RE: Apple getting cheap

[Cristobal Muñoz]

Don't throw your shoulder out there patting yourself on the back. 
Missing the point.
-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of Simon A 
Fogarty
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 8:02 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: Apple getting cheap

I guess some people don't like the truth!

Oh well!


-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of 
ed...@cox.net
Sent: Friday, 16 April 2021 2:53 pm
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: Apple getting cheap

Lol!

-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of Maria 
Campbell
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 6:16 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Apple getting cheap

Stuff it!


Maria Campbell
lucky1i...@gmail.com

All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing.
--Edmund Burke

On 4/15/2021 7:59 PM, Simon A Fogarty wrote:
> Yeah cheap,
>
> So I'm guessing people didn't listen to tim cook when he said they 
> were getting rid of the power bricks in the boxes for the devices,
>
> It's not about being cheap,
> It's more to do with apple trying to get back in to the eco friendly 
> world and save the planet from excess plastic  that we don't need to 
> clutter our lives with,
>
> Plus the fact that majority of the people around the planet who have 
> had or have apple mobile devices already have a couple of charging 
> bricks lying around and therefore those will still do the job they 
> were made for,
>
> So if you have one already,
> Why complain about them being left out of the box for a phone or iPad,
>
> I really love how these serious first world problems bug you guys so 
> much,
>
> Imagine if we had real problems around the planet like a pendemic 
> virus and millions dying,
>
> But you guys get upset because apple leave a $20 peace of plastic shit out of 
> a box.
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of 
> lenron brown
> Sent: Friday, 16 April 2021 7:18 am
> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: Apple getting cheap
>
> I say screw them it's just another way for them to be cheap. Can't for get 
> the fact that it's a ploy to get you to buy extra chargers, and airpods when 
> they dropped the headphone jacks, and of course them not putting them in the 
> box.
>
> On 4/15/21, Mary Otten  wrote:
>> Apparently others are following an apples lead. I believe I saw where 
>> Samsung is dropping the chargers as well. It was either them or 
>> Google with their pixels. Maybe they are being cheap. But we just 
>> don’t need all this extra crap going out into the environment. I have 
>> an iPad charger from a really old iPad mini that still works just 
>> fine. And of course I have a couple of iPhone chargers and a USB see 
>> power block which I think cost me all of eight bucks. It didn’t exactly 
>> break the bank.
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On Apr 15, 2021, at 10:54 AM, Cristóbal Muñoz 
>>> 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> I mean... I do believe it's a good thing that more plastic and 
>>> accessories like that aren't being put out into the world, but I 
>>> also definitely think that Apple's being cheap. More like a 
>>> convenient and specious excuse for them to remove an item and cut 
>>> the cost of production and logistics and still charge the same under 
>>> the cover of being environmentally conscious.
>>> Either way though, it's not like not having the charger included is 
>>> going to be a make or break decision for anyone who was thinking of 
>>> buying an iPhone. Just more nickel and diming from Apple.
>>> Cristóbal
>>>
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf 
>>> Of Richard Turner
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:34 AM
>>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: RE: Apple getting cheap
>>>
>>> Apple says it is for the environment because most people have all 
>>> the chargers they need and more.
>>> That is certainly  true in our household.
>>> I happen to agree with Apple in this case.
>>> We have enough (Expletive deleted) stuff in the landfills and ocean 
>>> now to last many life times.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Richard
>>> "The highest reward for a person's toil is not what they get for it, 
>>> but what they become by it."
>>> - John Ruskin, 1819-1900
>>>
>>> Web site: www.turner42.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf 
>>> Of Mich Verrier
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:30 AM
>>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: RE: Apple getting cheapq
>>>
>>>  From what I herd apple is not shipping any of there phones with 
>>> chargers since they want you to buy them seppritley since you have 
>>> to remember that apple's main thing is to make money. O shure apple 
>>> has dun good for the blind and vi comunidey with voice over and 
>>> stuff how ever you have to remember that the mane objective for 
>>> apple is to make more money. From Mich.
>>>
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: 

RE: Apple getting cheap

[Cristobal Muñoz]

Again, I think folks are missing the point. No one's not going to not buy an 
iPhone over a now no longer included wall charger.
It's that Apple's removed this accessory under the guise (and with likely 
merit) of environmentalism when really, it's a way to cut down on cost from 
manufacturing, sourcing materials to shipping (in those quantities, the 
difference adds up quickly) and is still charging the same price. It's not like 
they're getting out of the wall charger business. I mean, you can still buy one 
from them. It's just another way for them to nibble around the edges, get some 
good press and keep the same price. It comes off as chincy from a brand that 
holds itself up as a luxury and consumer friendly company . 
But no... people would rather carry on like a scold while again, missing the 
actual point.


-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of Maria 
Campbell
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 6:16 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Apple getting cheap

Stuff it!


Maria Campbell
lucky1i...@gmail.com

All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing.
--Edmund Burke

On 4/15/2021 7:59 PM, Simon A Fogarty wrote:
> Yeah cheap,
>
> So I'm guessing people didn't listen to tim cook when he said they 
> were getting rid of the power bricks in the boxes for the devices,
>
> It's not about being cheap,
> It's more to do with apple trying to get back in to the eco friendly 
> world and save the planet from excess plastic  that we don't need to 
> clutter our lives with,
>
> Plus the fact that majority of the people around the planet who have 
> had or have apple mobile devices already have a couple of charging 
> bricks lying around and therefore those will still do the job they 
> were made for,
>
> So if you have one already,
> Why complain about them being left out of the box for a phone or iPad,
>
> I really love how these serious first world problems bug you guys so 
> much,
>
> Imagine if we had real problems around the planet like a pendemic 
> virus and millions dying,
>
> But you guys get upset because apple leave a $20 peace of plastic shit out of 
> a box.
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of 
> lenron brown
> Sent: Friday, 16 April 2021 7:18 am
> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: Apple getting cheap
>
> I say screw them it's just another way for them to be cheap. Can't for get 
> the fact that it's a ploy to get you to buy extra chargers, and airpods when 
> they dropped the headphone jacks, and of course them not putting them in the 
> box.
>
> On 4/15/21, Mary Otten  wrote:
>> Apparently others are following an apples lead. I believe I saw where 
>> Samsung is dropping the chargers as well. It was either them or 
>> Google with their pixels. Maybe they are being cheap. But we just 
>> don’t need all this extra crap going out into the environment. I have 
>> an iPad charger from a really old iPad mini that still works just 
>> fine. And of course I have a couple of iPhone chargers and a USB see 
>> power block which I think cost me all of eight bucks. It didn’t exactly 
>> break the bank.
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On Apr 15, 2021, at 10:54 AM, Cristóbal Muñoz 
>>> 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> I mean... I do believe it's a good thing that more plastic and 
>>> accessories like that aren't being put out into the world, but I 
>>> also definitely think that Apple's being cheap. More like a 
>>> convenient and specious excuse for them to remove an item and cut 
>>> the cost of production and logistics and still charge the same under 
>>> the cover of being environmentally conscious.
>>> Either way though, it's not like not having the charger included is 
>>> going to be a make or break decision for anyone who was thinking of 
>>> buying an iPhone. Just more nickel and diming from Apple.
>>> Cristóbal
>>>
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf 
>>> Of Richard Turner
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:34 AM
>>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: RE: Apple getting cheap
>>>
>>> Apple says it is for the environment because most people have all 
>>> the chargers they need and more.
>>> That is certainly  true in our household.
>>> I happen to agree with Apple in this case.
>>> We have enough (Expletive deleted) stuff in the landfills and ocean 
>>> now to last many life times.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Richard
>>> "The highest reward for a person's toil is not what they get for it, 
>>> but what they become by it."
>>> - John Ruskin, 1819-1900
>>>
>>> Web site: www.turner42.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf 
>>> Of Mich Verrier
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:30 AM
>>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: RE: Apple getting cheapq
>>>
>>>  From what I herd apple is not shipping any of there phones with 
>>> chargers since they want you to buy them seppritley since you have 

RE: Apple getting cheap

[Simon A Fogarty]

I guess some people don't like the truth!

Oh well!


-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of 
ed...@cox.net
Sent: Friday, 16 April 2021 2:53 pm
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: Apple getting cheap

Lol!

-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of Maria 
Campbell
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 6:16 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Apple getting cheap

Stuff it!


Maria Campbell
lucky1i...@gmail.com

All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing.
--Edmund Burke

On 4/15/2021 7:59 PM, Simon A Fogarty wrote:
> Yeah cheap,
>
> So I'm guessing people didn't listen to tim cook when he said they 
> were getting rid of the power bricks in the boxes for the devices,
>
> It's not about being cheap,
> It's more to do with apple trying to get back in to the eco friendly 
> world and save the planet from excess plastic  that we don't need to 
> clutter our lives with,
>
> Plus the fact that majority of the people around the planet who have 
> had or have apple mobile devices already have a couple of charging 
> bricks lying around and therefore those will still do the job they 
> were made for,
>
> So if you have one already,
> Why complain about them being left out of the box for a phone or iPad,
>
> I really love how these serious first world problems bug you guys so 
> much,
>
> Imagine if we had real problems around the planet like a pendemic 
> virus and millions dying,
>
> But you guys get upset because apple leave a $20 peace of plastic shit out of 
> a box.
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of 
> lenron brown
> Sent: Friday, 16 April 2021 7:18 am
> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: Apple getting cheap
>
> I say screw them it's just another way for them to be cheap. Can't for get 
> the fact that it's a ploy to get you to buy extra chargers, and airpods when 
> they dropped the headphone jacks, and of course them not putting them in the 
> box.
>
> On 4/15/21, Mary Otten  wrote:
>> Apparently others are following an apples lead. I believe I saw where 
>> Samsung is dropping the chargers as well. It was either them or 
>> Google with their pixels. Maybe they are being cheap. But we just 
>> don’t need all this extra crap going out into the environment. I have 
>> an iPad charger from a really old iPad mini that still works just 
>> fine. And of course I have a couple of iPhone chargers and a USB see 
>> power block which I think cost me all of eight bucks. It didn’t exactly 
>> break the bank.
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On Apr 15, 2021, at 10:54 AM, Cristóbal Muñoz 
>>> 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> I mean... I do believe it's a good thing that more plastic and 
>>> accessories like that aren't being put out into the world, but I 
>>> also definitely think that Apple's being cheap. More like a 
>>> convenient and specious excuse for them to remove an item and cut 
>>> the cost of production and logistics and still charge the same under 
>>> the cover of being environmentally conscious.
>>> Either way though, it's not like not having the charger included is 
>>> going to be a make or break decision for anyone who was thinking of 
>>> buying an iPhone. Just more nickel and diming from Apple.
>>> Cristóbal
>>>
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf 
>>> Of Richard Turner
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:34 AM
>>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: RE: Apple getting cheap
>>>
>>> Apple says it is for the environment because most people have all 
>>> the chargers they need and more.
>>> That is certainly  true in our household.
>>> I happen to agree with Apple in this case.
>>> We have enough (Expletive deleted) stuff in the landfills and ocean 
>>> now to last many life times.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Richard
>>> "The highest reward for a person's toil is not what they get for it, 
>>> but what they become by it."
>>> - John Ruskin, 1819-1900
>>>
>>> Web site: www.turner42.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf 
>>> Of Mich Verrier
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:30 AM
>>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: RE: Apple getting cheapq
>>>
>>>  From what I herd apple is not shipping any of there phones with 
>>> chargers since they want you to buy them seppritley since you have 
>>> to remember that apple's main thing is to make money. O shure apple 
>>> has dun good for the blind and vi comunidey with voice over and 
>>> stuff how ever you have to remember that the mane objective for 
>>> apple is to make more money. From Mich.
>>>
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf 
>>> Of Maria Campbell
>>> Sent: April 15, 2021 1:27 PM
>>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: Apple getting cheapq
>>>
>>> My SE2020 didn't even come with a C charger.  How cheap is that 
>>> considering it's so proprietary?  It came with 

RE: Apple getting cheap

[edrew]

Lol!

-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of Maria 
Campbell
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 6:16 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Apple getting cheap

Stuff it!


