt.de wrote: When we have something to announce you can expect to read it in official places. It won't be something we'll be hiding in strange corners of the web. That means if an employee identifies proposals on XING does not correspond to the opinion of the IBM? Not officially? I think that's a strange point of view. I think sentences like: heute mal eine ganz andere Anfrage, IBM als eine der Firmen, die sich im Apache OpenOffice Projekt engagiert, macht sich auch über ein Service Support Konzept im Rahmen von Apache OpenOffice Gedanken. [...] Ich würde gerne mehr darüber erfahren, wer im OpenOffice Umfeld aktiv ist und an einer Partnerbeziehung auf dieser Ebene mit IBM interessiert ist. are absolutely clear. This sounds like research to me. exactly, I simply wanted to start a discussion on a further channel and I haven't offered anything concrete. It was an attempt of brainstorming without the success that I has looked for :-( The idea of such a partner network of course is that people or even companies can make use of it and can recommend each other on demand. Or ISV can work together on bigger deals if necessary. As Rob pointed already out if IBM receive a request for support for AOO but IBM can't help for whatever reason it would be good to have a partner network worldwide where we simply could recommend an ISV/partner. It's funny in the past people complained about the dominance of Sun/Oracle in the project, then people tried to put IBM in this position. But IBM don't want a special role in the project, we want be part of the overall community and want work together with others. It seems that you expect IBM should taking a leading role here. But I think the best way to show confidence in the project is a healthy, diverse and working community without a leading company and that exactly is what Apache guarantees. Juergen But no problem, I will contact IBM directly. Thanks for your clarification. If everything is absolutely clear to you then I don't know what you want clarifications on. But if you do have a question then just ask it, here or via private email if that is your preference. But I speak honestly when I say that I cannot figure out what your theory is here and what you think is occurring. Rob Greetings, Jörg
Re: [UX] - Design Exploration - Dockable Task Pane (Sidebar) - Tab User Interface Design
I like beveled tab option. One question, what kinds of content should be put into the sidebar? A navigator window or a style list window should be put into sidebar as a tab panel. On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 4:59 PM, Kevin Grignon kevingrignon...@gmail.comwrote: Hello All, I've been exploring design alternatives for adding navigation tabs to the docked task pane. See: http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_Exploration_-_Docked_Task_Pane_Container_-_Tab_User_Interface_Design Capture any thoughts or feedback in the discussion section of the wiki page. Thanks, Kevin
Re: [ApacheCon] BoF session on AOO community
On 11/1/12, Jürgen Schmidt jogischm...@gmail.com wrote: On 10/30/12 12:14 PM, Rob Weir wrote: On Oct 30, 2012, at 4:19 AM, Jörg Schmidt joe...@j-m-schmidt.de wrote: When we have something to announce you can expect to read it in official places. It won't be something we'll be hiding in strange corners of the web. That means if an employee identifies proposals on XING does not correspond to the opinion of the IBM? Not officially? I think that's a strange point of view. I think sentences like: heute mal eine ganz andere Anfrage, IBM als eine der Firmen, die sich im Apache OpenOffice Projekt engagiert, macht sich auch über ein Service Support Konzept im Rahmen von Apache OpenOffice Gedanken. [...] Ich würde gerne mehr darüber erfahren, wer im OpenOffice Umfeld aktiv ist und an einer Partnerbeziehung auf dieser Ebene mit IBM interessiert ist. are absolutely clear. This sounds like research to me. exactly, I simply wanted to start a discussion on a further channel and I haven't offered anything concrete. It was an attempt of brainstorming without the success that I has looked for :-( The idea of such a partner network of course is that people or even companies can make use of it and can recommend each other on demand. Or ISV can work together on bigger deals if necessary. As Rob pointed already out if IBM receive a request for support for AOO but IBM can't help for whatever reason it would be good to have a partner network worldwide where we simply could recommend an ISV/partner. It's funny in the past people complained about the dominance of Sun/Oracle in the project, then people tried to put IBM in this position. But IBM don't want a special role in the project, we want be part of the overall community and want work together with others. The issue with Sun/Oracle wasn't business related but community related. At a point Sun usually wasn't really in a meaningful picture in many of the peripheral offices. The partner network was always something that was embraced during the BizDev project, but the relevance of this effort wasn't enough to capture possible consultants. Also beside the BizDev list, there was a need for more corporate push, like partner relations upstream and a real channel to discuss business-related needs of the software. We meet a couple of times with Simon Phipps to have Sun more engaged on OOo affairs, but bureaucracy and the internal struggles at Sun didn't make the idea go that fair in. It seems that you expect IBM should taking a leading role here. But I think the best way to show confidence in the project is a healthy, diverse and working community without a leading company and that exactly is what Apache guarantees. Juergen But no problem, I will contact IBM directly. Thanks for your clarification. If everything is absolutely clear to you then I don't know what you want clarifications on. But if you do have a question then just ask it, here or via private email if that is your preference. But I speak honestly when I say that I cannot figure out what your theory is here and what you think is occurring. Rob Greetings, Jörg -- Alexandro Colorado PPMC Apache OpenOffice http://es.openoffice.org
Re: [RELEASE] Releasing new languages for 3.4.1
On 11/1/12 10:09 AM, Andrea Pescetti wrote: On 31/10/2012 jan iversen wrote: Ok, I thought team meant language teams. But I have searched the Wiki and cannot find any documentation on the required QA procedure relating to national languages. Can it be, that it was never really defined and written down ? It was. We used to have two tools, TCM and QATrack. The former was a test management platform, which (among many other things) contained a Release Sanity test suite, about 30 tests that should be passed to release OpenOffice in a certain language: sorting text with native language characters and so on. The latter was a web panel where responsible QA persons for each language could state that they were running QA on, say, the German Mac OS X version and report whether the build was approved or rejected (and much more, but this is the basic idea). Both tools are unused now. TCM is not accessible but if Oracle manages to provide the testcases (not the platform) we will be able to reuse them. QATrack was initially written by me and then significantly extended by Per Eriksson and we should have it somewhere, but can be easily redone on a proper framework: I wouldn't write a tool explicitly for that purpose any longer these days. I am not sure but maybe we can use TestLink more in the future. I have to confess that I never used QATrack in the past and don't know what it provided exactly and how it was used. http://aootesting.adfinis-sygroup.org/login.php Juergen
Re: CMS diff: Introduction to QA
Committed. Thanks for the patch. I'll review more later today. -Rob On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 3:34 AM, Yan Ji anonym...@apache.org wrote: Clone URL (Committers only): https://cms.apache.org/redirect?new=anonymous;action=diff;uri=http://openofficeorg.apache.org/openofficeorg%2Forientation%2Fintro-qa.mdtext Yan Ji Index: trunk/content/openofficeorg/orientation/intro-qa.mdtext === --- trunk/content/openofficeorg/orientation/intro-qa.mdtext (revision 1404425) +++ trunk/content/openofficeorg/orientation/intro-qa.mdtext (working copy) @@ -1,26 +1,89 @@ -Title: Introduction to QA -Notice:Licensed to the Apache Software Foundation (ASF) under one - or more contributor license agreements. See the NOTICE file - distributed with this work for additional information - regarding copyright ownership. The ASF licenses this file - to you under the Apache License, Version 2.0 (the - License); you may not use this file except in compliance - with the License. You may obtain a copy of the License at - . - http://www.apache.org/licenses/LICENSE-2.0 - . - Unless required by applicable law or agreed to in writing, - software distributed under the License is distributed on an - AS IS BASIS, WITHOUT WARRANTIES OR CONDITIONS OF ANY - KIND, either express or implied. See the License for the - specific language governing permissions and limitations - under the License. - -1. Please send an email to [ooo...@incubator.apache.org](mailto:ooo...@incubator.apache.org?subject=Starting Introduction to QA) to let us know you are working on this module. - -1. Understanding the defect workflow - - -1. Congratulations! You have completed this Level. Please send a note to [ooo...@incubator.apache.org](mailto:ooo...@incubator.apache.org?subject=Completed Introduction to QA) so -we all know you have completed this level. This is also a good opportunity to send along any feedback or questions you might have on this Orientation Module. - +Title: Introduction to QA +Notice:Licensed to the Apache Software Foundation (ASF) under one + or more contributor license agreements. See the NOTICE file + distributed with this work for additional information + regarding copyright ownership. The ASF licenses this file + to you under the Apache License, Version 2.0 (the + License); you may not use this file except in compliance + with the License. You may obtain a copy of the License at + . + http://www.apache.org/licenses/LICENSE-2.0 + . + Unless required by applicable law or agreed to in writing, + software distributed under the License is distributed on an + AS IS BASIS, WITHOUT WARRANTIES OR CONDITIONS OF ANY + KIND, either express or implied. See the License for the + specific language governing permissions and limitations + under the License. + +LEVEL 1: INTRODUCTION TO QAbr +In this orientation module you will know how a QA works in community.br +To get involved into QA work, firstly you need subscribe mail list: + +***QA Mailing List*** + +The list is for bug reports, quality assurance for release, beta tests, manual test, automated tests, etc. + +Subscribe: [ooo-qa-subscr...@incubator.apache.org](mailto:ooo-qa-subscr...@incubator.apache.org)br +Post (after subscription): [ooo...@incubator.apache.org](mailto:ooo...@incubator.apache.org)br +Unsubscribe: [ooo-qa-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org](ooo-qa-unsubscr...@incubator.apache.org) + +Archives: + + - [Markmail](http://markmail.org/search/+list:org.apache.incubator.ooo-qa) + - [Apache](http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-ooo-qa/) + +Post mail using special tag to identify QA activities: + + * [QA REPORT] - topic related with status report + * [QA AUTOMATION] - topic related with automation tools, scripts and scope + * [QA BUG] - topic related with bug discussion + * [QA CRITICAL] - important information related with QE + * [QA CALLFORREVIEW] - topic with some review + * [QA CALLFORVOLUNTEER] - if you want to call for volunteer for testing some features + * [QA] default if others don't fit. + +After you subscribe QA mail list then you can post your topic in the mail group. + +***Bug Handling***: + +Apache Bugzilla: + + * [http://issues.apache.org/ooo](http://issues.apache.org/ooo) + +Bugzilla related documents: + + * Bug lifecycle introduction [Issue Lifecycle](http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/Issue_lifecycle)br + * A guide for opening bug: [How to file bug](http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/QA/HowToFileIssue) + +To open a new bug, you need register your bugzilla
Re: extensions and translations.
On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 3:52 AM, Jürgen Schmidt jogischm...@gmail.com wrote: On 11/1/12 12:39 AM, Marcus (OOo) wrote: Am 10/27/2012 01:17 AM, schrieb jan iversen: I see, I have to get used to this license issues (a long time ago I believed open source was just open source, then I joined an apache project). never mind. Would it be to our advantage if we offered third party developers (that is how I see extension developers) the possibility to register a language file and get it translated as part of the language packs ? Of course it would be to our advantage; or let's say for the project and software. A lot of extensions would be available in many languages. However, I don't know where we should draw the line to set a limit. When we select here and there some extensions, then the other developers will ask why not their extensions. It's quite simple I would say, if people want develop extensions under ALv2 and want to contribute the code to the project. We can easy create a special section in our repo where we can host them. But this means they have to be handled in the same way as all other stuff here. Means a new release have to be voted... +1 I think the important thing is this: We don't just want code. We want communities. So if an extension author thinks that their extension is generally useful and he/she wants to join the AOO community and work on the extension here, and allow others to work on it as well, then this is good. We can have a set of standard extensions. And IMHO it's not possible to translate all strings for all extensions. But maybe others here have a great idea? we can't probably provide it and I think we have to do enough ;-). But I can think of an alternative service hosted somewhere else. Juergen Or should we just say extension developers does not concern us (and help AOO get more used) so we just look the other way ? Maybe the right way is somewhere in the middle. Yeah, maybe. ;-) Marcus On 27 October 2012 00:58, Marcus (OOo)marcus.m...@wtnet.de wrote: Am 10/27/2012 12:36 AM, schrieb jan iversen: While doing an update to the l10n workflow I think I found a slight problem. Extensions offers the capability to integrate/extend our UI. Assuming somebody writes an extension, and publishes it on http://www.openoffice.org/**extensions/http://www.openoffice.org/extensions/how does that get integrated into the translation process ? Simply, not at all. As far as I can see the sources are not integrated into our build --all --with-lang. Right. If I am right that they are not part of the general translation, then is that per design so or should it be different ? Yes, this is by design. Extensions are offered to extent your AOO install at any point of time. These are developed by people that do not have to belong to our project (when we put aside some exceptions). They can act independently. And therefore they are allowed to (or have to ;-) ) do all on their own; incl. translation. That applies for all extensions and templates available on: - http://extensions.services.**openoffice.orghttp://extensions.services.openoffice.org - http://templates.services.**openoffice.orghttp://templates.services.openoffice.org I might be following a wrong track here, but please forgive me for trying to make the l10n process as complete as I can. Don't panic. That's a great goal and everybody is thankful to you for doing this task. Marcus
who should I contact for giving an idea.
Hi, I'm an advanced user of openoffice and would like to give an idea for improving the speed of linked cells in related spreads. Is there any e-mail for this purpose? Many thanks. Greetings. Javier Corral, Barcelona - Spain.
Re: Volunteers, Contributors, Committers, PMC members -- is there any way to consolidate these lists?
Hi. On Wed, Oct 24, 2012 at 4:56 PM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: Any objections to this general idea? Any improvements? And if we did want a place to have a big table of volunteers, where on the wiki should we put it (CWiki or MWiki)? Yes, we must show who really helps too. The page in cwiki is but ideal. -- Albino
Re: who should I contact for giving an idea.
Hi Javier, this is of course the correct place here. But it is a mailing list and you should subscribe first otherwise you won't receive replies to your emails directly. Notice that I have put you explicitly on cc. Feel free to share your idea with us. Regards Juergen On 11/1/12 1:17 PM, E.S.Corral, S.L. wrote: Hi, I'm an advanced user of openoffice and would like to give an idea for improving the speed of linked cells in related spreads. Is there any e-mail for this purpose? Many thanks. Greetings. Javier Corral, Barcelona - Spain.
