Re: [Talk-gb-westmidlands] March Meeting

[Ian Caldwell]

Given the forecast, I will not be there tonight.

Ian

On 21 Feb 2018 9:32 a.m., "Ian Caldwell" 
wrote:

> I am hoping  to make it.
>
> Ian
>
> On 20 February 2018 at 18:00, Rob Nickerson 
> wrote:
>
>> Enjoy.
>>
>> I'm looking free at the moment. Anyone else able to make it?
>>
>> Rob
>>
>> On 20 Feb 2018 1:37 p.m., "Brian Prangle"  wrote:
>>
>>> Hi all
>>>
>>> I shan't be at this meeting - I'll be in Scotland
>>>
>>> Rgds
>>>
>>> Brian
>>>
>>> ___
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>>> Talk-gb-westmidlands@openstreetmap.org
>>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-gb-westmidlands
>>>
>>>
>> ___
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>>
>>
>
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Re: [Talk-cz] Jindřichův Hradec - mapuje tam někdo z nás?

[Lukáš Karas]

Ahoj, já z Jindřichova Hradce pocházím a objevím se tam tak jednou za dva 
měsíce. Jak tak procházím jeho editace, tak krom toho nesmyslného tagu na 
tobogán a duplicitních autobusových zastávek [1] tam nevidím nic fakticky 
špatně. 

Těch pár drobností se dá podle mě opravit od stolu. Vidíš tam něco co by si 
zasloužilo kontrolu na místě?

Lukáš (karry)

1) https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/5194613966

Dne středa 28. února 2018 16:32:55 CET majka napsal(a):
> Pohybuje se někdo z nás pravidelněji v Jindřichově Hradci?
> 
> Nezdá se mi, že by tam byl někdo aktuálně aktivní, a dost nám tam řádil náš
> oblíbený fell3. Sice mu nevadilo, že na mapě chybí budovy nebo jsou
> zakreslené nepřesně (mapování z roku 2010), zato zmapoval každý tobogán
> zvlášť (waterway=ditch), a pár míst obkreslil podle v té chvíli již
> zastaralého stavu včetně každé lampy. Vzhledem k tomu, že právě Seznam
> spustil JH nově v 3D, je to poměrně dost vidět.
> 
> Vypadá to, že to bude chtít několik výletů tímhle směrem za vzdáleným
> příbuzenstvem :)
> 
> Majka


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Re: [Talk-ca] Talk-ca Digest, Vol 120, Issue 53

[Clifford Snow]

On Wed, Feb 28, 2018 at 1:35 PM, Jonathan Brown  wrote:

> Hi, Keith. I’m in the same predicament. The OSM community tell me that it
> may be possible, but not in the short run. We are using the BC2020i
> framework for our March 29 event that Durham Region’s Open Data folks are
> hosting. One idea is to have the students add trees to OSM. For
> accessibility, you should see what Clifford Snow is doing with
> postsecondary students from the the Taskar Centre
> .
>
>
> I want to clear up any misconception. I'm not leading the accessibility
mapping effort with the Taskar Center. I've assisted with some meetups and
early help on their proposed sidewalk schema. Nick Bolton, PhD candidate,
is doing much of the work along with the director of the Taskar Center and
a number of grad students.

They are doing important work that should be adapted by communities across
the globe.

Clifford
-- 
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OpenStreetMap: Maps with a human touch
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[talk-ph] Proposed revisions for local road tagging

[Erwin Olario]

Hi folks.  @TagaSanPedroAko opened a PaperCutFix ticket [0] and proposing
some changes to the local road mapping conventions.

I have had a few changes [1] I want to propose myself. Let's take this
opportunity to review, and revise, if necessary, our road tagging
conventions, to help make a better map of the Philippines.

Let's continue the discussion here, or in the GitHub ticket.

[0]: https://github.com/OSMPH/papercut_fix/issues/38
[1]:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1uBuG6J3GlOZMVs_2dlLKbMl9YWEpqPJAE0cGgK4QI5k/edit?usp=drivesdk


-- 

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e: er...@ngnuity.xyz | v/m: https://t.me/GOwin | s: https://mstdn.io/@GOwin
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Re: [Talk-ca] using image recognition to create building foot prints.

[Gravel, Pierre (NRCan/RNCan)]

Hi Stewart
Our automatic extraction process is based on airborne LiDAR point cloud and not 
on optical imagery or elevation raster derived from LiDAR.

NRCAN doesn't have LiDAR over Toronto yet.
I will try to spread the pre-production over urban and rural areas (ehre we 
have LiDAR of course).
You can check yourself our LiDAR collection through Open Maps Canada. 
Presently, the viewer seems to not work well but you can download metadata 
coverage in kml or shp as well.
I open to suggestion for our pre-production. I prefer to process data where 
people have an interest.

Regards

Pierre

-Original Message-
From: Stewart C. Russell [mailto:scr...@gmail.com] 
Sent: February 6, 2018 12:54 PM
To: talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
Cc: Gravel, Pierre (NRCan/RNCan) 
Subject: Re: [Talk-ca] using image recognition to create building foot prints.

On 2018-02-02 11:01 AM, Gravel, Pierre (NRCan/RNCan) wrote:
> 
> I take the opportunity to ask you if you accept to give us a feedback 
> on these footprints before the official launch.
> 
> If yes, It will be my pleasure to provide a pre-production data for 
> those who want to check them.
> 
> It sounds good ?

It sounds amazing, thanks. I'd be very happy to take a look at a sample from 
Toronto if one's available. I'd like to see how it compares with the 
not-yet-usable-in-OSM Toronto building data.

cheers,
 Stewart
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Re: [Talk-ca] BC2020i Mapathon Event

[Jonathan Brown]

Rob Halkon, GIS Supervisor at the Durham Region, has approval to host an 
all-day mapathon event on March 29. The region has kindly offered to provide 
the venue with food. I attended the Toronto OSM Meetup last week and they 
suggested someone by the name of Richard might be able to help with the 
training, We are meeting on Friday Feb 23 from 1 pm to 4 pm to create a “flight 
plan” for the mapathon. This event will be followed up with a second event in 
late September or early October prior to the Oct 22 Municipal Elections in 
Ontario. We want to connect it to mapping trees in a narrowly defined boundary 
and connect it to the theme of sustainable development goals and climate 
change. We also want to use the BC2020i framework and mobile app for this 
event. Your feedback is welcome.  

From: talk-ca-requ...@openstreetmap.org
Sent: Friday, February 16, 2018 12:48 PM
To: talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
Subject: Talk-ca Digest, Vol 120, Issue 32

Send Talk-ca mailing list submissions to
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To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Talk-ca digest..."


Today's Topics:

   1. Cleanup of addr:country, addr:province, addr:state
  (Matthew Darwin)
   2. Re: Formatting of Municipality Names (Matthew Darwin)
   3. Re: Formatting of Municipality Names (James)


--

Message: 1
Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2018 12:40:15 -0500
From: Matthew Darwin 
To: Talk-CA OpenStreetMap 
Subject: [Talk-ca] Cleanup of addr:country, addr:province, addr:state
Message-ID: 
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; Format="flowed"

Hi all,

During the discussion of cleaning up municipality names in Canada, it 
was suggested that the addr:city could be removed entirely if the 
appropriate boundaries are defined.   I would hazard to guess (and 
will endeavour to investigate) that the addr:city and the boundaries 
do not always align in Canada (there are ~11300 administrative 
boundaries of some type and there are ~7000 unique addr:city tags)... 
so this will be a much more long term effort.

However, the provincial/territorial boundaries are defined, so 
removing the addr:country, addr:provice and addr:state tags might be a 
more reasonable at this time.  (addr:country is used ~94% less than 
addr:street)

Tags, by number of occurrences:

  167902 addr:country

   33252 addr:state

  179741 addr:province

2950115 addr:city

2942159 addr:street

2934341 addr:housenumber


-- 
Matthew Darwin
matt...@mdarwin.ca
http://www.mdarwin.ca

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Message: 2
Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2018 12:41:49 -0500
From: Matthew Darwin 
To: talk-ca 
Subject: Re: [Talk-ca] Formatting of Municipality Names
Message-ID: 
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; Format="flowed"

To start the cleanup process, the following *Ontario* cities are being 
changed (remove "City of" or "City Of").   Once that is done, I'll 
come back with the next batch to process...

The idea to remove the city name in its entirety will require careful 
consideration to ensure the necessary boundary relations are in place 
and of course more discussion to see if people are comfortable to 
proceed on that kind of activity.

  110707 City of Toronto
   45716 City of Hamilton
   27234 City of London
   25393 City of Brampton
   17251 City of Vaughan
   16929 City of St. Catharines
   16592 City of Kawartha Lakes
   16087 City of Thunder Bay
   14787 City of Niagara Falls
   13966 City of Kingston
   12085 City of Oshawa
   11321 City of Barrie
   10981 City of Burlington
   10347 City of Guelph
    9666 City of Brantford
    9384 City of Sarnia
    9102 City of Windsor
    9044 City Of Sault Ste. Marie
    8263 City of Peterborough
    7819 City of Quinte West
    7593 City of Welland
    6753 City of Pickering
    6608 City of Greater Sudbury
    6375 City Of Greater Sudbury
    6239 City of Belleville
    6165 City of Prince Edward County
    5696 City of Cornwall
    5269 City Of Timmins
    4877 City of Port Colborne
    4208 City of Woodstock
    3971 City of Thorold
    3692 City of St. Thomas
    3603 City of Cambridge
    3529 City of Orillia
    3355 City of Brockville
    3098 City of Owen Sound
    2733 City of Clarence-Rockland
    2377 City Of Pembroke
  

Re: [Talk-ca] Talk-ca Digest, Vol 120, Issue 53

[Jonathan Brown]

Hi, Keith. I’m in the same predicament. The OSM community tell me that it may 
be possible, but not in the short run. We are using the BC2020i framework for 
our March 29 event that Durham Region’s Open Data folks are hosting. One idea 
is to have the students add trees to OSM. For accessibility, you should see 
what Clifford Snow is doing with postsecondary students from the the Taskar 
Centre. 

Jonathan 

From: talk-ca-requ...@openstreetmap.org
Sent: Wednesday, February 28, 2018 1:07 PM
To: talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
Subject: Talk-ca Digest, Vol 120, Issue 53

Send Talk-ca mailing list submissions to
talk-ca@openstreetmap.org

To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca
or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
talk-ca-requ...@openstreetmap.org

You can reach the person managing the list at
talk-ca-ow...@openstreetmap.org

When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Talk-ca digest..."


Today's Topics:

   1. Manitoba buildings, addresses and high school work (keith hartley)
   2. Re: Manitoba buildings, addresses and high school work
  (john whelan)
   3. Re: Manitoba buildings, addresses and high school work (James)
   4. Re: Manitoba buildings, addresses and high school work
  (keith hartley)


--

Message: 1
Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2018 09:31:44 -0600
From: keith hartley <keith.a.hart...@gmail.com>
To: Talk-CA OpenStreetMap <talk-ca@openstreetmap.org>
Subject: [Talk-ca] Manitoba buildings, addresses and high school work
Message-ID:
<cap9rf0ka0bpefdhhwwukkk7n9cs56tyqbqcnydsooeyjwxp...@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"

 Hi OSM'ers

I am working on adding buildings to OSM in Manitoba and have a few
questions. I was just offered an updated building footprint and address
shape file from the City of Brandon, and agreement that it can be used in
OSM. I understand that the license needs to be compliant with the OSMs of
course, and will email the licensing group. The City uses a open data
license similar to Ottawa's (can be seen here http://opengov.brandon.ca/
terms.aspx) I can get  written consent in an email if need be as well.
Currently the buildings are from the Manitoba land initiative website (MLI)
and I can see that the city of Brandon Data is much more accurate (in both
attributes and position) I will review the current data. Is there anything
else I should be doing before I upload this?

The plan is to have high school students look at the map and using walking
maps or equivalent data capture (android app) to find what is accessible
for people with mobility issues around their schools. I'll write the
results on a wiki to show our successes. Anyone else have good ideas how to
get students to add to the map? (with teacher oversight of course!)

Cheers,
Keith
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Message: 2
Date: Wed, 28 Feb 2018 11:51:34 -0500
From: john whelan <jwhelan0...@gmail.com>
To: keith hartley <keith.a.hart...@gmail.com>
Cc: Talk-CA OpenStreetMap <talk-ca@openstreetmap.org>
Subject: Re: [Talk-ca] Manitoba buildings, addresses and high school
work
Message-ID:

Re: [Talk-in] Kerala PWD: GIS Based Road Information System

[Naveen Francis]

I had talked with him, he is looking for some open system which can add new
data (SH and MDRs ) from the field.

Is open roads a good option?
https://github.com/orma
Anyone knows how good open roads?

On 1 March 2018 at 07:13, Naveen Francis  wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> Kerala PWD Executive Engineer Mr. Biju G R had developed GIS Based Road
> Information System.
> http://103.35.198.65:8085/kpwd.gis/
>
> The website has the following data:-
> NH, SH and MDR data.
> Proposed Hill and Coastal HIghway for Kerala.
> Excellent Water bodies data.
> Junctions, Main centers, Bridges data.
>
> He developed the new application himself
> He can be contacted through eeit@kerala.gov.in.
> His Number is 9746097407 <097460%2097407>
>
> Data was developed during KSTP 2007 and it was in cold storage past 11
> years.
> It was not published publicly.
>
> Thanks,
> Naveen Francis
>
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[Talk-in] Kerala PWD: GIS Based Road Information System

[Naveen Francis]

Hi all,

Kerala PWD Executive Engineer Mr. Biju G R had developed GIS Based Road
Information System.
http://103.35.198.65:8085/kpwd.gis/

The website has the following data:-
NH, SH and MDR data.
Proposed Hill and Coastal HIghway for Kerala.
Excellent Water bodies data.
Junctions, Main centers, Bridges data.

He developed the new application himself
He can be contacted through eeit@kerala.gov.in.
His Number is 9746097407 <097460%2097407>

Data was developed during KSTP 2007 and it was in cold storage past 11
years.
It was not published publicly.

Thanks,
Naveen Francis
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Re: [Talk-ca] Manitoba buildings, addresses and high school work

[john whelan]

 If I look at OpenStreetMap at Brandon there seems to be most buildings
have been mapped.

https://www.openstreetmap.org/search?query=Brandon%20canada#
map=14/49.8381/-99.9503

They don't align perfectly with Bing but they aren't too bad.  If you ask
nicely someone could pick them up and move them over so they did but the
highways don't quite align either.

Why would you want to do an import here when most of the buildings are
already mapped or am I looking in the wrong place?

If I am perhaps we could identify those buildings that are likely to be of
interest to be marked as accessible or not and ensure they are mapped
before your event.

Cheerio John


On 28 February 2018 at 19:26, john whelan  wrote:

> If I look at OpenStreetMap at Brandon there seems to be most buildings
> have been mapped.
>
> https://www.openstreetmap.org/search?query=Brandon%20canada#
> map=14/49.8381/-99.9503
>
> They don't align perfectly with Bing but they aren't too bad.  If you ask
> nicely someone could pick them up and move them over so they did but the
> highways don
>
> On 28 February 2018 at 10:31, keith hartley 
> wrote:
>
>> Hi OSM'ers
>>
>> I am working on adding buildings to OSM in Manitoba and have a few
>> questions. I was just offered an updated building footprint and address
>> shape file from the City of Brandon, and agreement that it can be used in
>> OSM. I understand that the license needs to be compliant with the OSMs of
>> course, and will email the licensing group. The City uses a open data
>> license similar to Ottawa's (can be seen here
>> http://opengov.brandon.ca/terms.aspx) I can get  written consent in an
>> email if need be as well. Currently the buildings are from the Manitoba
>> land initiative website (MLI) and I can see that the city of Brandon Data
>> is much more accurate (in both attributes and position) I will review the
>> current data. Is there anything else I should be doing before I upload
>> this?
>>
>> The plan is to have high school students look at the map and using
>> walking maps or equivalent data capture (android app) to find what is
>> accessible for people with mobility issues around their schools. I'll write
>> the results on a wiki to show our successes. Anyone else have good ideas
>> how to get students to add to the map? (with teacher oversight of course!)
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Keith
>>
>>
>> ___
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>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca
>>
>>
>
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Re: [Talk-ca] Manitoba buildings, addresses and high school work

[john whelan]

If I look at OpenStreetMap at Brandon there seems to be most buildings have
been mapped.

https://www.openstreetmap.org/search?query=Brandon%20canada#map=14/49.8381/-99.9503

They don't align perfectly with Bing but they aren't too bad.  If you ask
nicely someone could pick them up and move them over so they did but the
highways don

On 28 February 2018 at 10:31, keith hartley 
wrote:

> Hi OSM'ers
>
> I am working on adding buildings to OSM in Manitoba and have a few
> questions. I was just offered an updated building footprint and address
> shape file from the City of Brandon, and agreement that it can be used in
> OSM. I understand that the license needs to be compliant with the OSMs of
> course, and will email the licensing group. The City uses a open data
> license similar to Ottawa's (can be seen here
> http://opengov.brandon.ca/terms.aspx) I can get  written consent in an
> email if need be as well. Currently the buildings are from the Manitoba
> land initiative website (MLI) and I can see that the city of Brandon Data
> is much more accurate (in both attributes and position) I will review the
> current data. Is there anything else I should be doing before I upload
> this?
>
> The plan is to have high school students look at the map and using walking
> maps or equivalent data capture (android app) to find what is accessible
> for people with mobility issues around their schools. I'll write the
> results on a wiki to show our successes. Anyone else have good ideas how to
> get students to add to the map? (with teacher oversight of course!)
>
> Cheers,
> Keith
>
>
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>
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Re: [OSM-talk-ie] OSM IRL Annual General Meeting

[Donal Hunt]

Re: CLG creation before or after. For me, I think after the AGM makes sense
as the community gets to ratify the names officially. Once the paperwork is
ready to go, the filing is quite straightforward I believe so timing
shouldn't matter.

