Re: [CF-metadata] [netcdfgroup] [Hdf-forum] Detecting netCDF versus HDF5 -- PROPOSED SOLUTIONS --REQUEST FOR COMMENTS

2016-04-22 Thread John Caron
> Pedro Vicente > pedro.vice...@space-research.org > https://twitter.com/_pedro__vicente > http://www.space-research.org/ > > > > > - Original Message - > *From:* John Caron <jcaron1...@gmail.com> > *To:* Pedro Vicente <pedro.vice...@space-r

Re: [CF-metadata] [netcdfgroup] [Hdf-forum] Detecting netCDF versus HDF5 -- PROPOSED SOLUTIONS --REQUEST FOR COMMENTS

2016-04-22 Thread John Caron
...@space-research.org > https://twitter.com/_pedro__vicente > http://www.space-research.org/ > > > > > - Original Message - > *From:* John Caron <jcaron1...@gmail.com> > *To:* Pedro Vicente <pedro.vice...@space-research.org> > *Cc:* cf-m

Re: [CF-metadata] [CF Metadata] Question about ancillary variables/formula terms variables

2015-12-22 Thread John Caron
Hi David: At the risk of giving more useful answers to the wrong question, i will say that we could do something other than require ancillary or coordinate variables to only have dimensions that the parent variable has. There just must be a simple and explicit rule for mapping between parent and

Re: [CF-metadata] [CF Metadata] Question about ancillary variables/formula terms variables

2015-12-21 Thread John Caron
oops, sorry misread the question On Mon, Dec 21, 2015 at 1:06 PM, Jim Biard <jbi...@cicsnc.org> wrote: > John, > > But ancillary variables aren't coordinates, are they? > > Jim > > > On 12/21/15 1:08 PM, John Caron wrote: > > i think a crucial property of

Re: [CF-metadata] [CF Metadata] Question about ancillary variables/formula terms variables

2015-12-21 Thread John Caron
i think a crucial property of coordinates is that their dimensions are a subset of the variable's dimensions. otherwise one cant assign the correct coordinate. the length of a char valued coordinate is an exception, really char(n) is logically the same as string. while a dim=1 coordinate could

[CF-metadata] Fwd: Geos grid mapping

2015-05-06 Thread John Caron
i think its just that CF 1.7 document has been stuck for going on 3 years now. -- Forwarded message -- From: Ethan Davis eda...@ucar.edu Date: Wed, May 6, 2015 at 3:29 PM Subject: Re: [CF-metadata] Geos grid mapping To: Randy Horne rho...@excaliburlabs.com Cc: John Caron ca

Re: [CF-metadata] geostationary vs vertical_perspective in CF 1.7.

2014-11-19 Thread John Caron
, at 3:19 PM, John Caron ca...@ucar.edu wrote: CF TRAC ticket 72 defines geostationary projection, accepted for 1.7. 1) I _think_ that Vertical Perspective is an earlier version of this, and it should be deprecated in favor of geostationary. Does anyone have a different opinion? 2) The draft

[CF-metadata] Correct mail group address?

2014-11-18 Thread John Caron
I have both cf-metadata@cgd.ucar.edu and cf-metad...@lists.llnl.gov it appears the many (most?) still use cf-metadata@cgd.ucar.edu, i guess its being forwarded to cf-metad...@lists.llnl.gov ___ CF-metadata mailing list CF-metadata@cgd.ucar.edu

Re: [CF-metadata] Correct mail group address?

2014-11-18 Thread John Caron
of the system for connecting the Trac issue-tracker to the main mailing list at ucar.edu. - Jeff On 11/18/14, 11:52 AM, John Caron wrote: I have both cf-metadata@cgd.ucar.edu and cf-metad...@lists.llnl.gov it appears the many (most?) still use cf-metadata@cgd.ucar.edu, i guess its

[CF-metadata] geostationary vs vertical_perspective in CF 1.7.

2014-11-18 Thread John Caron
CF TRAC ticket 72 defines geostationary projection, accepted for 1.7. 1) I _think_ that Vertical Perspective is an earlier version of this, and it should be deprecated in favor of geostationary. Does anyone have a different opinion? 2) The draft 1.7 does not yet include it, so its been hard to

Re: [CF-metadata] string valued coordinates

2014-10-30 Thread John Caron
My preference is that one explicitly puts in the units. For dimensionless, 1 or is ok for udunits. If the units attribute isnt there, I assume that the user forgot to specify it, so the units are unknown. Im not sure what CF actually says, but it would be good to clarify. John On Thu, Oct 30,

Re: [CF-metadata] string valued coordinates

2014-10-05 Thread John Caron
I understand that netCDF coordinate variables have to be strictly monotonic, and no-one wants to define what this means for the general case of strings; that is fine. in CDM, monontonicity is required to make the 1D coordinate maps invertible. For string valued coordinates, the equivilent

Re: [CF-metadata] CF-2.0 Convention discussion

2014-09-27 Thread John Caron
Hi all: Yes, 1.10 would follow 1.9, if needed, on that branch. In software, we are used to major version increments meaning API may have changed. Since any CF file using features of the extended model will not be fully visable (or even break) software that only understands the classic model, it

Re: [CF-metadata] Why surface_altitude instead of platform_altitude?

