Re: [Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
On 09/08/2010 06:05 AM, Mauro Lacy wrote: entering a new age of enlightenment, a new golden age. It is in that sense that the concept of apocalipsis must be understood. Apocalypsis meaning the rising of the veil.. As you can imagine, it's very important to understand the Apocalypsis, the rising of the veil I intended to mean 'raising' not 'rising'. 'Lifting' is probably a better term; the lifting of the veil. Revelation.
Re: [Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
The short answer is, that I don't have a clear idea about how these energies work with and interact with matter. I think that they are related to velocity, to something equivalent to increased friction. By the way, that could serve to give meaning and measurable qualities to the much needed concept of 'absolute velocity' in Physics. I think that the weak nuclear force is a result of the local environment. Protons are neutrons which began to rotate as a consequence of a kind of friction with their local surroundings. That would explain also the symmetry breaking of the weak nuclear forcein terms of the local(galactic?) environment. If you think you have detected a cosmic effect, the best thing to do first would be to try to pinpoint its origin, the direction from where it's coming. If it's a known effect like beta decay, the method used by Shnoll, counting frequencies, plotting a histogram and finding temporal (and after that, spatial) correlations, looks very good and could probably yield very precise results. If you have a new effect you don't know about, you would have to develop first a way to quantify it, and after that try to relate the measurements with time and location, or orientation. Take into account that there are probably different 'kinds' or 'flavours' of these energies. Those coming from the galactic center can be just one of them, maybe the most intense or 'coarse', but not the only kind. As a reference, consider the following: during the next centuries, the old science of astrology will be gradually rediscovered and researched under a new light. For better or worse, all these energies would have to be considered with their qualitative, not only quantitative, aspects. Take into account also that the best way to approach these studies would be with a non-materialistic and a non-mechanicistic approach. That they will be approached and studied with a materialistic and mechanicistic approach nevertheless, is in a sense unavoidable. All that will have important consequences for our future evolution as human beings. Another important thing is that the potential discoveries should be made public, and for the benefit of all. Best regards, Mauro On 09/08/2010 02:14 PM, Cosmo Manning wrote: Thank you for the informative reply Mauro! I guess I should have phrased my question with fewer assumptions... I am not (as far as I know) trying to fan any speculative philosophy or doomsday fears , rather I am interested in this phenomena as it may or may not relate to another vacuum energy conduit thing I have been playing with. My thinking is as follows: galactic center point would be the center of the milky way (roughly) and since it is stars they are blasting all kinds bands outward from their sources. if some isotropic-like radiator like a huge cluster of stars was causing a field that the earth moves into and out of or close and then far from that causes changes in decay rates of radioactive substances, I was just wondering what kind of field interaction the might cause? Could one amplitude modulate a chunk of cesium's emissions by moving the whole earth (ignoring orbits etc like you picked up a ball and shook it violently) in and out of this field? Could this field be induced into a tight crystalin structure and extracted via high frequency virtual photon interaction to create an input-dipole AKA electron holes? If this structure is on earth and it was inter facing with the larger field that is. I have been trying to methodically disprove by experiment different effects as the possible source of the a phenomena I stumbled across in order to figure out how it works. (chemical, RF induction, magnetic induction, heat changes, photon ex citation, etc). Could your effect be causing the phenomena I observe? Thanks again! BTW I really was not trying to bring up 2012/nibiru/annunaki etc!
Re: [Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
On 09/08/2010 01:16 AM, Cosmo Manning wrote: Hi, I have been lurking and have to ask a burning question! Mauro Lacy or anyone: in a hypothetical situation... Let's say for instance that the earth was in near alignment with galactic central point and then wobbled about it for a few days (such as it does at the winter solstice). What kind of fluctuations would be expected by your hypothesis? Galactic alignment with galactic central point. What does that mean? When you're in a circular, or quasi circular, motion, you are *always* aligned with the center of the circle. Look, we're actually at 0.02 degrees above (north of) the galactic plane. Because the distance to the center of the galaxy is of many light years, those 0.02 degrees are a relatively long distance. And we're actually traveling *farther* from the galactic plane, due to our actual direction of motion towards the Solar Apex, which is in the northern hemisphere. So, there's also no chance that we'll cross the galactic plane anytime soon. It seems to me that you're confusing or mixing the apparent motion of the Sun at the solstices, with so called galactic alignment. Take into account that the galactic distances are huge. My take is that we will not see any sudden changes in relation to any galactic related motion. We're wobbling inside the galaxy arm at 16.6 km/s. That's slow movement, in relation to galactic (extra solar system) distances. Even more: the conventional view is that that movement is a linear one, that is, at the moment, and as far as I know, scientists are unable to calculate the rate of curvature of such wobble. That can give you an idea of the times and distances involved. We're also traveling at 220 km/s in the general direction of galactic rotation. That means that we'll complete a hypothetical turn in 220 million years! And as I said, although that velocity is one order of magnitude greater than the movement towards the solar apex, we're always aligned to the center, in relation to that movement, because that movement is (roughly) on the circumference of a circle. Now, in relation to 2012 and doomsday scenarios, I'll take the chance here and say what I think, once and for all: In my opinion, 2012 in particular has nothing to do with galactic alignment(alignment with what?), crossing of the galactic plane, changing galactic frequencies, or whatever you want to call it in your particular brand or mix of speculative philosophy. There's a lot of hype and exaggeration. Even National Geographic, Discovery and History channel are feeding the fire of the coming final days. All they do in these documentaries is to emphasize the negative aspects of change, that is, those of destruction, upheaval, crisis, suffering and, in a general sense, doom. There will be no doomsday. I repeat: no doomsday. No end of the world. But, and this is undeniable, we're experiencing a lot of unusual things, mostly