from:"Jela Jovanovic"




> 
> source:
> http://news.independent.co.uk/world/middle_east/story.jsp?story=94339
> 
> Stunned into disbelief as their 'normal' son is blamed
> Robert Fisk in Almarj, Lebanon, meets the family of Ziad Jarrah, who
> died trying to destroy the White House
> 16 September 2001
> 
> When Ziad Jarrah climbed aboard United Airlines flight 93 from Newark to
> San Francisco, was he planning to holiday in California or to destroy
> the White House? The United States says the latter. His family begs
> visitors and friends to believe in his innocence. His father Samir sat
> beside me yesterday afternoon and opened his palms in that gesture of
> innocence which is also a form of special pleading.
> 
> "He called just two days before the plane crashed to tell me he'd
> received the $2,000 [£1,400] I'd sent him,'' Samir Jarrah said. Still
> recovering from open-heart surgery, he sat, half slumped, sick and
> traumatised, in a green plastic chair beneath the vines of his garden.
> "Ziad said it was for his aeronautical course. He had told me last year
> that he had a choice of courses - in France or in America - and it was
> me who told him to go to the States. But there are lots of Ziads. Maybe
> it wasn't him? He was a good, kind boy...''
> 
> At which point Samir leaned forward, brought his hands to his face and
> broke down in tears.
> 
> Around us, a clutch of middle-aged men sat on identical chairs beneath
> the vines, most of them members of the extended Jarrah family, all Sunni
> Muslims, all appalled that a crime against humanity should stain this
> tiny but wealthy village in Lebanon's Bekaa Valley. A massive new
> village mosque - I've never seen so big a mosque in so small a town -
> stood scarcely 200 metres from the front door, but both friends of the
> family and Ziad Jarrah's uncle insisted that he was neither religious
> nor political. "He was a normal person, Jamal Harrah said. "He drank
> alcohol, he had girlfriends. Only last August, his Turkish girlfriend,
> Asle, came to meet our family here because she wanted to meet her future
> in-laws. He wasn't able to come with her because he said he was too busy
> with his studies.''
> 
> Too busy to bring his fiancée to meet his family? Busy doing what? And
> what was the $2,000 for? To continue studies at his Miami aeronautical
> school? Or to buy air tickets for the Boeing 757 flight to California,
> for him perhaps - and maybe for the other men named as hijackers by the
> US government. It was Ziad Jarrah's flight that plunged to the ground in
> Pennsylvania, apparently en route to self-destruction on the White
> House, its passengers apparently wrestling with the hijackers, perhaps
> with Ziad as he gripped the aircraft controls.
> 
> Asle was in Germany, freely giving evidence to the Bochum city police
> who had just searched her apartment, discovering "aircraft-related
> documents'' in a suitcase belonging to one of three men named by
> Washington as hijackers. All of them - something the Jarrah family could
> not explain and would not believe - lived together in Hamburg.
> 
> Asle had already reported Ziad missing, just as she had 18 months ago
> when he disappeared for up to five weeks. And what she told the Jarrah
> family over the telephone then gave them their first suspicion that
> something was terribly wrong with their only son.
> 
> For according to a family friend, Asle told the Jarrahs that her fiancé,
> who would visit her each weekend from his university in Hamburg, might
> have gone to Afghanistan. Jamal Jarrah confirmed to me that this is what
> Asle had feared. "But it turned out that he had been moving from his
> first university in Greifswald to his new courses in Hamburg and had not
> been in contact with Asle during that time.'' Five weeks to change
> universities? Without telling his fiancée? Jamal hinted at some problems
> between the couple at that time. But even so, would he not have told his
> girlfriend his whereabouts?
> 
> The details of Ziad's life are as simple - or so the family say - as his
> death is obscure. Three other men have been named as hijackers of Flight
> UA93 - Ahmed Alhaznawi, Ahmed Alnami and Saeed Alghamdi - and if two of
> them lived with Ziad in Germany, his guilt seemed even more certain when
> it was revealed that one of his fellow students was Mohamad Atta, the
> Egyptian-born pilot who crashed American Airlines flight AA11 into the
> World Trade Centre on Tuesday morning. "You cannot choose your fellow
> students," Jamal Jarrah said. "He wouldn't have known his fellow
> students before he turned up at the university.'' Or would he?
> 
> Ziad was 26, born - according to his Lebanese identity documents - on 11
> May 1975, a village boy from a wealthy family. His father is a civil
> servant in the Beirut department of social security, his mother a
> schoolteacher. Ziad attended the evangelical school in the Christian
> town of Zahle - about 12 miles from his home - and Samir paid thousands
> to put

[NSP] Fw: [CTRL] Homepages Of Friends Of Suspected Terrorist Pilot



- Original Message - 
Sent: Sunday, September 16, 2001 4:31 AM
Subject: [CTRL] Homepages Of Friends Of Suspected Terrorist Pilot


http://www.aheadnews.com/gary.html 



9.15.01 UPDATE: 

"Writer Todd Brendan Fahey has obtained the following URLs of persons connected to at 
least one deceased suspect, Marwan Alshehhi of the United Arab Emirates, a pilot of 
the plane which flew into the first tower; one contains a guest-book of addresses of 
potential importance to FBI and CIA investigators: ... 

...Developing http://www.geocities.com/Broadway/Alley/8822/home.html 

...Developing http://www.angelfire.com/al/RA7AAL/LINK.html 

...Developing http://www.angelfire.com/hi/salsabeel/ 

...Developing http://www.angelfire.com/ok/shay6oon/main.html 

...Developing http://www.geocities.com/CollegePark/Lab/3555/ 

...Developing http://callisto.guestworld.tripod.lycos.com/wgb/wgbview.dbm?owner=RA7AAL 

Additionally, through a German source, it is known that Marwan and Atta, as they were 
known, attended Technical University of Hamburg-Harburg, where Marwan is recalled by 
few and who likely finished his studies on structural architecture via correspondence 
or non-traditional means; Atta, conversely, "moved through campus like a fish in 
water," and was both a physical and intellectual presence there. This list of 
potential terrorist cell members is exclusive to AheadNews.com by Todd Brendan Fahey 
and may be reprinted only in its entirety and with this sentence in place." 

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[NSP] Molba


Molim clanove SIEM-a da se prikljuce akciji da se pomogne dr Sanji Tadic, ginekologu u 
Domu zdravlja Zemun ( okupiran od strane zemunskih ustasa i  dosmanlija), da se povuce 
odluka - smanjene plate sest meseci za 30%odsto,istu je donela direktorka Doma 
zdravlja poznata srbomrziteljka dr. Salaski.
19.07.2001. godine dr Sanja Tadic je primila u ordinaciju pacijentkinju, tokom 
pregleda UZ pri uzimanja anamneze ista je zatrazila od doktorke prevodioca na albanski 
jezi,. dr Sanja Tadic je odgovorila "  mozete da dobijete  prevodioca ukoliko ste  
drzavljanka Albanije, ako ste sa Kosova i Metohije ne moze". Od tog trenutka pocinje 
teror od strane gore navedene Salaski i zaposlenih radnika hrvatske nacionlonosti i 
dosmanlija.
Poslednjih meseci je ustaljena praksa,  kada hoce da te oteraju sa posla krenu 
ucestalo da ti salju Siptarke - provokatorke, to je izum grobokopaca Mihajlovica i 
ostale bagabunde. Posto je Sanja Tadic mlada i naivna nije shvatila da ima posla sa 
provokatorkom.
Molim Vas da uputite pismo baba seri i djindjicu i trazite da se odluka ponisti, i da 
se dr Salaski upozori da prestane da maltretira lekarke srpkinje.
pukovnik 
Plata lekara specijaliste je 6.000 dinara  kada  oduzmu 30% ne ostaje bas da se 
prezivi, zima je na pragu. 

  
DSS <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; 
Demokratska stranka <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>  

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[NSP] Fw: Morgan Stanley says miraculous number of staff alive



> -Caveat Lector-
>
> Click Here: http://biz.yahoo.com/rf/010913/n13231304_2.html";>Yahoo -
> Morgan Stanley says miraculous number o.
> -
> Related QuotesMWD
> 48.90
> +0.00
>
> delayed 20 mins - disclaimer
> Thursday September 13, 7:37 pm Eastern Time
>
> Morgan Stanley says miraculous number of staff alive
>
> (UPDATE: Adds details, executive quotes)
>
> By Brian Kelleher
> NEW YORK, Sept 13 (Reuters) - Investment bank Morgan Stanley (NYSE:MWD -
news
> ), the World Trade Center's largest tenant with 3,700 employees, said on
> Thursday a remarkably high number of its staff escaped Tuesday's vicious
air
> attack that pulverized the twin towers.
>
> 
> Morgan Stanley Dean Witter & Co., which occupied 25 floors in the complex,
> was only missing 15 employees, a high-ranking official said. The firm,
which
> had 3,700 employees in the complex, had earlier said between 30 and 40
> workers were unaccounted for.
> ``It's a miracle,'' Chief Executive Philip Purcell told reporters Thursday
> evening.
> The firm had emergency plans that were sharpened in the wake of the 1993
> World Trade Center bombing, and President Bob Scott said Morgan Stanley's
> staff knew exactly what to do.
> ``I would describe it as a collective reflex,'' Scott said. Morgan Stanley
> had offices between floors 44 and 74 in Two World Trade Center, the second
> building struck by a hijacked commercial plane on Tuesday.
> The news is in stark contrast to the grim story of bond trading firm
Cantor
> Fitzgerald.
> Cantor's offices, which held 1,000 employees, were on floors 101 and 103
> through 105 in the World Trade Center's 110-story north tower. The company
> has issued a preliminary list of 320 workers it has accounted for but its
> chief executive said in a TV interview Thursday he is unaware of anyone
who
> escaped from their World Trade Center offices.
> Two hijacked commercial planes slammed into the twin towers Tuesday
morning,
> eventually causing them to collapse and creating chaos in the downtown
> financial district.
> In a tearful interview on ABC-TV, Cantor Fitzgerald Chief Executive Howard
> Lutnick said he wasn't in the office on Tuesday because he was bringing
his
> son to his first day of kindergarten.
> ``My view of business is different,'' Lutnick said. ``I need to try to be
> successful in business so I can take care of ... 700 families who are
> dreaming to find someone,'' referring to the families of the employees
feared
> dead.
> MORGAN STANLEY EXECUTIVES' TOP PRIORITY IS ITS PEOPLE
> Purcell's top priority has been the firm's employees since he and other
top
> executives hastily abandoned a Tuesday morning meeting to watch the tragic
> events unfold.
> ``I went to the window in my office, because you can see World Trade 1 and
> 2,'' he said. The second plane attack stunned him.
> ``I said 'My God, I hope they're out'.''
> Workers at Morgan Stanley's Discover credit card unit call centers fielded
> about 50,000 calls from people looking for or offering information on the
> firm's employees.
> Morgan Stanley's operations at the World Trade Center, which processed
trades
> and maintained account data for its retail brokerage accounts, will
largely
> be moved to a contingency site in lower Manhattan, executives said.
> New York City officials allowed the other facility to operate with a
skeleton
> crew on Thursday and Morgan Stanley expects a full crew of 400 people to
be
> working there on Friday.
> ``Morgan Stanley is open for business,'' Purcell said.
> U.S. bond markets reopened on Thursday morning, while national stock
markets
> closed for the third day in a row. U.S. stock markets will open on Monday
at
> 9:30 a.m. EDT (1330 GMT), according to Richard Grasso, chairman of the New
> York Stock Exchange.
> Exchanges and firms will start running tests of their systems on Saturday
> morning.
> Email this story - Most-emailed articles - Most-viewed articles
>
> 
>
> More Quotes and News:   Morgan Stanley Dean Witter & Co (NYSE:MWD - news)
> Related News Categories: banking, US Market News
> 
>
> Help
>

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[NSP] Fw: Lebanon: Druze Leader Believes CIA, Mossad Behind US Attacks

2001-09-15 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic



- Original Message - > 9:09 AM
> Subject: Lebanon: Druze Leader Believes CIA, Mossad Behind US Attacks
> 
> 
>  FYI
>  
>  Saturday September 15, 5:55 PM
>  Lebanese Druze leader believes CIA, Mossad responsible
>  for US attacks
>  BEIRUT, Sept 15 (AFP) - 
>  Lebanon's anti-Syrian Druze leader Walid Jumblatt
>  believes the CIA and Israel's secret service Mossad
>  are behind the terrorist attacks in the United States,
>  and that Saudi extremist Osama bin Laden is an
>  "American agent," newspaper reports said Saturday.
>  "There are a number of questions on the authors of the
>  attacks in America. I think they (the attacks) were a
>  great coup carried out by the secret services. The CIA
>  and the Mossad could be behind (the attacks) to
>  provoke a new war and impoverish and occupy the Middle
>  East," Jumblatt was quoted as saying.
>  "Who is bin Laden who has become the number one
>  (enemy) of western civilisations? He is an invention
>  of the American secret services who chose to fight
>  against the Soviets in Afghanistan with US backing,"
>  said Jumblatt, who had ties with the Soviet Union
>  until its collapse in 1991.
>  "It is an enormous scandal because in 1994, the CIA
>  pointed the finger at bin Laden as a very dangerous
>  man," Jumblatt said, adding: "It is also surprising
>  that a great state which has a military budget of 350
>  billion dollars, was not able to thwart these
>  attacks."
>  "One should find out whether the American (secret)
>  services are implicated in starting a merciless war
>  between America and the racist West against Arabs and
>  the Muslims," he said.
>  Jumblatt, who defends the Palestinian uprising and
>  their right to an independent state, also expressed
>  concern that the "war against terrorism" could develop
>  into a "huge massacre of Palestinians."
>  "Under the pretext of fighting bin Laden, the Zionists
>  may commit a huge massacre in Palestine to push
>  through an exodus of its Arab residents and give the
>  green-light to (Prime Minister Ariel Sharon) to carry
>  out a huge massacre," Jumblatt said.
>  He also called on Britain to "present its apologies to
>  the Arab and Muslim people for its crime: the creation
>  of Israel."
>  Britain, which in 1920 was granted a mandate over
>  Palestine up until the 1948 creation of the Israeli
>  state, promised to aid the "Jews to create a home in
>  Palestine," during the 1917 Balfour declaration often
>  considered to have led to the establishment of the
>  Jewish state.
>  Jumblatt, who was presiding over a ceremony in the
>  Shouf mountains southeast of Beirut, also called on
>  the audience to observe one minute of silence in
>  memory of the "innocent (people) killed in the World
>  Trade Center."
>  The silence was also held in memory of the "Arabs
>  killed in Palestine, in south Lebanon, in Syria,
>  Jordan and Iraq in the war against Israel," he said.
>  
>  
>  __
> 
> 

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[NSP] Was Flight 93 Shot Down?

2001-09-15 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic


http://www.rense.com/general13/yusf.htm 



Was UAL Flight 93 Shot 
Down By US Fighter? 

By Ian Goddard 

[EMAIL PROTECTED] 

c. 2001 Ian Williams Goddard 

9-14-1 

UPDATE 
  
UPI report excerpt: 
  
"The employee also told the newspaper that FAA air traffic controllers in Nashua 
learned through discussions with other controllers that an F-16 fighter stayed in hot 
pursuit of another hijacked commercial airliner until it crashed in Pennsylvania. 

By 10:30 a.m. Tuesday, the military had taken control of U.S. airspace, the employee 
said. Hijacked United Airlines Flight 93 crashed into a field in Pennsylvania at 10:37 
a.m. 

Although controllers don't have complete details of the Air Force's chase of the 
Boeing 757, they have learned the F-16 made 360-degree turns to remain close to the 
commercial jet, the employee said." 
  
Full UPI report: 

September 13, 2001 Hijacked jets nearly collided NASHUA, N.H., Sept. 13 (UPI) -- Two 
hijacked passenger jets that crashed into the World Trade Center nearly collided with 
each other before reaching New York City, the Nashua Telegraph reported Thursday. 
  
Quoting an unnamed Federal Aviation Administration employee at the Nashua control 
facility, the newspaper said it was told, "The two aircraft got too close to each 
other down by Stewart" International Airport in New Windsor, N.Y. 

Both Boeing 767s, American Airlines Flight 11 and United Airlines Flight 175 had taken 
off from Boston's Logan International Airport on Tuesday morning within 15 minutes of 
each other. 

Heading west to Los Angeles, both planes turned south toward New York City where they 
crashed into the World Trade Center's twin towers in massive fireballs. 

One air traffic controller in Nashua, along with an assistant, monitored the flight 
patterns of both jets. It appears that hijackers gained control of Flight 11 around 
Gardner, Mass. The employee said the aircraft "was just flying around, doing what it 
wanted." 

The employee said Flight 175 remained in the hands of its pilots until Albany, N.Y. 
The air traffic controller then noticed that the American Airlines plane had 
encountered difficulties when its transponder was shut off, the employee told the 
Telegraph. At that point, the plane veered from its course west. 

Soon after, the controller realized a hijacker was in Flight 11's cockpit because the 
plane's captain -- John Ogonowski of Dracut, Mass. -- turned on his microphone, the 
employee said. Ogonowski activated the microphone so the Federal Aviation 
Administration could hear the terrorists' threats, the employee said. 