Re: complaint
Hi, On 01.11.2012 13:26, mango...@talktalk.net wrote: Hi Why does my Open Office keep crashing? Please have a look at the first item in the Known Issues area of our AOO 3.4.1 release notes [1]. May be you are hit by the same and the proposed actions on the forum solves the problem. [1] https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/AOO+3.4.1+Release+Notes Best regards, Oliver. Ken
Re: [UX] - Design Exploration - Dockable Task Pane (Sidebar) - Tab User Interface Design
2012/11/1 Jürgen Schmidt jogischm...@gmail.com On 11/1/12 11:09 AM, Lei Wang wrote: I like beveled tab option. me too and it was already planned in the past to extend the existing solution. +1 to Beveled tab option. One question, what kinds of content should be put into the sidebar? A navigator window or a style list window should be put into sidebar as a tab panel. I think that are good examples and Symphony has used it in a good way too. But I am also looking forward to make more more use of it to via extensions and integrate in other systems. It can be a file browser on a CMS where you can checkin/checkout files, can share files, etc.. It can be a property SideBar as we know it from Symphony. property sidebar is a good candidate to implement in phase I. No need to migrated every thing from Symphony sidebar, but start from some frequent used buttons. Another candidate we can consider maybe clipart/gallery. And agree that we should provide interface for extension development. I can see it is a big feature that requires a lot of UX/development/testing effort. So I suggest to create a wiki under 4.0 planning wikihttps://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/AOO+4.0+Release+Planningto consolidate and trace all related tasks and action items. We may also need a branch to start ASAP. - Shenfeng Liu (Simon) A SideBar in general is smooth and nice way to integrate in the office UI and provide fast access to new interesting features. And last but not least to make use of wide screen displays ;-) Juergen On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 4:59 PM, Kevin Grignon kevingrignon...@gmail.com wrote: Hello All, I've been exploring design alternatives for adding navigation tabs to the docked task pane. See: http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_Exploration_-_Docked_Task_Pane_Container_-_Tab_User_Interface_Design Capture any thoughts or feedback in the discussion section of the wiki page. Thanks, Kevin
Re: complaint
Ken is not subscribed to the list and hasn't received your answer. I have cc'ed him now Juergen On 11/1/12 1:37 PM, Oliver-Rainer Wittmann wrote: Hi, On 01.11.2012 13:26, mango...@talktalk.net wrote: Hi Why does my Open Office keep crashing? Please have a look at the first item in the Known Issues area of our AOO 3.4.1 release notes [1]. May be you are hit by the same and the proposed actions on the forum solves the problem. [1] https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/AOO+3.4.1+Release+Notes Best regards, Oliver. Ken
Re: [ApacheCon] BoF session on AOO community
On Wed, Oct 31, 2012 at 10:29 PM, Louis Suárez-Potts lui...@gmail.comwrote: Roberto, On 12-10-31, at 15:14 , Roberto Galoppini rgalopp...@geek.net wrote: On Wed, Oct 31, 2012 at 8:55 AM, Andrea Pescetti pesce...@apache.org wrote: On 29/10/2012 Roberto Galoppini wrote: A more diverse and sustainable project. For example, until few years ago having OOo integrated or at least able to interoperate with SAP was a distinct dream, is there any chance we can have the right SAP people to attend the AOO BoF, and discuss about this? This would be quite interesting too. I don't have any contacts, but it would be good to have SAP people there and, in general, devote a part of the session to exploring how OpenOffice can interoperate with other solutions (or what the OpenOffice community can do to allow others to be able to integrate with OpenOffice more easily), so not only the community in a strict sense but the ecosystem around it too. I have sent an email to my open source contacts at SAP, maybe other Apache members might have contacts too. I have my old friend from Sun, Erwin T., as well as others through him, and then some outside of open source. We've had discussions with SAP before—but that was prior-moulting, when we were still Oracles. I've dropped a couple of emails, but it's All Saints in Germany and it would be unlikely to hear back before Monday. Having been in the OOo migrations' business for some years, I firmly believe we should try hard to reduce the SI integration gap. Absolutely. Totally agree. Huzza. So let's. Can we perhaps formalize this in a wiki of Things That Are Important or At Least Worth It? We might do that, but a survey could probably do a better job in this respect, though. While actually for things like SAP we've heard that so many times from medium-large companies that likely we do not need to ask. Roberto Louis Roberto Regards, Andrea. -- This e- mail message is intended only for the named recipient(s) above. It may contain confidential and privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this e-mail and any attachment(s) is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error, please immediately notify the sender by replying to this e-mail and delete the message and any attachment(s) from your system. Thank you.
Re: extensions and translations.
On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 1:17 PM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 3:52 AM, Jürgen Schmidt jogischm...@gmail.com wrote: On 11/1/12 12:39 AM, Marcus (OOo) wrote: Am 10/27/2012 01:17 AM, schrieb jan iversen: I see, I have to get used to this license issues (a long time ago I believed open source was just open source, then I joined an apache project). never mind. Would it be to our advantage if we offered third party developers (that is how I see extension developers) the possibility to register a language file and get it translated as part of the language packs ? Of course it would be to our advantage; or let's say for the project and software. A lot of extensions would be available in many languages. However, I don't know where we should draw the line to set a limit. When we select here and there some extensions, then the other developers will ask why not their extensions. It's quite simple I would say, if people want develop extensions under ALv2 and want to contribute the code to the project. We can easy create a special section in our repo where we can host them. But this means they have to be handled in the same way as all other stuff here. Means a new release have to be voted... +1 I think the important thing is this: We don't just want code. We want communities. So if an extension author thinks that their extension is generally useful and he/she wants to join the AOO community and work on the extension here, and allow others to work on it as well, then this is good. We can have a set of standard extensions. Agree 100%. Roberto And IMHO it's not possible to translate all strings for all extensions. But maybe others here have a great idea? we can't probably provide it and I think we have to do enough ;-). But I can think of an alternative service hosted somewhere else. Juergen Or should we just say extension developers does not concern us (and help AOO get more used) so we just look the other way ? Maybe the right way is somewhere in the middle. Yeah, maybe. ;-) Marcus On 27 October 2012 00:58, Marcus (OOo)marcus.m...@wtnet.de wrote: Am 10/27/2012 12:36 AM, schrieb jan iversen: While doing an update to the l10n workflow I think I found a slight problem. Extensions offers the capability to integrate/extend our UI. Assuming somebody writes an extension, and publishes it on http://www.openoffice.org/**extensions/ http://www.openoffice.org/extensions/how does that get integrated into the translation process ? Simply, not at all. As far as I can see the sources are not integrated into our build --all --with-lang. Right. If I am right that they are not part of the general translation, then is that per design so or should it be different ? Yes, this is by design. Extensions are offered to extent your AOO install at any point of time. These are developed by people that do not have to belong to our project (when we put aside some exceptions). They can act independently. And therefore they are allowed to (or have to ;-) ) do all on their own; incl. translation. That applies for all extensions and templates available on: - http://extensions.services.**openoffice.org http://extensions.services.openoffice.org - http://templates.services.**openoffice.org http://templates.services.openoffice.org I might be following a wrong track here, but please forgive me for trying to make the l10n process as complete as I can. Don't panic. That's a great goal and everybody is thankful to you for doing this task. Marcus -- This e- mail message is intended only for the named recipient(s) above. It may contain confidential and privileged information. If you are not the intended recipient you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this e-mail and any attachment(s) is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error, please immediately notify the sender by replying to this e-mail and delete the message and any attachment(s) from your system. Thank you.
Re: [UX] - Design Exploration - Dockable Task Pane (Sidebar) - Tab User Interface Design
2012/11/1 Kevin Grignon kevingrignon...@gmail.com Hello All, I've been exploring design alternatives for adding navigation tabs to the docked task pane. See: http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_Exploration_-_Docked_Task_Pane_Container_-_Tab_User_Interface_Design Capture any thoughts or feedback in the discussion section of the wiki page. Thanks, Kevin Good! I just added some thoughts on the talk page. Regards Ricardo
FW: [Full-disclosure] [SECURITY] [DSA 2570-1] openoffice.org security update
Because of the substitution of LibreOffice as openoffice.org installs, it is very confusing which of these defects may apply to Apache OpenOffice. In any case, the Debian CVE is now public. -Original Message- From: full-disclosure-boun...@lists.grok.org.uk [mailto:full-disclosure-boun...@lists.grok.org.uk] On Behalf Of Yves-Alexis Perez Sent: Wednesday, October 31, 2012 13:37 To: debian-security-annou...@lists.debian.org Subject: [Full-disclosure] [SECURITY] [DSA 2570-1] openoffice.org security update -BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA512 - - Debian Security Advisory DSA-2570-1 secur...@debian.org http://www.debian.org/security/ Yves-Alexis Perez October 31, 2012 http://www.debian.org/security/faq - - Package: openoffice.org Vulnerability : remote Problem type : remote Debian-specific: no CVE ID : CVE-2012-4233 Debian Bug : High-Tech Bridge SA Security Research Lab discovered multiple null-pointer dereferences based vulnerabilities in OpenOffice which could cause application crash or even arbitrary code execution using specially crafted files. Affected file types are LWP (Lotus Word Pro), ODG, PPT (MS Powerpoint 2003) and XLS (MS Excel 2003). For the stable distribution (squeeze), this problem has been fixed in version 1:3.2.1-11+squeeze8. openoffice.org package has been replaced by libreoffice in testing (wheezy) and unstable (sid) distributions. For the testing distribution (wheezy), this problem has been fixed in version 1:3.5.4+dfsg-3. For the unstable distribution (sid), this problem has been fixed in version 1:3.5.4+dfsg-3. We recommend that you upgrade your openoffice.org packages. Further information about Debian Security Advisories, how to apply these updates to your system and frequently asked questions can be found at: http://www.debian.org/security/ Mailing list: debian-security-annou...@lists.debian.org -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v2.0.19 (GNU/Linux) iQIcBAEBCgAGBQJQkYwEAAoJEDBVD3hx7wuoofcQAL40FW6uvEF8FQxJN1Sz46qK +9or2c+iRRF3eDuOBEHgECw0Knas33m/sLYIt2w7wywTLpO4FNgggeJXRY5P57oo I2EFo4ZnHSCa/kYGNkE6NuE+ZCDDJ8og+d8G7TxHbHMpWJXxWneEKlXhqB1nT0WQ t7TboxKXItxj82ezYClehkXCbK1v0t10rZipagwq7aZ5DPxSJ4GTBbFaJ96NLPqk aAZKO+yik+g+zFpy3y7EYPXseiTsW68pHQS+W/SvK6iTIHGHgKgZCFAlTAtVyQ// Vs82HkLWzGl/Bcm5o/Vght0rc0ZAEUBfpTiDfVTkAlmniao03YKD7wr3Ieqm9PXD hXgSy8x10DoLoZbdYPKG6M6To0jO4+8VidLd5nY48+TK//p3ZEEABuY5PP+OFIyI 7+vcLLvL/VeHguLJuKDqoK24YVsebCK6laNxIehtbvvJWz6qZzj7SfieVrVeaSgB 62XDCghfrhIlV23W/U85e0QRcEKbLzGxw1JFcbwmZh/7QMO3MixYvI9JJ7TQt/1r 9ZOqbfPiBVHzA0vEh5PK+L1C3idyh9pOT0Aoo9ZfTLt09P4CtWd3HTFZ8L+reaOi pWzV4REyhhFYo+4BsAgb4cT6fTW9x0Qh0P9b0rLWv2dCtqmpktKkVoXXzfCz/Pqp rKYAuypU8eo4B+Jq2O+p =hToM -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Full-Disclosure - We believe in it. Charter: http://lists.grok.org.uk/full-disclosure-charter.html Hosted and sponsored by Secunia - http://secunia.com/
Re: [UX] - Design Exploration - Dockable Task Pane (Sidebar) - Tab User Interface Design
On 01.11.2012 09:59, Kevin Grignon wrote: Hello All, I've been exploring design alternatives for adding navigation tabs to the docked task pane. See: http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_Exploration_-_Docked_Task_Pane_Container_-_Tab_User_Interface_Design We should keep in mind that there are not only UX changes involved here. I see three areas to work on: 1. UX. Look and feel. Kevin has made the first step in this area. 2. Programming framework. There is already a UNO API for plugable sidebar controls in general. There is a C++ framework for the side bar used in Impress. These different approaches should be unified and extended to be usable by all AOO applications and by extension developers. 3. Sidebar content. At the moment I only know the sidebar in AOO Impress (implemented a large part of it myself) and the Symphony sidebar. I think that we want the sidebar for AOO Writer and Calc, too, and have to think about what to put into it. Here we can learn and copy a lot from Symphony. -Andre
Re: OpenOffice Developer Room (devroom) at FOSDEM
On 30.10.2012 22:10, jan iversen wrote: Just for info, Juergen told me that he was going to talk about l10n on apacheCon, so I suggested that we could make a speech at FOSDEM, because at that time the new workflow is hopefully ready or so close that we know all details. A good theme for a main speech would be how the handle the build (and release) process with internationalization in a big project like AOO. Hi Jan, I will be talking at ApacheCon EU about the AOO build system and only briefly mention l10n (how it works today). Maybe you want to give a similar talk at FOSDEM but with a strong focus on l10n? -Andre
Re: [UX] - Design Exploration - Dockable Task Pane (Sidebar) - Tab User Interface Design
2012/11/1 Andre Fischer awf@gmail.com On 01.11.2012 09:59, Kevin Grignon wrote: Hello All, I've been exploring design alternatives for adding navigation tabs to the docked task pane. See: http://wiki.openoffice.org/**wiki/AOO_UX_Design_** Exploration_-_Docked_Task_**Pane_Container_-_Tab_User_**Interface_Designhttp://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_Exploration_-_Docked_Task_Pane_Container_-_Tab_User_Interface_Design We should keep in mind that there are not only UX changes involved here. I see three areas to work on: 1. UX. Look and feel. Kevin has made the first step in this area. 2. Programming framework. There is already a UNO API for plugable sidebar controls in general. There is a C++ framework for the side bar used in Impress. These different approaches should be unified and extended to be usable by all AOO applications and by extension developers. 3. Sidebar content. At the moment I only know the sidebar in AOO Impress (implemented a large part of it myself) and the Symphony sidebar. You can dock the stylist, the navigator, the gallery and the old fontwork tool to have a sort of sidebar on all AOO components. Regards Ricardo I think that we want the sidebar for AOO Writer and Calc, too, and have to think about what to put into it. Here we can learn and copy a lot from Symphony. -Andre
Re: Have you been contacted via private email and discouraged from participating on the OpenOffice project?
+1, what can I say apart from I am still here, and I mean to stay with AOO for a long time. Jan. On 1 November 2012 15:18, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: I'm hearing that some project volunteers, especially new ones, are being contacted by certain external parties, who then try to discourage them from contributing to the Apache OpenOffice project. I'm hearing that similar notes have been sent out to those who submitted listings to our new Consultants Directory, also discouraging them from involvement in the project. This is my personal view on this matter, for what it is worth. I think we all would agree that such techniques are deplorable and bring disrepute to the individuals involved, and to the project that sanctions such techniques. If you recall we had a similar wave of such unprofessional behavior a few months ago, when certain external parties were contacting journalists who mentioned OpenOffice and telling them that it was no longer being developed and to link to a different product instead. I any case, if you are receiving such FUD yourself, I'd encourage you to simply post it to this mailing list, or to your blog, or some other public website. Daylight is the best antiseptic as they say. I am not a medical doctor, but I do believe that FUD exposed to public scrutiny loses its potency. But FUD ignored is FUD that spreads. Regards, -Rob
Re: Have you been contacted via private email and discouraged from participating on the OpenOffice project?
