Re: [RCSE] Schulze and Airtronics receiver Price drop !
Schulze Chamaleon isl 6-330d software version 8 Charger has seen little use, no scratches $160 shipped within lower 48 4 Airtronics receivers, (old style connectors) #92775 ch26, used in good shape, $30 shipped within lower 48 #92785 ch14, used in good shape, $30 shipped within lower 48 #92785 ch26, used in good shape, $30 shipped within lower 48 Paypal please Jim Jacobson Jim Jacobson Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your home page. http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
RE: [RCSE] Contest Format
Here's a format that's fair to everyone and no hurt feelings at the end of the contest. We'll let everyone launch whenever they want and fly for whatever they can accomplish. When they land we'll rub their heads and tell them what a great job they did and give them a max score. If they break the line or pop off we'll ask them if that's their flight or if they want a 'do over'. Either way they are rewarded with a max score for being so aggressive on the launch. If they land off the field we'll give them the max landing score for trying so hard. On the field landing and they get a max score for their great skill. Should anyone crash they would immediately be awarded a max score for heroism and almost saving their plane and a new-in-box replacement for their broken airplane. After the predetermined number of rounds selected to make sure that no one gets too tired during the day we'll give everyone a small trophy and take a group picture to celebrate. Then everyone gets a nice box of juice and candy or cookie snack before they head home. All butterflies and warm milk thoughts will fill their heads as the drive that long highway home. Anything less than this and the contest is obviously unfair, poor sportsmanship or cheating. The argument is over. Cheers Rick PS No ego or emotion was created or destroyed in this post. At 10:52 PM 1/9/2008, Tim Bennett wrote: Jim Bacus wrote: > > "Shafting" the other fellow competitors by completing the task > time? "Unethical?" ;-) > > I see it as maximizing my available flying time during a contest > event, and playing by the rules of the contest attempting to > maximize my score. Jim makes a valid point while at the same time highlighting one of the weaknesses of seeded MOM as currently practiced. The format creates a structure that encourages or even requires what would seem to some as unsportsmanlike behavior which belittles and demeans the unsuccessful competitor. The rules encourage exploiting any opportunity to "bury" someone who has a bad flight by putting on a show of being the only one flying for as long as possible while everyone stands and watches. This kind of structure is unnecessary and disproportionately rewards the single episode of good luck or heroic effort as opposed to consistent superior performance round after round. There can be no greater turn off in competition than being shafted or buried. While it may be fun for one guy, it is at the expense of everyone else. If playing by the rules makes the competition a turnoff to many, maybe better rules can correct this. This is an issue of the design of the contest format which my earlier idea seeks to address. By assigning scores that are limited on the low side, a competitor is not able to lose or win the whole contest in one round and there is no need nor opportunity to bury or shaft anybody. I think this is a better way to structure a contest if you want to insure all competitors have a good time and encourage participation while not artificially limiting the performance of any competitor. I guess a key objective I left out was: "Respect for the dignity of all participants." I also think "...maximizing available flying time during a contest..." is better done by increasing the pace of the event so more rounds can be flown. Tim Bennett LSF IV RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Re: Contest Format
Guys, I've flown a variant of Tim's proposal at SLNT on quite a few occasions in their Class-A Scramble event. It's a great task, gets the load off the CD and keeps pilots involved all the way through the event. Extending it to TD classes is a really interesting approach and addresses a lot of issues that can come up at club contests. I suspect the format works best for club events in the 8 to 20 range or thereabouts. Why don't some of the clubs give it a try for their monthly events and report back to RCSE or RCGroups? The rules may merit some tweaking but the best way to figure that is to give it a shot. The Class A format draws more entries each month at Dallas than just about anything else - and that's a pretty competitive group of guys. One of the things it DEFINITELY accomplishes is draw more club members into club activities. If you're in it for the group and not just for yourself, that's not a bad outcome. Way to go Tim! - Dave R RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
Re: [RCSE] Contest format
- Original Message From: Tim Bennett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ...in a "real" contest, 9 points or less out of ten, which corresponds to 900 or less out of 1000, is a low score. So what do you do when you have a typical OVSS field where 4 out of the 7 guys come within a couple of seconds of the max? One has 10:00, one has 10:01, one has 9:58, one has 9:57. You give them 10, 9, 8, 7 respectively? The same as if they scored 10, 9, 8, and 7 minutes? I don't think so.
RE: [RCSE] Contest format
Now who is arguing for political correctness? Thanks for your interest, anyway. Remember that the format is not precision. Everybody who caught the air just flies past the target time and lands within the thirty seconds to collect their ten points. If somebody landed early while somebody else was still flying, He lost the round. That should have a price, as you correctly pointed out, to be fair to everybody else. The situation where everybody hits sink and has to scratch for that last minute before the max is one of the more exciting elements of the format and has validity as a competitive format since it is not what happens in good air that separates the good pilots from the rest, it is who does the best job with the air they have. Think about it. Tim -Original Message- From: tony estep [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2008 8:14 AM To: Soaring Subject: Re: [RCSE] Contest format - Original Message From: Tim Bennett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ...in a "real" contest, 9 points or less out of ten, which corresponds to 900 or less out of 1000, is a low score. So what do you do when you have a typical OVSS field where 4 out of the 7 guys come within a couple of seconds of the max? One has 10:00, one has 10:01, one has 9:58, one has 9:57. You give them 10, 9, 8, 7 respectively? The same as if they scored 10, 9, 8, and 7 minutes? I don't think so.