Maria Campbell
lucky1i...@gmail.com

All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing.
--Edmund Burke

On 4/15/2021 7:59 PM, Simon A Fogarty wrote:
> Yeah cheap,
>
> So I'm guessing people didn't listen to tim cook when he said they 
> were getting rid of the power bricks in the boxes for the devices,
>
> It's not about being cheap,
> It's more to do with apple trying to get back in to the eco friendly 
> world and save the planet from excess plastic  that we don't need to 
> clutter our lives with,
>
> Plus the fact that majority of the people around the planet who have 
> had or have apple mobile devices already have a couple of charging 
> bricks lying around and therefore those will still do the job they 
> were made for,
>
> So if you have one already,
> Why complain about them being left out of the box for a phone or iPad,
>
> I really love how these serious first world problems bug you guys so 
> much,
>
> Imagine if we had real problems around the planet like a pendemic 
> virus and millions dying,
>
> But you guys get upset because apple leave a $20 peace of plastic shit out of 
> a box.
>
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of 
> lenron brown
> Sent: Friday, 16 April 2021 7:18 am
> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: Apple getting cheap
>
> I say screw them it's just another way for them to be cheap. Can't for get 
> the fact that it's a ploy to get you to buy extra chargers, and airpods when 
> they dropped the headphone jacks, and of course them not putting them in the 
> box.
>
> On 4/15/21, Mary Otten  wrote:
>> Apparently others are following an apples lead. I believe I saw where 
>> Samsung is dropping the chargers as well. It was either them or 
>> Google with their pixels. Maybe they are being cheap. But we just 
>> don’t need all this extra crap going out into the environment. I have 
>> an iPad charger from a really old iPad mini that still works just 
>> fine. And of course I have a couple of iPhone chargers and a USB see 
>> power block which I think cost me all of eight bucks. It didn’t exactly 
>> break the bank.
>>
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>>> On Apr 15, 2021, at 10:54 AM, Cristóbal Muñoz 
>>> 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> I mean... I do believe it's a good thing that more plastic and 
>>> accessories like that aren't being put out into the world, but I 
>>> also definitely think that Apple's being cheap. More like a 
>>> convenient and specious excuse for them to remove an item and cut 
>>> the cost of production and logistics and still charge the same under 
>>> the cover of being environmentally conscious.
>>> Either way though, it's not like not having the charger included is 
>>> going to be a make or break decision for anyone who was thinking of 
>>> buying an iPhone. Just more nickel and diming from Apple.
>>> Cristóbal
>>>
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf 
>>> Of Richard Turner
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:34 AM
>>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: RE: Apple getting cheap
>>>
>>> Apple says it is for the environment because most people have all 
>>> the chargers they need and more.
>>> That is certainly  true in our household.
>>> I happen to agree with Apple in this case.
>>> We have enough (Expletive deleted) stuff in the landfills and ocean 
>>> now to last many life times.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Richard
>>> "The highest reward for a person's toil is not what they get for it, 
>>> but what they become by it."
>>> - John Ruskin, 1819-1900
>>>
>>> Web site: www.turner42.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf 
>>> Of Mich Verrier
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:30 AM
>>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: RE: Apple getting cheapq
>>>
>>>  From what I herd apple is not shipping any of there phones with 
>>> chargers since they want you to buy them seppritley since you have 
>>> to remember that apple's main thing is to make money. O shure apple 
>>> has dun good for the blind and vi comunidey with voice over and 
>>> stuff how ever you have to remember that the mane objective for 
>>> apple is to make more money. From Mich.
>>>
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf 
>>> Of Maria Campbell
>>> Sent: April 15, 2021 1:27 PM
>>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: Apple getting cheapq
>>>
>>> My SE2020 didn't even come with a C charger.  How cheap is that 
>>> considering it's so proprietary?  It came with the C cord but not 
>>> the charger.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Maria Campbell
>>> lucky1i...@gmail.com
>>>
>>> All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do 
>>> nothing.
>>> --Edmund Burke
>>>
>>> --
>>> The following 

Re: Apple getting cheap

[Maria Campbell]

Stuff it!


Maria Campbell
lucky1i...@gmail.com

All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing.
--Edmund Burke

On 4/15/2021 7:59 PM, Simon A Fogarty wrote:

Yeah cheap,

So I'm guessing people didn't listen to tim cook when he said they were getting 
rid of the power bricks in the boxes for the devices,

It's not about being cheap,
It's more to do with apple trying to get back in to the eco friendly world and 
save the planet from excess plastic  that we don't need to clutter our lives 
with,

Plus the fact that majority of the people around the planet who have had or 
have apple mobile devices already have a couple of charging bricks lying around 
and therefore those will still do the job they were made for,

So if you have one already,
Why complain about them being left out of the box for a phone or iPad,

I really love how these serious first world problems bug you guys so much,

Imagine if we had real problems around the planet like a pendemic virus and 
millions dying,

But you guys get upset because apple leave a $20 peace of plastic shit out of a 
box.



-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of lenron 
brown
Sent: Friday, 16 April 2021 7:18 am
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Apple getting cheap

I say screw them it's just another way for them to be cheap. Can't for get the 
fact that it's a ploy to get you to buy extra chargers, and airpods when they 
dropped the headphone jacks, and of course them not putting them in the box.

On 4/15/21, Mary Otten  wrote:

Apparently others are following an apples lead. I believe I saw where
Samsung is dropping the chargers as well. It was either them or Google
with their pixels. Maybe they are being cheap. But we just don’t need
all this extra crap going out into the environment. I have an iPad
charger from a really old iPad mini that still works just fine. And of
course I have a couple of iPhone chargers and a USB see power block
which I think cost me all of eight bucks. It didn’t exactly break the bank.


Sent from my iPhone


On Apr 15, 2021, at 10:54 AM, Cristóbal Muñoz

wrote:

I mean... I do believe it's a good thing that more plastic and
accessories like that aren't being put out into the world, but I also
definitely think that Apple's being cheap. More like a convenient and
specious excuse for them to remove an item and cut the cost of
production and logistics and still charge the same under the cover of
being environmentally conscious.
Either way though, it's not like not having the charger included is
going to be a make or break decision for anyone who was thinking of
buying an iPhone. Just more nickel and diming from Apple.
Cristóbal

-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf
Of Richard Turner
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:34 AM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: Apple getting cheap

Apple says it is for the environment because most people have all the
chargers they need and more.
That is certainly  true in our household.
I happen to agree with Apple in this case.
We have enough (Expletive deleted) stuff in the landfills and ocean
now to last many life times.



Richard
"The highest reward for a person's toil is not what they get for it,
but what they become by it."
- John Ruskin, 1819-1900

Web site: www.turner42.com



-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf
Of Mich Verrier
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:30 AM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: Apple getting cheapq

 From what I herd apple is not shipping any of there phones with
chargers since they want you to buy them seppritley since you have to
remember that apple's main thing is to make money. O shure apple has
dun good for the blind and vi comunidey with voice over and stuff how
ever you have to remember that the mane objective for apple is to
make more money. From Mich.

-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf
Of Maria Campbell
Sent: April 15, 2021 1:27 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Apple getting cheapq

My SE2020 didn't even come with a C charger.  How cheap is that
considering it's so proprietary?  It came with the C cord but not the
charger.



--
Maria Campbell
lucky1i...@gmail.com

All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do
nothing.
--Edmund Burke

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RE: Apple getting cheap

[Bonnie Blose]

You make me laugh. All that serious stuff just melted away when you wrote so 
humorously about this. 
I had the thought many times today that if this is the most important thing 
happening to people, they must live on another earth. There is a pandemic, 
trouble with vaccines, shootings, problems with Russia, Afghanistan, gas and 
food prices skyrocketing, hospitals filling with more covid patients, climate 
change, fake products, and I could go on and on. I needed your humor and 
deserve it because I live in the real world. The day I worry about a charger or 
feel cheated because I no longer get one is going to be a day when my life is 
just about perfect. I worried about the Smith Corona typewriter no longer being 
made and thought I was getting old because I was about to remember what to many 
are ancient or outdated equipment. You have given me a new lease on life. Thank 
you and especially for making me laugh.

Bonnie Blose

-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of Simon A 
Fogarty
Sent: April 15, 2021 7:59 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: Apple getting cheap

Yeah cheap,

So I'm guessing people didn't listen to tim cook when he said they were getting 
rid of the power bricks in the boxes for the devices,

It's not about being cheap,
It's more to do with apple trying to get back in to the eco friendly world and 
save the planet from excess plastic  that we don't need to clutter our lives 
with,

Plus the fact that majority of the people around the planet who have had or 
have apple mobile devices already have a couple of charging bricks lying around 
and therefore those will still do the job they were made for,

So if you have one already,
Why complain about them being left out of the box for a phone or iPad,

I really love how these serious first world problems bug you guys so much,

Imagine if we had real problems around the planet like a pendemic virus and 
millions dying,

But you guys get upset because apple leave a $20 peace of plastic shit out of a 
box.



-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of lenron 
brown
Sent: Friday, 16 April 2021 7:18 am
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Apple getting cheap

I say screw them it's just another way for them to be cheap. Can't for get the 
fact that it's a ploy to get you to buy extra chargers, and airpods when they 
dropped the headphone jacks, and of course them not putting them in the box.

On 4/15/21, Mary Otten  wrote:
> Apparently others are following an apples lead. I believe I saw where 
> Samsung is dropping the chargers as well. It was either them or Google 
> with their pixels. Maybe they are being cheap. But we just don’t need 
> all this extra crap going out into the environment. I have an iPad 
> charger from a really old iPad mini that still works just fine. And of 
> course I have a couple of iPhone chargers and a USB see power block 
> which I think cost me all of eight bucks. It didn’t exactly break the bank.
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Apr 15, 2021, at 10:54 AM, Cristóbal Muñoz 
>> 
>> wrote:
>>
>> I mean... I do believe it's a good thing that more plastic and 
>> accessories like that aren't being put out into the world, but I also 
>> definitely think that Apple's being cheap. More like a convenient and 
>> specious excuse for them to remove an item and cut the cost of 
>> production and logistics and still charge the same under the cover of 
>> being environmentally conscious.
>> Either way though, it's not like not having the charger included is 
>> going to be a make or break decision for anyone who was thinking of 
>> buying an iPhone. Just more nickel and diming from Apple.
>> Cristóbal
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf 
>> Of Richard Turner
>> Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:34 AM
>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: RE: Apple getting cheap
>>
>> Apple says it is for the environment because most people have all the 
>> chargers they need and more.
>> That is certainly  true in our household.
>> I happen to agree with Apple in this case.
>> We have enough (Expletive deleted) stuff in the landfills and ocean 
>> now to last many life times.
>>
>>
>>
>> Richard
>> "The highest reward for a person's toil is not what they get for it, 
>> but what they become by it."
>> - John Ruskin, 1819-1900
>>
>> Web site: www.turner42.com
>>
>>
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf 
>> Of Mich Verrier
>> Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:30 AM
>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: RE: Apple getting cheapq
>>
>> From what I herd apple is not shipping any of there phones with 
>> chargers since they want you to buy them seppritley since you have to 
>> remember that apple's main thing is to make money. O shure apple has 
>> dun good for the blind and vi comunidey with voice over and stuff how 
>> ever you have to remember that the mane objective for apple is to 

Re: Mac big sur: how to turn on VoiceOver to enter my password?

[Priscilla Garces (prisci)]

Hi everyone, I also got a shiny new Mac since my older MacBook Pro finally 
broke because my screen wasn’t working and my battery wasn’t holding a charge 
anymore.
I got the new MacBook Air because I found that using the Touch Bar would be an 
issue being that I need the physical buttons to turn on VoiceOver. I preferred 
the function keys since it is easier for me being that I’m totally blind. It is 
easier if I use command F5 to activate and deactivate VoiceOver rather than 
pressing the Touch ID button 3 times while holding the command button. + The 
MacBook Air has a lighter footprint and smaller charger I can always carry in 
my purse or pocket. I mostly use my Mac for basic word processing, email, 
researching on the internet and videoconferences.


> On Apr 15, 2021, at 7:11 PM, Bob Hill  wrote:
> 
> Hi Ann and list,
> 
> Having just received a shiny new MacBook Pro a couple of days ago, I can tell 
> you that the touch ID button is the power button in the right upper corner of 
> the machine, at the right end of the touch bar.
> 
> Bob Hill
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my BrailleNote Touch PlusOn Apr 15, 2021 5:24 PM, Ann Byrne 
>  wrote:
>> 
>> Where is the touch ID button? 
>> At 04:16 PM 4/15/2021, you wrote: 
>>> Press command-f5 to turn on VoiceOver. If 
>>> you’ve got a Touch Bar, hold command and press 
>>> the Touch ID  button three times. 
>>> Regards, 
>>> Daniel 
>>> 
 On Apr 15, 2021, at 5:57 PM, Ann Byrne  wrote: 
 
 the stinker is silent!  I have tried telling 
 siri to turn on voiceOver, but she's not listening.How do I get speech??? 
 
 Thx 
 
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> The 

RE: Apple getting cheapq

[Simon A Fogarty]

Waw,

My iphone se 2020 came with a USB-a to lightening cable and a 5 watt charging 
brick.

-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of Maria 
Campbell
Sent: Friday, 16 April 2021 5:27 am
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Apple getting cheapq

My SE2020 didn't even come with a C charger.  How cheap is that considering 
it's so proprietary?  It came with the C cord but not the charger.



--
Maria Campbell
lucky1i...@gmail.com

All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing.
--Edmund Burke

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RE: Apple getting cheap

[Simon A Fogarty]

Yeah fully agree,

-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of Richard 
Turner
Sent: Friday, 16 April 2021 5:34 am
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: Apple getting cheap

Apple says it is for the environment because most people have all the chargers 
they need and more.
That is certainly  true in our household.
I happen to agree with Apple in this case.
We have enough (Expletive deleted) stuff in the landfills and ocean now to last 
many life times.
 


Richard
"The highest reward for a person's toil is not what they get for it, but what 
they become by it."
- John Ruskin, 1819-1900

Web site: www.turner42.com



-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of Mich 
Verrier
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:30 AM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: Apple getting cheapq

>From what I herd apple is not shipping any of there phones with chargers since 
>they want you to buy them seppritley since you have to remember that apple's 
>main thing is to make money. O shure apple has dun good for the blind and vi 
>comunidey with voice over and stuff how ever you have to remember that the 
>mane objective for apple is to make more money. From Mich.

