RE: Font Rendering Question
> The attached image shows my message content pane in > TheBat! (v5.3.8.2) beside the output window from > Microsoft Visual Studio 2010. Both programs are > configured to use black text on a white background > using the Consolas font at 12 points (not bold, italic > or otherwise off-normal.) > > I'm curious why the font does not look the same in > TheBat! and VS2010. For example, the forward slash > characters in TheBat! are a bit thinner and many of > the characters rendered in TB have inconsistent stroke > widths. > > I think it would be nice if fonts in TheBat! rendered > the same as they do in other applications, but until > that happens (if it ever happens,) can anyone explain > WHY TheBat! is rendering the fonts differently? It's probably using an older API which doesn't support ClearType or *newer* version of ClearType. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.3.8.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: Source View: Message-ID sometimes to colored correctly
> >> Hello Vilius,
> >> >> Message-ID: >> >> 1352796933847@3capp-webde-bs49>
> >>
> >> > That's because it is invalid ID. It doesn't conform to RFC822
> >> > specification.
> >>
> >> You probably wouldn't volunteer to elaborate as to exactly what is wrong
> >> with it right away
> >> without being asked explicitly? :)
>
> > Message-ID should follow a subset of email specification, e.i. it
> > must contain @ and FQDN parts. And this ID obviously doesn't.
>
> FQDN usage isn't required but recommended.
> (in both http://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc2822#section-3.6.4 and the
> newer http://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc5322#section-3.6.4).
> Ritlabs folk might've not paid attention to such tiny details though.
It probably comes from older RFC822 which says that Message-ID is addr-spec
surrounded by <>.
An addr-spec is a specific Internet identifier that contains a
locally interpreted string followed by the at-sign character ("@",
ASCII value 64) followed by an Internet domain. The locally
interpreted string is either a quoted-string or a dot-atom. If the
string can be represented as a dot-atom (that is, it contains no
characters other than atext characters or "." surrounded by atext
addr-spec = local-part "@" domain
Current beta is 5.3.2.9 | 'Using TBBETA' information:
http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: Source View: Message-ID sometimes to colored correctly
> Hello Vilius, > >> Message-ID: >> 1352796933847@3capp-webde-bs49> > > > That's because it is invalid ID. It doesn't conform to RFC822 specification. > > You probably wouldn't volunteer to elaborate as to exactly what is wrong > with it right away > without being asked explicitly? :) Message-ID should follow a subset of email specification, e.i. it must contain @ and FQDN parts. And this ID obviously doesn't. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.3.2.9 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: Source View: Message-ID sometimes to colored correctly
> Hello mse, > > m> since Version 5.3.2.2 it is possible to assign a special color to the > m> contents (address) of the Message-ID-header. > m> However, it seems that sometimes this header is not correctly recognized > m> and thus colored in the assigned color. > > m> These are examples of Message-IDs that are not colored in the special > m> color: > > m> Message-ID: > > m> Message-ID: > m> x...@mail.gmail.com> > m> Message-ID: <41.7F.10257.945A8284@dc1bhmta01> > > This message-ID isn't recognized as well. It's a mail directly received via a > very > popular > German mail-provider (web.de) > > Message-ID: 1352796933847@3capp-webde-bs49> That's because it is invalid ID. It doesn't conform to RFC822 specification. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.3.2.9 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.3.2.5 / MIME forwarding messages as .eml files
>>How in the world is it "potentially dangerous"? > No idea, but MANY servers will bounce them if attached. MSG files go through I'm using MIME forwarding for more than 10 years now and I yet to find at least one server which bounces EML messages. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.3.2.5 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: IMAP not emptying Folders?
> > Rick rašė: > > >> I have a Gmail IMAP account. I will clear out the SPAM and TRASH > >> folders so there is nothing left, yet if I go to the account with > >> the web interface, there are a LOT of items left > > >> I have tried emptying these folders both with CONTROL DEL on the > >> folder and by highlighting all the messages and deleting them > > >> Any ideas? > > > This bug exist since version 5.0 alpha or so. > > > You have to use Compact instead of Purge/Purge+Compact, then it works. > > Has this been entered into bug tracker (lately) I couldn't find it. I will > put it in > if you want but it was YOUR fix that saved the day Do as you like. But then again, I see no point in that, IMAP bugs are never fixed anyway. I stopped reporting those after all bug tracker database was lost, which one would argue is the second most serious disaster in development after the source code loss. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.1.6.15 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: IMAP not emptying Folders?
Rick rašė: I have a Gmail IMAP account. I will clear out the SPAM and TRASH folders so there is nothing left, yet if I go to the account with the web interface, there are a LOT of items left I have tried emptying these folders both with CONTROL DEL on the folder and by highlighting all the messages and deleting them Any ideas? This bug exist since version 5.0 alpha or so. You have to use Compact instead of Purge/Purge+Compact, then it works. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.1.6.15 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Filters working in v5?
Sveiki, Saturday, June 16, 2012, 6:34:39 PM, you wrote: > Hello Dwight, > Saturday, June 16, 2012, 6:03:22 PM, you wrote: >>> Another problem with IMAP is that the messages have to actually be >>> kept on the server. DC>> that's not the problem with IMAP, it's the beauty of IMAP. It's the DC>> whole point. > This also goes into another philosophy: Do we want to keep our own > data or do we want to put all our eggs in one cloud whose keepers we > have to trust. The mods will slap us soon for off-topic discussions. Even if using POP, how would you know if mail server admin doesn't forward all your messages internally to his account? If you cannot trust your mail provider it doesn't matter if it's IMAP or POP. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.1.6.4 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Filters working in v5?
Sveiki, Saturday, June 16, 2012, 6:32:12 PM, you wrote: > Hello Vilius, > Saturday, June 16, 2012, 1:26:23 PM, you wrote: >>> Another problem with IMAP is that the messages have to actually be >>> kept on the server. I keep 14 days worth of mail on the server, older >>> mails are on my laptop and my PC. If I keep more than say, 2,000 or >>> 3,000 messages on the server, download becomes very slow, so I try to >>> limit the number of messages. VŠ>> This is a bug in your IMAP server or in your IMAP client. It doesn't VŠ>> matter how many messages you have on the server. Good written client VŠ>> always downloads only new messages. I have more than 125000 messages VŠ>> and it works in a matter of half a second. > Actually, the slow server is a POP server. "Checking for new messages" > takes so long, and that's not only with TB! but also with other > clients, and with all servers I have used. If that does not apply to > IMAP, it's my mistake. Does IMAP not need to check for new messages? It depends how you have configured IMAP client, but usually the client asks the server: "What new messages do you have since I last time checked?" The server responds with something like this: "I have 25 new messages with IDs 150,151,152,etc." The client then downloads message *headers* to list them in the mailbox on the client. After the the user can decide which messages he needs and download manually a whole message. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.1.6.4 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Filters working in v5?
Sveiki, Saturday, June 16, 2012, 8:05:18 AM, you wrote: > Hello Scuddy, > Friday, June 15, 2012, 9:49:07 PM, you wrote: TF>>> With IMAP I have only the headers on the computer. I want to open a TF>>> mail and the attachments, it takes ages which I have to spend in front TF>>> of the computer. smn>> Why not set it to download everything and then you have the best of both worlds. > Then I would have IMAP emulating POP... > Another problem with IMAP is that the messages have to actually be > kept on the server. I keep 14 days worth of mail on the server, older > mails are on my laptop and my PC. If I keep more than say, 2,000 or > 3,000 messages on the server, download becomes very slow, so I try to > limit the number of messages. This is a bug in your IMAP server or in your IMAP client. It doesn't matter how many messages you have on the server. Good written client always downloads only new messages. I have more than 125000 messages and it works in a matter of half a second. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.1.6.4 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: Improving IMAP speed
> Dear Dwight, > > --->>> Dwight Corrin / Wednesday Wed 09. May 2012, 10:05 PM > Improving IMAP speed > > > >> I'm not sure what Dwight pointer was meant for but that looked like a > >> setting on the server that would automatically delete after 40 days. > > > my point was that there may be a way to manage old messages at the > > provider level. This would, of course, vary from provider to provider. > > Dwight, I think gMail does not offer this ability. At least I haven't > found such options. The slowliness you are experiencing is not the amount of messages, it's the amount of folders. Almost every IMAP client by default polls all folders. This is hard on the client. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.1.4.0 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: Filters working in v5?
> On Wednesday, May 2, 2012, 9:28:57 PM, Thomas Fernandez wrote: > > > > Just picking this post to throw in another argument for POP you guys > > may not be aware of: Slow internet connection. > > so is it faster when you download same data with POP than with IMAP? > And will you be switching to POP for your phone? IMAP will be faster because you can specify which parts you can download. Headers, text part, html part, attachments, etc. And then later manually initiate full download only on specific messages. This especially useful for server-side Sent Mail folder, where you only sometimes need a full message. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.1.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Filters working in v5?