in weather patterns, also in the occurrence of volcanoes and earthquakes, floodings, extreme weather, etc. In my opinion, the weather, also earthquakes and volcanoes, that is, seismic activity on Earth, and also other, subtler phenomena, are all related to cosmic phenomena. In particular, to the activity of the Sun, but also to planetary positions and alignments, oppositions, etc. We're just starting to see and understand these connections, and that understanding will eventually lead to a new, scientific form of the old science of astrology, which clearly cannot continue and survive as it is today. Much water will have to run under the bridge for the actual, materialistic form of scientific knowledge to embrace and pursue that knowledge, but it will happen nevertheless, sooner or later, due to the simple fact that those effects and influences are real. We're approaching a particular event that will happen in 2012, which is related to the weather in forms that we actually don't understand in a scientific way, but that are probably due to the solar wind and its interactions with the Earth(i.e. electromagnetic effects, in a broad or generic form), which are in turn affected or modified by the planets, by their location in the ecliptic. The (second) transit of Venus will happen in 2012. The transits of Venus(Venus crossing the Sun in front of the Earth) come in pairs, separated by 8 years, and those pairs are separated by the next pair by 105 or 121 years. The first transit happened in 2004. So, if you study weather patterns, you discover that every hundred years or so, we have had a decade of uncommon weather. So much for the end of the times. Lastly, I want to add something more: In the very same way as there's a cycle of day and night, and a cycle of the seasons, there are probably greater cycles. And those cycles are probably related(in ways that we quite don't understand yet) to the rise and fall of civilizations on Earth, and also to the general state of mind of the beings on Earth. To the dark ages and to the golden ages. But
RE: [Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
I concur with Mario's sediments concerning the so-called galactic alignment issue, particularly its relationship with recent 2012 doomsday hype. Some of us may be old enough to remember the fact that recent 2012 Armageddon hype, which in certain New Age groups has been associated with the dreaded galactic alignment issue, seems to be harmonically aligned with a previous doomsday alignment scenario which back in its heyday was called the Harmonic Convergence, circa 1985-6. Back then the major planets of our solar system were said to be in the process of aligning themselves in such a unique way that it could only result in a planetary upheaval of significant proportions. Some may even recall a small tragedy that occurred around the event where a harmless cult (harmless except for its own membership) who committed mass suicide because they believed their spirits would be reborn on what they believed was a space ship that was detected to be in orbit near Saturn / Jupiter. I believe the space ship observation was in relationship to the famous comet that eventually produced a spectacular bull's eye on the surface of Jupiter. It's been my observation that these planetary doomsday scenarios seem to crop up every generation, every 23 years or so. I'm under the opinion that some of these sociological events may in part be fueled by batches of younger observers (initiates) who may not have had the opportunity to have been inoculated (exposed) by the effects of previous doomsday scenarios, particularly how these sociological events tend to play out in the public arena. In the meantime, for the curious-of-mind (like me!) you can get a belly-full of doomsday galactic ecliptic lore by browsing the web site: Project Camelot. http://projectcamelotportal.com/ Some really good video interviews can be found at: http://projectcamelotportal.com/camelot-library.html I noticed that the site has grown so large that they have had to reorganize the AV library substantially. Despite my obvious rabid skepticism in regards to fears of catching some virulent strain of convergentitus, I really enjoyed viewing most of these videos, particularly interviews with big named UFO proponents. Listening to some of their personal adventures was a real hoot for me! And who knows, perhaps there is a grain of truth buried deeply somewhere within some of the tales being told. I really don't know. In any case, perhaps some of you will find certain interviews educational. Be warned: You'll either catch a form of convergentitus or get inoculated against them. No guarantees! ;-) Regards, Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.ocm www.zazzle.com/orionworks
Re: [Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
Well, there's always the return of Nibiru. T
Re: [Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
On 08-Sep-10 11:58, Terry Blanton wrote: Well, there's always the return of Nibiru. T Not in 2012. MJ
Re: [Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
On Wed, Sep 8, 2010 at 11:08 AM, MJ feli...@gmail.com wrote: On 08-Sep-10 11:58, Terry Blanton wrote: Well, there's always the return of Nibiru. T Not in 2012. MJ More like 2087; but, there could be an Annunaki scouting party led by Quetzalcoatl himself. T
RE: [Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
It's been my observation that these planetary doomsday scenarios seem to crop up every generation, every 23 years or so. I'm under the opinion that some of these sociological events may in part be fueled by batches of younger observers (initiates) who may not have had the opportunity to have been inoculated (exposed) by the effects of previous doomsday scenarios, particularly how these sociological events tend to play out in the public arena. ... I noticed that the site has grown so large that they have had to reorganize the AV library substantially. Despite my obvious rabid skepticism in regards to fears of catching some virulent strain of convergentitus, I really enjoyed viewing most of these videos, particularly interviews with big named UFO proponents. Listening to some of their personal adventures was a real hoot for me! And who knows, perhaps there is a grain of truth buried deeply somewhere within some of the tales being told. I really don't know. In any case, perhaps some of you will find certain interviews educational. Be warned: You'll either catch a form of convergentitus or get inoculated against them. No guarantees! Yes. On common problem with many of these convergent idealists is one of speed, so to speak. Other common trend I see is that of passivity. By example, the notion that the day after December 21 2012, the world will awake to a new era of peace and harmony, due to the effect of the galactic alignment, is not only ludicrous, but also damaging, as on one side it deviates the attention and trivializes the potential reality of cosmic effects on Earth, and on the other side it leaves all in the hands of the galactic powers. We don't need to do anything; we only have to wait, and in a matter of weeks, or even days, all of our serious problems will be magically swept away by a sequence of galactic waves of higher frequency, that will automatically bring a new age to Earth.