Re: schedule - 24th works really well for me. There is another event
happening that day that I would like to at least pop into so +1 for that
date.

Re: constitution and other articles - the Google drive was certainly used
during the first meetup. I didn't make the most recent one so can comment
on that. Happy to contribute if needed (even if it's to corrals people to
do stuff).

Regards

Donal


On 28 Feb 2018 23:40, "Dave Corley"  wrote:

Hi,

My answers inline below

   1. What I would like to clear up before the AGM is whether the members
   of this mailing list wish the nominated group to proceed to form the
   company before the AGM, or post the AGM. It may shape how the meeting
takes
   place.

If there will be advice available to assist in the decision making process,
it would make sense to wait.

   2. Also Bob Tallent cannot attend on the 10th March and I think it would
   be better to have him there to facilitate questions. His real value to us
   is advising on what we need to assemble on us. Would the members be ok if
   we postpone the AGM until the 24th? I have checked with Tadeusz and it
   appears that Tog is available on that date.

24th is fine. Again, makes sense to adjust to avail of the support

   3. Also, can those guys who were working on a constitution and memos and
   articles bring these to some advanced stage and propose them for the AGM?

Is the Google drive still the location for these?

Dave



On 28 Feb 2018 21:19, "Ciarán Staunton"  wrote:

Hi All
I am sorry if this is a longer than usual message and I will try to be
brief as there is a lot of ground to cover. And 3 questions at the end.

I have secured (free of charge) the services of Robert Tallent of Synergy
Group. He is a sound person, he has a lot of experience of non-profit and
charity company formation, and provides advice on registration and
compliance for a range of different clients but usually small and
formative. His website is available if your websearch for his name with
"Synergy".

As regards the conversations I have had with Bob I gave him the following
brief (which was what was agreed at the last):
- Which structure will protect the members and directors against legally
liability, and will share the limited liability equally?
- Which structure will closely match the requirements of the Foundation to
be non-for-profit?
- Which structure will allow for the eventual registration as a charity
(enabling donations)
- Which structure might in the future enable seeking a grant or employing
someone

Bob has outlined to me that a Limited Partnership is a dangerous option
unless the lead partner is also a salaried executive director. The optimal
structure to satisfy all these is a *Company Limited by Guarantee (CLG)*.
The CLG once registered can then later seek charitable status from the
regulator, and is also free to apply for grants or other funds. The
understanding of non-for-profit with CLGs is simply to monitor that profit
seeking is not the main objective of the majority of activities, and that
when profits arise there is a plan to re-invest them. The DAC structure is
limiting in the scope of things the company may want to do which is why CLG
is not recommended.


   1. What I would like to clear up before the AGM is whether the members
   of this mailing list wish the nominated group to proceed to form the
   company before the AGM, or post the AGM. It may shape how the meeting
takes
   place.
   2. Also Bob Tallent cannot attend on the 10th March and I think it would
   be better to have him there to facilitate questions. His real value to us
   is advising on what we need to assemble on us. Would the members be ok if
   we postpone the AGM until the 24th? I have checked with Tadeusz and it
   appears that Tog is available on that date.
   3. Also, can those guys who were working on a constitution and memos and
   articles bring these to some advanced stage and propose them for the AGM?

I'm sorry again for the long email. Please speak up on all three. I know
you are all snowbound, so no excuses :)

Ciarán
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Re: [Talk-ca] Manitoba buildings and data that high school students could add

[Jonathan Brown]

Keith, I have had several conversations within this forum and offline about 
importing municipal building footprints into OSM for a mapathon event with 
students on March 29 in Durham Region. Based on advice from this and other OSM 
community member, we are holding off on importing building footprints for now. 

As for good ideas on how to engage students in adding to the OSM map, we are 
considering having students add trees to school building. The Toronto District 
School Board has a Green School Program and a database with over 40,000 trees 
on 5000 acres across approximately 600 schools. [Note: This was based on 
research from 2009 by an intern graduate student from the U of Toronto Forestry 
Department. It would be interesting to see if they would open this data to 
their students to use as an educational resource. 

Have you connected with Shawn Goulet and Steven Johnson at OSM Learn. They may 
have some good ideas as well. We may use their services to train our 
facilitators for the March 29 event. 

Jonathan  

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Re: [OSM-talk-ie] OSM IRL Annual General Meeting

[Dave Corley]

Hi,

My answers inline below

   1. What I would like to clear up before the AGM is whether the members
   of this mailing list wish the nominated group to proceed to form the
   company before the AGM, or post the AGM. It may shape how the meeting
takes
   place.

If there will be advice available to assist in the decision making process,
it would make sense to wait.

   2. Also Bob Tallent cannot attend on the 10th March and I think it would
   be better to have him there to facilitate questions. His real value to us
   is advising on what we need to assemble on us. Would the members be ok if
   we postpone the AGM until the 24th? I have checked with Tadeusz and it
   appears that Tog is available on that date.

24th is fine. Again, makes sense to adjust to avail of the support

   3. Also, can those guys who were working on a constitution and memos and
   articles bring these to some advanced stage and propose them for the AGM?

Is the Google drive still the location for these?

Dave



On 28 Feb 2018 21:19, "Ciarán Staunton"  wrote:

Hi All
I am sorry if this is a longer than usual message and I will try to be
brief as there is a lot of ground to cover. And 3 questions at the end.

I have secured (free of charge) the services of Robert Tallent of Synergy
Group. He is a sound person, he has a lot of experience of non-profit and
charity company formation, and provides advice on registration and
compliance for a range of different clients but usually small and
formative. His website is available if your websearch for his name with
"Synergy".

As regards the conversations I have had with Bob I gave him the following
brief (which was what was agreed at the last):
- Which structure will protect the members and directors against legally
liability, and will share the limited liability equally?
- Which structure will closely match the requirements of the Foundation to
be non-for-profit?
- Which structure will allow for the eventual registration as a charity
(enabling donations)
- Which structure might in the future enable seeking a grant or employing
someone

Bob has outlined to me that a Limited Partnership is a dangerous option
unless the lead partner is also a salaried executive director. The optimal
structure to satisfy all these is a *Company Limited by Guarantee (CLG)*.
The CLG once registered can then later seek charitable status from the
regulator, and is also free to apply for grants or other funds. The
understanding of non-for-profit with CLGs is simply to monitor that profit
seeking is not the main objective of the majority of activities, and that
when profits arise there is a plan to re-invest them. The DAC structure is
limiting in the scope of things the company may want to do which is why CLG
is not recommended.


   1. What I would like to clear up before the AGM is whether the members
   of this mailing list wish the nominated group to proceed to form the
   company before the AGM, or post the AGM. It may shape how the meeting
takes
   place.
   2. Also Bob Tallent cannot attend on the 10th March and I think it would
   be better to have him there to facilitate questions. His real value to us
   is advising on what we need to assemble on us. Would the members be ok if
   we postpone the AGM until the 24th? I have checked with Tadeusz and it
   appears that Tog is available on that date.
   3. Also, can those guys who were working on a constitution and memos and
   articles bring these to some advanced stage and propose them for the AGM?

I'm sorry again for the long email. Please speak up on all three. I know
you are all snowbound, so no excuses :)

Ciarán
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Re: [Talk-us] Satus CDP

[Albert Pundt]

Many towns and suburbs in my area are only CDPs, and having proper
boundaries for them seems like it'd be useful, especially in more densely
populated  areas. It's not like there's any fuzziness with them either,
since they're defined by the Census Bureau and could only change once every
10 years. Only one U.S. census has occurred in OSM history, so it's not
like we'd be constantly updating them.

On Wed, Feb 28, 2018, 17:40 OSM Volunteer stevea 
wrote:

> Brian Stromberg  writes:
> > As someone who does research with Census data, it would be helpful to
> keep all Census geographies in place (at least until Census decides to get
> rid of them). Someone will use them at some point. Additionally, they're an
> official component of Census geographies, as bureaucratic as that might be.
> That alone seems to make them significant enough to keep. Deleting them
> because they appear useless seems short sighted. It's not like roads are
> deleted from OSM just because nobody uses them.
>
> Brian, Wolfgang, Clifford, Michael, talk-us:
>
> Census boundaries were imported, then, after these data were already in
> our map, consensus was reached that these were statistical areas, not
> administrative areas of government.  Specific consensus was reached (in
> talk-us, if I recall correctly) on the following:
>
> • admin_level=8 was simply incorrect and should be deleted as a tag on
> these imported census boundaries,
> • boundary=administrative was also incorrect in all cases and should be
> changed to boundary=census as a tag on these.
>
> It is also specifically noted in our wiki[1] that in Alaska, as these
> boundaries were achieved with the cooperation of the Alaska state
> government in addition to the US (federal) Census Bureau, census boundaries
> in Alaska's Unorganized Borough are believed to be useful enough to keep in
> OSM, but, again, specifically without any admin_level tag, as (to repeat),
> census areas are not administrative boundaries.
>
> This consensus has resulted in most (all?) of these admin_level=8 tags
> (some were 7, likely from subsequent edits) being (correctly) removed and
> the boundary=administrative tag being (correctly) changed to a
> boundary=census tag, though this work to correct these Census Bureau import
> data may not be complete.  The result is that what data do remain in OSM
> (what Brian says would be helpful to keep in place) are of marginal value
> (except in Alaska and perhaps a very few other places).  If/as Brian finds
> these data useful, I caution him to keep all of this in mind and perhaps
> find another methodology to "do research" with these data of questionable
> value than by using them as they presently exist in OSM.  I politely
> disagree with him that "someone will use (these data) at some point," for
> several reasons:  the data age and are not updated, they do not "map" (in a
> language or mathematical sense) well onto specifically-rendered entities in
> any OSM renderer I know of, and (imo, I could be wrong) they only serve to
> add some sense of accuracy to perhaps geocoding or place-name lookups in
> what amounts to "hacked" corner cases.  OSM can do much better here and
> indeed should do so without these census data in OSM whatsoever.
>
> So, except for in Alaska, census boundaries in OSM appear to have marginal
> or even no value to any present or future conceivable use case.  While
> deleting them (except in Alaska) or "converting them to place=* nodes" may
> be the eventually correct solution(s), no organized effort to do so, or
> examination of the history or use-case-based arguments to keep them has
> emerged or presently exists.  (We do document the situation in our wikis,
> footnoted below).  I would like to see either the deletion of
> boundary=census entities entirely (except in Alaska) after a more-complete
> discussion of why and how they are presently used (perhaps in geocoding
> algorithms) and how better tagging on "more real" and/or "more stable"
> objects can and should supersede them.  Virtually always (if not always), a
> node with tag place= with a consensus-sane value[2] completely suffices.
> Such cleanup (garbage-y, rapidly obsoleted polygons become a node) is very
> much in OSM's interest.
>
> Complicating this is the major issue of Indian Reservation boundaries.
> What has emerged as a stopgap[3] is to tag these with either
> boundary=aboriginal_lands or boundary=protected_area + protect_class=24,
> omitting the admin_level=* tag in either case.  Please read our wiki as
> footnoted here, as this may suffice to persuade you to remove the Satus
> census object, replacing it with a node tagged place=* with little or no
> affront to your sense of correctness within OSM.
>
> These issues may seem complicated, though I posit that it is their history
> clouded by misunderstanding and poor introduction of US Census Bureau data
> into OSM that are to blame.  This makes the bottom line 

Re: [Talk-us] Satus CDP

[OSM Volunteer stevea]

Brian Stromberg  writes:
> As someone who does research with Census data, it would be helpful to keep 
> all Census geographies in place (at least until Census decides to get rid of 
> them). Someone will use them at some point. Additionally, they're an official 
> component of Census geographies, as bureaucratic as that might be. That alone 
> seems to make them significant enough to keep. Deleting them because they 
> appear useless seems short sighted. It's not like roads are deleted from OSM 
> just because nobody uses them.

Brian, Wolfgang, Clifford, Michael, talk-us:

Census boundaries were imported, then, after these data were already in our 
map, consensus was reached that these were statistical areas, not 
administrative areas of government.  Specific consensus was reached (in 
talk-us, if I recall correctly) on the following:

• admin_level=8 was simply incorrect and should be deleted as a tag on these 
imported census boundaries,
• boundary=administrative was also incorrect in all cases and should be changed 
to boundary=census as a tag on these.

It is also specifically noted in our wiki[1] that in Alaska, as these 
boundaries were achieved with the cooperation of the Alaska state government in 
addition to the US (federal) Census Bureau, census boundaries in Alaska's 
Unorganized Borough are believed to be useful enough to keep in OSM, but, 
again, specifically without any admin_level tag, as (to repeat), census areas 
are not administrative boundaries.

This consensus has resulted in most (all?) of these admin_level=8 tags (some 
were 7, likely from subsequent edits) being (correctly) removed and the 
boundary=administrative tag being (correctly) changed to a boundary=census tag, 
though this work to correct these Census Bureau import data may not be 
complete.  The result is that what data do remain in OSM (what Brian says would 
be helpful to keep in place) are of marginal value (except in Alaska and 
perhaps a very few other places).  If/as Brian finds these data useful, I 
caution him to keep all of this in mind and perhaps find another methodology to 
"do research" with these data of questionable value than by using them as they 
presently exist in OSM.  I politely disagree with him that "someone will use 
(these data) at some point," for several reasons:  the data age and are not 
updated, they do not "map" (in a language or mathematical sense) well onto 
specifically-rendered entities in any OSM renderer I know of, and (imo, I could 
be wrong) they only serve to add some sense of accuracy to perhaps geocoding or 
place-name lookups in what amounts to "hacked" corner cases.  OSM can do much 
better here and indeed should do so without these census data in OSM whatsoever.

So, except for in Alaska, census boundaries in OSM appear to have marginal or 
even no value to any present or future conceivable use case.  While deleting 
them (except in Alaska) or "converting them to place=* nodes" may be the 
eventually correct solution(s), no organized effort to do so, or examination of 
the history or use-case-based arguments to keep them has emerged or presently 
exists.  (We do document the situation in our wikis, footnoted below).  I would 
like to see either the deletion of boundary=census entities entirely (except in 
Alaska) after a more-complete discussion of why and how they are presently used 
(perhaps in geocoding algorithms) and how better tagging on "more real" and/or 
"more stable" objects can and should supersede them.  Virtually always (if not 
always), a node with tag place= with a consensus-sane value[2] completely 
suffices.  Such cleanup (garbage-y, rapidly obsoleted polygons become a node) 
is very much in OSM's interest.

Complicating this is the major issue of Indian Reservation boundaries.  What 
has emerged as a stopgap[3] is to tag these with either 
boundary=aboriginal_lands or boundary=protected_area + protect_class=24, 
omitting the admin_level=* tag in either case.  Please read our wiki as 
footnoted here, as this may suffice to persuade you to remove the Satus census 
object, replacing it with a node tagged place=* with little or no affront to 
your sense of correctness within OSM.

These issues may seem complicated, though I posit that it is their history 
clouded by misunderstanding and poor introduction of US Census Bureau data into 
OSM that are to blame.  This makes the bottom line straightforward:  US Census 
Bureau census boundary data as polygons do not belong in OSM (except in Alaska, 
where they remain distinctly useful), since a node with a place=* tag delivers 
OSM's proper mapping of these semantics.

SteveA
California
Contributor to our https://wiki.osm.org/wiki/United_States_admin_level and 
https://wiki.osm.org/wiki/WikiProject_United_States/Boundaries wikis
OSM Volunteer since 2009, frequently in listening mode even as I offer what is 
hopefully august opinion

[1] 

[Talk-es] Importación CDAU

[Javier Sánchez Portero]

Hola

Creo que con unas pocas modificaciones el programa para importar Catastro
puede descargar los datos de direcciones postales del Callejero Digital
Unificado de Andalucía e incorporarlos a los edificios.