Sveiki, Tuesday, May 1, 2012, 6:37:48 PM, you wrote: > 5/1/2012 11:36 AM > Hi Tony, > On 5/1/2012 Tony Hoare wrote: >>> IMO IMAP is the only driving force for v5. IMAP is not a part of my >>> future for reasons of security that cannot be overcome with IMAP. TH>> What security issues do you see in IMAP? > The message base is not local. If an attacker is in possesion of mail server it doesn't matter if it's IMAP or POP. He will still be able to read your new email. IMAP is just a protocol to get email from the server. It is no more or less secure than POP. Using POP3 and thinking that you are somehow more secure is completely ridicilous idea. If you need a security encrypt your email base (be it local or on the server). Most of the modern email server can do that. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.1.2.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Outlook to TB -- IMAP to POP
Eddie <50minco...@gmail.com> rašė: Dear all, That was a big task and ended happily :) Let me tell you what I wanted/needed to achieve and how it was done. I am sure this will be useful for others who are looking for the same to be achieved. Sorry if this a bit lengthy. -- Outlook to TB! -- That was the main goal we wanted to fulfill. The client had an initial wish that could not be solved with Outlook. After installing TB! I only configured it as IMAP as the POP mail base was not yet transferred to TB!. Step One was to convert the PSD file into a more common file format where all, including Arabic Characters and Attachments, are properly converted. The first progi I tried was "Outlook Export Wizard". The result was not very promising and my AVIRA always complained the EXE being a Troyan. Then I tried "Aid4Mails". First I wanted to locally convert and store the eMails. But that I kind of was unsuccessful. I must mention that the user had 1'200 Folders and 13'000 eMails in the 3,5 GB PSD file. So I had to take care that the folder structure was maintained and all eMails would go into them. When the local conversion failed I tried as a last step the IMAP upload. Prior to that there was a suggestion on the TB!beta list to do so. The upload was successful but it took me 30 hr for that task. Now I had on gMail server the full Folder Structure including all eMails in them. A request by the user was that he wanted all eMails locally stored (POP) as he had it with Outlook. Further he is constantly working on 2-3 different computers. In the past we faced the problem that he maintained 3 different eMail bases and had great difficulties finding his eMails. Based on that experience and requirements I decided to setup his main computer as POP and all other as IMAP. Because of that I now was in need to be able in downloading all eMails from gMail server to the local HD and preserving folder structure. With your help I found "IMAPsize". That's a cool little app that access your eMail server and makes a copy as is to your local HD. BTW - 5 GB took me about 16 hr. This was an easy step to go for. The last mile proved to be the most challenging. With the help of IMAPsize all eMails where in each folder stored as .EML file. Now how to get those converted into TB! TBB/TBN files? After longer searching and discussing it was Raymund from this list who kindly helped me in writing a little program - "IMAPsize2TB!" (nice would be "eml2TB!") - that could do exactly this. We needed a bit time to adjust but at the end of the day it was ready to be used. So I was set to run the life task and configure my clients TB!. Today I finished the task. I haven't lost any eMail. A note on POP vs IMAP. I know we could discuss ages on If and Yes POP should be used vs IMAP or If you use IMAP if it makes sense using POP to. Very personally I like to have my eMails locally stored as you never know of once day you may not have Internet and you still want to search and prepare eMails. Most of all it was the wish of the user that he wants (like under Outlook) to have all his eMails locally stored. But on the other hand, we all wanted to avoid the mess of some years before in maintaining different eMail bases. Thanks to all of you and thanks Raymund for eml2TB :) for all the support in this project. I don't want to offend you or anything. But that sound like complete waste of time for the purpose of not knowing how really IMAP works. And for the sake of thinking what could client think that he too really doesn't understand how IMAP works. As pointed multiple times on the list, IMAP can be and is used offline, including search and all other functionality. The whole operation I could have done: 1) Reorganize overcomplicated 1200 folder system into 10-20 folders in Outlook which needs work anyway. 2) Export/import messages from Outlook to Gmail account using some 3rd party program. It can be any program which exports mail folder by folder. 3) Connect TB! to IMAP account and set it to fully synchronize every message including attachments (on all computers). 4) Train the client. Done. Should have taken ~2-3 hours not including 1200 folder reorganization. However reorganization should be done by the client anyway as only he know the structure email currently is. -- Best Regards, Vilius Šumskas LNK TV IT manager mob.: +370 614 75713 http://www.lnk.lt Current beta is 5.1.0.3 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: [second try] IMAP - how to permanently store eMail local
He does. POP you can work with it even without Internet. With IMAP you must have a connection. No, you don't. IMAP can be fully used offline. I forgot to tell you one experience I have made with this/his 3,5 GB eMail structure. I had to change the Top Level Folder Name. After doing so, the TB! IMAP account had to re-read all the folders again as it has lost it's focus. And that process has taken it's time (about 1hr). Just imagine if this happens in a bad time - he would hang me probably ;) That's a pure limitation of TB! as an IMAP client. I risk starting a flame war here, but if you really need to migrate to IMAP I would suggest another email client. Putting that aside your client does it wrong. Nobody ever should have 1200 folders, both in email and on disk. Folders just help you sort email by general category. If your client wants to sort email by client then there is a search functionality for that. I am trying to play save and let him use POP on his main Computer and all others are running under IMAP: You are shooting yourself in the foot here. Combination of POP/IMAP just won't work and have a lot of drawbacks. Both on technical level and from a user perspective. -- Best Regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.1.0.3 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: [second try] IMAP - how to permanently store eMail local
> >> Not me. It's my clients computer and he wants it this way. Same as we > >> discussed with Tony, I have to create alternatives when clients have a > >> not so optimal idea and insist on it. > > > As far as I understand your client just wants a whole copy of email > > base cached locally. This is fully achieved by using IMAP and > > "Download All" setting. > > Correct. He feels very comfortable like this. I know him, he is very > accurate and special in filing his Information. Also the paper work he > handles the same. > > > > In fact the client won't even understand if it's a POP or IMAP > > account. > > He does. POP you can work with it even without Internet. With IMAP you > must have a connection. No, you don't. IMAP can be fully used offline. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.1.0.3 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: [second try] IMAP - how to permanently store eMail local
> >> See also my post > > > Why do you need a folder structure? > > Not me. It's my clients computer and he wants it this way. Same as we > discussed with Tony, I have to create alternatives when clients have a > not so optimal idea and insist on it. As far as I understand your client just wants a whole copy of email base cached locally. This is fully achieved by using IMAP and "Download All" setting. In fact the client won't even understand if it's a POP or IMAP account. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.1.0.3 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: [second try] IMAP - how to permanently store eMail local
-- Using aid4mails I uploaded all the eMails successfully on an IMAP account. I see the folders properly and ALL eMails. Now I want this exactly on the local HD. TB!'s IMAP local cache IS permanent. Just set it to always download all emails. Yes Vilius, but they are not in a clear Folder Structure. I then may have to go through each file look up in TB! IMAP to which folder it is associated and then move the file. Very time consuming. See also my post Why do you need a folder structure? -- Vilius Current beta is 5.1.0.3 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: [second try] IMAP - how to permanently store eMail local
Hi, Eddie <50minco...@gmail.com> rašė: -- Using aid4mails I uploaded all the eMails successfully on an IMAP account. I see the folders properly and ALL eMails. Now I want this exactly on the local HD. TB!'s IMAP local cache IS permanent. Just set it to always download all emails. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.1.0.3 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.1.0.3
Hi, Tony Hoare rašė: Hello Vilius, I don't use The Bat! anymore so I cannot test. What do you use now? Webmail and Outlook 2010 mostly. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.1.0.3 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.1.0.3
Hi, Mark Partous raše: Hello Vilius, Tuesday, April 17, 2012, 11:11:37 PM, you wrote: VŠ> If system HTML viewer is choosen TB! 5.1 uses mshtml.dll to render VŠ> HTML *inline* in internal TB! window. This doesn't affect email links, VŠ> message.html files, all other *.html attached files which are still VŠ> opened with default system browser. It depends on the message. I have made a little screencast (1,64 MB) to prove it. But perhaps I can forward you a message in which, when clicking on "Consultez le nouveau guide d'acceuil en ligne", the site of the bureau of Tourism of Châtelaillon-Plage is opened in IE, when the system HTML viewer is chosen and is opened in the default browser when the TB-viewer is chosen??? This way we can see wether it is a local problem or not. I don't use The Bat! anymore so I cannot test. -- Best Regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.1.0.3 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.1.0.3
Mark Partous rašė: Hello Rick, Tuesday, April 17, 2012, 10:16:56 PM, you wrote: R> I think I am missing something. I changed from using the IE defaults to the Bat's defaults just to see the effects R> and so far - nothing. HTML is rendering fine in the preview window and launches IE if I launch the message.html file. What should I be looking for? I think we are talking about different things. If you have chosen to use the IE HTML viewer and you click on a link within a mail, the internet-page is opened in IE. If you have chosen to use the TB!-viewer and you click on a link within a message, the internet-page is opened in your default browser (possibly IE of course, but not the case here). As far as the control (TB! or IE) is concerned: there seems to be something wrong, but I will try that out after restarting TB! As Ritlabs staff seems was reduced to one and testers were left in the dark here is how the things work. IE comes in two parts, 1) IE browser (IExplorer.exe) and IE platform (WebBrowser Control which can be used in Delphi, C++ and other programming languages or simply mshtml.dll). If system HTML viewer is choosen TB! 5.1 uses mshtml.dll to render HTML *inline* in internal TB! window. This doesn't affect email links, message.html files, all other *.html attached files which are still opened with default system browser. -- Best Regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.1.0.3 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Testing IMAP