RE: [Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
We don't need to do anything; we only have to wait, and in a matter of weeks, or even days, all of our serious problems will be magically swept away by a sequence of galactic waves of higher frequency, that will automatically bring a new age to Earth. Or, the other version: the world will be miserably destroyed. And it's none of your bussiness. You are powerless and helpless, there's nothing you can do about it. Just surrender to the idea of the inminent collapse of civilization, the destruction of mankind, and the absolute lack of any meaning and sense in anything you can do. There are serious efforts going around to propagate those kind of ideas too, and to instill the fear and desolation they bring.
Re: [Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
On 08-Sep-10 13:50, Mauro Lacy wrote: We don't need to do anything; we only have to wait, and in a matter of weeks, or even days, all of our serious problems will be magically swept away by a sequence of galactic waves of higher frequency, that will automatically bring a new age to Earth. Or, the other version: the world will be miserably destroyed. And it's none of your bussiness. You are powerless and helpless, there's nothing you can do about it. Just surrender to the idea of the inminent collapse of civilization, the destruction of mankind, and the absolute lack of any meaning and sense in anything you can do. There are serious efforts going around to propagate those kind of ideas too, and to instill the fear and desolation they bring. Maybe by the same guys that promote wars: http://www.jrgenius.com/audiofiles/William_Bramley_-_The_Gods_of_Eden.pdf MJ
Re: [Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
Thank you for the informative reply Mauro! I guess I should have phrased my question with fewer assumptions... I am not (as far as I know) trying to fan any speculative philosophy or doomsday fears , rather I am interested in this phenomena as it may or may not relate to another vacuum energy conduit thing I have been playing with. My thinking is as follows: galactic center point would be the center of the milky way (roughly) and since it is stars they are blasting all kinds bands outward from their sources. if some isotropic-like radiator like a huge cluster of stars was causing a field that the earth moves into and out of or close and then far from that causes changes in decay rates of radioactive substances, I was just wondering what kind of field interaction the might cause? Could one amplitude modulate a chunk of cesium's emissions by moving the whole earth (ignoring orbits etc like you picked up a ball and shook it violently) in and out of this field? Could this field be induced into a tight crystalin structure and extracted via high frequency virtual photon interaction to create an input-dipole AKA electron holes? If this structure is on earth and it was inter facing with the larger field that is. I have been trying to methodically disprove by experiment different effects as the possible source of the a phenomena I stumbled across in order to figure out how it works. (chemical, RF induction, magnetic induction, heat changes, photon ex citation, etc). Could your effect be causing the phenomena I observe? Thanks again! BTW I really was not trying to bring up 2012/nibiru/annunaki etc! On 9/8/10, Mauro Lacy ma...@lacy.com.ar wrote: On 09/08/2010 01:16 AM, Cosmo Manning wrote: Hi, I have been lurking and have to ask a burning question! Mauro Lacy or anyone: in a hypothetical situation... Let's say for instance that the earth was in near alignment with galactic central point and then wobbled about it for a few days (such as it does at the winter solstice). What kind of fluctuations would be expected by your hypothesis? Galactic alignment with galactic central point. What does that mean? When you're in a circular, or quasi circular, motion, you are *always* aligned with the center of the circle. Look, we're actually at 0.02 degrees above (north of) the galactic plane. Because the distance to the center of the galaxy is of many light years, those 0.02 degrees are a relatively long distance. And we're actually traveling *farther* from the galactic plane, due to our actual direction of motion towards the Solar Apex, which is in the northern hemisphere. So, there's also no chance that we'll cross the galactic plane anytime soon. It seems to me that you're confusing or mixing the apparent motion of the Sun at the solstices, with so called galactic alignment. Take into account that the galactic distances are huge. My take is that we will not see any sudden changes in relation to any galactic related motion. We're wobbling inside the galaxy arm at 16.6 km/s. That's slow movement, in relation to galactic (extra solar system) distances. Even more: the conventional view is that that movement is a linear one, that is, at the moment, and as far as I know, scientists are unable to calculate the rate of curvature of such wobble. That can give you an idea of the times and distances involved. We're also traveling at 220 km/s in the general direction of galactic rotation. That means that we'll complete a hypothetical turn in 220 million years! And as I said, although that velocity is one order of magnitude greater than the movement towards the solar apex, we're always aligned to the center, in relation to that movement, because that movement is (roughly) on the circumference of a circle. Now, in relation to 2012 and doomsday scenarios, I'll take the chance here and say what I think, once and for all: In my opinion, 2012 in particular has nothing to do with galactic alignment(alignment with what?), crossing of the galactic plane, changing galactic frequencies, or whatever you want to call it in your particular brand or mix of speculative philosophy. There's a lot of hype and exaggeration. Even National Geographic, Discovery and History channel are feeding the fire of the coming final days. All they do in these documentaries is to emphasize the negative aspects of change, that is, those of destruction, upheaval, crisis, suffering and, in a general sense, doom. There will be no doomsday. I repeat: no doomsday. No end of the world. But, and this is undeniable, we're experiencing a lot of unusual things, mostly in weather patterns, also in the occurrence of volcanoes and earthquakes, floodings, extreme weather, etc. In my opinion, the weather, also earthquakes and volcanoes, that is, seismic activity on Earth, and also other, subtler phenomena, are all related to cosmic phenomena. In particular, to the activity of the Sun, but also to planetary positions and