2014-09-18 Thread John Caron
As I recall, the original proposal was for station_altitude. We decided to change station to platform. At the same time it was thought that the existing standard name of surface altitude would be synonymous. I at least was thinking of ground stations. So I think we make a mistake there and

Re: [CF-metadata] CF Conventions and netCDF-4 enhanced model

2014-09-11 Thread John Caron
Hi Timothy: From my POV, groups are a way to, um, group things (variables, coord systems, etc) together. They should be used for the same reason we use directories in a file system, to prevent a big mess of things in one namespace. On the surface, your layout above seems reasonable for those

Re: [CF-metadata] CF Conventions and netCDF-4 enhanced model

2014-09-10 Thread John Caron
Hi Karl and all: NetCDF-4 compression and chunking are transparent to the user, and are compatible with the classic data model. I think we should be gathering experiences with the enhanced data model, and start a CF-2.X convention draft document that uses the enhanced model. It would also be a

Re: [CF-metadata] Date/time and leap seconds

2014-07-17 Thread John Caron
A true count of seconds since an epoch matches the approach of TAI, not UTC. On 7/16/14, 5:58 PM, John Caron wrote: Hi Maik: Unfortunately, CF references the udunits package which is no longer being developed, at least for date/time coordinates. udunits does not support leap seconds

Re: [CF-metadata] Date/time and leap seconds

2014-07-16 Thread John Caron
Hi Maik: Unfortunately, CF references the udunits package which is no longer being developed, at least for date/time coordinates. udunits does not support leap seconds. your best bet is to add an auxiliary time coordinate which uses leap seconds, eg TAI. your specialized software can use that

Re: [CF-metadata] Are ensembles a compelling use case for group-aware metadata? (CZ)

2013-10-01 Thread john caron
On 9/19/2013 3:58 PM, Schultz, Martin wrote: Now, here is another use case, which we haven't implemented yet - partly because we didn't see how it can be done in a CF consistent way: While there has been a definition of a standard file layout for data from multiple stations (a contribution

Re: [CF-metadata] Are ensembles a compelling use case for group-aware metadata? (CZ)

2013-10-01 Thread john caron
Hi all: A few thoughts from my (possibly limited) POV. 1. Best strategy for storing very large collections of data in flat files like netcdf? - store coherent chunks of the dataset in each file. Seems like a good file size these days is 100M - 1 Gbyte. - choose coherence by deciding on the

Re: [CF-metadata] thredds changing CF conventions version

2013-08-28 Thread John Caron
Hi Sean: What feature of CF are you using that you need to preserve the version? John If you torture data long enough, it will confess. -- Economist Ronald Coase On 8/28/2013 3:28 AM, Gaffney, Sean P. wrote: Hi, Here at the British Oceanographic Data Centre we use THREDDS to deliver and

Re: [CF-metadata] thredds changing CF conventions version

2013-08-28 Thread John Caron
On Aug 28, 2013, at 08:56, John Caron ca...@unidata.ucar.edu wrote: Hi Sean: What feature of CF are you using that you need to preserve the version? John If you torture data long enough, it will confess. -- Economist Ronald Coase On 8/28/2013 3:28 AM, Gaffney, Sean P. wrote: Hi, Here

Re: [CF-metadata] thredds changing CF conventions version

2013-08-28 Thread John Caron
Hi Seth: On 8/28/2013 12:59 PM, Seth McGinnis wrote: Hi Sean, Personally, I would regard that as suspect behavior. I'm of the opinion that it's best practice for a data service to affect the data it operates on in very targeted and transparent way, and that it should pass everything else

Re: [CF-metadata] CF-1.6 DSG clarification: time series lat/lon coordinates

2013-06-11 Thread John Caron
Hi Mark and Jonathan: I will say straight up that I dont understand the implications of this particular discussion. But in case its helpful, I have found it important to separate the data model and the encoding of the model in the netCDF file. Probably you are both already doing that, but I

Re: [CF-metadata] CF-1.6 DSG clarification: time series lat/lon coordinates

2013-06-04 Thread John Caron
Hi Jonathan: On 6/4/2013 4:17 AM, Jonathan Gregory wrote: Dear John Caron and John Maurer I agree with John C that the problem arises when the coordinate variables are not size one. John M's example float lon(lon) ; float lat(lat) ; float alt(alt) ; float temp