La idea sería que siguiendo el flujo de trabajo actual, al preparar la
importación en cada municipio se revisen los nombres de las calles y una
vez publicado el proyecto para importar el municipio los participantes
revisen las direcciones con las fotos de fachada.

La propuesta de importación está en
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/ES:Import_CDAU

Si todo va bien espero tener listas las modificaciones del programa este
mes, ¿alguien se anima a colaborar?

Si esto funciona se podría extender a conjuntos de datos disponibles en
otros lugares.

Saludos, Javier.
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Re: [OSM-talk-fr] opendata : les batis et leur hauteur à Paris

[Philippe Verdy]

Le 28 février 2018 à 22:17,  a écrit :

> *Sur la carte Google du concurrent, lui n'apparaissait carrément pas sur
> la carte. Il ne doit pas payer son obole.*
>
Le plus gros problème de Google c'est surtout sa politique tarifaire
complètement hors de contrôle (puisque soumise en permanence à son système
d'enchères à la hausse pour le placement). Ceux qui font le choix de Google
au début s'en mordent les doigts ensuite: c'est une course sans fin pour
payer plus, seulement pour être référencé.

Le problème étant que les alternatives sont mal connues pour ceux qui
cherchent avant tout sur Google. Cependant pour qu'un site se développe et
puisse afficher une carte avec ses données, il doit pouvoir maîtriser ses
coûts (la rentabilité peut être très longue et si le site est trop
déficitaire, soit il ferme, soit c'est la boite qui coûle faute de clients
et de référencement).

Il faut donc développer une alternative stable : Switch2OSM n'est pas
suffisant. Certes il propose une solution technique pour faire héberger à
coût raisonnable et avec une qualité de service acceptable (Mapbox ou
autre) mais il manque le référencement web (ce n'est pas vraiment la
mission d'OSM).

Mais les fournisseurs de cartographie basée sur OSM pourraient aider en
fournissant une plateforme collaborative de référencement pour que Google
ne soit pas le seul outil de recherche mais qu'on puisse trouver facilement
cette autre plateforme collaborative (pas Google, ni Bing, ni Facebook non
plus) à coût maîtrisé (donc sans système d'enchères à la hausse, juste la
couverture des couts d'explotiation et une petite marge permettant les
investissements et les mises à jour la maintenance, le renouvellement, la
mise à niveau de la plateforme).

Cette plateforme serait adaptée aux PME, commerces de proximité, services,
associations, collectivités. Et je pense qu'à ce niveau on devrait avoir
une incitation publique de l'Etat, dans l'esprit de l'Open Data (car ces
oboles dues aux gros moteurs de recherche ou réseaux sociaux américains
finissent par coûter cher au commerce extérieur français ou même européen,
donc avec l'aval de l'UE si elle est accessible à tout le monde avec une
politique tarifaire stable et maîtrisée).

Cette plateforme aurait des prestataires commerciaux (exemple MapBox) à
condition qu'ils adhèrent à la charte de maîtrise tarifaire et respectent
des règles en terme de protection de vie privée (donc pas comme Maze par
exemple qui envoie sans le dire des données privées, et cryptées en plus, à
Facebook même pour les utilisateurs de Maze, filiale de Google, n'ayant
aucun compte chez Facebook et sans même avoir approuvé cette collecte par
Maze/Google au profit d'un tiers qui n'est ensuite engagé à rien du tout,
donc peut aussi bien tout refournir sans condition à n'importe qui qui veut
l'acheter ou s'en saisir directement aux USA).

Il faut réinventer le concept collaboratif du "webring" : il n'a pas marché
au début car c'était juste un échange de liens désordonnés sans aucun
classement sur une thématique assez floue. Mais avec l'appui d'une
cartographie libre, on peut avoir des échanges de liens plus pertinents. La
carte libre serait donc un nouveau moteur de recherche, plus équitable,
adaptée aux activités locales (publiques, associatives, commerciales).
Cette(ces) plateforme(s) nationale(s) pourrai(en)t faire ensuite des émules
dans d'autres pays européens et ailleurs, et Google serait obligé de
la(les) référencer simplement car elle aurait de nombreux liens un peu
partout dans les web nationaux ou dans les réseaux sociaux: il y aurait de
la demande et elle serait mieux qualifiée que les liens postés par
placement publicitaire payant et de coût croissant ne profitant qu'aux plus
gros.

Ce serait donc une solution pour plein d'artisans, d'agences immobilières
sur le web. Elles auraient un appui technique. Elle paieraient un peu (un
prix juste qui serait même plutôt orienté à la baisse grâce aux économies
d'échelle). Elle pourrait apporter des subsides à OSM pour soutenir cet
effort de cartographie libre: en payant un peu ce service, l'agence
immobilière ou l'artisan contribuerait un peu aussi à OSM qui disposerait
alors de capacité financière pour consolider sa propre plateforme et
grandir doucement mais surement face aux GAFA (Uber inclus) qui veulent
tout prendre et parasitent de plus en plus l'économie du monde entier et
tuent les petites activités aux profit de grosses majors américaines qui ne
font que créer des "produits dérivés" (comme la bourse) basés sur les paris
à risque, les enchères illimitées, et engranger des bénéfices de plus en
plus énormes sans apporter de réel service supplémentaire aux petites
activités locales.

Bref l'obole à payer n'est pas tellement le problème: il est concevable
pour toute activité commerciale de payer un peu, mais il lui faut une
maitrise des couts adaptée à leur taille et leur activité réelle et leurs
marges réelles d'exploitation. Sinon tout le monde en 

[Talk-hr] Open Data Day 2018

[hbogner]

https://odd.codeforcroatia.org/

https://www.meetup.com/HrOpen/events/247705583/

Prenosim info

Organizatori pozivaju OSM zajednicu na obilježavanje Open Data Day 2018.

Na prvom panuelu u petak 2.3. bit će govora o geoprostornim podacima. 
Pitanja iz publike su dobrodošla ;)


Ako niste u mogućnosti doći, možete gledati online prijenos, link je na 
sluzbenij stranici odd.codeforcroatia.org



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Re: [OSM-talk-fr] opendata : les batis et leur hauteur à Paris

[Erwan Salomon]

> Le 28 févr. 2018 à 22:17, osm.sanspourr...@spamgourmet.com a écrit :
> 
> Erwan, il va falloir placer les panneaux solaires sur le toit de la mairie. 
> Christian, l'agglomération voulait promouvoir les renouvelables et a passé un 
> appel d'offre pour sensibiliser le public et louer des panneaux solaires. Du 
> coup des panneaux solaires appartenant à des particuliers via une coopérative 
> sont loués par la mairie et produisent sur la mairie et des écoles.
> 
sur la mairie et ailleurs (d’ailleurs la mairie n’a aucun tag de forme du 
bâtiment dans OSM, c’est à F4map qu’il faut que tu t'adresses)
y’en a pléthore sur les toits des maisons, parfois avec une pente particulière 
(pente 30° Est avec un bâtiment haut au Sud)
et celui en construction sur le K3 (ou K2 ?), le plus grand de quelque-chose

tu auras remarqué le magnifique rendu du travel-lift de l’estacade ...
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Re: [OSM-talk-fr] opendata : les batis et leur hauteur à Paris

[Erwan Salomon]

au fait il y a https://www.easter-eggs.com  qui 
semble fournir un service de serveur de carte pour au moins 2 agences 
immobilières à base d’OSM
j’ai tilté quand j’ai vu un grand panneau (2mx2m) dans une agence qui utilisait 
OSM (pas fr, j’en ai fait la remarque) avec des données de ~3 mois
mais là il n’est pas question de hauteur de bâti alors j’arrête mon HS

erwan [glyo]

> Le 28 févr. 2018 à 20:50, Nicolas Bétheuil  a écrit :
> 
> D'où l'idée de l'open data. Y a pleins de données, au moins le nombre de 
> palliers, et d'étage.
> 
> Le 28 févr. 2018 7:43 PM, "Francois Gouget"  > a écrit :
> On Wed, 28 Feb 2018, Erwan Salomon wrote:
> 
> > celui qui fait le rendu c’est F4map
> > petit exemple de rendu un peu travaillé
> > http://demo.f4map.com/#lat=47.7361783=-3.4271357=19 
> >  
> >  > >
> > l’église, mais aussi 100m au sud la médiathèque
> 
> Ah. Bien.
> 
> Mais c'est bizarre que pour un rendu en 3D ils ne prennent pas en compte
> le relief. Parce que bon, Montmatre plat ça fait un peu bizarre. Et
> comme ça semble utilisé pour l'immobilier le relief devrait quand même
> avoir une importance, y compris pour l'ensoleillement (y en a qui sont
> jamais contents ;-).
> 
> C'est quand même une super utilisation des données OpenStreetMap et ça
> donne envie d'aller se promener avec StreetComplete pour renseigner
> toutes les hauteurs de bâtiments et formes de toits.
> 
> Ça donne aussi envie d'acheter une caméra 360 pour mieux voir les
> façades et pouvoir compter le nombre d'étages.
> 
> 
> --
> Francois Gouget >  
> http://fgouget.free.fr/ 
>Un western sans indien c'est comme une police sans serif.
>  -- John Wayne
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> 
> 
> 
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Re: [OSM-talk-fr] opendata : les batis et leur hauteur à Paris

[Antoine Riche]

Le 28/02/2018 à 19:43, Francois Gouget a écrit :

Mais c'est bizarre que pour un rendu en 3D ils ne prennent pas en compte
le relief. Parce que bon, Montmatre plat ça fait un peu bizarre. Et
comme ça semble utilisé pour l'immobilier le relief devrait quand même
avoir une importance, y compris pour l'ensoleillement (y en a qui sont
jamais contents;-).


Tu vas être content : tu peux configurer tout ça dans les options 
graphiques, accessibles depuis le hamburger à droite de "Chercher un 
lieu". tu peux même avoir de la neige à Rio de Janeiro :-)


Antoine.




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[OSM-talk-ie] OSM IRL Annual General Meeting

[Ciarán Staunton]

Hi All
I am sorry if this is a longer than usual message and I will try to be
brief as there is a lot of ground to cover. And 3 questions at the end.

I have secured (free of charge) the services of Robert Tallent of Synergy
Group. He is a sound person, he has a lot of experience of non-profit and
charity company formation, and provides advice on registration and
compliance for a range of different clients but usually small and
formative. His website is available if your websearch for his name with
"Synergy".

As regards the conversations I have had with Bob I gave him the following
brief (which was what was agreed at the last):
- Which structure will protect the members and directors against legally
liability, and will share the limited liability equally?
- Which structure will closely match the requirements of the Foundation to
be non-for-profit?
- Which structure will allow for the eventual registration as a charity
(enabling donations)
- Which structure might in the future enable seeking a grant or employing
someone

Bob has outlined to me that a Limited Partnership is a dangerous option
unless the lead partner is also a salaried executive director. The optimal
structure to satisfy all these is a *Company Limited by Guarantee (CLG)*.
The CLG once registered can then later seek charitable status from the
regulator, and is also free to apply for grants or other funds. The
understanding of non-for-profit with CLGs is simply to monitor that profit
seeking is not the main objective of the majority of activities, and that
when profits arise there is a plan to re-invest them. The DAC structure is
limiting in the scope of things the company may want to do which is why CLG
is not recommended.


   1. What I would like to clear up before the AGM is whether the members
   of this mailing list wish the nominated group to proceed to form the
   company before the AGM, or post the AGM. It may shape how the meeting takes
   place.
   2. Also Bob Tallent cannot attend on the 10th March and I think it would
   be better to have him there to facilitate questions. His real value to us
   is advising on what we need to assemble on us. Would the members be ok if
   we postpone the AGM until the 24th? I have checked with Tadeusz and it
   appears that Tog is available on that date.
   3. Also, can those guys who were working on a constitution and memos and
   articles bring these to some advanced stage and propose them for the AGM?

I'm sorry again for the long email. Please speak up on all three. I know
you are all snowbound, so no excuses :)

Ciarán
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Re: [OSM-talk-fr] opendata : les batis et leur hauteur à Paris

[osm . sanspourriel]

/Erwan, il va falloir placer les panneaux solaires sur le toit de la 
mairie. //
//Christian, l'agglomération voulait promouvoir les renouvelables et a 
passé un appel d'offre pour sensibiliser le public et louer des panneaux 
solaires. Du coup des panneaux solaires appartenant à des particuliers 
via une coopérative sont loués par la mairie et produisent sur la mairie 
et des écoles./


Le rendu a fait pas mal de progrès. Mais les feuillus ne perdent pas 
leur feuilles en hiver ;-).


Les lignes et poteaux électriques sont bien rendus mais ne sont pas 
raccord :


http://demo.f4map.com/#lat=48.3644923=-4.5722182=19=56.853=-78.438
https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/242858977#map=15/48.3652/-4.5691
https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/2503070883#map=19/48.36554/-4.57118

/Philippe, oui c'est une utilisation abusive, quant aux pubs de Google 
je regardais où se trouvait un fabricant de poêles./


/Sur sa carte Google, une pub (un marqueur) pour une grande marque de 
poseurs de cheminées qui ne vendait pas la marque en question./


/Sur la carte Google du concurrent, lui n'apparaissait carrément pas sur 
la carte. Il ne doit pas payer son obole.//

/

/J'ai choisi la production locale ;-) et je dois toujours leur dire de 
changer de carte./


Mais comment taguer un fabricant de poêle ?

shop =fireplace 
 
c'est pour les fumistes.


Alors inventons un craft=fireplace ? Un craft=blacksmith me semble trop 
artisanal.
office=company 
 est bien 
générique.
industrial=factory 
 déjà mieux.



Le 28/02/2018 à 14:41, Erwan Salomon - r...@gmx.fr a écrit :

celui qui fait le rendu c’est F4map
petit exemple de rendu un peu travaillé
http://demo.f4map.com/#lat=47.7361783=-3.4271357=19
l’église, mais aussi 100m au sud la médiathèque
ils prennent en compte building:min_levels, building:colour … 
building:part (important pour les bâtiments en plusieurs volumes)

roof:material, mais pas stone
surface en vitre sont rendues
aussi les arbres et rangées d’arbre (arbre de noël si je me souvient)
les surface d’eau, les fontaines ...
y’a 2 ans c’était pas mis à jour rapidement
maintenant ça varie de la minute à qqn heures
ils ont aussi des bâtiment modélisé par leur propres moyens :
http://demo.f4map.com/#lat=47.7479520=-3.3652867=18
souvent les mairies
et l’ombrage et les conditions météos en direct (ça pourrait être 
intéressant de les définir à volonté pour évaluer la luminosité des 
appartements par exemple)

ça fait chauffer mon ordi par contre
ça passe mieux sur mon téléphone

erwan [glyo]


Le 28 févr. 2018 à 14:17, Francois Gouget > a écrit :


On Tue, 27 Feb 2018, Nicolas Bétheuil wrote:


Bonjour,

L'autre jour j'avais trouvé un site d'immobilier qui m'avait
impressionné : bienici.com  Je vous laisse aller 
faire un tour si ça

vous intéresse c'est ni le sujet ni une pub. Ils réutilisent les
données d'OSM pour les hauteurs de bâtiments. Forcément j'ai été voir
chez moi et les hauteurs ne sont pas renseignées.


Le rendu est sympa.

D'après mes tests ils se servent des champs building:levels,
roof:levels, roof:shape et peut-être roof:material (et peut-être encore
d'autres). Et en plus ils mettent à jour leurs données plutôt 
rapidement :

j'ai complété quelques bâtiments cette nuit à partir de Mapillary et
aujourd'hui le rendu les prend en compte !



--
Francois Gouget > 
http://fgouget.free.fr/
Linux: the choice of a GNU 
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Re: [Talk-cz] Kvartální pivo v Praze

[Matej Lieskovský]

Tak aktuálně jsme na Prahu zapsaní tři.

Ostatní pražáci by se měli přestat vymlouvat.

2018-02-28 16:37 GMT+01:00 Mikoláš Štrajt :

> Zdar,
> na Twitteru jsem zahlédnul, že se příští středu (7.3.) koná kvartální pivo.
>
> Zapsal jsem se do Prahy a mám dva dotazy:
>
> 1) chystá se do Prahy ještě někdo další?
> 2) mám zarezervovat stůl?
>
> Navrhuji zajít do Restaurace Oáza přímo na Smíchovském nádraží.
>
> --
> Mikoláš Štrajt / Severák
>
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>
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[OSM-talk-nl] Importvoorstel

[Multi Modaal]

Beste talk-lezers,

Zoals gemeld op https://forum.openstreetmap.org/viewtopic.php?id=61493 wil
ik jullie graag op de hoogte stellen van een import-voorstel voor BGT-data
specifiek voor kleine poldersloten in Rijnland.