Sveiki, Monday, January 30, 2012, 11:29:15 PM, you wrote: > Hello Tbbeta, > Ok here should be the solution to One problem that nags me since very > long. Let me explain: > Sure you remember that my postings send from TB! using POP did not > reach this list. So what I had to do is to send eMails from the > Browser. I didn't like it as I had to manually set (under Settings) > the reply-to address. That was very time consuming and if I forgot to > remove it when writing to someone else, then this list should have > received the answer. Of course it didn't as an error was returned to > the sender. > So the idea now is to have this account as IMAP (currently parallel > with the old POP) and I want to see if I can write to the list. I > suppose this works as I am - like using the browser - accessing and > sending eMails directly at gMail. Why have I not thought of this > solution earlier! > Using IMAP allows me now to insert the reply-to very easy and I > presume with Macro too. > Anyway, if this post arrives to the list please reply as to confirm > the arrival. Thank you. Nor IMAP, nor POP have anything to do with how email is sent. The error is returned by your SMTP server. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.30.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: My first IMAP4 account
Sveiki, Sunday, January 15, 2012, 11:20:06 PM, you wrote: > Dear Vilius, > --->>> Vilius Šumskas / Saturday 14. Jan 2012, 10:44:23 > My first IMAP4 account >> Neither plain IMAP port 143, nor IMAP SSL 993 is available on >> pop.orange.jo. > BTW I get the following ERROR within One setting. Any Idea? > ',- [ ] > '| 1/15/2012, 23:16:46: SEND - sending mail message(s) - 3 message(s) in > queue > '| 1/15/2012, 23:16:46: SEND - Connecting to SMTP server > smtpauth.orange.jo on port 587 > '| !1/15/2012, 23:16:47: SEND - Server reports error. The response > is: 5.5.1 command unrecognized > '| !1/15/2012, 23:16:47: SEND - Server reports it is not ready, > reply: "5.5.1 command unrecognized" > '| 1/15/2012, 23:16:47: SEND - connection finished - 0 message(s) sent > '| 1/15/2012, 23:16:47: SEND - Some messages were not sent - check You should really check these SMTP settings with Orange.jo support. When connecting from one server I get: "220 mwinf5d34 ME ESMTP server ready" but from the other: "421 mwinf5d27 ME Service refuse. Veuillez essayer plus tard. Service refused, please try later. NPE304_106 [106]" So it could be some kind of security protection. As for IMAP synchronization, it is called "Message download preferences" under "IMAP Fine-Tune" in The Bat!. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.30.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: My first IMAP4 account
Sveiki, Saturday, January 14, 2012, 2:26:30 PM, you wrote: > Dear Vilius, > --->>> Vilius Šumskas / Saturday 14. Jan 2012, 10:54:35 > My first IMAP4 account >>> I must mention that this account is already accessed through POP >>> using Outlook (hopefully I can convince my client to change to >>> TB!). The idea on this second Computer is, that he is accessing his >>> eMail using IMAP4 when traveling and that the eMail is still >>> available from the first computer. >> You must switch all clients to IMAP then. One POP and one IMAP just >> won't work realiably. The whole point of IMAP is to make email >> accessable on all clients all the time. > The reason for using POP on One computer (the main computer) and IMAP > on others is to have all eMails stored on the Main Computer so he can > also read and prepare eMails offline. The email *is* available on IMAP in offline mode too. Just set full synchronization on all folder and the email will be available on local client all the time, and syncronize when you are online. Just like POP does. > When I look at the gMail settings I can have POP and IMAP simultaneous > activated. THis is also what I do on my side. Usually I have all on > POP but my e72 Nokia access One account using IMAP. I suppose you are using "Leave message on the server" in case of POP. Else you would see serious inconsecienses in the email on different clients. Anyway, as said above there is no point to using POP instead of IMAP anymore. The only reason why POP was invented is because old slow modem connections could not handle amount of data required for IMAP. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.30.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: My first IMAP4 account
Eddie <50minco...@gmail.com> rašė: I must mention that this account is already accessed through POP using Outlook (hopefully I can convince my client to change to TB!). The idea on this second Computer is, that he is accessing his eMail using IMAP4 when traveling and that the eMail is still available from the first computer. You must switch all clients to IMAP then. One POP and one IMAP just won't work realiably. The whole point of IMAP is to make email accessable on all clients all the time. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.30.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: My first IMAP4 account
Eddie <50minco...@gmail.com> rašė: Dear Scuddy, --->>> scu...@mymts.net / Saturday 14. Jan 2012, 00:20:11 My first IMAP4 account E>> Question: E>> [1] could it be, that it's not possible to access that account with E>> POP and IMAP? E>> [2] Are my settings so far correct? E>> [3] Any suggestions on how to fine Tune my settings? I just did a quick search on the orange.jo site and I do not come up with any results for IMAP, so it may not be supported by orange. I presume you refer to the send and receive prefix. What "should" be used under IMAP instead of POP and SMTP? Neither plain IMAP port 143, nor IMAP SSL 993 is available on pop.orange.jo. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.30.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: IMAP on the Nokia e72
Sveiki, Sunday, December 25, 2011, 4:54:03 PM, you wrote: > -- Advanced MailboxSettings: > -- Port=993 > -- Secure Connection=No Port 993 usually means SSL connection, but you have configured plaintext. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.26.19 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: [SOT] Beta/alpha version question
Sveiki, Thursday, December 8, 2011, 6:49:13 PM, you wrote: > On Thursday, December 8, 2011, 8:22:16 AM, Jernej Simončič wrote: > >> The thing that bothers me most in the current versions is that >> selecting messages with keyboard is broken - when I'm going through >> the usual morning messages, using Shift+Down TB will often move the >> selection start somewhere way above the first message that was >> selected. > I find it constantly annoying that when moving to another folder > using control and the right arrow key, it is the second unread > message, not the first, where I land in the next folder. The same happens when deleting email. I constantly get 3 messages disappear intead of 2 when deleting 2. However one message reappears after switching to another folder. But nobody seems to care for years. So I don't report bugs anymore. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.26.17 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: IMAP and features
> > Again, if you are viewing your email on the computer which doesn't > > belong to you, you cannot guarantee it isn't read in any case. Even > > if your email is encoded, some rogue program can "grab" or "record" > > every window you open. Including the window content. > > Of course. > > The point is: After I turn in the machine (e.g. for a leasing > exchange) I don't want to leave anything on the machine. I can > "cancel" the saved login data by changing the password, but I can't > "remote-remove" the cache files once the machine is out of my direct > control. Yes you can. Clear the cache in Folder options for every folder. Or just delete account completely. > > > This is guarantied by IMAP protocol [...] > > If you are seeing incosistencies between your webmail account and > > your desktop email client, then your client or IMAP server is > > terribly broken. > > Yes, I agree. But TheBat doesn't. And as long as it doesn't, from time > to time I need "direct server access" to check something or perform > maintenance. For that I use either webmail access, Thunderbird or > IMAPsize, all of which can do the task. But TheBat can't. I agree. But the root cause of this is a poor handling of IMAP on The Bat! side. My point was: why waste time introducing feature you are suggesting instead of fixing current bugs which should solve this problem? -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.26.11 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: IMAP and features
> >> But when I close the browser, the cache is (if so configured) cleared. On > >> the next start, the cache is completely blank. > > As others pointed out. This doesn't make sence for email much. > > I think it indeed may: > > - On a computer that doesn't belong to me, and which is not under my > permanent control (such as a work place machine), I don't wish to > occupy unnecessary disk space, nor do I want to leave a cache-copy of > mail there. If I no longer have access to that machine, I could change > the access passwords to the account, and all the data still stored on > the machine in question would become useless. If there is still a > cache of mail there, this isn't the case. Encryption is a solution > here, but the disk-space issue still persists. (Many companies have a > no-foreign-bytes-on-company-machines policy, and the less you install, > the better.) Again, if you are viewing your email on the computer which doesn't belong to you, you cannot guarantee it isn't read in any case. Even if your email is encoded, some rogue program can "grab" or "record" every window you open. Including the window content. As for simple protection, if you are using internet caffee computer and you insist using dekstop email application instead of email, just clear the cache when you leave. There is already such functionality in The Bat! > - There is a technical use for that: If the client guaranties to store > nothing locally, what I see is the current state on the server. If I > see a folder, it is guaranteed to be at the server at this very > moment. If I see it as empty, it really is empty. All this is not the > case with TheBat at this time: TheBat stores and displays folders and > messages that are no longer there all the time. Also, it occasionally > does NOT display messages that ARE there, which may have a number of > root causes - in most of which caching can be a factor, for which > reason I'd like to take it out of the equation in certain situations. This is guarantied by IMAP protocol (at least on normal not paranoid level :)). In fact this is the whole point of IMAP. If you are seeing incosistencies between your webmail account and your desktop email client, then your client or IMAP server is terribly broken. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.26.11 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: IMAP and features
> Hi Vilius, > > > >> 3.) A feature question: Is it possible to disable the IMAP cache > >> completly? The goal would be a small-footprint client [...] > > This is not possible. Think of it as a WWW browser. You cannot > > display content on screen if it is not on local disk. > > But when I close the browser, the cache is (if so configured) cleared. On > the next start, the cache is completely blank. As others pointed out. This doesn't make sence for email much. In terms of used space, even smallest USB thumb drives have enough capacity to handle large amounts of emails. And in terms of security, if needed, you should be using proper USB/HDD disk encryption anyway. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.26.11 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: IMAP and features
