Erik Trimble said:
That's OK. It was resolved off-list. No harm, no foul.
Yea but I'm still willing to own being a jerk publicly. Sorry about that. Blame
the lack of Phillip Morris's products in my bloodstream if you must. Usually I
try not to make personal attacks as that is an logical
Oracle Solaris Studio Express 6/10 is supported on Solaris 10 (SPARC, x86),
OEL 5 (x86), RHEL 5 (x86), SuSE 11 (x86) today and will be made available for
OpenSolaris in the near future.
Yea ok when is that near future going to be? Anyone? Or is this more of the
usual marketing BS I'm growing
ian said:
Erik,
I think you are understating the usefulness of the the OpenSolaris desktop.
Ian, Erik's a frakkin endlessly blithering idiot about all of this. He doesn't
know what he's talking about, he doesn't know Sun's history, and he damn sure
doesn't know how things work in the real
Erik Trimble said:
Note: I have no inside knowledge about anything in this message. It's my
personal reading of the tea leaves that have been coming out of Oracle's mouth.
That's not tea leaves coming out of their mouth, it's something that looks like
flem but isn't. It probably came from one
Erik Trimble said:
There's the myth that you have to get everyone before they turn 12 hooked on
your product, or you've lost them forever.
While that is an exaggeration age wise, you're still off base. I read
everything you've said, and while I'd like to agree with about 50% of it, I
can't
:) Glad to be reading that. This is a reasonable expectation after all, no
matter what the iron is.
Tim
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As an aside, my last comment in reply to Erik's many postings should have been
at the last of them he made...
Also, my nautical analogies have nothing to do with BP, or Mr. Ellison's
sporting interests. They reflect that I live on an island with very few people
in the middle of nowhere...
Before I plaster the link that follows, I'd like to thank Adobe for their
support for Solaris OpenSolaris. Yea, I know there's various GNU-ish projects
around, but I seriously dislike the GPL template license too. Not only that but
objectively Adobe's stuff is good software.
If I could, I'd
Edward Ned Harvey said:
I don't think most people (oracle especially) are interested in
solaris/opensolaris replacing the home user/end user operating system.
Corporate user says/thinks But if this one doesn't run on my laptop, why
should I expect it to run on my servers?? This other one I know
Edward Ned Harvey wrote:
Windows as an apache server
You may have been using that as a quasi-made-up example, but the truth is I've
make a lot of nickels doing exactly that. I don't care what people want to run
anymore. If it's the most awful choice on the earth, I'll take it as a fun
kmays wrote:
The point is you could build an updated 'something' and call it something.
/* Firstly, I would remind everyone that this is a *discussion* list. All
topics involving OpenSolaris are open for discussion. So if you don't like
what I'm saying, fine. But stuff a sock in that ignorant
I really don't think there will be any need to fork. If anything, people moving
around who're still committed to the technology is a very good thing.
OpenSolaris is healthy. The code is healthy too. And so is the rather nice
CDDL, which I prefer over GNU's hideous template stamp.
They're
ruario said,
As I have stated elsewhere, there is absolutely no truth in this at all:
Thank you for clearing that up. I'd already gotten the tarball for current, but
not yet installed it when I came across the prior FUD. Now I'll happily go
install it.
Tim
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badmagic wrote:
It seems (I'm afraid that) ever since Oracle took over Sun Microsystems,
Solaris stands to die a protracted and painful death by attrition.
You are wrong. There are a lot of people who're going to stay with it,
including myself, no matter what the press says, no matter how
Well, pudding is served with a spoon. About all I can tell you is that this is
red pudding. I don't have anything staked on their results. I'm not a big
company, or an SMB, I'm just a person, not a thing on paper. I only work on
other people's computers for them. I don't sign the checks buying
Oracle sales and marketing is all over this problem. Their plans will ensure
the sort of enthusiasm that will lead to greater product interest more sales
successes. It really should be clear to you how much they care. They've made
such good efforts to organize information and make problems
jbk wrote:
Can I have whatever you're having? =]
Hey it's Oracle's party. You'll have to ask the people who work in the parts of
the company that are not purely technical. I'm sure they can be found in
abundance somewhere. People here just deal with code mostly. We are not the
people who spend
gu99roax wrote:
Now I know how it works! So the line
hosts: file dns
That should be files not file. - In case the typo is sitting in the file
itself not on the forum.