Re: [CF-metadata] CF-1.6 DSG clarification: time series lat/lon coordinates

2013-06-04 Thread John Caron
from John Caron ca...@unidata.ucar.edu - Date: Tue, 4 Jun 2013 10:54:45 -0600 From: John Caron ca...@unidata.ucar.edu User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:17.0) Gecko/20130509 Thunderbird/17.0.6 To: cf-metadata@cgd.ucar.edu Subject: Re: [CF-metadata] CF-1.6 DSG

Re: [CF-metadata] CF-1.6 DSG clarification: time series lat/lon coordinates

2013-05-29 Thread John Caron
Hi John: 1) The coordinates attribute is not new to DSG, it has been around since the beginning of CF. This defines the auxiliary coordinate variables, that is, coordinate variables that do not follow lat(lat) template. I think it would be good if Grads et al could be upgraded to use them.

Re: [CF-metadata] CF-1.6 DSG Trajectory files: clarification and advice

2013-05-28 Thread John Caron
Hi Derrick: Some first reactions: 1. the aggregation or collection will have two trajectories, the first is along a time axis time and the second is along a time axis time_avg. since they are both trajectories, then i think you dont have a problem with more than one feature type. however,

Re: [CF-metadata] New standard name: datetime_iso8601

2013-03-21 Thread John Caron
On 3/21/2013 9:41 AM, Steve Hankin wrote: On 3/21/2013 8:25 AM, John Caron wrote: Probably my proposal comes down to 2 parts, which are separable: 1. Find a suitable replacement for udunits as a reference library for CF calendar dates. Unfortunately, udunits used a slightly non-standard

Re: [CF-metadata] New standard name: datetime_iso8601

2013-03-20 Thread John Caron
Hi all: Another thing to consider is the relationship to the current udunit/CF standard for specifying dates in the unit string period SINCE date The udunits documentation http://www.unidata.ucar.edu/software/udunits/udunits-2/udunits2lib.html#Grammar not being very clear, I wrote up my

Re: [CF-metadata] New standard name: datetime_iso8601

2013-03-20 Thread John Caron
On 3/20/2013 9:41 AM, David Hassell wrote: Hello, My beer/coffee/perocet levels are too low to want to comment broadly on this, so I'll just make one comment ... Really the main advantage is that data writers are less likely to make a mistake specifying 1952-08-15T00:00:00Z than 2434567

Re: [CF-metadata] New standard name: datetime_iso8601

2013-03-15 Thread John Caron
://www.metoffice.gov.uk/ *From:* CF-metadata [mailto:cf-metadata-boun...@cgd.ucar.edu] *On Behalf Of *Steve Hankin *Sent:* 24 February 2013 19:07 *To:* John Caron *Cc:* cf-metadata@cgd.ucar.edu *Subject:* Re: [CF-metadata] New standard name

Re: [CF-metadata] brand new user

2013-03-14 Thread John Caron
On 3/14/2013 6:39 AM, Izidor Pelajic wrote: Hi all, I'm new at netCDF, new at CF, and moderate MATLAB user. I'm new at netCDF in a sense of days or week. So my problem (beyond the fact that I do not have general knowledge) is next. I was provided with a .nc file. In it there are 3 information of

Re: [CF-metadata] Rotated Pole projection possibly wrong

2013-03-06 Thread John Caron
On 2013-03-06 15:18, John Caron wrote: The Rotated Pole projection here: http://cf-pcmdi.llnl.gov/documents/cf-conventions/1.6/cf-conventions.html#appendix-grid-mappings Rotated pole grid_mapping_name = rotated_latitude_longitude Map parameters

Re: [CF-metadata] Rotated Pole projection possibly wrong

2013-03-06 Thread John Caron
--- Am 06.03.2013 um 17:09 schrieb John Caron ca...@unidata.ucar.edu: Hi Heiko: So grid_north_pole_longitude = normalizeLongitude180(longitudeOfSouthernPoleInDegrees) grid_north_pole_latitude = -1 * longitudeOfSouthernPoleInDegrees ? where does one find documentation on proj4's

Re: [CF-metadata] Rotated Pole projection possibly wrong

2013-03-06 Thread John Caron
Hi Seth: Thanks for the description, its really helpful. Im just wondering how we document this in the CF convention, so that implementers have something to check against. Is there a reference implementation we can use ? John On 3/6/2013 1:17 PM, Seth McGinnis wrote: So there are an

Re: [CF-metadata] calendar-based units of time

2012-12-17 Thread John Caron
Hi Jonathan: On 12/17/2012 10:51 AM, Jonathan Gregory wrote: Dear John I have prototyped similar functionality in the CDM, documented here: http://www.unidata.ucar.edu/software/netcdf-java/CDM/CalendarDateTime.html Thanks for this. I recall the earlier discussion and I think what you have

Re: [CF-metadata] CF calendars (was: problem with times in PSD dataset)