> Hi Vilius, > > >> 3.) A feature question: Is it possible to disable the IMAP cache > > This is not possible. Think of it as a WWW browser. You cannot > > display content on screen if it is not on local disk. > > I disagree. Of course you could just load the list of mails from the > mail server and put it into a list view without storing anything at > all on the hard drive. > > If one than clicks on a mail you would download it (into memory that > shouldn't be a problem today) and display it as needed. > > On the other hand that isn't very reasonable to do as you always need > to retrieve the whole message list which will consume more time with > every mail you receive. Could be a nice feature for a thumb drive mail > client which allows you to read your mails from virtually any > computer. > > But I would use webmail access for that... Indeed. Webmail access would work 10 times better in such a case. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.26.11 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: IMAP and features
> 3.) A feature question: Is it possible to disable the IMAP cache > completly? The goal would be a small-footprint client that does not > save anything locally (except configuration, of course), no "mail" > directory at all. This is not possible. Think of it as a WWW browser. You cannot display content on screen if it is not on local disk. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.26.11 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: quick search function
> Hello Tbbeta, > > Do any of you also have problems with the quick search function in V5? > When doing several searches one after another, which all get added as a tab > at the bottom of the message list, I very often get empty results. Then I have > to go back to the ALL tab, and then click on the tab with my search string > again, and suddenly the messages appear. Clicking from one search tab to > another mostly results in empty lists, as if two searches were applied at the > same time and both criteria had to be met. > > Can anyone confirm? Quick search doesn't work correctly for me since version 4.x (or maybe it was 3.x?). What I usually see is that when writing something into Search input field and clicking enter it chops half of the letters. E.i. you have to write and hit enter very fast. Sometimes it doesn't open new tab at all. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.26.10 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: IMAP (yes again)
scu...@mymts.net rašė: Hello Maxim, A reminder of what Maxim Masiutin typed on: Monday, October 17, 2011 at 00:11:52 GMT +0300 MM> Could you please sent the links to the IMAP bugs reported on BT, on which we MM> should focus first, upon your opinion? Currently my main issue is how slow things have become. When ever filters are involved things slow to a crawl. In one IMAP account that receives lots of mail that filters to other folders it can take 1-2 minutes to filter 20 messages. It seems to look at one message, then test it against all possible filters, then move it on the server, then move it on the local side, then go to the next filter. This process then starts again, but each message takes 3-4 seconds to accomplish this and there seems to be nothing else happening while this is going on in any of my other accounts while this is happening. Also filtering is still inconsistent. Happily I use server side filtering, so my main issue with slowliness is a slow mailbox purging. Which I happen to use a lot because of this bug: https://www.ritlabs.com/bt/view.php?id=8660 However I could understand the need for local filters. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.26.5 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: IMAP (yes again)
Maxim Masiutin raše: Hello Vilius, Monday, October 17, 2011, 10:53:34 PM, you wrote: VŠ> are you planning any beta series which focuses on IMAP again? There VŠ> are dozen of serious bugs still present. Could you please sent the links to the IMAP bugs reported on BT, on which we should focus first, upon your opinion? https://www.ritlabs.com/bt/view.php?id=8534 https://www.ritlabs.com/bt/view.php?id=8133 also seems like old bugs which doesn't permit to use the same account in The Bat! and other IMAP clients simultaniously are back again. For example if files are deleted from remote client, The Bat! still sometimes show deleted messages even if Browse Deleted is DIsabled. Sometimes The Bat just freezes with various error messages and disconnects. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.26.4 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: IMAP (yes again)
Hello, are you planning any beta series which focuses on IMAP again? There are dozen of serious bugs still present. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.26.4 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.0.22.15 IMAP - "unread" status appearing randomly with already read messages
Sveiki, Tuesday, September 27, 2011, 12:16:57 PM, you wrote: > Hello! > After installing 5.0.22.15, an issue poppped back up that I had already > been having before, but which seemed gone in the meantime: > - message arrives, I read it, it becomes "read". After some time, it > boldens again, becoming "unread". > - scroll to any random position in the Inbox message list, click on several > old > messages. Some of them become "unread". > Anyone having these symptoms too? Confirmed. Usually this happens in conjuction with frozen IMAP connection from The Bat! to the server. Only restart of the application helps. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.22.15 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: 5.0.22.12
> > The Bat! 5.0.22.12 (ALPHA) is available at > > I use TB! with Exchange server (via IMAP) that has self-signed > certificate. Now I cannot avoid annoying prompt about not trusted > certificate - the prompt window shows up ever time TB! connects to my > server So add it to your address book or don't use self-signed certificate. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.22.12 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: IMAP purge, mark as deleted, filters
> I just did some IMAP testing and made some experiences for months which I > would like to share here. Maybe you have information for me how I can get > rid of the problems, maybe it turns out that I noticed some bugs. > > When I delete a message on a IMAP account with TB, the message gets > marked > as deleted in the folder where it was and copied to the Trash folder. I > think this is the behavior have I set up in Account Properties / Mail > Management / Deletion. Although it says "move" the message to Trash. Already requested. Please add your vote: https://www.ritlabs.com/bt/view.php?id=8660 > > -- > > Regards, > Martin > > The Bat! v5.0.22.6 (ALPHA) powered by Windows 7 6.1 Build 7601 Service > Pack 1 > > ConCarne cooks best since 1998 > http://www.concarne.org Current beta is 5.0.22.6 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.0.22.6
Sveiki, Monday, August 8, 2011, 6:32:41 PM, you wrote: > The Bat! 5.0.22.6 (ALPHA) is available at > http://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/a-5/tb50226.rar > What's new in 5.0.22.6 since 5.0.22.5: > [+] An option to specify time format for the message list in the > Preferences dialog. Now the time format by default fits time format > used in previous version of The Bat! Works fine. One small note: "Force 24hours format" should not be needed now, because time format must be taken from regional settings. For some reason, even if I have 24hours configured in my regional settings, and The Bat! is configured to take language/format from regional settings I have to force it to display 24hours. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.22.6 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.0.22.4 (ALPHA)
Sveiki, Saturday, August 6, 2011, 10:55:02 PM, you wrote: > Hello Vilius, > Saturday, August 6, 2011, 4:23:36 PM, you wrote: >> The dates for English Windows with Lithuanian regional settings are >> shown in English format now :( > These dates are shown in The Bat!'s interface language. I mean the format, not the language. The dates are formatted like M/D/Y and time is in 12hours format. Then my windows has Y/M/Y and 24 hours configured. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.22.4 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.0.22.4 (ALPHA)
Sveiki, Saturday, August 6, 2011, 4:50:23 PM, you wrote: > Hello Vilius! > On Saturday, August 6, 2011 at 3:23:36 PM you wrote: >> The dates for English Windows with Lithuanian regional settings are >> shown in English format now :( > If are running W7* that's a problem of the OS; I experience the same > with German UI for Windows [TB runs in English]. I have the same > problem with several programs. > *Might even be confined to 64-bit with 32-bit programs. Yes, it is Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.22.4 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.0.22.4 (ALPHA)
Sveiki, Saturday, August 6, 2011, 3:40:45 PM, you wrote: > Hello Tbbeta, > The Bat! 5.0.22.4 (ALPHA) is available at > http://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/a-5/tb50224.rar > What's new in 5.0.22.4 since 5.0.22.3: > [-] LibrariesEntryPoints must be initialized BEFORE loading plug-ins > [-] The Bat! now formats date and time in the message list using > Windows API. You can configure different formats in the Regional options in > the Control Panel. The dates for English Windows with Lithuanian regional settings are shown in English format now :( -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.22.4 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: Date in English (on non-English OS)
> Hi Eddie, > > > Hi RS, > > > On Fri, Jul 29, 2011 at 10:37 AM, RS (FEDARA) wrote: > > >> MMM gives three leters of the month however it's in Polish (Lip) not > >> in English (Jul). > > > I think that is a change on OS level. I could not find any change Did > > you try that? > > Didn't have time yet to check where I need to change it on OS level. > But it would be a way around because it may affect other programs as well. > I'm really happy I do not have to work on Thai OS - would be a killer :) If you are on Thai OS you would have bigger problems date in TB! :) > IMO it should be on TB! level to use OS settings or not (at least for > English). It doesn't matter what language OS is. It's only regional settings. TB! as every other good written program just follows them. It doesn't make sense to want one regional settings in OS and another in a program. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.22.1 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: Date in English (on non-English OS)
> Hi Raymund, > > I have a feeling here that it's connected with OS national settings :( > > > Got the same feeling here now as well. > > > It still takes the names for month etc. from the OS but should take > > them from the translation files. > > And it makes date format with written names instead of numbers > unusable while copying date and time and replying to other language > than Polish :( > > > When I reply in English to somebody's message and I want to copy other > e-mail date and time of other e-mail (a date copied from a message > view window (header part)) I need to correct manually date in Polish > to English. > > Below after it's copied and pasted: > 29 lipca 2011, 14:27:16 (Fri, 29 Jul 2011 08:27:16 +0200) > > As said before no matter what language I select in TB! it's always in > Polish :( Just change your regional settings in OS. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.22.1 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.0.18.12
Sveiki, Sunday, July 24, 2011, 9:54:57 PM, you wrote: > Hello Vilius, > Sunday, July 24, 2011, 1:48:50 PM, you wrote: >> Multiple windows of the Folder? > Different folders can be viewed in different windows. How? I never knew about this feature. >> Or multiple windows of a whole The Bat! application? > Design of The Bat! have no objections from opening multiple "main windows" > under the same process thebat.exe, but we didn't make this possibility > available to the user. > And why do you think that IMAP should SELECT the folder which the user is > viewing? A user may be working in one folder but expect messages to come in Because it is consistent predictable behaviour from the user point of view. > another folder? Anyway, if a user is working with a folder, there is high > chance that The Bat! needs to update something via IMAP on that folder, or > read something that has not been read to the local cache, so with high > probability this current folder will be SELECTed anyway. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.18.12 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.0.18.12