[RCSE] Contest format
- Original Message ...Everybody who caught the air just flies past the target time and lands within the thirty seconds to collect their ten points == Still, you can have the odd situation where four guys make 10+, and one makes 9:59; if I understand it correctly, he gets a 6, the equivalent of 600 points, for a flight that should have been worth 999. The best way to avoid all these pathological outcomes is to normalize the scores. If you want to eliminate the precision, then just call every time over 10 minutes 10:00.
Re: [RCSE] Contest format
One time at an OVSS contest in Cincy, Rich Burnoski took me from 3rd to 22nd all in one flight. The last round. I still love MOM. (smile) But I never forget, and got even at the Gateway open about 3 yrs ago in the last contest I think I ever flew in. YUP. I still love MOM. Brian - Original Message - From: Steve Schneider To: RCSE Sent: Wednesday, January 09, 2008 10:58 PM Subject: Re: [RCSE] Contest format Maybe we should just do politically correct soaring contests and not keep score, like many kids sports programs these days. We wouldn't want to hurt any ones feelings, now would we? On Jan 9, 2008 10:53 PM, tony estep <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Original message: Your heart is in the right place for club events, but please do not do this at TNT... === Marc is right on. At a "real" contest, this sort of thing is fundamentally unfair. If everybody launches into the same air and one guy finds the air and gets max, while 6 out of 7 guys mess up and land early, they have to earn low scores, in fairness to everybody in the contest. The air was there and they blew their shot. Setting up some artificial scheme to pardon their failure is better policy for club contests than for the real thing -- sort of like allowing free popoffs. -- Steve Schneider Buffalo Grove, IL SOAR Club -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.19.0/1216 - Release Date: 1/9/2008 10:16 AM
[RCSE] SMOM 'dislike'
Interesting watching this discussion on Tim's formatand how critical some people are of it. I applaud him for just trying something different to mix it up a bit. Don't get me wrong...I love to fly MOM and SMOM, but I almost prefer straight MOM, as I learn more. In SMOM, you tend to rise to those equal to your level, and then stick there. Equal skills, close results, and most of the time same mistakes. I don't learn as much when I fly with guys with skills equal to mine. Where I learn is trying to fly with those ABOVE my skill level. (Way above!) Then you get radically different strategies, techniques, etc which you get to compare directly against your own. No better learning than doing (or trying to do).Watching that last flight group in SMOM is interesting, but I don't learn nearly as much as I would if I was somehow also out there with my own plane. Hell, with Tim's format, just might be able to fly in that same flight group as Daryl! I guess for me it's more the learning than the wood. I can feel very good about my flying, and still be in last place. (I HOPE not, but weirder things have happened!) -Les Grammer -NWSS RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
Re: [RCSE] Contest Format
Tim, I see and understand where you are going, and respectfully disagree. I fly model sailplanes to compete and so a contest to me is a test of skills among peers. Like Golfing I work at every aspect of flying to improve my game in order to get that edge on the less skilled, the less prepared and the less knowledgeable. So for me when it all comes together for a win or high place, the taste of victory is sweet although brief is very addictive. This is what keeps me going I can fun fly anytime!! I look forward to a true contest of skills. To level the playing field and to reward players for not being prepared, less skilled or less practiced will give them a false sense of success. They will wonder why they got there A%$ handed to them when they attend a real contest, and who fault is that? smokinjoe
[RCSE] Contest Format
Thank Heavens for the "DELETE" key. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Contest Format
Original message: ...To level the playing field and to reward players for not being prepared, less skilled or less practiced... = At first glance it appears to do that. But if you think about how this would have worked at contests you have attended, you might conclude that the overall effect is to introduce arbitrariness and quirky results into the scoring, with no corresponding benefit. It's purely a landing contest for the maxers; a guy who gets a near-max will have the door slammed on him with no chance to recover; and the guys who would have been at the bottom with conventional scoring will still be at the bottom.
Re: [RCSE] Contest Format
Tim, well done. I really like the idea and the execution. I might try this or a variant at one of our local contests. Anyone that knows me knows that I am a competitor. I like the challenge. I love MoM flight scoring, and can't get enough of FAI style flying. What I really like about this event, is its simplicity in scoring. I am surprised at everyone who thinks this format is not competitive. Just come and fly with us at TPG, and try to keep Mike Smith, Steve Condon, or Aurthor Mkevich (god a killed the sp, but I can pronounce it)from beating you. If you think about how this thing is scored, you will need all 10s to win. So getting buried or not doesn't really matter. Also, landing points still matter. The top guys always get their times, so to win you gotta hit the tape. Same thing here. This kind of format should make for a really fun contest. It promotes the old, I bet you a dollar I win stuff. So Joe R, bring your dollars dude, he who has the least at the end of the contest will get a photo opportunity on the short bus. :) (my wife is special ed teacher, she is secretly getting mad right now). How is that for competative spirit. It should also get more people warmed up to the idea of MoM flying. Take out the luck and bring the skill. So Tim, thanks for trying it out and taking the time to tell us all about it. David Klein, TPGulls BTW, I have flown enough to know that every club in the US has a top competitor or two, so there is no such thing as an easy contest. The only difference here is that the middle of the pack guys will score 900-950 points, instead of 800-900.