2012-12-17 Thread John Caron
Hi Cathy: I think that you are using backwards compatible in a different way. The current proposal(s) would not change files that are written with :Conventions=CF-1.x, where x = 6. Files with x 6 could still use the (ill-advised) old way if they want to, by putting an explicit calendar

Re: [CF-metadata] CF calendars (was: problem with times in PSD dataset)

2012-12-17 Thread John Caron
Hi Chris: On 12/17/2012 4:50 PM, Chris Barker - NOAA Federal wrote: I think a solution shouldn't break current files which followed what had been a standard for a long time (however ill-advised the standard was). I don't have a good sense of what might break if the standard changed in terms of

Re: [CF-metadata] CF calendars (was: problem with times in PSD dataset)

2012-12-14 Thread John Caron
Hi all: Heres what I understand of the conversation: 1. Theres nothing to do about existing files CF-1.6 and before. we are stuck with the udunits mixed calendar. 2. Starting with the next version after acceptance, (1.7 currently), we can do something different. I agree that forcing people

Re: [CF-metadata] [netcdf-java] problem with times in PSD dataset

2012-12-06 Thread John Caron
that in the late/winter spring timeframe, with some guidance on what functions were desired and a pass through our prioritization board. Best, -- Cecelia On 12/5/2012 12:25 PM, John Caron wrote: Hi all: Its probably the right thing to do to make gregorian (Mixed Gregorian/Julian calendar) the default

[CF-metadata] CF calendars (was: problem with times in PSD dataset)

2012-12-06 Thread John Caron
/2012 12:25 PM, John Caron wrote: Hi all: Its probably the right thing to do to make gregorian (Mixed Gregorian/Julian calendar) the default calendar for COARDS/CF, for backwards compatibility. However, CDM may leave proleptic_gregorian (ISO8601) as its default. And I would strongly suggest

Re: [CF-metadata] [netcdf-java] problem with times in PSD dataset

2012-12-06 Thread John Caron
files because the Java interface is not backwards compatible. Cathy Smith NOAA/ESRL PSD On 12/5/12 12:25 PM, John Caron wrote: Hi all: Its probably the right thing to do to make gregorian (Mixed Gregorian/Julian calendar) the default calendar for COARDS/CF, for backwards compatibility. However, CDM

Re: [CF-metadata] Choice of fill value for unpacked data

2012-10-11 Thread John Caron
On 10/10/2012 6:36 AM, Jim Biard wrote: John, I agree that there is no ambiguity in the original dataset. I was just pointing out a scenario in which the difficulty mentioned by Phil in his original post would manifest itself. The methodology referenced by Russ won't handle it. If you (for

Re: [CF-metadata] Choice of fill value for unpacked data

2012-10-09 Thread John Caron
Hi Jim: _FillValue/missing_value refers to the packed value, so theres no ambiguity in the original dataset. It is best to make sure its outside the range of real values, but even if not, one just has to search for that exact bit pattern. If someone rewrites the data, its their

Re: [CF-metadata] Roms: ocean_s_coordinate_g1 and g2?

2012-07-18 Thread John Caron
: Heiko, We worked with John Caron several years ago to get these into the CDM in the NetCDF-Java library, so if you have g1 or g2 coordinates they will work with codes that use NetCDF-java (like the Matlab NCTOOLBOX and Unidata's IDV), and I remember we drafted up some documentation to submit to CF

Re: [CF-metadata] You will get email from the CF Trac system.

2012-06-25 Thread John Caron
yes, i typically get 3 copies. it would be nice not to. On 6/25/2012 4:29 PM, Seth McGinnis wrote: I do want to see Trac messages, but since this update happened I'm getting two or three copies of each one. Is anyone else having this problem? What do I need to do to get only one copy?

[CF-metadata] Accept geostationary projection

2012-05-10 Thread John Caron
If no one has any objections, i move that we accept this ticket: Adding the geostationary projection. https://cf-pcmdi.llnl.gov/trac/ticket/72 the changes needed to the spec are at the bottom of the ticket, we didnt know how to change the top part.

Re: [CF-metadata] Ocean CTD data following CF Conventions v1.6

2012-05-01 Thread John Caron
On 4/30/2012 8:40 PM, andrew walsh wrote: Hi John and CF-Metadata list, Based on your earlier advice I decided using the Scalar way to represent the coordinate lat, long and time rather than Vector way i.e lat(lat0, lon(lon), time(time) mainly for reason of simplicity. the correct other

Re: [CF-metadata] Reverse-time trajectory

2012-05-01 Thread John Caron
a reason for increasing; I assume it's just because sect 9 was conceived for observations in the first place. However, John Caron may well have a comment. I don't think anything prevents your storing the data in the orthogonal multidimensional representation, which existed before sect 9 did and doesn't