The controller heard someone instruct, " 'Nobody do anything stupid,'" and no one 
would get hurt, the employee said. After that, the controller heard no more 
conversations, the employee said. 

"That's all that was heard," the employee said. When it became apparent the plane had 
fallen into the hands of hijackers, a third controller began helping the controller 
and his assistant and notified appropriate government agencies. 

The controller spoke with Flight 175 for quite some time after terrorists took command 
of Flight 11, the employee said. FAA controllers never expected Flight 175 to hit the 
second World Trade Center tower because of that sustained contact with the crew, the 
employee said. 

"It's not in anyone's mind they're hitting a target," the employee said. "When 
somebody takes a plane over, they try to negotiate a release with money," the employee 
said. 

"After the first plane hit, nobody imagined it would happen again," the employee said. 
"We all thought that was it. It (the crash by the second jet) totally caught everybody 
off guard." 

The controller is "pretty disturbed" that he lost both planes, the employee said. He 
handled both flights because they shared similar routes on their intended journey to 
Los Angeles, the employee said. 

The employee also told the newspaper that FAA air traffic controllers in Nashua 
learned through discussions with other controllers that an F-16 fighter stayed in hot 
pursuit of another hijacked commercial airliner until it crashed in Pennsylvania. 
By 10:30 a.m. Tuesday, the military had taken control of U.S. airspace, the employee 
said. Hijacked United Airlines Flight 93 crashed into a field in Pennsylvania at 10:37 
a.m. 

Although controllers don't have complete details of the Air Force's chase of the 
Boeing 757, they have learned the F-16 made 360-degree turns to remain close to the 
commercial jet, the employee said. 

"He must've seen the whole thing," the employee said of the F-16 pilot's view of 
Flight 93's crash. -- Copyright 2001 by United Press International. All rights 
reserved. 

- 
  
  
Yesterday (9/13/01) a Reuters report stated that the FBI cannot rule out that hijacked 
Flight 93 was shot down by a US fighter jet before it crashed in Pennsylvania. [1] 
Citing indications of a shoot down, the report states: 
  
"Pennsylvania state police officials said on Thursday de

[NSP] PUTEVI SLAMANJA TERORIZMA

2001-09-14 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic


UDRUZENJE GRADJANA "ODBOR ZA NACIONALNU SOLIDARNOST"
TOLSTOJEVA 34, BEOGRAD, YU


OLIVER VULOVIC
ul.27.marta 147,Beograd
011 400 392 , [EMAIL PROTECTED]


Nakon izvrsenih teroristickih napada na civilne i vojne ciljeve u Sjedinjenim Drzavama 
, pri kojim je stradalo na desetine hiljada  nevinih ljudi i naneta neprocenjiva 
materijalna steta , ceo svet se bavi analizom i predvidanjem mogucih  americkih poteza 
.
Nacini na koji se vrse pomenute analize , razlikuju se od toga na koji nacin 
analiticari posmatraju Ameriku, da li kao predvodnicu procesa globalizacije , pri cemu 
se nije libila ni upotrebe sile , sankcija , ucena i drugih sredstava prinude , kao 
jedinu supersilu , ili kao predvodnicu naprednog i civilizovanog sveta i utemeljitelja 
demokratskih vrednosti .
 
Oni prvi  se u analizama krecu u dva sasvim razlicita pravca. Jedni smatraju da ce SAD 
i ostali zagovornici globalizacije , teroristicke napade iskoristiti da sebe predstave 
kao zrtve i svoje buduce nastupe prema protivnicima globalizacije u svetu kreirati 
agresivnije . Kao upecatljive dokaze za svoj stav potkrepljuju poslednjim govorima 
Tonija Blera i Gerharda Sredera. Drugi smatraju da ce ovakva situacija Ameriku gurnuti 
u izolaciju i konacano u jedan jednak pristup terorizmu -uvek i na svakom mestu - kako 
je rekao i od Amerike trazio ruski predsednik Putin .

Analiticari koji SAD posmatraju kao jedinu super silu na planeti , ocekuju da ce ona 
ovu tragediju iskoristiti da snazno i brzo  udari po zemljama koje odavno ima -na 
nisanu- , kao sto su Sudan,Sirija,Avganistan,Irak,Iran , Libija i Severna Koreja.

I konacno , analiticari koji na SAD gledaju idealisticki , poput nekih vlada u 
Evropskoj Uniji i na Balkanu , ocekuju da ce americka diplomatija pokrenuti niz 
medunarodnih konferencija i drugih diplomatskih akcija i tako pokusati da preko UN 
iskoordiniraju jednu zajednicku diplomatsku akciju protiv terorizma.

Sto se nas u Srbiji tice odgovor je brzo stigao i to pravo iz usta sefa americke 
diplomatske kancelarije u Pristini , koji je pre privremenog zatvranja kancelarije , 
kosmetskim albancima uputio reci zahvalnosti za podrsku koju je kancelarija od njih 
dobila neposredno po prispecu prvih informacija o napadu, recima - Vi ste sada dragi 
Kosovari uz nas , kao sto smo mi nedavno bili uz Vas -.Moram napomenuti , da gospodin 
Montgomeri , americki ambasador u Beogradu , i pored vanrednog i dugog zasedanja DOS-a 
zbog iste stvari , sa kojeg su Amerikancima stigle izrazi sucesca i osude terorista , 
jos nije nasao vremena da -dragim Srbima- uputi makar malkice slicne izjave simpatija 
.Sudeci po ovim reakcijama , americka administracija ce i dalje imati dvostrike 
stndarde i za one koji napadaju njenu teritoriju imati najpogrdnije izraze i vrlo 
ostre kriterijume a za one koji ubijaju , otimaju , pale i otuduju drzavnu teritoriju 
drugih zemalja , drugaciji , otvoreni, saveznicki pristup. Kao prilog ovoj tezi naveo 
bih i ponasanje amerikanaca prema albanskim teroristima u Makedoniji .I sam Osama Bin 
Laden je nekada , u toku rusko-avganistanskog rata bio americki miljenik , a sada 
njegove kamikaze seju strah po srcu Amerike .

11. septembar , dan kada su napadnuti najveci simboli americke vojne i finansijeske 
moci , nije samo dan kada su americki narcisiodni generali i voditelji na CNN-u 
shvatili da ni njihova zemlja vise nije nedodirljiva i neranjiva , to je bio i dan 
kada je americkom narodu postalo jasno da vise nece moci svoj  stav prema politici 
vasingtonske administracije prema drugim narodima i drzava da gradi na osnovu 
kratkorocnih racunica i medijske harange. Jedno je napadati sa deset hiljada metara 
visine i pri tome ubijati nevine civile i sve to nazivati kolateralnom nesrecom , pri 
tome vodeci racuna da piloti ne dozive cak ni manji emotivni stres a drugo je brojati 
svoje zrtve i cistiti rusevine. Ogavni i bezumni cin terorista protiv Sjedinjenih 
drzava je pokazao da u trpljenju bola i ponizenja nemaju svi isti prag tolerancije kao 
sto su imali Vojska Jugoslavije i sve nase snage odbrane za vreme NATO agresije , kada 
ni jedan nas projektil nije odleteo u Makedoniju,Albaniju,Italiju,Madarsku,Bugarsku i 
Rumuniju i ako smo na to imali prirodno pravo , uzimajuci u obzir da je agresija 
vrsena sa teritorija tih drzava.Najmilitantniji predstavnici potlacenih su preneli rat 
na teritoriju SAD na najpodmukliji i kriminalan nacin za koji moraju biti kaznjeni , 
ali je to bio i jedini nacin , sa njihovog aspekta gledano , da neprijatelju svojih 
naroda nanesu , vojnicki gledano, dovoljno bolan udarac . Na kraju krajeva , na osnovu 
iste logike , ginuli su ljudi na ulicama Nisa,Surdulice,Cuprije,Varvarina,Novog Sada, 
Beograda i mnogih drugih mesta u Jugoslaviji  za vreme NATO agresije ali i po mnogim 
mestima sirom Kosmeta od strane siptarskih terorista i za tako nesto jos niko nije 
odgovarao .U Rusiji jos vidaju rane i tuguju za poginulim u miniranim stambenim 
zgradama a cecenski teroristi jos nisu zasluzil

[NSP] Fw: Banner of Libert - This War Began When Clinton Sided with Osama bin La

2001-09-14 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic



- Original Message -
From: Mary Mostert <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Gavin Grooms <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 5:18 PM
Subject: Banner of Libert - This War Began When Clinton Sided with Osama bin
Laden


> This War Began When Clinton Sided with Osama bin Laden
> http://www.bannerofliberty.com/OS9-01MQC/9-14-2001.1.html
>
> Are we Finally Switching Sides with George W. Bush as Commander-in-Chief?
> By Mary Mostert, Analyst, Banner of Liberty (www.bannerofliberty.com)
>
> September 14, 2001
>
> President George W. Bush tells us we are "at War" against terrorism. We've
> BEEN at war since the early 1990s - a war started in the Balkans, and a
war
> in which Bill Clinton made America an ally of Osama bin Laden and the
> terrorists. On March 23, 1999, a day before Clinton began a 79-day bombing
> attack on the Serbs, talk show host Michael Reagan said:
>
>
> "If you listen to my show a lot you'll remember that last week Col. David
> Hackworth said that many of the weapons being bought and paid for by the
> Kosovo Liberation Army are being bought and paid for by drugs,. Mary
> Mostert, my editor, who has developed sources in Europe, verified the drug
> connection. She sent me the Prague Post article reporting that one of the
> 'drug gangs' of the Kosovo Albanian 'Kosovo Liberation Army,' which
supplies
> up to 90% of the illegal heroin in Scandinavia, had been arrested. (See:
> http://www.reagan.com/HotTopics.main/HotMike/document-3.22.1999.12.html)
> "It seems when there's drugs the President of the United States somehow
> always comes down on the side of the drug lords. Just as Hollywood always
> seems to come down on the side of Communists and uplifts them, the
President
> always uplifts those who are dealing with drugs.
>
> "He says there's a war on drugs? Maybe there is a war that is going to
begin
> this week that's going to be paid for by drugs and we're going to be part
of
> it."
>
> It does. I've been writing about Osama bin Laden for years, especially his
> strange relationship with Bill Clinton (More) -
> http://www.bannerofliberty.com/OS9-01MQC/9-14-2001.1.html
>

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[NSP] Fw: CNN crime against public information [WWW.STOPNATO.ORG.UK]

2001-09-14 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic



> .
> - Original Message - 
> From: secr <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2001 6:33 PM
> Subject: [mobilize-globally] CNN crime against public information
> 
> 
> Subject:
>  [UK_Left_Network] Indymedia
> Date:
>  Thu, 13 Sep 2001 15:51:47 +0100
> From:
>  one 23 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>  Reply-To:
>  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>   To:
>  <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>  CC:
>  Rachel Tolhurst <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> 
> 
> 
> 
> >From Indymedia.
> 
> http://www.indymedia.org.il/imc/israel/webcast/display.php3?article_id=6946
> 
> I'd like to add some ideas from here, down south.
> 
> There's an important point in the power of press,
> specifically the power of
> CNN.
> 
> All around the world we are subjected to 3 or 4 huge news
> distributors, and
> one of them - as you well know - is CNN. Very well, I guess
> all of you have
> been seeing (just as I've been) images from this company. In
> particular, one
> set of images called my attencion: the Palestinians
> celebrating the bombing,
> out on the streets, eating some cake and making
> funny faces for the camera.
> 
> Well, THOSE IMAGES WERE SHOT BACK IN 1991!!! Those are
> images of
> Palestinians celebrating the invasion of Kuwait! It's simply
> unacceptable
> that a super-power of cumminications as CNN uses images
> which do not
> correspond to the reality in talking about so serious an
> issue.
> 
> A teacher of mine, here in Brazil, has videotapes recorded
> in 1991, with the
> very same images; he's been sending emails to CNN, Globo
> (the major TV
> network in Brazil) and newspapers, denouncing what I myself
> classify
> as a crime against the public opinion. If anyone of you has
> access to this
> kind of files, serch for it. In the meanwhile, I'll try to
> 'put my hands' on
> a copy of this tape.
> 
> But now, think for a moment about the impact of such images.
> Your people is
> hurt, emotionally fragile, and this kind broadcast have very
> high
> possibility of causing waves of anger and rage against
> Palestinians.
> It's simply irresponsible to show images such as those.
> 
> [edited content]
> 
> Mrcio A. V. Carvalho
> State University of Campinas - Brazil
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> > 

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[NSP] :Bin Laden - Some background facts

2001-09-13 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic



> 
> 
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Miroslav Antic <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > To: Siem News <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Sin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Date: Thursday, April 27, 2000 11:44 PM
> > Subject: SN920:Bin Laden - Some background facts
> >
> >
> > >
> > >Laden has 20 nukes
> > >
> > >SPECIAL TO WORLD TRIBUNE.COM
> > >
> > >Monday, August 9, 1999
> > >WASHINGTON -- Saudi fugitive Osama Bin Laden is believed to
> > >have up to 20 nuclear bombs and is seeking to launch a massive
> > >terrorist strike against the United States, a congressional
> > >investigator and author says.
> > >
> > >Yosef Bodansky, a researcher of the House Task Force for
> > >Counterterrorism and author of a new book on Bin Laden, told a
> > >news conference on Friday that Bin Laden has been seeking to
> > >follow up on his bombings of two U.S. embassies in east Africa
> > >one year ago. Echoing U.S. officials, Bodansky said Bin Laden
> > >was thwarted in plans to blow up the U.S. embassy and two
> > >consulates in India in last December and January.
> > >
> > >Bin Laden has biological, chemical and nuclear weapons and has
> > >received technical help from Iraq, Bodansky said. The nuclear
> > >weapons include suitcase bombs acquired through Chechniyan
> > >rebels.
> > >
> > >"The Russians believe that he has a handful [of nuclear weapons],
> > >the Saudi intelligence services are very conservative . . . they are
> > >friendly to the United States, [and] believe that he has in the
> > >neighborhood of 20," Bodansky said. Bin Laden obtained and
> > >purchased the suitcase bombs from multiple sources, he said. He
> > >has a "collection of individuals knowledgeable in activating the
> > >bombs" and "is recruiting former Soviet special forces [to learn]
> > >how to operate the bombs behind enemy lines."
> > >
> > >"As far as decision-making in Washington is concerned, we should
> > >assume that he has them," he added. "Most of them have been
> > >transferred through Pakistan."
> > >
> > >"Let me stress here: We don't have any indication that they are
> > >going to use [them] tomorrow or any other day," added Bodansky,
> > >whose intelligence estimates and analyses are considered
> > >controversial in Washingon. "But they have the capability, they
> > >have the legitimate authorization, they have the logic" for using
> > >them. "One does not [make] the tremendous amount of
> > >expenditures, effort, investment in human beings, in human
> > >resources, to have something that will be just kept somewhere in
> > >storage."
> > >
> > >Bodansky said Bin Laden has strong ties with Islamic
> > >fundamentalists throughout the Middle East, the Balkans, Britain
> > >and the United States. He refused to name any specific
> > >organization in the United States.
> > >
> > >"There's a distinct minority within the Moslem community in the
> > >United States that is very sympathetic to his cause, to his analysis
> > >and interpretation of the relationship between the hub of Islam and
> > >the penetration of Westernization, Western culture and the like,"
> > >he said. "And a minority among this minority are known to have
> > >crossed the threshold of willingness to commit terrorist acts or
> > >commit violence. Many have been trained in Afghanistan, Bosnia
> > >and elsewhere throughout the Moslem world, so that they are
> > >capable. They have the skills and capabilities to carry out an
> > >operation as required."
> > >
> > >Bodansky said Bin Laden remains in Afghanistan. He said the
> > >Saudi is located in Islam Darva, about 80 kilometers northwest of
> > >Kandahar. When he wants to communicate with the outside world,
> > >he travels to Jalalabad, he said.
> > >
> > >
> > >Monday, August 9, 1999
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> 
> 

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[NSP] "Collateral Damage" Hits Home


 
"Collateral Damage" Hits Home
by Bob Djurdjevic
Truth in Media



Matthew 26:52 - 
"Put your sword back in its place," Jesus said to him, 
"for all who draw the sword will die by the sword."



PHOENIX, Tuesday, Sep.11, 2001 - "I can't believe what's happening," 
a shocked close friend said this morning about the deadliest attack on
American soil since Pearl Harbor (or maybe even ever?). "No surprise
there," I replied. "I've seen too many tragedies (around the world) in the 
last 11 years, some firsthand as you know, to be fazed by anything anymore."

It wasn't a blasé answer.  Just factual.  So I explained:

When the "world's only superpower" and its allies bombed and killed
thousands of innocent civilians in Iraq and Serbia, Americans were told it 
was just "collateral damage."  After all, we, the "champions of democracy 
and the free world," were only fighting the murderous regimes of Saddam 
Hussein and Slobodan Milosevic.  Some civilian casualties were "regrettable, 
but unavoidable," the Pentagon, NATO or State Dept. spokesmen told us.