Re: [RCSE] Contest Format
Rick, Good Points... What kind of Cookies are We talking here. Larry Jolly Here's a format that's fair to everyone and no hurt feelings at the end of the contest. We'll let everyone launch whenever they want and fly for whatever they can accomplish. When they land we'll rub their heads and tell them what a great job they did and give them a max score. If they break the line or pop off we'll ask them if that's their flight or if they want a 'do over'. Either way they are rewarded with a max score for being so aggressive on the launch. If they land off the field we'll give them the max landing score for trying so hard. On the field landing and they get a max score for their great skill. Should anyone crash they would immediately be awarded a max score for heroism and almost saving their plane and a new-in-box replacement for their broken airplane. After the predetermined number of rounds selected to make sure that no one gets too tired during the day we'll give everyone a small trophy and take a group picture to celebrate. Then everyone gets a nice box of juice and candy or cookie snack before they head home. All butterflies and warm milk thoughts will fill their heads as the drive that long highway home. Anything less than this and the contest is obviously unfair, poor sportsmanship or cheating. The argument is over. Cheers Rick PS No ego or emotion was created or destroyed in this post. At 10:52 PM 1/9/2008, Tim Bennett wrote: >Jim Bacus wrote: > > > > "Shafting" the other fellow competitors by completing the task > > time? "Unethical?" ;-) > > > > I see it as maximizing my available flying time during a contest > > event, and playing by the rules of the contest attempting to > > maximize my score. > > >Jim makes a valid point while at the same time highlighting one of the >weaknesses of seeded MOM as currently practiced. The format creates a >structure that encourages or even requires what would seem to some as >unsportsmanlike behavior which belittles and demeans the unsuccessful >competitor. The rules encourage exploiting any opportunity to "bury" someone >who has a bad flight by putting on a show of being the only one flying for >as long as possible while everyone stands and watches. This kind of >structure is unnecessary and disproportionately rewards the single episode >of good luck or heroic effort as opposed to consistent superior performance >round after round. There can be no greater turn off in competition than >being shafted or buried. While it may be fun for one guy, it is at the >expense of everyone else. If playing by the rules makes the competition a >turnoff to many, maybe better rules can correct this. This is an issue of >the design of the contest format which my earlier idea seeks to address. > >By assigning scores that are limited on the low side, a competitor is not >able to lose or win the whole contest in one round and there is no need nor >opportunity to bury or shaft anybody. I think this is a better way to >structure a contest if you want to insure all competitors have a good time >and encourage participation while not artificially limiting the performance >of any competitor. > >I guess a key objective I left out was: > >"Respect for the dignity of all participants." > >I also think "...maximizing available flying time during a contest..." is >better done by increasing the pace of the event so more rounds can be flown. > >Tim Bennett >LSF IV > >RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send >"subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to >[EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and >unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME >turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL >are generally NOT in text format RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format **Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape. http://body.aol.com/fitness/winter-exercise?NCID=aolcmp0030002489
[RCSE] "The Problem of Tim's Contest Format"
Duh, I can't believe I have to post this :-) The biggest problem with Tim's Contest format is us all missing flying it. Gordy **Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape. http://body.aol.com/fitness/winter-exercise?NCID=aolcmp0030002489
RE: [RCSE] Contest Format
Why not just have everyone fly for 10 minutes to qualify for a landing attempt with 1 meter concentric divisions like f3J. After all, isn't that what it's about? Why not give bonus points for landing if they are within 2 seconds over the time. If they are short of 10 minutes then zero flight points. Isn't that what all the top experts do in each contest. If you can't make the time, what makes you think you are good enough to get landing points either? BTW, DLG contests do MOM all the time. The thought pattern is TOTALLY different in DLG contests. There is a set task, either you make it or you don't. The only thing I constantly hear is how many points did you DROP, not how many points did you achieve. This is not basketball, it is more like Golf. The course is rated and you know the task (par value) and you are being measured on what you can or cannot achieve. Chris RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
RE: [RCSE] Contest Format
Actually you can do a lot better than par in golf. A better example is skeet or trap shooting. The task is 100 targets and you can't get more than 100. As Chris says - ya only got to count the ones you missed - and at the upper levels if that is 1 you can plan for your ride home... Ask me how I know... :) Jim Jim Monaco Rocky Mountain Soaring Association Denver, CO http://www.rmsadenver.com -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2008 2:25 PM To: RCSE (E-mail) Subject: RE: [RCSE] Contest Format Why not just have everyone fly for 10 minutes to qualify for a landing attempt with 1 meter concentric divisions like f3J. After all, isn't that what it's about? Why not give bonus points for landing if they are within 2 seconds over the time. If they are short of 10 minutes then zero flight points. Isn't that what all the top experts do in each contest. If you can't make the time, what makes you think you are good enough to get landing points either? BTW, DLG contests do MOM all the time. The thought pattern is TOTALLY different in DLG contests. There is a set task, either you make it or you don't. The only thing I constantly hear is how many points did you DROP, not how many points did you achieve. This is not basketball, it is more like Golf. The course is rated and you know the task (par value) and you are being measured on what you can or cannot achieve. Chris RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Contest Format
Original message: ...short of 10 minutes then zero flight points. Isn't that what all the top experts do in each contest. If you can't make the time, what makes you think you are good enough to get landing points either? === Which suggests a slight variation on the 10-9-8 etc. scheme: Only the maxers or round-winners get to go on to the next round -- everybody else is eliminated. That would really move things along.
