Re: insight/herx
Cathryn-- Your possible Lyme could be mycoplasma fermentens. See www.immed.org. Get testeg!God, Gold, and Guns made America great! Jolly -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: insight/herx
Joyce wrote: Can anyone tell me what herx is? Maybe I can help. I recovered from a few degenerative diseases, and know a little about nutrition. You've gotten the concise answer from Brooks. Here's the verbose response: Subject: What is a Herx? Answer... Date sent:Sun, 19 Apr 1998 14:31:25 -5 I'm not as much of an expert as any of our Lyme sufferers, but I've heard them explain it often. The Jarisch-Herxheimer reaction is named for the scientists who identified the condition. It came out of research into the treatment of Syphilis, which is the archtypical spirochete disease. It is caused by a sudden die-off of microbes as a result of treatment. The dead beasties dump their toxins and metabolites into your system all at once and it takes a while for your liver to filter out the poisons. You then suffer an apparent worsening of symptoms, or additional symptoms entirely the result of the reaction. A major herx, paradoxically, is a sign of hope and improvement for the lyme sufferer, as it means the treatment is actually getting to the damn bugs. Given many of these folks' difficulty in getting proper diagonsis and effective treatment, they're usually grateful to finally see something, anything, happen. The downside is that a sudden massive herx can be very stressful and even fatal. We're talking the potential for toxic shock. Somebody who's already sick and immune compromised, maybe having more than one infection, could get knocked on their butt in a hurry with too big an initial dose of colloidal silver. Severe Herx's can feature sudden fever, vomiting, diarrhea, fainting or dizziness (from low blood pressure), and skin rash. Like other kinds of shock, it may require urgent treatment if blood pressure drops too low. A mild herx, while uncomfortable, does not *require* treatment and will run its course by itself. In the Lyme treatment protocol on one of Advantage Pharmaceutical's web pages, you'll notice the emphasis on starting slowly, and gradually increasing the dose based on symptoms. This minimises the risk of triggering a massive Herx. The URL is: http://www.xpressnet.com/bhealthy/bodywght.html Don't interpret anything I say here as medical advice. I'm just repeating what I've found and read elsewhere and may have it all wrong. Be well, Mike D. [Mike Devour, Citizen, Patriot, Libertarian] [mdev...@mail.id.net ] [Speaking only for myself... ] -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: insight/herx
Can anyone tell me what herx is? Maybe I can help. I recovered from a few degenerative diseases, and know a little about nutrition. :) Joyce Inouye jinou...@hills.ccsf.cc.ca.us On Wed, 29 Apr 1998, Donna wrote: Donna, My herx is back and is worse than ever. The last 2 evenings the pain has been extreme. Do the herx return because of the life cycle of the bugs? I will try to increase the strength of the CS through some of your suggestions.How long to do you cook the CS and how much do your cook at one time? Cathryn Cathryn, The pain and the herx seem to occur every time there is a build up of toxins in the system. I also have mine back but it is not as bad as the first extreme one. I am hoping it won't get much worse. Hang in there, I know it is hard to believe that this is a good thing that you feel so bad. Remember the CS can reach into place the anitbiotics can't, at least so it seems, I am not a doc. If you are in pain now wait alittle while to increase, try to do it around every two weeks. As for how long I cook it, I start with about 3 cups and it usually runs about 2 1/2 to 3 hours. I have been using the TDS-1 to watch the ppm reading so I can keep it pretty consistent. If Candace reads this she can tell you herself how bad her herx was. I think she has been off of CS now for quite a few months and can truly say that her lyme is gone. Let's hope that is us soon. What type of pain are you having? Right now I am having stabbing pains in the arms and legs, a bit tired, and alittle moody. Donna -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: insight/herx/Reid
Reid Smith wrote: In the past when my nurves get to twitching real bad I've taken pills to make me sleep for 24-48 hours. That takes care of the problem for a few days. Take Care Reid Yes Reid, it sounds like that would. Sorry if I sound a like little smart ass, I just got off of the Clinton whitewater newsgroup. That is a war zone. -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: insight/herx/Reid
