Re: [RCSE] OVSS...line break policy?
I like Barry's thinking. The majority of line breaks I have seen have been the equipments fault.Even in stiff wind #290 is very hard to break. It is not that difficult to watch a launch and determine if it is excessive line tension that breaks the line. Usually much after 60 degrees. After 60 degrees, a launch should be flown out. And if the "recovery" launch is more than 45 seconds after last launch a re-flight of the whole group ensues. Steve Meyer SOAR LSF IV At 07:58 PM 5/16/2005, Barry Andersen wrote: Most all the OVSS winches now use the 290# line. It is very hard to break. When out practicing, or playing, I haven't broken a line in a couple of years. I have broken lines at contests, including the NATS, I don't launch any differently there than normally, but the line at a contest is sometimes questionable, was crossed and dragged by the timer tapping down or a host of other mysteries that has caused it to be weak in just one small spot. While I guess it's possible that guys might try to purposely break a line, it seems a stretch to me (pun intended), moreover, if the line is good, it's hard or maybe not possible to break. When we stagger launches in seeded MOM, the high score is always launching first, the last guy always has a slight advantage, even then, lift is not often apparent right off launch. I suggest a time limit from first guy to last guy, maybe 2 minutes, but launch master uses his head If it's longer, you get bumped to the next round where it's tougher. If it's the last flight group, move fast. More than one break, everybody comes down. Seems like this is pretty much what we've been doing to date. It really sucks to be penalized for a line break, particularly when nearly every time, it's a weak line that causes the break. If someone has travelled a great distance to be essentially tossed out for a line break, it ain't so fun anymore. There's enough dumb things I can do to blow a contest, purposeful line breaks aren't in my bag of tricks to find the air. I don't believe that most pilots play that way; bad booga booga, not likely to really work, and might have the result Gordy got, and richly deserved, if he was really playing that way. We've done ok to date, seems to me. I agree that we don't want to regulate the fun out of contests, but if I break a line, I expect a way to get in the air to fly, that flight group or the next. Hey, the stakes are really high!! My .02 Barry On May 16, 2005, at 5:47 PM, pfsiegel wrote: I would like to throw this topic out to the soaring exchange to see if there is any consensus of opinion on policy concerning winch line breaks during launch, particularly during man on man competition. What would be a good standard policy for line breaks that could be universally adopted for a contest series like the OVSS? RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
Re: [RCSE] Receiver Malfunctions after Contact with Power Lines
Sound like StarWars started early out there and a phase pulse with resulting EMF wave fried the sensitive components. The Dark Side... At 11:02 PM 5/16/2005, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: My Ava encountered the power lines to the west side of our field on Sunday, resulting in an explosion, balls of fire travelling down the line for at least two power poles, and complete disintegration of the Ava. Tony Bermudez informed me tonight that two other pilots (Tony and Bill Knesek) experienced receiver malfunctions after the incident. Does anyone have knowledge of whether or how such a contact with power lines might generate interference which would cause a receiver some distance away to fail? Browne Goodwin
[RCSE] Receiver Malfunctions after Contact with Power Lines
My Ava encountered the power lines to the west side of our field on Sunday, resulting in an explosion, balls of fire travelling down the line for at least two power poles, and complete disintegration of the Ava. Tony Bermudez informed me tonight that two other pilots (Tony and Bill Knesek) experienced receiver malfunctions after the incident. Does anyone have knowledge of whether or how such a contact with power lines might generate interference which would cause a receiver some distance away to fail? Browne Goodwin
Re: [RCSE] OVSS...line break policy?
On Monday 16 May 2005 07:37 pm, you wrote: > I have gathered the data and present the followingFor what it's worth. > > Most contest start at 9:00 am (AT BEST) in an effort to increase readiness > and decrease line breaks Contestants should be allowed to register and > have a 3 min. MAX test flight; recorded on the score card less points. > (timer must retrieve the line during the flight..It takes about that > long to go get the chute an walk back) This flight would not be your god > given rightthe window would be open from 8:15 to 8:45 (sorry about your > luck 1st come 1st serve) > In lieu of this semi impractical thought given socialization the night > before and pressing the "VOLUNTEERS" we move on. Great suggestion for day one of "two day" contests for those road warriors who need to shake off the dust from a long drive in! I've always felt guilty asking for a trim flight but I guess that's the penalty for not being able to fly as often as I like, just a bit nervous on that first launch. > > Round one: Bring em all down > Two-final : I like Jims suggestion of reverse order with the broken line > moving up. > finals: (like a track meet) you get one free the other you fly out. bring > em down till we get a fair launch.(two breaks total for the contest) > Second this idea. > I have little pity for line breaks. This is a game/sport/event of assessing > conditions and abilities.One of the better lessons I got from my mentor and > bud Capt. Jack was a an afternoon where I pinched the tow ring between my > fingers and learned how to tap the pedal with out the ring being pull from > my fingers.A GRASSHOPPER > If you got the biggest plane the heaviest foot you better be ready to max > out from 75 ft.(it's all part of the game,how much ballast,wind) > > In (your) shorts.If you want to get the maxx launch bring your > BALLS to the line and blame no one but yourself when you gotta come fly > with me in the Fisher Price group. Sounds like a familiar group to me... . > > P.S. The BBQ for Nats looks better than ever. Got a new tent and screened in canopy..lets hope for warm, dry and no skeeters! (Yeah, right, it's the midwest, I forgot!) > RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Greening mounts for 368 needed
Looking for a pair of Greening mounts for a friend for JR 368 Craig must be away, haven't heard back for quite sometime. Anyone have a pair they can part with?? Barry RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
RE: [RCSE] OVSS and Line Breaks
Jeff brings up a good point about the line from MNT. Our experience is the same. Especially the last batch we got. It was pieced together and some of the line was terrible. The first contest we used it was awful, but after the breaks from the reload were done, the line lasts great. In the last 2 contests we had no line breaks. Moral of the story - use the line at least one contest prior to using it for a big event. Jim Jim Monaco In the ESL we noticed that new spools from Memphis twine had bad spots in it. After clearing the breaks, the lines rarely broke. We don't respool between contests any more, only when the line gets ragged. This is consistent with my experience with my own clubs and also retriever lines too. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
Re: [RCSE] OVSS...line break policy?