Re: [RCSE] Contest Format
I think you meant zero the landing points, not the flight points. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Why not just have everyone fly for 10 minutes to qualify for a landing attempt with 1 meter concentric divisions like f3J. After all, isn't that what it's about? Why not give bonus points for landing if they are within 2 seconds over the time. If they are short of 10 minutes then zero flight points. Isn't that what all the top experts do in each contest. If you can't make the time, what makes you think you are good enough to get landing points either? BTW, DLG contests do MOM all the time. The thought pattern is TOTALLY different in DLG contests. There is a set task, either you make it or you don't. The only thing I constantly hear is how many points did you DROP, not how many points did you achieve. This is not basketball, it is more like Golf. The course is rated and you know the task (par value) and you are being measured on what you can or cannot achieve. Chris RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format -- Jeff Steifel RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
Re: [RCSE] Contest Format
I hope you meant zero the landing points, not flight points. Here on the east coast, and certainly at the NATs, there have been days where even the top guys will miss a flight. Zeroing a flight is ridiculous if you don't make the 10, because even those guys would miss. I assume you are talking west coast give me a thermal and I can't come down air. Not the variable stuff that the midwest and east coast can get. Start a day off with 5mph and get up to winds that knock over the Shitter.. Not everyone will make their time, including the leaders.They will/may drop them. Zeroing a flight... what if everyone zeros a flight? Zero the landing? Still not convinced... Why not just adopt the FAI standard? Why do we have to do it different then the rest of the world. Use the f3j format with winches,and the U.S. might wind up winning the worlds. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Why not just have everyone fly for 10 minutes to qualify for a landing attempt with 1 meter concentric divisions like f3J. After all, isn't that what it's about? Why not give bonus points for landing if they are within 2 seconds over the time. If they are short of 10 minutes then zero flight points. Isn't that what all the top experts do in each contest. If you can't make the time, what makes you think you are good enough to get landing points either? BTW, DLG contests do MOM all the time. The thought pattern is TOTALLY different in DLG contests. There is a set task, either you make it or you don't. The only thing I constantly hear is how many points did you DROP, not how many points did you achieve. This is not basketball, it is more like Golf. The course is rated and you know the task (par value) and you are being measured on what you can or cannot achieve. Chris RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format -- Jeff Steifel RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Contest Format: Some personal experience
Kudos to Tim Bennett for coming up with a new variation on his contest format similar to one of his formats for HLG-size planes. I agree with Dave Register's comments (see below). I flew in one of Tim's Class-A Scramble events a couple of winters ago in Dallas (winter in Duluth, NICE in Dallas) and enjoyed it immensely. I later got the written contest rules and materials specifications from Tim, put together four Up-Starts, and we started these contests this past year in Minnesota, to the great enjoyment of the participants. Tim's format has all the good qualities mentioned by Tim and Dave. This winter at least a dozen of the MN soaring club members are building new 1.5 meter-or-less planes to be able to fly in the upcoming "smaller plane" events, after hearing about the very positive response to the contests we had this past year. I'd suggest not only trying Tim's new format for the larger planes, but also his similar, tried and true, format for the smaller ones. This may get to be as popular in Minnesota as it has been in Dallas. The pace is fast, there is a lot of laughter and camaraderie, exciting moments as two or more fliers battle it out in a weak thermal 20 feet off the ground then one plane lands a quarter of a second later than another, lots of appreciative banter, cheering. . . everyone likes it a lot and those who don't have the right planes for it decide on the spot to get one. It's about fun, and Tim's format is hard to beat for that. With bigger planes and their higher launch altitudes, the whole process will be more sedate, but it sounds to me like it would be fun in its own way because of the faster pace than usual in that category. Each kind of contest is fun and a challenge; Tim's suggestion is worth a try. A lot of clubs would like it a lot, I'll bet. Looks like Gordy thinks so, too (see below). I agree with Gordy, too. Al >Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2008 07:34:43 -0600 From: David Register <[EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:Soaring@airage.com) Subject: Re: Contest Format Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED] (mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]) > Guys, I've flown a variant of Tim's proposal at SLNT on quite a few occasions in their Class-A Scramble event. It's a great task, gets the load off the CD and keeps pilots involved all the way through the event. Extending it to TD classes is a really interesting approach and addresses a lot of issues that can come up at club contests. I suspect the format works best for club events in the 8 to 20 range or thereabouts. Why don't some of the clubs give it a try for their monthly events and report back to RCSE or RCGroups? The rules may merit some tweaking but the best way to figure that is to give it a shot. The Class A format draws more entries each month at Dallas than just about anything else - and that's a pretty competitive group of guys. One of the things it DEFINITELY accomplishes is draw more club members into club activities. If you're in it for the group and not just for yourself, that's not a bad outcome. Way to go Tim! - Dave R >Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2008 13:12:06 EST From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Soaring@airage.com Subject: "The Problem of Tim's Contest Format" Duh, I can't believe I have to post this :-) The biggest problem with Tim's Contest format is us all missing flying it. Gordy **Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape. http://body.aol.com/fitness/winter-exercise?NCID=aolcmp0030002489
Re: [RCSE] Contest Format: Some personal experience