Now the tables have turned.  Terrorism begets terrorism.  Unnamed
terrorists, presumed to be "Islamic fundamentalists," have now killed
thousands of innocent Americans while fighting, what they think are, the 
murderous regimes of Bill Clinton and George W. Bush.  Now Americans know 
firsthand some of the terror the Baghdad or Belgrade residents felt when 
NATO bombers unloaded their deadly cargo on them. The only thing missing is 
the terrorists' spokesmen telling us now that "it was just "collateral 
damage;" that "some civilian casualties were regrettable, but unavoidable."

What we did to Iraq and to Serbia was a case of state terrorism.  What 
unnamed terrorists did to us today was retaliation to state
terrorism.  "Collateral damage" has come home to roost.  "What goes around, 
comes around."  "He who plays with fire, gets burned by fire."

But make no mistake: This was NOT an "Attack on America," as CNN and other 
networks are hailing.  This was a strike at the heart of the Washington-led 
New World Order.  Signs are unmistakable.  Just look at the targets: The 
World Trade Center/Wall Street, the Pentagon...  Some sources speculate that 
one or both of the two hijacked planes that crashed in Pennsylvania might 
have been destined for either the White House or the Capitol.

America and Americans, meaning innocent civilians who perished today, are 
"just collateral damage."  As Iraqi and Serb civilians were.  We are now 
paying for aggressions and crimes against humanity that our government has 
committed.  Just as Iraqi and Serb civilians were.  We've become expendable. 
Just as Iraqi and Serb civilians were.

So whenever you hear a politician or a media personality say that this 
attack was "unprovoked;" that this was a murder of innocent "men, women and 
children;" that it was a strike at the "American way of life" - and no doubt 
you'll see and hear much of that in the next hours and days - try a role 
reversal.  Imagine that you're listening to an Iraqi or a Serb politician 
using those words in reference to victims of American bombs. Then - and only 
then! -  you'll get a fuller picture of what transpired today.

Meanwhile, madness also begets madness.  The dust had not yet settled from 
the collapsed World Trade Center twin-towers, and already some "hawks" in 
the American government and media were crying for "retaliatory strikes."  
That's pretty shallow on several levels:

First, the same "hawks" who are telling us bombastically that "America is 
at war" are at a loss to identify with whom.  So who and what are we to 
retaliate against?

Second, such "hawks" never learn.  One only needs to look at the Middle East 
for an example of futility of violence.  To stop anti-American terrorism, 
Washington must stop its own state terrorism. Both brands of terrorism are 
despicable and inexcusable.

Finally, if there is a silver lining in this vast American tragedy; if there 
is one good thing that comes out of all this madness - let us hope it is the 
death of that "death merchant" scheme - the national Defense Missile Shield.
The DMS was being rammed down the American taxpayers throats by both Clinton 
and Bush administrations, notwithstanding the opposition to it even from most 
of our allies.

Now I have a very simple question for the American President: In light of 
what happened today in New York, Washington and Pennsylvania, how would your 
national Defense Missile Shield have defended us from this attack?

The answer is obvious.  Congress should kill the sucker (DMS) before it 
kills us - financially and geopolitically!

Meanwhile, may God have mercy upon the souls of all innocent people who died 
today as "collateral damage" of arrogant Clinton/Bush foreign policies.  
The Washington-led New World Order has now come home to roost.  
For, "all who draw the sword will die by the sword."

Bob Djurdjevic/TiM/09/12/01 
--

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[NSP] Who Saw It Coming?


Click Here: http://www.counterpunch.org/";>Welcome to CounterPunch
-
September 11, 2001

"Flying Bombs"


Who Saw It Coming?

By Alexander Cockburn
and Jeffrey St Clair
Tuesday's onslaughts on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon are being
likened to Pearl Harbor and the comparison is just. From the point of view of
the assailants the attacks were near miracles of logistical calculation,
timing, courage in execution and devastation inflicted upon the targets.

The Pearl Harbor base containing America's naval might was thought to be
invulnerable, yet in half an hour 2000 were dead, and the cream of the fleet
destroyed. This week, within an hour on the morning of September 11, security
at three different airports was successfully breached, the crews of four
large passenger jets efficiently overpowered, the cockpits commandeered,
navigation coordinates reset.

In three of the four missions the assailants attained successes probably far
beyond the expectations of the planners. As a feat of suicidal aviation the
Pentagon kamikaze assault was particularly audacious, with eyewitness
accounts describing the Boeing 767 skimming the Potomac before driving right
through the low lying Pentagon perimeter, in a sector housing Planning and
Logistics.

The two Trade Center Buildings were struck at what structural engineers say
were the points of maximum vulnerability. The strength of the buildings
derived entirely from the steel perimeter frame, designed - so its lead
architect said only last week - to withstand the impact of a Boeing 707.
These buildings were struck full force Tuesday morning by Boeing 737s, with
fuel tanks fully loaded for the long flights to the West Coast. Within an
hour of the impacts both buildings collapsed. By evening, a third 46-story
Trade Center building had also crumbled.
Not in terms of destructive extent, but in terms of symbolic obliteration the
attack is virtually without historic parallel, a trauma at least as great as
the San Francisco earthquake or the Chicago fire.

There may be another similarity to Pearl Harbor. The possibility of a
Japanese attack in early December of 1941 was known to US Naval Intelligence
and to President Roosevelt. Last Tuesday, derision at the failure of US
intelligence was widespread. The Washington Post quoted an unnamed top
official at the National Security Council as saying, "We don't know anything
here. We're watching CNN too." Are we to believe that the $30 billion annual
intelligence budget, immense electronic eavesdropping capacity, thousands of
agents around the world, produced nothing in the way of a warning? In fact
Osama bin Laden, now prime suspect, said in an interview three weeks ago with
Abdel-Bari Atwan, the editor of the London-based al-Quds al-Arabi newspaper,
that he planned "very, very big attacks against American interests."

Here is bin-Laden, probably the most notorious Islamic foe of America on the
planet, originally trained by the CIA, planner of other successful attacks on
US installations such as the embassies in East Africa, carrying a $5 million
FBI bounty on his head proclaiming the imminence of another assault, and US
intelligence was impotent, even though the attacks must have taken months, if
not years to plan, and even though CNN has reported that bin-Laden and his
coordinating group al-Qa'ida had been using an airstrip in Afghanistan to
train pilots to fly 767s.

Back in the 1960s and 1970s, when hijacking was a preoccupation, the
possibility of air assaults on buildings such as the Trade Center were a
major concern of US security and intelligence agencies. But since the 1980s
and particularly during the Clinton-Gore years the focus shifted to more
modish fears, such as bio-chemical assault and nuclear weapons launched by
so-called rogue states. This latter threat had the allure of justifying the
$60 billion investment in Missile Defense aka Star Wars. One of the biggest
proponents of that approach was Al Gore's security advisor, Leon Fuerth, who
wailed plaintively amid Tuesday's rubble that "In effect the country's at war
but we don't have the coordinates of the enemy."

But the lust for retaliation traditionally outstrips precision in identifying
the actual assailant. By early evening on


Tuesday America's national security establishment were calling for a removal
of all impediments on the assassination of foreign leaders. Led by President
Bush, hey were endorsing the prospect of attacks not just on the perpetrators
but on those who might have harbored them. From the nuclear priesthood is
coming the demand that mini-nukes be deployed on a preemptive basis against
the enemies of America.

The targets abroad will be all the usual suspects: rogue states, (most of
which, like the Taleban or Saddam Hussein, started off as creatures of US
intelligence). The target at home will of course be the Bill of Rights. Less
than a week ago the FBI raided Infocom, the Texas-based web host for Muslim
groups such as the Council on Isl

[NSP] Fw:AA Stewardesses Die Fighting Terrorists



Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2001 8:45 AM
Subject: [CTRL] AA Stewardesses Die Fighting Terrorists


Now a car has been found at Logan airport parking with flight training manuals in 
Arabic.  Would they just have left it?  For sure not returning but the literature in 
Arabic does not seem genuine, some how contrived.  Overly convenient for why take the 
manuals to the airport and not just leave them home?
Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2001 12:54 AM
] AA Stewardesses Die Fighting Terrorists


This whole thing is very shocking.  We can only pray for 
everyone involved and pray for the few freedoms we had 
left are still standing after this is all said and done. 
How much freedom will be sacrificed in the name of security? 
We can only wait and see. 

Terrorists slit throats of 2 AA stewardesses 
Flight attendants 'were trying to stop them from 
getting inside the cockpit' 
-- 
http://wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=24445 
By Paul Sperry 
© 2001 WorldNetDaily.com 

WASHINGTON -- Terrorists who hijacked American Airlines Flight 11 out of 
Boston Tuesday morning slit the throats of two female flight attendants who 
tried to bar them from entering the cockpit, an American Airlines employee 
told WorldNetDaily in an exclusive interview. 

The terrorists then forced their way into the locked cockpit and commandeered 
the Boeing 767 to New York, where they slammed it into one of the World Trade 
Center towers. The flight, carrying 81 passengers, was bound for Los Angeles. 

A third stewardess aboard the nine-crew flight used her cell phone to alert 
another American Airlines stewardess back at Logan Airport about the 
hijacking and murders. The terrorists were armed with knives and box-cutters. 

"It was horrific," said the senior American Airlines employee, who works at 
Logan and said goodbye to the crew at the terminal. "They were trying to stop 
them from getting inside the cockpit." 

The plane left the gate at about 7:45 a.m. The cell phone call was placed 
about 30 minutes later, the source says. The jet crashed into the World Trade 
Center building at about 8:45 a.m. Soon after, a United Airlines jet sliced 
through the twin tower. 

According to the American source, the American captain managed to turn on the 
cockpit intercom, apparently without the terrorists knowing, allowing flight 
controllers to pick up cockpit conversation. The terrorists had turned off 
the plane's transponder, the equipment that identifies the plane and provides 
other information to flight controllers tracking it by radar. 

As part of their investigation, FBI agents and Massachusetts state troopers 
have interviewed American Airlines employees and Logan airport workers, 
including custodians working the morning shift, to rule out an inside job. 

... DEVELOPING ... 

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[NSP] Fw: [AL-AWDA-News] Strong Condemnation for the Terrorist Attacks



- Original Message -
From: Palestine Affairs Council <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Al-Awda-News <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2001 7:23 AM
Subject: [AL-AWDA-News] Strong Condemnation for the Terrorist Attacks


>
> Official Joint Statement from
> Palestine Affairs Council,
> the Palestinian American Congress and
> Houstonians for Peace & Justice in the Holy Land
> --
--
>
> (Houston, Texas - 9/11/2001) - Palestine Affairs Council, the Palestinian
American Congress and Houstonians for Peace & Justice in the Holy Land
condemn in the strongest terms possible the vicious and cowardly acts of
terrorism against the United States. We join with all Americans in calling
for the swift apprehension and punishment of the perpetrators. No cause
could ever be assisted by such immoral acts.
>
> The Palestinian, Arab, Muslim and Christian communities in Houston, the
United States and throughout the world are shocked and saddened by this
devastating tragedy.
>
> We wish to express our condolences to the families of those who were
killed or injured.
>
> We further call on all members of the Arab, Muslim and Christian
communities to offer whatever help they can to the victims and their
families.  Local community relief agencies should contact their counterparts
to offer support in the recovery efforts. Individuals should donate blood by
contacting the local office of the Red Cross. They should also send
donations to those relief agencies that are on the scene of the attacks.
>
> We further call on media professionals to exercise restraint and not draw
premature conclusions as to who was responsible for the apparent attacks.
>
> Palestine Affairs Council
> Houston, Texas, USA
> www.PalestineAffairsCouncil.org
>
>
>  Yahoo! Groups Sponsor -~-->
> The Nissan Sentra
> Everything but compact
> http://NissanDriven.com
> http://us.click.yahoo.com/3vsIKC/txlCAA/ySSFAA/xYTolB/TM
> -~->
>
> To sign Al-Awda's petition to terminate US aid to Israel go to:
> http://al-awda.org/terminate_aid_petition.htm
>
> To sign a letter asking Intel Corporation to disinvest from Israel go to:
http://al-awda.org/campaign/intel_letter.htm
> ==
> Al-Awda, The Palestine Right to Return Coalition is the largest network of
grassroots activists dedicated to Palestinian human rights. To find out how
to join an Al-Awda action committees in your area, please visit our website
at http://al-awda.org.
> ==
> To subscribe to Al-Awda News, send an email to:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> To unsubscribe, send an email to:
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> Unless indicated otherwise, all statements represent the views of their
authors and not necessarily those of Al-Awda, The Palestine Right to Return
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>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

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[NSP] Fw: [HumanRights] Taleban: Don't Blame Osama bin Laden for Attacks on U.S.

2001-09-11 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic



- Original Message -
From: InfoTimes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Wednesday, September 12, 2001 5:24 AM
Subject: [HumanRights] Taleban: Don't Blame Osama bin Laden for Attacks on
U.S.


>
> ==
> INFORMATION TIMES: http://www.InformationTimes.com
> ==
>
> Taleban: Don't Blame Osama bin Laden for Attacks on U.S.
>
> AYAZ GUL
>
> ISLAMABAD, Pakistan, 11 September 2001 (VOA): Afghanistan's
> Taleban Islamic movement says Saudi dissident Osama bin Laden
> could not be responsible for devastating air attacks in the
> United States.
>
> Afghanistan's Ambassador to Pakistan, Abdul Salam Zaeef, has
> condemned what he calls terrorist attacks on U.S. targets. At a
> news conference in Islamabad, he rejected allegations that Saudi
> militant Osama bin Laden, who lives in Afghanistan, could be
> behind them.
>
> Mr. Zaeef says it was a well-organized and sophisticated plan.
> He says Osama bin Laden does not have access to the tools and
> communication facilities, which are needed for attacks of this
> scale.
>
> Mr. bin Laden is wanted in the United States for masterminding
> the August 1998 bombings of two U.S. embassies in East Africa
> that killed more than 200 people. Washington retaliated with
> missile strikes a few days later in a bid to target alleged
> 'terrorist' training camps in Afghanistan, which it said were
> linked to the Saudi millionaire.
>
> Pakistan, a strong supporter of the Taleban movement, has also
> condemned the attacks. The country's military leader, General
> Pervez Musharraf, in a statement to President Bush says the
> world must unite to fight terrorism in all its forms. "We share
> the grief of the American people in their grave national
> tragedy," General Musharraf said. "We strongly condemn this most
> brutal and horrible acts of terror and violence. This world must
> unite to fight against terrorism and root out this modern-day
> evil."
>
> Two hijacked American planes crashed into the giant towers of
> the World Trade Center in New York on Tuesday morning,
> destroying them, and a third U.S. plane struck the Pentagon this
> morning outside Washington.
>
> INFOTIMES INTERNET-WEB LINK:
>
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> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/InfoTimes/message/1031
>
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[NSP] The Hellenic group of ex- NATO Generals for Peace and Disarmament protest

2001-09-06 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic






Dear Friends
 
We the Hellenic group of ex- NATO Generals for 
Peace and Disarmament protest  against the visit of 7 th  fleet to the 
civilian ports in Japan, so violating the Kobe Formula for the nuclear free 
ports.
 
The ruling class in USA is acting as the evil 
empire and try to subjugate all the world and install the world 
government.
 
THE EARTH IS CAPTIVE BY A NEW HITLER REGIME. THE 
LEADER IS INVISIBLE AT THIS MOMENT.And what are the leaders of the peace 
movement saying about all this? They say that they are having great success 
towards peace. I would rather see them present to the world the real 
state of affairs. We are not moving towards peace today; instead we are moving 
towards the universal catastrophe that Einstein and others spoke of in the 
past.I am asking the leaders of the NGO's - how long will they refuse to 
see reality? How long will we have the gift of time? The leadership of the peace 
movement must finally take the people of the earth on the streets. When 
will they do it? When the world will be in flames? It would be too 
late.
 

We, the world Peace Movement have to act in 
solidarity with the Anti - Globalization Movement against the NWO and 
activate all people ,  all nations against the nuclear weapons and the 
modern technology armament, such as  Stars War and other mass destruction 
weapons. 
 
Major General Kostas Konstantinidis(Ret)
the coordinator
 

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  kugimiya nobue 
  To: Undisclosed-Recipient:; 
  Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2001 1:02 
  PM
  Subject: Kobe Formula: USS 
  "Vincennes"
  
    
  Five naval ships of the US 7th Fleet made 
  simultaneous visits to four civilian ports in Japan on August 28. They entered 
  the ports of Himeji (Hyogo Prefecture), Wakayama (Wakayama Prefecture), 
  Nagoya  (Aichi Prefecture) and Shimizu (Shizuoka Prefecture). 
  
   
  This was the first visit by US warships to Himeji 
  and Wakayama.
   
  Himeji Port is in the same prefecture as Kobe 
  Port, better known as the Nuclear-free Kobe Formula. Himeji City has also 
  declared itself nuclear free, but the port's authority is the prefectural 
  government, not the city government, while Kobe Port is under the city 
  government's control. The prefectural government, after being urged by 
  citizens, asked the vessel if it respected the three Non-nuclear Principles 
  (not to manufacture, not to possess, not to allow the entry of nuclear 
  weapons). The vessel didn't respond whether or not it carried nuclear weapons 
  on board and came straight into the port. 
   