This should be a wake up call for the weak marketing effort it has been going. Lack of connection with major information providers and overal lack of PR. I hope this could change as we move forward. It also puts new light on the discussion on marketing efforts/support, funding and such. On 11/1/12, jan iversen jancasacon...@gmail.com wrote: +1, what can I say apart from I am still here, and I mean to stay with AOO for a long time. Jan. On 1 November 2012 15:18, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: I'm hearing that some project volunteers, especially new ones, are being contacted by certain external parties, who then try to discourage them from contributing to the Apache OpenOffice project. I'm hearing that similar notes have been sent out to those who submitted listings to our new Consultants Directory, also discouraging them from involvement in the project. This is my personal view on this matter, for what it is worth. I think we all would agree that such techniques are deplorable and bring disrepute to the individuals involved, and to the project that sanctions such techniques. If you recall we had a similar wave of such unprofessional behavior a few months ago, when certain external parties were contacting journalists who mentioned OpenOffice and telling them that it was no longer being developed and to link to a different product instead. I any case, if you are receiving such FUD yourself, I'd encourage you to simply post it to this mailing list, or to your blog, or some other public website. Daylight is the best antiseptic as they say. I am not a medical doctor, but I do believe that FUD exposed to public scrutiny loses its potency. But FUD ignored is FUD that spreads. Regards, -Rob -- Alexandro Colorado PPMC Apache OpenOffice http://es.openoffice.org
Re: [QA Report]Weekly Defect Analysis Report as of 2012/10/29
Yan Ji, I used the following 2 queries: All_Reported_Since - https://issues.apache.org/ooo/buglist.cgi?cmdtype=doremremaction=runnamedcmd=All_Reported_Sincesharer_id=249089 All_Fixed_Since - https://issues.apache.org/ooo/buglist.cgi?cmdtype=doremremaction=runnamedcmd=All_Fixed_Sincesharer_id=249089 The start date was set to 2011-06-01. While you need to edit the queries and set the end date to 2012-09-01, 2012-10-01, 2012-11-01. Then input the data to defects.txt . Please help to update the chart. And tell me if any question. Thanks! - Shenfeng Liu (Simon) 2012/11/1 Ji Yan yanji...@gmail.com Thanks, I'll talk to Simon for the detail data. 2012/11/1 Rob Weir robw...@apache.org On Mon, Oct 29, 2012 at 9:23 PM, Ji Yan yanji...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Rob, Sure I can update this chart in my weekly report, please let me know how to do. 1. Where should I upload the data to 2. What the numbers mean, e.g. 2012-08-01,2316,1208, does this mean in 2012 Aug, 2316 defects opened and 1208 fixed? Shenfeng Liu created the original data file. I don't know how he got the data. Maybe you can ask him. If you post an update to the list (or the ooo-qa) list I can add to website for you. We can also add some text to that page to explain what the numbers mean. -Rob 2012/10/29 Rob Weir robw...@apache.org On Mon, Oct 29, 2012 at 8:20 AM, Ji Yan yanji...@gmail.com wrote: Please find weekly defect analysis report http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/QA/Report/DefectStatus/20121029 Thanks for the report. Would it be possible to also get an update for this chart: http://www.openoffice.org/stats/defects.html ??? The data file is here: http://www.openoffice.org/stats/defects.txt Can I get the right numbers from that report? -Rob -- Thanks Best Regards, Yan Ji -- Thanks Best Regards, Yan Ji -- Thanks Best Regards, Yan Ji
Re: Have you been contacted via private email and discouraged from participating on the OpenOffice project?
2012/11/1 Rob Weir robw...@apache.org I'm hearing that some project volunteers, especially new ones, are being contacted by certain external parties, who then try to discourage them from contributing to the Apache OpenOffice project. I'm hearing that similar notes have been sent out to those who submitted listings to our new Consultants Directory, also discouraging them from involvement in the project. This is my personal view on this matter, for what it is worth. I think we all would agree that such techniques are deplorable and bring disrepute to the individuals involved, and to the project that sanctions such techniques. If you recall we had a similar wave of such unprofessional behavior a few months ago, when certain external parties were contacting journalists who mentioned OpenOffice and telling them that it was no longer being developed and to link to a different product instead. I any case, if you are receiving such FUD yourself, I'd encourage you to simply post it to this mailing list, or to your blog, or some other public website. Daylight is the best antiseptic as they say. I am not a medical doctor, but I do believe that FUD exposed to public scrutiny loses its potency. But FUD ignored is FUD that spreads. There is and always will be people who do not understand what an opensource project is and behave like hooligans defending their soccer team. I hope they are just individuals and nothing more, but I fully agree to put each case under daylight. Regards Ricardo Regards, -Rob
Re: Looking for guide to debug with MS Visual Studio Express
On 31.10.2012 13:40, Oliver-Rainer Wittmann wrote: Hi, On 31.10.2012 12:35, Regina Henschel wrote: Hi all, I read that debugging with MS Visual Studio works well. Is there somewhere a guide for dummies how to do it? The following steps should give you a start: - Have your AOO build installed on the system. - Build the module of interest with debug information - Copy the resulting DLLs and PDB files of the module into the corresponding directory of the installation. -- for gbuild modules like sw you find the DLLs and PDB files in /main/solver/350/wntmsci12/workdir/LinkTarget/Library/ -- for dmake modules like sd you find the DLLs and PDB files in /main/[module]/wntmsci12/bin/ I do it a little differently from here on because I am a lazy person who wants to press just one key to start debugging: - Start Visual Studio The Express version is just fine. I have been using it for most of my debugging for years. - File-New Project - In the new dialog: - In left list Installed Templates choose Visual C++-General - In center list choose Empty Project - In field near the bottom Location enter a path where the solution files will be stored. - In the field above that, Name, enter the name of the new project, eg aoo35 - Click OK to close dialog - Now the main window shows a new view. - In the Solution Explorer on the left side you will now see an entry in bold typeface named aoo35. - I usually delete the entries below it Header Files, Resource Files, Source Files. These are used only when Visual Studio is used for editing. But that is just for my convenience - Right click on the aoo35 entry. - Click Properties - In the aoo35 Property Pages dialog: - Select Configuration Properties-Debugging in the left box. - In the center box change values for Command to office-installation-path/OpenOffice.org 3/program/soffice.bin The .bin is important, do not use .exe - Set value for Environment to PATH=office-installation-path/OpenOffice.org 3/URE/bin - [optional] Set value of Command Arguments to filename to load a file when AOO starts or to eg -impress to start AOO with the Impress application. - Click OK to close dialog Now you are all set Just press F5 to start Apache OpenOffice. We probably should write a Wiki page for this. There is one [1] about Windows Debugging but it looks quite scary. Another one [2] is for the advanced Visual Studio user and tells you how to better visualize eg boost containers. Have fun, Andre [1] http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/Windows_Debugging [2] http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/VisualStudioVisualizer
Re: OpenOffice Developer Room (devroom) at FOSDEM
A brilliant idea, especially if I may copy some of your slides... I am still fumbling how the build works, and to be honest (NOT to criticize anyone) I am not impressed. Just one thing: I do a build --all, which comes back OK, then I do a second build --all and to my surprise it generates a couple of libraries again..I assumed I had missed an error, so I tried it a third time, same thing happened, libraries was built. In my opion (and according with normal makefile schemes) once it completes without errors, it should not build anything a second time. But putting that aside, I would be happy to focus on localization together with jürgen, but if it is something you want to do it yourself thats ok with me. Jan. On 1 November 2012 16:55, Andre Fischer awf@gmail.com wrote: On 30.10.2012 22:10, jan iversen wrote: Just for info, Juergen told me that he was going to talk about l10n on apacheCon, so I suggested that we could make a speech at FOSDEM, because at that time the new workflow is hopefully ready or so close that we know all details. A good theme for a main speech would be how the handle the build (and release) process with internationalization in a big project like AOO. Hi Jan, I will be talking at ApacheCon EU about the AOO build system and only briefly mention l10n (how it works today). Maybe you want to give a similar talk at FOSDEM but with a strong focus on l10n? -Andre
Re: Have you been contacted via private email and discouraged from participating on the OpenOffice project?
Please excuse me, I think I know the difference between hooligans and people who are just blowing hot air. To be honest, at the moment AOO does NOT have a great deal of momentum, and have (I think) lost a quite a lot of reputation among developers. That is something we have to remedy, not by glittering folders, or smart marketing, but by showing the developers, that we really care about their contributions. If I may say so, some developers might see the apache way as a limitation, which my experience during the last month somewhat confirms, I think we really need to focus on the community instead of telling people about legal issues, but about getting a product that still can out beat the big (costly) products out there. Do NOT forget some state institutions in EU choose OpenOffice against other, but today I would not be so sure !!! Sorry for the outburst, but I am used to say what I think, and I really really want AOO to be the opensource project, as it was in the past. Lets not forget why we are all here. Jan On 1 November 2012 17:20, RGB ES rgb.m...@gmail.com wrote: 2012/11/1 Rob Weir robw...@apache.org I'm hearing that some project volunteers, especially new ones, are being contacted by certain external parties, who then try to discourage them from contributing to the Apache OpenOffice project. I'm hearing that similar notes have been sent out to those who submitted listings to our new Consultants Directory, also discouraging them from involvement in the project. This is my personal view on this matter, for what it is worth. I think we all would agree that such techniques are deplorable and bring disrepute to the individuals involved, and to the project that sanctions such techniques. If you recall we had a similar wave of such unprofessional behavior a few months ago, when certain external parties were contacting journalists who mentioned OpenOffice and telling them that it was no longer being developed and to link to a different product instead. I any case, if you are receiving such FUD yourself, I'd encourage you to simply post it to this mailing list, or to your blog, or some other public website. Daylight is the best antiseptic as they say. I am not a medical doctor, but I do believe that FUD exposed to public scrutiny loses its potency. But FUD ignored is FUD that spreads. There is and always will be people who do not understand what an opensource project is and behave like hooligans defending their soccer team. I hope they are just individuals and nothing more, but I fully agree to put each case under daylight. Regards Ricardo Regards, -Rob
Re: [question] build infra structure.
On 31.10.2012 22:20, jan iversen wrote: Hi I have been searching for detailed internal information about how the build process works with build and dmake (gnumake). I have seen the relationship in the single directories (prj/build.lst prj/d.lst and makefile.mk), but I cannot find a central makefile. If I understand life, there should be a central makefile, telling e.g. how .cpp is translated to .o Pah, who needs a central makefile if he can have a Perl file instead :-) Sorry, I could not resist. I am currently preparing a talk for ApacheCon about the AOO build system and it is somewhat depressing to see how bizarre some things are. If I find the time after ApacheCon then I will turn my talk into a Wiki page or one or several blog posts. Here is the short version. First there is configure and bootstrap. But I think that you have mastered that step already. Then comes the actual building. The central makefile is main/solenv/bin/build.pl, yes, a Perl script. It reads module/prj/build.lst files to a) determine the dependency between modules and (just the first line) b) find the directories inside each module that have to be built. (all other lines) build.pl starts at main/instsetoo_native/prj/build.pl and follows the dependency to other modules. build.pl can handle multi process builds and uses the module dependency graph to build modules in the right order. It can do partial builds: build --all --from module ignores all modules before module when building AOO (in the linearization of the dependency graph) build --all called in another module than instsetoo_native builds all dependencies and stops when the current module is built. build.pl calls dmake for every module, regardless of whether they are dmake or gbuild modules. - For dmake modules it calls dmake for all directories listed in prj/build.lst - For gbuild modules it does the same but prj/build.lst only contains one entry which points to util/makefile.mk This util/makefile.mk then chains GNU make for module/Makefile gbuild modules have all their makefiles in their top level directory. One makefile per library or other main targets. Both dmake and gbuild distinguish between data and build logic. The modules usually contain only descriptions of which source files have to be compiled and which libraries are to be linked. How that is done, on all the different platforms, compilers, environment variables is handled by makefiles in solenv/incfor dmake solenv/gbuild for gbuild The last part of the build process is the creation of installation sets. It is triggered by instsetoo_native/util/makefile.mk which basically just calls solenv/bin/make_installer.pl with a cleverly selected bunch of parameters. make_installer.pl uses a larger number of Perl modules under solenv/bin/modules/installer which then do the actual work of collecting the relevant files, copying them into a temporary directory into a runnable office, and finally packing them into a package that fits the target platform. I am aware that the above is still very terse. I am happy to answer any questions (if I know the answer). Regards, Andre Can somebody please point me in the direction, or tell me if it done in a different way ? My reason for asking is that I need to add a set of new standard rules for localization (.xhlp - .po ) Thanks in advance. Jan
another XML file for the Consultants-Page
Hello, here is another XML file for an entry in: http://www.openoffice.org/bizdev/consultants.html Can someone please check and then add? Thank you. Greetings, Jörg XML-File: consultant nameUwe Altmann Unternehmensberatung/name countryDE/country practiceDeployment/practice practiceSupport/practice practiceDevelopment/practice practiceDocumentation/practice descriptionHelping small business customers since many years in using and optimizing IT solutions. This is done by careful requirements analysis, migration support, professional project management and continuous user support based on individual agreements./description websitehttp://www.altsys.de/website emailuwe.altm...@altsys.de/email phone+49 681 96 02 13 39/phone /consultant
Re: [question] build infra structure.
See below please. THANKS for your VERY informative answer, it helped me a lot. I was of the simple idea, that we pursued a simple build process made up of gnuMake and an addon to gather for the shortcoming of gnumake in respect of cascaded makefiles. I hope to see your presentation on video later, due to personal budget restriction (dont we all have that) I cannot participate. Jan. On 1 November 2012 17:44, Andre Fischer awf@gmail.com wrote: On 31.10.2012 22:20, jan iversen wrote: Hi I have been searching for detailed internal information about how the build process works with build and dmake (gnumake). I have seen the relationship in the single directories (prj/build.lst prj/d.lst and makefile.mk), but I cannot find a central makefile. If I understand life, there should be a central makefile, telling e.g. how .cpp is translated to .o Pah, who needs a central makefile if he can have a Perl file instead :-) Sorry, I could not resist. I am currently preparing a talk for ApacheCon about the AOO build system and it is somewhat depressing to see how bizarre some things are. It´s quite OK, I learn fast :-) (and being a dane I like that kind of jokes/hints) If I find the time after ApacheCon then I will turn my talk into a Wiki page or one or several blog posts. Here is the short version. First there is configure and bootstrap. But I think that you have mastered that step already. Then comes the actual building. The central makefile is main/solenv/bin/ build.pl, yes, a Perl script. It reads module/prj/build.lst files to a) determine the dependency between modules and (just the first line) b) find the directories inside each module that have to be built. (all other lines) build.pl starts at main/instsetoo_native/prj/buil**d.pl http://build.pl and follows the dependency to other modules. build.pl can handle multi process builds and uses the module dependency graph to build modules in the right order. It can do partial builds: build --all --from module ignores all modules before module when building AOO (in the linearization of the dependency graph) build --all called in another module than instsetoo_native builds all dependencies and stops when the current module is built. build.pl calls dmake for every module, regardless of whether they are dmake or gbuild modules. - For dmake modules it calls dmake for all directories listed in prj/build.lst - For gbuild modules it does the same but prj/build.lst only contains one entry which points to util/makefile.mk This util/makefile.mk then chains GNU make for module/Makefile gbuild modules have all their makefiles in their top level directory. One makefile per library or other main targets. Why dont we just use dmake/gnumake, have a makefile in each directory which includes a master makefile ? Both dmake and gbuild distinguish between data and build logic. The modules usually contain only descriptions of which source files have to be compiled and which libraries are to be linked. How that is done, on all the different platforms, compilers, environment variables is handled by makefiles in solenv/incfor dmake solenv/gbuild for gbuild A I wrong in saying that the bulid list and delivery list could just as easily have been expressed as a target in makefile.in ??? Please forgive me, I am (as one who looks at the process with new eyes) just floating ideas ? The last part of the build process is the creation of installation sets. It is triggered by instsetoo_native/util/makefile**.mkhttp://makefile.mkwhich basically just calls solenv/bin/ make_installer.pl with a cleverly selected bunch of parameters. make_installer.pl uses a larger number of Perl modules under solenv/bin/modules/installer which then do the actual work of collecting the relevant files, copying them into a temporary directory into a runnable office, and finally packing them into a package that fits the target platform. I am aware that the above is still very terse. I am happy to answer any questions (if I know the answer). Thanks again, you actually helped me a lot Regards, Andre Can somebody please point me in the direction, or tell me if it done in a different way ? My reason for asking is that I need to add a set of new standard rules for localization (.xhlp - .po ) Thanks in advance. Jan
Re: Have uploaded five nice presentation template
On 01.11.2012 10:00, Xin Li wrote: Hi, I have uploaded five nice presentation template. Welcome to have a try and give me some feedback. Thanks. http://templates.services.openoffice.org/en/node/8966 http://templates.services.openoffice.org/en/node/8968 http://templates.services.openoffice.org/en/node/8970 http://templates.services.openoffice.org/en/node/8972 http://templates.services.openoffice.org/en/node/8974 I like them all. It really gets time to clean up the set of AOO templates, drop the ugly ones (not sure how many would remain) and replace them by prettier ones like yours. -Andre
Re: [question] build infra structure.
