Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
Speaking of stimulus
http://www.ajc.com/news/biden-to-announce-fiber-243448.html
-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of David E. Smith
Sent: Thursday, December 17, 2009 9:42 AM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 21:56, Robert West
wrote:
> No, you were right, I was quoting from the Guide, it's just your
response
> reminded me of the guy who worked out 42 as the actual number.
>
> Google calculator comes up with 42, also, if you do a search for the
> meaning
> of life, the universe and everything. Just in case you missed that
one.
>
Fun fact: there actually is a way to make the Ultimate Question of Life,
The
Universe, and Everything ("what do you get if you multiply six by nine")
to
equal 42. If you do the math in base-13, 6x9 really is 42. Douglas Adams
was
as surprised as anyone by this revelation.
David Smith
MVN.net
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Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
On Wed, Dec 16, 2009 at 21:56, Robert West wrote:
> No, you were right, I was quoting from the Guide, it's just your response
> reminded me of the guy who worked out 42 as the actual number.
>
> Google calculator comes up with 42, also, if you do a search for the
> meaning
> of life, the universe and everything. Just in case you missed that one.
>
Fun fact: there actually is a way to make the Ultimate Question of Life, The
Universe, and Everything ("what do you get if you multiply six by nine") to
equal 42. If you do the math in base-13, 6x9 really is 42. Douglas Adams was
as surprised as anyone by this revelation.
David Smith
MVN.net
WISPA Wants You! Join today!
http://signup.wispa.org/
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org
Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
No, you were right, I was quoting from the Guide, it's just your response reminded me of the guy who worked out 42 as the actual number. Google calculator comes up with 42, also, if you do a search for the meaning of life, the universe and everything. Just in case you missed that one. (Has anyone ever set their Google language to "pirate"? I have a habit of doing that to my friends computers, heads up come next April 1st) -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 7:35 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice Oh, and I was giving you credit for quoting from Hitchikers Guide to the Galaxy, where 42 was the answer to the Universal Question. mg At 04:11 PM 12/16/2009, you wrote: >I read an interesting thing the other day concerning that. As proof that >you can use numbers to come to any conclusion that you desire, some smart >guy worked out some equation with the total mass of the universe (how in the >heck can anyone even calculate that?) and he comes up with an answer of 42. > >Same type of guy who said a person making 15 grand a year could afford a >loan on a $200k house. > >Bob- > > >-Original Message- >From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >Behalf Of MDK >Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 2:01 PM >To: WISPA General List >Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > >The universal answer to all questions. > >I had all but forgotten it... Thanks! > >now, if I could just remember > >-- >From: "Marlon K. Schafer" >Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 10:42 AM >To: "WISPA General List" >Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > > roflol > > > > Now THAT's funny! > > > > So long and thanks for all the fish! > > marlon > > > > - Original Message - > > From: "Robert West" > > To: "'WISPA General List'" > > Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 1:16 PM > > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > > > > >> 42 is the answer. > >> > >> -Original Message- > >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > >> Behalf Of RickG > >> Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 4:01 PM > >> To: WISPA General List > >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > >> > >> Thats right! And the government will provide us with REAL salaries too! > >> Actually, all I'm seeing is a REAL shaft coming. > >> Oh, one correction though, "thinking on this list." should be "by some > >> thinking on this list." :) > >> Not all here think the government is the answer. > >> -RickG > >> > >> On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 5:01 AM, MDK wrote: > >> > >>> That's because REAL broadband has to be provided by government. > >>> > >>> Just like REAL health care. > >>> Just like REAL education. > >>> Just like REAL science. > >>> > >>> Just ask the advocates of "government can make our lives a paradise" > >>> thinking on this list.I have "learned". > >>> > >>> All that private enterprise stuff... that's just profitmongering at the > >>> expense of the people.Get the government to buy it for you, and > >>> spend > >> 7 > >>> times as much for it and it's virtue, caring, love, and sainthood, all > >>> in > >>> one package. > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> -- > >>> From: "Scottie Arnett" > >>> Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 5:20 PM > >>> To: > >>> Subject: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > >>> > >>> > < http://www.cedmagazine.com/News-Broadband-stimulus-funds-121109.aspx > >>> > > > >>> > > >>> > "The $7.2 billion in broadband stimulus funding given out by President > >>> > Obama is not even close to enough to deploy truly universal broadband > >>> > access, according to a new study from Insight Research.&
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
Don't forget the towel.. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of MDK Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 1:01 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice The universal answer to all questions. I had all but forgotten it... Thanks! now, if I could just remember -- From: "Marlon K. Schafer" Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 10:42 AM To: "WISPA General List" Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > roflol > > Now THAT's funny! > > So long and thanks for all the fish! > marlon > > - Original Message - > From: "Robert West" > To: "'WISPA General List'" > Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 1:16 PM > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > >> 42 is the answer. >> >> -Original Message- >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >> Behalf Of RickG >> Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 4:01 PM >> To: WISPA General List >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice >> >> Thats right! And the government will provide us with REAL salaries too! >> Actually, all I'm seeing is a REAL shaft coming. >> Oh, one correction though, "thinking on this list." should be "by some >> thinking on this list." :) >> Not all here think the government is the answer. >> -RickG >> >> On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 5:01 AM, MDK wrote: >> >>> That's because REAL broadband has to be provided by government. >>> >>> Just like REAL health care. >>> Just like REAL education. >>> Just like REAL science. >>> >>> Just ask the advocates of "government can make our lives a paradise" >>> thinking on this list.I have "learned". >>> >>> All that private enterprise stuff... that's just profitmongering at the >>> expense of the people.Get the government to buy it for you, and >>> spend >> 7 >>> times as much for it and it's virtue, caring, love, and sainthood, all >>> in >>> one package. >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> From: "Scottie Arnett" >>> Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 5:20 PM >>> To: >>> Subject: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice >>> >>> > < http://www.cedmagazine.com/News-Broadband-stimulus-funds-121109.aspx >>> > > >>> > >>> > "The $7.2 billion in broadband stimulus funding given out by President >>> > Obama is not even close to enough to deploy truly universal broadband >>> > access, according to a new study from Insight Research." >>> > >>> > Scottie >>> > >>> > Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as >>> > $30.00/mth. >>> > Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> >> >> >>> > WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> > http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> > >>> >> >> >>> > >>> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> > >>> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> > >>> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >>> >> >> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
Oh, and I was giving you credit for quoting from Hitchikers Guide to the Galaxy, where 42 was the answer to the Universal Question. mg At 04:11 PM 12/16/2009, you wrote: >I read an interesting thing the other day concerning that. As proof that >you can use numbers to come to any conclusion that you desire, some smart >guy worked out some equation with the total mass of the universe (how in the >heck can anyone even calculate that?) and he comes up with an answer of 42. > >Same type of guy who said a person making 15 grand a year could afford a >loan on a $200k house. > >Bob- > > >-Original Message- >From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >Behalf Of MDK >Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 2:01 PM >To: WISPA General List >Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > >The universal answer to all questions. > >I had all but forgotten it... Thanks! > >now, if I could just remember > >-- >From: "Marlon K. Schafer" >Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 10:42 AM >To: "WISPA General List" >Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > > roflol > > > > Now THAT's funny! > > > > So long and thanks for all the fish! > > marlon > > > > - Original Message - > > From: "Robert West" > > To: "'WISPA General List'" > > Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 1:16 PM > > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > > > > >> 42 is the answer. > >> > >> -Original Message- > >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > >> Behalf Of RickG > >> Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 4:01 PM > >> To: WISPA General List > >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > >> > >> Thats right! And the government will provide us with REAL salaries too! > >> Actually, all I'm seeing is a REAL shaft coming. > >> Oh, one correction though, "thinking on this list." should be "by some > >> thinking on this list." :) > >> Not all here think the government is the answer. > >> -RickG > >> > >> On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 5:01 AM, MDK wrote: > >> > >>> That's because REAL broadband has to be provided by government. > >>> > >>> Just like REAL health care. > >>> Just like REAL education. > >>> Just like REAL science. > >>> > >>> Just ask the advocates of "government can make our lives a paradise" > >>> thinking on this list.I have "learned". > >>> > >>> All that private enterprise stuff... that's just profitmongering at the > >>> expense of the people.Get the government to buy it for you, and > >>> spend > >> 7 > >>> times as much for it and it's virtue, caring, love, and sainthood, all > >>> in > >>> one package. > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> -- > >>> From: "Scottie Arnett" > >>> Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 5:20 PM > >>> To: > >>> Subject: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > >>> > >>> > < http://www.cedmagazine.com/News-Broadband-stimulus-funds-121109.aspx > >>> > > > >>> > > >>> > "The $7.2 billion in broadband stimulus funding given out by President > >>> > Obama is not even close to enough to deploy truly universal broadband > >>> > access, according to a new study from Insight Research." > >>> > > >>> > Scottie > >>> > > >>> > Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as > >>> > $30.00/mth. > >>> > Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > > >>> > >> > > >> > >>> > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > >>> > http://signup.wispa.org/ > >>> > > >>> > >> > > >> > >>> > > >>> > WISPA
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
I read an interesting thing the other day concerning that. As proof that you can use numbers to come to any conclusion that you desire, some smart guy worked out some equation with the total mass of the universe (how in the heck can anyone even calculate that?) and he comes up with an answer of 42. Same type of guy who said a person making 15 grand a year could afford a loan on a $200k house. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of MDK Sent: Wednesday, December 16, 2009 2:01 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice The universal answer to all questions. I had all but forgotten it... Thanks! now, if I could just remember -- From: "Marlon K. Schafer" Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 10:42 AM To: "WISPA General List" Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > roflol > > Now THAT's funny! > > So long and thanks for all the fish! > marlon > > - Original Message - > From: "Robert West" > To: "'WISPA General List'" > Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 1:16 PM > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > >> 42 is the answer. >> >> -Original Message- >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >> Behalf Of RickG >> Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 4:01 PM >> To: WISPA General List >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice >> >> Thats right! And the government will provide us with REAL salaries too! >> Actually, all I'm seeing is a REAL shaft coming. >> Oh, one correction though, "thinking on this list." should be "by some >> thinking on this list." :) >> Not all here think the government is the answer. >> -RickG >> >> On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 5:01 AM, MDK wrote: >> >>> That's because REAL broadband has to be provided by government. >>> >>> Just like REAL health care. >>> Just like REAL education. >>> Just like REAL science. >>> >>> Just ask the advocates of "government can make our lives a paradise" >>> thinking on this list.I have "learned". >>> >>> All that private enterprise stuff... that's just profitmongering at the >>> expense of the people.Get the government to buy it for you, and >>> spend >> 7 >>> times as much for it and it's virtue, caring, love, and sainthood, all >>> in >>> one package. >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> From: "Scottie Arnett" >>> Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 5:20 PM >>> To: >>> Subject: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice >>> >>> > < http://www.cedmagazine.com/News-Broadband-stimulus-funds-121109.aspx >>> > > >>> > >>> > "The $7.2 billion in broadband stimulus funding given out by President >>> > Obama is not even close to enough to deploy truly universal broadband >>> > access, according to a new study from Insight Research." >>> > >>> > Scottie >>> > >>> > Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as >>> > $30.00/mth. >>> > Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> >> >> >>> > WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> > http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> > >>> >> >> >>> > >>> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> > >>> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> > >>> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >>> >> >> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
I certainly was not expecting a "Thanks for all the fish". You the man! Thanks, Marlon! -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Marlon K. Schafer Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 1:42 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice roflol Now THAT's funny! So long and thanks for all the fish! marlon - Original Message - From: "Robert West" To: "'WISPA General List'" Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 1:16 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > 42 is the answer. > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of RickG > Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 4:01 PM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > Thats right! And the government will provide us with REAL salaries too! > Actually, all I'm seeing is a REAL shaft coming. > Oh, one correction though, "thinking on this list." should be "by some > thinking on this list." :) > Not all here think the government is the answer. > -RickG > > On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 5:01 AM, MDK wrote: > >> That's because REAL broadband has to be provided by government. >> >> Just like REAL health care. >> Just like REAL education. >> Just like REAL science. >> >> Just ask the advocates of "government can make our lives a paradise" >> thinking on this list.I have "learned". >> >> All that private enterprise stuff... that's just profitmongering at the >> expense of the people.Get the government to buy it for you, and spend > 7 >> times as much for it and it's virtue, caring, love, and sainthood, all in >> one package. >> >> >> >> -- >> From: "Scottie Arnett" >> Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 5:20 PM >> To: >> Subject: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice >> >> > < http://www.cedmagazine.com/News-Broadband-stimulus-funds-121109.aspx >> > > >> > >> > "The $7.2 billion in broadband stimulus funding given out by President >> > Obama is not even close to enough to deploy truly universal broadband >> > access, according to a new study from Insight Research." >> > >> > Scottie >> > >> > Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as >> > $30.00/mth. >> > Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. >> > >> > >> > >> > > >> > WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> > http://signup.wispa.org/ >> > >> > > >> > >> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> > >> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> > >> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> >> > > >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> > > >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
The universal answer to all questions. I had all but forgotten it... Thanks! now, if I could just remember -- From: "Marlon K. Schafer" Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 10:42 AM To: "WISPA General List" Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > roflol > > Now THAT's funny! > > So long and thanks for all the fish! > marlon > > - Original Message - > From: "Robert West" > To: "'WISPA General List'" > Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 1:16 PM > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > >> 42 is the answer. >> >> -Original Message- >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >> Behalf Of RickG >> Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 4:01 PM >> To: WISPA General List >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice >> >> Thats right! And the government will provide us with REAL salaries too! >> Actually, all I'm seeing is a REAL shaft coming. >> Oh, one correction though, "thinking on this list." should be "by some >> thinking on this list." :) >> Not all here think the government is the answer. >> -RickG >> >> On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 5:01 AM, MDK wrote: >> >>> That's because REAL broadband has to be provided by government. >>> >>> Just like REAL health care. >>> Just like REAL education. >>> Just like REAL science. >>> >>> Just ask the advocates of "government can make our lives a paradise" >>> thinking on this list.I have "learned". >>> >>> All that private enterprise stuff... that's just profitmongering at the >>> expense of the people.Get the government to buy it for you, and >>> spend >> 7 >>> times as much for it and it's virtue, caring, love, and sainthood, all >>> in >>> one package. >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> From: "Scottie Arnett" >>> Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 5:20 PM >>> To: >>> Subject: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice >>> >>> > < http://www.cedmagazine.com/News-Broadband-stimulus-funds-121109.aspx >>> > > >>> > >>> > "The $7.2 billion in broadband stimulus funding given out by President >>> > Obama is not even close to enough to deploy truly universal broadband >>> > access, according to a new study from Insight Research." >>> > >>> > Scottie >>> > >>> > Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as >>> > $30.00/mth. >>> > Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> >> >> >>> > WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> > http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> > >>> >> >> >>> > >>> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> > >>> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> > >>> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >>> >> >> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://list
