[RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
On Mar 18, 1:06 pm, Steve Palincsar wrote: > Sorry, but fast 25 mile rides just aren't very interesting to me. 25 > isn't a long enough distance to figure, other than as a leisurely > recovery ride on an off-day. Palincsar, I like your attitude, though I like to go both long and somewhat briskly. A ride starts to get good somewhere around three hours. Frankly, I tossed out "25 miles" as a random number which might produce a reasonably educated impression (and to which the bike shop might be amenable). On the other hand, the last time I was on a bike that made my jaw drop, in a good way, it took about three revolutions of the pedals for me to realize that I was on something that was notable. The concern about comfort... I guess I've not been on uncomfortable bikes very often, just lucky I guess, or maybe adaptable, and I consider position to comprise about 90% of comfort. Digging back in my memories, I guess I do recall very much disliking early Cannondale road bikes. And come to think of it, I rode an early carbon TVT (1983?) which I found very unpleasant. Hmmn... there were a couple of SLX bikes that felt like rails to me, a disappointment after years of lovely, lively SL frames. Maybe I've blocked the bad memories. As far as light commute bikes go, the most fun I've ever had commuting on a bike was from a north Denver suburb to Longmont, 25 miles each way, rolling hills and velvet smooth shoulders. Merlin Extralight with Conti 28's. After I'd done it for a few months, I could just crack 60 minutes for the morning ride. I carried a Timbuk2 when I needed to, but more often I left clothes at the office to change into. Years before that I used to commute on my Eisentraut, from Boulder to Denver, with a seat bag. Bussed home at night. à chacun son goût -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
many of my rides are 25-50 somewhat fast, and in some ways moderately competitive group club rides. my lighter bike is quite nice for that use. so hopefully we are seeing many different ways in which we all use our bikes...and perhaps more importantly for this rambling thread, that we each of our own values about life, bikes, and the real lightness of being. i was never trying to convince anyone else to get a 17 lb carbon bike, just alluding to my experience of it. and you should all get one :). the 3 steel bikes are in the garage and the carbon one is in the house. they hate hanging out together. On Mar 18, 1:27 pm, Clayton Scott wrote: > Forgot to mention. The Boulder is very comfortable and I have been setting > one personal best after another since I got it. > > > > On Fri, Mar 18, 2011 at 1:07 PM, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > > That's fine, Steve, and may God bless you. I like short and fast. > > > On Fri, Mar 18, 2011 at 2:06 PM, Steve Palincsar wrote: > > >> On Fri, 2011-03-18 at 13:58 -0600, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > >> > Steve, listen: the crabon wunder might well be hell on a century, slow > >> > or not. That's not the point. The point is, for a fast 25 mile ride it > >> > might be quite fun; in fact, in certain ways, MORE fun than a 30 lb > >> > bike for that fast 25 mile ride. That's all. Over 'n' out. > > >> Sorry, but fast 25 mile rides just aren't very interesting to me. 25 > >> isn't a long enough distance to figure, other than as a leisurely > >> recovery ride on an off-day. > > >> But then, I'd rather go long than go fast anytime; and other than > >> around-town shoppers or urban commuters, bikes that aren't good for > >> centuries or longer hold no interest for me at all. > > >> > Patrick "and let's not even begin to talk about slow 25 mile rides" > >> > Moore > > >> Those are probably the only 25 mile rides actually worth doing... > > > -- > > Patrick Moore > > Albuquerque, NM > > For professional resumes, contact > > Patrick Moore, ACRW at patrickmo...@resumespecialties.com > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > > For more options, visit this group at > >http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
Forgot to mention. The Boulder is very comfortable and I have been setting one personal best after another since I got it. On Fri, Mar 18, 2011 at 1:07 PM, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > That's fine, Steve, and may God bless you. I like short and fast. > > > On Fri, Mar 18, 2011 at 2:06 PM, Steve Palincsar wrote: > >> On Fri, 2011-03-18 at 13:58 -0600, PATRICK MOORE wrote: >> > Steve, listen: the crabon wunder might well be hell on a century, slow >> > or not. That's not the point. The point is, for a fast 25 mile ride it >> > might be quite fun; in fact, in certain ways, MORE fun than a 30 lb >> > bike for that fast 25 mile ride. That's all. Over 'n' out. >> >> Sorry, but fast 25 mile rides just aren't very interesting to me. 25 >> isn't a long enough distance to figure, other than as a leisurely >> recovery ride on an off-day. >> >> But then, I'd rather go long than go fast anytime; and other than >> around-town shoppers or urban commuters, bikes that aren't good for >> centuries or longer hold no interest for me at all. >> >> >> > Patrick "and let's not even begin to talk about slow 25 mile rides" >> > Moore >> >> Those are probably the only 25 mile rides actually worth doing... >> >> >> >> >> > > > -- > Patrick Moore > Albuquerque, NM > For professional resumes, contact > Patrick Moore, ACRW at patrickmo...@resumespecialties.com > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
That's fine, Steve, and may God bless you. I like short and fast. On Fri, Mar 18, 2011 at 2:06 PM, Steve Palincsar wrote: > On Fri, 2011-03-18 at 13:58 -0600, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > > Steve, listen: the crabon wunder might well be hell on a century, slow > > or not. That's not the point. The point is, for a fast 25 mile ride it > > might be quite fun; in fact, in certain ways, MORE fun than a 30 lb > > bike for that fast 25 mile ride. That's all. Over 'n' out. > > Sorry, but fast 25 mile rides just aren't very interesting to me. 25 > isn't a long enough distance to figure, other than as a leisurely > recovery ride on an off-day. > > But then, I'd rather go long than go fast anytime; and other than > around-town shoppers or urban commuters, bikes that aren't good for > centuries or longer hold no interest for me at all. > > > > Patrick "and let's not even begin to talk about slow 25 mile rides" > > Moore > > Those are probably the only 25 mile rides actually worth doing... > > > > > -- Patrick Moore Albuquerque, NM For professional resumes, contact Patrick Moore, ACRW at patrickmo...@resumespecialties.com -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
On Fri, 2011-03-18 at 13:58 -0600, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > Steve, listen: the crabon wunder might well be hell on a century, slow > or not. That's not the point. The point is, for a fast 25 mile ride it > might be quite fun; in fact, in certain ways, MORE fun than a 30 lb > bike for that fast 25 mile ride. That's all. Over 'n' out. Sorry, but fast 25 mile rides just aren't very interesting to me. 25 isn't a long enough distance to figure, other than as a leisurely recovery ride on an off-day. But then, I'd rather go long than go fast anytime; and other than around-town shoppers or urban commuters, bikes that aren't good for centuries or longer hold no interest for me at all. > Patrick "and let's not even begin to talk about slow 25 mile rides" > Moore Those are probably the only 25 mile rides actually worth doing... -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