It's only a faster pace (getting a chance to fly again, that is) for those pilots who don't/can't max. the task times, correct? If everyone is maxing the task times than it is no faster than the traditional MoM format if I am understanding these rules correctly. > With bigger planes and their higher launch altitudes, the whole process > will > be more sedate, but it sounds to me like it would be fun in its own way > because of the faster pace than usual in that category. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
RE: [RCSE] Contest Format
This is Match play, just like they do in FF. You either max the time, or you are out! It does not matter what time you set, just that it has to be maxed. If you want to add difficulty, then just increase the flight time 1 or 2 minutes per round. We did a type of this contest in DLG at Visalia in 2006. I was CD. I had an airhorn. Everyone launched, and when 10 seconds had passed, the horn blew, and every pilot had to do a loop, then the first pilots down were eliminated. Next I made them do a loop at 10 second, then another at 30 seconds. It went on. Would you believe it that we got up to 4 loops then wait 20 seconds and then 4 more loops. Scoring was obvious, you made it or you didn't. The last round was tough as pilots pulled out with about 4 inches to spare. > Original Message > Subject: [RCSE] Contest Format > From: tony estep <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Date: Thu, January 10, 2008 2:16 pm > To: soaring@airage.com > > Original message: > ...short of 10 minutes then zero flight points. Isn't that what all the top > experts do in each contest. > > If you can't make the time, what makes you think you are good enough to get > landing points either? > === > Which suggests a slight variation on the 10-9-8 etc. scheme: Only the maxers > or round-winners get to go on to the next round -- everybody else is > eliminated. That would really move things along. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
RE: [RCSE] Contest Format
Nope, I MEAN no flight points because you never made the 10 minutes to be able to qualify for any sort of landing. Well..I guess it eliminated landing points too. Brutal! > Original Message > Subject: Re: [RCSE] Contest Format > From: Jeff Steifel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Date: Thu, January 10, 2008 2:23 pm > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Cc: "RCSE (E-mail)" > > I think you meant zero the landing points, not the flight points. > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > Why not just have everyone fly for 10 minutes to qualify for a landing > > attempt with 1 meter concentric divisions like f3J. After all, isn't > > that what it's about? Why not give bonus points for landing if they are > > within 2 seconds over the time. If they are short of 10 minutes then > > zero flight points. > > > > Isn't that what all the top experts do in each contest. > > > > If you can't make the time, what makes you think you are good enough to > > get landing points either? > > > > BTW, DLG contests do MOM all the time. > > > > The thought pattern is TOTALLY different in DLG contests. There is a > > set task, either you make it or you don't. The only thing I constantly > > hear is how many points did you DROP, not how many points did you > > achieve. > > > > This is not basketball, it is more like Golf. The course is rated and > > you know the task (par value) and you are being measured on what you can > > or cannot achieve. > > > > Chris > > > > RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and > > "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and > > unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. > > Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT > > in text format > > > > > > > > > > -- > Jeff Steifel RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Re: 2.4 Gig JR v Futaba ???
mithrandir Wrote: > Please go here and you will find step by step directions to do the > installation of the update and setup of the 2.4 GHZ system... > SUPER EASY!!! > > http://www.teamflyingcirkus.com/Forums/tabid/54/forumid/7/tpage/1/view/topic/postid/10407/Default.aspx#10407 I went there and did not find anything. Perhaps you can copy the post here. Ed Anderson -- aeajr aeajr's Profile: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/member.php?u=16056 View this thread: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=781514 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Re: 2.4 install problems
Robert, Did you ever resolve your range problems? If so, I am interested in knowing what you changed. Ed Anderson LISF Robert Samuels Wrote: > I bought a 2.4 9303 and > installed an AR6200 in an Organic which has an all Kevlar nosecone. > But it does not work. I put the main receiver in the nose with the > antennas fore and aft and the remote receiver on the bottom of the > fuse > behind the tow hook with the antennas exiting the fuse through small > holes so that the antennas were pointing > left and right. The range is lousy. > > I put > an AR6100 in the nose of a DLG TabooGt (all carbon fuse) with the > antennas sticking out the sides so it looks like a little catfish. > The > range was poor. So I extended the antennas by laying a piece of > insulated wire along side the original antennas held with heat shrink > so that the new wire was 31 mm longer than the original antennas. > This > gave me decent range and I've flown it successfully. But I don't like > all that wire sticking out in the airflow. I'd like a better > arrangement but can not think of one. > > Does anyone know of any > successful installations in these planes? Or have suggestions? > > Thank you > > Robert Samuels St. Louis > > > _ > im is proud to present Cause Effect, a series about real people making > a difference. > http://im.live.com/Messenger/IM/MTV/?source=text_Cause_Effect -- aeajr aeajr's Profile: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/member.php?u=16056 View this thread: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=785755 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Re: 2.4 Gig JR v Futaba ???
aeajr Wrote: > I went there and did not find anything. Perhaps you can copy the post > here. > Ed Anderson Ed - I think you'll need to set up an account and sign in to see the stuff he's refering to. You can also find the info on Futaba's sight. I had to actually read the instructions and try again, but it was pretty straight forward when I actually followed the directions. It only hurt for a little while. :o -- Robglover Robglover's Profile: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/member.php?u=22665 View this thread: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=781514 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Re: Challenge...