Re: [Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
On 09/04/2010 08:38 PM, Mauro Lacy wrote: The X component of the distance ($3 in the graphs), and the Y component of the velocity ($7 in the second graph), both closely match the bnl decay rate changes. After a careful orientation of the solar system inside the galaxy, I realized that X is the component of the distance that is in a direction almost perpendicular (~6 degrees of difference) to the galactic center, on the plane of the ecliptic. And Y is then almost pointing to the galactic center. Always on the plane of the ecliptic. As the plane of the ecliptic is tilted 60 degrees with respect to the plane of the galaxy, when X is negative we're closer to the galactic plane, and when positive we're farther from it. And when the Y velocity component is positive, we're traveling almost towards the galactic center, and when negative, we're travelling away from it. Actually, it's the other way around. During my 'careful orientation' I made a trivial mistake: exchanging Sun's and Earth's position. This link is useful to visualize it correctly, which is not easy. The image is correct, as far as I can tell: http://www.telusplanet.net/public/fenertyb/solsysGC.html#top So, when X is negative(minimum in march 21, northern vernal equinox, Sun in Pisces) actually we're farthest from the galactic plane, the Y velocity component is also most negative, and we're traveling towards the galactic center at max speed. And vice versa, when X is positive (maximum in september 21, northern autumn equinox, Sun in Virgo) we're closest to the galactic plane, and traveling away from the galactic center. What does this mean in relation to the decay rate changes? It could mean two things: 1) Closeness to the galactic plane increases the decay rates. This is reversed accordingly. By the way, this is unlikely to be the cause for the changes in decay rates, because we're actually traveling farther from the galactic plane due to Solar Apex motion, and that trend should be present in the decay data, as the rates of displacement are on the same order of magnitude. 2) Moving away from the galactic center does it, and is related to how fast the movement is. It must be: moving towards. I have projected (3D coordinate transformation) the Y component of the velocity as seen from the center of the galaxy, but there isn't a significant change in phase. And the addition of the solar apex component only displaces the magnitude of the Y component, not its phase. Next step would be to do curve fitting of the decay rate data, and look for a matching viewing angle for the resultant curve, but probably it does not make sense to do that with a dataset like that. Mauro
Re: [Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
Hi, The results of both papers are addressed, to a certain extent, in Power Spectrum Analyses of Nuclear Decay Rates http://arxiv.org/abs/1007.0924 Mauro On 09/06/2010 02:31 PM, Harry Veeder wrote: Here are two papers which find no evidence of periodic fluctuations in decay rates. Both have been published in journals since being uploaded to arxiv.org Harry http://arxiv.org/abs/0809.4248 Searching for modifications to the exponential radioactive decay law with the Cassini spacecraft Authors: Peter S. Cooper (Submitted on 24 Sep 2008) Abstract: Data from the power output of the radioisotope thermoelectric generators aboard the Cassini spacecraft are used to test the conjecture that small deviations observed in terrestrial measurements of the exponential radioactive decay law are correlated with the Earth-Sun distance. No significant deviations from exponential decay are observed over a range of 0.7 - 1.6 A.U. A 90% Cl upper limit of 0.84 x 10^-4 is set on a term in the decay rate of Pu-238 proportional to 1/R^2 and 0.99 x 10^-4 for a term proportional to 1/R. http://arxiv.org/abs/0810.3265 Evidence against correlations between nuclear decay rates and Earth-Sun distance Authors: Eric B. Norman, Edgardo Browne, Howard A. Shugart, Tenzing H. Joshi, Richard B. Firestone (Submitted on 17 Oct 2008) Abstract: We have reexamined our previously published data to search for evidence of correlations between the rates for the alpha, beta-minus, beta-plus, and electron-capture decays of 22Na, 44Ti, 108Agm, 121Snm, 133Ba, and 241Am and the Earth-Sun distance. We find no evidence for such correlations and set limits on the possible amplitudes of such correlations substantially smaller than those observed in previous experiments.
Re: [Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
Thanks. I'll pass this on. Harry - Original Message From: Mauro Lacy ma...@lacy.com.ar To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Cc: Harry Veeder hlvee...@yahoo.com Sent: Tue, September 7, 2010 6:27:40 AM Subject: Re: [Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements Hi, The results of both papers are addressed, to a certain extent, in Power Spectrum Analyses of Nuclear Decay Rates http://arxiv.org/abs/1007.0924 Mauro On 09/06/2010 02:31 PM, Harry Veeder wrote: Here are two papers which find no evidence of periodic fluctuations in decay rates. Both have been published in journals since being uploaded to arxiv.org Harry http://arxiv.org/abs/0809.4248 Searching for modifications to the exponential radioactive decay law with the Cassini spacecraft Authors: Peter S. Cooper (Submitted on 24 Sep 2008) Abstract: Data from the power output of the radioisotope thermoelectric generators aboard the Cassini spacecraft are used to test the conjecture that small deviations observed in terrestrial measurements of the exponential radioactive decay law are correlated with the Earth-Sun distance. No significant deviations from exponential decay are observed over a range of 0.7 - 1.6 A.U. A 90% Cl upper limit of 0.84 x 10^-4 is set on a term in the decay rate of Pu-238 proportional to 1/R^2 and 0.99 x 10^-4 for a term proportional to 1/R. http://arxiv.org/abs/0810.3265 Evidence against correlations between nuclear decay rates and Earth-Sun distance Authors: Eric B. Norman, Edgardo Browne, Howard A. Shugart, Tenzing H. Joshi, Richard B. Firestone (Submitted on 17 Oct 2008) Abstract: We have reexamined our previously published data to search for evidence of correlations between the rates for the alpha, beta-minus, beta-plus, and electron-capture decays of 22Na, 44Ti, 108Agm, 121Snm, 133Ba, and 241Am and the Earth-Sun distance. We find no evidence for such correlations and set limits on the possible amplitudes of such correlations substantially smaller than those observed in previous experiments.