I like this idea a lot. It wont knock you out of the contest for more then one line break, but it will cost you something if it keeps happening. In addition, I like to reserve the weakest winches for the alternate re launches and usually don't bother using a battery charger on the back ups either. I will probably use these ideas for our Bob Steele Memorials "Sunday" events Lets see how it works. Mike Remus LOFT Glider Club Fort Wayne IN LSF Level 5 #112 Remember; Think small. Big ideas upset others! On Mon, 16 May 2005 18:09:13 -0500 "James V. Bacus" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: > At 04:47 PM 5/16/2005, pfsiegel wrote: > >What about a compromise to allow one line break per day, with the > >provision that in the opinion of the launch master that there has > not been > >an intentional attempt to break the line? > > > >Or??? > > Here's another compromise that I thought about at one time, but > never > posted. I may have talked to TK about it on one of our many car > trips to > or from an OVSS contest. (although I really hate mentioning this > stuff one > week before the series. Better off discussed post series, and > perhaps > limited to the OVSS yahoo group with the guys who fly the series.) > > Allow one line break a day. > > Additional line breaks in future rounds are allowed a re-launch, but > cost > you 30 seconds off the task time for the round. > > More than two line breaks in a flight group, the entire group has to > > relaunch, but those line breaks count and penalties are applied if > applicable for those pilots (i.e. it wasn't their first one). > > If a pilot breaks the line on the relaunch, the flight counts and > the 30 > second penalty is applied. > > Just a suggestion. > > > Jim > Downers Grove, IL > Member of the Chicago SOAR club, and Team JR > AMA 592537LSF 7560 Level IV R/C Soaring blog at > www.jimbacus.net RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
Re: [RCSE] OVSS...line break policy?
We have some very wise CD's in the OVSS, and I am not worried about this issue a bit. Which ever way we go, it is the same for everyone. Let's try to maximize the fun next weekend, I am really looking forward to flying with everybody. At 07:58 PM 5/16/2005, Barry Andersen wrote: Hey, the stakes are really high!! Jim Downers Grove, IL Member of the Chicago SOAR club, and Team JR AMA 592537LSF 7560 Level IV R/C Soaring blog at www.jimbacus.net RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
RE: [RCSE] OVSS and Line Breaks
Jeff I agree that limited power winches would be a great thing, but it is not practical for all club to get new winches. I don't understand why a week link slows down a contest. In theory the weak link is the part that breaks and almost all breaks will not be re-launched. When it is not the weak link the only fair thing to do is re-launch because the line was damaged in the first place and that is the cost of doing business. John -Original Message- From: Jeff Steifel [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 7:52 PM To: John Cc: RCSE Subject: Re: [RCSE] OVSS and Line Breaks I don't think a weak link works. You want to keep things moving a link only serves to slow things down. I think the FAI solution works great. Limit the power on the winches. The resistored winches cut the power down and then everyone is nearly identical in power. Now does this solve line breaks... somewhat... it certainly cuts it down a considerable amount if you lower the power and level the playing field. But breaks will still happen especially on windy days. In the ESL we noticed that new spools from Memphis twine had bad spots in it. After clearing the breaks, the lines rarely broke. We don't respool between contests any more, only when the line gets ragged. This is consistent with my experience with my own clubs and also retriever lines too. 3 years ago at the nats I hit the pedal and broke the line. before I got any tension. Fortunately I got another winch. But the no relaunch policy doesn't allow for bad retrieves, or a previous bad launch. What about someone who launches before you and pulls the knot to exterme. or stresses the ring. The no relaunch doesn't work. BUT neither does letting the person relaunch with all the markers in the air. Either let them launch again or relight the group. If you let them relight it must be point the plane to the ground and land... no dilly dallying anyone caught slowing up for a reading of air should forfeit their flight. John wrote: >Mark, > >Why not use a weak link of 225lb at the tow hook with 280-300 line on the >winch? If the line breaks the weak link then they fly. You would need to be >able to check the line quickly. That said. I feel that you are doing a great >job with the series and everyone knows the rules. Everyone launches under >the same rules. They can choose to stay home if they don't like the contest. >You can't factor out all circumstances of launch problems. It is a roll of >the dice. You pays you money and you takes you chances. > >John > >-Original Message- >From: Marc Gellart [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] >Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 6:04 PM >To: soaring@airage.com >Subject: [RCSE] OVSS and Line Breaks > >Jim, Paul, Jack,and Jim: >Great comments and you all have pretty much sited all the pros and cons >about what we face at each and every contest. From what i know every one of >the contests we will be flying 280 or 290 line this year that is having MOM >formats, I know STL relined this weekend and all the winches that are coming >are set up with the good stuff (actually one club event ona line I think >eliminates the splices and they are even better then). Like all have said, >that eliminates nearly all the issues right there. > But, still what do we do? I have had folks saying to me that I should >mandate line strength and such, I have taken the attitude in the past that >the clubs run their show and OVSS just uses the scores generated. I realize >that my free market approach appaers a bit loose, but I still feel that this >approach is best since as has been pointed out that conditions can vary as >well as equipment. I urge clubs in the direction that I feel is what the >customer wants, i.e. MVSA going MOM format this year with the heavier line >than they have ever used before, there was trepidation, but they will make >folks happy with the choice. >My answer to what I will do in STL since I am the CD there is to give >line breaks in the first round and to call down the entire flight group, but >after that the show is on and no more chances are available. That is my >answer, and it can be used as a template, but each club is on their own with >council from the wise among us. > My 2 cents on the subject... > >Marc >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and >"unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that >subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with >MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL >are generally NOT in text format > > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format > > > > > -- Jeff Steifel RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airp
Re: [RCSE] OVSS...line break policy?
Most all the OVSS winches now use the 290# line. It is very hard to break. When out practicing, or playing, I haven't broken a line in a couple of years. I have broken lines at contests, including the NATS, I don't launch any differently there than normally, but the line at a contest is sometimes questionable, was crossed and dragged by the timer tapping down or a host of other mysteries that has caused it to be weak in just one small spot. While I guess it's possible that guys might try to purposely break a line, it seems a stretch to me (pun intended), moreover, if the line is good, it's hard or maybe not possible to break. When we stagger launches in seeded MOM, the high score is always launching first, the last guy always has a slight advantage, even then, lift is not often apparent right off launch. I suggest a time limit from first guy to last guy, maybe 2 minutes, but launch master uses his head If it's longer, you get bumped to the next round where it's tougher. If it's the last flight group, move fast. More than one break, everybody comes down. Seems like this is pretty much what we've been doing to date. It really sucks to be penalized for a line break, particularly when nearly every time, it's a weak line that causes the break. If someone has travelled a great distance to be essentially tossed out for a line break, it ain't so fun anymore. There's enough dumb things I can do to blow a contest, purposeful line breaks aren't in my bag of tricks to find the air. I don't believe that most pilots play that way; bad booga booga, not likely to really work, and might have the result Gordy got, and richly deserved, if he was really playing that way. We've done ok to date, seems to me. I agree that we don't want to regulate the fun out of contests, but if I break a line, I expect a way to get in the air to fly, that flight group or the next. Hey, the stakes are really high!! My .02 Barry On May 16, 2005, at 5:47 PM, pfsiegel wrote: I would like to throw this topic out to the soaring exchange to see if there is any consensus of opinion on policy concerning winch line breaks during launch, particularly during man on man competition. What would be a good standard policy for line breaks that could be universally adopted for a contest series like the OVSS? Let's assume that there is an extra winch that is available for relaunch if a line break occurs. If during launch there is a line break during a mass launch or even during a slightly staggered launch, then an unfair advantage can be gained by the pilot who experienced the line break. Before any subsequent relaunch from the extra winch during the same round, the delay in that relaunch could allow the pilot to observe the scatter of sailplanes already launched for any obvious areas of lift. The obvious solution is to NOT allow any relaunch after a line break. This solution certainly discourages intentional line breakage by a pilot who is not happy with his launch or who just wants to be the last pilot to launch. However, there is very real possibility that the line may have been weakened by a previous line cross during launch phase or even when the timer was "tapping down" the chute after a previous launch. In this instance, the pilot who suffered the line break would be unfairly penalized for a problem that he was not responsible for. This hardly seems fair, particularly for an unfortunate pilot who may have traveled a fair distance to compete over a full weekend of flying. For better or worse, this no relaunch rule also discriminates against larger, heavier sailplanes. One possible solution might be to automatically bump the pilot to the next flight group. But what if this happens in the last flight group for the round? Or, what if more than one line break happens in the same flight group and there is only one extra winch? Maybe a quick retrieve of an already been launched winch for the relaunch? Should there be a time limit for when the relaunch must happen? What would that time be? Or should this be at the discretion of the launch master? It sure slows down a contest to have everyone land for a mass relaunch which makes that an unpopular solution. What about a compromise to allow one line break per day, with the provision that in the opinion of the launch master that there has not been an intentional attempt to break the line? Or??? RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIM
Re: [RCSE] OVSS and Line Breaks
I don't think a weak link works. You want to keep things moving a link only serves to slow things down. I think the FAI solution works great. Limit the power on the winches. The resistored winches cut the power down and then everyone is nearly identical in power. Now does this solve line breaks... somewhat... it certainly cuts it down a considerable amount if you lower the power and level the playing field. But breaks will still happen especially on windy days. In the ESL we noticed that new spools from Memphis twine had bad spots in it. After clearing the breaks, the lines rarely broke. We don't respool between contests any more, only when the line gets ragged. This is consistent with my experience with my own clubs and also retriever lines too. 3 years ago at the nats I hit the pedal and broke the line. before I got any tension. Fortunately I got another winch. But the no relaunch policy doesn't allow for bad retrieves, or a previous bad launch. What about someone who launches before you and pulls the knot to exterme. or stresses the ring. The no relaunch doesn't work. BUT neither does letting the person relaunch with all the markers in the air. Either let them launch again or relight the group. If you let them relight it must be point the plane to the ground and land... no dilly dallying anyone caught slowing up for a reading of air should forfeit their flight. John wrote: Mark, Why not use a weak link of 225lb at the tow hook with 280-300 line on the winch? If the line breaks the weak link then they fly. You would need to be able to check the line quickly. That said. I feel that you are doing a great job with the series and everyone knows the rules. Everyone launches under the same rules. They can choose to stay home if they don't like the contest. You can't factor out all circumstances of launch problems. It is a roll of the dice. You pays you money and you takes you chances. John -Original Message- From: Marc Gellart [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 6:04 PM To: soaring@airage.com Subject: [RCSE] OVSS and Line Breaks Jim, Paul, Jack,and Jim: Great comments and you all have pretty much sited all the pros and cons about what we face at each and every contest. From what i know every one of the contests we will be flying 280 or 290 line this year that is having MOM formats, I know STL relined this weekend and all the winches that are coming are set up with the good stuff (actually one club event ona line I think eliminates the splices and they are even better then). Like all have said, that eliminates nearly all the issues right there. But, still what do we do? I have had folks saying to me that I should mandate line strength and such, I have taken the attitude in the past that the clubs run their show and OVSS just uses the scores generated. I realize that my free market approach appaers a bit loose, but I still feel that this approach is best since as has been pointed out that conditions can vary as well as equipment. I urge clubs in the direction that I feel is what the customer wants, i.e. MVSA going MOM format this year with the heavier line than they have ever used before, there was trepidation, but they will make folks happy with the choice. My answer to what I will do in STL since I am the CD there is to give line breaks in the first round and to call down the entire flight group, but after that the show is on and no more chances are available. That is my answer, and it can be used as a template, but each club is on their own with council from the wise among us. My 2 cents on the subject... Marc RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format -- Jeff Steifel RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Wax those screws
I bought a used extreme the other day. I noticed I had the problem with the wing bolts starting to form that we discussed on the forum the other day. , I originally hit them with oil ... but today I thought about it and decided to use wax instead. In biking the best chain lube is not a spray on it is a hot wax dip. Why? because it doesn't fling off AND it doesn't attract dirt. I drop my screws at least twice a season. I wouldn't want to deal with cleaning the dirt off. With wax it is less likely to collect dirt. Just take a candle and rub the screw threads on the wax and install. The wax will lubricate the threads and you won't have the wet screws to deal with. The wax is good for installing servo screws too. I made new reinforcement plates for the servos and drilled the screw holes a little undersized. I lubed the screws with wax to drive them in. They go in much easier. This HOT tip of the day brought to you by the makers of candles everywhere... 8>) -- Jeff Steifel RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
Re: [RCSE] Vision Transmitter
I have a couple of students who would be very interested in any NIB Visons that may be kicking around out there. Unlikey, but who knows. Anyone? Quoting Bill Swingle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > Wow, a vision in good shape for 150$. > > The vision used to command ~250$. Now they're down to 150$. Well, I guess > nothing is forever. > > Bill Swingle > > > > RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and > "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that > subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME > turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are > generally NOT in text format > Simon Van Leeuwen PnP Systems - The E-Harness of Choice Radius Systems Cogito Ergo Zoom RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
RE: [RCSE] OVSS and Line Breaks
Mark, Why not use a weak link of 225lb at the tow hook with 280-300 line on the winch? If the line breaks the weak link then they fly. You would need to be able to check the line quickly. That said. I feel that you are doing a great job with the series and everyone knows the rules. Everyone launches under the same rules. They can choose to stay home if they don't like the contest. You can't factor out all circumstances of launch problems. It is a roll of the dice. You pays you money and you takes you chances. John -Original Message- From: Marc Gellart [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 6:04 PM To: soaring@airage.com Subject: [RCSE] OVSS and Line Breaks Jim, Paul, Jack,and Jim: Great comments and you all have pretty much sited all the pros and cons about what we face at each and every contest. From what i know every one of the contests we will be flying 280 or 290 line this year that is having MOM formats, I know STL relined this weekend and all the winches that are coming are set up with the good stuff (actually one club event ona line I think eliminates the splices and they are even better then). Like all have said, that eliminates nearly all the issues right there. But, still what do we do? I have had folks saying to me that I should mandate line strength and such, I have taken the attitude in the past that the clubs run their show and OVSS just uses the scores generated. I realize that my free market approach appaers a bit loose, but I still feel that this approach is best since as has been pointed out that conditions can vary as well as equipment. I urge clubs in the direction that I feel is what the customer wants, i.e. MVSA going MOM format this year with the heavier line than they have ever used before, there was trepidation, but they will make folks happy with the choice. My answer to what I will do in STL since I am the CD there is to give line breaks in the first round and to call down the entire flight group, but after that the show is on and no more chances are available. That is my answer, and it can be used as a template, but each club is on their own with council from the wise among us. My 2 cents on the subject... Marc RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] For Sale: Hacker Motor & Batteries or how to power an AVA-E
FOR SALE 2 Zapped, Kapton-wrapped 12-cell Sanyo CP1700SCR NiCd packs. Less than 1 year old, originally paid $84/pack. Selling for $60/pack. See http://www.rcsoaring.com/forsale/battery.jpg Hacker B50 LMR Carbon (7-10 cells) w/6.7:1 gear box and Hacker Master 125 O F5F controller (6-16 cells, 2-5 LiPo, 5-24V). Paid $568, selling for $450. See http://www.rcsoaring.com/forsale/motor.jpg Includes shipping to CONUS. This setup will take an AVA-E (at ~60oz) vertical at ~4,000ft/min. Please contact me if you have any questions: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thanks, Joe RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] test
. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
Re: [RCSE] OVSS...line break policy?