Re: [CF-metadata] Ocean CTD data following CF Conventions v1.6

2012-04-30 Thread John Caron
On 4/29/2012 5:33 PM, andrew walsh wrote: Hi John, My responses inline below. Andrew - Original Message - From: John Caron ca...@unidata.ucar.edu To: cf-metadata@cgd.ucar.edu Sent: Saturday, April 28, 2012 2:39 AM Subject: Re: [CF-metadata] Ocean CTD data following CF Conventions

Re: [CF-metadata] Ocean CTD data following CF Conventions v1.6

2012-04-30 Thread John Caron
mailto:jim.bi...@noaa.gov 828-271-4900 On Apr 30, 2012, at 8:46 AM, John Caron wrote: On 4/29/2012 5:33 PM, andrew walsh wrote: Hi John, My responses inline below. Andrew - Original Message - From: John Caron ca...@unidata.ucar.edu mailto:ca...@unidata.ucar.edu To: cf-metadata

Re: [CF-metadata] Ocean CTD data following CF Conventions v1.6

2012-04-27 Thread John Caron
Variables: time lat lon temperature(pressure) The scalar approach you suggest as in section H.3.3. Single profile of the CF v1.6 standard is simpler than the vector approach so we will take your advice. Regards, Andrew - Original Message - From: John Caron ca...@unidata.ucar.edu

Re: [CF-metadata] Ocean CTD data following CF Conventions v1.6

2012-04-25 Thread John Caron
and a document specifying the CDL. Thanks and Regards, Andrew Walsh Ref. (1) Konovalov et. al (March 2012), Proposal to adopt a quality flag scheme standard for oceanographic and marine meteorological data, Version 1.2. - Original Message - From: John Caron ca...@unidata.ucar.edu

Re: [CF-metadata] identification of vector components

2012-04-24 Thread John Caron
On 4/24/2012 4:16 AM, Hedley, Mark wrote: There are particular issue here with format interoperability and conversion with respect to phenomenon. In GRIB2, for example, there are codes which identify vector components: Wind direction (from which blowing) degree true Wind speed ms

Re: [CF-metadata] code that does semantic checking of CF headers

2012-04-23 Thread John Caron
On 4/20/2012 4:54 AM, Gaffney, Sean P. wrote: Hi everyone, Thanks for all your feedback. It's made things clearer for me now. Just to summarise then, a suite of attributes that would provide a precise numeric description of the data within a variable could then be (ignoring things such as

Re: [CF-metadata] identification of vector components

2012-04-19 Thread John Caron
Heres my two cents: The meaning of the x_coordinate and y_coordinate is actually well defined. But it does not mean x=east and y=north. It means the input to the projection function proj(x,y) - (lat,lon), which are defined in appendix F, with pointers to reference software. AFAIU, these

Re: [CF-metadata] code that does semantic checking of CF headers

2012-04-19 Thread John Caron
On 4/19/2012 9:13 AM, Gaffney, Sean P. wrote: Hi all, My name is Sean Gaffney, from the British Oceanographic Data Centre, and I'm working on a project dealing with numerical model data that are in CF compliant NetCDF, so I thought I'd sign up to the community. The project I am working on

Re: [CF-metadata] Using add_offset scale_factor with coordinate variables

2012-04-11 Thread John Caron
On 4/11/2012 3:59 PM, Jonathan Gregory wrote: Dear Randy While I understand why this would be convenient for you, I'm inclined to think that your convenience would be outweighed by the inconvenience to the users of the data in this case. I don't expect there is any existing CF-aware analysis

Re: [CF-metadata] Ocean CTD data following CF Conventions v1.6

2012-04-03 Thread John Caron
Hi all: Lets see, I havent followed the entire conversation, but: 1) Andrew if you can send me a sample file (not just the CDL) I can check if it works in the CDM with the new 1.6 conventions, and maybe give you some advice from my POV. 2) Aggregation in the CDM comes in 2 flavors. 1) The

Re: [CF-metadata] CF-1.6 Conformance Requirements/Recommendations

2012-03-28 Thread John Caron
On 3/28/2012 6:26 AM, Jonathan Gregory wrote: Dear all Brian has a good point that sect 5.3 allows that there might be missing data in aux coord variables. Appendix A - which is equally ancient in the story of CF :-) - is not consistent with this, because it didn't allow _FillValue or

Re: [CF-metadata] CF-1.6 Conformance Requirements/Recommendations

2012-03-28 Thread John Caron
On 3/28/2012 10:49 AM, John Caron wrote: I think we have a number of valid use cases for missing data in aux coordinates, and i would vote to allow that. sorry i didnt really answer jonathan's concern. I would suggest this wording: Auxiliary coordinates do not have to be monotonic or have

Re: [CF-metadata] CF-1.6 Conformance Requirements/Recommendations

2012-03-26 Thread John Caron
On 3/26/2012 2:24 AM, Jonathan Gregory wrote: Dear Ros Regarding this requirement: 9.6 Where any auxiliary coordinate variable contains a missing value, all other coordinate, auxiliary coordinate and data values corresponding to that element should also contain missing values. Appendix A

Re: [CF-metadata] CF-1.6 Conformance Requirements/Recommendations

2012-03-26 Thread John Caron
Hi all: From a CDM developer perspective, an auxiliary coordinate is just as good as a regular coordinate variable. The extra requirements on coordinate variables are helpful in knowing when to optimize, eg monotonicity allows one to efficiently find the index given the coordinate value.