Sveiki, Sunday, July 24, 2011, 9:35:34 PM, you wrote: > Hello Vilius, > Sunday, July 24, 2011, 3:27:21 AM, you wrote: >> This should IDLE on the mailbox which is currently selected. Because >> mail can arrive on ANY mailbox if server side filtering is configured >> for example. > It is hard if not impossible to determine which maibox is currently selected, > since multiple windows can be opened, etc. Multiple windows of the Folder? Or multiple windows of a whole The Bat! application? Maybe I'm missing something but currently selected folder is always marked with different background in the folder list. No? -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.18.12 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.0.18.12
Sveiki, Sunday, July 24, 2011, 2:12:41 PM, you wrote: > Hi Vilius > Sunday, July 24, 2011, 9:27:21 AM, Tbbeta wrote: >> Sveiki, >> Saturday, July 23, 2011, 11:42:20 PM, you wrote: >>> [+] (#0008351) When The Bat! completes all IMAP tasks, it selects >>> INBOX and idles in this folder, to be able to receive notifications >>> about new messages before refreshing all the folders >> This should IDLE on the mailbox which is currently selected. Because >> mail can arrive on ANY mailbox if server side filtering is configured >> for example. > I think this should be configurable. Most people running IMAP don't > have server side filters running, so a global sync at startup and > then monitor INBOX is what they need. > A few "power users" (a) have access to setup server side filtering > and (b) have the knowledge to do it. For these people having the > option to IDLE in the currently selected folder. > What do you think? Yes it could be configurable. However it should default to current mailbox. It's not like only "few power users" have server side filtering. Most business users have it, especially if they use Exchange. Major filtering rules are usually set up by server administrator globally (e.g. [SPAM] filtering into Spam folder). Also on IMAP users can have access to other users' mailboxes where mail arrives too. In addition, using IDLE command on currently selected mailbox is consisten behaviour with other email clients. And there is a good reason why, in IMAP phylosophy INBOX is just another mailbox, it really makes no sense to assume that mail will arrive there. Even the name for it is configurable and it can be named whatever you want. With the rise of Gmail IMAP, most people assume that IMAP is just another email protocol. But it is really completely new point of view to how email works. It is good of course that Google is pushing it to mainstream, however I hope that some day it will be much more than just pop3 on streroids. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.18.12 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: bugs with the VerifyWait status
Sveiki, Sunday, July 24, 2011, 5:37:32 AM, you wrote: > Hello Tbbeta, > Could you please confirm that > https://www.ritlabs.com/bt/view.php?id=8308 > has been fixed in the recent betas, and also check the other bugs marked as > "veiry wait"? If you don't have rights to change them to "resolved" status, > please link the bugs here and I will change them to resolved myself. https://www.ritlabs.com/bt/view.php?id=6035 -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.18.12 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.0.18.12
Sveiki, Saturday, July 23, 2011, 11:42:20 PM, you wrote: > [+] (#0008351) When The Bat! completes all IMAP tasks, it selects > INBOX and idles in this folder, to be able to receive notifications > about new messages before refreshing all the folders This should IDLE on the mailbox which is currently selected. Because mail can arrive on ANY mailbox if server side filtering is configured for example. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.18.12 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Adress Book future
Sveiki, Sunday, June 5, 2011, 5:36:11 PM, you wrote: > On Sunday, June 5, 2011, 9:20:44 AM, Alto Speckhardt wrote: > >> Things like being able to send messages. You know, fancy stuff like >> that. > I think mine have been going out. But I was curious about the > forgotten part, since I had the impression that was what we have been > working on. > If you see this, IMAP will send messages. There are dozen serious IMAP bugs registered on BT and reported here. Which are still not fixed months after 5.x release. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.12.12 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Adress Book future
Sveiki, Sunday, June 5, 2011, 8:15:48 AM, you wrote: > Hello Thomas, TM>> as the development of TheBat! is going straight forward it seams that TM>> the development of the address book is been forgotten. TM>> For me, and i think a lot of others, GMail is one of the most used TM>> providers and so it´s address book. > We are going to rework Address Book as well as the organiser functions > and one of the directions planned is making it possible to synchronise > with GMail and probably some social networks. GMail is obviously #1 > because of its popularity. Will there any more IMAP fixes? Seems like currently it is forgotten - again... -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.12.12 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: 5.0.12.4
> At 20.05.2011 08:16, Vilius Šumskas wrote: > > Then marking it as read-only is even better for you. Because you would > > not need to search for Save As button; simple CTRL + S will open Save > > As dialog, and the editing is ALWAYS allowed regardless if the > > document is read-only or not. > Not, if using free OpenOffice: That does not allow editing of r/o files. Then that's a bug in OpenOffice. MS Office, Editplus and even vim allows you to edit the document in Read-Only mode and then save it with new name. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.12.4 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.0.12.4
Sveiki, Friday, May 20, 2011, 2:15:57 AM, you wrote: > Dwight, >> On Thursday, May 19, 2011, 1:46:30 PM, Gleason wrote: >> >>> Sure I do. Why does it matter where it is, if I need to edit it? That >>> means that I don't need to save it somewhere and then track it down to >>> edit it. Why should I want another hoop to jump through? >> because you want to know where the edited file is, not have it buried >> in and disappear from the temporary files. > That's why I am going to save it after editing. But I don't need the > extra hassle. Then marking it as read-only is even better for you. Because you would not need to search for Save As button; simple CTRL + S will open Save As dialog, and the editing is ALWAYS allowed regardless if the document is read-only or not. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.12.4 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.0.12.4
>>> Can you make this an option? I would like to be able to edit files >>> sometimes. >> Either save the file manually, or use File->Save As in the program >> (you really really don't want to edit a file in your temporary >> directory). > Sure I do. Why does it matter where it is, if I need to edit it? That > means that I don't need to save it somewhere and then track it down to > edit it. Why should I want another hoop to jump through? Because mosts users think that they are editing document in the email, and then loose all their work done on it. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.12.4 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: purging takes too long
Sveiki, Wednesday, May 11, 2011, 10:52:33 PM, you wrote: > Other bug it's when compresing and purging folders on the maintenance. > It blocks the entire TB! during 2-5 minutes. If you mean 2-5 seconds here, please add comment: https://www.ritlabs.com/bt/view.php?id=8554 -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.12.2 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.0.9.1
Sveiki, Saturday, April 23, 2011, 2:20:28 PM, you wrote: > Hello Maxim, hello List! > * Maxim Masiutin wrote '[1]: >> [-] (#0008621) Empty folders function was broken in v5 > Fixed. But there shouldn't be another dialog to accept it (IMHO): > --- > The Bat! > --- > 165K bytes of storage space released > --- > OK > --- https://www.ritlabs.com/bt/view.php?id=8554 Not exactly the same, but still very annoying. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.9.1 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: TLS + Self Signed Certificate
Sveiki, Monday, April 18, 2011, 6:23:01 PM, you wrote: > Hello Jernej, > On Fri, 8 Apr 2011 18:41:31 +0200 GMT (08/Apr/11, 23:41 PM +0700 GMT), > Jernej Simončič wrote: >>> I think I mentioned it before: I added this somehow with the result >>> that no messages could be sent anymore. I had to go through the cert >>> list in TB! and delete the one in question. The result was that I get >>> asked every time and have to click "OK". JS>> That's weird - it certainly worked for me (I recently switched to JS>> StartSSL for our mail server's certificate, and TB didn't know this JS>> CA, so I added their certificate). > I found out that the cert is wrong. It's in the name of our domain > hoster, not our domain. Gee. Cannot blame TB! for that. > I just don't know yet why I get this pop-up asking me to accept the > wrong certificate when I am connected to the internet at the > university, but not when in the office or at home (domain hoster and > ISP are not related in any way). Probably your university is filtering SSL traffic and evesdroping? -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.8.1 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: TLS + Self Signed Certificate
Sveiki, Friday, April 8, 2011, 8:08:14 PM, you wrote: > Hi Jernej, >> It isn't - but it's not any worse than using an unencrypted >> connection. > OK, but what to do if the other side does not wish to install some encryption? > I had to delete mine, because no one of the people I'm exchanging mail with, > has de/encryption. The answers I get the most if asking for it, are: > - "That's much too complicated, I don't want to spend time to read how that >works." > - "Can't do that myself and don't want to pay the guy again for that." > - "Bullshit, they don't check my mail, you're becoming a schizo." > So if delicate info has to become exchanged, we spread it over mail, instant > messaging in Skype and Windows Messenger and webphone. > That is fine for me too, because I myself still find the kind of encryption > available rather awkward. We were talking about Client to IMAP/POP3/SMTP server encryption here. All it does is protects your password, and partially protects traffic comming from you to your server. Other people don't need to install anything, they can read your email just fine. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.6.1 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: TLS + Self Signed Certificate
Sveiki, Wednesday, April 6, 2011, 8:56:31 PM, you wrote: > This is what the confirmation dialog does. It says "I have this > certificate that I don't trust, do you trust it?" and also gives the > details for the certificate. This means that the user has the control > to decide whether or not to trust the source. This moves the > responsibility for authorising a given certificate from a known flawed > implicit mechanism to a user authorization. Yeah, but how does the user know if this is really a certificate he is thinking it is? He must call other end for example by phone and ask forcertificatefingerprint,check it on certificate he is accepting, etc. In my opinion this is still a certification of other end, just without automatic technical means. > Which is safer depends on many factors, where you live, how much you > know, etc. As I said before, this is a philosophical discussion more > than a technical issue. Agreed. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.6.1 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: TLS + Self Signed Certificate