On 01.11.2012 17:57, jan iversen wrote: See below please. THANKS for your VERY informative answer, it helped me a lot. I was of the simple idea, that we pursued a simple build process made up of gnuMake and an addon to gather for the shortcoming of gnumake in respect of cascaded makefiles. We are in the process of migrating from dmake to GNU make. When that is finished then we will have essentially one single makefile. Well, there will be one top level makefile that includes all the other makefiles. But there will not one make process that starts other makes in subprocesses. That would be evil, or so I have been told, see http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/Build_System_Analysis I hope to see your presentation on video later, due to personal budget restriction (dont we all have that) I cannot participate. Sorry to hear that, I would have liked to meet you. Jan. On 1 November 2012 17:44, Andre Fischer awf@gmail.com wrote: On 31.10.2012 22:20, jan iversen wrote: Hi I have been searching for detailed internal information about how the build process works with build and dmake (gnumake). I have seen the relationship in the single directories (prj/build.lst prj/d.lst and makefile.mk), but I cannot find a central makefile. If I understand life, there should be a central makefile, telling e.g. how .cpp is translated to .o Pah, who needs a central makefile if he can have a Perl file instead :-) Sorry, I could not resist. I am currently preparing a talk for ApacheCon about the AOO build system and it is somewhat depressing to see how bizarre some things are. It´s quite OK, I learn fast :-) (and being a dane I like that kind of jokes/hints) If I find the time after ApacheCon then I will turn my talk into a Wiki page or one or several blog posts. Here is the short version. First there is configure and bootstrap. But I think that you have mastered that step already. Then comes the actual building. The central makefile is main/solenv/bin/ build.pl, yes, a Perl script. It reads module/prj/build.lst files to a) determine the dependency between modules and (just the first line) b) find the directories inside each module that have to be built. (all other lines) build.pl starts at main/instsetoo_native/prj/buil**d.pl http://build.pl and follows the dependency to other modules. build.pl can handle multi process builds and uses the module dependency graph to build modules in the right order. It can do partial builds: build --all --from module ignores all modules before module when building AOO (in the linearization of the dependency graph) build --all called in another module than instsetoo_native builds all dependencies and stops when the current module is built. build.pl calls dmake for every module, regardless of whether they are dmake or gbuild modules. - For dmake modules it calls dmake for all directories listed in prj/build.lst - For gbuild modules it does the same but prj/build.lst only contains one entry which points to util/makefile.mk This util/makefile.mk then chains GNU make for module/Makefile gbuild modules have all their makefiles in their top level directory. One makefile per library or other main targets. Why dont we just use dmake/gnumake, have a makefile in each directory which includes a master makefile ? I guess there are historical reasons for that. And then there is the not-invented-here syndrome. I have made an experiment a few months ago in which I wrote a Perl script that reads all prj/build.lst files and creates one GNU makefile that did what build --all does. Worked like a charm. It just has not many advantages over build.pl. Especially when we proceed with the dmake to gbuild transition and will have the centeral makefile in a few months. Both dmake and gbuild distinguish between data and build logic. The modules usually contain only descriptions of which source files have to be compiled and which libraries are to be linked. How that is done, on all the different platforms, compilers, environment variables is handled by makefiles in solenv/incfor dmake solenv/gbuild for gbuild A I wrong in saying that the bulid list and delivery list could just as easily have been expressed as a target in makefile.in ??? Yes, certainly. But when you use a makefile for inter-module dependencies then you get a much finer granularity. That is one of the goals of gbuild. Change one file in VCL, run build -all in instsetoo_native and only the files that directly or indirectly depend on the modified files are built. Today you have to rebuild all modules completely that depend on VCL. Please forgive me, I am (as one who looks at the process with new eyes) just floating ideas ? That is, of course, a good thing. I am not so differently in that I did not know much about the build system when I worked at Sun and later Oracle. Our release engineers took care of it. It became necessary
Re: [question] build infra structure.
you See below please. On 1 November 2012 18:18, Andre Fischer awf@gmail.com wrote: On 01.11.2012 17:57, jan iversen wrote: See below please. THANKS for your VERY informative answer, it helped me a lot. I was of the simple idea, that we pursued a simple build process made up of gnuMake and an addon to gather for the shortcoming of gnumake in respect of cascaded makefiles. We are in the process of migrating from dmake to GNU make. When that is finished then we will have essentially one single makefile. Well, there will be one top level makefile that includes all the other makefiles. But there will not one make process that starts other makes in subprocesses. That would be evil, or so I have been told, see http://wiki.openoffice.org/**wiki/Build_System_Analysishttp://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/Build_System_Analysis I am in the process of changing the l10n process. Currently it runs on one makefile that searches all directories, I want to change that to a target in every local makefile (build.lst). Can I attach myself to your progress, or would you suggest that I attach my development to the current build process. my timeline is somewhat around new year. I hope to see your presentation on video later, due to personal budget restriction (dont we all have that) I cannot participate. Sorry to hear that, I would have liked to meet you. Well if you come to FOSDEM, we can have a long chat. My problem is that I am currently only a contributor so that ticket alone is 600,- EUR. I am also prepared for google/skype videochats. Jan. On 1 November 2012 17:44, Andre Fischer awf@gmail.com wrote: On 31.10.2012 22:20, jan iversen wrote: Hi I have been searching for detailed internal information about how the build process works with build and dmake (gnumake). I have seen the relationship in the single directories (prj/build.lst prj/d.lst and makefile.mk), but I cannot find a central makefile. If I understand life, there should be a central makefile, telling e.g. how .cpp is translated to .o Pah, who needs a central makefile if he can have a Perl file instead :-) Sorry, I could not resist. I am currently preparing a talk for ApacheCon about the AOO build system and it is somewhat depressing to see how bizarre some things are. It´s quite OK, I learn fast :-) (and being a dane I like that kind of jokes/hints) If I find the time after ApacheCon then I will turn my talk into a Wiki page or one or several blog posts. Here is the short version. First there is configure and bootstrap. But I think that you have mastered that step already. Then comes the actual building. The central makefile is main/solenv/bin/ build.pl, yes, a Perl script. It reads module/prj/build.lst files to a) determine the dependency between modules and (just the first line) b) find the directories inside each module that have to be built. (all other lines) build.pl starts at main/instsetoo_native/prj/**buil**d.pl http://build.pl and follows the dependency to other modules. build.pl can handle multi process builds and uses the module dependency graph to build modules in the right order. It can do partial builds: build --all --from module ignores all modules before module when building AOO (in the linearization of the dependency graph) build --all called in another module than instsetoo_native builds all dependencies and stops when the current module is built. build.pl calls dmake for every module, regardless of whether they are dmake or gbuild modules. - For dmake modules it calls dmake for all directories listed in prj/build.lst - For gbuild modules it does the same but prj/build.lst only contains one entry which points to util/makefile.mk This util/makefile.mk then chains GNU make for module/Makefile gbuild modules have all their makefiles in their top level directory. One makefile per library or other main targets. Why dont we just use dmake/gnumake, have a makefile in each directory which includes a master makefile ? I guess there are historical reasons for that. And then there is the not-invented-here syndrome. I have made an experiment a few months ago in which I wrote a Perl script that reads all prj/build.lst files and creates one GNU makefile that did what build --all does. Worked like a charm. It just has not many advantages over build.pl. Especially when we proceed with the dmake to gbuild transition and will have the centeral makefile in a few months. Both dmake and gbuild distinguish between data and build logic. The modules usually contain only descriptions of which source files have to be compiled and which libraries are to be linked. How that is done, on all the different platforms, compilers, environment variables is handled by makefiles in solenv/incfor dmake solenv/gbuild for gbuild A I wrong in saying that the bulid list and delivery list
Re: [QA Report]Weekly Defect Analysis Report as of 2012/10/29
On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 12:13 PM, Shenfeng Liu liush...@gmail.com wrote: Yan Ji, I used the following 2 queries: All_Reported_Since - https://issues.apache.org/ooo/buglist.cgi?cmdtype=doremremaction=runnamedcmd=All_Reported_Sincesharer_id=249089 All_Fixed_Since - https://issues.apache.org/ooo/buglist.cgi?cmdtype=doremremaction=runnamedcmd=All_Fixed_Sincesharer_id=249089 The start date was set to 2011-06-01. While you need to edit the queries and set the end date to 2012-09-01, 2012-10-01, 2012-11-01. Then input the data to defects.txt . Please help to update the chart. And tell me if any question. Thanks! Thanks for that explanation. I updated the data file and also added a paragraph explaining where the data comes from. This should help whoever updates the chart in the future. http://www.openoffice.org/stats/defects.html -Rob - Shenfeng Liu (Simon) 2012/11/1 Ji Yan yanji...@gmail.com Thanks, I'll talk to Simon for the detail data. 2012/11/1 Rob Weir robw...@apache.org On Mon, Oct 29, 2012 at 9:23 PM, Ji Yan yanji...@gmail.com wrote: Hi Rob, Sure I can update this chart in my weekly report, please let me know how to do. 1. Where should I upload the data to 2. What the numbers mean, e.g. 2012-08-01,2316,1208, does this mean in 2012 Aug, 2316 defects opened and 1208 fixed? Shenfeng Liu created the original data file. I don't know how he got the data. Maybe you can ask him. If you post an update to the list (or the ooo-qa) list I can add to website for you. We can also add some text to that page to explain what the numbers mean. -Rob 2012/10/29 Rob Weir robw...@apache.org On Mon, Oct 29, 2012 at 8:20 AM, Ji Yan yanji...@gmail.com wrote: Please find weekly defect analysis report http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/QA/Report/DefectStatus/20121029 Thanks for the report. Would it be possible to also get an update for this chart: http://www.openoffice.org/stats/defects.html ??? The data file is here: http://www.openoffice.org/stats/defects.txt Can I get the right numbers from that report? -Rob -- Thanks Best Regards, Yan Ji -- Thanks Best Regards, Yan Ji -- Thanks Best Regards, Yan Ji
Chinese translators: please join ooo-L10N
We obviously have a group of Chinese-speaking people who are translating OpenOffice, press releases and web pages into (variants of) Chinese. If you are in this group, please remember to join the ooo-L10N mailing list http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-ooo-l10n/ since we have some newcomers who would like to join the Chinese localization team: see for example http://s.apache.org/Cwk (the same holds for everyone else involved with translation of course, in any language) Regards, Andrea.
Re: Chinese translators: please join ooo-L10N
On 11/02/12 02:05, Andrea Pescetti wrote: We obviously have a group of Chinese-speaking people who are translating OpenOffice, press releases and web pages into (variants of) Chinese. If you are in this group, please remember to join the ooo-L10N mailing list http://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/incubator-ooo-l10n/ since we have some newcomers who would like to join the Chinese localization team: see for example http://s.apache.org/Cwk I already joined it, although I have not spoken on it yet. (the same holds for everyone else involved with translation of course, in any language) Regards, Andrea. -- Best regards, imacat ^_*' ima...@mail.imacat.idv.tw PGP Key http://www.imacat.idv.tw/me/pgpkey.asc Woman's Voice News: http://www.wov.idv.tw/ Tavern IMACAT's http://www.imacat.idv.tw/ Woman in FOSS in Taiwan http://wofoss.blogspot.com/ OpenOffice http://www.openoffice.org/ EducOO/OOo4Kids Taiwan http://www.educoo.tw/ Greenfoot Taiwan http://greenfoot.westart.tw/ signature.asc Description: OpenPGP digital signature
CMS diff: Welcome to the localization (l10n) project
Clone URL (Committers only): https://cms.apache.org/redirect?new=anonymous;action=diff;uri=http://ooo-site.apache.org/l10n-new%2Findex.mdtext jan iversen Index: trunk/content/l10n-new/index.mdtext === --- trunk/content/l10n-new/index.mdtext (revision 1404729) +++ trunk/content/l10n-new/index.mdtext (working copy) @@ -30,21 +30,9 @@ - [UI][2] - [Help][3] -## The site is undergoing a major overhaul! -We are working hard at a new workflow, that involves translators more -directly in the release process. This site plays a major role in the new -workflow, so please accept our apoligies for the state of the site. -All old content can be found under the menupoint archive. -## Questions or comments? -Contact us [ooo-l...@incubator.apache.org][4] or subscribe -[ooo-l10n-subscr...@incubator.apache.org][5]. - - [1]: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internationalization_and_localization [2]: https://translate.apache.org/projects/OOo_34/ [3]: https://translate.apache.org/projects/OOo_34_help/ -[4]: mailto:ooo-l...@incubator.apache.org -[5]: mailto:ooo-l10n-subscr...@incubator.apache.org
CMS diff:
Clone URL (Committers only): https://cms.apache.org/redirect?new=anonymous;action=diff;uri=http://ooo-site.apache.org/l10n-new%2Fleftnav.mdtext jan iversen Index: trunk/content/l10n-new/leftnav.mdtext === --- trunk/content/l10n-new/leftnav.mdtext (revision 1404729) +++ trunk/content/l10n-new/leftnav.mdtext (working copy) @@ -1,12 +1,18 @@ divid: leftnav -# Some Header 1 +# News +## The site is undergoing a major overhaul! +We are working hard at a new workflow, that involves translators more +directly in the release process. This site plays a major role in the new +workflow, so please accept our apologies for the state of the site. + +# Links + - [How To Join](/l10n-new/how_to_join.html) - [Support](/l10n-new/support.html) - - [Team](/l10n-new/team.html) -# Some Header 2 +## Questions or comments? - - [Documentation](/l10n-new/documentation.html) - - [FAQ](/l10n-new/faq.html) +Contact us [ooo-l...@incubator.apache.org][mailto:ooo-l...@incubator.apache.org] or subscribe +[ooo-l10n-subscr...@incubator.apache.org][ mailto:ooo-l10n-subscr...@incubator.apache.org].
Re: Have you been contacted via private email and discouraged from participating on the OpenOffice project?