-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of Maria 
Campbell
Sent: April 15, 2021 1:27 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Apple getting cheapq

My SE2020 didn't even come with a C charger.  How cheap is that considering 
it's so proprietary?  It came with the C cord but not the charger.



--
Maria Campbell
lucky1i...@gmail.com

All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing.
--Edmund Burke

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RE: Apple getting cheap

[Simon A Fogarty]

Yeah cheap,

So I'm guessing people didn't listen to tim cook when he said they were getting 
rid of the power bricks in the boxes for the devices,

It's not about being cheap,
It's more to do with apple trying to get back in to the eco friendly world and 
save the planet from excess plastic  that we don't need to clutter our lives 
with,

Plus the fact that majority of the people around the planet who have had or 
have apple mobile devices already have a couple of charging bricks lying around 
and therefore those will still do the job they were made for,

So if you have one already,
Why complain about them being left out of the box for a phone or iPad,

I really love how these serious first world problems bug you guys so much,

Imagine if we had real problems around the planet like a pendemic virus and 
millions dying,

But you guys get upset because apple leave a $20 peace of plastic shit out of a 
box.



-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of lenron 
brown
Sent: Friday, 16 April 2021 7:18 am
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Apple getting cheap

I say screw them it's just another way for them to be cheap. Can't for get the 
fact that it's a ploy to get you to buy extra chargers, and airpods when they 
dropped the headphone jacks, and of course them not putting them in the box.

On 4/15/21, Mary Otten  wrote:
> Apparently others are following an apples lead. I believe I saw where 
> Samsung is dropping the chargers as well. It was either them or Google 
> with their pixels. Maybe they are being cheap. But we just don’t need 
> all this extra crap going out into the environment. I have an iPad 
> charger from a really old iPad mini that still works just fine. And of 
> course I have a couple of iPhone chargers and a USB see power block 
> which I think cost me all of eight bucks. It didn’t exactly break the bank.
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Apr 15, 2021, at 10:54 AM, Cristóbal Muñoz 
>> 
>> wrote:
>>
>> I mean... I do believe it's a good thing that more plastic and 
>> accessories like that aren't being put out into the world, but I also 
>> definitely think that Apple's being cheap. More like a convenient and 
>> specious excuse for them to remove an item and cut the cost of 
>> production and logistics and still charge the same under the cover of 
>> being environmentally conscious.
>> Either way though, it's not like not having the charger included is 
>> going to be a make or break decision for anyone who was thinking of 
>> buying an iPhone. Just more nickel and diming from Apple.
>> Cristóbal
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf 
>> Of Richard Turner
>> Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:34 AM
>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: RE: Apple getting cheap
>>
>> Apple says it is for the environment because most people have all the 
>> chargers they need and more.
>> That is certainly  true in our household.
>> I happen to agree with Apple in this case.
>> We have enough (Expletive deleted) stuff in the landfills and ocean 
>> now to last many life times.
>>
>>
>>
>> Richard
>> "The highest reward for a person's toil is not what they get for it, 
>> but what they become by it."
>> - John Ruskin, 1819-1900
>>
>> Web site: www.turner42.com
>>
>>
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf 
>> Of Mich Verrier
>> Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:30 AM
>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: RE: Apple getting cheapq
>>
>> From what I herd apple is not shipping any of there phones with 
>> chargers since they want you to buy them seppritley since you have to 
>> remember that apple's main thing is to make money. O shure apple has 
>> dun good for the blind and vi comunidey with voice over and stuff how 
>> ever you have to remember that the mane objective for apple is to 
>> make more money. From Mich.
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf 
>> Of Maria Campbell
>> Sent: April 15, 2021 1:27 PM
>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: Apple getting cheapq
>>
>> My SE2020 didn't even come with a C charger.  How cheap is that 
>> considering it's so proprietary?  It came with the C cord but not the 
>> charger.
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Maria Campbell
>> lucky1i...@gmail.com
>>
>> All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do 
>> nothing.
>> --Edmund Burke
>>
>> --
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>> iPhone list.
>>
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>> the owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
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>> at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>>
>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>> 

Re: Mac OS Big Sur 11.2.3, dock menu

[Mike Arrigo]

This is a known issue, I've had the same problem, here is a work around. Go in 
to system preferences to accessibility. Go to the mouse section and turn on 
mouse keys. This allows you to use your keyboard to control the mouse. You will 
need a keyboard with a number pad for this to work. Now open the application 
that you want to keep in the dock, move voiceover to that item and then press 
VO+command+F5 to move the mouse to that item. Now hold the control key and 
press numpad 5, this will do a control click on the item and the menu should 
work. Don't forget to turn the mouse keys feature off when you are done.

> On Apr 14, 2021, at 3:39 AM, Juan Hernandez  wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> I just got a new Mac mini w/ Mac OS Big Sur.  On my old Mac with Mac OS X 
> 10.15 I used to be able to go to running apps on the dock, and do vo+shift+m 
> to bring up the context menu, and then from there say to keep the app 
> shortcut on the dock when it wasn’t running that way I could run it from 
> there.   This no longer works, so how do I it?
> 
> Any help will be greatly appreciated.
> 
> Best,
> 
> Juan
> 
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>  
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RE: Apple getting cheap

[Simon A Fogarty]

Except at the high end where wired is better for examples in recording studios 

But for the average person,
Wireless is cleaner 

-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of lenron 
brown
Sent: Friday, 16 April 2021 7:46 am
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Apple getting cheap

Well bluetooth headphones need to have charge for a week. I get tired of 
recharging. Wired is still good even if it's lightning or usb C.

On 4/15/21, Mary Otten  wrote:
> They may have been the first to drop the headphone jack, but many 
> others have followed and will continue to follow. Wired headphones are going 
> away.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Apr 15, 2021, at 12:18 PM, lenron brown  wrote:
>>
>> I say screw them it's just another way for them to be cheap. Can't 
>> for get the fact that it's a ploy to get you to buy extra chargers, 
>> and airpods when they dropped the headphone jacks, and of course them 
>> not putting them in the box.
>>
>>> On 4/15/21, Mary Otten  wrote:
>>> Apparently others are following an apples lead. I believe I saw 
>>> where Samsung is dropping the chargers as well. It was either them 
>>> or Google with their pixels. Maybe they are being cheap. But we just 
>>> don’t need all this extra crap going out into the environment. I 
>>> have an iPad charger from a really old iPad mini that still works 
>>> just fine. And of course I have a couple of iPhone chargers and a 
>>> USB see power block which I think cost me all of eight bucks. It 
>>> didn’t exactly break the bank.
>>>
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
 On Apr 15, 2021, at 10:54 AM, Cristóbal Muñoz 
 
 wrote:

 I mean... I do believe it's a good thing that more plastic and 
 accessories like that aren't being put out into the world, but I 
 also definitely think that Apple's being cheap. More like a 
 convenient and specious excuse for them to remove an item and cut 
 the cost of production and logistics and still charge the same 
 under the cover of being environmentally conscious.
 Either way though, it's not like not having the charger included is 
 going to be a make or break decision for anyone who was thinking of 
 buying an iPhone. Just more nickel and diming from Apple.
 Cristóbal

 -Original Message-
 From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf 
 Of Richard Turner
 Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:34 AM
 To: viphone@googlegroups.com
 Subject: RE: Apple getting cheap

 Apple says it is for the environment because most people have all 
 the chargers they need and more.
 That is certainly  true in our household.
 I happen to agree with Apple in this case.
 We have enough (Expletive deleted) stuff in the landfills and ocean 
 now to last many life times.



 Richard
 "The highest reward for a person's toil is not what they get for 
 it, but what they become by it."
 - John Ruskin, 1819-1900

 Web site: www.turner42.com



 -Original Message-
 From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf 
 Of Mich Verrier
 Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:30 AM
 To: viphone@googlegroups.com
 Subject: RE: Apple getting cheapq

 From what I herd apple is not shipping any of there phones with 
 chargers since they want you to buy them seppritley since you have 
 to remember that apple's main thing is to make money. O shure apple 
 has dun good for the blind and vi comunidey with voice over and 
 stuff how ever you have to remember that the mane objective for 
 apple is to make more money. From Mich.

 -Original Message-
 From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf 
 Of Maria Campbell
 Sent: April 15, 2021 1:27 PM
 To: viphone@googlegroups.com
 Subject: Apple getting cheapq

 My SE2020 didn't even come with a C charger.  How cheap is that 
 considering it's so proprietary?  It came with the C cord but not 
 the charger.



 --
 Maria Campbell
 lucky1i...@gmail.com

 All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do 
 nothing.
 --Edmund Burke

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RE: Mac big sur: how to turn on VoiceOver to enter my password?

[Simon A Fogarty]

Yes the newer power bricks for the iPhones have or should I say had the 18w 
supply and a Usb type c slot to a lightening connector.

Why throw away the 5w bricks,
It's only the charging speed that is the issue,

If you don't use your phone over night,
Just charge it then,

And the slow speed charge isn't going to hert the phone.

I have both a 5 and a 12w brick on my multi board,
I also have a wifi charging pad 
It depends on which one I get to first as to which is used to charge the phones 
either an 11 pro max or the se 2020 

The 18 or 20 w brick I got with my 11pm is sitting in the box never used.   


-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of Malcolm 
Parfitt
Sent: Friday, 16 April 2021 10:12 am
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Mac big sur: how to turn on VoiceOver to enter my password?

Sorry friends, message went to wrong thread.

Sorry for any inconvenience or confusion.

Malcolm Parfitt

> On 15 Apr 2021, at 23:09, Malcolm Parfitt  wrote:
> 
> There are a couple of issues here when considering Apple’s approach to 
> chargers as I see it.
> 
> Firstly, I have six 5 Watt chargers here that came with various Apple devices 
> over the years.  When I updated to an iPhone XR these 5 Watt chargers, one of 
> them came with the phone will not charge the XR at its fastest rate which 
> begs the question as to why it came with such a low rated charger in the 
> first place.
> 
> I would rather not just discard these chargers, but finding someone who has a 
> use for them is difficult as they probably have redundant units themselves.
> 
> Personally I bought a 18 Watt charger from Amazon made by Anker.
> 
> As I understand it, newer devices made by Apple come with a USB C to 
> Lightning cable.  This implies that they assume people have a USB power 
> source available which may or may not be the case.  After all, why supply a 
> cable but no charger, why not both or neither.
> 
> I don’t consider it to be a rip off on Apple’s behalf I completely understand 
> and support any action that is environmentally friendly.  But it does look 
> rather inconsistent.
> 
> Yes, if you have an older charger and cable you can charge your new device 
> but not at its optimal rate.
> 
> Apple are rather in a no-win situation, what ever they do will earn them 
> criticism from some quarters.
> 
> Malcolm Parfitt
> 
>>> On 15 Apr 2021, at 22:25, Ann Byrne  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Where is the touch ID button?
>>> At 04:16 PM 4/15/2021, you wrote:
>>> Press command-f5 to turn on VoiceOver. If you’ve got a Touch Bar, hold 
>>> command and press the Touch ID  button three times.
>>> Regards,
>>> Daniel
>>> 
> On Apr 15, 2021, at 5:57 PM, Ann Byrne  wrote:
 
 the stinker is silent!  I have tried telling siri to turn on voiceOver, 
 but she's not listening.How do I get speech???
 
 Thx
 
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RE: one system dialog displayed

[Simon A Fogarty]

F2 twice quickly,

Remember that if in doubt you can try it either way and see what happens,

You can't do a lot wrong at this level and not be able to change things back to 
prior to your keypresses.

But in this case,

Ctrl option, f2 and then f2 again 

-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of Ann Byrne
Sent: Friday, 16 April 2021 10:25 am
To: viPhone list 
Subject: one system dialog displayed

So one of my heros got the Mac to talk.  Now it says "One system dialog 
displayed, ... to go to system dialogs in item chooser press ctrl, option, and 
then f2 2.Does this mean f22, or f2 twice, or something entirely different.  
the message repeats about once a minute; it would be nice if I could get rid of 
it.  I got to item chooser, but can't see how to close this message.

Thanks for any rescue.

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Re: Mac big sur: how to turn on VoiceOver to enter my password?

[Bob Hill]

Hi Ann and list,

Having just received a shiny new MacBook Pro a couple of days ago, I can tell 
you that the touch ID button is the power button in the right upper corner of 
the machine, at the right end of the touch bar.

Bob Hill





Sent from my BrailleNote Touch PlusOn Apr 15, 2021 5:24 PM, Ann Byrne 
 wrote:
>
> Where is the touch ID button? 
> At 04:16 PM 4/15/2021, you wrote: 
> >Press command-f5 to turn on VoiceOver. If 
> >you’ve got a Touch Bar, hold command and press 
> >the Touch ID  button three times. 
> >Regards, 
> >Daniel 
> > 
> >>On Apr 15, 2021, at 5:57 PM, Ann Byrne  wrote: 
> >> 
> >>the stinker is silent!  I have tried telling 
> >>siri to turn on voiceOver, but she's not listening.How do I get speech??? 
> >> 
> >>Thx 
> >> 
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Re: AppleCare+ question.

[Gordon]

It would all depend on how you pay for Apple Care. If you paid in 
advance for the service, then it would carry over until it expires at 
the end of 24 months. If you pay monthly for the service then it would 
carry over to the new device and start the 24 month cycle over again 
unless you continued to make the monthly payments on the Apple Care plan 
associated with your 10R.