I have gathered the data and present the followingFor what it's worth. Most contest start at 9:00 am (AT BEST) in an effort to increase readiness and decrease line breaks Contestants should be allowed to register and have a 3 min. MAX test flight; recorded on the score card less points. (timer must retrieve the line during the flight..It takes about that long to go get the chute an walk back) This flight would not be your god given rightthe window would be open from 8:15 to 8:45 (sorry about your luck 1st come 1st serve) In lieu of this semi impractical thought given socialization the night before and pressing the "VOLUNTEERS" we move on. Round one: Bring em all down Two-final : I like Jims suggestion of reverse order with the broken line moving up. finals: (like a track meet) you get one free the other you fly out. bring em down till we get a fair launch.(two breaks total for the contest) I have little pity for line breaks. This is a game/sport/event of assessing conditions and abilities.One of the better lessons I got from my mentor and bud Capt. Jack was a an afternoon where I pinched the tow ring between my fingers and learned how to tap the pedal with out the ring being pull from my fingers.A GRASSHOPPER If you got the biggest plane the heaviest foot you better be ready to max out from 75 ft.(it's all part of the game,how much ballast,wind) In (your) shorts.If you want to get the maxx launch bring your BALLS to the line and blame no one but yourself when you gotta come fly with me in the Fisher Price group.. P.S. The BBQ for Nats looks better than ever. - Original Message - From: "James V. Bacus" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Soaring" Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 6:23 PM Subject: Re: [RCSE] OVSS...line break policy? > That is the way it is traditionally done in the OVSS, but where you are > most likely to see line break action is in the last group with the > strongest pilots, and that round is always filled so there will never be an > empty slot to allow someone in. > > Chicago SOAR always restrings its winches with fresh #290 before a OVSS > weekend. > > > At 05:18 PM 5/16/2005, Jim Monaco wrote: > >I suggest that the order of the groups for seeded MOM send the lower > >seeds up first, then if a flight is delayed you get a tougher group rather > >than > >an "easier" group. > > Jim > Downers Grove, IL > Member of the Chicago SOAR club, and Team JR > AMA 592537LSF 7560 Level IV R/C Soaring blog at www.jimbacus.net > > RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
Re: [RCSE] OVSS...line break policy?
Oh Gord Mister, Granted, I do not travel in the exalted circles that you travel, BUT I Have Seen, and so have a few others concerned with this subject, watch the Late launcher / re lighter on purpose, walk away with the win after an opps "LINE Break", ...It Has happened, maybe not within the OVSS, then again maybe so... Do not ask me who, do not ask me when, just know that it has happened, and it was apparent. Thanks for sharing your war stories, I enjoy them Obviously, its a skill not to develope Mark Has the right idea, I will wait and see form whence it goes.. J At 06:11 PM 5/16/2005, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Complete relauch is the fairest, but any relight works. competitive edge hasn't ever proven to have caused a win. Complete relaunch is the fairest, but in fact a single relaunch has never ever resulted in the relauncher winning a contest. There's been plenty of chat about its 'possibility' or 'potential' but the reality is unless you know some one who is a crook that we fly with a lot, no one would bother to break a line for some advantage. It could be done doesn't mean it will be done. I was leading a contest recently in Australia, broke a line, relite and that line broke. My intention was to seal the deal by tricking them into finding the air for me that I had managed to find all daybut I was hoist by my own petard. :-) If the contest has a no pop off or no line break rule, I ain't driv'n :-) I go to fly :-) Gordy Jack Strother Granger, IN LSF V #117 //home.comcast.net/~strotherbj
Re: [RCSE] OVSS...line break policy?
Complete relauch is the fairest, but any relight works. competitive edge hasn't ever proven to have caused a win. Complete relaunch is the fairest, but in fact a single relaunch has never ever resulted in the relauncher winning a contest. There's been plenty of chat about its 'possibility' or 'potential' but the reality is unless you know some one who is a crook that we fly with a lot, no one would bother to break a line for some advantage. It could be done doesn't mean it will be done. I was leading a contest recently in Australia, broke a line, relite and that line broke. My intention was to seal the deal by tricking them into finding the air for me that I had managed to find all daybut I was hoist by my own petard. :-) If the contest has a no pop off or no line break rule, I ain't driv'n :-) I go to fly :-) Gordy
Re: [RCSE] OVSS...line break policy?
At 04:47 PM 5/16/2005, pfsiegel wrote: What about a compromise to allow one line break per day, with the provision that in the opinion of the launch master that there has not been an intentional attempt to break the line? Or??? Here's another compromise that I thought about at one time, but never posted. I may have talked to TK about it on one of our many car trips to or from an OVSS contest. (although I really hate mentioning this stuff one week before the series. Better off discussed post series, and perhaps limited to the OVSS yahoo group with the guys who fly the series.) Allow one line break a day. Additional line breaks in future rounds are allowed a re-launch, but cost you 30 seconds off the task time for the round. More than two line breaks in a flight group, the entire group has to relaunch, but those line breaks count and penalties are applied if applicable for those pilots (i.e. it wasn't their first one). If a pilot breaks the line on the relaunch, the flight counts and the 30 second penalty is applied. Just a suggestion. Jim Downers Grove, IL Member of the Chicago SOAR club, and Team JR AMA 592537LSF 7560 Level IV R/C Soaring blog at www.jimbacus.net RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] OVSS and Line Breaks
Jim, Paul, Jack,and Jim: Great comments and you all have pretty much sited all the pros and cons about what we face at each and every contest. From what i know every one of the contests we will be flying 280 or 290 line this year that is having MOM formats, I know STL relined this weekend and all the winches that are coming are set up with the good stuff (actually one club event ona line I think eliminates the splices and they are even better then). Like all have said, that eliminates nearly all the issues right there. But, still what do we do? I have had folks saying to me that I should mandate line strength and such, I have taken the attitude in the past that the clubs run their show and OVSS just uses the scores generated. I realize that my free market approach appaers a bit loose, but I still feel that this approach is best since as has been pointed out that conditions can vary as well as equipment. I urge clubs in the direction that I feel is what the customer wants, i.e. MVSA going MOM format this year with the heavier line than they have ever used before, there was trepidation, but they will make folks happy with the choice. My answer to what I will do in STL since I am the CD there is to give line breaks in the first round and to call down the entire flight group, but after that the show is on and no more chances are available. That is my answer, and it can be used as a template, but each club is on their own with council from the wise among us. My 2 cents on the subject... Marc RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
Re: [RCSE] OVSS...line break policy?