Sveiki, Wednesday, April 6, 2011, 8:21:03 PM, you wrote: > Hi Vilius et al, > Wednesday, April 6, 2011, 12:00:16 PM, you wrote: >>> > You can do this by using standard plain text connection method. >>> That is hard to do if the server, for example, only supports SSL >>> connections (as is common practice today) and uses self-signed >>> certs for that - and as such just as good as advising someone, who >>> complains that a car lets him put in diesel where unleaded is >>> needed, to try to run his car on wood. >> I'm not sure why you think this is "a common practice". Sure it was >> the case like 5 years ago, but now every major webmail provider, >> bigger companies and even universities use good certificates. I use >> 6 accounts for work and 2 personal accounts and all of them are >> properly secured with proper certificates. And given what messages >> IE, FF and Chrome throughs at users these days, I don't imagine who >> is using self-signed ones. > This is more of a philosophical discussion about PKE (Public Key > Encryption). This might be a bit OT, if so we can carry on PM. > There are 2 main uses for PKE. > 1.- Certify endpoints. For this there must be an unbroken certificate > chain from a trusted CA down through 0 or more intermediate > certificates to the end certificate that is being used. For this > purpose Vilius is right, self-signed certificates are no use. > 2.- Secure communications channel. The communication is opaque to all > but the 2 endpoints that are communicating. When you perform > IMAP/POP3/SMTP authentication you are sending your login details, you > definitely don't what people to read that, and you might not want them > to read the mail contents either. For this purpose self-signed > certificates are perfectly OK. > As a small aside, even for purpose 1 the current implementation is > flawed. It all goes down to having a few trusted 100% secure Root CA. > This is not actually the case. Some CA have been compromised in the > past, which is one problem, another is that some countries have their > own internationally recognised government controlled CA, which then > allows the government to mount man-in-the-middle attack on SSL traffic > going through their country. > I want The Bat! to store the self-signed certificate so that I can > simplify purpose 2 above. Completely true. With small addition, that point 2 only makes sense when you can certify endpoints also. E.i. to allow self-signed communication in secure manner you MUST get certificate from the person you trust, on USB key, or that such certificate should be pushed securely through Windows Group Policy for example. Trusting (e.g. accepting) self-signed CA through internet is risky. You could actually be accepting certificate of transparent proxy without knowing it, you have to check figerprint, etc, etc. This is why I think current method is really enough. If it doesn't work as some users said, then of course BT ticket should be created for that. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.6.1 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: TLS + Self Signed Certificate
> > You can do this by using standard plain text connection method. > That is hard to do if the server, for example, only supports SSL > connections (as is common practice today) and uses self-signed certs for > that - and as such just as good as advising someone, who complains that > a car lets him put in diesel where unleaded is needed, to try to run his car > on > wood. I'm not sure why you think this is "a common practice". Sure it was the case like 5 years ago, but now every major webmail provider, bigger companies and even universities use good certificates. I use 6 accounts for work and 2 personal accounts and all of them are properly secured with proper certificates. And given what messages IE, FF and Chrome throughs at users these days, I don't imagine who is using self-signed ones. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.6.1 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: TLS + Self Signed Certificate
> >> VŠ> What's the point to accept and store self-signed certificate > >> VŠ> anyway? It ads zero security. > >> > >> You are right, it does not add security. However, it adds > >> convenience. > > VŠ> Convenience? How? > > Byu not having to click OK to accept the cert each time I send a > message. I thought that was clear, I ment that self signed certificate adds zero security. I were not talking about the possibility to add such certificates into exception list. The conclusion is that if you care about security you should be using properly signed certificates. And if you are using self-signed certs you doesn't really care about security and should be prepared for inconveniences that are DESIGNED to annoy ordinary users which doesn't care about security either. Be it clicking OK on every connection or finding a way through different CryptoAPI/PKI dialogs to import root CA. Or to switch to normal plaintext method. > >> As I said in the other mail a moment ago, not really important on my > >> side, but it would be nice not to have to click OK each time I send a > >> mail. > > VŠ> You can do this by using standard plain text connection method. > > Of course. Some people told me I should use TLS for security. TB! > supports it. You are saying I should ignore security? TLS is secure only when used precisly as it was designed to be used. Man-in-the-middle attacks and non revoking certificates doesn't have much corellation with TLS or with security at all. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.6.1 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: TLS + Self Signed Certificate
> Hello Vilius, > > On Wed, 6 Apr 2011 17:10:29 +0300 GMT (06/Apr/11, 21:10 PM +0700 GMT), > Vilius Šumskas wrote: > > VŠ> What's the point to accept and store self-signed certificate > VŠ> anyway? It ads zero security. > > You are right, it does not add security. However, it adds > convenience. Convenience? How? > VŠ> This was discussed on this list extensively multiple times, and if > VŠ> you really really really know what you are doing, just add root CA > VŠ> to trusted CAs. > > I tried that, but the result was that I could not send at all any > more. As this is not a beta issue, we can continue the discussion on > TBUDL. Maybe you have added certificate itself, not root CA? I'm not sure about version 5, but it worked for me when I tested it during 4.x beta cycle. If it doesn't work in version 5.0 it needs to be reported on BT and fixed of course. > As I said in the other mail a moment ago, not really important on my > side, but it would be nice not to have to click OK each time I send a > mail. You can do this by using standard plain text connection method. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.6.1 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: TLS + Self Signed Certificate
>> how is that supposed to be helping the original poster? >> I believe he was asking for a possibility to explicitly mark a certificate >> as trusted locally. To my knowledge Thawte & alia can only issue him an >> official one, >> which is not really what he was aiming for. I don't know that. He stated that he wanted to "register the certificate" hence my suggestion. >> I would join the request for the possibility to store an exception for an >> otherwise invalid certificate just as I can (for example) in >> Firefox...having had the >> same problem in the past. The insistence of >> TheBat! in keeping complaining about the certificate at each and every >> connection is quite annoying. And I would join opposing side, that it would make The Bat! for average user less safe. It annoys you for are reason. Self Signed certificates have nothing to do with security and should not be used at all. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.6.1 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: Re[2]: TLS + Self Signed Certificate
Please do not use HTML for simple email messages, it is hard to reply inline, and mods are complaining about top posting. What's the point to accept and store self-signed certificate anyway? It ads zero security. This was discussed on this list extensively multiple times, and if you really really really know what you are doing, just add root CA to trusted CAs. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.6.1 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: TLS + Self Signed Certificate
Hello, Search for VeriSign, Thawte, Comodo. -- Vilius From: tbbeta-boun...@thebat.dutaint.com [mailto:tbbeta-boun...@thebat.dutaint.com] On Behalf Of Simon Martin Sent: 2011 m. balandžio 6 d. 16:05 To: tbbeta@thebat.dutaint.com Subject: TLS + Self Signed Certificate Hi all, I host my own mail server (Courier). Being the cheapskate that I am, I use a self signed certificate for TLS/SSL connections. I am using the internal S/MIME and TLS implementation. I have had different scenarios in different versions. This is the current 5.0.8 behaviour: if I set the "Secure to dedicated port" option in the Account dialog then every TLS/SSL connection (IMAP or SSL) complains about the self signed certificate. Is there anywhere I can register my certificate to avoid these errors? Regards. -- __ _ Debian GNU User Simon Martin / /(_)_ __ _ ___ __ __ Project Manager / / | | '_ \| | | \ \/ / Milliways / /__| | | | | |_| |> < mailto: smar...@milliways.cl \/_|_| |_|\__,_/_/\_\ Si Hoc Legere Scis Nimium Eruditionis Habes Current beta is 5.0.6.1 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: IMAP : deleting message does not stop downloading task from IMAP Queue
Hi, Monday, April 4, 2011, 11:13:59 PM, you wrote: > Hello, > today I have received two large messages (30MB and 10M) to GMAIL account > and even I have deleted messages from folder, those reappeared again and > when I checked Connection Centre, downloading task for deleted message was > still active - while task can not be deleted from IMAP Queue yet, I can not > delete this message until it is completely downloaded. Confirmed this first part. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.5 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
deleting more than two messages
Hello, any confirmations? https://www.ritlabs.com/bt/view.php?id=8534 -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.5 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Problems in 5.0.0.153 (some may be old)
Sveiki, Wednesday, March 30, 2011, 9:53:28 PM, you wrote: > * The IMAP setting on account level to fetch full messages does not seem to > work. Confirmed. > * "New thread sorting" on view modes does not work. Condirmed. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.153 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: duplicate messages in Sent Mail
Sveiki, Tuesday, March 29, 2011, 7:25:03 PM, you wrote: > On Tuesday, March 29, 2011, 11:24:07 AM, Dwight Corrin wrote: > >> I surmised correctly that the previously double appearance would be >> gone, but the new message was not doubled. > but then this one was. Yeah, and it gets even funnier when you have Sent Mail selected and send couple of messages. Some messages appear in the folder twice, some once, some disappear completely :) This is with default synchronization (or download as they called now) settings. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.153 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
duplicate messages in Sent Mail
Sveiki, Can someone deny or confirm? https://www.ritlabs.com/bt/view.php?id=8537 -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.153 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.0.0.151 - Really an RC?