Steve, listen: the crabon wunder might well be hell on a century, slow or not. That's not the point. The point is, for a fast 25 mile ride it might be quite fun; in fact, in certain ways, MORE fun than a 30 lb bike for that fast 25 mile ride. That's all. Over 'n' out. Patrick "and let's not even begin to talk about slow 25 mile rides" Moore On Fri, Mar 18, 2011 at 1:54 PM, Steve Palincsar wrote: > On Fri, 2011-03-18 at 13:32 -0600, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > > Unfair; different uses, different feels. A light gofast may well not > > be the bike to take on long, slow rides. And ad contram, too. > > I never said "long, slow rides" -- I said in addition to your brisk 25 > mile hill ride, take that carbon race bike on a century. Ride it at > whatever speed you like to ride a century. In my experience, comfort > really starts to matter when the distance goes up, and 100 miles is just > about long enough to qualify as a "long" distance. > > > > > > > On Fri, Mar 18, 2011 at 1:15 PM, Steve Palincsar > > wrote: > > On Thu, 2011-03-17 at 23:41 -0700, pb wrote: > > > Stop by your local "pro" shop. Borrow something along the > > lines of a > > > Cervelo R3 or a some Specialized S-Works or a Moots Vamoots > > or some > > > such. Take it out for a brisk 25 miles of hills. That may > > be a short > > > cut to the answer you seek. Let us know *your* conclusions. > > > > To be fair, also take it on a 100 mile ride out in the country > > somewhere, where you can ride all day and not get off of > > chipseal. > > > > > > > > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the > > Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > > To post to this group, send email to > > rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch > > +unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > > For more options, visit this group at > > http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > Patrick Moore > > Albuquerque, NM > > For professional resumes, contact > > Patrick Moore, ACRW at patrickmo...@resumespecialties.com > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > > Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > > To post to this group, send email to > > rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch > > +unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > > For more options, visit this group at > > http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > > -- Patrick Moore Albuquerque, NM For professional resumes, contact Patrick Moore, ACRW at patrickmo...@resumespecialties.com -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
On Fri, 2011-03-18 at 13:32 -0600, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > Unfair; different uses, different feels. A light gofast may well not > be the bike to take on long, slow rides. And ad contram, too. I never said "long, slow rides" -- I said in addition to your brisk 25 mile hill ride, take that carbon race bike on a century. Ride it at whatever speed you like to ride a century. In my experience, comfort really starts to matter when the distance goes up, and 100 miles is just about long enough to qualify as a "long" distance. > > On Fri, Mar 18, 2011 at 1:15 PM, Steve Palincsar > wrote: > On Thu, 2011-03-17 at 23:41 -0700, pb wrote: > > Stop by your local "pro" shop. Borrow something along the > lines of a > > Cervelo R3 or a some Specialized S-Works or a Moots Vamoots > or some > > such. Take it out for a brisk 25 miles of hills. That may > be a short > > cut to the answer you seek. Let us know *your* conclusions. > > To be fair, also take it on a 100 mile ride out in the country > somewhere, where you can ride all day and not get off of > chipseal. > > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the > Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > To post to this group, send email to > rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch > +unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > > > > > > -- > Patrick Moore > Albuquerque, NM > For professional resumes, contact > Patrick Moore, ACRW at patrickmo...@resumespecialties.com > > > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > To post to this group, send email to > rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch > +unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
Oh no, there is a huge difference in feel, which is what I keep repeating. And that "feel" is for some people a great part of the fun. Yesteray's ride when I went out and grunted the 17 3/4 lb 75" fixie up some steepish and longish hills (northern Rio Rancho for you locals) was great fun. I worked, not all-out, but kept my heartbeat up in the higher registers: not on purpose but because it is **fun** for me to work hard. Not that all this hard work generates a lot of speed, but it is the sort of ride I enjoy. So, to repeat again: Fun can = speed can = light. No harm in that! And again I repeat: I enjoy my 33lb+ Fargo but it is a *different* kind of enjoyment, obviously. On Fri, Mar 18, 2011 at 1:45 PM, Kelly Sleeper wrote: > So yes weight makes a difference in speed at equal all out efforts in time, > most likely not feel. But on a normal ride for fun I don't believe it makes > any difference at all for me.. even 10 lbs. Then again I've toured with > 85lbs of gear and towed a second bike along just because. > > > Patrick Moore Albuquerque, NM For professional resumes, contact Patrick Moore, ACRW at patrickmo...@resumespecialties.com -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
Before I bought a Rivendell I had a really nice race bike carbon bike whatever you wish to call it. http://www.flickr.com/photos/tksleeper/5155759637/in/set-72157625210417815/ The chase for speed is as bad as the chase for comfort. Now if I put two water bottles on my race bike or a front bag and added 5lbs I would not really "notice" it. I"m 220lbs so 5 lbs percentage wise is nothing on the same bike. Yes I believe it makes a difference, just one I can't feel in most instances. So if my AHH or Bombadil cost me 15 minutes on a 30 mile ride so be it. I can be on a road ride and end up on a path like this.. http://www.flickr.com/photos/tksleeper/5535823745/ ... a place I would never end up on with the race bike. Then again the ride that put me here would never have happened as I was just running to the local starbucks and ended up on a 40 mile run. Since I would have had to have gotten dressed and found shoes and checked on lights and blah blah blah I would have just gotten in the car. When I think about missing my spd-r's on a big climb I remember that the other 90% of the time I love my platforms and the advantages they give me. For every performance plus there is a trade off. You can't have everything and those that try to say you can are the freak aborrations to the norm. After base miles and stuff my race bike was very comfortable. with smooth roads. Speed isn't just weight and 5 lbs for us bigger riders is very little... and if you add that weight on the same bike someplace ie: seat bag or something chances are you will not notice it. Two bikes .. different bikes are not apple to apple comparsions So yes weight makes a difference in speed at equal all out efforts in time, most likely not feel. But on a normal ride for fun I don't believe it makes any difference at all for me.. even 10 lbs. Then again I've toured with 85lbs of gear and towed a second bike along just because. If you ride both bikes you will know which one is to heavy or not as comfortable or doesn't feel as good.. none of use here can make that decision.. or make what you think wrong or right. :) enjoy kelly -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
Unfair; different uses, different feels. A light gofast may well not be the bike to take on long, slow rides. And ad contram, too. On Fri, Mar 18, 2011 at 1:15 PM, Steve Palincsar wrote: > On Thu, 2011-03-17 at 23:41 -0700, pb wrote: > > Stop by your local "pro" shop. Borrow something along the lines of a > > Cervelo R3 or a some Specialized S-Works or a Moots Vamoots or some > > such. Take it out for a brisk 25 miles of hills. That may be a short > > cut to the answer you seek. Let us know *your* conclusions. > > To be fair, also take it on a 100 mile ride out in the country > somewhere, where you can ride all day and not get off of chipseal. > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > > -- Patrick Moore Albuquerque, NM For professional resumes, contact Patrick Moore, ACRW at patrickmo...@resumespecialties.com -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
On Thu, 2011-03-17 at 23:41 -0700, pb wrote: > Stop by your local "pro" shop. Borrow something along the lines of a > Cervelo R3 or a some Specialized S-Works or a Moots Vamoots or some > such. Take it out for a brisk 25 miles of hills. That may be a short > cut to the answer you seek. Let us know *your* conclusions. To be fair, also take it on a 100 mile ride out in the country somewhere, where you can ride all day and not get off of chipseal. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