Tim
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eam1 wrote:
it appears the so called writers,reporters from many well respected news sites
are ...
My conclusion is to let Oracle do the selling. I'm not gonna own their results,
so I'm unconcerned.
Tim
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hugh wrote:
But no upfront cost and no support revenue does not make for a good business.
I've no argument with that, or with what you've said about `casual users' etc.
In fact I'm avoiding speculation on the impact of these changes on audited
environments scads of other things that could be
I don't think evaporating non-contract security patch releases is especially
best practice. Note I'm only making reference to security patches. Other types
of patches are really a completely separate issue than this in some respects.
It's a fairly simple argument to make that this is a vendor
Mmmm thank you.
I'm wondering if you've tried out skype on it... That would make a lot of
people happy probably.
Tim
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yippi wrote:
The new GDM 2.28 was integrated into build 130. This replaces the
old GDM 2.20 which was in previous builds. The new GDM is a complete
rewrite of the code, and does not yet support a graphical configuration
program like gdmsetup. One is in the works, and should be available
in the
comay said;
130: could not even see the screen as it was all dark white
This is probably tied to X 3d feature stuff, I encountered the same problem
was able to trigger the white screen of doom when I tested to see if I could do
something more lively with my GeForce 9500 GT than the 'none'
There's been a lot of speculation in the press about this, and statements from
some Oracle executives that caused the speculation. It's not like it's some big
secret, or that customers aren't watching their backs because of it either.
Much less that mergers usually result in layoffs due to
Yes it will stay open source. The CDDL is a very nice license, and doesn't
allow easy 'take backs' either. The only approach Oracle would be able to take
would be one of SCO-like claims about improperly released copyright material.
That approach would not yield them any positives, and would
It's better than IBM. However the nicest thing I've ever heard anyone say about
Larry Ellison is that he has good taste in boats... So we'll see how it goes.
Tim
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ooreron said:
One led by Schwartz who believes Sun should sell and the other led by McNealy
who doesn't.
I agree with Mr. McNealy based on the concrete understanding that this would be
in the best interests of the national security of the United States. This is
why I suggested Sun seek out
ILOM ftw.
I have seen Dell racks blow breakers out of the electric junction box and imbed
the resulting shrapnel in the walls on the other side of the electric closet.
There's nothing quite like watching a large explosion to help clarify your
choices in hardware.
Tim
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ux-admin said:
Excellent engineers, excellent engineering practices and processes, but NEVER
a product that works 100%, with all kinks worked out.
Always phenomenal ideas, but never a 100% working product. About 75%, give or
take, is what gets released.
I have had different experiences than
martinb said:
Tim, didn't you state yourself, that you know him from having talked to him
a single time?
No that was perhaps someone else. I wouldn't claim to know him from that sort
of meeting either. I do know about some of the things that were occurring with
Sun NeXT and Lighthouse at the
I believe the NYT requires registration, that may be the problem you had. I
should have perhaps waited and cited a wire service report, but that one was
the most authoritative at the time of my post.
Tim
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http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/06/technology/business-computing/06blue.html
I'm glad about that, I think Sun can do a lot better. Also, IBM's behavior with
stimulus funds on one hand, and buying Sun on the other had an overt appearance
of fiscal impropriety.
