date:20130212



On Feb 11, 2013, at 9:48 PM, Eric Walker wrote:

On Mon, Feb 11, 2013 at 8:29 PM, Edmund Storms  
stor...@ix.netcom.com wrote:


In either case, the deuteron does not move.  The energy goes into  
the electron that is ejected well away from the atom. When it  
returns, a 20 keV photon is emitted. This process only involves the  
electron.  The process is well known and not a subject for debate.


This is where you and Ron disagree.  He's saying that the math  
allows for the K-shell hole decay to dump its energy directly to a  
nearby deuteron, bypassing the electron altogether.  Beyond that,  
he's saying that the math of the system indicates that the transfer  
of energy (via electrostatic repulsion) would be *preferentially*  
imparted to the deuteron rather than an electron, such that this  
would be the main form of decay of the K-shell hole when a deuteron  
is in close vicinity.


Of course, math can prove anything, Eric. However, this is not the way  
such systems are known to behave.  I know that people like to propose  
anything they can imagine because they think CF has no rules, so they  
are free to suggest any idea. But CF plays by the same rules as  
everything else.


This being a fact, I assumed Maimon was proposing that the process  
affected the barrier because otherwise the idea is nonsense.


I personally am not qualified to judge whether what Ron is saying is  
nonsense.  I gather from his interactions with others on  
physics.stackexchange.com, which has some pretty smart people on  
it,  and his overall reputation there, that he knows at least the  
basics of what he's talking about.


He may understand math but he obviously does not understand the basic  
physics of electron behavior.


As for what happens next, a fusion reaction MUST get rid of the  
energy in a way that is consistent with conservation of momentum.  
This process seems not to be understood by several of people who are  
discussing the idea. The mechanism proposed by Maimon has only one  
way to do this, i.e. by the hot fusion process.


Ron is conserving momentum in his reaction.  He's saying that the  
energy of the fusion is shared between the daughter alpha and the  
spectator palladium atom, because the fusion happens so close the  
the palladium nucleus.  (This also obviates the emission of the  
gamma photon.)


The only way 23 MeV can be communicated to separate particles is  
within the nucleus. No force great enough exists between the Pd and  
the He to communicate this amount of energy. In addition, the energy  
is contained initially in the He as extra mass. This energy has to be  
released first before it can appear as reaction energy, i.e. affect  
the motion of other particles.  He is imagining features of Nature  
that simply do not exist.


Either the energy is dissipated as fragments of He (hot fusion) or  
as a new process that leaves the He without any energy in any form,  
neither kinetic or that released by gamma emission.  Maimon does not  
address this issue, he just makes an assumption.


Ron's saying that the fusion results in a daughter 4He and 24 MeV of  
energy.  The resulting energy is shared between the daughter alpha  
and the spectator palladium nucleus.


There is no alpha. The helium CAN NOT MOVE spontaneously. The helium  
contains extra energy as mass. This mass must be converted to energy  
before it can appear as reaction energy. The He is fixed in space.  
Normally the He nucleus explodes into fragments producing hot fusion.  
Or it emits a gamma which releases the mass-energy. This conversion  
CAN NOT OCCUR outside of the nucleus simply by being near a Pd.


This conversion process is the great mystery of CF and it needs to be  
explained much more cleverly than Ron imagines.  I say this with  
certainty because I have studied chemistry and physics for 60 years  
and also know exactly what has been observed about CF. I'm very open  
to new ideas but they must not conflict with 200 years of scientific  
understanding.  In addition, I do not have the time to explain to  
someone all the reasons why what I say is true, which would be a waste  
of time anyway. Rob needs to take my advice and study the subject in  
greater depth on his own.


The alpha races through the lattice, causing the ejection of a  
portion of palladium K-shell electrons as it goes, and the palladium  
atom that was in the vicinity of the fusion gains a significant  
amount kinetic energy.


The He cannot move unless another particle is involved with its  
motion. This is like saying billiard ball could suddenly start to move  
on its own without involving another ball. This is where he ignores  
conservation of momentum.



Ed


I'm not saying any of this is true -- just trying to ensure that the  
details are understood so that a sharp critique can be prepared.   
Part of the difficulty here is that I'm just a beginner when it  
comes to physics.  I should let Ron speak in his own words; his

Re: [Vo]:Bose Einstein Condensate formed at Room Temperature



On Feb 11, 2013, at 11:06 PM, Chuck Sites wrote:

Hi Ed.  Again sorry for the delayed response and right now all I can  
give is a quick response.


Kim's theory is interesting as it's been refined more and more  
towards effects at the nano-scale and he's also incorporating proton  
descriptions that may allow his theory to describe H in Ni.  Kim's  
work is some of the best I've read.


Chuck, have you read my explanation? I'm able to describe all  
observations using internally consist logic and very few assumptions.  
In addition, I predict that the H-Ni reaction is not the source of  
energy being claimed by Rossi et al. Any theory that attempts to  
justify the H-Ni reaction as the source of claimed energy is open to  
test because, if I'm right, such a theory is useless because it  
predicts something that does not happen. I predict deuterium is the  
source of heat based on a mechanism that also explains all other  
reactions.  I'm waiting patiently for the necessary measurements to be  
made.


As for my theory, I find that most people do not understand what I'm  
actually describing. They superimpose their own ideas with great  
confidence rather than understand what I describe even though I try to  
be very clear. Consequently, I have been writing a series of papers in  
an attempt to keep up with the confusion and explain what I'm actually  
proposing.


But H/D in Metals really follow physics of solid state just with  
opposite charge and heavier weights. For that reason the Chubbs'   
seems very plausible.


Chubb proposes mass-wave conversion within the lattice. This  
phenomenon has only been proposed as a mathematical method to explain  
very weak processes. The idea is hard to justify being the cause of a  
nuclear reaction and it does not predict all that is observed.


If you don't think the wave function overlap is important to the  
fusion processes, I think you need to consider what the Gamow factor  
is based on.  It's the quantum wave function that describes how two  
particles can interact strongly through the Coulomb barrier.   It's  
the Gamow factor that really makes the BEC's so interesting.


The Gamow equation only provides a relationship between distance and  
the force being created by a charge.  It says nothing about what  
creates the charge or how it can be overcome except by applying an  
opposite force.  The term quantum wave function only identifies a  
mathematical tool, not anything real. People act as if wave functions  
were real rather than a method to apply a mathematical concept based  
on a series of assumptions


 Even in your Nuclear active sites, suppression of Coulomb barrier  
has to occur, and an n-body interactions has to occur.


Yes, but I propose a process that can do this in increments. I agree,  
this process is where the hole in knowledge is located which everyone  
is trying to fill different ways.


I understand Kim's theory and I also understand the Chubbs' theory.   
What makes the Active Nuclear sites a better theory (or concept)  
than that of a nuclear active BEC in metal?


The NAE is consistent with observation while the other concepts are  
not. I explain this assertion in my papers, so I don't need to waste  
our time doing it here.


Ed



Best Regards,
Chuck

On Sun, Feb 10, 2013 at 4:41 PM, Edmund Storms  
stor...@ix.netcom.com wrote:
Chuck, we have three separate and independent questions here. First,  
can a BEC based on atoms form in a lattice at room temperature. In  
spite of Kim, theory says this is not possible. Second, can such a  
cluster lead to fusion?  My answer is NO because the nuclear charge  
is not eliminated by forming a BEC. Yes, wave functions can overlay,  
but this is essentially a chemical process that would not affect the  
nucleus because too little energy is involved. Third, will the  
resulting fusion reaction produce hot fusion or cold fusion? My  
answer is that hot fusion must result because no part of the process  
can dissipate the energy before fusion takes place.  It is not  
enough to just throw out an idea with a little math and claim this  
explains anything. The entire process must be described in a  
logically connected way.


My theory attempts to do this. Yes, some previous ideas might be  
applied, but only as PART of the process.