On Fri, 2011-03-18 at 09:47 -0700, Pondero wrote: > "Do you think the 5 lbs alone, between the Trek and Ebisu is enough to > effect the performance?" > > To answer that question, you need to have a very clear understanding > of "performance for what?" To provide a couple of extreme examples, > performance measured by climbing speed...yes, performance for noodling > around in the neighborhood...no. And performance measured by long distance riding comfort and pleasure, probably not. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
Well, this certainly has been a lively discussion! I'm inclined to suspect that Jan Heine is right. My 22 lb Rambouillet and 25 lb Trek 620 have similar geometry and very similar handling and responsiveness, despite a 10% weight difference. The 30 lb Ebisu has the advantage of handling significantly beefier tires (It seems to be like an AHH but with canti brakes) but the OS tubing and added stiffness may degrade responsiveness a small but noticeable amount. I don't think I have ever ridden a standard gauge frame designed around 35-42 mm tires that wasn't also specked to be a workhorse. Is it live or is it memorex? Is it weight or is it stiffness? Who can be sure! The snow and mud is receding here in Vt but with the wind blowing at 40 - 50 mph, no bike feels lively. michael On Mar 18, 10:52 am, Jan Heine wrote: > > i can almost guarantee if you reduce bike weight by 5 lbs, you > > will both notice and enjoy the difference. > > I am not sure that bike weight matters much by itself. My bike rides > the same whether I carry only a spare tube in the handlebar bag or am > loaded down with 10 lbs of food and clothes for a 600 km brevet. (Yes, > you can measure the difference on a long climb, but it doesn't change > how the bike feels, nor how much I enjoy the ride.) > > That said, I really dislike riding bikes with heavy frames. Not > because they weigh more, but because they feel different. Call it > "lively feel" or "planing," there is a joy to a high-performance bike > that is absent from a bike that is overbuilt and too stiff for the > purpose. Putting lighter parts on a heavy frame doesn't make a > difference... > > In the 1960s and early 1970s, time trial bikes were equipped with > drilled-out components and even cantilever brakes to save weight. > (Remember http://www.bikequarterly.com/rebour.html";>Merckx' > hour record bike?) The conventional wisdom was that a TT bike had > to be as light as possible, even on a flat course. Of course, we all > know that the bike's weight matters little in a flat time trial, but > the old wisdom probably had some underlying grain of truth. I am sure > that I would have preferred to ride at a constant, all-out effort on > the superlight frame of a TT bike than on the heavier frame of a > standard racing bike, because of its "lively feel" or "planing," and > not because of the holes drilled into the chainrings! > > Jan Heine > Editor > Bicycle Quarterlyhttp://www.bikequarterly.com > > Follow our blog athttp://janheine.wordpress.com/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
I can only add that the single most accomplished cyclist I know rides a 45+/- lb bike, when outfitted with empty bags and racks. This fella has ridden across or around every continent on the planet, except for the really cold one. I am not sure if that helps, but I keep it in mind when I start considering how much stuff weighs. Chris Redding, Ca. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
Stop by your local "pro" shop. Borrow something along the lines of a Cervelo R3 or a some Specialized S-Works or a Moots Vamoots or some such. Take it out for a brisk 25 miles of hills. That may be a short cut to the answer you seek. Let us know *your* conclusions. I enjoy riding my Rambouillet (Campy 10-speed, Open Pro's and either 25's or 28's, depending on which wheels are along for the ride). It's relaxed, and requires no attention. I call it my "hangover" bike -- if I have a hangover, I can ride it without having to think about what I'm doing, especially if it has 28's on-board. I also choose it on days when I feel like steel, or when I just want a relaxed toodle of a ride, an easy 50 miles of rollers. I have other bikes that climb better and generally scoot better (but lots of folks think I'm wrong about that). IMO, yeah, the five pounds makes a difference (but lots of folks think I'm wrong about that). How significant that difference will be to you will depend partly on your perception (what pleases you?), partly on your riding style (you're on a solid climb -- do you jam your way up it, flirting with your max heartrate, or do you shift back to a low gear, and sit down and spin?), partly on your fitness level, and partly on where on the bike the extra weight is being carried. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2k1uOqRb0HU What's the answer? That's what you have to figure out. Caution: performance can be a very addictive drug. Me, I like flirting with max heartrate. pb On Mar 17, 5:54 pm, MichaelH wrote: > OK, now that we have dispensed with helmets, allow me to raise another > controversial topic. > > This is not like, when am I too heavy, which is easy right now. > > I have 4 bikes, well 6 really, but we wont go into those details. All > four of them are around 62 cm and get ridden regularly - a 1988 > classic stage racing frame, weighing around 22 lbs; a Rambouillet, > outfitted with White/ Open Pro wheels, a White dbl crank, Honjo > fenders, a Mark's Rack, and light tires also weighing about 22 lbs.; > a 1984 Trek (Reynolds 531 standard gauge tubing) with Shimano 9 speed > cranks and shifters, SKS Fenders, Passella 32 mm T Guards and coming > in around 25 lbs; and An Ebisu All Purpose, with front and real steel > racks, steel fenders, MA 40 Rims, triple DaVinci Cranks, and 38 mm > Avocet Cross tires that weighs in at a hefty 30 lbs. > > I live in Vermont, which has lots of rolling hills and some > significant climbs. Do you think the 5 lbs alone, between the Trek > and Ebisu is enough to effect the performance? What about the 3 lb > difference between the Rambouillet and the Trek? Or, are the > perceived differences imaginary? > > michael -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
Might. Also might not. The bike I am most in "sync" with is actually the Fargo, which is the heaviest bike. The least - the Hillborne. Which is also the (relatively) lightest tubed. That bike does have front and rear Nitto racks, SON and Phil hubs and an E3 light. All of which are heavier than other choices out there. Also, no bike has anything smaller than 35 or 40mm wide tires. In fact, am starting to get a distinct preference for 50 to 60mm wide. On the other hand, it is amazing how different a bike can feel after taking off the winter studded tires. I think I would still notice more of a difference if I could lose 5, 10 or even 50 pounds. Eric Platt St. Paul, MN On Mar 18, 9:19 am, eflayer wrote: > not trying to talk you into anything. but you could get a fine steel > bike, an all carbon fork, some Ultegra Open Pro wheels, and come in at > around 21 pounds. i am 195 lbs, understand what percentage of the > whole weight package my bike is, and really enjoy getting on a lighter > bike. i can almost guarantee if you reduce bike weight by 5 lbs, you > will both notice and enjoy the difference. in your case, you could > reduce bike weight easily by 10 lbs and you would feel as though you > were flying. > > On Mar 18, 3:31 am, EricP wrote: > > > > > This is something I have no experience in. Right now, my lightest > > bike (Hillborne) is around 31 pounds. My Surly LHT is 33 pounds and > > the Salsa Fargo 36. The latter two might lose a touch of weight when > > the studded tires come off. But probably not enough to make a > > difference. All without bags or bottles. > > > With me still needing to lose a lot of weight, the weights of the bike > > make really no difference. The fact is, no matter what bike is under > > me, I'm a slow rider. > > > At 6 feet tall and 225 pounds, not sure I'd trust a bike that weighs > > under 27 pounds or so. Might not be able to handle the tonnage. > > > A 20 pounder? - it would most likely break when I sat upon it. Forget > > pedaling. > > > Eric Platt > > St. Paul, MN > > > On Mar 17, 11:25 pm, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > > > > I mistook the Rex figure for the carbon bike figure. 17 lb is more to be > > > expected.- Hide quoted text - > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