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
roflol Now THAT's funny! So long and thanks for all the fish! marlon - Original Message - From: "Robert West" To: "'WISPA General List'" Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 1:16 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > 42 is the answer. > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of RickG > Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 4:01 PM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > Thats right! And the government will provide us with REAL salaries too! > Actually, all I'm seeing is a REAL shaft coming. > Oh, one correction though, "thinking on this list." should be "by some > thinking on this list." :) > Not all here think the government is the answer. > -RickG > > On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 5:01 AM, MDK wrote: > >> That's because REAL broadband has to be provided by government. >> >> Just like REAL health care. >> Just like REAL education. >> Just like REAL science. >> >> Just ask the advocates of "government can make our lives a paradise" >> thinking on this list.I have "learned". >> >> All that private enterprise stuff... that's just profitmongering at the >> expense of the people.Get the government to buy it for you, and spend > 7 >> times as much for it and it's virtue, caring, love, and sainthood, all in >> one package. >> >> >> >> -- >> From: "Scottie Arnett" >> Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 5:20 PM >> To: >> Subject: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice >> >> > < http://www.cedmagazine.com/News-Broadband-stimulus-funds-121109.aspx >> > > >> > >> > "The $7.2 billion in broadband stimulus funding given out by President >> > Obama is not even close to enough to deploy truly universal broadband >> > access, according to a new study from Insight Research." >> > >> > Scottie >> > >> > Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as >> > $30.00/mth. >> > Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. >> > >> > >> > >> > > >> > WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> > http://signup.wispa.org/ >> > >> > > >> > >> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> > >> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> > >> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> >> > > >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> > > >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
Yeah, that's kind of true.But I'm not quite understanding your context. Utilities, that is, gas, electricity, etc, are generally private companies and get their rates set for them. All they have to do to get a rate increase is prove they're losing money. While they're always careful to show "nominal profit" in accounting, the business models are rarely efficient. They could no more compete in an open market than you or I could flap our arms and fly. They just play a game of "keep the politicians happy" and they get lifetime security AND profits. You'll never see the power company using old trucks and making do with cheap office space.Their version of "budgeting" is "how to make sure all the money is spent" each year, in order to justify the rates they charge. That game sound familiar?That's how EVERY agency operates financially. BTW, that's how every non-profit works too. Why can't I play it? Just askin. -- From: "Robert West" Sent: Tuesday, December 15, 2009 3:04 AM To: "'WISPA General List'" Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > Walks on the edge of survival. Most non-profits rely on outside funding. > An organization that is set up to serve the people and not make a profit > is > usually a careful balance unless they have a perpetual endowment. > > > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of MDK > Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 9:36 PM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > Walks on the edge of what? > > For many decades, we paid HUGE per minute prices for long distance.And > rather large sums just to have a phone, for that matter. The telcos > innovated nothing. They thought of "innovation" as some small thing > every > 20 years. > > Why? You know the answer. No free market. > > Once finally got the door busted down, and competition entered... Voice > services, long distance or not, cost so little they are insignificant. > And the range of services exploded. > > Do you want the ISP business to do the same? > > Just get Uncle Sam involved and it'll come to a screeching halt, all us > small players will go away, and we'll have non evolutionary communications > for a few decades. > > Fortunately, it seems the cat is out of the bag, and we're too hard to > stuff > > back in, though the Congress and FCC so badly want to. > > Medicare refused to pay for services and as a result, my mother died 20 > years too soon. > The VA medical system is unresponsive. My father died of rather > pointless > issues in a VA hospital because the care just isn't... "there". > Social Security is a scam that makes Madoff look like Robin Hood. > Government created monopolies and we suffered for decades because of > them... > > still do. > > I read somewhere in this thread that I or someone had claimed the free > market will do everything. NO, it will not. But it will do the best > that can be done. And government will do the worst. > > And I'll stake my LIFE on that. > > > > -- > From: "Robert West" > Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 1:55 PM > To: "'WISPA General List'" > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > >> But none of those would work unless they were setup as a not for profit. >> Any entity that is to serve the people AND generate profit walks on the >> edge. >> >> Bob- >> >> >> >> -Original Message- >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >> Behalf Of MDK >> Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 4:37 PM >> To: WISPA General List >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice >> >> >> And each of these is the evidence I have that I do NOT want them doing >> anything more, and I want them OUT of those things, as well. >> >> >> >> -- >> From: "Tim Sylvester" >> Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 5:27 PM >> To: "'WISPA General List'" >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice >> >>> Yes, I am amazed. Amazed by the bitching and whining about government on >>> this list by people who ... >>> >>> - sell wireles
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
Walks on the edge of survival. Most non-profits rely on outside funding. An organization that is set up to serve the people and not make a profit is usually a careful balance unless they have a perpetual endowment. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of MDK Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 9:36 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice Walks on the edge of what? For many decades, we paid HUGE per minute prices for long distance.And rather large sums just to have a phone, for that matter. The telcos innovated nothing. They thought of "innovation" as some small thing every 20 years. Why? You know the answer. No free market. Once finally got the door busted down, and competition entered... Voice services, long distance or not, cost so little they are insignificant. And the range of services exploded. Do you want the ISP business to do the same? Just get Uncle Sam involved and it'll come to a screeching halt, all us small players will go away, and we'll have non evolutionary communications for a few decades. Fortunately, it seems the cat is out of the bag, and we're too hard to stuff back in, though the Congress and FCC so badly want to. Medicare refused to pay for services and as a result, my mother died 20 years too soon. The VA medical system is unresponsive. My father died of rather pointless issues in a VA hospital because the care just isn't... "there". Social Security is a scam that makes Madoff look like Robin Hood. Government created monopolies and we suffered for decades because of them... still do. I read somewhere in this thread that I or someone had claimed the free market will do everything. NO, it will not. But it will do the best that can be done. And government will do the worst. And I'll stake my LIFE on that. -- From: "Robert West" Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 1:55 PM To: "'WISPA General List'" Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > But none of those would work unless they were setup as a not for profit. > Any entity that is to serve the people AND generate profit walks on the > edge. > > Bob- > > > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of MDK > Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 4:37 PM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > > And each of these is the evidence I have that I do NOT want them doing > anything more, and I want them OUT of those things, as well. > > > > ---------------------- > From: "Tim Sylvester" > Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 5:27 PM > To: "'WISPA General List'" > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > >> Yes, I am amazed. Amazed by the bitching and whining about government on >> this list by people who ... >> >> - sell wireless service using spectrum "owned" by everyone and allocated >> to >> them by the FCC for free or low cost. >> - sell access to the Internet, a network originally funded and developed >> by >> DARPA and later funded by the National Science Foundation. >> - drive on roads funded with taxpayer dollars and maintained by the >> government. >> - sell Internet service in rural areas to farmers that receive billions >> in >> government subsidies per year. >> - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the >> Rural >> Electric Administration. >> - use VA health services. >> - will use Medicare and Social Security when they retire. >> - call the police and fire department when they need help. >> - send their kids to public schools. >> >> Amazing. >> >> Tim >> >> >> >> > > >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> > > >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > >
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
Sorry to reply to my own thread To add: While he was GM of NCTC and under the ownership of the said company, he gave a million dollars for a computer company in the town, YES I SAID $1,000,000 for a computer company in a town of a population in July 2008: 4,426( now I need to state the population may have been bigger or smaller at that time because this happened around circa 2000). It became North Central Computer Technologies < http://web3.userinstinct.com/40019409-north-central-computer-technologies-inc.htm >. Oh, did I forget to mention that the owners of this company before it was bought by NCTC, happened to be a close friend or relative of Rowland? The computer operation has since been sold to another company as it was losing money. This was after they built them a $300,000 building in Lafayette. Under his direction before retirement, they also gave $500,000 for a local security company. It is still in operation : < http://www.ncss.nctc.com/ >. My reason for stating all these facts is: where is the Fed's when all this bull went on? I personally contacted the TRA(Tennessee Regulatory Authority), the RUS (Rural Utility Services), and the FCC and NOTHING was ever done about it. Now talk about some crazy spending and the government not controlling their sheep! Scottie -- Original Message -- From: "Scottie Arnett" Reply-To: sarn...@info-ed.com, WISPA General List Date: Mon, 14 Dec 2009 21:17:00 -0600 >>From what I have seen from NFP rural cooperatives(electric and telco), the >>Administrative staff gets NICE bonuses or RAISES when they make too much >>money. The common pole climber gets a nice little raise too, or bonus, just >>enough to not raise any questions. I have seen them refund $20 per member if >>you have been with them 20 years or more. > >I do know that one GM at a telco cooperative was making $180,000 per >year(supposedly close to the the highest if not the highest paid GM of a rural >telco cooperative, just because he was elected NCTA's incoming president. < >http://www.encyclopedia.com/doc/1G1-144567858.html >. This came directly from >inside sources and my ability as a cooperative member to ask for such records, >which they turned over to me, yet reluctantly. He then retired within two >years. Anyways, I compete against his former company day to day. > >Scottie > >-- Original Message -- >From: "Robert West" >Reply-To: WISPA General List >Date: Mon, 14 Dec 2009 17:18:16 -0500 > >>I may be wrong but I thought that most non-profits have lots of >>accountability as well as a board of directors. I'm not an expert, however, >>just from what I've seen from the edges when dealing with them. >> >> >>-Original Message- >>From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >>Behalf Of ccrum >>Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 5:05 PM >>To: WISPA General List >>Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice >> >>With the exception of the local civil services, I would think that if >>there were a profit involved in those things, then maybe there would be >>some accountability too. As it is, most of those programs are nothing to >>write home about and most don't spend MY money wisely. >> >>Cameron >> >>Robert West wrote: >>> But none of those would work unless they were setup as a not for profit. >>> Any entity that is to serve the people AND generate profit walks on the >>> edge. >>> >>> Bob- >>> >>> >>> >>> -Original Message- >>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >>> Behalf Of MDK >>> Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 4:37 PM >>> To: WISPA General List >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice >>> >>> >>> And each of these is the evidence I have that I do NOT want them doing >>> anything more, and I want them OUT of those things, as well. >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> From: "Tim Sylvester" >>> Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 5:27 PM >>> To: "'WISPA General List'" >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice >>> >>> >>>> Yes, I am amazed. Amazed by the bitching and whining about government on >>>> this list by people who ... >>>> >>>> - sell wireless service using spectrum "owne
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
>From what I have seen from NFP rural cooperatives(electric and telco), the >Administrative staff gets NICE bonuses or RAISES when they make too much >money. The common pole climber gets a nice little raise too, or bonus, just >enough to not raise any questions. I have seen them refund $20 per member if >you have been with them 20 years or more. I do know that one GM at a telco cooperative was making $180,000 per year(supposedly close to the the highest if not the highest paid GM of a rural telco cooperative, just because he was elected NCTA's incoming president. < http://www.encyclopedia.com/doc/1G1-144567858.html >. This came directly from inside sources and my ability as a cooperative member to ask for such records, which they turned over to me, yet reluctantly. He then retired within two years. Anyways, I compete against his former company day to day. Scottie -- Original Message -- From: "Robert West" Reply-To: WISPA General List Date: Mon, 14 Dec 2009 17:18:16 -0500 >I may be wrong but I thought that most non-profits have lots of >accountability as well as a board of directors. I'm not an expert, however, >just from what I've seen from the edges when dealing with them. > > >-Original Message- >From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >Behalf Of ccrum >Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 5:05 PM >To: WISPA General List >Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > >With the exception of the local civil services, I would think that if >there were a profit involved in those things, then maybe there would be >some accountability too. As it is, most of those programs are nothing to >write home about and most don't spend MY money wisely. > >Cameron > >Robert West wrote: >> But none of those would work unless they were setup as a not for profit. >> Any entity that is to serve the people AND generate profit walks on the >> edge. >> >> Bob- >> >> >> >> -Original Message- >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >> Behalf Of MDK >> Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 4:37 PM >> To: WISPA General List >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice >> >> >> And each of these is the evidence I have that I do NOT want them doing >> anything more, and I want them OUT of those things, as well. >> >> >> >> -- >> From: "Tim Sylvester" >> Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 5:27 PM >> To: "'WISPA General List'" >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice >> >> >>> Yes, I am amazed. Amazed by the bitching and whining about government on >>> this list by people who ... >>> >>> - sell wireless service using spectrum "owned" by everyone and allocated >>> to >>> them by the FCC for free or low cost. >>> - sell access to the Internet, a network originally funded and developed >>> by >>> DARPA and later funded by the National Science Foundation. >>> - drive on roads funded with taxpayer dollars and maintained by the >>> government. >>> - sell Internet service in rural areas to farmers that receive billions >in >>> government subsidies per year. >>> - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the >Rural >>> Electric Administration. >>> - use VA health services. >>> - will use Medicare and Social Security when they retire. >>> - call the police and fire department when they need help. >>> - send their kids to public schools. >>> >>> Amazing. >>> >>> Tim >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> > >> >> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >>> >> > >> >> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >> >> >> >> > >>
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
This thread has gone on for far too long. Once again, it's time to stop feeding the troll. MDK wrote: Walks on the edge of what? For many decades, we paid HUGE per minute prices for long distance.And rather large sums just to have a phone, for that matter. The telcos innovated nothing. They thought of "innovation" as some small thing every 20 years. Why? You know the answer. No free market. Once finally got the door busted down, and competition entered... Voice services, long distance or not, cost so little they are insignificant. And the range of services exploded. Do you want the ISP business to do the same? Just get Uncle Sam involved and it'll come to a screeching halt, all us small players will go away, and we'll have non evolutionary communications for a few decades. Fortunately, it seems the cat is out of the bag, and we're too hard to stuff back in, though the Congress and FCC so badly want to. Medicare refused to pay for services and as a result, my mother died 20 years too soon. The VA medical system is unresponsive. My father died of rather pointless issues in a VA hospital because the care just isn't... "there". Social Security is a scam that makes Madoff look like Robin Hood. Government created monopolies and we suffered for decades because of them... still do. I read somewhere in this thread that I or someone had claimed the free market will do everything. NO, it will not. But it will do the best that can be done. And government will do the worst. And I'll stake my LIFE on that. -- From: "Robert West" Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 1:55 PM To: "'WISPA General List'" Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice But none of those would work unless they were setup as a not for profit. Any entity that is to serve the people AND generate profit walks on the edge. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of MDK Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 4:37 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice And each of these is the evidence I have that I do NOT want them doing anything more, and I want them OUT of those things, as well. -- From: "Tim Sylvester" Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 5:27 PM To: "'WISPA General List'" Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice Yes, I am amazed. Amazed by the bitching and whining about government on this list by people who ... - sell wireless service using spectrum "owned" by everyone and allocated to them by the FCC for free or low cost. - sell access to the Internet, a network originally funded and developed by DARPA and later funded by the National Science Foundation. - drive on roads funded with taxpayer dollars and maintained by the government. - sell Internet service in rural areas to farmers that receive billions in government subsidies per year. - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the Rural Electric Administration. - use VA health services. - will use Medicare and Social Security when they retire. - call the police and fire department when they need help. - send their kids to public schools. Amazing. Tim WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