Ed

On Feb 10, 2013, at 2:07 PM, Chuck Sites wrote:


HI Ed,

I think it is apparent that a BEC in it's normal sense with  
temps at near absolute zero is out of the question as you note.   
There are too many problems like the coupling of the lattice to the  
fusion reaction.  Still if you review Kim's several presentations  
over the years he has developed a consistent and testable  
theoretical frame work for a N-body mechanism of cold fusion at and  
above room temperatures.  I've always thought the physics was  
intriguing regardless of the nuclear aspects, that a condensate  
deuterium ions (or positive Bose ions or even virtual integer spin

Re: [Vo]:Bose Einstein Condensate formed at Room Temperature

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spaser

The Spaser

The negatively charged quasiparticle called a Plasmons is being produced on
the nano-surfaced micro-particles used in both the Rossi and DGT reactors.
First, surface plasmons are bosons: they are vector excitations and have
spin 1, just as photons do.

These electrons are forming condensates which amplify their wave function
as they become entangled. Their localization at lattice defects defines the
nuclear active areas where LENR occurs.

A spaser is the nanoplasmonic counterpart of a laser, but it (ideally) does
not emit photons. It is analogous to the conventional laser, but in a
spaser photons are replaced by surface plasmons and the resonant cavity is
replaced by a nanoparticle, which supports the plasmonic modes. Similarly
to a laser, the energy source for the Spasing mechanism is an active (gain)
medium that is excited externally. The LENR reaction provides this
excitation.

This spacer accomplishes two functions; it’s entangled and amplified wave
function catalyzes fusion by lowering the coulomb barrier of atoms at and
near the lattice defect and then it down converts and transfers this fusion
gamma energy from the nucleus into the lattice of the micro particle as
infrared radiation.




Cheers:   Axil

On Fri, Feb 8, 2013 at 9:02 PM, Kevin O'Malley kevmol...@gmail.com wrote:

 Hello Vorts:
 See below for confirmation from YE Kim that the formation of a BEC at room
 temperature gives his LENR theory a leg up.






 Kevin O'Malley kevmol...@gmail.com
 1:22 PM (4 hours ago)
  to yekim, ayandas, pkb
 Hello Dr. Kim. I left you a voicemail regarding this. Does the formation
 of a BEC at room temperature make your theory of Deuteron Fusion more
 viable? Wasn't the main criticism of your theory that BECs couldn't form at
 higher temperatures?
  Y. E. Kim, Bose-Einstein Condensate Theory of Deuteron Fusion in
 Metal, J. Condensed Matter Nucl. Sci. *4*, 188 (2011),
 best regards,
  Kevin O'Malley
   408%20460%205707

 --

 http://www.pnas.org/content/early/2013/01/29/1210842110

 Polariton Bose–Einstein condensate at room temperature in an Al(Ga)N
 nanowire–dielectric microcavity with a spatial potential trap

 Ayan Dasa,1,
 Pallab Bhattacharyaa,1,
 Junseok Heoa,
 Animesh Banerjeea, and
 Wei Guob

 Author Affiliations

 Edited by Paul L. McEuen, Cornell University, Ithaca, NY, and approved
 December 21, 2012 (received for review June 28, 2012)

 Abstract

 A spatial potential trap is formed in a 6.0-μm Al(Ga)N nanowire by varying
 the Al composition along its length during epitaxial growth. The polariton
 emission characteristics of a dielectric microcavity with the single
 nanowire embedded in-plane have been studied at room temperature.
 Excitation is provided at the Al(Ga)N end of the nanowire, and polariton
 emission is observed from the lowest bandgap GaN region within the
 potential trap. Comparison of the results with those measured in an
 identical microcavity with a uniform GaN nanowire and having an identical
 exciton–photon detuning suggests evaporative cooling of the polaritons as
 they are transported into the trap in the Al(Ga)N nanowire. Measurement of
 the spectral characteristics of the polariton emission, their momentum
 distribution, first-order spatial coherence, and time-resolved measurements
 of polariton cooling provides strong evidence of the formation of a
 near-equilibrium Bose–Einstein condensate in the GaN region of the nanowire
 at room temperature. In contrast, the condensate formed in the uniform GaN
 nanowire–dielectric microcavity without the spatial potential trap is only
 in self-equilibrium.

 Bose–Einstein condensation
 exciton–polariton
 Footnotes
 1To whom correspondence may be addressed.
 E-mail: ayan...@umich.edu or p...@umich.edu.



 Author contributions: A.D. and P.B. designed research; A.D. and J.H.
 performed research; J.H., A.B., and W.G. contributed new reagents/analytic
 tools; A.D. analyzed data; and P.B. wrote the paper.

 The authors declare no conflict of interest.

 This article is a PNAS Direct Submission.

 This article contains supporting information online at
 http://www.pnas.org/lookup/suppl/doi:10.1073/pnas.
 1210842110/-/DCSupplemental.

 Freely available online through the PNAS open access option.
  Reply
 Reply to all
  Forward
  Kim, Yeong E
 5:24 PM (32 minutes ago)
  to me, ayandas, pkb

 Hi, Kevin,

 Yes, the formation of a BEC of deuterons (or other Bose nuclei) makes my
 theory more viable.

 ** **

 The claim, made by some that BECs could not form at room temperatures, was
 based on an inconclusive conjecture

 which assumes that the Maxwell-Boltzmann (MB ) velocity distribution
 applies for deuterons in a metal.

 This conjecture was not based on any theories nor on any experimentally
 observed facts.

 The MB velocity distribution is for an ideal gas containing
 non-interacting

Re: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:Bose Einstein Condensate formed at Room Temperature

*What is free electron gas density on surface of lattice? ... are we
talking free electrons from metal bonding of lattice material or free
electrons from disassociated hydrogen gas? I know plasmons are sometimes
refered to as a mirrored effect so you can see why I am unsure if you are
talking lattice phenomena from below or exotic hydrogen states from above.*



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spaser

The Spaser

The negatively charged quasiparticle called a Plasmons is being produced on
the nano-surfaced micro-particles used in both the Rossi and DGT reactors.
First, surface plasmons are bosons: they are vector excitations and have
spin 1, just as photons do.

These electrons are forming condensates which amplify their wave function
as they become entangled. Their localization at lattice defects defines the
nuclear active areas where LENR occurs.

A spaser is the nanoplasmonic counterpart of a laser, but it (ideally) does
not emit photons. It is analogous to the conventional laser, but in a
spaser photons are replaced by surface plasmons and the resonant cavity is
replaced by a nanoparticle, which supports the plasmonic modes. Similarly
to a laser, the energy source for the Spasing mechanism is an active (gain)
medium that is excited externally. The LENR reaction provides this
excitation.

This spacer accomplishes two functions; it’s entangled and amplified wave
function catalyzes fusion by lowering the coulomb barrier of atoms at and
near the lattice defect and then it down converts and transfers this fusion
gamma energy from the nucleus into the lattice of the micro particle as
infrared radiation.



Cheers: Axil



On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 9:17 AM, francis froarty...@comcast.net wrote:

 Axil,

 I think the paper  AFM measurements by Chen Peng re catalytic action
 occurring at openings and defects in nanotubes supports your focus on
 “patterned surface” since each time the pattern repeats you are creating
 catalytic action over and over again in a confined area. Stiction forces
 being the bane to creating these geometries and the reason the anomaly is
 so hard to find in nature and why production of skeletal cats or activated
 nano powders is so difficult / pyrophoric.

 ** **

 Still need further clarification of your response[snip] This is an
 example of how Anderson localization of plasmons in the form of collective
 oscillations of the free electron gas density on the surface of the lattice
 can catalyze LENR.[/snip]… What is free electron gas density on surface of
 lattice? ... are we talking free electrons from metal bonding of lattice
 material or free electrons from disassociated hydrogen gas? I know plasmons
 are sometimes refered to as a mirrored effect so you can see why I am
 unsure if you are talking lattice phenomena from below or exotic hydrogen
 states from above. 