Re: [Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
Hi, I have been lurking and have to ask a burning question! Mauro Lacy or anyone: in a hypothetical situation... Let's say for instance that the earth was in near alignment with galactic central point and then wobbled about it for a few days (such as it does at the winter solstice). What kind of fluctuations would be expected by your hypothesis? Thanks for your time. -Cosmo On 9/7/10, Mauro Lacy ma...@lacy.com.ar wrote: Hi, The results of both papers are addressed, to a certain extent, in Power Spectrum Analyses of Nuclear Decay Rates http://arxiv.org/abs/1007.0924 Mauro On 09/06/2010 02:31 PM, Harry Veeder wrote: Here are two papers which find no evidence of periodic fluctuations in decay rates. Both have been published in journals since being uploaded to arxiv.org Harry http://arxiv.org/abs/0809.4248 Searching for modifications to the exponential radioactive decay law with the Cassini spacecraft Authors: Peter S. Cooper (Submitted on 24 Sep 2008) Abstract: Data from the power output of the radioisotope thermoelectric generators aboard the Cassini spacecraft are used to test the conjecture that small deviations observed in terrestrial measurements of the exponential radioactive decay law are correlated with the Earth-Sun distance. No significant deviations from exponential decay are observed over a range of 0.7 - 1.6 A.U. A 90% Cl upper limit of 0.84 x 10^-4 is set on a term in the decay rate of Pu-238 proportional to 1/R^2 and 0.99 x 10^-4 for a term proportional to 1/R. http://arxiv.org/abs/0810.3265 Evidence against correlations between nuclear decay rates and Earth-Sun distance Authors: Eric B. Norman, Edgardo Browne, Howard A. Shugart, Tenzing H. Joshi, Richard B. Firestone (Submitted on 17 Oct 2008) Abstract: We have reexamined our previously published data to search for evidence of correlations between the rates for the alpha, beta-minus, beta-plus, and electron-capture decays of 22Na, 44Ti, 108Agm, 121Snm, 133Ba, and 241Am and the Earth-Sun distance. We find no evidence for such correlations and set limits on the possible amplitudes of such correlations substantially smaller than those observed in previous experiments. -- Sent from my mobile device
Re: [Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
Here are two papers which find no evidence of periodic fluctuations in decay rates. Both have been published in journals since being uploaded to arxiv.org Harry http://arxiv.org/abs/0809.4248 Searching for modifications to the exponential radioactive decay law with the Cassini spacecraft Authors: Peter S. Cooper (Submitted on 24 Sep 2008) Abstract: Data from the power output of the radioisotope thermoelectric generators aboard the Cassini spacecraft are used to test the conjecture that small deviations observed in terrestrial measurements of the exponential radioactive decay law are correlated with the Earth-Sun distance. No significant deviations from exponential decay are observed over a range of 0.7 - 1.6 A.U. A 90% Cl upper limit of 0.84 x 10^-4 is set on a term in the decay rate of Pu-238 proportional to 1/R^2 and 0.99 x 10^-4 for a term proportional to 1/R. http://arxiv.org/abs/0810.3265 Evidence against correlations between nuclear decay rates and Earth-Sun distance Authors: Eric B. Norman, Edgardo Browne, Howard A. Shugart, Tenzing H. Joshi, Richard B. Firestone (Submitted on 17 Oct 2008) Abstract: We have reexamined our previously published data to search for evidence of correlations between the rates for the alpha, beta-minus, beta-plus, and electron-capture decays of 22Na, 44Ti, 108Agm, 121Snm, 133Ba, and 241Am and the Earth-Sun distance. We find no evidence for such correlations and set limits on the possible amplitudes of such correlations substantially smaller than those observed in previous experiments.
Re: [Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
Hi Jedm that's very interesting, and I'm glad to know about it. For completeness's sake, I'll develop two other (related) hypothesis regarding the origin of these variations. Always trying to explain the reason for the phase shift: If you recall my graphs related to this I made some months ago: http://maurol.com.ar/decay_rates/velocity_distance.pnghttp://maurol.com.ar/decay_rates/halflife_bnl+Rx.jpg and http://maurol.com.ar/decay_rates/velocity_distance.png (reprocessed) The X component of the distance ($3 in the graphs), and the Y component of the velocity ($7 in the second graph), both closely match the bnl decay rate changes. After a careful orientation of the solar system inside the galaxy, I realized that X is the component of the distance that is in a direction almost perpendicular (~6 degrees of difference) to the galactic center, on the plane of the ecliptic. And Y is then almost pointing to the galactic center. Always on the plane of the ecliptic. As the plane of the ecliptic is tilted 60 degrees with respect to the plane of the galaxy, when X is negative we're closer to the galactic plane, and when positive we're farther from it. And when the Y velocity component is positive, we're traveling almost towards the galactic center, and when negative, we're travelling away from it. What does this mean in relation to the decay rate changes? It could mean two things: 1) Closeness to the galactic plane increases the decay rates. 2) Moving away from the galactic center does it, and is related to how fast the movement is. Or both effects acting together. I'll now reproject the components of the distance and velocity as if exactly viewed from the galactic center, to see if a better match in phase is achieved. Regards, Mauro On 09/03/2010 09:44 PM, Jed Rothwell wrote: Mauro Lacy wrote: More recent data, just reported to the author, indicate that *the “24-hour” period is actually slightly shorter, and corresponds quite precisely to a sidereal day!* The latter would suggest, that *at least one astronomical factor influencing histogram shape may originate /outside/* the solar system, being associated with the orientation of the measuring station relative to the galaxy, and not only relative to the Sun. At ICCF15 Nagel et al. reported on 24-hour periodicity in cold fusion results. See: Diurnal Variations in LENR Experiments D.J. Nagel, T. Mizuno, G. Letts http://iccf15.frascati.enea.it/docs/Abstracts.pdf PDF p. 97. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