I built a tower one time in a place nobody else was able. The first thing I did was analyze the tower ordinance in the county. There was a special exception for an essential service. My tact was to get the county to admit I was an essential service. Once they did, the building permit was right behind. They pinned me down to how high the tower had to be for the path I was building. I had to show a path analysis Pinnacle did that showed the path needed 100 feet. I engineered and built the tower for 150 feet but didn't put the last 50 foot on. It was a monopole, and the caisson was engineered for the full height and to withstand their 140 mph wind load. The tower ordinance had a clause that said a one time extension of 50 feet was allowed on existing towers if it was for an essential service. I pulled out my papers and added the 50 feet. Once it was up, the wireless carriers all wanted on it. I rented to Metro PCS, AT&T, Sprint and a couple others. The tower was paid for in a little over a year. Oh yeah, why were we an essential service? We were a CLEC. We put up some Nortel OC3 licensed radios and linked back to our NOC. Then we put one of the very first Canopy deployments on that tower. So a utility can useful, but in this case, being an essential service was the key. mg At 08:00 PM 12/14/2009, you wrote: >Tom, > >According to Dictionary.com "Utility" just means "Useful." A service becomes >a utility when it becomes readily available and so useful that it is vital >to day to day life. When your phone or water or electricity goes out, that >is a real big deal because we expect utilities to be there and we depend on >them. The same is becoming more true with the internet. Technical complexity >can keep something from becoming a utility because people can't count on it. >But phones were very complex when they were introduced and problems were >hard to diagnose. As technology evolved they became important enough and >reliable enough to become a utility. Internet connectivity is following that >same path. > >Mark > > >On 12/14/09 6:14 PM, "Tom DeReggi" wrote: > > > Tim, > > Interesting quotes that you posted. > > > > I also challenge the definition of "utility" and what qualifies. Another > > subjective point of view often misunderstood, and how that translates to > > "need" and "broadband". > > Broadband is in no way a "utility" either. The reason is that it has an > > intelligence component that cant be avoided. For example, if broadband > > stops working from the perspective of the user, is it within the control of > > that consumer to indentify the cause of failure on their own, and if it is > > in fact a broadband outage? How do they tell if its the PC, the > PC's loaded > > software, a failed router, the destination web site, or the actual > > broadband? Every tool the end user needs to make that determination he has > > acces to, they just dont have the intelligence to understand how to run the > > tools to get the data. All it takes is a day in a phone support center to > > prove my point. Broadband needs "support". It is unavoidable. > Therefore not > > a basic utility. > > Electricity and water on the other hand is a utility, an consumers knows > > when it is on or off, they dont need a support center to tell them that. > > Sure they may want to call to get an ETA for repair, but thats about it, > > they know who is responsible. BRoadband is simply to technical and > > complicated to be classified as a utility, even if it is of similar need in > > some people's mind. > > Any time "quality of support" is a large part of a user's > experience, it has > > factors that cant be measured easilly and equally for comparison > to regulate > > what is fair price. > > > > Tom DeReggi > > RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc > > IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband > > > > > > - Original Message - > > From: "Tim Sylvester" > > To: "'WISPA General List'" > > Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 2:47 PM > > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > > > > >> A flashback to 1905 ... > >> > >> "Unless we adopt the principles of socialism, It can hardly be contended > >> that It is the province of government, either state or municipal, to > >> undertake the manufacture or supply of the ordinary subjects of trade and > >> commerce, or to impose burdens upon the whole community for the supposed > >> benefit of a few.. > >> &
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
Walks on the edge of what? For many decades, we paid HUGE per minute prices for long distance.And rather large sums just to have a phone, for that matter. The telcos innovated nothing. They thought of "innovation" as some small thing every 20 years. Why? You know the answer. No free market. Once finally got the door busted down, and competition entered... Voice services, long distance or not, cost so little they are insignificant. And the range of services exploded. Do you want the ISP business to do the same? Just get Uncle Sam involved and it'll come to a screeching halt, all us small players will go away, and we'll have non evolutionary communications for a few decades. Fortunately, it seems the cat is out of the bag, and we're too hard to stuff back in, though the Congress and FCC so badly want to. Medicare refused to pay for services and as a result, my mother died 20 years too soon. The VA medical system is unresponsive. My father died of rather pointless issues in a VA hospital because the care just isn't... "there". Social Security is a scam that makes Madoff look like Robin Hood. Government created monopolies and we suffered for decades because of them... still do. I read somewhere in this thread that I or someone had claimed the free market will do everything. NO, it will not. But it will do the best that can be done. And government will do the worst. And I'll stake my LIFE on that. -- From: "Robert West" Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 1:55 PM To: "'WISPA General List'" Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > But none of those would work unless they were setup as a not for profit. > Any entity that is to serve the people AND generate profit walks on the > edge. > > Bob- > > > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of MDK > Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 4:37 PM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > > And each of these is the evidence I have that I do NOT want them doing > anything more, and I want them OUT of those things, as well. > > > > ------------------ > From: "Tim Sylvester" > Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 5:27 PM > To: "'WISPA General List'" > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > >> Yes, I am amazed. Amazed by the bitching and whining about government on >> this list by people who ... >> >> - sell wireless service using spectrum "owned" by everyone and allocated >> to >> them by the FCC for free or low cost. >> - sell access to the Internet, a network originally funded and developed >> by >> DARPA and later funded by the National Science Foundation. >> - drive on roads funded with taxpayer dollars and maintained by the >> government. >> - sell Internet service in rural areas to farmers that receive billions >> in >> government subsidies per year. >> - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the >> Rural >> Electric Administration. >> - use VA health services. >> - will use Medicare and Social Security when they retire. >> - call the police and fire department when they need help. >> - send their kids to public schools. >> >> Amazing. >> >> Tim >> >> >> >> > > >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> > > >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > >
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
Tom, According to Dictionary.com "Utility" just means "Useful." A service becomes a utility when it becomes readily available and so useful that it is vital to day to day life. When your phone or water or electricity goes out, that is a real big deal because we expect utilities to be there and we depend on them. The same is becoming more true with the internet. Technical complexity can keep something from becoming a utility because people can't count on it. But phones were very complex when they were introduced and problems were hard to diagnose. As technology evolved they became important enough and reliable enough to become a utility. Internet connectivity is following that same path. Mark On 12/14/09 6:14 PM, "Tom DeReggi" wrote: > Tim, > Interesting quotes that you posted. > > I also challenge the definition of "utility" and what qualifies. Another > subjective point of view often misunderstood, and how that translates to > "need" and "broadband". > Broadband is in no way a "utility" either. The reason is that it has an > intelligence component that cant be avoided. For example, if broadband > stops working from the perspective of the user, is it within the control of > that consumer to indentify the cause of failure on their own, and if it is > in fact a broadband outage? How do they tell if its the PC, the PC's loaded > software, a failed router, the destination web site, or the actual > broadband? Every tool the end user needs to make that determination he has > acces to, they just dont have the intelligence to understand how to run the > tools to get the data. All it takes is a day in a phone support center to > prove my point. Broadband needs "support". It is unavoidable. Therefore not > a basic utility. > Electricity and water on the other hand is a utility, an consumers knows > when it is on or off, they dont need a support center to tell them that. > Sure they may want to call to get an ETA for repair, but thats about it, > they know who is responsible. BRoadband is simply to technical and > complicated to be classified as a utility, even if it is of similar need in > some people's mind. > Any time "quality of support" is a large part of a user's experience, it has > factors that cant be measured easilly and equally for comparison to regulate > what is fair price. > > Tom DeReggi > RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc > IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband > > > - Original Message - > From: "Tim Sylvester" > To: "'WISPA General List'" > Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 2:47 PM > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > >> A flashback to 1905 ... >> >> "Unless we adopt the principles of socialism, It can hardly be contended >> that It is the province of government, either state or municipal, to >> undertake the manufacture or supply of the ordinary subjects of trade and >> commerce, or to impose burdens upon the whole community for the supposed >> benefit of a few.. >> >> "The ownership and operation of municipal light plants stands upon a >> different basis from that of the ownership of water works, with which it >> is >> so often compared. Water is a necessity to the health and life of every >> individual member of a community.It must be supplied in order to preserve >> the public health, whether it can be done profitably or not, and must be >> furnished, not to a few individuals, but to every individual. >> >> "Electric lights are different. Electricity is not in any sense a >> necessity, >> and under no conditions is it universally used by the people of a >> community. >> It is but a luxury enjoyed by a small proportion of the members of any >> municipality, and yet if the plant be owned and operated by the city, the >> burden of such ownership and operation must be borne by all the people >> through taxation. >> >> "Now, electric light is not a necessity for every member of the community. >> It Is not the business of any one to see that I use electricity, or gas, >> or >> oil in my house, or even that I use any form of artificial light at all." >> >> and the 2009 version ... >> >> "Unless we adopt the principles of socialism, It can hardly be contended >> that It is the province of government, either state or municipal, to >> undertake the manufacture or supply of the ordinary subjects of trade and >> commerce, or to impose burdens upon the whole community for the supposed >> benefit of a few.. >> >> "The owner
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
Tim, Interesting quotes that you posted. I also challenge the definition of "utility" and what qualifies. Another subjective point of view often misunderstood, and how that translates to "need" and "broadband". Broadband is in no way a "utility" either. The reason is that it has an intelligence component that cant be avoided. For example, if broadband stops working from the perspective of the user, is it within the control of that consumer to indentify the cause of failure on their own, and if it is in fact a broadband outage? How do they tell if its the PC, the PC's loaded software, a failed router, the destination web site, or the actual broadband? Every tool the end user needs to make that determination he has acces to, they just dont have the intelligence to understand how to run the tools to get the data. All it takes is a day in a phone support center to prove my point. Broadband needs "support". It is unavoidable. Therefore not a basic utility. Electricity and water on the other hand is a utility, an consumers knows when it is on or off, they dont need a support center to tell them that. Sure they may want to call to get an ETA for repair, but thats about it, they know who is responsible. BRoadband is simply to technical and complicated to be classified as a utility, even if it is of similar need in some people's mind. Any time "quality of support" is a large part of a user's experience, it has factors that cant be measured easilly and equally for comparison to regulate what is fair price. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: "Tim Sylvester" To: "'WISPA General List'" Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 2:47 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice >A flashback to 1905 ... > > "Unless we adopt the principles of socialism, It can hardly be contended > that It is the province of government, either state or municipal, to > undertake the manufacture or supply of the ordinary subjects of trade and > commerce, or to impose burdens upon the whole community for the supposed > benefit of a few.. > > "The ownership and operation of municipal light plants stands upon a > different basis from that of the ownership of water works, with which it > is > so often compared. Water is a necessity to the health and life of every > individual member of a community.It must be supplied in order to preserve > the public health, whether it can be done profitably or not, and must be > furnished, not to a few individuals, but to every individual. > > "Electric lights are different. Electricity is not in any sense a > necessity, > and under no conditions is it universally used by the people of a > community. > It is but a luxury enjoyed by a small proportion of the members of any > municipality, and yet if the plant be owned and operated by the city, the > burden of such ownership and operation must be borne by all the people > through taxation. > > "Now, electric light is not a necessity for every member of the community. > It Is not the business of any one to see that I use electricity, or gas, > or > oil in my house, or even that I use any form of artificial light at all." > > and the 2009 version ... > > "Unless we adopt the principles of socialism, It can hardly be contended > that It is the province of government, either state or municipal, to > undertake the manufacture or supply of the ordinary subjects of trade and > commerce, or to impose burdens upon the whole community for the supposed > benefit of a few.. > > "The ownership and operation of municipal [broadband] stands upon a > different basis from that of the ownership of [electric plants], with > which > it is so often compared. [Electricity] is a necessity to the health and > life > of every individual member of a community.It must be supplied in order to > preserve the public health, whether it can be done profitably or not, and > must be furnished, not to a few individuals, but to every individual. > > "[Broadband is] different. [Broadband] is not in any sense a necessity, > and > under no conditions is it universally used by the people of a community. > It > is but a luxury enjoyed by a small proportion of the members of any > municipality, and yet if the [network] be owned and operated by the city, > the burden of such ownership and operation must be borne by all the people > through taxation. > > "Now, [broadband] is not a necessity for every member of the community. It > Is not the business of any one to see that I use [broadband or dial-up] in > my house, or even that I use [the Intern
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
http://imgsrv.gocomics.com/dim/?fh=bdeca0d1852c43b8f716894a4f89d808 On 12/14/2009 3:18 PM, Robert West wrote: > I may be wrong but I thought that most non-profits have lots of > accountability as well as a board of directors. I'm not an expert, however, > just from what I've seen from the edges when dealing with them. > > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of ccrum > Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 5:05 PM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > With the exception of the local civil services, I would think that if > there were a profit involved in those things, then maybe there would be > some accountability too. As it is, most of those programs are nothing to > write home about and most don't spend MY money wisely. > > Cameron > > Robert West wrote: > >> But none of those would work unless they were setup as a not for profit. >> Any entity that is to serve the people AND generate profit walks on the >> edge. >> >> Bob- >> >> >> >> -Original Message- >> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >> Behalf Of MDK >> Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 4:37 PM >> To: WISPA General List >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice >> >> >> And each of these is the evidence I have that I do NOT want them doing >> anything more, and I want them OUT of those things, as well. >> >> >> >> -- >> From: "Tim Sylvester" >> Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 5:27 PM >> To: "'WISPA General List'" >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice >> >> >> >>> Yes, I am amazed. Amazed by the bitching and whining about government on >>> this list by people who ... >>> >>> - sell wireless service using spectrum "owned" by everyone and allocated >>> to >>> them by the FCC for free or low cost. >>> - sell access to the Internet, a network originally funded and developed >>> by >>> DARPA and later funded by the National Science Foundation. >>> - drive on roads funded with taxpayer dollars and maintained by the >>> government. >>> - sell Internet service in rural areas to farmers that receive billions >>> > in > >>> government subsidies per year. >>> - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the >>> > Rural > >>> Electric Administration. >>> - use VA health services. >>> - will use Medicare and Social Security when they retire. >>> - call the police and fire department when they need help. >>> - send their kids to public schools. >>> >>> Amazing. >>> >>> Tim >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> > > >> >> >> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >>> >>> >> > > >> >> >> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >> >> >> >> > > >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> > > >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> >> > > > >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> > > > >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wirel
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