Zou ik om praktische redenen mogen voorstellen om eventuele vragen via het
forum te stellen in plaats van via deze mailinglist, aangezien het forum
actiever lijkt en dit onderwerp ook op nog op de import-mailingslijst moet
worden besproken (als we het ook op deze mailinglijst zouden bespreken, dan
zou de discussie op 3 plekken tegelijk plaatsvinden)

Hartelijke groet.
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[Talk-in] Missing al5-boundaries in India

[Walter Nordmann]

Hi,

just found some gaps in the admin boundaries level 5 in India.

https://wambachers-osm.website/images/osm/snaps_2018/india_al5.png

where you see a blue background there is no al5 or may be it's damaged.

could you please help and fix that gaps in your country?

regards

walter aka wambacher

attached: list of all al5 found in OSM

   id|   value   | level 
-+---+---
 2022179 | Adilabad  | 5
 1958554 | Agra  | 5
 1953566 | Ahmadabad | 5
 1986123 | Ahmednagar| 5
 2029066 | Aizwal| 5
 1949118 | Ajmer | 5
 1991136 | Akola | 5
 3743889 | Alappuzha | 5
 1958143 | Aligarh   | 5
 1959819 | Allahabad | 5
  374938 | Almora| 5
 1950060 | Alwar | 5
 1942687 | Ambala| 5
 1959867 | Ambedkar Nagar| 5
 1991113 | Amravati  | 5
 1948548 | Amritsar  | 5
 1953588 | Anand | 5
 2022303 | Anantapur | 5
 1944955 | Anantnag  | 5
 1984462 | Anugul| 5
 1960173 | Araria| 5
 1819586 | Ariyalur district | 5
 1959117 | Auraiya   | 5
 1991614 | Aurangabad| 5
 1963166 | Aurangabad| 5
 1959868 | Azamgarh  | 5
 1944967 | Badgam| 5
 2020666 | Bagalkote district| 5
  374914 | Bageshwar | 5
 1958008 | Baghpat   | 5
 1958963 | Bahraich  | 5
 1982958 | Balaghat  | 5
 1984026 | Balangir  | 5
 1984480 | Baleshwar | 5
 1959869 | Ballia| 5
 1958964 | Balrampur | 5
 1959820 | Banda | 5
 2020588 | Bangalore Rural   | 5
 2020589 | Bangalore Urban   | 5
 1972075 | Banka | 5
 1971787 | Bankura   | 5
 1950130 | Banswara  | 5
 1959692 | Barabanki | 5
 1944971 | Baramula  | 5
 1970280 | Barddhaman| 5
 1958196 | Bareilly  | 5
 1984023 | Bargarh   | 5
 1798824 | Barmer| 5
 1791158 | Barpeta   | 5
 1976212 | Barwani   | 5
 1972717 | Bastar| 5
 1959787 | Basti | 5
 1948503 | Bathinda  | 5
 1984065 | Baudh | 5
 1963174 | Begusarai | 5
 2020648 | Belgaum district  | 5
 2020692 | Bellary district  | 5
 1982914 | Betul | 5
 7698599 | Bhadradri Kothagudem District | 5
 1960212 | Bhagalpur | 5
 1988468 | Bhandara  | 5
 1950061 | Bharatpur | 5
 1950131 | Bhilwara  | 5
 1973948 | Bhind | 5
 1942977 | Bhiwani district  | 5
 1960294 | Bhojpur   | 5
 1976080 | Bhopal| 5
 1991622 | Bid   | 5
 2020723 | Bidar district| 5
 2020667 | Bijapur district  | 5
 1958009 | Bijnor| 5
 1948979 | Bikaner   | 5
  364166 | Bilaspur  | 5
 1972176 | Bilaspur  | 5
 1966288 | Birbhum   | 5
 2027934 | Bishnupur | 5
 1972059 | Bokaro| 5
 1791154 | Bongaigaon| 5
 1958555 | Budaun| 5
 1958144 | Bulandshahr   | 5
 7398836 | Buldhana  | 5
 1950132 | Bundi | 5
 1963161 | Buxar | 5
 2025971 | Cachar| 5
 2019940 | Chamarajanagar district   | 5
  364070 | Chamba| 5
  374815 | Chamoli   | 5
  374944 | Champawat | 5
 2029067 | Champhai  | 5
 1959911 | Chandauli | 5
 2027970 | Chandel   | 5
 1988465 | Chandrapur| 5
 2027455 | Changlang   

Re: [OSM-talk-fr] opendata : les batis et leur hauteur à Paris

[Nicolas Bétheuil]

D'où l'idée de l'open data. Y a pleins de données, au moins le nombre de
palliers, et d'étage.

Le 28 févr. 2018 7:43 PM, "Francois Gouget"  a écrit :

On Wed, 28 Feb 2018, Erwan Salomon wrote:

> celui qui fait le rendu c’est F4map
> petit exemple de rendu un peu travaillé
> http://demo.f4map.com/#lat=47.7361783=-3.4271357=19 <
http://demo.f4map.com/#lat=47.7361783=-3.4271357=19>
> l’église, mais aussi 100m au sud la médiathèque

Ah. Bien.

Mais c'est bizarre que pour un rendu en 3D ils ne prennent pas en compte
le relief. Parce que bon, Montmatre plat ça fait un peu bizarre. Et
comme ça semble utilisé pour l'immobilier le relief devrait quand même
avoir une importance, y compris pour l'ensoleillement (y en a qui sont
jamais contents ;-).

C'est quand même une super utilisation des données OpenStreetMap et ça
donne envie d'aller se promener avec StreetComplete pour renseigner
toutes les hauteurs de bâtiments et formes de toits.

Ça donne aussi envie d'acheter une caméra 360 pour mieux voir les
façades et pouvoir compter le nombre d'étages.


--
Francois Gouget   http://fgouget.free.fr/
   Un western sans indien c'est comme une police sans serif.
 -- John Wayne
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Re: [OSM-talk-fr] opendata : les batis et leur hauteur à Paris

[Philippe Verdy]

Note que je comprends bien pourquoi ce site a dû arrêter d'utiliser Google
Maps : en ne payant pas, Google pouvait librement insérer sur la carte des
annonces immobilières de sites concurrents et Google pour remplacer les
annonces placées par le site lui-même.

(Une autre raison de dire que "Google c'est le mal": si on veut produire sa
carte et montrer clairemetn ses données, au début on ne paye pas puis
Google commence à vous demander des sous et de plus en plus cher, car il
pratique les enchères en permanence sur les prix du placement préférentiel,
et dans le monde de l'immobilier il y a vraiment beaucoup de concurrents
qui cherchent à se placer, et les enchères montent ! Avec Google Maps, on
n'a aucune garantie de prix ou de service, le site peut vite devenir
déficitaire, ou obliger les sites à augmenter les prix de leurs services,
tels que les commissions d'agence dues par les clients uniquement pour
payer Google: Google est inflationniste et finalement coûte cher à tout le
monde, en témoigne ce qui s'est passé pour les autres services à domicile,
les hôtels, les restaurants: ceux qui restent encore sont ceux qui peuvent
payer Google avec les plus grosses enchères : McDo, Amazon, Uber, etc.
Google Maps tue le petit commerce qui doit absolument s'en éloigner et
refuser ce dictact qui profite uniquement aux géants du commerce en ligne,
en général américains et même actionnaires de Google !)


Le 28 février 2018 à 20:34, Philippe Verdy  a écrit :

> En même temps, ce site d'annonces ne fait qu'utiliser gratuitement (sans
> le dire, et en prétendant abusivement sur leur page d'accueil que c'est eux
> qui "font" la carte 2D et 3D) les services d'OSM et F4Map. Ils n'ont pas
> leur serveurs de tuiles, et la version de F4Map utilisée est la version
> "démo" qui n'a pas le relief, masi n'est pas sensée non plus être utilsiée
> directement sur un site commercial.
> Ils vont vite se faire bloquer pour usage abusif sans clé...
> Bref ne faisons pas de pub pour ce site d'annonces immobilières (il y en a
> des tas d'autres, celui-là est plus original car il a arrêté d'utiliser
> Google, à qui ils devaient payer sans doute trop cher, mais sont passé à
> F4Map sans rien demander à personne, et surtout pour ne pas payer non plus
> d'abonnement chez MapBox).
>
> Note: la page d'acceuil est abusive mais la carte visible quand on
> recherche dessus affiche bien les crédits, mais ne dispose pas des clés
> d'accès pour un usage en masse, et il n'a sans doute rien contribué du tout
> à OSM, ses données affichées dessus restent privées. Bref c'est un site
> purement égoïste et parasitaire.
>
> Le 28 février 2018 à 19:43, Francois Gouget  a écrit :
>
>> On Wed, 28 Feb 2018, Erwan Salomon wrote:
>>
>> > celui qui fait le rendu c’est F4map
>> > petit exemple de rendu un peu travaillé
>> > http://demo.f4map.com/#lat=47.7361783=-3.4271357=19 <
>> http://demo.f4map.com/#lat=47.7361783=-3.4271357=19>
>> > l’église, mais aussi 100m au sud la médiathèque
>>
>> Ah. Bien.
>>
>> Mais c'est bizarre que pour un rendu en 3D ils ne prennent pas en compte
>> le relief. Parce que bon, Montmatre plat ça fait un peu bizarre. Et
>> comme ça semble utilisé pour l'immobilier le relief devrait quand même
>> avoir une importance, y compris pour l'ensoleillement (y en a qui sont
>> jamais contents ;-).
>>
>> C'est quand même une super utilisation des données OpenStreetMap et ça
>> donne envie d'aller se promener avec StreetComplete pour renseigner
>> toutes les hauteurs de bâtiments et formes de toits.
>>
>> Ça donne aussi envie d'acheter une caméra 360 pour mieux voir les
>> façades et pouvoir compter le nombre d'étages.
>>
>>
>> --
>> Francois Gouget   http://fgouget.free.fr/
>>Un western sans indien c'est comme une police sans serif.
>>  -- John Wayne
>> ___
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>> Talk-fr@openstreetmap.org
>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-fr
>>
>>
>
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Re: [OSRM-talk] Small ways get small speeds

[Daniel Patterson]

Hi François,

  What you are seeing is rounding error.

  Internally, OSRM only stores the "duration" of each segment, with a
resolution of 0.1 seconds.  On the map, the speed is calculated by taking
the length of the segment, and dividing it by the "duration" value.

  We store longitude/latitude to 6 decimal places, so they have
approximately 10cm precision (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decimal_degrees)
depending on your latitude.  This precision means that calculating the
length of a segment is limited to +/- approx 10cm precision as well.

  Both of these precision limits compound for short segments when displayed
on the map, and sometimes the speed values look weird.

  However, they do not affect route selection very much, because routing is
done by accumulating time, and short segments generally only add small
amounts of time to the routing decision.

daniel



On Wed, Feb 28, 2018 at 10:41 AM, François Lacombe <
fl.infosrese...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> While investigating for flaws in a custom profile I'm trying to write, I
> discovered that arbitrary small ways got strange speed regarding the rules
> I used.
>
> Here is an extract from osrm-frontend debug
> https://imgur.com/a/L8coz
>
> All segments on the red line have the same attributes.
> I don't understand why the small parts in the middle got really slower
> speed than the longer ones.
> Do you have any idea?
>
> The purple road with 0km/h speed is normal and expected.
>
>
> Thank you for any hint
>
> Thanks in advance
>
> François
>
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Re: [OSM-talk-fr] opendata : les batis et leur hauteur à Paris

[Philippe Verdy]

En même temps, ce site d'annonces ne fait qu'utiliser gratuitement (sans le
dire, et en prétendant abusivement sur leur page d'accueil que c'est eux
qui "font" la carte 2D et 3D) les services d'OSM et F4Map. Ils n'ont pas
leur serveurs de tuiles, et la version de F4Map utilisée est la version
"démo" qui n'a pas le relief, masi n'est pas sensée non plus être utilsiée
directement sur un site commercial.
Ils vont vite se faire bloquer pour usage abusif sans clé...
Bref ne faisons pas de pub pour ce site d'annonces immobilières (il y en a
des tas d'autres, celui-là est plus original car il a arrêté d'utiliser
Google, à qui ils devaient payer sans doute trop cher, mais sont passé à
F4Map sans rien demander à personne, et surtout pour ne pas payer non plus
d'abonnement chez MapBox).

Note: la page d'acceuil est abusive mais la carte visible quand on
recherche dessus affiche bien les crédits, mais ne dispose pas des clés
d'accès pour un usage en masse, et il n'a sans doute rien contribué du tout
à OSM, ses données affichées dessus restent privées. Bref c'est un site
purement égoïste et parasitaire.

Le 28 février 2018 à 19:43, Francois Gouget  a écrit :

> On Wed, 28 Feb 2018, Erwan Salomon wrote:
>
> > celui qui fait le rendu c’est F4map
> > petit exemple de rendu un peu travaillé
> > http://demo.f4map.com/#lat=47.7361783=-3.4271357=19 <
> http://demo.f4map.com/#lat=47.7361783=-3.4271357=19>
> > l’église, mais aussi 100m au sud la médiathèque
>
> Ah. Bien.
>
> Mais c'est bizarre que pour un rendu en 3D ils ne prennent pas en compte
> le relief. Parce que bon, Montmatre plat ça fait un peu bizarre. Et
> comme ça semble utilisé pour l'immobilier le relief devrait quand même
> avoir une importance, y compris pour l'ensoleillement (y en a qui sont
> jamais contents ;-).
>
> C'est quand même une super utilisation des données OpenStreetMap et ça
> donne envie d'aller se promener avec StreetComplete pour renseigner
> toutes les hauteurs de bâtiments et formes de toits.
>
> Ça donne aussi envie d'acheter une caméra 360 pour mieux voir les
> façades et pouvoir compter le nombre d'étages.
>
>
> --
> Francois Gouget   http://fgouget.free.fr/
>Un western sans indien c'est comme une police sans serif.
>  -- John Wayne
> ___
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> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-fr
>
>
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Re: [OSM-talk-fr] opendata : les batis et leur hauteur à Paris

[Francois Gouget]

On Wed, 28 Feb 2018, Erwan Salomon wrote:

> celui qui fait le rendu c’est F4map
> petit exemple de rendu un peu travaillé
> http://demo.f4map.com/#lat=47.7361783=-3.4271357=19 
> 
> l’église, mais aussi 100m au sud la médiathèque

Ah. Bien.

Mais c'est bizarre que pour un rendu en 3D ils ne prennent pas en compte 
le relief. Parce que bon, Montmatre plat ça fait un peu bizarre. Et 
comme ça semble utilisé pour l'immobilier le relief devrait quand même 
avoir une importance, y compris pour l'ensoleillement (y en a qui sont 
jamais contents ;-).

C'est quand même une super utilisation des données OpenStreetMap et ça 
donne envie d'aller se promener avec StreetComplete pour renseigner 
toutes les hauteurs de bâtiments et formes de toits.

Ça donne aussi envie d'acheter une caméra 360 pour mieux voir les 
façades et pouvoir compter le nombre d'étages.


-- 
Francois Gouget   http://fgouget.free.fr/
   Un western sans indien c'est comme une police sans serif.
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[OSRM-talk] Small ways get small speeds

[François Lacombe]

Hi,

While investigating for flaws in a custom profile I'm trying to write, I
discovered that arbitrary small ways got strange speed regarding the rules
I used.

Here is an extract from osrm-frontend debug
https://imgur.com/a/L8coz

All segments on the red line have the same attributes.
I don't understand why the small parts in the middle got really slower
speed than the longer ones.
Do you have any idea?

The purple road with 0km/h speed is normal and expected.


Thank you for any hint

Thanks in advance

François
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Re: [Talk-br] Fundar Associação OpenStreetMap Brasil

[Vitor George]

Obrigado santamariense, reflete bem o que foi discutido até agora.