On 4/15/2021 5:59 PM, Malcolm Parfitt wrote:

Hello friends,

If an iPhone has AppleCare+ registered with it and it is traded in with Apple 
prior to the expiration of AppleCare+ does the remainder of the coverage 
transfer to the new device or is it cancelled?

I currently have an iPhone XR which has AppleCare+ which expires in July of 
this year.

If I was to trade it in with Apple for a new iPhone what would happen to my 
AppleCare+ on the XR would its remainder be carried over to a new device or 
would I lose it?

Malcolm Parfitt



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AppleCare+ question.

[Malcolm Parfitt]

Hello friends,

If an iPhone has AppleCare+ registered with it and it is traded in with Apple 
prior to the expiration of AppleCare+ does the remainder of the coverage 
transfer to the new device or is it cancelled?

I currently have an iPhone XR which has AppleCare+ which expires in July of 
this year.

If I was to trade it in with Apple for a new iPhone what would happen to my 
AppleCare+ on the XR would its remainder be carried over to a new device or 
would I lose it?

Malcolm Parfitt

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Re: beta testing

[kliph miller Sr]

I run a beta list, and we test all betas with all aspects.  IOS, MacOS, iPads, 
iPhones, with and without bluetooth keyboards.  Even submitted bug reports, and 
share those bug report numbers so it can be referenced and be connected to the 
same issue.

My groups
User of just apple products, like to ask and answer without other topics?  
That’s how it goes down in “only Apple talk and support. Subscribe here
only-apple-tns+subscr...@groups.io
 Come talk
 just apple!
Beta tester for apple products?  come help squash the bugs
public-beta-users+subscr...@groups.io
 Because of the non disclosure 
agreement, if your not a beta tester, please don’t join the group.
Have a braille display?  Come teach and learn with others
braille-display-users+subscr...@groups.io 


> On Apr 15, 2021, at 5:23 PM, deidreandlou...@gmail.com wrote:
> 
> I would urge beta testers to do a lot of the testing of features  not just 
> from bluetooth keyboards but through touching and tapping and swiping on the 
> screen. I think things have been overlooked in the past in regard to swiping 
> vs things that work real well for those using bluetooth keyboards or braile 
> devices with their phones.
>  
> Deidre
> 
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Re: beta testing

[Mary Otten]

As someone who does not use a display or a keyboard with my phone, I can tell 
you that there are a lot of beta testers who do the same. Would you like to do 
it as well? Do you have a device that’s not your daily device? How about 
joining the party.
Mary


Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 15, 2021, at 3:23 PM, deidreandlou...@gmail.com wrote:
> 
> 
> I would urge beta testers to do a lot of the testing of features  not just 
> from bluetooth keyboards but through touching and tapping and swiping on the 
> screen. I think things have been overlooked in the past in regard to swiping 
> vs things that work real well for those using bluetooth keyboards or braile 
> devices with their phones.
>  
> Deidre
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one system dialog displayed

[Ann Byrne]

So one of my heros got the Mac to talk.  Now it says "One system 
dialog displayed, ... to go to system dialogs in item chooser press 
ctrl, option, and then f2 2.Does this mean f22, or f2 twice, or 
something entirely different.  the message repeats about once a 
minute; it would be nice if I could get rid of it.  I got to item 
chooser, but can't see how to close this message.


Thanks for any rescue.

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beta testing

[deidreandlouise]

I would urge beta testers to do a lot of the testing of features  not just from 
bluetooth keyboards but through touching and tapping and swiping on the screen. 
I think things have been overlooked in the past in regard to swiping vs things 
that work real well for those using bluetooth keyboards or braile devices with 
their phones.

 

Deidre

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Re: Mac big sur: how to turn on VoiceOver to enter my password?

[Malcolm Parfitt]

Sorry friends, message went to wrong thread.

Sorry for any inconvenience or confusion.

Malcolm Parfitt

> On 15 Apr 2021, at 23:09, Malcolm Parfitt  wrote:
> 
> There are a couple of issues here when considering Apple’s approach to 
> chargers as I see it.
> 
> Firstly, I have six 5 Watt chargers here that came with various Apple devices 
> over the years.  When I updated to an iPhone XR these 5 Watt chargers, one of 
> them came with the phone will not charge the XR at its fastest rate which 
> begs the question as to why it came with such a low rated charger in the 
> first place.
> 
> I would rather not just discard these chargers, but finding someone who has a 
> use for them is difficult as they probably have redundant units themselves.
> 
> Personally I bought a 18 Watt charger from Amazon made by Anker.
> 
> As I understand it, newer devices made by Apple come with a USB C to 
> Lightning cable.  This implies that they assume people have a USB power 
> source available which may or may not be the case.  After all, why supply a 
> cable but no charger, why not both or neither.
> 
> I don’t consider it to be a rip off on Apple’s behalf I completely understand 
> and support any action that is environmentally friendly.  But it does look 
> rather inconsistent.
> 
> Yes, if you have an older charger and cable you can charge your new device 
> but not at its optimal rate.
> 
> Apple are rather in a no-win situation, what ever they do will earn them 
> criticism from some quarters.
> 
> Malcolm Parfitt
> 
>>> On 15 Apr 2021, at 22:25, Ann Byrne  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Where is the touch ID button?
>>> At 04:16 PM 4/15/2021, you wrote:
>>> Press command-f5 to turn on VoiceOver. If you’ve got a Touch Bar, hold 
>>> command and press the Touch ID  button three times.
>>> Regards,
>>> Daniel
>>> 
> On Apr 15, 2021, at 5:57 PM, Ann Byrne  wrote:
 
 the stinker is silent!  I have tried telling siri to turn on voiceOver, 
 but she's not listening.How do I get speech???
 
 Thx
 
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Re: Mac big sur: how to turn on VoiceOver to enter my password?

[Malcolm Parfitt]

There are a couple of issues here when considering Apple’s approach to chargers 
as I see it.

Firstly, I have six 5 Watt chargers here that came with various Apple devices 
over the years.  When I updated to an iPhone XR these 5 Watt chargers, one of 
them came with the phone will not charge the XR at its fastest rate which begs 
the question as to why it came with such a low rated charger in the first place.

I would rather not just discard these chargers, but finding someone who has a 
use for them is difficult as they probably have redundant units themselves.

Personally I bought a 18 Watt charger from Amazon made by Anker.

As I understand it, newer devices made by Apple come with a USB C to Lightning 
cable.  This implies that they assume people have a USB power source available 
which may or may not be the case.  After all, why supply a cable but no 
charger, why not both or neither.

I don’t consider it to be a rip off on Apple’s behalf I completely understand 
and support any action that is environmentally friendly.  But it does look 
rather inconsistent.

Yes, if you have an older charger and cable you can charge your new device but 
not at its optimal rate.

Apple are rather in a no-win situation, what ever they do will earn them 
criticism from some quarters.

Malcolm Parfitt

> On 15 Apr 2021, at 22:25, Ann Byrne  wrote:
> 
> Where is the touch ID button?
> At 04:16 PM 4/15/2021, you wrote:
>> Press command-f5 to turn on VoiceOver. If you’ve got a Touch Bar, hold 
>> command and press the Touch ID  button three times.
>> Regards,
>> Daniel
>> 
 On Apr 15, 2021, at 5:57 PM, Ann Byrne  wrote:
>>> 
>>> the stinker is silent!  I have tried telling siri to turn on voiceOver, but 
>>> she's not listening.How do I get speech???
>>> 
>>> Thx
>>> 
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Re: Mac big sur: how to turn on VoiceOver to enter my password?

[Ann Byrne]

Where is the touch ID button?
At 04:16 PM 4/15/2021, you wrote:
Press command-f5 to turn on VoiceOver. If 
you’ve got a Touch Bar, hold command and press 
the Touch ID  button three times.

Regards,
Daniel


On Apr 15, 2021, at 5:57 PM, Ann Byrne  wrote:

the stinker is silent!  I have tried telling 
siri to turn on voiceOver, but she's not listening.How do I get speech???


Thx

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Re: Mac big sur: how to turn on VoiceOver to enter my password?

[Daniel MacDonald]

Press command-f5 to turn on VoiceOver. If you’ve got a Touch Bar, hold command and press the Touch ID  button three times.Regards,DanielOn Apr 15, 2021, at 5:57 PM, Ann Byrne  wrote:the stinker is silent!  I have tried telling siri to turn on voiceOver, but she's not listening.How do I get speech???Thx-- The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone list.If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor.  Mark can be reached at:  mk...@ucla.edu.  Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.comThe archives for this list can be searched at:http://www.mail-archive.com/viphone@googlegroups.com/--- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "VIPhone" group.To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to viphone+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/viphone/6078a8b1.1c69fb81.b9a59.0298SMTPIN_ADDED_MISSING%40gmr-mx.google.com.



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Re: Apple getting cheap

[Wayne Merritt]

An option for those who don't want to give Apple more money is to buy
an older iPhone, like the 11 series or earlier. When I got the iPhone
11 last fall there was a wall plug in the box. Perhaps as time goes by
they will remove those from the older phones too. I don't agree with
every change Apple makes either, such as taking away the headphone
jack a few years ago. However, I keep buying Apple products because
those are the most usable and accessible to me, IMO.

Be well,
Wayne Merritt

On 4/15/21, Maria Campbell  wrote:
> Come on Richard.  Every other phone I got came with a block, even though
> there  was no difference in the USB connection.  The SE2020 is the first
> USBC phone I've had, so I didn't know I needed a different type of
> block, which I still haven't purchased, so I haven't used the cord that
> came with the phone.  It's not that I don't like Apple, it's that I
> don't understand the change in midstream.  Perhaps there are newer
> models with this USBC, but I hadn't had one till now.  That's all I'm
> saying.
>
>
> Maria Campbell
> lucky1i...@gmail.com
>
> All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing.
> --Edmund Burke
>
> On 4/15/2021 4:26 PM, Richard Turner wrote:
>>
>> Folks, you do not have to buy Apple products if they upset you so much.
>>
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Mac big sur: how to turn on VoiceOver to enter my password?

[Ann Byrne]

the stinker is silent!  I have tried telling siri to turn on 
voiceOver, but she's not listening.How do I get speech???


Thx

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Re: Apple getting cheap

[Maria Campbell]

Come on Richard.  Every other phone I got came with a block, even though 
there  was no difference in the USB connection.  The SE2020 is the first 
USBC phone I've had, so I didn't know I needed a different type of 
block, which I still haven't purchased, so I haven't used the cord that 
came with the phone.  It's not that I don't like Apple, it's that I 
don't understand the change in midstream.  Perhaps there are newer 
models with this USBC, but I hadn't had one till now.  That's all I'm 
saying.



Maria Campbell
lucky1i...@gmail.com

All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing.
--Edmund Burke

On 4/15/2021 4:26 PM, Richard Turner wrote:


Folks, you do not have to buy Apple products if they upset you so much.

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RE: Apple getting cheap

[Carolyn]

I vote for wired. I think the sound quality is better, maybe more responsive. 

-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of 
lenron brown
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 3:46 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Apple getting cheap

Well bluetooth headphones need to have charge for a week. I get tired of 
recharging. Wired is still good even if it's lightning or usb C.

On 4/15/21, Mary Otten  wrote:
> They may have been the first to drop the headphone jack, but many 
> others have followed and will continue to follow. Wired headphones are going 
> away.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Apr 15, 2021, at 12:18 PM, lenron brown  wrote:
>>
>> I say screw them it's just another way for them to be cheap. Can't 
>> for get the fact that it's a ploy to get you to buy extra chargers, 
>> and airpods when they dropped the headphone jacks, and of course them 
>> not putting them in the box.
>>
>>> On 4/15/21, Mary Otten  wrote:
>>> Apparently others are following an apples lead. I believe I saw 
>>> where Samsung is dropping the chargers as well. It was either them 
>>> or Google with their pixels. Maybe they are being cheap. But we just 
>>> don’t need all this extra crap going out into the environment. I 
>>> have an iPad charger from a really old iPad mini that still works 
>>> just fine. And of course I have a couple of iPhone chargers and a 
>>> USB see power block which I think cost me all of eight bucks. It 
>>> didn’t exactly break the bank.
>>>
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
 On Apr 15, 2021, at 10:54 AM, Cristóbal Muñoz 
 
 wrote:

 I mean... I do believe it's a good thing that more plastic and 
 accessories like that aren't being put out into the world, but I 
 also definitely think that Apple's being cheap. More like a 
 convenient and specious excuse for them to remove an item and cut 
 the cost of production and logistics and still charge the same 
 under the cover of being environmentally conscious.
 Either way though, it's not like not having the charger included is 
 going to be a make or break decision for anyone who was thinking of 
 buying an iPhone. Just more nickel and diming from Apple.
 Cristóbal

 -Original Message-
 From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf 
 Of Richard Turner
 Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:34 AM
 To: viphone@googlegroups.com
 Subject: RE: Apple getting cheap

 Apple says it is for the environment because most people have all 
 the chargers they need and more.
 That is certainly  true in our household.
 I happen to agree with Apple in this case.
 We have enough (Expletive deleted) stuff in the landfills and ocean 
 now to last many life times.