Re: [CF-metadata] CF-1.6 Conformance Requirements/Recommendations

2012-03-23 Thread John Caron
On 3/23/2012 1:59 PM, Jim Biard wrote: Hi. Jonathan's reply contained the section: 9.6 Where any auxiliary coordinate variable contains a missing value, all other coordinate, auxiliary coordinate and data values corresponding to that element should also contain missing

[CF-metadata] Example 5.10. British National Grid has wrong parameter names

2012-03-14 Thread John Caron
Example 5.10. British National Grid int crs ; crs:grid_mapping_name = transverse_mercator; crs:semi_major_axis = 6377563.396 ; crs:semi_minor_axis = 6356256.910 ; crs:inverse_flattening = 299.3249646 ; crs:latitude_of_projection_origin = 49.0 ;

Re: [CF-metadata] FW: GOES-R metadata prototype

2012-03-07 Thread John Caron
hi michael 1) There are a few typos (see attached) that made it invalid NcML. also .ncml suffix is preferred over .xml 2) for cdm_data_type, i might not call this a grid, maybe image is better. the satellite group should probably come up with a feature type name for geostationary data. 3)

Re: [CF-metadata] machine-accessible CF compliance checker?

2012-03-01 Thread John Caron
Hi all: If the checker can read from opendap, then putting the files on an opendap server might be helpful, in that only the metadata is read instead of the entire file. There are a few difference among servers (Hyrax, TDS, GDS, etc) but im pretty sure this would work for netcdf files well

[CF-metadata] defects in example 7.11, 7.12

2012-02-26 Thread John Caron
Possible defects: 1) Example 7.11. Extreme statistics and spell-lengths climatology_bounds=2007-12-1 6:00, 2000-8-2 6:00; should be climatology_bounds=2007-12-1 6:00, 2008-3-1 6:00; perhaps clearer as climatology_bounds=2007-12-1, 2008-3-1; 2) flip order of 7.11 and 7.12, since 7.12

Re: [CF-metadata] How to represent 6-hourly diurnal monthly means in CF ?

2012-02-24 Thread John Caron
Thanks, Jonathan. On 2/21/2012 11:18 AM, Jonathan Gregory wrote: Dear John However, im not sure what this sentence in 7.4 means: When considering intervals within days, if the earlier time of day is equal to the later time of day, then the method is applied to a full 24 hour day. It doesn't

[CF-metadata] How to represent 6-hourly diurnal monthly means in CF ?

2012-02-20 Thread John Caron
Im working with NOAA's CFSR dataset, reading it into the CDM, which essentially means converting GRIB into CF/netCDF. ref: http://nomads.ncdc.noaa.gov/data.php#cfs-reanal-data http://dss.ucar.edu/datasets/ds093.2/ from NCAR's DSS page: CFSR monthly atmospheric, oceanic and land surface

Re: [CF-metadata] Convention attribute

2011-12-22 Thread john caron
On 12/22/2011 2:11 AM, Jonathan Gregory wrote: Dear all The existing Unidata recommendation is OK and we could incorporate it into CF but it would help to be more precise, for instance: If the Conventions att includes no commas, it is interpreted as a blank-separated list of conventions; if it

Re: [CF-metadata] inconsistencies in translating projection parameters OGC WKT - CF-1.5

2011-12-14 Thread John Caron
Hi Etienne: Generally, CF has followed proj4 conventions as much as we could, and John Snyder's reference book is often underneath: http://pubs.usgs.gov/pp/1395/report.pdf OGC specs tended to come from experts using the EPSG, and generally we are less familiar with that. some specific

Re: [CF-metadata] udunits corresponding to Forel-Ule, milliequivalent

2011-12-09 Thread john caron
hi: I think I would also advocate adding another standard attribute, something like units_label which would be a label for the units in a plot, not necessarily udunit compliant. eg: var : units = ; var : units_label = milligrams per gram of dry sediment; john On 12/9/2011 2:09 AM,

Re: [CF-metadata] Proposal for better handling vector quantities in CF

2011-12-09 Thread John Caron
On 12/9/2011 11:37 AM, Jonathan Gregory wrote: Dear John I prefer the idea that Thomas has put forward of an umbrella, rather than containing the vector/tensor components in one data variable, because * I really don't like the idea of units being mixed within a data variable. I think things

Re: [CF-metadata] Proposal for better handling vector quantities in CF

2011-12-08 Thread John Caron
On 11/24/2011 2:53 PM, Thomas Lavergne wrote: Dear all, This email is a proposal to strenghthen the storage and exploitation of vector/tensor data in CF. Thanks to Jonathan for commenting an early version of this note. As far as I can tell, vectors are not handled as such by CF, only their

Re: [CF-metadata] [thredds] Compression by Gathering working with Thredds?