I may be wrong but I thought that most non-profits have lots of accountability as well as a board of directors. I'm not an expert, however, just from what I've seen from the edges when dealing with them. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of ccrum Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 5:05 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice With the exception of the local civil services, I would think that if there were a profit involved in those things, then maybe there would be some accountability too. As it is, most of those programs are nothing to write home about and most don't spend MY money wisely. Cameron Robert West wrote: > But none of those would work unless they were setup as a not for profit. > Any entity that is to serve the people AND generate profit walks on the > edge. > > Bob- > > > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of MDK > Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 4:37 PM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > > And each of these is the evidence I have that I do NOT want them doing > anything more, and I want them OUT of those things, as well. > > > > -- > From: "Tim Sylvester" > Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 5:27 PM > To: "'WISPA General List'" > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > >> Yes, I am amazed. Amazed by the bitching and whining about government on >> this list by people who ... >> >> - sell wireless service using spectrum "owned" by everyone and allocated >> to >> them by the FCC for free or low cost. >> - sell access to the Internet, a network originally funded and developed >> by >> DARPA and later funded by the National Science Foundation. >> - drive on roads funded with taxpayer dollars and maintained by the >> government. >> - sell Internet service in rural areas to farmers that receive billions in >> government subsidies per year. >> - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the Rural >> Electric Administration. >> - use VA health services. >> - will use Medicare and Social Security when they retire. >> - call the police and fire department when they need help. >> - send their kids to public schools. >> >> Amazing. >> >> Tim >> >> >> >> >> > > > >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> > > > >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
With the exception of the local civil services, I would think that if there were a profit involved in those things, then maybe there would be some accountability too. As it is, most of those programs are nothing to write home about and most don't spend MY money wisely. Cameron Robert West wrote: > But none of those would work unless they were setup as a not for profit. > Any entity that is to serve the people AND generate profit walks on the > edge. > > Bob- > > > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of MDK > Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 4:37 PM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > > And each of these is the evidence I have that I do NOT want them doing > anything more, and I want them OUT of those things, as well. > > > > -- > From: "Tim Sylvester" > Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 5:27 PM > To: "'WISPA General List'" > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > >> Yes, I am amazed. Amazed by the bitching and whining about government on >> this list by people who ... >> >> - sell wireless service using spectrum "owned" by everyone and allocated >> to >> them by the FCC for free or low cost. >> - sell access to the Internet, a network originally funded and developed >> by >> DARPA and later funded by the National Science Foundation. >> - drive on roads funded with taxpayer dollars and maintained by the >> government. >> - sell Internet service in rural areas to farmers that receive billions in >> government subsidies per year. >> - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the Rural >> Electric Administration. >> - use VA health services. >> - will use Medicare and Social Security when they retire. >> - call the police and fire department when they need help. >> - send their kids to public schools. >> >> Amazing. >> >> Tim >> >> >> >> >> > > > >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> > > > >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
But none of those would work unless they were setup as a not for profit. Any entity that is to serve the people AND generate profit walks on the edge. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of MDK Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 4:37 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice And each of these is the evidence I have that I do NOT want them doing anything more, and I want them OUT of those things, as well. -- From: "Tim Sylvester" Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 5:27 PM To: "'WISPA General List'" Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > Yes, I am amazed. Amazed by the bitching and whining about government on > this list by people who ... > > - sell wireless service using spectrum "owned" by everyone and allocated > to > them by the FCC for free or low cost. > - sell access to the Internet, a network originally funded and developed > by > DARPA and later funded by the National Science Foundation. > - drive on roads funded with taxpayer dollars and maintained by the > government. > - sell Internet service in rural areas to farmers that receive billions in > government subsidies per year. > - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the Rural > Electric Administration. > - use VA health services. > - will use Medicare and Social Security when they retire. > - call the police and fire department when they need help. > - send their kids to public schools. > > Amazing. > > Tim > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
No, he robbed from the corrupt people of the government and gave it back to the people. -- From: "Robert West" Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 9:09 AM To: "'WISPA General List'" Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > Why not? Robin Hood did it. > > Oh, wait, he robbed from the rich and gave to the poor... This is the > other > way around. My mistake. > > Sorry. > > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of RickG > Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 12:05 PM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > I workde for an REA. One of the most wasteful companies I've ever seen. > Private companies could do a much better job. Besides, I agree with our > forefathers who repeatedly said that they see no reason for the government > to take money from some to give to others. -RickG > > On Mon, Dec 14, 2009 at 11:11 AM, David E. Smith wrote: > >> On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 20:42, RickG wrote: >> >> > On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 8:27 PM, Tim Sylvester > > >wrote: >> > > - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the >> > Rural >> > > Electric Administration. >> > > >> > >> > Another bad deal. >> > >> > >> I'm gonna have to call you out on this. How was the Rural Electrification >> Act a bad idea? Are you going to argue that the most remote areas would >> have >> affordable electricity in the absence of the REA? (Keep in mind there was >> 20-30 years of history saying exactly the opposite before that act was >> passed. Parallels between that and some hypothetical Rural Fiber Act are >> purely intentional.) >> >> David Smith >> MVN.net >> >> >> >> > > >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> > > >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
And each of these is the evidence I have that I do NOT want them doing anything more, and I want them OUT of those things, as well. -- From: "Tim Sylvester" Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 5:27 PM To: "'WISPA General List'" Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > Yes, I am amazed. Amazed by the bitching and whining about government on > this list by people who ... > > - sell wireless service using spectrum "owned" by everyone and allocated > to > them by the FCC for free or low cost. > - sell access to the Internet, a network originally funded and developed > by > DARPA and later funded by the National Science Foundation. > - drive on roads funded with taxpayer dollars and maintained by the > government. > - sell Internet service in rural areas to farmers that receive billions in > government subsidies per year. > - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the Rural > Electric Administration. > - use VA health services. > - will use Medicare and Social Security when they retire. > - call the police and fire department when they need help. > - send their kids to public schools. > > Amazing. > > Tim > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
A flashback to 1905 ... "Unless we adopt the principles of socialism, It can hardly be contended that It is the province of government, either state or municipal, to undertake the manufacture or supply of the ordinary subjects of trade and commerce, or to impose burdens upon the whole community for the supposed benefit of a few.. "The ownership and operation of municipal light plants stands upon a different basis from that of the ownership of water works, with which it is so often compared. Water is a necessity to the health and life of every individual member of a community.It must be supplied in order to preserve the public health, whether it can be done profitably or not, and must be furnished, not to a few individuals, but to every individual. "Electric lights are different. Electricity is not in any sense a necessity, and under no conditions is it universally used by the people of a community. It is but a luxury enjoyed by a small proportion of the members of any municipality, and yet if the plant be owned and operated by the city, the burden of such ownership and operation must be borne by all the people through taxation. "Now, electric light is not a necessity for every member of the community. It Is not the business of any one to see that I use electricity, or gas, or oil in my house, or even that I use any form of artificial light at all." and the 2009 version ... "Unless we adopt the principles of socialism, It can hardly be contended that It is the province of government, either state or municipal, to undertake the manufacture or supply of the ordinary subjects of trade and commerce, or to impose burdens upon the whole community for the supposed benefit of a few.. "The ownership and operation of municipal [broadband] stands upon a different basis from that of the ownership of [electric plants], with which it is so often compared. [Electricity] is a necessity to the health and life of every individual member of a community.It must be supplied in order to preserve the public health, whether it can be done profitably or not, and must be furnished, not to a few individuals, but to every individual. "[Broadband is] different. [Broadband] is not in any sense a necessity, and under no conditions is it universally used by the people of a community. It is but a luxury enjoyed by a small proportion of the members of any municipality, and yet if the [network] be owned and operated by the city, the burden of such ownership and operation must be borne by all the people through taxation. "Now, [broadband] is not a necessity for every member of the community. It Is not the business of any one to see that I use [broadband or dial-up] in my house, or even that I use [the Internet] at all." Here's the link to the source article: http://publicola.net/?p=20687 and the Slashdot article: http://publicola.net/?p=20687. Tim > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of Tom DeReggi > Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 9:50 AM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > The question that one must ask themself is... Is the public adequately > being > served in most cases where broadband is delivered? > Is the private sector capable and doing a good enough job of meeting > demand > fast enough? And what evidence is there that the government could do it > better? > > I was in favor of the BTOP/BIP program for several reasons, however > that > does not mean I am automatically supportive of more of the same. > It was more of a situation of deciding how to spend money allocated > instead > of whether it should be spent. Truthfully, I think the industry needed > a > little boost, in a down economy, regardless of who the recipients of > the > funds were. I'd argue the Wifi manufacturers were in pretty good shape, > but > the WiMax vendors may have needed some bail-out. They will sell more > gear > under grants than loans, for sure. But I clearly dont believe monies > are > most efficiently spent when using other people's money. That is simply > a > fact. And government spending does not improve that problem. Aka the > stories of the $700 hammer via beaurocracy. I can give an example of > one > WISP who publically stated he could serve a rural community for as > little > $3000 upfront for like 20 sq miles, compared to another carrier WISP > that > claimed they needed like $100,000 per 2 square miles just for tower > infrastructure, and like $1000 per customer for CPE. There is a huge > void > in between. If you ask me, I'd like to see way more loans to help the > private sector and way less grants. Grants should be reserved for very > special circumstances, in my mind, and allocatin
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
It's irrelevant what they think...what is relevant is how they vote and what they are doing with our tax dollars. FOX was interviewing a congressman the other day forget who he was, but he was a Republican or should I say RINO (Republican In Name Only). The interviewer started pressing him about $400M in recent earmarks slated for his state; what they were for and could he explain why he felt they were necessary. He couldn't and in fact couldn't remember if he even supported or knew they were in the bill. This is a good example of the type of incumbents I'm speaking of that need to be voted out of office. They are spending our tax dollars without a clear understanding as to what they are spending them on. We have to replace guys like this with representatives that will be better stewards of the money we give them. Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Chuck Bartosch Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 12:00 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice On Dec 13, 2009, at 8:42 PM, Brad Belton wrote: > No, what's really amazing is people think the Government pays for these > services from a bottomless pot of money. I know it's real popular to say that. However, I've never met anyone who thinks that. Not even the politicians think that way. Chuck > When in fact that pot of money is > funded dearly with the blood, sweat and tears from you, me and the rest of > the USA citizens. > > The only positive in all this is Americans are starting to wake up, put > their foot down and say no more! Hopefully it isn't too late, but we do > have a chance to vote any and all the spending freak incumbents out of > office next year. > > > Brad > > > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of Tim Sylvester > Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 7:28 PM > To: 'WISPA General List' > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > Yes, I am amazed. Amazed by the bitching and whining about government on > this list by people who ... > > - sell wireless service using spectrum "owned" by everyone and allocated to > them by the FCC for free or low cost. > - sell access to the Internet, a network originally funded and developed by > DARPA and later funded by the National Science Foundation. > - drive on roads funded with taxpayer dollars and maintained by the > government. > - sell Internet service in rural areas to farmers that receive billions in > government subsidies per year. > - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the Rural > Electric Administration. > - use VA health services. > - will use Medicare and Social Security when they retire. > - call the police and fire department when they need help. > - send their kids to public schools. > > Amazing. > > Tim > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
Nicely put. The same thought has crossed my mind about the diatribes people write on these lists. Chuck On Dec 13, 2009, at 8:27 PM, Tim Sylvester wrote: > Yes, I am amazed. Amazed by the bitching and whining about government on > this list by people who ... > > - sell wireless service using spectrum "owned" by everyone and allocated to > them by the FCC for free or low cost. > - sell access to the Internet, a network originally funded and developed by > DARPA and later funded by the National Science Foundation. > - drive on roads funded with taxpayer dollars and maintained by the > government. > - sell Internet service in rural areas to farmers that receive billions in > government subsidies per year. > - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the Rural > Electric Administration. > - use VA health services. > - will use Medicare and Social Security when they retire. > - call the police and fire department when they need help. > - send their kids to public schools. > > Amazing. > > Tim > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
On Dec 14, 2009, at 12:05 PM, RickG wrote: > I workde for an REA. One of the most wasteful companies I've ever seen. > Private companies could do a much better job. Hard to know that for sure. I used to work for Lockheed. Damn they were wasteful. And stupid too... Certainly there is more fraud and hidden market manipulation in the private sector (think Enron, World Comm and Madoff). And when you get into duopoly situations (which is common in the ISP world), it can be very difficult for small businesses to compete even with an otherwise strong business proposition. We can discuss on Wispa Chat something the good and bad of government, regulations, and bureaucracies. The point here is, it's just way too simplistic to say "business is better" or "business is less wasteful". Sure, WE might be less wasteful-but that isn't true in many cases. And recent history is replete with problems in the private sector, from fraud to foolish risk decisions that hurt not just the offending companies, but our entire economy. Chuck > Besides, I agree with our > forefathers who repeatedly said that they see no reason for the government > to take money from some to give to others. -RickG > > On Mon, Dec 14, 2009 at 11:11 AM, David E. Smith wrote: > >> On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 20:42, RickG wrote: >> >>> On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 8:27 PM, Tim Sylvester >>> wrote: - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the >>> Rural Electric Administration. >>> >>> Another bad deal. >>> >>> >> I'm gonna have to call you out on this. How was the Rural Electrification >> Act a bad idea? Are you going to argue that the most remote areas would >> have >> affordable electricity in the absence of the REA? (Keep in mind there was >> 20-30 years of history saying exactly the opposite before that act was >> passed. Parallels between that and some hypothetical Rural Fiber Act are >> purely intentional.) >> >> David Smith >> MVN.net >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
On Dec 13, 2009, at 8:42 PM, Brad Belton wrote: > No, what's really amazing is people think the Government pays for these > services from a bottomless pot of money. I know it's real popular to say that. However, I've never met anyone who thinks that. Not even the politicians think that way. Chuck > When in fact that pot of money is > funded dearly with the blood, sweat and tears from you, me and the rest of > the USA citizens. > > The only positive in all this is Americans are starting to wake up, put > their foot down and say no more! Hopefully it isn't too late, but we do > have a chance to vote any and all the spending freak incumbents out of > office next year. > > > Brad > > > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of Tim Sylvester > Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 7:28 PM > To: 'WISPA General List' > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > Yes, I am amazed. Amazed by the bitching and whining about government on > this list by people who ... > > - sell wireless service using spectrum "owned" by everyone and allocated to > them by the FCC for free or low cost. > - sell access to the Internet, a network originally funded and developed by > DARPA and later funded by the National Science Foundation. > - drive on roads funded with taxpayer dollars and maintained by the > government. > - sell Internet service in rural areas to farmers that receive billions in > government subsidies per year. > - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the Rural > Electric Administration. > - use VA health services. > - will use Medicare and Social Security when they retire. > - call the police and fire department when they need help. > - send their kids to public schools. > > Amazing. > > Tim > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