  After entering the port, Robert Rudan, US 
  Consulate General to Osaka, stated at a press conference on board that he 
  hoped that eventually US  warships would be allowed to enter the Port of 
  Kobe. He also said that this port call was aimed at improving mutual 
  friendship between Japan and the US, and said that Kobe was losing the 
  opportunity to strengthen ties between our two countries.
   
  No US warship has entered any ports in the 
  prefecture since the Kobe Formula was inplemented in 1975. This portcall is 
  obviously aimed at putting pressure on Kobe to abandon its nuclear-free Kobe 
  Formula.
   
  Five hundred protesters gathered at the port 
  early on the morning of August 28 to protest against the entry of the US 
  missile cruiser "Vincennes." Shortly before 8 am, the Vincennes entered the 
  port to a chorus of protest. "We do not want US warships to use our civil 
  ports," "Vincennes go home! Get out of our 
  port!" were some of the slogans hurled at the ship.
   
  Protests and demonstrations also took place in 
  Nagoya, Wakayama and Shizuoka. 
   
  Nobue Kugimiya
  (Hyogo Gensuikyo)
  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi

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Fw: SB32R3:[NSP] Ljiljana Milanovic, supruga bivseg, ponovo pritv orenog general

2001-09-05 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic



- Original Message -
From: Mrs. Jela Jovanovic <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Wednesday, September 05, 2001 10:27 AM
Subject: Re: SB32R3:[NSP] Ljiljana Milanovic, supruga bivseg, ponovo pritv
orenog generalnog direktor


>
>
> Rastuzim se kada vidim kako je lako manipulisati sa srpskim sljamom, i
> koliko su su Srbi spremni da  gube energiju,  orni dA okrive svoje
> zemljake, istovremeno  da opravdaju nacisticke zlocince. Ko je bre znao?
> Da li ste vi ljudi normalni? Svi dobro znaju da je Slobodan Milosevic
odmah
> na pocetku bombardovanja naredio Milanovicu da maksimalno smanji broj
ljudi
> u RTS, i da ga je proveravao.  Dragoljub Milanovic  je izdao naredbu da
niko
> ko nema  zaduzenja ne sme da se zadrzava u zgradi.
> Pa bre ljudi CNN je danima insistirao da bas te veceri napravi intervju sa
> gospodinom Aleksandrom Vucicem, ministrom za informisanje Republike
Srbije,
> ti monstrumi su hteli  uzivo da ubiju srpskog ratnog ministra to je
> sustina.( Informacija je iz prve ruke, moja bliska prijateljica je
> komunicirala sa nacistima u vezi intervjua, koji je glatko u startu
> odbijen).
> Gadim se roditelja poginulih, ta bagra vaspitno i emocionalno  zapustenih
> osoba, neodgovornih prema sebi i sopstvenom potomstvu,  bezocno pokazuje
da
> svoju decu nikada nisu ni voleli,  monstrumi  koji  ne zele da privedu
> pravdi ubice svoje dece. ...
> 1995. godine srela sam majku Srpkinju iz sela pored Gradiske, koja je
dosla
> da primi posthumno odlikovanja za tri poginula sina, urucio joj je
komandant
> brigade, kome je prisla sa dubokim postovanjem i poljubila ga.Sva trojica
su
> ratovala u njegovoj brigadi.
> pukovnik
> - Original Message -
> From: Markovic, Draza <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Tuesday, September 04, 2001 10:41 PM
> Subject: SB32R3:[NSP] Ljiljana Milanovic, supruga bivseg, ponovo pritv
> orenog generalnog direktor
>
>
> >
> >
> > Ko je koga sklanjao pre bombardovanja moze
> > se `saznati' samo iz beogardskog carsijskog rekla-kazala,
> > ili iz ocigledno pristrasnih izvora (vlada, policija, partije).
> >
> > Pogledajte elementarnu logiku:
> >
> > SB452:Patka o bombardovanju televizije
> > 01/29/2001 1:51 AM
> >
> >   Ako su (kako tvrdi Karla) Ameri stvarno javili Milosevicu
> >   da ce bombardovati televiziju, zasto onda to nisu
> >   ucinili sasvim javno?  Recimo, oglas u NY Times-u:
> >   `Tog dana, u toliko i toliko sati, ucinicemo to i to;
> >molimo da se civili udalje; gadjacemo precizno, nema
> >sta da brinete, itd.'
> >
> >   To bi bio prilicni propagandni poen za njih.
> >   Zasto bi samo saputali Slobi na uvce; pa nisu
> >   Ameri tako stidljivi!
> >
> >   Misli li Karla da smo bas svi sisali vesla.
> >   ...
> >
> >   Pozdrav,
> >   Draza
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Mirko Stevanovic
> > To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'
> > Sent: 09/04/2001 2:32 PM
> > Subject: SB31R2:[NSP] Ljiljana Milanovic, supruga bivseg, ponovo pritv
> > orenog generalnog direktor
> >
> > Slazem se sa vam da je skoro svako sudjenje "pomalo" (a verovatno malo
> > vise)
> > i politicko. Medjutim da li je bas sve kao sto ste napisali. Ispade da
> > nam
> > je NATO, kojeg "volim" koliko i vi, kriv apsolutno za sve. Pa je li bas
> > tako?
> >
> > Kako to da su neki od rukovodioca sklonili svoju decu pre nego sto je
> > zgrada
> > bombardovana? Zar nije cerka jednog od rukovodioca (izvinjavam se sto
> > sam
> > zaboravio ime) rekla kada je izlazila:"Ja da sam na vasem mestu ne bi
> > bila
> > tu nocas". Ako se znalo da ce da nam bombarduju televiziju zasto se nisu
> > pripremili i sklonili na sigurno mesto. Samo mi nemojte reci da se to
> > nije
> > moglao uraditi. Da li je to trebao da radi onaj nesretni portir na ulazu
> > u
> > televiziju. Ako se ne varam bila je donesena odluka za evakuaciju ali je
> > Milanovic nije potpisao ili nije hteo. Sta ako je neko stvarno odlucio
> > da se
> > zrtvuju ljudi da bi se zaradilo par propagandnih poena. I zasto je
> > zapreceno
> > ljudima da niko nesme da napusti radno mesto pod pretnjom otkaza? Mnogo
> > je
> > pitanja na koja se mora odgovoriti ovde.
> >
> > Naravno da je kod nas sve politika i odnosi tipa:"Vi ste nas a sada cemo
> > malo mi vas", ali nazalost uvek i uvek plati neko drugi.
> >
> >
> > Mirko
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: Jovan Grbic [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> > Sent: Tuesda

[NSP] Fw: psihopate

2001-09-05 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic

Title: WORLD SERBIAN COMMUNITY



 


  
  

  

Kako je protekao dramatican 
  sastanak Predsednistva DOS 28. 
avgusta

  
  
Mesto obracuna: Palata 
  federacijeKostunica priznao 
  da nema 
  dokaze!

  
  
Djindjic porucio: 
  Idite i svojim intrigama hranite narod! Dosta mi je stuba 
  srama
Sedam sati trajala je 
proslonedeljna, po mnogima istorijska, sednica DOS sa samo jednom tackom dnevnog 
reda - odnosi u koaliciji. U sustini, trebalo je da se rese dva pitanja: ostaje 
li DSS u republickoj vladi i da li je vlada umesana u kriminal? 
Nedeljni Telegraf je u prilici da, na osnovu razgovora sa nekoliko 
ucesnika famoznog "samita 18-orice", rekonstruise kako je tekao ovaj 
sastanak.VOJISLAV KOSTUNICA: Steta sto je objavljeno 
Na samom pocetku sednice, predsednik Kostunica 
podsetio je da je, prema Ustavu, republicka vlast znatno veca od savezne, te da 
je na njoj i veca odgovornost. U sklopu toga dodao je i da reforme kasne zbog 
korupcije i kriminala i da bi to pitanje vec jednom trebalo otvoriti. Zatim 
je, kako se priseca jedan od nasih sagovornika, predsednik SRJ presao na ubistvo 
Momira Gavrilovica, priznajuci da se 3. avgusta i sam video sa ovim bivsim 
radnikom DB. Dodao je da je to ucinio i u aprilu, na insistiranje Lasla Sekelja. 
Kostunica je potvrdio da Gavrilovic nije predao nikakva dokumenta, dodavsi da je 
steta sto je doslo do objavljivanja famozne informacije u Blicu i da su njegov 
sef Kabineta Ljiljana Nedeljkovic i savetnici Bulatovic i Nalic o sadrzini 
razgovora obavestili javnog tuzioca. Naveo je i da su sva imena trebalo da 
ostanu kod javnog tuzioca kao strogo poverljiva informacija, ali da ih je Dusan 
Mihajlovic, ministar policije, obelodanio. Toliko o slucaju Gavrilovic.


  
  
Kostunica: Smenite 
  me!Kada su kritike na racun 
  Kostunice postale izuzetno ostre, on je, kaze jedan od nasih sagovornika, 
  zatrazio da se, ako treba, pokrene pitanje njegove smene. Ali, nije 
  propustio priliku da podseti da on u septembru nije zeleo da se kandiduje 
  i da je to uradio na insistiranje svih. Podsetio je da je u jednom 
  trenutku razlika izmedju liste DOS i njegove predsednicke liste bila 
  500.000 glasova sto, kako je primetio, nije malo. Napomenuo je da, pored 
  svih prica o vojnom udaru, fasizmu i svemu ostalom, to svi iz DOS treba da 
  imaju na umu.
A onda je predsednik SRJ decidirano rekao svojim sagovornicima da nece 
otvarati pitanje poverenja vladi jer bi to iziskivalo raspisivanje izbora, a 
izbori, opet, ne bi trebalo da se odrze pre promene Ustava. Dakle, ni rusenje 
vlade, ni izbori.Nas izvor napominje da je veliki deo svog uvodnog izlaganja 
predsednik posvetio optuzbama na racun naseg lista, rekavsi cak da su kritike 
objavljene u Nedeljnom Telegrafu, delatnost protiv drzave. 
ZARKO KORAC:Necu milostinjuZarko 
Korac je, posle Kostunice, zatrazio da se odmah iznesu argumenti ko je u vladi 
kriminalac, jer se, u suprotnom, i on mora osecati prozvanim da je kriminalac i 
ubica. Korac je napao DSS da sipa protiv vlasti, u kojoj je i sama, takve 
optuzbe da su radikali i socijalisti kao opozicija potpuno nepotrebni. Dodao je 
da ga ne zanima da "neko" iz milostinje pristaje da ne rusi vladu, nego da je 
bolje da je, ako ima razloge za to, rusi. 
VLADAN BATIC: Zamrznite 
funkciju!Pogodjen se, kaze jedan od nasih 
sagovornika, nasao i ministar pravde Vladan Batic. Decidirano je rekao da nema 
veze sa korupcijom, jer je drugacije vaspitan i da nikada nije upoznao nijednog 
kriminalca viseg ranga. Batic je zatrazio od Kostunice da zamrzne svoju 
stranacku funkciju, optuzujuci ga da, obavljajuci istovremeno obe funkcije, krsi 
Ustav. Kostunici je postavio nekoliko pitanja koja su ostala bez odgovora: zasto 
odbija da smeni Pavkovica, zasto je trebalo toliko dugo vremena da razresi 
duznosti Radeta Markovica, zasto je Kabinet predsednika podignut na nivo 
nadstranackog tela koje ucestvuje u radu nekih tela na Kosovu i vodi vojne 
delegacije u Republiku Srpsku... Batic je zatrazio da se sa sednice ne izadje 
dok se ne stavi tacka na pitanje kriminala i korupcije u vladi.
ZORAN DJINDJIC: Noz u 
ledjaPremijer Djindjic se tek posle vise od sat 
vremena ukljucio u raspravu. Prema nasem sagovorniku, izgledalo je da je spremao 
svoje izlaganje jer ga je vrlo precizno podelio u nekoliko problema. Prvo sto je 
rekao bila je zamerka upucena na racun DSS da je ova stranka u vlasti a da se 
ponasa kao najradikalnija opozicija i da sebi daje privilegiju da sedi na dve 
stolice. Optuzio je DSS da ne veruje svojim koalicionim partnerima, nego 
izvesnom Gavrilovicu, i pod tom firmom nastavlja rusenje Republicke vlade, 
zapoceto nekoliko meseci pre ubistva Gavrilovica. Dodao je i da su optuzbe za 
umesanost u kriminal proizvoljne i da ono za sta se optuzuje vlada uopste nije u 
njenoj, nego u nadleznosti carine, gde opet sedi covek iz DSS. Djindjic je 
trazio da DSS iznese dokaze o povezanosti vlade

Re: [NSP] Blic:Intervju: Bora Djordjevic

2001-09-03 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic


Taj bednik gostuje u rezidenciji britanske ambasade i zabavlja NATO zlocince
i domace sluge. Toliko je nisko pao da prica jeftine viceve o Miri i Slobi.
Posto je moja kuca preko puta pitanje je vremena kada ce kasikara da
proradi. Drugi me i nisu tako razocarali ali Bora potpuno. sta droga i
alkohol urade od coveka.

pukovnik
- Original Message -

Subject: [NSP] Blic:Intervju: Bora Djordjevic


>
>
> "Blic", 3. septembar 2001.
>
> Pise Simonida Milojkovic
>
> Intervju: Bora Djordjevic
>
> Dok ovo citate, nas sagovornik, Bora Djordjevic, upravo je u studiju gde
> snima 18. album, i to, kako kaze, sa velikim zadovoljstvom, jer se
> uzeleo studijskog posla.
>
> - Sve lepe stvari treba poceti ponedeljkom. Pa i pisanje uz vetar. To je
> nasa nacionalna disciplina - pisanje uz vetar i plivanje u govnima.
> Pesma "U govnima plivanje" je obrada pesme "Boris Spajder", grupe "Hu" i
> refren glasi "U govnima plivanje pravo je uzivanje", sto je takodje
> srpska nacionalna disciplina. Tako da je to jedna sportska ploca.
> Trebalo je da se zove "Pisanje uz vetar, pljuvanje u vis, Sizifov posao
> i pobuna Goja (sa j)", ali to je mnogo dugacko i zvuci pretenciozno i
> previse intelektualisticki, tako da smo ostavili samo ono sto je
> razumljivo nasem coveku, ono sto radi svaki dan - pisa uz vetar.
>
> Pesmu "Srbin je lud", na koncertima publika peva horski sa vama. Hocete
> li za citaoce "Blica" koji jos nisu imali prilike da je cuju da kazete
> neki stih. - "Srbin je lud, Srbin je proklet, jednom ga ubijes, on hoce
> opet." To je takodje jedna od nasih nacionalnih osobina.
>
> Sta vas je inspirisalo da napisete tu pesmu?
>
> - Jos je pokojni Jovan Raskovic rekao da su Srbi lud narod, sto je de
> facto tacno. Inspirisao me je ovaj nas sveprisutniji mazohizam i to sto
> nam je u mentalitetu da nam nikad nista ne valja. Ono sto je dobro i ne
> primecujemo, to se podrazumeva, ali lose odmah primetimo i deremo se na
> sav glas. Pesma je mala opomena onima koji prizivaju najvece zlo 20.
> veka - komunizam, za koji se nadam da ce u 21. potpuno izumreti. Oni
> koji prizivaju povratak komunizma neka se malo zapitaju da li su uopste
> normalni.
>
> Na koga mislite?
>
> - Na one zaludjenike koji se ponekad skupljaju na trgu trazeci da onaj
> starac bude oslobodjen.
>
> A kako se vama, kao vecitom kriticaru vlasti, cine ovi novi "mladici"?
>
> - Naravno da ima stvari koje ne valjaju, i te kako ne valjaju. Ne mogu
> se u domacim prilikama nekriticno primenjivati neki evropski arsini, to
> je vestacki nakalemljeno. Mora se obezbediti coveku ono osnovno - da
> zivi od svog rada, a to jos uvek u ovoj zemlji nije moguce. Zbog toga
> sam i napisao pesmu "Plivanje u govnima", koja moze da se zove i "Zivot
> na foru". Svi mi zivimo na foru, svako se nesto snalazi, petljari, muva
> i nekako prezivljava. E, ajd' da prestanemo da zivimo na foru, ajde da
> zivimo od svog rada, da zivimo normalno. Ajde da na trafici kupimo
> cigarete koje pusimo, i to original, bog te mazo! Pazi tu privilegiju!
> Postoje stvari koje su godinama sistematski unistavane i ne mogu preko
> noci da se poprave. Zato i ne insistiram na krupnim promenama odmah i
> sad, ali ne moze ni ovako - ne mozes siromasne udarati po dzepu. Udri
> bogatase! Jer, profiteri iz proslog sistema, ostaju profiteri, trljaju
> ruke i uzivaju i dalje. Bas kao u onom vicu o lisici koji kaze da se
> promene odnose samo na one gore, a ne i na nas dole.
>
> Nosite li se mislju da napisete neku himnu, to je, izgleda, sada
> popularno?
>
> - "Srbin je lud" moze da bude srpska himna, a crnogorsku sam vec
> napisao: "Gde god nadjes ladovinu, tu crnca posadi, tu je crnac navikao,
> ne voli da radi. Ni ja necu da radim, necu ni da pokusavam, ako me budu
> terali, ja cu da zabusavam."
>
> Kako bi glasila vojvodjanska?
>
> - Ne znam, to pitajte Balasevica, izgleda da on pise.
>
> Sta vi mislite o tome?
>
> - Problem Vojvodine je tesko resiti jer je Vojvodina ravna i zato je
> tamo najveci procenat samoubistava. On se probudi ujutru, uhvati se za
> glavu, kaze: "Jao, opet ravno", uzme utoku i rokne se.
>
> Ili sedne i napise himnu?
>
> - Ne napise himnu, padne u depresiju. Ili sa motora. Cudi me, buduci da
> je gospodin autonomas Canak, koliko ja znam, licko-banijskog porekla,
> otkud njemu te autonomaske teznje. Da li je navikao da bude pod
> habsburskom monarhijom pa to zeli i dalje?
>
> Za razliku od vaseg zemljaka Velje Ilica.
>
> - Znam Velju, prijatelji smo. On sada mora da balansira. U redu, lepo je
> mesto potpredsednika vlade, ali mora glasno i jasno da se izjasni za
> koga je u ovom aktuelnom sukobu, a ne da glumi mirovnog sudiju zbog toga
> sto je dobio to mesto. Mora da bude konkretniji i jasniji. A ja znam sta
> on misli. Mislimo isto.
>
> Kako se vama cini ovaj sukob na relaciji Kostunica - Djindjic?
>
> - Bice: tresla se gora rodio se mis. Opstace i vlada i DOS, jer su oni
> neophodni jedni drugima. Ne vidim neko burno razresenje. Neko ce da ode,
> verovatno ce pasti i neke gla