 Fran

 ** **

 ** **

 ** **

 Axil 
 Axilhttp://www.mail-archive.com/search?l=vortex-l@eskimo.comq=from:%22Axil+Axil%22
  Mon,
 11 Feb 2013 21:06:22 
 -0800http://www.mail-archive.com/search?l=vortex-l@eskimo.comq=date:20130211
 

 ** **

 I have just posted a reference (Plasmons on a patterned surface can

 enhance the production of bright electron beams) that describes how a

 properly configured patterned surface of cavities and mounds can convert**
 **

 the heat in the form of plasmons present in a lattice into electrons

 localized on that surface.

 ** **

 This is an example of how Anderson localization of plasmons in the form of
 

 collective oscillations of the free electron gas density on the surface of
 

 the lattice can catalyze LENR.

 ** **

 More generally, this shows how the proper structuring of materials can be*
 ***

 formulated to engineer localized concentrations of electrons in response to
 

 the 
 applicationhttp://www.mail-archive.com/vortex-l%40eskimo.com/msg76604.htmlof
  heat to the surface of the lattice.
 

 ** **

 These localized areas of high electron density form the active nuclear

 areas where the lowering of the coulomb barrier is greatly enhanced.

 ** **

 This is a similar mechanism to the crack method called out in Ed Storms***
 *

 theory where the cracks in the lattice localizes, pins down and

 concentrates surface electrons under the stimulus of heat in and around the
 

 cracks on the surface of the lattice.

 ** **

 Admittedly, breaking of chemical bonds may not be the appropriate term for
 

 processes so described.

 ** **

 Topological construction in materials might be a better term even if this*
 ***

 type of process might well be a chemical one.

 ** **

 ** **

 ** **

Re: [Vo]:Bose Einstein Condensate formed at Room Temperature

http://physicsworld.com/cws/article/news/2010/nov/24/bosons-bossed-into-bose-einstein-condensate

*Bosons bossed into Bose–Einstein condensate*

This article that described the formation process of a photon condensate
can inform us of how the Plasmons Bose-Einstein condensate could form.

First, there is a close comparison between a photon condensate and a
Plasmons condensate.

For one thing, the spin number is the same: both particles have integer
spin. Next, the weight of both particles is very light. They are also trap
in similar ways, one in a optical trap, the other in a lattice defect.

The collision process of photons cool the photon condensate to room
temperature, whereas the Plasmons condensate will reach the ambient
temperature of the lattice through the coherent nature of the lattice
thermal vibrations.

Both Rossi and DGT reactors use the UV/ X-ray explosion mechanisms of
alkali metal clusters to seed the surface of the lattice with abundant
electrons.

Both the photon and Plasmon condensate mechanism requires a minimum density
of particles before a condensate can be established--- much like a liquid
drop condensing in a gas.

In both cases, the cavity has a 2 dimensional design, which means that both
the photons Plasmon are confined to two dimensions. As a result of the
longitudinal confinement, they behave as if they are particles with an
effective mass corresponding to the cut-off energy. This mass is still
extremely small, which is why photons and by analogy Plasmons will form a
BEC at room temperature and don't need to be cooled to micro-Kelvin
temperatures like atoms.

Cheers: Axil

On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 12:55 PM, Axil Axil janap...@gmail.com wrote:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spaser

The Spaser

The negatively charged quasiparticle called a Plasmons is being produced
on the nano-surfaced micro-particles used in both the Rossi and DGT
reactors. First, surface plasmons are bosons: they are vector excitations
and have spin 1, just as photons do.

These electrons are forming condensates which amplify their wave function
as they become entangled. Their localization at lattice defects defines the
nuclear active areas where LENR occurs.

A spaser is the nanoplasmonic counterpart of a laser, but it (ideally)
does not emit photons. It is analogous to the conventional laser, but in a
spaser photons are replaced by surface plasmons and the resonant cavity is
replaced by a nanoparticle, which supports the plasmonic modes. Similarly
to a laser, the energy source for the Spasing mechanism is an active (gain)
medium that is excited externally. The LENR reaction provides this
excitation.

This spacer accomplishes two functions; it’s entangled and amplified wave
function catalyzes fusion by lowering the coulomb barrier of atoms at and
near the lattice defect and then it down converts and transfers this fusion
gamma energy from the nucleus into the lattice of the micro particle as
infrared radiation.

Cheers: Axil

On Fri, Feb 8, 2013 at 9:02 PM, Kevin O'Malley kevmol...@gmail.comwrote:

Hello Vorts:
See below for confirmation from YE Kim that the formation of a BEC at
room temperature gives his LENR theory a leg up.

Kevin O'Malley kevmol...@gmail.com
1:22 PM (4 hours ago)
to yekim, ayandas, pkb
Hello Dr. Kim. I left you a voicemail regarding this. Does the formation
of a BEC at room temperature make your theory of Deuteron Fusion more
viable? Wasn't the main criticism of your theory that BECs couldn't form at
higher temperatures?
Y. E. Kim, Bose-Einstein Condensate Theory of Deuteron Fusion in
Metal, J. Condensed Matter Nucl. Sci. *4*, 188 (2011),
best regards,
Kevin O'Malley
408%20460%205707

http://www.pnas.org/content/early/2013/01/29/1210842110

Polariton Bose–Einstein condensate at room temperature in an Al(Ga)N
nanowire–dielectric microcavity with a spatial potential trap

Ayan Dasa,1,
Pallab Bhattacharyaa,1,
Junseok Heoa,
Animesh Banerjeea, and
Wei Guob

Author Affiliations

Edited by Paul L. McEuen, Cornell University, Ithaca, NY, and approved
December 21, 2012 (received for review June 28, 2012)

Abstract

A spatial potential trap is formed in a 6.0-μm Al(Ga)N nanowire by
varying the Al composition along its length during epitaxial growth. The
polariton emission characteristics of a dielectric microcavity with the
single nanowire embedded in-plane have been studied at room temperature.
Excitation is provided at the Al(Ga)N end of the nanowire, and polariton
emission is observed from the lowest bandgap GaN region within the
potential trap. Comparison of the results with those measured in an
identical microcavity with a uniform GaN nanowire and having an identical
exciton–photon detuning suggests evaporative cooling of the polaritons as
they are transported into the trap in the Al(Ga)N nanowire. Measurement of
the spectral

Re: [Vo]:Bose Einstein Condensate formed at Room Temperature

2013-02-12 Thread Jed Rothwell

Edmund Storms stor...@ix.netcom.com wrote:


 I predict that the H-Ni reaction is not the source of energy being claimed
 by Rossi et al. Any theory that attempts to justify the H-Ni reaction as
 the source of claimed energy is open to test because, if I'm right, such a
 theory is useless because it predicts something that does not happen. I
 predict deuterium is the source of heat based on a mechanism that also
 explains all other reactions.


You are saying the deuterium in ordinary water is reacting in Rossi's cell?

What do you predict will happen if it is enriched above the natural ratio?

- Jed

[Vo]:New Lattice Energy Posting on Li-Battery Failures

2013-02-12 Thread pagnucco

Lattice Energy has recently posted a new item entitled -

Microscopic Dendrites Focus in Boeing Dreamliner Probe
- Wall Street Journal, Feb 11, 2013

The Li-battery industry is projected to be $50 billion annually by 2020
-- possibly more if the price of gasoline continues escalating.

This may be enough to justify careful experiments to rule out conjectured
LENR effects, since the batteries may develop nanostructures allegedly
ideally conducive to LENRs.

http://www.slideshare.net/lewisglarsen/microscopic-dendrites-focus-in-boeing-dreamliner-probe-wall-street-journalfeb-11-2013

Re: [Vo]:Bose Einstein Condensate formed at Room Temperature

2013-02-12 Thread Harry Veeder

On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 10:45 AM, Edmund Storms stor...@ix.netcom.com wrote:


 As for my theory, I find that most people do not understand what I'm actually 
 describing. They superimpose their own ideas with great confidence rather 
 than understand what I describe even though I try to be very clear. 
 Consequently, I have been writing a series of papers in an attempt to keep up 
 with the confusion and explain what I'm actually proposing.