Hi, Thoroughly searching the web for decay rates, I've found this excellent article, published in the year 2000: http://www.21stcenturysciencetech.com/articles/time.html The paper mentioned in the article, S.E. Shnoll, V.A. Kolombet, E.V. Pozharskii, T.A. Zenchenko, I.M. Zvereva, and A.A. Konradov, 1998. Realization of discrete states during fluctuations in macroscopic processes, in Uspekhi Fisicheskikh Nauk, Vol. 41, No. 10, pp. 1025-1035. summarizes the result of 40 years of investigation by Shnoll et al in non-random fluctuations of supposedly random phenomena, and their relation to cosmic cycles. From the article: Examining the distribution of time intervals between similar histograms, they found strong peaks at 0 hours (that is, histograms made independently at the same time tend to be similar), at approximately 24 hours, at 27.28 days (probably corresponding to the *synodic rotation of the Sun*), and at three time intervals close to a year: 364.4, 365.2 and 366.6 days. More recent data, just reported to the author, indicate that *the 24-hour period is actually slightly shorter, and corresponds quite precisely to a sidereal day!* The latter would suggest, that *at least one astronomical factor influencing histogram shape may originate /outside/* the solar system, being associated with the orientation of the measuring station relative to the galaxy, and not only relative to the Sun. Bolds are mine. These effects are known since at least 50 years. At the end of Shnoll historic paper, he mentions the reasons why he thinks their work was ignored. I think it's valuable to copy it here: * When the 'Scientific Method' Obstructs Science */Excerpts from the Conclusion of Shnoll et al., Realization of discrete states during fluctuations in macroscopic processes, in /Uspekhi Fisicheskikh Nauk,/ Vol. 41, No. 10, pp. 1025-1035. /Concluding this brief account of studies performed at our laboratory, we would like to anticipate some naturally arising questions. Forty years have passed since our first publication in 1958. Why then have there been no results from other laboratories? We believe that the main reason is that other researchers are too well aware of the principles of science. We are talking of the spread of readings of measurements. The spread of readings is something to be eliminated rather than studied. When physicists or chemists get a scatter of data greater than anticipated on account of inaccuracies of individual stages of investigations, the physicist will reach out for his soldering iron and screwdriver, and the chemist will check the purity of reactants and the quality of distilled water. Another reason is that the accepted methods of statistical data processing based on the central limit theorems are not suited for analysis of the fine structure of the distributions. The criteria of conformity of hypotheses just overlook this fine structure. The distributions are averaged and smoothed. . . . Moreover, the majority of problems do not require knowledge of the fine structure of the distributions. A third reason is a lack of confidence that this phemomenon is at all possible. The scatter of data is associated with the concept of error. We have spent many years looking for possible artifacts. Our main task therefore consisted in proving the theorem of existence. This task may be deemed completed. The acceptance of the phenomenon itself---the realization of the discrete spectrum of allowed states, which at any given time is similar for processes of entirely different nature, and which is attributable to to cosmophysical forces---requires some psychological effort. . . . There are many interesting problems that have to be studied. A number of theorems need to be proved, and new computer techniques developed. Experiments must be performed on satellites and space stations. A network for simultaneous measurements at different geographcial locations ought to be organized. Finally, and most importantly, we need to develop a theory that will explain the nature of this phenomenon. All this is to be done in the future. The task of this paper is accomplished---we have introduced the object of future research. Best regards, Mauro On 08/31/2010 09:01 PM, Mauro Lacy wrote: Sirs, I've read the preprints of your recent papers related to changes in decay rates http://arxiv.org/abs/1007.0924 http://arxiv.org/abs/1007.3318 In the first paper a number of possible systematic causes are checked, and the conclusion states that none of them can explain the changes in decay rates. It's also mentioned that although the cause has probably a solar origin, the phase shift between the inverse of the Sun-Earth distance and the decay rate changes hasn't been accounted for. I think that I have a potential explanation for the phase shift: If you plot the magnitude of Earth's velocity around the Sun, you'll not get a match in phase with the decay data, but if you add the velocity components of the
Re: [Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
Mauro Lacy wrote: More recent data, just reported to the author, indicate that *the “24-hour” period is actually slightly shorter, and corresponds quite precisely to a sidereal day!* The latter would suggest, that *at least one astronomical factor influencing histogram shape may originate outside* the solar system, being associated with the orientation of the measuring station relative to the galaxy, and not only relative to the Sun. At ICCF15 Nagel et al. reported on 24-hour periodicity in cold fusion results. See: Diurnal Variations in LENR Experiments D.J. Nagel, T. Mizuno, G. Letts http://iccf15.frascati.enea.it/docs/Abstracts.pdf PDF p. 97. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
Sirs, I've read the preprints of your recent papers related to changes in decay rates http://arxiv.org/abs/1007.0924 http://arxiv.org/abs/1007.3318 In the first paper a number of possible systematic causes are checked, and the conclusion states that none of them can explain the changes in decay rates. It's also mentioned that although the cause has probably a solar origin, the phase shift between the inverse of the Sun-Earth distance and the decay rate changes hasn't been accounted for. I think that I have a potential explanation for the phase shift: If you plot the magnitude of Earth's velocity around the Sun, you'll not get a match in phase with the decay data, but if you add the velocity components of the solar system towards the Solar Apex, the match is quite good: http://maurol.com.ar/decay_rates/hl_bnl_VSolarApex.png In that graph, the red line is 1/R^2-1. This is similar to the original bnl graph, and both lines are in fact superimposed. The green line is Earth's velocity plus the velocity of the solar system towards the Solar Apex. I took the direction of the Solar Apex from the literature. In this graph, the direction of the Solar Apex is in ecliptic coordinates, long. 260 degrees, lat 53.19 degrees, and velocity 16.6 km/s. So, changes in decay rates could be related to changes in velocity of the Earth towards the Solar Apex. The idea of velocity being responsible makes sense: At a higher velocity, more particles (neutrinos?) will cross the radioactive sample by unit time, increasing the probability of a nuclear collision that will