[NSP] Fw: nato.gif

2001-09-03 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic

- Original Message - 
From: mart 
To: Rick Rozoff 
Cc: 
Sent: Sunday, September 02, 2001 10:26 PM
Subject: nato.gif

To Rick Rozof,
CC to Jela, Heikki, Per, Miroslav, Bill, Klo, Jim, 
KIM, 

Dear Comrades,
I found this  "NATO gif." image on the net. 
Please use and distribute widely!
mart
NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi

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 nato.gif

[NSP] WESTERN SECRET SERVICES AND THE KOSOVO LIBERATION ARMY

2001-09-02 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic

WESTERN
SECRET SERVICES AND THE KOSOVO LIBERATION
ARMYExperiences sometimes
cost a lot. The Americans in Afghanistan have an experience that the
systematic help by the secret services to mujahedins in 1989 led to the so
much wanted disgrace of the Soviet troops, but it couldn't bribe the
further behaviour of the Islamic fighters in the long term. The western
secret services - especially CIA - trained the Afghanistan fighters who
later turned to be ungrateful and today are wanted as terrorists.
The same thing goes for the Kosovo Liberation Army. Before the
Kosovo war, the American, the British and the German secret services
ingratiated it, but its remainders after the fall of Milosevic turned
against Macedonia. The German Defence Minister, Scharping, in these not
very democracy-oriented forces today sees "Albanian terrorists." But, the
fighters from KLA have been welcomed guests in Germany for years. Also,
the seat of the government in exile of the Kosovo Albanians was situated
in Germany from 1996. The German secret service BND opened a seat of its
own in Albania. Through them, from 1992 a contact has been maintained with
the radical opposition of the Kosovo Albanians. But, when it comes to the
secret services, the United States of America soon assumed a more
important role. Starting from 1993, the German influence on the militant
Kosovo Albanians has reduced, parallel with the strengthening of the
American influence. Belgrade and Paris see this differently.
According to French information, the retired Deputy Chief of BND,
Kesselring, allegedly interceded in favour of military training of the
Kosovo rebels near the Turkish city of Izmir. Kesselring is a son of the
General from the German Air Force who during the World War II issued an
order for bombardment of Belgrade and also for a certain period of time
was a chief of the BND branch office in Izmir. But, the thing that the
pro-Serbian circles within the French secret service plant to this renown
man from BND is similar to the theory of conspiracy that came from Paris
two years ago and according to which the special units of the Bundesver
KSK secretly trained the fighters from KLA. Only the retired General Galua
doesn't share the same opinion in France. He thinks that Germany with its
secret services aimed at destabilizing former Yugoslavia. As far as these
claims are concerned, the bad thing is that they cannot be publicly
opposed because both BND and KSK work secretly. And as it is a usual thing
for the so-called "ongoing operations", no attitude is publicly expressed
about KLA. But the "brotherhood in arms" between BND and KLA, as
pro-Serbian groups claim, has never existed. It could be better to say
that KLA fighters sometimes helped BND in their surveillance of Kosovo,
equally as the American Delta Forces and the British Special Air Service
did it. It was not BND, but the American secret services that trained the
now unpopular "Kosovo fighters for freedom." www.dwelle.de/macedoniansource: DWWeb posted at:
5/5/2001 5:34:00 AM (GMT-8)

NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi

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[NSP] WESTERN SECRET SERVICES AND THE KOSOVO LIBERATION ARMY

2001-09-02 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic

NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi

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Re: [NSP] Sprejom protiv DOS-ovskih gnjida

2001-09-02 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic



Dragi moj brate Jovane
Po preuzimanju vlasti svu tu bagru cemo streljati za nauk srpskoj
opismenjenoj bagri intelektualaca da vise nikada ne sluze okupatoru .
pukovnik
[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Saturday, September 01, 2001 10:35 PM
Subject: [NSP] Sprejom protiv DOS-ovskih gnjida


> Da li smo mi jos nezavisna drzava? Da li je to nezavisno sudstvo kad
> vam sudije obucavaju strucnjaci neprijateljskog, nelegalnog
> politickog suda?
>
> Jovan Grbic,
> Tilburg, Holandija
>
> P.S. - Za DOS-ovske gnjide mora se pronaci BRZO sprej za unistavanje
> stetnih insekata
>
> __
>
> Poseta Karle del Ponte Beopgradu
>
> "Znak da ce pojedini haski slucajevi mozda biti prepusteni i domacem
> pravosudu jeste i nedavno odrzan specijalizovan seminar na Palicu. Od
> 24. do 29. avgusta tridesetak sudija, tuzilaca i advokata je obucavan
> kako da postupe u slucajevima optuzenih za ratne zlocine i povredu
> humanitarnog prava. Predavanja na ovom skupu, koji su organizovali
> Ministarstvo pravde Srbije i Fond za humanitarno pravo, drzali su
> strucnjaci iz Haskog tribunala".
>
> NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi
>
>
>
>

NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi

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[NSP] Fw: Protest NATO: Oct 6 Ottawa

2001-09-01 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic





 
- Original Message - 
From: mart 
Sent: Saturday, September 01, 2001 4:34 AM
Subject: Fw: Protest NATO: Oct 6 Ottawa 

 

Forward from mart.
Please Distribute Widely.

- Original Message -From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>Sent: Sunday, 
August 05, 2001 2:54 AMSubject: Protest NATO: Oct 6 Ottawa [WWW.STOPNATO.ORG.UK]Visit our 
website: HTTP://WWW.STOPNATO.ORG.UK-In 
a message dated 03/08/01 18:56:02 Eastern Daylight Time,[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
writes: Calling all 
Activists! This is an urgent  "Call to Dis 
Arms!"NATO PA* is coming to Ottawa!  October 5-8, 
2001   Please join us in building towards the:"No to NATO! 
Festival of Creative NonViolence"    <--<  
whatSaturday, October 6, at 1 
p.m.  
<--<  when  Gathering at the US Embassy (MacKenzie 
Ave.) <--< whereJOIN THE 
FESTIVITIES!  Celebrate the diversity of creative nonviolence!!Here are 
some of the ideas we've been discussing.  We need your help nowto turn 
these and other ideas into reality: large puppets and street 
theatre symbolic conversion of police barricades around NATO mtgs. into 
prisonwalls to contain war criminals poetry/spoken word/musical 
performances speaker phone/sound system creating a live connection to 
anti-NATOactivists around the world radical cheerleaders, the 
Raging Grannies and the Grumbling Gramps (?)interfaith peace 
servicedistribution of free vegetarian foodcivil disobedience to attempt 
citizens arrests of NATO war leadersboycott of corporations 
sponsoring/supporting the NATO visitprojecting images of NATO's war against 
Yugoslavia (slides, videos)  onto exterior walls of 
significant buildingsGET BUSY!  Start preparing for Olympics of 
nonviolent action! We areinviting activists from far and wide to come 
together to build thiscelebration of peacemaking!  We would like to see 
as many creativeactivities as possible to counter NATO's warmaking.  
Let's demonstrate toNATO, corporations, governments, the general public and 
the media, thatthere is a vibrant, dynamic, diverse and lively movement 
opposed tomilitarism and corporate globalization.  Please work with 
others to takeon a project (large or small) to prepare the most imaginative 
action,performance or display that you can muster!  Embrace your spirit 
ofcreativity and nonviolence to send the message loud and clear:  We 
areholding NATO leaders accountable for their crimes against peace 
andhumanity!A FEW THINGS THAT YOU CAN DO:(1) 
PUBLICITY!
Please help to promote this Festival.  Spread the word 
to friends andcolleagues:  Circulate this email announcement to your 
contacts, tolistserves, make phone calls, put notices in publications, 
makeannouncements at meetings, shout from the rooftops and generally 
encourage as many people as possible to attend!(2) 
ENDORSMENTS!
Please ask organizations to endorse the Festival so that 
our list ofsponsoring groups is as comprehensive as possible on future 
publicitymaterials.  Please consider asking for endorsements from 
groups focused on peace, anti-globalization, human rights, the environment, 
social justice, poverty as well as labour unions and religious, youth and 
feminist organizations, to name but a few.(3) 
CREATIVITY!
Please urge groups to bring their creative energies, props 
and performances to the Festival. Get together with others to plan some 
particular activity that creatively conveys a message that you feel strongly 
about.  (We're hoping to see puppets, costumes, street theatre, satirical 
songs, clever banners, flags, photos, signs and many other diverse symbolic 
representations to dramatically conveying who we are, what we stand for and why 
we think NATO should be behind bars!)  Please let us know what you're 
planning so we can compile a list to help publicize your activities and possibly 
direct some volunteers your way for a specific project!(4) FINANCIAL 
SUPPORT!
Of course, some money would help too!  We have 
received no funding for this event.  If you can't make it to the Festival, 
or even if you are attending, please remember that any donation -large or small 
-- would be very much appreciated.  Please ask unions, NGOs and other 
individuals for grants or donations to help us make this festival a great 
success.Cheques can be made payable to the Coalition to Oppose the Arms 
Trade (or just COAT), and mailed to 541 McLeod St., Ottawa Ontario K1R 5R2 
Canada (earmarked "Festival of Creative Nonviolence.")(5) JOIN OUR LIST 
SERVE!
The Coalition to Oppose the Arms Trade has created the 
"no_to_nato" listserve to discuss and build nonviolent responses to NATO's 
visit to Ottawa. To join our list, just send the following message to 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> : subscribe no_to_nato (Then, when you receive 
an automated email simply reply to it and you're subscribed.)You can connect 
to the "no_to_nato" archive of email postings from the COAT website:  or view it 
at

Re: [NSP] kostunica osudio sljivancanina zbog javnog nastupa

2001-09-01 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic




Vidju ti baba sere kako se razigrala, neda 
rodoljubima ni da se slobodno krecu.
Gde su srpski debili koji su 5. oktobra slavili 
slobodu i postenjacinu mackara.
pukovnik

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  SAVA VIDANOVIC 
  
  To: STOP_NSP 
  Sent: Saturday, September 01, 2001 3:50 
  AM
  Subject: [NSP] kostunica osudio 
  sljivancanina zbog javnog nastupa
  
NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi

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Re: [NSP] Stojan Cerovic menja Protica?

2001-08-29 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic

Title: Message



Prijatelj kaplice i marihuane, glup kao 
tocak,
kako bi rekla moja pokojna baba Mara 
JADO
pukovnik

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Miroslav 
  Antic 
  To: YUGO 
  ; BALKAN ; Siem-News ; 'SIM' ; 'SIM Egroups' ; [EMAIL PROTECTED] ; NSP 
  Cc: YUEMB - Ottawa 
  Sent: Thursday, August 30, 2001 2:26 
  AM
  Subject: [NSP] Stojan Cerovic menja 
  Protica? 
  
    
  Stojan Ceroviæ menja Protiæa? 
  BEOGRAD - Stojan Ceroviæ, novinar i predsednik Upravnog odbora 
  nedeljnika Vreme, najozbiljniji je kandidat za novog jugoslovenskog 
  ambasadora u SAD, saznaje Blic u Saveznom ministarstvu inostranih poslova. 
  
  - Neko mi je rekao da bih mogao da budem ambasador u SAD, ali mi niko iz 
  Saveznog ministarstva inostranih poslova nije zvanièno uputio takvu ponudu - 
  izjavio je Ceroviæ za Blic. On je ocenio da bi teko mogao da odbije takvu 
  ponudu, ukoliko bude predloen za ambasadora u Sjedinjenim Amerièkim Dravama, 
  jer se radi o suvie krupnoj stvari. Ceroviæ je naglasio da je proteklu 
  godinu proveo u Americi i da ima dobre veze sa èelnicima Stejt departmenta. 
  
  Pored Ceroviæa, kao drugi moguæi naslednik Milana St. Protiæa pominjan je 
  jo jedan kandidat, ali juèe nismo bili u moguænosti da dobijemo ni potvrdu ni 
  demanti ove informacije. 
  http://blic.gates96.com/
   
  www.antic.org
   NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi
NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi

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[NSP] Grim Fairytales

2001-08-29 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic




 
The 
BunkerGeorge Szamuely


Grim Fairytales
The most 
recent "genocide" hoax from the Balkans is the breathlessly retold horror story 
of "mass graves" of Kosovo Albanians supposedly littering Serbia. The Serbs 
allegedly murdered the Albanians in 1999, but rather than have NATO discover the 
evidence of this crime, Slobodan Milosevic ordered that the bodies be taken out 
of the province and buried in Serbia. 
Let us trace 
the origin of this amazing story. The first person to make this claim was Natasa 
Kandic, who heads the Humanitarian Law Center, a Belgrade outfit that has been 
bankrolled for years by George Soros and the U.S. National Endowment for 
Democracy (NED). During the 1999 bombing she did her duty and promoted the cause 
of her paymasters, NATO. On April 30 she announced that some 800 bodies were 
removed from their original burial sites in Kosovo and reburied elsewhere in the 
province and in Serbia. She demanded that the new regime in Belgrade reveal the 
"truth" about this destruction of evidence. 
The timing of 
Kandic’s demand was interesting. One month earlier the Belgrade regime had 
arrested Milosevic—on corruption, not war crimes, charges. The charges were 
bogus and the investigation was going nowhere. Kostunica was scheduled to visit 
Washington in early May. His meetings with Bush, Colin Powell, Dick Cheney and 
Condoleezza Rice were evidently brutal affairs. The Administration was not happy 
with his foot-dragging. U.S. aid to Yugoslavia, it was made clear to him, was 
conditional on Milosevic’s swift handover to the Hague Tribunal. Belgrade had to 
come up with "evidence" of war crimes to sell the policy of "cooperation" to a 
skeptical public. 
Next a story 
appeared in a local crime magazine, Timocka Krimi Revija, about a 
Mercedes refrigerator truck from Kosovo, full of bodies, that was hauled out of 
the Danube in April 1999. After the truck was recovered, the bodies were buried. 
According to the diver who helped recover the truck, Zivadin Djordjevic, there 
were between 30 and 50 bodies inside. Many were naked and some of the women were 
wearing Muslim-style pantaloons. There was a heavy stone leaning on the 
accelerator pedal. The truck had Kosovo license plates and belonged to an 
Albanian meat processing firm. According to a wire story, the diver "provided no 
details of where and how the bodies were disposed." The story tells us nothing. 
We do not know who the people inside the truck were, or how they died. The only 
identifying feature was the Muslim-style pantaloons. They may or may not have 
been Muslims, may or may not have been Albanians. Yet in no time at all, the 
story was presented as conclusive proof of Serbian war crimes and Milosevic’s 
cover-up thereof. 
On July 31, in 
the middle of a standard New York Times puff piece on the U.S.-installed 
Belgrade regime, Carlotta Gall uttered this gem: "What is known is that bodies 
were dumped in mass graves, either in the Danube or on land. The exhumations of 
the 800 to 1000 bodies known about so far will take months. Captain Karleusa 
says he will need much longer to establish who gave the orders for the carnage 
and who carried it out." Amazing that after all the tales of mass graves and 
trucks filled with bodies going from Kosovo to Serbia, Karleusa’s estimate of 
the number of bodies buried is identical to Natasa Kandic’s from three months 
earlier. They evidently have to keep their stories straight. 
The 
refrigerator truck story is so absurd that it will have an even shorter shelf 
life than NATO’s other stories. We are asked to believe the following: 
Yugoslavia was being bombed round-the-clock. Yet the army took the trouble to 
transport thousands of bodies for burial. Given a truck limit of 50 bodies, 
disposing of thousands of bodies would need a lot of trucks. U.S. satellites 
were closely monitoring Yugoslavia, yet NATO never had the slightest inkling of 
this refrigerator truck convoy. Moreover, dumping bodies into the Danube is not 
the brightest of ideas. The Danube is a busy waterway. The chances of collision 
are high. Nor is destroying Mercedes trucks the most prudent course for an 
impoverished country like Yugoslavia. Then again, why would one want to 
transport dead bodies just to remove evidence? Wouldn’t dousing them in 
gasoline, setting fire to them and burying the ashes be a lot easier? 

