Re: IOS 8.02 and VoiceOver

[Chuck Dean]

I just turned off voiceover, and started typing. Fleksy has its own voice.

Chuck (mobile)
Pleez x cuze enny tie ping or spelin air ores.

> On Sep 25, 2014, at 10:54 PM, Brett  wrote:
> 
> Well, how did you get Flexi to work without voice over running. I can't even 
> turn on the voicing option for Flexi.
> 
> Sent with Siri from Brett's iPhone
> 
>> On 26 Sep 2014, at 3:27 pm, Chuck Dean  wrote:
>> 
>> I also updated, and noticed that Fleksy still does not work with voiceover 
>> on. You have to turn voiceover off to get Fleksy to work at all. Then when I 
>> went to activate the menu, if Lexi crashed about three times. I'm not 
>> noticing much improvement.
>> 
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Re: IOS 8.02 and VoiceOver

[Brett]

Well, how did you get Flexi to work without voice over running. I can't even 
turn on the voicing option for Flexi.

Sent with Siri from Brett's iPhone

> On 26 Sep 2014, at 3:27 pm, Chuck Dean  wrote:
> 
> I also updated, and noticed that Fleksy still does not work with voiceover 
> on. You have to turn voiceover off to get Fleksy to work at all. Then when I 
> went to activate the menu, if Lexi crashed about three times. I'm not 
> noticing much improvement.
> 
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What to do about iOS8.0.1 already being downloaded

[Cheryl Homiak]

I downloaded and installed the 8.0.2 update on my 5S. But when I went to check 
for it on my 6+ I was told that 8.0.1 was downloaded and was asked if I wanted 
to install it, which of course I don't. Will this be eventually replaced by the 
notice of 8.0.2 or am I either going to have to go ahead and install 8.0.1 or 
find a way to delete that download before I am offered 8.0.2?

-- 
Cheryl

I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.
I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper
thrown in the trash!
Then God gave me a new heart and life:
His joy for my despairing tears!
And now, every day:
"This I call to mind,
and therefore I have hope:
The steadfast love of the Lord
never ceases;
his mercies never come to an end;
they are new every morning;
great is your faithfulness."
(Lamentations 3:21-23 ESV)




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Re: KNFB reader and the mofi juice pack

[Joanne Chua]

Hi, when you use it with the battery pack, you might want to check the
angle of your phone camera. I know some battery pack can be somewhat
bulk, and that might give you a different angle to the camera.



On 26/09/2014, Charles Rivard  wrote:
> Getting back on topic of the subject line, someone asked if the app would
> work with this case.  I'm wondering why it would not.  After all, the case
> does not affect apps any more than any other battery would, right?
>
> ---
> Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished,
> you! really! are! finished!
>   - Original Message -
>   From: Kerri
>   To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>   Sent: Friday, September 26, 2014 12:05 AM
>   Subject: Re: KNFB reader and the mofi juice pack
>
>
>   my issue is that I can't get the whole page to scan but then I'm not good
> at it yet.
>
>
>   ***
>   A careless word may kindle strife. A cruel  word may wreck a life. A
> timely word may level stress. But a loving word may heal and bless.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>   On Sep 25, 2014, at 7:25 PM, Julian  wrote:
>
>
> Hi Larry,
>
>
> I'm using it on an iPhone 5s in a Mophie juice pack and it works just
> fine.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Sep 25, 2014, at 6:25 PM, "Larry Lumpkin" 
> wrote:
>
>
>   Any problems using the reader on the phone in a mofi juice pack?
> Thanks.
>
>
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Re: IOS 8.02 and VoiceOver

[Chuck Dean]

I also updated, and noticed that Fleksy still does not work with voiceover on. 
You have to turn voiceover off to get Fleksy to work at all. Then when I went 
to activate the menu, if Lexi crashed about three times. I'm not noticing much 
improvement.

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iOS 8.0.2

[Marissa Solaun]

I just upgraded my iPhone 4S to iOS 8.0.2 and while I do notice that voiceover 
is a lot more responsive and does not crash as much . the accessibility issue 
of voiceover not speaking the Caller id still present and Siri and voice over 
do not work well on my device. Guessing that since there mention of 
accessibility fixes on the Apple vis website then that means that fixes will 
come in later versions of iOS eight?

Does anyone know, if the issue of the tone being emitted when you press the key 
or getting stuck has been fixed?

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Re: IOS 8.02 and VoiceOver

[Cathy Inglis]

I have updated to 8.02 and not any improvements at all. Still can not use the 
share function while texting.
Cathy  and Tiny.

> On Sep 26, 2014, at 12:54 AM, Brett  wrote:
> 
> Hi, 
> 
> I have just downloaded it. So far I have noticed that VoiceOver doesn't seem 
> to crash as much. Also entering a space in braille seems a lot more reliable, 
> although the issue still exists somewhat. 
> 
> This is what I have noticed so far. I will report further, if I notice more 
> improvements. 
> 
> So far, I see no reason for those on IOS8 not to upgrade. 
> 
> Cheers, 
> Brett. 
> 
> Sent with Siri from Brett's iPhone
> 
>> On 26 Sep 2014, at 2:15 pm, Shai  wrote:
>> 
>> Hello,
>> Has anyone had a chance to download IOS 8.02 and if so, what VoiceOver
>> bugs have been resolved? I was particularly waiting for the keypad and
>> sharing issues to be addressed. Has anyone had a chance to try these
>> out and confirm whether or not they are still present?
>> Thanks in advance for any responses
>> 
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Re: I love braille input in iOs 8!

[Cheryl Homiak]

Don't be discouraged! That's how I felt about Mbraille! Everybody else kept 
raving about it and I didn't want to admit I just couldn't seem to get it!

-- 
Cheryl

I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.
I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper
thrown in the trash!
Then God gave me a new heart and life:
His joy for my despairing tears!
And now, every day:
"This I call to mind,
and therefore I have hope:
The steadfast love of the Lord
never ceases;
his mercies never come to an end;
they are new every morning;
great is your faithfulness."
(Lamentations 3:21-23 ESV)




On Sep 25, 2014, at 8:12 PM, Nicki Keck  wrote:

> Man I have tried, but just can't get the hang of it.
> 
> Nicki
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Sep 25, 2014, at 12:57 PM, Cheryl Homiak  wrote:
> 
>> Somehow I never got the idea of mbraille; I don't know if I got stuck on 
>> calibration or what my problem was. But I have caught on to the built-in 
>> braille screen input and I am loving it!
>> 
>> -- 
>> Cheryl
>> 
>> I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.
>> I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper
>> thrown in the trash!
>> Then God gave me a new heart and life:
>> His joy for my despairing tears!
>> And now, every day:
>> "This I call to mind,
>> and therefore I have hope:
>> The steadfast love of the Lord
>> never ceases;
>> his mercies never come to an end;
>> they are new every morning;
>> great is your faithfulness."
>> (Lamentations 3:21-23 ESV)
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -- 
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> 
> 
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Re: Problems using onscreen Braille keyboard

[Cheryl Homiak]

I don't calibrate either. When I saw that this was mentioned here and in "iOS8 
without the eye" I wondered if I was doing something wrong but I figure if it 
ain't broke, don't fix it!

-- 
Cheryl

I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.
I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper
thrown in the trash!
Then God gave me a new heart and life:
His joy for my despairing tears!
And now, every day:
"This I call to mind,
and therefore I have hope:
The steadfast love of the Lord
never ceases;
his mercies never come to an end;
they are new every morning;
great is your faithfulness."
(Lamentations 3:21-23 ESV)




On Sep 25, 2014, at 8:16 PM, Alex Hall  wrote:

> Simply don't calibrate. I find calibration has no effect in Away Mode, and 
> the odd problems you discovered in Table Mode. However, nothing says you have 
> to calibrate, and I didn't even know you could for days. So, I never 
> calibrate, and things work well enough.
> On Sep 25, 2014, at 9:14 PM, Paweł Masarczyk  wrote:
> 
>> Hello guys!
>> 
>> I was trying this feature out on an iPhone 5.
>> 
>> I've discovered that when I calibrate the dot positions, it often happens 
>> that the 456 dots cell changes the dots positions in a rather uncontrollable 
>> manner. Sometimes dots 4 and 6 are turned round, sometimes it is dots 5 and 
>> 4 that change their positions.This makes it rather hard to type on it 
>> reliably.Has anyone found a way around this?\I've also noticed that it works 
>> best when you hold it with the home button to the right.
>> 
>> Best regards
>> Paw
>> eł
>> W dniu 2014-09-25 18:09, Cheryl Lenartiene pisze:
>>> Glad it's not just me. I always make sure that I am in braille input mode 
>>> before I start typing, and I traditionally use the phone in away mode. When 
>>> the phone decides that it does not want to recognize my gestures, it 
>>> recognizes nothing. It doesn't matter whether I am in contracted mode or 
>>> not. I have experimented with finger placement, and extremely exaggerated 
>>> swipes. Nothing works.
>>> 
>>> When I learned that Apple was putting braille input into iOS, I had a bit 
>>> of buyer's remorse for purchasing MBraille. I am so glad I still have it.
>>> 
>>> Cheryl
>>> 
>>> Be joyful always, pray continually, give thanks in all circumstances;
>>> for this is God's will for you in Christ Jesus.
>>> 1 Thessalonians 5:16-18
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>> On Sep 25, 2014, at 11:49 AM, Jenifer Barr  wrote:
>>> 
 Hi all. I thin; we all have to remember that this is a brand new 
 feature... and there will be bugs. I've experienced this as well. 
 
 Jenifer Barr
 Sent from my iPhone
 
 On Sep 25, 2014, at 10:20 AM, Cheryl Lenartiene 
  wrote:
 
> Hi all,
> 
> Much of the time, when I use the onscreen Braille keyboard, nothing I 
> type is recognized or input. Other gestures that aren't recognized 
> include turning contracted Braille translation on and off, attempting to 
> calibrate the dots, and attempting to use Explore Mode to locate the dots 
> on screen. The only gesture that seems to be recognized is the gesture to 
> change the rotor setting. Is anyone else experiencing this?
> 
> I am an experienced MBraille user, and MBraille is still working reliably 
> for me, so I don't think it's me or the hardware in my phone. Thoughts 
> appreciated.
> 
> Cheryl
> 
> Be joyful always, pray continually, give thanks in all circumstances;
> for this is God's will for you in Christ Jesus.
> 1 Thessalonians 5:16-18
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
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Re: KNFB reader and the mofi juice pack

[Charles Rivard]

Getting back on topic of the subject line, someone asked if the app would work 
with this case.  I'm wondering why it would not.  After all, the case does not 
affect apps any more than any other battery would, right?

---
Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, 
you! really! are! finished!
  - Original Message - 
  From: Kerri 
  To: viphone@googlegroups.com 
  Sent: Friday, September 26, 2014 12:05 AM
  Subject: Re: KNFB reader and the mofi juice pack


  my issue is that I can't get the whole page to scan but then I'm not good at 
it yet.


  ***
  A careless word may kindle strife. A cruel  word may wreck a life. A timely 
word may level stress. But a loving word may heal and bless.






  On Sep 25, 2014, at 7:25 PM, Julian  wrote:


Hi Larry, 


I'm using it on an iPhone 5s in a Mophie juice pack and it works just fine. 

Sent from my iPhone

On Sep 25, 2014, at 6:25 PM, "Larry Lumpkin"  wrote:


  Any problems using the reader on the phone in a mofi juice pack?  Thanks.


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Re: Let's try this again... iOS 8.0.2 is out

[Kerri]

I downloaded 8.2 and found that Alex cmd on right away after I redowloaded him. 
***
"A  friend is someone who knows the song in your heart and can sing it back 
to you when you have forgotten the words."

On Sep 25, 2014, at 6:23 PM, John Diakogeorgiou  wrote:

> I had to download it over air. When I used ITunes it downloaded then
> gave me an error message. It worked fine over the air but I haven't
> used it yet except to say that the touchpad and cell service both
> work.
> 
> On 9/25/14, Corey Michael Cook  wrote:
>> Downloading it now.
>> 
>> Fingers crossed.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Corey Cook
>> 
>> Facebook:
>> 
>>  corey.coo...@gmail.com
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
>> Of Cristóbal
>> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:27 PM
>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: Let's try this again... iOS 8.0.2 is out
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Once bitten. Twice shy? Anyway, Version 8.0.2 is now out. Same changelog as
>> 8.0.1 with the fixes for the cell and touch ID issues from the earlier
>> release.
>> 
>> Again, curious to hear of any Voiceover bug fixes.
>> 
>> http://www.theverge.com/2014/9/25/6841455/ios-8-0-2-available-to-fix-iphone-
>> 6-models
>> 
>> --
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> 
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Re: Release schedules [was "Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out"]

[Charles Rivard]

If the phone was given to you as an employee of a business, and they decide 
to upgrade, your phone will be upgraded.  Also, most companies, if they are 
smart, won't immediately jump to the latest and greatest.  The system must 
be working before businesses go to it.


Also, and this is a personal opinion, I would not jump to a Samsung phone 
based on one mistake by Apple, because, based on previous experience, they 
have corrected the problems in their operating systems.


---
Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, 
you! really! are! finished!
- Original Message - 
From: "Joanne Chua" 

To: 
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 10:56 PM
Subject: Re: Release schedules [was "Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out"]


Everyone have a choice. If you, as a customer, are not happy with what
they, Apple, are offering, you, as a customer can always get to the
Samsung/Google wagon. They, as Apple, didn't put a gun on your head
and force you to get the newest and latest. They, might put the
software on your phone, but you, as a customer can ignore it.


On 26/09/2014, Charles Rivard  wrote:

The customer should be their focus, because that's their source of income.
As a customer, I'd rather wait until the product is made right.  I can 
wait


for a few months to get a new iPhone.  It'll come out when it works
properly.  There's no harm in using what is stable and usable for a while
longer.  I still think that I, as a business, would be better off by 
getting


a reputation of producing quality, even though it may take a bit longer,
rather than producing fast and shoddy.  If they have to make something by
their deadline, and that something is very buggy, then maybe they should
move their deadline back next year, get it right, and then put it on the
market so that it works fairly well the first time it is sold.  I'll take
quality over speed every single time.

---
Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're 
finished,


you! really! are! finished!
- Original Message -
From: "Christopher J Chaltain" 
To: 
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:56 PM
Subject: Re: Release schedules [was "Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out"]


That may be what you prefer, but Apple and other large companies have to
worry about multiple things.

KNFB announced that they would be delaying the release of their iPhone
app a few weeks, and they gave a reason. They were criticized for doing
this and questions were raised as to the viability of a company that
couldn't meet their announced delivery dates. You may have been OK with
Apple postponing the release of IOS 8 and the availability of the new
iPhone 6's but others would have been unhappy, competitors would have
made hay with Apple's inability to meet their dates and people would
have questioned what's going on at Apple.

Sure, customers are unhappy when they get a buggy product, but they're
also unhappy when they have to wait for a product or don't get it when
it was promised to them. How many people have been holding off on
upgrading their iPhone waiting for the iPhone 6's to be released. Would
these people have been happy if they had to keep waiting and using their
old smart phones?

Don't forget that Apple also depends on the iPHone 6 for revenue. People
are holding off on buying new iPhones waiting for the iPhone 6's to come
out. How many iPhone 6's did Apple sell last weekend? Postponing the
availability of the iPhone 6 would hit Apple right in the pocket book.

Apple is also at the center of a whole ecosystem. Cell phone providers,
accessory manufacturers, resellers and others all have agreements with
Apple and are dependent on Apple meeting their commitments. If Apple was
constantly missing their commitments then their partners would start to
lose faith and confidence in Apple.

Apple also has other options besides just slipping their dates or
releasing products with too many bugs. They could drop some features and
put more resources into testing or fixing bugs. Apple is a very wealthy
company. They could probably throw more resources at IOS without
removing functionality from IOS.

When I went through CMMI training, I was asked, quality, schedule or
cost, pick one. I never met an executive that didn't say they're all
important, but I've also never seen a large company choose anything
other than schedule. I've seen companies throw money at products to keep
them on schedule, and I've seen companies ship products with too many
bugs just to keep them on schedule. I've also seen the pendulum swing
the other way, and once a company is beat up too much in the market
place over quality then you'll see a focus from them on quality the next
time around or two. They focus on quality by reducing the feature set a
bit, focusing on testing and bug fixing and letting their customers know
quality if priority #1. They still meet their dates though.

You may not believe it, but Apple has some pretty smart people making
decisions on whether to release a prod

Re: KNFB reader and the mofi juice pack

[Kerri]

my issue is that I can't get the whole page to scan but then I'm not good at it 
yet.

***
A careless word may kindle strife. A cruel  word may wreck a life. A timely 
word may level stress. But a loving word may heal and bless.



On Sep 25, 2014, at 7:25 PM, Julian  wrote:

> Hi Larry, 
> 
> I'm using it on an iPhone 5s in a Mophie juice pack and it works just fine. 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Sep 25, 2014, at 6:25 PM, "Larry Lumpkin"  wrote:
> 
>> Any problems using the reader on the phone in a mofi juice pack?  Thanks.
>> 
>> -- 
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>> All new members to the this list are moderated by default. If you have any 
>> questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you feel that a 
>> member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or moderators 
>> directly rather than posting on the list itself. The archives for this list 
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> 
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Re: Braille Inpput: What Helped me Figure it out

[Cheryl Homiak]

This is the first one that has really worked for me although I understood and 
could do typeinbraille, just not very fast.

-- 
Cheryl

I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.
I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper
thrown in the trash!
Then God gave me a new heart and life:
His joy for my despairing tears!
And now, every day:
"This I call to mind,
and therefore I have hope:
The steadfast love of the Lord
never ceases;
his mercies never come to an end;
they are new every morning;
great is your faithfulness."
(Lamentations 3:21-23 ESV)




On Sep 25, 2014, at 11:40 PM, Traci Duncan  wrote:

>  You explained that very well.
> 
> I look forward to trying this once I update to iOS 8.  Honestly though, I've 
> tried so many of the braille apps, and I have never gotten the hang of it.  
> At least not enough to consider it a speedy typing solution for me.
> 
> Traci
> 
> On Sep 25, 2014, at 9:08 PM, Cheryl Homiak  wrote:
> 
>> Okay, I've experimented with this in the light of people saying the dots 
>> stay backward in tabletop mode and here's what I found. But it's very 
>> confusing to try to write correctly so it has taken me a long time to put 
>> this down to try to communicate. I don't know if this is how it is 
>> "supposed" to work but this is what works for me for tabletop mode.
>> 
>> If I have the phone on my lap flat with the home button on my right and 
>> tturn the phone away from me so the home button and screen face out and then 
>> turn it back toward me, , my dots are backward. In other words, goign from 
>> left to right along the long edge of the phone that is closest to me, I will 
>> have 6 5 4 1 2 3, with 3 nearest the home button. If I put three fingers of 
>> my left hand down from left to right toward the left end of the long side 
>> but going from left to right on the long side, I will get an underscore. If 
>> I put three fingers of my right hand going along the long side further 
>> right, I will get an l. If instead, I hold the phone in my lap, again with 
>> the home button to my right and turn the phone so the home button is facing 
>> me, still on the right, then turn it back to tabletop, the dots from left to 
>> right are 3 2 1 4 5 6 with 6 nearest the home button.  Then putting three 
>> fingers of my left hand down from left to right on the long side that is 
>> toward me gives me an l where putting three fingers down on that long side 
>> but further right gives me an underscore. Brailling then feels so much like 
>> brailling on a braille writer that I forget and want to do a space in the 
>> middle of the long side by touching there where a space key would be on a 
>> braille writer. This  of course is wrong and instead usually puts an a where 
>> I wanted a space.
>> 
>> Here's the same equation with the home button on the left:
>> If I hold the phone flat on my lap with the home button to the left, turn it 
>> away so the home button is away from me but still on the left, and then turn 
>> it back flat in tabletop mode, again, i have from left to right: 6 5 4 1 2 3 
>> with 3 the furthest away from the home button. If, however, I hold it on my 
>> lap with the home button to the left and turn the phone toward me so the 
>> home button and screen are facing me, then turn the phone back flat, the 
>> dots are then as they should be from left to right: 3 2 1 4 5 6, which is 
>> the way they are on a braille writer except that the braille writer would 
>> have the space key between the 1 and the 4. 
>> 
>> I have done this several times and it appears to be consistent. So in other 
>> words, what works for me if I want to do tabletop is to hold the phone flat 
>> on my lap turn it toward me instead of away from me till it says away mode 
>> and then put it flat into tabletop mode again. The dots are then on the long 
>> side closest to me and not on the two ends of the phone.
>> 
>> If I am understanding rightly though I haven't tried to do away mode much,  
>> in away mode your dots are at the opposit ends of the phone so that 1 2 and 
>> 3 would be on the left short side and 4 5 6 are on the right short side 
>> which of course does not feel like brailling with a Perkins braille writer 
>> at least not for me.
>> 
>> Hth.
>> 
>> -- 
>> Cheryl
>> 
>> I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.
>> I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper
>> thrown in the trash!
>> Then God gave me a new heart and life:
>> His joy for my despairing tears!
>> And now, every day:
>> "This I call to mind,
>> and therefore I have hope:
>> The steadfast love of the Lord
>> never ceases;
>> his mercies never come to an end;
>> they are new every morning;
>> great is your faithfulness."
>> (Lamentations 3:21-23 ESV)
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> On Sep 25, 2014, at 9:01 PM, Sandy Finley  wrote:
>> 
>>> Nicki and others,
>>>  
>>> I don't know if this will help you but here is a set of steps I have 
>>> learned from  others that helped me with the braille input.
>>>  
>>> 1.When you land in an edi

Re: Release schedules [was "Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out"]

[Charles Rivard]

Does it hurt to discuss issues and voice our opinions?  If you don't like 
it, all you have to do is to hit the delete key on the subject line being 
used, and your problem will be solved.


---
Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, 
you! really! are! finished!
- Original Message - 
From: "Cristóbal" 

To: 
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 11:00 PM
Subject: RE: Release schedules [was "Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out"]


Good God, let it go folks. We're already on to version 8.0.2

-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Joanne Chua
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:56 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Release schedules [was "Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out"]

Everyone have a choice. If you, as a customer, are not happy with what they,
Apple, are offering, you, as a customer can always get to the Samsung/Google
wagon. They, as Apple, didn't put a gun on your head and force you to get
the newest and latest. They, might put the software on your phone, but you,
as a customer can ignore it.


On 26/09/2014, Charles Rivard  wrote:

The customer should be their focus, because that's their source of income.
As a customer, I'd rather wait until the product is made right.  I can
wait

for a few months to get a new iPhone.  It'll come out when it works
properly.  There's no harm in using what is stable and usable for a
while longer.  I still think that I, as a business, would be better
off by getting

a reputation of producing quality, even though it may take a bit
longer, rather than producing fast and shoddy.  If they have to make
something by their deadline, and that something is very buggy, then
maybe they should move their deadline back next year, get it right,
and then put it on the market so that it works fairly well the first
time it is sold.  I'll take quality over speed every single time.

---
Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're
finished,

you! really! are! finished!
- Original Message -
From: "Christopher J Chaltain" 
To: 
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:56 PM
Subject: Re: Release schedules [was "Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out"]


That may be what you prefer, but Apple and other large companies have
to worry about multiple things.

KNFB announced that they would be delaying the release of their iPhone
app a few weeks, and they gave a reason. They were criticized for
doing this and questions were raised as to the viability of a company
that couldn't meet their announced delivery dates. You may have been
OK with Apple postponing the release of IOS 8 and the availability of
the new iPhone 6's but others would have been unhappy, competitors
would have made hay with Apple's inability to meet their dates and
people would have questioned what's going on at Apple.

Sure, customers are unhappy when they get a buggy product, but they're
also unhappy when they have to wait for a product or don't get it when
it was promised to them. How many people have been holding off on
upgrading their iPhone waiting for the iPhone 6's to be released.
Would these people have been happy if they had to keep waiting and
using their old smart phones?

Don't forget that Apple also depends on the iPHone 6 for revenue.
People are holding off on buying new iPhones waiting for the iPhone
6's to come out. How many iPhone 6's did Apple sell last weekend?
Postponing the availability of the iPhone 6 would hit Apple right in the

pocket book.


Apple is also at the center of a whole ecosystem. Cell phone
providers, accessory manufacturers, resellers and others all have
agreements with Apple and are dependent on Apple meeting their
commitments. If Apple was constantly missing their commitments then
their partners would start to lose faith and confidence in Apple.

Apple also has other options besides just slipping their dates or
releasing products with too many bugs. They could drop some features
and put more resources into testing or fixing bugs. Apple is a very
wealthy company. They could probably throw more resources at IOS
without removing functionality from IOS.

When I went through CMMI training, I was asked, quality, schedule or
cost, pick one. I never met an executive that didn't say they're all
important, but I've also never seen a large company choose anything
other than schedule. I've seen companies throw money at products to
keep them on schedule, and I've seen companies ship products with too
many bugs just to keep them on schedule. I've also seen the pendulum
swing the other way, and once a company is beat up too much in the
market place over quality then you'll see a focus from them on quality
the next time around or two. They focus on quality by reducing the
feature set a bit, focusing on testing and bug fixing and letting
their customers know quality if priority #1. They still meet their dates

though.


You may not believe it, but Apple has some pretty smart people making
decisions on whethe

Re: IOS 8.02 and VoiceOver

[Brett]

Hi, 

I have just downloaded it. So far I have noticed that VoiceOver doesn't seem to 
crash as much. Also entering a space in braille seems a lot more reliable, 
although the issue still exists somewhat. 

This is what I have noticed so far. I will report further, if I notice more 
improvements. 

So far, I see no reason for those on IOS8 not to upgrade. 

Cheers, 
Brett. 

Sent with Siri from Brett's iPhone

> On 26 Sep 2014, at 2:15 pm, Shai  wrote:
> 
> Hello,
> Has anyone had a chance to download IOS 8.02 and if so, what VoiceOver
> bugs have been resolved? I was particularly waiting for the keypad and
> sharing issues to be addressed. Has anyone had a chance to try these
> out and confirm whether or not they are still present?
> Thanks in advance for any responses
> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the viphone list. 
> All new members to the this list are moderated by default. If you have any 
> questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you feel that a 
> member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or moderators 
> directly rather than posting on the list itself. The archives for this list 
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RE: Braille Input: What Helped me Figure it out

[Neal Ewers]

Yes, I have that thread. I'll try that as well.

 

Thanks.

 

Neal

 

 

From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Cheryl Homiak
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 11:32 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Braille Input: What Helped me Figure it out

 

Yw!

 

There actually is a way to deal with bluetooth keyboards too which has a
thread on this list if you can go back and find it. Sorry that I don't have
time to go back and reiterate it or repost it right now.

 

-- 

Cheryl

 

I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.

I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper

thrown in the trash!

Then God gave me a new heart and life:

His joy for my despairing tears!

And now, every day:

"This I call to mind,

and therefore I have hope:

The steadfast love of the Lord

never ceases;

his mercies never come to an end;

they are new every morning;

great is your faithfulness."

(Lamentations 3:21-23 ESV)

 

 

 

 

On Sep 25, 2014, at 11:27 PM, Neal Ewers  wrote:





Cheryl. This makes a lot of sense. I wondered if you could get to something
that was like the Perkins braille writer. That is what I am used to. I'm not
sure who came up with the flat V termonology, but it totally confused me.
And I don't think I would like away mode. Oh, I could get use to it, but it
would appear that there is an easier way.

 

This may make the bug of not being able to use a blue tooth keyboard a
little less frustating, because now, there is a choice that appears to work.

 

Thanks for taking the time to write this all out.

 

Neal

 

From:   viphone@googlegroups.com [
 mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Cheryl Homiak
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 11:09 PM
To:   viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Braille Inpput: What Helped me Figure it out

 

Okay, I've experimented with this in the light of people saying the dots
stay backward in tabletop mode and here's what I found. But it's very
confusing to try to write correctly so it has taken me a long time to put
this down to try to communicate. I don't know if this is how it is
"supposed" to work but this is what works for me for tabletop mode.

 

If I have the phone on my lap flat with the home button on my right and
tturn the phone away from me so the home button and screen face out and then
turn it back toward me, , my dots are backward. In other words, goign from
left to right along the long edge of the phone that is closest to me, I will
have 6 5 4 1 2 3, with 3 nearest the home button. If I put three fingers of
my left hand down from left to right toward the left end of the long side
but going from left to right on the long side, I will get an underscore. If
I put three fingers of my right hand going along the long side further
right, I will get an l. If instead, I hold the phone in my lap, again with
the home button to my right and turn the phone so the home button is facing
me, still on the right, then turn it back to tabletop, the dots from left to
right are 3 2 1 4 5 6 with 6 nearest the home button.  Then putting three
fingers of my left hand down from left to right on the long side that is
toward me gives me an l where putting three fingers down on that long side
but further right gives me an underscore. Brailling then feels so much like
brailling on a braille writer that I forget and want to do a space in the
middle of the long side by touching there where a space key would be on a
braille writer. This  of course is wrong and instead usually puts an a where
I wanted a space.