Donna I hate to be the barrer of bad tidings but the twitches are caused by the nurves short circuiting and it takes one year for a nurve to heal. The twitching subsiding is good but don't expect it to quit real soon. Reid, Thanks for that info. That is good news to know. Compared to what it was in the beginning it is very weak now so maybe that is one symptom I can chalk up the saying that time heals all?? Donna Earnest Something that I forgot to mention is alot of sleep helps the healing along alot faster. The nurves are kind of like a wire with insulation that is brittle. The more you move them the more that they are going to short circuit and the longer time it's going to take them to heal. In the past when my nurves get to twitching real bad I've taken pills to make me sleep for 24-48 hours. That takes care of the problem for a few days. Take Care Reid -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: insight/herx
Whitney some more, Susan I feel really bad to keep hearing this. This is what I do for Herx whixh I nearly killed myself with once. I use: Digestive enzymes on an empty stomack--they go through the body and eat up trash like toxins and immune complexes--this is well documented now. I have done this for ten years--that's how many times I have had herx for Candida and whatever else. I take Mega Zyme by Enzymatic Therapy and 5 at once then 20-30 mins later 5 more. This WILL diminish your muscle pain and the twitching. You can continue until relieved, or sick to your stomach. The enzymes have worked as well or better than morphine. Molybdenum--250mcgms once to start aned then again amazing results alacer Emergen-C 2000mgms of vit C minerals stir into liquid fizzes, contiunue with the above upto whatever you can tolerate. Water in massive amounts. Soda water--Club soda read the label some have bicarbonate of soda in them and are great over ice when you are feeling so bad. COQ10 100 mgms 2-3X pewr day. Grape seed extract--the capsule 100mgms 2-3-4 times a day, or 2 at once with the enzymes for pain. You can also add the COQ 10 with it and it all workd together. Other antioxidants as you feel able or have on hand. You are probably saying right!? I'm so sick I can't even see and this woman is telling me to do all this stuff or even get it. Get someone to help you. OR When you are feeling better get these things and keep them on hand so that you won't be with out. when you are sick. I live alone so I have to be prepared especially when I know the results of what I am doing are more than likely going to cause me to herx!! You can take bicarbonate of soda now if you have some in a glass of water to help alkalinate the reaction. When you Herx you become more acid due to lots of factors not only just the toxins in your system. Your body is also producing catecholamines as a result of the insult these lead to inflammation of everything that can become inflamed. The problem here is that not properly taken care of this can become a cycle in itself. The enzymes will reduce the catecxholamines also. Hope this helps and your suffering eases soon. Life is Fragile. Handle with Prayer Susan -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: insight/herx
I don't know what the cause of the original poster's twitches were, but sometimes the twitches can be from a lack of calcium and magnesium. This works wonders for some people. It can even help some people with restless legs. Worked for me. I've tryed both with no luck in the past. Take Care Reid -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
insight/herx
Just checking, Donna: You're taking similar size doses now but of the higher ppm CS? Did you ever determine if you had taken large enough doses of the 7 ppm stuff it might have worked just as well? It is one school of thought that large enough quantities of even 3-5 ppm CS will do as much good as higher ppm, and be easier to make to boot. That's why we have kidneys, doncha know! g If your experience differs it would be good to analyze why. Be well, Mike D. [Mike Devour, Citizen, Patriot, Libertarian] [mdev...@mail.id.net Mike, I did continue to take the same amount of the higher ppm. I would have to take alot of the lower dose ppm to make up the difference. I would probably spend my entire time making CS as to the fact I am not the only one that takes it here. That would be a good thing to find out though. Donna ] -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: insight/herx
Susan, I was told that it is counter productive to the medication I am taking. In other words if the medication is meant to slow down my heart rate and open up the blood vessels, the antiocident would do the opposite. Specifically they mentioned the Coq10, Ghinko, and a couple others. I'm really not sure aabout the paarticulars. Anything about the MSM I mentioned? Thanks, Nick -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: insight/herx