Please post again a link to your explanation.

Thanks,

Harry

Re: [Vo]:Bose Einstein Condensate formed at Room Temperature

The papers were posted to vortex and to an e-mail by Jed just a few  
minutes ago.


Ed
On Feb 12, 2013, at 1:37 PM, Harry Veeder wrote:

On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 10:45 AM, Edmund Storms  
stor...@ix.netcom.com wrote:



As for my theory, I find that most people do not understand what  
I'm actually describing. They superimpose their own ideas with  
great confidence rather than understand what I describe even  
though I try to be very clear. Consequently, I have been writing a  
series of papers in an attempt to keep up with the confusion and  
explain what I'm actually proposing.






Please post again a link to your explanation.

Thanks,

Harry

RE: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:Bose Einstein Condensate formed at Room Temperature

2013-02-12 Thread Roarty, Francis X

Axil,
It sounds like a pretty good theory but I think you still need a bootstrap 
mechanism to initiate the oscillations responsible for LENR reaction. Plasmons 
are just  waves on the surface of an electron  medium rather than the flow of 
said electrons and as such aren’t an energy source nor is the quantum effects 
of the geometry an energy source in itself.. you still need something to cause 
relative motion between the rubber and the road.. to move these gas atoms in 
opposition to the NAE  as a prestep toward  your  LENR reaction and to keep it 
from damping out. I still posit this environment makes possible a seeming 
violation of COE where the random motion of gas and hence HUP can be exploited 
as an energy source. The random chaotic motion of these  gas  atoms are mostly 
confined to 2D and possibly 1D while simultaneously permeated by the field 
changes of this nano geometry .  This “less random” motion relative to the 
changing field created by the geometry would make possible a self assembling  
maxwellian like demon, instead of separating hot from cold atoms into 
reservoirs it simply discounts  the required energy to disassociate h2  below 
the level released when the atoms recombine.
Fran

From: Axil Axil [mailto:janap...@gmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2013 12:56 PM
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Subject: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:Bose Einstein Condensate formed at Room Temperature

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spaser

The Spaser

The negatively charged quasiparticle called a Plasmons is being produced on the 
nano-surfaced micro-particles used in both the Rossi and DGT reactors. First, 
surface plasmons are bosons: they are vector excitations and have spin 1, just 
as photons do.

These electrons are forming condensates which amplify their wave function as 
they become entangled. Their localization at lattice defects defines the 
nuclear active areas where LENR occurs.

A spaser is the nanoplasmonic counterpart of a laser, but it (ideally) does not 
emit photons. It is analogous to the conventional laser, but in a spaser 
photons are replaced by surface plasmons and the resonant cavity is replaced by 
a nanoparticle, which supports the plasmonic modes. Similarly to a laser, the 
energy source for the Spasing mechanism is an active (gain) medium that is 
excited externally. The LENR reaction provides this excitation.

This spacer accomplishes two functions; it’s entangled and amplified wave 
function catalyzes fusion by lowering the coulomb barrier of atoms at and near 
the lattice defect and then it down converts and transfers this fusion gamma 
energy from the nucleus into the lattice of the micro particle as infrared 
radiation.



Cheers:   Axil
On Fri, Feb 8, 2013 at 9:02 PM, Kevin O'Malley 
kevmol...@gmail.commailto:kevmol...@gmail.com wrote:
Hello Vorts:
See below for confirmation from YE Kim that the formation of a BEC at room 
temperature gives his LENR theory a leg up.






Kevin O'Malley kevmol...@gmail.commailto:kevmol...@gmail.com


1:22 PM (4 hours ago)


to yekim, ayandas, pkb


Hello Dr. Kim. I left you a voicemail regarding this. Does the formation of a 
BEC at room temperature make your theory of Deuteron Fusion more viable? Wasn't 
the main criticism of your theory that BECs couldn't form at higher 
temperatures?
Y. E. Kim, Bose-Einstein Condensate Theory of Deuteron Fusion in Metal, J. 
Condensed Matter Nucl. Sci. 4, 188 (2011),
best regards,
Kevin O'Malley
 tel:408%20460%205707
--

http://www.pnas.org/content/early/2013/01/29/1210842110

Polariton Bose–Einstein condensate at room temperature in an Al(Ga)N 
nanowire–dielectric microcavity with a spatial potential trap

Ayan Dasa,1,
Pallab Bhattacharyaa,1,
Junseok Heoa,
Animesh Banerjeea, and
Wei Guob

Author Affiliations

Edited by Paul L. McEuen, Cornell University, Ithaca, NY, and approved December 
21, 2012 (received for review June 28, 2012)

Abstract

A spatial potential trap is formed in a 6.0-μm Al(Ga)N nanowire by varying the 
Al composition along its length during epitaxial growth. The polariton emission 
characteristics of a dielectric microcavity with the single nanowire embedded 
in-plane have been studied at room temperature. Excitation is provided at the 
Al(Ga)N end of the nanowire, and polariton emission is observed from the lowest 
bandgap GaN region within the potential trap. Comparison of the results with 
those measured in an identical microcavity with a uniform GaN nanowire and 
having an identical exciton–photon detuning suggests evaporative cooling of the 
polaritons as they are transported into the trap in the Al(Ga)N nanowire. 
Measurement of the spectral characteristics of the polariton emission, their 
momentum distribution, first-order spatial coherence, and time-resolved 
measurements of polariton cooling provides strong evidence of the formation of 
a near-equilibrium Bose–Einstein condensate in the GaN region of

Re: [Vo]:Bose Einstein Condensate formed at Room Temperature

Dr. Storms: A short hand approach has to be used because neither one of us
has the time to explain everything in detail.
***Can you please clarify whether you are using some kind of shorthand
approach on the Nanocavities thread? Because formation of BECs using
lasers to COOL the environment removing energy from the system was how
Dr. Chu got his Nobel Prize. It pointed to the possibility of BECs forming
at higher temperatures, and now we have this evidence that BECs can form at
room temperature.

On the Nanocavities thread, you wrote
Re:
[Vo]:nanocavitieshttp://www.mail-archive.com/search?l=vortex-l@eskimo.comq=subject:%22Re%3A+%5BVo%5D%3Ananocavities%22

Edmund
Stormshttp://www.mail-archive.com/search?l=vortex-l@eskimo.comq=from:%22Edmund+Storms%22Sun,
10 Feb 2013 08:08:52
-0800http://www.mail-archive.com/search?l=vortex-l@eskimo.comq=date:20130210
I don't understand your point. Laser stimulation has been done many times
and it simply adds energy to the process. Energy can be added by increased
temperature and application of applied current, which also increases the
power. This changes nothing basic about the process nor reveals how the
process works.

On Mon, Feb 11, 2013 at 7:04 AM, Edmund Storms stor...@ix.netcom.comwrote:

Sorry, I thought I had made the point often enough that very little
radiation is detected that I got sloppy. The point is that large amounts
of energetic radiation are not detected. Yes, a little radiation is
detected that is energetic enough to get out of the apparatus. However, a
large amount of radiation would be created inside the apparatus. If you
read my papers, you would already know exactly what I claim.

Re: EXTERNAL: Re: [Vo]:Bose Einstein Condensate formed at Room Temperature

It is not oscillations that cause the coulomb barrier to weaken, but the
accumulation of coherent negative electric charge that is responsible.