 

Here's the same equation with the home button on the left:

If I hold the phone flat on my lap with the home button to the left, turn it
away so the home button is away from me but still on the left, and then turn
it back flat in tabletop mode, again, i have from left to right: 6 5 4 1 2 3
with 3 the furthest away from the home button. If, however, I hold it on my
lap with the home button to the left and turn the phone toward me so the
home button and screen are facing me, then turn the phone back flat, the
dots are then as they should be from left to right: 3 2 1 4 5 6, which is
the way they are on a braille writer except that the braille writer would
have the space key between the 1 and the 4. 

 

I have done this several times and it appears to be consistent. So in other
words, what works for me if I want to do tabletop is to hold the phone flat
on my lap turn it toward me instead of away from me till it says away mode
and then put it flat into tabletop mode again. The dots are then on the long
side closest to me and not on the two ends of the phone.

 

If I am understanding rightly though I haven't tried to do away mode much,
in away mode your dots are at the opposit ends of the phone so that 1 2 and
3 would be on the left short side and 4 5 6 are on the right short side
which of course does not feel like brailling with a 

All Football Radio and Tunein

[Andy Baracco]

I have noticed that this year the feeds available on All Football Radio seem to 
be reduced. The feeds for the 49ers simply do not seem to work, and I have had 
to either use NFL Audio Pass or listen to the opponent’s feed.

Also, the same seems to be true for college football. I was not able to listen 
to the UCLA game this evening on AFR. I am able to hear it on Tunein radio. And 
as for Tunein, if you haven’t used it for a while, you now apparently have to 
sign up for an account. i did so on the PC, because I find it easier to do it 
that way. I then logged in in the Tunein app, and am now listening to the UCLA 
game. Go Bruans!

Andy
I'm not wearing a diaper, so don't try to change me.

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Re: Problems using onscreen Braille keyboard

[Brett]

aHi, 

For those with braille issues, check out the 8;.0;.2 upgrade. I was only 
experiencing the space issue, and while not completely gone: its vastly 
improved. 

Cheers, 
Brett. 

Sent with Siri from Brett's iPhone

> On 26 Sep 2014, at 10:58 am, Alex Hall  wrote:
> 
> The gesture for explore mode is not a double tap and hold, you simply place a 
> finger on the screen and leave it there until VO says "now in explore mode". 
> That might be part of the confusion.
>> On Sep 25, 2014, at 8:55 PM, Cheryl Lenartiene  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> When I can get it to work, what I entered does make sense. Fortunately, it's 
>> not gibberish. However, when it fails, it fails royally. It does not even 
>> recognize the double tap and hold gesture to enter explore mode.
>> 
>> Cheryl
>> 
>> Be joyful always, pray continually, give thanks in all circumstances;
>> for this is God's will for you in Christ Jesus.
>> 1 Thessalonians 5:16-18
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Sep 25, 2014, at 3:55 PM, Deb Lewis  wrote:
>>> 
>>> I've definitely done all this. Everything I write is jibberish. Lots
>>> of it is on the wrong side of the cell. If it isn't, it' just garbage
>>> for the most part. I've tried both modes. I know lots of people have
>>> gotten it to work, and I got it to work in the app so I don't know
>>> hwat's different here but it most definitely is.
>>> 
 On 9/25/14, RobH.  wrote:
 Oh, very good;  that's two gems;  the 2finger scrub to get out is more my
 thing.
 
 Rh.
 - Original Message -
 From: "Ioana Gandrabur" 
 To: 
 Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:22 PM
 Subject: Re: Problems using onscreen Braille keyboard
 
 
 Hi,
 
 Here is the section on writing in braille from the apple user guide, just 
 in
 
 case it might outline something you missed.
 I did not know for example about expand text option with 2 finger hlick
 down.
 
 http://help.apple.com/iphone/8/en.lproj/iph10366cc30.html";
 
 
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
> On Sep 25, 2014, at 11:10 AM, Deb Lewis  wrote:
> 
> I have the same issues as cheryl. I think we may not be getting it
> calibrated correctly. Don't know if anyone can comment to that aspect
> of it.
> 
> 
>> On 9/25/14, Alex Hall  wrote:
>> Aside from spaces not always registering, and key echo not working in
>> contracted mode, I have no problems. The actual accuracy of the braille
>> input (again, spaces notwithstanding) seems to be the same as MBraille.
>> Granted, I always use Away Mode, but still, all gestures and commands
>> work
>> as expected. This will sound rather stupid, I know, but are you sure you
>> enabled braille mode? Since the only gesture you can get working is the
>> rotor, it almost sounds like braille isn't on at all. Again, I know how
>> od
>> that sounds, but I can't think of why else it would not work for you.
>>> On Sep 25, 2014, at 10:39 AM, Jennie Facer 
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> I have found that if you use uncontracted Braille, it works better. You
>>> 
>>> do
>>> have to write that way, but characters are noticed better that way.
>>> 
>>> Jenn
>>> 
>>>   TO THE WORLD YOU ARE SOMEONE, BUT TO SOMENE YOU ARE THE
>>> WORLD!
>>> 
>>> On Sep 25, 2014, at 8:20 AM, Cheryl Lenartiene
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
 Hi all,
 
 Much of the time, when I use the onscreen Braille keyboard, nothing I
 type is recognized or input. Other gestures that aren't recognized
 include turning contracted Braille translation on and off, attempting
 to
 calibrate the dots, and attempting to use Explore Mode to locate the
 dots
 on screen. The only gesture that seems to be recognized is the gesture
 
 to
 change the rotor setting. Is anyone else experiencing this?
 
 I am an experienced MBraille user, and MBraille is still working
 reliably
 for me, so I don't think it's me or the hardware in my phone. Thoughts
 appreciated.
 
 Cheryl
 
 Be joyful always, pray continually, give thanks in all circumstances;
 for this is God's will for you in Christ Jesus.
 1 Thessalonians 5:16-18
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
 --
 The following information is important for all members of the viphone
 list. All new members to the this list are moderated by default. If
 you
 have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if
 you
 feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners
 or
 moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. The
 archives
 for this list can be searched at
 http://www.mail-archive.c

Re: Braille Inpput: What Helped me Figure it out

[Traci Duncan]

 You explained that very well.

I look forward to trying this once I update to iOS 8.  Honestly though, I've 
tried so many of the braille apps, and I have never gotten the hang of it.  At 
least not enough to consider it a speedy typing solution for me.

Traci

On Sep 25, 2014, at 9:08 PM, Cheryl Homiak  wrote:

> Okay, I've experimented with this in the light of people saying the dots stay 
> backward in tabletop mode and here's what I found. But it's very confusing to 
> try to write correctly so it has taken me a long time to put this down to try 
> to communicate. I don't know if this is how it is "supposed" to work but this 
> is what works for me for tabletop mode.
> 
> If I have the phone on my lap flat with the home button on my right and tturn 
> the phone away from me so the home button and screen face out and then turn 
> it back toward me, , my dots are backward. In other words, goign from left to 
> right along the long edge of the phone that is closest to me, I will have 6 5 
> 4 1 2 3, with 3 nearest the home button. If I put three fingers of my left 
> hand down from left to right toward the left end of the long side but going 
> from left to right on the long side, I will get an underscore. If I put three 
> fingers of my right hand going along the long side further right, I will get 
> an l. If instead, I hold the phone in my lap, again with the home button to 
> my right and turn the phone so the home button is facing me, still on the 
> right, then turn it back to tabletop, the dots from left to right are 3 2 1 4 
> 5 6 with 6 nearest the home button.  Then putting three fingers of my left 
> hand down from left to right on the long side that is toward me gives me an l 
> where putting three fingers down on that long side but further right gives me 
> an underscore. Brailling then feels so much like brailling on a braille 
> writer that I forget and want to do a space in the middle of the long side by 
> touching there where a space key would be on a braille writer. This  of 
> course is wrong and instead usually puts an a where I wanted a space.
> 
> Here's the same equation with the home button on the left:
> If I hold the phone flat on my lap with the home button to the left, turn it 
> away so the home button is away from me but still on the left, and then turn 
> it back flat in tabletop mode, again, i have from left to right: 6 5 4 1 2 3 
> with 3 the furthest away from the home button. If, however, I hold it on my 
> lap with the home button to the left and turn the phone toward me so the home 
> button and screen are facing me, then turn the phone back flat, the dots are 
> then as they should be from left to right: 3 2 1 4 5 6, which is the way they 
> are on a braille writer except that the braille writer would have the space 
> key between the 1 and the 4. 
> 
> I have done this several times and it appears to be consistent. So in other 
> words, what works for me if I want to do tabletop is to hold the phone flat 
> on my lap turn it toward me instead of away from me till it says away mode 
> and then put it flat into tabletop mode again. The dots are then on the long 
> side closest to me and not on the two ends of the phone.
> 
> If I am understanding rightly though I haven't tried to do away mode much,  
> in away mode your dots are at the opposit ends of the phone so that 1 2 and 3 
> would be on the left short side and 4 5 6 are on the right short side which 
> of course does not feel like brailling with a Perkins braille writer at least 
> not for me.
> 
> Hth.
> 
> -- 
> Cheryl
> 
> I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.
> I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper
> thrown in the trash!
> Then God gave me a new heart and life:
> His joy for my despairing tears!
> And now, every day:
> "This I call to mind,
> and therefore I have hope:
> The steadfast love of the Lord
> never ceases;
> his mercies never come to an end;
> they are new every morning;
> great is your faithfulness."
> (Lamentations 3:21-23 ESV)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Sep 25, 2014, at 9:01 PM, Sandy Finley  wrote:
> 
>> Nicki and others,
>>  
>> I don't know if this will help you but here is a set of steps I have learned 
>> from  others that helped me with the braille input.
>>  
>> 1.When you land in an edit field turn your rotor once to the right. 
>> The Braille keyboard is usually there because the Braille setting on your 
>> rotor follows the edit field around.
>>  
>> 2.   I find it useful  to use away mode. For some reason, when in table 
>> mode, dots 1, 2, 3 appear on the right so everything is backwards.
>>  
>> 3.   Once in a way mode, Do not calibrate just write.
>>  
>> Unfortunately, when trying to  use  contracted Braille the app does not echo 
>> characters. I like to have characters echoed at this point so I write in 
>> unconstructed Braille.
>>  
>> 4.   Flick once left to erase a character and once right for space.
>> 5.
>> 6.   When done rotor once left o

Re: Braille Input: What Helped me Figure it out

[Cheryl Homiak]

Yw!

There actually is a way to deal with bluetooth keyboards too which has a thread 
on this list if you can go back and find it. Sorry that I don't have time to go 
back and reiterate it or repost it right now.

-- 
Cheryl

I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.
I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper
thrown in the trash!
Then God gave me a new heart and life:
His joy for my despairing tears!
And now, every day:
"This I call to mind,
and therefore I have hope:
The steadfast love of the Lord
never ceases;
his mercies never come to an end;
they are new every morning;
great is your faithfulness."
(Lamentations 3:21-23 ESV)




On Sep 25, 2014, at 11:27 PM, Neal Ewers  wrote:

> Cheryl. This makes a lot of sense. I wondered if you could get to something 
> that was like the Perkins braille writer. That is what I am used to. I'm not 
> sure who came up with the flat V termonology, but it totally confused me. And 
> I don't think I would like away mode. Oh, I could get use to it, but it would 
> appear that there is an easier way.
>  
> This may make the bug of not being able to use a blue tooth keyboard a little 
> less frustating, because now, there is a choice that appears to work.
>  
> Thanks for taking the time to write this all out.
>  
> Neal
>  
> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of 
> Cheryl Homiak
> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 11:09 PM
> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: Braille Inpput: What Helped me Figure it out
>  
> Okay, I've experimented with this in the light of people saying the dots stay 
> backward in tabletop mode and here's what I found. But it's very confusing to 
> try to write correctly so it has taken me a long time to put this down to try 
> to communicate. I don't know if this is how it is "supposed" to work but this 
> is what works for me for tabletop mode.
>  
> If I have the phone on my lap flat with the home button on my right and tturn 
> the phone away from me so the home button and screen face out and then turn 
> it back toward me, , my dots are backward. In other words, goign from left to 
> right along the long edge of the phone that is closest to me, I will have 6 5 
> 4 1 2 3, with 3 nearest the home button. If I put three fingers of my left 
> hand down from left to right toward the left end of the long side but going 
> from left to right on the long side, I will get an underscore. If I put three 
> fingers of my right hand going along the long side further right, I will get 
> an l. If instead, I hold the phone in my lap, again with the home button to 
> my right and turn the phone so the home button is facing me, still on the 
> right, then turn it back to tabletop, the dots from left to right are 3 2 1 4 
> 5 6 with 6 nearest the home button.  Then putting three fingers of my left 
> hand down from left to right on the long side that is toward me gives me an l 
> where putting three fingers down on that long side but further right gives me 
> an underscore. Brailling then feels so much like brailling on a braille 
> writer that I forget and want to do a space in the middle of the long side by 
> touching there where a space key would be on a braille writer. This  of 
> course is wrong and instead usually puts an a where I wanted a space.
>  
> Here's the same equation with the home button on the left:
> If I hold the phone flat on my lap with the home button to the left, turn it 
> away so the home button is away from me but still on the left, and then turn 
> it back flat in tabletop mode, again, i have from left to right: 6 5 4 1 2 3 
> with 3 the furthest away from the home button. If, however, I hold it on my 
> lap with the home button to the left and turn the phone toward me so the home 
> button and screen are facing me, then turn the phone back flat, the dots are 
> then as they should be from left to right: 3 2 1 4 5 6, which is the way they 
> are on a braille writer except that the braille writer would have the space 
> key between the 1 and the 4. 
>  
> I have done this several times and it appears to be consistent. So in other 
> words, what works for me if I want to do tabletop is to hold the phone flat 
> on my lap turn it toward me instead of away from me till it says away mode 
> and then put it flat into tabletop mode again. The dots are then on the long 
> side closest to me and not on the two ends of the phone.
>  
> If I am understanding rightly though I haven't tried to do away mode much,  
> in away mode your dots are at the opposit ends of the phone so that 1 2 and 3 
> would be on the left short side and 4 5 6 are on the right short side which 
> of course does not feel like brailling with a Perkins braille writer at least 
> not for me.
>  
> Hth.
>  
> -- 
> Cheryl
>  
> I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.
> I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper
> thrown in the trash!
> Then God gave me a new heart and life:
> His joy for my despairing tears!
> And now, every d

RE: Braille Input: What Helped me Figure it out

[Neal Ewers]

Cheryl. This makes a lot of sense. I wondered if you could get to something
that was like the Perkins braille writer. That is what I am used to. I'm not
sure who came up with the flat V termonology, but it totally confused me.
And I don't think I would like away mode. Oh, I could get use to it, but it
would appear that there is an easier way.

 

This may make the bug of not being able to use a blue tooth keyboard a
little less frustating, because now, there is a choice that appears to work.

 

Thanks for taking the time to write this all out.

 

Neal

 

From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Cheryl Homiak
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 11:09 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Braille Inpput: What Helped me Figure it out

 

Okay, I've experimented with this in the light of people saying the dots
stay backward in tabletop mode and here's what I found. But it's very
confusing to try to write correctly so it has taken me a long time to put
this down to try to communicate. I don't know if this is how it is
"supposed" to work but this is what works for me for tabletop mode.

 

If I have the phone on my lap flat with the home button on my right and
tturn the phone away from me so the home button and screen face out and then
turn it back toward me, , my dots are backward. In other words, goign from
left to right along the long edge of the phone that is closest to me, I will
have 6 5 4 1 2 3, with 3 nearest the home button. If I put three fingers of
my left hand down from left to right toward the left end of the long side
but going from left to right on the long side, I will get an underscore. If
I put three fingers of my right hand going along the long side further
right, I will get an l. If instead, I hold the phone in my lap, again with
the home button to my right and turn the phone so the home button is facing
me, still on the right, then turn it back to tabletop, the dots from left to
right are 3 2 1 4 5 6 with 6 nearest the home button.  Then putting three
fingers of my left hand down from left to right on the long side that is
toward me gives me an l where putting three fingers down on that long side
but further right gives me an underscore. Brailling then feels so much like
brailling on a braille writer that I forget and want to do a space in the
middle of the long side by touching there where a space key would be on a
braille writer. This  of course is wrong and instead usually puts an a where
I wanted a space.

 

Here's the same equation with the home button on the left:

If I hold the phone flat on my lap with the home button to the left, turn it
away so the home button is away from me but still on the left, and then turn
it back flat in tabletop mode, again, i have from left to right: 6 5 4 1 2 3
with 3 the furthest away from the home button. If, however, I hold it on my
lap with the home button to the left and turn the phone toward me so the
home button and screen are facing me, then turn the phone back flat, the
dots are then as they should be from left to right: 3 2 1 4 5 6, which is
the way they are on a braille writer except that the braille writer would
have the space key between the 1 and the 4. 

 

I have done this several times and it appears to be consistent. So in other
words, what works for me if I want to do tabletop is to hold the phone flat
on my lap turn it toward me instead of away from me till it says away mode
and then put it flat into tabletop mode again. The dots are then on the long
side closest to me and not on the two ends of the phone.

 

If I am understanding rightly though I haven't tried to do away mode much,
in away mode your dots are at the opposit ends of the phone so that 1 2 and
3 would be on the left short side and 4 5 6 are on the right short side
which of course does not feel like brailling with a Perkins braille writer
at least not for me.

 

Hth.

 

-- 

Cheryl

 

I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.

I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper

thrown in the trash!

Then God gave me a new heart and life:

His joy for my despairing tears!

And now, every day:

"This I call to mind,

and therefore I have hope:

The steadfast love of the Lord

never ceases;

his mercies never come to an end;

they are new every morning;

great is your faithfulness."

(Lamentations 3:21-23 ESV)

 

 

 

 

On Sep 25, 2014, at 9:01 PM, Sandy Finley  wrote:





Nicki and others,

 

I don't know if this will help you but here is a set of steps I have learned
from  others that helped me with the braille input.

 

1.When you land in an edit field turn your rotor once to the right.
The Braille keyboard is usually there because the Braille setting on your
rotor follows the edit field around.

 

2.   I find it useful  to use away mode. For some reason, when in table
mode, dots 1, 2, 3 appear on the right so everything is backwards.

 

3.   Once in a way mode, Do not calibrate just write.

 

Unfortunatel

IOS 8.02 and VoiceOver

[Shai]

Hello,
Has anyone had a chance to download IOS 8.02 and if so, what VoiceOver
bugs have been resolved? I was particularly waiting for the keypad and
sharing issues to be addressed. Has anyone had a chance to try these
out and confirm whether or not they are still present?
Thanks in advance for any responses

-- 
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new members to the this list are moderated by default. If you have any 
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Re: Braille Inpput: What Helped me Figure it out

[Cheryl Homiak]

Okay, I've experimented with this in the light of people saying the dots stay 
backward in tabletop mode and here's what I found. But it's very confusing to 
try to write correctly so it has taken me a long time to put this down to try 
to communicate. I don't know if this is how it is "supposed" to work but this 
is what works for me for tabletop mode.

If I have the phone on my lap flat with the home button on my right and tturn 
the phone away from me so the home button and screen face out and then turn it 
back toward me, , my dots are backward. In other words, goign from left to 
right along the long edge of the phone that is closest to me, I will have 6 5 4 
1 2 3, with 3 nearest the home button. If I put three fingers of my left hand 
down from left to right toward the left end of the long side but going from 
left to right on the long side, I will get an underscore. If I put three 
fingers of my right hand going along the long side further right, I will get an 
l. If instead, I hold the phone in my lap, again with the home button to my 
right and turn the phone so the home button is facing me, still on the right, 
then turn it back to tabletop, the dots from left to right are 3 2 1 4 5 6 with 
6 nearest the home button.  Then putting three fingers of my left hand down 
from left to right on the long side that is toward me gives me an l where 
putting three fingers down on that long side but further right gives me an 
underscore. Brailling then feels so much like brailling on a braille writer 
that I forget and want to do a space in the middle of the long side by touching 
there where a space key would be on a braille writer. This  of course is wrong 
and instead usually puts an a where I wanted a space.

Here's the same equation with the home button on the left:
If I hold the phone flat on my lap with the home button to the left, turn it 
away so the home button is away from me but still on the left, and then turn it 
back flat in tabletop mode, again, i have from left to right: 6 5 4 1 2 3 with 
3 the furthest away from the home button. If, however, I hold it on my lap with 
the home button to the left and turn the phone toward me so the home button and 
screen are facing me, then turn the phone back flat, the dots are then as they 
should be from left to right: 3 2 1 4 5 6, which is the way they are on a 
braille writer except that the braille writer would have the space key between 
the 1 and the 4. 

I have done this several times and it appears to be consistent. So in other 
words, what works for me if I want to do tabletop is to hold the phone flat on 
my lap turn it toward me instead of away from me till it says away mode and 
then put it flat into tabletop mode again. The dots are then on the long side 
closest to me and not on the two ends of the phone.

If I am understanding rightly though I haven't tried to do away mode much,  in 
away mode your dots are at the opposit ends of the phone so that 1 2 and 3 
would be on the left short side and 4 5 6 are on the right short side which of 
course does not feel like brailling with a Perkins braille writer at least not 
for me.

Hth.

-- 
Cheryl

I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.
I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper
thrown in the trash!
Then God gave me a new heart and life:
His joy for my despairing tears!
And now, every day:
"This I call to mind,
and therefore I have hope:
The steadfast love of the Lord
never ceases;
his mercies never come to an end;
they are new every morning;
great is your faithfulness."
(Lamentations 3:21-23 ESV)




On Sep 25, 2014, at 9:01 PM, Sandy Finley  wrote:

> Nicki and others,
>  
> I don't know if this will help you but here is a set of steps I have learned 
> from  others that helped me with the braille input.
>  
> 1.When you land in an edit field turn your rotor once to the right. 
> The Braille keyboard is usually there because the Braille setting on your 
> rotor follows the edit field around.
>  
> 2.   I find it useful  to use away mode. For some reason, when in table 
> mode, dots 1, 2, 3 appear on the right so everything is backwards.
>  
> 3.   Once in a way mode, Do not calibrate just write.
>  
> Unfortunately, when trying to  use  contracted Braille the app does not echo 
> characters. I like to have characters echoed at this point so I write in 
> unconstructed Braille.
>  
> 4.   Flick once left to erase a character and once right for space.
> 5.
> 6.   When done rotor once left or right, then you can use VO gestures 
> again. HTH
>  
> Sandy
> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the viphone list. 
> All new members to the this list are moderated by default. If you have any 
> questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you feel that a 
> member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or moderators 
> directly rather than posting on the list itself. The archives for this list 
> can be searched a

Re: Release schedules [was "Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out"]

[Christopher J Chaltain]

And there's no option not to update if you're getting a new device. You 
need IOS 8 if you're getting an iPhone 6.


On 9/25/2014 11:02 PM, Neal Ewers wrote:

Actually, everyone does not have a choice. Some people work for companies
who only use Apple. So if the phone doesn't work, then you may be out of
luck. You are right, of course, when you say that people may not have to
update. However, some companies update all people at the same time. If the
device belongs to the company and they decide to update, you don't have a
choice. The good thing is that I doubt many companies have updated many
people this early in the release cycle.

Neal



-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Joanne Chua
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 10:56 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Release schedules [was "Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out"]

Everyone have a choice. If you, as a customer, are not happy with what they,
Apple, are offering, you, as a customer can always get to the Samsung/Google
wagon. They, as Apple, didn't put a gun on your head and force you to get
the newest and latest. They, might put the software on your phone, but you,
as a customer can ignore it.


On 26/09/2014, Charles Rivard  wrote:

The customer should be their focus, because that's their source of income.
As a customer, I'd rather wait until the product is made right.  I can
wait

for a few months to get a new iPhone.  It'll come out when it works
properly.  There's no harm in using what is stable and usable for a
while longer.  I still think that I, as a business, would be better
off by getting

a reputation of producing quality, even though it may take a bit
longer, rather than producing fast and shoddy.  If they have to make
something by their deadline, and that something is very buggy, then
maybe they should move their deadline back next year, get it right,
and then put it on the market so that it works fairly well the first
time it is sold.  I'll take quality over speed every single time.

---
Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're
finished,

you! really! are! finished!
- Original Message -
From: "Christopher J Chaltain" 
To: 
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:56 PM
Subject: Re: Release schedules [was "Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out"]


That may be what you prefer, but Apple and other large companies have
to worry about multiple things.

KNFB announced that they would be delaying the release of their iPhone
app a few weeks, and they gave a reason. They were criticized for
doing this and questions were raised as to the viability of a company
that couldn't meet their announced delivery dates. You may have been
OK with Apple postponing the release of IOS 8 and the availability of
the new iPhone 6's but others would have been unhappy, competitors
would have made hay with Apple's inability to meet their dates and
people would have questioned what's going on at Apple.

Sure, customers are unhappy when they get a buggy product, but they're
also unhappy when they have to wait for a product or don't get it when
it was promised to them. How many people have been holding off on
upgrading their iPhone waiting for the iPhone 6's to be released.
Would these people have been happy if they had to keep waiting and
using their old smart phones?

Don't forget that Apple also depends on the iPHone 6 for revenue.
People are holding off on buying new iPhones waiting for the iPhone
6's to come out. How many iPhone 6's did Apple sell last weekend?
Postponing the availability of the iPhone 6 would hit Apple right in the

pocket book.

Apple is also at the center of a whole ecosystem. Cell phone
providers, accessory manufacturers, resellers and others all have
agreements with Apple and are dependent on Apple meeting their
commitments. If Apple was constantly missing their commitments then
their partners would start to lose faith and confidence in Apple.

Apple also has other options besides just slipping their dates or
releasing products with too many bugs. They could drop some features
and put more resources into testing or fixing bugs. Apple is a very
wealthy company. They could probably throw more resources at IOS
without removing functionality from IOS.

When I went through CMMI training, I was asked, quality, schedule or
cost, pick one. I never met an executive that didn't say they're all
important, but I've also never seen a large company choose anything
other than schedule. I've seen companies throw money at products to
keep them on schedule, and I've seen companies ship products with too
many bugs just to keep them on schedule. I've also seen the pendulum
swing the other way, and once a company is beat up too much in the
market place over quality then you'll see a focus from them on quality
the next time around or two. They focus on quality by reducing the
feature set a bit, focusing on testing and bug fixing and letting
their customers know quality if priority #1. The

RE: Release schedules [was "Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out"]

[Neal Ewers]

Actually, everyone does not have a choice. Some people work for companies
who only use Apple. So if the phone doesn't work, then you may be out of
luck. You are right, of course, when you say that people may not have to
update. However, some companies update all people at the same time. If the
device belongs to the company and they decide to update, you don't have a
choice. The good thing is that I doubt many companies have updated many
people this early in the release cycle.

Neal



-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Joanne Chua
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 10:56 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Release schedules [was "Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out"]

Everyone have a choice. If you, as a customer, are not happy with what they,
Apple, are offering, you, as a customer can always get to the Samsung/Google
wagon. They, as Apple, didn't put a gun on your head and force you to get
the newest and latest. They, might put the software on your phone, but you,
as a customer can ignore it.


On 26/09/2014, Charles Rivard  wrote:
> The customer should be their focus, because that's their source of income.
> As a customer, I'd rather wait until the product is made right.  I can 
> wait
>
> for a few months to get a new iPhone.  It'll come out when it works 
> properly.  There's no harm in using what is stable and usable for a 
> while longer.  I still think that I, as a business, would be better 
> off by getting
>
> a reputation of producing quality, even though it may take a bit 
> longer, rather than producing fast and shoddy.  If they have to make 
> something by their deadline, and that something is very buggy, then 
> maybe they should move their deadline back next year, get it right, 
> and then put it on the market so that it works fairly well the first 
> time it is sold.  I'll take quality over speed every single time.
>
> ---
> Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're 
> finished,
>
> you! really! are! finished!
> - Original Message -
> From: "Christopher J Chaltain" 
> To: 
> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:56 PM
> Subject: Re: Release schedules [was "Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out"]
>
>
> That may be what you prefer, but Apple and other large companies have 
> to worry about multiple things.
>
> KNFB announced that they would be delaying the release of their iPhone 
> app a few weeks, and they gave a reason. They were criticized for 
> doing this and questions were raised as to the viability of a company 
> that couldn't meet their announced delivery dates. You may have been 
> OK with Apple postponing the release of IOS 8 and the availability of 
> the new iPhone 6's but others would have been unhappy, competitors 
> would have made hay with Apple's inability to meet their dates and 
> people would have questioned what's going on at Apple.
>
> Sure, customers are unhappy when they get a buggy product, but they're 
> also unhappy when they have to wait for a product or don't get it when 
> it was promised to them. How many people have been holding off on 
> upgrading their iPhone waiting for the iPhone 6's to be released. 
> Would these people have been happy if they had to keep waiting and 
> using their old smart phones?
>
> Don't forget that Apple also depends on the iPHone 6 for revenue. 
> People are holding off on buying new iPhones waiting for the iPhone 
> 6's to come out. How many iPhone 6's did Apple sell last weekend? 
> Postponing the availability of the iPhone 6 would hit Apple right in the
pocket book.
>
> Apple is also at the center of a whole ecosystem. Cell phone 
> providers, accessory manufacturers, resellers and others all have 
> agreements with Apple and are dependent on Apple meeting their 
> commitments. If Apple was constantly missing their commitments then 
> their partners would start to lose faith and confidence in Apple.
>
> Apple also has other options besides just slipping their dates or 
> releasing products with too many bugs. They could drop some features 
> and put more resources into testing or fixing bugs. Apple is a very 
> wealthy company. They could probably throw more resources at IOS 
> without removing functionality from IOS.
>
> When I went through CMMI training, I was asked, quality, schedule or 
> cost, pick one. I never met an executive that didn't say they're all 
> important, but I've also never seen a large company choose anything 
> other than schedule. I've seen companies throw money at products to 
> keep them on schedule, and I've seen companies ship products with too 
> many bugs just to keep them on schedule. I've also seen the pendulum 
> swing the other way, and once a company is beat up too much in the 
> market place over quality then you'll see a focus from them on quality 
> the next time around or two. They focus on quality by reducing the 
> feature set a bit, focusing on testing and bug fixing and letting 
> their customers know qualit

RE: Release schedules [was "Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out"]

[Cristóbal]

Good God, let it go folks. We're already on to version 8.0.2

-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Joanne Chua
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:56 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Release schedules [was "Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out"]

Everyone have a choice. If you, as a customer, are not happy with what they,
Apple, are offering, you, as a customer can always get to the Samsung/Google
wagon. They, as Apple, didn't put a gun on your head and force you to get
the newest and latest. They, might put the software on your phone, but you,
as a customer can ignore it.