Normally, I kind of keep to the back of the tree line but this is one of my few hot buttons-launching systems. FAI has a method, not good for us. I have proposed for years that we in AMA scheduled TD events use a winch system with some kind of limit device (sensor) other than the winch line. It could be motor current, it could be line tension, it could be power/second used or a bunch of combinations. Just so I don't ramble any more (I think you get the idea), if the winch system limited some parameter that kept the line from breaking under tension, then all line breaks belong to the club, not the pilot. This could then always be a relight for the group and no need for backup winches. I think all of our equipment would last a lot longer, both launch and flying equipment. Although this is not a prime concern to the competition minded, it could help those in the sportsman classes as well as the club treasury. Mike Wade does our winches as a club member but we still have to pay him for his trouble just like anyone else. I am not sure what the cost is/winch/year but my guess is we could have a couple more winches by now making MOM with club winches easier. With todays electronics, a controller should be able to be done for a reasonable amount (I think reasonable would be under $150-200). Making some noise Wadayathink? On 5/16/05, pfsiegel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I would like to throw this topic out to the soaring exchange to see if > there is any consensus of opinion on policy concerning winch line > breaks during launch, particularly during man on man competition. What > would be a good standard policy for line breaks that could be > universally adopted for a contest series like the OVSS? > > Let's assume that there is an extra winch that is available for relaunch > if a line break occurs. If during launch there is a line break > during a mass launch or even during a slightly staggered launch, then an > unfair advantage can be gained by the pilot who experienced the line > break. Before any subsequent relaunch from the extra winch during the > same round, the delay in that relaunch could allow the pilot to observe > the scatter of sailplanes already launched for any obvious areas of lift. > > The obvious solution is to NOT allow any relaunch after a line break. > This solution certainly discourages intentional line breakage by a pilot > who is not happy with his launch or who just wants to be the last pilot > to launch. > > However, there is very real possibility that the line may have been > weakened by a previous line cross during launch phase or even when the > timer was "tapping down" the chute after a previous launch. In this > instance, the pilot who suffered the line break would be unfairly > penalized for a problem that he was not responsible for. This hardly > seems fair, particularly for an unfortunate pilot who may have traveled > a fair distance to compete over a full weekend of flying. > > For better or worse, this no relaunch rule also discriminates against > larger, heavier sailplanes. > > One possible solution might be to automatically bump the pilot to the > next flight group. But what if this happens in the last flight group > for the round? Or, what if more than one line break happens in the same > flight group and there is only one extra winch? Maybe a quick > retrieve of an already been launched winch for the relaunch? > > Should there be a time limit for when the relaunch must happen? What > would that time be? Or should this be at the discretion of the launch > master? > > It sure slows down a contest to have everyone land for a mass relaunch > which makes that an unpopular solution. > > What about a compromise to allow one line break per day, with the > provision that in the opinion of the launch master that there has not > been an intentional attempt to break the line? > > Or??? > > RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and > "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and > unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. > Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in > text format > -- Jack Iafret Home and Hobbies Acc't. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
RE: [RCSE] "I found a new glue at Toledo and you didn't!"
Looks interesting. Use phone number 123-456-7890 to browse their store without registering. -==- Barrett -Original Message- From: Bob Johnson [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 6:17 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; soaring@airage.com Subject: RE: [RCSE] "I found a new glue at Toledo and you didn't!" It has the best features of the glues we are currently using and I just had an opportunity or misfortune to try it on a damage molded wing tip. This stuff let you move stuff around till you are satisfied then lets you harden it immediately. You can put filler in it too. Stting in the jug it seems expensive but considering it has a shelf life supposedly 10times that of CA and its versatility...cheap. I'll be reviewing it in RCSD in a coming issue, just waiting on specs etc. How much do I like it? I just ordered $300 worth. Hey Gordy, The miracle glue you found at Toledo wouldn't happen to be CoolChem? www.coolchem.com Regards, Bob Johnson Fond du Lac, WI RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
Re: [RCSE] Switch Harness Problem
Sorry about your misfortune, but you have a great attitude and I look forward to flying with you in Cinci. At 05:04 PM 5/16/2005, Glauco Lago wrote: Anyway I'll be there with the Organic so beware of a 2 m and flying as master now ;-) Jim Downers Grove, IL Member of the Chicago SOAR club, and Team JR AMA 592537LSF 7560 Level IV R/C Soaring blog at www.jimbacus.net RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
Re: [RCSE] OVSS...line break policy?
That is the way it is traditionally done in the OVSS, but where you are most likely to see line break action is in the last group with the strongest pilots, and that round is always filled so there will never be an empty slot to allow someone in. Chicago SOAR always restrings its winches with fresh #290 before a OVSS weekend. At 05:18 PM 5/16/2005, Jim Monaco wrote: I suggest that the order of the groups for seeded MOM send the lower seeds up first, then if a flight is delayed you get a tougher group rather than an "easier" group. Jim Downers Grove, IL Member of the Chicago SOAR club, and Team JR AMA 592537LSF 7560 Level IV R/C Soaring blog at www.jimbacus.net RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
Re: [RCSE] OVSS...line break policy?
Paul - In RMSA we fly all our contests as random MoM - not seeded. The rules are: 1. If the line break occurs to a novice they are allowed to relite on a free winch for the same round. While there might be an advantage, novices are not generally capable of using that advantage successfully. 2. For Sportsman or Masters, the pilot will be scheduled into the next available flight group (checking frequencies of course). 3. If there are no free slots available in a subsequent group (perhaps other pilots had breaks too and filled the slots or frequency conflicts) then we bring them down and refly the group. 4. For breaks in the last group of a round they are always brought down for a relaunch (if masters or sportsman). Generally bringing them down is not too much of a time hit if you do it promptly. We had much debate about relaunching in the same group and for the more seasoned competitors we felt it was too much of an advantage. When flying seeded MOM there will be the question of breaking the line to get into a later group. I suggest that the order of the groups for seeded MOM send the lower seeds up first, then if a flight is delayed you get a tougher group rather than an "easier" group. We use 290# braided and have very few line breaks so it is not really a big deal in practice. Hope this helps.. Jim Monaco Rocky Mountain Soaring Association Denver --- pfsiegel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > I would like to throw this topic out to the soaring exchange to see if > there is any consensus of opinion on policy concerning winch line > breaks during launch, particularly during man on man competition. What > would be a good standard policy for line breaks that could be > universally adopted for a contest series like the OVSS? > > Let's assume that there is an extra winch that is available for relaunch > if a line break occurs. If during launch there is a line break > during a mass launch or even during a slightly staggered launch, then an > unfair advantage can be gained by the pilot who experienced the line > break. Before any subsequent relaunch from the extra winch during the > same round, the delay in that relaunch could allow the pilot to observe > the scatter of sailplanes already launched for any obvious areas of lift. > > The obvious solution is to NOT allow any relaunch after a line break. > This solution certainly discourages intentional line breakage by a pilot > who is not happy with his launch or who just wants to be the last pilot > to launch. > > However, there is very real possibility that the line may have been > weakened by a previous line cross during launch phase or even when the > timer was "tapping down" the chute after a previous launch. In this > instance, the pilot who suffered the line break would be unfairly > penalized for a problem that he was not responsible for. This hardly > seems fair, particularly for an unfortunate pilot who may have traveled > a fair distance to compete over a full weekend of flying. > > For better or worse, this no relaunch rule also discriminates against > larger, heavier sailplanes. > > One possible solution might be to automatically bump the pilot to the > next flight group. But what if this happens in the last flight group > for the round? Or, what if more than one line break happens in the same > flight group and there is only one extra winch? Maybe a quick > retrieve of an already been launched winch for the relaunch? > > Should there be a time limit for when the relaunch must happen? What > would that time be? Or should this be at the discretion of the launch > master? > > It sure slows down a contest to have everyone land for a mass relaunch > which makes that an unpopular solution. > > What about a compromise to allow one line break per day, with the > provision that in the opinion of the launch master that there has not > been an intentional attempt to break the line? > > Or??? > > > > > > > RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and > "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that > subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME > turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are > generally NOT in text format > > DeleteReplyForwardMove... RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
RE: [RCSE] "I found a new glue at Toledo and you didn't!"