Materials with a “negative dielectric constant” are expected to provide an
attraction between similar charges and unusual scattering to
electromagnetic waves with possible profound implications for high
temperature superconductivity, communications, and LENR.

http://arxiv.org/pdf/1211.1412
*Superradiance of a 2D-spaser array*


 Schematically, the spaser is an inversely populated two-level system
(TLS). The transition from the excited to the ground state is accompanied
by oscillations of the TLS dipole moment. These oscillations excite surface
plasmons at the nano-particle (NP). Due to the short distance between the
NP and the TLS, plasmon generation is much more efficient than photon
radiation. In turn, plasmon oscillations induce the TLS to radiate
providing feedback for the spaser.

In other words, the lattice vibrations feed the spacer.

The main sources of losses in spasers are dissipation in the metal NP and
radiation of electromagnetic waves (far fields). For small NPs ( 20 nm),
the first channel predominates [1]. For this reason, spasers have never
been considered as efficient source of radiation but rather as systems that
create high local intensity of the electric field and enhance nonlinear
effects.

In other words, the spacer produces intense electric fields rather than EMF.

Thus, a boost of energy extraction from spasers is of special interest. In
addition, due to the spaser’s small size, one cannot design a narrow
radiation pattern for the emission of a spaser into free space. According
to the antenna theory [10], to achieve a narrow radiation pattern, a wide
aperture system built of many spasers, is required. Usually, the phases of
emitters in antenna oscillations are specified, but controlling an
individual antenna is not a simple task in optics. Ideally, a system of
antennas should be self-ordering to create in-phase oscillations. This idea
was suggested in Ref. [11] in the framework of a simplified approach in
which instead of generation, wave scattering on the lattice of NPs was
considered. NPs were assumed to interact with the gain medium described by
the “negative part of dielectric permittivity”. Since the effects of
saturation were not taken into account, lasing generation could not be
described properly.

In other words, spacers are responsible for the Shukla-Eliasson effect
which produces attraction between like charged particles.
In this Letter, we show that the near field interaction of TLSs with
neighboring NPs leads to mutual synchronization of spaser oscillations in
large 2D arrays of spasers. This mutual synchronization arises due to
interaction of quantum subsystem of a spaser with plasmonic particles of
the other spasers. The synchronization results in superradiance. Until the
array size is smaller than the free space wavelength, the interference of
radiated fields is constructive and the radiation intensity power increases
as N2 with the number of spasers, N. For larger systems the interference
becomes destructive and the total radiation power is linear in N while the
power of radiation per solid angle perpendicular to the plane grows as N2.
The N2- dependence is a consequence of superradiance from a subwavelength
array and narrowing of the radiation pattern when the size of the array
exceeds the free space wavelength.

In other words, a two dimensional pile of spacers of arbitrary size act as
a negative charge laser projecting a coherent negative electric charge
perpendicular to the surface of the micro-particle into the bulk of the
particle. This charge affects the bulk near the surface because it has
“negative dielectric permittivity”. This forces like charges together while
lowering the coulomb barrier in the bulk material.



Cheers:Axil

On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 3:57 PM, Roarty, Francis X 
francis.x.roa...@lmco.com wrote:

  Axil,

 It sounds like a pretty good theory but I think you still need a bootstrap
 mechanism to initiate the oscillations responsible for LENR reaction.
 Plasmons are just  waves on the surface of an electron  medium rather than
 the flow of said electrons and as such aren’t an energy source nor is the
 quantum effects of the geometry an energy source in itself.. you still need
 something to cause relative motion between the rubber and the road.. to
 move these gas atoms in opposition to the NAE  as a prestep toward  your
  LENR reaction and to keep it from damping out. I still posit this
 environment makes possible a seeming violation of COE where the random
 motion of gas and hence HUP can be exploited as an energy source. The
 random chaotic motion of these  gas  atoms are mostly confined to 2D and
 possibly 1D while simultaneously permeated by the field changes of this
 nano geometry .  This “less random” motion relative to the changing field
 created by the geometry would make possible a

Re: [Vo]:Bose Einstein Condensate formed at Room Temperature

The problem is that apparently we are not talking about the same thing  
or even using the same concepts.  I'm taking about cold fusion and you  
are talking about BEC. You are making all kinds of assumptions based  
on theory while I'm trying  to describe what is present in the real  
world.  I know how lasers can be used to cool. That is not how lasers  
are used when they are applied to cold fusion.  I know that claims are  
made that BEC can be produced at room temperature based on how energy  
fields behave. This, in my opinion, has no relationship to how  
deuterons behave in PdD.  Unfortunately I do not have the time to  
reach an understanding here, even if this were possible.  I can only  
give you my objections to your conclusions.


Ed
On Feb 12, 2013, at 2:51 PM, Kevin O'Malley wrote:

Dr. Storms:  A short hand approach has to be used because neither  
one of us has the time to explain everything in detail.
***Can you please clarify whether you are using some kind of  
shorthand approach on the Nanocavities thread?  Because formation of  
BECs using lasers to COOL the environment  removing energy from the  
system was how Dr. Chu got his Nobel Prize.  It pointed to the  
possibility of BECs forming at higher temperatures, and now we have  
this evidence that BECs can form at room temperature.




On the Nanocavities thread, you wrote
Re: [Vo]:nanocavities
Edmund StormsSun, 10 Feb 2013 08:08:52 -0800

I don't understand your point. Laser stimulation has been done many  
times and it simply adds energy to the process. Energy can be added  
by increased temperature and application of applied current, which  
also increases the power. This changes nothing basic about the  
process nor reveals how the process works.

Ed


On Mon, Feb 11, 2013 at 7:04 AM, Edmund Storms  
stor...@ix.netcom.com wrote:





Sorry, I thought I had made the point often enough that very little  
radiation is detected that I got sloppy.  The point is that large  
amounts of energetic radiation are not detected. Yes, a little  
radiation is detected that is energetic enough to get out of the  
apparatus. However, a large amount of radiation would be created  
inside the apparatus.  If you read my papers, you would already know  
exactly what I claim.

Fwd: [Vo]:Bose Einstein Condensate formed at Room Temperature

Kevin, having given this more thought, if you want to apply the BEC  
concept to the hydroton that I propose is the active structure  in  
LENR, I'm listening.  We all agree that a method must be found to  
release mass-energy without producing energetic particles or energetic  
radiation. To do this, the D nuclei must form a relationship  within a  
structure (cluster) that is unique. Perhaps the BEC has the required  
properties, but this is not obvious based on the arguments made so far.


Begin forwarded message:


From: Edmund Storms stor...@ix.netcom.com
Date: February 12, 2013 3:29:09 PM MST
To: vortex-l@eskimo.com
Cc: Edmund Storms stor...@ix.netcom.com
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Bose Einstein Condensate formed at Room Temperature

The problem is that apparently we are not talking about the same  
thing or even using the same concepts.  I'm taking about cold fusion  
and you are talking about BEC. You are making all kinds of  
assumptions based on theory while I'm trying  to describe what is  
present in the real world.  I know how lasers can be used to cool.  
That is not how lasers are used when they are applied to cold  
fusion.  I know that claims are made that BEC can be produced at  
room temperature based on how energy fields behave. This, in my  
opinion, has no relationship to how deuterons behave in PdD.   
Unfortunately I do not have the time to reach an understanding here,  
even if this were possible.  I can only give you my objections to  
your conclusions.


Ed
On Feb 12, 2013, at 2:51 PM, Kevin O'Malley wrote:

Dr. Storms:  A short hand approach has to be used because neither  
one of us has the time to explain everything in detail.
***Can you please clarify whether you are using some kind of  
shorthand approach on the Nanocavities thread?  Because formation  
of BECs using lasers to COOL the environment  removing energy from  
the system was how Dr. Chu got his Nobel Prize.  It pointed to the  
possibility of BECs forming at higher temperatures, and now we have  
this evidence that BECs can form at room temperature.