 Richard
 "The highest reward for a person's toil is not what they get for 
 it, but what they become by it."
 - John Ruskin, 1819-1900

 Web site: www.turner42.com



 -Original Message-
 From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf 
 Of Mich Verrier
 Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:30 AM
 To: viphone@googlegroups.com
 Subject: RE: Apple getting cheapq

 From what I herd apple is not shipping any of there phones with 
 chargers since they want you to buy them seppritley since you have 
 to remember that apple's main thing is to make money. O shure apple 
 has dun good for the blind and vi comunidey with voice over and 
 stuff how ever you have to remember that the mane objective for 
 apple is to make more money. From Mich.

 -Original Message-
 From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf 
 Of Maria Campbell
 Sent: April 15, 2021 1:27 PM
 To: viphone@googlegroups.com
 Subject: Apple getting cheapq

 My SE2020 didn't even come with a C charger.  How cheap is that 
 considering it's so proprietary?  It came with the C cord but not 
 the charger.



 --
 Maria Campbell
 lucky1i...@gmail.com

 All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do 
 nothing.
 --Edmund Burke

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RE: Apple getting cheap

[Richard Turner]

Folks, you do not have to buy Apple products if they upset you so much.

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Re: Apple getting cheap

[Devin Prater]

Yep, and Apple set the standard on truly wireless being five hours, because
that's all anyone would ever need, right? right? At least some go up to 8
hours, sometimes. I just wish phones at least had two USB C or Lightning
ports, so if we used wired headphones, we could still charge our phones
with a wire too. Thank goodness batteries are better and last longer
nowadays.
Devin Prater
r.d.t.pra...@gmail.com


On Thu, Apr 15, 2021 at 2:46 PM lenron brown  wrote:

> Well bluetooth headphones need to have charge for a week. I get tired
> of recharging. Wired is still good even if it's lightning or usb C.
>
> On 4/15/21, Mary Otten  wrote:
> > They may have been the first to drop the headphone jack, but many others
> > have followed and will continue to follow. Wired headphones are going
> away.
> >
> > Sent from my iPhone
> >
> >> On Apr 15, 2021, at 12:18 PM, lenron brown  wrote:
> >>
> >> I say screw them it's just another way for them to be cheap. Can't for
> >> get the fact that it's a ploy to get you to buy extra chargers, and
> >> airpods when they dropped the headphone jacks, and of course them not
> >> putting them in the box.
> >>
> >>> On 4/15/21, Mary Otten  wrote:
> >>> Apparently others are following an apples lead. I believe I saw where
> >>> Samsung is dropping the chargers as well. It was either them or Google
> >>> with
> >>> their pixels. Maybe they are being cheap. But we just don’t need all
> >>> this
> >>> extra crap going out into the environment. I have an iPad charger from
> a
> >>> really old iPad mini that still works just fine. And of course I have a
> >>> couple of iPhone chargers and a USB see power block which I think cost
> >>> me
> >>> all of eight bucks. It didn’t exactly break the bank.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> Sent from my iPhone
> >>>
>  On Apr 15, 2021, at 10:54 AM, Cristóbal Muñoz <
> cristobalm...@gmail.com>
>  wrote:
> 
>  I mean... I do believe it's a good thing that more plastic and
>  accessories like that aren't being put out into the world, but I also
>  definitely think that Apple's being cheap. More like a convenient and
>  specious excuse for them to remove an item and cut the cost of
>  production
>  and logistics and still charge the same under the cover of being
>  environmentally conscious.
>  Either way though, it's not like not having the charger included is
>  going
>  to be a make or break decision for anyone who was thinking of buying
> an
>  iPhone. Just more nickel and diming from Apple.
>  Cristóbal
> 
>  -Original Message-
>  From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf
> Of
>  Richard Turner
>  Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:34 AM
>  To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>  Subject: RE: Apple getting cheap
> 
>  Apple says it is for the environment because most people have all the
>  chargers they need and more.
>  That is certainly  true in our household.
>  I happen to agree with Apple in this case.
>  We have enough (Expletive deleted) stuff in the landfills and ocean
> now
>  to
>  last many life times.
> 
> 
> 
>  Richard
>  "The highest reward for a person's toil is not what they get for it,
>  but
>  what they become by it."
>  - John Ruskin, 1819-1900
> 
>  Web site: www.turner42.com
> 
> 
> 
>  -Original Message-
>  From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf
> Of
>  Mich Verrier
>  Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:30 AM
>  To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>  Subject: RE: Apple getting cheapq
> 
>  From what I herd apple is not shipping any of there phones with
>  chargers
>  since they want you to buy them seppritley since you have to remember
>  that
>  apple's main thing is to make money. O shure apple has dun good for
> the
>  blind and vi comunidey with voice over and stuff how ever you have to
>  remember that the mane objective for apple is to make more money. From
>  Mich.
> 
>  -Original Message-
>  From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf
> Of
>  Maria Campbell
>  Sent: April 15, 2021 1:27 PM
>  To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>  Subject: Apple getting cheapq
> 
>  My SE2020 didn't even come with a C charger.  How cheap is that
>  considering it's so proprietary?  It came with the C cord but not the
>  charger.
> 
> 
> 
>  --
>  Maria Campbell
>  lucky1i...@gmail.com
> 
>  All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do
>  nothing.
>  --Edmund Burke
> 
>  --
>  The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone
>  list.
> 
>  If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list,
>  or
>  if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the
>  owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Re: Apple getting cheap

[lenron brown]

Well bluetooth headphones need to have charge for a week. I get tired
of recharging. Wired is still good even if it's lightning or usb C.

On 4/15/21, Mary Otten  wrote:
> They may have been the first to drop the headphone jack, but many others
> have followed and will continue to follow. Wired headphones are going away.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Apr 15, 2021, at 12:18 PM, lenron brown  wrote:
>>
>> I say screw them it's just another way for them to be cheap. Can't for
>> get the fact that it's a ploy to get you to buy extra chargers, and
>> airpods when they dropped the headphone jacks, and of course them not
>> putting them in the box.
>>
>>> On 4/15/21, Mary Otten  wrote:
>>> Apparently others are following an apples lead. I believe I saw where
>>> Samsung is dropping the chargers as well. It was either them or Google
>>> with
>>> their pixels. Maybe they are being cheap. But we just don’t need all
>>> this
>>> extra crap going out into the environment. I have an iPad charger from a
>>> really old iPad mini that still works just fine. And of course I have a
>>> couple of iPhone chargers and a USB see power block which I think cost
>>> me
>>> all of eight bucks. It didn’t exactly break the bank.
>>>
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
 On Apr 15, 2021, at 10:54 AM, Cristóbal Muñoz 
 wrote:

 I mean... I do believe it's a good thing that more plastic and
 accessories like that aren't being put out into the world, but I also
 definitely think that Apple's being cheap. More like a convenient and
 specious excuse for them to remove an item and cut the cost of
 production
 and logistics and still charge the same under the cover of being
 environmentally conscious.
 Either way though, it's not like not having the charger included is
 going
 to be a make or break decision for anyone who was thinking of buying an
 iPhone. Just more nickel and diming from Apple.
 Cristóbal

 -Original Message-
 From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of
 Richard Turner
 Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:34 AM
 To: viphone@googlegroups.com
 Subject: RE: Apple getting cheap

 Apple says it is for the environment because most people have all the
 chargers they need and more.
 That is certainly  true in our household.
 I happen to agree with Apple in this case.
 We have enough (Expletive deleted) stuff in the landfills and ocean now
 to
 last many life times.



 Richard
 "The highest reward for a person's toil is not what they get for it,
 but
 what they become by it."
 - John Ruskin, 1819-1900

 Web site: www.turner42.com



 -Original Message-
 From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of
 Mich Verrier
 Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:30 AM
 To: viphone@googlegroups.com
 Subject: RE: Apple getting cheapq

 From what I herd apple is not shipping any of there phones with
 chargers
 since they want you to buy them seppritley since you have to remember
 that
 apple's main thing is to make money. O shure apple has dun good for the
 blind and vi comunidey with voice over and stuff how ever you have to
 remember that the mane objective for apple is to make more money. From
 Mich.

 -Original Message-
 From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of
 Maria Campbell
 Sent: April 15, 2021 1:27 PM
 To: viphone@googlegroups.com
 Subject: Apple getting cheapq

 My SE2020 didn't even come with a C charger.  How cheap is that
 considering it's so proprietary?  It came with the C cord but not the
 charger.



 --
 Maria Campbell
 lucky1i...@gmail.com

 All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do
 nothing.
 --Edmund Burke

 --
 The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone
 list.

 If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list,
 or
 if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the
 owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

 Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor.  Mark can be reached at:
 mk...@ucla.edu.  Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at
 caraqu...@caraquinn.com

 The archives for this list can be searched at:
 https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mail-archive.com%2Fviphone%40googlegroups.com%2Fdata=04%7C01%7C%7C92f26482288949021c7008d900342262%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C637541046174440862%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000sdata=mwTIEcrmdoXefSDRuVnNudQuRo8dXSTYCEHkPHBPzEk%3Dreserved=0
 ---
 You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
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 "VIPhone" 

Re: Apple getting cheap

[Mary Otten]

They may have been the first to drop the headphone jack, but many others have 
followed and will continue to follow. Wired headphones are going away.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 15, 2021, at 12:18 PM, lenron brown  wrote:
> 
> I say screw them it's just another way for them to be cheap. Can't for
> get the fact that it's a ploy to get you to buy extra chargers, and
> airpods when they dropped the headphone jacks, and of course them not
> putting them in the box.
> 
>> On 4/15/21, Mary Otten  wrote:
>> Apparently others are following an apples lead. I believe I saw where
>> Samsung is dropping the chargers as well. It was either them or Google with
>> their pixels. Maybe they are being cheap. But we just don’t need all this
>> extra crap going out into the environment. I have an iPad charger from a
>> really old iPad mini that still works just fine. And of course I have a
>> couple of iPhone chargers and a USB see power block which I think cost me
>> all of eight bucks. It didn’t exactly break the bank.
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Apr 15, 2021, at 10:54 AM, Cristóbal Muñoz 
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> I mean... I do believe it's a good thing that more plastic and
>>> accessories like that aren't being put out into the world, but I also
>>> definitely think that Apple's being cheap. More like a convenient and
>>> specious excuse for them to remove an item and cut the cost of production
>>> and logistics and still charge the same under the cover of being
>>> environmentally conscious.
>>> Either way though, it's not like not having the charger included is going
>>> to be a make or break decision for anyone who was thinking of buying an
>>> iPhone. Just more nickel and diming from Apple.
>>> Cristóbal
>>> 
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of
>>> Richard Turner
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:34 AM
>>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: RE: Apple getting cheap
>>> 
>>> Apple says it is for the environment because most people have all the
>>> chargers they need and more.
>>> That is certainly  true in our household.
>>> I happen to agree with Apple in this case.
>>> We have enough (Expletive deleted) stuff in the landfills and ocean now to
>>> last many life times.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Richard
>>> "The highest reward for a person's toil is not what they get for it, but
>>> what they become by it."
>>> - John Ruskin, 1819-1900
>>> 
>>> Web site: www.turner42.com
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of
>>> Mich Verrier
>>> Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:30 AM
>>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: RE: Apple getting cheapq
>>> 
>>> From what I herd apple is not shipping any of there phones with chargers
>>> since they want you to buy them seppritley since you have to remember that
>>> apple's main thing is to make money. O shure apple has dun good for the
>>> blind and vi comunidey with voice over and stuff how ever you have to
>>> remember that the mane objective for apple is to make more money. From
>>> Mich.
>>> 
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of
>>> Maria Campbell
>>> Sent: April 15, 2021 1:27 PM
>>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: Apple getting cheapq
>>> 
>>> My SE2020 didn't even come with a C charger.  How cheap is that
>>> considering it's so proprietary?  It came with the C cord but not the
>>> charger.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> Maria Campbell
>>> lucky1i...@gmail.com
>>> 
>>> All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do
>>> nothing.
>>> --Edmund Burke
>>> 
>>> --
>>> The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone
>>> list.
>>> 
>>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or
>>> if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the
>>> owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>>> 
>>> Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor.  Mark can be reached at:
>>> mk...@ucla.edu.  Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at
>>> caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>>> 
>>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mail-archive.com%2Fviphone%40googlegroups.com%2Fdata=04%7C01%7C%7C92f26482288949021c7008d900342262%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C637541046174440862%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000sdata=mwTIEcrmdoXefSDRuVnNudQuRo8dXSTYCEHkPHBPzEk%3Dreserved=0
>>> ---
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>>> "VIPhone" group.
>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
>>> email to viphone+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>>> 

Re: Apple getting cheap

[lenron brown]

I say screw them it's just another way for them to be cheap. Can't for
get the fact that it's a ploy to get you to buy extra chargers, and
airpods when they dropped the headphone jacks, and of course them not
putting them in the box.