Susan, Thanks for the information. If you do get that article back, I would love a copy of it. Thanks again. Vern -Original Message- From: Susan M. Yensen syen...@clearwater.net To: silver-list@eskimo.com silver-list@eskimo.com Date: Thursday, April 30, 1998 2:10 AM Subject: Re: insight/herx Susan, Tell me some more about these digestive enzymes that you take. I haven't seen a thing about them cleaning out toxins and such and would be interested to read anything that you could direct me toward. Are they Papaya, Bromelain, and the like? I didn't quite follow the part about the candida infections. Does the enzyme combat candida infection? I have a friend that has a systemic candida infection and he can't seem to beat it. I would appreciate any info that you could provide. Vern Vern, I had the article and sent it with a friend so she would understand what I am saying to her. It has a good bibliogralphy for you. I will see if I can get it back from her and post it for you. Megazymes by Enzymatic tharapy are good for me b/c I can tolerate them whereas others I cannot that is why I say this brand. It is Pancreatic enzymes (10X) 325 mg (full strength undiluted and uncut) Units of activity* Protease 96,580 Amylase 98,780 Lip[ase 24,496 Trypsin75 mg papain 50mg bromelain (1.200 M.C.U.) 50 mg amylase 10 mg lipase 10 mg lysozyme 100 mg chymotrypsin 2mg About Candida, you can eradicate it with CS done slowly and carefully according to your health state. WHen a single celled organism, or parasite or the spirochete of which we read so much dies, it's death releases a toxin that was inside the organism heretofor. So when [people get treated for Candida and are not properlu educated about the Jarisch Herxheiomer reaction--the body'e reaction to the toxin released at the death of the organism, oftentimes they feel worse and stop taking the medication and may say they are allergic or whatever b/c we don't get the same thing painfiul reactions with antibiotic therapy for common micro organisms. As a matter of fact many doctors don't understand this. Funguses are very different creatures docs in 3rd world countries are the best at recognizing these things and treating them. Although we are catching up. Funguses have the ability to change forms according to their replication cycle and unless you are in this cycle they will not be found in the blood, they can be budding yeast which looks like cottage cheese or mycelia which can travel from organ to organ with out the use of the vascular system. When you are in this replication cycle you feel worse and crave sweets or fermented things. The yeast need more carbohydrate to live. Yeast Canndida and monilia are basically the same for the purpose of this post. What the enzyme does ON AN EMPTY STOMACH is get readily absorbed into the bloodstream and eat up 'the toxins released by the dying fungi or spirochete. It is a good add on for treatment of Candida but will not kill candida. It will alleviate the pain as do the other things I delineated in a previous post. Now, the article had several subtitles and said in effect that in studies done--double blind no less that it has been found that they relieve the pain of inflammation better that then ensaids so commonly prescribed which are poison to me. They also discovered a use for these in autoimmune disease like MS and so forth is that they discovereed that the enzymes will also eliminate circulating immune complexes. this is important for peopole like me for instance b/c the immune complexes I have are anti myelin ones and attack the lining of the nerves and it is painful process. Also good in allergies for precisely the same thing they will digest allergens, reduce swelling (anti inflammation effect) tThe anti inflammation effect is accomplished as the enzymes soften and digest the fibrin and other substance and catecholamines in the infalammatory reaction, including arachidonic acid which is the culprit that causes pain. So It may be a while before I can get that bibliography up b/c I can't leave the mountain just now and I will have to get her to bring it to me. These also aid in digestion taken with food. Many people have malabsorption problems once things are set into motion of being a disease that is multi organ. Leaky gut syndrome needs to be addresed in you rfriend proabably after a long siege of intractable Candida. There is a special diet for that too. It is an ordeal but it can be done. Hope this answers your question for now. Life is Fragile. Handle with Prayer Susan -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net -- The silver-list
Re: insight/herx/pools?