Curiously 
enough, the Humanitarian Law Center’s website gives a clue as to what really 
happened. The site carries a story from the newspaper Danas, dated June 
1, which reported eyewitness accounts of the recovery of the truck. Yet one of 
the eyewitnesses actually saw the dumping of the truck. Here is what he 
says: "I was in a boat on the river, only some thirty meters from the bank, when 
I heard voices about 2.15 a.m. Sound carries a long way on the Danube at night. 
I don’t know what language they were speaking there on the bank—I didn’t 
understand any of the words. It might have been Tu

Re: [NSP] canak ponudio proticu mesto savetnika, zmijarnik

2001-08-28 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic




Vesti iz zmijarnika
Dama iz zmijarnika tvrdi da je iz pouzdanog izvora 
baba serenih dosovaca dobila sledecu informaciju:
tokom predizborne kampanje DOS-a u avgustu i 
septembru 2000. godine "veliki srpski istoricar" je  uspeo da stupi u kontakt sa 
povecom grupom kriminalaca iz beogradskog podzemlja, i da im ponudi lokale 
i  velike poslove na nivou grada Beograda posle izbora i pobede Dos-a, i 
naravno njegovog ustolicenja na mesto gradonacelnika Beograda. Zestoki 
momci su pristali uz medjusobno potpisivanje sporazuma, sa detaljnom 
specifikacijom deobe plena. Kada se nas "vrli uglednik" nasao u fotelji 
gradonacelnika momci su dosli po plen, Protic se silno zalagao, 
koprcao, odlucivao ali nikako nije uspevao da ispuni obavezu prema 
vitezovima beogradskog podzemlja. Momci su jedno vreme bili strpljivi a 
onda su krenuli da nasrcu, "nas veliki istoricar" je ubrzo shvatio da 
moze  da ostane bez glave,  te je zatrazio od baba sere i 
djindjoline da ga negde sklone na sigurno,  naravno Vasingrton je bio pravi 
izbor. 
Nas diplomata od formata, sa porodicnim 
pedigreom veleizdajnika bio je toplo primljen od americkih zvanicnika, velikih 
prijatelja srpskog naroda,  zaljubljenika u  decu Varvarina, 
Aleksinca, Novog Sada, Sopota, Ralje, batajnice.  Ali ne lezi 
vraze, moderni beogradjanin  pored dobre kapljice u poslednje vreme je 
otkrio da je smrkanje kokaina zaista najsigurniji put ka gradjaninu europe i 
sveta. Istovremeno nije bilo  problema za nabavku koke, pa tu je 
diplomatska posta. Medjutim, tu je nas buduci akademik uglednik napravio  
kardinalnu gresku u koracima, preterao je u kolicinama. 
pa bre glupa maso od protica, nema bato kod Amera da se radi sta hoce, ti naucio kod Slobe, 
da rusis vladu, ne moze to da se radi u Vasingtonu, kada je koka u pitanju kod 
njih je drustvanjce odabrano i kamerno, ne nose oni bre kaubojske cizme, oni bre 
nose dobre lojd cipele, seljacino jedna.  
posto kupila po toliko prodala
pukovnik
From: SAVA VIDANOVIC 

  To: STOP_NSP 
  Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2001 3:57 
  AM
  Subject: [NSP] canak ponudio proticu 
  mesto savetnika
  
    

NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi

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[NSP] Fw: Iraq Under Siege

2001-08-28 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic





 
- Original Message - 
From: Biswanath Halder <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 
Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2001 8:33 AM
Subject: Iraq Under Siege
>     
> 
>    If you 
would not like to remain on my mailing list, please> 
    send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED].  Type "REMOVE" in the 
Subject>     line, and in the body 
type in all of your e-mail addresses.> > 
    
> 
>    Over the 
last eleven years, United States-manipulated and> 
    United Nations-imposed economic 
sanctions -- and massive>     
bombings by the United States and the United Kingdom -- have> 
    claimed the lives of 1.5 million 
people in Iraq.  Most of the> 
    victims are children under the age of 
five.  The damage to>     
infrastructure resulting from bombings and economic sanctions> 
    has left this once prosperous nation 
crippled and dying.  The>     
combined effect of these actions has been devastating: hyper-> 
    inflation, massive disease 
proliferation in both people and> 
    animals, mass migration, chronic 
malnutrition, extreme poverty,> 
    increased crime, collapse of medical 
services, collapse of>     
agriculture, collapse of water and sewage processing, increased> 
    reliance on the state.  The list 
is endless.> > 
   In March 1999, a 
special United Nations Security Council> 
    panel reported, "The gravity of the 
humanitarian situation of>     the 
Iraqi people is indisputable and cannot be overstated."> 
    Iraq, the report states, has 
"experienced a shift from relative> 
    affluence to massive poverty."  
Prior to the imposition of>     
sanctions, Iraq's health care system was regarded as among the> 
    best in the Middle East.  Today, 
however, children die from>     
epidemics of once preventable diseases.  The special Security> 
    Council panel also reported that "the 
infant mortality rates in>     
Iraq today are among the highest in the world."  The US> 
    government actively supports 
sanctions to prevent the production> 
    of "weapons of mass destruction," 
while itself remaining the>     
world's largest producer, distributor, and user of weapons of> 
    mass destruction.> > 
   Condemned by Pope 
John Paul II, this undeclared war by> 
    insidious means is not only immoral 
but also illegal by>     standards 
of international and US law.  The embargo directly> 
    violates the Geneva Convention, the 
UN Charter, the Constitution>     
of the World Health Organization, the Universal Declaration of> 
    Human Rights, and the Charter of 
Economic Rights and Duties of>     
States.  Furthermore, according to US law, the blockade of the> 
    Iraqi people is also an act of 
international terrorism.> > 
   All compassionate 
and rational people should oppose the> 
    inhuman policies of the US and the UK 
against Iraq.  Let us send> 
    a loud and clear message to them to 
end the eleven-year-long>     
siege.  Please sign the petitions at the following URL:> > 
    http://junior.apk.net/~halder/poll.html> 
>     A. Petition to Stop the 
Sanctions and Bombing Against Iraq> > 
    B. Petition to the British Parliament 
(at the Mariam Appeal)> > 
    C. End the Iraqi Sanctions (to the 
UN/US/UK Administrations)> > 
    D. Petition to the UN Security 
Council>    
Addressing the Humanitarian Situation in Iraq> 

NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi

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Re: [NSP] del ponte iduce nedelje u beogradu i sarajevu

2001-08-28 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic




Bojovicu
 javi se u nedelju uvece radi dogovora kako tu 
nacisticku kravu da docekamo u ponedeljak.
kucni 3671-372
pukovnik

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  SAVA VIDANOVIC 
  
  To: STOP_NSP 
  Sent: Tuesday, August 28, 2001 4:03 
  AM
  Subject: [NSP] del ponte iduce nedelje u 
  beogradu i sarajevu
  
  
  Del Ponte iduće nedelje u Beogradu i 
  Sarajevu 
  
  Hag, 27. avgusta (Tanjug-agencije) 
  Glavni tužilac Haškog tribunala Karla del Ponte dolazi početkom iduće 
  nedelje u Beograd, a zatim i u Sarajevo, u radnu posetu, saznaje danas AFP od 
  njenog portparola Florens Artman. 
  Karla del Ponte će doputovati u Beograd 3. septembra u radnu posetu, čiji 
  je cilj da se napravi bilans saradnje sa Tribunalom, precizirala je Artmanova. 
  Karla del Ponte bi trebalo da razgovara sa "svojim uobičajenim sagovornicima" 
  iz savezne i srpske vlade, među kojima su i ministri pravde i unutrašnjih 
  poslova. 
  Kancelarija Karle del Ponte nije želela da komentariše pre ove posete 
  stanje saradnje između Haškog tribunala i SR Jugoslavije i Srbije. 
  Karla del Ponte će napustiti Beograd u utorak uveče da bi otputovala za 
  Sarajevo, gde će ostati do srede. Tamo će se sresti sa predstavnicima vlasti 
  Bosne i Hercegovine, kao i sa predstavnicima međunarodne zajednice. 
  NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi
NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi

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Re: [NSP] Vesti SPO za 27.8.2001.

2001-08-27 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic


 Posto sam u tom periodu bila zaposlena u Demokratskoj stranci, i
rasporedjena na poslovima i zadacima organizacije protesta od  strane
Zorana Djindjica, za  svakodnevno ucesce uglednih govornika  na skupovima u
pedeset gradova,  prevoz  i benzin, odgovorno tvrdim da smo svakodnevno
dobijale  novac Ljiljana Kuzmanovic i ja  za benzin od Zorana Djindjica,
koji smo davale soferima volonterima.Nadam se, da jos uvek postoji lista
volontera koji mogu da potvrde ove navode.
To sto je Zoran Djindjic veleizdajnik ne daje pravo Vuku Draskovicu da
plasira lazi.
pukovnik

> SRPSKI POKRET OBNOVE
> Ponedeljak, 27. avgust 2001.
>
>
>
> OTVORENO PISMO IZVRŠNOG ODBORA SRPSKOG POKRETA OBNOVE PREDSEDNIKU VLADE
> SRBIJE ZORANU ĐINĐIĆU
>
> Gospodine Đinđiću,
> Biznismeni Stanko Subotić Cane i Srećko Kestner nedavno su izjavili za
> sredstva javnog informisanja, a Vi to niste demantovali, da su Vam za
> vreme demonstracija Koalicije "Zajedno" 1996. godine dali 500 hiljada
> maraka u krupnim novčanicama. Pomenuta gospoda tvrde da su vam novac
> dali za organizaciju tromesečnih protesta protiv izborne krađe
> socijalista, ali mi iz SPO-a dobro znamo da Vi lično i Demokratska
> stranka tada niste dali ni jednu marku za plaćanje ozvučenja,
> postavljanje bine, obezbeđenje skupova, benzin i ostale troškove. Sve
> pomenute izdatke  plaćao je isključivo Srpski pokret obnove, što
> potvrđuju i odgovarajuće priznanice koje posedujemo. Gospodine Đinđiću,
> tražimo od Vas da obavestite javnost  na šta ste i kako utrošili pola
> miliona maraka koje ste pre pet godina dobili na ruke. Radi se velikom
> iznosu  kojim se može isplatiti pet hiljada prosečnih plata u Srbiji.
> Odgovor na ovo pitanje sigurno zanima i vaše saradnike i sve ostale
> članove Demokratske stranke. Odgovor dugujete tim više što često
> govorite o javnosti  rada novih vlasti i što za sve tvrdnje o kriminalu
> i korupciji tražite dokaze. Ako, ipak, odlučite da dobijeni novac, barem
> sada, utrošite, predlažemo Vam da ga date za lečenje i preživljavanje
> teško povređenog demonstranta Ivice Lazovića, u koga je 24. decembra
> 1996. pucao član SPS-a. Takođe, verujemo da ćete finansijski pomoći i
> porodici istoga dana ubijenog Predraga Starčevića, koji je nastradao pod
> cokulama Miloševićevih pristalica. Gospodine Đinđiću, takođe, tražimo od
> Vas da kao predsednik republičke vlade ispunite svoje obećanje i
> doprinesete da se što pre otkriju ubice Predraga Starčevića.
>
> ČEKAMO ODGOVOR NA NAŠE PISMO
>
> Pre dva dana Izvršni odbor Srpskog Pokreta Obnove uputio je otvoreno
> pismo Zoranu Đinđiću, tražeći od njega da odgovori šta je bilo sa
> 500.000 nemačkih maraka, koje je on, prema javnim izjavama Stanka
> Subotića i njegovog saradnika Srećka Kestnera, dobio za vreme
> tromesečnih demonstracija 96. i 97. godine, a za pokriće troškova
> Koalicije "Zajedno". Umesto odgovora na to pismo, koje naši "slobodni"
> mediji nisu objavili, dobili smo saopštenje Gradskog Odbora Demokratske
> stranke, koje su svi mediji objavili i u kome se kaže da je SPO krao
> prilikom izgradnje Jugoslovenskog dramskog pozorišta. Čekajući odgovor
> na naše pismo, poručujemo Gradskom odboru DS ono što oni već znaju, da
> Srpski Pokret Obnove nikada nije krao i da sistemom "držte lopova" neće
> skrenuti pažnju javnosti sa istine da su DS i njen lider simbol
> korupcije i kriminala u današnjoj Srbiji. Nijedan dinar namenjen
> izgradnji Jugoslovenskog dramskog pozorišta nije ukrao SPO, a u slučaju
> koji Gradski odbor DS spominje novac je utrošen na renoviranje
> Bogoslovije, o čemu postoji sva dokumentacija. Stanove nismo oteli, već
> delili po zakonu, kao što su to i oni radili na Vračaru, Starom gradu,
> Zvezdari, u Nišu, Pirotu, Kraljevu, Kragujevcu i svuda tamo gde su DS i
> GSS imali većinu vlasti unutar koalicije "Zajedno", i kao što je to
> činio njihov sadašnji lider u DOS-u Nebojša Čović, za čijeg je mandata u
> Beogradu podeljeno oko 3.000 stanova. Oni koji sada pljačkaju celu
> državu, švercuju naftu, cigarete, drogu i šta sve još preko svojih
> saradnika u kriminalnim aferama Srbije, nemaju nikakvog prava da govore
> o drugima, već im preporučujemo da se pozabave svojom strankom, svojim
> predsednikom i kriminalom kojim se bave.
>
>
>
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> www.spo.org.yu
>
> -
>
> NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi
>
>
>
>

NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi

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[NSP] Fw: Poruka

2001-08-26 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic



Sent: Sunday, August 26, 2001 12:32 PM
Subject: Poruka


Drustvo veleizdajnika.
pukovnik


> PAKT STABILNOSTI ZA JUGOISTOCNU EVROPU U SRJ. NACIONALNI KOORDINATOR:
Milan
> Pajevic, savetnik za spoljnu politiku potpredsednika Savezne vlade,
E-mail:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
> Zamenik NACIONALNOG KOORDINATORA: Zdravko Tuvic, SMIP, Grupa za Pakt
> stabilnost, E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
> Savetnik NACIONALNOG KOORDINATORA: Zorana Ivankovic, E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
> KOORDINATOR: Jovan Ratkovic, SMIP, E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
> KOORDINATOR: Milica Uvalic, pomocnik saveznog ministra za ekonomske odnose
sa
> inostranstvom, E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
> INICIJATIVE /LIBERALIZACIJA TRGOVINE/. KOORDINATOR: Dusko Lopandic, SMIP,
> E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
> INICIJATIVA /REGIONALNA INFRASTRUKTURA I RAZVOJ PRIVATNOG SEKTORA/.
> KOORDINATOR: Boris Begovic, Ekonomski savetnik potpredsednika Savezne
vlade,
> E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
> INICIJATIVA /UNAPREDJIVANJE POSLOVANJA - INVEST COMPACT/. KOORDINATOR:
Jelica
> Minic, pomocnik saveznog minista za inostrane poslove, E-mail:
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
> INICIJATIVA /SAVET ZA BIZNIS/, KOORDINATOR: Nikola Mijatovic, predsednik
Mostec
> Limited, E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
>
> INICIJATIVA /NACIONALNI KOORDINACIONI KOMITET ZA REREP I DR. MEDJUNARODNE
> PROJEKTE. KOORDINATOR:
>
> - Srdja Popovic, E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> - Radoje Lausevic, REREP, E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> - Andjelka Mihajlov, Vlada RS, E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> - Predrag Simonovic, ekspert, E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> - Jelena Beronja, NGO sektor, E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
> - Srdjan Susic, sekretar Komiteta, E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
>
> INICIJATIVA /e-SEE - UNAPREDJIVANJE ICT/. KOORDINATOR: Marijana
Vidas-Bubanja,
> specijalni savetnik, E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
> INICIJATIVA /INICIJATIVA ZA SOCIJALNU KOHEZIJU/, KOORDINATOR: Dragoljub
Kavran,
> predsednik Saveta za javnu upravu, Vlada RS, E-mail:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] ;
> Kontakt osoba, ekspert Mihail Arandarenko, E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
> INICIJATIVA /REFORMA FINANSIJSKOG SEKTORA/. KOORDINATOR: Radovan Jelasic,
> vice-guvernet Narodne banke Jugoslavije, E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
> **
>
> Sandra Raskovic Ivic, Komesar za izbeglice: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
> PARLAMENTARNA SARADNJA: Jovan Ratkovic, SMIP, E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>

NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi

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Re: [NSP] upozorenje

2001-08-26 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic




Na toj listi je i ono masonsko antisrpsko djubre 
Dukanac.
pukovnik

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  SAVA VIDANOVIC 
  
  To: STOP_NSP 
  Sent: Saturday, August 25, 2001 1:17 
  AM
  Subject: [NSP] upozorenje
  