It has the best features of the glues we are currently using and I just had an opportunity or misfortune to try it on a damage molded wing tip. This stuff let you move stuff around till you are satisfied then lets you harden it immediately. You can put filler in it too. Stting in the jug it seems expensive but considering it has a shelf life supposedly 10times that of CA and its versatility...cheap. I'll be reviewing it in RCSD in a coming issue, just waiting on specs etc. How much do I like it? I just ordered $300 worth. Hey Gordy, The miracle glue you found at Toledo wouldn’t happen to be CoolChem? www.coolchem.com Regards, Bob Johnson Fond du Lac, WI
Re: [RCSE] OVSS...line break policy?
Paul, I too am somewhat dismayed. Whatever answer that is brought forth, someone will surely feel slighted. I too do not like the unfair, 2 minutes later relight, for the very reason that you state. I also do not like the low launch rule, especially, as you say, and I have seen, it was not the launching pilots error, but a line improperly retrieved; wrapped around the turn around, or even better, the turn around threaded backwards !!! Those of us who fly the larger airplanes are often held hostage, if you will, to the sponsoring clubs version of heavy line... whatever that might be. There is no standard called out, but I try to run 280lb on my winch, with few if any line breaks. Line condition, grass condition , wet / dry / new / last years or even worse " It looks new line ", also impacts the competitive edge. Let us not forget as well, not matter how hard we try, basically none of the winches at these MOM contests are truly matched, if they even look the same, we should consider ourselves lucky. Differences in brakes, brake hookups, Brake type for that matter, are usually different. I for one think that it is more appropriate to call them all down, "IF" the launch director determines a malfunction within "X" seconds, that not of the launching pilot, HOWEVER, Like you say, it tends to lead to a long contest day, and all it takes is one person to be the .. aahhPerp !! Great Question, I am interested in the outcome, but be fore warned, if we are not careful we could regulate ourselves outta the fun this is supposed to be.. Actually this needed to be covered last fall, during the planning phase for this year... 8-) Jack At 04:47 PM 5/16/2005, pfsiegel wrote: I would like to throw this topic out to the soaring exchange to see if there is any consensus of opinion on policy concerning winch line breaks during launch, particularly during man on man competition. What would be a good standard policy for line breaks that could be universally adopted for a contest series like the OVSS? Let's assume that there is an extra winch that is available for relaunch if a line break occurs. If during launch there is a line break during a mass launch or even during a slightly staggered launch, then an unfair advantage can be gained by the pilot who experienced the line break. Before any subsequent relaunch from the extra winch during the same round, the delay in that relaunch could allow the pilot to observe the scatter of sailplanes already launched for any obvious areas of lift. The obvious solution is to NOT allow any relaunch after a line break. This solution certainly discourages intentional line breakage by a pilot who is not happy with his launch or who just wants to be the last pilot to launch. However, there is very real possibility that the line may have been weakened by a previous line cross during launch phase or even when the timer was "tapping down" the chute after a previous launch. In this instance, the pilot who suffered the line break would be unfairly penalized for a problem that he was not responsible for. This hardly seems fair, particularly for an unfortunate pilot who may have traveled a fair distance to compete over a full weekend of flying. For better or worse, this no relaunch rule also discriminates against larger, heavier sailplanes. One possible solution might be to automatically bump the pilot to the next flight group. But what if this happens in the last flight group for the round? Or, what if more than one line break happens in the same flight group and there is only one extra winch? Maybe a quick retrieve of an already been launched winch for the relaunch? Should there be a time limit for when the relaunch must happen? What would that time be? Or should this be at the discretion of the launch master? It sure slows down a contest to have everyone land for a mass relaunch which makes that an unpopular solution. What about a compromise to allow one line break per day, with the provision that in the opinion of the launch master that there has not been an intentional attempt to break the line? Or??? RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format Jack Strother Granger, IN LSF V #117 //home.comcast.net/~strotherbj RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Switch Harness Problem
Guys, My beloved Artemis got to the end of his soaring life this weekend at a club contest after what appears to be a switch harness failure. I'll describe what happened and see if someone can help me. The plane was a V tail Artemis with 6 x 368 JR servos, JR 770 PCM receiver, 1750 mAh 4 cell NiCad pack from Servocity and was ballasted with 8oz bringing the total weight to 76 oz. We were flying a MOM contest with brand new 290 line, brand new 12 V deep cycle batteries and new injoy 6 volt motors on real balls (as powerful as it can get :-). The wind was 10 to 15 miles. First launch went ok and I maxed it (10 m) and blew the landing. On the second launch at the mid of the launch the plane started to spiral down like if something was hanging on the plane (no retrievers) but it released from the line from about 100 ft and kept flying like if nothing happened. I even did some circles and got some landing points. I then checked all that I could on that specific winch and in the plane. All servos moved, had good range check, the charge on the battery was good so decided to fly the last round. On this launch the plane veered slightly left and popped off at 50 ft. After that I had no radio control and it spiraled down to earth. Inspecting the wreckage I could see the servos were not moving with radio inputs. The first thing I noticed was the switch harness quit working. When I plugged the battery directly to the radio everything worked fine. So at home after checking the wiring on the switch harness here is a link to a picture of what I found http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=371701#post3758917 Apparently the circuit board blew like if it was a short but I don't know how that could happen. The plastic case has no marks. I don't know the brand of the harness but it had the Futaba J plugs so it could be Futaba original or maybe Hitec. So my question is could the current load on launch blow the harness? I've heard it could get to several amps on launch and I don't know how these harness' are rated. Maybe it got a weak spot on the first troubled launch but still worked without the launch loads and at the last launch it blew like a fuse. Any other theory? I can see the guys that will be in Cincinnati next weekend are all happy (Gordy being one of them) since they won't have to fly against the plane that won the 04 OVSS sportsman class. Anyway I'll be there with the Organic so beware of a 2 m and flying as master now ;-) Glauco MVSA RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] OVSS...line break policy?