"Do you think the 5 lbs alone, between the Trek and Ebisu is enough to effect the performance?" To answer that question, you need to have a very clear understanding of "performance for what?" To provide a couple of extreme examples, performance measured by climbing speed...yes, performance for noodling around in the neighborhood...no. The key, in my opinion, is to have a very definite and honest assessment of what you mean by performance. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
On Fri, Mar 18, 2011 at 8:52 AM, Jan Heine wrote: > > > [...] . My bike rides > the same whether I carry only a spare tube in the handlebar bag or am > loaded down with 10 lbs of food and clothes for a 600 km brevet. (Yes, > you can measure the difference on a long climb, but it doesn't change > how the bike feels, nor how much I enjoy the ride.) > This is not at all my experience! True, steady state efforts are not much affected by weight, but frequent accelerations, turns, ups and downs certainly are. I can tell a difference in the way my 18 lb bike feels when I "throw it around" compare to the barely 5 lb heavier commuter, not to mention the 10 lb heavier Motobecane (which is itself very nice; in a way perhaps nicer riding than the Rivs because of its standard gauge, lightweight 531 tubing -- or perhaps just the lower gearing; haven't decided). And climbing with fewer lbs at least in a fixed gear, certainly is different! > > That said, I really dislike riding bikes with heavy frames. Not > because they weigh more, but because they feel different. Call it > "lively feel" or "planing," there is a joy to a high-performance bike > that is absent from a bike that is overbuilt and too stiff for the > purpose. Putting lighter parts on a heavy frame doesn't make a > difference... > I expect that here, as with gearing, individual capacities and style and tastes decide what frame is heavy and what is light. I've wondered tho' if the OS custom Rivs I have would feel better if they used tubing more like the Motobecane's. Tho' I also ride the Fargo and find that enjoyable -- I am beginning to suspect that I am happiest with a gear of about 67". Must try the Rivs with such a gear. (And then I get on a Riv after the Motobecane and tell myself, "Revelation! Glory! Who wudda thunk?) > > In the 1960s and early 1970s, time trial bikes were equipped with > drilled-out components and even cantilever brakes to save weight. > (Remember http://www.bikequarterly.com/rebour.html";>Merckx' > hour record bike?) The conventional wisdom was that a TT bike had > to be as light as possible, even on a flat course. Of course, we all > know that the bike's weight matters little in a flat time trial, but > the old wisdom probably had some underlying grain of truth. I am sure > that I would have preferred to ride at a constant, all-out effort on > the superlight frame of a TT bike than on the heavier frame of a > standard racing bike, because of its "lively feel" or "planing," and > not because of the holes drilled into the chainrings! > > Jan Heine > Editor > Bicycle Quarterly > http://www.bikequarterly.com > > Follow our blog at http://janheine.wordpress.com/ > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > For more options, visit this group at > http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > > -- Patrick Moore Albuquerque, NM For professional resumes, contact Patrick Moore, ACRW at patrickmo...@resumespecialties.com -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
i agree with jan, as i too have felt the subtle differences in the ride of different, lighter, heavier, and tubed framesets. unlike jan, i can't quantify a damn thing. but...my all carbonated Fisher Cronus does not have the most forgiving feel in how it rides as it is one stiff mofo. but...it is 5 lbs lighter than my nearest steel bike and out of the saddle climbing and accelleration from a dead stop do "seem" markedly quicker. you see i put "seem" in quote marks. is it not possible that degrees of how a bike feels relative to weight is correlated with where the weight is located? just a thought. On Mar 18, 7:52 am, Jan Heine wrote: > > i can almost guarantee if you reduce bike weight by 5 lbs, you > > will both notice and enjoy the difference. > > I am not sure that bike weight matters much by itself. My bike rides > the same whether I carry only a spare tube in the handlebar bag or am > loaded down with 10 lbs of food and clothes for a 600 km brevet. (Yes, > you can measure the difference on a long climb, but it doesn't change > how the bike feels, nor how much I enjoy the ride.) > > That said, I really dislike riding bikes with heavy frames. Not > because they weigh more, but because they feel different. Call it > "lively feel" or "planing," there is a joy to a high-performance bike > that is absent from a bike that is overbuilt and too stiff for the > purpose. Putting lighter parts on a heavy frame doesn't make a > difference... > > In the 1960s and early 1970s, time trial bikes were equipped with > drilled-out components and even cantilever brakes to save weight. > (Remember http://www.bikequarterly.com/rebour.html";>Merckx' > hour record bike?) The conventional wisdom was that a TT bike had > to be as light as possible, even on a flat course. Of course, we all > know that the bike's weight matters little in a flat time trial, but > the old wisdom probably had some underlying grain of truth. I am sure > that I would have preferred to ride at a constant, all-out effort on > the superlight frame of a TT bike than on the heavier frame of a > standard racing bike, because of its "lively feel" or "planing," and > not because of the holes drilled into the chainrings! > > Jan Heine > Editor > Bicycle Quarterlyhttp://www.bikequarterly.com > > Follow our blog athttp://janheine.wordpress.com/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
I really have no idea how much my Hillborne weighs, except that it weighs more than my wife's dutch bike and less than my Santa Cruz mountain bike. When I can't lose another pound off my ass, then maybe I'll start thinking about how much my bike weighs. As long as I can get it to take me where I want to go, it's not "too heavy". He ain't heavy; he's my Hillborne Cheers! Shawn On Mar 18, 3:31 am, EricP wrote: > This is something I have no experience in. Right now, my lightest > bike (Hillborne) is around 31 pounds. My Surly LHT is 33 pounds and > the Salsa Fargo 36. The latter two might lose a touch of weight when > the studded tires come off. But probably not enough to make a > difference. All without bags or bottles. > > With me still needing to lose a lot of weight, the weights of the bike > make really no difference. The fact is, no matter what bike is under > me, I'm a slow rider. > > At 6 feet tall and 225 pounds, not sure I'd trust a bike that weighs > under 27 pounds or so. Might not be able to handle the tonnage. > > A 20 pounder? - it would most likely break when I sat upon it. Forget > pedaling. > > Eric Platt > St. Paul, MN > > On Mar 17, 11:25 pm, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > > > > > > > > > I mistook the Rex figure for the carbon bike figure. 17 lb is more to be > > expected. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
> i can almost guarantee if you reduce bike weight by 5 lbs, you > will both notice and enjoy the difference. I am not sure that bike weight matters much by itself. My bike rides the same whether I carry only a spare tube in the handlebar bag or am loaded down with 10 lbs of food and clothes for a 600 km brevet. (Yes, you can measure the difference on a long climb, but it doesn't change how the bike feels, nor how much I enjoy the ride.) That said, I really dislike riding bikes with heavy frames. Not because they weigh more, but because they feel different. Call it "lively feel" or "planing," there is a joy to a high-performance bike that is absent from a bike that is overbuilt and too stiff for the purpose. Putting lighter parts on a heavy frame doesn't make a difference... In the 1960s and early 1970s, time trial bikes were equipped with drilled-out components and even cantilever brakes to save weight. (Remember http://www.bikequarterly.com/rebour.html";>Merckx' hour record bike?) The conventional wisdom was that a TT bike had to be as light as possible, even on a flat course. Of course, we all know that the bike's weight matters little in a flat time trial, but the old wisdom probably had some underlying grain of truth. I am sure that I would have preferred to ride at a constant, all-out effort on the superlight frame of a TT bike than on the heavier frame of a standard racing bike, because of its "lively feel" or "planing," and not because of the holes drilled into the chainrings! Jan Heine Editor Bicycle Quarterly http://www.bikequarterly.com Follow our blog at http://janheine.wordpress.com/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