result in a decay. This is similar, in a sense, to the way a car is subjected to increased friction depending on its velocity. It's also very interesting to note that the relation between decay rates and this velocity is inverse (note the minus sign in the dividend at the end of the formula for the green line). When the velocity is smaller (more negative), the effect is greater. That means that when the Earth is traveling against the general direction of movement towards the Solar Apex, the decay rate increases, and vice versa. This can be explained by the Earth having to overcome a 'wind' that is blowing towards that point, in a similar way that a runner encounters more resistance running against the wind that along the wind. I've also plotted other potential cause, namely, Earth's velocity plus Local Standard of Rest (LSR) velocity: http://maurol.com.ar/decay_rates/hl_bnl_VLSR.png In this second graph, LSR is in ecliptic coordinates, long. 347 degrees, lat 59.57 degrees, and velocity 220 km/s. That is equivalent to a movement of the LSR in the general direction of galactic rotation: galactic longitude 90 degrees, galactic latitude 0 degrees. In this case, Earth's velocity towards the LSR is not reversed. I think this match is not so good, and would not explain the effect so well as the previous one, but please judge for yourselves. Probably you can suggest further tests or shortcomings of the hypothesis. I would also like to match the other datasets against these velocities, but the other published graphs are not so clear as the bnl graph is. Best regards, and please let me know what you think. Mauro Lacy
Re: [Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:10 AM, mix...@bigpond.com wrote: In reply to David Jonsson's message of Fri, 27 Aug 2010 00:57:16 +0200: Hi, [snip] If viscosity is active what are the driving torques due to? Shear flow in combination with viscosity requires torque to remain and not slow down. Here's a half-backed notion: The inner and out parts of the Sun act as stator and rotor of a giant electric motor, with power supplied by fusion. How could the fusion produce electricity? David
re:[Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
Harry Veeder cited on Thu, 26 Aug 2010 11:31 Stanford Report, August 23, 2010 The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements When researchers found an unusual linkage between solar flares and radioactive decay of some elements sitting quietly in laboratories on Earth 93 million miles away. This is only a half baked idea but perhaps someone else can support or debunk it.. If the Puthoff model is correct than normal matter has an orbital radius that represents a balance between energy density and spontaneous emission. We know spontaneous emissions can be delayed or accelerated by changing the energy density using casimir geometry or waveguides. A deep gravity well such as our sun's also modifies this energy density but at such a slow gradient we normally dismiss it since the field should appear isotropic to all local observers. My question therefore is regarding the Puthoff model for radioactive material. Does the unstable radioactive atom emission rate scale differently than normal matter? Could a solar flare uniformly modify the energy density of the solar system such that all but radioactive material scales uniformly? Fran
Re: [Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
In reply to David Jonsson's message of Fri, 27 Aug 2010 09:31:34 +0200: Hi, It produces plasma which is a mixture of ions and electrons. Vast plasma currents flow in the Sun generating magnetic fields (you can see plasma trapped in huge arcs during Solar flares), probably largely due to the difference in mass between protons and electrons. The Sun as a whole has a magnetic field which flips every 11 years (IIRC). On Fri, Aug 27, 2010 at 2:10 AM, mix...@bigpond.com wrote: In reply to David Jonsson's message of Fri, 27 Aug 2010 00:57:16 +0200: Hi, [snip] If viscosity is active what are the driving torques due to? Shear flow in combination with viscosity requires torque to remain and not slow down. Here's a half-backed notion: The inner and out parts of the Sun act as stator and rotor of a giant electric motor, with power supplied by fusion. How could the fusion produce electricity? David Regards, Robin van Spaandonk http://rvanspaa.freehostia.com/Project.html
Re: [Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
FYI A recent peer reviewed paper by H. Jenkins, Daniel W. Mundy, Ephraim Fischbach: Analysis of environmental influences in nuclear half-life measurements exhibiting time-dependent decay rates Abstract In a recent series of papers evidence has been presented for correlations between solar activity and nuclear decay rates. This includes an apparent correlation between Earth–Sun distance and data taken at Brookhaven National Laboratory (BNL), and at the Physikalisch-Technische Bundesanstalt (PTB). Although these correlations could arise from a direct interaction between the decaying nuclei and some particles or fields emanating from the Sun, they could also represent an “environmental” effect arising from a seasonal variation of the sensitivities of the BNL and PTB detectors due to changes in temperature, relative humidity, background radiation, etc. In this paper, we present a detailed analysis of the responses of the detectors actually used in the BNL and PTB experiments, and show that sensitivities to seasonal variations in the respective detectors are likely too small to produce the observed fluctuations. published in the August 2010 issue of: Nuclear Instruments and Methods in Physics Research Section A: Accelerators, Spectrometers, Detectors and Associated Equipment http://tinyurl.com/333aw2h An earlier version of this paper is avaible here for free: http://arxiv.org/abs/0912.5385 Harry
[Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