There are better matches to be had,
This link might be a bit more useful to some people:
http://www.endicottalliance.org/aboutmembership.htm
As I have expressed, I do not think this is a wise match with IBM. I believe it
will destroy value at Sun. My personal opinion is that a better match would be
with Cisco or Google. I don't
davenz wrote:
I might add that amongst these ineloquent commnents about Ponytail it was
through JIS I was introduced to Sun, precisely at the time he mentioned ZFS was
being included in Mac OS X. Prior to that I knew zip about the company and its
products, and was a fulltime Mac OS and Wintel
I'm hearing rumors of piles of layoffs to go with some announcement tomorrow.
What I wish was that someone would take My Little Pony out into a field, shoot
him, and make glue out of his stupid ass. This is the same crap he did with
LightHouse Design, and when Sun picked him to lead I was very
system5 said:
CISCO buying SUN makes more sense from a purely business perspective because
CISCO values engineering and Sun's engineers are the best. CISCO also seems to
be interested in getting in to the server market (although the results would
probably still be negative for the OpenSolaris
on the horizon for this deal.
Both Sun and IBM's lack of response to potential problems with this idea across
the board from interested communities is very troubling.
Tim Scanlon
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One potential problem is that you have things installed in places other than
where you're looking for them with pkg-config, and configure is getting mixed
up...
I use this a lot, and tweak it to be smaller depending on what I'm doing:
I'd prefer they not be bought out. I don't think it's a good idea, and won't
create customer value.
I do think the talk about a possible purchase has flushed out the persistent
short sellers. I seriously hope those people lose their shirts, they deserve
every nickel of loss they suck down.
If
Try this:
http://cssh.sourceforge.net/
Tim
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That may work, it may not for some things though. The environment I'm working
in is composed of scientific one offs, We're already relying on VNC for similar
issues, but not all of them. I'm not sure how consequential this will be, it
may have very little impact. On the other hand the easiest
I noticed today that Sun has stopped selling Sparc based desktop machines. I
was sort of shocked by this to say the least. I have to support applications
that have endian issues, and this could be painful.
Does anyone know if Fujitsu or another vendor will pick up the slack?
Thanks,
Tim
Look at scripts in /var/spool/cron/crontabs for examples.
The man page for crontab tells you a lot about the details.
Tim
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I think they'd be better off ditching Star Office from the install over the
compilers for most people, but oh well.
In my experience the same people who know that OpenOffice is free, and in most
cases know OpenSolaris comes with StarOffice, do not know that the compilers
are free to use.
RBAC is a standard. Like POSIX is a standard. Sudo is a single tool. They are
in no way equivalent.
I suggest this as reading to get somewhat up to speed:
http://www.gcn.com/online/vol1_no1/45980-1.html
http://blogs.sun.com/jonathan/entry/opensolaris_and_the_nsa_national
ux-admin wrote:
http://csrc.nist.gov/groups/SNS/rbac/standards.html
Oh, and by the way, I was one of the engineers to implement that role system
and the 1,300 roles for that bank in the article above. Perhaps you'll find
that funny...
Then how can you possibly be conflating the use of RBAC
I've thought a lot about what people have said in this thread.
I personally do not care what format ends up being used as long as i have tools
to deal with the old format(s) were. Linux users might not like the idea of
SRV4 packages, but a lot of 3rd party vendors for commercial Unix flavors do
Look to see if gdm or dtlogin is running when you are logged in at the console.
If dtlogin is running, read the man page for gdm to switch services. I would
recommend you ssh into the machine to make this change. Use something like 'ps
-eaf |grep dtlogin' in a shell window to see which is
Blastwave has it's own trade-offs. God help you if you install everything and
then want to install/deinstall the OSS driver with /opt/csw in your path. Not
to mention the wacky 'pick a uid' lottery that goes with package installs that
require one... Picking from the bottom up would make sense
Jim Grizanzo wrote:
I don't mean to imply that the Website CG will maintain it, per say,
just that it's on the list of content items to be reviewed because it's
no longer being maintained by anyone, that's all. Personally, I think
the road map should live with the OGB, and that's what I'll argue
. Instead it conflates politics with business in a way that tends to
generate results that often are not either the best or the brightest.
Tim Scanlon
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That's pretty impressive, who's the manufacturer?