not trying to talk you into anything. but you could get a fine steel bike, an all carbon fork, some Ultegra Open Pro wheels, and come in at around 21 pounds. i am 195 lbs, understand what percentage of the whole weight package my bike is, and really enjoy getting on a lighter bike. i can almost guarantee if you reduce bike weight by 5 lbs, you will both notice and enjoy the difference. in your case, you could reduce bike weight easily by 10 lbs and you would feel as though you were flying. On Mar 18, 3:31 am, EricP wrote: > This is something I have no experience in. Right now, my lightest > bike (Hillborne) is around 31 pounds. My Surly LHT is 33 pounds and > the Salsa Fargo 36. The latter two might lose a touch of weight when > the studded tires come off. But probably not enough to make a > difference. All without bags or bottles. > > With me still needing to lose a lot of weight, the weights of the bike > make really no difference. The fact is, no matter what bike is under > me, I'm a slow rider. > > At 6 feet tall and 225 pounds, not sure I'd trust a bike that weighs > under 27 pounds or so. Might not be able to handle the tonnage. > > A 20 pounder? - it would most likely break when I sat upon it. Forget > pedaling. > > Eric Platt > St. Paul, MN > > On Mar 17, 11:25 pm, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > > > > > I mistook the Rex figure for the carbon bike figure. 17 lb is more to be > > expected.- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
Well i have no idea how much my bikes weigh (like everybody else who seem to have weighed theirs), the times i feel like the bike is heavy are: when at the end of a long ride i need to get up that big a** hill to get home and when i have to bring my bike in after that long ride (which i have to carry up a flight of stairs). i have to echo, that asking this question means you have are blessed to have many bikes---and i ask myself this question every now and then :) -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
This is something I have no experience in. Right now, my lightest bike (Hillborne) is around 31 pounds. My Surly LHT is 33 pounds and the Salsa Fargo 36. The latter two might lose a touch of weight when the studded tires come off. But probably not enough to make a difference. All without bags or bottles. With me still needing to lose a lot of weight, the weights of the bike make really no difference. The fact is, no matter what bike is under me, I'm a slow rider. At 6 feet tall and 225 pounds, not sure I'd trust a bike that weighs under 27 pounds or so. Might not be able to handle the tonnage. A 20 pounder? - it would most likely break when I sat upon it. Forget pedaling. Eric Platt St. Paul, MN On Mar 17, 11:25 pm, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > I mistook the Rex figure for the carbon bike figure. 17 lb is more to be > expected. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
I mistook the Rex figure for the carbon bike figure. 17 lb is more to be expected. On Thu, Mar 17, 2011 at 9:54 PM, eflayer wrote: > the all carbon bike weighs 17.0 lbs. > > On Mar 17, 8:38 pm, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > > I agree; a significantly lighter bike (and don't ask me to define > > "significantly" -- I know it when I ride it) has virtues of its own and, > > therefore, its own kind of fun -- light wheels especially, when you > climb. > > Of course, there are other bicycle qualities beside light weight (and > that > > may even trump light weight in a give instance) but ceteris paribus, > light > > has its own fun. > > > > Eddie: I'm surprised you got down only to 21 1/2 with all that carbon > fiber > > and those very light wheels on what looks to be a medium size frame. My > 58 > > cm Riv #3, back when it was a multispeed gofast, with its 7 lb frame and > > fork and headset, weighed 18 3/4 lb with a 1X10 drivetrain and titanium > only > > in the Flite rails and Specialized Aero stem binder bolt. > > > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 17, 2011 at 9:31 PM, eflayer wrote: > > > i own an all steel Gunnar Sport, a coupled Rambouillet, a custom Rex > > > with all carbon fork. poundage on those goes from a low of about 21.5 > > > up to 24. > > > > > for fun, i just built up a carbon Fisher Cronus; all carbon. for the > > > first time i paid attention to lower weight parts; carbon bars, carbon > > > seatpost, and shimano RS 80 1600 gram wheels. with pedals and cages it > > > weighs 17 lbs. that is nearly 5 less than the rest. i am old, sorta > > > plumpish, but i ride quite a bit. i can't quantify the difference, but > > > the lighter bike is a fine fun contrast to the others. you can drink > > > less beer, lose some weight...and until you actually do it, a > > > significantly lighter bike is a ball. > > > > > not my normal conservative approach. in fact, way out there: > > > > >https://picasaweb.google.com/107231724174916923201/CronusWheels# > > > > > On Mar 17, 8:16 pm, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > > > > Oh good, another controversy to jump into. Herewith: > > > > > > 1. I imagine that "heavy" is said relative to rider weight, no? If a > 17 > > > lb > > > > bike is light for me, it would be simply fragile for a 250 pounder. > > > > > > 2. Ditto for the bikes purpose: a fixie gofast has a different > standard > > > than > > > > a touring or mountain bike. > > > > > > 3. The tolerable limits also have to do with one's preferences for > owning > > > > fewer multipurpose or more single purpose bikes. > > > > > > Having disposed of that: > > > > > > For me, 170: gofast, certainly under 20 lb equipped. Mine is (ahem) > 17 > > > 3/4 > > > > lb exactly. Nice commuter under 25 lb equipped but not laden. Mine is > > > > probably under 23 lb with rack but no bag. But when you get to errand > > > > beaters and tourer/offroad bikes, who is to say? I'd love a 20 lb ss > > > 29er, > > > > but I'd rather have my multipurpose Fargo, which is porcine at 33 lb, > > > than a > > > > single use, lightweight ss off road bike if I had to choose just one. > My > > > > Motobecane is unweighed but, equipped and unladen, I'd guess it is at > > > least > > > > 28 lb despite the nicely light frame thanks to heavy wheels, > non-SON20R > > > > dynohub, luggage and so forth. > > > > > > I did some windy hills this afternoon, about 17 or 18 miles (no > computer! > > > So > > > > I can fudge!) on the gofast and let me tell you, climbing those > hills, > > > > especially with SW 21 G 33 winds, is far easier when your bike is 10 > lb > > > less > > > > (and of course the wheels are far, far lighter). > > > > > > OTOH, the porcine Motobecane and grossly obese Fargo are still fun to > > > ride > > > > -- funner than many a lighter bike I've ridden. I'd choose fun over > light > > > > any day. (Still, how can I drop 10 lb from the Fargo.?) > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 17, 2011 at 6:54 PM, MichaelH > wrote: > > > > > OK, now that we have dispensed with helmets, allow me to raise > another > > > > > controversial topic. > > > > > > > This is not like, when am I too heavy, which is easy right now. > > > > > > > I have 4 bikes, well 6 really, but we wont go into those details. > All > > > > > four of them are around 62 cm and get ridden regularly - a 1988 > > > > > classic stage racing frame, weighing around 22 lbs; a Rambouillet, > > > > > outfitted with White/ Open Pro wheels, a White dbl crank, Honjo > > > > > fenders, a Mark's Rack, and light tires also weighing about 22 > lbs.; > > > > > a 1984 Trek (Reynolds 531 standard gauge tubing) with Shimano 9 > speed > > > > > cranks and shifters, SKS Fenders, Passella 32 mm T Guards and > coming > > > > > in around 25 lbs; and An Ebisu All Purpose, with front and real > steel > > > > > racks, steel fenders, MA 40 Rims, triple DaVinci Cranks, and 38 mm > > > > > Avocet Cross tires that weighs in at a hefty 30 lbs. > > > > > > > I live in Vermont, which has lots of rolling hills and some > > > > >
[RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