*--Vitor George*

*aparabólica - estúdio de softwarehttp://aparabolica.com.br
*

2018-02-28 15:51 GMT+00:00 santamariense :

> Voltando para fazer um resumo do que foi discutido até agora e algumas
> questões que surgiram neste ínterim. (até 12:00 de 28 de fevereiro de
> 2018)
>
> Vale lembrar que a discussão tem ocorrido na lista Talk-Br
> (https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-br/2018-
> February/012322.html),
> no fórum (https://forum.openstreetmap.org/viewtopic.php?id=61459) e
> algumas vezes nas comunidades OSM do Telegram
> (https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Pt:Contact).
>
> O que vai sendo decido, acrescenta-se a
> https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/WikiProject_Brazil/
> Associa%C3%A7%C3%A3o
> (precisa e será feito revisão) e discussões e sintetizações das
> discussões vão para o Talk da mesma.
>
> Parece-me que existem várias pessoas interessadas quanto ao apoio
> financeiro de se criar uma entidade, outros alegam não ter tempo para
> esse corre-corre, ou para ajustes técnicos (no caso de um portal web).
> Mas como as áreas de conhecimento dos colaboradores do OSM é
> abrangente, e dado a quantidade de interessados somados desta proposta
> à antiga de 2014, creio ser viável e no fim não acabe pesando para uma
> pessoa apenas fazer tudo.
>
> Levantou-se a necessidade de reuniões on-line. Dúvida: É preciso atas
> antes da ata de criação? (só se fosse algo informal, já que não teria
> assinaturas)
>
> Uma questão também levantada foi a importância de não focar em
> governança mas sim em funcionalidade operacional. Para isso se faz
> necessários traçar objetivos (fins), e com os fins estabelecidos se
> decide o melhor caminho para chegarmos a ele.
>
> Muitos objetivos já foram enumerados. É preciso fazer uma compilação
> deles, atualizá-los e reapresentá-los sempre que possível para
> apreciação dos demais.
>
> Quanto à burocracia, vem a tona a questão de definirmos que tipo de
> entidade queremos ou podemos alcançar atualmente. Uma das propostas
> inicial é sermos encubados por alguma entidade maior como o Wikimedia
> ou o Open Knowledge até que o movimento crie corpo, as demais são
> criar de fato já uma entidade jurídica para o OpenStreetMap Brasil.
> Daí surgiu até agora 3 possibilidades: Fundação, Associação ou
> Condomínio Voluntário. Dito isto, é preciso analisar 2 pontos-chave:
> Se cada uma delas vão nos levar aos objetivos traçados e seus custos
> operacionais, bem como a burocracia envolvida.
>
> Para fins de esclarecer quem não entende desta área jurídica, fiz um
> resumo da diferença entre Fundação / Associação / Condomínio
> Voluntário
>
> Segundo http://www.administradores.com.br/artigos/negocios/
> associacao-ou-fundacao/43197/
> , a diferença básica entre Fundação e Associação, são estas:
>
> -- Associação
> Constituída por pessoas.
> Pode (ou não) ter patrimônio inicial.
> A finalidade é definida pelos associados.
> Os associados deliberam livremente.
> Registro e administração são mais simples.
> Regida pelos artigos 44 a 61 do Código Civil.
> Criada por intermédio de decisão em assembléia, com transcrição em ata
> e elaboração de um estatuto.
>
> -- Fundação
> Constituída por patrimônio, aprovado previamente pelo Ministério Público.
> O patrimônio é condição para sua criação.
> A finalidade deve ser religiosa, moral, cultural ou de assistência,
> definida pelo instituidor.
> A finalidade é perene.
> As regras para deliberações são definidas pelo instituidor e
> fiscalizadas pelo Ministério Público.
> Registro e Administração são mais burocráticos.
> Regida pelos artigos 62 a 69 do Código Civil. Criada por intermédio de
> escritura pública ou testamento.
> Todos os atos de criação, inclusive o estatuto, ficam condicionados à
> prévia aprovação do Ministério Público.
>
> O Condomínio Voluntário seria a entidade mais simples de todas, e está
> está sucintamente explicada com uma linguagem bem acessível em
> https://medium.com/@peterkrauss/condom%C3%ADnio-
> volunt%C3%A1rio-a-propriedade-comum-que-descentraliza-os-
> direitos-da-propriedade-privada-5bc92081fd82
>
> Há também uma preocupação com descentralização da entidade a ser
> criada, de modo a possibilitar atuação o mais local possível junto a
> organizações governamentais, de modo que a importância seja algo como
> município > estado > união.
>
> Como o OSM é individualmente inconstante, quero dizer com isso que os
> usuários não estão por dentro de tudo ao tempo todo, se faz necessário
> chamá-los para a conversa e saber qual o nível de interesse deles no
> assunto. Também é preciso e até interessante levar a ideia para
> projetos correlatos como o Qgis e a própria Wikimedia. Conforme
> possível, vamos trabalhando nisso.
>
> Sem mais para o momento, estejam a vontade para opinar e dar
> seguimento ao assunto,
>
> usuário santamariense
>
> ___
> Talk-br 

Re: [Talk-ca] Manitoba buildings, addresses and high school work

[James]

Before Scruss comes out and says it:
1. Wiki documentation
2. You need to get LWG to approve license as it's not a standard license.
Explicit permission can certainly help our case.

After license is approved we could move on to approval of data quality,
then submit it for revue on import list(p.s. if it's crappy data they are
going to tell you about how it's crappy)

After all that(maybe 1-2 years later) can we move on to the serving of data
via a tasking manager and start the import

On Feb 28, 2018 11:54 AM, "john whelan"  wrote:

> Similar to does not mean the same unless it is the TB Open Data license
> but I suspect it predates that one.  Given that Stats Canada has said it
> will make the data available through the Federal Government's Open Data
> portal real soon now I suspect that an email from the city even to yourself
> would be acceptable.
>
> There is an import process speak nicely to James and he may be kind enough
> to handhold you through it.
>
> The LWG will give an opinion on the license but it could take some
> considerable time to do so.
>
> The import needs to be approved by a the local community.  In Ottawa two
> or three local mappers gathered together over coffee to approve it.  I
> think there were more than three.
>
> Given your suspected time frames its probably best to document the import
> fairly quickly.  That way it allows for those mappers who feel imports are
> terrible to have their say.
>
> Cheerio John
>
> On 28 February 2018 at 10:31, keith hartley 
> wrote:
>
>> Hi OSM'ers
>>
>> I am working on adding buildings to OSM in Manitoba and have a few
>> questions. I was just offered an updated building footprint and address
>> shape file from the City of Brandon, and agreement that it can be used in
>> OSM. I understand that the license needs to be compliant with the OSMs of
>> course, and will email the licensing group. The City uses a open data
>> license similar to Ottawa's (can be seen here
>> http://opengov.brandon.ca/terms.aspx) I can get  written consent in an
>> email if need be as well. Currently the buildings are from the Manitoba
>> land initiative website (MLI) and I can see that the city of Brandon Data
>> is much more accurate (in both attributes and position) I will review the
>> current data. Is there anything else I should be doing before I upload
>> this?
>>
>> The plan is to have high school students look at the map and using
>> walking maps or equivalent data capture (android app) to find what is
>> accessible for people with mobility issues around their schools. I'll write
>> the results on a wiki to show our successes. Anyone else have good ideas
>> how to get students to add to the map? (with teacher oversight of course!)
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Keith
>>
>>
>> ___
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>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca
>>
>>
>
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Re: [Talk-ca] Manitoba buildings, addresses and high school work

[john whelan]

Similar to does not mean the same unless it is the TB Open Data license but
I suspect it predates that one.  Given that Stats Canada has said it will
make the data available through the Federal Government's Open Data portal
real soon now I suspect that an email from the city even to yourself would
be acceptable.

There is an import process speak nicely to James and he may be kind enough
to handhold you through it.

The LWG will give an opinion on the license but it could take some
considerable time to do so.

The import needs to be approved by a the local community.  In Ottawa two or
three local mappers gathered together over coffee to approve it.  I think
there were more than three.

Given your suspected time frames its probably best to document the import
fairly quickly.  That way it allows for those mappers who feel imports are
terrible to have their say.

Cheerio John

On 28 February 2018 at 10:31, keith hartley 
wrote:

> Hi OSM'ers
>
> I am working on adding buildings to OSM in Manitoba and have a few
> questions. I was just offered an updated building footprint and address
> shape file from the City of Brandon, and agreement that it can be used in
> OSM. I understand that the license needs to be compliant with the OSMs of
> course, and will email the licensing group. The City uses a open data
> license similar to Ottawa's (can be seen here
> http://opengov.brandon.ca/terms.aspx) I can get  written consent in an
> email if need be as well. Currently the buildings are from the Manitoba
> land initiative website (MLI) and I can see that the city of Brandon Data
> is much more accurate (in both attributes and position) I will review the
> current data. Is there anything else I should be doing before I upload
> this?
>
> The plan is to have high school students look at the map and using walking
> maps or equivalent data capture (android app) to find what is accessible
> for people with mobility issues around their schools. I'll write the
> results on a wiki to show our successes. Anyone else have good ideas how to
> get students to add to the map? (with teacher oversight of course!)
>
> Cheers,
> Keith
>
>
> ___
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> Talk-ca@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-ca
>
>
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Re: [Talk-it] risposta a dichiarazione uso di GoogleStreetView

[Alessandro Sarretta]

Ma sarebbe veramente irrealizzabile per dataset ad es a livello 
regionale tipo per il citato Friuli Venezia Giulia?


Ale


On 28/02/2018 17:11, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:



2018-02-28 15:58 GMT+01:00 Alfredo Gattai >:



Sarebbe molto bello, ma è decisamente impraticabile, almeno
con le risorse di oggi.


+1 concordo, e lo faccio di mestiere. Tenere un database di questo
genere aggiornato e validato e' uno sforzo da grande azienda, non
a caso molte aziende che fanno cartografia stradale si sono
consorziate spazzando via le altre e la produzione cartografica di
Google Maps (che crea problemi seri anche alle grandi aziende tipo
Here) e' fatta al solo scopo di vendere altro, se dovessero farlo
per vendere dati sarebbero in rosso.di milioni...




si, è impensabile, e sarebbe assicurato di usare sempre dei dati 
vecchi, come succede con le mappe delle grande aziende. Se Google non 
ce lo fa a fare i review in tempo, lo facciamo noi con "un numero di 
mappatori molto più ristretto" rispetto ad OSM, dove già non ci riusciamo?


Ciao,
Martin


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--
--

Alessandro Sarretta

skype/twitter: alesarrett
Web: ilsarrett.wordpress.com 

Research information:

 * Google scholar profile
   
 * ORCID 
 * Research Gate 
 * Impactstory 

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Re: [Talk-es] Importación de Catastro. Eliminar archivos de tareas del repositorio en línea

[Javier Sánchez Portero]

Haz

git rm 29092/*
git commit -m "29092 Totalán. Fin de trabajos." 29092/*
git push -f origin master


El 28 de febrero de 2018, 14:58, dcapillae  escribió:

> Hola, Javier.
>
> Se ha completado con éxito la importación de edificios y direcciones en
> Totalán. He archivado el proyecto en el gestor de tareas y he enviado un
> mensaje de agradecimiento a todos los colaboradores que han participado.
> ¡Gracias a todos!
>
> Estoy intentando borrar los archivos de tareas correspondientes a Totalán
> (29092) del repositorio en línea. No los vamos a necesitar más y creo que
> sería conveniente eliminarlos. También quiero eliminar los correspondientes
> al municipio de Málaga (29900). Estos últimos tendremos que resubirlos
> nuevamente cuando terminemos de revisar el callejero, así que también sería
> conveniente eliminarlos del repositorio.
>
> Estoy teniendo problemas para borrarlos, no lo he conseguido. Por ejemplo,
> para borrar la carpeta de Málaga (29900), escribo:
>
>  git rm 29900
>
> Y el terminal me devuelve el siguiente mensaje de error:
>
>  fatal: pathspec '29900' did not match any files
>
> A partir de ahí, no sé como seguir. Prefiero preguntar antes de hacer algo
> por mi cuenta desde el desconocimiento y eliminar algo que no deba del
> repositorio.
>
> P. D.: Estoy en proceso de aprendizaje sobre cómo funcionan los
> repositorios
> de los sistemas Git. Necesitaré tiempo para aprender lo básico. Pido
> disculpas mientras tanto.
>
>
>
> -
> Daniel Capilla
> OSM user: dcapillae
> --
> Sent from: http://gis.19327.n8.nabble.com/Spain-f5409873.html
>
> ___
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Re: [Talk-it] Di nuovo l'utente pasticcione

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

2018-02-28 14:12 GMT+01:00 Simone Saviolo :

> non credo ci sia maggioranza per una cosa del genere, in quanto aumenta il
>> numero dei dati personali (privacy) e si alza la sbarra da saltare sopra
>> per contribuire.
>>
>
> Non lo farebbe l'utente, ma il software.
>


dovresti comunque chiedere consenso dalle persone, e ci sarebbe un db con
questi dati alla OSMF, che potenzialmente potrebbe essere compromesso o
confiscato. Attualmente il board discute di raccogliere (e sopratutto
distribuire) meno metadati. Parlano di non far vedere più nome dell'utente
e data e versione (ipotesi). Attualmente, quanto ho letto, sembra che si
faccia una cosa che solo gli utenti registrati possono vedere i metadati
(quindi abbastanza "soft").
Questo per la privacy directive della CE che entra in vigore fra poco. Ci
sono già persone (dicono una al giorno) che chiedono di essere rimossi dal
db (e lo possono chiedere, hanno il diritto a quanto pare), presumibilmente
perché gli mette paura l'ipotesi che qualcuno analizzi il planet e crei una
scheda con informazioni su di loro. Figurati se dobbiamo mettere nei
termini d'utilizzo che andremmo a tracciare i loro device ;-)

Ciao,
Martin
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Re: [Talk-br] Fundar Associação OpenStreetMap Brasil

[santamariense]

Voltando para fazer um resumo do que foi discutido até agora e algumas
questões que surgiram neste ínterim. (até 12:00 de 28 de fevereiro de
2018)

Vale lembrar que a discussão tem ocorrido na lista Talk-Br
(https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-br/2018-February/012322.html),
no fórum (https://forum.openstreetmap.org/viewtopic.php?id=61459) e
algumas vezes nas comunidades OSM do Telegram
(https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Pt:Contact).

O que vai sendo decido, acrescenta-se a
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/WikiProject_Brazil/Associa%C3%A7%C3%A3o
(precisa e será feito revisão) e discussões e sintetizações das
discussões vão para o Talk da mesma.

Parece-me que existem várias pessoas interessadas quanto ao apoio
financeiro de se criar uma entidade, outros alegam não ter tempo para
esse corre-corre, ou para ajustes técnicos (no caso de um portal web).
Mas como as áreas de conhecimento dos colaboradores do OSM é
abrangente, e dado a quantidade de interessados somados desta proposta
à antiga de 2014, creio ser viável e no fim não acabe pesando para uma
pessoa apenas fazer tudo.

Levantou-se a necessidade de reuniões on-line. Dúvida: É preciso atas
antes da ata de criação? (só se fosse algo informal, já que não teria
assinaturas)

Uma questão também levantada foi a importância de não focar em
governança mas sim em funcionalidade operacional. Para isso se faz
necessários traçar objetivos (fins), e com os fins estabelecidos se
decide o melhor caminho para chegarmos a ele.

Muitos objetivos já foram enumerados. É preciso fazer uma compilação
deles, atualizá-los e reapresentá-los sempre que possível para
apreciação dos demais.

Quanto à burocracia, vem a tona a questão de definirmos que tipo de
entidade queremos ou podemos alcançar atualmente. Uma das propostas
inicial é sermos encubados por alguma entidade maior como o Wikimedia
ou o Open Knowledge até que o movimento crie corpo, as demais são
criar de fato já uma entidade jurídica para o OpenStreetMap Brasil.
Daí surgiu até agora 3 possibilidades: Fundação, Associação ou
Condomínio Voluntário. Dito isto, é preciso analisar 2 pontos-chave:
Se cada uma delas vão nos levar aos objetivos traçados e seus custos
operacionais, bem como a burocracia envolvida.

Para fins de esclarecer quem não entende desta área jurídica, fiz um
resumo da diferença entre Fundação / Associação / Condomínio
Voluntário

Segundo 
http://www.administradores.com.br/artigos/negocios/associacao-ou-fundacao/43197/
, a diferença básica entre Fundação e Associação, são estas:

-- Associação
Constituída por pessoas.
Pode (ou não) ter patrimônio inicial.
A finalidade é definida pelos associados.
Os associados deliberam livremente.
Registro e administração são mais simples.
Regida pelos artigos 44 a 61 do Código Civil.
Criada por intermédio de decisão em assembléia, com transcrição em ata
e elaboração de um estatuto.

-- Fundação
Constituída por patrimônio, aprovado previamente pelo Ministério Público.
O patrimônio é condição para sua criação.
A finalidade deve ser religiosa, moral, cultural ou de assistência,
definida pelo instituidor.
A finalidade é perene.
As regras para deliberações são definidas pelo instituidor e
fiscalizadas pelo Ministério Público.
Registro e Administração são mais burocráticos.
Regida pelos artigos 62 a 69 do Código Civil. Criada por intermédio de
escritura pública ou testamento.
Todos os atos de criação, inclusive o estatuto, ficam condicionados à
prévia aprovação do Ministério Público.