2011-12-07 Thread John Caron
Hi Matthias: The CDM/TDS does not support Compression by Gathering, nor does any other package i know of. There was some internal talk in CF of deprecating this. I am cc'ing the CF list in case anyone there wants to comment. Have you looked at using netcdf-4 with compression? John On

Re: [CF-metadata] FW: netcdf for particle trajectories

2011-11-26 Thread John Caron
Hi Ute: On 11/25/2011 6:01 AM, Ute Brönner wrote: Hi folks, I kind of lost track of our latest discussions and had the feeling that this was partly outside the mailing group; so I will try to sum up what we were discussing. My latest try was to produce NetCDF for particle trajectory trying

[CF-metadata] Fwd: Re: Proposed addition to CF principles: outside conventions

2011-11-21 Thread John Caron
Original Message Subject: Re: [CF-metadata] Proposed addition to CF principles: outside conventions Date: Mon, 21 Nov 2011 14:39:13 -0700 From: Seth McGinnis mcgin...@ucar.edu To: John Caron ca...@unidata.ucar.edu Hi John, I'm generally in favor of this proposal

Re: [CF-metadata] standards for probabilities

2011-11-15 Thread John Caron
Hi Vegard: I see some of these kinds of things from NCEP, encoded in GRIB, and Im still trying to understand what they are. So, some questions from a non-modeler: On 11/15/2011 2:10 AM, Vegard Bønes wrote: Hi! I am trying to create a document containing various probability values for

Re: [CF-metadata] standard names for stations

2011-09-16 Thread John Caron
Heres a few comments on this discussion from my POV: 1) to summarize whats already in CF1.6: section A9.2: It is strongly recommended that there should be a station variable (which may be of any type) with the attribute cf_role=”timeseries_id”, whose values uniquely identify the stations. It

Re: [CF-metadata] CDM calendar date handling

2011-08-24 Thread John Caron
On 8/24/2011 6:23 AM, Jonathan Gregory wrote: Dear John It seems to me it would be better to somehow denote the epoch seperately, because its kind of silly keeping track of # millisecs between two dates separated by 50 million years. plus its hard. what about: 01-01-01 12:00 epoch 50m BCE

Re: [CF-metadata] CDM calendar date handling

2011-08-23 Thread John Caron
; The problem is that udunits ends up computing times for -64 Myear as: 63998634-12-14 00:00:00 BCE so you lose precision on the year. Don On 8/19/11 10:45 AM, John Caron wrote: Regarding paleoclimate, a point I forgot is that some modellers may wish to have years which are very large negative

Re: [CF-metadata] CDM calendar date handling

2011-08-23 Thread John Caron
On 8/23/2011 6:13 AM, Lynnes, Christopher S. (GSFC-6102) wrote: On Aug 22, 2011, at 6:36 PM, John Caron wrote: On 8/22/2011 6:37 AM, Jonathan Gregory wrote: Dear Chris Perhaps there could be an attribute we could set that says whether we have accounted for leap seconds? With the absence

Re: [CF-metadata] CDM calendar date handling

2011-08-19 Thread John Caron
On 8/19/2011 7:48 AM, Lynnes, Christopher S. (GSFC-6102) wrote: On Aug 19, 2011, at 7:54 AM, Jon Blower wrote: Hi Chris, Does the calendar system usually define whether leap-seconds are taken into account or not? Generally speaking, I don't believe so, if only because calendar systems

Re: [CF-metadata] CDM calendar date handling

2011-08-19 Thread John Caron
Regarding paleoclimate, a point I forgot is that some modellers may wish to have years which are very large negative numbers (many more than four digits) if they set up the model with the true date for the run. Although for geological timescales you might say that this isn't necessary and you

Re: [CF-metadata] CDM calendar date handling

2011-08-18 Thread John Caron
Hi Jonathan: On 8/18/2011 9:41 AM, Jonathan Gregory wrote: Dear John http://www.unidata.ucar.edu/software/netcdf-java/CDM/DateTime.html If there's interest, I can propose as a CF convention. Otherwise it can remain a CDM extension. Thank you for doing this. I think it's an attractive

[CF-metadata] CDM calendar date handling

2011-08-17 Thread John Caron
In March I promised to do something with the udunits handling of fuzzy time units email conversation. I now have a preliminary implementation of extended date coordinates. docs are here: http://www.unidata.ucar.edu/software/netcdf-java/CDM/DateTime.html

Re: [CF-metadata] Is there a convention defining day offsets to use for monthly average time series?