the all carbon bike weighs 17.0 lbs. On Mar 17, 8:38 pm, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > I agree; a significantly lighter bike (and don't ask me to define > "significantly" -- I know it when I ride it) has virtues of its own and, > therefore, its own kind of fun -- light wheels especially, when you climb. > Of course, there are other bicycle qualities beside light weight (and that > may even trump light weight in a give instance) but ceteris paribus, light > has its own fun. > > Eddie: I'm surprised you got down only to 21 1/2 with all that carbon fiber > and those very light wheels on what looks to be a medium size frame. My 58 > cm Riv #3, back when it was a multispeed gofast, with its 7 lb frame and > fork and headset, weighed 18 3/4 lb with a 1X10 drivetrain and titanium only > in the Flite rails and Specialized Aero stem binder bolt. > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 17, 2011 at 9:31 PM, eflayer wrote: > > i own an all steel Gunnar Sport, a coupled Rambouillet, a custom Rex > > with all carbon fork. poundage on those goes from a low of about 21.5 > > up to 24. > > > for fun, i just built up a carbon Fisher Cronus; all carbon. for the > > first time i paid attention to lower weight parts; carbon bars, carbon > > seatpost, and shimano RS 80 1600 gram wheels. with pedals and cages it > > weighs 17 lbs. that is nearly 5 less than the rest. i am old, sorta > > plumpish, but i ride quite a bit. i can't quantify the difference, but > > the lighter bike is a fine fun contrast to the others. you can drink > > less beer, lose some weight...and until you actually do it, a > > significantly lighter bike is a ball. > > > not my normal conservative approach. in fact, way out there: > > >https://picasaweb.google.com/107231724174916923201/CronusWheels# > > > On Mar 17, 8:16 pm, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > > > Oh good, another controversy to jump into. Herewith: > > > > 1. I imagine that "heavy" is said relative to rider weight, no? If a 17 > > lb > > > bike is light for me, it would be simply fragile for a 250 pounder. > > > > 2. Ditto for the bikes purpose: a fixie gofast has a different standard > > than > > > a touring or mountain bike. > > > > 3. The tolerable limits also have to do with one's preferences for owning > > > fewer multipurpose or more single purpose bikes. > > > > Having disposed of that: > > > > For me, 170: gofast, certainly under 20 lb equipped. Mine is (ahem) 17 > > 3/4 > > > lb exactly. Nice commuter under 25 lb equipped but not laden. Mine is > > > probably under 23 lb with rack but no bag. But when you get to errand > > > beaters and tourer/offroad bikes, who is to say? I'd love a 20 lb ss > > 29er, > > > but I'd rather have my multipurpose Fargo, which is porcine at 33 lb, > > than a > > > single use, lightweight ss off road bike if I had to choose just one. My > > > Motobecane is unweighed but, equipped and unladen, I'd guess it is at > > least > > > 28 lb despite the nicely light frame thanks to heavy wheels, non-SON20R > > > dynohub, luggage and so forth. > > > > I did some windy hills this afternoon, about 17 or 18 miles (no computer! > > So > > > I can fudge!) on the gofast and let me tell you, climbing those hills, > > > especially with SW 21 G 33 winds, is far easier when your bike is 10 lb > > less > > > (and of course the wheels are far, far lighter). > > > > OTOH, the porcine Motobecane and grossly obese Fargo are still fun to > > ride > > > -- funner than many a lighter bike I've ridden. I'd choose fun over light > > > any day. (Still, how can I drop 10 lb from the Fargo.?) > > > > On Thu, Mar 17, 2011 at 6:54 PM, MichaelH wrote: > > > > OK, now that we have dispensed with helmets, allow me to raise another > > > > controversial topic. > > > > > This is not like, when am I too heavy, which is easy right now. > > > > > I have 4 bikes, well 6 really, but we wont go into those details. All > > > > four of them are around 62 cm and get ridden regularly - a 1988 > > > > classic stage racing frame, weighing around 22 lbs; a Rambouillet, > > > > outfitted with White/ Open Pro wheels, a White dbl crank, Honjo > > > > fenders, a Mark's Rack, and light tires also weighing about 22 lbs.; > > > > a 1984 Trek (Reynolds 531 standard gauge tubing) with Shimano 9 speed > > > > cranks and shifters, SKS Fenders, Passella 32 mm T Guards and coming > > > > in around 25 lbs; and An Ebisu All Purpose, with front and real steel > > > > racks, steel fenders, MA 40 Rims, triple DaVinci Cranks, and 38 mm > > > > Avocet Cross tires that weighs in at a hefty 30 lbs. > > > > > I live in Vermont, which has lots of rolling hills and some > > > > significant climbs. Do you think the 5 lbs alone, between the Trek > > > > and Ebisu is enough to effect the performance? What about the 3 lb > > > > difference between the Rambouillet and the Trek? Or, are the > > > > perceived differences imaginary? > > > > > michael > > > > > -- > > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > > Groups > >
Re: [RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
I agree; a significantly lighter bike (and don't ask me to define "significantly" -- I know it when I ride it) has virtues of its own and, therefore, its own kind of fun -- light wheels especially, when you climb. Of course, there are other bicycle qualities beside light weight (and that may even trump light weight in a give instance) but ceteris paribus, light has its own fun. Eddie: I'm surprised you got down only to 21 1/2 with all that carbon fiber and those very light wheels on what looks to be a medium size frame. My 58 cm Riv #3, back when it was a multispeed gofast, with its 7 lb frame and fork and headset, weighed 18 3/4 lb with a 1X10 drivetrain and titanium only in the Flite rails and Specialized Aero stem binder bolt. On Thu, Mar 17, 2011 at 9:31 PM, eflayer wrote: > i own an all steel Gunnar Sport, a coupled Rambouillet, a custom Rex > with all carbon fork. poundage on those goes from a low of about 21.5 > up to 24. > > for fun, i just built up a carbon Fisher Cronus; all carbon. for the > first time i paid attention to lower weight parts; carbon bars, carbon > seatpost, and shimano RS 80 1600 gram wheels. with pedals and cages it > weighs 17 lbs. that is nearly 5 less than the rest. i am old, sorta > plumpish, but i ride quite a bit. i can't quantify the difference, but > the lighter bike is a fine fun contrast to the others. you can drink > less beer, lose some weight...and until you actually do it, a > significantly lighter bike is a ball. > > not my normal conservative approach. in fact, way out there: > > https://picasaweb.google.com/107231724174916923201/CronusWheels# > > On Mar 17, 8:16 pm, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > > Oh good, another controversy to jump into. Herewith: > > > > 1. I imagine that "heavy" is said relative to rider weight, no? If a 17 > lb > > bike is light for me, it would be simply fragile for a 250 pounder. > > > > 2. Ditto for the bikes purpose: a fixie gofast has a different standard > than > > a touring or mountain bike. > > > > 3. The tolerable limits also have to do with one's preferences for owning > > fewer multipurpose or more single purpose bikes. > > > > Having disposed of that: > > > > For me, 170: gofast, certainly under 20 lb equipped. Mine is (ahem) 17 > 3/4 > > lb exactly. Nice commuter under 25 lb equipped but not laden. Mine is > > probably under 23 lb with rack but no bag. But when you get to errand > > beaters and tourer/offroad bikes, who is to say? I'd love a 20 lb ss > 29er, > > but I'd rather have my multipurpose Fargo, which is porcine at 33 lb, > than a > > single use, lightweight ss off road bike if I had to choose just one. My > > Motobecane is unweighed but, equipped and unladen, I'd guess it is at > least > > 28 lb despite the nicely light frame thanks to heavy wheels, non-SON20R > > dynohub, luggage and so forth. > > > > I did some windy hills this afternoon, about 17 or 18 miles (no computer! > So > > I can fudge!) on the gofast and let me tell you, climbing those hills, > > especially with SW 21 G 33 winds, is far easier when your bike is 10 lb > less > > (and of course the wheels are far, far lighter). > > > > OTOH, the porcine Motobecane and grossly obese Fargo are still fun to > ride > > -- funner than many a lighter bike I've ridden. I'd choose fun over light > > any day. (Still, how can I drop 10 lb from the Fargo.?) > > > > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 