On 30 Apr 98 at 17:13, Deb wrote: My husband's friend is into the Y2K thing and so now my husband is finally ready to get me the CS maker for that. That's *great* news! Er, Ah, about the CS maker that is! Not the y2k thing. G Also, I remember reading that one can keep ones pool clean with CS, does anyone know how this is done??? We are not up and running yet this year and I would like to do the switch if it is at all feasible Pool water treatment is actually one of the uses of colloidal silver (and copper) that the skeptics and righteous debunkers out there will recognise as valid. I guess the pool chemical industry doesn't have as big a lobbying effort in Washington. g Silver sanitizes the water and copper kills the algae. Here's the URL of one company that makes metal ionizer type pool water treatment equipment: http://web.evcom.net/Zark/index.htm And more detailed (and very small type) explanations at: http://web.evcom.net/Zark/everi.htm No endorsement implied. It's just a site I found. I imagine a system like that would be lot's easier than making CS by the batch and dumping it in all the time. $500-600 (US) compared to how much in pool chemicals? How many years 'til payback? How much is your time and aggravation worth? Let us know if you decide to buy one! Sounds like a class way to go. Be well, Mike [Mike Devour, Citizen, Patriot, Libertarian] [mdev...@mail.id.net ] [Speaking only for myself... ] -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: insight/herx/pools?
M. G. Devour wrote: Hope you get better soon, Ma'am! Thanks Mike, very muchG. My husband's friend is into the Y2K thing and so now my husband is finally ready to get me the CS maker for that. I will be requiring your adviceG. Also, I remember reading that one can keep ones pool clean with CS, does anyone know how this is done??? We are not up and running yet this year and I would like to do the switch if it is at all feasible Deb Debbie McDonald mailto:lullw...@flash.net -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: insight/herx
Susan, One other question. Someone told me that the antioxidants may interfere with the hypertension medication I am taking. The CS is working. I'm having better days more often. Thanks for any info. Nick -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
Re: insight/herx
Thanks for the very informative post, Susan. (If this is too much off topic, you can privately email me. I've got some questions.) I've found great benefit in using Beano to eat various vegetables and beef fat (sorry, haven't given beef up yet!) I'm curious about other enzymes; my allergies are causing continual mild upset stomachs. It causes me to crave carbohydrates which is likely over feeding candida, contributing to more hunger... I think the CS is helping keep candida in check. Never the less, due to allergies, I wake up feeling famished and find myself munching on junk all day long. (Still no sinus infections despite a couple bad colds this year. CS has diverted them! I used to get SI 3 or a4 times a year!) Do you have any idea what's going on here if an enzyme supplement can help with that? Sincerely, Nancy -Original Message- From: Susan M. Yensen syen...@clearwater.net To: silver-list@eskimo.com silver-list@eskimo.com Date: Thursday, April 30, 1998 4:15 AM Subject: Re: insight/herx Susan, Tell me some more about these digestive enzymes that you take. I haven't seen a thing about them cleaning out toxins and such and would be interested to read anything that you could direct me toward. Are they Papaya, Bromelain, and the like? I didn't quite follow the part about the candida infections. Does the enzyme combat candida infection? I have a friend that has a systemic candida infection and he can't seem to beat it. I would appreciate any info that you could provide. Vern Vern, I had the article and sent it with a friend so she would understand what I am saying to her. It has a good bibliogralphy for you. I will see if I can get it back from her and post it for you. Megazymes by Enzymatic tharapy are good for me b/c I can tolerate them whereas others I cannot that is why I say this brand. It is Pancreatic enzymes (10X) 325 mg (full strength undiluted and uncut) Units of activity* Protease 96,580 Amylase 98,780 Lip[ase 24,496 Trypsin75 mg papain 50mg bromelain (1.200 M.C.U.) 50 mg amylase 10 mg lipase 10 mg lysozyme 100 mg chymotrypsin 2mg About Candida, you can eradicate it with CS done slowly and carefully according to your health state. WHen a single celled organism, or parasite or the spirochete of which we read so much dies, it's death releases a toxin that was inside the organism heretofor. So when [people get treated for Candida and are not properlu educated about the Jarisch Herxheiomer reaction--the body'e reaction to the toxin released at the death of the organism, oftentimes they feel worse and stop