I would like to throw this topic out to the soaring exchange to see if there is any consensus of opinion on policy concerning winch line breaks during launch, particularly during man on man competition. What would be a good standard policy for line breaks that could be universally adopted for a contest series like the OVSS? Let's assume that there is an extra winch that is available for relaunch if a line break occurs. If during launch there is a line break during a mass launch or even during a slightly staggered launch, then an unfair advantage can be gained by the pilot who experienced the line break. Before any subsequent relaunch from the extra winch during the same round, the delay in that relaunch could allow the pilot to observe the scatter of sailplanes already launched for any obvious areas of lift. The obvious solution is to NOT allow any relaunch after a line break. This solution certainly discourages intentional line breakage by a pilot who is not happy with his launch or who just wants to be the last pilot to launch. However, there is very real possibility that the line may have been weakened by a previous line cross during launch phase or even when the timer was "tapping down" the chute after a previous launch. In this instance, the pilot who suffered the line break would be unfairly penalized for a problem that he was not responsible for. This hardly seems fair, particularly for an unfortunate pilot who may have traveled a fair distance to compete over a full weekend of flying. For better or worse, this no relaunch rule also discriminates against larger, heavier sailplanes. One possible solution might be to automatically bump the pilot to the next flight group. But what if this happens in the last flight group for the round? Or, what if more than one line break happens in the same flight group and there is only one extra winch? Maybe a quick retrieve of an already been launched winch for the relaunch? Should there be a time limit for when the relaunch must happen? What would that time be? Or should this be at the discretion of the launch master? It sure slows down a contest to have everyone land for a mass relaunch which makes that an unpopular solution. What about a compromise to allow one line break per day, with the provision that in the opinion of the launch master that there has not been an intentional attempt to break the line? Or??? RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] this is a test
Re: [RCSE] Vision Transmitter
Wow, a vision in good shape for 150$. The vision used to command ~250$. Now they're down to 150$. Well, I guess nothing is forever. Bill Swingle RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
Re: [RCSE] spring fling
I am going to try and rip that thing from your cold, dying? hands. I'll bet your hands will be pretty darn alive everytime there is a buck on the line for the landing. Sure hope they have that bonus zone for when you really screw up ;^) I liked that one last time. See you there. Mike At 07:56 AM 5/14/2005, Daryl Perkins wrote: Hey guys, I was just on the SVSS website signing up for the Spring Fling. Hello.. where is everybody? Looks like a fun format - lots of flying, challenging tasks, and a great group of guys. Besides, I'll be there... who wants to miss that ;-) Go here for more info - www.svss.org By the way, there has been a small group of volunteers who have resurrected the Triad trophy. The Triad, for those who don't know, was awarded to the top scoring pilot through three Southwest based contests for the year - AZ (South West Classic), The RoseBowl 2 Day (Don't recall the name) and Visalia. With the death of PSS, the Triad got kinda lost. A few clubs tried to resurrect it, but it never really stuck. I carried the trophy around for awhile, but it was so ugly I never bothered to have my name put on it. (It's a prepetual trophy) I finally stuck it in the trailer in Visalia and ran ;-) But now... a new and improved Triad resurfaces The Spring Fling will make up the second leg this year. It's the type of title that means a lot to a true competitor. To have won a single contest is nice, but to have bested the top soaring pilots in the West over 25-30 flights over 6 days of flying, in varying conditions, varying landing tasks is pretty meaningful. It always meant a lot to me. It was a shame to see it die. If you scored well in AZ, better get your butt up to Sac-O-Potatoes June 25 and 26 and kick some butt. I've seen some ideas regarding the new trophy, and whichever way they go, it'll be a must have. I know I'll be working hard for it. So everybody come on up to the Spring Fling. Support SVSS. Support the Triad. Somebody's gotta win this thing. Might as well be you. But, of course, you'll have to pry it from my cold dying hands. ;-) D Yahoo! Mail Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour: http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Fw: Vision Transmitter
Sent this yesterday and I didn't see it come up..If you get a double I apologize..Brian -- Subject: Vision Transmitter Any one looking for a good Vision transmitter? This has been my everyday flyer...It was sent in for a check up this past winter...I consider it in Good Condition...All switches intact, works perfect in every way..Very trust worthy. Latest software for the 8SP version..Has nearly new 1100 nicad pack..I Can put it on ch 16, ch 20 or ham ch 7 for anyone interestedThe only down grade on it is a loose door hinge on the right side..The door is intact and works perfect.. I just picked up two new Visions and just can't see this just sitting in my cupboard.. Like to have $150 and 1/2 the shipping.. I will gladly refund your money if not pleased..Will bring it to Cincy next Sat if anyone would like to see it...Or have it here the 28th and 29th at the Tullahoma Contest..Thanks for the BW..Brian Smith RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Fw: Jim Bag
Subject: Jim Bag Went to MG..Thanks..Brian RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
Re: [RCSE] GOT my new Frequency Checker today!
I got a notification that Tower has shipped mine, should be here in the next day or two. giddy with excitement.. CJ At 12:20 PM 5/16/2005, Brian Chan wrote: At 12:53 PM -0400 5/16/05, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: WoW its smaller than I remembered. About the size of two Hitec 8 channel RX's... Easily fits in a shirt pocket! GordyGordy, Then I should be getting my soon... did you get the external antenna? Brian -- -- * Brian Chan, * AFDD Instrumentation Group, US Army Research Support * Ames Research Center, Mail Stop-215-2, * Bldg 215 Room 120 * Moffett Field, CA 94035-1000 * 650-604-0389 FAX 650-604-5173 * e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] - Jack Strother Granger, IN LSF V #117 //home.comcast.net/~strotherbj
Re: [RCSE] GOT my new Frequency Checker today!
Title: Re: [RCSE] GOT my new Frequency Checker today! At 12:53 PM -0400 5/16/05, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: WoW its smaller than I remembered. About the size of two Hitec 8 channel RX's... Easily fits in a shirt pocket! Gordy Gordy, Then I should be getting my soon... did you get the external antenna? Brian -- -- * Brian Chan, * AFDD Instrumentation Group, US Army Research Support * Ames Research Center, Mail Stop-215-2, * Bldg 215 Room 120 * Moffett Field, CA 94035-1000 * 650-604-0389 FAX 650-604-5173 * e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -
[RCSE] PS, Freq Checker
It uses 3 AAA cells. Gordy
[RCSE] GOT my new Frequency Checker today!
WoW its smaller than I remembered. About the size of two Hitec 8 channel RX's... Easily fits in a shirt pocket! Gordy
Re: [RCSE] "I pity the fool didn't get some LSF Tasks done today!"
Hey that was my cap Gordy..now you owe me a beer! Good flying. AJ > > I ended it with style, about 15 guys witnessing, I > brought it in on the zero > and put the nose in the landing target hat to cap it > with some panache :-) > > RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
RE: [RCSE] "I found a new glue at Toledo and you didn't!"