On 4/15/21, Mary Otten  wrote:
> Apparently others are following an apples lead. I believe I saw where
> Samsung is dropping the chargers as well. It was either them or Google with
> their pixels. Maybe they are being cheap. But we just don’t need all this
> extra crap going out into the environment. I have an iPad charger from a
> really old iPad mini that still works just fine. And of course I have a
> couple of iPhone chargers and a USB see power block which I think cost me
> all of eight bucks. It didn’t exactly break the bank.
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Apr 15, 2021, at 10:54 AM, Cristóbal Muñoz 
>> wrote:
>>
>> I mean... I do believe it's a good thing that more plastic and
>> accessories like that aren't being put out into the world, but I also
>> definitely think that Apple's being cheap. More like a convenient and
>> specious excuse for them to remove an item and cut the cost of production
>> and logistics and still charge the same under the cover of being
>> environmentally conscious.
>> Either way though, it's not like not having the charger included is going
>> to be a make or break decision for anyone who was thinking of buying an
>> iPhone. Just more nickel and diming from Apple.
>> Cristóbal
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of
>> Richard Turner
>> Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:34 AM
>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: RE: Apple getting cheap
>>
>> Apple says it is for the environment because most people have all the
>> chargers they need and more.
>> That is certainly  true in our household.
>> I happen to agree with Apple in this case.
>> We have enough (Expletive deleted) stuff in the landfills and ocean now to
>> last many life times.
>>
>>
>>
>> Richard
>> "The highest reward for a person's toil is not what they get for it, but
>> what they become by it."
>> - John Ruskin, 1819-1900
>>
>> Web site: www.turner42.com
>>
>>
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of
>> Mich Verrier
>> Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:30 AM
>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: RE: Apple getting cheapq
>>
>> From what I herd apple is not shipping any of there phones with chargers
>> since they want you to buy them seppritley since you have to remember that
>> apple's main thing is to make money. O shure apple has dun good for the
>> blind and vi comunidey with voice over and stuff how ever you have to
>> remember that the mane objective for apple is to make more money. From
>> Mich.
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of
>> Maria Campbell
>> Sent: April 15, 2021 1:27 PM
>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: Apple getting cheapq
>>
>> My SE2020 didn't even come with a C charger.  How cheap is that
>> considering it's so proprietary?  It came with the C cord but not the
>> charger.
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Maria Campbell
>> lucky1i...@gmail.com
>>
>> All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do
>> nothing.
>> --Edmund Burke
>>
>> --
>> The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone
>> list.
>>
>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or
>> if you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the
>> owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>>
>> Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor.  Mark can be reached at:
>> mk...@ucla.edu.  Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at
>> caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>>
>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mail-archive.com%2Fviphone%40googlegroups.com%2Fdata=04%7C01%7C%7C92f26482288949021c7008d900342262%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C637541046174440862%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000sdata=mwTIEcrmdoXefSDRuVnNudQuRo8dXSTYCEHkPHBPzEk%3Dreserved=0
>> ---
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
>> "VIPhone" group.
>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
>> email to viphone+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
>> To view this discussion on the web visit
>> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgroups.google.com%2Fd%2Fmsgid%2Fviphone%2F6c1ea5dc-1d49-4d62-4834-09ef735c8ad9%2540gmail.comdata=04%7C01%7C%7C92f26482288949021c7008d900342262%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C637541046174440862%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000sdata=SZkmieAC3UZER0NUTKo0VWfQydiZgpXG3e80pzq8dsg%3Dreserved=0.
>>
>> --
>> The following information is important for all members 

Re: Apple getting cheap

[Mary Otten]

Apparently others are following an apples lead. I believe I saw where Samsung 
is dropping the chargers as well. It was either them or Google with their 
pixels. Maybe they are being cheap. But we just don’t need all this extra crap 
going out into the environment. I have an iPad charger from a really old iPad 
mini that still works just fine. And of course I have a couple of iPhone 
chargers and a USB see power block which I think cost me all of eight bucks. It 
didn’t exactly break the bank.


Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 15, 2021, at 10:54 AM, Cristóbal Muñoz  wrote:
> 
> I mean... I do believe it's a good thing that more plastic and accessories 
> like that aren't being put out into the world, but I also definitely think 
> that Apple's being cheap. More like a convenient and specious excuse for them 
> to remove an item and cut the cost of production and logistics and still 
> charge the same under the cover of being environmentally conscious. 
> Either way though, it's not like not having the charger included is going to 
> be a make or break decision for anyone who was thinking of buying an iPhone. 
> Just more nickel and diming from Apple. 
> Cristóbal
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of 
> Richard Turner
> Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:34 AM
> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
> Subject: RE: Apple getting cheap
> 
> Apple says it is for the environment because most people have all the 
> chargers they need and more.
> That is certainly  true in our household.
> I happen to agree with Apple in this case.
> We have enough (Expletive deleted) stuff in the landfills and ocean now to 
> last many life times.
> 
> 
> 
> Richard
> "The highest reward for a person's toil is not what they get for it, but what 
> they become by it."
> - John Ruskin, 1819-1900
> 
> Web site: www.turner42.com
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of Mich 
> Verrier
> Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:30 AM
> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
> Subject: RE: Apple getting cheapq
> 
> From what I herd apple is not shipping any of there phones with chargers 
> since they want you to buy them seppritley since you have to remember that 
> apple's main thing is to make money. O shure apple has dun good for the blind 
> and vi comunidey with voice over and stuff how ever you have to remember that 
> the mane objective for apple is to make more money. From Mich.
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of Maria 
> Campbell
> Sent: April 15, 2021 1:27 PM
> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Apple getting cheapq
> 
> My SE2020 didn't even come with a C charger.  How cheap is that considering 
> it's so proprietary?  It came with the C cord but not the charger.
> 
> 
> 
> --
> Maria Campbell
> lucky1i...@gmail.com
> 
> All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing.
> --Edmund Burke
> 
> --
> The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone list.
> 
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
> 
> Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor.  Mark can be reached at:  
> mk...@ucla.edu.  Your list owner is Cara Quinn - you can reach Cara at 
> caraqu...@caraquinn.com
> 
> The archives for this list can be searched at:
> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mail-archive.com%2Fviphone%40googlegroups.com%2Fdata=04%7C01%7C%7C92f26482288949021c7008d900342262%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C637541046174440862%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000sdata=mwTIEcrmdoXefSDRuVnNudQuRo8dXSTYCEHkPHBPzEk%3Dreserved=0
> ---
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "VIPhone" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
> email to viphone+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
> To view this discussion on the web visit 
> https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgroups.google.com%2Fd%2Fmsgid%2Fviphone%2F6c1ea5dc-1d49-4d62-4834-09ef735c8ad9%2540gmail.comdata=04%7C01%7C%7C92f26482288949021c7008d900342262%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435%7C1%7C0%7C637541046174440862%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000sdata=SZkmieAC3UZER0NUTKo0VWfQydiZgpXG3e80pzq8dsg%3Dreserved=0.
> 
> --
> The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone list.
> 
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
> 
> Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor.  Mark can be reached at:  
> mk...@ucla.edu. 

RE: Apple getting cheap

[Cristóbal Muñoz]

I mean... I do believe it's a good thing that more plastic and accessories like 
that aren't being put out into the world, but I also definitely think that 
Apple's being cheap. More like a convenient and specious excuse for them to 
remove an item and cut the cost of production and logistics and still charge 
the same under the cover of being environmentally conscious. 
Either way though, it's not like not having the charger included is going to be 
a make or break decision for anyone who was thinking of buying an iPhone. Just 
more nickel and diming from Apple. 
Cristóbal

-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of Richard 
Turner
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:34 AM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: Apple getting cheap

Apple says it is for the environment because most people have all the chargers 
they need and more.
That is certainly  true in our household.
I happen to agree with Apple in this case.
We have enough (Expletive deleted) stuff in the landfills and ocean now to last 
many life times.
 


Richard
"The highest reward for a person's toil is not what they get for it, but what 
they become by it."
- John Ruskin, 1819-1900

Web site: www.turner42.com



-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of Mich 
Verrier
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:30 AM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: Apple getting cheapq

>From what I herd apple is not shipping any of there phones with chargers since 
>they want you to buy them seppritley since you have to remember that apple's 
>main thing is to make money. O shure apple has dun good for the blind and vi 
>comunidey with voice over and stuff how ever you have to remember that the 
>mane objective for apple is to make more money. From Mich.

-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of Maria 
Campbell
Sent: April 15, 2021 1:27 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Apple getting cheapq

My SE2020 didn't even come with a C charger.  How cheap is that considering 
it's so proprietary?  It came with the C cord but not the charger.



--
Maria Campbell
lucky1i...@gmail.com

All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing.
--Edmund Burke

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RE: Apple getting cheap

[bentleyj1952]

Hi Maria ,

This seems to becoming common place with a lot of different products that I 
have purchased lately.

I am guessing that so many people have an abundance of chargers laying around 
that it is no longer necessary to include an AC  charger.

If a person does not have a spare charger laying around, then, this is a major 
bummer.

In my case, I am glad that my SE 2020 did not come with a charger because I 
would have had to pay more for the phone to get a charger.  No charges for 
accessories are paid for by the manufacturer.  The additional cost are always 
absorbed by the purchaser which means higher prices.

Amazon is an excellent place to find a multitude of different types of 
chargers.  Some even have surge protection, multiple USB ports, and even 
multiple AC outlets.  Just make sure that it is Apple certified.

Regards,

James B  

-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of Maria 
Campbell
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 12:27 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Apple getting cheapq

My SE2020 didn't even come with a C charger.  How cheap is that 
considering it's so proprietary?  It came with the C cord but not the 
charger.



-- 
Maria Campbell
lucky1i...@gmail.com

All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing.
--Edmund Burke

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Re: Apple getting cheapq

['Mervin Keck III' via VIPhone]

At first I felt like Apple was being cheap. Then I looked around and realized I 
didn’t use the charging blocks I had here anyway. I use an old computer with a 
hub as a charging station for all types of devices including my watch, phone, 
and sometimes my iPad. I’ve got several of those bricks lying around gathering 
dust just in case. But haven’t used them in years. And I have four batteries 
and a JBL Boombox with two 20,000 MA ports on it that I keep charged that will 
keep me going for days in the event of a power outage. So the bricks are exacly 
as Apple says. Just future land fill or most likely recycle for electronic 
recycle day.
Merv


> On Apr 15, 2021, at 1:28 PM, Richard Turner  
> wrote:
> 
> Apple figures everyone has extra charging blocks from all their devices so 
> the environment doesn't need millions more for the landfills or that will end 
> up in the ocean.
> 
> BTW, USBC is not Apple's, it is universal; the lightning plug/ports are 
> Apple's exclusively.
> 
> 
> 
> Richard
> "The highest reward for a person's toil is not what they get for it, but what 
> they become by it."
> - John Ruskin, 1819-1900
> 
> Web site: www.turner42.com
> 
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of Maria 
> Campbell
> Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:27 AM
> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Apple getting cheapq
> 
> My SE2020 didn't even come with a C charger.  How cheap is that considering 
> it's so proprietary?  It came with the C cord but not the charger.
> 
> 
> 
> --
> Maria Campbell
> lucky1i...@gmail.com
> 
> All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing.
> --Edmund Burke
> 
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To 

RE: Apple getting cheap

[Richard Turner]

Apple says it is for the environment because most people have all the chargers 
they need and more.
That is certainly  true in our household.
I happen to agree with Apple in this case.
We have enough (Expletive deleted) stuff in the landfills and ocean now to last 
many life times.
 


Richard
"The highest reward for a person's toil is not what they get for it, but what 
they become by it."
- John Ruskin, 1819-1900

Web site: www.turner42.com



-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of Mich 
Verrier
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:30 AM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: Apple getting cheapq

>From what I herd apple is not shipping any of there phones with chargers since 
>they want you to buy them seppritley since you have to remember that apple's 
>main thing is to make money. O shure apple has dun good for the blind and vi 
>comunidey with voice over and stuff how ever you have to remember that the 
>mane objective for apple is to make more money. From Mich.

-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of Maria 
Campbell
Sent: April 15, 2021 1:27 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Apple getting cheapq

My SE2020 didn't even come with a C charger.  How cheap is that considering 
it's so proprietary?  It came with the C cord but not the charger.



--
Maria Campbell
lucky1i...@gmail.com

All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing.
--Edmund Burke

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RE: Apple getting cheapq

[Mich Verrier]

>From what I herd apple is not shipping any of there phones with chargers since 
>they want you to buy them seppritley since you have to remember that apple's 
>main thing is to make money. O shure apple has dun good for the blind and vi 
>comunidey with voice over and stuff how ever you have to remember that the 
>mane objective for apple is to make more money. From Mich.

-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of Maria 
Campbell
Sent: April 15, 2021 1:27 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Apple getting cheapq

My SE2020 didn't even come with a C charger.  How cheap is that 
considering it's so proprietary?  It came with the C cord but not the 
charger.



-- 
Maria Campbell
lucky1i...@gmail.com

All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing.
--Edmund Burke

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RE: Apple getting cheapq

[Richard Turner]

Apple figures everyone has extra charging blocks from all their devices so the 
environment doesn't need millions more for the landfills or that will end up in 
the ocean.

BTW, USBC is not Apple's, it is universal; the lightning plug/ports are Apple's 
exclusively.



Richard
"The highest reward for a person's toil is not what they get for it, but what 
they become by it."
- John Ruskin, 1819-1900

Web site: www.turner42.com



-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of Maria 
Campbell
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:27 AM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Apple getting cheapq

My SE2020 didn't even come with a C charger.  How cheap is that considering 
it's so proprietary?  It came with the C cord but not the charger.



--
Maria Campbell
lucky1i...@gmail.com

All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing.
--Edmund Burke

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Apple getting cheapq

[Maria Campbell]

My SE2020 didn't even come with a C charger.  How cheap is that 
considering it's so proprietary?  It came with the C cord but not the 
charger.