The question that one must ask themself is... Is the public adequately being served in most cases where broadband is delivered? Is the private sector capable and doing a good enough job of meeting demand fast enough? And what evidence is there that the government could do it better? I was in favor of the BTOP/BIP program for several reasons, however that does not mean I am automatically supportive of more of the same. It was more of a situation of deciding how to spend money allocated instead of whether it should be spent. Truthfully, I think the industry needed a little boost, in a down economy, regardless of who the recipients of the funds were. I'd argue the Wifi manufacturers were in pretty good shape, but the WiMax vendors may have needed some bail-out. They will sell more gear under grants than loans, for sure. But I clearly dont believe monies are most efficiently spent when using other people's money. That is simply a fact. And government spending does not improve that problem. Aka the stories of the $700 hammer via beaurocracy. I can give an example of one WISP who publically stated he could serve a rural community for as little $3000 upfront for like 20 sq miles, compared to another carrier WISP that claimed they needed like $100,000 per 2 square miles just for tower infrastructure, and like $1000 per customer for CPE. There is a huge void in between. If you ask me, I'd like to see way more loans to help the private sector and way less grants. Grants should be reserved for very special circumstances, in my mind, and allocating them on a competitive basis doesn't make sense to me. And its rarely a good idea to rush spending and evaluation of others' network plans. Government help in itself is not a bad thing. Tim gave so many good examples of how Government has helped society. But we need to be realistic that nothing is free, and one way or another consumers pay for what they consume, whether the efficiency of spending was hidden from sight or not. The answer is to continue investigating how Government help can be most effective, and how it can still best preserve and protect the private sector. The government does somethings very well, but when trouble occurs is when they think they can do something better than the private sector, when its an industry historically served by the private sector. If there was a better way, the private sector would already be doing it. The problem is not the providers, but maybe barriers that need removed. I beleive in some regulation, not anarchy. Regulation should be used to create a healthy industry environment, not to unnecessarilly burden the providers of the industry. Clearly some improvements to regulation is needed. This is why it is so important that WISPs are involved in National Broadband Plan debates, to help define those new policies. I will always try to reach out to my Government for help, that is why they are there, and I will also standup and protest when they try to give to much help or the wrong kind of help, because that is what I'm here for. There are places where help is "needed". I think part of the problem is that definition of "need" requires better definition, it is way to highly subjective as-is. I live near the nation's capitol, participate in a Broadband intensive IT industry, even distance learning, and I serve my company from a 900Mhz wireless CPE, am happy with it, and it does everything that I "NEED". I paid for it myself. I just question why the same is not good enough for everyone else? I personally beleive the Feds need more seed grant money, to help innovators, not necessarilly to help the people at the expense of competition amoungst providers. Respectfully, Tom DeReggi RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband - Original Message - From: "Matt Larsen - Lists" To: "WISPA General List" Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 8:35 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > Took the typing right off of my keyboard Tim. Bravo. > > Matt Larsen > vistabeam.com > > Tim Sylvester wrote: >> Yes, I am amazed. Amazed by the bitching and whining about government on >> this list by people who ... >> >> - sell wireless service using spectrum "owned" by everyone and allocated >> to >> them by the FCC for free or low cost. >> - sell access to the Internet, a network originally funded and developed >> by >> DARPA and later funded by the National Science Foundation. >> - drive on roads funded with taxpayer dollars and maintained by the >> government. >> - sell Internet service in rural areas to farmers that receive billions >> in >> government subsidies per year. >> - connect CPE equipment to electrical service
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
Hah! Our current government reminds me more of Mickey Mouse and friends! On Mon, Dec 14, 2009 at 12:09 PM, Robert West wrote: > Why not? Robin Hood did it. > > Oh, wait, he robbed from the rich and gave to the poor... This is the > other > way around. My mistake. > > Sorry. > > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of RickG > Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 12:05 PM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > I workde for an REA. One of the most wasteful companies I've ever seen. > Private companies could do a much better job. Besides, I agree with our > forefathers who repeatedly said that they see no reason for the government > to take money from some to give to others. -RickG > > On Mon, Dec 14, 2009 at 11:11 AM, David E. Smith wrote: > > > On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 20:42, RickG wrote: > > > > > On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 8:27 PM, Tim Sylvester < > t...@avanzarnetworks.com > > > >wrote: > > > > - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the > > > Rural > > > > Electric Administration. > > > > > > > > > > Another bad deal. > > > > > > > > I'm gonna have to call you out on this. How was the Rural Electrification > > Act a bad idea? Are you going to argue that the most remote areas would > > have > > affordable electricity in the absence of the REA? (Keep in mind there was > > 20-30 years of history saying exactly the opposite before that act was > > passed. Parallels between that and some hypothetical Rural Fiber Act are > > purely intentional.) > > > > David Smith > > MVN.net > > > > > > > > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > > > > > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
Why not? Robin Hood did it. Oh, wait, he robbed from the rich and gave to the poor... This is the other way around. My mistake. Sorry. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of RickG Sent: Monday, December 14, 2009 12:05 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice I workde for an REA. One of the most wasteful companies I've ever seen. Private companies could do a much better job. Besides, I agree with our forefathers who repeatedly said that they see no reason for the government to take money from some to give to others. -RickG On Mon, Dec 14, 2009 at 11:11 AM, David E. Smith wrote: > On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 20:42, RickG wrote: > > > On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 8:27 PM, Tim Sylvester > >wrote: > > > - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the > > Rural > > > Electric Administration. > > > > > > > Another bad deal. > > > > > I'm gonna have to call you out on this. How was the Rural Electrification > Act a bad idea? Are you going to argue that the most remote areas would > have > affordable electricity in the absence of the REA? (Keep in mind there was > 20-30 years of history saying exactly the opposite before that act was > passed. Parallels between that and some hypothetical Rural Fiber Act are > purely intentional.) > > David Smith > MVN.net > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
I workde for an REA. One of the most wasteful companies I've ever seen. Private companies could do a much better job. Besides, I agree with our forefathers who repeatedly said that they see no reason for the government to take money from some to give to others. -RickG On Mon, Dec 14, 2009 at 11:11 AM, David E. Smith wrote: > On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 20:42, RickG wrote: > > > On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 8:27 PM, Tim Sylvester > >wrote: > > > - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the > > Rural > > > Electric Administration. > > > > > > > Another bad deal. > > > > > I'm gonna have to call you out on this. How was the Rural Electrification > Act a bad idea? Are you going to argue that the most remote areas would > have > affordable electricity in the absence of the REA? (Keep in mind there was > 20-30 years of history saying exactly the opposite before that act was > passed. Parallels between that and some hypothetical Rural Fiber Act are > purely intentional.) > > David Smith > MVN.net > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 20:42, RickG wrote: > On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 8:27 PM, Tim Sylvester >wrote: > > - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the > Rural > > Electric Administration. > > > > Another bad deal. > > I'm gonna have to call you out on this. How was the Rural Electrification Act a bad idea? Are you going to argue that the most remote areas would have affordable electricity in the absence of the REA? (Keep in mind there was 20-30 years of history saying exactly the opposite before that act was passed. Parallels between that and some hypothetical Rural Fiber Act are purely intentional.) David Smith MVN.net WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
Truth is always stranger than fiction. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of RickG Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 9:45 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice http://www.physorg.com/news178186859.html On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 8:35 PM, Robert West wrote: > You have somehow eluded having the government mind control chips inserted > into your brain. We are sending our agents over right now, you cannot > hide. > > > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of MDK > Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 7:55 PM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > You are correct. my apologies to those misrepresented. > > I don't mean to say everyone's in agreement on anything.Just that I see > this everywhere. NOt by everyone, just that it pervades almost everything > in life. > > I still don't know who has these experiences that so amazes them at the > competence of government. > > I'd just like to know what it is I've never seen that's so widespread ) > > > > -------------- > From: "RickG" > Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 1:00 PM > To: "WISPA General List" > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > > Thats right! And the government will provide us with REAL salaries too! > > Actually, all I'm seeing is a REAL shaft coming. > > Oh, one correction though, "thinking on this list." should be "by some > > thinking on this list." :) > > Not all here think the government is the answer. > > -RickG > > > > On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 5:01 AM, MDK wrote: > > > >> That's because REAL broadband has to be provided by government. > >> > >> Just like REAL health care. > >> Just like REAL education. > >> Just like REAL science. > >> > >> Just ask the advocates of "government can make our lives a paradise" > >> thinking on this list.I have "learned". > >> > >> All that private enterprise stuff... that's just profitmongering at the > >> expense of the people.Get the government to buy it for you, and > spend > > >> 7 > >> times as much for it and it's virtue, caring, love, and sainthood, all > in > >> one package. > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> From: "Scottie Arnett" > >> Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 5:20 PM > >> To: > >> Subject: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > >> > >> > < > http://www.cedmagazine.com/News-Broadband-stimulus-funds-121109.aspx > >> > > > >> > > >> > "The $7.2 billion in broadband stimulus funding given out by President > >> > Obama is not even close to enough to deploy truly universal broadband > >> > access, according to a new study from Insight Research." > >> > > >> > Scottie > >> > > >> > Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as > >> > $30.00/mth. > >> > Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > > >> > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > >> > http://signup.wispa.org/ > >> > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > >> > > >> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > >> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > >> > > >> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! > >> http://signup.wispa.org/ > >> > >> > > > > >> > >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > >> > >> Subscribe/Uns
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
Of course you can bitch and complain, but for someone who benefits from government to state that the government has done nothing right and free enterprise can solve all of the world's problems is ridiculous. Tim > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of Eje Gustafsson > Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 6:03 PM > To: 'WISPA General List' > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > And whom is providing the government with the monies to do this? The > tax > payers and isn't a tax payer allowed to comment/argue what the monies > are > being used for? > > Can just look at for example Kansas where the government done a poor > job in > managing the monies. 8 years ago toll free numbers was "removed". This > year > education gotten almost $500 in reduction, might not have monies to pay > government payroll. Was talks last year that they might not be able to > payout tax refunds (monies where the tax payers paid too MUCH). > > Anyone paying taxes have the right to bitch, whine and gripe about the > government on anything they do that cost monies. Now if I or others > might > want to hear it here or in another place that is a different matter. > > / Eje > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of Tim Sylvester > Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 7:28 PM > To: 'WISPA General List' > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > Yes, I am amazed. Amazed by the bitching and whining about government > on > this list by people who ... > > - sell wireless service using spectrum "owned" by everyone and > allocated to > them by the FCC for free or low cost. > - sell access to the Internet, a network originally funded and > developed by > DARPA and later funded by the National Science Foundation. > - drive on roads funded with taxpayer dollars and maintained by the > government. > - sell Internet service in rural areas to farmers that receive billions > in > government subsidies per year. > - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the > Rural > Electric Administration. > - use VA health services. > - will use Medicare and Social Security when they retire. > - call the police and fire department when they need help. > - send their kids to public schools. > > Amazing. > > Tim > > > > --- > - > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > --- > - > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > --- > - > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > --- > - > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
This is what amazes me... http://images.google.com/images?q=us%20debt%20graph&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&hl=en&tab=wi Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 "The secret to creativity is knowing how to hide your sources." --- Albert Einstein On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 9:46 PM, RickG wrote: > Amen! http://www.usdebtclock.org/ > > On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 8:42 PM, Brad Belton wrote: > > > No, what's really amazing is people think the Government pays for these > > services from a bottomless pot of money. When in fact that pot of money > is > > funded dearly with the blood, sweat and tears from you, me and the rest > of > > the USA citizens. > > > > The only positive in all this is Americans are starting to wake up, put > > their foot down and say no more! Hopefully it isn't too late, but we do > > have a chance to vote any and all the spending freak incumbents out of > > office next year. > > > > > > Brad > > > > > > > > -Original Message- > > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > > Behalf Of Tim Sylvester > > Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 7:28 PM > > To: 'WISPA General List' > > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > > > Yes, I am amazed. Amazed by the bitching and whining about government on > > this list by people who ... > > > > - sell wireless service using spectrum "owned" by everyone and allocated > to > > them by the FCC for free or low cost. > > - sell access to the Internet, a network originally funded and developed > by > > DARPA and later funded by the National Science Foundation. > > - drive on roads funded with taxpayer dollars and maintained by the > > government. > > - sell Internet service in rural areas to farmers that receive billions > in > > government subsidies per year. > > - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the > Rural > > Electric Administration. > > - use VA health services. > > - will use Medicare and Social Security when they retire. > > - call the police and fire department when they need help. > > - send their kids to public schools. > > > > Amazing. > > > > Tim > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > > > > > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > > > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
Amen! http://www.usdebtclock.org/ On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 8:42 PM, Brad Belton wrote: > No, what's really amazing is people think the Government pays for these > services from a bottomless pot of money. When in fact that pot of money is > funded dearly with the blood, sweat and tears from you, me and the rest of > the USA citizens. > > The only positive in all this is Americans are starting to wake up, put > their foot down and say no more! Hopefully it isn't too late, but we do > have a chance to vote any and all the spending freak incumbents out of > office next year. > > > Brad > > > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of Tim Sylvester > Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 7:28 PM > To: 'WISPA General List' > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > Yes, I am amazed. Amazed by the bitching and whining about government on > this list by people who ... > > - sell wireless service using spectrum "owned" by everyone and allocated to > them by the FCC for free or low cost. > - sell access to the Internet, a network originally funded and developed by > DARPA and later funded by the National Science Foundation. > - drive on roads funded with taxpayer dollars and maintained by the > government. > - sell Internet service in rural areas to farmers that receive billions in > government subsidies per year. > - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the Rural > Electric Administration. > - use VA health services. > - will use Medicare and Social Security when they retire. > - call the police and fire department when they need help. > - send their kids to public schools. > > Amazing. > > Tim > > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