Lex Mierop Wrote: > RCSE sends posts from people directly subscribed to the list > immediately > to all those on the list. > > If you receive RCSE through a forwarder or post from a web based forum > (such as rcgroups.com), those posts need to be screened by one of the > moderators before it will be posted to the subscribers. This is all > done to ensure that SPAM and other off-topic posts are sent to > everyone > on RCSE. The downside is that the moderators (Mike L and myself) have > lives, and don't always get around to approving posts. When there is > a > delay, this is why. > > -l > > > Lex - > If you'd quit spending all your time watching those old DVDs you > would have time to approve my posts in a timely fashion! > Bubba -- Robglover Robglover's Profile: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/member.php?u=22665 View this thread: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=794683 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Re: "Maybe the Best 'Airframe' I Have Ever Seen on the Beach...EVER, Puerto V Today"
GGGEE... I musta hit pretty close to home to have Gordo post that much of a philosophical rant. It's like this... when you start out with "I don't know where you've been" etc. online, it can't help coming off as an insulting bunch of crap, as others pointed out to you. You should remember that if you kick someone in the crotch, they may kick back. But you're right. The limiting of line length and winch power is pretty silly... almost as silly as people saying a tactless travelling salesmani "soaring's ambassaror." See you at SWC? Jack -- schrederman schrederman's Profile: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/member.php?u=13218 View this thread: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=799088 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Re: Contest Format
Tim, The idea of points based on landing order seems OK to me. However a couple of details confuse me. Perhaps you can clarify. 1) 30 seconds to land when you are the last man up seems a bit harsh. If everyone else is down because they failed to find lift, and I am 3/4 mile out and 1000 feet up because I was successful now penalized me for my success. I may not be able to get back in 30 seconds and make a proper approach for landing points. Your approach would penalize me for my success and their failure. 2) Your system favors people who fly in smaller rounds. I score better based on the smaller group rather than my skills. Unless you gurantee even rounds, I see this as a serious issue. 3) Part of your rational seems to be that my round has to finish before the next can start. Why would that be the case? Every contest I have flown has allowed for multiple groups in rapid succession. I have never seen a problem with this. So how does calling people in on a rushed basis help move the contest along? I don't understand how this works. I say, let me fly out the task time if I wish. If landing order is the key, as long as I land within task time plus one minute, the duration of my flight should not matter. I think your system is interesting, but I don't understand how it deals with these points or how it makes for a faster paced contest. I also don't see how it prevents luck from playing a role, or how it prevents "air poacing" whatever that is. And how does it prevent sand bagging? Finally, could you explain how landing points play in this system? Ed Anderson Long Island Silent Flyers Eastern Soaring League Tim Bennett Wrote: > This past November, I was contest director for a monthly contest of the > Soaring League of North Texas at which I tried out a new format for > Man-on-Man competition. It was well received. The format addresses a > few of > my pet peeves about soaring contests. I offer this description in the > hopes > that readers of the exchange may be interested. > > First, a few comments about my objectives: > > Fast paced contest. > Scoring and judging must be easy and quick. > Minimal luck factor. > Everyone has a chance to succeed on each flight. > A blown flight does not end your day. > A blown landing does not end your day. > No dropped rounds; all flights count. > Emphasis on flying and consistency. > A contest not won in the air, cannot be won in the landing circle. > No sandbagging or air poaching. > > .. > > Tim Bennett > LSF IV > > -- aeajr aeajr's Profile: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/member.php?u=16056 View this thread: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=798989 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Re: "Maybe the Best 'Airframe' I Have Ever Seen on the Beach...EVER, Puerto V Today"
Wait just a gosh darn minute.. You mean to tell me the Gordy is hanging out at a four season resort with the most beautiful airframe(aka the most beautiful woman he has ever seen) within view and he still has time or makes time to write a batch of BS deep enough to float a battleship. Gordy..Gordy..Gordy..Put your beer goggles on, drop the sailplane guff and go after her. Hey youre out of the country its all good. Either that or snap a few pics for your flying buddies.. Wait a second I thinkl I see one of those cold weather thermals.. Gotta go Yours Wdkk -- WDKK WDKK's Profile: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/member.php?u=130621 View this thread: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=799088 RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Experimental contest format.