On the Nanocavities thread, you wrote
Re: [Vo]:nanocavities
Edmund StormsSun, 10 Feb 2013 08:08:52 -0800

I don't understand your point. Laser stimulation has been done many  
times and it simply adds energy to the process. Energy can be added  
by increased temperature and application of applied current, which  
also increases the power. This changes nothing basic about the  
process nor reveals how the process works.

Ed


On Mon, Feb 11, 2013 at 7:04 AM, Edmund Storms  
stor...@ix.netcom.com wrote:





Sorry, I thought I had made the point often enough that very little  
radiation is detected that I got sloppy.  The point is that large  
amounts of energetic radiation are not detected. Yes, a little  
radiation is detected that is energetic enough to get out of the  
apparatus. However, a large amount of radiation would be created  
inside the apparatus.  If you read my papers, you would already  
know exactly what I claim.

[Vo]:Re: AGEFI Geneva: Chauvin/LENR-Cars presented. Funded by the founder of Logitech

2013-02-12 Thread Alain Sepeda

Hi,
another article is published in a (French speaking) Mainstream newspaper
in switzerland: Le Temps
http://www.letemps.ch/Page/Uuid/9a0dfe3e-7477-11e2-943f-94c4d8973bed#.URlJJmc-Erh
you have to register to read it.

beside a description of N Chauvin and his partnership , there is clear
evocation of the disdain of the local mainstream physicist about LENR.

(quoted/translated on
http://www.lenr-forum.com/showthread.php?1120-AGEFI-Geneva-Chauvin-LENR-Cars-presented-Funded-by-the-founder-of-Logitechp=3954#post3954)

maybe someone of his level can discuss with this important actor of hot
fusion, to report recent data (less than 20 years old).

*Start-up non grata on the EPFL
sitehttp://www.letemps.ch/Page/Uuid/9a0dfe3e-7477-11e2-943f-94c4d8973bed#.URlJJmc-Erh
*

Supported by Daniel Borel, LENR Cars starts in cold fusion, an area of
controversy aimed an energy ideal
Cold fusion remains a subject of controversy since 20 years. Therefore,
when the start-up LENR Cars, based in the Science Park of Ecublens - a few
steps from the Daniel Borel Innovation Center - announced that it was
conducting research in the field*, the EPFL did not hide his
embarrassment. It is a pity that it is possible to establish a start-up at
the PSE technology is not from our laboratories, said Ambrogio Fasoli,
Professor of physics at the EPFL and Director of the Center for research in
plasma physics. Nothing has ever been shown on cold fusion. I don't believe
any.*

*Heat and electricity

*Microengineering engineer who worked for various start-up as well as
Nestlé and Logitech, Nicolas Chauvin, founder of LENR Cars, dedicated, for
its part, a real passion for cold fusion which dangles an energy ideal.

...

*Dream or reality? It is not for us to demonstrate that cold fusion is
not realistic. Them to prove the contrary', notes Ambrogio Fasoli.*

For Daniel Borel, a minority shareholder of LENR Cars, what counts is to
go until the end of his dreams.

2013/2/5 Alain Sepeda alain.sep...@gmail.com

I just fall on that french speaking article (found by PESN RSS)

http://www.agefi.com/une/detail/archive/2013/february/artikel/lenr-cars-la-start-up-lausannoise-developpe-une-nouvelle-generation-de-moteurs-electriques.html

I've made an article with some translation, and links to google
translate...

http://www.lenr-forum.com/showthread.php?1120-AGEFI-Geneva-Chauvin-LENR-Cars-presented-Funded-by-the-founder-of-Logitechp=3890#post3890

some data about business connections... article is very positive, nearly
advertizing, but there is new data.

*Applied nuclear
fusion*http://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1hl=frrurl=translate.google.comsl=autotl=entwu=1u=http://www.agefi.com/une/detail/archive/2013/february/artikel/lenr-cars-la-start-up-lausannoise-developpe-une-nouvelle-generation-de-moteurs-electriques.htmlusg=ALkJrhiT7qQDMFdwae77FMMXhFBNcdyXVQ
*Lenr
cars.*http://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1hl=frrurl=translate.google.comsl=autotl=entwu=1u=http://www.agefi.com/une/detail/archive/2013/february/artikel/lenr-cars-la-start-up-lausannoise-developpe-une-nouvelle-generation-de-moteurs-electriques.htmlusg=ALkJrhiT7qQDMFdwae77FMMXhFBNcdyXVQ
*The start-up develops Lausanne a new generation of electric
motors.*http://translate.googleusercontent.com/translate_c?depth=1hl=frrurl=translate.google.comsl=autotl=entwu=1u=http://www.agefi.com/une/detail/archive/2013/february/artikel/lenr-cars-la-start-up-lausannoise-developpe-une-nouvelle-generation-de-moteurs-electriques.htmlusg=ALkJrhiT7qQDMFdwae77FMMXhFBNcdyXVQ

The technology we are developing will allow a car to travel 40,000
kilometers on a single tank of fuel without generating any waste.
This ambitious project comes from Nicolas Chauvin, founder and CEO of
startup LENR Cars, based at the EPFL (Ecole Polytechnique Fédérale). To
meet this challenge, *this Logitech and NASA former engineer,* uses a
technology called nuclear fusion LENR (Low Energy Nuclear Reactions).

...

To date, the prototype is being developed. *Its final version should be
released in 2014.* Funded initially by private funds, including those of
its creator, the company can also count on *the support of the founder
of Logitech , Daniel Borel.* He was immediately fascinated by the
project. His many contacts we are also very valuable. However, the company
seeking additional funds. We are not looking for significant funding for
now. 200,000 francs (swiss franc) allow us to continue the development of
our prototype. *LENR Cars is currently in talks with several
automakers, including PSA (Peugeot-Citroen) and Telsa groups.* Though
the start-up is only on the development of this specific segment of the
market can change quickly. This is a risky area or can go very fast. It is
likely that within five years the energy giants are involved significantly
in this revolutionary technology.
Many scientists and journalists are indeed of the

Re: [Vo]:Bose Einstein Condensate formed at Room Temperature

We all agree that a method must be found to release mass-energy without
producing energetic particles or energetic radiation. To do this, the D
nuclei must form a relationship within a structure (cluster) that is
unique.

Transactions of Fusion Technology, Vol. 26, Number 4T, Part 2, December
1994: p. xiii. This paper was presented at The Fourth International
Conference on Cold Fusion, 1993. (ICCF-4) Lahaina, Maui, Dec. 6-9, by
Eugene Mallove in place of Julian Schwinger. Schwinger died in July 1994.

Cold Fusion Theory

www.lenr-canr.org/acrobat/SchwingerJcoldfusionb.pdf

This paper addresses the question of conservation of energy and momentum as
a coupling of phonons within the lattice with the LENR reaction in the
nucleus.

I am receptive to this concept as a mechanism to moderate high energy
nuclear emissions.

Cheers: Axil

On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 5:56 PM, Edmund Storms stor...@ix.netcom.comwrote:

Kevin, having given this more thought, if you want to apply the BEC
concept to the hydroton that I propose is the active structure in LENR,
I'm listening. We all agree that a method must be found to release
mass-energy without producing energetic particles or energetic radiation.
To do this, the D nuclei must form a relationship within a structure
(cluster) that is unique. Perhaps the BEC has the required properties, but
this is not obvious based on the arguments made so far.

Begin forwarded message:

*From: *Edmund Storms stor...@ix.netcom.com
*Date: *February 12, 2013 3:29:09 PM MST
*To: *vortex-l@eskimo.com
*Cc: *Edmund Storms stor...@ix.netcom.com
*Subject: **Re: [Vo]:Bose Einstein Condensate formed at Room Temperature*

The problem is that apparently we are not talking about the same thing or
even using the same concepts. I'm taking about cold fusion and you are
talking about BEC. You are making all kinds of assumptions based on theory
while I'm trying to describe what is present in the real world. I know
how lasers can be used to cool. That is not how lasers are used when they
are applied to cold fusion. I know that claims are made that BEC can be
produced at room temperature based on how energy fields behave. This, in my
opinion, has no relationship to how deuterons behave in PdD. Unfortunately
I do not have the time to reach an understanding here, even if this were
possible. I can only give you my objections to your conclusions.