--
Maria Campbell
lucky1i...@gmail.com

All that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good people to do nothing.
--Edmund Burke

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Re: Mac OS Big Sur 11.2.3, dock menu

[Anna Dresner]

Hi Juan,

I just looked at my dock, and it seems to have pretty much every app I ever 
run, so apps may be added when you run them without your having to do anything. 
You can get to whatever options are available, however, by pressing 
VO-Command-Space anytime voiceOver tells you actions are available. Then press 
VO-Down Arrow to move through the choices and VO-Space to activate the current 
choice. This works in Notification Center (which you get to with VO-O) and many 
other places.

Best,
Anna


> On Apr 14, 2021, at 3:39 AM, Juan Hernandez  wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> I just got a new Mac mini w/ Mac OS Big Sur.  On my old Mac with Mac OS X 
> 10.15 I used to be able to go to running apps on the dock, and do vo+shift+m 
> to bring up the context menu, and then from there say to keep the app 
> shortcut on the dock when it wasn’t running that way I could run it from 
> there.   This no longer works, so how do I it?
> 
> Any help will be greatly appreciated.
> 
> Best,
> 
> Juan
> 
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RE: Issues in iOS 14.4 that you are hoping are fixed in 14.5

[Star Gazer]

Thank you 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Richard Turner
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 10:28 AM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Issues in iOS 14.4 that you are hoping are fixed in 14.5

All done. 

Richard 


Software means never having to say you're finished 



On Apr 15, 2021, at 6:41 AM, Star Gazer  wrote:
•  I’ve Googled and apparently the Iphone 12 mini (and this seems unique to the 
Iphone 12 though I don’t know if it is unique to only the mini is that it no 
longer charges wirelessly. It charges for a minute (and I mean that literally) 
then stops. I’d like that fixed. 
•  I’d also like to have voiceover come over the phone speaker and audio 
through a speaker when paired to Bluetooth. 
•  For example, I’d like to be able to listen to a caps game over my Bluetooth 
speaker and say all kinds of things over text about the game and have that be 
displayed if you will on my phone. 
•  I’d like the default to be where voiceover is displayed on the Iphone 
speaker instead of being picked up by Bluetooth with the rest of the audio. 
•  This is an ongoing issue since my last Iphone, an Iphonex I think. 
•  -- 
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Re: Issues in iOS 14.4 that you are hoping are fixed in 14.5

[Richard Turner]

All done.


Richard


Software means never having to say you're finished


On Apr 15, 2021, at 6:41 AM, Star Gazer  wrote:

  *   I’ve Googled and apparently the Iphone 12 mini (and this seems unique to 
the Iphone 12 though I don’t know if it is unique to only the mini is that it 
no longer charges wirelessly. It charges for a minute (and I mean that 
literally) then stops. I’d like that fixed.
  *   I’d also like to have voiceover come over the phone speaker and audio 
through a speaker when paired to Bluetooth.
  *   For example, I’d like to be able to listen to a caps game over my 
Bluetooth speaker and say all kinds of things over text about the game and have 
that be displayed if you will on my phone.
  *   I’d like the default to be where voiceover is displayed on the Iphone 
speaker instead of being picked up by Bluetooth with the rest of the audio.
  *   This is an ongoing issue since my last Iphone, an Iphonex I think.
  *

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Re: Issues in iOS 14.4 that you are hoping are fixed in 14.5

[Star Gazer]

Please submit it Richard. I see in audio settings under the roder something 
that looks like you should be able to display voiceover on the phone though at 
this point it is only a decoration 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 15, 2021, at 09:50, Richard Turner  wrote:
> 
> 
> I have no position whatsoever.
> But, I can submit your feedback through the beta feedback program as feature 
> requests.
> I know that lots of people would prefer VoiceOver to stay on the phone when 
> connected to a Bluetooth speaker.
> The problem I see there is if you are using Bluetooth headphones, you want 
> VoiceOver in your headphones, right?
> I’m not sure it is smart enough to be able to separate the two.
>  
> I have an extra old SE that I am using with the beta so I can submit feedback 
> for what it is worth.
> You should also send that list to accessibil...@apple.com and go to 
> www.apple.com/feedback and submit it under iPhone feedback.
>  
> HTH,
>  
> Richard
> "The highest reward for a person's toil is not what they get for it, but what 
> they become by it."
> 
> - John Ruskin, 1819-1900
> 
>  
> Web site: www.turner42.com
>  
>  
>  
> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of Star 
> Gazer
> Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 6:42 AM
> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
> Subject: RE: Issues in iOS 14.4 that you are hoping are fixed in 14.5
>  
> Hi Richard,
> Are you in a position to fix or communicate fixes?
> Not asking to be snarky, but I have a few.
> I’ve Googled and apparently the Iphone 12 mini (and this seems unique to the 
> Iphone 12 though I don’t know if it is unique to only the mini is that it no 
> longer charges wirelessly. It charges for a minute (and I mean that 
> literally) then stops. I’d like that fixed.
> I’d also like to have voiceover come over the phone speaker and audio through 
> a speaker when paired to Bluetooth.
> For example, I’d like to be able to listen to a caps game over my Bluetooth 
> speaker and say all kinds of things over text about the game and have that be 
> displayed if you will on my phone.
> I’d like the default to be where voiceover is displayed on the Iphone speaker 
> instead of being picked up by Bluetooth with the rest of the audio.
> This is an ongoing issue since my last Iphone, an Iphonex I think.
>  
>  
> Sent from Mail for Windows 10
>  
> From: Richard Turner
> Sent: Wednesday, April 14, 2021 5:54 PM
> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Issues in iOS 14.4 that you are hoping are fixed in 14.5
>  
> Hello all,
> Could you remind me of what issues people are hoping to have fixed in iOS 
> 14.5?
> I’ve been concentrating on several different braille devices and fallen 
> behind on keeping up with issues, and since I suspect 14.5 is close to 
> happening, could you refresh my memory?
>  
> I know message threading focus is a big one … but that isn’t all, I’m sure.
>  
> Thanks,
>  
>  
> Richard
> "The highest reward for a person's toil is not what they get for it, but what 
> they become by it."
> 
> - John Ruskin, 1819-1900
> 
>  
> Web site: www.turner42.com
>  
>  
>  
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>  
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RE: Issues in iOS 14.4 that you are hoping are fixed in 14.5

[Richard Turner]

I have no position whatsoever.
But, I can submit your feedback through the beta feedback program as feature 
requests.
I know that lots of people would prefer VoiceOver to stay on the phone when 
connected to a Bluetooth speaker.
The problem I see there is if you are using Bluetooth headphones, you want 
VoiceOver in your headphones, right?
I'm not sure it is smart enough to be able to separate the two.

I have an extra old SE that I am using with the beta so I can submit feedback 
for what it is worth.
You should also send that list to 
accessibil...@apple.com and go to 
www.apple.com/feedback and submit it under 
iPhone feedback.

HTH,

Richard
"The highest reward for a person's toil is not what they get for it, but what 
they become by it."
- John Ruskin, 1819-1900

Web site: www.turner42.com



From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of Star 
Gazer
Sent: Thursday, April 15, 2021 6:42 AM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: Issues in iOS 14.4 that you are hoping are fixed in 14.5

Hi Richard,
Are you in a position to fix or communicate fixes?
Not asking to be snarky, but I have a few.

  1.  I've Googled and apparently the Iphone 12 mini (and this seems unique to 
the Iphone 12 though I don't know if it is unique to only the mini is that it 
no longer charges wirelessly. It charges for a minute (and I mean that 
literally) then stops. I'd like that fixed.
  2.  I'd also like to have voiceover come over the phone speaker and audio 
through a speaker when paired to Bluetooth.
  3.  For example, I'd like to be able to listen to a caps game over my 
Bluetooth speaker and say all kinds of things over text about the game and have 
that be displayed if you will on my phone.
  4.  I'd like the default to be where voiceover is displayed on the Iphone 
speaker instead of being picked up by Bluetooth with the rest of the audio.
  5.  This is an ongoing issue since my last Iphone, an Iphonex I think.
  6.

Sent from 
Mail
 for Windows 10

From: Richard Turner
Sent: Wednesday, April 14, 2021 5:54 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Issues in iOS 14.4 that you are hoping are fixed in 14.5

Hello all,
Could you remind me of what issues people are hoping to have fixed in iOS 14.5?
I've been concentrating on several different braille devices and fallen behind 
on keeping up with issues, and since I suspect 14.5 is close to happening, 
could you refresh my memory?

I know message threading focus is a big one ... but that isn't all, I'm sure.

Thanks,


Richard
"The highest reward for a person's toil is not what they get for it, but what 
they become by it."
- John Ruskin, 1819-1900

Web site: 
www.turner42.com



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RE: Issues in iOS 14.4 that you are hoping are fixed in 14.5

[Star Gazer]

Hi Richard, 
Are you in a position to fix or communicate fixes? 
Not asking to be snarky, but I have a few. 
1. I’ve Googled and apparently the Iphone 12 mini (and this seems unique to the 
Iphone 12 though I don’t know if it is unique to only the mini is that it no 
longer charges wirelessly. It charges for a minute (and I mean that literally) 
then stops. I’d like that fixed. 
2. I’d also like to have voiceover come over the phone speaker and audio 
through a speaker when paired to Bluetooth. 
3. For example, I’d like to be able to listen to a caps game over my Bluetooth 
speaker and say all kinds of things over text about the game and have that be 
displayed if you will on my phone. 
4. I’d like the default to be where voiceover is displayed on the Iphone 
speaker instead of being picked up by Bluetooth with the rest of the audio. 
5. This is an ongoing issue since my last Iphone, an Iphonex I think. 
6. 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Richard Turner
Sent: Wednesday, April 14, 2021 5:54 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: Issues in iOS 14.4 that you are hoping are fixed in 14.5

Hello all,
Could you remind me of what issues people are hoping to have fixed in iOS 14.5?
I’ve been concentrating on several different braille devices and fallen behind 
on keeping up with issues, and since I suspect 14.5 is close to happening, 
could you refresh my memory?

I know message threading focus is a big one … but that isn’t all, I’m sure.

Thanks,


Richard
"The highest reward for a person's toil is not what they get for it, but what 
they become by it."
- John Ruskin, 1819-1900

Web site: www.turner42.com



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RE: Aphone 12 questions

[Star Gazer]

So do I, the problem is that it charges for about a minute then stops. 

Sent from Mail for Windows 10

From: Carolyn
Sent: Wednesday, April 14, 2021 6:33 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: Aphone 12 questions

Yes, you have to place the phone just so in order to get a charge from a 
wireless charger. I check mine to hear it say charging. 

-Original Message-
From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of 
Simon A Fogarty
Sent: Wednesday, April 14, 2021 6:02 PM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: Aphone 12 questions

Are you sure it’s not just sliding off the charging pad 

 

I get this happening with my 11pm sometimes,

 

From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of Star 
Gazer
Sent: Thursday, 15 April 2021 12:35 am
To: viphone@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: Aphone 12 questions

 

 

 

Sent from Mail   for Windows 10

 

From: Richard Turner    Hi everybody. 

I’ve got an Iphone 12 mini. 

First issue is that it doesn’t charge wirelessly.. everything else does except 
my phone. It will charge for a minute(andI mean that literally) then stop. 

Anybody know how to fix this? 

I’ve tried it with the case and without the case. I’ve tried it on all 3 of our 
wireless chargers. I’ve tried repositioning the phone. I’ve tried rebooting the 
phone. 

Too bad I can’t write like Dr. Seuss or I could turn this into a poem. 

Anybody know about this? 

Also, I like to listen to podcasts and hockey on a Bluetooth speaker. I’d love 
to have the audio content play through the speaker and the voiceover over the 
speaker on my phone. 

Can I do this? 


Sent: Wednesday, April 14, 2021 1:07 AM
To: viphone@googlegroups.com  
Subject: Re: At My Wits End With The Native Mail App On IOS 14.4.1

 

Yes, it is a problem especially with longer threads. 

I don't keep that many messages in one thread, but if a thread happens to have 
15 or 20 messages, I can experience that, so what I do is before opening the 
thread, flick up with one finger to expand thread.

Then, it lists them out separately so it is like not having threading on until 
you go back to the top of the group and fllick up to collapse thread and double 
tap.

HTH,

 

 

Richard 

"Great minds discuss ideas, average minds discuss events, small minds discuss 
people." -- Eleanor Roosevelt

 

www.turner42.com  

 

 

On Apr 13, 2021, at 9:11 PM, Maria Reyes mailto:sassyblindg...@gmail.com> > wrote:

nope you're not alone. this happens more with longer threads.

want to talk about all aspects of blindness? Join the blind chatroom 
list by sending an email to blind-chatroom-requ...@freelists.org 
  with subscribe in the subject 



On Apr 13, 2021, at 11:32 PM, Tom Lange mailto:lang...@gmail.com> > wrote:

 

Hi,

Excuse me while I vent, as I’ve become increasingly frustrated 
with the native IOS mail app.  I’ve been using iPhones since the iphone 4  came 
along in 2010 or 2011, and I’ve used Mail with my GMail account, which has been 
around since 2007.

Over the years there have always been focus issues in message 
lists, and when ovening message threads for the first time I will rarely land 
on message 1. Then, when opening a message in the thread and using the Messages 
item in the  rotor to move to the next message, I may get bounced back to a 
message that’s way earlier in the thread than the one that I intended to move 
to. For example, let’s say I’m on message 50 of 120 in the thread. I use 
Messages in the  rotor and select Next Message. In this example, I might get 
bounced back to Message 21. 