http://www.physorg.com/news178186859.html On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 8:35 PM, Robert West wrote: > You have somehow eluded having the government mind control chips inserted > into your brain. We are sending our agents over right now, you cannot > hide. > > > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of MDK > Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 7:55 PM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > You are correct. my apologies to those misrepresented. > > I don't mean to say everyone's in agreement on anything.Just that I see > this everywhere. NOt by everyone, just that it pervades almost everything > in life. > > I still don't know who has these experiences that so amazes them at the > competence of government. > > I'd just like to know what it is I've never seen that's so widespread ) > > > > ---------- > From: "RickG" > Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 1:00 PM > To: "WISPA General List" > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > > Thats right! And the government will provide us with REAL salaries too! > > Actually, all I'm seeing is a REAL shaft coming. > > Oh, one correction though, "thinking on this list." should be "by some > > thinking on this list." :) > > Not all here think the government is the answer. > > -RickG > > > > On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 5:01 AM, MDK wrote: > > > >> That's because REAL broadband has to be provided by government. > >> > >> Just like REAL health care. > >> Just like REAL education. > >> Just like REAL science. > >> > >> Just ask the advocates of "government can make our lives a paradise" > >> thinking on this list.I have "learned". > >> > >> All that private enterprise stuff... that's just profitmongering at the > >> expense of the people.Get the government to buy it for you, and > spend > > >> 7 > >> times as much for it and it's virtue, caring, love, and sainthood, all > in > >> one package. > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> From: "Scottie Arnett" > >> Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 5:20 PM > >> To: > >> Subject: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > >> > >> > < > http://www.cedmagazine.com/News-Broadband-stimulus-funds-121109.aspx > >> > > > >> > > >> > "The $7.2 billion in broadband stimulus funding given out by President > >> > Obama is not even close to enough to deploy truly universal broadband > >> > access, according to a new study from Insight Research." > >> > > >> > Scottie > >> > > >> > Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as > >> > $30.00/mth. > >> > Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. > >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > > > >> > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > >> > http://signup.wispa.org/ > >> > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > >> > > >> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > >> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > >> > > >> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! > >> http://signup.wispa.org/ > >> > >> > > > > >> > >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > >> > >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > >> > >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > >> > > > > > > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > > http://signup.wispa.or
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 8:27 PM, Tim Sylvester wrote: > Yes, I am amazed. Amazed by the bitching and whining about government on > this list by people who ... > > - sell wireless service using spectrum "owned" by everyone and allocated to > them by the FCC for free or low cost. > Since I'm included in "everyone" its my right to provide the service to everyone else. > - sell access to the Internet, a network originally funded and developed by > DARPA and later funded by the National Science Foundation. > And they used my tax dollars to do so. > - drive on roads funded with taxpayer dollars and maintained by the > government. > Again, my tax dollars. > - sell Internet service in rural areas to farmers that receive billions in > government subsidies per year. > And thats a bad deal. > - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the Rural > Electric Administration. > Another bad deal. > - use VA health services. > Not I. > - will use Medicare and Social Security when they retire. > I'm not counting on it. > - call the police and fire department when they need help. > I've never called them. Still my tax dollars. > - send their kids to public schools. > Nope, not here. > > Amazing. > > Tim > > I'd trade it all in a heartbeat if the government would reciprocate by shutting down to a bare minimum. -RickG > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
And whom is providing the government with the monies to do this? The tax payers and isn't a tax payer allowed to comment/argue what the monies are being used for? Can just look at for example Kansas where the government done a poor job in managing the monies. 8 years ago toll free numbers was "removed". This year education gotten almost $500 in reduction, might not have monies to pay government payroll. Was talks last year that they might not be able to payout tax refunds (monies where the tax payers paid too MUCH). Anyone paying taxes have the right to bitch, whine and gripe about the government on anything they do that cost monies. Now if I or others might want to hear it here or in another place that is a different matter. / Eje -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Tim Sylvester Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 7:28 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice Yes, I am amazed. Amazed by the bitching and whining about government on this list by people who ... - sell wireless service using spectrum "owned" by everyone and allocated to them by the FCC for free or low cost. - sell access to the Internet, a network originally funded and developed by DARPA and later funded by the National Science Foundation. - drive on roads funded with taxpayer dollars and maintained by the government. - sell Internet service in rural areas to farmers that receive billions in government subsidies per year. - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the Rural Electric Administration. - use VA health services. - will use Medicare and Social Security when they retire. - call the police and fire department when they need help. - send their kids to public schools. Amazing. Tim WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
No, what's really amazing is people think the Government pays for these services from a bottomless pot of money. When in fact that pot of money is funded dearly with the blood, sweat and tears from you, me and the rest of the USA citizens. The only positive in all this is Americans are starting to wake up, put their foot down and say no more! Hopefully it isn't too late, but we do have a chance to vote any and all the spending freak incumbents out of office next year. Brad -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Tim Sylvester Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 7:28 PM To: 'WISPA General List' Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice Yes, I am amazed. Amazed by the bitching and whining about government on this list by people who ... - sell wireless service using spectrum "owned" by everyone and allocated to them by the FCC for free or low cost. - sell access to the Internet, a network originally funded and developed by DARPA and later funded by the National Science Foundation. - drive on roads funded with taxpayer dollars and maintained by the government. - sell Internet service in rural areas to farmers that receive billions in government subsidies per year. - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the Rural Electric Administration. - use VA health services. - will use Medicare and Social Security when they retire. - call the police and fire department when they need help. - send their kids to public schools. Amazing. Tim WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
You have somehow eluded having the government mind control chips inserted into your brain. We are sending our agents over right now, you cannot hide. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of MDK Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 7:55 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice You are correct. my apologies to those misrepresented. I don't mean to say everyone's in agreement on anything.Just that I see this everywhere. NOt by everyone, just that it pervades almost everything in life. I still don't know who has these experiences that so amazes them at the competence of government. I'd just like to know what it is I've never seen that's so widespread ) -- From: "RickG" Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 1:00 PM To: "WISPA General List" Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > Thats right! And the government will provide us with REAL salaries too! > Actually, all I'm seeing is a REAL shaft coming. > Oh, one correction though, "thinking on this list." should be "by some > thinking on this list." :) > Not all here think the government is the answer. > -RickG > > On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 5:01 AM, MDK wrote: > >> That's because REAL broadband has to be provided by government. >> >> Just like REAL health care. >> Just like REAL education. >> Just like REAL science. >> >> Just ask the advocates of "government can make our lives a paradise" >> thinking on this list.I have "learned". >> >> All that private enterprise stuff... that's just profitmongering at the >> expense of the people.Get the government to buy it for you, and spend >> 7 >> times as much for it and it's virtue, caring, love, and sainthood, all in >> one package. >> >> >> >> -- >> From: "Scottie Arnett" >> Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 5:20 PM >> To: >> Subject: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice >> >> > < http://www.cedmagazine.com/News-Broadband-stimulus-funds-121109.aspx >> > > >> > >> > "The $7.2 billion in broadband stimulus funding given out by President >> > Obama is not even close to enough to deploy truly universal broadband >> > access, according to a new study from Insight Research." >> > >> > Scottie >> > >> > Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as >> > $30.00/mth. >> > Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. >> > >> > >> > >> >> > WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> > http://signup.wispa.org/ >> > >> >> > >> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> > >> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> > >> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
Took the typing right off of my keyboard Tim. Bravo. Matt Larsen vistabeam.com Tim Sylvester wrote: > Yes, I am amazed. Amazed by the bitching and whining about government on > this list by people who ... > > - sell wireless service using spectrum "owned" by everyone and allocated to > them by the FCC for free or low cost. > - sell access to the Internet, a network originally funded and developed by > DARPA and later funded by the National Science Foundation. > - drive on roads funded with taxpayer dollars and maintained by the > government. > - sell Internet service in rural areas to farmers that receive billions in > government subsidies per year. > - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the Rural > Electric Administration. > - use VA health services. > - will use Medicare and Social Security when they retire. > - call the police and fire department when they need help. > - send their kids to public schools. > > Amazing. > > Tim > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
Yes, I am amazed. Amazed by the bitching and whining about government on this list by people who ... - sell wireless service using spectrum "owned" by everyone and allocated to them by the FCC for free or low cost. - sell access to the Internet, a network originally funded and developed by DARPA and later funded by the National Science Foundation. - drive on roads funded with taxpayer dollars and maintained by the government. - sell Internet service in rural areas to farmers that receive billions in government subsidies per year. - connect CPE equipment to electrical service that was funded by the Rural Electric Administration. - use VA health services. - will use Medicare and Social Security when they retire. - call the police and fire department when they need help. - send their kids to public schools. Amazing. Tim WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
You are correct. my apologies to those misrepresented. I don't mean to say everyone's in agreement on anything.Just that I see this everywhere. NOt by everyone, just that it pervades almost everything in life. I still don't know who has these experiences that so amazes them at the competence of government. I'd just like to know what it is I've never seen that's so widespread ) -- From: "RickG" Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 1:00 PM To: "WISPA General List" Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > Thats right! And the government will provide us with REAL salaries too! > Actually, all I'm seeing is a REAL shaft coming. > Oh, one correction though, "thinking on this list." should be "by some > thinking on this list." :) > Not all here think the government is the answer. > -RickG > > On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 5:01 AM, MDK wrote: > >> That's because REAL broadband has to be provided by government. >> >> Just like REAL health care. >> Just like REAL education. >> Just like REAL science. >> >> Just ask the advocates of "government can make our lives a paradise" >> thinking on this list.I have "learned". >> >> All that private enterprise stuff... that's just profitmongering at the >> expense of the people.Get the government to buy it for you, and spend >> 7 >> times as much for it and it's virtue, caring, love, and sainthood, all in >> one package. >> >> >> >> -- >> From: "Scottie Arnett" >> Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 5:20 PM >> To: >> Subject: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice >> >> > < http://www.cedmagazine.com/News-Broadband-stimulus-funds-121109.aspx >> > > >> > >> > "The $7.2 billion in broadband stimulus funding given out by President >> > Obama is not even close to enough to deploy truly universal broadband >> > access, according to a new study from Insight Research." >> > >> > Scottie >> > >> > Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as >> > $30.00/mth. >> > Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. >> > >> > >> > >> >> > WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> > http://signup.wispa.org/ >> > >> >> > >> > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> > >> > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> > >> > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> >> >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
42 is the answer. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of RickG Sent: Sunday, December 13, 2009 4:01 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice Thats right! And the government will provide us with REAL salaries too! Actually, all I'm seeing is a REAL shaft coming. Oh, one correction though, "thinking on this list." should be "by some thinking on this list." :) Not all here think the government is the answer. -RickG On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 5:01 AM, MDK wrote: > That's because REAL broadband has to be provided by government. > > Just like REAL health care. > Just like REAL education. > Just like REAL science. > > Just ask the advocates of "government can make our lives a paradise" > thinking on this list.I have "learned". > > All that private enterprise stuff... that's just profitmongering at the > expense of the people.Get the government to buy it for you, and spend 7 > times as much for it and it's virtue, caring, love, and sainthood, all in > one package. > > > > -- > From: "Scottie Arnett" > Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 5:20 PM > To: > Subject: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > > < http://www.cedmagazine.com/News-Broadband-stimulus-funds-121109.aspx > > > > > "The $7.2 billion in broadband stimulus funding given out by President > > Obama is not even close to enough to deploy truly universal broadband > > access, according to a new study from Insight Research." > > > > Scottie > > > > Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as > > $30.00/mth. > > Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. > > > > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
Thats right! And the government will provide us with REAL salaries too! Actually, all I'm seeing is a REAL shaft coming. Oh, one correction though, "thinking on this list." should be "by some thinking on this list." :) Not all here think the government is the answer. -RickG On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 5:01 AM, MDK wrote: > That's because REAL broadband has to be provided by government. > > Just like REAL health care. > Just like REAL education. > Just like REAL science. > > Just ask the advocates of "government can make our lives a paradise" > thinking on this list.I have "learned". > > All that private enterprise stuff... that's just profitmongering at the > expense of the people.Get the government to buy it for you, and spend 7 > times as much for it and it's virtue, caring, love, and sainthood, all in > one package. > > > > -- > From: "Scottie Arnett" > Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 5:20 PM > To: > Subject: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > > < http://www.cedmagazine.com/News-Broadband-stimulus-funds-121109.aspx > > > > > "The $7.2 billion in broadband stimulus funding given out by President > > Obama is not even close to enough to deploy truly universal broadband > > access, according to a new study from Insight Research." > > > > Scottie > > > > Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as > > $30.00/mth. > > Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. > > > > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
That's because REAL broadband has to be provided by government. Just like REAL health care. Just like REAL education. Just like REAL science. Just ask the advocates of "government can make our lives a paradise" thinking on this list.I have "learned". All that private enterprise stuff... that's just profitmongering at the expense of the people.Get the government to buy it for you, and spend 7 times as much for it and it's virtue, caring, love, and sainthood, all in one package. -- From: "Scottie Arnett" Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 5:20 PM To: Subject: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > < http://www.cedmagazine.com/News-Broadband-stimulus-funds-121109.aspx > > > "The $7.2 billion in broadband stimulus funding given out by President > Obama is not even close to enough to deploy truly universal broadband > access, according to a new study from Insight Research." > > Scottie > > Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as > $30.00/mth. > Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
He's actually from the future. I just have to wait until he's born. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Philip Dorr Sent: Saturday, December 12, 2009 5:59 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice you do not have to channel Tesla you have to find him, since he is a vampire. On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 9:45 AM, Robert West wrote: > I'll get the witches together tonight and see if we can channel Nikola Tesla > and get some answers. > > I've been trying not to do that anymore, the last time I followed his > instructions I caught the dog on fire. But we'll see. > > Bob- > > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of Mike > Sent: Saturday, December 12, 2009 10:22 AM > To: sarn...@info-ed.com; WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > I have to believe we are on the cusp of some real innovation. The > answer will not be wireless as we now know it. Instead, it will be > some sort of ultra wide band signal spread over a certain frequency > band and controlled by software defined radios. With the right > algorithms, many users could be using the same band and only raise > the noise floor slightly to an observer or an analog spectrum analyzer. > > Most of the recent innovation in UWB is for personal devices, low > power, and short range. It can be done on a much larger, wider > scale. Distance will dictate the amount of spectrum a device can use > and still have adapting radiators efficient at that slice of > spectrum. The biggest hurdle will be the "back door" the government > will insist on having into the system. > > http://www.deviceforge.com/articles/AT8171287040.html > > Every house or business could have a central device communicating > with the mesh or whatever it becomes, and relaying to devices in use > by individuals, using a lower power UWB. > > I'm not sure the end device will be a phone/IPhone type device, but > instead will be some sort of thin film display you either unfold, or > something that is integrated into eye wear. > > http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,667638,00.asp > > I think we have reached the limits of the technology now commonly > available. The smart phone is not the answer. Little tiny screens > are usable by young eyes, but not by mature users. A screen that > communicates with the device in your pocket will be the norm. > > I have a friend/customer who just got a new set of hearing aids. It > interfaces with his phone via bluetooth. He is able to use a cell > phone now, where previous attempts were less than satisfying. > > My prediction is many of the people on this list will be amongst the > innovators that bring these technologies to the masses. > > mg > > > At 08:30 AM 12/12/2009, you wrote: >>There will be places that running fiber 5 miles for one or two >>customers is not going to be feasible. The telcos had to run copper >>to provide a telephone in many circumstances to these areas. With >>fiber, I don't think they are going to do it. Not counting the cost >>of fiber, but the build-out with poles and/or digging will be >>astounding. What's the cheaper alternative here, and everywhere but >>the largest of populated areas? Wireless. How are we gonna provide >>those speeds? We need more spectrum. My guess is we will never see >>it under the duopoly centered FCC/all govt we have had for the past >>15 years. AND of course, the govt would never want to do something >>the cheaper way. >> >>Scottie >> >>-- Original Message -- >>From: "Robert West" >>Reply-To: WISPA General List >>Date: Fri, 11 Dec 2009 21:25:23 -0500 >> >> >And that makes sense, however back during the rural electrification days, >> >they weren't after 200 amp service, just a line and a light bulb made it > all >> >good. Everything after was built on top of that. But one could also > argue >> >that dial-up was the start and this is the additional upgrading. But >> >they are right, fiber is the one true way of bringing everyone up to the >> >same level of access. I'm conflicted because both sides in it are right, > in >> >my eyes. >> > >> > >> > >> >-Original Message- >> >From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >> >Behalf Of Mike Hammett >> >Sent: Friday, December 11,