Thanks,
Tim
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It's out of date and appears unmaintained. Which is not surprising, but at this
point is annoying given there seems to be some effort to dumb down the OS for
the linux crowd. I can not figure out if SXDE is being discontinued for some
Tuxed up flavor that so far, does not look suitable for a
Well since I can't edit what I said I'll follow up what I wrote..
I saw that SXDE is being discontinued. This worries me and disappoints me too.
If i wanted to run Linux, I would. Solaris performs better, is actually
standards compliant, and gets tested well. I can't say that I am seeing the
The roadmap thing is what I want.
I can handle digging out the flag-day/heads-up project page myself to see
what's being uh announced in terms of features and changes that're in
upcoming releases. That, even if it utterly fails on the P.R. front.. I get
embarrassed to have to refer people to
That's not a bad idea as a starting point. There is a lot of stuff on bigadmin
that could be sourced for specific answers besides the faq there.
This is sort of trying to grab a hold of a firehose and pinpoint where it's
going to hit.
Another possible source for frequency data might be from the
Has anyone seen any movement on these issues?
I tried a vpnc package from sunfreeware but got no joy with that on SXDE for
some ugly reasons.
Cisco vpn client for sparc support has pretty limited utility. People are more
likely to need it on x86 than on sparc at the least just due to use on
It could be useful for a lot of things still, you can set up and run Sparc
applications on it that don't need big performance. That can be pretty useful
if you need a testbed to try something out on. It'd be potentially useful as a
non-hosted compile environment too, you can load an OEM
I might be a bit more excited if they did a non amd64 Solaris build...
Seriously wtf? It's not rocket science and they did it for every flavor of
linux under the sun...
Tim
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One thing that's good to do on a new system is set up the windex files in
/usr/man /usr/sfw/man and any other man directories contained in your MANPATH
for use with the apropos and whatis commands. You can do this by:
cd /usr/man
/usr/lib/makewhatis .
This way you can at least find functions
This is a question I'm struggling with too. Non-English fonts language
integration are very important to me.
Tim
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If you work with Fortran you may run into some data source/destination related
endian issues, but otherwise they're pretty rare. Both the Sun Compilers and
GCC have flags to work around those issues.
The overall majority of the time, you are not going to see any problems at all.
It can be a
Well it's that kernel mode ECC was introduced in that build, and that
particular crypto has something of a history, both at large and with Sun too.
It got put into openssh, then I think pulled out after the code was donated
due to some politics with the openssh maintainers and the US
in, instead there are huge
piles of people globally who're working to prevent that.
Tim
On Wed, Jan 02, 2008 at 11:12:15AM -0800, Alan Coopersmith wrote:
Tim Scanlon wrote:
dclarke wrote:
minor nit. Solaris is not open source.
Solaris still gets code reviews by government agencies to preclude
The irony of this thread when read in the context of understanding the code in
build 81 is rather notable.
Tim
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lennart wrote:
Also, good audio support also requires good RT support, and afaik
out-of-the-box Linux still tops Solaris by far on that.
You obviously don't know much about Solaris realtime support, good thing you
qualified that statement.
As for the 'slowlaris' crack, that really shows how
The thing I find frustrating about this is that I'd much rather see star being
able to avoid naming conflicts with every random nitwit who wants to name a
program or a script compare rather than trying to fend off the commonality of
the idea being translated into J. Random script and stuck in
kebabber wrote:
Could this scenario with NSA also be valid with Solaris 10?
No, no and to be clear no it is not a valid scenario with Solaris.
Without getting into some of the issues with your source material, there is a
real problem with this idea, and it's a pretty simple one.
Any sort of
dclarke wrote:
minor nit. Solaris is not open source.
Solaris still gets code reviews by government agencies to preclude this sort of
OS back door though, as does every other major OS in use by the US
international governments to preclude this sort of activity from happening.
Tim
This
+1 for me too...