O Condomínio Voluntário seria a entidade mais simples de todas, e está
está sucintamente explicada com uma linguagem bem acessível em
https://medium.com/@peterkrauss/condom%C3%ADnio-volunt%C3%A1rio-a-propriedade-comum-que-descentraliza-os-direitos-da-propriedade-privada-5bc92081fd82

Há também uma preocupação com descentralização da entidade a ser
criada, de modo a possibilitar atuação o mais local possível junto a
organizações governamentais, de modo que a importância seja algo como
município > estado > união.

Como o OSM é individualmente inconstante, quero dizer com isso que os
usuários não estão por dentro de tudo ao tempo todo, se faz necessário
chamá-los para a conversa e saber qual o nível de interesse deles no
assunto. Também é preciso e até interessante levar a ideia para
projetos correlatos como o Qgis e a própria Wikimedia. Conforme
possível, vamos trabalhando nisso.

Sem mais para o momento, estejam a vontade para opinar e dar
seguimento ao assunto,

usuário santamariense

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[Talk-cz] Kvartální pivo v Praze

[Mikoláš Štrajt]

Zdar,
na Twitteru jsem zahlédnul, že se příští středu (7.3.) koná kvartální pivo.

Zapsal jsem se do Prahy a mám dva dotazy:

1) chystá se do Prahy ještě někdo další?
2) mám zarezervovat stůl?

Navrhuji zajít do Restaurace Oáza přímo na Smíchovském nádraží.

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[Talk-cz] Jindřichův Hradec - mapuje tam někdo z nás?

[majka]

Pohybuje se někdo z nás pravidelněji v Jindřichově Hradci?

Nezdá se mi, že by tam byl někdo aktuálně aktivní, a dost nám tam řádil náš
oblíbený fell3. Sice mu nevadilo, že na mapě chybí budovy nebo jsou
zakreslené nepřesně (mapování z roku 2010), zato zmapoval každý tobogán
zvlášť (waterway=ditch), a pár míst obkreslil podle v té chvíli již
zastaralého stavu včetně každé lampy. Vzhledem k tomu, že právě Seznam
spustil JH nově v 3D, je to poměrně dost vidět.

Vypadá to, že to bude chtít několik výletů tímhle směrem za vzdáleným
příbuzenstvem :)

Majka
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[Talk-ca] Manitoba buildings, addresses and high school work

[keith hartley]

 Hi OSM'ers

I am working on adding buildings to OSM in Manitoba and have a few
questions. I was just offered an updated building footprint and address
shape file from the City of Brandon, and agreement that it can be used in
OSM. I understand that the license needs to be compliant with the OSMs of
course, and will email the licensing group. The City uses a open data
license similar to Ottawa's (can be seen here http://opengov.brandon.ca/
terms.aspx) I can get  written consent in an email if need be as well.
Currently the buildings are from the Manitoba land initiative website (MLI)
and I can see that the city of Brandon Data is much more accurate (in both
attributes and position) I will review the current data. Is there anything
else I should be doing before I upload this?

The plan is to have high school students look at the map and using walking
maps or equivalent data capture (android app) to find what is accessible
for people with mobility issues around their schools. I'll write the
results on a wiki to show our successes. Anyone else have good ideas how to
get students to add to the map? (with teacher oversight of course!)

Cheers,
Keith
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Re: [Talk-es] Importación de Catastro. Eliminar archivos de tareas del repositorio en línea

[dcapillae]

Hola, Javier.

Se ha completado con éxito la importación de edificios y direcciones en
Totalán. He archivado el proyecto en el gestor de tareas y he enviado un
mensaje de agradecimiento a todos los colaboradores que han participado.
¡Gracias a todos!

Estoy intentando borrar los archivos de tareas correspondientes a Totalán
(29092) del repositorio en línea. No los vamos a necesitar más y creo que
sería conveniente eliminarlos. También quiero eliminar los correspondientes
al municipio de Málaga (29900). Estos últimos tendremos que resubirlos
nuevamente cuando terminemos de revisar el callejero, así que también sería
conveniente eliminarlos del repositorio.

Estoy teniendo problemas para borrarlos, no lo he conseguido. Por ejemplo,
para borrar la carpeta de Málaga (29900), escribo:

 git rm 29900

Y el terminal me devuelve el siguiente mensaje de error:

 fatal: pathspec '29900' did not match any files

A partir de ahí, no sé como seguir. Prefiero preguntar antes de hacer algo
por mi cuenta desde el desconocimiento y eliminar algo que no deba del
repositorio.

P. D.: Estoy en proceso de aprendizaje sobre cómo funcionan los repositorios
de los sistemas Git. Necesitaré tiempo para aprender lo básico. Pido
disculpas mientras tanto.



-
Daniel Capilla
OSM user: dcapillae 
--
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Re: [Talk-it] risposta a dichiarazione uso di GoogleStreetView

[Alfredo Gattai]

>
>
> Sarebbe molto bello, ma è decisamente impraticabile, almeno con le risorse
> di oggi.
>
>
+1 concordo, e lo faccio di mestiere. Tenere un database di questo genere
aggiornato e validato e' uno sforzo da grande azienda, non a caso molte
aziende che fanno cartografia stradale si sono consorziate spazzando via le
altre e la produzione cartografica di Google Maps (che crea problemi seri
anche alle grandi aziende tipo Here) e' fatta al solo scopo di vendere
altro, se dovessero farlo per vendere dati sarebbero in rosso.di
milioni...

Alfredo
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Re: [Talk-it] risposta a dichiarazione uso di GoogleStreetView

[Simone Saviolo]

Il giorno 28 febbraio 2018 15:02, francesco gargano <
frengofieramos...@gmail.com> ha scritto:

> Il giorno 28 febbraio 2018 13:16, Martin Koppenhoefer <
> dieterdre...@gmail.com> ha scritto:
>
>> 2018-02-28 12:15 GMT+01:00 Cascafico Giovanni :
>>
>>> Ti porto un esempio limite, ma non credo di esagerare.
>>>
>>> In FVG abbiamo importato da fonte ufficiale i numeri civici di gran
>>> parte dei comuni. A Trieste abbiamo un vandalo che, tra le altre cose,
>>> modifica i nome delle strade. Il 118 regionale usa un navigatore
>>> proprietario basato su dati OSM (e che spero fuzioni meglio di Nominatim).
>>> Non mi solleva il fatto che la responsabilità legale di qualche ritardo
>>> nelle emergenze non sia di OSM.
>>>
>>
>> al mio modesto parere loro devono comunque rendersi conto di utilizzare
>> un prodotto crowd sourced dove ci possono essere grossi errori
>> (temporaneamente). Se avete presi i civici da una fonte ufficiale, perché i
>> poveri soccoritori del 118 regionale devono usare dati di "seconda mano" e
>> non quelli ufficiali e "certificati"? Posso capire l'utilizzo di OSM come
>> fonte alternativa di informazioni, ma basare il lavoro di un pronto
>> soccorso su solo OSM mi sembrerebbe un fatto colposo.
>>
>
> Questa è una delle ragioni che dovrebbe spingerci a creare un fork
> "stable" del db che non sia più modificabile ma solo da revisionare e
> "ceritficare" con accuratezza da un numero molto più ristretto di utenti
> "senior", ed a lasciare in perenne "beta" la versione che attualmente ogni
> utente va a modificare
>

Sarebbe molto bello, ma è decisamente impraticabile, almeno con le risorse
di oggi.

Ciao,

Simone
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Re: [Diversity-talk] Code of Conduct & Moderation for this list

[Rebecca Firth]

Hi,

I also very much support a CoC and like this format.

Rebecca

On Wed, Feb 28, 2018 at 8:56 AM, alyssa wright 
wrote:

> I support a CoC and very much like the Geek Feminism format.
>
> Thanks all! Looking forward to further discussion.
>
> Best,
> Alyssa.
>
> On Wed, Feb 28, 2018 at 5:44 AM, Rory McCann  wrote:
>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> To follow up on the phone call, and waiting a little bit for people to
>> join. 
>>
>> I think this list should have a Code of Conduct. I propose something
>> like Geek Feminism's one. Thoughts?
>>
>> http://geekfeminism.wikia.com/wiki/Community_anti-harassment/Policy
>>
>> If/When anyone else volunteers to mod this list, I'll add them. Just
>> email me.
>>
>> I'm new to running a mailman list, but I think if you email
>> diversity-talk-ow...@openstreetmap.org that will only go to the list
>> mods (and the emails aren't public). This can function as a private "mod
>> list", or report system.
>>
>> There some moderation features with mailman (this software), everything
>> is still on the default settings (I think). Feel free to suggest
>> improvements.
>>
>> Rory
>>
>> ___
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>> (_internal_name)s
>>
>
>
> ___
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>
>


-- 
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Community and Partnerships Manager
rebecca.fi...@hotosm.org 
@RebeccaFirthy

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*Using OpenStreetMap for Humanitarian Response & Economic Development*

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Re: [Talk-it] risposta a dichiarazione uso di GoogleStreetView

[francesco gargano]

Il giorno 28 febbraio 2018 13:16, Martin Koppenhoefer <
dieterdre...@gmail.com> ha scritto:

> 2018-02-28 12:15 GMT+01:00 Cascafico Giovanni :
>
>> Ti porto un esempio limite, ma non credo di esagerare.
>>
>> In FVG abbiamo importato da fonte ufficiale i numeri civici di gran parte
>> dei comuni. A Trieste abbiamo un vandalo che, tra le altre cose, modifica i
>> nome delle strade. Il 118 regionale usa un navigatore proprietario basato
>> su dati OSM (e che spero fuzioni meglio di Nominatim). Non mi solleva il
>> fatto che la responsabilità legale di qualche ritardo nelle emergenze non
>> sia di OSM.
>>
>
>
>
> al mio modesto parere loro devono comunque rendersi conto di utilizzare un
> prodotto crowd sourced dove ci possono essere grossi errori
> (temporaneamente). Se avete presi i civici da una fonte ufficiale, perché i
> poveri soccoritori del 118 regionale devono usare dati di "seconda mano" e
> non quelli ufficiali e "certificati"? Posso capire l'utilizzo di OSM come
> fonte alternativa di informazioni, ma basare il lavoro di un pronto
> soccorso su solo OSM mi sembrerebbe un fatto colposo.
>
> Ciao,
> Martin
>
>
Questa è una delle ragioni che dovrebbe spingerci a creare un fork "stable"
del db che non sia più modificabile ma solo da revisionare e "ceritficare"
con accuratezza da un numero molto più ristretto di utenti "senior", ed a
lasciare in perenne "beta" la versione che attualmente ogni utente va a
modificare
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Re: [Diversity-talk] Code of Conduct & Moderation for this list

[alyssa wright]

I support a CoC and very much like the Geek Feminism format.

Thanks all! Looking forward to further discussion.

Best,
Alyssa.

On Wed, Feb 28, 2018 at 5:44 AM, Rory McCann  wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> To follow up on the phone call, and waiting a little bit for people to
> join. 
>
> I think this list should have a Code of Conduct. I propose something
> like Geek Feminism's one. Thoughts?
>
> http://geekfeminism.wikia.com/wiki/Community_anti-harassment/Policy
>
> If/When anyone else volunteers to mod this list, I'll add them. Just
> email me.
>
> I'm new to running a mailman list, but I think if you email
> diversity-talk-ow...@openstreetmap.org that will only go to the list
> mods (and the emails aren't public). This can function as a private "mod
> list", or report system.
>
> There some moderation features with mailman (this software), everything
> is still on the default settings (I think). Feel free to suggest
> improvements.
>
> Rory
>
> ___
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> Contact the mods (private): diversity-talk-ow...@openstreetmap.org
> (_internal_name)s
>
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Re: [Talk-it] risposta a dichiarazione uso di GoogleStreetView

[Jo]

Io lo ho domandato a la persona di Google chi é molto dedicato a fare che
Google aiuta proietti di Software libero. Su lavoro anche no sempre é
appreciato per qualchi divizioni di Google. Era un Meetup per mentori e
studenti di Google Summer of Code, prevvio a FOSDEM.

Ho rimarcato che per OSM saria molto interessante poter utilizzare GSV. La
risposta era che questo non va occurire.

(I should probably have used Google Translate to produce this comment :-)
Anyway, it's extremely unlikely that we will ever get permssion from Google
to use their Streetview imagery) So we should continue to make our own.

Ciao,

Polyglot

2018-02-22 18:25 GMT+01:00 Martin Koppenhoefer :

>
>
> sent from a phone
>
> > On 22. Feb 2018, at 15:09, emmexx  wrote:
> >
> > Ma nessuno ha mai provato a chiederlo direttamente a Google? ;-)
>
>
> si, hanno chiesto ma mai ricevuto risposta (credo)
>
>
> Ciao, Martin
>
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Re: [OSM-talk-fr] opendata : les batis et leur hauteur à Paris

[Erwan Salomon]

celui qui fait le rendu c’est F4map
petit exemple de rendu un peu travaillé
http://demo.f4map.com/#lat=47.7361783=-3.4271357=19 

l’église, mais aussi 100m au sud la médiathèque
ils prennent en compte building:min_levels, building:colour … building:part 
(important pour les bâtiments en plusieurs volumes)
roof:material, mais pas stone
surface en vitre sont rendues
aussi les arbres et rangées d’arbre (arbre de noël si je me souvient)
les surface d’eau, les fontaines ...
y’a 2 ans c’était pas mis à jour rapidement
maintenant ça varie de la minute à qqn heures
ils ont aussi des bâtiment modélisé par leur propres moyens :
http://demo.f4map.com/#lat=47.7479520=-3.3652867=18 

souvent les mairies
et l’ombrage et les conditions météos en direct (ça pourrait être intéressant 
de les définir à volonté pour évaluer la luminosité des appartements par 
exemple)
ça fait chauffer mon ordi par contre
ça passe mieux sur mon téléphone

erwan [glyo]


> Le 28 févr. 2018 à 14:17, Francois Gouget  a écrit :
> 
> On Tue, 27 Feb 2018, Nicolas Bétheuil wrote:
> 
>> Bonjour,
>> 
>> L'autre jour j'avais trouvé un site d'immobilier qui m'avait 
>> impressionné : bienici.com Je vous laisse aller faire un tour si ça 
>> vous intéresse c'est ni le sujet ni une pub. Ils réutilisent les 
>> données d'OSM pour les hauteurs de bâtiments. Forcément j'ai été voir 
>> chez moi et les hauteurs ne sont pas renseignées.
> 
> Le rendu est sympa.
> 
> D'après mes tests ils se servent des champs building:levels, 
> roof:levels, roof:shape et peut-être roof:material (et peut-être encore 
> d'autres). Et en plus ils mettent à jour leurs données plutôt rapidement :
> j'ai complété quelques bâtiments cette nuit à partir de Mapillary et 
> aujourd'hui le rendu les prend en compte !
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Francois Gouget   http://fgouget.free.fr/
> Linux: the choice of a GNU 
> generation___
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Re: [OSM-talk-fr] opendata : les batis et leur hauteur à Paris

[Francois Gouget]

On Tue, 27 Feb 2018, Nicolas Bétheuil wrote:

> Bonjour,
> 
> L'autre jour j'avais trouvé un site d'immobilier qui m'avait 
> impressionné : bienici.com Je vous laisse aller faire un tour si ça 
> vous intéresse c'est ni le sujet ni une pub. Ils réutilisent les 
> données d'OSM pour les hauteurs de bâtiments. Forcément j'ai été voir 
> chez moi et les hauteurs ne sont pas renseignées.

Le rendu est sympa.

D'après mes tests ils se servent des champs building:levels, 
roof:levels, roof:shape et peut-être roof:material (et peut-être encore 
d'autres). Et en plus ils mettent à jour leurs données plutôt rapidement :
j'ai complété quelques bâtiments cette nuit à partir de Mapillary et 
aujourd'hui le rendu les prend en compte !



-- 
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Re: [Talk-it] Di nuovo l'utente pasticcione

[Simone Saviolo]

Il giorno 28 febbraio 2018 14:08, Martin Koppenhoefer <
dieterdre...@gmail.com> ha scritto:

> 2018-02-28 13:54 GMT+01:00 Francesco Pelullo :
>
>>
>> Ormai stiamo parlando di aria fritta, comunque visto che ci siamo la
>> soluzione più vantaggiosa sarebbe quella di leggere i dati del PC tramite
>> uno JavaScript (MAC, risoluzione schermo, sistema operativo, patch di
>> sicurezza installate, IP rete LAN, nome NetBIOS etc) da far girare
>> obbligatoriamente nell'editor.
>>
>> Con queste informazioni si stabilisce in maniera pressoché univoca la
>> macchina e quindi l'utente.
>>
>
> non credo ci sia maggioranza per una cosa del genere, in quanto aumenta il
> numero dei dati personali (privacy) e si alza la sbarra da saltare sopra
> per contribuire.
>

Non lo farebbe l'utente, ma il software.