Hi Jan, We are all here as individuals with various and different amounts of time and energy. Many are employed to work on OpenOffice, but many like me are volunteers who have demanding day jobs. The key part of the Apache Way is that leadership comes from DOING and COMMUNICATING. You are new here with lots of admirable energy and work! This is what acquires merit in an Apache project! Since we ultimately can only control ourselves, do you have any suggestions about how we can more actively encourage participation? Best Regards, Dave On Nov 1, 2012, at 9:38 AM, jan iversen wrote: Please excuse me, I think I know the difference between hooligans and people who are just blowing hot air. To be honest, at the moment AOO does NOT have a great deal of momentum, and have (I think) lost a quite a lot of reputation among developers. That is something we have to remedy, not by glittering folders, or smart marketing, but by showing the developers, that we really care about their contributions. If I may say so, some developers might see the apache way as a limitation, which my experience during the last month somewhat confirms, I think we really need to focus on the community instead of telling people about legal issues, but about getting a product that still can out beat the big (costly) products out there. Do NOT forget some state institutions in EU choose OpenOffice against other, but today I would not be so sure !!! Sorry for the outburst, but I am used to say what I think, and I really really want AOO to be the opensource project, as it was in the past. Lets not forget why we are all here. Jan On 1 November 2012 17:20, RGB ES rgb.m...@gmail.com wrote: 2012/11/1 Rob Weir robw...@apache.org I'm hearing that some project volunteers, especially new ones, are being contacted by certain external parties, who then try to discourage them from contributing to the Apache OpenOffice project. I'm hearing that similar notes have been sent out to those who submitted listings to our new Consultants Directory, also discouraging them from involvement in the project. This is my personal view on this matter, for what it is worth. I think we all would agree that such techniques are deplorable and bring disrepute to the individuals involved, and to the project that sanctions such techniques. If you recall we had a similar wave of such unprofessional behavior a few months ago, when certain external parties were contacting journalists who mentioned OpenOffice and telling them that it was no longer being developed and to link to a different product instead. I any case, if you are receiving such FUD yourself, I'd encourage you to simply post it to this mailing list, or to your blog, or some other public website. Daylight is the best antiseptic as they say. I am not a medical doctor, but I do believe that FUD exposed to public scrutiny loses its potency. But FUD ignored is FUD that spreads. There is and always will be people who do not understand what an opensource project is and behave like hooligans defending their soccer team. I hope they are just individuals and nothing more, but I fully agree to put each case under daylight. Regards Ricardo Regards, -Rob
AOO.Next IBM Priorities
A quick note, wearing my IBM hat. We (IBM) have consulted with customers, internal users, other IBM product teams, on what our (IBM's) development priorities should be for the next AOO release. Obviously, we're not the only ones with priorities or interests or opinions. We don't make AOO decisions by ourselves. But we want to be transparent about what our own priorities are, for our employees participating in the AOO community, and what they will be focusing on. As we did with AOO 3.4.0 and 3.4.1, we'll be putting the details onto the wiki over the next couple of weeks. You'll hear more at ApacheCon, but I wanted you to hear it hear first. Our top priorities: -- Improve the install and deployment experience, especially by supporting digital signatures on installs, and introducing a new incremental update feature, so users are not required to download and install a full image for just a minor update. -- A major UI enhancement, a sidebar framework for the editors, ported over from Symphony, and including an API. If you recall, Symphony won quite a lot of praise for its UI, and much of this was due to the sidebar panel. I think we can make a good argument that this approach, say compared to the MS Office ribbon is a better use of screen real-estate, especially as we see more frequent use of wide screen displays. -- Improved Table of Contents in Writer -- Improved system integration on Windows and MacOS, including possible adoption of gestures. -- IAccessible2 bridge, ported over from Symphony, to improve accessibility. This is a major effort, but very important. -- Closer integration of clipart and template libraries with user experience. -- Update branding and visual styling, contemporary and compelling, fresh and relevant. -- Social integration, allow our users to quickly and easily share their thoughts in a way that compliment their commercial social behavior. Explore the integration of consumer service-specific capabilities as well as generic Share... actions. -- And many other smaller items Obviously the release date for this cannot be pinned down so early, and releasing is PMC decision, not an IBM one. But we think that this work could be completed and tested for a release in the March/April 2013 time-frame. And the scope of the release might be significant enough to warrant a 4.0 designation. In any case, we'll soon set up a page on the wiki to collect these items. As always, I invite you to add your own priorities to the wiki, things that you would like to work on. This could be a new feature. Or, if one of the above items sound interesting to you, we always welcome help designing and implementing these features. Regards, -Rob
Re: Have you been contacted via private email and discouraged from participating on the OpenOffice project?
Hi Dave. Even though I have stopped my companies, I still have many other things to do than working on AOO, and when I had my companies I had limited time, so I can for sure follow you. Today I am just trying to help open source as such, because it has helped me a lot in my career. And to answer your question, yes I do have some ideas (but they might be wrong), I have listed some of the important ones below: - We need to focus more on people who want to help, instead of using all the legal stuff (which are necessary) as a buffer not to move things. (e.g. I got 2 volunteers working on a danish translation, highly motivated, now we are discussing details about how to release the stuff). I think Rob is having a lead here with his new web pages. - We do NOT want a war of religions between AOO and others, ASF is well known, upper end of free software, so we should be publicly asking for collaboration. - I think events like ApacheCon is nice, but events like FOSDEM is quite a lot more important for the ordinary openSource developer. - I would like to see more marketing for developers, instead of businesses...I think we need to get back to roots where a developers think its fun, and pride to develop AOO. We could easily e.g. make challenges like who can solve this problem. I am new to AOO (so I am either interfering or bringing in new views), but I have quite some years of experience with openSource and I am a strong believer of ASF. The apache way is in many ways a limitation, but at the end it is the guarantee for a better end-user product. Please accept my apologies, if I have broken n-policies, but I think the question from Dave was well placed, and well formulated so it deserved a straight answer. Jan. On 1 November 2012 20:51, Dave Fisher dave2w...@comcast.net wrote: Hi Jan, We are all here as individuals with various and different amounts of time and energy. Many are employed to work on OpenOffice, but many like me are volunteers who have demanding day jobs. The key part of the Apache Way is that leadership comes from DOING and COMMUNICATING. You are new here with lots of admirable energy and work! This is what acquires merit in an Apache project! Since we ultimately can only control ourselves, do you have any suggestions about how we can more actively encourage participation? Best Regards, Dave On Nov 1, 2012, at 9:38 AM, jan iversen wrote: Please excuse me, I think I know the difference between hooligans and people who are just blowing hot air. To be honest, at the moment AOO does NOT have a great deal of momentum, and have (I think) lost a quite a lot of reputation among developers. That is something we have to remedy, not by glittering folders, or smart marketing, but by showing the developers, that we really care about their contributions. If I may say so, some developers might see the apache way as a limitation, which my experience during the last month somewhat confirms, I think we really need to focus on the community instead of telling people about legal issues, but about getting a product that still can out beat the big (costly) products out there. Do NOT forget some state institutions in EU choose OpenOffice against other, but today I would not be so sure !!! Sorry for the outburst, but I am used to say what I think, and I really really want AOO to be the opensource project, as it was in the past. Lets not forget why we are all here. Jan On 1 November 2012 17:20, RGB ES rgb.m...@gmail.com wrote: 2012/11/1 Rob Weir robw...@apache.org I'm hearing that some project volunteers, especially new ones, are being contacted by certain external parties, who then try to discourage them from contributing to the Apache OpenOffice project. I'm hearing that similar notes have been sent out to those who submitted listings to our new Consultants Directory, also discouraging them from involvement in the project. This is my personal view on this matter, for what it is worth. I think we all would agree that such techniques are deplorable and bring disrepute to the individuals involved, and to the project that sanctions such techniques. If you recall we had a similar wave of such unprofessional behavior a few months ago, when certain external parties were contacting journalists who mentioned OpenOffice and telling them that it was no longer being developed and to link to a different product instead. I any case, if you are receiving such FUD yourself, I'd encourage you to simply post it to this mailing list, or to your blog, or some other public website. Daylight is the best antiseptic as they say. I am not a medical doctor, but I do believe that FUD exposed to public scrutiny loses its potency. But FUD ignored is FUD that spreads. There is and always will be people who do not understand what an opensource project is and behave like hooligans defending their soccer team.
Re: extensions and translations.
Am 11/01/2012 01:17 PM, schrieb Rob Weir: On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 3:52 AM, Jürgen Schmidtjogischm...@gmail.com wrote: On 11/1/12 12:39 AM, Marcus (OOo) wrote: Am 10/27/2012 01:17 AM, schrieb jan iversen: I see, I have to get used to this license issues (a long time ago I believed open source was just open source, then I joined an apache project). never mind. Would it be to our advantage if we offered third party developers (that is how I see extension developers) the possibility to register a language file and get it translated as part of the language packs ? Of course it would be to our advantage; or let's say for the project and software. A lot of extensions would be available in many languages. However, I don't know where we should draw the line to set a limit. When we select here and there some extensions, then the other developers will ask why not their extensions. It's quite simple I would say, if people want develop extensions under ALv2 and want to contribute the code to the project. We can easy create a special section in our repo where we can host them. But this means they have to be handled in the same way as all other stuff here. Means a new release have to be voted... +1 I think the important thing is this: We don't just want code. We want communities. So if an extension author thinks that their extension is generally useful and he/she wants to join the AOO community and work on the extension here, and allow others to work on it as well, then this is good. Of course, +1. We can have a set of standard extensions. So, we just need to define the standard. Marcus And IMHO it's not possible to translate all strings for all extensions. But maybe others here have a great idea? we can't probably provide it and I think we have to do enough ;-). But I can think of an alternative service hosted somewhere else. Juergen Or should we just say extension developers does not concern us (and help AOO get more used) so we just look the other way ? Maybe the right way is somewhere in the middle. Yeah, maybe. ;-) Marcus On 27 October 2012 00:58, Marcus (OOo)marcus.m...@wtnet.de wrote: Am 10/27/2012 12:36 AM, schrieb jan iversen: While doing an update to the l10n workflow I think I found a slight problem. Extensions offers the capability to integrate/extend our UI. Assuming somebody writes an extension, and publishes it on http://www.openoffice.org/**extensions/http://www.openoffice.org/extensions/how does that get integrated into the translation process ? Simply, not at all. As far as I can see the sources are not integrated into our build --all --with-lang. Right. If I am right that they are not part of the general translation, then is that per design so or should it be different ? Yes, this is by design. Extensions are offered to extent your AOO install at any point of time. These are developed by people that do not have to belong to our project (when we put aside some exceptions). They can act independently. And therefore they are allowed to (or have to ;-) ) do all on their own; incl. translation. That applies for all extensions and templates available on: - http://extensions.services.**openoffice.orghttp://extensions.services.openoffice.org - http://templates.services.**openoffice.orghttp://templates.services.openoffice.org I might be following a wrong track here, but please forgive me for trying to make the l10n process as complete as I can. Don't panic. That's a great goal and everybody is thankful to you for doing this task. Marcus
[mwiki]SyntaxHighlight extension use wrong colours
A volunteer on the ES wiki that is working on an introduction to macro programming, informed that the SyntaxHighlight extension is using the wrong colours for StarBasic, Python and JavaScript. Is this something that needs to be informed directly to mediawiki or the colours used by the extension are a configuration option set on our side? Regards Ricardo
Re: CMS diff: Welcome to the localization (l10n) project
I committed this. A did a little clean up. The left nav wasn't handling the long email list addresses well (wasn't wrapping them) so I rewrote to user shorter names. It is starting to look good: http://www.openoffice.org/l10n-new/ Good work! My unsolicited feedback, which you are free to ignore, is that the news might go better on the right, as another column. That way the links on the left are always at the top of their column, which seems more natural to me. That also gives space to have more than one news story without displacing navigation elements. -Rob On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 3:34 PM, jan iversen anonym...@apache.org wrote: Clone URL (Committers only): https://cms.apache.org/redirect?new=anonymous;action=diff;uri=http://ooo-site.apache.org/l10n-new%2Findex.mdtext jan iversen Index: trunk/content/l10n-new/index.mdtext === --- trunk/content/l10n-new/index.mdtext (revision 1404729) +++ trunk/content/l10n-new/index.mdtext (working copy) @@ -30,21 +30,9 @@ - [UI][2] - [Help][3] -## The site is undergoing a major overhaul! -We are working hard at a new workflow, that involves translators more -directly in the release process. This site plays a major role in the new -workflow, so please accept our apoligies for the state of the site. -All old content can be found under the menupoint archive. -## Questions or comments? -Contact us [ooo-l...@incubator.apache.org][4] or subscribe -[ooo-l10n-subscr...@incubator.apache.org][5]. - - [1]: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internationalization_and_localization [2]: https://translate.apache.org/projects/OOo_34/ [3]: https://translate.apache.org/projects/OOo_34_help/ -[4]: mailto:ooo-l...@incubator.apache.org -[5]: mailto:ooo-l10n-subscr...@incubator.apache.org
Re: AOO.Next IBM Priorities
Thanks for the note, however knowing IBM I had hoped that one of the official goals was to help the development part of the community to get stabilized. I acknowledge that it is important for IBM to get an output of invested energy/time/money, but I think IBM would benefit not only from features but also from the soft points of helping the community. that being said in response to your IBM HAT, but I do feel that you and other IBM Fellows still do a great job in getting the community to prosper. Jan. On 1 November 2012 17:45, robert_w...@us.ibm.com wrote: A quick note, wearing my IBM hat. We (IBM) have consulted with customers, internal users, other IBM product teams, on what our (IBM's) development priorities should be for the next AOO release. Obviously, we're not the only ones with priorities or interests or opinions. We don't make AOO decisions by ourselves. But we want to be transparent about what our own priorities are, for our employees participating in the AOO community, and what they will be focusing on. As we did with AOO 3.4.0 and 3.4.1, we'll be putting the details onto the wiki over the next couple of weeks. You'll hear more at ApacheCon, but I wanted you to hear it hear first. Our top priorities: -- Improve the install and deployment experience, especially by supporting digital signatures on installs, and introducing a new incremental update feature, so users are not required to download and install a full image for just a minor update. -- A major UI enhancement, a sidebar framework for the editors, ported over from Symphony, and including an API. If you recall, Symphony won quite a lot of praise for its UI, and much of this was due to the sidebar panel. I think we can make a good argument that this approach, say compared to the MS Office ribbon is a better use of screen real-estate, especially as we see more frequent use of wide screen displays. -- Improved Table of Contents in Writer -- Improved system integration on Windows and MacOS, including possible adoption of gestures. -- IAccessible2 bridge, ported over from Symphony, to improve accessibility. This is a major effort, but very important. -- Closer integration of clipart and template libraries with user experience. -- Update branding and visual styling, contemporary and compelling, fresh and relevant. -- Social integration, allow our users to quickly and easily share their thoughts in a way that compliment their commercial social behavior. Explore the integration of consumer service-specific capabilities as well as generic Share... actions. -- And many other smaller items Obviously the release date for this cannot be pinned down so early, and releasing is PMC decision, not an IBM one. But we think that this work could be completed and tested for a release in the March/April 2013 time-frame. And the scope of the release might be significant enough to warrant a 4.0 designation. In any case, we'll soon set up a page on the wiki to collect these items. As always, I invite you to add your own priorities to the wiki, things that you would like to work on. This could be a new feature. Or, if one of the above items sound interesting to you, we always welcome help designing and implementing these features. Regards, -Rob
Re: extensions and translations.