Sveiki, Saturday, March 19, 2011, 6:22:22 PM, you wrote: > I am not sure I saw a confirmation that screen splits work now. > mid:10589532.20110308183...@gmail.com They are. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.150 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.0.0.150
Sveiki, Thursday, March 17, 2011, 1:54:32 AM, you wrote: > The Bat! 5.0.0.150 BETA is available at > http://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/a-5/tb500150.rar When "Download during periodic checks" and "Download during 'get new mail'" settings are checked I get "Mailbox does not exist" every time when "get new mail" is clicked. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.150 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Daily crash ritual
Sunday, March 13, 2011, 1:40:01 PM, you wrote: V>> P.S.BTW,whyare you using such complicated messages base V>> synchronization scheme with IMAP? > I am? And why shouldn't I? Isn't that why IMAP was rewritten - so > that people could use the IMAP structure of their choice? And > Thunderbird can handle it perfectly well. And K-9 mail (Android) can > handle it perfectly well. You may be confusing the issue with > non-issues here :). I mean in IMAP you don't need to bring message base (on external HDD) to every computer you use. IMAP does this "automatically". -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.148 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Daily crash ritual
Hello, Sunday, March 13, 2011, 12:57:27 PM, you wrote: > v5.0.0.148 BETA SILVERSONG/Marck 13/03/2011 09:59:15.162 > DLMGR:TFileStorage.LoadBD EConvertError '30/12/1899' is not a valid date and > time Sounds like one of the messages in your account has the date of 1899? Or maybe you external hard drive has trouble setting dates on files? P.S.BTW,whyare you using such complicated messages base synchronization scheme with IMAP? -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.148 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: HTML mass mailing
Sveiki, Friday, March 11, 2011, 3:52:18 PM, you wrote: > Dear All, > When I do a mass mailing using HTML the formats are not preserved. as > Example, when a Text is in color this is then shown as standard color. > Spaces are shown like "Â Â Â Â Â Â ". > What is the last /stable/ version of TB!beta? 1.61 :) -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.148 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: IMAP server-dise outbox
> can someone explain the concept of an IMAP server-side outbox folder > to me? Is it supposed to be the same as the "Drafts"-folder used by > Outlook and Thunderbird? Server side outbox is used to store messages which are completed and in a process of sending, e.g. delayed delivery. You can close email client but messages will be sent still. It must be supported by the server though. Drafts folder is a little bit different. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.146 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: National chars in UTF8 messages displayed wrong
Sveiki, Tuesday, March 1, 2011, 7:48:10 PM, you wrote: > Hi Marek, >> I see it correctly in Outlook, because it probably uses MIME definition >> instead META tag, which is disputable. > Especially as the tag is only allowed in the tag and the > mail you attached previously definitely doesn't adhere to that. > So the mime type of the attachment should take precedence as there is > no valid meta tag definition. And TB! should display it like that. It's not the question of precedence, but the question of how many conversions should be done. MIME is very broad standard and defined not only email messages but a lot of other things. Different MIME parts can have different charsets, different content type, etc. Let's say we have such message: 0.1 Whole email body (UTF8) 0.1.1 HTML content (UTF8, HTML META as UTF8) 0.1.1.1 Image1 0.1.1.2 Image2 0.1.2 Alternative HTML content (UTF8, HTML META as Windows-1257) 0.1.3 Alternative Plain text content (UTF8 quoted-printable) For every MIME part email client should perform such charset conversion: Whole body charset/encoding -> MIME part content charset/encoding -> HTML part charset (or next step if HTML META doesn't exist) -> display charset This is exactly how Outlook works. If any of the conversion is missing you will see buggy characters. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.145 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: Deleting IMAP folder cache causes wrong Total messages account counter
> Hello, > I had problem with one missing message in IMAP folder, so I have cleared > cache and TB reloaded message headers again - but now Total counter > of account calculates this folder twice. > > Confirmations? Confirmed. I noticed this when deleting more than 1 message. E.i. select 5 messages in the Inbox, Delete, 6 messages are missing from the view. Switch to another folder, switch back to Inbox. 1 missing message appears. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.141 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.0.0.139 changelog update
Sveiki, Tuesday, February 15, 2011, 10:25:29 PM, you wrote: > Sveiki, > Tuesday, February 15, 2011, 9:26:38 PM, you wrote: >> [-] (#0008420) When refresh IMAP folder, deleted messages become hidden > Deleted messages for IMAP works completely wrong still. The Bat! > memorizes deleted state in local cache only. If you delete a message > from another client it doesn't appear in The Bat as deleted. Correction. The Bat! does mark messages as deleted only when they are actually moved or purged from another client. This is wrong. From what I see The Bat! doesn't use DELETED IMAP flag at all. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.139 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.0.0.139
Sveiki, Tuesday, February 15, 2011, 7:25:34 PM, you wrote: > The Bat! 5.0.0.139 BETA is available at > http://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/a-5/tb500139.rar > [-] When The Bat! did compress a folder on IMAP, it did also report > "Looks like no folder processing is necessary", even if it saved > space, now it properly reports "...bytes of storage space released". I really think Purge and Compact should be a separate options in IMAP. It is two completely different things. Purge is used almost faily by most IMAP users and now we get "No folder processing is necessary" on every Purge action. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.139 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.0.0.139 changelog update
Sveiki, Tuesday, February 15, 2011, 9:26:38 PM, you wrote: > [-] (#0008420) When refresh IMAP folder, deleted messages become hidden Deleted messages for IMAP works completely wrong still. The Bat! memorizes deleted state in local cache only. If you delete a message from another client it doesn't appear in The Bat as deleted. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.139 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.0.0.139
Sveiki, Tuesday, February 15, 2011, 7:25:34 PM, you wrote: > The Bat! 5.0.0.139 BETA is available at > http://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/a-5/tb500139.rar Still getting lots of "AddRemotePartEx.Error.Instream=nil.Folder=Inbox"errors when I adjust any IMAP folder settings to download full messages on check. Also split window position still not memorized during program restart. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.139 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.0.0.135
Sveiki, Wednesday, February 2, 2011, 8:31:44 AM, you wrote: > The Bat! 5.0.0.135 BETA is available at > http://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/a-5/tb500135.rar > What's new in 5.0.0.135 since 5.0.0.134: > [-] Default colours of messages were wrong (Beta issue) > [-] (#0008392) Account properties dialog on Common folder produces error in > 5.0.0.134 > [-] (IMAP Download related) Access Violation at address 00939D67 on start > 5.0.0.134 > [-] Folder Maintenance was not working properly for IMAP folders, > WIP: integrity checking and repair (Beta issue) > [*] Folder download options was reorganized > [*] Pop-up menus of IMAP accounts/folders was reorganized > [-] Folder Integrity checking was not working (Beta issue) IgetIMAP - AddRemotePartEx.Error.Instream=nil.Folder=Inbox constantly if IMAP Download settings are set. Also I think that there are too many too complicated choices in IMAP Download screen. Syncronization window was more user friendly. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.136 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: Lost cursor icon in The Bat!
> Hello, > when I worked with TB yesterday, I lost cursor icon - to be accurate, > cursor icon was not displayed in TB's place, when I moved cursor to > different app, it appeared. > > Anybody saw this? I saw similar behaviour but with icons in Windows 7 taskbar. Generally when you move mouse cursor over open program icons in the taskbar the whole area highlights with icon colors. For example when you move over TB! icon whole rectangle is yellowish and program tooltip appears. Later it disappears. The problem with TB! is that when TB! is open there is enourmous lag between when tooltip appears and disappears. It's like 30 seconds or more. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.134 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: 5.0.0.134
Sveiki, Friday, January 28, 2011, 5:20:56 AM, you wrote: > The Bat! 5.0.0.134 BETA is available at > http://www.ritlabs.com/download/files3/the_bat/a-5/tb500134.rar > What's new in 5.0.0.134 since 5.0.0.132: > [-] Exceptions when embedded message was opened in separate view > (on opening attachments and on close) > [-] (#0008235) Untranslatable Begin / Substr / Equal / RegulExp in Image > download manager > [-] Image download manager wasn't properly resized > [-] IMAP folder exit tasks were not executed when exiting by the /EXIT command > [-] When Windows did close The Bat! in case of system shutdown and > there were open editor windows, The Bat! hang. > [-] Using several folders as the source for a message list tab was not > working properly (Beta issue) > [+] Improved certificate chain building for X.509 in S/MIME and TLS > [*] You can configure IMAP download mode in the folder properties > (BETA issue: in some places of the interface this is still called > "synchronization", we will rename it to "download mode") > [+] You can configure "odd/even row contrast" in > Options->Preferences->Message List (BETA issue: the current default > setting is not yet optimal, you should configure it for your own taste) Setting download couple of folders and hitting Recieve have me constant AVs and !2011.01.28, 10:00:50: IMAP - AddRemotePartEx.Error.Instream=nil.Folder=Inbox Also it starts to download all the folders at once. (at least this is green arrow icon shows in the folder list). Message list coloring works, but has a bug, when you select one message, all odd or even messages are selected. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.134 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Strange behavior od IMAP IDLE Mode.