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
you do not have to channel Tesla you have to find him, since he is a vampire. On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 9:45 AM, Robert West wrote: > I'll get the witches together tonight and see if we can channel Nikola Tesla > and get some answers. > > I've been trying not to do that anymore, the last time I followed his > instructions I caught the dog on fire. But we'll see. > > Bob- > > > -Original Message- > From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > Behalf Of Mike > Sent: Saturday, December 12, 2009 10:22 AM > To: sarn...@info-ed.com; WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > I have to believe we are on the cusp of some real innovation. The > answer will not be wireless as we now know it. Instead, it will be > some sort of ultra wide band signal spread over a certain frequency > band and controlled by software defined radios. With the right > algorithms, many users could be using the same band and only raise > the noise floor slightly to an observer or an analog spectrum analyzer. > > Most of the recent innovation in UWB is for personal devices, low > power, and short range. It can be done on a much larger, wider > scale. Distance will dictate the amount of spectrum a device can use > and still have adapting radiators efficient at that slice of > spectrum. The biggest hurdle will be the "back door" the government > will insist on having into the system. > > http://www.deviceforge.com/articles/AT8171287040.html > > Every house or business could have a central device communicating > with the mesh or whatever it becomes, and relaying to devices in use > by individuals, using a lower power UWB. > > I'm not sure the end device will be a phone/IPhone type device, but > instead will be some sort of thin film display you either unfold, or > something that is integrated into eye wear. > > http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,667638,00.asp > > I think we have reached the limits of the technology now commonly > available. The smart phone is not the answer. Little tiny screens > are usable by young eyes, but not by mature users. A screen that > communicates with the device in your pocket will be the norm. > > I have a friend/customer who just got a new set of hearing aids. It > interfaces with his phone via bluetooth. He is able to use a cell > phone now, where previous attempts were less than satisfying. > > My prediction is many of the people on this list will be amongst the > innovators that bring these technologies to the masses. > > mg > > > At 08:30 AM 12/12/2009, you wrote: >>There will be places that running fiber 5 miles for one or two >>customers is not going to be feasible. The telcos had to run copper >>to provide a telephone in many circumstances to these areas. With >>fiber, I don't think they are going to do it. Not counting the cost >>of fiber, but the build-out with poles and/or digging will be >>astounding. What's the cheaper alternative here, and everywhere but >>the largest of populated areas? Wireless. How are we gonna provide >>those speeds? We need more spectrum. My guess is we will never see >>it under the duopoly centered FCC/all govt we have had for the past >>15 years. AND of course, the govt would never want to do something >>the cheaper way. >> >>Scottie >> >>-- Original Message -- >>From: "Robert West" >>Reply-To: WISPA General List >>Date: Fri, 11 Dec 2009 21:25:23 -0500 >> >> >And that makes sense, however back during the rural electrification days, >> >they weren't after 200 amp service, just a line and a light bulb made it > all >> >good. Everything after was built on top of that. But one could also > argue >> >that dial-up was the start and this is the additional upgrading. But >> >they are right, fiber is the one true way of bringing everyone up to the >> >same level of access. I'm conflicted because both sides in it are right, > in >> >my eyes. >> > >> > >> > >> >-Original Message- >> >From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >> >Behalf Of Mike Hammett >> >Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 9:17 PM >> >To: WISPA General List >> >Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice >> > >> >A lot of organizations only consider fiber worthy of deployment going >> >forward. $1500 seems about appropriate, then. >> > >> > >> >
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
I'll get the witches together tonight and see if we can channel Nikola Tesla and get some answers. I've been trying not to do that anymore, the last time I followed his instructions I caught the dog on fire. But we'll see. Bob- -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Sent: Saturday, December 12, 2009 10:22 AM To: sarn...@info-ed.com; WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice I have to believe we are on the cusp of some real innovation. The answer will not be wireless as we now know it. Instead, it will be some sort of ultra wide band signal spread over a certain frequency band and controlled by software defined radios. With the right algorithms, many users could be using the same band and only raise the noise floor slightly to an observer or an analog spectrum analyzer. Most of the recent innovation in UWB is for personal devices, low power, and short range. It can be done on a much larger, wider scale. Distance will dictate the amount of spectrum a device can use and still have adapting radiators efficient at that slice of spectrum. The biggest hurdle will be the "back door" the government will insist on having into the system. http://www.deviceforge.com/articles/AT8171287040.html Every house or business could have a central device communicating with the mesh or whatever it becomes, and relaying to devices in use by individuals, using a lower power UWB. I'm not sure the end device will be a phone/IPhone type device, but instead will be some sort of thin film display you either unfold, or something that is integrated into eye wear. http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,667638,00.asp I think we have reached the limits of the technology now commonly available. The smart phone is not the answer. Little tiny screens are usable by young eyes, but not by mature users. A screen that communicates with the device in your pocket will be the norm. I have a friend/customer who just got a new set of hearing aids. It interfaces with his phone via bluetooth. He is able to use a cell phone now, where previous attempts were less than satisfying. My prediction is many of the people on this list will be amongst the innovators that bring these technologies to the masses. mg At 08:30 AM 12/12/2009, you wrote: >There will be places that running fiber 5 miles for one or two >customers is not going to be feasible. The telcos had to run copper >to provide a telephone in many circumstances to these areas. With >fiber, I don't think they are going to do it. Not counting the cost >of fiber, but the build-out with poles and/or digging will be >astounding. What's the cheaper alternative here, and everywhere but >the largest of populated areas? Wireless. How are we gonna provide >those speeds? We need more spectrum. My guess is we will never see >it under the duopoly centered FCC/all govt we have had for the past >15 years. AND of course, the govt would never want to do something >the cheaper way. > >Scottie > >-- Original Message -- >From: "Robert West" >Reply-To: WISPA General List >Date: Fri, 11 Dec 2009 21:25:23 -0500 > > >And that makes sense, however back during the rural electrification days, > >they weren't after 200 amp service, just a line and a light bulb made it all > >good. Everything after was built on top of that. But one could also argue > >that dial-up was the start and this is the additional upgrading. But > >they are right, fiber is the one true way of bringing everyone up to the > >same level of access. I'm conflicted because both sides in it are right, in > >my eyes. > > > > > > > >-Original Message----- > >From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > >Behalf Of Mike Hammett > >Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 9:17 PM > >To: WISPA General List > >Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > > >A lot of organizations only consider fiber worthy of deployment going > >forward. $1500 seems about appropriate, then. > > > > > >- > >Mike Hammett > >Intelligent Computing Solutions > >http://www.ics-il.com > > > > > > > >-- > >From: "Scottie Arnett" > >Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 7:48 PM > >To: > >Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > > >> > >> I found these stats interesting: "the number of households either lacking > >> Internet service altogether or using dial-up connec
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
I have to believe we are on the cusp of some real innovation. The answer will not be wireless as we now know it. Instead, it will be some sort of ultra wide band signal spread over a certain frequency band and controlled by software defined radios. With the right algorithms, many users could be using the same band and only raise the noise floor slightly to an observer or an analog spectrum analyzer. Most of the recent innovation in UWB is for personal devices, low power, and short range. It can be done on a much larger, wider scale. Distance will dictate the amount of spectrum a device can use and still have adapting radiators efficient at that slice of spectrum. The biggest hurdle will be the "back door" the government will insist on having into the system. http://www.deviceforge.com/articles/AT8171287040.html Every house or business could have a central device communicating with the mesh or whatever it becomes, and relaying to devices in use by individuals, using a lower power UWB. I'm not sure the end device will be a phone/IPhone type device, but instead will be some sort of thin film display you either unfold, or something that is integrated into eye wear. http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,667638,00.asp I think we have reached the limits of the technology now commonly available. The smart phone is not the answer. Little tiny screens are usable by young eyes, but not by mature users. A screen that communicates with the device in your pocket will be the norm. I have a friend/customer who just got a new set of hearing aids. It interfaces with his phone via bluetooth. He is able to use a cell phone now, where previous attempts were less than satisfying. My prediction is many of the people on this list will be amongst the innovators that bring these technologies to the masses. mg At 08:30 AM 12/12/2009, you wrote: >There will be places that running fiber 5 miles for one or two >customers is not going to be feasible. The telcos had to run copper >to provide a telephone in many circumstances to these areas. With >fiber, I don't think they are going to do it. Not counting the cost >of fiber, but the build-out with poles and/or digging will be >astounding. What's the cheaper alternative here, and everywhere but >the largest of populated areas? Wireless. How are we gonna provide >those speeds? We need more spectrum. My guess is we will never see >it under the duopoly centered FCC/all govt we have had for the past >15 years. AND of course, the govt would never want to do something >the cheaper way. > >Scottie > >-- Original Message -- >From: "Robert West" >Reply-To: WISPA General List >Date: Fri, 11 Dec 2009 21:25:23 -0500 > > >And that makes sense, however back during the rural electrification days, > >they weren't after 200 amp service, just a line and a light bulb made it all > >good. Everything after was built on top of that. But one could also argue > >that dial-up was the start and this is the additional upgrading. But > >they are right, fiber is the one true way of bringing everyone up to the > >same level of access. I'm conflicted because both sides in it are right, in > >my eyes. > > > > > > > >-Original Message- > >From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On > >Behalf Of Mike Hammett > >Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 9:17 PM > >To: WISPA General List > >Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > > >A lot of organizations only consider fiber worthy of deployment going > >forward. $1500 seems about appropriate, then. > > > > > >----- > >Mike Hammett > >Intelligent Computing Solutions > >http://www.ics-il.com > > > > > > > >-- > >From: "Scottie Arnett" > >Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 7:48 PM > >To: > >Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > > >> > >> I found these stats interesting: "the number of households either lacking > >> Internet service altogether or using dial-up connections approaches 58 > >> million - half of the households in the United States." > >> > >> Somebody is wrong somewhere on these numbers? > >> > >> and... > >> > >> "Insight Research claims that it takes about $1,500 per household to > >> deploy broadband, bringing the amount of money needed for universal access > > > >> to $60 billion." > >> > >> I know I could do mucho mucho wireless with $1500 per custome
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
I'm not sure of how long of a time, but over a period of say 10 years, fiber is cost effective for any developed area (subdivisions in the middle of nowhere, small towns, etc.). Rural areas are better suited for wireless. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: "Scottie Arnett" Sent: Saturday, December 12, 2009 8:30 AM To: "WISPA General List" Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > There will be places that running fiber 5 miles for one or two customers > is not going to be feasible. The telcos had to run copper to provide a > telephone in many circumstances to these areas. With fiber, I don't think > they are going to do it. Not counting the cost of fiber, but the build-out > with poles and/or digging will be astounding. What's the cheaper > alternative here, and everywhere but the largest of populated areas? > Wireless. How are we gonna provide those speeds? We need more spectrum. My > guess is we will never see it under the duopoly centered FCC/all govt we > have had for the past 15 years. AND of course, the govt would never want > to do something the cheaper way. > > Scottie > > -- Original Message -- > From: "Robert West" > Reply-To: WISPA General List > Date: Fri, 11 Dec 2009 21:25:23 -0500 > >>And that makes sense, however back during the rural electrification days, >>they weren't after 200 amp service, just a line and a light bulb made it >>all >>good. Everything after was built on top of that. But one could also >>argue >>that dial-up was the start and this is the additional upgrading. But >>they are right, fiber is the one true way of bringing everyone up to the >>same level of access. I'm conflicted because both sides in it are right, >>in >>my eyes. >> >> >> >>-Original Message----- >>From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >>Behalf Of Mike Hammett >>Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 9:17 PM >>To: WISPA General List >>Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice >> >>A lot of organizations only consider fiber worthy of deployment going >>forward. $1500 seems about appropriate, then. >> >> >>----- >>Mike Hammett >>Intelligent Computing Solutions >>http://www.ics-il.com >> >> >> >>-- >>From: "Scottie Arnett" >>Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 7:48 PM >>To: >>Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice >> >>> >>> I found these stats interesting: "the number of households either >>> lacking >>> Internet service altogether or using dial-up connections approaches 58 >>> million - half of the households in the United States." >>> >>> Somebody is wrong somewhere on these numbers? >>> >>> and... >>> >>> "Insight Research claims that it takes about $1,500 per household to >>> deploy broadband, bringing the amount of money needed for universal >>> access >> >>> to $60 billion." >>> >>> I know I could do mucho mucho wireless with $1500 per customer! >>> >>> Scottie >>> >>> -- Original Message -- >>> From: "Robert West" >>> Date: Fri, 11 Dec 2009 20:28:56 -0500 >>> >>>>Maybe if it was given to those who are truly interested in providing >>>>broadband, it would be more than enough. >>>> >>>>How much more could YOU do, Scottie, if they gave you 100 grand >>>>outright? >>>>I >>>>bet it would go directly towards the customer. >>>> >>>>Now I'm sure that there are plenty of well meaning companies out there >>>>just >>>>trying for a little help and deservedly so, but basic human nature is >>>>greed >>>>and as we've talked about before, once those "Wisps by Convenience" get >>>>the >>>>cash, play Wisp until they run out of that cash and then go bye-bye, our >>>>payday will come when we are able to buy their equipment at auction. At >>>>least that's what I tell myself to feel better.. :) >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>-Original Message- &g
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