2011-08-10 Thread John Caron
On 8/8/2011 3:43 PM, Jim Biard wrote: Hi. I have a time series of monthly averaged values. I have an integer-valued time coordinate variable and an associated time_bounds variable. Is it correct to use the 15th of February and the 16th of all the other months for my time centers, or should

Re: [CF-metadata] the need to store lat/lon coordinates in a CF metadata compliant netCDF file

2011-08-10 Thread John Caron
On 7/26/2011 4:24 AM, Jonathan Gregory wrote: Dear all For datasets which are intended for analysis by end-users I think it would be undesirable to remove the requirement of providing explicit lat and lon coords even if a grid_mapping is provided. I think it is unrealistic to expect all

Re: [CF-metadata] the need to store lat/lon coordinates in a CF-compliant netCDF file

2011-08-03 Thread John Caron
On 8/3/2011 8:19 AM, Jon Blower wrote: Hi all, I've been following this thread with great interest. For me it boils down to this question: - Is the datum always known by the data provider? If the answer is yes then I see no reason to omit the datum (and plenty of reasons to include it).

Re: [CF-metadata] the need to store lat/lon coordinates in a CF metadata compliant netCDF file

2011-07-28 Thread John Caron
Hi all: If I understand the situation, a GCM, whether global or regional, always has a datum. In the simple case, its just the radius of a spherical earth. However, for current global models its typical that this datum doesnt affect anything (presumably as long as its within the typical

Re: [CF-metadata] CF feature type trajectory (Ch. 9; May 10, 2011) and axis, attribute

2011-07-26 Thread John Caron
Hi Chris: I think we agreed that this sentence in section 5 should be removed: The|axis|attribute is not allowed for auxiliary coordinate variables. If anyone has a better idea, let me know. otherwise i will submit a defect change. John On 7/20/2011 7:51 AM, Chris Paver wrote: Dear list,

Re: [CF-metadata] CF-metadata Digest, Vol 99, Issue 8

2011-07-20 Thread John Caron
On 7/20/2011 3:43 AM, Comiskey, Glenn wrote: Thanks for the reply John. Just to confirm, the vertical coordinate is described by a number of other metadata attributes such as axis, standard_name, _CoordinateAxisType etc. and therefore wouldn't expect any problems with applications discovering

Re: [CF-metadata] Units: degrees - COARDS/CF Convention

2011-07-16 Thread John Caron
On 7/14/2011 8:48 AM, Comiskey, Glenn wrote: Hi, The use of the variable unit value degrees would appear to discount a data set from being both COARDS and CF compliant, at least according to the CF conventions document, i.e. v1.5, section 3.1 states The COARDS convention prohibits the unit

Re: [CF-metadata] the need to store lat/lon coordinates in a CF metadata compliant netCDF file

2011-07-07 Thread John Caron
On 6/30/2011 1:26 PM, Randy Horne wrote: Paragraph 5.6 Coordinate Reference Systems, Grid Mappings, and Projections, first sentence: When the coordinate variables for a horizontal grid are not longitude and latitude, it is required that the true latitude and longitude coordinates be supplied

Re: [CF-metadata] udunits time units question

2011-04-22 Thread John Caron
/esmf_releases/public/last/ESMF_refdoc/ Brian On Fri, Apr 01, 2011 at 05:04:42AM -0600, John Caron wrote: Hi Martin and all: Im wondering what essential methods a calendar library needs to have to support, eg 360 day calendars? The only one that comes to mind is to calculate the difference between

Re: [CF-metadata] physical vs dimensional units

2011-04-15 Thread John Caron
On 4/15/2011 10:29 AM, Steve Emmerson wrote: John, On 04/14/2011 08:09 PM, John Caron wrote: Im thinking that ne wants a grammer that allows moleX / mole * mole/ moleX = 1 moleX / mole * mole/ moleY= moleX/ moleY and so on. I wonder if this list could accumulate a list of such examples

Re: [CF-metadata] physical vs dimensional units

2011-04-14 Thread John Caron
Hi Jonathan: On 4/14/2011 2:14 AM, Jonathan Gregory wrote: Dear John and Steve I agree with Steve about this: On 04/13/2011 02:25 PM, John Caron wrote: the point im trying to make is that it would be better to understand that mol mol-1 (canonical udunit = 1) is not the same as m3 m-3

Re: [CF-metadata] physical vs dimensional units

2011-04-14 Thread John Caron
On 4/13/2011 2:52 PM, Steve Emmerson wrote: On 04/13/2011 02:25 PM, John Caron wrote: the point im trying to make is that it would be better to understand that mol mol-1 (canonical udunit = 1) is not the same as m3 m-3 (canonical udunit = 1). In my opinion, the distinction between mol/mol

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