17, 2011 at 6:54 PM, MichaelH wrote: > > > OK, now that we have dispensed with helmets, allow me to raise another > > > controversial topic. > > > > > This is not like, when am I too heavy, which is easy right now. > > > > > I have 4 bikes, well 6 really, but we wont go into those details. All > > > four of them are around 62 cm and get ridden regularly - a 1988 > > > classic stage racing frame, weighing around 22 lbs; a Rambouillet, > > > outfitted with White/ Open Pro wheels, a White dbl crank, Honjo > > > fenders, a Mark's Rack, and light tires also weighing about 22 lbs.; > > > a 1984 Trek (Reynolds 531 standard gauge tubing) with Shimano 9 speed > > > cranks and shifters, SKS Fenders, Passella 32 mm T Guards and coming > > > in around 25 lbs; and An Ebisu All Purpose, with front and real steel > > > racks, steel fenders, MA 40 Rims, triple DaVinci Cranks, and 38 mm > > > Avocet Cross tires that weighs in at a hefty 30 lbs. > > > > > I live in Vermont, which has lots of rolling hills and some > > > significant climbs. Do you think the 5 lbs alone, between the Trek > > > and Ebisu is enough to effect the performance? What about the 3 lb > > > difference between the Rambouillet and the Trek? Or, are the > > > perceived differences imaginary? > > > > > michael > > > > > -- > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google > Groups > > > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > > > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com > . > > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.c
[RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
i own an all steel Gunnar Sport, a coupled Rambouillet, a custom Rex with all carbon fork. poundage on those goes from a low of about 21.5 up to 24. for fun, i just built up a carbon Fisher Cronus; all carbon. for the first time i paid attention to lower weight parts; carbon bars, carbon seatpost, and shimano RS 80 1600 gram wheels. with pedals and cages it weighs 17 lbs. that is nearly 5 less than the rest. i am old, sorta plumpish, but i ride quite a bit. i can't quantify the difference, but the lighter bike is a fine fun contrast to the others. you can drink less beer, lose some weight...and until you actually do it, a significantly lighter bike is a ball. not my normal conservative approach. in fact, way out there: https://picasaweb.google.com/107231724174916923201/CronusWheels# On Mar 17, 8:16 pm, PATRICK MOORE wrote: > Oh good, another controversy to jump into. Herewith: > > 1. I imagine that "heavy" is said relative to rider weight, no? If a 17 lb > bike is light for me, it would be simply fragile for a 250 pounder. > > 2. Ditto for the bikes purpose: a fixie gofast has a different standard than > a touring or mountain bike. > > 3. The tolerable limits also have to do with one's preferences for owning > fewer multipurpose or more single purpose bikes. > > Having disposed of that: > > For me, 170: gofast, certainly under 20 lb equipped. Mine is (ahem) 17 3/4 > lb exactly. Nice commuter under 25 lb equipped but not laden. Mine is > probably under 23 lb with rack but no bag. But when you get to errand > beaters and tourer/offroad bikes, who is to say? I'd love a 20 lb ss 29er, > but I'd rather have my multipurpose Fargo, which is porcine at 33 lb, than a > single use, lightweight ss off road bike if I had to choose just one. My > Motobecane is unweighed but, equipped and unladen, I'd guess it is at least > 28 lb despite the nicely light frame thanks to heavy wheels, non-SON20R > dynohub, luggage and so forth. > > I did some windy hills this afternoon, about 17 or 18 miles (no computer! So > I can fudge!) on the gofast and let me tell you, climbing those hills, > especially with SW 21 G 33 winds, is far easier when your bike is 10 lb less > (and of course the wheels are far, far lighter). > > OTOH, the porcine Motobecane and grossly obese Fargo are still fun to ride > -- funner than many a lighter bike I've ridden. I'd choose fun over light > any day. (Still, how can I drop 10 lb from the Fargo.?) > > > > > > On Thu, Mar 17, 2011 at 6:54 PM, MichaelH wrote: > > OK, now that we have dispensed with helmets, allow me to raise another > > controversial topic. > > > This is not like, when am I too heavy, which is easy right now. > > > I have 4 bikes, well 6 really, but we wont go into those details. All > > four of them are around 62 cm and get ridden regularly - a 1988 > > classic stage racing frame, weighing around 22 lbs; a Rambouillet, > > outfitted with White/ Open Pro wheels, a White dbl crank, Honjo > > fenders, a Mark's Rack, and light tires also weighing about 22 lbs.; > > a 1984 Trek (Reynolds 531 standard gauge tubing) with Shimano 9 speed > > cranks and shifters, SKS Fenders, Passella 32 mm T Guards and coming > > in around 25 lbs; and An Ebisu All Purpose, with front and real steel > > racks, steel fenders, MA 40 Rims, triple DaVinci Cranks, and 38 mm > > Avocet Cross tires that weighs in at a hefty 30 lbs. > > > I live in Vermont, which has lots of rolling hills and some > > significant climbs. Do you think the 5 lbs alone, between the Trek > > and Ebisu is enough to effect the performance? What about the 3 lb > > difference between the Rambouillet and the Trek? Or, are the > > perceived differences imaginary? > > > michael > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > > For more options, visit this group at > >http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > > -- > Patrick Moore > Albuquerque, NM > For professional resumes, contact > Patrick Moore, ACRW at patrickmo...@resumespecialties.com- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
to me each bike has a purpose... my new rando/fast bike is for pavement primarily and is the lightest. The Ram shod with Jack Browns is for mixed terrain rides with beefy rims it handles rough double track with aplomb. My '82 Claud Butler is a touring bike, racks, 531st tubing and soon 650B wheels. I don't worry about weight, I don't even know what they weigh. I pick the right bike for the right ride and go... and think damn... aren't we lucky to have these wonderful rides! ~Mike On Mar 17, 7:49 pm, doug peterson wrote: > There's more to it than just gross tonnage. My wife has 2 bikes that > weigh within a water bottle of each other. She claims the Atlantis > feels much lighter, and she climbs noticebly faster on it. I'm happy > to encourage that sort of thinking. > > My bike usually weighs around 30 lbs with Nitto big back rack, small > front rack, and Acorn Boxy Rando bag mostly empty. Strong wheels & > nice cushy 35 mm tires seem a small performance loss to give up for > reliability & comfort. > > dougP > > On Mar 17, 5:54 pm, MichaelH wrote: > > > > > OK, now that we have dispensed with helmets, allow me to raise another > > controversial topic. > > > This is not like, when am I too heavy, which is easy right now. > > > I have 4 bikes, well 6 really, but we wont go into those details. All > > four of them are around 62 cm and get ridden regularly - a 1988 > > classic stage racing frame, weighing around 22 lbs; a Rambouillet, > > outfitted with White/ Open Pro wheels, a White dbl crank, Honjo > > fenders, a Mark's Rack, and light tires also weighing about 22 lbs.; > > a 1984 Trek (Reynolds 531 standard gauge tubing) with Shimano 9 speed > > cranks and shifters, SKS Fenders, Passella 32 mm T Guards and coming > > in around 25 lbs; and An Ebisu All Purpose, with front and real steel > > racks, steel fenders, MA 40 Rims, triple DaVinci Cranks, and 38 mm > > Avocet Cross tires that weighs in at a hefty 30 lbs. > > > I live in Vermont, which has lots of rolling hills and some > > significant climbs. Do you think the 5 lbs alone, between the Trek > > and Ebisu is enough to effect the performance? What about the 3 lb > > difference between the Rambouillet and the Trek? Or, are the > > perceived differences imaginary? > > > michael- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