Why keep it a mystery - what is it, and who makes it? Matt From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 10:03 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED]; soaring@airage.com Subject: [RCSE] "I found a new glue at Toledo and you didn't!" Very pricy indeed at $89.00 per 20 grams of glue in a kit, which includes the various accelerators, primers, and modifiers in a handy plastic tool box. 50 grams (under 2 oz) of glue by itself for $45.00. Special purpose glue to be sure. But it certainly sounds interesting You guys can go back and read my original post I didn't say 'interesting' and being a sailplaner, buying somethiing expensive is an oxy moron. Stand by, it should be in the next issue. That Pasco stuff is just another CA. That's not a 'new' glue. Gordy :-)
[RCSE] RE: "I found a new glue at Toledo and you didn't!"
Now I am really intrigued, it will be hard to wait for the next RCSD. cheers, Graham in Embrun near Ottawa Canada -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 10:03 To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Collins, Graham; soaring@airage.com Subject: "I found a new glue at Toledo and you didn't!" Very pricy indeed at $89.00 per 20 grams of glue in a kit, which includes the various accelerators, primers, and modifiers in a handy plastic tool box. 50 grams (under 2 oz) of glue by itself for $45.00. Special purpose glue to be sure. But it certainly sounds interesting You guys can go back and read my original post I didn't say 'interesting' and being a sailplaner, buying somethiing expensive is an oxy moron. Stand by, it should be in the next issue. That Pasco stuff is just another CA. That's not a 'new' glue. Gordy :-) RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] "I found a new glue at Toledo and you didn't!"
Very pricy indeed at $89.00 per 20 grams of glue in a kit, whichincludes the various accelerators, primers, and modifiers in a handyplastic tool box.50 grams (under 2 oz) of glue by itself for $45.00.Special purpose glue to be sure. But it certainly sounds interesting You guys can go back and read my original post I didn't say 'interesting' and being a sailplaner, buying somethiing expensive is an oxy moron. Stand by, it should be in the next issue. That Pasco stuff is just another CA. That's not a 'new' glue. Gordy :-)
[RCSE] Jim Bag
Went to MG..Thanks..Brian RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
Re: [RCSE] Our contest
At 08:10 AM 5/16/2005, you wrote: I was ask: What - Where is our contest.? It is May 28th and 29th Two one day events with a high overall award for the weekend. RES and Unlimited classesIt is the 26th year running this event has been held here.. We have great winches and use retrievers, it will open winch, laid back but very competitive, and we normally get a nice turn out from a 4 or 5 state area.. We are in Tullahoma TN about 1/2 way between Nashville and Chattanooga, 15 miles off I24..Kendall McDonald is the CD and can be reached at 931 455 5779 Actually this is the 35th annual spring soaring contest. I was the CD for the first one in May,1971 and we haven't missed a year. The first one was so successful we held another the following September and haven't missed a fall contest either. Chuck Anderson RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] RE: Great day slope flying on Maui
Al, you flew a Quick Silver at Maluhia? Wow, you must have great eyes! Anything smaller than 60" specs out for me before you get out over the lift band. Wishing I was there with you, and I really mean that! Cheers, Nathan Woods -Original Message- From: "glide" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> The wind at Camp Maluhia was averaging 18 M.P.H gusting to 25 M.P.H. Everything flew today from foamies to 4 meter scale ships and even a beautiful Wizard Compact. The lift was excellent and fun was had by all. I was able to fly my Lucky and get that trimmed out as with my reconditioned Quick Silver and JW. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
RE: [RCSE] "I found a new glue at Toledo and you didn't!"
Very pricy indeed at $89.00 per 20 grams of glue in a kit, which includes the various accelerators, primers, and modifiers in a handy plastic tool box. 50 grams (under 2 oz) of glue by itself for $45.00. Special purpose glue to be sure. But it certainly sounds interesting. JD Endless Mountain Models http://www.scalesoaring.com email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > -Original Message- > From: Collins Graham [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 7:29 AM > To: Soaring@airage.com > Subject: RE: [RCSE] "I found a new glue at Toledo and you didn't!" > > Sounds like this might be PascoFix > > http://www.pascofix.de/Pasco_-_Fix/pasco_-_fix.html > > Not really new; maybe new at Toldeo however. It has been around for some > time. It seems to be a high grade CYANO glue "system". System in the sense > that they have fillers and primers. > > Yes, it does work very well and is a high quality product, a little goes a > long way but it is pricey. > > If it is not PascoFix, I'd sure like to know what this new magical glue > is. > > cheers, Graham in Embrun near Ottawa > > RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Our contest
I was ask: What - Where is our contest.? It is May 28th and 29th Two one day events with a high overall award for the weekend. RES and Unlimited classesIt is the 26th year running this event has been held here.. We have great winches and use retrievers, it will open winch, laid back but very competitive, and we normally get a nice turn out from a 4 or 5 state area.. We are in Tullahoma TN about 1/2 way between Nashville and Chattanooga, 15 miles off I24..Kendall McDonald is the CD and can be reached at 931 455 5779 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] OVSS #2
OVSS #2 will be at LOFT in Fort Wayne, Indiana June 11 & 12. We will be flying both sportsman and expert on saturday. No separate awards for unlimited on sunday. Location is Salomon Farm (same as last year). Flier is on the web site. http://www.loftrc.org/steele/flier.html If I don't see you this weekend in Cincinnati, hope to see you in Fort Wayne. Denny Zech LSF II RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Jim Bag
Cleaning up a little..Found a nice Jim bag..Blue and yellow..Used once "I think"..Paid $100 "I think" (smile) Been behind my bed for nearly a year..Is $60 for it fair? I really don't want to ship it, so I can have it in Cincy this coming Sat or here at our contest May 28 & 29..As usual thanks for the BW..Brian Smith RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
RE: [RCSE] "I found a new glue at Toledo and you didn't!"
Sounds like this might be PascoFix http://www.pascofix.de/Pasco_-_Fix/pasco_-_fix.html Not really new; maybe new at Toldeo however. It has been around for some time. It seems to be a high grade CYANO glue "system". System in the sense that they have fillers and primers. Yes, it does work very well and is a high quality product, a little goes a long way but it is pricey. If it is not PascoFix, I'd sure like to know what this new magical glue is. cheers, Graham in Embrun near Ottawa Date: Sun, 15 May 2005 20:24:40 -0700 From: George Gillburg <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: soaring@airage.com, [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [RCSE] "I found a new glue at Toledo and you didn't!" Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > It has the best features of the glues we are currently using and I > just had an opportunity or misfortune to try it on a damage molded > wing tip. > > This stuff let you move stuff around till you are satisfied then lets > you harden it immediately. You can put filler in it too. Stting in > the jug it seems expensive but considering it has a shelf life > supposedly 10times that of CA and its versatility...cheap. > > I'll be reviewing it in RCSD in a coming issue, just waiting on specs > etc. > > How much do I like it? I just ordered $300 worth. > > Gordy > Off to lexington for some soaring :-) So, does $300 buy you 0.1 oz or a quart? RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