These are just a couple of situations that are frustrating me 
like crazy.

I could try the GMail app or Outlook for Ios, but I like the 
native mail app for the most part and am realy surprised that Apple hasn’t 
managed to make the damn thing behave. 

Surely I’m not the only one who’s having focus issues such as 
I’ve described above.

 

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Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com 
 

 

The archives for this list can be 

Re: At My Wits End With The Native Mail App On IOS 14.4.1

[Anthony Vece]

Open the draft and send it to yourself. When it arrives just delete it as you 
would delete any other email.

Sent from my Verizon iPhone 12 Pro!!!

> On Apr 14, 2021, at 11:54 PM, 'Simon Wong' via VIPhone 
>  wrote:
> 
> I wish something could be done when you cancel out of email you want to make 
> and you go to delete it it still shows up as a draft.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Apr 14, 2021, at 9:04 PM, Christopher Chaltain  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> You can just download it from the App Store. The direct URL is 
>> https://apps.apple.com/us/app/microsoft-outlook/id951937596
>> 
>> --
>> Christopher (AKA CJ)
>> Chaltain at Outlook
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of 
>> Carolyn
>> Sent: Wednesday, April 14, 2021 1:19 PM
>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: RE: At My Wits End With The Native Mail App On IOS 14.4.1
>> 
>> What do you do to download Outlook! I wouldn't know how to start, but it is 
>> the devil I know. 
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf 
>> Of Alan Lemly
>> Sent: Wednesday, April 14, 2021 1:30 PM
>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: Re: At My Wits End With The Native Mail App On IOS 14.4.1
>> 
>> I agree with Christopher. If I'm remembering correctly, the focus issue with 
>> the native Mail app started with some iteration of iOS 13. I started using 
>> Outlook for iOS then and am so glad I did. It doesn’t have the focus issues 
>> and I've used Outlook on my Windows desktop for years. I suggest you try 
>> Outlook for iOS. It's free so trying it is easy and you can decide whether 
>> the native Mail app is still preferable. I open the native Mail app from 
>> time to time to see if it's any better but quickly return to Outlook for iOS.
>> 
>> Alan Lemly  
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone with Outlook   for iOS 
>> 
>> 
>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  on behalf of 
>> Christopher Chaltain 
>> Sent: Wednesday, April 14, 2021 6:52:49 AM
>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com 
>> Subject: RE: At My Wits End With The Native Mail App On IOS 14.4.1 
>> 
>> I know it's already been mentioned, but this is why I switched to Outlook on 
>> my iPhones.
>> 
>> --
>> Christopher (AKA CJ)
>> Chaltain at Outlook
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of 
>> bentleyj1...@gmail.com
>> Sent: Wednesday, April 14, 2021 6:51 AM
>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: RE: At My Wits End With The Native Mail App On IOS 14.4.1
>> 
>> Hello,
>> 
>> Who is saying that the ScrollBar is the problem?
>> 
>> And, if that is the problem, why can't Apple make that optional.  I would 
>> much rather do without the ScrollBar if loosing my place in the giant fat 
>> middle of a long list of mail could be resolved.
>> 
>> Regards,
>> 
>> James B  
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of Donna 
>> Casteen
>> Sent: Tuesday, April 13, 2021 10:51 PM
>> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: Re: At My Wits End With The Native Mail App On IOS 14.4.1
>> 
>> You are not alone with your frustration with the mail app. The problem & 
>> cause of the hair pulling, & loud swearing, is the useless scrollbar!!! If 
>> Apple wants to keep it, because some people want the scrollbar, make it an 
>> option that can be selected or left alone in the depths of HE郎郎 for those of 
>> us that find the scrollbar a only a pain in the A郎郎! Oh, lets not forget the 
>> emails that won’t delete unless a magic trick is performed!郎郎
>> 
>> Donna
>> 
>>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> Excuse me while I vent, as I’ve become increasingly frustrated with the 
>>> native IOS mail app.  I’ve been using iPhones since the iphone 4  came 
>>> along in 2010 or 2011, and I’ve used Mail with my GMail account, which has 
>>> been around since 2007.
>>> Over the years there have always been focus issues in message lists, and 
>>> when ovening message threads for the first time I will rarely land on 
>>> message 1. Then, when opening a message in the thread and using the 
>>> Messages item in the  rotor to move to the next message, I may get bounced 
>>> back to a message that’s way earlier in the thread than the one that I 
>>> intended to move to. For example, let’s say I’m on message 50 of 120 in the 
>>> thread. I use Messages in the  rotor and select Next Message. In this 
>>> example, I might get bounced back to Message 21. 
>>> These are just a couple of situations that are frustrating me like crazy.
>>> I could try the GMail app or Outlook for Ios, but I like the native mail 
>>> app for the most part and am realy surprised that Apple hasn’t managed to 
>>> make the damn thing behave. 
>>> Surely I’m not the only one who’s having focus issues such as I’ve 
>>> described above.
>>> 
>>> --
>>> The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone list.
>>> 
>>> If you have any questions or concerns 

Re: Adjusting Vibration Strenghth in iPhone 12 Pro

[David Redman]

I’m experienced that iPhones going back to iPhone 4. On my 12 pro max I have 
literally done this gesture hundreds of times with voiceover on and it does not 
work. I feel like Apple is not telling us something. I suggest going in and 
enabling the back tap method for abs switcher and for closing an app. I’m sure 
this works for earlier phones as others that I know who are blind are able to 
do it. I’m just talking about the 12 pro and 12 Pro Max phones.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 14, 2021, at 4:20 PM, Mr. Ed  wrote:
> 
> Hi,
> Make sure when you swipe up from the bottom to open your iPhone go up 
> straight with your finger and not at an angle. I am guessing this is the 
> issue for a lot of blind people not swiping up straight with their finger.
> Mr. Ed
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of 
> Carolyn
> Sent: Wednesday, April 14, 2021 5:35 PM
> To: viphone@googlegroups.com
> Subject: RE: Adjusting Vibration Strenghth in iPhone 12 Pro
> 
> Lisa, I think you'll get used to it with practice. You'll get a spatial feel 
> for the screen, and that should make a big difference. 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of 
> Lisa Belville
> Sent: Wednesday, April 14, 2021 6:12 PM
> To: viphone@googlegroups.com; Richard Turner 
> Subject: Re: Adjusting Vibration Strenghth in iPhone 12 Pro
> 
> Hi, Richard.  I knew it was there somewhere.  I did find it and it was set 
> already at 100%.  I'm Okay if I can hear the little popping sound the phone 
> makes when my finger is in the right spot to swipe up, and I can feel 
> vibrations when I swipe, but I don't feel anything that actually tells me 
> where to swipe.  Very frustrating because it's there and people can see me 
> trying to unlock my phone and failing miserably for a few times before 
> getting it right.  
> 
> Lisa Belville
> missktlab1...@frontier.com
> 
>> On 4/14/2021 2:54 PM, Richard Turner wrote:
>> Hi Lisa,
>> Go to the VoiceOver Settings, Audio, Sounds and Haptics, and flick right 
>> until you get to the haptic intensity.
>> 
>> HTH,
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Richard
>> "The highest reward for a person's toil is not what they get for it, but 
>> what they become by it."
>> - John Ruskin, 1819-1900
>> 
>> Web site: www.turner42.com
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: viphone@googlegroups.com  On Behalf Of 
>> Lisa Belville
>> Sent: Wednesday, April 14, 2021 12:52 PM
>> To: V I Phone 
>> Subject: Adjusting Vibration Strenghth in iPhone 12 Pro
>> 
>> Hi, all.
>> 
>> 
>> I just got my new phone set up and so far, I'm able to do things as before.  
>> The issue I'm having involves feeling the vibrations I need in order to 
>> unlock the phone, access the app switcher, etc.
>> 
>> 
>> I seem to remember a discussion on this list regarding changing the force or 
>> strength of the haptic feedback.  I can find vibrations in the sounds and 
>> haptics, but this seems to apply to the ringer and to notifications.  I 
>> thought it was somewhere in accessibility, but if it is, I cannot find 
>> anything that would apply.
>> 
>> 
>> All help would be appreciated.
>> 
>> 
>> Lisa
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> Lisa Belville
>> missktlab1...@frontier.com
>> 
>> --
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>> 
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>> %7C0%7C637540267048706053%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAi
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> 
> --
> 

Re: Mac OS Big Sur 11.2.3, dock menu

[kliph miller Sr]

There are a couple work arounds.  Some say you can hold down the control key, 
push on the track pad, and the context menu comes up an you can do it this way. 
 The way I have gotten it to work is.
1. Vo shift m, go to option, go to remove from dock, but don’t press it. 
2. Command tab away from it, command back, it will say finder but no worries it 
is still on the remove from dock option. Hit enter, and you should hear, the 
sound that it has been removed from dock. HTH

Are you good at editing audio or want to learn how? Want to explore all the 
options on how to make your recordings for podcasts or other files sound good? 
Then audio editing101 is the group for you, join here
audio-editing101+subscr...@groups.io
 Even explore my Tutorials 

 and SoundEffects Folder 

 to receive updated resources
Let’s master editing audio together!

> On Apr 14, 2021, at 3:39 AM, Juan Hernandez  wrote:
> 
> Hi all,
> 
> I just got a new Mac mini w/ Mac OS Big Sur.  On my old Mac with Mac OS X 
> 10.15 I used to be able to go to running apps on the dock, and do vo+shift+m 
> to bring up the context menu, and then from there say to keep the app 
> shortcut on the dock when it wasn’t running that way I could run it from 
> there.   This no longer works, so how do I it?
> 
> Any help will be greatly appreciated.
> 
> Best,
> 
> Juan
> 
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>  
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> .

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Re: Mac OS Big Sur and punctuation settings

[kliph miller Sr]

You should be able to set this up in VoiceOver utility, under activity.
New to the Mac, transitioning from a PC, need extra help, struggle with certain 
apps and features, or just want to brush up on your Skills? Then the macCafe is 
the place to be! We meet every 1st&3rd Monday of the month at 10:00AM central 
to discuss basics, hints and tricks on learning our MacOS in To get more 
info, send an email to
sturi...@icloud.com
 Put MacCafe in the Subject-line and you will 
receive info on how to join this great resource of information!
Also subscribe to our youTube page 
 for audio tutorials, and 
live streaming of workshops.

> On Apr 15, 2021, at 1:02 AM, Juan Hernandez  wrote:
> 
> Hi All,
> 
> I have come home! I have been away from the Mac world for a couple years, and 
> I just bought a Mac mini m1.  And I am loving it.  It has come far since I 
> remember Mac OS X a few years ago.
> 
> The reason I am on the Mac the majority of the time is that I’m doing doing 
> development in Xcode and doing Mac/iOS development.
> 
> I wanted to know, is it possible to enable all punctuation in a single 
> application? Lie a application specific setting?
> 
> If not, can I set the punctuation google with a hotkey so I can toggle it 
> when I need it?
> 
> And last but not least, in the same vane, on my iPhone I can add the 
> punctuation option to the VoiceOver rotor  so I can just change it via 
> ctrl+opt+cmd+[left/right/up/down arrows] ???
> 
> Any advise would be greatly appreciated.
> 
> Best,
> 
> Juan
> 
> 
> -- 
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> 
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> 
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> 
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Re: A Google Search Question

[Richard Turner]

 I'm not sure if you did anything because I use Duckduckgo as my search engine.
Much cleaner responses and no tracking.
I have not used Google for a long time.
You still get ads, but I get better results than when I used google.



Richard
"Great minds discuss ideas, average minds discuss events, small minds discuss 
people." -- Eleanor Roosevelt

www.turner42.com


On Apr 15, 2021, at 2:07 AM, Arnold Schmidt  wrote:

Recently, when I search for something either from Safari, google being my 
designated search engine,  or the google search app, rather than answering my 
question, after a bunch of adds, it wants me to add my question to the web, so 
that publishers can answer it. What have I done so that google won't answer my 
question? Thanks in advance for any information.

Arnold Schmidt


Sent from  Arnold's  iPhone S E 2

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A Google Search Question

[Arnold Schmidt]

Recently, when I search for something either from Safari, google being my 
designated search engine,  or the google search app, rather than answering my 
question, after a bunch of adds, it wants me to add my question to the web, so 
that publishers can answer it. What have I done so that google won't answer my 
question? Thanks in advance for any information. 

Arnold Schmidt 


Sent from  Arnold's  iPhone S E 2

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Mac OS Big Sur and punctuation settings

[Juan Hernandez]

Hi All,

I have come home! I have been away from the Mac world for a couple years, and I 
just bought a Mac mini m1.  And I am loving it.  It has come far since I 
remember Mac OS X a few years ago.

The reason I am on the Mac the majority of the time is that I’m doing doing 
development in Xcode and doing Mac/iOS development.

I wanted to know, is it possible to enable all punctuation in a single 
application? Lie a application specific setting?

If not, can I set the punctuation google with a hotkey so I can toggle it when 
I need it?

And last but not least, in the same vane, on my iPhone I can add the 
punctuation option to the VoiceOver rotor  so I can just change it via 
ctrl+opt+cmd+[left/right/up/down arrows] ???

Any advise would be greatly appreciated.

Best,

Juan
 

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