Can standard loosely be defined as an extension: - is developed by people who have signed ICLA - uses the apache license header in the source files - is of interest to the general public in different countries - is willing to let the source be controlled/reviewed by committer. - accept a vote by the committers to be accepted If those points are fuillfilled we could add the project to swext, and then it would automatically be integrated in the build and l10n process. Please help me out here, I am not sure if that is enough for the apache way. Jan. On 1 November 2012 21:24, Marcus (OOo) marcus.m...@wtnet.de wrote: Am 11/01/2012 01:17 PM, schrieb Rob Weir: On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 3:52 AM, Jürgen Schmidtjogischm...@gmail.com wrote: On 11/1/12 12:39 AM, Marcus (OOo) wrote: Am 10/27/2012 01:17 AM, schrieb jan iversen: I see, I have to get used to this license issues (a long time ago I believed open source was just open source, then I joined an apache project). never mind. Would it be to our advantage if we offered third party developers (that is how I see extension developers) the possibility to register a language file and get it translated as part of the language packs ? Of course it would be to our advantage; or let's say for the project and software. A lot of extensions would be available in many languages. However, I don't know where we should draw the line to set a limit. When we select here and there some extensions, then the other developers will ask why not their extensions. It's quite simple I would say, if people want develop extensions under ALv2 and want to contribute the code to the project. We can easy create a special section in our repo where we can host them. But this means they have to be handled in the same way as all other stuff here. Means a new release have to be voted... +1 I think the important thing is this: We don't just want code. We want communities. So if an extension author thinks that their extension is generally useful and he/she wants to join the AOO community and work on the extension here, and allow others to work on it as well, then this is good. Of course, +1. We can have a set of standard extensions. So, we just need to define the standard. Marcus And IMHO it's not possible to translate all strings for all extensions. But maybe others here have a great idea? we can't probably provide it and I think we have to do enough ;-). But I can think of an alternative service hosted somewhere else. Juergen Or should we just say extension developers does not concern us (and help AOO get more used) so we just look the other way ? Maybe the right way is somewhere in the middle. Yeah, maybe. ;-) Marcus On 27 October 2012 00:58, Marcus (OOo)marcus.m...@wtnet.de wrote: Am 10/27/2012 12:36 AM, schrieb jan iversen: While doing an update to the l10n workflow I think I found a slight problem. Extensions offers the capability to integrate/extend our UI. Assuming somebody writes an extension, and publishes it on http://www.openoffice.org/extensions/http://www.openoffice.org/**extensions/ http://www.**openoffice.org/extensions/http://www.openoffice.org/extensions/ how does that get integrated into the translation process ? Simply, not at all. As far as I can see the sources are not integrated into our build --all --with-lang. Right. If I am right that they are not part of the general translation, then is that per design so or should it be different ? Yes, this is by design. Extensions are offered to extent your AOO install at any point of time. These are developed by people that do not have to belong to our project (when we put aside some exceptions). They can act independently. And therefore they are allowed to (or have to ;-) ) do all on their own; incl. translation. That applies for all extensions and templates available on: - http://extensions.services.**o**penoffice.org http://openoffice.org http://**extensions.services.**openoffice.orghttp://extensions.services.openoffice.org - http://templates.services.**op**enoffice.org http://openoffice.org http://templates.**services.openoffice.orghttp://templates.services.openoffice.org I might be following a wrong track here, but please forgive me for trying to make the l10n process as complete as I can. Don't panic. That's a great goal and everybody is thankful to you for doing this task. Marcus
Re: AOO.Next IBM Priorities
On 11/1/12 9:53 PM, jan iversen wrote: Thanks for the note, however knowing IBM I had hoped that one of the official goals was to help the development part of the community to get stabilized. I acknowledge that it is important for IBM to get an output of invested energy/time/money, but I think IBM would benefit not only from features but also from the soft points of helping the community. that being said in response to your IBM HAT, but I do feel that you and other IBM Fellows still do a great job in getting the community to prosper. I hope so and the priorities were focused on the product only and not on the community aspects that are of course very important for us as well. Juergen Jan. On 1 November 2012 17:45, robert_w...@us.ibm.com wrote: A quick note, wearing my IBM hat. We (IBM) have consulted with customers, internal users, other IBM product teams, on what our (IBM's) development priorities should be for the next AOO release. Obviously, we're not the only ones with priorities or interests or opinions. We don't make AOO decisions by ourselves. But we want to be transparent about what our own priorities are, for our employees participating in the AOO community, and what they will be focusing on. As we did with AOO 3.4.0 and 3.4.1, we'll be putting the details onto the wiki over the next couple of weeks. You'll hear more at ApacheCon, but I wanted you to hear it hear first. Our top priorities: -- Improve the install and deployment experience, especially by supporting digital signatures on installs, and introducing a new incremental update feature, so users are not required to download and install a full image for just a minor update. -- A major UI enhancement, a sidebar framework for the editors, ported over from Symphony, and including an API. If you recall, Symphony won quite a lot of praise for its UI, and much of this was due to the sidebar panel. I think we can make a good argument that this approach, say compared to the MS Office ribbon is a better use of screen real-estate, especially as we see more frequent use of wide screen displays. -- Improved Table of Contents in Writer -- Improved system integration on Windows and MacOS, including possible adoption of gestures. -- IAccessible2 bridge, ported over from Symphony, to improve accessibility. This is a major effort, but very important. -- Closer integration of clipart and template libraries with user experience. -- Update branding and visual styling, contemporary and compelling, fresh and relevant. -- Social integration, allow our users to quickly and easily share their thoughts in a way that compliment their commercial social behavior. Explore the integration of consumer service-specific capabilities as well as generic Share... actions. -- And many other smaller items Obviously the release date for this cannot be pinned down so early, and releasing is PMC decision, not an IBM one. But we think that this work could be completed and tested for a release in the March/April 2013 time-frame. And the scope of the release might be significant enough to warrant a 4.0 designation. In any case, we'll soon set up a page on the wiki to collect these items. As always, I invite you to add your own priorities to the wiki, things that you would like to work on. This could be a new feature. Or, if one of the above items sound interesting to you, we always welcome help designing and implementing these features. Regards, -Rob
Re: AOO.Next IBM Priorities
On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 2:53 PM, jan iversen jancasacon...@gmail.com wrote: Thanks for the note, however knowing IBM I had hoped that one of the official goals was to help the development part of the community to get stabilized. This is what their costumers asked for, not IBM itself. Costumers dont care about development, most of the time. They think everyting is created with Pixeldust. I acknowledge that it is important for IBM to get an output of invested energy/time/money, but I think IBM would benefit not only from features but also from the soft points of helping the community. I was a bit disapointed they didnt asked for some more 'enterprise-ready' features like integration with ERP systems, tivoli, and credential management of profiles, improve Base and add bridge to DB2 or something in those veins. that being said in response to your IBM HAT, but I do feel that you and other IBM Fellows still do a great job in getting the community to prosper. Jan. On 1 November 2012 17:45, robert_w...@us.ibm.com wrote: A quick note, wearing my IBM hat. We (IBM) have consulted with customers, internal users, other IBM product teams, on what our (IBM's) development priorities should be for the next AOO release. Obviously, we're not the only ones with priorities or interests or opinions. We don't make AOO decisions by ourselves. But we want to be transparent about what our own priorities are, for our employees participating in the AOO community, and what they will be focusing on. As we did with AOO 3.4.0 and 3.4.1, we'll be putting the details onto the wiki over the next couple of weeks. You'll hear more at ApacheCon, but I wanted you to hear it hear first. Our top priorities: -- Improve the install and deployment experience, especially by supporting digital signatures on installs, and introducing a new incremental update feature, so users are not required to download and install a full image for just a minor update. -- A major UI enhancement, a sidebar framework for the editors, ported over from Symphony, and including an API. If you recall, Symphony won quite a lot of praise for its UI, and much of this was due to the sidebar panel. I think we can make a good argument that this approach, say compared to the MS Office ribbon is a better use of screen real-estate, especially as we see more frequent use of wide screen displays. I like what KOffice did with the management of tiles and panes, and I think is a great UI study case. There were some of these ideas embedded in the UX project. Personally I used to admire the UI from Macromedia projects which had a nice use of toolbars, floating panes, and could add a series of options in a clean icon-based intereface. -- Improved Table of Contents in Writer -- Improved system integration on Windows and MacOS, including possible adoption of gestures. Is this like for tablets? Not sure what gestures means, Opear has some gestures which are mouse keys combinations. -- IAccessible2 bridge, ported over from Symphony, to improve accessibility. This is a major effort, but very important. -- Closer integration of clipart and template libraries with user experience. I think there was always objections to bloat the office suite with too much graphic intensive templates. Not sure if that opposition will be gone now. Impress does need a major facelift with animations and transitions. GSOC had integration bridge to OpenClipArt to import the clipart from the website, this functionality is also present on Inkscape. -- Update branding and visual styling, contemporary and compelling, fresh and relevant. Funny enough, stale is the new fresh, taken from logos of Chrome and Windows, is more an art-deco style. -- Social integration, allow our users to quickly and easily share their thoughts in a way that compliment their commercial social behavior. Explore the integration of consumer service-specific capabilities as well as generic Share... actions. eww I hate this and dont really understand why companies want to share a document. -- And many other smaller items Obviously the release date for this cannot be pinned down so early, and releasing is PMC decision, not an IBM one. But we think that this work could be completed and tested for a release in the March/April 2013 time-frame. And the scope of the release might be significant enough to warrant a 4.0 designation. In any case, we'll soon set up a page on the wiki to collect these items. As always, I invite you to add your own priorities to the wiki, things that you would like to work on. This could be a new feature. Or, if one of the above items sound interesting to you, we always welcome help designing and implementing these features. Regards, -Rob -- Alexandro Colorado PPMC Apache OpenOffice http://es.openoffice.org
Re: CMS diff: Welcome to the localization (l10n) project
I do not ignore qualified input !! I will just have to find a way of making a right-nav bar, something that Ariel did not provide (but still it was a very helpful job). I will download and try to make the changes. Jan. On 1 November 2012 21:40, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: I committed this. A did a little clean up. The left nav wasn't handling the long email list addresses well (wasn't wrapping them) so I rewrote to user shorter names. It is starting to look good: http://www.openoffice.org/l10n-new/ Good work! My unsolicited feedback, which you are free to ignore, is that the news might go better on the right, as another column. That way the links on the left are always at the top of their column, which seems more natural to me. That also gives space to have more than one news story without displacing navigation elements. -Rob On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 3:34 PM, jan iversen anonym...@apache.org wrote: Clone URL (Committers only): https://cms.apache.org/redirect?new=anonymous;action=diff;uri=http://ooo-site.apache.org/l10n-new%2Findex.mdtext jan iversen Index: trunk/content/l10n-new/index.mdtext === --- trunk/content/l10n-new/index.mdtext (revision 1404729) +++ trunk/content/l10n-new/index.mdtext (working copy) @@ -30,21 +30,9 @@ - [UI][2] - [Help][3] -## The site is undergoing a major overhaul! -We are working hard at a new workflow, that involves translators more -directly in the release process. This site plays a major role in the new -workflow, so please accept our apoligies for the state of the site. -All old content can be found under the menupoint archive. -## Questions or comments? -Contact us [ooo-l...@incubator.apache.org][4] or subscribe -[ooo-l10n-subscr...@incubator.apache.org][5]. - - [1]: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internationalization_and_localization [2]: https://translate.apache.org/projects/OOo_34/ [3]: https://translate.apache.org/projects/OOo_34_help/ -[4]: mailto:ooo-l...@incubator.apache.org -[5]: mailto:ooo-l10n-subscr...@incubator.apache.org
Re: AOO.Next IBM Priorities
On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 4:53 PM, jan iversen jancasacon...@gmail.com wrote: Thanks for the note, however knowing IBM I had hoped that one of the official goals was to help the development part of the community to get stabilized. This was specifically product goals for the next release, as the subject title suggests. Community development are ongoing, not tied to any particular release. And not tied to any one company, either. It be worth if we (the AOO project) set our own community development goals and worked toward them? Priorities and goals are a good thing, I think. They keep us focused, help us avoid distractions. Well, good goals, at least... -Rob I acknowledge that it is important for IBM to get an output of invested energy/time/money, but I think IBM would benefit not only from features but also from the soft points of helping the community. that being said in response to your IBM HAT, but I do feel that you and other IBM Fellows still do a great job in getting the community to prosper. Jan. On 1 November 2012 17:45, robert_w...@us.ibm.com wrote: A quick note, wearing my IBM hat. We (IBM) have consulted with customers, internal users, other IBM product teams, on what our (IBM's) development priorities should be for the next AOO release. Obviously, we're not the only ones with priorities or interests or opinions. We don't make AOO decisions by ourselves. But we want to be transparent about what our own priorities are, for our employees participating in the AOO community, and what they will be focusing on. As we did with AOO 3.4.0 and 3.4.1, we'll be putting the details onto the wiki over the next couple of weeks. You'll hear more at ApacheCon, but I wanted you to hear it hear first. Our top priorities: -- Improve the install and deployment experience, especially by supporting digital signatures on installs, and introducing a new incremental update feature, so users are not required to download and install a full image for just a minor update. -- A major UI enhancement, a sidebar framework for the editors, ported over from Symphony, and including an API. If you recall, Symphony won quite a lot of praise for its UI, and much of this was due to the sidebar panel. I think we can make a good argument that this approach, say compared to the MS Office ribbon is a better use of screen real-estate, especially as we see more frequent use of wide screen displays. -- Improved Table of Contents in Writer -- Improved system integration on Windows and MacOS, including possible adoption of gestures. -- IAccessible2 bridge, ported over from Symphony, to improve accessibility. This is a major effort, but very important. -- Closer integration of clipart and template libraries with user experience. -- Update branding and visual styling, contemporary and compelling, fresh and relevant. -- Social integration, allow our users to quickly and easily share their thoughts in a way that compliment their commercial social behavior. Explore the integration of consumer service-specific capabilities as well as generic Share... actions. -- And many other smaller items Obviously the release date for this cannot be pinned down so early, and releasing is PMC decision, not an IBM one. But we think that this work could be completed and tested for a release in the March/April 2013 time-frame. And the scope of the release might be significant enough to warrant a 4.0 designation. In any case, we'll soon set up a page on the wiki to collect these items. As always, I invite you to add your own priorities to the wiki, things that you would like to work on. This could be a new feature. Or, if one of the above items sound interesting to you, we always welcome help designing and implementing these features. Regards, -Rob
Re: extensions and translations.