Ed
On Feb 12, 2013, at 2:51 PM, Kevin O'Malley wrote:

Dr. Storms: A short hand approach has to be used because neither one of
us has the time to explain everything in detail.
***Can you please clarify whether you are using some kind of shorthand
approach on the Nanocavities thread? Because formation of BECs using
lasers to COOL the environment removing energy from the system was how
Dr. Chu got his Nobel Prize. It pointed to the possibility of BECs forming
at higher temperatures, and now we have this evidence that BECs can form at
room temperature.

On the Nanocavities thread, you wrote
Re:
[Vo]:nanocavitieshttp://www.mail-archive.com/search?l=vortex-l@eskimo.comq=subject:%22Re%3A+%5BVo%5D%3Ananocavities%22

On Mon, Feb 11, 2013 at 7:04 AM, Edmund Storms stor...@ix.netcom.comwrote:

Re: [Vo]:Bose Einstein Condensate formed at Room Temperature

I know how lasers can be used to cool. That is not how lasers are used when
they are applied to cold fusion.
***Incorrect.  KP Sinha said directly that lasers were used to cool in his
LENR experiment  theory.

Re: [Vo]:Bose Einstein Condensate formed at Room Temperature

So, you accept reality as Sinha describes it. That simplifies out  
discussion because now we only need to learn from Sinha.


Ed
On Feb 12, 2013, at 4:34 PM, Kevin O'Malley wrote:

I know how lasers can be used to cool. That is not how lasers are  
used when they are applied to cold fusion.


***Incorrect.  KP Sinha said directly that lasers were used to cool  
in his LENR experiment  theory.

Re: [Vo]:Bose Einstein Condensate formed at Room Temperature

On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 2:56 PM, Edmund Storms stor...@ix.netcom.comwrote:

 Kevin, having given this more thought, if you want to apply the BEC
 concept to the hydroton that I propose is the active structure  in LENR,
 I'm listening.  We all agree that a method must be found to release
 mass-energy without producing energetic particles or energetic radiation.
 To do this, the D nuclei must form a relationship  within a structure
 (cluster) that is unique. Perhaps the BEC has the required properties, but
 this is not obvious based on the arguments made so far.

  ***Sounds good, other than the previously mentioned fact that I probably
won't understand your theory.  I did not think to apply the BEC concept to
the hydroton because I'm not that familiar with the hydroton.  I gather
I'll need to spend that 100 hours on coming up to speed on your theory.

We all agree that a method must be found to release mass-energy without
producing energetic particles or energetic radiation.
***I see that Axil Axil found the Phonon reference for the absorption of
nuclear emissions.   It would seem that your Hydroton theory competes with
that.  Since this is all above my paygrade, perhaps it makes sense for
Vortex to invite those authors of the phonon absorption thing to engage
with you in a discussion here, so we could all learn?

 To do this, the D nuclei must form a relationship within a structure
(cluster) that is unique.
***Why?

Perhaps the BEC has the required properties, but this is not obvious based
on the arguments made so far.
***I think it becomes more obvious when we see that KP Sinha used laser
cooling to generate excess heat in his LENR environment.  So where do we
stand?  We have YE Kim's theory that Deuteron BECs can form at higher temps
than absolute zero.  There is corresponding support for this position in
the current paper being discussed where BECs were formed at higher temps.
We have laser cooling to generate an active LENR environment as reported by
KP Sinha and probably others.  But KP Sinha doesn't seem to suggest that he
formed a BEC, he generates an entirely different theory.  And then we have
the phonon absorption theory to account for the lack of emissions.  That's
basically 3 theories conglomerated into one.  Your theory is more elegant
in that it is only one theory to account for overcoming the Coulomb Barrier
and then accounting for the reduced emissions.  The trick to settling on
the better theory is to look through experiments that might have already
generated results that have bearing on these theories.  Of course, that's
the poor man's approach to settling it, because the real scientific
approach is to test directly both theories in LENR environments with top
notch personnel.  Unfortunately, the current state of LENR is that
we're the Wright brothers with garages, and Langley is the dude with all
the money  top notch personnel.  We can all take heart in noting who won
that engagement.   Again, it's above my pay grade but this current BEC
experiment counts towards one side more than the other.

Re: [Vo]:Bose Einstein Condensate formed at Room Temperature

So, you accept reality as Sinha describes it. That simplifies out
discussion because now we only need to learn from Sinha.

So, as usual, the place to start is Jed's website:

Excess Heat Triggering by 532 nm Laser in a D/Pd Gas Loading System

http://lenr-canr.org/acrobat/TianJexcessheatb.pdf

then here
On the Laser Stimulation of Low-Energy Nuclear Reactions in Deuterated
Palladium
http://arxiv.org/abs/cond-mat/0603213

then here

J. Condensed Matter Nucl. Sci. 4 (2011) 241-255

Tunneling Beneath the 4He* Fragmentation Energy
http://www.iscmns.org/CMNS/JCMNS-Vol4.pdf

Re: [Vo]:Bose Einstein Condensate formed at Room Temperature

2013-02-12 Thread David Roberson

I have a question about the laser cooling and what magic it performs as related 
to the BEC.  If you are considering the cooling as being a necessary factor 
that must be present before the BEC can form, then there is a natural process 
occurring that performs a similar function.  Whenever too D's have a head on 
collision, they must by definition come to a complete halt in forward motion as 
the kinetic energy that they possess is converted into potential energy stored 
within the coulomb field.  This close contact does not last very long, but 
perhaps it is long enough for the BEC activity to occur.


Does the net motion of zero velocity constitute a temperature of zero Kelvin 
for that brief period of time?  That is the definition of zero degrees Kelvin 
according to my understanding.  The question is how long does this state have 
to exist before the BEC action takes place?  Has anyone calculated the length 
of time required?


The close proximity of the D's captured within a NAE would force collisions of 
this type to occur orders of magnitude more often than would be expected in a 
less dense plasma environment.   The lower average temperature associated with 
LENR devices would lead to another benefit.  Less relative velocity of the 
active D's would allow more time to be spent in close proximity at zero Kelvin 
since the stored potential energy would be much less than that found in high 
temperature plasma collisions.  Less potential energy translates into less 
acceleration apart and more time to react.


Dave



-Original Message-
From: Kevin O'Malley kevmol...@gmail.com
To: vortex-l vortex-l@eskimo.com
Sent: Tue, Feb 12, 2013 7:23 pm
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Bose Einstein Condensate formed at Room Temperature



So, you accept reality as Sinha describes it. That simplifies out discussion 
because now we only need to learn from Sinha.
 
So, as usual, the place to start is Jed's website: 

Excess Heat Triggering by 532 nm Laser in a D/Pd Gas Loading System
http://lenr-canr.org/acrobat/TianJexcessheatb.pdf

then here

On the Laser Stimulation of Low-Energy Nuclear Reactions in Deuterated  
Palladium
http://arxiv.org/abs/cond-mat/0603213

then here
 
J. Condensed Matter Nucl. Sci. 4 (2011) 241–255 

Tunneling Beneath the 4He∗ Fragmentation Energy 
http://www.iscmns.org/CMNS/JCMNS-Vol4.pdf

Re: [Vo]:Bose Einstein Condensate formed at Room Temperature

 The irradiation of a palladium lattice with coherent green light can
produce Plasmons which can form a BEC at room temperature because of the
interaction of electrons on the surface of the lattice with coherent
radiation of laser light.The Plasmons will produce a high negative electric
charge on the surface of the lattice which it turn will catalyze LERN via
charge screening. No laser cooling is required as with atoms because a
plasmon BEC can be formed at room temperature.Cheers:   Axil
On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 8:01 PM, David Roberson dlrober...@aol.com wrote:

 I have a question about the laser cooling and what magic it performs as
 related to the BEC.  If you are considering the cooling as being a
 necessary factor that must be present before the BEC can form, then there
 is a natural process occurring that performs a similar function.  Whenever
 too D's have a head on collision, they must by definition come to a
 complete halt in forward motion as the kinetic energy that they possess is
 converted into potential energy stored within the coulomb field.  This
 close contact does not last very long, but perhaps it is long enough for
 the BEC activity to occur.