They would rather spend twice that amount just on a study. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scottie Arnett Sent: Saturday, December 12, 2009 9:31 AM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice There will be places that running fiber 5 miles for one or two customers is not going to be feasible. The telcos had to run copper to provide a telephone in many circumstances to these areas. With fiber, I don't think they are going to do it. Not counting the cost of fiber, but the build-out with poles and/or digging will be astounding. What's the cheaper alternative here, and everywhere but the largest of populated areas? Wireless. How are we gonna provide those speeds? We need more spectrum. My guess is we will never see it under the duopoly centered FCC/all govt we have had for the past 15 years. AND of course, the govt would never want to do something the cheaper way. Scottie -- Original Message -- From: "Robert West" Reply-To: WISPA General List Date: Fri, 11 Dec 2009 21:25:23 -0500 >And that makes sense, however back during the rural electrification days, >they weren't after 200 amp service, just a line and a light bulb made it all >good. Everything after was built on top of that. But one could also argue >that dial-up was the start and this is the additional upgrading. But >they are right, fiber is the one true way of bringing everyone up to the >same level of access. I'm conflicted because both sides in it are right, in >my eyes. > > > >-Original Message- >From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >Behalf Of Mike Hammett >Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 9:17 PM >To: WISPA General List >Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > >A lot of organizations only consider fiber worthy of deployment going >forward. $1500 seems about appropriate, then. > > >- >Mike Hammett >Intelligent Computing Solutions >http://www.ics-il.com > > > >------------------ >From: "Scottie Arnett" >Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 7:48 PM >To: >Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > >> >> I found these stats interesting: "the number of households either lacking >> Internet service altogether or using dial-up connections approaches 58 >> million - half of the households in the United States." >> >> Somebody is wrong somewhere on these numbers? >> >> and... >> >> "Insight Research claims that it takes about $1,500 per household to >> deploy broadband, bringing the amount of money needed for universal access > >> to $60 billion." >> >> I know I could do mucho mucho wireless with $1500 per customer! >> >> Scottie >> >> -- Original Message -- >> From: "Robert West" >> Date: Fri, 11 Dec 2009 20:28:56 -0500 >> >>>Maybe if it was given to those who are truly interested in providing >>>broadband, it would be more than enough. >>> >>>How much more could YOU do, Scottie, if they gave you 100 grand outright? >>>I >>>bet it would go directly towards the customer. >>> >>>Now I'm sure that there are plenty of well meaning companies out there >>>just >>>trying for a little help and deservedly so, but basic human nature is >>>greed >>>and as we've talked about before, once those "Wisps by Convenience" get >>>the >>>cash, play Wisp until they run out of that cash and then go bye-bye, our >>>payday will come when we are able to buy their equipment at auction. At >>>least that's what I tell myself to feel better.. :) >>> >>> >>> >>>-Original Message- >>>From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >>>Behalf Of Scottie Arnett >>>Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 8:20 PM >>>To: wireless@wispa.org >>>Subject: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice >>> >>>< http://www.cedmagazine.com/News-Broadband-stimulus-funds-121109.aspx > >>> >>>"The $7.2 billion in broadband stimulus funding given out by President >>>Obama >>>is not even close to enough to deploy truly universal broadband access, >>>according to a new study from Insight Research." >>> >>>Scottie >>> >>>Wireless High
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
There will be places that running fiber 5 miles for one or two customers is not going to be feasible. The telcos had to run copper to provide a telephone in many circumstances to these areas. With fiber, I don't think they are going to do it. Not counting the cost of fiber, but the build-out with poles and/or digging will be astounding. What's the cheaper alternative here, and everywhere but the largest of populated areas? Wireless. How are we gonna provide those speeds? We need more spectrum. My guess is we will never see it under the duopoly centered FCC/all govt we have had for the past 15 years. AND of course, the govt would never want to do something the cheaper way. Scottie -- Original Message -- From: "Robert West" Reply-To: WISPA General List Date: Fri, 11 Dec 2009 21:25:23 -0500 >And that makes sense, however back during the rural electrification days, >they weren't after 200 amp service, just a line and a light bulb made it all >good. Everything after was built on top of that. But one could also argue >that dial-up was the start and this is the additional upgrading. But >they are right, fiber is the one true way of bringing everyone up to the >same level of access. I'm conflicted because both sides in it are right, in >my eyes. > > > >-Original Message- >From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >Behalf Of Mike Hammett >Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 9:17 PM >To: WISPA General List >Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > >A lot of organizations only consider fiber worthy of deployment going >forward. $1500 seems about appropriate, then. > > >- >Mike Hammett >Intelligent Computing Solutions >http://www.ics-il.com > > > >------------------ >From: "Scottie Arnett" >Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 7:48 PM >To: >Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > >> >> I found these stats interesting: "the number of households either lacking >> Internet service altogether or using dial-up connections approaches 58 >> million - half of the households in the United States." >> >> Somebody is wrong somewhere on these numbers? >> >> and... >> >> "Insight Research claims that it takes about $1,500 per household to >> deploy broadband, bringing the amount of money needed for universal access > >> to $60 billion." >> >> I know I could do mucho mucho wireless with $1500 per customer! >> >> Scottie >> >> -- Original Message -- >> From: "Robert West" >> Date: Fri, 11 Dec 2009 20:28:56 -0500 >> >>>Maybe if it was given to those who are truly interested in providing >>>broadband, it would be more than enough. >>> >>>How much more could YOU do, Scottie, if they gave you 100 grand outright? >>>I >>>bet it would go directly towards the customer. >>> >>>Now I'm sure that there are plenty of well meaning companies out there >>>just >>>trying for a little help and deservedly so, but basic human nature is >>>greed >>>and as we've talked about before, once those "Wisps by Convenience" get >>>the >>>cash, play Wisp until they run out of that cash and then go bye-bye, our >>>payday will come when we are able to buy their equipment at auction. At >>>least that's what I tell myself to feel better.. :) >>> >>> >>> >>>-Original Message- >>>From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >>>Behalf Of Scottie Arnett >>>Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 8:20 PM >>>To: wireless@wispa.org >>>Subject: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice >>> >>>< http://www.cedmagazine.com/News-Broadband-stimulus-funds-121109.aspx > >>> >>>"The $7.2 billion in broadband stimulus funding given out by President >>>Obama >>>is not even close to enough to deploy truly universal broadband access, >>>according to a new study from Insight Research." >>> >>>Scottie >>> >>>Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as >>>$30.00/mth. >>>Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. >>> >>> >>>-- >-- &g
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
I'm sure the $1,500 per customer figure was total cost for everything (bandwidth, backhaul, switches, routers, etc.). It seems like a lot, until you start adding up everything we need to get service to that customer... AP's, backhaul, towers, routers, switches, UPS's, etc. Travis Microserv Scottie Arnett wrote: I found these stats interesting: "the number of households either lacking Internet service altogether or using dial-up connections approaches 58 million – half of the households in the United States." Somebody is wrong somewhere on these numbers? and... "Insight Research claims that it takes about $1,500 per household to deploy broadband, bringing the amount of money needed for universal access to $60 billion." I know I could do mucho mucho wireless with $1500 per customer! Scottie -- Original Message -- From: "Robert West" Date: Fri, 11 Dec 2009 20:28:56 -0500 Maybe if it was given to those who are truly interested in providing broadband, it would be more than enough. How much more could YOU do, Scottie, if they gave you 100 grand outright? I bet it would go directly towards the customer. Now I'm sure that there are plenty of well meaning companies out there just trying for a little help and deservedly so, but basic human nature is greed and as we've talked about before, once those "Wisps by Convenience" get the cash, play Wisp until they run out of that cash and then go bye-bye, our payday will come when we are able to buy their equipment at auction. At least that's what I tell myself to feel better.. :) -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scottie Arnett Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 8:20 PM To: wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice < http://www.cedmagazine.com/News-Broadband-stimulus-funds-121109.aspx > "The $7.2 billion in broadband stimulus funding given out by President Obama is not even close to enough to deploy truly universal broadband access, according to a new study from Insight Research." Scottie Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ --- [This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
And that makes sense, however back during the rural electrification days, they weren't after 200 amp service, just a line and a light bulb made it all good. Everything after was built on top of that. But one could also argue that dial-up was the start and this is the additional upgrading. But they are right, fiber is the one true way of bringing everyone up to the same level of access. I'm conflicted because both sides in it are right, in my eyes. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Mike Hammett Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 9:17 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice A lot of organizations only consider fiber worthy of deployment going forward. $1500 seems about appropriate, then. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: "Scottie Arnett" Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 7:48 PM To: Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > I found these stats interesting: "the number of households either lacking > Internet service altogether or using dial-up connections approaches 58 > million - half of the households in the United States." > > Somebody is wrong somewhere on these numbers? > > and... > > "Insight Research claims that it takes about $1,500 per household to > deploy broadband, bringing the amount of money needed for universal access > to $60 billion." > > I know I could do mucho mucho wireless with $1500 per customer! > > Scottie > > -- Original Message -- > From: "Robert West" > Date: Fri, 11 Dec 2009 20:28:56 -0500 > >>Maybe if it was given to those who are truly interested in providing >>broadband, it would be more than enough. >> >>How much more could YOU do, Scottie, if they gave you 100 grand outright? >>I >>bet it would go directly towards the customer. >> >>Now I'm sure that there are plenty of well meaning companies out there >>just >>trying for a little help and deservedly so, but basic human nature is >>greed >>and as we've talked about before, once those "Wisps by Convenience" get >>the >>cash, play Wisp until they run out of that cash and then go bye-bye, our >>payday will come when we are able to buy their equipment at auction. At >>least that's what I tell myself to feel better.. :) >> >> >> >>-Original Message- >>From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >>Behalf Of Scottie Arnett >>Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 8:20 PM >>To: wireless@wispa.org >>Subject: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice >> >>< http://www.cedmagazine.com/News-Broadband-stimulus-funds-121109.aspx > >> >>"The $7.2 billion in broadband stimulus funding given out by President >>Obama >>is not even close to enough to deploy truly universal broadband access, >>according to a new study from Insight Research." >> >>Scottie >> >>Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as >>$30.00/mth. >>Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. >> >> >>-- -- >> >>WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>http://signup.wispa.org/ >>-- -- >> >> >>WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >>Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >>Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >>--- >>[This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] >> >> > > > Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as > $30.00/mth. > Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ --
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
A lot of organizations only consider fiber worthy of deployment going forward. $1500 seems about appropriate, then. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com -- From: "Scottie Arnett" Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 7:48 PM To: Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > > I found these stats interesting: "the number of households either lacking > Internet service altogether or using dial-up connections approaches 58 > million - half of the households in the United States." > > Somebody is wrong somewhere on these numbers? > > and... > > "Insight Research claims that it takes about $1,500 per household to > deploy broadband, bringing the amount of money needed for universal access > to $60 billion." > > I know I could do mucho mucho wireless with $1500 per customer! > > Scottie > > -- Original Message -- > From: "Robert West" > Date: Fri, 11 Dec 2009 20:28:56 -0500 > >>Maybe if it was given to those who are truly interested in providing >>broadband, it would be more than enough. >> >>How much more could YOU do, Scottie, if they gave you 100 grand outright? >>I >>bet it would go directly towards the customer. >> >>Now I'm sure that there are plenty of well meaning companies out there >>just >>trying for a little help and deservedly so, but basic human nature is >>greed >>and as we've talked about before, once those "Wisps by Convenience" get >>the >>cash, play Wisp until they run out of that cash and then go bye-bye, our >>payday will come when we are able to buy their equipment at auction. At >>least that's what I tell myself to feel better.. :) >> >> >> >>-Original Message- >>From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >>Behalf Of Scottie Arnett >>Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 8:20 PM >>To: wireless@wispa.org >>Subject: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice >> >>< http://www.cedmagazine.com/News-Broadband-stimulus-funds-121109.aspx > >> >>"The $7.2 billion in broadband stimulus funding given out by President >>Obama >>is not even close to enough to deploy truly universal broadband access, >>according to a new study from Insight Research." >> >>Scottie >> >>Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as >>$30.00/mth. >>Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. >> >> >> >> >>WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>http://signup.wispa.org/ >> >> >> >>WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >>Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >>Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >>--- >>[This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] >> >> > > > Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as > $30.00/mth. > Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. > > > > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
That's nuts. No wonder there isn't enough cash. HA! I don't think I'm charging enough of an install fee after reading that. Hmm "That'll be a $1000.00 install fee please." Gotta be a whole lotta padding in those numbers. -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scottie Arnett Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 8:49 PM To: wireless@wispa.org Subject: Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice I found these stats interesting: "the number of households either lacking Internet service altogether or using dial-up connections approaches 58 million - half of the households in the United States." Somebody is wrong somewhere on these numbers? and... "Insight Research claims that it takes about $1,500 per household to deploy broadband, bringing the amount of money needed for universal access to $60 billion." I know I could do mucho mucho wireless with $1500 per customer! Scottie -- Original Message -- From: "Robert West" Date: Fri, 11 Dec 2009 20:28:56 -0500 >Maybe if it was given to those who are truly interested in providing >broadband, it would be more than enough. > >How much more could YOU do, Scottie, if they gave you 100 grand outright? I >bet it would go directly towards the customer. > >Now I'm sure that there are plenty of well meaning companies out there just >trying for a little help and deservedly so, but basic human nature is greed >and as we've talked about before, once those "Wisps by Convenience" get the >cash, play Wisp until they run out of that cash and then go bye-bye, our >payday will come when we are able to buy their equipment at auction. At >least that's what I tell myself to feel better.. :) > > > >-Original Message- >From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >Behalf Of Scottie Arnett >Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 8:20 PM >To: wireless@wispa.org >Subject: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > >< http://www.cedmagazine.com/News-Broadband-stimulus-funds-121109.aspx > > >"The $7.2 billion in broadband stimulus funding given out by President Obama >is not even close to enough to deploy truly universal broadband access, >according to a new study from Insight Research." > >Scottie > >Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as >$30.00/mth. >Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. > > >--- - > >WISPA Wants You! Join today! >http://signup.wispa.org/ >--- - > > >WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > >Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > >Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > >--- >[This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] > > Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
I found these stats interesting: "the number of households either lacking Internet service altogether or using dial-up connections approaches 58 million half of the households in the United States." Somebody is wrong somewhere on these numbers? and... "Insight Research claims that it takes about $1,500 per household to deploy broadband, bringing the amount of money needed for universal access to $60 billion." I know I could do mucho mucho wireless with $1500 per customer! Scottie -- Original Message -- From: "Robert West" Date: Fri, 11 Dec 2009 20:28:56 -0500 >Maybe if it was given to those who are truly interested in providing >broadband, it would be more than enough. > >How much more could YOU do, Scottie, if they gave you 100 grand outright? I >bet it would go directly towards the customer. > >Now I'm sure that there are plenty of well meaning companies out there just >trying for a little help and deservedly so, but basic human nature is greed >and as we've talked about before, once those "Wisps by Convenience" get the >cash, play Wisp until they run out of that cash and then go bye-bye, our >payday will come when we are able to buy their equipment at auction. At >least that's what I tell myself to feel better.. :) > > > >-Original Message- >From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >Behalf Of Scottie Arnett >Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 8:20 PM >To: wireless@wispa.org >Subject: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice > >< http://www.cedmagazine.com/News-Broadband-stimulus-funds-121109.aspx > > >"The $7.2 billion in broadband stimulus funding given out by President Obama >is not even close to enough to deploy truly universal broadband access, >according to a new study from Insight Research." > >Scottie > >Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as >$30.00/mth. >Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. > > > > >WISPA Wants You! Join today! >http://signup.wispa.org/ > > > >WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > >Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > >Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > >--- >[This E-mail scanned for viruses by Declude Virus] > > Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
Re: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice
Maybe if it was given to those who are truly interested in providing broadband, it would be more than enough. How much more could YOU do, Scottie, if they gave you 100 grand outright? I bet it would go directly towards the customer. Now I'm sure that there are plenty of well meaning companies out there just trying for a little help and deservedly so, but basic human nature is greed and as we've talked about before, once those "Wisps by Convenience" get the cash, play Wisp until they run out of that cash and then go bye-bye, our payday will come when we are able to buy their equipment at auction. At least that's what I tell myself to feel better.. :) -Original Message- From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Scottie Arnett Sent: Friday, December 11, 2009 8:20 PM To: wireless@wispa.org Subject: [WISPA] Report: Broadband stimulus funds won't suffice < http://www.cedmagazine.com/News-Broadband-stimulus-funds-121109.aspx > "The $7.2 billion in broadband stimulus funding given out by President Obama is not even close to enough to deploy truly universal broadband access, according to a new study from Insight Research." Scottie Wireless High Speed Broadband service from Info-Ed, Inc. as low as $30.00/mth. Check out www.info-ed.com/wireless.html for information. WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