Ciao,

Simone
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Re: [Talk-it] Di nuovo l'utente pasticcione

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

2018-02-28 14:06 GMT+01:00 Marco_T :

> OSM potrebbe rilasciare gli account dietro il pagamento (ehm, donazione) di
> 5eur, tramite strumento tracciabile:
> - incasserebbe qualche soldino pro bono;
> - ridurrebbe il rischio che i biricchini aprano account solo per fare danni
> (dato che conoscerebbe la loro identità e toccerebbe loro il porcellino
> portamonete).
>



e escluderemmo quasi tutte le persone del "terzo mondo" (al meno dal avere
un account proprio) che già ora non ci sono in grande numero perché oltre a
non avere soldi, non hanno nemmeno tempo ed attrezzature.

Ciao,
Martin
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Re: [Talk-it] Di nuovo l'utente pasticcione

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

2018-02-28 13:54 GMT+01:00 Francesco Pelullo :

>
> Ormai stiamo parlando di aria fritta, comunque visto che ci siamo la
> soluzione più vantaggiosa sarebbe quella di leggere i dati del PC tramite
> uno JavaScript (MAC, risoluzione schermo, sistema operativo, patch di
> sicurezza installate, IP rete LAN, nome NetBIOS etc) da far girare
> obbligatoriamente nell'editor.
>
> Con queste informazioni si stabilisce in maniera pressoché univoca la
> macchina e quindi l'utente.
>



non credo ci sia maggioranza per una cosa del genere, in quanto aumenta il
numero dei dati personali (privacy) e si alza la sbarra da saltare sopra
per contribuire.

Ciao,
Martin
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Re: [Talk-it] Di nuovo l'utente pasticcione

[Marco_T]

Ciao,

OSM potrebbe rilasciare gli account dietro il pagamento (ehm, donazione) di
5eur, tramite strumento tracciabile:
- incasserebbe qualche soldino pro bono;
- ridurrebbe il rischio che i biricchini aprano account solo per fare danni
(dato che conoscerebbe la loro identità e toccerebbe loro il porcellino
portamonete).

-- 
Marco_T



--
Sent from: http://gis.19327.n8.nabble.com/Italy-General-f5324174.html

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Re: [Talk-it] Di nuovo l'utente pasticcione

[Cascafico Giovanni]

Il giorno 28 febbraio 2018 12:59, Andreas Lattmann  ha scritto:

> E mi ero dimenticato questo strumento [2] che può essere utile per tenere
> sott'occhio un utente che fa pasticci.
> [2] http://resultmaps.neis-one.org/newestosmcreatefeed.php
>
>
Questo lo uso quotidianamente; su suggerimento in ML, ho installato un
semplice tool che mi manda la mail quando arriva in bbox un nuovo utente.
Ne scrivevo affermando che i niubbi rispondono 9/10 ai commenti nei
changeset.
Invece che redirigere il feed alla mail, potrebbe essere più efficiente
dirigerlo ad un canale telegram. Ed una bbox regionale potebbe essere la
dimensione giusta per accogliere/correggere i nuovi mappatori.
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Re: [Talk-it] Di nuovo l'utente pasticcione

[Francesco Pelullo]

Il 28 feb 2018 1:35 PM, "Martin Koppenhoefer"  ha
scritto:



Sarebbe in ogni caso una cosa da implementare nell'API / sul server della
OSMF. Prima di farmi il lavoro dell'implementazione chiederei in
d...@openstreetmap.org cosa dicono gli altri sviluppatori.


Ormai stiamo parlando di aria fritta, comunque visto che ci siamo la
soluzione più vantaggiosa sarebbe quella di leggere i dati del PC tramite
uno JavaScript (MAC, risoluzione schermo, sistema operativo, patch di
sicurezza installate, IP rete LAN, nome NetBIOS etc) da far girare
obbligatoriamente nell'editor.

Con queste informazioni si stabilisce in maniera pressoché univoca la
macchina e quindi l'utente.

Ciao
/niubii/
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Re: [Talk-it] risposta a dichiarazione uso di GoogleStreetView

[Cascafico Giovanni]

Il giorno 28 febbraio 2018 13:16, Martin Koppenhoefer <
dieterdre...@gmail.com> ha scritto:

>
> al mio modesto parere loro devono comunque rendersi conto di utilizzare un
> prodotto crowd sourced dove ci possono essere grossi errori
> (temporaneamente). Se avete presi i civici da una fonte ufficiale, perché i
> poveri soccoritori del 118 regionale devono usare dati di "seconda mano" e
> non quelli ufficiali e "certificati"? Posso capire l'utilizzo di OSM come
> fonte alternativa di informazioni, ma basare il lavoro di un pronto
> soccorso su solo OSM mi sembrerebbe un fatto colposo.
>
>
Non ho detto che si basino solo su OSM.

Siamo arrivati a questo OT perchè sono amareggiato che il problema della
legalità sia guardare StreetView (per aggiungere un non-dato), mentre i
vandali possono godere della totale spensieratezza durante le loro azioni.
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Re: [Talk-it] Di nuovo l'utente pasticcione

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

2018-02-28 13:27 GMT+01:00 Marco Ciampa :

> Si certo ma come ho detto prima si fa presto a capire se il mac address è
> pubblico o no.



Sarebbe in ogni caso una cosa da implementare nell'API / sul server della
OSMF. Prima di farmi il lavoro dell'implementazione chiederei in
d...@openstreetmap.org cosa dicono gli altri sviluppatori.

Ciao,
Martin
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Re: [Talk-it] Di nuovo l'utente pasticcione

[Marco Ciampa]

On Wed, Feb 28, 2018 at 12:54:15PM +0100, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:
> 2018-02-28 11:18 GMT+01:00 Marco Ciampa :
> 
> > > non c'è bisogno di NAT se usi IPv6 (non è ancora molto diffuso tra gli
> > > utenti "home" italiani). In generale, tutti questi blocchi si possono
> > > agirare con un VPN, servirebbe a poco. Nulla ti impedisce poi a creare un
> > > account nuovo per ogni changeset.
> >
> > Ok se uno è "sgamato" aggira facilmente tutti i blocchi ma ... è questo il
> > caso?
> > Accade normalmente?
> >
> > non credo...
> >
> 
> nel senso ora non succede, ma quando ti metti a bloccare utenti via MAC del
> loro router, se sono determinati a danneggiare (e ce ne sono casi), lo
> potranno fare anche con blocchi. Poi ogni blocco blocca anche utilizzo
> lecito (generalmente, per sbaglio / overblocking, esempio da macchine in
> luoghi pubblici come Internet café, biblioteche, scuole e università),
> quindi danneggia anche "utenti buoni".

Si certo ma come ho detto prima si fa presto a capire se il mac address è
pubblico o no.


-- 


Marco Ciampa

I know a joke about UDP, but you might not get it.



 GNU/Linux User #78271
 FSFE fellow #364




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Re: [Talk-it] risposta a dichiarazione uso di GoogleStreetView

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

2018-02-28 12:15 GMT+01:00 Cascafico Giovanni :

> Ti porto un esempio limite, ma non credo di esagerare.
>
> In FVG abbiamo importato da fonte ufficiale i numeri civici di gran parte
> dei comuni. A Trieste abbiamo un vandalo che, tra le altre cose, modifica i
> nome delle strade. Il 118 regionale usa un navigatore proprietario basato
> su dati OSM (e che spero fuzioni meglio di Nominatim). Non mi solleva il
> fatto che la responsabilità legale di qualche ritardo nelle emergenze non
> sia di OSM.
>



al mio modesto parere loro devono comunque rendersi conto di utilizzare un
prodotto crowd sourced dove ci possono essere grossi errori
(temporaneamente). Se avete presi i civici da una fonte ufficiale, perché i
poveri soccoritori del 118 regionale devono usare dati di "seconda mano" e
non quelli ufficiali e "certificati"? Posso capire l'utilizzo di OSM come
fonte alternativa di informazioni, ma basare il lavoro di un pronto
soccorso su solo OSM mi sembrerebbe un fatto colposo.

Ciao,
Martin
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Re: [Talk-it] Di nuovo l'utente pasticcione

[Andreas Lattmann]

>Messo insieme ad un feed reader che >mandi una mail (o un messaggio
>in
>un canale telegram apposito) su utenti sospetti od anche nuovi, credo
>possa
>essere utile.

Changeset sospetti [1]
E mi ero dimenticato questo strumento [2] che può essere utile per tenere 
sott'occhio un utente che fa pasticci.


[1] 
http://www.resultmaps.neis-one.org/osm-suspicious?country=103=96=10==t=%3E=10=d=n#4/42.46/11.60

[2] http://resultmaps.neis-one.org/newestosmcreatefeed.php


Andreas Lattmann
-- 
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Re: [Talk-it] Di nuovo l'utente pasticcione

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

2018-02-28 11:18 GMT+01:00 Marco Ciampa :

> > non c'è bisogno di NAT se usi IPv6 (non è ancora molto diffuso tra gli
> > utenti "home" italiani). In generale, tutti questi blocchi si possono
> > agirare con un VPN, servirebbe a poco. Nulla ti impedisce poi a creare un
> > account nuovo per ogni changeset.
>
> Ok se uno è "sgamato" aggira facilmente tutti i blocchi ma ... è questo il
> caso?
> Accade normalmente?
>
> non credo...
>



nel senso ora non succede, ma quando ti metti a bloccare utenti via MAC del
loro router, se sono determinati a danneggiare (e ce ne sono casi), lo
potranno fare anche con blocchi. Poi ogni blocco blocca anche utilizzo
lecito (generalmente, per sbaglio / overblocking, esempio da macchine in
luoghi pubblici come Internet café, biblioteche, scuole e università),
quindi danneggia anche "utenti buoni".

Ciao,
Martin
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Re: [Talk-it] Di nuovo l'utente pasticcione

[Lorenzo "Beba" Beltrami]

Il giorno 28 febbraio 2018 11:43, Simone Saviolo 
ha scritto:

> Su Welcome non si potrebbe introdurre una ricerca geografica e per tempo?
> Possibilmente con un feed RSS.
>
+1


> Immagino sia open source: dov'è il codice?
>
Ricordo che si partiva da un progetto belga fatto in PHP:
https://github.com/osmbe/osm-welcome-belgium
Poi Stefano ha fatto un fork: https://github.com/osmItalia/welcome-tool

Lorenzo
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Re: [Talk-it] risposta a dichiarazione uso di GoogleStreetView

[Andreas Lattmann]

>OSM. Le nostre mappe sono spesso utili, ma non sostituiscono
>cartografie
>ufficiali e obblighi di cautela.

Gli obblighi di cautela ci vogliono anche per quelle ufficiali. Come del resto 
in tutte le cose. 
Andreas Lattmann
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Re: [Talk-it] mia prima modifica in OSM - help!

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

2018-02-23 11:23 GMT+01:00 Martina :

> ok, mappato come nodo con railway=station. Tolto il precedente tag
> all'edificio e anche il name e aggiunto public_transport= station
>
> Guardando gli altri tag dell'edificio mi sono però resa conto che ci sono
> anche i tag wikipedia e wikidata. Li lascio sull'edificio o li sposto sul
> nodo?
>


ammetto che non ho capito del tutto la tua modifca, per chiarezza che forse
già lo hai trovato, gli edifici delle stazioni sono normalmente taggati con
building=train_station
(il tag building descrive l'edificio, quindi quel tag può anche rimanere
quando la stazione non è più servita).

I tag di wikipedia e wikidata devono andare sull'oggetto OSM che rapresenta
la cosa descritta in wikipedia e wikidata. Se si riferisce all'edificio
della stazione vanno sull'edificio, se si riferisce sulla stazione
ferroviaria (luogo dove si compongono treno, dove treni si fermano per far
scendere e salire passeggeri, ecc.) allora va su railway=station. Nel caso
di wikipedia (ma anche wikidata) non è sempre chiaro, spesso gli articoli
trattano di più cose e devi decidere come comportarti. Se fai un area per
railway=station, questo problema si pone di meno, perché solitamente questa
area comprende già il building=train_station (e da' anche un informazione
in più: la grandezza e forma).

Per l'estensione del railway=station lungo i binari si può orientare
all'ultimo segnale oppure ultimo deviatoio. Parallelo ai binari si trovano
spesso recinzioni.
C'è uno schema qui:
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/File:A-simple-station.svg

Ciao,
Martin
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Re: [Talk-it] Josm off line, come salvare la visione aerea

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

2018-02-23 10:40 GMT+01:00 Cascafico Giovanni :

> Ciao,
> presumo tu sia su windows.
>
> Le immagini di Bing e Mapbox mi sembra siano gestite come TMS (tile map
> service), cioè sono composte di tanti tasselli  il cui nome è  zoom>__.png
>
> Cerca dov'è la cartella che li contiene andando in impostazioni JOSM,
> accendi la casella "modalità avanzata", clicca la chiave inglese in basso e
> cerca "imagery.tms".
> Troverai qualcosa di simile a:
> C:\Users\nomeutente\appData\Local\Temp\JMapViewerTiles_nomeutente
>
> Quando sei online, la cartella si riempie di taselli mano a mano che di
> sposti ed ingrandisci. Prova a rimepire un po' questa cache, ricordandoti
> di zoommare nelle zone di cui hai bisogno di dettaglio.
>
> Quando hai terminato, disabilita la rete, riavvia JOSM e prova a navigare
> nella stessa zona. A me le immagini restano visibili.
>
> Probabilmente quando hai cercato di rivederle, ti sei mosso a livelli di
> zoom che non avevi scaricato. Per facilitare la navigazione, sempre in
> impostazioni avanzate, cerca il parametro "imagery.tms.default_autozoom"...
> dovrebbe essere "true" cambialo in "false".
>



a parte che sono d'accordo con Francesco Pelullo, è rischioso lavorare
offline (ovviamente, meno tempo passa fino al caricamento su OSM, meno
rischioso è), le ortofoto dovrebbero funzionare offline in JOSM. Per
ampiare la quantità delle foto temporaneamente salvati sul computer bisogna
ingrandire la cache. Si fa in preferenze -> tab WMS/TMS -> tab
"impostazioni" (settings in inglese). Lì puoi impostare la cartella da
salvare le tiles, ma anche quanto spazio (in MB) viene utilizzato. Se il
numero è troppo basso non ti salva tutte le tiles. In "contenuti del cache"
(cache contents) puoi anche verificare quanti tiles hai in locale, e di
quale mappa (e puoi cancellare la cache se vuoi).

Quando uso i WMS (esempio del PCN) tolgo "auto zoom" (opzione con click
destro sul livello del WMS in "livelli", non in impostazioni). Quando usi
il WMS del PCN bisogna impostare la cache a 0 perché è vietato il caching
(credo).

Ciao,
Martin
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Re: [Talk-it] risposta a dichiarazione uso di GoogleStreetView

[Cascafico Giovanni]

Il giorno 28 febbraio 2018 12:04, Martin Koppenhoefer <
dieterdre...@gmail.com> ha scritto:

> 2018-02-23 13:47 GMT+01:00 Cascafico Giovanni :
>
>>
>> Ora come ora, se un vandalo di OSM causa la morte di una persona perchè
>> ha cambiato il nome della via, nessuno lo perseguirà.
>>
>
> nessuno può causare la morte di qualcuno modificando dati di OSM. Se
> qualcuno muore a "causa" di un errore in OSM la colpa è comunque sempre
> fuori OSM, perché è chiaro che non puoi affidare la tua vita o quella degli
> altri ad un sistema del genere. Come un aeroplano deve utilizzare
> cartografie ufficiali, anche chi guida un ambulanza oppure spegne incendi
> deve conoscere il territorio a prescindere di OSM, e chi fa un escursione
> in montagna in zone che non conosce si deve informare non solo con dati
> OSM. Le nostre mappe sono spesso utili, ma non sostituiscono cartografie
> ufficiali e obblighi di cautela.
>

Ti porto un esempio limite, ma non credo di esagerare.

In FVG abbiamo importato da fonte ufficiale i numeri civici di gran parte
dei comuni. A Trieste abbiamo un vandalo che, tra le altre cose, modifica i
nome delle strade. Il 118 regionale usa un navigatore proprietario basato
su dati OSM (e che spero fuzioni meglio di Nominatim). Non mi solleva il
fatto che la responsabilità legale di qualche ritardo nelle emergenze non
sia di OSM.
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Re: [Talk-it] Di nuovo l'utente pasticcione

[Cascafico Giovanni]

Il giorno 28 febbraio 2018 11:18, Marco Ciampa  ha
scritto:

> > In generale, tutti questi blocchi si possono
> > agirare con un VPN, servirebbe a poco. Nulla ti impedisce poi a creare un
> > account nuovo per ogni changeset.
>
> Ok se uno è "sgamato" aggira facilmente tutti i blocchi ma ... è questo il
> caso?
> Accade normalmente?
>

Si, il pasticcione di Trieste inizialmente cambiava l'username, ma poi,
visto che lo scovavamo subito con l'userid, ha iniziato ad aprire altri
account.