On 26/09/2014, Charles Rivard  wrote:
> The customer should be their focus, because that's their source of income.
> As a customer, I'd rather wait until the product is made right.  I can 
> wait
>
> for a few months to get a new iPhone.  It'll come out when it works 
> properly.  There's no harm in using what is stable and usable for a 
> while longer.  I still think that I, as a business, would be better 
> off by getting
>
> a reputation of producing quality, even though it may take a bit 
> longer, rather than producing fast and shoddy.  If they have to make 
> something by their deadline, and that something is very buggy, then 
> maybe they should move their deadline back next year, get it right, 
> and then put it on the market so that it works fairly well the first 
> time it is sold.  I'll take quality over speed every single time.
>
> ---
> Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're 
> finished,
>
> you! really! are! finished!
> - Original Message -
> From: "Christopher J Chaltain" 
> To: 
> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:56 PM
> Subject: Re: Release schedules [was "Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out"]
>
>
> That may be what you prefer, but Apple and other large companies have 
> to worry about multiple things.
>
> KNFB announced that they would be delaying the release of their iPhone 
> app a few weeks, and they gave a reason. They were criticized for 
> doing this and questions were raised as to the viability of a company 
> that couldn't meet their announced delivery dates. You may have been 
> OK with Apple postponing the release of IOS 8 and the availability of 
> the new iPhone 6's but others would have been unhappy, competitors 
> would have made hay with Apple's inability to meet their dates and 
> people would have questioned what's going on at Apple.
>
> Sure, customers are unhappy when they get a buggy product, but they're 
> also unhappy when they have to wait for a product or don't get it when 
> it was promised to them. How many people have been holding off on 
> upgrading their iPhone waiting for the iPhone 6's to be released. 
> Would these people have been happy if they had to keep waiting and 
> using their old smart phones?
>
> Don't forget that Apple also depends on the iPHone 6 for revenue. 
> People are holding off on buying new iPhones waiting for the iPhone 
> 6's to come out. How many iPhone 6's did Apple sell last weekend? 
> Postponing the availability of the iPhone 6 would hit Apple right in the
pocket book.
>
> Apple is also at the center of a whole ecosystem. Cell phone 
> providers, accessory manufacturers, resellers and others all have 
> agreements with Apple and are dependent on Apple meeting their 
> commitments. If Apple was constantly missing their commitments then 
> their partners would start to lose faith and confidence in Apple.
>
> Apple also has other options besides just slipping their dates or 
> releasing products with too many bugs. They could drop some features 
> and put more resources into testing or fixing bugs. Apple is a very 
> wealthy company. They could probably throw more resources at IOS 
> without removing functionality from IOS.
>
> When I went through CMMI training, I was asked, quality, schedule or 
> cost, pick one. I never met an executive that didn't say they're all 
> important, but I've also never seen a large company choose anything 
> other than schedule. I've seen companies throw money at products to 
> keep them on schedule, and I've seen companies ship products with too 
> many bugs just to keep them on schedule. I've also seen the pendulum 
> swing the other way, and once a company is beat up too much in the 
> market place over quality then you'll see a focus from them on quality 
> the next time around or two. They focus on quality by reducing the 
> feature set a bit, focusing on testing and bug fixing and letting 
> their customers know quality if priority #1. They still meet their dates
though.
>
> You may not believe it, but Apple has some pretty smart people making 
> decisions on whether to release a product on time or not with the 
> given set of bugs. I can assure you that they've considered your three 
> options, and there's a reason they stick to their committed schedule
>
> On 9/25/2014 6:01 PM, Charles Rivard wrote:
>> As a customer, which would you pref

RE: Problems using onscreen Braille keyboard

[Neal Ewers]

Hi all. Several questions about the braille keyboard.

 

I have not upgraded yet, but I am getting lots of questions from people.

 

One. Is it really true that when using table top mode, the dots are reversed 
left and right from what they are in away mode?

 

Two. In this flat v table top mode, I am not sure how to know what this 
arrangement would be. 

 

Three. If you don’t need to calibrate, how far can you change where your 
fingers are. What if I wanted to type like I might on a braille display so 
that, for example, you hold your hands so that your fingers run parallel to the 
length of the phone with dots 1 2 and 3 in the left hand, and 4 5 and 6 in the 
right. Can this be done.

 

Thanks all for your help.

 

Neal

 

 

 

 

From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of 
Alex Hall
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:17 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Problems using onscreen Braille keyboard

 

Simply don't calibrate. I find calibration has no effect in Away Mode, and the 
odd problems you discovered in Table Mode. However, nothing says you have to 
calibrate, and I didn't even know you could for days. So, I never calibrate, 
and things work well enough.

On Sep 25, 2014, at 9:14 PM, Paweł Masarczyk  wrote:





Hello guys!

I was trying this feature out on an iPhone 5.

I've discovered that when I calibrate the dot positions, it often happens that 
the 456 dots cell changes the dots positions in a rather uncontrollable manner. 
Sometimes dots 4 and 6 are turned round, sometimes it is dots 5 and 4 that 
change their positions.This makes it rather hard to type on it reliably.Has 
anyone found a way around this?\I've also noticed that it works best when you 
hold it with the home button to the right.

Best regards
Paw
eł

W dniu 2014-09-25 18:09, Cheryl Lenartiene pisze:

Glad it's not just me. I always make sure that I am in braille input mode 
before I start typing, and I traditionally use the phone in away mode. When the 
phone decides that it does not want to recognize my gestures, it recognizes 
nothing. It doesn't matter whether I am in contracted mode or not. I have 
experimented with finger placement, and extremely exaggerated swipes. Nothing 
works.

 

When I learned that Apple was putting braille input into iOS, I had a bit of 
buyer's remorse for purchasing MBraille. I am so glad I still have it.

 

Cheryl





Be joyful always, pray continually, give thanks in all circumstances;

for this is God's will for you in Christ Jesus.

1 Thessalonians 5:16-18

 

Sent from my iPhone


On Sep 25, 2014, at 11:49 AM, Jenifer Barr  wrote:

Hi all. I thin; we all have to remember that this is a brand new feature... and 
there will be bugs. I've experienced this as well. 

Jenifer Barr 

Sent from my iPhone


On Sep 25, 2014, at 10:20 AM, Cheryl Lenartiene  
wrote:

Hi all,

 

Much of the time, when I use the onscreen Braille keyboard, nothing I type is 
recognized or input. Other gestures that aren't recognized include turning 
contracted Braille translation on and off, attempting to calibrate the dots, 
and attempting to use Explore Mode to locate the dots on screen. The only 
gesture that seems to be recognized is the gesture to change the rotor setting. 
Is anyone else experiencing this?

 

I am an experienced MBraille user, and MBraille is still working reliably for 
me, so I don't think it's me or the hardware in my phone. Thoughts appreciated.

 

Cheryl




Be joyful always, pray continually, give thanks in all circumstances;

for this is God's will for you in Christ Jesus.

1 Thessalonians 5:16-18

 

Sent from my iPhone

-- 
The following information is important for all members of the viphone list. All 
new members to the this list are moderated by default. If you have any 
questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you feel that a 
member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or moderators 
directly rather than posting on the list itself. The archives for this list can 
be searched at http://www.mail-archive.com/viphone@googlegroups.com/.
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You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
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To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email 
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The following information is important for all members of the viphone list. All 
new members to the this list are moderated by default. If you have any 
questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you feel that a 
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be searched at http://www.mail-archive.com/viphone@googlegroups.com/.
--- 
You received t

Re: Release schedules [was "Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out"]

[Joanne Chua]

Everyone have a choice. If you, as a customer, are not happy with what
they, Apple, are offering, you, as a customer can always get to the
Samsung/Google wagon. They, as Apple, didn't put a gun on your head
and force you to get the newest and latest. They, might put the
software on your phone, but you, as a customer can ignore it.


On 26/09/2014, Charles Rivard  wrote:
> The customer should be their focus, because that's their source of income.
> As a customer, I'd rather wait until the product is made right.  I can wait
>
> for a few months to get a new iPhone.  It'll come out when it works
> properly.  There's no harm in using what is stable and usable for a while
> longer.  I still think that I, as a business, would be better off by getting
>
> a reputation of producing quality, even though it may take a bit longer,
> rather than producing fast and shoddy.  If they have to make something by
> their deadline, and that something is very buggy, then maybe they should
> move their deadline back next year, get it right, and then put it on the
> market so that it works fairly well the first time it is sold.  I'll take
> quality over speed every single time.
>
> ---
> Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished,
>
> you! really! are! finished!
> - Original Message -
> From: "Christopher J Chaltain" 
> To: 
> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:56 PM
> Subject: Re: Release schedules [was "Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out"]
>
>
> That may be what you prefer, but Apple and other large companies have to
> worry about multiple things.
>
> KNFB announced that they would be delaying the release of their iPhone
> app a few weeks, and they gave a reason. They were criticized for doing
> this and questions were raised as to the viability of a company that
> couldn't meet their announced delivery dates. You may have been OK with
> Apple postponing the release of IOS 8 and the availability of the new
> iPhone 6's but others would have been unhappy, competitors would have
> made hay with Apple's inability to meet their dates and people would
> have questioned what's going on at Apple.
>
> Sure, customers are unhappy when they get a buggy product, but they're
> also unhappy when they have to wait for a product or don't get it when
> it was promised to them. How many people have been holding off on
> upgrading their iPhone waiting for the iPhone 6's to be released. Would
> these people have been happy if they had to keep waiting and using their
> old smart phones?
>
> Don't forget that Apple also depends on the iPHone 6 for revenue. People
> are holding off on buying new iPhones waiting for the iPhone 6's to come
> out. How many iPhone 6's did Apple sell last weekend? Postponing the
> availability of the iPhone 6 would hit Apple right in the pocket book.
>
> Apple is also at the center of a whole ecosystem. Cell phone providers,
> accessory manufacturers, resellers and others all have agreements with
> Apple and are dependent on Apple meeting their commitments. If Apple was
> constantly missing their commitments then their partners would start to
> lose faith and confidence in Apple.
>
> Apple also has other options besides just slipping their dates or
> releasing products with too many bugs. They could drop some features and
> put more resources into testing or fixing bugs. Apple is a very wealthy
> company. They could probably throw more resources at IOS without
> removing functionality from IOS.
>
> When I went through CMMI training, I was asked, quality, schedule or
> cost, pick one. I never met an executive that didn't say they're all
> important, but I've also never seen a large company choose anything
> other than schedule. I've seen companies throw money at products to keep
> them on schedule, and I've seen companies ship products with too many
> bugs just to keep them on schedule. I've also seen the pendulum swing
> the other way, and once a company is beat up too much in the market
> place over quality then you'll see a focus from them on quality the next
> time around or two. They focus on quality by reducing the feature set a
> bit, focusing on testing and bug fixing and letting their customers know
> quality if priority #1. They still meet their dates though.
>
> You may not believe it, but Apple has some pretty smart people making
> decisions on whether to release a product on time or not with the given
> set of bugs. I can assure you that they've considered your three
> options, and there's a reason they stick to their committed schedule
>
> On 9/25/2014 6:01 PM, Charles Rivard wrote:
>> As a customer, which would you prefer:
>>
>> 1.  A product delivered on time, regardless of the quality.
>>
>> 2.  A product delayed due to problems in the programming.
>>
>> 3.  Number 2, with an explanation of why there is a delay.
>>
>> I, personally, would prefer option 3.
>>
>> If I had a business, I would give customers option 3.  My reputation would
>>
>> be that I produce reliable, good qu

Re: Changes to Goodreads App

[Joanne Chua]

Hi Yulanda,

Maybe some users have not experience with the books progress before.
>From what i can remember, it always there...
By saying so, i haven't update to the new GR app yet, deal to laziness
than anything.

Yes, i know, i have been lazy with the techy part of things lately.

J


On 26/09/2014, Yolanda  wrote:
> I use it daily as well, and so far have not found any part of the update
> that was not accessible.
>
> On 9/25/2014 9:00 PM, Joanne Chua wrote:
>> Reading the update screen for the update features might also help you
>> decide either to update or not updating an app.
>> On Goodreads, it stated clearly that the new update will give you a
>> progress bar for better control on your book progress.
>>
>> I hope they will keep GR accessibl. I use Goodreads in a daily bases.
>>
>>
>>
>> Joanne Chua
>> The flip side of Inclusion is Exclusion.
>> Leaders For Tomorrow 2013 Candidate
>> Send from my iPad
>>
>>> On 26 Sep 2014, at 7:48, Michelle Bernstein
>>>  wrote:
>>>
>>> Thank you for this helpful information.  I learned a good lesson today
>>> which is to turn off the automatic updates in the settings part of my
>>> iPad until I evaluate what is involved with each update.
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>
 On Sep 25, 2014, at 5:41 PM, "Alan Lemly"  wrote:

 Michelle, in the iOS world, the only way to return to an earlier version
 of
 an app once it's been updated is if you made a backup copy of the older
 version of the app on your computer and then use iTunes to reinstall
 it.
 Someone correct me if this is not accurate.

 Alan Lemly

 -Original Message-
 From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On
 Behalf
 Of Michelle Bernstein
 Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 12:16 PM
 To: viphone@googlegroups.com
 Subject: RE: Changes to Goodreads App

 Thank you, Sieghard, for that helpful explanation about automatic
 updates. I
 reset the settings on my Ipad so that automatic updates of my apps will
 not
 be permitted.   Even though I receive the Goodreads newsletter and
 other
 notifications, I was unaware that an update of this app was planned
 until it
 occurred and I contacted their support to find out how to return to the
 earlier version of the app.

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Re: Changes to Goodreads App

[Yolanda]

I use it daily as well, and so far have not found any part of the update 
that was not accessible.


On 9/25/2014 9:00 PM, Joanne Chua wrote:

Reading the update screen for the update features might also help you decide 
either to update or not updating an app.
On Goodreads, it stated clearly that the new update will give you a progress 
bar for better control on your book progress.

I hope they will keep GR accessibl. I use Goodreads in a daily bases.



Joanne Chua
The flip side of Inclusion is Exclusion.
Leaders For Tomorrow 2013 Candidate
Send from my iPad


On 26 Sep 2014, at 7:48, Michelle Bernstein  
wrote:

Thank you for this helpful information.  I learned a good lesson today which is 
to turn off the automatic updates in the settings part of my iPad until I 
evaluate what is involved with each update.

Sent from my iPad


On Sep 25, 2014, at 5:41 PM, "Alan Lemly"  wrote:

Michelle, in the iOS world, the only way to return to an earlier version of
an app once it's been updated is if you made a backup copy of the older
version of the app on your computer and then use iTunes to reinstall it.
Someone correct me if this is not accurate.

Alan Lemly

-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Michelle Bernstein
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 12:16 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: Changes to Goodreads App

Thank you, Sieghard, for that helpful explanation about automatic updates. I
reset the settings on my Ipad so that automatic updates of my apps will not
be permitted.   Even though I receive the Goodreads newsletter and other
notifications, I was unaware that an update of this app was planned until it
occurred and I contacted their support to find out how to return to the
earlier version of the app.

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Re: Release schedules [was "Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out"]

[Charles Rivard]

The customer should be their focus, because that's their source of income. 
As a customer, I'd rather wait until the product is made right.  I can wait 
for a few months to get a new iPhone.  It'll come out when it works 
properly.  There's no harm in using what is stable and usable for a while 
longer.  I still think that I, as a business, would be better off by getting 
a reputation of producing quality, even though it may take a bit longer, 
rather than producing fast and shoddy.  If they have to make something by 
their deadline, and that something is very buggy, then maybe they should 
move their deadline back next year, get it right, and then put it on the 
market so that it works fairly well the first time it is sold.  I'll take 
quality over speed every single time.


---
Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, 
you! really! are! finished!
- Original Message - 
From: "Christopher J Chaltain" 

To: 
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:56 PM
Subject: Re: Release schedules [was "Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out"]


That may be what you prefer, but Apple and other large companies have to
worry about multiple things.

KNFB announced that they would be delaying the release of their iPhone
app a few weeks, and they gave a reason. They were criticized for doing
this and questions were raised as to the viability of a company that
couldn't meet their announced delivery dates. You may have been OK with
Apple postponing the release of IOS 8 and the availability of the new
iPhone 6's but others would have been unhappy, competitors would have
made hay with Apple's inability to meet their dates and people would
have questioned what's going on at Apple.

Sure, customers are unhappy when they get a buggy product, but they're
also unhappy when they have to wait for a product or don't get it when
it was promised to them. How many people have been holding off on
upgrading their iPhone waiting for the iPhone 6's to be released. Would
these people have been happy if they had to keep waiting and using their
old smart phones?

Don't forget that Apple also depends on the iPHone 6 for revenue. People
are holding off on buying new iPhones waiting for the iPhone 6's to come
out. How many iPhone 6's did Apple sell last weekend? Postponing the
availability of the iPhone 6 would hit Apple right in the pocket book.

Apple is also at the center of a whole ecosystem. Cell phone providers,
accessory manufacturers, resellers and others all have agreements with
Apple and are dependent on Apple meeting their commitments. If Apple was
constantly missing their commitments then their partners would start to
lose faith and confidence in Apple.

Apple also has other options besides just slipping their dates or
releasing products with too many bugs. They could drop some features and
put more resources into testing or fixing bugs. Apple is a very wealthy
company. They could probably throw more resources at IOS without
removing functionality from IOS.

When I went through CMMI training, I was asked, quality, schedule or
cost, pick one. I never met an executive that didn't say they're all
important, but I've also never seen a large company choose anything
other than schedule. I've seen companies throw money at products to keep
them on schedule, and I've seen companies ship products with too many
bugs just to keep them on schedule. I've also seen the pendulum swing
the other way, and once a company is beat up too much in the market
place over quality then you'll see a focus from them on quality the next
time around or two. They focus on quality by reducing the feature set a
bit, focusing on testing and bug fixing and letting their customers know
quality if priority #1. They still meet their dates though.

You may not believe it, but Apple has some pretty smart people making
decisions on whether to release a product on time or not with the given
set of bugs. I can assure you that they've considered your three
options, and there's a reason they stick to their committed schedule

On 9/25/2014 6:01 PM, Charles Rivard wrote:

As a customer, which would you prefer:

1.  A product delivered on time, regardless of the quality.

2.  A product delayed due to problems in the programming.

3.  Number 2, with an explanation of why there is a delay.

I, personally, would prefer option 3.

If I had a business, I would give customers option 3.  My reputation would 
be that I produce reliable, good quality software.  Loyal customers would 
spread my reputation, bringing in more customers based on that reputation.


---
Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're 
finished, you! really! are! finished!
- Original Message - From: "Christopher Chaltain" 


To: 
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 6:59 AM
Subject: Release schedules [was "Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out"]


Obviously customer satisfaction suffers when a program is released with
a lot of bugs, but customer satisfaction also suffers when a program is

Re: Changes to Goodreads App

[Joanne Chua]

Reading the update screen for the update features might also help you decide 
either to update or not updating an app.
On Goodreads, it stated clearly that the new update will give you a progress 
bar for better control on your book progress.

I hope they will keep GR accessibl. I use Goodreads in a daily bases.



Joanne Chua
The flip side of Inclusion is Exclusion.
Leaders For Tomorrow 2013 Candidate
Send from my iPad

> On 26 Sep 2014, at 7:48, Michelle Bernstein  
> wrote:
> 
> Thank you for this helpful information.  I learned a good lesson today which 
> is to turn off the automatic updates in the settings part of my iPad until I 
> evaluate what is involved with each update.
> 
> Sent from my iPad
> 
>> On Sep 25, 2014, at 5:41 PM, "Alan Lemly"  wrote:
>> 
>> Michelle, in the iOS world, the only way to return to an earlier version of
>> an app once it's been updated is if you made a backup copy of the older
>> version of the app on your computer and then use iTunes to reinstall it.
>> Someone correct me if this is not accurate.
>> 
>> Alan Lemly
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
>> Of Michelle Bernstein
>> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 12:16 PM
>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: RE: Changes to Goodreads App
>> 
>> Thank you, Sieghard, for that helpful explanation about automatic updates. I
>> reset the settings on my Ipad so that automatic updates of my apps will not
>> be permitted.   Even though I receive the Goodreads newsletter and other
>> notifications, I was unaware that an update of this app was planned until it
>> occurred and I contacted their support to find out how to return to the
>> earlier version of the app.
>> 
>> -- 
>> The following information is important for all members of the viphone list.
>> All new members to the this list are moderated by default. If you have any
>> questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you feel that a
>> member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or moderators
>> directly rather than posting on the list itself. The archives for this list
>> can be searched at http://www.mail-archive.com/viphone@googlegroups.com/.
>> --- 
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RE: Some Tips On Braille On-screen Input

[Nicki Keck]

I never used m-Braille so admittedly, I am new to braille input on a touch
screen.  But I go into explore mode and hit what I thihnk should be dot 1
and it says 2 instead and I move over and can't get to dot 1.  I am really
having trouble really getting where the dots are positioned on the screen.
I have tried both tabletop and away modes.  I do a bit better with away
mode, but not much.  What's weird is the first time I tried it, I did it
successfully but since then I have gotten no where.  The patterns just don't
make any sense to me.  And it's funny.  It will say "screen away mode, home
button to the right" and my home button is not on the right and when I move
it to the right it then says "tabletop mode, home button to the left and so
it seems almost like my home button is opposite what it should be.  And the
person who said you don't have to have your home button where they say,
wouldn't the dots be harder to find if it is not where VO says it should be?

I do have a braille display, but would like to master this braille input for
times I don't want to use it but want to type something.  I have tried and
done successfully direct touch typing, but I think if I could just get this,
it would be even faster than that.  I know braille very well, having learned
it when I was 6, both grade 1 and grade 2 or contracted braille.  I do input
very successfully with my braille display, though the sluggishness in IOS 8
is driving me batty.  But that's a topic for another thread.  So it's not a
matter of me not knowing braille well enough.  But this truly has me
baffled, and I've listened to the applevis podcast multiple times.


-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Cheryl Homiak
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 5:29 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Some Tips On Braille On-screen Input

I don't think you can make that comparison with your 4s unless the new
braille input really is exactly mbraille. The only reason I question this is
that for some reason, though I know other people had great success and I am
glad for them, I never could at all master mbraille and yet I am doing well
with the built-in system. That's not a criticism of mbraille or a defense of
the built-in system; it just makes me question whether the two systems are
actually totally the same and can be reliably compared as to the performance
of mbraile on a 4s still running iOS7 and the built-in system   on a phone
running iOS8. It seems to me that for me to have had so much trouble with
one and be doing well on the other, there must be some difference between
the two but i don't know what that difference would be. What does seem
obvious is that some people who do well on mbraille are having trouble with
the built-in system and at least one person who could not manage mbraille is
doing well with the built-in system.

--
Cheryl

I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.
I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper thrown in the trash!
Then God gave me a new heart and life:
His joy for my despairing tears!
And now, every day:
"This I call to mind,
and therefore I have hope:
The steadfast love of the Lord
never ceases;
his mercies never come to an end;
they are new every morning;
great is your faithfulness."
(Lamentations 3:21-23 ESV)




On Sep 25, 2014, at 4:17 PM, Deb Lewis  wrote:

> Well I think I'm following all the instructions just fine. I haven't 
> seen anything I didn't know. But when I'm in exploring mode, I get one 
> pattern correctly named, change one figer and it gives me an entirely 
> unrelated pattern even though some fingers have not moved at all. I 
> get the same results in table top or landscape mde. I can confirm that 
> with my 4S, which was not upgraded, I can still use MBraille just 
> fine. So there may be something about my phone itself.
> 
> On 9/25/14, Cheryl Homiak  wrote:
>> Actually, the home button does not have to be on the left for 
>> tabletop mode though the default has the dots going 1 through 6 from 
>> left to right with the home button the left so that turning it with 
>> the home button on the right would make them backwards. . You can go 
>> to away mode and then turn the phone around with the home button 
>> facing right and go back to tabletop mode and get dots 1 through 6 
>> still going from left to right. The same is true in away mode; the 
>> home button does not have to be on the right. Everything is totally 
>> reversible and you can have the home button wherever you want it at any
time.
>> 
>> --
>> Cheryl
>> 
>> I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.
>> I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper thrown in the trash!
>> Then God gave me a new heart and life:
>> His joy for my despairing tears!
>> And now, every day:
>> "This I call to mind,
>> and therefore I have hope:
>> The steadfast love of the Lord
>> never ceases;
>> his mercies never come to an end;
>> they are new every morning;
>> great is your faithfulness."
>>

Re: Braille Input: What Helped me Figure it out

[Sharonda Greenlaw]

this is awesome information. Thanks! I am writing this in Braille
!

Sharonda
Sent from my mobile device; please excuse all mistakes 

> On Sep 25, 2014, at 7:20 PM, Neal Ewers  wrote:
> 
> That’s interesting that they give you both modes. It takes me back to the 
> days when I used a slate and stylus and when you were writing, dots one, two, 
> and three were on the right side. Of course, note takers and braille displays 
> reversed this, but I find it interesting that you have both on the device.
>  
> Neal
>  
>  
> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of 
> Sandy Finley
> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 9:01 PM
> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Braille Inpput: What Helped me Figure it out
>  
> Nicki and others,
>  
> I don’t know if this will help you but here is a set of steps I have learned 
> from  others that helped me with the braille input.
>  
> 1.When you land in an edit field turn your rotor once to the right. 
> The Braille keyboard is usually there because the Braille setting on your 
> rotor follows the edit field around.
>  
> 2.   I find it useful  to use away mode. For some reason, when in table 
> mode, dots 1, 2, 3 appear on the right so everything is backwards.
>  
> 3.   Once in a way mode, Do not calibrate just write.
>  
> Unfortunately, when trying to  use  contracted Braille the app does not echo 
> characters. I like to have characters echoed at this point so I write in 
> unconstructed Braille.
>  
> 4.   Flick once left to erase a character and once right for space.
> 5.
> 6.   When done rotor once left or right, then you can use VO gestures 
> again. HTH
>  
> Sandy
> -- 
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Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out

[Christopher J Chaltain]

Of course, as a user of Microsoft products, I'd be concerned if 
Microsoft were pushing updates to it's products by mistake. It's one 
thing to have a company make a conscious decision to ship a product with 
some known warts in it and another thing for a company to push out some 
software accidentally. It would be hard to trust or rely on a company 
when you can't depend on them following their own internal processes to 
get the right product out the door. Hopefully, Microsoft has fixed those 
process problems in the last seven years.


I'm not saying it can't happen, but having seen all of the steps a 
software release has to go through to get out of the door at more than 
one large company, I just can't believe this happens as frequently as 
you seem to indicate it does. The press is always looking for such 
stories, so I'd think we'd all hear about these cases if they were more 
frequent, and if anything, we'd probably think they happened even more 
than they do, given how the press likes to hype these kinds of mistakes.


On 9/25/2014 8:49 PM, David Chittenden wrote:

Well, I guess you would be troubled by Microsoft also. I once rec



eived an unintended upgrade release from them back in 2007. It can happen to 
any company, and happens more often than one might think.