Good morning, I felt compelled to throw something out for comment, but we in the Tidewater Model Soaring Society (TMSS) have been messing around with club contest formats, as it seems many others have been doing. I was the CD in December, and had a somewhat different event to try-out. Basically, the concept of rounds was kind of abandoned and we blended in a constant-task ladder event with a nominal 10-minute task. Here are the details: 1) The first round was basic 10-minute duration, open winch, with FAI landing tapes. You needed a timer for this round. The need for this round will be clearer after you read the rest. 2) After the first round, we flew non-precision duration 10-minute tasks, still with the FAI tapes. Pilots needed some way of knowing when they reached 10-minutes of airtime, then they could shoot the landing and didn't need someone timing them. The resulting score was 10:00 plus whatever the landing was if the flight was 10-minutes or more. If the flight was less than 10:00 minutes, the score was zero (no landing either). Everyone was on their honor. 3) The winner was whoever had the highest score. You could fly as many times as you wanted (within the established contest window of 10am to 4pm, or until all gave-up) and use whatever launch equipment you had as long as it didn't out-perform the single club winch. This format enabled all to fly a lot and was kind of man-on-man, just not on a per-round fashion. The man-on-man part was on a per-day basis. So, it was fly or be buried, no excuses. The need for the first round was to avoid anyone having a zero score for the day (i.e. juice box and a snack ;-)) and provided some finer separation, if needed. Some free benefits occurred: pop-offs, bad-air, bad-luck, etc, were no longer meaningful issues. If you didn't like your flight, do it again. Seems like many liked it, though some boycotted it. Perhaps re-arranging pilot classes could help (i.e. I am here to fly my blank-off and bury everyone class, or I am here to fly, sort of, but want a 2+-hour lunch break class). It would be interesting to see if this concept could be scaled-up. Perhaps the advent of 2.4 gig technology could help alleviate potential frequency issues with applying this to a larger event. Thoughts? Thanks, Josh.
[RCSE] Contest Format
This topic always brings a chuckle to me. Larry's idea is the only one (other than rolling dice or cutting cards) that gives everyone an even chance to win with no regard for their skills or equipment. If that's what you're looking for, that's the way to go. But who's looking for that? I've been to contests for over 20 years, and the best pilots, with the best skills and equipment usually win, as they should. What would be the point of anything else? Does winning a contest by luck make anyone feel any better? I doubt it. The real benefit of contest flying (to me) is the comradery, the sport, the challenge, and the competition (the thrill of victory and the agony of defeat). I would never throw that away for a win of a "luck" driven contest. The pilots that are better than I (and there are many), challenge me and push me to fly better. I wouldn't have it any other way! Hank ** Henry P. Schorz Executive Vice President - Chief Scientist ACT Litigation Services 27200 Tourney Road Suite 450 Valencia, Ca 91355 PH: (661) 284-6401 x232 FX: (661) 284-7654 ** Confidentiality Notice: The information contained in this e-mail and any attachments may be legally privileged and confidential. If you are not an intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this e-mail is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender and permanently delete the e-mail and any attachments immediately. You should not retain, copy or use this e-mail or any attachment for any purpose, nor disclose all or any part of the contents to any other person. Thank you in advance for your cooperation.
[RCSE] Contest Format
This topic always brings a chuckle to me. Larry's idea is the only one (other than rolling dice or cutting cards) that gives everyone an even chance to win with no regard for their skills or equipment. If that's what you're looking for, that's the way to go. But who's looking for that? I've been to contests for over 20 years, and the best pilots, with the best skills and equipment usually win, as they should. What would be the point of anything else? Does winning a contest by luck make anyone feel any better? I doubt it. The real benefit of contest flying (to me) is the comradery, the sport, the challenge, and the competition (the thrill of victory and the agony of defeat). I would never throw that away for a win of a "luck" driven contest. The pilots that are better than I (and there are many), challenge me and push me to fly better. I wouldn't have it any other way! Hank ** Henry P. Schorz Executive Vice President - Chief Scientist ACT Litigation Services 27200 Tourney Road Suite 450 Valencia, Ca 91355 PH: (661) 284-6401 x232 FX: (661) 284-7654 ** Confidentiality Notice: The information contained in this e-mail and any attachments may be legally privileged and confidential. If you are not an intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of this e-mail is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error, please notify the sender and permanently delete the e-mail and any attachments immediately. You should not retain, copy or use this e-mail or any attachment for any purpose, nor disclose all or any part of the contents to any other person. Thank you in advance for your cooperation. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
Re: [RCSE] Re: 2.4 Gig JR v Futaba ???
One thing you have to be careful with on ground range checks is the ground. Having the antenna just about on the ground really reduces range. You get a a lot more repeatable test if the models is a foot or so off the ground. 72 is similar, But 72 and 2.4 are quite a bit different in wave length, look at the antenna length, so things behave differently sitting right on the ground. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
Re: [RCSE] Re: Challenge...
>From the FAI web page. The second sentence fascinates me. F3J - Thermal Duration Gliders This class is very popular as it is a single task event with simple rules. The competitors try to keep their models aloft for exactly 10 minutes and land as close as possible to a designated spot. Launching the model is achieved by hand towing, where two persons with a 150m-monofilament line pull the model. Pilots are divided in groups, after a matrix schedule, so that during the preliminary or qualifying rounds, they compete against as many as possible of the other pilots. Then the top pilots fly in a single group the Final or Fly-Off rounds, which determine the winner. Excuse my ignorance I am new to the world of soaring. Are they launching like this in international competition? Sounds fun. VFBASS RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
[RCSE] Re: Contest Format
This is amazing. Someone comes up with a new idea on how to run a contest and all I see coming from the masses is ridicule. I feel that someone who can think outside the norm and takes a chance diserves a little more credit than many of you are giving them. SMOM is not the only contest format available. SMOM may be fun but it had to be flown for the first time at some point. How far would it have gone if everyone took the same stance as those on this exchange Yes I am still new to this sport, but I can hold my own in most contests (sometimes top 3, sometimes bottom 3). Thanks for the time. Alan
[RCSE] How F3J models are launched
- Original Message - From: "D M" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> From the FAI web page. The second sentence fascinates me. F3J - Thermal Duration Gliders This class is very popular as it is a single task event with simple rules. The competitors try to keep their models aloft for exactly 10 minutes and land as close as possible to a designated spot. Excuse my ignorance I am new to the world of soaring. Are they launching like this in international competition? Sounds fun. Here are some pictures from the last US F3J team selection contest: http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?p=8102305#post8102305 Someone else might have some better pictures to link to. The answer is: Yes, that is how F3J models are launched. RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
Re: [RCSE] Contest Format
Jeff It is if you only go over the working time you get zero landing points and a 30 point penalty in F3J. Dr. Danny Williams D.C. "Bad Roads bring good people and good roads bring bad people" Colorado Springs, Colorado From: Jeff Steifel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: "RCSE (E-mail)" Subject: Re: [RCSE] Contest Format I think you meant zero the landing points, not the flight points. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Why not just have everyone fly for 10 minutes to qualify for a landing > attempt with 1 meter concentric divisions like f3J. After all, isn't > that what it's about? Why not give bonus points for landing if they are > within 2 seconds over the time. If they are short of 10 minutes then > zero flight points.