Ancora: la miglior soluzione è un minimo di comunità (locale, regionale) e
l'uso di qualche analizzatore di changeset un po' più evoluto di quello
OSM. Messo insieme ad un feed reader che mandi una mail (o un messaggio in
un canale telegram apposito) su utenti sospetti od anche nuovi, credo possa
essere utile.
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Re: [Talk-it] risposta a dichiarazione uso di GoogleStreetView

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

2018-02-23 13:47 GMT+01:00 Cascafico Giovanni :

>
> Ora come ora, se un vandalo di OSM causa la morte di una persona perchè ha
> cambiato il nome della via, nessuno lo perseguirà.
>


nessuno può causare la morte di qualcuno modificando dati di OSM. Se
qualcuno muore a "causa" di un errore in OSM la colpa è comunque sempre
fuori OSM, perché è chiaro che non puoi affidare la tua vita o quella degli
altri ad un sistema del genere. Come un aeroplano deve utilizzare
cartografie ufficiali, anche chi guida un ambulanza oppure spegne incendi
deve conoscere il territorio a prescindere di OSM, e chi fa un escursione
in montagna in zone che non conosce si deve informare non solo con dati
OSM. Le nostre mappe sono spesso utili, ma non sostituiscono cartografie
ufficiali e obblighi di cautela.

Cerchiamo di non esagerare ;-)

Ciao,
Martin
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Re: [Talk-br] Fundar Associação OpenStreetMap Brasil

[Peter Krauss]

Ótimas colocações Sergio, algumas acredito que sejam consenso geral,
outras podemos até aproveitar na Wiki para descrever as *motivações*,
  "... o OSM precisa melhorar (...) se organizar mais".

Somos um coletivo querendo somar esforços:
 se a força de cada um é aplicada para um lado diferente, zera, não soma;
 se é aplicada numa mesma direção, aí sim vai somando...
na hora do esforço maior precisa haver consenso entre nós, só ações
coordenadas/organizadas é que somam de fato.
... E para gravar esse consenso em pedra e ir somando a construção de um
edifício sobre ele, é preciso criar uma entidade, um CNPJ do coletivo.


Antes de continuar, gostaria de sugerir que os resultados desta e de outras
discussões sejam "destilados" para a Wiki,
centralizando, ao lado da página que já criaram, as votações, os extratos
de discussão e os subsídios,
  https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:WikiProject_Brazil/Associação

Por exemplo, o debate sistematizado pelo Serge Wroclawski, aquilo que
concordamos ou discordamos das colocações dele,
podem ser postados por lá.
... Eu achei interessante, e gostaria de saber se por aqui na OSM-BR todos
concordam com ele, particularmente em duas colocações:

* Arquitetura: *"One of the most significant technical problems with OSM is
the lack of a review model"*;
   (Um dos problemas técnicos mais significativos com o OSM é a falta de um
modelo de revisão)
   (ou seja estabelecer um processo de homologação/revisão separando mapa
qualificado estável de mapa novo instável)

* Governança: *"... the answer is that sadly the keys to the OSM castle
largely do not lie in the hands of the OpenStreetMap Foundation, *
*   but instead in the hands of one or two individuals who act as
gatekeepers to the project's source code and infrastructure".*

parece que ele toca na ferida, e acredito que muitos já sentiram ela por
aqui, no OSM-BR.
Exemplo: precisar mendigar ferramentas essenciais aos nossos projetos (ex.
task-manager ) mostra
como falta descentralizar a gestão da infra.



2018-02-25 14:24 GMT-03:00 Jairo Duarte :

> Concordo plenamente com o Volk.
>
> Em dom, 2018-02-25 às 12:16 +, Sérgio V. escreveu:
>
> Acho que o foco da proposta presente, assim como da discussão na talk
> (https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk/2018-February/080161.html)
> não estão muito centrados em questão específica de governança, que é mais
> contingente. Também não me parece que seja tão geral uma preocupação
> internacional no OSM quanto a governança.
> É importante ter claro a diferença entre finalidades do OSM, melhorias,
> organização, etc; e governança.
> Esta última pode eventualmente ser no máximo um meio contingente para os
> fins do OSM.
>
> Pessoalmente não me parece bom muito acento em questão de governança, como
> se essa fosse a preocupação fundamental. Seria tomar o meio como se fosse
> fim.
> O fundamento do OSM, valores fundamentais em si, são a colaboratividade e
> a comunidade.
> E claro, o crescimento do mapeamento e melhoria, cobertura, dos dados.
> Não existe uso de dados se não houverem dados.
> Dados podem existir em si, mesmo sem uso (falando unicamente do ponto de
> vista físico); mas uso nunca pode existir sem dados.
>
> O que vem sendo discutido no talk internacional são os pontos em que o OSM
> precisa melhorar, crescer, difundir, e sugestões de algumas formas de
> evetnualmente se organizar mais, como meios para implementar seus objetivos
> (isto é, da comunidade).
> De modo geral, o OSM vem funcionando, se difundindo; comunidades vem se
> consolidando. Mas pode melhorar e avançar em muitos aspectos.
>
> A proposta de, de alguma forma, se organizar (qualquer figura jurídica que
> atenda às necessidades) do que entendo pretende ser prática.  Um meio
> para alcançar os objetivos em propósitos bem práticos, como possuir
> ferramentas e serviços próprios no OSM-BR, divulgação, integração da
> comunidade. O resto são meios para fins.
>
> Tendo em vista os fins do OSM, a princípio qualquer proposta que ajude a
> implementá-los, e por outro lado não esteja em contradição com o próprio
> espírito do OSM e não venha a dificultá-los, no meu ver é válida. A que
> seja mais fácil e simples.
>
>
> - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
>
> Sérgio - http://www.openstreetmap.org/user/smaprs
>
>
> --
> *De:* Peter Krauss 
> *Enviado:* domingo, 25 de fevereiro de 2018 06:36
> *Para:* OpenStreetMap no Brasil
> *Assunto:* Re: [Talk-br] Fundar Associação OpenStreetMap Brasil
>
> Oi gente, parece uma ótima iniciativa (!), que tal agendar *reuniões
> temáticas*?  (por voz, teleconferência Appear.in, Hangouts, etc. na Web)
> Temos *anos* de discussão e relativo consenso, acho que é o caso apenas
> de ir fechando cada tópico, começando pelas decisões mais simples e
> consensuais.
>
> *Obrigado* SergioAJV e Santamariense por estarem apresentando a proposta
> na Wiki
> 

Re: [Talk-de] Dt. Kartenstil: Rendern von historic=fort

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

Am 27. Februar 2018 um 20:57 schrieb Stefan Keller :

>
> Da sollten wir meines Erachtens ansetzen, denn Burgen (Schlösser?) und
> Ruinen prägen das Landschaftsbild sehr - egal auf welchem Kontinent
> und auch wenn es 10x weniger wären. Just my 2 cents.




Ich bin auch für das prominente Rendern von Burgen, Schlössern und
meinetwegen auch Herrenhäusern und ähnlichen adeligen Landsitzen und ggf.
auch Palästen in der Stadt, und auch für das prominente Rendern von
Burgruinen und ähnlichem, aber nur historic=ruins or building=ruins zu
betrachten ist zumindest hier zu wenig, es gibt zu viele verfallende Ställe
und andere Nebengebäude und kleinere Wohngebäude, die alle ebenfalls Ruinen
sind, aber das Landschaftsbild nicht oder kaum prägen. Da muss man auf
jeden Fall genauer hinsehen.

Gruß,
Martin
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[Diversity-talk] Code of Conduct & Moderation for this list

[Rory McCann]

Hi all,

To follow up on the phone call, and waiting a little bit for people to
join. 

I think this list should have a Code of Conduct. I propose something
like Geek Feminism's one. Thoughts?

http://geekfeminism.wikia.com/wiki/Community_anti-harassment/Policy

If/When anyone else volunteers to mod this list, I'll add them. Just
email me.

I'm new to running a mailman list, but I think if you email
diversity-talk-ow...@openstreetmap.org that will only go to the list
mods (and the emails aren't public). This can function as a private "mod
list", or report system.

There some moderation features with mailman (this software), everything
is still on the default settings (I think). Feel free to suggest
improvements.

Rory

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Re: [Talk-it] Di nuovo l'utente pasticcione

[Simone Saviolo]

Su Welcome non si potrebbe introdurre una ricerca geografica e per tempo?
Possibilmente con un feed RSS.

Immagino sia open source: dov'è il codice?

Ciao,

Simone
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Re: [Talk-it] Di nuovo l'utente pasticcione

[Marco Ciampa]

On Wed, Feb 28, 2018 at 10:25:38AM +0100, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote:
> 2018-02-28 8:47 GMT+01:00 Marco Ciampa :
> 
> > Ma al 99% no perché il router (piccolo ufficio/casa) farà NAT (Network
> > Address Translation) perciò vedrà l'IP del router associato al MAC del
> > router. Poi il router associerà quella connessione (associazione
> > temporale di mac+ip+porta) alla connessione ad un ip interno, e inotrerà
> > la connessione.
> 
> non c'è bisogno di NAT se usi IPv6 (non è ancora molto diffuso tra gli
> utenti "home" italiani). In generale, tutti questi blocchi si possono
> agirare con un VPN, servirebbe a poco. Nulla ti impedisce poi a creare un
> account nuovo per ogni changeset.

Ok se uno è "sgamato" aggira facilmente tutti i blocchi ma ... è questo il caso?
Accade normalmente?

non credo...

--


Marco Ciampa

I know a joke about UDP, but you might not get it.



 GNU/Linux User #78271
 FSFE fellow #364




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Re: [Talk-it] Di nuovo l'utente pasticcione

[Andreas Lattmann]

Questo strumento [1] lo conosco ed anch' io ho salutato i nuovi arrivati. Qui 
si sta parlando di strumenti per segnalare chi fa disastri e non risponde ai 
commenti al changeset ed ai messaggi.  
[OT] Welcome OpenStreetMap è molto bello ma se mi perdo il segnalibro nel 
browser dove recupero l' indirizzo? E questo vale per la miriade di tools a 
disposizione  [/OT]

[1] http://welcome.openstreetmap.it

Andreas Lattmann
-- 
Inviato dal mio dispositivo Android con K-9 Mail. Perdonate la brevità. 

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Re: [Talk-it] [Imports] Fwd: Re: Sabbioneta buildings import

[Andrea Musuruane]

Hi Giorgio,

On Mon, Feb 26, 2018 at 9:06 AM, Giorgio Limonta <
giorgio.limont...@gmail.com> wrote:

> * A bell tower has one tag "man_made:part=tower" which is not documented.
>> You should use two building:part tags.
>
> * You should also add building=yes to bell towers.
>
>
> done thanks
>

You removed the building:part tags. It's fine for me but you had the data
about them.

* There is one building with only one building:part=residential tag (there
>> should be more than one).
>> * In this same building the entrance part of the house is tagged as a
>> separate building.
>>
>
The building outline (the one with the building tag) is now fine. But one
of the building:part - the one with another building part inside - must be
a multi polygon.

This problem is also present in Chiesa della Beata Vergine: one of the
building:part must be a multi polygon and not an area because it has
another building:part inside.


> *The previous example is not the only one where a part of a single
>> building is tagged as different building.
>
>
> I made a general check of all the buildings, please review them.
>

Looking with sat images it seems you forgot (I maybe wrong because I can't
see original data and I cannot verify on site):
-50470 (the first building on the left in Via San Remigio, going into
Sabbioneta)

Bye,

Andrea
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Re: [Talk-it] Why OpenStreetMap is in Serious Trouble

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

2018-02-28 10:22 GMT+01:00 Lorenzo "Beba" Beltrami :

> Lo fa già Mapbox.
>>
>
> Cioè Mapbox nei suoi prodotti mette a disposizione una copia modificata
> ("verificata" da loro) di OSM?
>



infatti, sono sempre vecchi ;-)

Ciao,
Martin
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Re: [Talk-it] Di nuovo l'utente pasticcione

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

2018-02-28 8:47 GMT+01:00 Marco Ciampa :

> Ma al 99% no perché il router (piccolo ufficio/casa) farà NAT (Network
> Address Translation) perciò vedrà l'IP del router associato al MAC del
> router. Poi il router associerà quella connessione (associazione
> temporale di mac+ip+porta) alla connessione ad un ip interno, e inotrerà
> la connessione.




non c'è bisogno di NAT se usi IPv6 (non è ancora molto diffuso tra gli
utenti "home" italiani). In generale, tutti questi blocchi si possono
agirare con un VPN, servirebbe a poco. Nulla ti impedisce poi a creare un
account nuovo per ogni changeset.

Ciao,
Martin
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Re: [Talk-it] Why OpenStreetMap is in Serious Trouble

[Stefano]

Il giorno 28 febbraio 2018 08:59, Lorenzo "Beba" Beltrami <
lorenzo.b...@gmail.com> ha scritto:

> Un altro sistema (indubbiamente complesso) per non perdere l'immediatezza
> delle modifiche potrebbe essere quello di avere due DB: uno "edge" che
> funziona come quello attuale (tutti possono contribuire e le modifiche sono
> immediate) e uno "stable" frutto della moderazione degli utenti più esperti.
> Starà poi al data consumer scegliere: dati aggiornati al volo, ma meno
> precisi, oppure dati più vecchi, ma moderati dagli utenti più esperti.
> È più complesso da gestire perché c'è il problema del workflow di
> approvazione delle modifiche (e tutto quello che ne consegue, di cui si è
> già ampiamente scritto).
>

Lo fa già Mapbox.


>
> In ogni caso, come detto da tanti, sarebbe utile un sistema di "livelli"
> degli utenti: più sei esperto più ti vengono attribuiti permessi. Ad
> esempio il permesso di pubblicare immediatamente le tue modifiche o di
> moderare gli altri...
> Del resto, come ogni progetto, si parte in piccolo con le cose semplici e,
> man mano che si cresce, ci si evolve adottando soluzioni complesse per
> gestire situazioni complesse.
>
> Lorenzo
>
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Re: [Talk-it] Why OpenStreetMap is in Serious Trouble

[Alessandro Palmas]

Il 28/02/2018 08:59, Lorenzo "Beba" Beltrami ha scritto:
Un altro sistema (indubbiamente complesso) per non perdere 
l'immediatezza delle modifiche potrebbe essere quello di avere due DB: 
uno "edge" che funziona come quello attuale (tutti possono contribuire e 
le modifiche sono immediate) e uno "stable" frutto della moderazione 
degli utenti più esperti.



Quindi quasi raddoppiare le risorse hardware e impegnarsi a verificare 
TUTTI i contributi? :-O
Perchè se è "stable" lo deve essere al 100%, non potremmo dire "un pò 
più stable dell'edge"


Alessandro

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Re: [Talk-it] Di nuovo l'utente pasticcione

[Alessandro]

Il 28/02/2018 08:43, Stefano ha scritto:



On 28 Feb 2018 7:36 am, "Andreas Lattmann" > wrote:


 >> Se non si è ancora capito a me piacerebbe avere un "foglio excel"
 >pubblico
 >> in cui ognuno di noi aggiunge i mappatori sospetti che nota
nella sua
 >zona


Nessuno pensa ai tool che già esistono :(

http://welcome.openstreetmap.it



Abbiamo già degli strumenti che altri volontari hanno sviluppato e non 
vengono usati (io negli ultimi due mesi non sono proprio riuscito a 
seguirlo).


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Re: [Talk-it] Why OpenStreetMap is in Serious Trouble

[Lorenzo "Beba" Beltrami]

Un altro sistema (indubbiamente complesso) per non perdere l'immediatezza
delle modifiche potrebbe essere quello di avere due DB: uno "edge" che
funziona come quello attuale (tutti possono contribuire e le modifiche sono
immediate) e uno "stable" frutto della moderazione degli utenti più esperti.
Starà poi al data consumer scegliere: dati aggiornati al volo, ma meno
precisi, oppure dati più vecchi, ma moderati dagli utenti più esperti.
È più complesso da gestire perché c'è il problema del workflow di
approvazione delle modifiche (e tutto quello che ne consegue, di cui si è
già ampiamente scritto).

In ogni caso, come detto da tanti, sarebbe utile un sistema di "livelli"
degli utenti: più sei esperto più ti vengono attribuiti permessi. Ad
esempio il permesso di pubblicare immediatamente le tue modifiche o di
moderare gli altri...
Del resto, come ogni progetto, si parte in piccolo con le cose semplici e,
man mano che si cresce, ci si evolve adottando soluzioni complesse per
gestire situazioni complesse.

Lorenzo
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