David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone


On 26 Sep 2014, at 10:11, Christopher Chaltain  wrote:

I don't know all of the details about why IOS 8.0.1 was released by mistake, 
but if it really was just human error then that would trouble me greatly. Large 
companies, like Apple, when they're releasing an update to a major operating 
system of theirs, has processes in place to make sure things are not released 
by mistake or prematurely. Developers make mistakes too, and that's why you 
have test teams to catch those bugs before they hit the public. I've been 
involved in product releases my entire professional career, and at any company 
I've worked at, it's inconceivable to me that an update to a major product 
could be released accidentally. If human error could circumvent all of the 
checks and processes in place to make sure this doesn't happen then there are 
some serious process issues in Apple's release process. The fact that something 
like this could happen, troubles me much more than the bugs I've seen in IOS 8.


On 09/25/2014 08:39 AM, John Diakogeorgiou wrote:
The people who are bashing Apple about 8.0.1 are conveniently ignoring
the fact that it was released by human error. Come on people are you
saying you've never made a mistake?


On 9/25/14, Jed Barton  wrote:
I couldn't agree more.
Guys look, here's the deal, no technology company is perfect, nor will
it ever be.
Apple has gone through some great lengths to make the iphone family and
macs accessible in so many different ways.  Sometimes you just have to
get creative and learn.  Part of the issue is the specific app
development itself.
There are many apps where the developers don't know how to make their
apps accessible although many of them are open to it and want to learn.
   I switched to an iphone almost 2 years ago and i would never go back.
Take some time, learn, and spend some time with it, and you can't go wrong.

Cheers,
Jed


On 9/25/2014 7:51 AM, Krister Ekstrom wrote:
I wholeheartedly agree with the posting here below. In fact i couldn't
have said it better myself, i probably would have added some grumpy
comments that would make if not enemies then at least some not so happy
people.:-)
I may be overly loyal to Apple, even to the point of religion but i have
to say that Apple has done a whole lot more than i ever expected a main
stream company to ever do for us. As i stated in an earlier post, i don't
think i have ever seen a bug that's not been fixed although it may have
taken some time.
/Krister


25 sep 2014 kl. 13:18 skrev Joanne Chua :

not finger ppointing at anyone, but at times, most times, i do wonder,
what is really the accessibility issue of Apple, and what is user
errores, or the lack of understanding and training for user usage.

I heard this over and over again, from different list how apple is
inaccessible for VO user, how Apple got so many different and
keystrokes to learn compare to jaws and windows and etc etc. But,  do
these users really give VO a chance, putting window aside, for say, 3
months, and really focus on VO


And these people also often forget to celebrate the good things of
accessibility on apple products, but instead, decide to focus on the
bad things and how inaccessible apple products are for VO user.

I'm not saying apple is perfect, in many ways apple is far from
perfect, or the ideal technology for blind  users. But at the same
time, if Apple is so inaccessible, why then, there are more and more
blind and VI professionals switch to Apple instead of stay on with
windows?

Just my 0.2 worth of sense


On 25/09/2014, mário navarro  wrote:

yes friend absolutely r

Re: KNFB reader and the mofi juice pack

[Julian]

Hi Larry, 

I'm using it on an iPhone 5s in a Mophie juice pack and it works just fine. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 25, 2014, at 6:25 PM, "Larry Lumpkin"  wrote:
> 
> Any problems using the reader on the phone in a mofi juice pack?  Thanks.
> -- 
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RE: Braille Input: What Helped me Figure it out

[Neal Ewers]

That’s interesting that they give you both modes. It takes me back to the days 
when I used a slate and stylus and when you were writing, dots one, two, and 
three were on the right side. Of course, note takers and braille displays 
reversed this, but I find it interesting that you have both on the device.

 

Neal

 

 

From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of 
Sandy Finley
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 9:01 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Braille Inpput: What Helped me Figure it out

 

Nicki and others, 

 

I don’t know if this will help you but here is a set of steps I have learned 
from  others that helped me with the braille input.

 

1.When you land in an edit field turn your rotor once to the right. The 
Braille keyboard is usually there because the Braille setting on your rotor 
follows the edit field around. 

 

2.   I find it useful  to use away mode. For some reason, when in table 
mode, dots 1, 2, 3 appear on the right so everything is backwards.

 

3.   Once in a way mode, Do not calibrate just write.

 

Unfortunately, when trying to  use  contracted Braille the app does not echo 
characters. I like to have characters echoed at this point so I write in 
unconstructed Braille.

 

4.   Flick once left to erase a character and once right for space.

5.

6.   When done rotor once left or right, then you can use VO gestures 
again. HTH

 

Sandy 

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Braille Inpput: What Helped me Figure it out

[Sandy Finley]

Nicki and others, 

 

I don’t know if this will help you but here is a set of steps I have learned 
from  others that helped me with the braille input.

 

1.When you land in an edit field turn your rotor once to the right. The 
Braille keyboard is usually there because the Braille setting on your rotor 
follows the edit field around. 

 

2.   I find it useful  to use away mode. For some reason, when in table 
mode, dots 1, 2, 3 appear on the right so everything is backwards.

 

3.   Once in a way mode, Do not calibrate just write.

 

Unfortunately, when trying to  use  contracted Braille the app does not echo 
characters. I like to have characters echoed at this point so I write in 
unconstructed Braille.

 

4.   Flick once left to erase a character and once right for space.

5.

6.   When done rotor once left or right, then you can use VO gestures 
again. HTH

 

Sandy 

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Re: Problems using onscreen Braille keyboard

[Cheryl Lenartiene]

You are right. I misspoke. That's what I get for multitasking when I write 
email.

Cheryl

Be joyful always, pray continually, give thanks in all circumstances;
for this is God's will for you in Christ Jesus.
1 Thessalonians 5:16-18

Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 25, 2014, at 8:58 PM, Alex Hall  wrote:
> 
> The gesture for explore mode is not a double tap and hold, you simply place a 
> finger on the screen and leave it there until VO says "now in explore mode". 
> That might be part of the confusion.
>> On Sep 25, 2014, at 8:55 PM, Cheryl Lenartiene  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> When I can get it to work, what I entered does make sense. Fortunately, it's 
>> not gibberish. However, when it fails, it fails royally. It does not even 
>> recognize the double tap and hold gesture to enter explore mode.
>> 
>> Cheryl
>> 
>> Be joyful always, pray continually, give thanks in all circumstances;
>> for this is God's will for you in Christ Jesus.
>> 1 Thessalonians 5:16-18
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Sep 25, 2014, at 3:55 PM, Deb Lewis  wrote:
>>> 
>>> I've definitely done all this. Everything I write is jibberish. Lots
>>> of it is on the wrong side of the cell. If it isn't, it' just garbage
>>> for the most part. I've tried both modes. I know lots of people have
>>> gotten it to work, and I got it to work in the app so I don't know
>>> hwat's different here but it most definitely is.
>>> 
 On 9/25/14, RobH.  wrote:
 Oh, very good;  that's two gems;  the 2finger scrub to get out is more my
 thing.
 
 Rh.
 - Original Message -
 From: "Ioana Gandrabur" 
 To: 
 Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:22 PM
 Subject: Re: Problems using onscreen Braille keyboard
 
 
 Hi,
 
 Here is the section on writing in braille from the apple user guide, just 
 in
 
 case it might outline something you missed.
 I did not know for example about expand text option with 2 finger hlick
 down.
 
 http://help.apple.com/iphone/8/en.lproj/iph10366cc30.html";
 
 
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
> On Sep 25, 2014, at 11:10 AM, Deb Lewis  wrote:
> 
> I have the same issues as cheryl. I think we may not be getting it
> calibrated correctly. Don't know if anyone can comment to that aspect
> of it.
> 
> 
>> On 9/25/14, Alex Hall  wrote:
>> Aside from spaces not always registering, and key echo not working in
>> contracted mode, I have no problems. The actual accuracy of the braille
>> input (again, spaces notwithstanding) seems to be the same as MBraille.
>> Granted, I always use Away Mode, but still, all gestures and commands
>> work
>> as expected. This will sound rather stupid, I know, but are you sure you
>> enabled braille mode? Since the only gesture you can get working is the
>> rotor, it almost sounds like braille isn't on at all. Again, I know how
>> od
>> that sounds, but I can't think of why else it would not work for you.
>>> On Sep 25, 2014, at 10:39 AM, Jennie Facer 
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> I have found that if you use uncontracted Braille, it works better. You
>>> 
>>> do
>>> have to write that way, but characters are noticed better that way.
>>> 
>>> Jenn
>>> 
>>>   TO THE WORLD YOU ARE SOMEONE, BUT TO SOMENE YOU ARE THE
>>> WORLD!
>>> 
>>> On Sep 25, 2014, at 8:20 AM, Cheryl Lenartiene
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
 Hi all,
 
 Much of the time, when I use the onscreen Braille keyboard, nothing I
 type is recognized or input. Other gestures that aren't recognized
 include turning contracted Braille translation on and off, attempting
 to
 calibrate the dots, and attempting to use Explore Mode to locate the
 dots
 on screen. The only gesture that seems to be recognized is the gesture
 
 to
 change the rotor setting. Is anyone else experiencing this?
 
 I am an experienced MBraille user, and MBraille is still working
 reliably
 for me, so I don't think it's me or the hardware in my phone. Thoughts
 appreciated.
 
 Cheryl
 
 Be joyful always, pray continually, give thanks in all circumstances;
 for this is God's will for you in Christ Jesus.
 1 Thessalonians 5:16-18
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
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 you
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 you
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 or
 moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. The
 archives
 for this list can be searched a

Re: Release schedules [was "Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out"]

[Christopher J Chaltain]

That may be what you prefer, but Apple and other large companies have to 
worry about multiple things.


KNFB announced that they would be delaying the release of their iPhone 
app a few weeks, and they gave a reason. They were criticized for doing 
this and questions were raised as to the viability of a company that 
couldn't meet their announced delivery dates. You may have been OK with 
Apple postponing the release of IOS 8 and the availability of the new 
iPhone 6's but others would have been unhappy, competitors would have 
made hay with Apple's inability to meet their dates and people would 
have questioned what's going on at Apple.


Sure, customers are unhappy when they get a buggy product, but they're 
also unhappy when they have to wait for a product or don't get it when 
it was promised to them. How many people have been holding off on 
upgrading their iPhone waiting for the iPhone 6's to be released. Would 
these people have been happy if they had to keep waiting and using their 
old smart phones?


Don't forget that Apple also depends on the iPHone 6 for revenue. People 
are holding off on buying new iPhones waiting for the iPhone 6's to come 
out. How many iPhone 6's did Apple sell last weekend? Postponing the 
availability of the iPhone 6 would hit Apple right in the pocket book.


Apple is also at the center of a whole ecosystem. Cell phone providers, 
accessory manufacturers, resellers and others all have agreements with 
Apple and are dependent on Apple meeting their commitments. If Apple was 
constantly missing their commitments then their partners would start to 
lose faith and confidence in Apple.


Apple also has other options besides just slipping their dates or 
releasing products with too many bugs. They could drop some features and 
put more resources into testing or fixing bugs. Apple is a very wealthy 
company. They could probably throw more resources at IOS without 
removing functionality from IOS.


When I went through CMMI training, I was asked, quality, schedule or 
cost, pick one. I never met an executive that didn't say they're all 
important, but I've also never seen a large company choose anything 
other than schedule. I've seen companies throw money at products to keep 
them on schedule, and I've seen companies ship products with too many 
bugs just to keep them on schedule. I've also seen the pendulum swing 
the other way, and once a company is beat up too much in the market 
place over quality then you'll see a focus from them on quality the next 
time around or two. They focus on quality by reducing the feature set a 
bit, focusing on testing and bug fixing and letting their customers know 
quality if priority #1. They still meet their dates though.


You may not believe it, but Apple has some pretty smart people making 
decisions on whether to release a product on time or not with the given 
set of bugs. I can assure you that they've considered your three 
options, and there's a reason they stick to their committed schedule


On 9/25/2014 6:01 PM, Charles Rivard wrote:

As a customer, which would you prefer:

1.  A product delivered on time, regardless of the quality.

2.  A product delayed due to problems in the programming.

3.  Number 2, with an explanation of why there is a delay.

I, personally, would prefer option 3.

If I had a business, I would give customers option 3.  My reputation 
would be that I produce reliable, good quality software.  Loyal 
customers would spread my reputation, bringing in more customers based 
on that reputation.


---
Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're 
finished, you! really! are! finished!
- Original Message - From: "Christopher Chaltain" 


To: 
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 6:59 AM
Subject: Release schedules [was "Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out"]


Obviously customer satisfaction suffers when a program is released with
a lot of bugs, but customer satisfaction also suffers when a program is
promised on a certain date and then isn't released. Look at the
criticism we saw on this list when KNFB Reader pushed out it's release
by a few weeks?

Apple also has a lot riding on their September releases. It's a big
event with a lot of hype and press coverage. It also coincides with new
iPhones, which generates new revenue for Apple. This revenue would be
postponed if they had to push out the release of IOS 8, which is what's
needed on the new iPhones. Imagine the criticism you'd hear lofted
Apple's way if they postponed there big annual announcement?

When a company releases a new update to a product, they have to weigh a
lot of different factors, and ultimately a business decision is made
based on all of the available facts.

On 09/24/2014 11:41 PM, Neal Ewers wrote:

This is not a complaint, just an observation.

I know lots of companies that tie the release of their next version to a
particular time of year, and if it's not ready, well it just may go out
anyway. I'm guessing that there are a lot of mi

Re: Bluetooth disaster

[ramy moustafa]

My keyboard is not working with ios8 
Strange and repeated letters
Help plz 
Thanks so much 

Ramy moustafa saber
Musicc instructor at:
faculty of musical education
music arranger and sound engineer
Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 26, 2014, at 3:47 AM, ramy moustafa  wrote:
> 
> zzssFFaaddZZSSgghhgg  ffببffببسسععff  ffddffdd  
> ff  ff  ff ff  fgfgffddggdd  ff
> fff 
> Ramy moustafa saber
> Musicc instructor at:
> faculty of musical education
> music arranger and sound engineer
> Sent from my iPhone

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RE: why I don't like iOS 8: was Re: IOS is complete crap with VoiceOver

[Pablo Morales]

But, why but statements are  offensive for you?
This is an opinion of a member of the list, about IOs8, no about you.
This member has enough reasons why is saying that IOs8 is what ever. But this 
member is talking about IOs8, not about you. Relax, and try to be on his shoes. 
Think for a few minutes, that apple products are very expensive, maybe so much 
expensive, and when you pay a lot of money, you expect high quality, and not 
what is happening with IOs8 with blind people, and sighted people. Or do you 
think that we are only who is calling apple with problems about IOs8.
No, is not only the blind community who is calling apple. Apple is getting a 
very hard time with this IOs release.



-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of 
Charles Rivard
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 6:35 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: why I don't like iOS 8: was Re: IOS is complete crap with VoiceOver

What a lot of people are objecting to is not your complaints about iOS8.  I, 
for one, don't know any Apple employees or employers.  But your blanket 
statement that iOS8 being total crap is both offensive and absolutely untrue.

---
Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, 
you! really! are! finished!
- Original Message -
From: "Brian Fischler" 
To: 
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 4:10 PM
Subject: Re: why I don't like iOS 8: was Re: IOS is complete crap with VoiceOver


I am the one who posted this topic, and I find it funny how many people want to 
defend Apple as if I have offended a relative of theirs. I'm sorry, but why do 
people expect the blind to have lesser expectations than our sighted 
counterparts when buying a product and operating system that has been marketed 
as fully accessible? I get there are going to be bugs but the dial pad bug, VO 
constantly crashing on a 5S, yes 5S, the scrolling issues, these are all major 
issues that should have never made it to a full release. Can I live with them, 
yes, but should I have to, no. Will I still buy Apple, most likely yes, as I 
have invested so heavily in a fully Apple ecosystem, iPhone, iMac, and Mac Air, 
but as someone who has never even picked up a Droid, or used Jaws as my vision 
went in 2009, I'm starting to at least listen to the other side, something I 
thought I would never do.
On Sep 25, 2014, at 1:00 PM, SoonerAnnie  wrote:

> My 4S is doing better than my 5S. Fortunately I'm not having any 
> crashing problems for the most part, but the caller ID on my 5S 
> doesn't announce who's calling anymore! Major disappointment! However, 
> my 4S, which doesn't have cell service but began ringing after this 
> update, does announce who's calling. So go figure! LOL
>
> Ann
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Ron Pelletier" 
> To: 
> Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2014 11:47 PM
> Subject: RE: why I don't like iOS 8: was Re: IOS is complete crap with 
> VoiceOver
>
>
> Sharonda,
>
> Maybe Apple is not complete crap but, in view of what they pulled 
> today, its making people wonder if the extra money they pay for an 
> Apple product is really worth it.  They seem to have completely abused 
> the confidence of their customers by letting down their quality 
> control which, in fact, is complete crap.  As far as I am concerned, 
> the subjet line can stay there for a while
>
> Ron & Danvers
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On 
> Behalf Of Sharonda Greenlaw
> Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2014 9:17 PM
> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
> Subject: why I don't like iOS 8: was Re: IOS is complete crap with 
> VoiceOver
>
> Personally, I believe the subject  should be changed. iOS is not 
> complete crap. It may not have all of the bugs worked out, but it is 
> not complete crap. That's just one person's opin ion.
>
> Sharonda
> Sent from my mobile device; please excuse all mistakes
>
>> On Sep 24, 2014, at 5:39 PM, Christopher Chaltain 
>> 
>> wrote:
>>
>> I don't think it's exclusive to people running IOS 8 on the 4S. Brian 
>> for example, who started this thread, said he's running IOS 8 on his 5s.
>>
>>> On 09/24/2014 09:09 AM, John Diakogeorgiou wrote:
>>> It seems to me that the people who are having crashing problems with 
>>> IOS 8 are those with 4s's. It's very possible that the 4s can't 
>>> handle the requirements of IOS with other apps and Apple shouldn't 
>>> have supported it.
>>>
 On 9/24/14, Ųyvind Lode  wrote:
 First of all I must say that I don't regret upgrading my 4s to iOS 8.
 However, VoiceOver crashes all the time on my 4s.
 I have not found a pattern to all the crashes.
 The good thing is that VO at least restarts when it decide to die 
 on me.
 But it crashes at least 10-15 times a day and I know when it 
 crashed VO is on, screen curtain on etc is announced.
 I have done a reset - reset to factory settings but still th

Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out

[David Chittenden]

Well, I guess you would be troubled by Microsoft also. I once received an 
unintended upgrade release from them back in 2007. It can happen to any 
company, and happens more often than one might think.

David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone

> On 26 Sep 2014, at 10:11, Christopher Chaltain  wrote:
> 
> I don't know all of the details about why IOS 8.0.1 was released by mistake, 
> but if it really was just human error then that would trouble me greatly. 
> Large companies, like Apple, when they're releasing an update to a major 
> operating system of theirs, has processes in place to make sure things are 
> not released by mistake or prematurely. Developers make mistakes too, and 
> that's why you have test teams to catch those bugs before they hit the 
> public. I've been involved in product releases my entire professional career, 
> and at any company I've worked at, it's inconceivable to me that an update to 
> a major product could be released accidentally. If human error could 
> circumvent all of the checks and processes in place to make sure this doesn't 
> happen then there are some serious process issues in Apple's release process. 
> The fact that something like this could happen, troubles me much more than 
> the bugs I've seen in IOS 8.
> 
>> On 09/25/2014 08:39 AM, John Diakogeorgiou wrote:
>> The people who are bashing Apple about 8.0.1 are conveniently ignoring
>> the fact that it was released by human error. Come on people are you
>> saying you've never made a mistake?
>> 
>>> On 9/25/14, Jed Barton  wrote:
>>> I couldn't agree more.
>>> Guys look, here's the deal, no technology company is perfect, nor will
>>> it ever be.
>>> Apple has gone through some great lengths to make the iphone family and
>>> macs accessible in so many different ways.  Sometimes you just have to
>>> get creative and learn.  Part of the issue is the specific app
>>> development itself.
>>> There are many apps where the developers don't know how to make their
>>> apps accessible although many of them are open to it and want to learn.
>>>   I switched to an iphone almost 2 years ago and i would never go back.
>>> Take some time, learn, and spend some time with it, and you can't go wrong.
>>> 
>>> Cheers,
>>> Jed
>>> 
 On 9/25/2014 7:51 AM, Krister Ekstrom wrote:
 I wholeheartedly agree with the posting here below. In fact i couldn't
 have said it better myself, i probably would have added some grumpy
 comments that would make if not enemies then at least some not so happy
 people.:-)
 I may be overly loyal to Apple, even to the point of religion but i have
 to say that Apple has done a whole lot more than i ever expected a main
 stream company to ever do for us. As i stated in an earlier post, i don't
 think i have ever seen a bug that's not been fixed although it may have
 taken some time.
 /Krister
 
> 25 sep 2014 kl. 13:18 skrev Joanne Chua :
> 
> not finger ppointing at anyone, but at times, most times, i do wonder,
> what is really the accessibility issue of Apple, and what is user
> errores, or the lack of understanding and training for user usage.
> 
> I heard this over and over again, from different list how apple is
> inaccessible for VO user, how Apple got so many different and
> keystrokes to learn compare to jaws and windows and etc etc. But,  do
> these users really give VO a chance, putting window aside, for say, 3
> months, and really focus on VO
> 
> 
> And these people also often forget to celebrate the good things of
> accessibility on apple products, but instead, decide to focus on the
> bad things and how inaccessible apple products are for VO user.
> 
> I'm not saying apple is perfect, in many ways apple is far from
> perfect, or the ideal technology for blind  users. But at the same
> time, if Apple is so inaccessible, why then, there are more and more
> blind and VI professionals switch to Apple instead of stay on with
> windows?
> 
> Just my 0.2 worth of sense
> 
>> On 25/09/2014, mário navarro  wrote:
>> 
>> yes friend absolutely right.
>> I also share your words ...
>> I sold my imac because I was tired of the irresponsibility of the
>> apple.
>> I thought things were better in IOS and with the money from selling the
>> imac bought an iPhone.
>> but once again the apple disappointed me because it is the total
>> irresponsibility on all your systems ...
>> vo on OSX, is stopped in time.
>> Apple does not listen to us and no longer serves us as it should ...
>> I think that apple is no longer able to continue to innovate the vo.
>> if apple would hear us things would not be this shame ...
>> we must have the same rights as the sighted people.
>> let's stop  to say amen to favors that apple makes us ...
>> apple stop  sl

Bluetooth disaster

[ramy moustafa]

 zzssFFaaddZZSSgghhgg  ffببffببسسععff  ffddffdd  ff 
 ff  ff ff  fgfgffddggdd  ff
fff 
Ramy moustafa saber
Musicc instructor at:
faculty of musical education
music arranger and sound engineer
Sent from my iPhone

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Re: IOS8, The Posatives

[Alex Hall]

I've been able to do this for a long time, before iOS7 I think. I may be wrong 
about the time the feature has been round, but I know it was at least in iOS7.
On Sep 25, 2014, at 7:14 PM, Charles Rivard  wrote:

> Just today, by accident, I discovered that you can very quickly raise the 
> volume of the phone by holding down the up volume button rather than having 
> to tap it numerous times.  This, as far as I know, wasn't available in 7.1.2 
> when running it on an iPhone 5.  I like this feature.
> 
> ---
> Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, 
> you! really! are! finished!
> - Original Message -
> From: Hicks Steven (CORNWALL IT SERVICES)
> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 2:28 AM
> Subject: IOS8, The Posatives
> 
> Hi friends,
>  
> Just a quick message really, there has been a lot of talk about IOS8 and the 
> issues.
> I just wanted to post a message to the list to see if anyone comes back with 
> positive feedback and can let us know things that they have found in IOS8 
> that are a positive?
> Has anyone found any difference with the battery usage for example?
>  
> Steve.
>  
> 
> 
> 
> This message may contain confidential information. If you are not the 
> intended recipient please inform the
> sender that you have received the message in error before deleting it.
> Please do not disclose, copy or distribute information in this e-mail or take 
> any action in reliance on its contents:
> to do so is strictly prohibited and may be unlawful.
> 
> Thank you for your co-operation.
> 
> NHSmail is the secure email and directory service available for all NHS staff 
> in England and Scotland
> NHSmail is approved for exchanging patient data and other sensitive 
> information with NHSmail and GSi recipients
> NHSmail provides an email address for your career in the NHS and can be 
> accessed anywhere
> 
> 
> 
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mehg...@icloud.com

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Re: ways of backing up your iphone

[Feliciano G]

Local back up on the iTunes player is best.reason being is because you can back 
up eight application if it updated version is no good as far as 
accessibility.you can always do a manual back up with iTunes and have iCloud on.

  Regards, Feliciano



Like my Facebook page: https://m.facebook.com/profile.php?id=690649294341327
Follow me on Twitter: Www.twitter.com/theblindman12v


Sent from the Super-iPhone

> On Sep 25, 2014, at 5:56 PM, martin nelson  wrote:
> 
> Hello, friends: it is my understanding that there are two ways of backing up 
> your I device: using the iTunes on your computer, or using the I cloud. When 
> purchasing a new phone  I assume that all the contents of your phone can be 
> retrieve by either of these methods. My question is, is one of them more 
> reliable than the other? Also, when setting up your new device, will all the 
> content stored in the I cloud be automatically downloaded to your device?
> Thank you in advance for your help.
> Regards,
> Martin Nelson 
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Re: Why I'm returning my iPhone 6 (well, maybe)

[David Chittenden]

Et is because sighted people prefer the larger screen for movies. We are such a 
small minority that we really do not matter.

David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone

> On 26 Sep 2014, at 02:55, John Panarese  wrote:
> 
>   That is really my feeling too. I bought the 6 and it is a bit bigger than 
> the 5S. The 6 Plus is just simply far too big for my liking.  I don't 
> understand exactly why the grand is now moving towards bigger phones.  How do 
> you carry the things?  Even if they are lighter, they still are bricks.
> 
> 
> Take Care
> 
> John D. Panarese
> Director
> Mac for the Blind
> Tel, (631) 724-4479
> Email, j...@macfortheblind.com
> Website, http://www.macfortheblind.com
> 
> APPLE CERTIFIED SUPPORT PROFESSIONAL FOR MAC OS X LION and OS X Mountain Lion
> 
> AUTHORIZED APPLE STORE BUSINESS AFFILIATE
> 
> MAC and iOS VOICEOVER TRAINING AND SUPPORT
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Sep 25, 2014, at 12:31 PM, Chuck Dean  wrote:
>> 
>> When I went to look at the iPhone 6 I remarked of the salesman that I would 
>> actually prefer a smaller phone, over a bigger phone. Because I listen to 
>> everything on the screen I don't need to see it, so a smaller phone would be 
>> more convenient. He looked at me like I was nuts.
>> 
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Hijacking threads

[Jenifer Barr]

Hi all. I am not a moderator... but have a favor to ask... can we please stop 
highjacking threads? I just deleted a thread that I'd been saving re: the KNFB 
reader because it was highjacked re: telling someone to buy it... and there 
were a lot of good tips I've lost. Now I have to search for the thread again... 
and weed out the ones I don't want because I was only saving a few. I'm not 
trying to be difficult, really... but I am rather annoyed. (sigh) 


Jenifer Barr
Sent from my iPhone

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KNFB reader and the mofi juice pack

[Larry Lumpkin]

Any problems using the reader on the phone in a mofi juice pack?  Thanks.

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Re: Let's try this again... iOS 8.0.2 is out

[John Diakogeorgiou]

I had to download it over air. When I used ITunes it downloaded then
gave me an error message. It worked fine over the air but I haven't
used it yet except to say that the touchpad and cell service both
work.

On 9/25/14, Corey Michael Cook  wrote:
> Downloading it now.
>
> Fingers crossed.
>
>
>
>
>
> Corey Cook
>
> Facebook:
>
>   corey.coo...@gmail.com
>
>
>
> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
> Of Cristóbal
> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:27 PM
> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Let's try this again... iOS 8.0.2 is out
>
>
>
> Once bitten. Twice shy? Anyway, Version 8.0.2 is now out. Same changelog as
> 8.0.1 with the fixes for the cell and touch ID issues from the earlier
> release.
>
> Again, curious to hear of any Voiceover bug fixes.
>
> http://www.theverge.com/2014/9/25/6841455/ios-8-0-2-available-to-fix-iphone-
> 6-models
>
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Re: Not seeing messages I sent to the list

[Charles Rivard]

That did not answer the question, though.  The question dealt with 
receiving, not sending.


I do not receive messages I send to lists, either.  Maybe you and I have the 
same problem.  My Email account is a G mail account, provided through my 
Internet Service provider.  There is a setting in a G mail account that can 
be changed to allow you to receive messages sent to an Email list.  However, 
seeing as the account was provided to me by my ISP, I don't know the user 
name and or password.  Unfortunately, as a security measure, one of those 
darned capshas must be dealt with.  I use Internet Explorer, not Firefox, 
for political reasons, so cannot get past it.  So, I just live with not 
getting my sent message back into my inbox.


---
Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, 
you! really! are! finished!
- Original Message - 
From: "Michelle Bernstein" 

To: 
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 9:32 AM
Subject: Not seeing messages I sent to the list


This message is on the viphone message board so you appear to be able to 
post messages.