I encounter a lot of situations where the Cisco VPN client is used, would
like to be able to use it or an alternative.
Given that Cisco's too lame to do a recompile on x86, well I'd love some
workable alternative.
Sadly, speaking from direct experience, Cisco is losing out
A suggestion, if there are Solaris 8 drivers for it as has been mentioned, try
them. I've had some amazing luck doing similar things. I once used some Dell
Solaris 7 x86 PERC drivers with Solaris 10 x86 successfully... The install
needed some hacking, but once installed they worked fine.
Tim
I looked, this is what I got from their site:
# Windows XP, XP64
# Linux 32 and Linux 64
Is anyone else out there interested in this stuff? I'm thinking I might be able
to get some indirect use via the shared visualization software, but I'd rather
Solaris was hosting these boards honestly.
I was originally going to put this in the trademark flamewar, but decided this
might be a better thread, grabbed what I'd written from a buffer...
I really do need this. Badly in fact. The issues that are being addressed by
Indiana have been the barriers to entry with many of the Linux users I
I'll be both blunt and brief about this. I posted more in another thread on
page 2 my opinion hasn't changed much yet. Not that it won't, but probably
it'll get revised some based on needs analysis.
I am desperate for the type of thing Indiana is doing. Not for myself, but for
the people I
You miss my point, it's not that I don't know where to look for stuff, I do. My
point was that I get a lot of very similar questions, and I find it frustrating
that the information isn't promoted in such a manner to where it was more
obvious to people.
I tend to use this personally:
I have been somewhat frustrated by trying to dig out, or point others to
release info. There was some serious coherence in presenting this info simply
that was lost when things went from the closed src beta program to opensolaris.
Tim
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I've had pretty good luck building and using MPlayer, you might want to try
that.
Tim
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I would get the Nvidia driver for solaris 10 use that instead.
http://www.nvidia.com/object/solaris_display_100.14.11.html
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If MS coughs up NTFS code, well then they might actually be more than spewing
PR.
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The thing ident really needs is a policy interface, often enough it's a good
idea to tweak what it spits out depending on the environment.
Tim
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I was getting 1.8meg from Hilo on it today...
Tim
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It's reasonable to expect problems in one release that aren't there in the next
one, I've been using unstable builds as my primary desktop for a very long time
without much trouble. Usually what I do is use another local machine as a
stable platform use 'screen' to that, or restrict certain
are critical areas of
interest for me with this issue.
Thanks
Tim Scanlon
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I have had good luck with the text installer on ultra 5's (ultra2i) with 256
ram in them. I have done a lot of installs this way.
Upgrading in text mode is also a good option when there isn't as much ram too,
but this also needs 256 ram.
It's not too hard to up ram some, but from a cd/dvd boot
Things in a full reboot inside /tmp should disappear, things in /var/tmp should
not, that other OS's don't do this is just another missing spoke in the
reinvented wheel.
One of the nice features of zfs on a /var slice is that you can have it be a
compressed fs, which is nice for logs in a lot
So what do you think of this board? ;)
http://www.tyan.com/product_board_detail.aspx?pid=496
Really nice but underpowered on the network side out of the box. That thing
could use a higher speed port, or more gig-e ports. That is a lot of cpu to
throw at some web applications, and it's got a
Every time there's one of those Sun Microsoft We're going to get along and
play nice and make our software work with each other I think NTFS instantly.
I fully expect to -never- see that happen either, which makes these song and
dance routines about how they're going to get along and do
not like any of the vendors out
there can't offer them reference platforms and support for them to do it with.
It's not rocket science to do it either. Which points at managerial
shortcomings pretty clearly, and there's little to be done about that.
Tim Scanlon
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looking at hardware reuse.
Tim Scanlon
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Linux is a reinvented wheel, and not always a very good one either. I do not
think people understand portability very well beyond `will it run on RedHat AND
SUSE?', which is quite a narrow perspective. POSIX is about portability, and I
notice Linux programmers like to claim it an awful lot as a
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