Stanford Report, August 23, 2010 The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements When researchers found an unusual linkage between solar flares and the inner life of radioactive elements on Earth, it touched off a scientific detective investigation that could end up protecting the lives of space-walking astronauts and maybe rewriting some of the assumptions of physics. BY DAN STOBER It's a mystery that presented itself unexpectedly: The radioactive decay of some elements sitting quietly in laboratories on Earth seemed to be influenced by activities inside the sun, 93 million miles away. Is this possible? Researchers from Stanford and Purdue University believe it is. But their explanation of how it happens opens the door to yet another mystery. There is even an outside chance that this unexpected effect is brought about by a previously unknown particle emitted by the sun. That would be truly remarkable, said Peter Sturrock, Stanford professor emeritus of applied physics and an expert on the inner workings of the sun. The story begins, in a sense, in classrooms around the world, where students are taught that the rate of decay of a specific radioactive material is a constant. This concept is relied upon, for example, when anthropologists use carbon-14 to date ancient artifacts and when doctors determine the proper dose of radioactivity to treat a cancer patient. Random numbers But that assumption was challenged in an unexpected way by a group of researchers from Purdue University who at the time were more interested in random numbers than nuclear decay. (Scientists use long strings of random numbers for a variety of calculations, but they are difficult to produce, since the process used to produce the numbers has an influence on the outcome.) Ephraim Fischbach, a physics professor at Purdue, was looking into the rate of radioactive decay of several isotopes as a possible source of random numbers generated without any human input. (A lump of radioactive cesium-137, for example, may decay at a steady rate overall, but individual atoms within the lump will decay in an unpredictable, random pattern. Thus the timing of the random ticks of a Geiger counter placed near the cesium might be used to generate random numbers.) As the researchers pored through published data on specific isotopes, they found disagreement in the measured decay rates – odd for supposed physical constants. Checking data collected at Brookhaven National Laboratory on Long Island and the Federal Physical and Technical Institute in Germany, they came across something even more surprising: long-term observation of the decay rate of silicon-32 and radium-226 seemed to show a small seasonal variation. The decay rate was ever so slightly faster in winter than in summer. Was this fluctuation real, or was it merely a glitch in the equipment used to measure the decay, induced by the change of seasons, with the accompanying changes in temperature and humidity? Everyone thought it must be due to experimental mistakes, because we're all brought up to believe that decay rates are constant, Sturrock said. The sun speaks On Dec 13, 2006, the sun itself provided a crucial clue, when a solar flare sent a stream of particles and radiation toward Earth. Purdue nuclear engineer Jere Jenkins, while measuring the decay rate of manganese-54, a short-lived isotope used in medical diagnostics, noticed that the rate dropped slightly during the flare, a decrease that started about a day and a half before the flare. If this apparent relationship between flares and decay rates proves true, it could lead to a method of predicting solar flares prior to their occurrence, which could help prevent damage to satellites and electric grids, as well as save the lives of astronauts in space. The decay-rate aberrations that Jenkins noticed occurred during the middle of the night in Indiana – meaning that something produced by the sun had traveled all the way through the Earth to reach Jenkins' detectors. What could the flare send forth that could have such an effect? Jenkins and Fischbach guessed that the culprits in this bit of decay-rate mischief were probably solar neutrinos, the almost weightless particles famous for flying at almost the speed of light through the physical world – humans, rocks, oceans or planets – with virtually no interaction with anything. Then, in a series of papers published in Astroparticle Physics, Nuclear Instruments and Methods in Physics Research and Space Science Reviews, Jenkins, Fischbach and their colleagues showed that the observed variations in decay rates were highly unlikely to have come from environmental influences on the detection systems. Reason for suspicion Their findings strengthened the argument that the strange swings in decay rates were caused by neutrinos from the sun. The swings seemed to be
RE: [Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
-Original Message- From: Harry Veeder [mailto:hlvee...@yahoo.com] Sent: Thursday, August 26, 2010 11:30 AM Stanford Report, August 23, 2010 The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements When researchers found an unusual linkage between solar flares and the inner life of radioactive elements on Earth... BY DAN STOBER It's a mystery that presented itself unexpectedly: The radioactive decay of some elements sitting quietly in laboratories on Earth seemed to be influenced by activities inside the sun, 93 million miles away. Is this possible?... YES Was this fluctuation real? YES Jenkins and Fischbach guessed that the culprits in this bit of decay-rate mischief were probably solar neutrinos IT WAS However, it is also firmly established, documented, and proven that the intention of the observer can affect the decay rate ( Even retroactively! ): http://www.paramuspost.com/article.php/2006071015214274 http://fourmilab.ch/rpkp/ http://noosphere.princeton.edu/ http://www.emergentmind.org/PDF_files.htm/timereversed.pdf Hoyt Stearns Scottsdale, Arizona US
Re: [Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
On Thu, Aug 26, 2010 at 8:29 PM, Harry Veeder hlvee...@yahoo.com wrote: A surprise Going back to take another look at the decay data from the Brookhaven lab, the researchers found a recurring pattern of 33 days. It was a bit of a surprise, given that most solar observations show a pattern of about 28 days – the rotation rate of the surface of the sun. The explanation? The core of the sun – where nuclear reactions produce neutrinos – apparently spins more slowly than the surface we see. It may seem counter-intuitive, but it looks as if the core rotates more slowly than the rest of the sun, Sturrock said. 33 days for the inner rotation of the sun is highly interesting. What would you say is the reason that the outher layer is rotating slower? Is there viscosity involved? I have my explanation but I have this far only been able to prove it for gases. I have mailed about it before here on vortex-l. If someone could provide me with the adiabatic heat gradient in the Sun I could calculate it for the Sun. My explanation is that viscosity is countered. If viscosity is active what are the driving torques due to? Shear flow in combination with viscosity requires torque to remain and not slow down. David
Re: [Vo]:The strange case of solar flares and radioactive elements
In reply to David Jonsson's message of Fri, 27 Aug 2010 00:57:16 +0200: Hi, [snip] If viscosity is active what are the driving torques due to? Shear flow in combination with viscosity requires torque to remain and not slow down. Here's a half-backed notion: The inner and out parts of the Sun act as stator and rotor of a giant electric motor, with power supplied by fusion. Regards, Robin van Spaandonk http://rvanspaa.freehostia.com/Project.html