Sveiki, Thursday, January 27, 2011, 3:30:08 PM, you wrote: > Hi Vili, >>> Your mails and his mail just thread nicely on the references. No >>> worries :-) >> Not here. His emails are missing In-Reply-To header. > Well, which mail program do you use? My bat is sorting based on > references without any problems for the complete thread with and > without in-reply-to header. The Bat 5.0.0.132 :) I'm using References + Subject sorting, but it is the same with References only, just worse. I'm not sure how threading without In-Reply-To should suppose to work. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.133 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Strange behavior od IMAP IDLE Mode.
Sveiki, Thursday, January 27, 2011, 11:37:51 AM, you wrote: > Hi Darzur, >>> while making suggestions about client behavior, it would be an >>> improvement if your messages would thread by reference. :) >> Besides if you look at my "References" header you'll see that all >> references are there. Or did I misunderstood you? > Your mails and his mail just thread nicely on the references. No > worries :-) Not here. His emails are missing In-Reply-To header. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.133 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Strange behavior od IMAP IDLE Mode. [OT]
Sveiki, Wednesday, January 26, 2011, 9:08:33 PM, you wrote: > P.S. Please do something with your email/newsgroups reader as your posts > are barely readable and very hard to quote. Every line should be wrapped > at 80th character. :) No it should not. RFC says that line should be wrapped at 80th character only in *message source*, not in real text. It's up to the client to take care of the rest. Including quoting :) -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.133 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: Strange behavior od IMAP IDLE Mode.
> > Thunderbird does so by opening 5 connection to 5 different > > folders.Andas far as I know 5 is the limit. So if you are using more > than 5 folders > you have to enable syncronization anyway. > > Hmm... checked it again. With only 1 active connection Thunderbird works > like you described - Inbox have to be selected to get new emails. But > when I've enabled second connection it started to act as per my > description. I have almost 60 subfolders in my Inbox and with 2 active > connections and all synchronization options disabled I'm always getting > instant notifications and proper filtering. It looks like with one > available connection it idles in actually selected folder, but when > there is more connections available one of them always idles on inbox. > And I think this is very good compromise - good for me and good for you. > Unfortunately I hate Thunderbird so I hope The Bat! will finally have > good IMAP service. I think that it should work the other way around. If 1 connection is available then selected folder should be idled. And if more than 1 is used then one of these connections should idle inbox. I would really hate The Bat! for using 2 connections just to IDLE. This really makes no sense from IMAP point of view. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.133 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: Strange behavior od IMAP IDLE Mode.
Sveiki, Wednesday, January 26, 2011, 5:04:52 PM, you wrote: > Hello Vilius, > Wednesday, January 26, 2011, 2:55:50 PM, you wrote: >> Snip... >> Again, The Bat developers can decide which folder the client should >> idle, but current method is the best IMHO. It follows the whole IMAP >> philosophy. > My vote would be for an option to idle in Inobx or idle in last read > mailbox. With multiple connections, option for one to idle in the Inbox > and the others to most recently used. +1 but this should be low priority, considering other more important things (like syncronisation) currently doesn't work at all. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.133 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: Strange behavior od IMAP IDLE Mode.
> On Wed, 26 Jan 2011 16:05:53 +0200, Vilius Šumskas s1cezwje...@public.gmane.org> says... > > > I think you are confusing IDLE with synchronization. It doesn't matter what > folder you have selected, as long as your client syncs every 2 or 5 or ... > minutes the new mail will arrive. It just a little "slower" than waiting for > IDLE. > > > > > > > > No, synchronization isn't what I was writing about. During > synchronization email client have to poll server every defined period of > time. So first its not immediate unless I set very short (i.e. 1s) > synchronization period, and second it makes unnecessary network traffic > especially when synchronization period is short. Of course before 5.0 I > had to use synchronization because former TB vesions didn't support IDLE > mode. But now it works but not in the way I was expecting and not how > other clients (i.e. Thunderbird) works. Thunderbird does so by opening 5 connection to 5 different folders. And as far as I know 5 is the limit. So if you are using more than 5 folders you have to enable syncronization anyway. IMAP IDLE does not replace syncronization. There is IMAP NOTIFY extension on the rise to combine best of both worlds but for now there is no easy way to make IMAP IDLE command work in all folders. Again, The Bat developers can decide which folder the client should idle, but current method is the best IMHO. It follows the whole IMAP philosophy. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.133 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: Strange behavior od IMAP IDLE Mode.
> Hi Vilius, > > > I think you are confusing IDLE with synchronization. > > And I think you meant subscription here. As you have to be subscribed > for synchronization to work, don't you? No and Yes. Subscriptions are not Syncronization (or Pooling in Thunderbird's case). Subscriptions are server side and mainly are used by the IMAP client to separate "important" and "other_available" folders. In IMAP you can have hundreds and thousands mailboxes available. For example: user.userA.INBOX user.userA.INBOX.tbbeta user.userA.Trash user.userA.Sent Mail shared#.digitalfax shared#.conference IMAP mailbox shared#.fax can be shared by mail server admins to all users. But not all of them works with fax or need it. So they decide to unsubscribe from that folder. Syncronization works on top of all this by doing actual job by syncing mailboxes, but IMAP client can sync any folder. It doesn't matter if it was subscribed or not. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.133 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: Strange behavior od IMAP IDLE Mode.
> > That's the way IDLE works. It can only work on one folder per > > connection at a time. And ONLY on IMAP SELECTed folder. It doesn't > > mean that The Bat! should issue IMAP SELECT command if user changed > > his current folder on the client of course! However I personaly vote > > for the current behaviour. That's because I'm using server-side > > filters and new mail can arrive in multiple folders for me, and I > > usually be idling on the most important for the moment folder. > > So this behaviour should be selectable. Thunderbird works in a way I've > described without problems. It's very annoying to remember to select > "Inbox" after any new read message and I often forget to do this. And if > you have server side filtering then you never know when you have new > mail in a particular folder before you select it? Then how can you know > that you've got a new message? I think you are confusing IDLE with synchronization. It doesn't matter what folder you have selected, as long as your client syncs every 2 or 5 or ... minutes the new mail will arrive. It just a little "slower" than waiting for IDLE. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.133 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: Strange behavior od IMAP IDLE Mode.
> Hello, > > I have many troubles with setting IDLE mode to work properly with gmail. > I have several folders under my main "Inbox" folder and set filters to > sort all incoming and ongoing mail. I've noticed that IDLE command only > works when "Inbox" folder is selected in The Bat! - then I'm getting > instant notifications about new mail and filters are working as > expected. But when any other folder is selected then IDLE is not working > and I have no notifications at all. Itshould be possible to use IDLE > mode regardless of selected folder as in current form it's unusable. That's the way IDLE works. It can only work on one folder per connection at a time. And ONLY on IMAP SELECTed folder. It doesn't mean that The Bat! should issue IMAP SELECT command if user changed his current folder on the client of course! However I personaly vote for the current behaviour. That's because I'm using server-side filters and new mail can arrive in multiple folders for me, and I usually be idling on the most important for the moment folder. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.133 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
Re: feature request
Sveiki, Saturday, January 22, 2011, 3:51:06 PM, you wrote: > Hello Roelof, > A reminder of what Roelof Otten typed on: > Saturday, January 22, 2011 at 14:42:26 GMT +0100 RO>> I'm sharing an imap account with more people. RO>> When somebody creates a new folder I must find out by myself. It RO>> would be nice for TB to tell me there's a new folder, not RO>> necessarily that I'm subscribed to it, but just that there have been RO>> changes. > Good point. I find the one problem with IMAP as a whole is that when you > actually try to use 2 or more computers, you need to have all computers doing > the same thing. If you create a folder for filing something, you need to > remember to set that folder up on all computers or you will miss mail. This > goes > even further to filtering and other things. > I have some filters set up that need to be set up on all computers, such as > automatic replies, that need to be carried out on one computer, but then moved > so the same filter does not affect it on the second computer as well. It is > sometimes difficult to keep this in sync. But it is still 100 times better > than > POP. That's why IMAP was created in the first place. To make sync easy. Suchthings as filtering, automatic replies (which is just another filter), labels or even folder subscription is server side feature and on proper IMAP server is handled there. What The Bat! could do is be good IMAP client for example by supporting filtering or labeling extensions on the server. I'm not sure if there is a mechanism for the client to get changes about folders in any convenient way though. -- Best regards, Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.133 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
RE: IMAP and Gmail
> VŠ> For what it's worth I must note, that Gmail's IMAP implementation > VŠ> is very different from other servers and some even doesn't > VŠ> consider it real IMAP (for example because of Sent Mail folder > behaviour). > > Well, Gmail's IMAP is made very well from what I see, actually. It has > its own quirks, but I would not call them bugs. What do you mean by > bugs, specifically. http://weblog.timaltman.com/archive/2008/02/24/gmails-buggy-imap-implementation For starters. Or http://mail.google.com/support/bin/answer.py?answer=77657 "Send a message -> Store message in Sent Mail" ??? "Delete a message from a folder -> Remove that label from the message" ?? These are serious flaws. -- Vilius Current beta is 5.0.0.130 | 'Using TBBETA' information: http://www.silverstones.com/thebat/TBUDLInfo.html