On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 5:07 PM, jan iversen jancasacon...@gmail.com wrote: Can standard loosely be defined as an extension: - is developed by people who have signed ICLA - uses the apache license header in the source files - is of interest to the general public in different countries - is willing to let the source be controlled/reviewed by committer. - accept a vote by the committers to be accepted If those points are fuillfilled we could add the project to swext, and then it would automatically be integrated in the build and l10n process. Please help me out here, I am not sure if that is enough for the apache way. There are probably two degrees of standard or official extensions. 1) An extension that is released with our binaries, e.g., it is available out-of-the-box, either automatically installed, or available as an option in the installer. 2) An extension that is developed and released by the project, and published in the extension repository. The process for these would be nearly identical, differing only on whether it is released standalone or bundled with the full AOO installer. -Rob Jan. On 1 November 2012 21:24, Marcus (OOo) marcus.m...@wtnet.de wrote: Am 11/01/2012 01:17 PM, schrieb Rob Weir: On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 3:52 AM, Jürgen Schmidtjogischm...@gmail.com wrote: On 11/1/12 12:39 AM, Marcus (OOo) wrote: Am 10/27/2012 01:17 AM, schrieb jan iversen: I see, I have to get used to this license issues (a long time ago I believed open source was just open source, then I joined an apache project). never mind. Would it be to our advantage if we offered third party developers (that is how I see extension developers) the possibility to register a language file and get it translated as part of the language packs ? Of course it would be to our advantage; or let's say for the project and software. A lot of extensions would be available in many languages. However, I don't know where we should draw the line to set a limit. When we select here and there some extensions, then the other developers will ask why not their extensions. It's quite simple I would say, if people want develop extensions under ALv2 and want to contribute the code to the project. We can easy create a special section in our repo where we can host them. But this means they have to be handled in the same way as all other stuff here. Means a new release have to be voted... +1 I think the important thing is this: We don't just want code. We want communities. So if an extension author thinks that their extension is generally useful and he/she wants to join the AOO community and work on the extension here, and allow others to work on it as well, then this is good. Of course, +1. We can have a set of standard extensions. So, we just need to define the standard. Marcus And IMHO it's not possible to translate all strings for all extensions. But maybe others here have a great idea? we can't probably provide it and I think we have to do enough ;-). But I can think of an alternative service hosted somewhere else. Juergen Or should we just say extension developers does not concern us (and help AOO get more used) so we just look the other way ? Maybe the right way is somewhere in the middle. Yeah, maybe. ;-) Marcus On 27 October 2012 00:58, Marcus (OOo)marcus.m...@wtnet.de wrote: Am 10/27/2012 12:36 AM, schrieb jan iversen: While doing an update to the l10n workflow I think I found a slight problem. Extensions offers the capability to integrate/extend our UI. Assuming somebody writes an extension, and publishes it on http://www.openoffice.org/extensions/http://www.openoffice.org/**extensions/ http://www.**openoffice.org/extensions/http://www.openoffice.org/extensions/ how does that get integrated into the translation process ? Simply, not at all. As far as I can see the sources are not integrated into our build --all --with-lang. Right. If I am right that they are not part of the general translation, then is that per design so or should it be different ? Yes, this is by design. Extensions are offered to extent your AOO install at any point of time. These are developed by people that do not have to belong to our project (when we put aside some exceptions). They can act independently. And therefore they are allowed to (or have to ;-) ) do all on their own; incl. translation. That applies for all extensions and templates available on: - http://extensions.services.**o**penoffice.org http://openoffice.org http://**extensions.services.**openoffice.orghttp://extensions.services.openoffice.org - http://templates.services.**op**enoffice.org http://openoffice.org http://templates.**services.openoffice.orghttp://templates.services.openoffice.org I might be following a wrong track here, but please forgive me for trying to make the l10n process as complete as I
Re: AOO.Next IBM Priorities
On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 5:10 PM, Alexandro Colorado j...@oooes.org wrote: On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 2:53 PM, jan iversen jancasacon...@gmail.com wrote: Thanks for the note, however knowing IBM I had hoped that one of the official goals was to help the development part of the community to get stabilized. This is what their costumers asked for, not IBM itself. Costumers dont care about development, most of the time. They think everyting is created with Pixeldust. I acknowledge that it is important for IBM to get an output of invested energy/time/money, but I think IBM would benefit not only from features but also from the soft points of helping the community. I was a bit disapointed they didnt asked for some more 'enterprise-ready' features like integration with ERP systems, tivoli, and credential management of profiles, improve Base and add bridge to DB2 or something in those veins. Some of these are being done, but as extensions. And in some cases they depend on proprietary code, so they lead to proprietary extensions. Personally, I'd recommend bring features like this into the core only if they can be done in some open fashion, e.g., standards based or at least an open driver-based or other extensible model which is open to all vendors. that being said in response to your IBM HAT, but I do feel that you and other IBM Fellows still do a great job in getting the community to prosper. Jan. On 1 November 2012 17:45, robert_w...@us.ibm.com wrote: A quick note, wearing my IBM hat. We (IBM) have consulted with customers, internal users, other IBM product teams, on what our (IBM's) development priorities should be for the next AOO release. Obviously, we're not the only ones with priorities or interests or opinions. We don't make AOO decisions by ourselves. But we want to be transparent about what our own priorities are, for our employees participating in the AOO community, and what they will be focusing on. As we did with AOO 3.4.0 and 3.4.1, we'll be putting the details onto the wiki over the next couple of weeks. You'll hear more at ApacheCon, but I wanted you to hear it hear first. Our top priorities: -- Improve the install and deployment experience, especially by supporting digital signatures on installs, and introducing a new incremental update feature, so users are not required to download and install a full image for just a minor update. -- A major UI enhancement, a sidebar framework for the editors, ported over from Symphony, and including an API. If you recall, Symphony won quite a lot of praise for its UI, and much of this was due to the sidebar panel. I think we can make a good argument that this approach, say compared to the MS Office ribbon is a better use of screen real-estate, especially as we see more frequent use of wide screen displays. I like what KOffice did with the management of tiles and panes, and I think is a great UI study case. There were some of these ideas embedded in the UX project. Personally I used to admire the UI from Macromedia projects which had a nice use of toolbars, floating panes, and could add a series of options in a clean icon-based intereface. -- Improved Table of Contents in Writer -- Improved system integration on Windows and MacOS, including possible adoption of gestures. Is this like for tablets? Not sure what gestures means, Opear has some gestures which are mouse keys combinations. For example, MacOS multi-touch gestures. See: http://www.apple.com/osx/what-is/gestures.html -- IAccessible2 bridge, ported over from Symphony, to improve accessibility. This is a major effort, but very important. -- Closer integration of clipart and template libraries with user experience. I think there was always objections to bloat the office suite with too much graphic intensive templates. Not sure if that opposition will be gone now. Impress does need a major facelift with animations and transitions. GSOC had integration bridge to OpenClipArt to import the clipart from the website, this functionality is also present on Inkscape. I think better integration with external repositories is key. Look at what MS Office 2013 does. -- Update branding and visual styling, contemporary and compelling, fresh and relevant. Funny enough, stale is the new fresh, taken from logos of Chrome and Windows, is more an art-deco style. Maybe if we wait long enough what we have now will come back in fashion? ;-) -- Social integration, allow our users to quickly and easily share their thoughts in a way that compliment their commercial social behavior. Explore the integration of consumer service-specific capabilities as well as generic Share... actions. eww I hate this and dont really understand why companies want to share a document. Why do we share a news clipping or a status update or anything else? If you can grab content from a
Re: CMS diff: Welcome to the localization (l10n) project
On Thu, Nov 01, 2012 at 10:11:05PM +0100, jan iversen wrote: I do not ignore qualified input !! I will just have to find a way of making a right-nav bar, something that Ariel did not provide (but still it was a very helpful job). I will download and try to make the changes. It's rather simple: - add the right navigation MarkDown file in ooo-site/content/l10n-new/rightnav.mdtext it must have the header divid:rightnav - instruct ooo-site/templates/l10n-new/ssi.mdtext to include it, adding a line like this: rightnav:/l10n-new/rightnav.html Anyway I committed the changes right now :) May be we can style the right bar to look like the news bar on the main index. Regards -- Ariel Constenla-Haile La Plata, Argentina pgp4zk3I7OMwP.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: AOO.Next IBM Priorities
On 11/01/2012 09:45 AM, robert_w...@us.ibm.com wrote: A quick note, wearing my IBM hat. We (IBM) have consulted with customers, internal users, other IBM product teams, on what our (IBM's) development priorities should be for the next AOO release. Obviously, we're not the only ones with priorities or interests or opinions. We don't make AOO decisions by ourselves. But we want to be transparent about what our own priorities are, for our employees participating in the AOO community, and what they will be focusing on. As we did with AOO 3.4.0 and 3.4.1, we'll be putting the details onto the wiki over the next couple of weeks. You'll hear more at ApacheCon, but I wanted you to hear it hear first. Thanks for sharing this, and could you re-post the (IBM) wiki link. It's been a while since we looked at anything related to this, and I didn't save it. Thanks. Our top priorities: -- Improve the install and deployment experience, especially by supporting digital signatures on installs, and introducing a new incremental update feature, so users are not required to download and install a full image for just a minor update. -- A major UI enhancement, a sidebar framework for the editors, ported over from Symphony, and including an API. If you recall, Symphony won quite a lot of praise for its UI, and much of this was due to the sidebar panel. I think we can make a good argument that this approach, say compared to the MS Office ribbon is a better use of screen real-estate, especially as we see more frequent use of wide screen displays. -- Improved Table of Contents in Writer -- Improved system integration on Windows and MacOS, including possible adoption of gestures. -- IAccessible2 bridge, ported over from Symphony, to improve accessibility. This is a major effort, but very important. -- Closer integration of clipart and template libraries with user experience. -- Update branding and visual styling, contemporary and compelling, fresh and relevant. -- Social integration, allow our users to quickly and easily share their thoughts in a way that compliment their commercial social behavior. Explore the integration of consumer service-specific capabilities as well as generic Share... actions. -- And many other smaller items Obviously the release date for this cannot be pinned down so early, and releasing is PMC decision, not an IBM one. But we think that this work could be completed and tested for a release in the March/April 2013 time-frame. And the scope of the release might be significant enough to warrant a 4.0 designation. In any case, we'll soon set up a page on the wiki to collect these items. As always, I invite you to add your own priorities to the wiki, things that you would like to work on. This could be a new feature. Or, if one of the above items sound interesting to you, we always welcome help designing and implementing these features. Regards, -Rob -- MzK Anyone who considers protocol unimportant has never dealt with a cat. -- Robert Heinlein
Re: extensions and translations.
see below please. On 1 November 2012 22:21, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 5:07 PM, jan iversen jancasacon...@gmail.com wrote: Can standard loosely be defined as an extension: - is developed by people who have signed ICLA - uses the apache license header in the source files - is of interest to the general public in different countries - is willing to let the source be controlled/reviewed by committer. - accept a vote by the committers to be accepted If those points are fuillfilled we could add the project to swext, and then it would automatically be integrated in the build and l10n process. Please help me out here, I am not sure if that is enough for the apache way. There are probably two degrees of standard or official extensions. 1) An extension that is released with our binaries, e.g., it is available out-of-the-box, either automatically installed, or available as an option in the installer. That would be things like wiki publisher in swext, that still have the sun license and not the apache license. But that what actually what I was thinking about, and of course these extension MUST be part of the apache demands. We might include include in the setup package, but it should not be automatically installed, if that was the case the end-user would see it as an integrated part, and not an add-on. We should not take responsibility for the extension, but simply offer it. 2) An extension that is developed and released by the project, and published in the extension repository. This is the current standard and should not be changed. the add on is optional The process for these would be nearly identical, differing only on whether it is released standalone or bundled with the full AOO installer. and not to forget, the possibility of getting the UI translated and available all over the world. Can we collect statistics about which extensions is installed how often ?? -Rob Jan. On 1 November 2012 21:24, Marcus (OOo) marcus.m...@wtnet.de wrote: Am 11/01/2012 01:17 PM, schrieb Rob Weir: On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 3:52 AM, Jürgen Schmidtjogischm...@gmail.com wrote: On 11/1/12 12:39 AM, Marcus (OOo) wrote: Am 10/27/2012 01:17 AM, schrieb jan iversen: I see, I have to get used to this license issues (a long time ago I believed open source was just open source, then I joined an apache project). never mind. Would it be to our advantage if we offered third party developers (that is how I see extension developers) the possibility to register a language file and get it translated as part of the language packs ? Of course it would be to our advantage; or let's say for the project and software. A lot of extensions would be available in many languages. However, I don't know where we should draw the line to set a limit. When we select here and there some extensions, then the other developers will ask why not their extensions. It's quite simple I would say, if people want develop extensions under ALv2 and want to contribute the code to the project. We can easy create a special section in our repo where we can host them. But this means they have to be handled in the same way as all other stuff here. Means a new release have to be voted... +1 I think the important thing is this: We don't just want code. We want communities. So if an extension author thinks that their extension is generally useful and he/she wants to join the AOO community and work on the extension here, and allow others to work on it as well, then this is good. Of course, +1. We can have a set of standard extensions. So, we just need to define the standard. Marcus And IMHO it's not possible to translate all strings for all extensions. But maybe others here have a great idea? we can't probably provide it and I think we have to do enough ;-). But I can think of an alternative service hosted somewhere else. Juergen Or should we just say extension developers does not concern us (and help AOO get more used) so we just look the other way ? Maybe the right way is somewhere in the middle. Yeah, maybe. ;-) Marcus On 27 October 2012 00:58, Marcus (OOo)marcus.m...@wtnet.de wrote: Am 10/27/2012 12:36 AM, schrieb jan iversen: While doing an update to the l10n workflow I think I found a slight problem. Extensions offers the capability to integrate/extend our UI. Assuming somebody writes an extension, and publishes it on http://www.openoffice.org/extensions/ http://www.openoffice.org/**extensions/ http://www.**openoffice.org/extensions/ http://www.openoffice.org/extensions/ how does that get integrated into the translation process ? Simply, not at all. As far as I can see the sources are not integrated into our build --all --with-lang.
Re: CMS diff: Welcome to the localization (l10n) project
THANKS, you are really super !! Yes I would like the style of the the news bar, do we need to add a style sheet. I am flying a bit blindfolded here, being a contributor, not being able to do the things myself, so thanks again for your help. One question: When you commit to SVN, I think you also need to publish it. but how come CMS is not updated... jan. On 1 November 2012 22:31, Ariel Constenla-Haile arie...@apache.org wrote: On Thu, Nov 01, 2012 at 10:11:05PM +0100, jan iversen wrote: I do not ignore qualified input !! I will just have to find a way of making a right-nav bar, something that Ariel did not provide (but still it was a very helpful job). I will download and try to make the changes. It's rather simple: - add the right navigation MarkDown file in ooo-site/content/l10n-new/rightnav.mdtext it must have the header divid:rightnav - instruct ooo-site/templates/l10n-new/ssi.mdtext to include it, adding a line like this: rightnav:/l10n-new/rightnav.html Anyway I committed the changes right now :) May be we can style the right bar to look like the news bar on the main index. Regards -- Ariel Constenla-Haile La Plata, Argentina
Re: CMS diff: Welcome to the localization (l10n) project
Can someone please publish rightnav (that ariel committed) so I can edit it with cms. thanks in advance. Jan. On 1 November 2012 22:31, Ariel Constenla-Haile arie...@apache.org wrote: On Thu, Nov 01, 2012 at 10:11:05PM +0100, jan iversen wrote: I do not ignore qualified input !! I will just have to find a way of making a right-nav bar, something that Ariel did not provide (but still it was a very helpful job). I will download and try to make the changes. It's rather simple: - add the right navigation MarkDown file in ooo-site/content/l10n-new/rightnav.mdtext it must have the header divid:rightnav - instruct ooo-site/templates/l10n-new/ssi.mdtext to include it, adding a line like this: rightnav:/l10n-new/rightnav.html Anyway I committed the changes right now :) May be we can style the right bar to look like the news bar on the main index. Regards -- Ariel Constenla-Haile La Plata, Argentina
Re: CMS diff: Welcome to the localization (l10n) project
On Thu, Nov 01, 2012 at 11:36:20PM +0100, jan iversen wrote: I would love to publish it myself, but I dont have the karma to do so (I am a contributor). I have updated CMS, no luck ! I published the site, please try again. Nevertheless, and AFAIK, even when you log in as anonymous user your working copy can be updated, and is not completely transient (I can't find the mail right now, but anonymous working copies have a lifetime even if you logout). But looking at staging, did not do the complete trick (I cannot see rightnav), It's there http://ooo-site.staging.apache.org/l10n-new/ and also on the main site, since I published. But unpublished svn commmitts get reflected on staging. Regards -- Ariel Constenla-Haile La Plata, Argentina pgp2QQVqgWOtf.pgp Description: PGP signature
Re: CMS diff: Welcome to the localization (l10n) project
El 02/11/2012 0:03, Ariel Constenla-Haile escribió: On Thu, Nov 01, 2012 at 11:36:20PM +0100, jan iversen wrote: I would love to publish it myself, but I dont have the karma to do so (I am a contributor). I have updated CMS, no luck ! I published the site, please try again. Nevertheless, and AFAIK, even when you log in as anonymous user your working copy can be updated, and is not completely transient (I can't find the mail right now, but anonymous working copies have a lifetime even if you logout). But looking at staging, did not do the complete trick (I cannot see rightnav), It's there http://ooo-site.staging.apache.org/l10n-new/ and also on the main site, since I published. But unpublished svn commmitts get reflected on staging. But if you use the web browser CMS add-in on the staging you can´t see the new file (i suppose you see the published site)
Re: AOO.Next IBM Priorities
Great! Thanks for sharing. Peter On 11/2/2012 12:45 AM, robert_w...@us.ibm.com wrote: A quick note, wearing my IBM hat. We (IBM) have consulted with customers, internal users, other IBM product teams, on what our (IBM's) development priorities should be for the next AOO release. Obviously, we're not the only ones with priorities or interests or opinions. We don't make AOO decisions by ourselves. But we want to be transparent about what our own priorities are, for our employees participating in the AOO community, and what they will be focusing on. As we did with AOO 3.4.0 and 3.4.1, we'll be putting the details onto the wiki over the next couple of weeks. You'll hear more at ApacheCon, but I wanted you to hear it hear first. Our top priorities: -- Improve the install and deployment experience, especially by supporting digital signatures on installs, and introducing a new incremental update feature, so users are not required to download and install a full image for just a minor update. -- A major UI enhancement, a sidebar framework for the editors, ported over from Symphony, and including an API. If you recall, Symphony won quite a lot of praise for its UI, and much of this was due to the sidebar panel. I think we can make a good argument that this approach, say compared to the MS Office ribbon is a better use of screen real-estate, especially as we see more frequent use of wide screen displays. -- Improved Table of Contents in Writer -- Improved system integration on Windows and MacOS, including possible adoption of gestures. -- IAccessible2 bridge, ported over from Symphony, to improve accessibility. This is a major effort, but very important. -- Closer integration of clipart and template libraries with user experience. -- Update branding and visual styling, contemporary and compelling, fresh and relevant. -- Social integration, allow our users to quickly and easily share their thoughts in a way that compliment their commercial social behavior. Explore the integration of consumer service-specific capabilities as well as generic Share... actions. -- And many other smaller items Obviously the release date for this cannot be pinned down so early, and releasing is PMC decision, not an IBM one. But we think that this work could be completed and tested for a release in the March/April 2013 time-frame. And the scope of the release might be significant enough to warrant a 4.0 designation. In any case, we'll soon set up a page on the wiki to collect these items. As always, I invite you to add your own priorities to the wiki, things that you would like to work on. This could be a new feature. Or, if one of the above items sound interesting to you, we always welcome help designing and implementing these features. Regards, -Rob
Re: AOO volunteers: essential skills and tasks
On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 7:52 PM, Andrea Pescetti pesce...@apache.org wrote: On 30/10/2012 Guy Waterval wrote: But for other people who will occasionally participate, why not a Post Office where they could register (for security reasons, acceptation of the license, etc.). When they have time, they can visit the Post Office to see the list of to do tasks, and they can download for instance a translation job. This has been a recurring request, a sort of web application acting as employment agency: matching skills and tasks. Done properly (and with an adequately smart user interface) it would indeed help in attracting new volunteers. I wonder if something like this would work: http://openhatch.org/search/?q=toughness=bitesizelanguage=Python It looks like they can suck in appropriately flagged BZ issues. -Rob It would need new tools since BugZilla does not offer an adequate interface and lacks the individual part (i.e., a self-assessed list of skills that will match the tasks). If somebody wants to draft some ideas on a wiki page, this is something that might be worth some effort on a medium term. Regards, Andrea.