On Mar 17, 7:49 pm, doug peterson wrote: > There's more to it than just gross tonnage. My wife has 2 bikes that > weigh within a water bottle of each other. She claims the Atlantis > feels much lighter, and she climbs noticebly faster on it. I'm happy > to encourage that sort of thinking. > > My bike usually weighs around 30 lbs with Nitto big back rack, small > front rack, and Acorn Boxy Rando bag mostly empty. Strong wheels & > nice cushy 35 mm tires seem a small performance loss to give up for > reliability & comfort. > > dougP > > On Mar 17, 5:54 pm, MichaelH wrote: > > > > > OK, now that we have dispensed with helmets, allow me to raise another > > controversial topic. > > > This is not like, when am I too heavy, which is easy right now. > > > I have 4 bikes, well 6 really, but we wont go into those details. All > > four of them are around 62 cm and get ridden regularly - a 1988 > > classic stage racing frame, weighing around 22 lbs; a Rambouillet, > > outfitted with White/ Open Pro wheels, a White dbl crank, Honjo > > fenders, a Mark's Rack, and light tires also weighing about 22 lbs.; > > a 1984 Trek (Reynolds 531 standard gauge tubing) with Shimano 9 speed > > cranks and shifters, SKS Fenders, Passella 32 mm T Guards and coming > > in around 25 lbs; and An Ebisu All Purpose, with front and real steel > > racks, steel fenders, MA 40 Rims, triple DaVinci Cranks, and 38 mm > > Avocet Cross tires that weighs in at a hefty 30 lbs. > > > I live in Vermont, which has lots of rolling hills and some > > significant climbs. Do you think the 5 lbs alone, between the Trek > > and Ebisu is enough to effect the performance? What about the 3 lb > > difference between the Rambouillet and the Trek? Or, are the > > perceived differences imaginary? > > > michael- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
There's more to it than just gross tonnage. My wife has 2 bikes that weigh within a water bottle of each other. She claims the Atlantis feels much lighter, and she climbs noticebly faster on it. I'm happy to encourage that sort of thinking. My bike usually weighs around 30 lbs with Nitto big back rack, small front rack, and Acorn Boxy Rando bag mostly empty. Strong wheels & nice cushy 35 mm tires seem a small performance loss to give up for reliability & comfort. dougP On Mar 17, 5:54 pm, MichaelH wrote: > OK, now that we have dispensed with helmets, allow me to raise another > controversial topic. > > This is not like, when am I too heavy, which is easy right now. > > I have 4 bikes, well 6 really, but we wont go into those details. All > four of them are around 62 cm and get ridden regularly - a 1988 > classic stage racing frame, weighing around 22 lbs; a Rambouillet, > outfitted with White/ Open Pro wheels, a White dbl crank, Honjo > fenders, a Mark's Rack, and light tires also weighing about 22 lbs.; > a 1984 Trek (Reynolds 531 standard gauge tubing) with Shimano 9 speed > cranks and shifters, SKS Fenders, Passella 32 mm T Guards and coming > in around 25 lbs; and An Ebisu All Purpose, with front and real steel > racks, steel fenders, MA 40 Rims, triple DaVinci Cranks, and 38 mm > Avocet Cross tires that weighs in at a hefty 30 lbs. > > I live in Vermont, which has lots of rolling hills and some > significant climbs. Do you think the 5 lbs alone, between the Trek > and Ebisu is enough to effect the performance? What about the 3 lb > difference between the Rambouillet and the Trek? Or, are the > perceived differences imaginary? > > michael -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
Man...you guys are all riding bicycles that are too lightweight. My main ride is about 30 pounds with empty bottles and no rack or bag but I do have fenders and lights! Of course when I ride I take along extra food and clothing, camera, extra glasses, nearly everything I think I might need which probably makes the thing weigh 40 pounds. I could care less though as I tip the scales at 275 right now and am no "mountain goat" but I do use mountain bike gearing. I think for a real racer bike weight is similar to fat weight or even too much upper body muscle..you'll never be competitive if you are outside the norms of "that group" whichever "that group" is that you ride with. I feel really fast riding with my wife but massively slow riding with a 25 year old competitive racing cyclist. Light bikes are cool but not if when riding them you bend them until they break like a piece of spaghetti. On Mar 17, 7:19 pm, Curtis Schmitt wrote: > My Seven Alaris is 18 lbs and my Romulus is 27 lbs. I notice a huge > difference, but not just in the weight. On Seven's customization > scale, it's a 10 on "drive chain rigidity" and "weight to performance" > so the frame is significantly heavier than a standard quality titanium > frame. It's also a model down from the Axiom so the tubes are straight > gauge making it heavier all things being equal. But it's perfect for > me as I'm 190 lbs and not very light on my bikes. > > My favorite quality is that it has almost the rigidity and > acceleration of a track bike so I can mash on it with no worries, and > it is also unfairly comfortable (somehow, have no idea why) on the > distance rides — did a 200K on it last year with no pain — and it's > just more fun to ride fast than the Romulus. However, it's much more > of a pain to commute with than the Romulus and of course I can't put > racks and panniers on the Seven. There's also that steel "feel" which > is no worse or better than ti, but is so familiar to me I appreciate > just being on it. Not to mention the paint. I love Riv paint. And it > gets all of the compliments. The Seven doesn't get any from > non-cyclists. > > It's also about where the weight is of course, the stuff you have to > move around like tires (which I notice more than anything), wheels > (rims), cranks, pedals, shoes, etc. I think it's why I tinker so > uncontrollably. > > Curtis > > > > On Thu, Mar 17, 2011 at 9:48 PM, Bruce wrote: > > My bikes range from 23.5 to 29 lbs (as built up with everything attached but > > no bottles and empty bags.) The difference in weight isn't a material factor > > in my avg pace over the same course. I do use the bikes for different routes > > though. The bike which feels fastest is not the lightest, either. > > > Let me put it this way. If you lost 5 lbs, how would that effect your > > performance? > > > > > From: MichaelH > > To: RBW Owners Bunch > > Sent: Thu, March 17, 2011 7:54:52 PM > > Subject: [RBW] When is a bike to heavy? > > > Do you think the 5 lbs alone, between the Trek > > and Ebisu is enough to effect the performance? What about the 3 lb > > difference between the Rambouillet and the Trek? Or, are the > > perceived differences imaginary? > > > michael > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > > For more options, visit this group at > >http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > > > -- > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > > To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. > > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to > > rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > > For more options, visit this group at > >http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. > > -- > Curtis R Schmitt > 646.481.2625 -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: When is a bike to heavy?
With that kind of stable, I'd just be happy that I owned some very nice bikes. The Ebisu All Purpose, in particular, looks like a superb bike. I don't think weight is really that relevant for much of the riding that is done by recreational cyclists (as opposed to the racing weight wennies...). That's just my opinion, of course. Jim Cloud Tucson, AZ On Mar 17, 5:54 pm, MichaelH wrote: > OK, now that we have dispensed with helmets, allow me to raise another > controversial topic. > > This is not like, when am I too heavy, which is easy right now. > > I have 4 bikes, well 6 really, but we wont go into those details. All > four of them are around 62 cm and get ridden regularly - a 1988 > classic stage racing frame, weighing around 22 lbs; a Rambouillet, > outfitted with White/ Open Pro wheels, a White dbl crank, Honjo > fenders, a Mark's Rack, and light tires also weighing about 22 lbs.; > a 1984 Trek (Reynolds 531 standard gauge tubing) with Shimano 9 speed > cranks and shifters, SKS Fenders, Passella 32 mm T Guards and coming > in around 25 lbs; and An Ebisu All Purpose, with front and real steel > racks, steel fenders, MA 40 Rims, triple DaVinci Cranks, and 38 mm > Avocet Cross tires that weighs in at a hefty 30 lbs. > > I live in Vermont, which has lots of rolling hills and some > significant climbs. Do you think the 5 lbs alone, between the Trek > and Ebisu is enough to effect the performance? What about the 3 lb > difference between the Rambouillet and the Trek? Or, are the > perceived differences imaginary? > > michael -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