taking the medication and may say they are allergic or whatever b/c we don't get the same thing painfiul reactions with antibiotic therapy for common micro organisms. As a matter of fact many doctors don't understand this. Funguses are very different creatures docs in 3rd world countries are the best at recognizing these things and treating them. Although we are catching up. Funguses have the ability to change forms according to their replication cycle and unless you are in this cycle they will not be found in the blood, they can be budding yeast which looks like cottage cheese or mycelia which can travel from organ to organ with out the use of the vascular system. When you are in this replication cycle you feel worse and crave sweets or fermented things. The yeast need more carbohydrate to live. Yeast Canndida and monilia are basically the same for the purpose of this post. What the enzyme does ON AN EMPTY STOMACH is get readily absorbed into the bloodstream and eat up 'the toxins released by the dying fungi or spirochete. It is a good add on for treatment of Candida but will not kill candida. It will alleviate the pain as do the other things I delineated in a previous post. Now, the article had several subtitles and said in effect that in studies done--double blind no less that it has been found that they relieve the pain of inflammation better that then ensaids so commonly prescribed which are poison to me. They also discovered a use for these in autoimmune disease like MS and so forth is that they discovereed that the enzymes will also eliminate circulating immune complexes. this is important for peopole like me for instance b/c the immune complexes I have are anti myelin ones and attack the lining of the nerves and it is painful process. Also good in allergies for precisely the same thing they will digest allergens, reduce swelling (anti inflammation effect) tThe anti inflammation effect is accomplished as the enzymes soften and digest the fibrin and other substance and catecholamines in the infalammatory reaction, including arachidonic acid which is the culprit that causes pain. So It may be a while before I can get that bibliography up b/c I can't leave the mountain just now and I will have to get her to bring it to me. These also aid in digestion taken with food. Many people have malabsorption problems once things are set into motion
Re: insight/herx
On 30 Apr 98 at 14:13, Donna wrote: For quite a few months I was really discouraged because I was not getting anywhere and then I finally had it tested to find out it was only 7ppm. Now that I am taking the 30ppm there is a big difference. Just checking, Donna: You're taking similar size doses now but of the higher ppm CS? Did you ever determine if you had taken large enough doses of the 7 ppm stuff it might have worked just as well? It is one school of thought that large enough quantities of even 3-5 ppm CS will do as much good as higher ppm, and be easier to make to boot. That's why we have kidneys, doncha know! g If your experience differs it would be good to analyze why. Be well, Mike D. [Mike Devour, Citizen, Patriot, Libertarian] [mdev...@mail.id.net ] [Speaking only for myself... ] -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
insight/herx
Donna, My herx is back and is worse than ever. The last 2 evenings the pain has been extreme. Do the herx return because of the life cycle of the bugs? I will try to increase the strength of the CS through some of your suggestions.How long to do you cook the CS and how much do your cook at one time? Cathryn Cathryn, The pain and the herx seem to occur every time there is a build up of toxins in the system. I also have mine back but it is not as bad as the first extreme one. I am hoping it won't get much worse. Hang in there, I know it is hard to believe that this is a good thing that you feel so bad. Remember the CS can reach into place the anitbiotics can't, at least so it seems, I am not a doc. If you are in pain now wait alittle while to increase, try to do it around every two weeks. As for how long I cook it, I start with about 3 cups and it usually runs about 2 1/2 to 3 hours. I have been using the TDS-1 to watch the ppm reading so I can keep it pretty consistent. If Candace reads this she can tell you herself how bad her herx was. I think she has been off of CS now for quite a few months and can truly say that her lyme is gone. Let's hope that is us soon. What type of pain are you having? Right now I am having stabbing pains in the arms and legs, a bit tired, and alittle moody. Donna -- The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: silver-list-requ...@eskimo.com -or- silver-digest-requ...@eskimo.com with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the subject: line. To post, address your message to: silver-list@eskimo.com List maintainer: Mike Devour mdev...@id.net