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Re: why I don't like iOS 8: was Re: IOS is complete crap with VoiceOver

[Charles Rivard]

What a lot of people are objecting to is not your complaints about iOS8.  I, 
for one, don't know any Apple employees or employers.  But your blanket 
statement that iOS8 being total crap is both offensive and absolutely 
untrue.


---
Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, 
you! really! are! finished!
- Original Message - 
From: "Brian Fischler" 

To: 
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 4:10 PM
Subject: Re: why I don't like iOS 8: was Re: IOS is complete crap with 
VoiceOver



I am the one who posted this topic, and I find it funny how many people want 
to defend Apple as if I have offended a relative of theirs. I'm sorry, but 
why do people expect the blind to have lesser expectations than our sighted 
counterparts when buying a product and operating system that has been 
marketed as fully accessible? I get there are going to be bugs but the dial 
pad bug, VO constantly crashing on a 5S, yes 5S, the scrolling issues, these 
are all major issues that should have never made it to a full release. Can I 
live with them, yes, but should I have to, no. Will I still buy Apple, most 
likely yes, as I have invested so heavily in a fully Apple ecosystem, 
iPhone, iMac, and Mac Air, but as someone who has never even picked up a 
Droid, or used Jaws as my vision went in 2009, I'm starting to at least 
listen to the other side, something I thought I would never do.

On Sep 25, 2014, at 1:00 PM, SoonerAnnie  wrote:


My 4S is doing better than my 5S. Fortunately I'm not having any crashing
problems for the most part, but the caller ID on my 5S doesn't announce
who's calling anymore! Major disappointment! However, my 4S, which doesn't
have cell service but began ringing after this update, does announce who's
calling. So go figure! LOL

Ann

- Original Message - 
From: "Ron Pelletier" 

To: 
Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2014 11:47 PM
Subject: RE: why I don't like iOS 8: was Re: IOS is complete crap with
VoiceOver


Sharonda,

Maybe Apple is not complete crap but, in view of what they pulled today, 
its

making people wonder if the extra money they pay for an Apple product is
really worth it.  They seem to have completely abused the confidence of
their customers by letting down their quality control which, in fact, is
complete crap.  As far as I am concerned, the subjet line can stay there 
for

a while

Ron & Danvers


-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Sharonda Greenlaw
Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2014 9:17 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: why I don't like iOS 8: was Re: IOS is complete crap with 
VoiceOver


Personally, I believe the subject  should be changed. iOS is not complete
crap. It may not have all of the bugs worked out, but it is not complete
crap. That's just one person's opin ion.

Sharonda
Sent from my mobile device; please excuse all mistakes


On Sep 24, 2014, at 5:39 PM, Christopher Chaltain 
wrote:

I don't think it's exclusive to people running IOS 8 on the 4S. Brian for
example, who started this thread, said he's running IOS 8 on his 5s.


On 09/24/2014 09:09 AM, John Diakogeorgiou wrote:
It seems to me that the people who are having crashing problems with
IOS 8 are those with 4s's. It's very possible that the 4s can't
handle the requirements of IOS with other apps and Apple shouldn't
have supported it.


On 9/24/14, Ųyvind Lode  wrote:
First of all I must say that I don't regret upgrading my 4s to iOS 8.
However, VoiceOver crashes all the time on my 4s.
I have not found a pattern to all the crashes.
The good thing is that VO at least restarts when it decide to die on 
me.

But it crashes at least 10-15 times a day and I know when it crashed
VO is on, screen curtain on etc is announced.
I have done a reset - reset to factory settings but still the same.

-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On
Behalf Of Christopher Chaltain
Sent: 24. september 2014 13:53
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: IOS is complete crap with VoiceOver

Doing as David suggests is probably best, but it might also be the
case that your voice was turned off. Try a three finger double tap
to toggle the voice on and off.

Also, if you have the home button set as your VoiceOver short cut,
try a triple tap of the home button. Recycling VoiceOver helps me in
similar situations. Maybe you can use Siri to turn VoiceOver off and
then back on as well.

I've seen a couple of posts now to where IOS 8 with it's VoiceOver
bugs is compared to blindness specific products or older smart phone
technologies, like Windows Mobile running Mobile Accessibility.
IMHO, one of the great things about Apple and their commitment to
making their main stream products accessible is that we get treated
the same as the rest of their main stream customers. I fear that if
we lower the bar with our expectations then we're no better off then
when we use those so called b

Re: The U2 subject, again

[Charles Rivard]

Check the archives, as this has been covered extremely extensively.

---
Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, 
you! really! are! finished!
- Original Message - 
From: "Patti Johnson" 

To: 
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 2:42 PM
Subject: The U2 subject, again


I am sorry but I find this so very strange.  Yesterday I wanted a friend
to hear an album I had  downloaded from Itunes about 3 weeks ago.
I had purchased a couple songs too last month from there.  Well, not
only were those songs on my ipad and the album I bought, but also some
U2 songs.  Whether it was a whole album I don't know but i sure as heck
didn't buy them. Where they came from I just don't know.
I hope they will be taken off my ipad, and what is also strange about
this is I haven't updated.
So what gives here? I suppose I should call Apple, but I hate dealing
with people on the phone, grin.
Patti

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Re: IOS8, The Posatives

[Charles Rivard]

Just today, by accident, I discovered that you can very quickly raise the 
volume of the phone by holding down the up volume button rather than having to 
tap it numerous times.  This, as far as I know, wasn't available in 7.1.2 when 
running it on an iPhone 5.  I like this feature.

---
Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, 
you! really! are! finished!
  - Original Message - 
  From: Hicks Steven (CORNWALL IT SERVICES) 
  To: viphone@googlegroups.com 
  Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 2:28 AM
  Subject: IOS8, The Posatives


  Hi friends,

   

  Just a quick message really, there has been a lot of talk about IOS8 and the 
issues.

  I just wanted to post a message to the list to see if anyone comes back with 
positive feedback and can let us know things that they have found in IOS8 that 
are a positive?

  Has anyone found any difference with the battery usage for example?

   

  Steve.

   


  


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accessed anywhere

  



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phone size - Re: Why I'm returning my iPhone 6 (well, maybe)

[Charles Rivard]

Sounds like they're more like panels than bricks.  I'm not commenting on 
size other than that until I see one and try to put it into my pocket.


---
Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, 
you! really! are! finished!
- Original Message - 
From: "John Panarese" 

To: 
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 11:55 AM
Subject: Re: Why I'm returning my iPhone 6 (well, maybe)


  That is really my feeling too. I bought the 6 and it is a bit bigger than 
the 5S. The 6 Plus is just simply far too big for my liking.  I don't 
understand exactly why the grand is now moving towards bigger phones.  How 
do you carry the things?  Even if they are lighter, they still are bricks.



Take Care

John D. Panarese
Director
Mac for the Blind
Tel, (631) 724-4479
Email, j...@macfortheblind.com
Website, http://www.macfortheblind.com

APPLE CERTIFIED SUPPORT PROFESSIONAL FOR MAC OS X LION and OS X Mountain 
Lion


AUTHORIZED APPLE STORE BUSINESS AFFILIATE

MAC and iOS VOICEOVER TRAINING AND SUPPORT






On Sep 25, 2014, at 12:31 PM, Chuck Dean  wrote:

When I went to look at the iPhone 6 I remarked of the salesman that I 
would actually prefer a smaller phone, over a bigger phone. Because I 
listen to everything on the screen I don't need to see it, so a smaller 
phone would be more convenient. He looked at me like I was nuts.


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Re: Family Sharing

[Charles Rivard]

This seems confusing to me.  If the cost was deducted from her card, and if you 
buy something and it will get charged to yours, I see no benefit.

I was thinking that if I buy, or already have, an app, the other person can get 
it at no charge.

And if what I buy is a Christmas present for her, I sure don't want her to know 
about it when I buy.

---
Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, 
you! really! are! finished!
  - Original Message - 
  From: christopher hallsworth 
  To: Viphone 
  Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 1:19 PM
  Subject: Family Sharing


  Hi all

  The new Family Sharing service introduced in iOS 8 is just fantastic. I have 
set up Family Sharing for myself (organizer) and added my manager (Hannah Day) 
to the family. Well Apple don't need to know we are not related smile. We put 
it to the test yesterday when Hannah purchased a song in the iTunes Store. Not 
only did it come out of her own credit instead of my credit card on file with 
Apple (required to set up Family Sharing); we also received an email receipt 
with proof of purchase.

  Try it for yourself by going to Settings > iCloud and look for Family 
Sharing. you can only do this on an iOS 8 device or a Mac/PC running the latest 
iTunes.


  Sent from my Macbook Pro 



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Re: Release schedules [was "Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out"]

[Charles Rivard]

As a customer, which would you prefer:

1.  A product delivered on time, regardless of the quality.

2.  A product delayed due to problems in the programming.

3.  Number 2, with an explanation of why there is a delay.

I, personally, would prefer option 3.

If I had a business, I would give customers option 3.  My reputation would 
be that I produce reliable, good quality software.  Loyal customers would 
spread my reputation, bringing in more customers based on that reputation.


---
Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, 
you! really! are! finished!
- Original Message - 
From: "Christopher Chaltain" 

To: 
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 6:59 AM
Subject: Release schedules [was "Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out"]


Obviously customer satisfaction suffers when a program is released with
a lot of bugs, but customer satisfaction also suffers when a program is
promised on a certain date and then isn't released. Look at the
criticism we saw on this list when KNFB Reader pushed out it's release
by a few weeks?

Apple also has a lot riding on their September releases. It's a big
event with a lot of hype and press coverage. It also coincides with new
iPhones, which generates new revenue for Apple. This revenue would be
postponed if they had to push out the release of IOS 8, which is what's
needed on the new iPhones. Imagine the criticism you'd hear lofted
Apple's way if they postponed there big annual announcement?

When a company releases a new update to a product, they have to weigh a
lot of different factors, and ultimately a business decision is made
based on all of the available facts.

On 09/24/2014 11:41 PM, Neal Ewers wrote:

This is not a complaint, just an observation.

I know lots of companies that tie the release of their next version to a
particular time of year, and if it's not ready, well it just may go out
anyway. I'm guessing that there are a lot of mid level workers at apple
who likely knew this was not ready for prime time but the choice may
have been made for them by the higher ups. Those mid-level workers may
be just as frustrated as we are. After all, many of them use iOS 8 also.
I just hope the managers who set the time for this release didn't let so
many bugs in the house that it will be a very long process to kill them 
all.


Neal

*From:*viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] *On
Behalf Of *Ron Pelletier
*Sent:* Wednesday, September 24, 2014 11:28 PM
*To:* viphone@googlegroups.com
*Subject:* RE: iOS 8.0.1 is out

Neal,

I think that Apple is trying so hard to satisfy the people who are
impatient that they are cranking out the updates too fast and don't have
time to properly check them.  Having seen what has happened last year
and this year also, I still think that they feel that timing to put out
the new product is more important than coming out with the right thing
from the get go.  They set themselves a deadline and go crazy trying to
stick to it and the result is what we get.

I guess they have evaluated that their reputation can stand the problems
and they seem to be right. No matter how many bugs there are, people
seem to forgive Apple for putting out a product before it is ready.
When people camp out on the sidewalk for two days to be the first to get
the new product, I guess you don't have to worry about several dozen bugs.

Ron & Danvers

*From:*viphone@googlegroups.com 
[mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] *On Behalf Of *Neal Ewers
*Sent:* Wednesday, September 24, 2014 2:28 PM
*To:* viphone@googlegroups.com 
*Subject:* RE: iOS 8.0.1 is out

Hi, I applaud Apple's quick update release. What is bothersome is that
they put out an update not knowing about the issue that caused them to
pull it. I bring this up only to ask a question. For those who are on
the beta team, do you get to see these updates first, or is the testing
of these done in house. This also raises the question of updates
released that may, in fact, break things that already work. I guess we
will have to wait and see, but I am curious about who tests the updates
they release.

Neal

*From:*viphone@googlegroups.com 
[mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] *On Behalf Of *Alex Hall
*Sent:* Wednesday, September 24, 2014 1:21 PM
*To:* viphone@googlegroups.com 
*Subject:* Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out

FYI, Apple has just pulled the update. You can no longer get it; I
imagine it will be re-released soon with a fix for the problems on the
iPhone6.

On Sep 24, 2014, at 2:14 PM, Trea Abma mailto:trea.a...@gmail.com>> wrote:

I updated and didn't have this problems. I called voicemail and was able
to delete messages without the dial tone bug, so maybe this is solved.

*From:*Rich Ring 

*Sent:*Wednesday, September 24, 2014 8:00 PM

*To:*viphone@googlegroups.com 

*Cc:*Rich Ring 

Re: Why I'm returning my iPhone 6 (well, maybe)

[Charles Rivard]

I'm more interested in the 6 plus than the 6 based on the battery life, but 
the size might be a problem.  I won't know until I see one and try to put it 
into my pocket.  I think that, even a better idea, will be to see the size 
of a case and try to put that into my pocket, because I flat out refuse to 
get an iPhone without a case.  I believe in protecting my expensive 
electronic equipment.


---
Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, 
you! really! are! finished!
- Original Message - 
From: "Wayne Merritt" 

To: 
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 11:55 AM
Subject: Re: Why I'm returning my iPhone 6 (well, maybe)


It seems like, from what I have read on the web, that most people
think the 6 Plus is too big and the 6 is just right. Many of those
comments were from blind people that checked out both phones or who
just looked at the 6 and thought it was just right. After reading all
that and knowing I had gotten the 6 myself for that reason, I am glad
I ordered the 6 and didn't pay the extra $100 for a larger phone with
more space than I needed. Then again, there are those blind people
that got the 6 Plus and are happy with their purchase. Guess I will
find out in about a week or so when I get the new phone.

Wayne

On 9/25/14, Chuck Dean  wrote:
When I went to look at the iPhone 6 I remarked of the salesman that I 
would

actually prefer a smaller phone, over a bigger phone. Because I listen to
everything on the screen I don't need to see it, so a smaller phone would 
be

more convenient. He looked at me like I was nuts.

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RE: Not seeing messages I sent to the list

[Larry Lumpkin]

Funny, I'm seeing my posts.

-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Woody Anna Dresner
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 7:50 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Not seeing messages I sent to the list

Hi Michelle,

This list is configured so that you don't see the messages you post.

Best,
Anna



On Sep 25, 2014, at 9:32 AM, Michelle Bernstein
 wrote:

> This message is on the viphone message board so you appear to be able to
post messages.
> 
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Re: Mophie JuicePack & Apple iPhone

[Charles Rivard]

Your best source of information on your questions would be, of course, 
Mophie.


---
Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, 
you! really! are! finished!
- Original Message - 
From: "Robin" 

To: 
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 12:25 PM
Subject: Mophie JuicePack & Apple iPhone


Will Mophie offer a JuicePack for either the Apple iPhone 6+ and/or
Apple iPhone 6? If so, when will it be available for purchase?

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Re: Why I'm returning my iPhone 6 (well, maybe)

[Charles Rivard]

Yes.  Please do.  These simple one line messages are extremely annoying. 
They give no pertinent information.  This is especially annoying after Raul 
sent a message dealing with the list guidelines just the other day.


---
Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, 
you! really! are! finished!
- Original Message - 
From: "Chuck Dean" 

To: 
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 12:01 PM
Subject: Re: Why I'm returning my iPhone 6 (well, maybe)


Hi Cheryl, glad to hear you like your 6+, but tell us why.

Chuck (mobile)
Pleez x cuze enny tie ping or spelin air ores.


On Sep 25, 2014, at 9:58 AM, Cheryl Homiak  wrote:

I like my 6+!

--
Cheryl

I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.
I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper
thrown in the trash!
Then God gave me a new heart and life:
His joy for my despairing tears!
And now, every day:
"This I call to mind,
and therefore I have hope:
The steadfast love of the Lord
never ceases;
his mercies never come to an end;
they are new every morning;
great is your faithfulness."
(Lamentations 3:21-23 ESV)





On Sep 25, 2014, at 11:55 AM, Wayne Merritt  wrote:

It seems like, from what I have read on the web, that most people
think the 6 Plus is too big and the 6 is just right. Many of those
comments were from blind people that checked out both phones or who
just looked at the 6 and thought it was just right. After reading all
that and knowing I had gotten the 6 myself for that reason, I am glad
I ordered the 6 and didn't pay the extra $100 for a larger phone with
more space than I needed. Then again, there are those blind people
that got the 6 Plus and are happy with their purchase. Guess I will
find out in about a week or so when I get the new phone.

Wayne


On 9/25/14, Chuck Dean  wrote:
When I went to look at the iPhone 6 I remarked of the salesman that I 
would
actually prefer a smaller phone, over a bigger phone. Because I listen 
to
everything on the screen I don't need to see it, so a smaller phone 
would be

more convenient. He looked at me like I was nuts.

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Re: Will my iPhone 6+ eventually replace my iPad?

[Charles Rivard]

I know people on another list who carry both an iPhone and an iPad around.  I 
ask, "Why?"  While I haven't seen an iPhone 6 plus, I would think that is would 
be handier to carry 1 device instead of 2.  I have known of people who not only 
carry an iPhone and an iPad, but they also carry a Bluetooth keyboard because 
they don't like typing on either of the touch screens.  Doesn't this kill the 
portability aspect??

---
Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, 
you! really! are! finished!
  - Original Message - 
  From: Cheryl Homiak 
  To: viphone@googlegroups.com 
  Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 3:49 PM
  Subject: Will my iPhone 6+ eventually replace my iPad?


  I am seriously wondering about this. I enjoy using all my Mac devices: my 
macbook Air, my iMac, my two old mac minis - one unable to go further than Lion 
and one a ppc machine that would have been stuck forever in Leopard if I had 
not turned it into a Linux box (you see I hate to get rid of anything until it 
actually comes to a grinding hault! I like my iPad, but now I am wondering 
whether iPads will eventually fade from my life! My iPhone 6+ has as much 
storage space as my iPad, perhaps the sound isn't quite as good as that of the 
iPad but it is plenty lound enough, the little adjustable Anchor multi-angle 
stand that holds my iPad in various positions of landscape and portrait when I 
don't need the keyboard stand fits the iPhone 6+, probably even more safely 
because it isn't so tall and really has no possibility of  tipping over in 
portrait when moved. For a sighted person, I can see that the iPad may still 
have its advantages but for me, I'm not so sure! My iPad is both celular and 
wifi and I'll either keep using it or find it a good home, but I wonder whether 
eventually I will find myself taking the iPhone 6+ out where I used to take my 
iPad. I suppose the iPad could always be ready to jump in as a hotspot when 
needed rather than using the iPhone 6+ so that I don't have to worry about my 
battery going down on the phone. I guess only time will answer this question. 
Perhaps this is a question sighted people are also asking but I would think the 
even larger screen would be more motivating for a sighted person for keeping 
both types of devices than for a blind person. Any thoughts? I know many people 
on this list don't like the size of the larger iPhone 6+, but to me it seems to 
be the perfect compromise between the larger iPad mini and iPad and the smaller 
iPhones of the 4 and 5 series.


  -- 
  Cheryl


  I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.
  I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper
  thrown in the trash!
  Then God gave me a new heart and life:
  His joy for my despairing tears!
  And now, every day:
  "This I call to mind,
  and therefore I have hope:
  The steadfast love of the Lord
  never ceases;
  his mercies never come to an end;
  they are new every morning;
  great is your faithfulness."
  (Lamentations 3:21-23 ESV)









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Re: why I don't like iOS 8: was Re: IOS is complete crap with VoiceOver

[Charles Rivard]

If you don't have cell service, what number are people calling to contact 
you?


---
Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, 
you! really! are! finished!
- Original Message - 
From: "SoonerAnnie" 

To: 
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 12:00 PM
Subject: Re: why I don't like iOS 8: was Re: IOS is complete crap with 
VoiceOver



My 4S is doing better than my 5S. Fortunately I'm not having any crashing
problems for the most part, but the caller ID on my 5S doesn't announce
who's calling anymore! Major disappointment! However, my 4S, which doesn't
have cell service but began ringing after this update, does announce who's
calling. So go figure! LOL

Ann

- Original Message - 
From: "Ron Pelletier" 

To: 
Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2014 11:47 PM
Subject: RE: why I don't like iOS 8: was Re: IOS is complete crap with
VoiceOver


Sharonda,

Maybe Apple is not complete crap but, in view of what they pulled today, its
making people wonder if the extra money they pay for an Apple product is
really worth it.  They seem to have completely abused the confidence of
their customers by letting down their quality control which, in fact, is
complete crap.  As far as I am concerned, the subjet line can stay there for
a while

Ron & Danvers


-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Sharonda Greenlaw
Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2014 9:17 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: why I don't like iOS 8: was Re: IOS is complete crap with VoiceOver

Personally, I believe the subject  should be changed. iOS is not complete
crap. It may not have all of the bugs worked out, but it is not complete
crap. That's just one person's opin ion.

Sharonda
Sent from my mobile device; please excuse all mistakes


On Sep 24, 2014, at 5:39 PM, Christopher Chaltain 
wrote:

I don't think it's exclusive to people running IOS 8 on the 4S. Brian for
example, who started this thread, said he's running IOS 8 on his 5s.


On 09/24/2014 09:09 AM, John Diakogeorgiou wrote:
It seems to me that the people who are having crashing problems with
IOS 8 are those with 4s's. It's very possible that the 4s can't
handle the requirements of IOS with other apps and Apple shouldn't
have supported it.


On 9/24/14, Øyvind Lode  wrote:
First of all I must say that I don't regret upgrading my 4s to iOS 8.
However, VoiceOver crashes all the time on my 4s.
I have not found a pattern to all the crashes.
The good thing is that VO at least restarts when it decide to die on me.
But it crashes at least 10-15 times a day and I know when it crashed
VO is on, screen curtain on etc is announced.
I have done a reset - reset to factory settings but still the same.

-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On
Behalf Of Christopher Chaltain
Sent: 24. september 2014 13:53
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: IOS is complete crap with VoiceOver

Doing as David suggests is probably best, but it might also be the
case that your voice was turned off. Try a three finger double tap
to toggle the voice on and off.

Also, if you have the home button set as your VoiceOver short cut,
try a triple tap of the home button. Recycling VoiceOver helps me in
similar situations. Maybe you can use Siri to turn VoiceOver off and
then back on as well.

I've seen a couple of posts now to where IOS 8 with it's VoiceOver
bugs is compared to blindness specific products or older smart phone
technologies, like Windows Mobile running Mobile Accessibility.
IMHO, one of the great things about Apple and their commitment to
making their main stream products accessible is that we get treated
the same as the rest of their main stream customers. I fear that if
we lower the bar with our expectations then we're no better off then
when we use those so called blind ghetto products that so many
people are quick to thumb their noses at. Let's give Apple credit
where credit is due, but let's just not roll over like blind Uncle
Tom's being happy with whatever accessibility Apple thinks we'll be
content with.


On 09/24/2014 12:18 AM, David Chittenden wrote:
When VO goes quiet like that, take your fingers away from the
iPhone. iOS is performing memory management. Give a chance for iOS / VO
to catch up.
Something similar occurred with iOS 7 when it first came out.
Unlike blindness specific poducts which can take six months to a
year to be fixed, Apple's history is to take one-three months.
Let's see what happens.

David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
Sent from my iPhone


On 24 Sep 2014, at 14:49, Brian Fischler  wrote:

I'm sorry but VoiceOver on my 5S has now complete crap on IOS 8 as
for the second time today VoiceOver has completely crapped out
while tapping the screen at the same time a push notification
comes through. VoiceOVer just dies and if I press the home button
and tell Siri to tell Siri to tur

Re: Problems using onscreen Braille keyboard

[Alex Hall]

Simply don't calibrate. I find calibration has no effect in Away Mode, and the 
odd problems you discovered in Table Mode. However, nothing says you have to 
calibrate, and I didn't even know you could for days. So, I never calibrate, 
and things work well enough.
On Sep 25, 2014, at 9:14 PM, Paweł Masarczyk  wrote:

> Hello guys!
> 
> I was trying this feature out on an iPhone 5.
> 
> I've discovered that when I calibrate the dot positions, it often happens 
> that the 456 dots cell changes the dots positions in a rather uncontrollable 
> manner. Sometimes dots 4 and 6 are turned round, sometimes it is dots 5 and 4 
> that change their positions.This makes it rather hard to type on it 
> reliably.Has anyone found a way around this?\I've also noticed that it works 
> best when you hold it with the home button to the right.
> 
> Best regards
> Paw
> eł
> W dniu 2014-09-25 18:09, Cheryl Lenartiene pisze:
>> Glad it's not just me. I always make sure that I am in braille input mode 
>> before I start typing, and I traditionally use the phone in away mode. When 
>> the phone decides that it does not want to recognize my gestures, it 
>> recognizes nothing. It doesn't matter whether I am in contracted mode or 
>> not. I have experimented with finger placement, and extremely exaggerated 
>> swipes. Nothing works.
>> 
>> When I learned that Apple was putting braille input into iOS, I had a bit of 
>> buyer's remorse for purchasing MBraille. I am so glad I still have it.
>> 
>> Cheryl
>> 
>> Be joyful always, pray continually, give thanks in all circumstances;
>> for this is God's will for you in Christ Jesus.
>> 1 Thessalonians 5:16-18
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> On Sep 25, 2014, at 11:49 AM, Jenifer Barr  wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi all. I thin; we all have to remember that this is a brand new feature... 
>>> and there will be bugs. I've experienced this as well. 
>>> 
>>> Jenifer Barr
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>> On Sep 25, 2014, at 10:20 AM, Cheryl Lenartiene 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
 Hi all,
 
 Much of the time, when I use the onscreen Braille keyboard, nothing I type 
 is recognized or input. Other gestures that aren't recognized include 
 turning contracted Braille translation on and off, attempting to calibrate 
 the dots, and attempting to use Explore Mode to locate the dots on screen. 
 The only gesture that seems to be recognized is the gesture to change the 
 rotor setting. Is anyone else experiencing this?
 
 I am an experienced MBraille user, and MBraille is still working reliably 
 for me, so I don't think it's me or the hardware in my phone. Thoughts 
 appreciated.
 
 Cheryl
 
 Be joyful always, pray continually, give thanks in all circumstances;
 for this is God's will for you in Christ Jesus.
 1 Thessalonians 5:16-18
 
 Sent from my iPhone
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>> member's post is 

Re: Problems using onscreen Braille keyboard

[Paweł Masarczyk]

Hello guys!

I was trying this feature out on an iPhone 5.

I've discovered that when I calibrate the dot positions, it often 
happens that the 456 dots cell changes the dots positions in a rather 
uncontrollable manner. Sometimes dots 4 and 6 are turned round, 
sometimes it is dots 5 and 4 that change their positions.This makes it 
rather hard to type on it reliably.Has anyone found a way around 
this?\I've also noticed that it works best when you hold it with the 
home button to the right.


Best regards
Paw
eł
W dniu 2014-09-25 18:09, Cheryl Lenartiene pisze:
Glad it's not just me. I always make sure that I am in braille input 
mode before I start typing, and I traditionally use the phone in away 
mode. When the phone decides that it does not want to recognize my 
gestures, it recognizes nothing. It doesn't matter whether I am in 
contracted mode or not. I have experimented with finger placement, and 
extremely exaggerated swipes. Nothing works.


When I learned that Apple was putting braille input into iOS, I had a 
bit of buyer's remorse for purchasing MBraille. I am so glad I still 
have it.


Cheryl

Be joyful always, pray continually, give thanks in all circumstances;
for this is God's will for you in Christ Jesus.
1 Thessalonians 5:16-18

Sent from my iPhone

On Sep 25, 2014, at 11:49 AM, Jenifer Barr > wrote:


Hi all. I thin; we all have to remember that this is a brand new 
feature... and there will be bugs. I've experienced this as well.


Jenifer Barr
Sent from my iPhone

On Sep 25, 2014, at 10:20 AM, Cheryl Lenartiene 
mailto:cheryl.lenarti...@gmail.com>> wrote:



Hi all,

Much of the time, when I use the onscreen Braille keyboard, nothing 
I type is recognized or input. Other gestures that aren't recognized 
include turning contracted Braille translation on and off, 
attempting to calibrate the dots, and attempting to use Explore Mode 
to locate the dots on screen. The only gesture that seems to be 
recognized is the gesture to change the rotor setting. Is anyone 
else experiencing this?


I am an experienced MBraille user, and MBraille is still working 
reliably for me, so I don't think it's me or the hardware in my 
phone. Thoughts appreciated.


Cheryl

Be joyful always, pray continually, give thanks in all circumstances;
for this is God's will for you in Christ Jesus.
1 Thessalonians 5:16-18

Sent from my iPhone
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Re: I love braille input in iOs 8!

[Nicki Keck]

Man I have tried, but just can't get the hang of it.