  Upozoravam sve clanove ove liste da ignorisu forum "Ljudska 
  prava" zbog svojih nedemokratskih metoda u  sputavanju istine , SLOBODE 
  MISLIi  I  stavova drugih ljudi ,koji  se ne slazu sa 
  misljenjem ganga Ljudskih prava.
  Komentar na clanak" ideologa" ljudskih prava Milice Hrebeljanovic{u 
  prilogu}
  gospoda moderatori  su blokirali, jer  protivureci 
  njihovim stavovima.
  Dosad je bilo dosta upozorenja na nedemokraticnost 
  moderatora od strane pojedinaca. Ja se pridruzujem njima ovim apelom jer 
  smatram da nam nije mesto tamo gde su Dragin, Robert, David 
  Jakovljevic,Mirceta Bozovic, Milica Hrebeljanovic, Mihajlo Pavlica, Petar 
  Andric i Krsmanovic, direktor foruma Ljudska prava.
  Sava Vidanovic
   
   
  U pravu ste gospodine Georgevic, procitajte ne jednom 
  vec vise puta  Ricardavan Houtena, odnosno brilijantny nasu Branku , 
  pa vam nece nikada vise pastina pamet  da se  nosite sa jednom 
  svestrano obrazovanom zenom, komentatoromi politickim analiticarem kakav 
  se samo moze pozeleti. Velika je hrabrostvaseg "ideologa" Milice 
  Hrebeljanovic da se upusta u diskusiju sa Brankom.Ako je imalo pametna 
  mogla bi da primeti da nije dorasla Branki. Ovomprilikom pokazala je sve 
  svoje nedostatke i zablude{vidi clanak odgovorMilice Branki-DOS i sabotaza 
  Nacije}.I vi gospodine Robert pokazujete svoju maloumnost, kad kazete da 
  ce nam bitisve jasno. Da jasno je svima , ali vama nije jasno. Sta je na 
  kraju vamajasno sto drugima nije? Dovoljno je procitati i Branku i Milicui 
  i dashvatite ono sto niste u stanju da shvatite, povrsnost i verbalizam 
  MiliceHrebeljanin, koja kruzi ko kisa oko Kragujevca  bez hrabrosti i 
  neznanja dapobije bilo jednu konstataciju  i vidjenje politicke 
  situacije u Srbiji iJugoslaviji gospodje Branke. To je samo jos jedan 
  dokaz politicke nezrelostiforuma ljudskih prava koji uporno pokusava da 
  bezuspesno demantuje svacijemisljenje.Sve dosadasnje  
  humanitarne organizacije i organizacije ljudskih prava, kojedeklarisu sebe 
  kao nevladine organizacije, dokazale su da su to organizacijekoje  
  zastupaju i sprovode politiku zapada protiv srpskog naroda.Forumljudskih 
  prava, koliko je meni poznato, dosada nije spomenuo srpske zrtve,dok 
  slatkorecivo govori o zrtvama Siptara, Muslimana i Hrvata. Nije secuditi 
  inostranim organizacijama, vec organizacijama u nasoj zemlji ,koje bipo 
  svim moralnim kriterijumima trebale prvenstveno da se bave humanium 
  iljudskim pravima Srba. Zasto je to tako, odgovor lezi u 
  inostranimfondacijama ,na prvom mestu Sorosa, koji finansiraju njihove 
  aktivnosti.Vidanovuic Original Message -From: Robert 
  Georgevic <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>Sent: 
  Friday, August 24, 2001 10:09 AMSubject: Re: - Ljudska prava - Re: - DOS i 
  sabotaza nacije.> Pa procitajte samo galamatijas Richarda van 
  Houtena, pa ce vam> sve biti jasno. Robert>> --- Milica 
  Hrebeljanovic <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 
  wrote:> > >>DOS I SABOTAZA NACIJE.Prvi put posle 
  1945 godine smo dobili koliko toliko vlast sacinjenu odpragmaticara i 
  umerenih politicara, povrh svega demokratski nastrojenih. Onisu velika 
  nada da se zavede red i demokratija i nacija izvede iz  krize. Ioni 
  to zele.Ali mnogima u svetu, narocito u bliskom geo-politickom 
  okruzenju ne odgovarada nasa nacija i zemlja izadju iz krize, zele da nas 
  sprece da napredujemo,da se priblizimo Evropi.Zele da nas pretvore u 
  roblje.Zato svim silama radeda opstruiraju i blokiraju na sve moguce nacin 
  DOS.Nasa nacija su u opasnosti, mozemo nestati. To mnogi ne shvataju. 
  Nas nacijaizumire ubrzano, iz dana u dan.Te snage su se okoristile 
  od komunizma, to je koncept koj je bio nametnut iimao je za cilj sadasnje 
  rastakanje i raspad nacije i drzave. DOS jesuprotnost, treba ga spreciti i 
  dovesti one koji ce nastaviti raspadanjedrzave, oduzimanje njenih 
  teritorija. Ako zemlja ojaca sto zeli DOS toganecebiti, ako dodju oni 
  koji ce nastaviti slabljenje sto su cinili pola veka,odesve u 
  propast.Zato svim silama svi zajedno, iz zemlje i uz pomoc neznalica u 
  zemlji, izlonamernih, svugde sabotiraju svaku dobru akciju, spsovci i 
  julovci,radikali, to cine navodno da blamiraju DOS, da dobiju glasove. A 
  iza toga sekrije prevara, cilj je sve zavadjati i destabilizovati zemlju. 
  Isti cilj imai mera liberalnog odnosa Haskog suda prema S.Milosevicu , da 
  ohrabrirazvlascene u zemlji.( "Nas vodja je jak, ne moze mu nista 
  Hag").Nasa nacija posle pola veka slabljenja i unistavanja je 
  snemocala. Nema kaoranije mudrih ljudi, bolesni su, umrli, oslabili, 
  preokupirani brigama kakoda prezive, otisli van zemlje. To se 
  zloupotrebljava da se obezglavljenanacija zavadja, usmerava u pogresnom 
  pravcu.Pot

Re: [NSP] Djindjicevi faktori i motori.

2001-08-20 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic


CIA preko Kostunice je njega ustolicila, obojica mora da vise na Terazijama,
Srbima za nauk da se izdaja ne isplati.
Danas u 15:00casova, ispred americke ambasade u Beogradu , clanice   Narodne
straze su proslavile rodjendan gospodina Slobodana Milosevica uz sampanjac
(pandura je bilo kao salate).
pukovnik
- Original Message -
From: Milan Tepavac <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: STOPNSP <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Sunday, August 19, 2001 6:35 AM
Subject: [NSP] Djindjicevi faktori i motori.


> U Subotici ovih dana otvoren madjarski konzulat, u prisustvu Djindjica i
> predsednika vlade Madjarske Orbana. Bila je to orgija madjaskog
nacionalizma
> kao usred Budimpeste. Tom prilikom Djindjic je rekao: "Madjarska zajednica
u
> Srbiji bila je faktor i motor demokratskih promena u poslednjoj deceniji i
> zelim da odam priznanje Madjarima u Srbiji koji su se borili ne samo za
> svoja prava vec za demokratizaciju citave zemlje". Ovaj janicar broj jedan
> medju DOS -manlijama koristi svaku priliku da omalovazi Srbe a da se
dodvori
> nesrbima. Bar da je bio iskren do kraja pa da se zahvalio i Hrvatima,
> Siptarima, muslimanima, Jevrejima i naravno $$$ koji su ga doveli na
vlast.
>
> NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi
>
>
>
>

NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi

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Re: [NSP] SRPSKIM "AMERIKANCIMA"

2001-08-20 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic


Bravo momci!

pukovnik
- Original Message -
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Saturday, August 18, 2001 7:22 AM
Subject: RE: [NSP] SRPSKIM "AMERIKANCIMA"


> Podrzavam potpuno ovaj predlog. Ovo me sve potseca na ratno vreme,
> kada sam na Beotel chatu, gde sam prvod dana rata oformio grupu pod
> nazivom "Bomba", gde su se dobronamerni ljudi iz celog sveta sakupljali
> da bi na neki nacin ucestvovali u odbrani zemlje. Osnovna ideja je bila
> da se ukljucimo (potpuno neformalno) u sistem obavestavanja zemlje.
> Razmenjivali smo informacije o poletanjima iz baza u Italiji, Britaniji i
> Nemackoj, preletima neprijateljskih aviona, o njihovom broju. Takodje
> smo imali veoma obimne informacije o dejstvima nase PVO, o pogotcima
> i eventualnim padovima aviona i drugih letelica. Sistem je funkcionisao
> veoma dobro, bez obzira na sve pokusaje sabodase. A oni su bili
> sledeci:
> 1. "lose obavesteni Srbi" i "dobronamerni stranci" su stalno ulazili u
> diskuje o politickim temam, krivicom nas i NATO-a, jednom recju
> pokusavali su da razvodne diskusiju i da nas prebace sa jednog
> korisnog posla na beskorisnu polemiku.
> 2. Davanje dezinformacija o preletima nepostojecih aviona, o napadima
> tamo gde ih nije bilo, itd.
> 3. Skupljanje informacija o dejstvima PVO i njihovim rezultatima, o
> psiholoskom stanju stanovnistva, politickim razmisljanjima, itd.
> Sve u svemu radilo se o obavestajnoj i kontraobavestajnoj delatnosti.
> U pocetku je meni bilo zanimljivo da ih "otkrivam" da pravim sale
> na racun Agencije (sa velikim A), za koju rade, itd. ali sam konacno
> shvatio da postizem upravo ono sto treba izbeci.
> Hvala Bogu, brzo sam se specijalizovao u razotkrivanju ovih "agenata",
> i posle prvih pokusaja "demokratskog" otstranjivanja, presao sam na
> "sirovu silu". Jednostavno sam ih izbacivao sa sajta uz stalnu
> zabranu za datu IP-adresu. Moram da kazem da sam u pocetku imao
> potpuno otsustvo saradnje od strane uprave sajta, cak je doslo dotle
> da je meni bio ;postavljen "permanentni ban"! Na kraju sam trazio
> intervenciju policije. Nikada nisam saznao sta se dogodilo, ali ponovo
> sam dobio pristup sajtu i cak privilegiju administratora sistema, a da
> to nikada nisam trazio. to je prvi put za sve vreme rata da sam cvrso
> osetio da zaista radim nesto korisno i da to nije samo decija igra.
> Medjutim druga strana je presla na grublje metode, bilo je pokusaja
> rusenja sistema, neovlastenog upadanja u kompjutere stalnih clanova
> (dnevna norma pokusaja upada u moj kompjuter je bila u proseku
> 20-50 pokusaja - hvala Bogu, sistem zastite je funkcionisao). Onda
> sam zatrazio pomoc nasih hakera i IP adrese sa kojih su vrseni ovi
> pokusaji dobijale uzvratne udarce.
> Razvili smo i obimnu razmenu informacija sa Venikom koji je sve vreme
> vodio verovatno najbolju dokumentaciju o gubitcima NATO-a.
> NE pricam sve ovo da bih se hvalio, vec da bih objasnio koliko ovakve
> grupe nisu obicna zabava, vec mogu biti ozbiljan dobrinos "nasoj stvari".
> NEmam nikakvih predloga, ali se plasim da se suvise demokratski
> ponasamo prema tipicnim predstavnicima "demo(no)kratije", koji
> poznaju jedino jezik sirove sile.
> Na kraju, vezano za ovu temu, hteo bih da napomenem da sam sreo ogroman
> broj ljudi iz inostranstva , ne samo nasih (u koje ubrajam i Makedonce
> koji su cesto pokazivali vise patriotizma nego mnogi Srbi), vec i Rusa
> Italijana,
> Grka, Bugara, Engleza, Amerikanaca, Nemaca, Arapa, pa cak i Hrvata! To mi
> je povecalo optimizam i to je jedna znacajna cinjenica koja mi je
omogucila
> da mi onaj surovi rat ostane u secanju kao jedna ipak svetla epizoda.
> Koristim ovu priliku da se svim tim neznanim ljudima i na ovaj nacin
> zahvalim na velikom doprinosu koji su pruzili pravednoj borbi Srpskog
> naroda ne samo za svoju slobodu, vec i za opstu stvar, za jedan bolji,
> humaniji i posteniji svet.
> Ja sam na samom pocetku rata, upravo u grupi "Bomba" taj rat nazvao
> borbama Sila Mraka protivu Sila Svetlosti. Smatram da je i ova grupa
> "STOP-NSP" jedna od divizija koja se bori na strani Sila Svetlosti.
Zalosna
> cinjenica je da je jedan broj Srba i tada kao i sada bio i ostao na strani
> Sila Mraka, nekad ostrascenije nego nasi formalni neprijatelji. Neki od
> nis su naivni, glupi, neinformisani, ali verujte mi, veliki broj njih su
> jednostavno
> ljudi koji su "svoju dusu prodali djavolu", ljudi za koje sve pa i ono
> najsvetije "ima svoju cenu" (uvek veoma, veoma nisku). Razgovor i polemika
> s takvim ljudima je cisto gubljenje vremena, i zapravo doprinosi rasipanju
> nasih
> snaga, razvodnjavnju borbe. A ovo su kljucni trenutci istorije, od borbe
> ciji smo i mi deo, ne zavisi samo sudbina Srpskog naroda vec i sudbina
celog
> covecanstva. Mi jesmo jedan mali deo "vojske" koja taj rat vodi, i nas
> doprinos je mozda mali, ali nije zanemarljiv. Jer svaki rat je dobijala
neka
> voska koja nije bila nista vise nego suma napora svakog pojedinog vojnika.
> Zato ne treba ni posustati,

Re: [NSP] HITNO: Pad srpske vlade

2001-08-17 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic


Brod tone pacovi beze!
Baba sera veruje da ce postati neprikosnoveni vodja izludjenih Srba,
medjutim, stici ce i njega srpski svilen gajtan, nece mu vredeti ni podrska
NATOSMANLIJA .
pukovnik
- Original Message -
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Friday, August 17, 2001 8:03 PM
Subject: [NSP] HITNO: Pad srpske vlade


> BK televizija je javila u 7:40 da je DSS odlucila da se povuce iz vlade
> Republike Srbije i da postavi pred republicku skupstinu odgovornost ove
vlade.
> Nadam se da je ovo pocetak kraja najsramnije vlasti u istoriji ove zemlje.
>
> djordje Blagojevic
>
> NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi
>
>
>
>

NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi

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Re: [NSP] RTV Palma

2001-08-17 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic




Poznati obrenovacki kriminalac, pucisticki ministar 
pravde nakaza batic je oteo TV Palmu, posle gostovanja gospode Mome Kapora i 
Dragosa Kalajica.Vujovicu je sigurnije da cuti nego da ga baticevi ili 
djindjicevi kriminalci likvidiraju kao 
psa.
pukovnik

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  
  To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  Sent: Friday, August 17, 2001 7:16 
  AM
  Subject: Re: [NSP] RTV Palma
  Ja bih vas najlepse zamolio da to i ucinite. I mene 
  zaistazanima sta se tamo zapravo desava. Kako to da je odjednom,bez 
  ikakvog obavestenja potpuno promenjena uredjivackapolitika. Zasto se 
  direktor Palme, Miki Vujovic od tada nijejavio ni jednom ni u jednom 
  mediju. Zasto na mnogobrojne e-mailove niko ne dgovara... i jos toliko 
  pitanja.Djordje BlagojevicAt 20:13 9/8/01 +0200, you wrote: 
  
  Postovani Gospodine Vidanovicu,kada budete procenili da je 
cekanje na odgovor predugo, slobodno mi se obratite za pomoc, jer 
stanujem vrlo blizu"Palme", pa cu se prosetati da proverim sta se to 
desava kod njih.Pozdrav Branko O. BojovicNSP Lista isprobava 
demokratiju u 
NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi

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[NSP] godisnji odmor

2001-07-27 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic




Iskljucenje od 28.07.2001. do 
15.08.2001.
 