Re: AOO.Next IBM Priorities
-- A major UI enhancement, a sidebar framework for the editors, ported over from Symphony, and including an API. I hope I understand correctly that you mean the right side in the picture http://www.file-extensions.org/imgs/app-picture/4561/ibm-lotus-symphony.gif (OK, this picture is symphony but the same in AOO). In the picture namend Text and CellProperties. In this case, my question is: Is there already a compiled test version for Windows? (I do not necessarily mean a formal trial rather a snapshot, my personal problem is only that I could not compile and therefore need a compiled version.) Greetings, Jorg
Re: AOO.Next IBM Priorities
If I didn't know better I'd swear you had been spying on my wishlist. If IBM brought nothing else to the project it's customer focus is hugely valuable. Many thanks Rob, one marketing guy very happy. On 2/11/2012 8:52 AM, robert_w...@us.ibm.com wrote: A quick note, wearing my IBM hat. We (IBM) have consulted with customers, internal users, other IBM product teams, on what our (IBM's) development priorities should be for the next AOO release. Obviously, we're not the only ones with priorities or interests or opinions. We don't make AOO decisions by ourselves. But we want to be transparent about what our own priorities are, for our employees participating in the AOO community, and what they will be focusing on. As we did with AOO 3.4.0 and 3.4.1, we'll be putting the details onto the wiki over the next couple of weeks. You'll hear more at ApacheCon, but I wanted you to hear it hear first. Our top priorities: -- Improve the install and deployment experience, especially by supporting digital signatures on installs, and introducing a new incremental update feature, so users are not required to download and install a full image for just a minor update. -- A major UI enhancement, a sidebar framework for the editors, ported over from Symphony, and including an API. If you recall, Symphony won quite a lot of praise for its UI, and much of this was due to the sidebar panel. I think we can make a good argument that this approach, say compared to the MS Office ribbon is a better use of screen real-estate, especially as we see more frequent use of wide screen displays. -- Improved Table of Contents in Writer -- Improved system integration on Windows and MacOS, including possible adoption of gestures. -- IAccessible2 bridge, ported over from Symphony, to improve accessibility. This is a major effort, but very important. -- Closer integration of clipart and template libraries with user experience. -- Update branding and visual styling, contemporary and compelling, fresh and relevant. -- Social integration, allow our users to quickly and easily share their thoughts in a way that compliment their commercial social behavior. Explore the integration of consumer service-specific capabilities as well as generic Share... actions. -- And many other smaller items Obviously the release date for this cannot be pinned down so early, and releasing is PMC decision, not an IBM one. But we think that this work could be completed and tested for a release in the March/April 2013 time-frame. And the scope of the release might be significant enough to warrant a 4.0 designation. In any case, we'll soon set up a page on the wiki to collect these items. As always, I invite you to add your own priorities to the wiki, things that you would like to work on. This could be a new feature. Or, if one of the above items sound interesting to you, we always welcome help designing and implementing these features. Regards, -Rob
Re: Have uploaded five nice presentation template
KG01 - see comments inline On Fri, Nov 2, 2012 at 11:15 AM, Xin Li lxnice...@gmail.com wrote: Andre, thanks for your feedback. Yes, agreed. The current templates in AOO looks a little out of date. It is the time that we explore more new templates to make the templates nice and good for use. We have more nice design, I will continue to publish more. 2012/11/2 Andre Fischer awf@gmail.com On 01.11.2012 10:00, Xin Li wrote: Hi, I have uploaded five nice presentation template. Welcome to have a try and give me some feedback. Thanks. http://templates.services.openoffice.org/en/node/8966 http://templates.services.openoffice.org/en/node/8968 http://templates.services.openoffice.org/en/node/8970 http://templates.services.openoffice.org/en/node/8972 http://templates.services.openoffice.org/en/node/8974 I like them all. It really gets time to clean up the set of AOO templates, drop the ugly ones (not sure how many would remain) and replace them by prettier ones like yours. KG01 - +1 We should perform an assessment of all the templates to see which ones are still relevant and which are dated. For example, perhaps we could introduce templates to help people create wireframes for mobile devices? In addition, we should seek ways to make the templates more discoverable. Perhaps we could introduce tags to the template ecosystem? For example: business, formal, cool_colours This opportunity for improvement has been captured in the UX Opportunity Backloghttp://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_-_Opportunity_Backlog. Let's start to explore possible design directions. Regards, Kevin -Andre -- Best regards, Xin Li 李欣 UX designer
Re: AOO.Next IBM Priorities
KG01 - see comment inline On Fri, Nov 2, 2012 at 5:28 AM, Rob Weir robw...@apache.org wrote: On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 5:10 PM, Alexandro Colorado j...@oooes.org wrote: On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 2:53 PM, jan iversen jancasacon...@gmail.com wrote: Thanks for the note, however knowing IBM I had hoped that one of the official goals was to help the development part of the community to get stabilized. This is what their costumers asked for, not IBM itself. Costumers dont care about development, most of the time. They think everyting is created with Pixeldust. I acknowledge that it is important for IBM to get an output of invested energy/time/money, but I think IBM would benefit not only from features but also from the soft points of helping the community. I was a bit disapointed they didnt asked for some more 'enterprise-ready' features like integration with ERP systems, tivoli, and credential management of profiles, improve Base and add bridge to DB2 or something in those veins. Some of these are being done, but as extensions. And in some cases they depend on proprietary code, so they lead to proprietary extensions. Personally, I'd recommend bring features like this into the core only if they can be done in some open fashion, e.g., standards based or at least an open driver-based or other extensible model which is open to all vendors. that being said in response to your IBM HAT, but I do feel that you and other IBM Fellows still do a great job in getting the community to prosper. Jan. On 1 November 2012 17:45, robert_w...@us.ibm.com wrote: A quick note, wearing my IBM hat. We (IBM) have consulted with customers, internal users, other IBM product teams, on what our (IBM's) development priorities should be for the next AOO release. Obviously, we're not the only ones with priorities or interests or opinions. We don't make AOO decisions by ourselves. But we want to be transparent about what our own priorities are, for our employees participating in the AOO community, and what they will be focusing on. As we did with AOO 3.4.0 and 3.4.1, we'll be putting the details onto the wiki over the next couple of weeks. You'll hear more at ApacheCon, but I wanted you to hear it hear first. Our top priorities: -- Improve the install and deployment experience, especially by supporting digital signatures on installs, and introducing a new incremental update feature, so users are not required to download and install a full image for just a minor update. -- A major UI enhancement, a sidebar framework for the editors, ported over from Symphony, and including an API. If you recall, Symphony won quite a lot of praise for its UI, and much of this was due to the sidebar panel. I think we can make a good argument that this approach, say compared to the MS Office ribbon is a better use of screen real-estate, especially as we see more frequent use of wide screen displays. I like what KOffice did with the management of tiles and panes, and I think is a great UI study case. There were some of these ideas embedded in the UX project. Personally I used to admire the UI from Macromedia projects which had a nice use of toolbars, floating panes, and could add a series of options in a clean icon-based intereface. -- Improved Table of Contents in Writer -- Improved system integration on Windows and MacOS, including possible adoption of gestures. Is this like for tablets? Not sure what gestures means, Opear has some gestures which are mouse keys combinations. For example, MacOS multi-touch gestures. See: http://www.apple.com/osx/what-is/gestures.html -- IAccessible2 bridge, ported over from Symphony, to improve accessibility. This is a major effort, but very important. -- Closer integration of clipart and template libraries with user experience. I think there was always objections to bloat the office suite with too much graphic intensive templates. Not sure if that opposition will be gone now. Impress does need a major facelift with animations and transitions. GSOC had integration bridge to OpenClipArt to import the clipart from the website, this functionality is also present on Inkscape. I think better integration with external repositories is key. Look at what MS Office 2013 does. -- Update branding and visual styling, contemporary and compelling, fresh and relevant. Funny enough, stale is the new fresh, taken from logos of Chrome and Windows, is more an art-deco style. Maybe if we wait long enough what we have now will come back in fashion? ;-) -- Social integration, allow our users to quickly and easily share their thoughts in a way that compliment their commercial social behavior. Explore the integration of consumer service-specific
Re: Have uploaded five nice presentation template
Some comments from another post to consider when exploring clipart and template enhancements. Closer integration of clipart and template libraries with user experience. I think there was always objections to bloat the office suite with too much graphic intensive templates. Not sure if that opposition will be gone now. Impress does need a major facelift with animations and transitions. GSOC had integration bridge to OpenClipArt to import the clipart from the website, this functionality is also present on Inkscape. I think better integration with external repositories is key. Look at what MS Office 2013 does. On Fri, Nov 2, 2012 at 1:13 PM, Kevin Grignon kevingrignon...@gmail.comwrote: KG01 - see comments inline On Fri, Nov 2, 2012 at 11:15 AM, Xin Li lxnice...@gmail.com wrote: Andre, thanks for your feedback. Yes, agreed. The current templates in AOO looks a little out of date. It is the time that we explore more new templates to make the templates nice and good for use. We have more nice design, I will continue to publish more. 2012/11/2 Andre Fischer awf@gmail.com On 01.11.2012 10:00, Xin Li wrote: Hi, I have uploaded five nice presentation template. Welcome to have a try and give me some feedback. Thanks. http://templates.services.openoffice.org/en/node/8966 http://templates.services.openoffice.org/en/node/8968 http://templates.services.openoffice.org/en/node/8970 http://templates.services.openoffice.org/en/node/8972 http://templates.services.openoffice.org/en/node/8974 I like them all. It really gets time to clean up the set of AOO templates, drop the ugly ones (not sure how many would remain) and replace them by prettier ones like yours. KG01 - +1 We should perform an assessment of all the templates to see which ones are still relevant and which are dated. For example, perhaps we could introduce templates to help people create wireframes for mobile devices? In addition, we should seek ways to make the templates more discoverable. Perhaps we could introduce tags to the template ecosystem? For example: business, formal, cool_colours This opportunity for improvement has been captured in the UX Opportunity Backloghttp://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_-_Opportunity_Backlog. Let's start to explore possible design directions. Regards, Kevin -Andre -- Best regards, Xin Li 李欣 UX designer
Re: [UX] - Design Exploration - Dockable Task Pane (Sidebar) - Tab User Interface Design
KG01 - see comments inline On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 8:39 PM, Shenfeng Liu liush...@gmail.com wrote: 2012/11/1 Jürgen Schmidt jogischm...@gmail.com On 11/1/12 11:09 AM, Lei Wang wrote: I like beveled tab option. me too and it was already planned in the past to extend the existing solution. +1 to Beveled tab option. One question, what kinds of content should be put into the sidebar? A navigator window or a style list window should be put into sidebar as a tab panel. I think that are good examples and Symphony has used it in a good way too. But I am also looking forward to make more more use of it to via extensions and integrate in other systems. It can be a file browser on a CMS where you can checkin/checkout files, can share files, etc.. It can be a property SideBar as we know it from Symphony. property sidebar is a good candidate to implement in phase I. No need to migrated every thing from Symphony sidebar, but start from some frequent used buttons. KG01 - This is an important point. Any enhancements to the existing AOO sidebar should leverage the best user experience elements from both Symphony and AOO. In addition, while we are updating this code we can address any other known issues. I have already completed an analysis of each tool's sidebar, strengths and weaknesses and captured some recommendations. See the analysis doc on the Dockable Task Pane (Side bar) Design Exploration pagehttp://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_4.0_Dockable_Task_Pane_%28Task_Bar%29_Design_Explorationon the AOO UX wiki. http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_4.0_Dockable_Task_Pane_%28Task_Bar%29_Design_Exploration Another candidate we can consider maybe clipart/gallery. And agree that we should provide interface for extension development. I can see it is a big feature that requires a lot of UX/development/testing effort. So I suggest to create a wiki under 4.0 planning wiki https://cwiki.apache.org/confluence/display/OOOUSERS/AOO+4.0+Release+Planning to consolidate and trace all related tasks and action items. We may also need a branch to start ASAP. - Shenfeng Liu (Simon) A SideBar in general is smooth and nice way to integrate in the office UI and provide fast access to new interesting features. And last but not least to make use of wide screen displays ;-) Juergen On Thu, Nov 1, 2012 at 4:59 PM, Kevin Grignon kevingrignon...@gmail.com wrote: Hello All, I've been exploring design alternatives for adding navigation tabs to the docked task pane. See: http://wiki.openoffice.org/wiki/AOO_UX_Design_Exploration_-_Docked_Task_Pane_Container_-_Tab_User_Interface_Design Capture any thoughts or feedback in the discussion section of the wiki page. Thanks, Kevin