Nicki
Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 25, 2014, at 12:57 PM, Cheryl Homiak  wrote:
> 
> Somehow I never got the idea of mbraille; I don't know if I got stuck on 
> calibration or what my problem was. But I have caught on to the built-in 
> braille screen input and I am loving it!
> 
> -- 
> Cheryl
> 
> I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.
> I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper
> thrown in the trash!
> Then God gave me a new heart and life:
> His joy for my despairing tears!
> And now, every day:
> "This I call to mind,
> and therefore I have hope:
> The steadfast love of the Lord
> never ceases;
> his mercies never come to an end;
> they are new every morning;
> great is your faithfulness."
> (Lamentations 3:21-23 ESV)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the viphone list. 
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Re: ways of backing up your iphone

[Paul Ferrara]

Others may be  able to better tell you which way is best to back up your device 
and might be able to give even better reasons for their claims, but I can tell 
you I would definitely back it up using iTunes before you get a new device. 
Make sure all your purchases including apps. music, etc. are saved to your 
computer. The problem with using an iCloud backup is that, at least when the 
iPhone 5 came out, if you did not download from the cloud before setting up the 
device, you could not do it; you got one chance only.
So if the store associate sets up stuff on the phone, you cannot get the backed 
up cloud version.
So I would say it’s best to back up with iTunes and then immediately restore 
the new device with the backup from iTunes.

Paul

From: martin nelson 
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:56 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com 
Subject: ways of backing up your iphone

Hello, friends: it is my understanding that there are two ways of backing up 
your I device: using the iTunes on your computer, or using the I cloud. When 
purchasing a new phone  I assume that all the contents of your phone can be 
retrieve by either of these methods. My question is, is one of them more 
reliable than the other? Also, when setting up your new device, will all the 
content stored in the I cloud be automatically downloaded to your device?
Thank you in advance for your help.
Regards,
Martin Nelson 
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Re: Problems using onscreen Braille keyboard

[Alex Hall]

The gesture for explore mode is not a double tap and hold, you simply place a 
finger on the screen and leave it there until VO says "now in explore mode". 
That might be part of the confusion.
On Sep 25, 2014, at 8:55 PM, Cheryl Lenartiene  
wrote:

> When I can get it to work, what I entered does make sense. Fortunately, it's 
> not gibberish. However, when it fails, it fails royally. It does not even 
> recognize the double tap and hold gesture to enter explore mode.
> 
> Cheryl
> 
> Be joyful always, pray continually, give thanks in all circumstances;
> for this is God's will for you in Christ Jesus.
> 1 Thessalonians 5:16-18
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Sep 25, 2014, at 3:55 PM, Deb Lewis  wrote:
> 
>> I've definitely done all this. Everything I write is jibberish. Lots
>> of it is on the wrong side of the cell. If it isn't, it' just garbage
>> for the most part. I've tried both modes. I know lots of people have
>> gotten it to work, and I got it to work in the app so I don't know
>> hwat's different here but it most definitely is.
>> 
>> On 9/25/14, RobH.  wrote:
>>> Oh, very good;  that's two gems;  the 2finger scrub to get out is more my
>>> thing.
>>> 
>>> Rh.
>>> - Original Message -
>>> From: "Ioana Gandrabur" 
>>> To: 
>>> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:22 PM
>>> Subject: Re: Problems using onscreen Braille keyboard
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> 
>>> Here is the section on writing in braille from the apple user guide, just in
>>> 
>>> case it might outline something you missed.
>>> I did not know for example about expand text option with 2 finger hlick
>>> down.
>>> 
>>> http://help.apple.com/iphone/8/en.lproj/iph10366cc30.html";
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
 On Sep 25, 2014, at 11:10 AM, Deb Lewis  wrote:
 
 I have the same issues as cheryl. I think we may not be getting it
 calibrated correctly. Don't know if anyone can comment to that aspect
 of it.
 
 
> On 9/25/14, Alex Hall  wrote:
> Aside from spaces not always registering, and key echo not working in
> contracted mode, I have no problems. The actual accuracy of the braille
> input (again, spaces notwithstanding) seems to be the same as MBraille.
> Granted, I always use Away Mode, but still, all gestures and commands
> work
> as expected. This will sound rather stupid, I know, but are you sure you
> enabled braille mode? Since the only gesture you can get working is the
> rotor, it almost sounds like braille isn't on at all. Again, I know how
> od
> that sounds, but I can't think of why else it would not work for you.
>> On Sep 25, 2014, at 10:39 AM, Jennie Facer 
>> wrote:
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> I have found that if you use uncontracted Braille, it works better. You
>> 
>> do
>> have to write that way, but characters are noticed better that way.
>> 
>> Jenn
>> 
>>   TO THE WORLD YOU ARE SOMEONE, BUT TO SOMENE YOU ARE THE
>> WORLD!
>> 
>> On Sep 25, 2014, at 8:20 AM, Cheryl Lenartiene
>>  wrote:
>> 
>>> Hi all,
>>> 
>>> Much of the time, when I use the onscreen Braille keyboard, nothing I
>>> type is recognized or input. Other gestures that aren't recognized
>>> include turning contracted Braille translation on and off, attempting
>>> to
>>> calibrate the dots, and attempting to use Explore Mode to locate the
>>> dots
>>> on screen. The only gesture that seems to be recognized is the gesture
>>> 
>>> to
>>> change the rotor setting. Is anyone else experiencing this?
>>> 
>>> I am an experienced MBraille user, and MBraille is still working
>>> reliably
>>> for me, so I don't think it's me or the hardware in my phone. Thoughts
>>> appreciated.
>>> 
>>> Cheryl
>>> 
>>> Be joyful always, pray continually, give thanks in all circumstances;
>>> for this is God's will for you in Christ Jesus.
>>> 1 Thessalonians 5:16-18
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>> --
>>> The following information is important for all members of the viphone
>>> list. All new members to the this list are moderated by default. If
>>> you
>>> have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if
>>> you
>>> feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners
>>> or
>>> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. The
>>> archives
>>> for this list can be searched at
>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/viphone@googlegroups.com/.
>>> ---
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>> Groups
>>> "VIPhone" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send
>>> 
>>> an
>>> email to viphone+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
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>>> Visit this group at http:/

RE: new to this list

[Corey Michael Cook]

Offer ends on 9/30 for Verizon


Corey Cook
Facebook:
corey.coo...@gmail.com

-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of John Diakogeorgiou
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:56 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: new to this list

Verizon is doing the same as Sprint.

On 9/25/14, Pam Berman  wrote:
> Sprint is telling me that they will give $200 for any IPhone that is
traded
> in for the 6 or 6+. Last night I went into the Apple store & they told me
> they would give me $115 for my 4S.
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
> Of John Diakogeorgiou
> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 6:30 PM
> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: new to this list
>
> If you have a phone that you are trying to sell to get the $200, it is
> coming from Apple not Sprint.
>
> On 9/25/14, Marianne Denning  wrote:
>> Pam, this happened when people started using IOS 6 and 7.  Yes, I am
>> sure there are bugs and Apple will put out a release to fix many of
>> them.  I don't usually upgrade for a few weeks to see what people are
>> saying.  When I do upgrade it seems to work well.  You will always
>> hear the bad things about something and not so much about the good.
>> If you can afford it then go ahead and get the 6.  I always upgrade my
>> phone when my contract runs out so I have another year but I will get
>> the most current phone when I upgrade.
>>
>> On 9/25/14, Pam Berman  wrote:
>>> Thanks, I'm a bit nervous with all the bad press everyone is giving
>>> ios 8but
>>> $200 is a nice savings.
>>>
>>> Pam
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On
>>> Behalf Of Alan Paganelli
>>> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 4:37 PM
>>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: Re: new to this list
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> If Sprint is offering you a bonus of 2 hundred bucks then go for it.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Alan
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Go Chicago Bears in 2014!
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Teenagers; Tired of being harassed by your stupid parents?  Act now!
>>> Move out.  Get a job.  Pay your bills wile you still know everything.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Please click on:
>>> HTTP://WWW.home.earthlink.net/~alanandsuzanne/
>>> There, you'll find free files of my arrangements and performances
>>> played on the Yamaha Tyros 1 keyboard.  The albums in Technics
>>> format formerly on my website are still available upon request.
>>> Thanks for listening!
>>>
>>> - Original Message -
>>>
>>> From: Pam Berman 
>>>
>>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>>>
>>> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 2:05 PM
>>>
>>> Subject: RE: new to this list
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hi Connie & thank you for the warm welcome.
>>>
>>> Now I hear that I should go with the 6 when I replace my phone, but
>>> should I wait or jump in. I'm only anxious because Sprint is offering
>>> $200 for any IPhones that have been on their service plans within the
>>> past 30 days, as long as they are up grading to a 6 or 6+, but this
>>> deal is only available until Sept. 30.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On
>>> Behalf Of Connie Mohney
>>> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 3:23 PM
>>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: RE: new to this list
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hello Pam,
>>>
>>> Welcome to this list with friendly and knowledgeable people.
>>>
>>> Connie
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On
>>> Behalf Of Pam Berman
>>> Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2014 11:24 AM
>>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: new to this list
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hello All!
>>>
>>> My name is Pam, I'm totally blind & use voiceover exclusively. A
>>> friend just told me about this list. I have some questions.
>>>
>>> #1. What's the V for in the name of this list? Voiceover?
>>>
>>> #2. I've got a 2 year old IPhone 4S with Sprint & am thinking of
>>> upgrading.
>>> Do you recommend:
>>>
>>> A.  The 5S
>>>
>>> B.  The new 6
>>>
>>> C.  I just wait awhile longer.
>>>
>>> I really appreciate any feedback on this.
>>>
>>> Thank You,
>>>
>>> Pam
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> The following information is important for all members of the viphone
>>> list.
>>> All new members to the this list are moderated by default. If you
>>> have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if
>>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the
>>> owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>>> The archives for this list can be searched at
>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/viphone@googlegroups.com/.
>>> ---
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>> Groups "VIPhone" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,
>>> send an email to viphone+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>>> To 

RE: Let's try this again... iOS 8.0.2 is out

[Corey Michael Cook]

Downloading it now.

Fingers crossed.

 

 

Corey Cook

Facebook:

  corey.coo...@gmail.com

 

From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Cristóbal
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:27 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Let's try this again... iOS 8.0.2 is out

 

Once bitten. Twice shy? Anyway, Version 8.0.2 is now out. Same changelog as
8.0.1 with the fixes for the cell and touch ID issues from the earlier
release.

Again, curious to hear of any Voiceover bug fixes.

http://www.theverge.com/2014/9/25/6841455/ios-8-0-2-available-to-fix-iphone-
6-models

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ways of backing up your iphone

[martin nelson]

Hello, friends: it is my understanding that there are two ways of backing up 
your I device: using the iTunes on your computer, or using the I cloud. When 
purchasing a new phone  I assume that all the contents of your phone can be 
retrieve by either of these methods. My question is, is one of them more 
reliable than the other? Also, when setting up your new device, will all the 
content stored in the I cloud be automatically downloaded to your device?
Thank you in advance for your help.
Regards,
Martin Nelson 

-- 
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directly rather than posting on the list itself. The archives for this list can 
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Re: new to this list

[John Diakogeorgiou]

Verizon is doing the same as Sprint.

On 9/25/14, Pam Berman  wrote:
> Sprint is telling me that they will give $200 for any IPhone that is traded
> in for the 6 or 6+. Last night I went into the Apple store & they told me
> they would give me $115 for my 4S.
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
> Of John Diakogeorgiou
> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 6:30 PM
> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: new to this list
>
> If you have a phone that you are trying to sell to get the $200, it is
> coming from Apple not Sprint.
>
> On 9/25/14, Marianne Denning  wrote:
>> Pam, this happened when people started using IOS 6 and 7.  Yes, I am
>> sure there are bugs and Apple will put out a release to fix many of
>> them.  I don't usually upgrade for a few weeks to see what people are
>> saying.  When I do upgrade it seems to work well.  You will always
>> hear the bad things about something and not so much about the good.
>> If you can afford it then go ahead and get the 6.  I always upgrade my
>> phone when my contract runs out so I have another year but I will get
>> the most current phone when I upgrade.
>>
>> On 9/25/14, Pam Berman  wrote:
>>> Thanks, I'm a bit nervous with all the bad press everyone is giving
>>> ios 8but
>>> $200 is a nice savings.
>>>
>>> Pam
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On
>>> Behalf Of Alan Paganelli
>>> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 4:37 PM
>>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: Re: new to this list
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> If Sprint is offering you a bonus of 2 hundred bucks then go for it.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Alan
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Go Chicago Bears in 2014!
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Teenagers; Tired of being harassed by your stupid parents?  Act now!
>>> Move out.  Get a job.  Pay your bills wile you still know everything.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Please click on:
>>> HTTP://WWW.home.earthlink.net/~alanandsuzanne/
>>> There, you'll find free files of my arrangements and performances
>>> played on the Yamaha Tyros 1 keyboard.  The albums in Technics
>>> format formerly on my website are still available upon request.
>>> Thanks for listening!
>>>
>>> - Original Message -
>>>
>>> From: Pam Berman 
>>>
>>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>>>
>>> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 2:05 PM
>>>
>>> Subject: RE: new to this list
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hi Connie & thank you for the warm welcome.
>>>
>>> Now I hear that I should go with the 6 when I replace my phone, but
>>> should I wait or jump in. I'm only anxious because Sprint is offering
>>> $200 for any IPhones that have been on their service plans within the
>>> past 30 days, as long as they are up grading to a 6 or 6+, but this
>>> deal is only available until Sept. 30.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On
>>> Behalf Of Connie Mohney
>>> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 3:23 PM
>>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: RE: new to this list
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hello Pam,
>>>
>>> Welcome to this list with friendly and knowledgeable people.
>>>
>>> Connie
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On
>>> Behalf Of Pam Berman
>>> Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2014 11:24 AM
>>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: new to this list
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Hello All!
>>>
>>> My name is Pam, I'm totally blind & use voiceover exclusively. A
>>> friend just told me about this list. I have some questions.
>>>
>>> #1. What's the V for in the name of this list? Voiceover?
>>>
>>> #2. I've got a 2 year old IPhone 4S with Sprint & am thinking of
>>> upgrading.
>>> Do you recommend:
>>>
>>> A.  The 5S
>>>
>>> B.  The new 6
>>>
>>> C.  I just wait awhile longer.
>>>
>>> I really appreciate any feedback on this.
>>>
>>> Thank You,
>>>
>>> Pam
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> The following information is important for all members of the viphone
>>> list.
>>> All new members to the this list are moderated by default. If you
>>> have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if
>>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the
>>> owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>>> The archives for this list can be searched at
>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/viphone@googlegroups.com/.
>>> ---
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>>> Groups "VIPhone" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,
>>> send an email to viphone+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>>> To post to this group, send email to viphone@googlegroups.com.
>>> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/viphone.
>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>>>
>>> --
>>> The following information is important for all members of the viphone
>>> list.
>>> All new members to

Re: Problems using onscreen Braille keyboard

[Cheryl Lenartiene]

When I can get it to work, what I entered does make sense. Fortunately, it's 
not gibberish. However, when it fails, it fails royally. It does not even 
recognize the double tap and hold gesture to enter explore mode.

Cheryl

Be joyful always, pray continually, give thanks in all circumstances;
for this is God's will for you in Christ Jesus.
1 Thessalonians 5:16-18

Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 25, 2014, at 3:55 PM, Deb Lewis  wrote:
> 
> I've definitely done all this. Everything I write is jibberish. Lots
> of it is on the wrong side of the cell. If it isn't, it' just garbage
> for the most part. I've tried both modes. I know lots of people have
> gotten it to work, and I got it to work in the app so I don't know
> hwat's different here but it most definitely is.
> 
>> On 9/25/14, RobH.  wrote:
>> Oh, very good;  that's two gems;  the 2finger scrub to get out is more my
>> thing.
>> 
>> Rh.
>> - Original Message -
>> From: "Ioana Gandrabur" 
>> To: 
>> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 8:22 PM
>> Subject: Re: Problems using onscreen Braille keyboard
>> 
>> 
>> Hi,
>> 
>> Here is the section on writing in braille from the apple user guide, just in
>> 
>> case it might outline something you missed.
>> I did not know for example about expand text option with 2 finger hlick
>> down.
>> 
>> http://help.apple.com/iphone/8/en.lproj/iph10366cc30.html";
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Sep 25, 2014, at 11:10 AM, Deb Lewis  wrote:
>>> 
>>> I have the same issues as cheryl. I think we may not be getting it
>>> calibrated correctly. Don't know if anyone can comment to that aspect
>>> of it.
>>> 
>>> 
 On 9/25/14, Alex Hall  wrote:
 Aside from spaces not always registering, and key echo not working in
 contracted mode, I have no problems. The actual accuracy of the braille
 input (again, spaces notwithstanding) seems to be the same as MBraille.
 Granted, I always use Away Mode, but still, all gestures and commands
 work
 as expected. This will sound rather stupid, I know, but are you sure you
 enabled braille mode? Since the only gesture you can get working is the
 rotor, it almost sounds like braille isn't on at all. Again, I know how
 od
 that sounds, but I can't think of why else it would not work for you.
> On Sep 25, 2014, at 10:39 AM, Jennie Facer 
> wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I have found that if you use uncontracted Braille, it works better. You
> 
> do
> have to write that way, but characters are noticed better that way.
> 
> Jenn
> 
>   TO THE WORLD YOU ARE SOMEONE, BUT TO SOMENE YOU ARE THE
> WORLD!
> 
> On Sep 25, 2014, at 8:20 AM, Cheryl Lenartiene
>  wrote:
> 
>> Hi all,
>> 
>> Much of the time, when I use the onscreen Braille keyboard, nothing I
>> type is recognized or input. Other gestures that aren't recognized
>> include turning contracted Braille translation on and off, attempting
>> to
>> calibrate the dots, and attempting to use Explore Mode to locate the
>> dots
>> on screen. The only gesture that seems to be recognized is the gesture
>> 
>> to
>> change the rotor setting. Is anyone else experiencing this?
>> 
>> I am an experienced MBraille user, and MBraille is still working
>> reliably
>> for me, so I don't think it's me or the hardware in my phone. Thoughts
>> appreciated.
>> 
>> Cheryl
>> 
>> Be joyful always, pray continually, give thanks in all circumstances;
>> for this is God's will for you in Christ Jesus.
>> 1 Thessalonians 5:16-18
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> --
>> The following information is important for all members of the viphone
>> list. All new members to the this list are moderated by default. If
>> you
>> have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if
>> you
>> feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners
>> or
>> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. The
>> archives
>> for this list can be searched at
>> http://www.mail-archive.com/viphone@googlegroups.com/.
>> ---
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
>> Groups
>> "VIPhone" group.
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Re: Why I'm returning my iPhone 6 (well, maybe)

[John Diakogeorgiou]

I think you will be pleased as to how easy it is to transition from
one phone to another.

On 9/25/14, Vicky Collins  wrote:
> You might recall that I ordered my 6 plus using the Apple Store
> app, ordered it early the first morning they were available, but
> they couldn't get through to AT&T to verify my information so
> sent me the reservation email.  Thus, it was actually the next
> day before I officially placed my order.  The Apple leather case
> I purchased at the same time was delivered this Tuesday, and I
> actually got the 6 plus today.  I would have had it yesterday,
> but the UPS driver wasn't allowed to leave it at the apartment
> complex leasing office, and I was at work and couldn't sign for
> it myself.  Believe it or not, I have resisted unboxing the phone
> and case, wanting to wait till the weekend when I have plenty of
> time, especially if I need to do a lot of rearranging of things
> to take the phone to and from work with me.
>
>  on a side note, I checked the My AT&T app, and the option to
> manage my Next installment plan was there, even the option to pay
> it off showed up, but I just couldn't get the button to work to
> say yes that I wanted to continue paying in full.  Then, when I
> called the AT&T National Disability Center, they said I was
> having the problem with paying because I hadn't yet received the
> phone.  After I said I did have the phone, I was asked for my SIM
> number in order for them to take the payment, but then I had to
> apologize for wasting their time and explain that I couldn't give
> that number as I
> hadn't yet taken the phone out of the box.- Original Message
> -
> From: Marcos Rodrigues  To: viphone@googlegroups.com
> Date sent: Thu, 25 Sep 2014 15:52:44 -0300
> Subject: Re: Why I'm returning my iPhone 6 (well, maybe)
>
> Hi folks:
>
> I preordered my 6+ at the first day at a ATNT store and it has
> not beeing shipped yet so I am very disappointed.
>
> Regards.
> Marcos Rodrigues
> mrodrigue...@hotmail.com
>
>
>
> Em Sep 25, 2014, à(s) 3:49 PM, Rick Alfaro
>  escreveu:
>
>  Deb,
>
>  How long of a wait to get your 6 plus? I'm thinking of going the
> same route
>  but have heard they are totally sold out.
>
>
>
>  Best regards,
>
>  Rick Alfaro
>
>  -Original Message-
>  From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com]
> On Behalf
>  Of Deb Lewis
>  Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 2:06 PM
>  To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>  Subject: Re: Why I'm returning my iPhone 6 (well, maybe)
>
>  I'm going to get the 6 Plus and I'm going to like it, LOL.
>  I have an Ipad Mini and I like that.  The Plus is smaller than
> that.  I
>  love the bigger screen particularly on the internet and for
> typing.
>  I don't mind carrying it.  I always have carried my phones in a
> secure
>  pouch or bag of some kind.  I only have one thing to carry
> phones in
>  that will be too small for the 6 plus.  I'm not saying that
> bigger is
>  necessarily better, but most other phones are bigger these days
> and
>  it's just a fact of life.  So I'm holding out for the Plus.  I
> think
>  people should just go look at them, choose what they want, and
>  discussion should pretty much be over.
>  And if you'd all be so kind as to select the 6, I can have my
> Plus sooner..
>
>  On 9/25/14, Chuck Dean  wrote:
>  Hi Cheryl, glad to hear you like your 6+, but tell us why.
>
>  Chuck (mobile)
>  Pleez x cuze enny tie ping or spelin air ores.
>
>  On Sep 25, 2014, at 9:58 AM, Cheryl Homiak 
> wrote:
>
>  I like my 6+!
>
>  --
>  Cheryl
>
>  I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.
>  I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper
>  thrown in the trash!
>  Then God gave me a new heart and life:
>  His joy for my despairing tears!
>  And now, every day:
>  "This I call to mind,
>  and therefore I have hope:
>  The steadfast love of the Lord
>  never ceases;
>  his mercies never come to an end;
>  they are new every morning;
>  great is your faithfulness."
>  (Lamentations 3:21-23 ESV)
>
>
>
>
>  On Sep 25, 2014, at 11:55 AM, Wayne Merritt
>  wrote:
>
>  It seems like, from what I have read on the web, that most
> people
>  think the 6 Plus is too big and the 6 is just right.  Many of
> those
>  comments were from blind people that checked out both phones or
> who
>  just looked at the 6 and thought it was just right.  After
> reading all
>  that and knowing I had gotten the 6 myself for that reason, I am
> glad
>  I ordered the 6 and didn't pay the extra $100 for a larger phone
> with
>  more space than I needed.  Then again, there are those blind
> people
>  that got the 6 Plus and are happy with their purchase.  Guess I
> will
>  find out in about a week or so when I get the new phone.
>
>  Wayne
>
>  On 9/25/14, Chuck Dean  wrote:
>  When I went to look at the iPhone 6 I remarked of the salesman
> that I
>  would
>  actually prefer a smaller phone, over a bigger phone.  Because I
> listen
>  to
>  everything on the screen I don't need to see it, so a smaller

Re: Not seeing messages I sent to the list

[Woody Anna Dresner]

Hi Michelle,

This list is configured so that you don't see the messages you post.

Best,
Anna



On Sep 25, 2014, at 9:32 AM, Michelle Bernstein  
wrote:

> This message is on the viphone message board so you appear to be able to post 
> messages.
> 
> -- 
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> All new members to the this list are moderated by default. If you have any 
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> member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or moderators 
> directly rather than posting on the list itself. The archives for this list 
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KNFB reader questions

[Larry Lumpkin]

Hi.  KNFB reader is definitely on my Christmas list.  I have a couple of
questions for those of you who have put it through its paces.

 

1.Does anyone know the image size the reader will accommodate.  I am
digitizing my large collection of vinyl record albums and would like to
shoot their jackets for info.

2.   Has anyone tried shooting pages from a cookbook to see how recipes
come out.

 

Thanks.

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Re: Why I'm returning my iPhone 6 (well, maybe)

[Vicky Collins]

You might recall that I ordered my 6 plus using the Apple Store 
app, ordered it early the first morning they were available, but 
they couldn't get through to AT&T to verify my information so 
sent me the reservation email.  Thus, it was actually the next 
day before I officially placed my order.  The Apple leather case 
I purchased at the same time was delivered this Tuesday, and I 
actually got the 6 plus today.  I would have had it yesterday, 
but the UPS driver wasn't allowed to leave it at the apartment 
complex leasing office, and I was at work and couldn't sign for 
it myself.  Believe it or not, I have resisted unboxing the phone 
and case, wanting to wait till the weekend when I have plenty of 
time, especially if I need to do a lot of rearranging of things 
to take the phone to and from work with me.


on a side note, I checked the My AT&T app, and the option to 
manage my Next installment plan was there, even the option to pay 
it off showed up, but I just couldn't get the button to work to 
say yes that I wanted to continue paying in full.  Then, when I 
called the AT&T National Disability Center, they said I was 
having the problem with paying because I hadn't yet received the 
phone.  After I said I did have the phone, I was asked for my SIM 
number in order for them to take the payment, but then I had to 
apologize for wasting their time and explain that I couldn't give 
that number as I
hadn't yet taken the phone out of the box.- Original Message 
-

From: Marcos Rodrigues I preordered my 6+ at the first day at a ATNT store and it has 
not beeing shipped yet so I am very disappointed.


Regards.
Marcos Rodrigues
mrodrigue...@hotmail.com



Em Sep 25, 2014, à(s) 3:49 PM, Rick Alfaro 
 escreveu:


Deb,

How long of a wait to get your 6 plus? I'm thinking of going the 
same route

but have heard they are totally sold out.



Best regards,

Rick Alfaro

-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf

Of Deb Lewis
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 2:06 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Why I'm returning my iPhone 6 (well, maybe)

I'm going to get the 6 Plus and I'm going to like it, LOL.
I have an Ipad Mini and I like that.  The Plus is smaller than 
that.  I
love the bigger screen particularly on the internet and for 
typing.
I don't mind carrying it.  I always have carried my phones in a 
secure
pouch or bag of some kind.  I only have one thing to carry 
phones in
that will be too small for the 6 plus.  I'm not saying that 
bigger is
necessarily better, but most other phones are bigger these days 
and
it's just a fact of life.  So I'm holding out for the Plus.  I 
think

people should just go look at them, choose what they want, and
discussion should pretty much be over.
And if you'd all be so kind as to select the 6, I can have my 
Plus sooner..


On 9/25/14, Chuck Dean  wrote:
Hi Cheryl, glad to hear you like your 6+, but tell us why.

Chuck (mobile)
Pleez x cuze enny tie ping or spelin air ores.

On Sep 25, 2014, at 9:58 AM, Cheryl Homiak  
wrote:


I like my 6+!

--
Cheryl

I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.
I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper
thrown in the trash!
Then God gave me a new heart and life:
His joy for my despairing tears!
And now, every day:
"This I call to mind,
and therefore I have hope:
The steadfast love of the Lord
never ceases;
his mercies never come to an end;
they are new every morning;
great is your faithfulness."
(Lamentations 3:21-23 ESV)




On Sep 25, 2014, at 11:55 AM, Wayne Merritt 
 wrote:


It seems like, from what I have read on the web, that most 
people
think the 6 Plus is too big and the 6 is just right.  Many of 
those
comments were from blind people that checked out both phones or 
who
just looked at the 6 and thought it was just right.  After 
reading all
that and knowing I had gotten the 6 myself for that reason, I am 
glad
I ordered the 6 and didn't pay the extra $100 for a larger phone 
with
more space than I needed.  Then again, there are those blind 
people
that got the 6 Plus and are happy with their purchase.  Guess I 
will

find out in about a week or so when I get the new phone.

Wayne

On 9/25/14, Chuck Dean  wrote:
When I went to look at the iPhone 6 I remarked of the salesman 
that I

would
actually prefer a smaller phone, over a bigger phone.  Because I 
listen

to
everything on the screen I don't need to see it, so a smaller 
phone

would be
more convenient.  He looked at me like I was nuts.

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moderators
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Let's try this again... iOS 8.0.2 is out

[Cristóbal]

Once bitten. Twice shy? Anyway, Version 8.0.2 is now out. Same changelog as
8.0.1 with the fixes for the cell and touch ID issues from the earlier
release.

Again, curious to hear of any Voiceover bug fixes.

http://www.theverge.com/2014/9/25/6841455/ios-8-0-2-available-to-fix-iphone-
6-models

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Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out

[Christopher Chaltain]

I don't know all of the details about why IOS 8.0.1 was released by 
mistake, but if it really was just human error then that would trouble 
me greatly. Large companies, like Apple, when they're releasing an 
update to a major operating system of theirs, has processes in place to 
make sure things are not released by mistake or prematurely. Developers 
make mistakes too, and that's why you have test teams to catch those 
bugs before they hit the public. I've been involved in product releases 
my entire professional career, and at any company I've worked at, it's 
inconceivable to me that an update to a major product could be released 
accidentally. If human error could circumvent all of the checks and 
processes in place to make sure this doesn't happen then there are some 
serious process issues in Apple's release process. The fact that 
something like this could happen, troubles me much more than the bugs 
I've seen in IOS 8.