  Does the net motion of zero velocity constitute a temperature of zero
 Kelvin for that brief period of time?  That is the definition of zero
 degrees Kelvin according to my understanding.  The question is how long
 does this state have to exist before the BEC action takes place?  Has
 anyone calculated the length of time required?

  The close proximity of the D's captured within a NAE would force
 collisions of this type to occur orders of magnitude more often than would
 be expected in a less dense plasma environment.   The lower average
 temperature associated with LENR devices would lead to another benefit.
  Less relative velocity of the active D's would allow more time to be spent
 in close proximity at zero Kelvin since the stored potential energy would
 be much less than that found in high temperature plasma collisions.  Less
 potential energy translates into less acceleration apart and more time to
 react.

  Dave


 -Original Message-
 From: Kevin O'Malley kevmol...@gmail.com
 To: vortex-l vortex-l@eskimo.com
 Sent: Tue, Feb 12, 2013 7:23 pm
 Subject: Re: [Vo]:Bose Einstein Condensate formed at Room Temperature

  So, you accept reality as Sinha describes it. That simplifies out
 discussion because now we only need to learn from Sinha.

 So, as usual, the place to start is Jed's website:
  Excess Heat Triggering by 532 nm Laser in a D/Pd Gas Loading System
 http://lenr-canr.org/acrobat/TianJexcessheatb.pdf
   then here
  On the Laser Stimulation of Low-Energy Nuclear Reactions in Deuterated
 Palladium
 http://arxiv.org/abs/cond-mat/0603213

 then here

 J. Condensed Matter Nucl. Sci. 4 (2011) 241-255

 Tunneling Beneath the 4He* Fragmentation Energy
  http://www.iscmns.org/CMNS/JCMNS-Vol4.pdf

Re: [Vo]:Bose Einstein Condensate formed at Room Temperature

On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 5:01 PM, David Roberson dlrober...@aol.com wrote:

 I have a question about the laser cooling and what magic it performs as
 related to the BEC.  If you are considering the cooling as being a
 necessary factor that must be present before the BEC can form,

***Well, yes, because BECs only form at very low energy.



 then there is a natural process occurring that performs a similar
 function.  Whenever too D's have a head on collision, they must by
 definition come to a complete halt in forward motion as the kinetic energy
 that they possess is converted into potential energy stored within the
 coulomb field.  This close contact does not last very long, but perhaps it
 is long enough for the BEC activity to occur.

 ***If 2 D's collide, then their kinetic energy is zero.  But they don't
 necessarily form a 2-atom BEC because they probably have an energy
 transference mechanism similar to when 2 basketballs collide, they push
 against eachother.  But let's say they do collide and even fuse, generating
 Helium, etc.  In the general atmosphere that happens so rarely, maybe
 1/10^30 collisions?  I have no idea.  But if you confine D's in such a way
 that their energy gets reduced (like in a lattice), the probability of
 fusion collisions maybe goes down to 1/10^12 (I have no idea).  If there is
 10^13 atoms in the lattice, you've just made better conditions for the
 likelihood of fusion.



Does the net motion of zero velocity constitute a temperature of zero
Kelvin for that brief period of time?
***Well, I think it does, but let's have others weigh in.

 That is the definition of zero degrees Kelvin according to my
understanding. The question is how long does this state have to exist
before the BEC action takes place? Has anyone calculated the length of time
required?
***I've seen it referenced before that it needs to happen over a
picosecond.

The close proximity of the D's captured within a NAE would force collisions
of this type to occur orders of magnitude more often than would be expected
in a less dense plasma environment.
***That, in essence, is the YE Kim's BEC theory.


  The lower average temperature associated with LENR devices would lead to
another benefit. Less relative velocity of the active D's would allow more
time to be spent in close proximity at zero Kelvin since the stored
potential energy would be much less than that found in high temperature
plasma collisions.  Less potential energy translates into less acceleration
apart and more time to react.
***I suppose so.  The real benefit of lower average temperature associated
with LENR devices is that you don't need a hydrogen bomb in your water
heater, once this technology becomes viable.

[Vo]:Ed Storms explanation of LENR

2013-02-12 Thread Harry Veeder

The papers in vortex-l hard to find so I went to the lenr-canr.org
library and found them.

An Explanation of Low-energy Nuclear Reactions (Cold Fusion) - 2012
http://lenr-canr.org/acrobat/StormsEanexplanat.pdf

An Approach to Explaining Cold Fusion - 2012
http://lenr-canr.org/acrobat/StormsEanapproach.pdf


Harry

On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 3:39 PM, Edmund Storms stor...@ix.netcom.com wrote:
 The papers were posted to vortex and to an e-mail by Jed just a few minutes
 ago.

 Ed
 On Feb 12, 2013, at 1:37 PM, Harry Veeder wrote:

 On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 10:45 AM, Edmund Storms stor...@ix.netcom.com
 wrote:



 As for my theory, I find that most people do not understand what I'm
 actually describing. They superimpose their own ideas with great confidence
 rather than understand what I describe even though I try to be very clear.
 Consequently, I have been writing a series of papers in an attempt to keep
 up with the confusion and explain what I'm actually proposing.




 Please post again a link to your explanation.

 Thanks,

 Harry

[Vo]:Tech Predictions

2013-02-12 Thread Mark Gibbs

http://www.polratings.com/predictions

Currently they're all IT predictions but anyone care to predict what will
happen in CF in 2013? If you have an insight, fire away:
http://www.polratings.com/predictions/prediction-submission/

[mg]

Re: [Vo]:Ed Storms explanation of LENR

2013-02-12 Thread Harry Veeder

BTW, I posted the first link as well as a link to JCMNS in a facebook
group for people interested in the neutron scattering research in
Canada
and around the world.

Harry

On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 9:27 PM, Harry Veeder hveeder...@gmail.com wrote:
 The papers in vortex-l hard to find so I went to the lenr-canr.org
 library and found them.

 An Explanation of Low-energy Nuclear Reactions (Cold Fusion) - 2012
 http://lenr-canr.org/acrobat/StormsEanexplanat.pdf

 An Approach to Explaining Cold Fusion - 2012
 http://lenr-canr.org/acrobat/StormsEanapproach.pdf


 Harry

Re: [Vo]:Tech Predictions

2013-02-12 Thread Jed Rothwell

The IT predictions are interesting!

I have sworn off trying to predict the future of cold fusion because it
determined by politics, not technology. If it was technology we could spot
a trend or extrapolate from what has happened. But the progress of cold
fusion -- or likely lack of progress -- depends entirely on emotions. To be
blunt, it is stymied by fanatics who oppose science and academic freedom.

People repeatedly set up carefully devised funding with government agencies
and private donors. Everything is lined up. Approvals are given. Then, at
the last minute, Robert Park or one his crowd hears about it, raises a
stink, threatens people's careers, pulls strings, and the whole project
goes down the tubes. Or the meeting is cancelled, or the book is not
printed. Every few months I hear about that kind of thing. As long as we
face this kind of opposition there is not likely to be much funding or
progress. It is a miracle the conference at U. Missouri is on track, and
their research is still funded.

Progress also depends to some extent on people such as Rossi, who are,
shall we say, unpredictable. Self centered. Uncooperative. Prone to hurting
their own interests.

- Jed

Re: [Vo]:Re: AGEFI Geneva: Chauvin/LENR-Cars presented. Funded by the founder of Logitech