[RCSE] Contests format.
It's been a long time since I flew it, but Triathalon seemed like a challenging event for contests. Anyone still flying that? Ron **Start the year off right. Easy ways to stay in shape. http://body.aol.com/fitness/winter-exercise?NCID=aolcmp0030002489
Re: [RCSE] Re: F3J launch
They Sure are It's hella of fun to launch off of Mono :-) D M <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Excuse my ignorance I am new to the world of soaring. Are they launching like this in international competition? Sounds fun. VFBASS
Re: [RCSE] Contests format.
Ron, If you thought that there's been a lot of criticism about the latest contest format suggestion in this forum, you should have been around for the Triathlon discussion. Jim Deck
Re: [RCSE] Contest Format
Ok, so what if no one makes the time. Does everyone get a zero. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Nope, I MEAN no flight points because you never made the 10 minutes to be able to qualify for any sort of landing. Well..I guess it eliminated landing points too. Brutal! Original Message Subject: Re: [RCSE] Contest Format From: Jeff Steifel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Date: Thu, January 10, 2008 2:23 pm To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Cc: "RCSE (E-mail)" I think you meant zero the landing points, not the flight points. [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Why not just have everyone fly for 10 minutes to qualify for a landing attempt with 1 meter concentric divisions like f3J. After all, isn't that what it's about? Why not give bonus points for landing if they are within 2 seconds over the time. If they are short of 10 minutes then zero flight points. Isn't that what all the top experts do in each contest. If you can't make the time, what makes you think you are good enough to get landing points either? BTW, DLG contests do MOM all the time. The thought pattern is TOTALLY different in DLG contests. There is a set task, either you make it or you don't. The only thing I constantly hear is how many points did you DROP, not how many points did you achieve. This is not basketball, it is more like Golf. The course is rated and you know the task (par value) and you are being measured on what you can or cannot achieve. Chris RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]. Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format -- Jeff Steifel RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED]. Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format -- Jeff Steifel RCSE-List facilities provided by Model Airplane News. Send "subscribe" and "unsubscribe" requests to [EMAIL PROTECTED] Please note that subscribe and unsubscribe messages must be sent in text only format with MIME turned off. Email sent from web based email such as Hotmail and AOL are generally NOT in text format
Re: [RCSE] Contest Format
Hi gang, I just gotta chime in here. I know Tim and have flown with him and the rest of the SLNT crew as well as Tulsoar back in the day..I appreciate what Tim has thrown out here for us to chew on..no one has said that anyone should use this format in ALL contests, but it might be interesting to try it as Dave Register says...it's occasionally not a bad idea to level the field a little, especially if there are newcomers in a club that might benefit from a contest where they just might not get hammered to last place because they couldn't make the precision times, or they can't afford more than an OLY for the time being.they may be practicing, but they may also have a job and a family that they choose to spend time with that limits that practice time..but they still enjoy this wonderful hobby.so once in awhile run a contest where their choices of practice level or aircraft doesn't necessarily doom them to the bottom of the pile...no one enjoys coming in last or in the back of the pack every time.but some folks may not have access to the hardware, time and even patience to get to the level of the really good fliers.and this scoring system looks like it has that potentialI'm not saying let them win for the sake of winning, but you would be suprised just how much better a person might feel if he places in the middle of the pack instead of the bottom.it might even entice him to practice more...after that, then hammer them back into oblivion.. flame on!! Later.. ( Tim, I may see you guys Sunday) Kevin O'Dell On Jan 10, 2008, at 10:31 AM, Joe Rodriguez wrote: Tim, I see and understand where you are going, and respectfully disagree. I fly model sailplanes to compete and so a contest to me is a test of skills among peers. Like Golfing I work at every aspect of flying to improve my game in order to get that edge on the less skilled, the less prepared and the less knowledgeable. So for me when it all comes together for a win or high place, the taste of victory is sweet although brief is very addictive. This is what keeps me going I can fun fly anytime!! I look forward to a true contest of skills. To level the playing field and to reward players for not being prepared, less skilled or less practiced will give them a false sense of success. They will wonder why they got there A%$ handed to them when they attend a real contest, and who fault is that? smokinjoe