On 09/25/2014 08:39 AM, John Diakogeorgiou wrote:

The people who are bashing Apple about 8.0.1 are conveniently ignoring
the fact that it was released by human error. Come on people are you
saying you've never made a mistake?

On 9/25/14, Jed Barton  wrote:

I couldn't agree more.
Guys look, here's the deal, no technology company is perfect, nor will
it ever be.
Apple has gone through some great lengths to make the iphone family and
macs accessible in so many different ways.  Sometimes you just have to
get creative and learn.  Part of the issue is the specific app
development itself.
There are many apps where the developers don't know how to make their
apps accessible although many of them are open to it and want to learn.
   I switched to an iphone almost 2 years ago and i would never go back.
Take some time, learn, and spend some time with it, and you can't go wrong.

Cheers,
Jed

On 9/25/2014 7:51 AM, Krister Ekstrom wrote:

I wholeheartedly agree with the posting here below. In fact i couldn't
have said it better myself, i probably would have added some grumpy
comments that would make if not enemies then at least some not so happy
people.:-)
I may be overly loyal to Apple, even to the point of religion but i have
to say that Apple has done a whole lot more than i ever expected a main
stream company to ever do for us. As i stated in an earlier post, i don't
think i have ever seen a bug that's not been fixed although it may have
taken some time.
/Krister


25 sep 2014 kl. 13:18 skrev Joanne Chua :

not finger ppointing at anyone, but at times, most times, i do wonder,
what is really the accessibility issue of Apple, and what is user
errores, or the lack of understanding and training for user usage.

I heard this over and over again, from different list how apple is
inaccessible for VO user, how Apple got so many different and
keystrokes to learn compare to jaws and windows and etc etc. But,  do
these users really give VO a chance, putting window aside, for say, 3
months, and really focus on VO


And these people also often forget to celebrate the good things of
accessibility on apple products, but instead, decide to focus on the
bad things and how inaccessible apple products are for VO user.

I'm not saying apple is perfect, in many ways apple is far from
perfect, or the ideal technology for blind  users. But at the same
time, if Apple is so inaccessible, why then, there are more and more
blind and VI professionals switch to Apple instead of stay on with
windows?

Just my 0.2 worth of sense

On 25/09/2014, mário navarro  wrote:


yes friend absolutely right.
I also share your words ...
I sold my imac because I was tired of the irresponsibility of the
apple.
I thought things were better in IOS and with the money from selling the
imac bought an iPhone.
but once again the apple disappointed me because it is the total
irresponsibility on all your systems ...
vo on OSX, is stopped in time.
Apple does not listen to us and no longer serves us as it should ...
I think that apple is no longer able to continue to innovate the vo.
if apple would hear us things would not be this shame ...
we must have the same rights as the sighted people.
let's stop  to say amen to favors that apple makes us ...
apple stop  sleeping in the spotlight ...
open your eyes and stop being irresponsible ...
cheers.

Em 25/09/2014 10:27, Pablo Morales escreveu:


Hmmm, I think everything has a limit. Apple makes great products, even
though, it should not be a excuse to start doing this kind of things.
Since this last year, me and apple are very mad. Mad, because I am
noticing that for them, when they have a huge reputation, they want to
sale more, and IOs and other examples is something that apple is not
testing enough, just to  make more money.

Anyway. I am very happy now, with my IOs 7.1.2, and you know what?

I have less than one year using this IOs 7.1.2, why I will install a
new release with bunches of bugs?

It doesn't make sense. But it is my opinion, and I respect who wants
to try something new, when the

Re: IOS8, The Posatives

[Christopher Chaltain]

Yeh, I remembered this from the IOS 7 update, and I'm occasionally 
toggling bluettooth on and off anyway, since I'm not a frequent 
bluetooth user, so I caught this right away. I didn't think to check the 
brightness right away though. It seems like I'm still not getting the 
battery life I used to, so there may be another setting I need to find. 
It also may be that my iPhone usage habits have changed a bit recently, 
specifically reading a lot more email with the IOS update and all.


On 09/25/2014 12:01 PM, Gmail wrote:

You might want to try checking to see if your Bluetooth is on. This has been 
enabled by default after an iOS update ever since iOS 7 so that people who're 
deaf-blind, people who rely solely on a braille display to interact with their 
iDevice, won't get stuck with something that's unusable until cited help can be 
found to help repare the display back to the iDevice.


Thanks,
Ari



On Sep 25, 2014, at 5:03 AM, Christopher Chaltain  wrote:

My battery life has been significantly decreased since I updated my iPhone 4S 
to IOS 8. I turned off auto brightness and lowered my screen brightness, but I 
suspect there's another setting that I need to change back to what it was 
before the update to get my battery life back to where it was.


On 09/25/2014 02:28 AM, Hicks Steven (CORNWALL IT SERVICES) wrote:
Hi friends,

Just a quick message really, there has been a lot of talk about IOS8 and
the issues.

I just wanted to post a message to the list to see if anyone comes back
with positive feedback and can let us know things that they have found
in IOS8 that are a positive?

Has anyone found any difference with the battery usage for example?

Steve.




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Re: iOS 8.0.1 is out

[Shawn Krasniuk]

And this is the reason I'm thinking of unsubscribing from this list. No one 
wants to give out any constructive criticism. Instead all people want to do is 
sit here and bitch and bash Apple in the process. I've been a happy iPhone and 
Mac user for almost 4 years. I'm running the beta of OS X Yosemite as we speak. 
And guess what? There were bugs. But in a later beta they fixed a whole bunch 
of them. No one wants to think of the positives and be optimistic that Apple 
will eventually squash these bugs. And as for the accidental release of 8.0.1, 
that's all it was. AN ACCIDENT! Move on! I mean seriously, it's very 
disconcerting and come home from whatever I'm doing to find almost 200 emails 
all saying that iOS8 is the most crappy, inaccessible, whatever you wanna say, 
iOS ever. So yeah, I might just go off list for a while because listening to 
the same crap for over a week now is very tiring. I have other things to do 
then sit here and listen to this crap. And to those of you that are staying 
positive about iOS8 like Charles and Sieghard, I commend you. At least some 
people are enjoying this iOS. So yeah I might be leaving this list for a while. 
If you positive people would like to follow me on social networking, my 
Facebook is my name, Shawn Krasniuk and my twitter is @shawn_aka_bbs. Maybe 
I'll come back when the next iOS8 comes out.

Shawn
Sent From My White MacBook

> On Sep 25, 2014, at 6:56 AM, Jed Barton  wrote:
> 
> I couldn't agree more.
> Guys look, here's the deal, no technology company is perfect, nor will it 
> ever be.
> Apple has gone through some great lengths to make the iphone family and macs 
> accessible in so many different ways.  Sometimes you just have to get 
> creative and learn.  Part of the issue is the specific app development itself.
> There are many apps where the developers don't know how to make their apps 
> accessible although many of them are open to it and want to learn.  I 
> switched to an iphone almost 2 years ago and i would never go back.
> Take some time, learn, and spend some time with it, and you can't go wrong.
> 
> Cheers,
> Jed
> 
> On 9/25/2014 7:51 AM, Krister Ekstrom wrote:
>> I wholeheartedly agree with the posting here below. In fact i couldn't have 
>> said it better myself, i probably would have added some grumpy comments that 
>> would make if not enemies then at least some not so happy people.:-)
>> I may be overly loyal to Apple, even to the point of religion but i have to 
>> say that Apple has done a whole lot more than i ever expected a main stream 
>> company to ever do for us. As i stated in an earlier post, i don't think i 
>> have ever seen a bug that's not been fixed although it may have taken some 
>> time.
>> /Krister
>> 
>>> 25 sep 2014 kl. 13:18 skrev Joanne Chua :
>>> 
>>> not finger ppointing at anyone, but at times, most times, i do wonder,
>>> what is really the accessibility issue of Apple, and what is user
>>> errores, or the lack of understanding and training for user usage.
>>> 
>>> I heard this over and over again, from different list how apple is
>>> inaccessible for VO user, how Apple got so many different and
>>> keystrokes to learn compare to jaws and windows and etc etc. But,  do
>>> these users really give VO a chance, putting window aside, for say, 3
>>> months, and really focus on VO
>>> 
>>> 
>>> And these people also often forget to celebrate the good things of
>>> accessibility on apple products, but instead, decide to focus on the
>>> bad things and how inaccessible apple products are for VO user.
>>> 
>>> I'm not saying apple is perfect, in many ways apple is far from
>>> perfect, or the ideal technology for blind  users. But at the same
>>> time, if Apple is so inaccessible, why then, there are more and more
>>> blind and VI professionals switch to Apple instead of stay on with
>>> windows?
>>> 
>>> Just my 0.2 worth of sense
>>> 
>>> On 25/09/2014, mário navarro  wrote:
 
 yes friend absolutely right.
 I also share your words ...
 I sold my imac because I was tired of the irresponsibility of the apple.
 I thought things were better in IOS and with the money from selling the
 imac bought an iPhone.
 but once again the apple disappointed me because it is the total
 irresponsibility on all your systems ...
 vo on OSX, is stopped in time.
 Apple does not listen to us and no longer serves us as it should ...
 I think that apple is no longer able to continue to innovate the vo.
 if apple would hear us things would not be this shame ...
 we must have the same rights as the sighted people.
 let's stop  to say amen to favors that apple makes us ...
 apple stop  sleeping in the spotlight ...
 open your eyes and stop being irresponsible ...
 cheers.
 
 Em 25/09/2014 10:27, Pablo Morales escreveu:
> 
> Hmmm, I think everything has a limit. Apple makes great products, even
> though, it should not be a excuse to start doing

RE: new to this list

[Pam Berman]

Sprint is telling me that they will give $200 for any IPhone that is traded
in for the 6 or 6+. Last night I went into the Apple store & they told me
they would give me $115 for my 4S.


-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of John Diakogeorgiou
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 6:30 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: new to this list

If you have a phone that you are trying to sell to get the $200, it is
coming from Apple not Sprint.

On 9/25/14, Marianne Denning  wrote:
> Pam, this happened when people started using IOS 6 and 7.  Yes, I am 
> sure there are bugs and Apple will put out a release to fix many of 
> them.  I don't usually upgrade for a few weeks to see what people are 
> saying.  When I do upgrade it seems to work well.  You will always 
> hear the bad things about something and not so much about the good.
> If you can afford it then go ahead and get the 6.  I always upgrade my 
> phone when my contract runs out so I have another year but I will get 
> the most current phone when I upgrade.
>
> On 9/25/14, Pam Berman  wrote:
>> Thanks, I'm a bit nervous with all the bad press everyone is giving 
>> ios 8but
>> $200 is a nice savings.
>>
>> Pam
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On 
>> Behalf Of Alan Paganelli
>> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 4:37 PM
>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: Re: new to this list
>>
>>
>>
>> If Sprint is offering you a bonus of 2 hundred bucks then go for it.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>>
>>
>> Alan
>>
>>
>>
>> Go Chicago Bears in 2014!
>>
>>
>>
>> Teenagers; Tired of being harassed by your stupid parents?  Act now!
>> Move out.  Get a job.  Pay your bills wile you still know everything.
>>
>>
>>
>> Please click on:
>> HTTP://WWW.home.earthlink.net/~alanandsuzanne/
>> There, you'll find free files of my arrangements and performances 
>> played on the Yamaha Tyros 1 keyboard.  The albums in Technics  
>> format formerly on my website are still available upon request.  
>> Thanks for listening!
>>
>> - Original Message -
>>
>> From: Pam Berman 
>>
>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>>
>> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 2:05 PM
>>
>> Subject: RE: new to this list
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi Connie & thank you for the warm welcome.
>>
>> Now I hear that I should go with the 6 when I replace my phone, but 
>> should I wait or jump in. I'm only anxious because Sprint is offering 
>> $200 for any IPhones that have been on their service plans within the 
>> past 30 days, as long as they are up grading to a 6 or 6+, but this 
>> deal is only available until Sept. 30.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On 
>> Behalf Of Connie Mohney
>> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 3:23 PM
>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: RE: new to this list
>>
>>
>>
>> Hello Pam,
>>
>> Welcome to this list with friendly and knowledgeable people.
>>
>> Connie
>>
>>
>>
>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On 
>> Behalf Of Pam Berman
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2014 11:24 AM
>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: new to this list
>>
>>
>>
>> Hello All!
>>
>> My name is Pam, I'm totally blind & use voiceover exclusively. A 
>> friend just told me about this list. I have some questions.
>>
>> #1. What's the V for in the name of this list? Voiceover?
>>
>> #2. I've got a 2 year old IPhone 4S with Sprint & am thinking of 
>> upgrading.
>> Do you recommend:
>>
>> A.  The 5S
>>
>> B.  The new 6
>>
>> C.  I just wait awhile longer.
>>
>> I really appreciate any feedback on this.
>>
>> Thank You,
>>
>> Pam
>>
>>
>>
>> --
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>> list.
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>> have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the 
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>>
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>> have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the 
>> owners or moderators dir

Re: The U2 subject, again

[Patti Johnson]

Oh, I thought it was just one song, I didn't realize it was a whole 
album and I thought it just came with the update.  Shows how much 
attention I paid, grin, sorry.

But I did read it will be removed, right?
If that's the case I won't worry about it.
Thanks,
Patti
On 9/25/2014 7:41 PM, Richard Turner wrote:

Apple gifted the new U 2 album to everyone with an Apple ID.
If you don't want it, you can delete it.
If you search the archives of this list you will also find information 
about a removal tool that Apple released for that album specifically.

I paid no attention to all that because I actually like the album.
Richard


"Common sense is in spite of, not as the result of education." -
Victor Hugo

Sent from my iPhone


On Sep 25, 2014, at 12:42 PM, Patti Johnson > wrote:


I am sorry but I find this so very strange.  Yesterday I wanted a 
friend to hear an album I had  downloaded from Itunes about 3 weeks ago.
I had purchased a couple songs too last month from there.  Well, not 
only were those songs on my ipad and the album I bought, but also 
some U2 songs.  Whether it was a whole album I don't know but i sure 
as heck didn't buy them. Where they came from I just don't know.
I hope they will be taken off my ipad, and what is also strange about 
this is I haven't updated.
So what gives here? I suppose I should call Apple, but I hate dealing 
with people on the phone, grin.

Patti

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Re: The U2 subject, again

[Richard Turner]

Apple gifted the new U 2 album to everyone with an Apple ID.
If you don't want it, you can delete it.
If you search the archives of this list you will also find information about a 
removal tool that Apple released for that album specifically.
I paid no attention to all that because I actually like the album.
Richard


"Common sense is in spite of, not as the result of education." - Victor Hugo

 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 25, 2014, at 12:42 PM, Patti Johnson  wrote:
> 
> I am sorry but I find this so very strange.  Yesterday I wanted a friend to 
> hear an album I had  downloaded from Itunes about 3 weeks ago.
> I had purchased a couple songs too last month from there.  Well, not only 
> were those songs on my ipad and the album I bought, but also some U2 songs.  
> Whether it was a whole album I don't know but i sure as heck didn't buy them. 
> Where they came from I just don't know.
> I hope they will be taken off my ipad, and what is also strange about this is 
> I haven't updated.
> So what gives here? I suppose I should call Apple, but I hate dealing with 
> people on the phone, grin.
> Patti
> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the viphone list. 
> All new members to the this list are moderated by default. If you have any 
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Re: Why I'm returning my iPhone 6 (well, maybe)

[John Diakogeorgiou]

To put things into perspective the IPhone 6 is about the size of a 5s
with a case on it. It really isn't much larger. Because of its shape
it is actually more comfortable in the hand.

On 9/25/14, Alan Paganelli  wrote:
> The iPhone 5 will go by the wayside as it's only 32 bit.
>
>
> Regards,
>
> Alan
>
> Go Chicago Bears in 2014!
>
> Teenagers; Tired of being harassed by your stupid parents?  Act now!
> Move out.  Get a job.  Pay your bills wile you still know everything.
>
> Please click on:
> HTTP://WWW.home.earthlink.net/~alanandsuzanne/
> There, you'll find free files of my arrangements and performances played on
> the Yamaha Tyros 1 keyboard.  The albums in Technics  format formerly on my
>
> website are still available upon request.  Thanks for listening!
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "Wayne Merritt" 
> To: 
> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 2:40 PM
> Subject: Re: Why I'm returning my iPhone 6 (well, maybe)
>
>
> If you really want to hang onto the 5S, then you could probably do
> that since next year the 5S will be the free phone and oldest one
> supported. This is assuming that Apple will skip over the 2-year-old
> iPhone 5 that is.
>
> Wayne
>
> On 9/25/14, Kerri  wrote:
>> I personally prefer a smaller phone too whig is why I'm concerned for
>> when
>> the 5S we have no longer serves us.
>> ***
>> He is no fool who gives away what he cannot keep,
>> to gain what he cannot lose.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Sep 25, 2014, at 9:31 AM, Chuck Dean  wrote:
>>
>>> When I went to look at the iPhone 6 I remarked of the salesman that I
>>> would actually prefer a smaller phone, over a bigger phone. Because I
>>> listen to everything on the screen I don't need to see it, so a smaller
>>> phone would be more convenient. He looked at me like I was nuts.
>>>
>>> --
>>> The following information is important for all members of the viphone
>>> list. All new members to the this list are moderated by default. If you
>>> have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you
>>> feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or
>>> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. The archives
>>> for this list can be searched at
>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/viphone@googlegroups.com/.
>>> ---
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
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>>> "VIPhone" group.
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>>> an
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>>
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>>
>
>
> --
> Follow me on Twitter at:
> www.twitter.com/wcmerritt
> My websites:
> www.wayneism.com
> www.whitecaneday.org
>
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Re: new to this list

[John Diakogeorgiou]

If you have a phone that you are trying to sell to get the $200, it is
coming from Apple not Sprint.

On 9/25/14, Marianne Denning  wrote:
> Pam, this happened when people started using IOS 6 and 7.  Yes, I am
> sure there are bugs and Apple will put out a release to fix many of
> them.  I don't usually upgrade for a few weeks to see what people are
> saying.  When I do upgrade it seems to work well.  You will always
> hear the bad things about something and not so much about the good.
> If you can afford it then go ahead and get the 6.  I always upgrade my
> phone when my contract runs out so I have another year but I will get
> the most current phone when I upgrade.
>
> On 9/25/14, Pam Berman  wrote:
>> Thanks, I'm a bit nervous with all the bad press everyone is giving ios
>> 8but
>> $200 is a nice savings.
>>
>> Pam
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On
>> Behalf
>> Of Alan Paganelli
>> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 4:37 PM
>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: Re: new to this list
>>
>>
>>
>> If Sprint is offering you a bonus of 2 hundred bucks then go for it.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>>
>>
>> Alan
>>
>>
>>
>> Go Chicago Bears in 2014!
>>
>>
>>
>> Teenagers; Tired of being harassed by your stupid parents?  Act now!
>> Move out.  Get a job.  Pay your bills wile you still know everything.
>>
>>
>>
>> Please click on:
>> HTTP://WWW.home.earthlink.net/~alanandsuzanne/
>> There, you'll find free files of my arrangements and performances played
>> on
>> the Yamaha Tyros 1 keyboard.  The albums in Technics  format formerly on
>> my
>> website are still available upon request.  Thanks for listening!
>>
>> - Original Message -
>>
>> From: Pam Berman 
>>
>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>>
>> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 2:05 PM
>>
>> Subject: RE: new to this list
>>
>>
>>
>> Hi Connie & thank you for the warm welcome.
>>
>> Now I hear that I should go with the 6 when I replace my phone, but
>> should
>> I
>> wait or jump in. I'm only anxious because Sprint is offering $200 for any
>> IPhones that have been on their service plans within the past 30 days, as
>> long as they are up grading to a 6 or 6+, but this deal is only available
>> until Sept. 30.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On
>> Behalf
>> Of Connie Mohney
>> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 3:23 PM
>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: RE: new to this list
>>
>>
>>
>> Hello Pam,
>>
>> Welcome to this list with friendly and knowledgeable people.
>>
>> Connie
>>
>>
>>
>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On
>> Behalf
>> Of Pam Berman
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2014 11:24 AM
>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: new to this list
>>
>>
>>
>> Hello All!
>>
>> My name is Pam, I'm totally blind & use voiceover exclusively. A friend
>> just
>> told me about this list. I have some questions.
>>
>> #1. What's the V for in the name of this list? Voiceover?
>>
>> #2. I've got a 2 year old IPhone 4S with Sprint & am thinking of
>> upgrading.
>> Do you recommend:
>>
>> A.  The 5S
>>
>> B.  The new 6
>>
>> C.  I just wait awhile longer.
>>
>> I really appreciate any feedback on this.
>>
>> Thank You,
>>
>> Pam
>>
>>
>>
>> --
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>> list.
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>> questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you feel that
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Re: Audible app not showing purchased books

[Georgia Smith]

I have the same problem and I have tried refreshing numerous times but it 
just doesnt work please help

On Saturday, 5 October 2013 01:08:10 UTC+10, Kimber wrote:
>
> There's a button that refreshes your content. I think it's in 
> settings. Tap that then you should see all your books. 
>
> On 10/4/13, Tom Rash > wrote: 
> > How can I get access to my purchased books with the Audible app?  I 
> select 
> > cloud and am only seeing excerpts. 
> > 
> > -- 
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> > 
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>
>
> -- 
> Kimberly 
>

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RE: ITunes and Backups

[Mike O'Brien]

Hi

When I go to iTunes, preferences, devices and tab to the list of backups,
the only one that appears in the list is the latest backup.  So when I
backup again, the old one will be gone and only the latest one shows up.
Are there supposed to be multiple backups?


-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Sieghard Weitzel
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 11:52
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: ITunes and Backups

1. Open iTunes
2. Go to Edit, Preferences, Device tab
3. Tab to the list of backups
4. Select the one you want, then tab to Delete and activate  it, confirm and
it's gone. Reopeat until all old backups you don't want are gone or delete
all of them and then right away do a new backup of your phone of course
after you first transfer all purchases and do a sync. I recommend you do an
encrypted backup, just make sure you don't forget the password.


-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Blind Treasures
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 3:48 AM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: ITunes and Backups

Can some kind sole tell me how or if you even can remove older backups from
ITunes? I have about a dozen listed and would like to remove some of them.

"I'd rather be infected with love for the tiniest sliver of a second than
live a hundred years smothered by a lie."--Lena Haloway

Blind Treasures
sa...@blindtreasures.com
PH: 804-726-8900
Web: www.blindtreasures.com
  

  


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Re: new to this list

[Marianne Denning]

Pam, this happened when people started using IOS 6 and 7.  Yes, I am
sure there are bugs and Apple will put out a release to fix many of
them.  I don't usually upgrade for a few weeks to see what people are
saying.  When I do upgrade it seems to work well.  You will always
hear the bad things about something and not so much about the good.
If you can afford it then go ahead and get the 6.  I always upgrade my
phone when my contract runs out so I have another year but I will get
the most current phone when I upgrade.

On 9/25/14, Pam Berman  wrote:
> Thanks, I'm a bit nervous with all the bad press everyone is giving ios
> 8but
> $200 is a nice savings.
>
> Pam
>
>
>
>
>
> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
> Of Alan Paganelli
> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 4:37 PM
> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: new to this list
>
>
>
> If Sprint is offering you a bonus of 2 hundred bucks then go for it.
>
>
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
> Alan
>
>
>
> Go Chicago Bears in 2014!
>
>
>
> Teenagers; Tired of being harassed by your stupid parents?  Act now!
> Move out.  Get a job.  Pay your bills wile you still know everything.
>
>
>
> Please click on:
> HTTP://WWW.home.earthlink.net/~alanandsuzanne/
> There, you'll find free files of my arrangements and performances played on
> the Yamaha Tyros 1 keyboard.  The albums in Technics  format formerly on my
> website are still available upon request.  Thanks for listening!
>
> - Original Message -
>
> From: Pam Berman 
>
> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>
> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 2:05 PM
>
> Subject: RE: new to this list
>
>
>
> Hi Connie & thank you for the warm welcome.
>
> Now I hear that I should go with the 6 when I replace my phone, but should
> I
> wait or jump in. I'm only anxious because Sprint is offering $200 for any
> IPhones that have been on their service plans within the past 30 days, as
> long as they are up grading to a 6 or 6+, but this deal is only available
> until Sept. 30.
>
>
>
>
>
> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
> Of Connie Mohney
> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 3:23 PM
> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
> Subject: RE: new to this list
>
>
>
> Hello Pam,
>
> Welcome to this list with friendly and knowledgeable people.
>
> Connie
>
>
>
> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
> Of Pam Berman
> Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2014 11:24 AM
> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
> Subject: new to this list
>
>
>
> Hello All!
>
> My name is Pam, I'm totally blind & use voiceover exclusively. A friend
> just
> told me about this list. I have some questions.
>
> #1. What's the V for in the name of this list? Voiceover?
>
> #2. I've got a 2 year old IPhone 4S with Sprint & am thinking of upgrading.
> Do you recommend:
>
> A.  The 5S
>
> B.  The new 6
>
> C.  I just wait awhile longer.
>
> I really appreciate any feedback on this.
>
> Thank You,
>
> Pam
>
>
>
> --
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Re: Some Tips On Braille On-screen Input

[Teresa Cochran]

I believe that mBraille has a ′flip dots" mode, so you don't have to turn the 
device 180 degrees. My tabletop mode is always backwards, so I have to turn it 
180 degrees from away mode. I'm sorry about the confusion, but I suppose YMMV 
in this case.

Teresa

"We can see with the eyes, but we see with the brain as well, and seeing with 
the brain is often called imagination."--Oliver Sacks

> On Sep 25, 2014, at 2:50 PM, Alex Hall  wrote:
> 
> My main problem, aside from the frustrating bug where spaces don't always 
> register, is Table Mode. No matter how I turn my phone, or how many times I 
> go to Away Mode and then back to Table Mode, or how many times I calibrate, 
> Table mode is backwards. Dots 1-3 are on the right hand, while dots 4-6 are 
> on the left. In fact, calibrating in this mode makes it worse, as I usually 
> end up with dot 1 *between* dots 2 and 3, instead of preceding them. Away 
> mode works fine, it's only Table Mode that seems to hate me. :)
>> On Sep 25, 2014, at 5:29 PM, Cheryl Homiak  wrote:
>> 
>> I don't think you can make that comparison with your 4s unless the new 
>> braille input really is exactly mbraille. The only reason I question this is 
>> that for some reason, though I know other people had great success and I am 
>> glad for them, I never could at all master mbraille and yet I am doing well 
>> with the built-in system. That's not a criticism of mbraille or a defense of 
>> the built-in system; it just makes me question whether the two systems are 
>> actually totally the same and can be reliably compared as to the performance 
>> of mbraile on a 4s still running iOS7 and the built-in system   on a phone 
>> running iOS8. It seems to me that for me to have had so much trouble with 
>> one and be doing well on the other, there must be some difference between 
>> the two but i don't know what that difference would be. What does seem 
>> obvious is that some people who do well on mbraille are having trouble with 
>> the built-in system and at least one person who could not manage mbraille is 
>> doing well with the built-in system.
>> 
>> -- 
>> Cheryl
>> 
>> I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.
>> I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper
>> thrown in the trash!
>> Then God gave me a new heart and life:
>> His joy for my despairing tears!
>> And now, every day:
>> "This I call to mind,
>> and therefore I have hope:
>> The steadfast love of the Lord
>> never ceases;
>> his mercies never come to an end;
>> they are new every morning;
>> great is your faithfulness."
>> (Lamentations 3:21-23 ESV)
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Sep 25, 2014, at 4:17 PM, Deb Lewis  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Well I think I'm following all the instructions just fine. I haven't
>>> seen anything I didn't know. But when I'm in exploring mode, I get one
>>> pattern correctly named, change one figer and it gives me an entirely
>>> unrelated pattern even though some fingers have not moved at all. I
>>> get the same results in table top or landscape mde. I can confirm that
>>> with my 4S, which was not upgraded, I can still use MBraille just
>>> fine. So there may be something about my phone itself.
>>> 
 On 9/25/14, Cheryl Homiak  wrote:
 Actually, the home button does not have to be on the left for tabletop mode
 though the default has the dots going 1 through 6 from left to right with
 the home button the left so that turning it with the home button on the
 right would make them backwards. . You can go to away mode and then turn 
 the
 phone around with the home button facing right and go back to tabletop mode
 and get dots 1 through 6 still going from left to right. The same is true 
 in
 away mode; the home button does not have to be on the right. Everything is
 totally reversible and you can have the home button wherever you want it at
 any time.
 