Jela Jovanovic. NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi==^
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Re: [NSP] smrt jugoslovenskog diplomate u ljubljani

2001-07-27 Прати разговор Jela Jovanovic




Ivo Viskovic ambasador?
Njegov tast je jos pre trideset godina bio 
poznat  u JNA  kao ljuti hercegovacki ustasa(Listica), a ni zet mu 
nije odmakoa i ceri i da ne pricamo.
izgleda se ivica dobro zaigrao.
pukovnik 
- Original Message - 

  From: 
  SAVA VIDANOVIC 
  
  To: STOP_NSP 
  Cc: minja 
  Sent: Friday, July 27, 2001 7:41 AM
  Subject: [NSP] smrt jugoslovenskog 
  diplomate u ljubljaniNSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi==^
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Re: [NSP] NIJE SVE U PROPOVEDI

Title: Message



Miko
oladi sa tim psihopatom Trebjesaninom.
pukovnik

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Miroslav 
  Antic 
  To: Sorabia ; NSP ; News ; SIM-Egroups ; SIM ; BALKAN 
  
  Cc: LJudska Prava ; 'KPJ' 
  Sent: Wednesday, July 25, 2001 2:11 
  AM
  Subject: [NSP] NIJE SVE U PROPOVEDI
  
  


  
NIJE SVE U 
PROPOVEDI

  
 Pise: Prof. dr Zarko 
Trebjesanin  KOD nas se mnoge stvari 
rade naopako, uprkos logici i zdravoj pameti, pa i sa uvodjenjem 
veronauke u skolu. Umesto da se prvo povede ozbiljna i temeljna strucna, 
a onda i siroka javna rasprava o ovom pitanju, kod nas se na precac, 
preko noci donose odluke vlade, a onda se, post festum zapocne rasprava 
o svrsishodnosti i opravdanosti tako radikalnog i dalekoseznog 
poteza!  Argumenti za uvodjenje 
veronauke cesto su tek prividno racionalni, a zapravo su neubedljivi jer 
pocivaju na konfuziji pojmova, poluistinama i zameni teza. Zato 
razmotrimo naizgled najjace adute za uvodjenje veronauke u 
skolu.  Veronauka podstice toleranciju 
i moralno ponasanje ljudi. Zagovornici uvodjenja veronauke isticu da je 
vernik odgovorniji i moralniji covek od nevernika i da, buduci verski 
vaspitan, ima vise ljubavi i postovanja za bliznjeg. Na prvi pogled, 
ovaj argument deluje ubedljivo jer istinski vernik redje cini rdjava 
dela. Ali da li je to uvek tako, i da li to znaci da agnostik ili 
ateista ne moze biti moralan covek? Takva teza je ne samo netacna, vec 
je i vrlo opasna jer podstice versku i ideolosku netoleranciju. Takodje, 
zapitajmo se koliko ima pravih vernika? Dalje, misliti da ce narod, ciji 
je moral decenijama sistematski potkopavan i razaran zivotom u 
autoritarnom sistemu, u bedi i u strahu, postati preko noci moralan 
prevashodno na osnovu verskih propovedi, isto je toliko naivno kao i 
verovati da ce neuroticar ozdraviti citanjem knjiga o psihoterapiji ili 
da ce se korupcija i kriminal iskoreniti deljenjem brosura sa zitijima 
svetaca! I najzad, istorija neumoljivo pokazuje da su najsuroviji, 
najkrvaviji ratovi bili upravo verski ratovi, vodjeni u ime Boga, da bi 
se ognjem i macem dokazalo da je samo jedna, "nasa" vera 
ispravna.  Verske slobode su sastavni 
deo ljudskih prava i moraju se postovati, kazu pobornici uvodjenja 
veronauke. To je tacno, ali to ne znaci da je mesto veronauci u skoli. 
Ovde se radi o klasicnoj zameni teze. Verske slobode su zagarantovane 
time sto svako ima pravo da bude vernik, da pripada crkvi kojoj zeli i 
da tamo ispoveda svoju veru. Ali to ne znaci da svoje privatno pravo 
bude religiozan treba da ostvaruje u javnim, gradjanskim, drzavnim 
skolama! Roditelj ima pravo da svoje dete vodi u crkvu koju zeli, a 
skola je sekularna obrazovna institucija koja sa ovim pravom nema i ne 
treba da ima veze.  Bez poznavanja 
religije obrazovanja je krnje, nepotpuno i nesolidno. Potpuno tacno. 
Knjizevnost, filozofija, psihilogija, arhitektura, likovna i muzicka 
umetnost, te celokupna istorija ljudske kulture ne mogu se razumeti bez 
poznavanja istorije religija. Ali oni koji koriste ovaj argument za 
uvodjenje veronauke grdno grese, svesno ili ne. Naime, ovo je valjan 
razlog za uvodjenje nauke o religiji (komparativne studije religije ili 
istoriju religije), a ne veronauke! posto je vise od pola veka kod nas 
religija bila proterivana nije ni cudo sto mnogi pogresno misle da je 
veronauka zapravo nauka o religiji. Pojmovi se moraju rascistiti, da 
bismo se sporazumeli. Veronauka je uvodjenje u veru (konkretnu 
konfesiju), dakle, verska indoktrinacija, a Nauka o religiji je skup 
naucnih disciplina (sociologija, istorija, psihologija) koje proucavaju 
religiju kao izvanredno vazan drustveni, kulturni i ljudski 
fenomen.  Sve u svemu na pitanje: 
Veronauka da ili ne, odgovor je: Da, ali u crkvi, a ne u skoli, gde 
jedino ima mesto poznavanje religije.  
V e c e r n j e    N o v o s t 
i NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksiNSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi==^
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Re: [NSP] VELJA U VLADI

Title: Message



Vesti iz zmijarnika:
Pozvao mali balkanski Pinoce - Djindjic, vrlog   
Velju- bagerasa da se zdogovore oko daljeg opkupacionog delovanja na prostorima 
nekadasnje slobodne Srbije, Velja poceo da tvrdi pazar a dokazani 
mafijas-kidnaper-reketas-patoloski lazov ce Velji "pazi sta radis mogao bi 
nezgodno da se okliznes u stanu", kazu Velja se samo izbecio kao pravi cacanski 
prevarant i pristao
posto kupila po toliko prodala
pukovnik
 

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Miroslav 
  Antic 
  To: Sorabia ; NSP ; News ; SIM-Egroups ; SIM ; BALKAN 
  
  Sent: Tuesday, July 24, 2001 7:58 
PM
  Subject: [NSP] VELJA U VLADI 
  NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi==^
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[NSP] AP: EU Discusses Biotech Food Labeling





-Caveat Lector-[This is a news update [and 
AP article] from The Campaign to LabelGenetically Engineered Foods.  
--MS]Dear Health Freedom Fighters,Two items:1) CBS 
News will have a segment on genetically engineered foods today(Monday) 
during their Evening News with Dan Rather. Their web site states,"Our 
month-long series of Eye on America investigations and updates looksat the 
next big battleground in the dispute overgenetically-modified 
foods."2) Posted below is an article from Associated Press titled "EU 
DiscussesBiotech Food Labeling." Currently, only genetically engineered soy 
and cornare required to be labeled in the 15 European Union 
countries:http://www.thecampaign.org/eu1.htmHowever, 
soy and corn are the only products that do need to be labeled inthe EU since 
there has been a three-year moratorium in place againstimporting any other 
genetically modified crops. Now there is an attempt toremove the moratorium 
by expanding the labeling requirements to allgenetically engineered 
foods.It does not look like the attempt to remove the moratorium will 
besuccessful, at least in the immediate future. And since no one wants to 
buyproducts labeled as containing genetically modified soy or corn, there 
arevirtually no genetically engineered foods currently beingsold in the 
European Union countries.The article below will explain more about the 
recent attempt to remove themoratorium and implement further labeling 
requirements.Craig WintersExecutive DirectorThe Campaign to 
Label Genetically Engineered FoodsThe CampaignPO Box 
55699Seattle, WA 98155Tel: 425-771-4049Fax: 603-825-5841E-mail: 
mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]Web 
Site: http://www.thecampaign.orgMission 
Statement: "To create a national grassroots consumer campaign forthe purpose 
of lobbying Congress and the President to pass legislation thatwill require 
the labeling of genetically engineered foods in the 
UnitedStates."__EU 
Discusses Biotech Food LabelingBy PAUL GEITNER.c The Associated 
PressBRUSSELS, Belgium (AP) - The European Union's head office wants to 
allowfoods with trace amounts of genetically altered ingredients to escape 
newlabeling requirements, an idea criticized Monday by some politicians 
andconsumer groups.The proposals, to be taken up by the European 
Commission on Wednesday,would expand tracing and labeling requirements as 
part of a push to end theEU moratorium that has angered U.S. exporters and 
hamstrings Europeanbiotech companies.However, one article in the 
draft would exempt products that may havepicked up trace amounts of 
genetically modified material during harvesting,transport or 
processing.The exact level has yet to be determined but may be ``no 
higher than 1percent,'' according to the draft seen by The Associated 
Press.Producers also must be able to show that the traces were 
``technicallyunavoidable,'' and the material must have been approved in a 
third countryfor use in food.German Environment Minister Renate 
Kunast attacked that idea Monday duringa visit to Brussels, insisting the 
current system of ``zero tolerance'' wasthe safest course.EU 
officials call that an impossibly unrealistic goal in today's 
mechanizedfood-processing industry.The United States currently does 
not require any labels for products withgene-altered ingredients.But 
genetically modified organisms, or GMOs, are highly unpopular inEurope, 
where they are often referred to as ``Frankenstein foods'' in 
newsheadlines.Despite assurances from producers, surveys show most 
Europeans see them asa health hazard, and recent scares about mad cow and 
foot and mouthdiseases have only heightened sensitivity to food 
safety.The Commission's proposed new rules for GMOs would tighten 
regulations inone area to require labeling even if genetically altered 
material can nolonger be detected.Current regulations do not require 
labeling in cases such as, for example,where oil made from genetically 
altered corn or soybeans is used forcooking another product and the proteins 
and DNA are broken down by hightemperatures.EU Health Commissioner 
David Byrne is backing labeling in such casesdespite resistance from 
industry groups, according to an EU source whospoke on condition of 
anonymity.``It's the only way we think consumers will have confidence,'' 
the sourcesaid.Jim Murray, director of the European Consumers 
Organization, called theproposals ``overall a good thing,'' although he 
expressed hesitancy aboutallowing trace amounts of GMOs to go 
unlabeled.``We're prepared to look at it,'' he said, adding that a final 
judgmentdepended on how the proposal develops when it is sent to the 
EuropeanParliament and national governments for approval.That 
process will probably take a year or more, meaning no new rules until2003 at 
the earliest.The Commission's proposals are intended to implement rules 
approved inFebruary by the European Parliament that would enable the lifting 
of a3-year-old moratorium on appro

[NSP] Fw: AP: BUSH BIOGRAPHER FOUND DEAD (fwd)



- Original Message -
From: >
To:  -Caveat Lector-
>
> [Note the last line of the below post.  Can anyone verify or add to this?
> The below news excerpt is supposedly from The Globe and Mail via
Associated
> Press. The Globe and Mail is published in Toronto and is Canada's
> "national" newspaper, like the New York Times in the U.S. -MS]
>
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Tom McKay" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Monday, July 23, 2001 3:18 PM
> Subject: Ah... It's getting interesting now: ---> BUSH BIOGRAPHER FOUN D
> DEAD
>
>
> BUSH BIOGRAPHER FOUND DEAD
>
> BUSH BIOGRAPHER'S DEATH A SUICIDE
>
> Bush Biographer's death a suicide, Police say Saturday, July 21, 2001.
>
>
> Little Rock, Ark.-James Howard Hatfield, whose biography of U.S. President
> George W. Bush won national attention before its publisher withdrew it
over
> the author's criminal past, died in a motel in what police called a
suicide
> yesterday. Police said Mr. Hatfield, 43, died of an apparent drug
overdose.
> His body was found on Wednesday in a motel in Springdale, about 320
> kilometres northwest of Little Rock. Mr. Hatfield wrote the unauthorized
> biography, Fortunate Son: George W. Bush and the Making of an American
> President.
>
> --
>
> Mark Vallen of Yahoo group Change-Links writes:
>
> I'm NOT a conspiracy theorist... but. In the immediate aftermath of the
> violence at the Democratic National Convention, Mr Hatfield wrote a
> personal e-mail to me requesting the use of a Photograph I had taken and
> posted on my Website. He graciously offered to pay me by sending me a copy
> of his book "Fortunate Son: George W. Bush and the Making of an American
> President." Upon it's arrival I read the book from cover to cover.
> Hatfield's main allegation was that Bush Jr. had been arrested for
> possession of Cocaine in 1972... and the author cited three anonymous
> sources verifying the charge. Further, Hatfield claimed that the Bush
> Family's influence had any record of this arrest expunged. ST. MARTIN'S
> PRESS published 104,000 copies of Hatfield's book, and just prior to that
> publisher recalling the books... it hit the New York Times hardcover
> nonfiction best seller list. The Bush Family was outraged and denied the
> allegations. Hatfield then became the target of a public campaign to
> discredit him. The Dallas Morning News and The Washington Post both
> reported that Hatfield was convicted in 1988 of plotting to kill a
> co-worker. TEXAS prison officials confirmed that a man named James Howard
> Hatfield went to prison in 1988 for such a crime (and was paroled in
1993).
> Hatfield insisted that he was not that man, and that it was a case of
> mistaken identity meant to destroy his reputation. He stuck by his
> allegations and found another publisher (Soft Skull Press). His book was
> printed once again and put back into circulation... but on a much smaller
> scale. In 1999, Bush Jr., continuing his pleas of innocence said of
> Hatfield, "I may not be finished with this yet, It's outrageous."
>
>
> 


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Re: [NSP] SINISA VUCINIC O SLOBODANU MILOSEVICU



TAJ DEBIL, JOVICE STANISICA POKUSAVA DA SVE I SVAKOGA ZAGADI. TA STETOCINA
JE DIREKTNO ODGOVORNA ZA HAPSENJE 19 MLADICA KOJI SU DO KRAJA CUVALI SLOBU.
ON JE NAPAKOVAO DECI SVASTA. POSLEDNJIH DESET GODINA NE MOGU CUDOM DA SE
NACUDIM KAKVIH GNJIDA IMA NA OVIM   PROSTORIMA,
PUKOVNIK
Subject: [NSP] SINISA VUCINIC O SLOBODANU MILOSEVICU


> SINISA VUCINIC O SLOBODANU MILOSEVICU
>
>
> POGRESIO STO NIJE POBEGAO
>
>
>  BEOGRAD - Tvrdeci da je Cedomir Jovanovic (DOS) izigrao obecanje i
> pismenu garanciju da Slobodan Milosevic nece biti isporucen haskom
> Tribunalu, Sinisa Vucinic, u izjavi za javnost, juce istice:
>   - Bio sam ocevidac i tvrdim da je na poledjini tog garantnog
> papira ciji su potpisnici Kostunica, Milutinovic i DJindjic, pisacom
> masinom dokucano, na licu mesta, da Milosevic nece biti izrucen Hagu. Za
> razliku od svih drugih iz Milosevicevog okruzenja u vili "Mir" ja sam
> molio da ne pristaje ni na kakve pregovore i dogovore s Cedomirom
> Jovanovicem. A dva dana uoci tih pregovora, ubedjivao sam Milosevica da
> organizujemo njegovo bekstvo. Za tako nesto imali smo idealne uslove
> zahvaljujuci nekim dobro ocuvanim vezama i kanalima u MUP i VJ. Slobodan
> Milosevic je to smatrao nepotrebnim, vise je verovao savetima Branislava
> Ivkovica nego mojim, i tu je katastrofalno pogresio - tvrdi Vucinic.
>   A. M.
>
>
>  V e c e r n j eN o v o s t i
>
> NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi
>
>

NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi

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[NSP] Fw: Who was killed in Genoa? [WWW.STOPNATO.ORG.UK]



- Original Message -
From: Luciano Di Cocco <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: 'STOP NATO: !NO PASARAN!' <>
Sent: Monday, July 23, 2001 3:53 PM
Subject: Re: Who was killed in Genoa? [WWW.STOPNATO.ORG.UK]


> STOP NATO: ¡NO PASARAN! - HTTP://WWW.STOPNATO.ORG.UK
>
> --- ListBot Sponsor --
> Sopranos fanatics, this one is for you.  Tony Soprano's autographed
> Suburban is available for purchase on eBayTM.  James Gandolfini has
> personally signed the vehicle.  Find this and over 800 other Sopranos
> items for sale on eBay.
> http://www.bcentral.com/listbot/ebay
> --
>
> Kole,
>
> > Nonetheless, there were "credible" media reports that a
> > young
> > lady was also shot and was in critical condition (little information
> is
> > available on her, or what exactly happened) and some reports say
> another
> > person died (was killed?) on the Italian border.
>
> This person was a French young woman. She was going at the anti-G8 but
> was victim of a car accident at the Italian border. She died the day
> after.
> The victim was only one, but 580 persons (mainly manifesters) result
> injuried (one is in a coma, although with serious chances of recover)
> and at least 250 arrested.
> There were groups of manifesters who acted irresponsibly, although their
> acts were largely exagerated in the press.
> But police brutality was something never seen before in Italy. Some
> journalists present there who were in Pinochet Chili or Videla's
> Argentina have said that they acted the same.
> Especially the raid against slleping manifesters on Saturday night is
> something at the level of a dictatorship. Italian Government is quickly
> shifting to open fascism. After all, considering that no more than 8
> years ago some present ministers used to call himself a fascist, do the
> Roman salute and praise Mussolini, this is hardly a surprise. As I live
> in Italy, I'm seriously concerned.
> Every demonstration (non-violent, of course) in front of Italian
> Embassies, Consulates etc are warmly welcomed by Italian opposition.
>
> Luciano
>
>
> __


NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi

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Re: [NSP] slucaj galenikeresi ce arbitraza




Dva brata lazova i kriminalca, ljudi bre pa ovo je 
stvarno uzasno sta se dogadja sa nama.
pukovnikNSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi==^
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Re: [NSP] rade markovic naredio ubistvo arkan a




Taj di Stefano posle zatvora u Engleskoj peva 
njihovu pesmicu, sitni mali italijanski prevarant.
On je radio i sa Nikcevicem, bankarski prevarant i 
titoisticka muljara.
pukovnik
- Original Message - NSP Lista isprobava demokratiju u praksi==^
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Re: [NSP] tribunal neveruje miri markovic