 --
 Cheryl
 
 I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.
 I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper
 thrown in the trash!
 Then God gave me a new heart and life:
 His joy for my despairing tears!
 And now, every day:
 "This I call to mind,
 and therefore I have hope:
 The steadfast love of the Lord
 never ceases;
 his mercies never come to an end;
 they are new every morning;
 great is your faithfulness."
 (Lamentations 3:21-23 ESV)
 
> On Sep 25, 2014, at 3:52 PM, Teresa Cochran  wrote:
> 
> Hi, all,
> 
> I've noticed some folks having difficulties with this and posting to other
> threads, so I thought I'd make a thread dedicated to it and post a few
> hints.
> 
> Try the following for practice. Go into Notes or a new mail message. Turn
> to the Braille screen input item on the rotor. There are two ways to
> position the device for Braille. You can use "screen-away mode", which
> makes it possible to point the screen away from you in landscape mode with
> the home button to the righ

Re: why I don't like iOS 8: was Re: IOS is complete crap with VoiceOver

[Charles Rivard]

I think that Apple does care about accessibility.  Otherwise, Voice-Over 
would not exist.  I feel that they should have waited until a lot of the 
bugs were fixed before releasing this firmware update.  It could be that, 
like a lot of corporations, they set and announce a deadline, and then, 
regardless of the quality, the long awaited product is released, and fixed 
later.  I feel that this is not a good business practice.  Then again, 
corporate logic is certainly an oxymoron.


---
Be positive!  When it comes to being defeated, if you think you're finished, 
you! really! are! finished!
- Original Message - 
From: "John Panarese" 

To: 
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 4:29 PM
Subject: Re: why I don't like iOS 8: was Re: IOS is complete crap with 
VoiceOver



  Frankly, I don't think the problems with iOS 8 would tempt me to consider 
Android.  As far as Talk Back has come, it's still along way off and Android 
has plenty of other problems that go beyond accessibility.  Good luck if you 
go that route.  You are in for a lot of fun ...


   The reality is iOS 8 has plenty of bugs.  Should it have been released 
to the public? No.  Should more consideration have been taken for 
accessibility? Without a doubt.  People have to answer to this in Apple and 
accessibility needs to hear about it.  We all paid good money for our 
iDevices and Apple has set a pretty big expectation and standard for 
accessibility that this release has tarnished.  If they are looking for the 
"gold standard", this was not a step in that direction for sure.


  However, with that said, as I said on Triple Click Home, anyone who feels 
Apple doesn't care or is abandoning accessibility is sadly mistaken and 
talking out of their posteriors.  That is the farthest mindset inside the 
company, regardless of iOS 8.  I have witnessed a serious commitment to 
accessibility and an effort to make the company inside aware of 
accessibility issues in all areas.


I have my own theories as to what is going on, but those are things I 
am not going to talk about without knowing nor do I like to engage in 
speculation of that kind.  That only leads to more rumors and assumptions. 
I'm sure, though, they hear us loud and clear after this mishap.




Take Care

John D. Panarese
Director
Mac for the Blind
Tel, (631) 724-4479
Email, j...@macfortheblind.com
Website, http://www.macfortheblind.com

APPLE CERTIFIED SUPPORT PROFESSIONAL FOR MAC OS X LION and OS X Mountain 
Lion


AUTHORIZED APPLE STORE BUSINESS AFFILIATE

MAC and iOS VOICEOVER TRAINING AND SUPPORT






On Sep 25, 2014, at 5:10 PM, Brian Fischler  wrote:

I am the one who posted this topic, and I find it funny how many people 
want to defend Apple as if I have offended a relative of theirs. I'm 
sorry, but why do people expect the blind to have lesser expectations than 
our sighted counterparts when buying a product and operating system that 
has been marketed as fully accessible? I get there are going to be bugs 
but the dial pad bug, VO constantly crashing on a 5S, yes 5S, the 
scrolling issues, these are all major issues that should have never made 
it to a full release. Can I live with them, yes, but should I have to, no. 
Will I still buy Apple, most likely yes, as I have invested so heavily in 
a fully Apple ecosystem, iPhone, iMac, and Mac Air, but as someone who has 
never even picked up a Droid, or used Jaws as my vision went in 2009, I'm 
starting to at least listen to the other side, something I thought I would 
never do.

On Sep 25, 2014, at 1:00 PM, SoonerAnnie  wrote:


My 4S is doing better than my 5S. Fortunately I'm not having any crashing
problems for the most part, but the caller ID on my 5S doesn't announce
who's calling anymore! Major disappointment! However, my 4S, which 
doesn't
have cell service but began ringing after this update, does announce 
who's

calling. So go figure! LOL

Ann

- Original Message - 
From: "Ron Pelletier" 

To: 
Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2014 11:47 PM
Subject: RE: why I don't like iOS 8: was Re: IOS is complete crap with
VoiceOver


Sharonda,

Maybe Apple is not complete crap but, in view of what they pulled today, 
its

making people wonder if the extra money they pay for an Apple product is
really worth it.  They seem to have completely abused the confidence of
their customers by letting down their quality control which, in fact, is
complete crap.  As far as I am concerned, the subjet line can stay there 
for

a while

Ron & Danvers


-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On 
Behalf

Of Sharonda Greenlaw
Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2014 9:17 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: why I don't like iOS 8: was Re: IOS is complete crap with 
VoiceOver


Personally, I believe the subject  should be changed. iOS is not complete
crap. It may not have all of the bugs worked out, but it is not complete
crap. That's just one person's opin ion.

Sharonda
Sent from 

Re: Changes to Goodreads App

[Michelle Bernstein]

Thank you for this helpful information.  I learned a good lesson today which is 
to turn off the automatic updates in the settings part of my iPad until I 
evaluate what is involved with each update.

Sent from my iPad

> On Sep 25, 2014, at 5:41 PM, "Alan Lemly"  wrote:
> 
> Michelle, in the iOS world, the only way to return to an earlier version of
> an app once it's been updated is if you made a backup copy of the older
> version of the app on your computer and then use iTunes to reinstall it.
> Someone correct me if this is not accurate.
> 
> Alan Lemly
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
> Of Michelle Bernstein
> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 12:16 PM
> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
> Subject: RE: Changes to Goodreads App
> 
> Thank you, Sieghard, for that helpful explanation about automatic updates. I
> reset the settings on my Ipad so that automatic updates of my apps will not
> be permitted.   Even though I receive the Goodreads newsletter and other
> notifications, I was unaware that an update of this app was planned until it
> occurred and I contacted their support to find out how to return to the
> earlier version of the app.
> 
> -- 
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> member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or moderators
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deleting books from audible

[Larry Smith]

Someone posted info on how to delete  books from audible. Will you mind posting 
that information again. For the life of me, I can't figure out how to remove 
books from audible since the update. Thanks

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Re: Some Tips On Braille On-screen Input

[Cheryl Homiak]

This is really strange. I'm having no problem with spacing on my 6+ and while I 
struggled with mbraille a few times and eventually just didn't keep working on 
it, I immediately could use the built-in system. Maybe it's totally 
psychological on my part because I have no explanation. Now watch! I'll go to 
braille input and won't be able to get a single space - lol!


-- 
Cheryl

I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.
I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper
thrown in the trash!
Then God gave me a new heart and life:
His joy for my despairing tears!
And now, every day:
"This I call to mind,
and therefore I have hope:
The steadfast love of the Lord
never ceases;
his mercies never come to an end;
they are new every morning;
great is your faithfulness."
(Lamentations 3:21-23 ESV)




On Sep 25, 2014, at 4:51 PM, Brett  wrote:

> Hi, 
> 
> I always use away mode when brailling and do have a 4S and MBraille 
> 
> In terms of braille accuracy, I notice no difference between using MBraille 
> under iOS7 or 8 and IOS8's built-in braille keyboard . The only exception 
> being entering a space with the in-built braille keyboard, where the space 
> isn't always entered. 
> 
> I find the best way to enter a space using the built-in braille keyboard, is 
> to pause for about half a second, before swiping for the space.
> 
> I hope this does get corrected. 
> 
> Cheers, 
> Brett. 
> 
> 
> Sent with Siri from Brett's iPhone
> 
>> On 26 Sep 2014, at 7:29 am, Cheryl Homiak  wrote:
>> 
>> I don't think you can make that comparison with your 4s unless the new 
>> braille input really is exactly mbraille. The only reason I question this is 
>> that for some reason, though I know other people had great success and I am 
>> glad for them, I never could at all master mbraille and yet I am doing well 
>> with the built-in system. That's not a criticism of mbraille or a defense of 
>> the built-in system; it just makes me question whether the two systems are 
>> actually totally the same and can be reliably compared as to the performance 
>> of mbraile on a 4s still running iOS7 and the built-in system   on a phone 
>> running iOS8. It seems to me that for me to have had so much trouble with 
>> one and be doing well on the other, there must be some difference between 
>> the two but i don't know what that difference would be. What does seem 
>> obvious is that some people who do well on mbraille are having trouble with 
>> the built-in system and at least one person who could not manage mbraille is 
>> doing well with the built-in system.
>> 
>> -- 
>> Cheryl
>> 
>> I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.
>> I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper
>> thrown in the trash!
>> Then God gave me a new heart and life:
>> His joy for my despairing tears!
>> And now, every day:
>> "This I call to mind,
>> and therefore I have hope:
>> The steadfast love of the Lord
>> never ceases;
>> his mercies never come to an end;
>> they are new every morning;
>> great is your faithfulness."
>> (Lamentations 3:21-23 ESV)
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Sep 25, 2014, at 4:17 PM, Deb Lewis  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Well I think I'm following all the instructions just fine. I haven't
>>> seen anything I didn't know. But when I'm in exploring mode, I get one
>>> pattern correctly named, change one figer and it gives me an entirely
>>> unrelated pattern even though some fingers have not moved at all. I
>>> get the same results in table top or landscape mde. I can confirm that
>>> with my 4S, which was not upgraded, I can still use MBraille just
>>> fine. So there may be something about my phone itself.
>>> 
 On 9/25/14, Cheryl Homiak  wrote:
 Actually, the home button does not have to be on the left for tabletop mode
 though the default has the dots going 1 through 6 from left to right with
 the home button the left so that turning it with the home button on the
 right would make them backwards. . You can go to away mode and then turn 
 the
 phone around with the home button facing right and go back to tabletop mode
 and get dots 1 through 6 still going from left to right. The same is true 
 in
 away mode; the home button does not have to be on the right. Everything is
 totally reversible and you can have the home button wherever you want it at
 any time.
 
 --
 Cheryl
 
 I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.
 I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper
 thrown in the trash!
 Then God gave me a new heart and life:
 His joy for my despairing tears!
 And now, every day:
 "This I call to mind,
 and therefore I have hope:
 The steadfast love of the Lord
 never ceases;
 his mercies never come to an end;
 they are new every morning;
 great is your faithfulness."
 (Lamentations 3:21-23 ESV)
 
> On Sep 25, 2014, at 3:52 PM, Teresa Cochran  wrote:
> 
> Hi, all,
> 
> I've noticed some folks having difficulties with this and po

Re: Some Tips On Braille On-screen Input

[Brett]

Hi, 

I always use away mode when brailling and do have a 4S and MBraille 

In terms of braille accuracy, I notice no difference between using MBraille 
under iOS7 or 8 and IOS8's built-in braille keyboard . The only exception being 
entering a space with the in-built braille keyboard, where the space isn't 
always entered. 

I find the best way to enter a space using the built-in braille keyboard, is to 
pause for about half a second, before swiping for the space.

I hope this does get corrected. 

Cheers, 
Brett. 


Sent with Siri from Brett's iPhone

> On 26 Sep 2014, at 7:29 am, Cheryl Homiak  wrote:
> 
> I don't think you can make that comparison with your 4s unless the new 
> braille input really is exactly mbraille. The only reason I question this is 
> that for some reason, though I know other people had great success and I am 
> glad for them, I never could at all master mbraille and yet I am doing well 
> with the built-in system. That's not a criticism of mbraille or a defense of 
> the built-in system; it just makes me question whether the two systems are 
> actually totally the same and can be reliably compared as to the performance 
> of mbraile on a 4s still running iOS7 and the built-in system   on a phone 
> running iOS8. It seems to me that for me to have had so much trouble with one 
> and be doing well on the other, there must be some difference between the two 
> but i don't know what that difference would be. What does seem obvious is 
> that some people who do well on mbraille are having trouble with the built-in 
> system and at least one person who could not manage mbraille is doing well 
> with the built-in system.
> 
> -- 
> Cheryl
> 
> I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.
> I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper
> thrown in the trash!
> Then God gave me a new heart and life:
> His joy for my despairing tears!
> And now, every day:
> "This I call to mind,
> and therefore I have hope:
> The steadfast love of the Lord
> never ceases;
> his mercies never come to an end;
> they are new every morning;
> great is your faithfulness."
> (Lamentations 3:21-23 ESV)
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Sep 25, 2014, at 4:17 PM, Deb Lewis  wrote:
>> 
>> Well I think I'm following all the instructions just fine. I haven't
>> seen anything I didn't know. But when I'm in exploring mode, I get one
>> pattern correctly named, change one figer and it gives me an entirely
>> unrelated pattern even though some fingers have not moved at all. I
>> get the same results in table top or landscape mde. I can confirm that
>> with my 4S, which was not upgraded, I can still use MBraille just
>> fine. So there may be something about my phone itself.
>> 
>>> On 9/25/14, Cheryl Homiak  wrote:
>>> Actually, the home button does not have to be on the left for tabletop mode
>>> though the default has the dots going 1 through 6 from left to right with
>>> the home button the left so that turning it with the home button on the
>>> right would make them backwards. . You can go to away mode and then turn the
>>> phone around with the home button facing right and go back to tabletop mode
>>> and get dots 1 through 6 still going from left to right. The same is true in
>>> away mode; the home button does not have to be on the right. Everything is
>>> totally reversible and you can have the home button wherever you want it at
>>> any time.
>>> 
>>> --
>>> Cheryl
>>> 
>>> I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.
>>> I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper
>>> thrown in the trash!
>>> Then God gave me a new heart and life:
>>> His joy for my despairing tears!
>>> And now, every day:
>>> "This I call to mind,
>>> and therefore I have hope:
>>> The steadfast love of the Lord
>>> never ceases;
>>> his mercies never come to an end;
>>> they are new every morning;
>>> great is your faithfulness."
>>> (Lamentations 3:21-23 ESV)
>>> 
 On Sep 25, 2014, at 3:52 PM, Teresa Cochran  wrote:
 
 Hi, all,
 
 I've noticed some folks having difficulties with this and posting to other
 threads, so I thought I'd make a thread dedicated to it and post a few
 hints.
 
 Try the following for practice. Go into Notes or a new mail message. Turn
 to the Braille screen input item on the rotor. There are two ways to
 position the device for Braille. You can use "screen-away mode", which
 makes it possible to point the screen away from you in landscape mode with
 the home button to the right, or "tabletop mode", which lets you place the
 device on a flat surface with the home button to the left.  In screen-away
 mode, the dots are arranged "accordion fashion" with dots 1-2-3 on the
 left short side and dots 4-5-6 on the right short side. In tabletop mode,
 the dots are arranged on the long side closest to you. When you begin
 practice, hold your hands pressed on the device until you hear "explore
 mode", and Voiceover will tell you which dots are pressed. You will exit
 explore 

I guess this is one of the reasons I feel no need for a case for my iPhone. I always use two hands to operate it. Less chance of dropping it, and less chance of someone grabbing it out of my hands. I

[Chuck Dean]

Chuck (mobile)
Pleez x cuze enny tie ping or spelin air ores.

> On Sep 25, 2014, at 2:44 PM, Mary Otten  wrote:
> 
> The reason I started this thread was really to get ideas from people on how 
> they are or are not able to still use the phone one-handed. To me, that is a 
> huge deal. I realize it isn't for everybody.
> I love my iPad mini, but an iPad is not a phone. Smile.
> Mary
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Sep 25, 2014, at 11:06 AM, Deb Lewis  wrote:
>> 
>> I'm going to get the 6 Plus and I'm going to like it, LOL.
>> I have an Ipad Mini and I like that. The Plus is smaller than that. I
>> love the bigger screen particularly on the internet and for typing.
>> I don't mind carrying it. I always have carried my phones in a secure
>> pouch or bag of some kind. I only have one thing to carry phones in
>> that will be too small for the 6 plus. I'm not saying that bigger is
>> necessarily better, but most other phones are bigger these days and
>> it's just a fact of life. So I'm holding out for the Plus. I think
>> people should just go look at them, choose what they want, and
>> discussion should pretty much be over.
>> And if you'd all be so kind as to select the 6, I can have my Plus sooner.
>> 
>>> On 9/25/14, Chuck Dean  wrote:
>>> Hi Cheryl, glad to hear you like your 6+, but tell us why.
>>> 
>>> Chuck (mobile)
>>> Pleez x cuze enny tie ping or spelin air ores.
>>> 
 On Sep 25, 2014, at 9:58 AM, Cheryl Homiak  wrote:
 
 I like my 6+!
 
 --
 Cheryl
 
 I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.
 I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper
 thrown in the trash!
 Then God gave me a new heart and life:
 His joy for my despairing tears!
 And now, every day:
 "This I call to mind,
 and therefore I have hope:
 The steadfast love of the Lord
 never ceases;
 his mercies never come to an end;
 they are new every morning;
 great is your faithfulness."
 (Lamentations 3:21-23 ESV)
 
 
 
 
> On Sep 25, 2014, at 11:55 AM, Wayne Merritt  wrote:
> 
> It seems like, from what I have read on the web, that most people
> think the 6 Plus is too big and the 6 is just right. Many of those
> comments were from blind people that checked out both phones or who
> just looked at the 6 and thought it was just right. After reading all
> that and knowing I had gotten the 6 myself for that reason, I am glad
> I ordered the 6 and didn't pay the extra $100 for a larger phone with
> more space than I needed. Then again, there are those blind people
> that got the 6 Plus and are happy with their purchase. Guess I will
> find out in about a week or so when I get the new phone.
> 
> Wayne
> 
>> On 9/25/14, Chuck Dean  wrote:
>> When I went to look at the iPhone 6 I remarked of the salesman that I
>> would
>> actually prefer a smaller phone, over a bigger phone. Because I listen
>> to
>> everything on the screen I don't need to see it, so a smaller phone
>> would be
>> more convenient. He looked at me like I was nuts.
>> 
>> --
>> The following information is important for all members of the viphone
>> list.
>> All new members to the this list are moderated by default. If you have
>> any
>> questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you feel
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>> member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or moderators
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>> can be searched at
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>> ---
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>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
>> 
> 
> 
> --
> Follow me on Twitter at:
> www.twitter.com/wcmerritt
> My websites:
> www.wayneism.com
> www.whitecaneday.org
> 
> --
> The following information is important for all members of the viphone
> list. All new members to the this list are moderated by default. If you
> have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you
> feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or
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> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it,

Re: Some Tips On Braille On-screen Input

[Alex Hall]

My main problem, aside from the frustrating bug where spaces don't always 
register, is Table Mode. No matter how I turn my phone, or how many times I go 
to Away Mode and then back to Table Mode, or how many times I calibrate, Table 
mode is backwards. Dots 1-3 are on the right hand, while dots 4-6 are on the 
left. In fact, calibrating in this mode makes it worse, as I usually end up 
with dot 1 *between* dots 2 and 3, instead of preceding them. Away mode works 
fine, it's only Table Mode that seems to hate me. :)
On Sep 25, 2014, at 5:29 PM, Cheryl Homiak  wrote:

> I don't think you can make that comparison with your 4s unless the new 
> braille input really is exactly mbraille. The only reason I question this is 
> that for some reason, though I know other people had great success and I am 
> glad for them, I never could at all master mbraille and yet I am doing well 
> with the built-in system. That's not a criticism of mbraille or a defense of 
> the built-in system; it just makes me question whether the two systems are 
> actually totally the same and can be reliably compared as to the performance 
> of mbraile on a 4s still running iOS7 and the built-in system   on a phone 
> running iOS8. It seems to me that for me to have had so much trouble with one 
> and be doing well on the other, there must be some difference between the two 
> but i don't know what that difference would be. What does seem obvious is 
> that some people who do well on mbraille are having trouble with the built-in 
> system and at least one person who could not manage mbraille is doing well 
> with the built-in system.
> 
> -- 
> Cheryl
> 
> I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.
> I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper
> thrown in the trash!
> Then God gave me a new heart and life:
> His joy for my despairing tears!
> And now, every day:
> "This I call to mind,
> and therefore I have hope:
> The steadfast love of the Lord
> never ceases;
> his mercies never come to an end;
> they are new every morning;
> great is your faithfulness."
> (Lamentations 3:21-23 ESV)
> 
> 
> 
> 
> On Sep 25, 2014, at 4:17 PM, Deb Lewis  wrote:
> 
>> Well I think I'm following all the instructions just fine. I haven't
>> seen anything I didn't know. But when I'm in exploring mode, I get one
>> pattern correctly named, change one figer and it gives me an entirely
>> unrelated pattern even though some fingers have not moved at all. I
>> get the same results in table top or landscape mde. I can confirm that
>> with my 4S, which was not upgraded, I can still use MBraille just
>> fine. So there may be something about my phone itself.
>> 
>> On 9/25/14, Cheryl Homiak  wrote:
>>> Actually, the home button does not have to be on the left for tabletop mode
>>> though the default has the dots going 1 through 6 from left to right with
>>> the home button the left so that turning it with the home button on the
>>> right would make them backwards. . You can go to away mode and then turn the
>>> phone around with the home button facing right and go back to tabletop mode
>>> and get dots 1 through 6 still going from left to right. The same is true in
>>> away mode; the home button does not have to be on the right. Everything is
>>> totally reversible and you can have the home button wherever you want it at
>>> any time.
>>> 
>>> --
>>> Cheryl
>>> 
>>> I tried and tried to turn over a new leaf.
>>> I got crumpled wads of tear-stained paper
>>> thrown in the trash!
>>> Then God gave me a new heart and life:
>>> His joy for my despairing tears!
>>> And now, every day:
>>> "This I call to mind,
>>> and therefore I have hope:
>>> The steadfast love of the Lord
>>> never ceases;
>>> his mercies never come to an end;
>>> they are new every morning;
>>> great is your faithfulness."
>>> (Lamentations 3:21-23 ESV)
>>> 
>>> On Sep 25, 2014, at 3:52 PM, Teresa Cochran  wrote:
>>> 
 Hi, all,
 
 I've noticed some folks having difficulties with this and posting to other
 threads, so I thought I'd make a thread dedicated to it and post a few
 hints.
 
 Try the following for practice. Go into Notes or a new mail message. Turn
 to the Braille screen input item on the rotor. There are two ways to
 position the device for Braille. You can use "screen-away mode", which
 makes it possible to point the screen away from you in landscape mode with
 the home button to the right, or "tabletop mode", which lets you place the
 device on a flat surface with the home button to the left.  In screen-away
 mode, the dots are arranged "accordion fashion" with dots 1-2-3 on the
 left short side and dots 4-5-6 on the right short side. In tabletop mode,
 the dots are arranged on the long side closest to you. When you begin
 practice, hold your hands pressed on the device until you hear "explore
 mode", and Voiceover will tell you which dots are pressed. You will exit
 explore mode when you lift a finger. With explore mode

RE: new to this list

[Pam Berman]

Thanks, I'm a bit nervous with all the bad press everyone is giving ios 8but
$200 is a nice savings.

Pam

 

 

From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Alan Paganelli
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 4:37 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: new to this list

 

If Sprint is offering you a bonus of 2 hundred bucks then go for it.

 

 

Regards,

 

Alan

 

Go Chicago Bears in 2014!

 

Teenagers; Tired of being harassed by your stupid parents?  Act now!
Move out.  Get a job.  Pay your bills wile you still know everything.

 

Please click on: 
HTTP://WWW.home.earthlink.net/~alanandsuzanne/
There, you'll find free files of my arrangements and performances played on
the Yamaha Tyros 1 keyboard.  The albums in Technics  format formerly on my
website are still available upon request.  Thanks for listening!

- Original Message - 

From: Pam Berman   

To: viphone@googlegroups.com 

Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 2:05 PM

Subject: RE: new to this list

 

Hi Connie & thank you for the warm welcome. 

Now I hear that I should go with the 6 when I replace my phone, but should I
wait or jump in. I'm only anxious because Sprint is offering $200 for any
IPhones that have been on their service plans within the past 30 days, as
long as they are up grading to a 6 or 6+, but this deal is only available
until Sept. 30.

 

 

From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Connie Mohney
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 3:23 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: new to this list

 

Hello Pam,

Welcome to this list with friendly and knowledgeable people.

Connie  

 

From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
Of Pam Berman
Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2014 11:24 AM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: new to this list

 

Hello All!

My name is Pam, I'm totally blind & use voiceover exclusively. A friend just
told me about this list. I have some questions.

#1. What's the V for in the name of this list? Voiceover?

#2. I've got a 2 year old IPhone 4S with Sprint & am thinking of upgrading.
Do you recommend:

A.  The 5S

B.  The new 6

C.  I just wait awhile longer.

I really appreciate any feedback on this.

Thank You,

Pam

 

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Re: why I don't like iOS 8: was Re: IOS is complete crap with VoiceOver

[SoonerAnnie]

I can receive calls from the iPhone 4S but am unable to make any. I set 
everything that seemed to need to be set but guess since this is actually a 
phone and not an iPad or iPod, it works somewhat differently.

Ann

- Original Message - 
From: christopher hallsworth
To: Viphone
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2014 1:31 PM
Subject: Re: why I don't like iOS 8: was Re: IOS is complete crap with 
VoiceOver


Lol! That will be part of the handoff feature in iOS 8. This allows calls to 
be made and received from any device running iOS 8 including iPad and iPod 
Touch as well as Macs running Yosemite coming soon.


Sent from my Macbook Pro


On 25 Sep 2014, at 18:00, SoonerAnnie  wrote:


  My 4S is doing better than my 5S. Fortunately I'm not having any crashing
  problems for the most part, but the caller ID on my 5S doesn't announce
  who's calling anymore! Major disappointment! However, my 4S, which doesn't
  have cell service but began ringing after this update, does announce who's
  calling. So go figure! LOL

  Ann

  - Original Message - 
  From: "Ron Pelletier" 
  To: 
  Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2014 11:47 PM
  Subject: RE: why I don't like iOS 8: was Re: IOS is complete crap with
  VoiceOver


  Sharonda,

  Maybe Apple is not complete crap but, in view of what they pulled today, 
its
  making people wonder if the extra money they pay for an Apple product is
  really worth it.  They seem to have completely abused the confidence of
  their customers by letting down their quality control which, in fact, is
  complete crap.  As far as I am concerned, the subjet line can stay there 
for
  a while

  Ron & Danvers


  -Original Message-
  From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf
  Of Sharonda Greenlaw
  Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2014 9:17 PM
  To: viphone@googlegroups.com
  Subject: why I don't like iOS 8: was Re: IOS is complete crap with 
VoiceOver

  Personally, I believe the subject  should be changed. iOS is not complete
  crap. It may not have all of the bugs worked out, but it is not complete
  crap. That's just one person's opin ion.

  Sharonda
  Sent from my mobile device; please excuse all mistakes


On Sep 24, 2014, at 5:39 PM, Christopher Chaltain 
wrote:

I don't think it's exclusive to people running IOS 8 on the 4S. Brian 
for
example, who started this thread, said he's running IOS 8 on his 5s.


  On 09/24/2014 09:09 AM, John Diakogeorgiou wrote:
  It seems to me that the people who are having crashing problems with
  IOS 8 are those with 4s's. It's very possible that the 4s can't
  handle the requirements of IOS with other apps and Apple shouldn't
  have supported it.


On 9/24/14, Ųyvind Lode  wrote:
First of all I must say that I don't regret upgrading my 4s to iOS 
8.
However, VoiceOver crashes all the time on my 4s.
I have not found a pattern to all the crashes.
The good thing is that VO at least restarts when it decide to die on 
me.
But it crashes at least 10-15 times a day and I know when it crashed
VO is on, screen curtain on etc is announced.
I have done a reset - reset to factory settings but still the same.

-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On
Behalf Of Christopher Chaltain
Sent: 24. september 2014 13:53
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: IOS is complete crap with VoiceOver

Doing as David suggests is probably best, but it might also be the
case that your voice was turned off. Try a three finger double tap
to toggle the voice on and off.

Also, if you have the home button set as your VoiceOver short cut,
try a triple tap of the home button. Recycling VoiceOver helps me in
similar situations. Maybe you can use Siri to turn VoiceOver off and
then back on as well.

I've seen a couple of posts now to where IOS 8 with it's VoiceOver
bugs is compared to blindness specific products or older smart phone
technologies, like Windows Mobile running Mobile Accessibility.
IMHO, one of the great things about Apple and their commitment to
making their main stream products accessible is that we get treated
the same as the rest of their main stream customers. I fear that if
we lower the bar with our expectations then we're no better off then
when we use those so called blind ghetto products that so many
people are quick to thumb their noses at. Let's give Apple credit
where credit is due, but let's just not roll over like blind Uncle
Tom's being happy with whatever accessibility Apple thinks we'll be
content with.


  On 09/24/2014 12:18 AM, David Chittenden wrote:
  When VO goes quiet like that, take your fingers away from the
  iPhone. iOS is pe